Well, I started a new thread and i am back with a new attitude or so I hope. I have so many mixed emotions in my head I don’t know where to begin. I am going to briefly go over my sit paraphrased and then let you know where we are now and see what you think.
In January of 2006 my husband was hospitalized for being suicidal. 12 days later he came home and 5 days after that let me know he met a woman in the hospital who understood him better than I ever did. He was “in love” and he was leaving me. That lasted about a week and then he came back. Shortly after coming back I had to have him taken out of the home by the police because he had a knife to his throat. He was hospitalized again and did not return to me until 3 months later. During this time he was diagnosed as bipolar and this is where my storey begins.
He came home in May of 2006 with a list of ultimatums and I agreed to everyone just because I wanted him home. I didn’t care what I had to do. I would have walked through fire. (pathetic I know). Rules were
• I could not ask about his affair.
• I could not talk about his illness
• I could not ever bring up anything he did over the past 3 months
• Absolutely no marital counseling.
Needless to say 15 months later he came home one day only to tell me he didn’t love me anymore and really had been faking it the past 3 months. He told me that he was sick of faking it and feeling empty and he wanted out. He also promised he wouldn’t leave because he knew it would hurt the kids to much.
2 weeks later after our family vacation he packed up and moved out 2 days before school started. This was hardest on my oldest who was new to middle school this year. At first I was done, I didn’t think I could do this anymore and the anger was unreal. I read book after book on bipolar. I also ready Love must be tough, by dr. James Dobson, I don’t love you anymore by Dave Clark, Divorce Remedy and Divorce Busting by Michelle, and the list goes on. I have gotten so many different opinions and so many different ideas. The one thing that is most difficult though is these techniques do necessarily say they apply to the mentally ill.
That being said I have tried to give him more space this time. It has not been easy. He has been spending the night with the other woman from 15 months ago. He says they are only “friends”. She is involved with someone else who is always there but….it still eats at me. He met some guys at a bar and crashes at their place a lot and sometimes sleeps in his car. He says there is no other woman and that he just wants to be homeless and have no worries. I am left at home with the 5 children and all the worries. (I am trying not to be sarcastic but…..) I should point out he was and has been an un-medicated bipolar. At this time he is getting back on meds or so he says.
Here is where I am confused for 4 weeks he was adamant that we were divorcing. I never said much but just tried to keep calm. Then on Labor day we ended up sleeping together. (I am not sure exactly why I was that dumb. It was a whirlwind). Well he told me he wanted to work on things and he thought maybe they could work etc…. four hours later he called me to tell me he hated me and that he was wrong it wouldn’t work. Tuesday night we met with a bipolar friend and talked a lot and things seemed to calm. On Friday he was supposed to take my son to the movies and didn’t show so my son called him. He tried to back out so I got on the phone and said don’t tell them your coming again if your not and then he said Fine I will take the F***ing kid to the F***ing movie. (I should point out I was doing dishes and the speaker was on) My son was devastated and didn’t want to go at that point. After some coaxing and etc he went to the movies with my other son and my husband. When they got back I was told that daddy made them promise not to tell me but that they went to a rated R movie. (they are 11 and 9 and I was not happy) I bit my tongue so there were no issues.
On Saturday he asked me to meet him at the mall with my girls so he could spend time with them. I left him with 4 of the 5 kids because another was at a sleepover and started walking off and he yelled after me and asked me to come with them. We had a great time. We enjoyed the day it was amazing. Then when time to go I asked him if he wanted the kids that evening also since it was supposed to be his weekend and he snapped. He was so mad because he thought I had a date. (as if) He started to drive off and my purse was in his car so I reached in to get it and he rolled the car window on my arm. He kept it there for quite a while rolling it down a little and then cramming it up further. My kids saw it and needless to say it was horrid. He swore on Monday he would file for divorce he hated me.
Monday he came over to the house to make spaghetti for the kids. I always leave so he can have the kids and the house. He called me and asked me to come back to eat with them. I did and everything went great. He asked me if Tuesday I wanted to go for a soda and I said sure. Tuesday he called and said he changed his mind maybe Wednesday (today). Today he called and said never mind how about tomorrow.
Now that I have rambled forever here are my questions.
1) How would you handle this?
2) Should I simply tell him no we can not go out because I feel this is his way of controlling me. If I think I am going with him I can’t make other plans.
3) Was what he did with my arm considered physical abuse? I am very unsure about this but I was terrified.
I really don’t know what to do or where to go from here. I just know I love him. I want my family back together but not if it is going to be broken and violent.
I have really changed a lot in the past couple of weeks. I have joined a womans bible study on Tuesdays. I attend Wednesday bible studies. I go to church on Sundays and I have found an entire new group of Christian friends. When I tell him about my church or that he is in my prayers he is violently mad. He calls me”Jesus”.
I am wondering if maybe sometimes it is better to throw in the towel. I don't want to but I know biblically I do have grounds for divorce because of the adultery. I dont want this but I am starting to worry that I am going to lose myself in all of this and I am worried about my children. (whole different story for a different day)
I am very lost and would appreciate so much the feedback from any of you.
Sorry to be so lengthy.
Based on what you have said I think your H has some serious mental issues. I don't know if this is so much a troubled marriage as it is a troubled mind for him. I think he needs some major psych help.
Maybe you need to set some boundaries. Tell him you like spending time with him and the kids but that the verbal and now physical abuse will not stand. Point out that you are protecting yourself but also that you're protecting your kids from having to see this kind of behavior. Tell him if it happens that way again, he will still be able to see the kids but not with you, not in your house (he moved out, that makes it yours), and not with the same level of flexibility. He's enjoying a lot of benefits right now in terms of access to you and your kids. I'm not suggesting that you threaten him, just that you lay out where the boundaries are and what will happen if he crosses them again. Be respectful but firm. Something like I know you're under a lot of pressure but I can't allow myself or my kids to be part of your reactions to that pressure any longer. It may push him away but for my $.02, I not sure that's 100% a bad thing right now.
I agree I need to set boundaries. I have none. I am where he wants me when he wants me how he wants me. He says jump and I say how high. I know he has mental issues and that is 90% of our issue. Our marriage was great before he had his two accidents which left him injured for life and since that in 2005 he hasn't been the man I married.
His only thing he says bad about me is that I did not give him enough sympathy during his recovery and it hurt him to the point he cant get past it.
I am not saying i am the perfect wife but...
I love sex as much as any man and if he didn't initiate it I did daily.
I let him go out whenever he wanted with never questioning and always supporting him having friends and alone time.
I do all of the housework and that includes the yard work, laying 1600 square foot of tile in our home, and hanging drywall with him in our new kitchen.
He says I am perfect in every way except I wasn't loving enough during that time. I just don't get how that can be justification to destroy this family.
Sorry just venting...
The one thing that scares me is he has the I don't want you but I don't want anyone else to have you mentality and I am very worried about what he will do if I even go out with friends.
Today when I talked with him he was cordial. Just called one more time to say he wont be here for his night with the kids tonight. Just one more disappointment.
I think boundaries and space are going to be the next goal of mine to get taken care of.
OK I failed my goals... here is where we are now help.. this may take a while....
We had a big blow up on Friday night. The details are not fun so i wont go into them but it was bad. On Saturday he had decided to have my cell phone cut off. I panicked because he was getting nastier and talked to all of my family and friends and made the decision I would most likely move up north to where I come from about 1400 miles from here.
He sends me the following email.
""Some of what I hear you want to know about is,
The dogs / animals, I will take care of them.
The kids stuff, if you leave their stuff I'll put it into storage.
The house, I'll get things cleaned up and fixed up then sell it. You can stay in the house as long as possible if you continue to stay here in the state, if you move out, I will proceed with fixing it up and selling it.
The Van, I wont report it stolen, and I will continue to pay for it until the divorce is final, and we can see what has to happen then.
Going out of state, I don't mind if you take the kids out of state for a few months or until this thing is resolved, but I do not consent to a permanent move.
We will keep the current visitation, 1 day a week and every other weekend.
The kids and your insurance, well of course I will take care of that until everything is finalized, and then I will continue to take care of the kids.
All bill info needs to be turned over to me.
My work laptop and key fob needs to be turned over to me.
Meeting today, well as much as I don't think we should, we can meet around 3:30 at mall, I'll bring my parents you can bring Jodie if you like or whomever.
Anything else we can fill in on this sheet and we both can sign it, as well as get it notarized, also if you are agreeable my mother can notarize it, if not we will have to make other arrangements, I will only sign what we agree upon in front of a notary.
On monday, I will try to set up some child support for you, you will need to have a bank account so I can have it direct deposited into that account.
Please go over this before we meet, and make any correction you may want. I will do the same until we have what we both can agree upon and then we can meet to sign this. We should only be meeting to sign this, anything else should be done in front of a attorney. I feel like you, we can agree upon what we both want without the cost of an attorney, so we can best do this be email, then to meet to sign the paper.""
I send back what I want and hear nothing back from him. (did find out that he and his girlfriend were in a car wreck on Saturday afternoon and that is why we couldn't meet) On Sunday no contact at all. My daughter called him like 5 times and he wouldn’t even answer her. On Monday morning I was still thinking I was going to move but I wasn’t sure what to do so my sister said she had to have a decision by 10 am to get plane tickets. I text him I need to talk to him by 10 am or I would have to make the decision without him.
He immediately called and asked me to come to his work. I went and we talked and talked and so much went on and he finally convinced me to stay for a bit. Later that day he called me and told me he was in love with two women and didn’t know what to do.
I called him back an hour later and said I deserve better than being the other woman. I said that I was going to take off my wedding rings and if he was gonna go out so was I. I asked him what time he would be at the house to look at my pipes that were backing up and told him I would go out with friends while he did that. He begged me to be there because he wanted to talk.
That night he came over talked to me again and told me he loved me and he was going to try to let the other woman go but he didn’t want to hurt her so he would let her down easy. We had an amazing night and even went to a local park and made love on the boardwalk out under the stars (craziest thing we have ever done) it was awesome. After it was over he told me he was going to spend the night at his moms and go from there.
Well then…..this morning I drive by and he is not at his moms (we live 4 houses away). I called him and talked to him and he asked me to meet him at his work again. I go there and he tells me he stayed with her and that he was confused. I made him call her in front of me and tell her what we did and he did and she did what I thought and she said it was over. Well I am not sure that was a good idea.
This afternoon he called me back and told me it was over he was seeing a lawyer and that he was divorcing me. He went to his lawyer and decided on trying mediation and asked me if I would. I said sure (trying to divorce bust here) The mediator called me and said he comes to tampa every 5 weeks and that he would be here Monday. I said sorry Monday is no good so I will go for the end of October date. That bought me 5 weeks. Ok so I have no intention of cooperating with this but….
Tonight the kids and him all went to the movies with us and we had a great time it was amazing and as soon as it was over he got short and nasty with me and told me nothing changed and we were still divorcing.
Can you all please tell me at this point what do I do? How do I divorce bust?? Please help me because I am totally confused and this is my last shot. I have 5 weeks to get my act together. Can you all please advise??
My opinion is he doesn't want me right now but doesn't want anyone else to have me. I know by how he looks at me and acts that he really loves me. HELP
What is the best way to DB this and I mean i really need some hard core lecturing here because I am the worlds worst divorce buster ever....
I might also add the only time he seems interested in me is when he thinks I might have found someone else. He actually blows me off until I tell him I am moving on. I am desperate here for some advice. I have no money to call a DB coach or i would. Right now we are in debt up to our eyeballs and beyond.
Part of me thinks you need to pack up your kids and move to a different state and not leave him the forwarding address.
My next door neighbour counsels couples as her ministry in her church. She used to tell me what God binds together let no man break apart kind of stuff. I was grateful to have a pro marriage person who understood me. Until one day when she heard the hateful verbal abuse my H spewed to me in the garage away from the kids. She heard it and approached me the next day. She cried and said that his abuse would escalate because my unconditional love repulsed him and made him feel even more shame and guilt. IIn my H's eyes, it would be easier for me to hate him and react like a wicked person than to stand lovingly by his side while he was disrespecting me.
Your H is beyond your help. He is mentally ill and should probably only have suprevised visits with your kids. You may need a forum that deals with bipolar as this sounds way extreme, beyond MLC stuff. Where are his parents in all of this? His meds are up to him. For better or worse is one thing but how can you help him if you are being abused yourself? Think of how this look sto your kids. They will start to normalize this sitch and accept it. Oh goodness, I am not a TH but that is a huge fear of mine with my kids so I have to stand up for myself to show my D6 not to accept a bad man/ mean man/ yelling man, etc.
I know and I have thought about that. I will say that he did get on meds last week and his parents are trying to be there for him. He is just really struggling.
Part of me wants to run also but then I just read an entire book on how fear is a sin and we need to trust God so that is what i am doing or trying to.
My biggest problem now is what do people do to talk themselves out of calling him, counseling him, trying to be there for him when he doesn't want me. Every time he thinks he is losing me he realizes he loves me so at this point what i have to do is basically not be available to him but I am very weak when it comes to him. VERY WEAK.
Well today was lets just say eventful. I dropped my daughter off at my mother in laws and my husband was there. We talked just a second and then I started to leave.
He said can I ask you something...He said it doesn't matter but i was just wondering.... i am like ok what and he says "Why aren't you wearing your wedding rings?" Well the truth is that they are way to big now and I keep losing them because I have lost SOOOO much weight. I just said no reason and walked off.
That was to me a sign he still cares.. am I right?
Tonight we talked a little and he said he doesn't want to hear from me again how much I care for and believe in him. Soooo I guess i am going to really have to start divorce busting and just simply NOT say anything. I am begging for advice on this from any of you.
Help
This morning my oldest son was a complete nightmare. I made the mistake of calling my husband to have him talk to my son. How do you all handle this? What do you do when you need help? How do you let go of your spouse and the phone.
Begging for help here.
