this maryangela -thread 3 -- he's gone

[jmw128]

I agree Kalni...I made a different list for that stuff. I separate stuff like that. I even made a list of do differents. Made a summer GAL list, stuff like that...I am not a list person, but to me, goals with W, goals for me, etc...are easier to build if I do them separately.

[sandi2]

Dear Maryangela,

I have read your entire thread. I have thought about posting to you but since I am from the other side of the fence, I didn't know if you would want to hear from me. I said I was from the other side.....I never tried to take another woman's H from her or I didn't have a PA, but I almost walked away from my own M and had gotten in an EA with a divorced man over the Internet. I never left my H and we are in Piecing.

When I read about how your H was in your early post, I thought you were talking about mine for a little bit b/c they sounded so much alike. My H never talked about anything. I felt that I was the one that was always trying to improve our MR and yet he did nothing to try to compromise or change for the better. I would try to have a talk with him......and of course I did all the talking...and he might put forth a little more effort for two days and then it was back to the same old thing. As time went on and we got older, it seem our R just went downhill. Then I got Fibromyalgia about ten years ago. When I read your story, it hit home about how your H could not deal with you being sick. I don't think my H could either. Ever since my first child, I have had a bad back and soon after my second child I had bad female problems that got worse and worse over the years until I finally gave up to have surgery. Just as I thought I might be feeling better due to that....I get Fibromyalgia (which there is no cure).

Anyway, our story is long and I have never posted it all at one time b/c it would take forever. Over the past several years, I felt my H's attention toward me grow less and less and even the kids (which are grown) could see that he spoke harshly to me and when our D was in an accident and had to live with us a few months, she saw first hand how little time he gave me. Anyway, we have had a hard time through 42 years of M and I won't bore you with all the details, but I did like you to try to fill my void emotional needs with other things in my life. However, after getting down physically where I could no longer do much of anything physically, it got harder. I was so lonely and so bored and I began to play games over the Internet....the ones where you can "chat" with the other person. That was not good. So, anyway, to shorten the story, I began to flirt and send IM messages and then H found them. And all you know what broke loose.

That was Feb of 2007. It seems like a lifetime ago. Some people say my symptoms sounds like a MLC but I was really too old to be having that, but I know that I had "something"....some kind of crises that was very similar. I know if my H had been giving me what I had needed in our R that I would not have ever thought of "flirting" with men over the Internet. Unlike you and your H, we did not have sex. He had not slept in the same bed with me for over 20 years and he has not ML to me in 12 years. Again.....very long story.

I guess I just wanted to tell you that I have been able somehow to see my H's side in all this from what you have told in your story. I have not been any "fun" to live with due to my physical problems......I'm down almost every weekend and that has got to get very old to my H. But, as I told him, it's no picnic for me either!

I never left my H for the OM, and never even met the OM in person, but just my H knowing about the EA and finding my messages to him has aged him so much and has almost drained the life out of him. So, I see more and more what I have done to him.

In reading your story, as with so many others here on the board, the LBS hurts beyond anything the WAS can imagine. In a way, I suppose it is worse than death, b/c you don't have closure and you keep hoping that there will be a turn-around and he will come back home.

I don't think I can give you advice that you would accept from me b/c you know I have not been in your shoes. But, I know that I still cared very much for my H and I truly did not want to hurt him......however, he could not see that b/c of what my actions were telling him. On the other hand.....I also only saw his worst side in his actions towards me. I remember him saying that he only wanted his wife back again. The problem was, she was temporarily lost. When they talk about the "fog"......they know what they are saying b/c that is exactly what you feel like you are in. I did not know who I was anymore or why I was doing what I was, but it had control over me.......let me back up and say that I allowed it to have control over me. I liked the feeling that the OM gave me and it was addictive. I did not realize this until I came here and people told me how the chemical actually effected your brain to cause you to want to continue the A. But, they were correct.

LBS are given a variety of advice from the posters here. Most of the vets will always refer you to the DB techniques b/c they are the best.

I do believe that your H's affair will play out. I hope that he will not marry this OW before he wakes up out of the fog and sees what he has lost in the process. By then, you may not want him to ever come back to you. That happens a lot of times.

