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Posted By: Jamesjohn "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/06/02 09:44 PM
Although I haven't seen where Michele specifically addressed "going dark" as one of her techniques, it IS a very popular and effective tool to produce results (both good AND bad), and I felt that it needed to be addressed in a thread for easier reference to all. I'm hoping that many much wiser then me will add their wisdom here.

For me, going dark was both a blessing and a curse.

In my pre-DB'ing days, during our separation, going dark was kind of a natural thing for me. It helped to take me out of the chaos, and was pretty effective for causing both my wife and I to miss each other. Every 4 to 6 weeks, we'd get together, and I'd spend a couple of nights at the house with her. However, after a couple of days, I had enough. The same old crap was going on, nothing had changed, and I'd end up leaving again.

During my last period of darkness that lasted a couple of months was when she found the om. I left her alone for just a bit too long it seems.

My last period of darkness was the most effective for me and our relationship. I had been on the board for a couple of months, and knew a lot of the basics. Then, the bomb dropped. Although I thought I handled the initial reaction fairly well, I had to take myself out of the picture to regroup, and to prevent from doing any further damage. I was a mess, but the kind and loving people here on this board helped to pick me up, and to start getting myself back together.

During the next 6 weeks, I participated in, and dedicated myself to, the KLA discussion group Michele had going at the time. By doing this, I was better able to focus on what changes had to be made to be more effective the next time I went "light", and learned some of the skills it was going to take to get there.

Although things by NO means went smoothly, that period of dark time was used effectively, and I had much better results. I saw what things I could change, and how I really didn't need the cooperation of my wife to do it.

Going dark can be a great way to make your partner miss you, and to draw their attention back to you. In and by itself, though, it can't KEEP them there with you.

If you are constantly persuing and bothering them, it's a great way to take the pressure off of them, and it's a "doing something different".

If you were guilty of being withdrawn and emotionally neglectful during the R, it can be a "more of the same" behavior, and could do more harm then good.

I'll stop for now, and let others add their thoughts, comments, and questions.

Mick, are you out there?! [Smile]
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/06/02 10:31 PM
Originally posted by Jamesjohn:


First of all, going dark is often seen as a "black or white" thing, which it really shouldn't be. There are various shades of gray in life, and I believe we should look at this "technique" in this way.

In one sense, going dark is an "LRT", if you've been prone to persue, plead, beg, cry - anything - to try to win back the departing spouse. Also, in effect, the LRT is a form of a 180 if we've been doing these things out of our desperation.

If you have been someone who has been "dark" throughout most of your relationship, this could be defined as "more of the same" behavior, and possibly "more of what doesn't work".

Going dark could also fall into the "do nothing" category. If you were the type of person that always had to be involved in everything, either fixing, directing, or controlling the situation, then staying out of direct contact with your partner can help you to do a "180" on this situation. You are essentially "dropping the rope" to let others handle the situation without your interference.

Going dark can take you out of the chaos long enough to "take stock" of where you are versus where you were, and compared to where you want to go.

Going dark can be a form of "stop going down cheeseless tunnels". If you persist on running through the maze blindly, you may need to take yourself out of the picture until you can "sniff out" the tunnel you need to head down. (Humm, do I want the cheddar or the swiss?!)

Going dark can help you to "start with a beginner's mind". If you can take a step back back, far away from being in the middle of the situation, you can often begin to see things with a fresh eye, a "beginner's mind", and get a clearer view of where you need to head. We've seen this by the way others on this board can often view our situations with a clearer mind then we can.

Going dark is a way you can "make yourself happy for a change" if you've been sooooo wrapped up in saving your relationship that you've forgotten how to really live.

As you can see, I'm VERY opinionated about the whole going dark subject. I firmly believe that it is NOT a technique in itself, but a way to discover,implement, and utilize other techniques.

If a person were to use "going dark" in the spirit of solely "no contact", they would be wasting their time, and setting themselves up for great disappointment.

Remember, learn, live, and love the basics. If you DO go dark, and it IS working for you, take a closer look at the reasons why it works. Then, adjust your future plans from there.
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/06/02 10:40 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Jamesjohn:
quote:
Originally posted by Phoenix:

*****
As for going dark - do you think you can maintain a dusky dark where you aren't pursuing him or engaging in old behavior? That gives you time to do all that you need to for yourself and your life but also doesn't add to what doesn't work in your R. If things get too intense or hard you can always darken the shade a bit.
*****

I think that it's a misconception that "going dark" is an "on-off" type switch, where there are either 100 10,000 watt bulbs blaring away and blinding us, or the power is totally shut-off.

I like to think of more of a dimmer switch, where we can constantly and easily adjust how light/dark/dim it is at any given moment.

Please, please, PLEASE remember that DB/DR'ing is all about change. Keep your hands close to the dimmer switch, and adjust as often as necessary!! [Smile]

Posted By: Sparky Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/06/02 11:59 PM
Going dark is the chance to work on you and to allow the spouse that left you to go through the journey they need to go through. If you start butting into that when they have made it clear that they don't want to be with you, then you come off as someone who is not honoring their request. You are short-circuiting the journey they have to go through to work out what is going on inside themselves.

There was obviously something very wrong that made them decide they wanted out in the first place. Oftentimes, it is probably the case that they are depressed and they have lost faith that anything can ever change. That patterns are set and are not reversible. It's a sign of depression to feel this kind of hopelessness.

One thing they knew for sure was that they did not want you in the picture. When people are depressed and confused about their identity like many people who request separations are, they become cognitively disorganized and impulsive in their choices. And when you are coming at them trying to make them stay with you, it just feels bad and like there's a pressure there to stay where they were.

And they don't want to stay where they were. They are wanting big changes. And if you stay the same as you always have been, and are unwilling to allow them to go on the journey that they need, or you are setting agendas about how they need to be, you just look like a controlling wench or asshole. You become a representation of what they were trying to get away from.

As long as you keep pressuring them, you don't stand a chance. You will remain the embodiment of those bad feelings they are having. You will be something to avoid. You will make it very easy for them to continue to project or blame you for the bad feelings that reside inside of them.

If they are alone with those bad feelings still lingering inside, and you are nowhere in the vicinity, then perhaps they will begin to see that the pain they were feeling was really about something unhealed inside of them rather than something about you. You need to cut that link between bad feelings and you.

If you want there to ever be a future between you and your spouse, I believe you have to let your spouse take the journey that is rightfully theirs, even if they way they are communicating that to you sucks. Even if it hurts like nothing else you've ever felt. If you love them, you have to let them go through that.

And you can't keep looking over to see if they are done yet. It's suffocating. Instead, this is your chance to learn new things. Walk around in your feelings and see what is unhealed in you that makes it so easy for you to feel crazy about this crappy situation in which you find yourself.

You have the gift of time now, and the focusing energy of pain. Don't feel all of this pain without getting your money's worth. Surrender to what is really happening. Face it head on. Summer in the MLC area says that you should stay dark UNLESS your spouse initiates a contact.

For me, there have been two main contacts. First, he called me several weeks ago, and we ended up talking for over an hour. Then, he told me that he wanted to meet with me to tell me some "news." At first, I did not meet with him, because I was not ready to feel more pain. I knew the news wasn't going to be good. But last week, I finally decided to recontact him and tell him that I was ready to meet to hear his news.

His news was that he was seeing the woman I had at first feared he was seeing. But I met when I was good and ready, and it was actually a really productive and authentic contact. I was ready to be calm and not plead and hear his news. And I think that even though he is with another woman, this contact was a good one, even though it was about painful stuff.

When I allow my husband to be the initiator, then he has to know that he wanted to see me. And from being dark, I, Sparky, have actually become a bit mysterious to my husband - which is hilarious, becase I'm the least mysterious person you will ever meet. And he was intrigued. And I liked it. And I'm going to keep doing this because I thing that not only is it "working," but I'm using all this time to grow as I never thought I would.

The worst thing that ever happened to me has been the best thing that ever happened to me. And even though I still feel a lot of pain, I mean that sincerely.
Posted By: Michele Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 12:21 AM
I really like this thread. It's very helpful and informative, especially to newcomers who are trying make sense out of all the expressions folks use around here.

I have stressed this many times on the board and I'm glad to see it stressed here again. Keeping a low profile works well when you've been pursuing and chasing, begging and crying. Going dark- pulling back and being scarce- represents novel behavior. Novelty shakes up the dice and increases the chances your spouse will react in new ways. However, as has been suggested, if you've been the sort of person who has taken a back seat throughout much of your marriage, going dark may seem like old hat.

The key to DBing, whether it's the last resort, going dark, acting as if, or just focusing on the exceptions, is to try something, notice the results and allow those results to guide your future actions. Modify your approach if your spouse responds in undesirable ways. Keep doing what seems to be working. This sort of mind set will get you a lot further than trying to think of what's right or wrong. If your marriage becomes more loving, it's right. IF you push your spouse away and what you want is a close relationship, it's wrong. THis makes life somewhat simpler.

Thanks, JJ, for starting this thread.
Michele
Posted By: Beth Woods Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 10:35 AM
Thanks for the information! I'm pretty unclear as to this whole dark thing and this helped me to see it better (I can see in the dark?).

One question, how should I procede with this dark business? I've decided to go dark when I found out, again, that my H was still seeing the OW. I know that he is running away from his problems by doing this. He also has a very important decision to make about his career right now. But I don't want him to think that I'm avoiding him because I hate him and don't ever want to see him again. I don't want him to pursue this relationship with her because he thinks it's completely over with us. Should I talk to him and tell him that we both need to concentrate on what it is that we want? Or just leave it as is? See my thread if you want further information - Three Strikes - Why can't I call him out?

Thanks again.
Posted By: rearly Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 01:39 PM
quote:
If you are constantly pursuing and bothering them, it's a great way to take the pressure off of them, and it's a "doing something different".
i have been staying in the family home and trying 2 b as dark as possible and act as if however my W announced her intention 2 proceed mainly bcos she claimed i was not giving her space [Eek!]
quote:
If you were guilty of being withdrawn and emotionally neglectful during the R, it can be a "more of the same" behavior, and could do more harm then good.

this is probably an accurate description of the old me however, based on the point above, what should i do/ have done?? [Frown]
Posted By: Mick Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 02:10 PM
If you were guilty of being withdrawn and emotionally neglectful during the R, it can be a "more of the same" behavior, and could do more harm then good.

Well I think if you are going to start being all "emotionally available and not neglectful" when they are not wanting that from you anymore just because somehow it seems like some sort of (logical) 180 then you will likely come unstuck.

This is like closing the barn door after the horse has bolted...


The key is that prior to walking away, the walkaway spouse did want you to be emotionally there for them and so on but having been let down so many times before has most likley decided that not only are they never going to get those things,they no longer want them....a likely emotional divorce will have taken place..most walkaways pretty much could care less at this stage.If you insist on trying to force feed your partner "love and affection" when they are running then dont be surprised if they bring it all back up over you.(and get really antagonistic). You have to let them proceed with their self imposed fast.If they should however get hungry and decide to break thier fast then you can slowly feed them small amounts of "love and affections" again.

Royce(MICK) [Smile]
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 02:39 PM
"If you insist on trying to force feed your partner "love and affection" when they are running then dont be surprised if they bring it all back up over you.(and get really antagonistic)."

The force-feeding of the love and affection usually will act as a repellent.

Start with cracking the door open a bit for rekindling a friendship first.

I think that this is where most great relationships both begin and end.
Posted By: Beth Woods Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 02:51 PM
Hey, JJ - could you check out my question as well? You may have missed it just above Rearly's.
My 180 will be to not pursue my H and hope that he works things out on his own.

Thanks.
Posted By: rearly Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 03:03 PM
quote:
If you insist on trying to force feed your partner "love and affection" when they are running then dont be surprised if they bring it all back up over you.(and get really antagonistic).
quote:
The force-feeding of the love and affection usually will act as a repellent.

Start with cracking the door open a bit for rekindling a friendship first.

I think that this is where most great relationships both begin and end.

i was not force-feeding love and affection 2 my SO - as soon as i started DBing in fact i stopped pursuit as much as possible. the main difference is that i started 2 b more involved with my Ds giving them my time and patience and this is where i think i came unstuck bcos i think she saw this as me trying 2 replace her role or still pursuing her thro them. obviously i am trying 2 2nd guess her, either this or i was not dark in my own house [Confused]
Posted By: Mick Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 03:20 PM
she saw this as me trying 2 replace her role or still pursuing her thro them. obviously i am trying 2 2nd guess her, either this or i was not dark in my own house

Yes and she may have also see it as an attempt to win her over......

or this often has the spouse who wants out of the marriage thinking along the lines that what you are doing "is all too little and all too late" at best and manpulative and an attempt to box them in at worst.
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 03:36 PM
"or this often has the spouse who wants out of the marriage thinking along the lines that what you are doing "is all too little and all too late" at best and manpulative and an attempt to box them in at worst."

That is why I think it's soooo important to make the changes for you, and you alone. To improve the quality of your life.

Yes, we can do a lot of things to grab our partner's attention. To get their curiousity up to take a closer look at us.

Even though we tend to think otherwise, most of our partners aren't idiots. If you REALLY think they are, why on earth did you get together with them in the first place, and why do you really want them back? They'll be able to see through major "manipulations" in a hurry. After all, if that's what they think it really is to start with, they're looking at it under a microscope.

Keep your intentions honest.

Too little, too late? Maybe. This is where consistent "actions speak louder than words" come into play. After all, they may "only believe half of what they see, and none of what they hear", too!
Posted By: totallyconfused Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 03:40 PM
'Going dark is the chance to work on you and to allow the spouse that left you to go through the journey they need to go through. If you start butting into that when they have made it clear that they don't want to be with you, then you come off as someone who is not honoring their request. You are short-circuiting the journey they have to go through to work out what is going on inside themselves.'

Would 'going dark' be suggested (for me) if/when you tell H to move out..ie separation for a while? I have previously always been in the mode of 'trying to fix everything'. Towards the end though (before I found out about his EA)...I pretty much tried to ignore all he did to keep my sanity. (He ALWAYS does what he wants to do, no matter what I might have to say about it..so I just stopped talking.) Throughout our 23 years of marriage I have gone to every extreme as far as my approach to my husband's current crisis..yes DBing too. (Amongst those crises, 3 affairs of one type or another....that I am AWARE of.) And with a track record like this...how can/will my H ever understand/realize what he has done/is doing?

I have allowed my H to continue living with us. (Otherwise financially it would be pretty rough for both of us.) He "promised" that any/all contact would be cut off with his 'friend'. I have discovered that this is not the case and again have been "thrown" into an emotional roller coaster. The second I began asking him..telling him that someone had told me that they seen him at a local restaurant with his blonde friend (we live in a small community)..he immediately went into the mode of " I have been around here..trying to make it work..and think I have been pretty happy. Now, why are you bringing this up? You will never let it go, will you?"

I sure would appreciate any/all thoughts on this.

My first infuriated thoughts would be that he needs to leave right now! Otherwise, I am just setting myself up all over again. I believe he feels as always..that he can do whatever he wants.

Glo
Posted By: rearly Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 03:51 PM
quote:
Yes and she may have also see it as an attempt to win her over......

or this often has the spouse who wants out of the marriage thinking along the lines that what you are doing "is all too little and all too late" at best and manpulative and an attempt to box them in at worst.

mick u know i agree 100% with u on this
quote:
That is why I think it's soooo important to make the changes for you, and you alone. To improve the quality of your life.

Yes, we can do a lot of things to grab our partner's attention. To get their curiousity up to take a closer look at us.

Even though we tend to think otherwise, most of our partners aren't idiots. If you REALLY think they are, why on earth did you get together with them in the first place, and why do you really want them back? They'll be able to see through major "manipulations" in a hurry. After all, if that's what they think it really is to start with, they're looking at it under a microscope.

Keep your intentions honest.

Too little, too late? Maybe. This is where consistent "actions speak louder than words" come into play. After all, they may "only believe half of what they see, and none of what they hear", too!

this is where my confusion is, i am remaining totally committed 2 the changes in me cos they r making me a better person "4 better or worse" however now i am looking 2 move out and give her space, i have not announced my intention to do so and it is gonna b very difficult 4 several reasons
  • financial constraints
  • 3-week stay away residential course
  • new job role
  • school summer holidays
[Frown]
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 03:58 PM
BMW -

"Should I talk to him.."

Yes, but see below.

"and tell him that we both need to concentrate on what it is that we want?"

She says "We need to concentrate on this and that".

He thinks "Who the hell is she to tell me what I need to do?!"

I've found that what works best for me is, not a conversation, but a simple, non-threatening statement that doesn't have to have an immediate reply.

"I know that you have a lot on your mind right now because of your job. I just wanted to let you know that if you want to talk to me about it, I'd be more than happy to listen to you."

Then drop it, and let him take things from there. You've opened up a door, and given him an opportunity to peak through if he wishes. And you've done it without any pursuit, pressure, or OR talk stuff.

IMHO [Smile]
Posted By: Beth Woods Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/08/02 04:09 AM
Thanks JJ. I'll give it a whirl and then go dark.
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/08/02 04:15 AM
Your welcome BMW.

The difficult of working things this way is that you're not likely to get immediate results. For me, it took, and is taking, doing this on a consistent basis over a long period of time. It was very difficult to stay out of the OR stuff, but was essential for my success.

As always, what works for one person doesn't always work for another. I just try to throw out some different ideas of what has worked for me.
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/08/02 04:25 AM
Maybe, sometimes, instead of going dark on a person, we just need to go dark on trying to "fix" the marriage?
Posted By: aplomado Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 05:23 PM
Good answer, JJ. After my telephone consult with Vernetta, who advised me to go dark, I wasn't all that sure what to do. I wasn't about to leave the home as that would look like abandonment of my children, which I would never do. Reading your posts, those of KentS and some others, I came to that conclusion: Go dark on trying to fix things. Just sit back, detach from the tempest and see what happens. So far, so good. [Wink]

~aplomado
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 06:20 PM
"this is where my confusion is, i am remaining totally committed 2 the changes in me cos they r making me a better person "4 better or worse" however now i am looking 2 move out and give her space, i have not announced my intention to do so and it is gonna b very difficult 4 several reasons"

You don't HAVE to move out in order to give her space.
Posted By: Phoenix Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 06:49 PM
Thank You! That's what I was trying to explain to rearely on his last thread but I think my fingers get all twisted sometimes...