I think you just have to pretend like your spouse is no longer an option. If he wasn't there, who would you call then or what would you do? Just make sure if and when you say something to him about it that you're not nasty, just matter of fact. "I've been having a hard time getting a hold of you lately and I really needed this done so I called X instead."
Bryan,
Thanks for the advice I know you are right.
Here is how this afternoon went.
11 AM I get a call from the school guidance counselor and my son was in sobbing. He had told her a lot of what went on but I feel he exaggerated a bit of what has happened. I got 100 questions on my husband and if i am abused. It was not fun.
(already failed at your advice Bryan)
I called my husband to talk about it and he got ticked off big time. He blasted me for 30 minutes on how it is all my fault that my kids think bad of him. Finally I just hung up. I got of the phone and something clicked inside me and for the first time in a while i felt anger. A bit to much because i sent him the following email.
You have made me the bad guy in all of your problems but here is what I think
You are miserable with yourself
you don't like the father that you are.. you feel guilt over the neglect of the kids up north and the pain you caused the ones down here
You feel guilt over your infidelity and your betrayal of me, Lisa, and even Lynne .. if there are more I don't know....
I think you are looking to fill the void in your heart in a million different places but you are not facing the problem and not filling the void.
You have not done any therapy to take care of you. You do not seek counseling for you. You are not trying to improve. You enjoy your misery because you don't know anything but that.
I think deep down you love me and you can't stand it because you know you don't deserve the unconditional love someone would give you. You know you don't deserve a wife that will love you beyond all of the ugliness you have caused her from betrayal, STD's, and more.....
I think it would be easier for you if I hated you and did fight with you because you could ease your conscious.
I think you want me to find someone else so you can feel less guilty about abandoning me and it would also be a great way to get some sympathy.
I think one day you are going to wake up and realize how many lives you have destroyed and it will be too late.
I think you feel really bad that You are verbally nasty to me, your mother, your kids, and I am sure others
you make everything about how everyone has hurt you and nothing about how you hurt others. You say your parents hurt you, Lisa hurt you, I hurt you but you take no responsibility for what you have done to us. You have walked out on two families for your own selfish reasons and self gratification.
Now for what else I think
I am going to give you what you want and I am going to stop bothering you. If you want information on the kids please call me.
I am going to be so good at this that I will not call you even for problems with the kids unless it is a life or death issue.
I am going to show them unconditional love and I am going to be there for them every day of their lives just like a parent should be.
I am going to teach them self respect by not letting you disrespect me anymore.
I am going to teach them how much you love them even if they don't see it or believe it.
I am going to move on with my life, find a place to live, and go on as if you don't exist because the Joey I knew doesn't. your right he did die.
I will not break my wedding vows but when it is all said and done and you have terminated our family I will move on and I will show them life goes on and that you can have a happy life even after you have been hurt so bad. I will move on and find someone that really knows what unconditional love is. I will show my kids a real family and real togetherness.
I will continue to pray for myself that I might walk the path God wants and while I fail a lot I will keep trying.
I will not miss my counseling sessions and I will face what is hard to face and I will work to get better.
I will pray for you that one day you will let go of Satan and turn to God. I will pray for this because rather we are together or not your children need a role model that they can look up to.
You win. You have hurt me deep. You showed me today how cold you can be. You attack me over everything.
I can't live anymore like this. I am trying to be calm and rational when we talk but I am feeling like a punching bag. You are so sure you hate me that you actually work at it. You go out of your way to be mean to me and that is so hurtful. You blame me for the kids feelings but here are some points on why they think the way they do about some things. I can never say this to you on the phone because you hang up every time you don't like what I say but think about this. Yes I do wrong and I do wrong a lot and yes I make mistakes. I am human and the difference in you and I is I will admit to mine. Think about these.
They have seen you yell at me for years and at them
They have seen you punch a hole in a wall.
They have seen you roll my arm up in a window.
They have heard you scream you hate me on the front porch.
They have watched me cry and pray for our family to be whole.
They have seen you with your mistress.
They have watched me take you back and forgive you all the time.
They see how you disrespect me.
They see how you turn from God and turn on your vows to him.
They see the one that is walking out without even giving counseling a shot is you.
They see how I work so hard to take care of five children.
They see I am the one to feed them, clothe them, help with homework, get them to school.
They know who is there when they have a bad dream and when they need a shoulder to cry on.
Your children believe what they believe because they see what is going on everyday.
They have tried to call you and had you not answer.
They have emailed you and gotten no response.
Stop feeling sorry for yourself for five minutes and look at all the damage you are causing.
Well needless to say he was a bit upset but the funny thing is that tonight is his night with the kids and when he came over he was nicer than he had been in forever.
He watches them here on Thursday nights so he saw me all dressed up and looking good. He asked where I was going and my son blurts out. She is going to dinner with Ben. (Ben is a friend of mine). My husband was so jealous and played 50 questions. I was evasive. When i got him he lingered here a bit and acted as if he didn't want to go but I sort of shoved him out the door. (it was so hard i wanted to take him to bed)
I am more determined than ever to not contact him for the next several days. i think if we have any hope at all it will be through my ability to let go of the control and let him see me change.
Thanks for reading the lengthy post.
Why does it have to be so hard to fight off the urge to call him? I have asked before with little response but what are some of things that you all do to cut off the phone and email contact? I just want to scream because I am so darn weak. I literally have to leave him alone it is crucial and yet I self talk myself and justify reasons to call him.
Why does it have to be so hard to fight off the urge to call him?
I think because at that time, we are quite literally addicted to that person and contacting them is what our addiction demands. Why does someone who can barely breathe suck smoke into their lungs? Why does someone with 4 DUI's continue to drink? Addictions push us to do things we know are bad for us. The best defintion I've ever heard of an addiction, and I've heard many in the course of working on my own, is that it's a physical compulsion combined with a mental obsession. So not only do you have a physical craving for it (your comment about wanting to take him to bed) but you can't stop thinking about it (this speaks for itself).
Also, check out the stuff on
http://www.coping.org about codependency and detachment, there's some interesting info there. I don't fully subscribe to everything on that website but I do think there is some good insight.
Oh, and I meant to say that I don't think you failed by contacting your H about your kid. That seems like a natural thing to do given the situation. But, since you have told him that you won't do that anymore, you've closed that door. So don't do it. I have a good friend here that lets me send her e-mails that I want to send to my W. That way, I can get the crap out of my system, have the satisfaction of hitting send, but I don't have to deal with any of the fall out from W. Try it, it really does work. If you don't have someone there you can send it to, let me know.
Thanks Bryan for your advice. I am trying. I just hit another brick wall and failed again. I know I am only 6 weeks into this but wow I just suck at it.
My husbands mistress just called me to let me know he spent the night with her last night. (They supposedly broke up on Monday). I think she is toying with me just to hurt me. He however would protect her to death even though its over according to her. He told me this morning when we talked that he slept in his car.
Instead of just taking her jabs I then called him (BIG MISTAKE) and asked him why he lied and he went off about me checking up on him and it spiraled from there.
I got myself together came back to my desk to pay the phone bill and found he has locked me out of the account. I called him crying about that (BIG MISTAKE)
I am hopeless. I need to get a plan and get goals and let go but I am finding it so darn hard to do so. I am finding it so hard to let go of the man I love and gave my life to. I really need help. My biggest problem is that my family hates him and they are not supportive and 1400 miles away anyway.
I really have no one here except him, his family, his friends, and etc. I do have my church but no one I am extremely close with. I feel like I am an island out in the middle of the ocean with nothing but water surrounding me, sucking me in, and drowning me.
I need to snap out of my pity party but I am so alone it makes it hard.
Wow. I'm so sorry for your situation.
I'm really glad, just on a LBS level, that you "read him the riot act" with that email. Sounds like he had it coming.
I have only two quick comments/suggestions for you:
1. If he didnt already understand: make it clear to him, that his mistress called YOU, not the other way around. Offer to prove it, if you have means of doing so like a callerID log.
2. Avoid useless or self-hurting questions.
"Why did you lie", is a useless question, There is no way you can reasonably expect any kind of useful answer out of that.
You didnt even technically know that he lied to start with. But even if he did... what did you expect to achieve by asking the question?
Avoid non-productive questions. they only stir up drama
oh, and PS: sounds like, in reponse to your son's counsellor's questions, that he WAS "abusive" towards you in your marriage.
It might be interesting to talk with the counsellor, and describe in unbiased, strictly factual terms what was done, and get that person's take on it.
If they say "yes"... then the next time your H rants at you about "always painting him as the bad guy", etc, etc... simply point out, that you told the counsellor that he did A, B, and C, and that according to [him/her], that is abusive. SO yes, he IS "the bad guy".
In addition to what Dom said, stop beating yourself up for making mistakes. Are you making them: sure. Is it productive to berate yourself for them: no. Stop it. You made them, OK. Move on, make some decisions about what you want, what you need, and what you can put up with and act accordingly.
I think you would benefit from an hour this weekend of just sitting by yourself with a cup of coffee (or your favorite beverage) and seriously thinking goals and means. No interruptions, nothing else but you and your plan. Get it cemented in your head that this is who you are and this is your plan and your H does not need to do ANYTHING to make this happen for you. You make it happen. Somewhere along the way, you gave your H power over your feelings and I think he's demonstrated that he can't be trusted to use that power responsibly. So take it back. That's my suggestion.
Thank you both so much. I sat tonight with some friends and they really hit a lot of these points also.
I am a very self sacrificing person. I don't really know even who i am anymore. I have lost myself in who I needed to be for him.
I am just not sure where to start. I was asked tonight what was holding me back from moving on and GAL and the answer I came up with was because i am afraid I will lose H forever. How silly is that. I have already lost him forever so I really have nothing to lose and everything to gain by improving. I just need to figure out where to start.
I think part of me is afraid that if I change and move on I will realize how badly I was treated and I wont want my marriage. I know that really sounds warped but I get scared that I might find I am happier without him and that terrifies me as to what that will do to my kids.
Yeah, I think that's warped but then I must be warped too because similar thoughts have crossed my mind. I don't have kids so I'm sure it's even worse with that to think about as well. My heart goes out to you.
My mom told me something a while back that might help you out. I was stressing about W and what if I do something wrong, what if I say something wrong, what if what if what if. She said "She's gone, you've already lost her, so do anything cause you have nothing left to lose". That really brought me some peace. I was so busy trying to change the situation and make it be something it wasn't that I was wearing myself out. Instead, if I accept that it's already gone, I'm free of the stress because it's out of my hands. And, as a bonus, I'm free to do things for me which may in turn actually bring back what I lost. May not but maybe it will.
I don't know if you're familiar with "The Secret" but there's something in there that I keep thinking about. What you resist, persists. I was fighting so hard against getting a D (and still am in some regards) that I was actually bringing it closer to happening. Instead, the more turn my energy towards fighting for the M, the more successful I become. Instead of fighting against the stream, I use it's momentum to help me make small changes in the current. Homer McDonald refers to this as jujitsu. It's hard and I'm by no means perfect (read my thread for proof of that
) so I'm not lecturing. In fact, maybe I'm talking more to myself than to anyone else. I do think there is value in this though which is why I'm passing it on.
What is the link to your thread? I would love to read it because I have a feeling you are the one person that might be able to make some since to me.
SO I blew it again today. He took his mistress back again and I threw a fit like an idiot. I am beginning to think I deserve what I get because I am not even surviving divorce busting for one day much less a week.
I have misplaced both DR and DB from last time this happened and I think I am going to purchase those again
Original Thread (no longer updated) Current Thread The first one is short and kind of explains my sitch. The second is the most recent and the one that I'm updating. I thought it best to keep everything to one thread after I got over the initial spastic "oh my God, please help me!" stage. I don't think there's any great insights in anything I wrote but you're welcome to look.
Ok so today I went to church and the first thing i see is a father walking his handicapped child to class. I realized my trials were nothing in comparison.
I then went into church and I heard a mother tell a story of her 5 year old dying last week and I realized my pain does not compare.
I then made the decision that I was going to be a single mom and I was going to be good at it. I decided that the crying was over. I felt peace for the first time in my life. I am almost scared by the calmness I feel. I feel like I can let God take this situation over and I really am 100% sure he will see me through it.
I wrote a 7 page letter in church to my husband and then called him and read it. It was so unbelievable to just tell him. You are free. I am done. i will not call... I will not email I do not want to feel the pain anymore. I am OK. He didn't say a word or get angry just listened to me. At the end we hung up and I honestly can say I am going to be ok. The best part is I am not just saying it. I am feeling it. I feel safe and secure knowing I can do this with or without him.
My goals for today
1)take kids to church
2) take kids to park
3) Get laundry caught up
4) Read my bible 30 minutes
5) Take 30 minutes out for me and just enjoy my quiet time when the kids are in bed.
6) make the kids sleep in their own bed to gain some normalcy back.
7) Make NO phone calls to husband for any reason at all.
I will let you know tonight how I do.
Just when I think I am ready to let go....
15 Minutes after I hung up he called me back and asked if he could come see me. Stupid me should have said no but I said yes. He came over and told me he missed me and the kids and wanted to come back. He said that he can't live without us. We ended up spending the day together and it was great and then......
He and I ended up in bed and the minute we had sex he got up and went absolutely insane he started freaking out and said I just cheated on my girlfriend. I can't believe i did that i am terrible and it went on and on and he told me he was going to kill himself.
I told him I could not stand and go through this anymore and that he needed to calm down and he got in his car and took off. 3 hours later I got a call that he is in the psychiatric unit at a local hospital. He is refusing to see me and says that the reason he wants to kill himself is all my fault.
I feel like such a piece of trash right now. I honestly think that the only thing left for me to do is just completely cut him off until he gets help. I mean no answering phone, no letting him come over, and NO getting in bed with him.
It is so hard to love someone so much but what he is doing is wrong. He told my kids he was coming back and now he is telling me to tell them he never will. I am not telling them anything. they can't take it.
So my question is. Am I wrong in thinking that maybe this battle is fought out? Am I wrong in feeling like it may be better to just let him divorce me without trying to get him back? I believe in my vows in sickness and health but I feel there are some deal breakers such as abandonment, abuse, and repetitive adultery and he has done all of that.
