Is the best choice for long term marital success to let him make any decisions to move out?
Pretty, I am sorry. Do you see the burden you are placing on people asking for advice in that? Wrong advice and you have a horrible outcome.
The question seems to be: Let him stay until he chooses or force him to leave...
Both are hard, the grass is going to look greener on the other side of the fence no matter what you decide. But the trick to that is...the grass isn't greener it is just different.
I would not recommend forcing him out until you can no longer take it.
Experience is a brutal teacher, but you learn. My God, do you learn. - C.S. Lewis
Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B. - Jack3Beans
Listen without defending; Speak without offending - FaithinAK
Jack, I sifted through many of your posts, but please remind me how long for you, bomb to some basic recommitment?
No. Sorry it is not fair to you or anyone else. I have been here at least since 01/25/06, and like most I was lurking for a little longer than that. I'm not being a clown-hat on purpose, timelines don't work, some are shorter some are longer we all go through the same things during our individual and unique time here.
Experience is a brutal teacher, but you learn. My God, do you learn. - C.S. Lewis
Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B. - Jack3Beans
Listen without defending; Speak without offending - FaithinAK
Hi BPretty, Thanks for checking out my thread-I just read through yours. A few differences, but definite similarities..One thing I would have you think about as its come up with me and my H : When your H makes ANY effort toward improving your R or marriage, like calling for a MC appointment-notice and appreciate. The things that we may think are "no big deal", can be a major step for some MLCers. Sincere appreciation my be the positive reinforcement they need to continue those helpful behaviors. In many ways it seems to me that these MLC spouses go back to the teenage years-they may be trying out different personas(like our teenagers do), to see if maybe there is a better fit, a more exciting person to become(just my guess)- so the videogaming, the IMing with the OW fit into that. You have two teenagers so at least that experience may help you deal with your H's changes.. It seems like your H needs to learn skills he was lacking regarding being comfortable with positive and negative communication-hopefully his therapist can help him with learning those skills. You seem to be doing well considering all that's been dealt to you! I think learning what your boundaries are, having few expectations helps. My DB counselor reminded me that when something seems to be going in a positive direction-EXPECT a cooling off or reverse, because it is truly a rollercoaster ride for them and us(as long as we tag along). It helps to expect a downturn..to be wary of a continual, smooth path back to you and the marriage. I'll keep checking in-let me know if you have any ideas for me and my sitch to.
M44 H46 T21 Married 16y D14 D12 Bomb 12/08(EA), (PA/Separation)1/09 to 5/09 Home/MC 5/09 to 12/09 Leaves 12/09 Files for Divorce Divorce final 6/30/10.
I really need advice and support and some centering. The rollercoaster is taking its toll and it has only been weeks since the second confrontation.
Though I write this in a way that unfolds logically, I'm sure each of you can understand that the information did not come out in a logical, orderly, chronological manner which adds to the pain and confusion. Additionally, since MLC'ers lie, some of the info may not be deadly accurate. Let’s call all of this "the standard disclaimer."
The 3/31/09 "second confrontation" in my previous latest post exposed the ongoing nature of the EA and that it had escalated to in-person meetings and talking about their relationship. H said these were lunch dates in public places but I know by a text message on his phone that at least one of these was well past the lunch hour. Since my exposing the first bomb, H has been more attentive to me and the family so I was really knocked down by the ongoing EA after H saying he cut off contact.
On the night of 04/01/2009, H entered my separate sleeping quarters, fell into my arms and sobbed. This was the first touching in four weeks. During the remainder of that work week, his old workplace was a-buzz with the gossip. Our mutual long-term friends in the workplace took him to task in well-written but no bones minced emails after H tried to do "damage control" (remember he was the golden shining leader at the previous workplace)--for himself and OW and in some misguided attempt to protect me from embarrassment (people reaching out to me were told to MYOB). These were very hard days for H. He looked like shee-ite. He continues to be sick all the time as well as muscle and head aches.
The story filled in only recently was that OW was successfully escalating H's attentiveness by sleeping with a previous boyfriend/mutual friend (same workplace) one week, breaking up with said man (again) the next week, causing said man (the computer guy at the former workplace) to super-sleuth electronically that the reason for his misery was H. This allowed OW to "break open" the EA details at the old workplace. H realizes that she manipulated this exposure.
For the first two solid weeks after the 04/01 confrontation, H was loving and attentive. Said ILY, cried a lot, sobbed when he saw my ring back on at counseling, wants me in our bed, and to carry essentially a better relationship than we've had for a while before the bomb. He is adamant about ongoing MC (still don't know how to DB and MC at the same time--they seem mutually exclusive). There has been no commitment to end A as H said he made what turned out to be a hollow promise earlier. He revealed at counseling that he made an internal commitment to not see her in person until "he decides what to do" but he continues with chat/email/phone multiple times/day. She is getting demanding about him visiting her--I think he plays "busy." H does not tell her about our recovering closeness, ongoing work on the relationship, sexual contact, etc. He acknowledges verbally but does not comprehend the idea of a "triangle." H thinks he has two different relationships and he will lose (himself) if he chooses either one. However, his actions continually choose me and a future with me--his mouth, not as much.
In the third week after the confrontation, there is a sense of him slipping away. Not to her, but to the "discontent" and unhappiness. He still goes through the motions, there are flashes of true connection, but the anger and frustration at his lot in life comes back. I know he believes it is him, but I think he becomes especially vulnerable to escalating with her again to avoid the ugly feelings. This gives me lots of anxiety.
The DB distancing doesn't seem to work with H. To him, I think it registers as more of the same--"separate lives." He desperately wants to be close to me but can't. This turns into a dynamic of me continuing to be responsible for his emotions or saving him. The MC exacerbates this. It's like we are reconciling at his insistence but he can't actually change his behavior that much yet. It's hard to describe this dynamic. I saw on another post that it is like the sane part of him is clinging to me as his only hope. I feel him clawing back to me--but then anxiety and common sense slap me around.
Add to this that he is wildly Passive Aggressive and very successful in business on the basis of G--d given leadership abilities--wow, my head hurts.
I also want to encourage you to think about if you really want to continue in a relationship with someone with this type of personality.
Divorce Busting Board, Half, bad form.
Jack, I've got to respectfully disagree with you here and as someone who's been living this for awhile I've got to agree with HalfMissing. Everyone should review the entirety of their relationship and look at all their alternatives. DB is just as much about learning to live and be happy with yourself as it is the spouse returning because I'd say there's a chance that they won't.
Pretty, read a book called "Living with the Passive Aggressive Man" by Scott Wetzler. I wish I had read this book 6 months ago, heck...6 years ago. I would have not beat myself up for the past few months. When you've lived with a PA for 20 years like I have you fall into patterns. This book helps point out your errors and correct those because that is in your control. Jack is right about that one. We all have something to contribute to the downfall of a relationship. But, if you are truly living with a Passive Aggressive, there is not much you can do unless they really want to change except learn to live with it or leave it.
Last edited by ThinkingItThru; 04/23/0909:30 PM.
Married - 19 years Noticed Problem - Aug 2008 THE Conversation - Oct 2008
The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference.