This thread has taken a really important turn. So many people try techniques that are comfortable for them (going dark when they usually withdraw or become extra supportive when they usually hover) - But they're likely to have more success if they dip into what is uncomfortable for them. And if they expect the object of their DBing to react in strange ways. Usually with more of their same, or a negative reaction at first and probably for a while; depending on the situation.

I especially appreciate Michele jumping in there and clarifying that. Thanks again JJ for another Gem!
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 07:22 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Phoenix:
But they're likely to have more success if they dip into what is uncomfortable for them. And if they expect the object of their DBing to react in strange ways. Usually with more of their same, or a negative reaction at first and probably for a while; depending on the situation.

SOOOO very true, my friend.

If you're doing a true 180, it probably SHOULD be very uncomfortable to you. And to them.

Remember, when you are doing a 180, you are really just "renting" it, trying it on for size. It doesn't have to become a PERMANENT part of your life. Often, we'll find that a good balance will be somewhere between what our extreme 180 is, and where we are now.

Taking your life off of "autopilot" can be uncomfortable. However, every small thing you do differently starts the butterfly effect in motion.

Sometimes, your partner WILL get pissed at you for changing the dance steps, for taking them off of THEIR autopilot. But that ain't neccessarily a BAD thing.
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/07/02 08:08 PM
aplamado - What are some of the things that are helping you to "stay dark" while still living in the same house?
Posted By: rearly Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/08/02 08:21 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Jamesjohn:
You don't HAVE to move out in order to give her space.

quote:
Originally posted by Phoenix:
Thank You! That's what I was trying to explain to rearely on his last thread but I think my fingers get all twisted sometimes...

This thread has taken a really important turn. So many people try techniques that are comfortable for them (going dark when they usually withdraw or become extra supportive when they usually hover) - But they're likely to have more success if they dip into what is uncomfortable for them. And if they expect the object of their DBing to react in strange ways. Usually with more of their same, or a negative reaction at first and probably for a while; depending on the situation.

I especially appreciate Michele jumping in there and clarifying that. Thanks again JJ for another Gem!

OK now i am really confused

let me c if i can make sense from my perspective:
  • if i stay dark then, based on my past performance(pre DB), i am not changing... my SO will continue 2 slip away, whether i stay at home or not.
  • if i take charge (of myself) and stay in the house; this can b seen as pursuit, manipulative or, 2 little 2 late. however this is also likely 2, with adjustments, have the greatest benefit in the long term 4 ME if i stay constant so the changed me becomes the REAL me
sorry if i seem thick, mispent youth, lost brain cells, etc
Posted By: rearly Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/08/02 08:37 AM
sorry about this however cannot edit posts at the moment... as this is not my thread 2 hijack i thought that if i include a link then (heaven forbid) u would come visit the DB shuttle is leaving for smilie space - all aboard!! [Cool]
Posted By: Wardacres Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/08/02 09:19 AM
JJ, read all the comments on your thread and they were very helpful. W and I are not living together now..she's in her house and me in mine. Haven't heard a word from her...prior to DBing, I would email her and attempt to call her. She simply deleted my emails and won't answer the phone. Haven't attempted any of that in 3 weeks but it's killing me by having NO contact...good or bad!

How and when do I attempt contact? She's stubborn and I don't ever see her contacting me again...it's going to have to be me doing the contacting. She's also got her sister, and other girlfriends giving her the old advice of "dump him, find someone new"...I'm at wit's end...
Posted By: aplomado Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/08/02 11:33 AM
JJ ~

I have very much shut myself down emotionally with W in that I do not initiate any physical contact, no ILYs (she knows that I love her) or initiate OR talks (never were many b4 [her deal, not mine] and they certainly stopped entirely with MLC). I am there if she needs something, I listen attentively to whatever she has to say, however, I listen like a lover not a lawyer (I'm very analytical). I am giving her all the "Space" she wants to do as she wants without me being in her face or questioning anything. I used to bring her flowers every Friday and did many other things for her. That has all stopped. No telephone calls during the day, either. As I mentioned in a different post, when our 19th anniversary arrived last month, I did nothing ~ no flowers, no card, no mention of it. This is a real 180 for me but I didn't want to remind her of "us." I saw it more as a "dark" thing than a 180. The morning of the anniversary she asked if we could go to dinner for our anniversay (she was first to mention the date). I told her that I would go to dinner with her in honor of our anniversary only if it wouldn't be our last anniversary. This was not presented as pursuit but a statement of how I felt about the situation ~ I was not about to celebrate a sham, if that's all it was to her. Turned out we had a very pleasant evening.

But, the pursuit has totally stopped and I spend more time doing other things and time with the children. She is geting no pressure from me to do anything; she has all the time in the world to think through whatever it is she is thinking about. If she wants to discuss anything with me, I am available.

I am not new to DB but was led astray by my wife in my first go 'round. After getting THE BOMB in August of 2000, only days after being told how wonderful I was, I went out after everything I could find to help including individual and joint therapy. I found Michelle's book in late June of 2001. Last July I had a very serious OR discussion with W(I did not have DR yet; I now know better) and she said she would read DB. While she only read half of the book, things suddenly got better. By October things were much improved and she told me she was happy and wouldn't be leaving after all. When I asked what had changed, she said, "I read your book. I wanted change so I changed." I found out at the end of this April that she had reverted to her original stance and again wanted a divorce. Angry at being misled again I took off my wedding ring and told her that since it was a symbol of her love for me to take it back; it was meaningless. She would not take it back, so we talked. I found a little more light in that black hole when I asked her about why she didn't finish the book. Her - I read most of it. Me (the lawyer) - Your book mark is on page 149, that's hardly half. Her - I got frustrated because it never said how to rekindle the flame.

WOW [Cool] [Big Grin] There is hope!!!

I bought another copy of DR (the original copy had mysteriously disappeared) found this wonderful bb (y'all have saved my sanity) and arranged a telephone consult with Vernetta (there are no SBTs here or anywhere near here). She advised that I go DARK. I spoke with wife about KLA (I had already ordered the tapes for myself) since she was, at least at one time, interested in rekindling the flame. I mentioned Vernetta and she agreed to talk with her. Vernetta was gracious enough to speak with her on the only day W has available which is not a normal day for Vernetta to take calls ~ God bless you , Vernetta. She said she found the talk very useful and is also listening to the KLA tapes.

So, I am being very calm and detached but not uncaring, acting "AS IF" and letting her work through things. I am there as a friend when she wants me but I am NOT pursuing at all. Thanks to this board, I understand how it works.

~ aplomado

dd just asked if I'd go get some fresh Krispy Kreme donuts. Guess where I'm headed? Right! [Big Grin]
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 06:21 PM
let me c if i can make sense from my perspective:

rearly -

"if i stay dark then, based on my past performance(pre DB), i am not changing... my SO will continue 2 slip away, whether i stay at home or not.
if i take charge (of myself) and stay in the house; this can b seen as pursuit, manipulative or, 2 little 2 late. however this is also likely 2, with adjustments, have the greatest benefit in the long term 4 ME if i stay constant so the changed me becomes the REAL me"


By George, you've got it! By George, I think you've got it!

One of your key phrases there was "taking charge of yourself". From what you said earlier, it sounds like YOU moving would be a pretty big hardship for you at this time. So, let her move if she wants out.

Take a look at what aplamado wrote about how he's doing it. Looks like some pretty good stuff there.

"Actions speak louder than words".

Will check out your thread here in a bit. [Smile]

"sorry if i seem thick, mispent youth, lost brain cells, etc"

I thought that I recognized you from those parties! [Big Grin]
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 09:00 PM
^
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 09:18 PM
Wardacres -

"Haven't heard a word from her...prior to DBing, I would email her and attempt to call her. She simply deleted my emails and won't answer the phone."

Around that point of time, what were your e-mails and conversations about? Let me guess, OR stuff, right?! Didn't work, did it? What was the lesson in this? [Eek!]

"How and when do I attempt contact?"

or

"How long should I stay dark?"

Statistics prove that a person should stay dark approximately 368,243 seconds for every year of marriage. Unless the second full moon of the month falls in that period of time, in which case you would have to add another 387 minutes. [Razz]

But, that's just statistical data, which has nothing to do with any of our situations or the real world, right?!

I think a good rule of thumb for a person is when they can get rid of any whiney, judgemental, pitiful, sad, etc. behaviours, and can be a little more centered on their goals. When you can treat your partner as you would a friend. Until you get there, it's probably better to remain hidden.

Another rule of thumb is to wait until your partner makes contact with you. Although this is also good, sometimes the period of time becomes rather "extended". If you start running into 2, 3 or 6 months without having ANY contact, it might be time to take a closer look to see if what you're doing is really working, and, if not, do something different.

I tried to keep my "re-entry into light" pretty light, yet personal. A funny birthday card, like you would give to a friend. A funny birthday card from our dog. During an annual trade show of mine, I sent her a card of thanks and appreciation for all the support and understanding she had for me during the shows of the years past. She loves birds, so I occasionally sent her some info I found on the internet about them. A "Rocky Horror Picture Show" video. Some Lucille Ball commerative stamps, just 'cuz "She Loves Lucy"!

No I love you's, no I miss you's, or any other OR stuff. Just things that I knew she would appreciate, some things that no one else could know were special to her. Over a period of time, and with no expectations of any calls, of any thank you's. (It usually only took about a week before I would hear from her, and had pleasant conversations. NO OR!!!)

Some may think this borders on persuit, but I believe that someone needs to be the first one to reach their hand out eventually, to instigate some kind of contact, unless you want to spend the rest of your days in the dark.

Again, this may not be for everybody, but it's what worked for me. [Smile]

JJ
Posted By: DJC Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 09:56 PM
Ok John I have a question.

My W says I wasn't affectionate enough in the relationship that I cared only about myself. Now going "dark" has worked in the past with her initiating contact but it seems I have to keep doing it as she pulls away. Go dark she comes, go light she pulls back. I want to try something different and although going dark works I am not sure it is the most effective too I could be using. Any ideas how I can be affectionate to W and not be pursuing?

DJC
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 10:29 PM
DJC - To answer your question honestly.....

I dunno! [Eek!]

I'm still doing the "light / dark" dance for the past year. Sometimes for a day or two, sometimes just for a matter of minutes. However, it IS getting to be less as time goes on. Questions for you....

When you "go light", how bright are you getting? Is it something that may be seen as overwhelming to her, or do you turn it up just gradually? Is it all or nothing? Have you tried staggering your distancing, maybe added some mystery, or have you been an open book?

Do you know what ways your wife wants to be shown affection? Not what YOU would want, but what SHE wants? (This one's tough, because it varies from person to person) Have you ever taken a look at the 5 love languages book? If you have, where does she fall in?

What things do you do when you're together? What are some of her favorite things in life? Favorite colors or smells? Favorite foods? Favorite movies, especially light-hearted, and / or funny movies?

What are her strengths? Her weaknesses? Her most signicant accomplishments that she's proud of? What does she hope to yet accomplish? (And not just career stuff, but as a person.) What are some things you know about her that no one else might? (Try to focus on the good.)

What things could you do to help build up her self-esteem, and make her feel better about herself when she's with you?

What are the things that both you and she are doing when she begins distancing, and what could you do to throw something different into the mix?

Do you think I ask too many questions? [Roll Eyes]
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 10:47 PM
Here's something I found on another thread that I thought was quite appropriate now...

quote:
Originally posted by einstein:

Here is something quoted from MF that may help:
quote:
My years of neglect forced her to stop this huge flow of love that is her basic nature. She is angry cause she can no longer feel the only thing that was ever really important to her, feeling the flow of her love outward. It is completely damned up and stopped because of neglect. Seduce to find the smallest crack for this flow to start flowing again. But the seduction must be very subtle, quiet. It cannot appear as pursuit—compliments, praise, when we touch letting the touch linger a little to long, telling her how pretty she looks, what a great mom she is, etc—anything that reinforces and draws out this flow of love.
[Wink]

E.[/QB]

Posted By: tc33406 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 11:00 PM
^ just bumping this thread. I am "going dark and appreciate all the advice given here. Thx...TC
Posted By: DJC Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 11:13 PM
Hmmmm James those are tough questions. Here is what she wrote to me in a recent IM conversation:

quote:
you stopped dressing up, going to the gym, cleaning, taking care of the animals, complimenting me, buying me flowers or cards, everything was different--you didnt have to do anything cuz i married you and you put in no time or effort into anyting except what you wanted

So I wonder are these the things she is looking for? I don't know. I sent her a little card but it got no response so I am confused.

DJC
Posted By: Mick Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 11:27 PM
My W says I wasn't affectionate enough in the relationship that I cared only about myself.

So was every cuddle read by you as a signal for sex?... were you the typical male?...grope first,I love you's and compliments etc later if she was lucky and you had'nt already fallen asleep..

Now going "dark" has worked in the past with her initiating contact but it seems I have to keep doing it as she pulls away.

Backing off is a lot like fishing,you cast you line and wait for a bite..well your wife is nibbling but she has'nt bitten down on the hook yet,meanwhile you are attempting to reel her in.Of course she slip away every time.

DJC the proper emotional attitude towards you is not existant in your wife to any large degree as yet.She is not committed to "making a go of it" as such and wont be until she is convinced it is in her best interest to be reeled in.That will take you convincing her of your changes..by showing her actions not words(although combined with actions your words carry wieght and will influence her)....


Go dark she comes, go light she pulls back. I want to try something different and although going dark works I am not sure it is the most effective too I could be using.

Well are you communicating effectievly?...are you listening to her...hearing what she wants...have you been dark long enough?
Have you mixed it up a bit?...have you run Hot and Cold on her?...give it some thought.I feel your to anxious to "run with it" the moment she draws a little nearer.You need to be a bit more aloof and nonchalont.

Any ideas how I can be affectionate to W and not be pursuing?

Well I could give you a thousand ideas but firstly is that what she wants right now?..
and if it is what kind of things mean affection to her....not to any one else but her?

Royce(MICK) [Smile]
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 11:27 PM
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
you stopped dressing up, going to the gym, cleaning, taking care of the animals, complimenting me, buying me flowers or cards, everything was different--you didnt have to do anything cuz i married you and you put in no time or effort into anyting except what you wanted


Damn, my man, even if these aren't all the things she's looking for, she's given you a helluva great starting point!

A word of caution here. It's a natural tendency to go overboard in doing all these things she's talking about. What happens is we'll do ALL of these things for a couple of days, and expect big kudos for having changes our ways. When this praise doesn't happen, we throw our arms up and say "What the hell, I'm giving her everything she wants and it's not making a difference. I give up!"

Don't let that happen. Pick out one or two things to start with, and be consistent with them. It's going to take some time to undo any damage that's done done over a period of years. THEY are only going to believe half of what they see, and none of what they hear.

Maybe start with the dressing up around her a bit more first. This might grab her attention the soonest. If you try to do everything at once, this could definitely be seen as persuing, and off she'll go again.
Posted By: DJC Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 11:47 PM
I ahve done alot of these not out of desire but out of necessity. I have been going to the gym and dressing nice and she has really noticed these but is leery that I will fall back. All I can say is more time is needed.

DJC
Posted By: DJC Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 11:50 PM
Plus I have been trying to compliment her when I can but of course the flowers and card thing is probably not a good idea at this point. [Razz]

DJC
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 11:52 PM
"have you run Hot and Cold on her?...give it some thought.I feel your to anxious to "run with it" the moment she draws a little nearer.You need to be a bit more aloof and nonchalont."

If you run too hot on her, you're placing a tremendous amount of pressure on her to "make it work". She might feel that her only choices are to be with you either 100%, or not at all. Don't place her in that position yet. You probably won't get the results you want.

Let her chose to be with you on her own.

sloooowwwweee. [Smile]
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/10/02 11:58 PM
"Plus I have been trying to compliment her when I can but of course the flowers and card thing is probably not a good idea at this point."

Try complimenting her like you would a friend, not a lover.

Stay away from cards and flowers, unless you're getting good results from them. Which it doesn't sound like you are.

What are her favorite smelling flowers? Maybe do a potpourri with some of them and put them in an inconspicious place, where she won't see them. Sometimes, it helps to to subconscienciously intice a person's senses. Aromatherapy type stuff, you know!
Posted By: DJC Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/11/02 12:00 AM
Hard to put them places when she doesn't live with me! [Razz]

DJC

Yes I do tend at timies to run hot and cold at time. She leaves for a 6 week deployment in a week and a half so I guess I will be dark by default.

DJC
Posted By: DJC Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/11/02 11:50 AM
bump
Posted By: calico Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/13/02 01:19 AM
JJ,

I'm having some major issues with going dark. Would you be so kind to take a look at my thread and give me your opinion? [Smile]

savedwoman
savedwoman's 3 Thread
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/14/02 08:39 PM
Going Dark????
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/29/02 12:01 AM
^
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/20/02 12:19 AM
^
Posted By: Robert1956 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/23/02 03:28 PM
JJ,

Just a bump up and a big thank you for looking at my thread. Check in on me from time to time, will you? I'm trying to read everything that you've posted.

Robbie
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/25/02 10:12 PM
Bump time!
Posted By: Phoenix Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/26/02 08:45 PM
I love this thread. Maybe because going dark was probably one of the most important and effective things I ever did to get where I am now (which is a fabulous place tho I wouldn't call us a success story that every one is looking for). I like this and Mick and R8's Slowee Slowee Monkey story. Which I didn't see during my cursory glances.

JJ - congrats on the moderator status. Good for you. You're a great guy with such an openness about you. You are admirable. And you know...this bird doesn't toss off complements for nothing
Posted By: hurtin Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/26/02 11:52 PM
Hi JJ and Pheonix,

Pheonix,I will have to find your thread and read thru
your post.I am glad to hear that you got in a nice
place by going dark.I myself have been going dark lately
and personally I am so scared that it may push my H
away further.Yet,at first when I pursued,begged etc. He
seemed to hate that too.Yet,when we do have a contact
now,which is very rare,he seems to love the hugs and kisses.
And also seems to like giving them.
I am beginning to just ramble.Anyways,I too find this
thread very interesting,thanks so much JJ.
Take care.tammy
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/27/02 01:02 PM
Quoting Phoenix:
I love this thread. Maybe because going dark was probably one of the most important and effective things I ever did to get where I am now (which is a fabulous place tho I wouldn't call us a success story that every one is looking for). I like this and Mick and R8's Slowee Slowee Monkey story. Which I didn't see during my cursory glances.