Any opinions?
Well, last night my kids called him to say goodnight at the hospital and I didn't ask to talk to him. I felt empowered by that but then today his mom and his boss called with all these questions so i had to call him. I did and it was ok until I was an idiot and said can I come see you tonight and he said I am not sure. I said how will I know? He said I may call you....
At this point I feel like I am hanging on the line again. I want to scream. I know I am probably best to just not call or not show up right? What is your opinion? I just feel like I need to be there in his time of need but then I feel like he doesnt want me there.
I want to strangle the other woman but I know that I cant do that so I am just sick to my stomach.
Can someone reassure me that this yucky feeling inside my gut goes away??
I think it goes away if only because you'll get sick of making yourself sick and make no mistake, you are making yourself sick. Amy, if you're going to be serious about cutting him off (as you stated) you have to do a better job of prepping yourself to do that. What I mean is, maybe you did have to call him today but if that's true, did you run through it in your head first? Did you tell yourself that you were going to talk about exactly what needed to be said and nothing more? Did you remind yourself to be calm, clear and detached? Did you take deep breaths, remind yourself of your goals and move from there? If you fail to prepare, prepare to fail.
You know this stuff, you know what you have to do. I'm not lecturing you, God knows I'd be the pot calling the kettle black, I'm just trying to remind you that you cannot go halfway with this thing. This sometimes strong, sometimes needy thing you're doing is only going to make it that much harder for you down the road. He's (rightly) seeing this behavior as a lack of commitment on your part to change and when he starts to see sincere change in the future, he won't believe it because he's seen this back and forth too many times. Eventually, when he does believe it, things may be too late for you. Do yourself a favor, take yourself off the roller coaster.
Thank you Bryan. I would give you a big hug if I was there. I need someone to set me straight every now and then. I am seriously not going to call him anymore. I am so frustrated right now that I could scream.
My son called the hospital tonight to say goodnight and they said that he had checked out. I can't believe he didn't let his kids know.
I think I have finally hit the angry point and I I really don't want to talk to him so not calling him will be easy at least for a day or two.
So much has happened this week I feel like I am in the midst of a hurricane and just getting by right now.
On Tuesday my son called the hospital to tell my H goodnight only to find out he had checked himself out. On Wednesday night I picked up a vm that his mom had left saying she hoped he had fun on his ski trip with the OW. She was glad she could help pay for it and she overnighted him more money. This is right after he told me he was coming home on Sunday and then hospitalized.
I realized at that moment I had no choice but to get out of where I was. His parents which were my support (or so I thought) were funding his affair while I was at home with 5 heartbroken children and no money for even groceries.
Thursday morning I let my childrens school know that as soon as I had the money I was leaving and going home out of the state. By that night I had almost 2k in donations and the uhaul loaded. I figured that it definately was a sign from God because how else could this have happened. Well this morning I sit 1300 miles away from my house even more heartbroken and wondering if I made the write choice or if I have really messed up.
He did call from the mountains yesterday and told me how he hated that I was taking his kids just to hurt him and that I was mean and cruel and etc. I tried to tell him that he needed to get help for his illness and I felt that we were in the best place financially, emotionally, and physically for right now. He hung up and I haven't heard from him since. I still want my marriage to work but I really think he needed a wakeup call. I think he needs to relize he needs HELP.
Any advice as to where to go from here?
I just talked to his mom and she said that he told her that he wants to work on things with me. I have no idea if she is lying or what. I know I don't really trust her anymore. I can't. she has lied way to much.
What did she lie about? The trip thing was a little underhanded but maybe it wasn't exactly what you thought it was.
I think you made the right call getting yourself out of the situation. It was a tough decision to make, I'm sure. Just reading your posts, you were falling apart where you were.
She has lied about so much that it is hard to even begin. She told me Tuesday night that he was still in the hospital and she had visited him and he was in good spirits. She had checked him out at 5PM taken him to dinner and sent him on his way with his girlfriend.
That is just one of the recent ones that really got me.
I have slept most of the afternoon and my head is a bit clearer. I really am at the point that I just need to figure out what I am doing and what I want. I love my husband and I would love nothing more than my family but when I look at all the lies, deception, and hurt I honestly am not sure at this point if I am even strong enough to get past that. I am not sure I can take the thought of a life looking over my shoulder wondering what he is doing.
I feel like I deserve so much more than that. Maybe if he gets help he and I can start over and who knows but for now I honestly don't even want to take his phone calls until he gets his self under control.
I know for each step forward there are two back so I am sure the days that lie ahead are not easy but I also know that at least now I am trying to move forward because for the past six weeks I have just been spinning my wheels.
I spent today at my brothers farm. My cell doesnt reach there which was a blessing probably.
When I left it was like clockwork. He called me and talked to the kids. Then he and I talked. He bashed me some more about taking his kids and moving and etc. I told him he had to take care of him and he had some tough choices to make. I told him I was here for him but that I couldn't make his choices.
At the end of the conversation I told him I would pray for him and he said yeah you should.. Pray I don't kill myself. I told him that if he felt he had to do that it was the most selfish thing he could do but that I couldn't stop him nor would I carry the guilt for his decisions. He then hung up. I know it was just an idle threat but it is still hard to go to bed tonight with that being the last thing he said to me.
Well I got word he is back at his parents house so I am sure by now he will have seen the home empty and realize the kids and I are gone. He has not contacted us. I am not sure if that is good or not because the silence is so scarey.
It's good. If he were talking to you, he'd probably be yelling at you and that's not a good thing. So, no talking = no yelling = good thing. He's got a lot of issues Amy, lots of things he needs to work out with a professional before he should be allowed anywhere near you or your kids. You're his wife, not his therapist, his nurse, his maid, whatever. You can't fix him and it sounds like there is something broken there. You're doing the right things, hang in there.
Well, he called an hour ago and was utterly calm. I asked him if he saw the house and he said yes. I said I was sorry I know it had to be hard to see it empty. I told him I did what I had to do for the kids. He said he does not begrudge me for taking the kids. He sounded very calm and peaceful and honestly I am more scared with that than the chaos because I have no idea what his next move is. I am just going to keep on praying because I know that works.
Thanks for the support. I am a basket case. I am a wreck when he calls and a wreck when he doesn't... Go figure....
The kids called to tell him good morning this morning and to have a good day. He was chipper and said good morning and told them he loved them. It was on speaker.
When I got home I had an email thanking me for helping start his day off better. Its a start.
One thing and this is something I have to tell myself all the time: your happiness should not depend on him. I found my moods rolling along with whatever W did that day (and they still do to some extent) and I got tired of it. I got tired of not being able to decide when I was going to be happy and when I was going to be upset. I did some reading and came to see that what was going on with me was classic codependency. So, I had to work at decoupling my happiness from what she did. Not perfect at it at all but I am better. You seem to be into prayer and that's good because that's how I did it. I just prayed for her to be taken care of and for the stregth to live my life on my own. I had to detach or I was going to drive myself nuts.
OK, so I lied, I have a second thing. Have you noticed that your ability to stay "insane" about a situation has fallen? Initially, I would let my mind run wild on me for a week or more when things with her weren't going well. Now, I get a day, maybe two and then I seem to snap out of it. Either I make a choice and can stick to it or I wake up feeling a lot better than I did the night before. Just curious if that is happeneing for anyone else.
I am very up and down right now. I really need to work on detatching. Funny you should use the codependent word because I was told I am VERY Codependent by my last therapist. I am up and down with his moods. I really need to figure out how to function without him.
I am finding that I am afraid to move on. I am afraid to find a job and be happy because I am scared I will be ok not wanting him. I am scared I will move on and I will be ok without him. Do I sound insane? Part of me is petrified that I can exist without him and I don't want to....
So my very immediate problem is my mother HATES my husband and wont even begin to forgive him or even see his side of things. She has now taken all of our family photos out of her house. This hurts me to the core and makes me SO mad at her. I just want to pack up my kids and move. Of course I cant but I am just so flippin upset with her right now.
I know that he has done a lot wrong but with her negative attitude and unforgiving heart how in the world am I to mend this and get my kids to understand he isnt all bad?
Help
I am finding that I am afraid to move on. I am afraid to find a job and be happy because I am scared I will be ok not wanting him. I am scared I will move on and I will be ok without him. Do I sound insane? Part of me is petrified that I can exist without him and I don't want to....
Amy, this is the same fear you were talking about over a week ago (page 3). A week isn't very much time and it's a big fear that I understand but what are you doing to deal with it? It's good to get these things out in the open and to be able to talk in a friendly enviornment. Eventually, you're gonna want to do something more than talk about it though, you're going to want to make it stop. So, are you ready for it to stop yet?
In answer to your questions. I am ready. I think the straw that broke the camels back happened tonight. I honestly have to move on. He is sick and I can't live on his coat tails anymore.
Tomorrow I am going to do my best to apply for jobs and go from there. One day at a time I guess.
Can't say much except I have just hit rock bottom!
THE OTHER WOMAN CLAIMS SHE IS PREGNANT WITH MY HUSBANDS BABY!!
i am so sorry for you, Amy
He is so distraught and suicidal right now. I don't know what to do. He says he loves me but I don't know. He says he wants to come here but he is torn. Is this a game because he is now freaked out down there with her? What do I do? Is it time to just go dark and let go? Should I just divorce him? I love him and I could even get past this and love this baby but I can't ride this roller coaster. What do I do?? Has anyone been here? Does anyone know what I should do? I am litterally spinning out of control.
Bad night.. can't sleep. I don't know what to do. I am just so lost. I feel like I am just going to crumble. I just wish I knew what was right. I mean at this point if she is pregnant do I just walk away? Do I have a right to fight for a man that has a baby on the way? Is that fair to her? I am just falling apart.
I guess you need to figure out what you want. I don't think there's anything "right" for you to do. If you still love him and want to be with, keep that goal in mind. If not, don't. It's up to you, there are no right or wrong answers.
I think you should maintain your distance right now. He's got a lot of things to work through and he's going to want to run away from that work. Don't let him.
I'm really sorry.
Well, I think the hands off approach is what it will have to be. I guess I have no choice. He sliced his wrist 7 times last night. I think I have to just let go and let God. He is very sick and I am in danger if I pursue him right now.
(((Amy)))
Wow, just wow.
I finally read your stich. I would like to say a couple of things, this is strictly my opinion of course
1. It took ALOT of guts and strenght to get yourself out of that whole situation. Be proud of yourself that you were able to find the strength to realize this. I truly think you did make the right choice for you and your kids. I know you will second guess yourself, but don't.
2. I think I have your personalty figured out. You want to help everyone around you and do the right thing, and especially for the ones you love....
Do I have a right to fight for a man that has a baby on the way? Is that fair to her?
that says it right there. You are actually thinking what is fair to the OW. Wow, that takes a lot of character. Listen, she is not part of your decision in the least! She did not care that your H had 5 kids at home when she decided to have an affair with your H, she should in no way impact YOUR feelings or decision. You do what is best for YOU.
3. This one in important. Your H is mentally ill, YOU CAN NOT HELP HIM WITH THIS. Until he is ready to realize that he has serious problems, they will not go away. As much as you want to help him, you can't ( I have had some experience with my H and depression, I was always thinking I could help him get better, it wasn't until my theripist told me that no matter what I did, I could not because it is an illness, not just a feeling). He needs to address this with himself and get the help he really needs.
With alot of the questions you are asking, should I just move on? should I fight for him?
These are questions only you can answer, and trust me your answers will change for the next while at least. These are not easy things to answer. It will take time. You need to be patient, especially with yourself. You are going through so many things at once. Try to to answer everything today. For a while, it will be a day at a time, maybe even an hour at a time.
Don't know if this was of any help. My prayers are with you
Take care of yourself Amy
Ditto to what sigh said.
a bit of spot emphasis:
That woman has a baby on the way?
you have **six children**, that she has devastated the lives of.
She is an unfit mother.
He is YOUR husband.
durn tootin you have a right to fight for him.
Well I guess I should clarify something that I haven't told you all. This is baby number 8. He has two children from a prior marriage that I do most all the work to communicate and take care of. His Xwife and I are very close. This is the second time he has done this. This is baby number 8!!!!!!!
I am so ticked at him right now. It is the first time I have gotten ticked. I sent him an email I may regret but boy did it feel good to write. Here is what I sent. Sorry for the length but thanks in advance for your opinions.
The last few days, weeks, months have been a roller coaster for me that I can not longer ride. I can not do the ups and the downs. The I love yous and I don't love yous. I am coming back and I am not coming back anymore. I am finished. I am truly finished. I really love you. Way more than is even healthy for me but I can no longer go on like this. What I have learned is that while loving you I have stopped loving myself. I have no self respect. I am embarrassed of myself. I can no longer be the other woman in my own marriage. I can not live with you out making babies with someone else and choosing her and that baby over me and your own children. You say that you didn't leave the children but Joey that is a cop out. Marriage is forever and when someone leaves a marriage they leave their family. Any way you want to look at it to make it easier on you is fine but you did leave them. You left all of us. Your own selfish desires for self gratification, sexual pleasure, and shear not wanting responsibility caused you to abandon your family which includes a wife and five absolutely beautiful children that love you so much. I would put money on the fact that within the next 8 years you will do the same to Lynne and God only hopes you stop having children by then because what kind of life are any of them going to have with a dad that bails on them like you do.
