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#1053977 05/15/07 01:52 PM
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before you go ahead and say "because we love them" or "we made a committment" those are not the answers I'm looking for as I feel those are just cop-outs.

why do we put up with this crap. Why when I come here looking to see if there's someone who's gone through this...gotten back together and is actually truly happy with their m now...all I find is people still putting up with crap from their spouse that they would tell their friends or family not to put up with.

why do we allow ourselves to be treated with disrespect in hopes of someday getting the love we deserve from the people we married?

This all just doesn't seem worth it.

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Amen! I know how you feel. BUT, as one who has been through one divorse, divorse isn't worth it either. If I have to choose which is the lesser of two evils, trying to work on the marriage is definately the winner. Am I happily married, no. But what the hell is the alternative? I feel like I loose either way. Sorry to sound so glum, but I cannot tell you if I will stay or go. I take one day at a time. My h is certainly trying, but he keeps me financially in the dark and I don't like it. I already have to overcome his A. But I can tell you first hand. Divorse is much, much worse.


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Gwyn #1054021 05/15/07 02:13 PM
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Why is Divorce so bad? I could see divorce being bad if you don't want to enter the singles pool again but if you're happy to be alone with your children and live your life why is it so bad?

Your h shouldn't keep you in the dark financially but I understand how you feel...when it comes to the $ I feel like the child that has to ask daddy what we can get for the house and he doesn't have to ask anyone.

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In your case, I would say you do it as self-defense because of weak self-esteem.

It is easier to feel unloved by a guy you think is a creep than it is to risk looking for something better and worrying that it might turn out that YOU are unlovable.

You are lovable. Quit being afraid.

I can tell you from experience that getting D is MUCH MUCH better than staying in an M that will never be something that you want. I am very happy that I got D and even happier with my new M. I know with certainty that this is by far the more fulfilling path in my life.

Choose your happiness.

As for money, it sounds like you need to negotiate monthly budgets that include one for household spending and one for your own spending. You should have both financial power and responsibllity in your M.


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P.S. That (fear), and, you are still trying to be "right," you still want to win and H to lose in this battle. Give up that fight. There is no right or wrong. There are Rs that work or don't work.


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OK so you got me...it's a bit of low self esteem but I know I'm lovable. Yes, I am afraid...but the fear is not so much of me being wrong as it is me doing the wrong thing. What if my kids and I are better of right where we are than with h not living here. It almost seems like because h and I are married he is excused from certain things but if we were apart he'd have to be dad on his own and would step up more...but then again maybe he wouldn't and that'd cause a whole new mess and if I were the one to initiate things the kids would blame me. The season has already started with me putting the kids to bed only to have them ask "where's daddy" and then them trying to go outside to see him after I've already gotten them cleaned up and put to bed at 8:30PM so they can say goodnight to him. I don't really understand how before and after our seperation he can't seem to get home until late but during seperation he was able to be here by 5PM 6PM the latest on the nights he was to visit the kids. Things like that make me think we'd be better off without him living here. I even had dd ask if he was dead because he hadn't gotten home from work when it was getting to be her bedtime.

I understand there are reasons people stay together and fight for their marraiges but what if the fighting/staying just isn't worth the reward at the end. Are we all being martyrs trying to earn our way in through the pearly gates?

Either path I choose I'm dammed...file and I'm the bad woman that didn't do all she could to keep her family together for her own selfish reasons...stay and I'm a weak woman who tolerates a sub par marraige.

So, I didn't start this thread to talk about me...I really want to hear from everyone here WHY DO YOU DO IT?

LL

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Oh, well, I can't answer that question.

I didn't stay in an M I knew would never work for me even when it was pretty clear that I could have the chance. I DIDN'T do it because I had learned enough about myself and what I wanted from life to not be willing to settle for less.


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Why do we do it? Because there's so much at stake. Going through a divorse is hard, but I will tell you, after some time went by, I was okay with it. Would I do it again, NO! That's why I'm still trying to save my marriage. Not because "I love him" and "I can't live without him" because I can. But I like myself better as married than single. Remember, when you get a divorse, the ENTIRE dynamics of your family will change!



Excuse me for a moment. Oldtimer, stop by my thread. I want to talk to you a bit.


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Gwyn #1054132 05/15/07 03:30 PM
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Gwyn,

What is up?


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Originally Posted By: lostlove
I understand there are reasons people stay together and fight for their marraiges but what if the fighting/staying just isn't worth the reward at the end. Are we all being martyrs trying to earn our way in through the pearly gates?


I think you'll see it mentioned fairly often that it's not about the outcome, but about the journey of self-discovery and self-improvement. You seem to be very focused on how your actions or positioning makes you look. I don't mean to single you out here, but your words demonstrate what a lot of the beliefs that a lot of the people here operate from. Having a great marriage is a goal, THE goal for most people when they get here, but all the personal goals that constribute to the success of the big one are more important. They are the ones you can control as an individual, and they are the ones that drive your happiness and satisfaction in your life, regardless of what your relationship status is.

These goals, this growth and honest self awareness is not about figuring out how to play the perfect role that will win your spouse back. It's about being sincerely honest with yourself and living up to your own potential, whether it dooms or enhances your marriage.

Quote:
Either path I choose I'm dammed...file and I'm the bad woman that didn't do all she could to keep her family together for her own selfish reasons...stay and I'm a weak woman who tolerates a sub par marraige.


You're not damned, there are simply negative consequences to your choices. As there are to every choice you make. If you focus on the negatives, it's all you will have. You make all these associations with the outcomes, and in doing so, you keep yourself prisoner, and define yourself in these grandiosely negative ways. Your choices determine the path your life will take, but they do not define you. You are who you are regardless which labels you apply to yourself. Another thing I feel compelled to comment on is that you talk of tolerating a sub-par marriage. The way you have phrased this suggests that you see the marraige as something in and of itself, not a manifestation of you and your spouse's choices. If you focus on your choices and make the best ones you can, you're not "tolerating" anything. If your spouse's choices are one's you don't want to live with, don't. Establish whatever boundaries you need to in order for you to live the way you choose to, but don't "tolerate" anything because you expect to earn something by doing so. Don't play the role of a victim or a martyr because you're throwing your life away because you expect some payoff that will never come.

Now, why do I choose to maintain hope for my marraige? I do it because I committed to. Because my son deserves to have both of his parents together. Because together we can do a lot of healing and growing (things that we are each addressing on our own now). Because we had a deep connection at one point, and I believe that the potential is there. For financial reasons. Because a person is never the problem - interactions and situations are. Because I made choices in life, and I choose to own the responsibilities that came with these choices. Etc., etc., etc.

Why is it difficult to let go? Avoidance of the shame and stigma of failure. If the marriage hasn't ended, I haven't failed (whether it's failure is another debate entirely). Fear of the unknown. Fear of accepting that I'm not good enough for my W (my own negative interpretation of "we don't fit"). There are a whole host of low self esteem reasons for clinging and hanging on, just as there are for running away. Fear of harming my son. Fear of letting my family down. Fear of having regrets later in life. Fear of a future of unending conflict with my Ex-W (because we haven't resolved our issues or solved the real problems in our relationship - something that will still exist whether we are married or not).


“No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. ”
– Albert Einstein
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