JJ - congrats on the moderator status. Good for you. You're a great guy with such an openness about you. You are admirable. And you know...this bird doesn't toss off complements for nothing



i love it toooo... and fee's compliments aren't cheap
Posted By: jwhetnc Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/27/02 02:27 PM
This thread is really good. It hits home on where I'm at right now.

I came off as controlling and smothering with my W. I have now realized that and am trying to work on it. She has moved out and says she needs time and space.

I have made it very clear to her that I want to work things out, and that I am trying to make positive changes in myself. In our last R conversation about a week ago, she was pretty much confused as to whether she wants to work things out or not. Said at times she just thinks that it is over, then she misses me when she doesn't see me or talk to me for a few days, but when she gets around me she can't stand me and wants to get away.

So, I had decided that I would just back off and leave her alone to figure things out. But, this morning I was having second thoughts...thinking, "maybe if I send her an email telling her that I believe in our M, that it can be better than it was, that things don't have to be the same as before..."

Then, I saw this thread. I realized that I don't need to send her an email, or tell her any of that. It has all been said before. There is nothing more that I can say. I realized that actions speak louder than words. I have to stand back and leave her alone while she processes everything. While doing so, I have to discover what I am doing that drives her away. I have to work on myself so that the next time we are together she has a more positive reaction.

Thanks for this great thread!
Posted By: patfrompast Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/27/02 03:08 PM
JJ,
please read my story and give me some sugestions. It seems different from all stories since it is an trans-Atlantic separation and I do not know how I can actually apply DBing.

I would be thankfull to you
Posted By: jsiena Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/27/02 07:18 PM
I have read this thread and understand the concept of going dark. I have experienced my W running when I did anything remotely pursuing. All of this has stopped. What I would like to know is how I should go dark given my situation. My W had a EA with a high school friend who lives out of state before we were separated. We have been separated since mid-August. I believe that she has taken her affair to a physical level with the OM but can't be sure. Although we have only been separated a very short time, she filed for D two weeks ago. She seems to be in a huge rush. Is going dark the answer given this fast track? If so, does it give her the space to be with the OM? Maybe it will help her realize what an idiot this guy is. I feel that she may be hurrying it because of the OM.

Any suggestions?
Posted By: PKD Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/27/02 09:05 PM
Hi JamesJohn, Couple of quick questions. Although, I understand the need to stop the chase. The problem when sharing the same bedroom makes it difficult. So far I am taking cold showers and sometimes sleeping on the couch.
Also when the fears come bubbling up: change, abandomment,
not being loved again, rejection, not being good enough, not being accepted, being alone, the big unknown. Looking for ideas to better handle these gremlins. I know that worrying doesn't help--but hard to stay on target at 4 AM.
Appreciate any ideas. PKD
Posted By: Phoenix Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/27/02 11:42 PM
Tammy - I've been away for a while and I hadn't really posted much on myself before that. My last thread was Swan Song and I think my first thread was Phoenix Rising. It's a jumbled journey to say the least.

Thumbnail recap: We're mid-30s, been together one way or another 21 years (yikes!); teen son. Anyway, I was the perfect woman for a verbally abusive-destructive alcoholic dope addict. Meaning I twisted myself into knots trying to do what I thought I was supposed to do but in reality I was playing my role in keeping it that messed up.

I had already filed for D when I re-aquainted myself with Michele's work and yahooed to this site. I really wanted to save my marriage and family. Just before that I asked IGgy (H) if he really wanted to be married to me and he said he did. I told him that I thought we needed to take 6 months (yep, 6) apart so that we could both do what we needed to do and not interfere with the other. He reluctantly agreed. From then, I'd say it was less than two months and we started trying to relate to each other as people. Most of that is documented here from early 01 (I had to re-register a while ago) - anyway...

It's been a very difficult road here and I knew it was a 1 in a million shot from the get go but you know what? I am really not the same weak scared woman I was and he has learned a great deal as well. Will we reconcile? I still don't see it because he's still hanging on to some big things I honestly cannot live with. But we have never (and I mean never) been able to relate to each other (as human beings) as we do now. And I believe that the root of that is thru Michele's work. And Susan Forward, Iylanla Vanzant, Joyce Meyer, Ed Young, Phil McGraw, Gary Smalley...

And very many wonderful people who sit here typing on this messageboard. Really. There are some real gems here who I really don't want to get into naming cause I'd miss some.

Anyway, to you I would say the more confidence you can allow yourself to have with your gut, the better your chances. The quicker you can work thru your emotions the better. The more willing you are to take a chance and really guage the results - the better. You have to get analytical. For me, I found IGgy would react really badly when I found something that worked - because he wanted me to stop it.

Anyway, The fact that your contact is good is a great sign. Really enjoy those positive things, regardless in how small they are. And for the setbacks? Try to learn from them but don't dwell. Don't make your R the center of your universe. Being healthy is the most important thing to me. And don't expect things to happen overnite tho some things really do happen quickly when they do.

Good luck to you hon. I don't know how much I'll be returning over time but I'll be sure to check in with ya periodically. You can do it chickie! Rah! Rah! Rah!
Posted By: hurtin Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/28/02 02:11 AM
Hi phoenix,

I will have to try and locate your old threads.
I cannot express my words of thanks enough for
you encouraging words.Good-luck to you to.
Oh,and thanks for the cheers
Take care,Tammy
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/15/02 11:26 PM
^ Bump for leighann!
Posted By: CAGirl Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/16/02 07:54 PM
Dear JJ,

I think you hit the nail on the head of what I thought 'going dark' was when I first found this board in April.
Quote:

If a person were to use "going dark" in the spirit of solely "no contact", they would be wasting their time, and setting themselves up for great disappointment.



Reading and rereading this thread has really helped my perspective. The good thing is that things happen when they are supposed to. I don't think I could have done this right at the beginning, so I'm glad to have this tool to use now. I have been trying different shades of grey, and am going to arm myself with them to get thru the holidays with a minimum of fuss.

Thank you for all these great new threads and all the time and effort you spend in moderating. It is very helpful.

xoxox Karen
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/06/02 11:45 PM
Make a great weekend!
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/20/02 04:50 PM
****
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/23/02 03:18 PM
some of the best advice on the board
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/12/03 04:25 PM
Hi sg!!

Yup, lots of great input from a lot of wise people here!
Posted By: thesane1 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/12/03 05:50 PM
this is what this site is all about
THANKYOU
Posted By: gtocher Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/12/03 06:04 PM
My WAW has been avoiding everyone since leaving a note &
walking out. We spoke a few times in the weeks after she left & our talks were about how good the M was.

I then pursued & she pushed away.

I then went Dark since jan 7, with only a couple angry
messages. Then no contact for 2 weeks.

Only response since has been a couple calls from her about minor things.

When I asked about finances this week, she said whenever you are ready. I said you wanted time & space so I gave it
to you.


Does going dark with someone who does not want to deal with the emotional issues & the R work?

Where do I go from here? I was going to make some minor
contact to test the waters. Try to keep it upbeat & freindly. So maybe she could see the changes I have made
are going to be permanent.

Any input is appreciated.

Thanks
Posted By: Phoenix Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/12/03 11:58 PM
Perhaps in your situation it isn't about going dark or not. It's more about what you do with the time/contact you do have with her. Sometimes we gotta understand that they aren't going to open up about things. It's hard but I suggest that maybe you think about the fact she may never do that and focus on other things. Respect her space, take care of actual business and other than that, every once in a while just let her know that you're still there.

The good thing is that she's called you twice for whatever reason. There are people here who would love that from their SO.

It also helps to understand that when you've been around someone long enough, a sigh, an inflection, a glance - speaks volumes. So we may convince ourselves we've backed off and in reality we're still pressuring hard with the slightest of effort. That's part of the dance that needs to be broken.

Remember, it's about actions, not words. Observe yourself and her and take notes if it helps. Good luck in your continued journey
Posted By: gtocher Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/13/03 02:53 PM
Thanks Phoenix, you are right about watching & learning.

I spoke with her again yesterday. About some medical forms.

She sounded very tired & is working 9 days straight.

I tried to lighten it up a little. Asked about her dad &
work.

Told her I wanted drop off a Valentines card for my "freind", but that it probably wasn't a good idea. She said "Probably not but it was a very nice thought, buy a
rose for someone else & say it was from me".

Told her not to work so hard, she was going to burn out.
She told me not to work so hard and to take care.

I have been taking notes on our calls & the last 3 contacts have beeb pretty good. She seems to be moving on
but I don't think she is as happy where she is as she thought she would be.

It seems maybe I can be a little grey, let her make contacts or if I make sporadic contact it is ok.

Thanks for the perspective. It always helps to have someone
else look at things & give an objective response.
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/20/03 05:16 PM
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/22/03 03:50 PM
to the top
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/25/03 05:23 PM
up for grislen!
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/27/03 02:16 AM
hello
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 03/21/03 08:59 PM
UP!!!
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 05/16/03 10:42 PM
Bump time!!
Posted By: rjd5974 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 05/17/03 02:17 PM
I've often wondered, what's the difference between "going dark" and going into the LRT? Are they essentially the same thing...particularly if you're seperated physically?
Posted By: electra Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/17/03 02:17 PM
This is an excellent thread!
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/01/03 02:51 AM
Up we go!!!!!!
Posted By: Confused_Hope Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/01/03 03:26 AM
Would you please take a look at my sit and offer any advice from Moderator's perspective? I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks.

Confused_Hope
Posted By: monte Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/01/03 10:08 AM
As with confused hope, if you were able to take a look at my sitch, I greatly appreciate it.

Otherwise, if my H is away having thinking / decision time, is this the time I should be going dark? I have a 2.5yr old, who he MAY want to talk to, but if he's having time, and OW is still contacting him, can't my going dark be detrimental? I was the fixer previously, had to have the fight and fix it all. Too much confrontation and not enough listening (not that he ever talked). BUT if I ring him he will feel pressured.

Unsure of the next move, as I don't know how long he is planning on being gone.
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/03/03 02:35 AM
Matt_L posted this over on shirley's thread, and I thought it belongs here, too!!!

Quoting Matt_L:
Hi Shirley,

No contact can be better than contact depending on your timing.

DO NOT contact your SO when you need affirmation. This will show and will push him away. Also, it is more likely than not you will not get it, which will ruin your PMA.

DO NOT contact your SO when you are looking for signs of progress. This will come across to him as you being needy and will push him away. Again, it is also more likely than not you will not get what you are looking for.

DO NOT contact your SO when you are in a bad, sad, or crummy mood. This will usually result in a bad encounter, which will push him away.

DO contact your SO when you have something that needs to be addressed. However, don't make up things just as an excuse to contact him. When you do contact him, make sure you are mentally prepared with good PMA.

DO contact your SO when you are in a good mood. This will often shine through in the contact and will leave him with a good impression.

DO be the first to end contact with your SO.

DO read your SO's mood when you contact him. If after a few comments, the contact is not going well, end it. If Your SO volunteers information, listen and validate to show him good rapport.


EVERY contact with your SO should be an opportunity to win him back. Do not fall prey to your present emotional needs, which can result in contact that pushes him away. Keep your ultimate goal in mind. Use contact to draw him closer!

Hope that helped.
Posted By: Zebra Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/03/03 03:34 AM
I've read a bit of this thread, but not all of it, but I want to put in my 2 cents. I've written this all before, but my threads have all been purged it seems, and those that still exist are buried so deep that I'm an unknown. But this is what I've learned...

Going dark is the most over-rated technique I've seen listed on the board at all. To me, it is the epitome of the LRT. If you are not ready to do a LRT, do not go dark!

To me, Michele has only one thing to say in all her books... "If what you are doing is not working, do something else. If what you do does work, do more of it!!!" If you are in an uncommunicative marriage, and you go dark, you are doing more of what doesn't work. Period.

I busted my divorce when I finally in an angry, frustrated outburst, proclaimed that I refused to live with the OM's girlfriend anymore. Up to that point, I "went dark" while she still lived at home. I let her do what she wanted. I didnt' protest her coming home at 2,3, 4, 5 am. I snooped in all her email, and I knew exactly -- in graphic detail --- what she was doing in the wee hours, but I remained silent. When I finally received a letter from her attorney telling me to hire my own and to "proceed with negotiations toward a divorce", I finally voiced all my opinions. Some time later, when I had had enough of her coming home at all hours, and I told her to move out, because I was finished with "living with OM's girlfriend", she responded that she never knew I felt that way, and agreed to stop seeing him, postponing the lawyer's action, and entering joint counceling. Wow.

Now, my sitch is my sitch. But, I learned real fast that I had been "going dark" all wrong. In fact, going dark almost killed my marriage, because W took it as lack of interest.

You must keep in touch with the situation. YOu must continue to press your intention. You must let your WS know that you care, that you are willing to make it work. You must not appear indifferent.

I still beleive that going dark is terribly over-rated, and that it is among the worst advice one can give. I truly believe it is the epitome of an LRT. Beware of this technique, and only use it when appropriate.

God bless you all....

z
Posted By: lostlove Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/03/03 03:42 AM
just want to add that going dark should not mean going cold....

going dark means you don't initiate...but heck if your was IS initiating you respond kindly.

you listen when they offer but you don't pry or ask for more.

you remain vauge about yourself and/or only offer info when it is asked for.

LL
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/18/03 02:49 PM
Quoting Michele:
I really like this thread. It's very helpful and informative, especially to newcomers who are trying make sense out of all the expressions folks use around here.

I have stressed this many times on the board and I'm glad to see it stressed here again. Keeping a low profile works well when you've been pursuing and chasing, begging and crying. Going dark- pulling back and being scarce- represents novel behavior. Novelty shakes up the dice and increases the chances your spouse will react in new ways. However, as has been suggested, if you've been the sort of person who has taken a back seat throughout much of your marriage, going dark may seem like old hat.

The key to DBing, whether it's the last resort, going dark, acting as if, or just focusing on the exceptions, is to try something, notice the results and allow those results to guide your future actions. Modify your approach if your spouse responds in undesirable ways. Keep doing what seems to be working. This sort of mind set will get you a lot further than trying to think of what's right or wrong. If your marriage becomes more loving, it's right. IF you push your spouse away and what you want is a close relationship, it's wrong. THis makes life somewhat simpler.

Michele
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/20/03 01:08 AM
to the tippy top
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/07/03 01:46 AM
^^^^^^^^
Posted By: sad_n_lonely Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/07/03 03:38 PM
My sitch:
M 1.5 yrs, seperated after 9 mos. Back together after DB'ing for almost 4 months. I relapsed and let my low self esteem creep back and H ran again. He has been gone for 6 days, have not seen or spoken to him for 5 days. We were back together almost 6 months this last time. I realize most of our problems are over my issues of trust.

Last time I suggested we "date" so he could see I was trying to change. It worked out well and he did return. This time he wants nothing to do with me and says no matter what I do, it's over. My MIL totally supports his decision, which is a nail in my coffin, so to speak.

Do I even stand a chance by going dark? It is what I have decided because seeing him would hurt even more than the agony I feel now. Also, he promised he would never run again, so there goes more of my trust. I am wary and angry at him.

I am so torn...at one point I miss him so badly and want to see him but again, I don't think i'm ready, either. I want to have hope but I know it could turn out for the worst. I am not ready to do this again but what else do I have to do? I suppose I am reluctant because I always end up being hurt. I want this R and our M to work, but I am sceptical on his part.

Please advise...am I doing the right thing by being dark?

~~~Debi
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/15/03 03:34 AM
a must read
Posted By: emm Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/25/03 12:40 AM
Quote:

Hi JamesJohn, Couple of quick questions. Although, I understand the need to stop the chase. The problem when sharing the same bedroom makes it difficult. So far I am taking cold showers and sometimes sleeping on the couch.
Also when the fears come bubbling up: change, abandomment,
not being loved again, rejection, not being good enough, not being accepted, being alone, the big unknown. Looking for ideas to better handle these gremlins. I know that worrying doesn't help--but hard to stay on target at 4 AM.
Appreciate any ideas. PKD


can jj answer this these are the same things i think about.
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/05/03 02:31 AM
~~~~~~~~
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/05/03 04:08 AM
It may help to try the thought-stopping technique. THink about other warm, pleasant things. If you're feeling hurt, while in the same bed, you probably send those signals. Try to feel the good things...........what you focus on expands.
Posted By: pleasehelpme Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/06/03 10:23 PM
Ok - I have read all all of this thread and it gave me alot of insight to my situation and about the LRT and going dark. My H left b/c I wasnt there emotionally and physically. I got the its too little to late speech. There is OW in picture right now. What do I do? By going dark I am showing him that same thing I did before. I feel like I am in a no-win situation right now.
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/27/03 03:36 AM
!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted By: Phoenix Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/28/03 08:26 PM
PHM - Then don't go dark. What I've usually told people in your situation is...accept it may be too late and decide to go ahead and do your best anyway regardless of what response you get is for a while. Set a time (3 months? 6 months?) to sit back and decide how it's been working.

The hardest part (DB wise, not emotionally) - is the balance between sincerity and overplaying it. Remember a little goes a long way. But in your case...a little overplaying may not be a bad thing.

The key is, are you willing or able to actually make the change? Make it something he can count on or is it another temporary measure? Something he's sure he can wait out and find the old you behind?
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/13/04 07:44 PM
Quoting Michele from 06/06/02.

********************************************************

Quote:

I really like this thread. It's very helpful and informative, especially to newcomers who are trying make sense out of all the expressions folks use around here.

I have stressed this many times on the board and I'm glad to see it stressed here again. Keeping a low profile works well when you've been pursuing and chasing, begging and crying. Going dark- pulling back and being scarce- represents novel behavior. Novelty shakes up the dice and increases the chances your spouse will react in new ways. However, as has been suggested, if you've been the sort of person who has taken a back seat throughout much of your marriage, going dark may seem like old hat.