I am backing out. I will not ask you back again. I will not fight for you. I will do my best to not call you. I will let you live the life you want with Lynne and this baby if there is one and if it is yours. You have repeated history again and instead of breaking the cycle you have chosen to continue it. You have done to this family the same thing you did to Lisa and those kids but this time it is worse because you have put your children through the verbal abuse of saying you will come back and then the next day calling them liars by saying you didn't say it. I do nothing but tell them how you love them and how you are sick but honestly at this point you are using your bipolar as a crutch and I choose to not enable you anymore. Your illness messes with your heart, mind, and feelings but at some point you have to grow up and you have to decide what is morally right and you have to work on it to fix it. You know what you are doing is wrong. You told me you know it is. On judgement day you will have to answer for that and until then I hope you when you go to bed each night having missed out on the ball games, the laughter, the first girlfriends and boyfriends, prom night, music concerts, the homework, the hugs, and the kisses you can live with your decision. I hope each time you sleep with her and put your arms around her you think of the little pattering feet that run into our bed and jump in during the middle of the night that you have chosed to give up. Am I saying that to guilt you? You bet your butt I am because if you live one day without guilt you are not the father I think you are. You should be sick with guilt. You should be torn up in side. You can say I am not a Christian but God says to confront a sinner and the problem with all of this is that everyone is so worried about fragile Joey they don't let him know the cold hard facts. It is your duty to God and your family to work on your current family. It is your duty to your children to be here with them. You know what you have done and yet you are enjoying the self gratification that you are getting out of this other woman so much so that you have destroyed your children's lives. I hope that you can look in the mirror each day know what you have done. I hope that when you see them grow up in photos and your visits here and there you will understand that you made that choice.
You have made these choices not me, not your parents, no one but you. We could have worked it out. You NEVER gave me the benifit of counseling. You refused therapy. You did nothing to work things out with us you just QUIT! YOU QUIT ME AND YOU QUIT YOUR KIDS! Joey in our relationship/marriage I have supported you through Sonia, Martha, Tunvee, Charity, and Lynne and Until now I have always been willing to take you back overlook and forgive you.
Today was the end though for me. When you promised our children last night you would be coming back and then today called them liars. If you want to attack, belittle, and physically and mentally hurt me that is one thing but when you do it to my babies well that's where I draw the line. They deserve better than to be drug through your self pity, dramatic, and psychotic episodes. You wonder why I left XXX state and that is because you did this to them on a weekly basis. You continuously told them you were coming back and then lashed out at me in anger. You left the state to go on a vacation with your girlfriend over seeing your children for their visitation weekend. You LIED about it to me and them and just didn't show up. IT IS SO SICK!!!! What is even more sick is that I was going to forgive you again.
Which brings me to my next point. Why do you always take your nastiness and anger out on me. I am the one that sits there beside you and loves you beyond anything. I am the one that accepts you and all of your faults and was still willing to love you beyond each of them. I was willing to work two jobs to support you let you do what you want take care of you but you choose Lynne over me... the kids... our family... and your vows to God. You completely have destroyed us. You dumped your children for this other woman. You threw them out like yesterdays trash. You have destroyed Andrew and Austin and the girls are hurting also. You make me sick how you cant keep your XXXX in your pants when any woman out there gives you a second glance. You have such little self confidence that someone gives you any attention and you are in their bed.
I am ready to let you out of this marriage. Please if you want out go ahead and file for divorce I will not try to stop you. I will be doing whatever necessary to let you out of thei marriage and yet make sure I am financially able to take care of the kids on my own. I know that if they get they same attention as your oldest son and daughter have from you they will never hear from you so I will need to do what I can to be both mom and dad until we find someone that enters our life (hopefully as loving as Eddie has been to Joely and Wesley) and then I will be able to give the children the real family they deserve. You see Joey with you I loved you so much I didn't even look at all the pain.. all the hurt.. and all the lack of being there that I went through. How many times did you help with homework? How many baths did you help with? How many times did you help me with anything to do with them? You sat, played your computer, ran around with other women, and neglected all of us. And even through that I was dumb enough to stand there and take it all. I finally woke up today. For God's sake if she is so important that you are crazy enough to jump out of a moving car on the interstate to get to her then go to her and leave me and these kids alone. Stop hurting them by making false promises. Stop making them cry. You made your choice so live with it but STOP hurting us please.
I want someone that does the following for me. I want someone that is mature, self motivated, and emotionally secure. I want someone to be my friend and companion. I don't need gifts, money, or material things to make me happy. You know this because you sure never did any of that for me and I still loved you. I am looking for someone that is secure enough with his own identity to handle my strong personality. I am determined, controlling, and strong willed and I know that. While I like to get my way I want to find someone tough enough to stand up to me and yet gentle enough to know when to give in. You see you blamed me for all of these things but you never stood up. You never tried. You just quit your family. You could never make the smallest decision and when I did you just turned around and called me controlling. You forced my hand because if I didnt do it it didn't get done. I have been the one that has totally cared for your son and daughter and you are a freaking liar by telling xwife you asked me to pick things up for them. 99% of the time you didn't even know what I sent to them and the other 1% I had to beg you to sign a card to them so it had your handwriting and I still have some in a box I addressed and put stamps on you never bothered to sign. Stop freaking lying. YOU HAVE NOT BEEN THERE FOR THEM. You walked out on xwife and said here ya go xwife you have 2 kids raise them on your own and now You just walked out and said here ya go Amy raise 5 kids on your own. I am out of this marriage because you didn't treat me 100% perfectly. I need what makes me happy and to hell with what makes you or the kids happy. I am sick and I have bipolar so I just can't be here anymore. Stop using that as a crutch. I know so many people that are success stories because THEY STOPPED THEIR PITY PARTIES AND MADE IT HAPPEN!!!!!!! GET OVER IT!!!!!! GROW UP!!!! You didnt want to kill yourself last night you wanted attention. You slashed your wrist multiple times so you could get some sympathy If you wanted to be dead you would have been so stop the child's play, grow up , and do something right for once. Stop making everyone around you scared to even speak to you.
If you think this letter is tough well you are darn right it is. I am sick of walking on eggshells. I am not asking you to come back again. I am not going to beg you or take care of you. You want to be on your own you are on your own. You want a divorce lets start living it. You need to pay me 800 per paycheck starting with the next one. This is what the courts said you will pay. You will have to figure it out how you will live from there. You are going to have about 600 per month after paying child support for 7 kids. I hope thats enough left for baby number 8. I will talk to you about your bills when you are ready to take them on but I will no longer sit here and be mentally abused and take care of your finances and be your secretary while you are sleeping with another woman. If everything you own gets repossesed that is your problem. I am sorry but I have more self respect than that. If you want your crap done for you then see how much OW will do for you. I think you will find real quick that I was one in a million when it comes to bailing you out.
You are either in or out and the time to decide is over. I am asking you to file for divorce this week. I will be moving on. I will start dating and find that special someone that can be what the kids and I need. A constant, someone to help with homework, attend ball games, and show the children their mother can be loved. Some to hold me when I am sad. Someone that allows me to have a bad day because he loves me enough to not make it all about him. I have never had that. I have never been truly loved and by golly I am ready for it. I have never been so sure or so content in my life. I know that God doesn't want divorce but God doesn't want someone to sit and be mentally and physically abused like I have been. What you are doing to the kids and i may not be physical abuse anymore but it is mental and that is so much worse. The mental scars take so much longer to heal. I don't know if some of what you have done will ever heal.
Our son is sitting and crying right now. He crys all day and night. He is broken and sad. He is in the counselors office at school everyday worried about his daddy. He keeps saying you promised you would come. YOU ARE KILLING OUR SON!!!!!!!
I am done now I am letting you go. I will leave you alone. You have proven what you want. You are in her arms while I am wiping our childrens tears. I am going to go cuddle and play with our five children and let them know that mommy is here nomatter what and you well you can just give OW that reassurance because that was your choice.
You have until Tuesday to file to give me one good reason why I shouldn't file myself on Wednesday and it better be a real qood reason. Because anything other than you walking through fire to save our marriage will not be accepted. I took and took and took the pain but you have now hurt our babies and that I where I draw the line. You know how to reach me so the ball is in your court. You have 3 days.
Amy
He called again with a guilt trip last night. I let him talk to my kids on the phone and he told them I stole them by leaving the state. I think its time we don't take his calls for a while. He is really hurting my kids.
I had an 8 am with my counselor this morning. She has given me a list of things I need to do. I am not sure I agree with them She is the only christian counselor in town and well...
1) turn phones off take and make no calls to him.
2) do not allow him to call the kids
3) Only allow the kids to call him if they want to and set timer for 5 minutes. Keep on speaker phone if he acts inappropriately hang up.
4) Find a church family here
5)FILE FOR DIVORCE.
Ok so why can I not find a counselor promarriage. I guess maybe divorce is the only answer. I liked her because she didn't sugar coat things for me but I didn't necessarily like what she had to say. UGH.......
I need to catch up on your sitch stat! Whoa! Are you going to follow that advice? How do you feel?
Well, I have to tell you I am beginning to think I am the one that needs to be committted. I don't know. I keep changing my mind up and down and back and forth.
One minute I am so mad at him I want to just get rid of him and never see him again. I hate that he has the audacity to call me from his girlfriends house. I hate that he can actually tell me he loves both of us.
Then there are days like today when he calls me sobbing and says he misses me and the kids and he is being checked back into the hospital for another suicide attempt. He told me he loved me and not to give up on him. I said what are you saying and he said I dont know. I am not sure what I want. Then he says I am sorry I hurt you. He then just begged me to continue to be nice to him and promised me he would figure things out soon. I just said ok and hung up.
My mother in law told me that the OW has said she is going to have an abortion. For whatever that is worth. I don't think she is pregnant but she is trying so hard to convince him and controls him with guilt and her threats of suicide so he just can't walk away. She too is bipolar so they feed of each other. As much as he is being a selfish jerk I also know that he is very sensitive and I think his guilt is killing him right now.
I did get a new cell phone today in the state I am in and did not give him the number. I felt it was best that I have backup in case he turned mine off. As for ignoring his calls I don't know what to do. Part of me thinks I should and part of me doesnt. I know that I will not call him. I am going to let him work things out and come to me. I have no choice but to do that. I guess I will decide when the phone rings rather or not to take his calls. I know that if I am the least bit upset I shouldn't because right now his state of mind is so fragile and I do not want to hurt him at all.
Crazy I know because I am dying in pain but I still can't bear the thought of causing someone else pain.
The really hard thing for me here is that I am dealing with not only a WAS but one with a mental illness that hasn't been properly medicated. While so many of thise techniques are great there are also very many that just simply don't work when you are dealing with someone that is out of their mind.
I am going to keep praying. Keep my kids protected. Keep loving my husband from afar and continue to build my own life so that I can function with or without him.
I am just so lost. Can any of you give me some good advice here?
My son talked to my husband today on speaker phone of course because I monitor what he tells them. He sounded so sad and so broken. My 9 yr old gave him hell. I felt bad but I was told by the therapist to let him express himself so I did. He told my husband he was making bad choices. My husband told him that he wasn't sure he could get past the nagging I did and my son said you have a girlfriend and mom is willing to forgive you. Everything my H said my S came back with something. It was hard to listen to really.
He finally just said Dad I don't want to talk to you if you are going to be this way and he hung up.
I didn't call back but wanted to. I don't know what to do. I feel so bad for my husband but I feel also like he made his bed and he will have to take what the kids toss at him.
Why do I feel this need to protect him and take care of him? He has committed adultry multiple times. Walked out on me and verbally abused me and yet I still want to take care of him.
My question is what advice do you give me as of now. Do I just continue to not talk to him? Should I send him a get well card? I don't know how to deal with this.
Thanks. I needed that. I am going crazy. I keep trying to make up reasons to need to talk to him and I just have to stay away. I will let you know how it goes.
((((Amy)))) I had no idea all that you were going through! I looked for you a few times on here but didn't find you. Thanks so much for stopping by my thread.
Sweetie you have been through so much lately! I am so sorry things are going this way for you.
You did fantastic at physically moving away from the situation. You HAVE to move away from it emotionally (as much as you can), spiritually and mentally. I know how difficult it is to free the man you love, but it may be the only way that he will come back.
Your H is a very ill person. Due to his illness he is poisoning you and your children. You MUST stand in the gap for your kids. They need to see health. They need to see wellness. They need to see and feel love. You are the only one that can provide them with that, right now. I don't know if your H will ever pull himself together. But you cannot be apart of the problem or the solution. This is his deal. His pain. His hurt. His illness.
In the last few weeks you have told him repeatedly that you are not going to contact him, speak to him, stand for any of this. So stop. Don't. Do what you say you are going to do. You have to let him feel rage, let him be with OW, let him live his life without his kids and with his parents. You have the best part of your life with him - your children. They need the best part of your marriage - you.
Amy, I'm not telling you anything new. This is the same stuff you were going through over the summer. Don't let yourself be controlled by him. You are responsible for you and your actions, just as he is for his. You are both adults and can only control yourselves.
Go open a bank account in your name only. Get a job. Join a church. Make some friends. Speak to your mother about how you feel disappointed and hurt that she took your photos out of the house, but understand at the same time that she loves you,cares for you, and doesn't want to see the pain you are going through. Leave it there. Don't ask her to put them back, accept that she loves you and this is the manner in which she is showing it. Read a book - a fun one. Write a list of dreams (not necessarily goals - dreams for your life and don't include H.) Find a new hobby. Go to the library. Put down roots in your community for the sake of your children. Sign them up for a sport or after school club so they can make friends quickly. Begin living a healthy lifestyle. Plan Halloween customes for and with your kids, give them something to look forward to and live for. Take them pumpkin picking, apple picking, plan a special time just for all of you to regroup.
Amy, you have to pull yourself together. A note about the counselor: I had a similar experience with a Christian marriage counselor - she advised me right away to separate from my H. I wasn't in any state to do so, and I didn't. I kind of kick myself now. I think if he had seen how serious I was about him stopping his behavior, we may be in a different place than we are now. I'll never know if that's true, but the counselor I saw, saw something in me that I couldn't. She saw that my H was poisoning me mentally. Your counselor's main focus is to get you healthy. A healthy marriage will come after that. If you aren't comfortable filing for divorce, don't. But do the other things on your list that you are comfortable with. When you see her again, express that you weren't ready to make that step yet, but you did the other stuff....
(((((AMY)))) Hang in there. You have made great strides.