To answer you questions about how could he do this to his little girl that loves him so much........it is the power or the seduction of the effect of the addiction of the A with OW. He is not thinking logically nor acting rationally. He can't due to the condition he is in. I am not taking his side.....just trying to explain it a little bit. I was a lot older, but I still remember the feeling and I would want my children to hurry and leave the house and go back to their own perspective places in order for me to have time alone on the computer with my OM. I would fake being sick on Sundays so I could be home alone on the computer. This is totally opposite from the real person that I am.

So, in a way, it is like the H you had did die and you need to grieve that and get through it. Then if/when he should get through this crises, and he wants to come back home......and you still want him, you will need to start fresh as if it was a new R all over again. More than likely, both of you will be different people when you come through this.

BTW, you keep referring to this OW as being so wonderful and beautiful and special, etc. It seldom is that way at all. The LBS has all that in their own head and it is very far from the truth. Looks usually has nothing to do with the A. The sex between them may be awful! As one of the women that helped me here on the board told me.....she was doing the same as you, imagining the OW being so great and all. Only she found out that the OW was not attractive.......lived like white trash and their sex life was very poor. So she had fretted about all that for nothing. "She" had made the OW some kind of goddess and given the power to her. It took the H a long time to get his eyes open, but he finally did.

Have you actually seen this OW? I can understand you not wanting your child to be around her, but is this the reason for her trouble at school? Or, is it b/c she feels the bad tension and vibrations at home? Children know when things between their parents are bad and she feels very insecure. If she is playing with OW's little boy, then she probably isn't preoccupied with OW. It could even work for your advantage if your D was around OW for the H to see how well OW took to his child and visa-versa. However, I can see how it would unnerve you to allow her time with your child.

Since I'm on a roll here, I might as well throw in my opinion about allowing your H to go into your house so that he gets a chance to "inspect" the bathroom and go behind you to bleach it out. I would have been so furious I would have thrown him out on his tail and that would have been the last time he ever crossed the threshold of my front door. Anyway, not only was that rude and disrespectful but it's really none of his business since he no longer abides there!

You can have it arranged where you don't have to see him when he picks up and delivers D. She is old enough that he does not have to go to the door to get her. He could drive up in the driveway and stay in the car. That way, you would be able to go more "dark".

As far as your goals.....make them all about you and not your H. Don't set goal dates on the calendar about your R. It doesn't work. And, sweetie, you still have not detached and you have GOT to do that. It is for your sake....not his.

Your response to your stitch sounds like all the LBS....the men and the women's.....it is normal. However, for your sake as well as your child's you have got to get a grip and take back control of your life. If your child senses you falling apart, she may be scared that you are going to get sick and leave her....and you could have a nervous breakdown if this keeps up. So, that is something to think about and work towards.....being healthy mentally, physically and emotionally.

I hope you will accept this post in the spirit that it was given. I do not believe in breaking up homes and marriages. The only M I almost broke up....was my own. For that, I have to answer for.

I pray that you will be able to get the help you need from a good counselor (they are hard to come by) and I would not even suggest that your H meet with you in MC b/c it will not be good. He is not in that place....as you've already been told by others.

Good luck and please take care of yourself.

Sandi

[spark]

thanks Kalni, my love. crying all day. I think I'm in the "grieving" period of the 5 stages of grief. I feel like someone died. I'm not even kidding. I'm in so much pain. h has d5 today and I miss her and I miss HIM. I miss US as a family. I'm so pathetic that my dad asked me if even after what he's done/doing (affair), if he walked in the door today and said he'd come back but no questions are to be asked, would I take him back and I said yes.

I feel (know) I drove him to ow. I was depressed and selfish last fall and snappy and didn't want sex. I could have done so many things differently. He just always acted the same, never acted like anything was wrong, like he accepted me, the good and the bad, and the BAM. this.

I feel that I will never be happy again.

I'm sorry to sound so horrible.. my birthday is tomorrow and no h.

[spark]

Sandi, wow. I don't know what to say. I can't believe you took the time to write that long and heartfelt response. I'm in tears that someone "out there" that doesn't even know me, reached out to me like that.

thank you for your insight about "the fog". I believe that completely. I am seeing a great shrink and she says affairs are literally the same as addictions. I know this is true. I feel like I'm dealing with an alcoholic. I was raised in an alcoholic home and this feels the same. things make no sense. no rationale. up and down. you get the picture.

you and kalni are right. I have to make goals for myself. I'm going back to school in August and that is HUGE for me. but I need to make day to day goals.