The key to DBing, whether it's the last resort, going dark, acting as if, or just focusing on the exceptions, is to try something, notice the results and allow those results to guide your future actions. Modify your approach if your spouse responds in undesirable ways. Keep doing what seems to be working. This sort of mind set will get you a lot further than trying to think of what's right or wrong. If your marriage becomes more loving, it's right. IF you push your spouse away and what you want is a close relationship, it's wrong. THis makes life somewhat simpler.

Thanks, JJ, for starting this thread.
Michele


Posted By: Briget Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 03/09/04 08:01 PM
bump
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 04/15/04 02:06 PM
Is "going dark" a "doing something different", or a "more of the same" for you?!
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 05/27/04 05:27 PM
^^^^^^^^^^^
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/20/04 09:08 PM
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Posted By: kenfrnyc Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/05/04 08:18 PM
I have a question
We have been separated for almost 4 weeks. I realized I am the initiator, I call her on 2 nd day usually.
She dropped the bomb , she had affair, she says she loves me, she says she never wants to loose me, she says I am still the most imprortant person for her blah blah now we are separated she doesnt call me... WHATS UP??
I dont pressure her anymore, I dont talk about R or M stuff

Should I just stop calling her to see if she calls?? I have not done this yet at all, I tried for 2 days and I called.

WHAT SHOULD I DO??

Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/06/04 11:55 AM
PHM- I am new to this board and you are the first to have the same situation as minethat I have found. I notice the dates are from 6 months ago on this post. Any advice would be apprecaited. I was not there for my H physically and emotionally and realize just how much so the past few days. It is heartbreaking to realize how cruel I have been to H. Was my own stubbornness and stupidty to close my eyes to what I was doing. H has moved out and told me it is time to get on with our lives. We have 3 kids and I see him most everyday. I see small steps and signs that he does still care. I also see he is scared and becomes automatic in response to any offer of spending time without kids. H has OW and believe it is more of the idea than the OW. H said he wasnot willing to give up that OW to try to work it out with me. H said scared of it being the same old thing. H is a very caring and giving person most of the time and I realize what a taker I had been. I need to be a giver and not sure where to go.
ANy ideas of things that did or did not work for you in trying to show you do care and are not interested in the same old ways.
I hope your situation has taken a road on the upswing.
crushedbyg
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/06/04 03:50 PM
The most important aspect of the LRT/going dark...is to stop behaviors that are considered pursuing:

calling, emailing, writing, initiating affection.

This does not mean cold and angry.

This means being scarce, pulling back so they have to miss you. And when they DO initiate.....make them work a little. (Don't tell them any of this).

Don't be easy or boring.
Don't tell them where you will be unless it's critical to do so (it usually is not).


The point is .... they should have to wonder if you are really still interested.


Enjoy your life. Really get involved in your own life.


You are both in this position. Keep posting here, so we can help you monitor your results and keep you solution oriented.
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/07/04 12:14 AM
Thanks for the advice! How long do you do this if no initiation? Is hard as I see H everyday this month due to son's baseball tournaments. Sometimes H even drives us. Go figure. As a family we are scheduled to go to CA in AUgust. H has ask numerous times for me to reconsider after I told him I didn't think the kids and I should go. At this point, am sure OW will be out of her mind while back at home! ANy pointers?
crushed
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/08/04 12:19 AM
AAAAAGGGHHHHHHh! I need to vent. Have been going with my S8 and H to my son's baseball tournament. I ususally know when H is seeing OW by way he acts and dresses. I was actually feeling like I had gone one step forward with H and wham the bat hit me in the face. OW must have been in his car as she left her address card from flowers on the floor at my feet. I don't think this is working. I beleive H thinks I am dealing with the sitch and is treating me like a great friend. I had 2 days of getting baby steps or so I thought and was all crap. Am feeling about as low as the day the bomb dropped. So much for baby steps.
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/08/04 03:22 PM
2 steps forward, 1 step back. Don't sweat it.


You actually decide, but I've read that a guy needs about 8-12 weeks to really miss you. So.....get busy doing something else and fuggedaboutit.
Posted By: xalelle Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/08/04 05:03 PM
how do you get enough time to miss you when you have to see (in my case my WAW) often due to children? I KNOW she will miss me if she cannot talk to me, but I cannot seem to create the needed space! Especially as I was the emotionally distant one so Going Dark is probably not a good choice.
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/08/04 05:56 PM
Thanks for the advice. I only wished it was that easy.
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/08/04 06:26 PM
Well, going dark should be used to help you get yourself emotionally together.

If you were the emotional distant one, you want to show emotional warmth, but probably not overload and definitely not control (of the other) or force or imposition. It's a fine dance. It's REALLY LISTENING to the other person. And trying some things, monitoring results and adjusting accordingly.


Crushed....even more important is how you come out of the dark.....the other things you do. Do a search on JJ's advice for coming out of the dark.
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/09/04 06:40 PM
sg

I survived yesterday and that is a blessing! I met with H and I took responsibilty for my faults in our past and apologized. I was not whining or begging for anything of that nature. I needed to do it for me. I felt some of the weight removed from my shoulders last night after my initial tear session after I was done. H said nothing. Not a word. H only called my mom and told her to call me. I did not speak to H or have contact all night. Was a very rough day. Was even worse than I expected b/c H never said a word. This am when I checked had 3 emails from H. I read them but did not answer for awhile. Had to finally as dealt with my S8 and his practice at 1230. H wants to come with kids and I to movie and dinner to celebrate my D9's making a travel team in soccer. Was a surprise and she is so excited. Do I allow H to go or tell him no and hurt my D9. Is rough. I am emotionally in a better place this day as a result of telling my H yesterday. My plans were to not avoid him but not see him either but realistically it is impossible with baseball everyday. I don't want to miss my S8's games. S8 is my caring one and is always thinking of me. How do I do this and have a win/win situatuion???
Also I am back to the decision about the trip coming up to CA in 3 weeks. Do we go or not? H told my mom last chance to (hesitation) do this. She said as if he stopped for fear of saying something he wasn't ready to admit. Any thoughts?

H is so comfortable around me it is scary but once he thinks about it gets nervous and seems to back off. Is this me wanting this or H afraid? I have no idea what is going on with his OW. has not seen her much that I am aware of no time. I thought H was with OW last night but was asleep til 11 due to stress I inflicted on him I guess. H wants to spend eve with kids vs OW tonight. I am rambling but am looking for answers that are not quite as biased as mine!
Posted By: xalelle Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/09/04 06:46 PM
Quote:

Do I allow H to go or tell him no and hurt my D9



I would look at this this way - #1 do everything you can to not hurt D9 - if she would like him there, let him be there.

#2 this is an oportunity for being together that you CANNOT talk about R - make sure you dont! Just enjoy the outing. Be like you are out with friends.

I for one would love for this kind of opportunity in my R.

Good luck
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/09/04 08:10 PM
Thanks for the positive feedback. I am able to have these often due to so many kids activities. Is tough when "signs" of OW pop up! H is always nervous when cell rings. Usually hides it as it will say OW name.
H won't answer if I am around.
Posted By: xalelle Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/09/04 08:39 PM
Quote:

Is tough when "signs" of OW pop up!



I agree - but my W is SUPER good at not having any
"signs" - which is why I just assume no. Better for my
PMA anyway!

Just make sure when his phone rings you couldnt see it anyway - then he dosnt have to hide it, and you will have less to think about. For now make it easier for it to not be out in the open so it dosnt cause you undue stress.

I am assuming that you want to restore/repair your R even though you know about OW, correct? If so, the only thing you can do is completely let go of any thoughts of OW and keep reading here about A's that end. They almost always do.

To me you are in an enviable position - you know for sure about OW, and I think you have indicated that H does not deny it. In my case there is lots of circumstantial evidence, but W vehemently denys, says he is just friend. So I have to just accept that. Makes it more painfull thinking my W could be being dishonest with me, something she has never done in our M. And very unlike her.

Remember you can do nothing about OW, you cannot cause it to end. Only 2 things can end it: 1 - it burns out (usually does) 2 - H decides to work on M and ends it himeself. All you can do is keep DBing and be what he wants to return to when it does end. And it will.

Hang in there.
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/10/04 03:37 AM
I don't have the confidence you do this eve that the A will end. He speaks in a way to loving tone with OW. He is not the type to love and leave easily. I am having a neg night as you can see. H went to movies with kids and I. Was good until end. A friend needed marital advice and H was giving it on phone in front of me. Friends H was staying at hotel and my H told friend to go to hotel and tell her spouse how miserable she is etc....Was the biggest slap in my face. All I could do to hold it together on way home. I wish I had your strength and patience.
crushed
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/10/04 09:37 AM
x,
How do you continue if you believe your H is acting more out of pity? Heard H tell friend that OW was with her kids. I guess validating that H was with me and our kids. Is rather ironic that the friend is having marriage problems but theirs is due to having relatives children live with them. Hearing my H give friend advice that I wish he would be giving himself was tough. Am to go with H to S8's baseball games today at 8am and thinking not and go myself. confidence level is low today. Tough thinking about spending whole day with H and then H brings us home to go out with OW. Doesn't make for a positive day.
crushed
Posted By: xalelle Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/10/04 01:09 PM
Quote:

How do you continue if you believe your H is acting more out of pity?




This is very hard. I have a hard time with just this because my W gives little things - hugs, lets me kiss her cheek. But I often wonder if it is just to get me to leave quickly without tears. I know she still cares about me, even continues to say she "loves me very much" so I know she dosnt "want" to hurt me. What she dosnt understand is hiding the truth and lying to me hurts more than anything that could happen. She has never done this before. I am prepared to survive anything including an A and still know our M could be saved, but honesty will have to come first.

I am sorry you are having a down day - have lots of those myself. Today is going to be rough, We have an appointment we must go to together today, and it has potential to bring up a lot of stuff, good and/or bad. Then she is off for the weekend with her friends. It is easier during the week - she calls me at least once a day, but when she goes away she does not. Probably with OG. So I try to tough up and be strong for my kids. It is hard. Right now I am missing her so much, it is hard to focus on getting me better. And having the kids makes it even harder - she is the emotional part of our M, so lots of things with the kids just feels like something is missing.

Hang in there. Try to find the strength to go to the game.
Posted By: xalelle Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/10/04 01:15 PM
Quote:

I don't have the confidence you do this eve that the A will end. He speaks in a way to loving tone with OW. He is not the type to love and leave easily.




Sometimes my confidence is bravado. There are times I belive it will burn out, and times I dont. But I continue to tell myself it will - and I get stronger in my resolve.

I worry because my W attatches very easily, lets go hard, and I am sure cannot belive I could forgive an A. I am sure that she feels that (EA/PA/or not) things have gone to far to ever come back. All I can do is wait untill she allows me to first be her friend again, then be here when she needs me. If that ever happens, then we can begin the walk back to us. The pain is waiting, and trying not to think of what might be happening with her right now. But I must continue to belive our M can be saved, and continue to DB as well as I can. I cannot give up on her as she is giving up on me. It is my turn to bear the weight of our R for a while - she has for a long time. Now she is not. Will she just enjoy the weight being lifted and move on, or get the rest from it and find the strength to come back? I cannot know, I can just wait.
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/14/04 09:54 AM
Has been awhile x! I miss your wisdom. How are things going with W? What happened after her weekend away with friends? I am on thebiggest roller coaster this week. Was working on not contacting H yesterday. Was tough but got through it. H called and wanted to go someplace with us and actually said that and asked to go. Took it as a pos. and ran! H has seen OW but doesn't seem as much. H shows signs of still caring but is so hesitant. Afraid if he shows them he will get hurt all over and keeps his distance physically also. Tries not to sit right next to me. Always to the side and in full view. I just keep plugging along. Still cannot believe H doesn't think he is having an affair. Not sure what he would call it!! Just so thankful to have friends on here to be able to vent with who actually know what each other is going through to some degree.

Seems like the summer is slipping away and will be gone before I know it. Was thinking about holidays and what will be happening with kids and was not a good road to take. Have a few days to keep my distance and let H "miss" me a bit. I sometimes think I am too accessible. I just keep thinking once the "honeymoon" period is over things won't be as rosey with the OW. No everyday stress, kids, bills, juggling schedules, etc...

Things can never go back. They can only forge ahead on a better route. You have changed and become a better person and your W will soon see that. Almost like a lightbulb has been lit and you see things in such a different perspective. I think trying the missing idea for a bit here and there makes them realize what you have to offer them. Also think by having a history and knowing some of their responses and needs and acting on them surprises them and is a plus. Just knowing what they expect and want in small ways is a nice baby step for us!
Hope today is a good one for you and I!
c
Posted By: JinBklyn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/14/04 12:10 PM
In my sitch, I was the clingy one. He left me 6 weeks ago. We've seen each other twice since, he looking very sad and tortured, me being cold the first time and warm the second. Then he called to TALK. It's the first gesture he's made. The times we saw each other were chance encounters on the street.

I've been dark for 6 weeks. Do I call back? Do I let him call again? He was pretty clear 6 weeks ago that he wanted to split up.

Friend says, "Don't call him back. Aren't you worth at least two phone calls?" I know this is skewed logic, but...

Posted By: xalelle Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/14/04 02:17 PM
Hi Crushedbyg,

I dont know that I have any wisdom. You can check on my thread to see what is up with me. There seem to have been some positives, but very ballanced by lots of time with OM. It is starting to pull me apart - my W talks to me all day, then spends her evenings with OM. I wonder sometimes is she "having her cake and eating it too" - she is holding on to what was good in our M by having me there to talk to, discuss decisions with, etc, but as soon as he is available runs to him for whatever else.

Maby it is time to go dark for a while. Or maby it is time to give her an unprovoked ILY. Something needs to shake soon.

I am having a very down day. Hard to focus on positives. Had nightmares all night about OM bomb being dropped (W still acts as if I dont know/think anything is going on, still covering quite well)

Read my thread if you have time, see what you think of my "positives". Still hoping for some time with her tomorrow - trying not to get myself in a position that I will be crushed if it dosnt happen.

Hope you are doing well.
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/14/04 11:14 PM
X

Sorry to hear you are having a down day. It comes and goes. I can relate to the best of both worlds. Is frustrating and upsetting. I wish you luck with your shake. I know the feeling but not sure what to do. i will check out the link.

Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/14/04 11:17 PM
Jin,

My best piece of advice is do some soul searching on your own. Write things down if you have to. The decision has to be yours and yours only. No friends and parents etc. influencing you. You have to make your own choices. You are responsible for your happiness. Do you want to work it out or move on? Good luck to you!
crushed
Posted By: JinBklyn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/15/04 12:07 AM
Quote:


H told my mom last chance to (hesitation) do this. She said as if he stopped for fear of saying something he wasn't ready to admit. Any thoughts?





not sure what this means. H told your mom that it was the last chance to do what? decide? go? work on the R together? go on a trip together?

Quote:


H is so comfortable around me it is scary but once he thinks about it gets nervous and seems to back off. Is this me wanting this or H afraid?





I take this to mean that he lets himself go to where he is happiest (comfortable with you) then gets scared (been burned before). So that's good news, right? It means he still, at his basic level, feels a deep connection to you.



Posted By: xalelle Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/15/04 01:14 AM
Quote:

Sorry to hear you are having a down day.



Thanks crushed.. back to stable now. With kids, which helps, and W was quite nice when she left.

And I am pretty sure the "date" is indeed on.
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/15/04 10:17 AM
Jin,
H's hesitation was meant as Last chance to be as a family and see how it goes. How H and I interact and if there is any chance or spark I guess. Trying to fill in his blank but makes sense knowing him. Thanks for the insight about his going to where he is comfortable and then backing off. Sometimes it is hard to see obvious things when it is your own sitch. One of the reasons why this board is so helpful and the people are great.
H did tell my step-father that I had kissed him the other day and he was overwhelmed. Said I should try that more often. I guess if you get baby steps and pos results you keep up the behavior and if not then try something new.
c
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/15/04 10:21 AM
X,
I am hoping for great things out of your date!!! Even if it yields pos baby steps it is moving in the right direction. COngrats to you and enjoy the benefit of all your hard work.
As my kids say always keep a smile on your face as it makes others wonder what you have been up to!

Is so crazy how from day to day can be so pos to so neg and back again. What a roller-coaster ride we are on!
c
Posted By: willtry Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/15/04 11:02 AM
Loved your info on going dark. I 'm trying myself
Also since I see your a moderator could you tell me hoe to Private message. Iv'e tried everything

WILLTRY
Posted By: JinBklyn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/15/04 11:55 AM
Quote:


H's hesitation was meant as Last chance to be as a family and see how it goes. How H and I interact and if there is any chance or spark I guess.





Then it seems to me that he's open to that possibility. That's positive! He thinks there's the possibility that a spark might be there, that something positive can come out of it. Sounds like he's willing to try, if he's really encouraging you to go along.

What can you do to make the trip an opportunity for you to show the changes you've made? One thing I always have to tell myself is something I read (was it DR? Maybe it was something my DB coach said):

Is what I'm about to say going to bring us closer together or push us farther apart?

If you do go on the trip, H2H had some great advice for me (adapted for your sitch): Act as though you're with a friend. Have a great time. Forget about the R and the issues in it.

One thing that always Worked with my SO was when we were doing something out of the ordinary (museum, movie, a trip), I would just say out loud (which isn't entirely natural for me) as much as I could about what I was enjoying about it, what was great about it, how happy I was to be doing X, how great Y was, look at Z, isn't that cool... and the most amazing thing happened. SO brightened up like he was responsible for those things. It made him feel like a man, that he was taking care of me and making me happy.

And my therapist says that's what men want most in their Rs-- to make their partners happy and feel responsible for their happiness.

I'd go on the trip if I were you. Take advantage of your H's willingness to try.

Good luck!

JinB
Posted By: xalelle Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/15/04 02:43 PM
Quote:

I am hoping for great things out of your date!!! Even if it yields pos baby steps it is moving in the right direction. COngrats to you and enjoy the benefit of all your hard work.



Thanks. I will be happy with no real "steps" as long as we get to spend a little time together with no "incedents". It is what we need right now, just time to get re-aquainted with each other, and remember that we really do enjoy each others company, as long as we arent fighting or ignoring each other!

Quote:

As my kids say always keep a smile on your face as it makes others wonder what you have been up to!