Please don't take my words harshly. They aren't intended to hurt. I just feel for you and can see that you CAN pull yourself and your kids out of this mess. You have the power to make some changes. You know what to do.
I'll check on you again in a little while.
EM
Amy, you then should meet the goals set forth by your TH. Ths have seen these sitches before. You are pretty insightful into the bipolar mind. It soulds like you know you can no longer be an enabler or a mother to this sitch. You really do have to take care of yourself and go dark.
Thank you both so much. I was smacked with reality tonight and for the first time I am feeling such anger I could SCREAM. My 9 yr old called the hospital to talk with his dad. (my son is bipolar as well and really seems to do better after a conversation with his dad) When one of the patients answered the phone my son said "Can I speak with XXX XXXX he is my dad." The person said to him. It is family time and he is with his girlfriend he is not accepting calls. MY son was devastated and I am done. The cell phones went off and I am so mad right now if I never hear from him again it will be too soon. I will be writing my resume tomorrow. Pursuing a job big time and moving toward my goals. My children deserve better than the slaps in the face he is giving them.
Wednesday I have the nerve study done on my arm that he repeatedly crushed a month ago and I am hoping no permanent nerve damage has been done. I can't believe the crap I have taken in the name of love. I am so mad right now. I hate what happened to my son but in a way I think it was a sign from God that I needed to get angry and get my self together. Edie thanks for stopping by I have missed you. Thank you all for your advice. I feel like you are my family. I love you for the support you give me.
Hugs
Amy,
I am so sorry to hear the latest news.
I know that you love your H and you can't stand to watch him destroy himself but you can not put yourself or your kids in jeopardy. He needs serious help and you should not go back unless he gets it.
He also needs to let the OW go. I hate to say this but by not setting boundaries with all his As, you have enabled him. I'm not saying this to lay blame but rather that you are allowing him to walk all over you. That is not love because if you loved YOURSELF as much as you love him, you would not allow this to continue.
If your H chooses not to get help and chooses to take his own life, it is still his choice. A selfish one but you need to understand that you are not responsible for his choices. I went through feeling a lot of guilt when my father took his life but I realized that I couldn't go on lying to my then H and taking money out of our line of credit to feed my father's gambling addiction. I owed the bank $40K that I took out for my F without my H knowing. How much longer was this going to continue? As long as I let it. The fact that he chose to take his life, when I finally said, I can't do it anymore, left me feeling responsible until I realized that there was no saving him because he wasn't doing anything to save himself. You can't fix him.
You can continue to be supportive but do it from afar. After he has been going for some time, you do need to tell him that you want to talk to his doctor and that he is welcome to go with you. He needs to include you in his therapy so that he doesn't try to deceive you again. This may sound controlling but hey, this is one time when you need to show him that you will be there for him and with him. You will want to ensure that he takes his meds.
As for sending him a card, I'm not sure that you should until he decides to get help. How can you send him a get well card if he's not doing anything about it?
You can continue to stand for your M from afar until you feel it is safe to go back. He is so manipulative and he knows he can get to your side and he can get his way again. Think about what this is doing to your kids. Would you want your kids to marry someone like your H?
You will be in my prayers for that is all we can do to help your H right now.
Hugs to you,
ISLH
Please note: you need to talk to a lawyer first, if you plan to not allow him to call his children.
similarly, if you plan to limit their calls to him.
PS:
He told me he loved me and not to give up on him
next time he pulls that garbage, I think you should feel free to tell him that when he actually commits to your marriage again, then you will.
Thanks everyone for your advice. I am going to talk to a lawyer today and see what I need to do. Once again I have survived a sleepless night. I know somehow my children and I will survive this.
ISLH, you are so right. If I gave myself a percentage of the love I gave him I would be so much better off. I have to focus on me and let him go. I know the road ahead may be rocky but I have no choice but to ride out the bumps.
Well, I have made it all day without calling him and I plan to continue with no contact at all. It is so hard. I just want to SCREAM. I did send him this email but he wont get it until he gets out of the hospital but it was at the advice of my therapist. That was my last contact totally. If he calls the kids will answer if he doesn't obey the guidelines then he wont talk to them at all.
H,
You may call the kids from 6-7 PM CST on school nights and on the weekends all calls need to be made before 7 PM CST also as I will be maintaining a consistent bedtime. Per the advise of the therapist all phone calls need to be concluded by 7 PM so they can have time to let their minds clear before going to bed.
We will be attending church on Sundays and Wednesdays so the kids may not be available on these days via phone. When I have them in sports and activities if the times need to change I will let you know.
The kids know that they will be expecting calls from you from 6-7 CST which is 7-8 your time. If you do not call then they will wait until the next day to speak with you. Many times there have been many calls made from the kids to you and I get the blame for them so to clarify this we will not call at all. They have been told they can talk to you when you call them. They are fine with this. If there are any emergencies I will email you or notify you when you call the kids. If you choose to not speak to me then you will get all notification via email or certified mail.
At the advice of the therapist all calls will be limited to whichever kids want to speak. I am not to force anyone that does not want to talk to do so at this time. They all have their own ways of dealing with everything.
Also, all calls will monitored and if the conversation is not appropriate the call will be disconnected.
I will not keep you from interacting from your kids but boundaries need to be set.
Let me know what you guys think about that? I hope it wasn't to harsh but I wanted to be to the point and unemotional. He needs to think/know I am done.
Well, he didnt call the kids last night so we will see what happens.
Per the advise of the therapist all phone calls need to be concluded by 7 PM so they can have time to let their minds clear before going to bed.
that seems a little bizzare to me. what time do you actually make them go to sleep?
Many times there have been many calls made from the kids to you and I get the blame for them so to clarify this we will not call at all.
Sorry, what is the blame issue here? you should be specific, i think.
blamed for what? is he complaining that they call too much?
Also, all calls will monitored and if the conversation is not appropriate the call will be disconnected.
I think you need to be more specific about what kinds of things you deem as "not appropriate".
[/quote]
Ok first of all they go to bed at 8:30 PM and before he was calling at like 8 PM and they were sobbing, and upset and I couldn't get them to go to bed. I have had 5 children in bed with me for weeks. She thought to do baths after they talk to dad they have time to play do a bedtime storey and then read a book and they have other things on their minds.. I thought it worth a try because I really need a schedule to get them out of my bed.
He has been saying I call him 10-15 times a day. I haven't been calling at all. Of course phone records show I call because the kids use my cell phones. With having five kids if they each call him two times that is 10 calls. My 9 year old (also bipolar) calls him 8-10 times a day if I do not hide the phone. He is distraught by all of this.
Basically he is not allowed to tell them he is coming back because last week he told them on Wednesday he was moving back up here he loved mommy and them and he would be here soon. (he was doped up on meds). I heard the phone call because it was on speaker and ask him not to make promises and we concluded the call. On Thursday when my son ask him about it he called my son a liar and said he never said that. That was the same night he slashed his wrist 4 times after telling me he loved me. He is just not stable and is dragging the kids on his emotional roller coaster. He knows I mean that he can not say he is coming back. I guess however I should be clearer next time.
I will say that with explaining these boundaries to my children last night they had a much better night. When he didn't call by 7 PM they knew we were turning phones off and they were ok with that. For the first night in weeks I had everyone in bed and asleep by 8:30 except the 11 yr old who had to watch Heros. I honestly think the kids need boundaries and consistency as much as I do. Am I wrong?
I will say that with explaining these boundaries to my children last night they had a much better night. When he didn't call by 7 PM they knew we were turning phones off and they were ok with that. For the first night in weeks I had everyone in bed and asleep by 8:30 except the 11 yr old who had to watch Heros. I honestly think the kids need boundaries and consistency as much as I do. Am I wrong?
Ah.. with more info, it makes sense now.
It's kinda too bad.. if he was more stable, it might be nice for the children for him to wish them good night. but, you gotta work with what you have.
you definately need to make clear to him, that it was his complaints about "you" calling all the time, which is leading you to not allow your children to call.
Although, you might give a little flexibility there, and do the same thing for your children, that you are doing for your husband. set boundaries. Tell them (and let him know that you are telling them, and why), "children, if YOU want to call daddy, it needs to be at this particular time", otherwise, we dont want to 'bother' him".
He knows I mean that he can not say he is coming back. I guess however I should be clearer next time.
Dunno if you want to make it the same "7pm", or a different time.
He knows I mean that he can not say he is coming back. I guess however I should be clearer next time.
He doesnt seem to me like he understands ANYTHING in normal senses. So I would definately think that spelling that out to him more clearly, is a good idea.
I think you should also be explicit about,
"you cant say you are coming back, if you are NOT coming back".
telling him, "dont say you are coming back", seems like a bad idea to me.
Yeah that is true. I am glad you all help me make since because I am so emotional I am a robot. Therapist says do something and I do.
I am just trying to do what is right for the kids and somehow find a way to exist. My son got in the car tonight crying and cried all day. He misses his daddy so much. I just don't know what to do or say to make him feel better. The other four seem ok but my 9 yr old really struggles. He really was connected to my husband in a unique way. I think the fact that they share the same illness and really understand each other has a lot to do with it.
I am praying he calls the kids tonight because if not I am afraid it is going to really put my son in a downward spiral. We will see. All I know is I am going to zip my lips and sit on my hands I will not speak a word to him.
Well I am not sure if I did the right thing or not but he called tonight at 7:05 PM and I went ahead and let him talk to my son. It was past when I said he could call but I didn't want to be a real witch however every time I give him an inch he takes a mile. Did I do the right thing? None of my kids would talk to him except for my 9 yr old. The others said they don't want to talk to him so I did not make them.
I didn't give him a chance to talk to me and just hung up when he started to talk to me I said good night and hung up.
I have decided the worst part of this whole thing besides the pain it is causing my kids is the empty pit in my stomach each morning and the lump in my throat. I literally wake up ill every day.
It was also so sad last night I walked outside to my daughter praying about her daddy and she said. God please don't let him forget me because I am already forgetting what he looks like.
I think it was a good thing that you let him talk to your son, so long as he didnt say anything bad to his son.
From what I've read about children in this situation... you really really dont want to be viewed by him, as the person "keeping him from his father".
Hmm..
kinda wierd to my mind, that your daughter was praying about her dad not forgetting her... yet she didnt want to talk to him?
I found that weird also but when I asked her why she didn't want to talk she said because she loves him but he yells all the time and she doesn't want to be yelled at.
Well he checked himself out of the hospital. He told my S9 on the phone last night. Everyone talked to him last night but my S11. He says he is never going to again. I told him to pray about forgiving his dad and that his dad loves him. It is so hard to say that when I myself want to choke the man.
I hate it when he is out of the hospital my urge to call him is so much worse. I am going to have to tie my hands up today. I want to find reasons to call him and I KNOW that is BAD BAD BAD.
I found that weird also but when I asked her why she didn't want to talk she said because she loves him but he yells all the time and she doesn't want to be yelled at.
Sounds like something he should be told.
Wow the roller coaster I keep trying to get off of continues. He called me today to "talk" for a minute about bills and brought up the R. I simply told him that I could not take the lies anymore and that I gave him a million chances to make it right and each time he has lied. I said that I had to continue to move forward and I really hoped that he was happy and getting help. He said I am miserable. He said he missed the kids and pointed out many times he never wanted to hurt me. I just listened. I did tell him why the kids don't want to talk and what they said to me. A couple of times he got angry then he calmed himself down because I said if you yell I will disconnect.
Then when it was time to go he said "I love you" I said "H, why did you do that." he said sorry then he said but I do and I said yeah and hung up.....
I know tomorrow he will hate me so I just have to continue to blow it off but dangit I wish he wouldn't do this. If he loved me he wouldn't be living with/making babies with OW.
Oh well, we will see what happens tonight when he calls the kiddos.
Thanks
I give up. I suck at this whole DB thing. I honestly think maybe my marriage is one that just needs to end.
I know I sound like a big quitter but I am just so pathetic and I don't know how to stop being so. Last night he was so mean it was unreal (he was with her) right at bedtime so I cry all night long. Then today he calls and is nasty (he is with her.) Then today he told me he got in a fight with her last night and almost drove here to me. (Just what I want.... my husband when he is fighting with his Pregnant GF back with me..)
Now I am actually afraid he might come back. I am not sure now I want that.. I DO NOT want him back like he is or has been. I am so scared to say NO I don't want this because he will just give up and stay with her. I have no idea what to do. Maybe I should just throw in the towell. After all the roller coaster isn't going to stop until I bail right??
I am in a real mood tonight I know.....
You don't suck. He sucks. maybe he needs to start DBing and you take a LaLa Land vacation? What if the tables were turned? Huh? How would he handle knowing you were out last night with OP? Maybe then he would start acting more protective of you and not some OW? I am sorry you are on this roller coaster. You have every right to be confused about what to do but there are some patterns in his behavior. Just try to prepare yourself for every way this sitch could turn.
I know how you feel about the lies. It has become a complulsion for my H so it does help that I cut off communication from my H. it protects me from the ordeal of his R and his lies.
UGH he just called again. I said what do you want? I was thinking about you. I said ok. I said H, I cant do this anymore this up and down and up and down. I have no clue how you feel ever. He said I feel about you like I always have... So stupid me says "Wow great to know you never loved me". He gets mad and says I have to go. I said figures. He said you just don't get it. I said get what. He said just hang in there and give me time... I love you... and now I need to go.
And I said... yep you guessed it can't shut my mouth ... I said..
Yeah go to her... don't tell me you love me and then go jump in bed with her. JUST STOP CALLING ME!
Now is that what I want?? No... but I blurted it out anyway. I am so confused and so tired and so dang frustrated with him it is unreal. I think tomorrow when I take the kids to the town festival and parade I will leave my phone at home. I am so predictable. I carry my phone 24 X 7 so it would do him good to not be able to get a hold of me.
UGH he just called again. I said what do you want? I was thinking about you. I said ok. I said H, I cant do this anymore this up and down and up and down. I have no clue how you feel ever. He said I feel about you like I always have... So stupid me says "Wow great to know you never loved me". He gets mad and says I have to go. I said figures. He said you just don't get it. I said get what. He said just hang in there and give me time... I love you... and now I need to go.