I have never experienced pain like this. NOt even when my grandmother died. It's incredible. I can only pray that I will grow from this experience.

My daughter is acting out in school because she misses her father. She cries and acts out now. that is what has been happening. I am taking her to a child psychologist.

I just want to know, when does the crying daily stop? it's been three months since bomb, 2 months since I found out about ow and 1 month since he's been gone. When the f does this feeling start to subside?

And yes, I have to set boundaries in terms of h coming into the house and cleaning, opening my mail, etc. staying for 2 hours. "well, I'm paying the mortgage", is what he says. I need an EXACT answer from my lawyer and not in snotty way to get this to stop because he won't stop. And every friday and sunday I'll have to go through this. and the whole time he is here, my heart is pounding out of my chest and I have to go in other rooms because I'm about to burst into tears.

Ok, the love on this board is amazing. I don't think I could have made if this far without you guys. I'm trying to be helpful to others, I'm sorry if I don't respond a lot, I'm trying though.

[sandi2]

It's okay, sweetie, if you don't respond to others a lot. You have enough on your own plate. I would think that just b/c your H is paying the mortgage does not give him the special privileges he is taking, but like you said, check with L to see where you stand legally. He has no right to go through your mail, etc. and he can have his mail forwarded or open a P.O. Box. He is just being an a$$ and taking an advantage to look around to see what he can find as "evidence" to make you look bad, b/c he knows he is the one that has screwed up (literally). Don't allow him to make you feel inferior to him. I have heard and read over and over that men think the sexiest thing a woman can have is self confidence. Not that you are trying to show him that you are hot and sexy at this point, but I'm just trying to help you feel more confident about taking a stand on your on turf. He may not show it in words or actions, but I bet he would respect you for it.

Don't give him the satisfaction of knowing how upset he can make you. That gives him way too much power over the stitch. Your weakest link is your DD.....which is understandable. Ask you C how to deal with him on that level b/c it is your child that is suffering so much.

It is amazing how your DD feels so strongly about her daddy. But, I would suspect she would have a much stronger reaction if her mommy had left the home. She may see him as the "protector" of the home and without him there, she feels somewhat frightened. She may have even sensed you seeming to be frightened when in reality you were just upset with him. We never know how kids interpret things. However, you are getting her help and that is good. You are billing your H for this, right? BTW, do you get to sit in on the sessions? I would insist in being able to at least watch threw a one way window and preferably with a listening device. But at least you could watch and she doesn't have to know you are there. It's just best, IMHO, if the parent has a way of observing the session without the child knowing. That way, you feel she is protected and yet she can confide in the doctor without trying to say things just to please mommy. (I just have my own personal reasons for saying that.)

Although I almost left my H, my heart does go out to LBS. I tend to get a bit tough on some of the men, but it's b/c I can see it from a female POV.

I am glad that you received my post graciously and anytime you need to talk, know that I am here.

Take care of you and DD.

Sandi

[Ready2Change]

I think what a lot of us (not just me) who have been communicating regularly with CBK are seeing in him is he seeks advice, considers it, very often even vocalizes what he KNOWS he should (or shouldn't) do . . . and then he does it anyway. It's not so much he has disagreed with the advice, rather it's a sense of:

"Should I touch the hot stove?"

"No!!!!"

"I know I shouldn't, but maybe it would help me determine the real temperature of the burners."

"No, don't do it -- it will make it worse!"

"OK, I hear you, and I know I shouldn't, but maybe if I just do it once, I will know what I'm dealing with and the stove will know that I'm serious about knowing what its temperature is."

"Please, CBK, you'll only burn your hand!"

"I know you're all saying I shouldn't touch the stove, and I hear you. But last nite, I backslid and I touched the stove again, and this is why . . . "

Lather. Rinse. Repeat.

It's not that we don't respect CBK's instincts, and we DAMNED sure respect his EFFORT. He's working his azz off. It's that he's not following his instincts, even when he knows (and vocalizes) that he should.

Puppy