Ok, too wierd. This is one of my W's favorite sayings!

Quote:

Is so crazy how from day to day can be so pos to so neg and back again. What a roller-coaster ride we are on!



And what I find most frustrating is sometimes I create my own downs. Trying to work on it - let the positives pull me up and use the negatives to learn and pull myself up with the learning. Not easy, but it can be done!
Posted By: crushedbyg Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/16/04 02:03 AM
Thanks for the great advice Jin. I am going on the trip and will take this with me to keep looking at throughout the trip. Had a down and dirty discussion this eve with my parents about what is happening. Came out of it feeling pretty good considering they were looking at all aspects not just my view.

Today was hard as I got a phone call from a guy I knew before my husband who I never dated but got to be great friends. he would visit me at work but nothing else. My H has this chip on his shoulder about this guy after 11 years. I have not spoken to him in 2 years. My H is actually friends with him and sees him regularly. My H had a conversation with him last week about me and told him to call me. I was so hurt and offended that H would do such a thing. maybe he thinks I will have a fling with this guy and make it easier on himself. Am working through it. I did tell H was the rudest thing he has done to me.

I told h that we were friends and I have no interest in him and that it is h that I love. Felt it was necessary considering. I guess I will see!

X, have a great time on your date. Someday I hope to have one also. Take Jin's advice with you.
c
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/09/04 05:04 PM
Quote:

If you want to consider "going dark" to be a sun metaphor, it's not that you stop emitting light, you just move it somewhere else. Your wife is not a plant; she can decide that she's not getting enough light where she's at, and she can move herself to where you are. At least, that's the theory. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

Beren


Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 05/10/05 03:06 PM
^^^^^
Posted By: KeepTheFaith Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 05/10/05 03:32 PM
jj u said you went dark and then your W found OM. so how was that successful? *doesn't get it*
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 05/10/05 04:25 PM
Quote:

jj u said you went dark and then your W found OM.




Yep, you're right. This first time I went dark and my wife found OM was pretty much during my "pre-DB'ing" days. I had no idea what going dark was, and was pretty much just waiting for my wife to change. I wasn't really looking at any of my contributions to the failure of the relationship, and wasn't doing much to make any changes on my part. Every time we had contact or got together, I was doing the same old things that I'd always done, which didn't work. She saw the same old guy in me, saw me dealing with things in the same old way, therefore, she had no reason to miss me, and no reason to think things could ever work out between us.

The second time I went dark, however, was a different story. It was just after I found out about the OM, and it was at a time when I REALLY started to pay heed to what I was learning here. In fact, it was at the time I was in my first KLA group here. During this period of darkness, I did something different. I really started to take a closer look at things that I could do to change the dynamics of the relationship, instead of counting on her to make the changes. I didn't really change "me" that much, just took the time to figure out what different things I could do to draw her back to me. Things that weren't the same old same old way of doing things that didn't work.

I took charge of changing the dynamics of the relationship, she noticed the difference, and she started to make some changes, too. Things just grew from there. So, this was the part where it was "successful".

"Darkness" shouldn't be an idle time. It's a time for you to regroup, and start to change some of your relationship habits. Time to quit letting your emotions and feelings dictate what you do, and come up with a solid plan of action. Time to figure out what you can do to help to make them see you in a different light whenever you do have any contact with them. Time to give them some space, and let them go through some of their growing pains, too. A time to help yourself find some more empathy towards what they are going through, too.

Hope this helps explain it a bit more for you!
Posted By: KeepTheFaith Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 05/10/05 04:40 PM
yes it does. Because of that post I had a MAJOR FEAR of going dark man. I'mlike uh Ill go dark and she'll find OM. Thanks for the feedback.
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/04/06 10:41 PM
^^^^
Posted By: Confident_Me Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/12/06 07:54 AM
Quote:

"Darkness" shouldn't be an idle time. It's a time for you to regroup, and start to change some of your relationship habits. Time to quit letting your emotions and feelings dictate what you do, and come up with a solid plan of action. Time to figure out what you can do to help to make them see you in a different light whenever you do have any contact with them. Time to give them some space, and let them go through some of their growing pains, too. A time to help yourself find some more empathy towards what they are going through, too.

Hope this helps explain it a bit more for you!




I wandering the same thing - in my situation do you think I have gone too dark or "just right"?
Posted By: Fender Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/13/06 11:35 PM
I am wondering if going dark right away is a good strategy for me. W is going to leave in New Year and says she wants her space. I can think of no better way to give her that space than to go dark.

I do wonder how to go dark with kids in the mix. For those of you that have used this method how did you overcome that issue. I mean with her coming by to see the kids or me dropping them off at her place, how can I go dark?
Posted By: Jan0207 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/05/07 09:26 PM
Originally Posted By: Fender

I do wonder how to go dark with kids in the mix. For those of you that have used this method how did you overcome that issue. I mean with her coming by to see the kids or me dropping them off at her place, how can I go dark?


I would like some input on this too, please.
Posted By: vampsmagnolia Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/08/07 05:28 PM
I can certainly relate to that last sentence [the worst thing that happened to me turned out to be the best thing).
My sitch:
separated now 4 years, H lives w/OW. Still pays some household bills for me, we exchange gifts, give birthday and Christmas gifts together within the family, I work for his brother in a small family business (H has no part in it). He has taken me to the Dr. when I have been ill, or had surgery, he stayed in our home with our dogs. Usually, we get along, however, although he will say he has forgiven me, he hasn't. ( I had a brief affair just before I confirmed my suspicions that he was). He is still with her (nurse he had during cancer treatment). He frequently tells me all is my fault and that he can't live with a wife who cheated on him. I stopped immediately when he found out, yet he continues to this day. Just over a year ago, they moved within 8 miles of my home. They had lived in a nearby town and he commuted up here daily to tend to the farm, which he still tends daily. OW built a house and barn (in her name, not his). H and I own cattle, equipment, property I live in, and additional land together. After 4 years of separation I began to date someone. ( a person he knew and encouraged to pursue me). I have no plans for a divorce and as far as I know, he doesn't either.
After I started seeing someone, he stopped taking the trash and having much to do with our dogs, it's like he totally abandoned them now. We had no kids together. He has 3 grown and 8 grandkids, all of whom I still have a relationship with, and who don't acknowledge the OW.
I still have a great relationship with my Mom-in-law, his mother, with whom he does not get along with at all. During all this strife of the past almost 5 years now, I did join the Catholic church, which has helped me find peace in my heart. H had to actively particpate in that process in order for me to get into the Church, although he is not Catholic.
I suppose I need advice on going dark. Just today, he yelled at me and said I wanted to run everything and control everything (just because I mentioed I noticed he changed address on his checking from ours to hers, after over 4 years.) I am a believer in that life is not a bed of roses and that value and strength can be obtained in suffering, whether emotional, mental or physical. Also, if you love something, let it go and if it comes back, it is yours and if not it never was.
There are days I feel like leaving the area, and starting over, and then other days, I feel well, turn the other cheek again. Generally, I don't want to face the turmoil I'd have to go through with him in the divorce process. And by the way, I am ok with the church as the person I am seeing understands we will no longer have a sexual relationship. I am still technically married, and I cannot live in the inner turmoil being in the sin of adultey causes. I went over 4 years without, so feel I can do it again. I am more conerned now with my eternal life rather than this one.
Any advice or your thoughts would be appreciated, especially do you feel there is any advantage in going dark?
Posted By: Jamesjohn Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 03/27/07 07:09 PM
^^
Posted By: bright 2 morro Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 05/27/07 11:21 AM
I am not sure if this was addressed but I want to ask it anyway. My H left me not that long ago. We have three small children. How do I go dark with the children.

I have stopped calling him for the most part. I have decided to proceed on with life for me and the kids. I make plans as if he is not there. But he calls me every day. Over the last several days I have stricktly only spoken to him about non R things. We talk about the kids and other things in each others life. I also try not to answer every call from him

Last week he called me one night late just to see how the kids and I were and to tell me that he missed the kids. I did call him afterwards to see if he was ok because he sounded so down. I kept is stricktly at that he called me back after to thank me for caring.

I have called him this weekend only because he has the kids and I want to talk to them. This has lead to some decent conversations (no yelling and fighting). He has also agreed to go to Family counciling which we start a week from monday.

I am trying to work on my changes: not being so negative and angry, trying to do things for myself and not for everyone else (some of his complaints over the years), I am also trying to not be so critical of his actions, and trying to thank him more for what he does.

I know that I feel better when I do not see him. When I do see him and he leaves I feel sad and cry again.

Is this what they consider going (gray) dark?

mimi
Posted By: hope4whatsbest Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/09/07 01:22 PM
I'm going to try this Beth with my own situation. My H needs to figure out his life - he's left for a 21 yr old (he's 35) when we have 2 little kids (one a newborn!)

I really liked Sparky's thread. It's the stuff I need to keep reading. My husband complains all the time that every decision was made for him and he's not going to make any decision on my "timetable". He's so lost but I do realize that I am trying to force my decision on his life. I'm learning I really can't control him and its driving me nuts :)!!!

I'm trying to back off and let him go through his journey - hoping the affair will die a natural death, as they say most do within 6 months of discovery.

Will tell you I said to my H yesterday that I don't think he thinks about things because he never talks. He said "i'm just quiet - I think about things and change my mind daily". That gave me hope - just because you're not hearing your H think doesn't mean he's not doing it.

Give him space - Michelle said in DR that if you do all the worrying about the relationship, they don't have to. I'm a ACOA and a caretaker/fixer. I need to start letting my H fix this and he needs space to figure that out. Whether he will is another thing, but ....I can only hope.

Good luck not pursuing your H - hope it works!
Posted By: hurtnangry Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/11/07 10:07 PM
i just read what you have been doing and i think im goint to try it also. i have a hard time not wanting to talk to her every day. i keep reading if you just give her space things might get better but im scared it might make it easier for her to just stay away and not come home to me and our daughter.some people say absence makes the heart grow fonder. im just scared that absence will make the heart grow more absent.
Posted By: saddadinkc Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/12/07 01:32 AM
How are you doing with your GAL strategies?
Posted By: Kelley Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 07/10/07 07:30 PM
I am feeling the same way also. Seems like the longer that he is gone, the less that he wants to deal with me. When this all started back in May, I tried to talk things thru with him, gave him some things I found on good marriages. Gave him a letter I wrote of the way things were and where I thought they went bad. I even went to him to make up and I thought things were. I changed the one major complaint about me that he had but I found a thing he wrote about desperately wanting to be with this OW and paying a great price to do so. I didn't know what else to do at that time and kicked him out of the house. Now I am wondering if I did the right thing but I couldn't let him stay there after I found his true thoughts.

Since I have kicked him out and talked to a DB coach, I avoid trying to call him unless I have to about some house or kids matter. When he shows up at the house to fix things up, I am treating him like a friend, trying to help him out and just talking about other things. He won't bring anything up about our R and I am afraid right now to say anything about it. It just seems like the longer we are separated the more happy that he is about it.
Posted By: Tia Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/16/07 06:40 AM
JJ,
Peter used the expression, "going dark" in reference to Michele's LRT. It became a popular expression here.

Aloha,
/Tia
Posted By: theotherhalf Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/19/07 05:30 PM
The second time I went dark, however, was a different story. It was just after I found out about the OM, and it was at a time when I REALLY started to pay heed to what I was learning here. In fact, it was at the time I was in my first KLA group here. During this period of darkness, I did something different. I really started to take a closer look at things that I could do to change the dynamics of the relationship, instead of counting on her to make the changes. I didn't really change "me" that much, just took the time to figure out what different things I could do to draw her back to me. Things that weren't the same old same old way of doing things that didn't work.

I took charge of changing the dynamics of the relationship, she noticed the difference, and she started to make some changes, too. Things just grew from there. So, this was the part where it was "successful".


How do you "find different things that can draw them back to you?" I am trying to figure out things in "me" that "I" need to change about "me". Patience is a huge issue, being so clingy, and always trying to be the fixer in everything. But if there is no R. If there is a OW. And if he wants no contact with you so you see and talk to them very, very little. How do they see the changes that you are making. How do you draw their attention to you?
Posted By: theotherhalf Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/03/07 04:45 AM
I too am trying to go "dark". It started by going to H house one night and really laying my demands on him. Wanted the truth about OW, demanded respect, demanded H is not to be in our house unless I am home. Well, did not get my answers but H has only one key to house and not to dead bolts.

From there I stopped, stopped calling, stopping dropping in to see him. All contact unless absolutely necessary (kids or money). Bad thing in our stich is that we farm and he has to be around here some what do check cow,do hay, etc. But when he is here I stay in house. If he comes in I'm nice but short. When he leaves, I no longer follow or ask him to stay longer.

No contact first week and a half. Then H (for 1st time) come by to just talk. Good visit. Talked of work, kids, etc. mostly he talked, I listened. Then he led conversation to D. He had a plan of agreeing, and using same lawyer. For me to keep house and him the farm ground. I said wont work cuz I'd have to see him all the time. He said we can get along. And who knows maybe something become of it all again someday. I just listened and didn't say too much. After that he didn't stay too long then left.(No way am I going along with his little plan)

Again no contact for over a week or two. Went out Friday night with my brother and ended up with SIL's and niece. H called me at least 8-10 times. I answered first few calls. He wanted to know where I was. I didn't tell. Then it was stupid accusations and crap. I quit answering calls. He came out home to see if I was there. When I did get home I parked my car where he couldn't see it. (I know, playing in the game, shouldn't have) He came. Calling my phone as he didn't think I was here. He seen me and then went on to throw a major fit. (He was drunk) I ended up calling the police(1st time ever). He left before they got here. So nothing more happened.

Next day he showed up about noon in driveway. He called my cell, asked me to come out. I did, his first words were, I'm really sorry. That was really stupid of me and I'm sorry. I don't know why I got so mad.

I asked him if maybe it could be because he still cares. He said no that's not it. Yes he cares but no, not like that. That he really didn't know what came over him. I let it go. Did not push it any farther. I did say, he was just pissed cuz I wouldn't tell him where I was and quit answering my phone. Yea, he said, could be. He said I did nothing wrong, that I can do what ever I want etc... We had good visit otherwise but it was short.

Today, was here shortly to do hay. He seemed almost pissed at me. Wouldn't look me in eye. Very short. But that's okay. I really didn't have too much to say to him either.

I hope that the "dark" is working on him but then again, maybe just making it easier for him to be with OW, and forget about me and the girls. Maybe easing his guilt some. As far as his fit the other night, probably just a drunked control thing, maybe he really doesnt' care. Then again, maybe it turned his head back to me again if only for a night.
Posted By: nephartiti Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/04/07 11:41 AM
I think it is doing something! There is regular contact instead of 1-2 weeks of nothing. That's a change in the right direction. He says you can do whatever, but his behavior shows that it bothers him. He's contradicting himself, which I interpret as confusion. Confusion means he's contemplating and thinking of things. Now you have his attention, show off your GAL and stay positive so he wants to be around you. Just keep playing it cool and don't act too interested and don't talk about R. If he brings it up, take it slow and be careful. Let him keep wondering about what's going on with you. I'm so excited for you. Hopefully this dark thing works for me too. It's only been 2 days with no contact. Hey, does sending a couple pics of the kids count a pursuing?
Posted By: nephartiti Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/04/07 11:54 AM
Same here. The longer he is away, the easier it seems to be for him to stay that way. He doesn't even call to check on the kids anymore. Hasn't seen them in over a week and that was only because I lapsed and showed up at his eye doctor appt. That royally pissed him off.

He moved out on the 19th, and we've had very little contact. He's asked to see the kids a few times, but has only followed through once. A handful of times he's said he's coming, then just doesn't show or call.

He's playing games with the money.

Seems like he is taking walking away to the extreme.

However, the way I see it, it can't get much worse. So what do I have to lose by going dark? It may work. I've seen it work for others like 789 and TOH seems to be getting a response too. Looks like it typically takes 2-3 weeks before a anything happens. We just have to be patient and try to have faith. If we can stick to it, we have a chance.

It's hard not to react to fear and panic, but we have to rise above our fear. The way I see it, if the worse happens (H gets content to be w/out us and files for D), then I've already begun to learn how to live w/out him. This is scary, but it prepares myself and our two small children no matter what.

I've decided to try to wait out the A with OW til the end of the year and then re-evaluate our sitch. Seems like a long time, but is small when I compare it to the length of a lifetime.

Good luck, everyone!
Posted By: JeffV Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/07/07 04:05 PM
HI everyone I'm brand new and just over a week away from the bomb being dropped, (Other man/emotional affair, and I'm not attracted to you anymore, etc.) It was the hardest couple of days I've ever survived, but now with the help of going dark, things are already turning around. I have alway been the more emotional, pursuing one (many calls a day, etc.) so it is not in any way a natural way for me, but with the help of the fuel my anger provides, and rediscovering myself a little (an amazing thing!) It's been surprisingly easy. And after just a few days I received 2 notes and was told today to give her a call if I needed to. This may not seem like much but compared to the cold anger and withdrawl that have been the norm lately, this is a near miracle.

Just wanted to tell my story and thank everyone forbeing so open. It's helped me a great deal.

JeffV
Posted By: Nutty Chick Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/08/07 06:20 PM
Hi Jeff.

I too have found the 'going dark' very effective.

This is a great place to get some support and hints on how to cope.

Do you and your wife have any children?

Nutty x
Posted By: JeffV Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/10/07 09:16 AM
Hi. No we don't have any children, we have dogs. And things now have gotten worse. For the 3rd straight weekend she has left and won't me where she's going. Snd she keeps repeating that she's safe. I'm starting feel very frustrated and am considering moving out myself for a week or so to get my thoughts together. In the 2 weeks since I found out about her affair (hurts to even type the word) all I could think about was that I had to do everything in my power to not scare her away. But now I'm starting to wonder what it is that I TRULY want. I'd welcome any thoughts...

JeffV
Posted By: my3sons Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/10/07 03:34 PM

If she "keeps repeating" that she's 'safe' then someone keeps asking her where she is going. Would that be you?

Don't ask her where she's going. Assume that she is with OM. Don't tell her to "have fun" but perhaps use her words and say "be safe" or just "drive carefully."