Owch.
I'm sorry for how you feel. i know it's horrible.
Right now, you are, understandibly, at the end f your rope with him.
May i suggst, first and foremost, that you stick to your plan of just not talking to him for a few days. recharge yourself. feel better about yourself.
then, AFTER that... how about sticking to this plan:
let him be him, and act appropriately to how he treats yu.
Try to avoid anticipating bad behaviour, like you did above. that's the behaviour pattern that the "act as if.." stuff in the DB books was invented to avoid.
If he calls yu, and treats you nicely... then let him talk. feel free to be nice back :)If he talks to you, and spews at you... then say "I need to go now", and hang up r something.
Amy, frm what you quoted as him saying... it sounds like he's kinda at the far side of the swing, and may be ready to swing back to you more.
It happens to a lot of people, that by the time the filandering spouse is ready for this, the LBS has lost their patience, and so a recovery instead turns into an escalation.
hang in there.
For what it's worth... I think that you might be able to actually believe him, when he says that he loves you, and to give him time.
How he reacted, in the fact of you snapping back, shows that to me, i think.
I think yu should believe what he said this time.
Give him time.
In practical terms, that means, "look after yourself, and protect yourself from his ugly side, and protect what positive feelings you have left for him".
focus more on you.
when he wants to be nice to you, then... IF you feel up to it... let him. (otherwise, politely bow out)
if he's nasty... then dont talk to him, when and if he is nasty.
Hang in there.
He is headed back to the psychiatric hospital again. I was told this time he will be transferred to a longer term unit. He is really messed up. I think that in most cases DB might work if you are working with someone mentally all together but he is really messed up and I am not sure how to handle this. I am just going to sit tight and wait for his calls.
His mother is just lovely and points out that the reason he is being hospitalized again is because he truly loves 2 women. They think I should just accept this and let him have us both. They actually have a friend that claims he has two wives and supports two women. Well that might work in his world but it isn't in mine.
I am just so worn out from the insanity of it all. I need a break myself. Maybe he wont call from the hospital and as hard as that will be on me it will help me detach.
(((Amy))) just stopping by to say Hi. Hang in there, sweetie. Keep staying strong for the sake of your kids. He needs to fix himself. He isn't capable of being your H right now, or a dad to the kids as he isn't capable of caring for himself.
It appears that your H's indecision about two women is causing an issue, not him LOVING two women. My H went through the same thing with his OW and me. He "loves/d" us both but knows he can't have both. He was/is scared to be with me, but feels his R with OW will be tainted if he were to leave me for her. Your H would feel better if he just decided which way to go and then went that way. But, you can't control that. You can only control what you do.
Hang in there! Stay strong!
Hugs,
Em
Thanks Edie, I needed the hug today. My 11 yr old woke me up at 11 PM last night sobbing. For the first time it hit him. He said mom I miss dad I said I know baby he said I just saw a dad and son on tv and it made me realize I will never have that. He is 18 hours away. It broke my heart and made me question all I have done. I know though that my kids are safer here and I know I did what I had to do as their mom.
I talked to H this morning and he said they are moving him to a long term facility today. He is not sure where. He will call when/if he can. He really hs no will to live and it saddens me and breaks my heart. I try not to let him know how broken I am but I got off the phone and can't stop crying. The pain is unbearable. I just want to fix him and I know I can't.
I told him that I cared about him and that we all wanted him to get well. I then hung up before I fell apart.
I feel guilty for thinking this but I feel so much like part of this is a show to see which woman will break and toss him out first so he doesnt have to make the decision. I feel like he is so incapable of making a decision that he is trying to push it off on us. I don't know... Just feel that way.
I feel guilty for thinking this but I feel so much like part of this is a show to see which woman will break and toss him out first so he doesnt have to make the decision. I feel like he is so incapable of making a decision that he is trying to push it off on us. I don't know... Just feel that way.
Yup, you got it. You are right on target. If she gave him up he would be by you in no time...just to repeat this behavior, again. If you gave him up, he'd be by her and repeating this behavior with her. You don't have to fight for him, Amy. He is your husband. She will
always be the other woman. Even if he left you for her, their relationship began out of an adulterous affair. There is no purity in that. All this to say that this is his deal. This is his decision. This is his life.
I am glad he is getting help. Don't question yourself about moving your children out of that situation. You did what you were supposed to do - protect your kids. If your kids don't underrstand that now, they will eventually. They will also one day thank you for it. It's tough to see your kids hurting so badly, but this is your H doing this to them. It's not you.
We, as humans, are pretty resilient. We all have the ability to heal. Focus on healing as your H focuses on healing. What are you going to do for yourself now, Amy? What are you going to do to make yourself more at home where you are? You have to focus on making yourself happier. I know it is difficult. I know it hurts. Amy you can do this! Do something to put a smile on your face today.
Hugs
Thanks Edie, I went to see my grandparents today. I hadn't seen them in months. I enjoyed just being there with the kids. We played outside and had a nice time. It was hard becaue it was the first time I had been there without my H in 12 years but I made it.
I talked to H for a minute they are moving him tomorrow and he said he would call with details. I told him if he had new information to leave it on my voicemail I would be out tonight. He says Have fun on your date....
Well, trust me I have no date but I was so mad I wasn't going to say that to him so I said I hope to. It is about time I go out and have some fun and he hung up on me.
Just taking it one day at a time...
He called me this moring and asked me how my date went. I said perfectly. He said good I hope you had fun kissing and hugging on him. I just laughed. He got mad and hung up.
He called back like 15 minutes later and said did you have something you were trying to say. I said no but it was really rude of him to always hang up and if he was going to continue to do so to just stop calling. He then just went on about how I didn't understand how torn he was and etc etc etc. Finally I said I can't do this I have to go get our kids off to school. I said bye and I hung up.
If he only knew I went out with girlfriends.....
heya Amy,
thinking of you.
Im really glad that your husband may be getting the "serious help", that he seems to need.
some quick thoughts:
- i think you handled yourself really well on that phone call where you told him that "you all wanted him to get better", and left it at that. That's showing some great PMA and unconditional love for your H
- I think you "need to detach".. from mother-in-law
- I dont think it's a good idea to "mess with his mind" about you dating other men. The poor man's mind is messed up enough as it is, ya know?
May God comfort you and support you and your family in this rough time. I dont know if you are Christian or not, but for some reason, it seemed to me like you really need a prayer for you right now.
Thank you so much and yes prayer is what gets me by. That and I listen to the song "Praise you in the storm". My kids even belt it out when I am playing it.
I am actually not going to take any calls from MIL because she simply will not stop pumping me for information and then twist it all up. She even informed me if I were a better housekeeper this wouldn't have happend because OW is a better housekeeper. Hello I have 5 kids full time and a slob for a husband, I work full time, PTA VP, Soccer asst. coach, and H personal secretary. I had 2 dogs, 2 cats, birds, fish, and a bearded dragon! I did the best I could. OW is on permanent disability for her bipolar and is never out of her house so lets do the math. I did the best I could.
Wow sorry needed to vent... anyway yes I plan to detach from MIL.
I am really going to try to take some time to work on me. I need to figure out if I can even get past all of this and if I even want my marriage to work at this point. I love my H and always will but I have to heal a lot to ever trust him again.
One day at a time I suppose. He did call me tonight and told me he loved me for what that is worth.. I just said thank you and hung up... I take it all with a grain of salt. I have no idea tomorrow he could hate me...
I did a complete no no tonight. I am so mad at myself. He just blurts out his email password to me and tells me if I want to know the truth go look. Stupid me has to look. (He was so drugged I am sure he doesnt remember telling me or he thought nothing was in there. Here is the email I found)
OW,
I'm sorry I did what I did. I only hope someday I can repair your heart. I'm sorry it took what it did for me to come to 100% of what I already knew I should be, and that was not to be in a relationship with ME, and to cheerish the one I had with you. I know now, and its to late. I would take anything, do anything, just to go back 24 hours and continue to show you my love for you and to realize what I now know. I hope you and the boys can someday forgive me, I can't believe I have done to them what I'm doing to my own. I do care. And now they too will go thru disappointment because of me. I'm sorry I ever got you messed up with me again. I do love you, but I'm a mess and I have failed everyone. I haven't taken my medicine yet, I didn't want to last night, because I wanted to be somewhat awake for you, and I was. I was awake enough to watch over you, that made me happy. Now I can't take it because I need to be there for my kids. Part of me doesn't want to anymore, no I'm not telling you anything. I guess I got that just don't care additude, kinda looking forward for the withdraw to get worse, self torture. Talk to you later, I'm sorry again for everything. I do Love you, I'm sorry it took this to wake me up.
H
OK THIS MAKES ME SO MAD.......... I SHOULDNT HAVE LOOKED BECAUSE NOW I AM BEYOND DARK I NEVER WANT TO TALK TO HIM AGAIN.
In what he shouldnt have done he is referring to sleeping with me on the 18th. The part that really gets me is his worrying about HER BOYS. What about our 5 children that are falling apart. This guy is a snake and honestly I really don't know that at this point he deserves me. Guess this is what I get for snooping. I swear if I had the 5k the attorney wants I would slap his aXX with divorce papers tomorrow.
He called my kids this morning to tell them he is being transferred to a place where he probably can not call us for a few weeks. He said he will try if he can but I honestly hope he can't. I really need the time as much as he does. I got a book on forgiveness and I am going to try to read it. I want to be able to forgive him but I am not sure anymore if I can. I am not sure I am that strong. I want my kids to have a family, I want and love my husband, but he lies so much he doesnt know when he tells the truth.
This morning he talked to me for a second and I simply said. H, all I want from you is for you to get better and be the dad you can be. I want you healthy and happy and whomever that is with I will have to accept. I hope while you are in there you really deal with who you are and what you want and your relationship with God. Know you are loved by your children and hold onto that if the therapy hurts. I gave him no chance to say anything. I said take care and hung up. We will see where it goes now. I honestly need to take a long look at what I want because I am not sure anymore myself.
I want to do what is right for my children, myself, and God but here is my question.
If I do take my husband back after the affairs, verbal abuse, and abandonment what am I teaching my kids? Here are the two things they could take from it but which is more likely. Am I thinking to deep.
1) My boys could learn it is ok to have affairs and expect their wife to take them back.
2) My girls could think it is ok for their husbands to have affairs, verbally abuse them, and feel they have to just accept it and keep taking them back.
3) Maybe they will all learn you can work through problems and we can actually be a healthy family.
I honestly don't know what to think so any words of wisdom would help. I am starting to think I need to check into the hosp. right along with him.
Ranting atm but I just talked to the MIL to make sure my H was all settled in and all was ok. She said yes. She said OW hadn't even called to check on him one time.
IT MAKES ME SO MAD! How can he love someone that doesn't even care enough to check on him. She can have no contact with him while he is in there and neither can I so it is only his mom and dad. Even his mom said for someone that loves him so much she sure hasn't even called once.
Ok that doesnt matter I know but it infuriates me how he can be so loyal to her.
Amy,
I am feeling you there on those three points you made.....
I ask myself those same tings..
I reinterated to my girls this morning how what daddy and Ow are doing is not right in the eyes of the Lord...how being M was not meant to M to one person and still have a GF...
D7 told me she asked OW if she was gonna M her daddy and she said NO... I told her, Ofcoarse!! OW will not tell you otherwise..
I told her how OW IS trying to take away your daddy and she knows it isnt right....so that does not make her a good woman..no matter how "good of a mommy" she may act to you girls...
Sorry..not much help.....
I did a complete no no tonight. I am so mad at myself. He just blurts out his email password to me and tells me if I want to know the truth go look. Stupid me has to look. (He was so drugged I am sure he doesnt remember telling me or he thought nothing was in there. Here is the email I found)
....
Umm... Amy...
i got a completely different take from reading that email.
What I got, was him saying "goodbye" to the OW.
and thats why he let you know his password.
his "sorry it took so long for him to wake up" comment, could be in reference to "sorry i was stringing you[OW] along for so long, while I was fogged up. "
yes, he still has "feelings of love for her". but he has chosen to end things with her.
thats why she hasnt called, i'm guessing.
Dom, I think you are wrong. She is obviously mad at him for being involved with Amy and kicking him to the curb. He's squealing like a pig for forgiveness and trying to get taken back. He wasn't dumping the OW.
Dom, I think you are wrong. She is obviously mad at him for being involved with Amy
well, that part is "obvious", i'll agree.
and kicking him to the curb. He's squealing like a pig for forgiveness and trying to get taken back. He wasn't dumping the OW.
Where do you get that the OW is the one doing the dumping?
Also, what bits do you interpret, as him asking to get back in the OW's life?
[well, ok, there's the one line about "going back and wishing he could continue to show her that he loved her". But even there, there might be potential ambiguity.. depending on WHY he can no longer do that. ]
yes, he wanted to "be forgiven" for the pain he caused. That doesnt always mean "and take me back". after all, many leaving spouses, ask the same thing from the LBS, yet have no intention at the time, of reconciling with the LBS.
His message is very confusing... however,
Note that he said that he "has to be there", for
his kids, not hers.
But even if I'm wrong about who dumped who, it seems to be plain that
1. He is resigned to it being over between them. He's stating that
her kids will suffer, and he's sorry for that
2. He seems to acknowlege his responsability towards his own children.
and...
he gave Amy his passwordthat to me, says that he wants to open up to her, at least for now... and people dont usually do that to people they are looking to dump.
This looks like his "bottom", and the potential start of a very long, and painful, but potentially real reconciliation path... if Amy can find it within herself to hold on for a while longer.
Many (if not the majority of!) affairs, end, when the cheating partner dumps the married one... and then the married one goes crawling back, it seems to me.
So, even if that is the case... it could still be a positive thing for Amy's marriage.
Hang in there, Amy.
His mind is presumably very fuzzy right now, and what may be well-intentioned from him, may seem negative to you.
