Puppy Dog Tails

[karen43]

I agree with that. I'm pretty sure that Puppy always recommends you do it just to get the intel you need and then to stop b/c it is or can be painful. I've never wanted to know any of that stuff, and listening to it or seeing it in print must be very tough. Karen

[SteveInTN]

That is all I'm saying. And I also know that once you start down that road, it is VERY hard to stop. When I was a newbie on this board about two years ago, the sages said "don't go there". That is what Michelle says too. That is my only point.

[saffie]

Steve,

I think you bring up very valid points about the damage continual 'snooping' can do.

I don't think Puppy would ever advocate someone collected intel to the prolonged detriment of their health/ sanity etc.... I wonder a bit if you are projecting your own experiences into the mix here.

I do actually think there is a bit of a difference between finding out where one stands and 'snooping' as such. I also see a fair few folks on these boards that spend hours, which then add up into days/weeks, agonising about what is going on with their S. Finding out might allow them to make a decision about how to proceed and stop waffling.

In my sitch I would have found it hard to gather evidence....in fact I never did because I was unaware an A was going on......but that didn't stop my M being a misery and it would have accounted for a lot of hurtful things I just couldn't understand that my H did, and it would have saved me some public humiliation that still scars my outlook on life and interaction with others IRL to this day. Do I wish I had known about these ways of gathering evidence? Yes! Would I have used them? Probably. I knew something was happening - just not what;I had to wait until my H told me.( I had fleetingly thought about him having an A but I knew that I didn't have any way of establishing factual evidence and that was what I would have needed to get him to open up to me - just accusing him would have caused harm and vitriol without any conclusion - let's face it; If he was cheating on me he was hardly going to tell me the truth until HE was ready). Could it have helped me to know - yes, I feel it would. I feel it may have well helped me sort things out sooner and caused less harm and hurt to my children and to my mental health.

Have I used any of the methods puppy has advocated since knowing about them just to 'check up' on my H - no. I am happy now that my H is totally faithful again and our M is on a strong footing; I have to trust at some point for the M to work. However, if things got like they had before, ( and I pray that with all the learning and growing we have done that couldn't happen), I would do what I could to find out where I stood. I wouldn't carry on 'snoooping' afterwards....once I had established what was going on.

This is not an exact science - surely you can see that?

I know that I have on some occasions rubbed another poster up the wrong way - I have never done it on purpose. I don't think puppy would either. We all carry our own baggage, and it is good to hear all sides.

[SteveInTN]

I most definitely see that and I can't say that Puppy really rubbed me the wrong way. The majority of what he said was great, it was just some of the interactions, like the one that started all of this, that I took objection to. I am simplifying the dialog here, but not overly:

Person: I just don't know what is going on with my spouse, they are distant and cold. I can't figure it out. More of the usual stuff here...

Puppy: Could be an affair, install a key logger

I saw this on more than one occasion. My point is that it is NOT an exact science and depending on the individual, it can really be damaging to send them down that road right off the bat. Sure, I am projecting my own experiences but I hardly think that I am an exception to the rule. Personally, I have had three friends whom I had to beg off the road of "snooping" once they started, one being the W of my then W's OM.

My only point is that "snooping" or initial "intel" ought not be the the normal prescription nor should it be given lightly. It ought to be the exception, and it ought to be prescribed with a healthy dose of counsel on when to stop. Otherwise, it can easily become addictive and absolutely get in the way of doing the things one ought to be doing in order to try and save a marriage. I KNOW I am not off base here, nor am I taking this personally. I just feel strongly that newcomers here ought to be given good and well thought out guidance when it comes to dealing with things this important.

Again, My opinion....

Steve

[Forrest Gump]

"I just worry that off the cuff advice to snoop is going to cause pain for others."

I don't know that it is "off the cuff" advice. It somewhat depends on the "motive". DB.. does address this. It is a very "hard" line to follow. It has a lot to do with "your" frame of mind. For it to work.. it cannot be "vindictive" or "try to get them back".. "prove them wrong". You would be "guarding". It's hard to explain.. and I hate long posts.

"You have a very large ego my friend."

People that "know".. sometimes come across like that.. I have been accused of having a "Big Ego". But.. it just comes down to how you "see" things. Puppy's "Ego" can work. He has proven that. Will it always work.. No. Neither will my "Ego". That is the beauty.. of this "place". Take what you can.. leave what does not fit.

"Person: I just don't know what is going on with my spouse, they are distant and cold. I can't figure it out. More of the usual stuff here...

Puppy: Could be an affair, install a key logger"

You always have to start somewhere.. with a poster. Get a feel for where they are. Then maybe you can direct them. Don't hate the "player".. hate the "game".

We all (old timers) start somewhere.. and let the poster lead. Don't get drawn into.. they (old timers/random poster) are wrong. If they are.. or you think they are.. state your case.

Nothing wrong with that.

I like stand out people.. Puppy is one.. and you are too. Best I can tell you is throw some of that "Emotion" at a post. Discuss within the confines of a post.. it will be more productive.