The point of going dark is to remove yourself from the drama, as well as to demonstrate different behavior (not pursuing, in your case). This will take many weeks or months, depending on how long your "old" style communication was in place.

As for you moving out for a week, do it if it is for you to clear your head, but not to get a reaction from her. Show her the appropriate kindness that she has lacked, ie tell her exactly where you are going. "I'm going to stay with my friend X for a week or two--I need to clear my head."

If you're going to do this, don't be there Friday or next Monday to even know whether she is home or not.
Posted By: JeffV Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/10/07 08:51 PM
Thank you for your thoughts. After being strong for a while I've really gone to pieces the last couple of days. The thought of her with the OM is almost more than I can stand, and is rapidly approaching the pain of finding out in the first place.I am going to move out for a while for my own head clearing and will try hard not to think of it as a way to get a rise out of her. Thanks again!

JeffV
Posted By: NoDirection Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/11/07 07:30 PM
I am new to this thread and very interested in what people hve to say about my situation. My W and I were married when she was young, 22. We had a son when she was 23. She never really had the opportuntiy to go out and live on her own or be a part of the job force and I believe that is part of the reason why she has become a WAW.

The other part is that I neglected our R. I rarely did nice things for her. I always used verbal affection to state my feelings toward her. In retrospect, I REALLY took her for granted.

I have been DB'ing for about two months now. I have had success bringing our relationship back to a positive level but it is a far stretch to where we were before all the problems cameout. In many cases I would work on things and then something would trip me up and many of my old traits came out.

Now I have decided to "go dark". We still live under the same roof and interact as friends. What has got me into trouble is the fact that she "wants to go out and live." I feel that I need to let her just to get some resolution in the R. Let her decide if she wants to move forward with our son and I, I will be there. From what I have gotten from this thread is to be distant without not being there at all. I still help her as much as possible and interact whenever she initiates. It is something to help me not think about her stance in teh relationship right now. Any suggestions/comments???
Posted By: theotherhalf Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/27/07 02:41 AM
Hey all,
Just dropped in to review some of the postings on this thread.
I really don't know if the "going dark" is working in my sitch or not. Alot lately I'm wondering if it is just enabling him to see OW in peace and to be "cake eating". Who knows?

Since my last post H stopped in one night out of the blue to just hang out. Ended up spending the night. I initiated the spending the night. Then nothing for over a week.

Next contact, was I went out, H knew it. He called and invited me to BIL's I said we'll see and I didn't go. I know that I have to not be available every time, but I really kicked myself for the next week.

Last Friday H called and invited me to BIL's to BBQ. I went of course. Didn't talk to him much there. But when I left I called him and asked if he wanted company at home. He said sure. I went and stayed till 3:30 am. And again I haven't heard anything from him since.

Other than these highlights there have been a few nights that H has been here to do farm stuff, and he'll hang out an hour or so just to chat. Neither of us have brought up R or D since back first of August. Good or bad? Who knows.

Granted H works Sun, Mon, Tues, and every other Sat. Night 5pm-5am. Then if he works extra day. So it The first part of the weeks he is sleeping most of the day. But a call just to say hi or to talk to the girls would make me feel better as to whether this may be working.

I guess time will tell.
Posted By: transformer Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/12/08 07:23 PM
bump!
Posted By: needlove Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 04/23/08 03:00 PM
My Q is how long do you stay in the dark? I'm with Beth and letting my H work things out on his own. I've been w/drawn and I've been nice during the past 6 months. There was no change. He's still acts the same way. And I sincerely think H is not faithful.

I've GAL and am happy with it. However, wish there was more to our family than this.
Posted By: redsawks44 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/03/08 07:46 PM
I will throw my 2 cents into here.. those folks on "we're seperated forum" know my sich.. anyways it will soon be 3 months of seperation (Aug 19)..

we live in the same house, different rooms.. as finance are dictating things a little, and the housing market is horrible.

I have lost 25 pounds, have gotten into the best shape since i can ever remember, quit smoking, quit drinking.. and just completely remain positive at all times, even if i get weak at times.. (which i do)

W and I are amicable. She has told friends she just wants to keep peace. She broke down crying after she sent me an email , and then snooped into my email when i was away on travel.. she then replied with a"it's over no matter what letter" to both me and a friend of mine that had been supporting me (she got her email by snooping thru mine)..my 180.. to not react, in the past i would have flipped! .. nope W is always trying to pull me into arguing and I refuse to do it.

Anyways I think going dark would hurt me personally.. as i spent 1 1/2 years working in the field 4 days a week and coming home for 3, etc.

just my 2 cents..
Posted By: samina Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/30/08 09:38 PM
Hi

I need some advice as to what to do next. My H had EA which began in 05/08, began to behave distant and said it was work problems etc and then told me in 08/08 he wanted to divorce as he had fallen in love with someone else. He has not been interested in any talks and wants divorce. I have been DB and talking to Cheryl. I went dark 2 months ago and he moved all his belongings out a month ago and moved in with OW. He kept getting in touch initally when I went dark but I only responded to financial things. I have not heard any thing from him for about a month and then last tweek he got in touch by e-mail

He wanted to know if he could come round and download music on my PC to his laptop as he had just bought one now. He also asked what was happening with the divorce. I replied with a date that was convenient for him to come round. I told him I had sent the divroce papers and he needs to check with his lawyer as to the next step. His mail still cmes here so I asked him to re-direct it. He replied with ok. He came round yesterday and was very nervous around me. Might be because he still cares about me or he doesn't know how I will react to anything (he has already said he finds me unpredictable). Anyway I tried to do a 180 and kept quiet and agreed with him rather then try to have chats and try to reason with him. He wanted me to sort some things out for him which I did and he said he appreciated that.

He didn't seem keen on leaving but I didn't initiate any talks etc and he said see you around. He still didn't leave the keys to the flat as I had previsously asked him to do. I have been dark for 2 months and do not know when the right time to come back is. I spoke to a fellow DB 2 weeks ago and I thought I was done with DB but when I saw him I realised I still love him and now I don't know what to do. If I stay dark then I know that I will not want him back as my feelings are already fading but I don't want to jump back in as it was too painful and the reason I went dark was to let myself heal ( which has happened - I no longer react) and also to stop pursing which I have always done.

Any suggestions?
Posted By: JCJ Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/07/08 05:07 PM
Hi Samina

I understand why you went dark, it must hurt. It does sound like he is trying to make small contacts and you are blocking them. Going dark isn't a defense mechanism. If you want to work on your marriage I would start to be a little more open and receptive to these gestures. Otherwise he will give up and stop them if he is rebuked each time.

This is jmo.

Good luck
Posted By: pauld2100 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 07:40 PM
I have an important question about going dark, I did do this also for a while after I found out she was dating. as I have read here I was already in that dark mode before I left and it may have done more damage but I did try small things to "save our R" but that also backfired. so I went dark again and she did finally call here and there but also has help her grow away. It seems anything I try or do or say is countered with the opposite of what ever it is, I did see some small positive but she quikly stoppmed it out. So since I was dark before and she won't repspond to any ideas from me to some thing diffrent then what WOW what a challenge plus an OM on top of that!?!?!?
Posted By: samina Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 08:04 PM
Hi

Not sure this will help as I am not fully aware of your stich, will look it up. I had a similar problem with going dark, I went dark and initially he contacted via mail all the time, but it was always with a plausible reason, finances, flat, picking up things etc etc. I think he also felt obligated to ow to have a reason to meet me.

With the post above I took Julia's advice and then got in touch with an email a few days later, telling him about the concert I went to as H loves Nick Cave. He immediately responded, seemed pleased to hear from me and gave me another artist to go and see. We then had some e-mail contact but nothing had changed. he is always polite/respectful to me and will always answer my e-mails/phone calls and even meet up. We have been interacting well now for a few months but he still wants divorce.

I think in some cases like in mine - nothing works. The WAS has to go and live their life as they see fit and we have to live ours. He seems happy to be friends and I know he still cares and respects me with the actions I have seen over the last few months but he is not "in love" and there is nothing I can do about that as he is "in love" with someone else.

In this case I have done what is best for me. I can't be his friend, it is either a marriage or nothing. I think you have to decide what you want and do that. Still aim to be the best you, and GAL and 180 but they are for you. If going dark has helped you heal then do it and wait for her to initiate. But I think you need to have no expectations.
Posted By: samina Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 08:15 PM
Hi Paul,

Have read a few of your posts and I think it'll help with you going dark, in that I think you need to take the time to heal yourself. It seems you have had some responses from W and you expect everyting to turn around too quickly. You have to learn to be patient. You need to stop talking about the R and what she is up to. Stop any snooping and just concentrate on yourself. GAL and 180 so that when she does get in touch she can see something different. Please take care of yourself and look and feel good otherwise why would your W want to come back?
Posted By: pauld2100 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 09:27 PM

this was her last e-mail

Paul,

There is not much to say that hasn’t been said already. We loved each other, we tried to make this work-both of us gave it all that we were capable of, I believe.

With that said, I have to move on. I could stay in the house, not date, and remain miserable or I can get out and actually live life. I hope you are too. I hope you

Know I still care about you, what happens to you, your health, your future. I will probably always love you. But we just can’t try to make this relationship work, again.

So, I will move on and so should you… I am finding it gets better with time…

Love, Nicole
Posted By: samina Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 10:02 PM
Hi Paul

I would stick to being dark. You don't need to reply and if you want to then just validate. My H came up with: I don't know what was wrong with our marriage but I've fallen in love with someone else and so fallen out of love with you....didn't want to even try counselling or trial separation. It doesn't make sense to us but it does to them. If you try and reason with her then she will think you are trying to control her.

She needs to go and date and do what she wants and see that the grass is not greener on the other side...this only works if you have something better waiting at home. So you have a lot of work to do so stop thinking of what she is doing, you mentioned in another post that for years you have being doing things for her.. youu need to change it and do things for you and re-discover what you enjoyed doing. Show her an attractive man to come back to.

What are you doing for yourself? What are your 180's, GAL and what issues do you think led to her leaving? Which of these can you change?
Posted By: pauld2100 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 10:04 PM

anyway I don't think I mentioned that not 2 months ago this same person wes talling me things like we have something special and kissing me and so on... I guess I am in a state of shock. Did chasing her completly kill it for her or can that recover. hard to tell I guess but now with an OM that maybe temperary not sure but sorry to ramble.....
Posted By: samina Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 10:13 PM
Paul, not more then 3 months before the bomb we were discussing having children!!!

It makes no sense, and no need to apologise. You need to let her go. You didn't answer my questions. Have you done anything different and stuck to it? 180's and GAL for YOU??
Posted By: pauld2100 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 10:16 PM
you know the thing that sucks is I didnt take her out much and she always asked me to but I came up with so excuse not to, SO that is one big change that i would love to show her but she rarly repondes so I don't even try to anymore.. catch 22, she has been burnt already tring this dating thing but has continued anyway I do validate and told her to go ahead and date. tring hard to make her think I mind a little but not tring to stop her. Sad thing is I think she is dating one person and is using that just for something to do not in love like we were so that blows me away that she would do that instead of just dating me for a while and see where it could go.
Posted By: pauld2100 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 10:23 PM

I am just tring to get back to working, with the market in such bad shape there is hardly any work. I am looking into training and other jobs but most need experiance that I don't have. she knows I am in the construction field and it is taking a beating worse then I have ever seen! no jobs at all, and if one shows up it's gone before you can get on the phone. I think I killed the love with love ya know....
Posted By: samina Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 10:29 PM
She probably hasn't seen the changes in you. You need to do 180's to change your behaviour, you are still thinking of what to do for her. Stop making it about her, it hasn't been working. She is not interested as you keep pursuing. let her go. keep dark or dim if you have kids and GAL for YOU
Posted By: whateverittakes Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 11:04 PM
Thanks JJ. This is a helpful thread.
Posted By: pauld2100 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/18/09 11:07 PM

your right I am really tring! I guess I just miss her.... and the funny thing is she used to be the one that cried when I had to places or work for weeks away from home.... thanks for listening.. \:\)
Posted By: pauld2100 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/20/09 02:04 AM
Hey people,
Samina, I know you keep asking what am I doing for me... well I am just tring to survive right now. I have even thought of going to Iraq to work. now she found this out through someone else and she didn't seem to mind much from what I understand. If I can leave the country and she didn't care that much well as you can see from that e-mail she sent her saying she cares and loves me well how can she love me and go out with others. as for doing this diffrent I have tried everything. staying dark maybe hurting it more, I know her well also and she is doing everything she can to keep distance. pursing her was the worse thing I could have done but it also had some small impact she felt good about it also but really was a bad idea. maybe I went over board with it. as far as the grass not being greener is right but I did so much damage at first that my changes are not gaining any intrest from her. I know she has her friends and this new distration to keep her mind off of things. I did back slide a bit ago and told her I was still in love with her, this is when she sent that e-mail. but she has called me before I sent her that message. also she believed that I was seeing someone else also when we split, she said she was broken hearted at one point and may have sparked the dating on her end, not sure because I don't ask. I haven't heard from her since that last email. its been less then a week, I am not sure what level of dating she is in but know she has went out for many hours on the weekends so I can only assume she is leveled up in this dating that would explain the email being so firm on moving on. Telling her I loved her to also could have done more damage and slow things down again. why would she stop dating a nobody when she knows I would right there. so many questions that I cant ask, she has not forced me to move my things out and when she does call I hear a bit of the old her slip through very little but its there.. one thing that kills me is she may have tried sex with this person and maybe why she is acting like she is. I guess if she can do that I am really suprized. I guess I just don't know what to think anymore, she probably thinks I'm out running around with other women and thought she would do the same. sad thing is im not and if she did it out of anger or to continue the end for us that would be just seem so destructive. just to many things left hanging in wind, truth is not even apart of this anymore. cant tell her anything, she would just get upset or not responde at all. The fact that she won't even see me and I mean just any face to face of any kind she won't let it happen. is she afraid to see me cause it would hurt me or her? sorry just to many unawnsered questions
Posted By: pauld2100 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/20/09 02:11 AM
You know I wonder if the person dump her tomorrow I just don't know if she would even call me. maybe I hurt her to bad. don't know
Posted By: pauld2100 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/20/09 03:21 PM

If there is anyone out there that was in a similar situation and found a way to do the 180 or help her do the 180 and it worked please let me know. what did you do diffrent I know I have to do things to but with the current conditions there is not much opportunity for her to see any changes. if she can say she loves me and I do also then she is simply forcing herself to take these actions. there has to be a way to give a wake up call in some way before things get any worse. I know she is tring to take care of the house on her own so my help would be a great thing for her but she won't accept my help, so anyone that has lived this and found a way I need your help....
Posted By: pauld2100 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 03/13/09 03:07 PM

More of the same!
Well I read back through some of these post and I am also don't understand it completly, I did see her for a day when my Mother had to go to the emergency room. It was a good day and she was even being suggestive about not getting any sex! I didn't respond to that because I know she has. she also sincerely told me she had a nice day. Now she also asked me to help her and why couldn’t’ I do that and have to live there to do so, I had not even asked to live there. I have not asked for anything but to go lunch once and church with her and the kids. She said yes both times. She didn’t make it both times but sincerely apologized on that good day about missing lunch! So the days after I did go by again and she seemed to not be as nice so I backed off again. I was emotionally distant before I left the house to stay somewhere else but still have not moved out. It seems that some things are working and some not. She has not contacted me since that day and had already started to make less contact before I saw her that day this is also while she had or still is dating maybe, I know it hasn’t went well with that for her. But I have not been asking about any of that. So doing more things for her could that get me out of the more of the same club? That was my 50% that could have pushed her to wanting out. So far I have been just doing a little at a time. I was really surprised that day that when I told her I couldn’t help because I can’t be in two places at once that was the time she told me she had a nice day. It is very hard to tell if she is dating but I can tell she is getting frustrated and worried about not having help. It’s like she wants me to help with the house and her everyday things that need to be done (and I had not done so well at that before so feel that would be a 180 for me) But I also can’t be doing this if she is out looking for Mr. Right also. I know I had baby steps happen but how do I continue. I have not tried to contact her since for a bit and wonder if that flirting with me was my signal to be more open. Any suggestions please….
Posted By: pauld2100 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 03/15/09 05:17 PM
Is anyone seeing these? I have posted a few things. If a Mod. could reply it make my day! I noticed the day I saw her she was frustrated and asking me for help with the house but asked why I had to live there to do so! I had not even given the impression that I did wanted to move back in when asked this. Now I think this important! I responded with I can't in two places at once and well not angry but said I don't care. All the while I was happy as can be, I did not ask about her dating. this seemed to set the tone for that day she asked me to stay for dinner and watch a movie. Now I did see her a couple brief times after this day and she was not as nice. so I backed off again, I was not there emotionally in the R for a while, and I did pursue for a while after she asked me to leave. so it would seem I have both problems to over come, not being there and being there to much right after.... I have read some things she wrote and one thing caught me she said " I am not her truth and never will be" yet we had this nice day after she wrote this. Anyway she told me she is over wehlmed and I know she is. she has not contacted me since that day. But the times I have contacted her she seems more reponsive. Please any suggestions or thoughts!
Posted By: I tried hard Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 04/09/09 05:03 PM
I like this thread! In a sense I've gone dark. Wife (37) started a new affair with 23 yr old. Although I think this is a midlife crisis I resolved there is nothing I can do to tell her this. I decided to go dark/disconnect from the pain and work on me. I wont hold out hope or encourage the affair but rather separate/divorce to give her the space. I beleive there is alot of therapy she needs in other areas but she will not face the facts but rather ignore them because it's easier. I think this affair will run it's course but I can't stand seeing it happen right in front of me.
Posted By: witz10 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/08/11 07:33 PM
Hi I just stumbled upon this topic and I was wondering or get opinions regarding my circumstance. I love my wife and she was the one who said she did not want to be married. She has also stated she is confused on what she wants. She wants me to have more time with our kids. I am out of our condo and living in my mothers basement. I usually pick up my kids Tuesdays and Thursdays and just take them home, dinner bath bed. My wife works late these nights and goes to the gym. I am thinking of going dark and taking them with me to my moms house for a sleep over then up early morning for school and daycare. I think the less contact with my wife the better we might be or it could back fire on me.
She is consulting with a attorney who is also a psychologist and mediator. We are looking to do a separation agreement. I am looking at a personal loan to consolidate my credit into one monthly payment.
I agreed to do couples therapy which she wanted to stop, I am doing my own therapy as well as willing to do couples therapy and 1 or 2 times a year go to couples retreat to work on us. She is just doing her own therapy and a support group. She is a psychologist who also sees couples. Why would she not want to work this out. I saw my issues and have taken care of them with exception to a few.
Confused husband
Witz10

M 37
W 34
S 6mos
Son 6
Daughter 3
Married 8 yrs
together 12yrs
Bad years maybe 3
Math is in our favor to have a happy life together if she wants it.
Posted By: MynameisMZ Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/11/11 02:55 PM
Hi witz10,

Read the first post on this thread. Have you read the DR book?