Maybe you could hold off on making any judgements about him, until he is out of his treatment, and his mind is clear enough to tell you what is going on with him now.
People are so desperate on here to reconcile that they would go back with anything. You can't polish a turd.
Amy,
I'm with Dom R. Why would he blurt out his password if he had things that he wanted to hide? You desrve some good news, so why not go with notion that he may be ending the R with OW.
I also understand the tempation to snoop. I've done it and found things that I wish that I hadnt. I wouldnt go into that email account again.
I did a complete no no tonight. I am so mad at myself. He just blurts out his email password to me and tells me if I want to know the truth go look. Stupid me has to look. (He was so drugged I am sure he doesnt remember telling me or he thought nothing was in there. Here is the email I found)
....
Umm... Amy...
i got a completely different take from reading that email.
What I got, was him saying "goodbye" to the OW.
and thats why he let you know his password.
his "sorry it took so long for him to wake up" comment, could be in reference to "sorry i was stringing you[OW] along for so long, while I was fogged up. "
yes, he still has "feelings of love for her". but he has chosen to end things with her.
thats why she hasnt called, i'm guessing.
That wasn't it trust me. He went to the mountains with her right after that. He was telling her goodbye because she dumped him but then she took him right back. It was his way of looking pathetic and getting her back. Two days later we slept together again and then 4 days later they went to the mountains together. Wow I have no self respect. I really am pathetic when I really type that out.
Ok well he called me today and he is only allowed according to his mom and him 1 phone call a day. He called and talked about things and he sounded so much better. He asked me to send photos. I overnighted our family photo. I am a sucker I know. At the end of the conversation I said rather you and I make it please take time to get healthy for your children. He said to me I love all of you and I said the kids love you too and he said well I just want you to know I love all of you and I said ok call the kids when you can when they are home and I hung up. I wanted to scream IF YOU LOVE ME WHY ARE YOU DOING THIS?
Anyway, at least he called me, he was upbeat and for the first time in weeks he was nice to me. I mean really really nice. We will see.
Amy,
Celebrate the little things. I have difficulty doing that myself. But at least he IS saying things that are positive. Concentrate on those. No matter what you want him to be healthy and in control of his life again. Encourage the good. Try to ignore the bad and pray the Lord will convict his heart to turn things around.
And you, my dear, are not pathetic. You are a loving wife and mom.
That wasn't it trust me. He went to the mountains with her right after that. He was telling her goodbye because she dumped him but then she took him right back. It was his way of looking pathetic and getting her back. Two days later we slept together again and then 4 days later they went to the mountains together. Wow I have no self respect. I really am pathetic when I really type that out.
you are not the pathetic one. he is.
you are doing an incredibly tough thing.
I've read that when there is an OW involved, it isnt uncommon for the H to yo-yo back and forth trying to give her up.
Just like multiple failed attempts to give up smoking.
Even HE knows this. He referenced "withdrawal" in his email to her. Sounds like he's actually read some marriage recovery books.
Anyway, at least he called me, he was upbeat and for the first time in weeks he was nice to me. I mean really really nice. We will see.
Attagirl. You're understandably tired. So, how about letting him do the work? If he's nice to you, then keep talking with him, and at some level (even if it's only at the "politeness" level) show some kind of positive back in return.
Otherwise, just keep it about the kids.
aka, "Keep doing what you are doing"
I think you're doing good things. Even if, ironically, that actually mostly means, "do nothing"
Thank you guys I needed that. Just when I am about to give up you help boost me up.
Today I was thinking about all of this and I kept thinking "What exactly am I fighting for?" I feel like I have been in a mental battle for a long time now between my own personal needs and the family I want for my children and I. I am just hoping at the end of this that it can all be a good thing all the way around. I just hope that in the end I can have both. I want my cake and eat it too =)
Thanks for the support... love ya all.
I am going on a small trip tomorrow and wont be back until Sunday so I probably wont have PC access which is probably a good thing because I keep getting myself into more trouble. (don't even ask what I did this time.) I need to read DR and DB again because my backsliding is ugly today.
I am going about 5.5 hours away to spend some time with my step children. I am so blessed that my current H xwife knows how much I love the kids and she and I have an awesome relationship. She is as shocked at what he is doing as I am.
Anyway, I am going to get to be with them and that will be good for my kids and myself to see the children.
I need to do something to stay outta trouble because I can't seem to do it by myself. Well I am off to read my latest book. The courage to be a single mother. I know it isn't really DB positive but it actually is helping me with how to handle what I am doing right now. Single mother doesnt necessarily mean divorced mother right? I mean it just means right now I am doing it on my own. I am and have been for 9 weeks. He has not seen the kids or I at all for 3 weeks now.
I was headed to see the step children on Friday (about a 5 hour drive) and H calls and says in a short nasty tone "I hope you have fun with MY children this weekend." I said me too I am looking forward to it. He said "Yeah well I am glad you get to spend time with MY children." I simply said me too. He then hung up.
It really hurt me at first but then I realized he was just bitter and hurt that I was going and he is locked up in a psychiatric hospital. I think he is slowly realizing he brought all of this on himself.
I spent two days with his x-wife, my two step children and her other 3 children and we had an amazing time. The xwife and I talked so much and I think we have grown so much closer. We were able to read between the "LIES" and really get to know each other. He was probably bitter because he knew that together she and I would be able to really figure out how many games he had played. I found out so much that I almost wish I hadn't. I am glad though because so much more is put into perspective and I it is helping me put closure on things.
Yesterday we went to the park and went fishing and it was awesome but yet an eye opener for me. I really had reality smack me up side the face. I realized that even if I want my husband back I can not take him back unless some MAJOR changes are made all the way around.
Yesterday was the first time my 9 yr old son had cast a fishing pole and the first time a man had tossed a football with my 11 yr old son. I stood and watched my own husbands xwifes husband (that is a mouthful)do things with my boys that their own dad has never done once. He was always on his computer or playing video games. I realized that I had been spending so much time for 11 years trying to make him happy and keep him with me that I myself neglected to do this with my kids. I sat and just cried. I ached. I vowed to change.
I do not want the man I used to be married to. I want my husband but only if he can be a faithful husband and a good father. I know I can be a good mother with or without him and I know my kids can have a healthier life with one very involved parent than having two that are so self absorbed that they can't parent at all.
I am not sure where this will take my relationship with my husband or what I even want anymore but for the first time I am excited about who I can be without him. I am disgusted with him for his lack of being there for the kids and yet wanting to have more and more. We will just see where we go from here.
I also got my information about returning to college and am working today to fill out all the financial aid paperwork. I plan to start working toward my criminal justice degree as soon as I have the financial aid worked out.
Thanks for listening.
His mom visited him today and said that he is still torn between me and OW. He has been calling her with his one phone call a day his mom said. He didnt call the kids yesterday or today. I am so hurt right now.
I have decided to cut off contact with MIL because it causes me to hurt and then I say not nice things about her son and it isn't fair to her.
I honestly am not sure I want this marriage anymore. In fact I am getting more sure everyday that I don't. Need to go to sleep because right now all I want to do is scream and cry.
Ok so I now did another no no and did more snooping. H gave me password a few days ago to cell account so I could take care of it while he is in the hospital. He has been swearing all alone He hadn't talked to OW prior to the end of August. Well, the cell phone shows them talking back in May. I guess this baby if it is really on the way very well could be his because they have been together since 3 months before he left me at least. I am such a fool.
I honestly don't think there is much left to fight for. I am printing everything and starting to get all my data together for when/if this ends up in court. I will not file for divorce but honestly don't care if he does at this point. All I am getting from this marriage is medical insurance and a ton of headaches.
Night
I am not sure where this will take my relationship with my husband or what I even want anymore but for the first time I am excited about who I can be without him.
This is the best attitude you can have, Amy! I never want to say a M is hopeless, but yours would take a lot of effort on your H's part and right now he's just not capable. But what matters is that you are going to be fine no matter what. I'm just coming around to this realization as well. And it's exciting and a tad scary, since it cools my desire to *fix* our M. I just keep reminding myself that I'm not the one standing in the way of healing our M. You aren't either. You've done all you can so the very best you can do for you and your kids is to work on your own life!
HUGS!!
I told you on your prayer thread that I'd be putting this here for you, so here ya go:
Amy ~ I'm sorry things are like they are for your family right now. If I can share something I have learned in my own journey, maybe it will help...
Do not get too focused on "am I doing what God wants?" or "Is the restoration of my family God's will?". You are and it is. HOWEVER, in this walk, our focus is so often STUCK on our husbands that we are not fully functioning in His strength nor are we comprehending His guidance. When you reach the point where you can turn your back on your husband (Note: I did not say give up on) in order to save your KIDS, it will be empowering as well as uplifting for you. I had the same experience with my daughter, in that I was not doing all that I could for her with her struggles because I was so afraid of offending my husband. Then came the point where I realized HE is an adult - and as much as I sincerely WANT to be his wife, I HAVE TO BE HER MOTHER. If he was offended because I was being a PARENT - which he struggles to be instead of just her play buddy - well, quite frankly that was HIS problem. The rest will play out in due time. This is the part where your only obligation towards your husband is to keep him in prayer. If you find you can't do that (it happens), ask someone else to pray for him. Busy yourself in your God-ordained role as a mother and let Him work on the rest.
AmyC
Thank you Amy and Ginger. I am doing just that. I can no longer allow him to control me or my emotions. I have taken all the steps necessary to get myself back into school. I am working on getting my kids involved in sports here. I have no desire to call H or answer his calls. I am going to move forward without him as right now I have no other choice. I will continue to pray for him but that is where I draw the line.
Amy:
your husband is wavering, yes.
However, he has also reached out to you more recently, than he has in the past. I think that cutting him off now, would be counter-productive.
It may make you personally feel "better". but I think it would be counter-productive.
May I suggest that you accept his calls, (if he calls), but only keep listening to him for as long as he talks nicely to you.
I see what you are saying but the problem is even what he is telling me nicely is lies. He swore (on our childrens lives I might add) that he didn't talk to this woman until 3 weeks after he left me when in all actuality they have had this going for at least 5 months. I am just tired of listening to the nice things he has to say, falling for them only to find out what he has said is all lies and then I grieve all over again. I am just tired of giving him an opening to stab that knife deeper in my back.
Here is something that I learned.
in years of lies from my wife, and her pursuing multiple EAs.
I snooped on her.
Things got quiet. I got nervous. I dug deeper. I found she had done things 2 weeks ago.
I got very upset. Things got very ugly. She did things more...
Things eventually got quiet. I got nervous.... and so on.
Thing is.. during some of those times, I think that if I just let the "2 weeks ago" stuff go... things may have stayed quiet, and eventually improved between us. (she even claimed something similar to that, at one point)
I couldnt let it go at the time... i was just too wound up and hurt. But if I could talk to myself then, I would try to tell myself to let it go.
I think you are in a similar situation. You are building up worry and resentment from the past.
Those feelings, are getting in the way of a potential better future.
it's a ways off.. your husband is still stuck in his "addiction" to the OW. he almost got free..he's suffering from a relapse right now.
The thing is... if that is the case, do you think being cold to him and shutting him out when he reaches out to you? Or do you think that being, if not warm, then at least open to him, would be best?
as for me, i think the latter is the better way to go in your situation.
I guess your right I am just so hurt right now. I feel like my entire life is a lie. I am so angry at the pain my children are feeling and his lack of being here. Then to find out all that I have well it all hurts.
yeah.
it's tough to go through this type of betrayal once.
To go through it multiple times, is so much worse. makes you feel stupid.
this could be the last time though. They say that sometimes, a person has to hit bottom, before they want to give up on the bad stuff. There's not too much further "down" that he could go, eh?
Well I think it really is over but we will see. He called the kids tonight after they were asleep and woke us up. I went ahead and let him talk to the only one that would talk to him. Then he got on the phone and told me he has decided it is over with us, he wants a divorce and he wants to be with the OW and their baby on the way. I simply said ok if that is what you want then you can file for divorce because I will not. He said you know I can't afford it and I said then how can you afford an 8th child and he hung up on me.
I just can't stop putting my foot in my mouth but last week his mom was so supportive of me and even sent me this letter of how she loved me and wanted it to work. Then Sunday when she saw him she called me afterward and was very cold to me. I could tell something was wrong but she said i was "reading into it" well, I have found that her mood towards me goes with his mood towards me and she is as mentally unstable as he is. I probably shouldn't have but I sent the following email to her and now I intend to just detach and not talk to any of his family for now.
MIL,
H said he told you on Sunday that he has decided to stay with OW. I could tell something was wrong Sunday when you called but wasn't sure what it was. It seems like your attitude towards me goes with H's decisions and that is fine. I have done nothing but try to love and support him and if this is his decision then so be it. The kids and I will survive just as his XWIFE and the kids did. I will not file for divorce as I will not be the one to terminate our children's family. If you all feel this is the best, then while I can not understand the decision to support him, I will not ask you not to. I know as a parent you love your child nomatter what but I also know that there is such a thing as tough love and sometimes it is a parents job to let their child know when they are making a huge mistake. It seems H's mistakes have always been brushed under the rug and covered up. Well I hope you enjoy the new grandbaby and maybe he will actually be there for this one until it is 18. Take care and know I love you I just can't go on chatting like we are family because the truth is that the minute he said he wanted OW you were dining out with her parents, letting her call you mom, and taking her in like she is your own only 2 weeks after he left me. It has been made very easy for him to destroy the hearts of his 7 kids and wife. Like XWIFE said he has not only torn one family of SS and SD's up but now two. It is just sad. At what point will he be held accountable. There is no need to reply I don't intend to get into a debate or argument with you. I just needed to say what I felt on my heart. I don't even have anger, only hurt for the way I have been betrayed.
Love you and take care of dad,
Wow Amy! What strength! I could hear your heart. I know this is tough. You sound great. You sound strong. You sound loving. The tough love part is always so tough on the one delivering it. Hang in there!