You could take the kids to your place as you thought and back off the communication. Go mini dark and see what the result is.

There was someone in the piecing section who basically went dark by default; he was done! Then his W did an about face.

Moderator: Are we allowed to point someone to another thread?


MZ
Posted By: witz10 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/11/11 09:13 PM
Thank you and no I am currently reading DB. Tried to look for DR but did not find it at bookstore
Posted By: dbmod Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/12/11 10:48 PM
MZ--
yes


witz-- DR is the upgraded version of DB--and it has chapters on special situations like Infidelity, Depression and MLC.
Posted By: witz10 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/14/11 09:49 PM
Last night after reading a little, I decided to write down the differences between when I lived in California and here. I did so much more when I worked from home in California compared to when we moved back here. I was taking care of more of the home duties since I worked from home. Like cooking, cleaning, shopping etc. Going out more being more active. Here I let my wife do all the cooking and figuring out what we need from the store etc. In other words my list from California is longer then the one from when we moved back here. And what is the difference between the two. I work for my family and am around them all day. Compared to California where I would only talk to them on the phone. The old adage family is only a long plane trip away comes in mind. From looking at this list I need to find other work and get out from my family. Its gotten so bad that I hate working here and I have said I hate them. This is not a good family dynamic.
All my friends say I should be writing this all down, even my therapist, and putting it in a book. A lot of them don't know how I have been this patient and not moved on. Only answer is I love my wife and am willing to fight for my marriage. Whether there is an affair or she is going through a form of MLC. I love her and want to live my life with her.
If it comes down to a D then so be it. I will look her straight in the eye tell her I will always love her she is the mother of my children and was the love of my life. Also she will never find anyone that would have cared for her and loved her as much as I did. These past three or four years was not me was not the man she married. I am becoming that man again and if she misses out on it her loss.
Posted By: WenikiTiki Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/13/11 06:13 PM
Okay Read as instructed. Absorbing!
Posted By: Brit45 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 05/05/12 04:59 PM
Just finished this thread. Really really good advice. I feel like we've had very very good communication since I went dark on talking about fixing it. This past week/weekend especially. He told me he was still chuckling about a text I sent him.
So I tried to look at why...I was being myself, I was being funny, and I was making reference to something no one else would get. Not a personal joke but something from our shared history.
But after looking at this week the majority of our convos I've initiated so I'm detaching a bit from that...I don't know if it's the right thing to do since our communication has been so good lately....tough decision.
Posted By: ForMyHusband Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/24/12 03:55 PM
Hi: I just read through the thread, (still more to do, its quite long) but wondering how "going dark" would apply in my situation. I was the WAW sadly and am now in my H shoes from a year ago and wanting to save my marriage and he is now the WAH.
So im not sure if going dark would work best for my situation - I was the one who didnt show him affection and attention and we still live together and have a child together. I am refraining from contacting him throughout the day now (the downward spiral started about a month ago)and keeping the convos at home to anything but "us" or the OW. Would that be "dark" enough for my situation?
Posted By: TryingToDo180 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/22/13 08:59 AM
Originally Posted By: Sparky
Going dark is the chance to work on you and to allow the spouse that left you to go through the journey they need to go through. If you start butting into that when they have made it clear that they don't want to be with you, then you come off as someone who is not honoring their request. You are short-circuiting the journey they have to go through to work out what is going on inside themselves.

There was obviously something very wrong that made them decide they wanted out in the first place. Oftentimes, it is probably the case that they are depressed and they have lost faith that anything can ever change. That patterns are set and are not reversible. It's a sign of depression to feel this kind of hopelessness.

One thing they knew for sure was that they did not want you in the picture. When people are depressed and confused about their identity like many people who request separations are, they become cognitively disorganized and impulsive in their choices. And when you are coming at them trying to make them stay with you, it just feels bad and like there's a pressure there to stay where they were.

And they don't want to stay where they were. They are wanting big changes. And if you stay the same as you always have been, and are unwilling to allow them to go on the journey that they need, or you are setting agendas about how they need to be, you just look like a controlling wench or [censored]. You become a representation of what they were trying to get away from.

As long as you keep pressuring them, you don't stand a chance. You will remain the embodiment of those bad feelings they are having. You will be something to avoid. You will make it very easy for them to continue to project or blame you for the bad feelings that reside inside of them.

If they are alone with those bad feelings still lingering inside, and you are nowhere in the vicinity, then perhaps they will begin to see that the pain they were feeling was really about something unhealed inside of them rather than something about you. You need to cut that link between bad feelings and you.

If you want there to ever be a future between you and your spouse, I believe you have to let your spouse take the journey that is rightfully theirs, even if they way they are communicating that to you [censored]. Even if it hurts like nothing else you've ever felt. If you love them, you have to let them go through that.

And you can't keep looking over to see if they are done yet. It's suffocating. Instead, this is your chance to learn new things. Walk around in your feelings and see what is unhealed in you that makes it so easy for you to feel crazy about this crappy situation in which you find yourself.

You have the gift of time now, and the focusing energy of pain. Don't feel all of this pain without getting your money's worth. Surrender to what is really happening. Face it head on. Summer in the MLC area says that you should stay dark UNLESS your spouse initiates a contact.

For me, there have been two main contacts. First, he called me several weeks ago, and we ended up talking for over an hour. Then, he told me that he wanted to meet with me to tell me some "news." At first, I did not meet with him, because I was not ready to feel more pain. I knew the news wasn't going to be good. But last week, I finally decided to recontact him and tell him that I was ready to meet to hear his news.

His news was that he was seeing the woman I had at first feared he was seeing. But I met when I was good and ready, and it was actually a really productive and authentic contact. I was ready to be calm and not plead and hear his news. And I think that even though he is with another woman, this contact was a good one, even though it was about painful stuff.

When I allow my husband to be the initiator, then he has to know that he wanted to see me. And from being dark, I, Sparky, have actually become a bit mysterious to my husband - which is hilarious, becase I'm the least mysterious person you will ever meet. And he was intrigued. And I liked it. And I'm going to keep doing this because I thing that not only is it "working," but I'm using all this time to grow as I never thought I would.

The worst thing that ever happened to me has been the best thing that ever happened to me. And even though I still feel a lot of pain, I mean that sincerely.


Sparky, that is a brilliant post and I can relate to this. I feel that my H is going through a depression and he is blaming me for it. It makes sense to give him the space to realise that it is not me making him depressed and I thank you from the bottom of my heart smile
The only thing that prevents me from going totally dark on my H is my son. He always tells his dad what we've been up to and as most of my life revolves round my son, My H knows most of my comings and goings. If he comes round, I have stopped talking about what I've been getting up to at college and things that I've been doing without my son.
Posted By: Cadet Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/26/13 08:38 AM
You realize that Sparky hasn't been here for 10 years now.
But it gives you an idea of how good the advice was.

I am glad you are posting in newcomers now and I hope you are off of moderation.

Keep moving forward!
Posted By: TryingToDo180 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 06/26/13 10:29 PM
Thanks Cadet smile I am off moderation now, I read somewhere on here that you suddenly get a surprise when your post gets posted up straight away and that's what happened to me! It's a good feeling smile
Posted By: workinprogress Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/02/13 04:33 AM
I'm new here. Going on three months separated. My H. left after feeling disconnected, empty nesters, lost job, and needing "things" to change. He felt as if he wasn't number one, second class in our home. I put the kids first... We wrote back and forth, for weeks, I mainly listened to what he didn't want, and finally got a bit of what he wants. To date no O.W. He started out living with a chum and stayed their for about 7 weeks. Realized it was like a frat house and had to get out. Now he is in a condo a friend is allowing him to stay in , free of charge. Oh yes, he is also 55. I have done a lot of listening, and encouraging him to vent. There was a lot of anger and resentment. We went to two M.C. sessions, but at the second one he declared he was unsure he wanted to work on the marriage , he wants to work on himself,and that we already had a good friendship. Perhaps that would change after he got counseling ; he wants it to be "about him". I couldn't leave fast enough from the place. Last week we wrote a couple of times about our feelings, and desires. He was honest about feeling no "desire" for me, and that he was not sure where it came from or if it was something that would return, perhaps it may have come from his feeling second.
I shared with him that he was not alone in those feelings. I had had many uncomfortable feelings about him, hate, sadness, no desire, anger, loneliness. I also had wonderful feelings of lust, joy, happiness, glee, etc. That I understood that marriage was about ups , downs, and plateaus. They could last hours, days, weeks, months and even years. I was not trying to convince him that things would be okay, but that he was not alone in his feelings. I told him he needed to feel them, and embrace them, for from that growth and understanding comes.
I had rolled my car a week ago, and was grateful that I'd been given a second chance at life. I am not going to get sucked down a dark hole and that happiness , sadness, anger, and resentment were choices. I let him know that I choose to celebrate my second chance, and I am choosing happiness. I ended the note by saying he was a smart guy, one of the things I so appreciate, and that he'll figure things out. He never responded to the note, but when he came over to collect the title to the car and mail, he seemed changed. It was a very brief time, an hour? He and I were upbeat and positive. He is working currently, with a better offer in the wings. He noticed I'd lost 23 lbs. actually gave me a compliment, which I haven't heard in oh 29 years! He was checking me out physically,( averting his eyes when I caught him looking) and asked me to dinner/lunch this coming weekend. I did not call him or text after he left. On the fourth day, yesterday, he called and we chatted. He tells me he will call on Friday, and I'm not sure if I should expect the date to occur. I do not want to expect or get hopes up. The last week has been up, but I just can't figure out why he wants to go out now? I am still bruised and tender, but do not wish to discourage his attempt. Especially since he needs to feel like he comes first. I did not ask about the weekend today, when we chatted on the phone again. I just don't know if I can take another disappointment. I'm trying to stay busy, and work on my reading, school, and the overgrown gardens I have. It is just so difficult, I don't want to go into non functional mode again.
Posted By: TryingToDo180 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/02/13 06:11 PM
I can understand how you must be feeling, these are very confusing times. If you do get a chance to let him take you out for dinner then I would go smile If he doesn't mention it again, then assume you're not going and make other plans to go out with a friend. This is important as you are showing your H that you're not going to wait around for him smile Your H sounds a lot like mine, except mine is 47 and I feel he is going through depression/MLC.
Sorry to hear about your car accident and the fact that you are still bruised and tender frown The accident might have made your H think how much he doesn't want to lose you. I'm only guessing here, so don't take this as gospel.
I've just started to read a book called 5 love languages. It explains that everyone sees love in a different way and it tells you how to talk your partner's love language. You can also get lots of advice by going to the website called 5lovelanguages.com
Hoped I've helped a bit smile You may also want to post your story in the newcomers section as this gets a lot of traffic smile Hope to hear from you soon smile
Posted By: confuzed0903 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/03/13 06:46 PM
Ok I am working on "going dark" not texting, emailing, calling unless important in regards to our 4 yr old daughter. We had custody mediation orientation and HE initiated a conversation afterwards about her. My question is when he starts asking me questions like are you working today? why arent you working today or why did you drive this path to get here- i seen you down this road. How should I handle these questions from him when I am trying to be mysterious and "dark". To me he is being nosey...lol. I just need help replying to him should i just be honest if he asks specific questions or be vague?? Thx
Posted By: TryingToDo180 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/03/13 08:32 PM
I would just give him one word answers or shrug your shoulders in answer to his questions. Don't elaborate. Some questions do require an honest answer, but don't feel you have to explain yourself to him. I'll leave you to work out which questions need an honest answer and which ones don't smile Use your female intuition here smile
Posted By: Confluences Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/23/13 03:56 AM
Today was my WAW's Birthday and it is also 90 days since we've last seen each other in person. I did not send her a card, no text messages, e-mail...nothing. I did remind a friend that it was her Birthday and they called her, which was good but me nothing.

Going Dark has taken a lot of the emotion out of the situation and forced me to look upon the situation with a different light that brings an element of resolve about my actions being the right thing. It's hard but it gets easier over time if you stick with it and believe in yourself.

The holiday season is approaching and this is a good warm-up for navigating those challenging scenarios that are coming soon. This forum is one of the best on here, so keep posting.
Posted By: S4tk Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/17/13 09:36 PM
I'm about to read this entire thread, since I am torn between going dark (with two young kids, I guess it would be dim at best) and continuing to pursue but in a 180 kind of way.

I sent my first post about 2-3 days ago. Does it usually take that long for them to be posted when newbies are on moderation here?

TB
Posted By: TryingToDo180 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/18/13 08:14 AM
Hi TB, yes it does take a long time for your posts to be moderated. Keep posting and soon you'll be off moderation. You may want to tell us your story in the newcomers section and start your own thread.
I wouldn't continue to pursue your H, but let H make all the contact. The only time you need to contact your H is when it's to do with your kids or money.
I'll pop into your new thread once you've set it up smile
Posted By: 2old Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/18/13 05:21 PM
Hi Confluences, was reading the post you did about WAW's bday on 9/22....my WAW's bday was 9/17 and after much thought I did email her a short bday wish. She did respond with a "thank you, had a wonderful day"...That is the last time we have had contact as she completely ignored my bday 3 weeks later.

So, I am now committed to going dark as u even through the fast approaching holidays. My contacting her wasnt bringing anything more than short icy emails anyways. I would be interested in how your sitch goes during this dark period. I still have my thread in newcomers and yesterday was six months since she WA....

You are correct about being dark and easing of the emotions of ones sitch....
Posted By: Iva Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/05/13 11:16 PM
I wish someone would answer because all I feel is regret. I received a hate email - you know the one where everything is my fault and H wants nothing to do with me because OW deserves more. I have been dark ever since. I didn't respond to his email, I mean what was the point? Any response he would have taken as justification. Right now he is playing victim which is a pretty good description of our marriage...I am the problem he is the victim.

Holidays and our anniversary then his birthday it will be an interesting period. As angry as he is I suspect that I will not hear from him at all which is fine because taking a break from his anger has been healthy for me. It is hard missing him, knowing he is with OW, and wanting to say so many things but may never get the chance.

I have been going out lots lately and it has been good for my self esteem.
Posted By: TryingToDo180 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/05/13 11:40 PM
Iva, welcome to DB forum smile You'll find us all a friendly and helpful bunch smile For starters, just stick to one thread smile When I first joined I used to do what you did and go to other threads just to get an immediate answer. We're all on different timezones, so tomorrow morning you may get loads of answers to your thread smile Be patient - A word you'll hear a lot on here smile
Getting hate email and telling you it's all your fault is typical behaviour for a WAS.
You sound like you are doing ok with your GALing and your PMA, keep it up smile
First of all, it is not entirely your fault, just remember that. He is trying to put you down and because you've been married for a while he knows what buttons to press.
Has he moved in with OW? How long as he been with her? I wasn't sure if you put on your thread how old you both are. It normally helps to have a signature like mine especially until we get to know you smile
What are you doing to GAL apart from going out? Have you thought about taking up a new hobby or doing some volunteering work? Going out is ok in small doses but you are going to need to watch your money as it is harder to manage on your own.
You mention not being able to get the chance to talk to him. He will contact you soon, but if he doesn't then just peek out and find an excuse to email him such as his mail coming to yours or financial issues. I hope to hear from you soon, either on this thread or on your own thread smile
Posted By: Iva Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/06/13 12:23 AM
He is 46 I am 47. No he hasn't move in with her she lives in Miami and H lives in Oregon. OW works for a company that will fly them for free so they have been taking lots of trips together and he frequently goes to see her and she come to visit here. He hooked up with her before we split - an emotional relationship to start. Then even before we physically split they vacationing together, OW is separated from H and is going through custody proceedings.

I have been doing many MANY things to keep myself occupied. First, restoring furniture, running, joined a gym, and a woman's group.
I don't think reaching out to him is a good idea because it has only succeeded in pissing him off. He said he just wants me to go away.
Posted By: TryingToDo180 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/06/13 12:36 AM
You seem to be doing fine and finding lots of things to keep you occupied smile You mentioned that you want an answer, but what is the question?
Keep on doing what you're doing and if you don't want to reach out to him then that's ok smile Be careful of your language on here though, you could end up being banned.
The roller coaster ride starts here and I hate roller coasters smile When you get a chance, come over to my thread. We have fun on there at times when it's not being overtaken by our sitches. Me, not quitting and milehigh all have fun threads when the mood takes us smile We try and cheer each other up when the going gets tough smile
Look after yourself, your health is the most important right now smile
Posted By: Iva Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/06/13 02:36 AM
Thank you for responding, the answer I seek was just a response. I was starting to feel ignored...sorry had my pity party..now I am done.

I have definitely been on a roller coaster ride for some time and trying to read which direction it goes. I know I just need to keep staying dark for now and be patient.

Right now I am just living life as though it is over and trying to build a life an accept that we won't ever see each other again. I know right now this is what he wants because he knows it would hurt me.
Thanks again
Posted By: TryingToDo180 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/06/13 07:08 PM
Hi Iva,
You're welcome smile
You'll get more traffic if you move to your own thread. Also look in on other people's threads like mine and join in the conversation smile
Posted By: Iva Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/07/13 01:16 AM
I do have my own thread but haven't had a single response until now, and I have responded to others just haven't gotten anything back.

Thank you!
Posted By: Iva Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/07/13 01:22 AM
You mentioned my language... I am sorry to offend, but I don't know what I said that could get me banned. I don't want to be banned could you give me a hint?

Much appreciated.
Iva
Posted By: TryingToDo180 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/07/13 09:06 AM
You said p*ssing him off. I'm now not sure if this is considered inappropriate language as some words are allowed in the US than in the UK.
If you move to your thread then I'll follow you smile
Posted By: Iva Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/07/13 11:33 PM
Thanks for the heads up I appreciate it!

Here is my thread.
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2385372#Post2385372
Posted By: dgb60 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/18/14 02:41 PM
I have same sitch as you do. How are things now with your R?
Posted By: hope4 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/02/14 03:00 PM
Last night I informed my H that if he wanted a D, then we should not renew our lease together in 2wks. Now, today, Im a sobbing mess. I want him here, but it hurts too much to have him here. He said if he leaves, he is never coming back. Did I screw up the method somehow?

Back story...I chalk this up to a MLC. Our marriage suffered recently from E-separation, lack of intimacy. He told me 4m ago he wanted to divorce - (while I was 8m pregnant). I had an EA long ago, and he has started an EA which he claims he can do because he started pursuing her 4d after he told me he wanted out(he originally met her 2y ago). The past 4m have been full of passive aggressive cruelty from him and I don't want our boys learning that it is OK to treat women like a doormat. I have tried GAL - it is so hard with a new baby, new job, and holidays.

He stated he wanted the D before the baby was born; now he wants us to go in mutually and waive the separation period. I just need him away for my own healing, it hurts to have him sleep next to me and flinch if I even brush up against him during sleep.

What is the next step? Waiting?
I'm already praying day and night.
Posted By: Cadet Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/02/14 10:51 PM
hope4 please start a thread on newcomers or MLC there is very little traffic here.

Sorry you are here but it is a good place to be.

Keep Posting
Posted By: Zelda09 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 12/20/14 05:10 PM
This was so helpful, so on point for my situation.
Posted By: Cadet Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/12/15 07:36 PM
Anyone reading this thread should also read this thread on LRT

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=42377#Post42377
Posted By: Swabby Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/19/15 04:26 PM
The GDT seems interesting, but if i was unavailable for years, i don't think it would be in my benefit to use it. The conundrum i'm at right now is exactly what to do. She wants her space, but we live in the same house, and i don't want to do "more of the same" and go dark.

-Nathaniel
Posted By: yola Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 04/04/15 05:18 AM
I'm relatively new here. Been reading a lot and finally decided to ask my question. Quick background: discovered husband's affair last year. Married 28 years, daughter in college, son in high school. Husband says he was miserable for a long time and has a long list of why we are no longer compatible and not a good fit. He wanted to move out but I convinced him not to because our daughter was about to study abroad. I went through the the typical first stage of hysterically begging, etc. After a tortuous four months, he stopped seeing the OW although they still talk. I've been very clear in acknowledging my role in how we got to this point and really want to turn things around. We go through periods when we are fine, then he says he's still conflicted and wants to leave. When we discuss the relationship, I try but seem to fail at using the correct techniques listed here. When we go through good periods, I'm ok. I feel like I'm being torn apart. Part of me wants to let him move out and then go dark, but then I think of the kids being collateral damage during this experiment. Both kids are extremely sensitive and going through their own difficult times. I just lose it when I think about how this would derail them at critical points in their lives. It's just so unfair to them. So far, they think we have a perfect marriage. They will utterly go into shock. I'm completely distraught at this point. When we discuss the relationship, he ends up being very hurtful and I say all the wrong things...
Posted By: Cadet Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 04/04/15 01:08 PM
Originally Posted By: yola
I'm relatively new here. Been reading a lot and finally decided to ask my question. Quick background: discovered husband's affair last year. Married 28 years, daughter in college, son in high school. Husband says he was miserable for a long time and has a long list of why we are no longer compatible and not a good fit. He wanted to move out but I convinced him not to because our daughter was about to study abroad. I went through the the typical first stage of hysterically begging, etc. After a tortuous four months, he stopped seeing the OW although they still talk. I've been very clear in acknowledging my role in how we got to this point and really want to turn things around. We go through periods when we are fine, then he says he's still conflicted and wants to leave. When we discuss the relationship, I try but seem to fail at using the correct techniques listed here. When we go through good periods, I'm ok. I feel like I'm being torn apart. Part of me wants to let him move out and then go dark, but then I think of the kids being collateral damage during this experiment. Both kids are extremely sensitive and going through their own difficult times. I just lose it when I think about how this would derail them at critical points in their lives. It's just so unfair to them. So far, they think we have a perfect marriage. They will utterly go into shock. I'm completely distraught at this point. When we discuss the relationship, he ends up being very hurtful and I say all the wrong things...


Welcome to DB

My first suggestion is re-post this and a little more in newcomers.

Your kids are almost adults, I think you need to start looking out for YOU!

Have you read DR?
Posted By: yola Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 04/04/15 02:37 PM
I have read DR multiple times. My kids may be "almost" adults, but they are each in critical stages of life. My son has set his sights on tough colleges and taking a lot of AP classes. I fear a separation will derail him. My daughter has had a lot of her own issues and bordering on depression. When I think about them, I literally get sick to my stomache. I am thinking about myself because I know I will be more miserable if they are suffering.
Posted By: yola Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 04/04/15 08:57 PM
So as a follow up question, I wonder if it's possible to go dark and yet live together. For the past few months, I have been trying to be kind and affectionate and loving. I think it's gotten me nowhere. He thinks I'm still controlling him. We've also had an active sex life, and it's been a mutual desire. But now he says his fantasy is that I would want to have sex for the sake of sex for now, without the emotion attached. To some extend I'm ok with that, although it's not always easy. I'm trying to take care of myself and do more for me. How do I go dark without acting uninterested, as I think that would backfire as well. I'm just so confused about how to act.
Posted By: Joe J S Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 04/15/15 05:11 PM
I went dark on my W yesterday, with our child involved it makes it difficult to text her just about him during the week as I only get to see him Friday and Saturday and I am always curious as to what he is doing and how he is because this isn't going easy on him. I feel as though the more I don't text her the more he and I miss out on being on the same page in regards to where he is with letters and numbers. Plus I just miss being around him.
Posted By: Ripken8 Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 04/16/15 12:23 AM
From everything that I've read and heard, when it comes to your children, you never go dark on that. imo if you want to know how your child is doing, call and ask or text. Maybe be able to talk with them. You should not initiate with her but continue to initiate with your children.
Posted By: Joe J S Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 04/16/15 03:24 PM
I am proud to say that I successfully continued to stay in the dark after a surprise call from W. She accused me of a couple things including kidnapping our son while she would be out of town with OOM. I calmly told her to stop listening to other people. Then she started to ask about me and I quickly ended the conversation. It's hard but I no longer feel under her control.
Posted By: bride Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/06/15 02:49 AM
I am at the point where my h is going to file very soon. He's said he is done, doens't love me.. We have been separated 6 months. I am confused as to whether I should just sit back and let him file and go through the divorce process and HOPE he changes his mind or do I have a conversation with him.. I want to basically tell him I respect his feelings, that I am moving on with my life but that I would like him to be a part of things and our family with the kids and grandkids.
I don't want to address the past and bring up marital issues, somehow I just want to tell him that I want him to reconsider but I really dont know how to go about that and I especially do not want to make him feel trapped and have me asking by a push for him to want to sign papers.
I believe he is a mlc'r he told me that six months before he left he had planned out his suicide and I was the reason. He tried to leave in feb 2015 and stayed another month. He has a "good friend" who he has been texting for at least 6 montsh almost every minute of the day.. Now I believe he is talking or seeing other woman because I saw a pic come up on his phone the other day of a woman.
I need help on how to address him and when? I have minimal contact with him through text. Most of the time he responds and we have a brief conversation He has recently gone to three concerts with us and breakfast afterwards. He traveled to many restaurants along side us to find one that was open. I kept insisting he could go home since his drive is 40m minutes away... He also just went clothes shopping with me and my daughter the other day.. We all got our ear pierced and again went to dinner. I tried to end the dinner date when I saw he was getting ansy to leave and he kept restarting a conversation topic.. I am surpirsed he has gone to these things with us because he told my daughter he doesn't enjoy my company. I believe he only went to please my daughter but I see that he didn't have to eat with... His behavior like many here is confusing. I think he's just being polite but I hope his heart is softening.. It doesn't seem like it when he still talks about divorce things though like the finances... I want to talk to him soon because his lease will be up in a month.
One reason I am hesitant to talk to him now though is the fact that he is leaving out of town for some psychology workshops and I am afraid that if I make a plea with him, he will go down to these workshops and talk about me and get advice from his collegues which will further solidify his leaving me. He feels he needs to be authentic with himself and he hasn't been our whole 25 year marriage. He treated me like gold and this divorce stuff is a total shocker to me and everyone that knows us..
Posted By: Cadet Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/06/15 03:57 PM
Originally Posted By: bride
I am at the point where my h is going to file very soon. He's said he is done, doens't love me.. We have been separated 6 months. I am confused as to whether I should just sit back and let him file and go through the divorce process and HOPE he changes his mind or do I have a conversation with him.. I want to basically tell him I respect his feelings, that I am moving on with my life but that I would like him to be a part of things and our family with the kids and grandkids.

Welcome to the board.

First I would suggest you post in newcomers as your posts will get out of moderation faster.

As far as the above, are you trying to guilt him into changing?

I would just keep quiet.
Posted By: brit Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/11/15 01:09 AM
My husband is a wah and going through a mLC. I'm not use to him being hurtful, but since he left he's been actively pushing me away as hard as he can. I finally decided to go dark and I'm implementing the LRT as he is already filing for divorce. After he said some hurtful things, in which I would normally respond in a needy and sad way, I decided to not respond. I have been hoping for him to help me understand, but I realize that will not happen. He won't go to counseling, even so we can better communicate for our three kids under 5. I sent him a picture of our baby after he skyped with the kids. She is 4 months old, and he left me when she was 1month, so I think he feels guilt especially when I send him pictures and he realizes all he's missing out on. After I sent the picture, I was surprised to get a text from him a couple of hours later that wasn't filled with the hate I had been dealing with since he left. I don't know if I should respond or how I should respond. I want to respond but I feel I should do opposite of what id normally do. The text was very emotional to me and I feel a response to it would be better in person, in the future. Here's the text: thank you for the photo. I love our children so much!!
You and I have made beautiful children together!! I don't regret the choices I have made to marry you and to create the family we have made. The choice that you and I made together to leave school and get married was the best decision I made. It has made me the person I am now. Yes I have made many mistakes during that time. I have fallen short many times during our marriage as a husband.
I'm sorry for those mistakes W, I really am. I tried my best, I really did. I know that you don't agree with my choice of divorce and I don't expect you to. I just want you to know that I love you and I always will!
I have you and our families best interest in my thoughts and every choice that I make. Please forgive me. I have asked God to forgive me and I know that the choice will affect us in many ways.
I do understand that moving on with my choice. Understand that I will never have ill feelings towards you moving on, I just want the best for you! I'm here for you...I know that we have not been the best to each other lately. I don't want to tear each other down anymore. I am moving forward but I will not tear you down in the process anymore. You don't do that to people you care about.
I'm hurting you enough by the choice that I have made.".
Posted By: JGuy Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/20/15 04:54 PM
I finally just got around to reading this topic and I'd like to thank JJ for sharing these ideas. I think the following may apply to me and my sitch:

Originally Posted By: Jamesjohn
Going dark could also fall into the "do nothing" category. If you were the type of person that always had to be involved in everything, either fixing, directing, or controlling the situation, then staying out of direct contact with your partner can help you to do a "180" on this situation. You are essentially "dropping the rope" to let others handle the situation without your interference.

Going dark can take you out of the chaos long enough to "take stock" of where you are versus where you were, and compared to where you want to go.

Going dark can be a form of "stop going down cheeseless tunnels". If you persist on running through the maze blindly, you may need to take yourself out of the picture until you can "sniff out" the tunnel you need to head down. (Humm, do I want the cheddar or the swiss?!)

Going dark can help you to "start with a beginner's mind". If you can take a step back back, far away from being in the middle of the situation, you can often begin to see things with a fresh eye, a "beginner's mind", and get a clearer view of where you need to head. We've seen this by the way others on this board can often view our situations with a clearer mind then we can.


I'm not sure about fully dark, but some shade of grey that is darker than how I have been so far does seem like it might be a good idea at this point in my sitch. I have always been the fixer and the pursuer. My W has recently come clean about past A's and is trying to figure out what her heart wants now after hiding that she wasn't attracted to me anymore since 2011. It seems like going dark would be good to just let her figure out what she wants while I focus on myself. I do hesitate a bit, because I worry that if I go dark she may forget about our emotional connection and that may sway her toward choosing to end the M. My emotions are all tangled up in her and I am a bit co-dependent though, so in some ways going dark may be good just for me.

Thanks for sharing this...
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/23/15 04:11 AM
JGuy -

What are you thinking about specifically when you say you will go a little darker? Do you mean less pursuit, giving her space? What specifically will you be saying or doing or NOT be saying or doing?

It's great that you are putting some careful thought into this!

-sg
Posted By: JGuy Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/23/15 06:53 AM
Originally Posted By: sgctxok
What are you thinking about specifically when you say you will go a little darker? Do you mean less pursuit, giving her space? What specifically will you be saying or doing or NOT be saying or doing?

Yeah, less pursuit. Stepping back out of the chaos to slow down, take care of myself, process my feelings, take stock of the situation and gain clarity on what my own needs are so that I can assess the best way forward.

Right now I feel like I'm taking back some of the space that she occupied in my psyche. Filling the empty hole in my heart that she vacated with my own self-love, if that makes sense. It's the kind of thing that I should do for myself for the sake of myself, regardless of whether or now we can save the M.

I will still care for her and share stories of what we are going through, for now. Our ability to talk about things openly has be a source of meaning for us in the chaos and seems to speed up the processing that we need to go through individually. I just have to be vigilant about keeping a hold on than needy part of me that wants so badly to reach out and grab onto her for support and comfort.
Posted By: sgctxok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 11/24/15 04:35 AM
Originally Posted By: JGuy
Originally Posted By: sgctxok
What are you thinking about specifically when you say you will go a little darker? Do you mean less pursuit, giving her space? What specifically will you be saying or doing or NOT be saying or doing?

Yeah, less pursuit. Stepping back out of the chaos to slow down, take care of myself, process my feelings, take stock of the situation and gain clarity on what my own needs are so that I can assess the best way forward.

Right now I feel like I'm taking back some of the space that she occupied in my psyche. Filling the empty hole in my heart that she vacated with my own self-love, if that makes sense. It's the kind of thing that I should do for myself for the sake of myself, regardless of whether or now we can save the M.

I will still care for her and share stories of what we are going through, for now. Our ability to talk about things openly has be a source of meaning for us in the chaos and seems to speed up the processing that we need to go through individually. I just have to be vigilant about keeping a hold on than needy part of me that wants so badly to reach out and grab onto her for support and comfort.



That's a really good plan. I believe that it will get you where you want to be. Controlling what you allow to occupy your mind is major.

Best-
sg
Posted By: hmc Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/13/16 07:35 PM
My husband wants to be friends after announcing he wants a divorce. He said it's a done deal. He is still sleeping at home when it's convenient for him. Still very involved in kids life. He is chatty with me and pleasent and even helps me out. I'm having a hard time not confusing these actions as a sign that there may be hope. When I bring up our marriage he shuts down and reiterates the same thing. That he's done and his focus is himself his kids and getting along with me. My question is how friendly should u act towards my husband. I'm finding this extremely hard... the boundaries are blurry at least to me. I know I need to dissatach but it's so hard when he's so present and pleasent in my life
Posted By: hmc Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/14/16 06:09 PM
Went dark today when husband was trying to engage in an upbeat conversation with me. He asked if I was ok and what was wrong. I said I was fine. Left to go to gym. Then I got home also went dark and answered him with one word and went upstairs with kids to watch a movie. Leaving him alone downstairs. He left just now and didn't tell me where he was going or when he would be back. I want nothing more than act normal with him and be pleasent but I am trying this technique and LR. Did I do something wrong? Can this change push him away?
Posted By: hmc Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/14/16 06:15 PM
Also how do I respond when he's asking me what's wrong or if I'm ok when I'm using this method?
Posted By: hmc Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 01/15/16 12:55 PM
Update, he got really upset at me today and said I have been inconsiderate and not clear about where I have been going and not taking into consideration his time and his plans. He was angry at me and said it has been inconvenient for him as I'm vague about when I will be home etc. I stayed calm and told him I wasn't aware that he was feeling this way and that I would be more mindful in the future of this. I walked away and he came back in the room I was in and apologized and said he overreacted and that he's still angry and probably needs counselling for himself. I listened and said that it sounds like a good idea and then he hugged me anaaaaannnd.... kissed me on the lips! I smiled and said goodbye to my kids as I have a coffee date with a girlfriend. And left. He followed me to the door and said bye....is this progress???
Posted By: kdvor Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 10/18/16 06:01 AM
HMC - i can kind of relate to you. The more I go dark and back off the more he becomes available. He is available but still distant. I feel like I want to whole heartedly respond to his attempts to be kind, but I know this will backfire. Sometimes I think who cares. I should open myself up to vulnerability and see wheat happens. But I continue to listen to the advice of this group. I am 1 1/2 weeks of dark. He went away for the weekend, so that was easy. He has been asking me how I am, if I am ok, etc. alot. I just respond "i'm fine". Even asked if I wanted to talk once. I said "no". So he continues to go along every day as if all is ok. Cold but his normal routine of coming and going when he chooses.
Posted By: Viking Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/27/17 04:23 PM
This is ages old, and you probably won't see this reply, but your post is really helpful to me...what happened with your marriage?
Posted By: Viking Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 08/31/17 04:34 AM
Update??
Posted By: A_ok Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 09/25/17 11:03 PM
I am one of those people caught in the challenge. I did pull back emotionally and intimacy so it would be more of the same. I am trying to find a middle ground. I try to steer clear of anything personal etc. I am working on the GAL. But when he does talk to me about those daily work and kid things I am far more present which is also different.

The downside is that I feel like i am learning to compartmentalize which is not good. And of course the energy this takes is exhausting. Patience is not one of my things.
Posted By: Tas Re: "Going Dark" - 101 - 02/07/19 10:32 PM
This section has answered so many of my questions since the end of Dec....thank you all the info here