((((AMY)))
Thanks Edie,
I have to admit I am really hurting right now but I know that I have no choice but to let go and move on. He has made his decisions and while they hurt me I have to live with them. I am just going to keep trying to do the best for my kids. I know they are my first priority.
Well, the latest. H calls me an hour ago and told me he has decided to break it off with the OW. He can not do this anymore. He said it is a sticky situation and he has to deal with the fact that she is pregnant and etc. but he is going to tell her that he is done. He said that he wants to be closer to his kids up here and even if I wont have him back he intends to relocate. He said that he has always loved me but that he was hurt but a lot of what I did.
He then went on to say that he was sorry for never trying marriage counseling, sorry for not opening up to me, and sorry for what he did. I didn't know how to respond because i have heard so much of this before however this was the first time he has said "I AM SORRY" Where do I go from here? Any advice? He said he is calling me again tonight.
I think you just listen. I think you remain quiet, validate what he is saying but don't say anything committal in return. He could call you back and say he has changed his mind - again. I think you can only rely on what you SEE him doing, not on what you HEAR him saying. He has proven over and over that he says one thing and does another. This is the difficult part, he is saying exactly what you WANT to hear right now, but who knows if it's truly how he feels? He may even truly feel this right now, but in an hour, a day, 2 days?? Where will he be then? Just listen. If he asks what you think just say you think your kids would benefit greatly from healthy parents, that you are looking to get healthy and stay healthy, and that you are and will continue to take this one day at a time....hope that helps.
Thanks Edie,
That is exactly what his xwife said and exactly what I plan to do. I know that I can not trust him right now. I just don't want to scare him off by being distant and yet I don't want him like he is right now either.
He called late last night and was crying on the phone. He kept saying he loves me but he hates everything about me. He sounds broken and lost. He said he still loves OW also. He says his kids are the driving force for him to move here. But he has to deal with the fact that she has a baby on the way. He called his xwife hoping to get some sympathy and she told him to grow up and put his kids first for once. He hung up on her. I am so hurt and angry and yet I know his pain is so deep. He told me several times he wanted to kill himself and that if he had a way he would. I have no idea what to do. I am going to just continue listening. I am afraid to get my hopes up he is really sick and by today he could have changed his mind. All I can do is keep praying and listening.
Amy, I'm not sure you should even be listening at this point. Reading your posts, nothing he's saying now is any different than the things he's said in the past but you're still listening. Obviously, you want to be there for him because you love him but it doesn't sound like he's ready for that yet. Being there for someone implies that they're moving, they're growing, they're going through a process. He's not growing, he's whining about a situation he created and looking for sympathy. Xwife called him on it and he hung up on her, the same way he's been hanging up on you when you call him on his BS.
He has a really tough road ahead of him but, in my opinion, he's not even on it yet. He's sitting on a bench next to the road, looking towards the horizon and complaining to anyone who will stop to listen how hard it's going to be to go down that road. My $.02: stop listening to him until he gets off the bench and starts walking.
I agree with you Bryan. I am just so torn. I feel like he wants someone to make a decision for him so he doesnt have to and then when we do we will be damned for doing it. He treats me horrible until I finally say ok I am done I am moving on and then he pulls this with me and ignores her. I guess looking back over all I wrote you are right the only difference now is he is at least locked up in a safe place where he can not hurt himself. I am trying not to let his games get to me but it is hard. I also have to admit I am really finding it easier each day to detach from him. I find each day that I find it a little easier to look at a future without him. I feel guilt about that because I feel it is my duty to stand by him but I am just getting so tired. Between raising five children alone and dealing with him I am completely worn out.
Oh also he asked me to come see him at the psychiatric hospital this weekend becaue I am flying into town. I really want to but I feel like I shouldn't, I feel like it will be a big step backwards for me. Also, he told xwife that I told him I was coming and he had to say in it. The truth his he begged me to come. I told him I probably couldn't because I was flying in strictly to work and my boss is paying for the trip.
I feel like if I show he is using it to tell people "see how controlling she is... I told her not to come." I am not sure how to handle this but it is another game and I don't want to end up losing at it. If I go he will say I did it against his will and if I don't go he is going to throw in my face how little I care about him.
I feel like I am back in highschool.
Then he got on the phone and told me he has decided it is over with us, he wants a divorce and he wants to be with the OW and their baby on the way. I simply said ok if that is what you want then you can file for divorce because I will not. He said you know I can't afford it and I said then how can you afford an 8th child and he hung up on me.
I think you handled that perfectly
Amy.. keep in mind, that he is, medically speaking, "nuts".
he is literally in a nuthouse.
So, I dont think you should take anything he says now, as any kind of rational, permenant thing
now that I've read more...
totally agree with what ediemarie said. just listen.
Also... go see him!
It will really mean something to him, that you came to see him.
I remember reading about someone, who went through just horrible, horrible things with her husband... things finallhy straightened out, or at least started pointing in the right direction, when he got himself in hospital (car crash), and she was the one who came to see him, not OW.
Make no mistake... this may not be "the magic bullet". Things will still be very difficult for you. But I'm confident that you going to see him, is the best thing for you to do.
if you have to take a vacation day, and pay for an extra night's hotel, to get to see him.. id' say it was worth it.
(usually the airlines are very flexible about changing flight dates for this type of thing; mixing personal trip with business trip.)
I couldn't disagree more. Hospital is one thing, mental hospital is another thing, especially after the umpeenth suicide threat/attempt. H has shown is is incapable of functioning like an adult, at least right now. Therefore, I don't think the normal ideas of what is positive apply because those ideas assume there are two somewhat reasonable adults involved.
It's a catch 22, sure. He'll call you controlling if you go and call you uncaring if you don't. I suggest telling him the next time you talk to him that you really do want to see him but that you don't trust him yet. He's said and done a lot of things to hurt you in the very recent past and you just haven't sorted them all out yet. Therefore, while you continue to support and care about him, you're just not ready to see him yet because not enough time has passed since he last hurt you for you to trust that he won't do it during your visit.
Besides, what's the upside if you do see him? Best case, he tells you how much he loves you and misses the family and that he's leaving the OW. Would you buy that or would you feel like sure I've heard that before? Worst case, he curses you and you leave crying. Either way, I'm betting you walk out of there feeling worse than when you went in. Not what you need to keep your PMA going, IMO.
The thing is, it doesnt matter what he told his EX-wife.
there is no mandate that he tell her the truth.
there is no mandate that she tell Amy the truth.
There are a whole host of reasons that he may have chosen to lie to his ex-wife about why Amy would come to see him.
The most important thing, is that he actually asked Amy, directly, if she would come see him.
he's in a way nastier situation than regular hospital, in some ways. He needs an anchor to the outside.
My opinion, is that it is even more important that she go see him, since he asked.
If he did NOT ask, then I would say the opposite. I would in no way suggest just turning up there, given his mental state, otherwise.
In contrast, if he was in a physical accident, "just turning up" once, might be warranted.
Yes, odds are, something he will say to her at that time, will hurt her. whether deliberate, or unintended.
Thing is though... for long term, "i care about you as a person, I care about having you healthy and well" purposes... I think it is still important for Amy to go see him as he requested.
You both have valid points. I am just trying to see what I should do. He just called me again. I confronted him about what he said to the xwife. He said that he doesn't remember them even discussing it. (Always his way out, his bad memory) Anyway, he told me that his counselors told him that the OW was a bad idea but that he is in no way rational enough to make a decision right now so they thought he should just leave things alone with her atm. He did call me though on his 4:00 phone call not her so that is a plus. He told me he was reading his bible and really trying to do soul searching as to who he really is. He even said that his counselors said we are co-dependent on each other (DUH I HAVE TOLD HIM THIS THOUSANDS OF TIMES) and that we needed couseling.. (HELLO DO I HAVE TO HAVE A DEGREE TO GET HIM TO LISTEN). He said he would consider counseling but he still has 21 days left there best case scenario so he is really trying to get better.
I can only pray he does. Now on another note.
I am furious with my childs school right now. My S9 has bipolar and is really struggling right now with his identity(he has always been called mini-H) so he is hurting because while he loves his dad he hates what he has done to me so it is a flood of emotions and negative thoughts about himself. He cries a lot in class and has a hard time doing work so two days in a row they have sent him to the principals office to do his work and said he is using his home issues as a crutch and they can not tolerate it.
I have a meeting at 9:45 tomorrow morning but I am livid. His dad only left 11 weeks ago and we have only been in this state for 3 weeks. He is a bipolar child in a new school, in a new house, in a new town, and without his anchor, his father. I don't even know what I am going to say tomorrow but I am so mad I am glad I have 17 hours to cool off before I meet with them.
Hey Amy -
Hugs. If it's not one thing it's another. If you can, request to have the school psychologist there when you meet at school. If you have any paperwork that diagnosis your son, bring that too. They should be able to work with you and your son during this time not burden you more - we see this all the time in my school and allowances are made all the time (and I teach on the high school level.)
In regard to visiting your H, I too see both sides of that issue. My gut says, go see him - but not for yourself - for him and for the future of the relationship the two of will have to have for the sake of your kids (regardless of whether or not you stay married). IMO, you do not want to be in the position where anyone can say (including yourself) that you didn't do what was needed to save your marriage or help your H. That being said, do not go for the sake of working out your M, go because a sick "friend" asked you to go. You don't have to stay long - 5 minutes maybe, but just show up. Don't give yourself enough time there to discuss anything or get accused of anything, say hello, get well soon, call me when you're better, the kids miss you, bye.
Hugs
Thanks Edie, I am working out how I will get there and then i will go from there. It is about 2 hours from where I will be so I will have to borrow the bosses car. I am seeing what I can do and I will go from there. When he calls tonight I am going to see his tone before I make my final decision.
I am off to Florida! I will let you know how it goes.
He even said that his counselors said we are co-dependent on each other (DUH I HAVE TOLD HIM THIS THOUSANDS OF TIMES) and that we needed couseling.. (HELLO DO I HAVE TO HAVE A DEGREE TO GET HIM TO LISTEN). He said he would consider counseling but he still has 21 days left there best case scenario so he is really trying to get better.
heh heh... sorry, you may as well choose to see the humor in this one
Amy.. you have a lot of frustration, and understandably so.
hang in there... do nice things for you... and let God and his "people on the inside" do the work now
it sounds like your H is finally in a place that is quiet enough for him to listen... and he has found people that he is actually capable of listening to.
Just give it time, and keep doing what you have been doin
(and go see him
)
PS:
(HELLO DO I HAVE TO HAVE A DEGREE TO GET HIM TO LISTEN)
Perhaps not... the main thing is that you have to be "someone other than Amy, his wife", unfortunately
it's good that he has now found someone who fits that description, to talk to.
May he continue to listen.
and while he is doing HIS listening... may you then feel free to let go of that worry from your mind, so that it will be clearer to listen to what your son is trying to tell you.
Peace
He didn't call yesterday at all. I was hoping if nothing else he would leave a message on my phone but he didn't. So of course I didn't sleep a wink last night and all I can think is he talked to her and changed his mind. My own mind is my worse enemy. I hate it.
Hang in there Amy.
presume that he is going to flip-flop.
dont expect him to stay sane, or committed to anything, at this point.
IF you drop the expectations, it doesnt hurt as much.
Yeah I know. It is so darn hard. I just want to make him better.... and I can't. He has to want it for himself and right now... he doesn't ... just stinks.
He just called and informed me I have to come Sunday because OW is coming tomorrow and of course I lost it.
What should I do?
My opinion is I have more self respect than to take the left over day she wants. I feel I shouldn't go at all. I have nothing left nice to say to him right now. I am angry. Any advice?
i think this is where you draw the line.
you could tell him that if he wants you there, it will have to be that day, or nothing. That you are his wife, and you dont deserve to be treated like that.
If you dont hear from him, or if he wont choose over the phone: You might even choose to show up, and make him choose between you two in person.
if he chooses her, then go 100% dark on him.
see what he has to say for himself in 3 months.
I am not going to see him. I ended up in the hospital with 11 stitches in my finger. His mom told him and he didn't even try to call me to see if I was ok. He had promised to call before this even happened. I am going dark as I can. I have no other choice.
How do you go dark when children are involved. Do I just let them answer the phone or do I just not take any calls from him at all? I don't want to deny him his kids but without me talking to him I have no idea his mental stability and what he will say to them. This whole thing stinks but at this point I feel I have to just let him go.
BTW: IF you're going to go dark on him, deliberately.. i think it's important to let him know why.
In other words, to make it clear to him that you are not talking to him becuase you care about him and he is hurting you, rather than that you arent talking to him becuase you dont care about him.
BTW: IF you're going to go dark on him, deliberately.. i think it's important to let him know why.
In other words, to make it clear to him that you are not talking to him becuase you care about him and he is hurting you, rather than that you arent talking to him becuase you dont care about him.
That's a good distinction. Amy, what happened to your finger? I missed something somewhere....
On Saturday after praying God would give me a sign on rather I should go see him or not I got it caught in a cotton candy machine and cut the end almost off. Had to have 11 stitches.
He has not called me now in two days. When he calls tonight I plan to tell him to not call me again until he is 100% better and knows what he wants. I am going to tell him that I can not take the pain of his indecisiveness and by him making me cry and hurting me it in turn hurts the kids because they hurt when I do. We will see how that goes. I honestly have at this point no desire to talk to him or see him. I am disgusted at the thought of him so not taking his calls should be easy. His actions at this time are simply repulsive.
Amy: i'm sorry for your pain. you're in a horrible place.
i know you dont want to suffer any more.
I think the "knows what he wants" thing is reasonable.
I dont think it is reasonable to demand that he is "100% better" first, though.
He may never be "100% better", for one thing. Also, how would you even judge that?
I guess you have a point I mainly just mean when he is 100% ready to come to us then he can call me until then he needs to leave me alone. The on again off again is bad on the kids and I. He can call them on their cell if he wants them.
He didn't call again yesterday. 3 days no call. I honestly feel relieved. I really just want a few weeks of silence so we can both think.