Hey everyone - last one locked.
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...&gonew=1#UNREADSo my parents have fronted me the money for the rental house. 1st, last and security. I'll pay them back once the house sells. I was going to drop this into our account and cut the checks from it but I decided it was time for me to open my own account anyway...so I did that with it. They rounded it up $200, so there will be more than enough to cut those checks from. Once the house is sold I'll start depositing my checks into this new account. Just more "moving on" I guess. Kinda sucks but kind of exciting too. I'll be happy to have control over my money again. Looking forward to taking control of that part of my life, pay off all our debt and get it straightened out.
great job Swashy. I know I felt kind of good when I opened my own account also.
I think keeping focus on moving on is what keeps us going. I spend a very small (almost none) amount of time on that 'how it could have been.' I focus on the future of me and the kids. As a combo H and I were not good at saving anything. One of the things I did is open college funds for each one of the kids. What a great feeling.
Keep moving forward.
Neli
Strange that you opened your new account today. The reason I say that is I met my W at the bank today to have her name taken off of the joint account. It is now my account only.
Thanks guys...not much new. W baked a cake today!?!? Little weird. I sent her a text about it...said she was just procrastinating studying and told me to eat some....aaahight...it was yummy.
Otherwise not much - been on the phone, taking care of the kids and then had to work for about an hour or so. Tired. This job is really kicking into gear now. Exciting challenge for me and really gives me something to focus on which is great too. Psyched to prove myself.
Nothing like a good challange to help you focus. What kind of cake?
I certainly hope so Speed.
A three layer white cake with strawberry filling and homemade butter cream frosting. It was AWESOME!
Talked to W briefly this morning. Had to call her to find out what S5 needed for camp. Then she called back. Apparntly their old pre-school teacher is starting some type of after school program next year. That could be really good. Sounds cheap and they will be able to get off the bus there and I could just pick them up on my way home. Good, good, good.
Signing the lease tonight! Yay me!
Hey man-
As you know, I'm just about done moving out of my house. I wasn't sure if I would get weirded out about it, or down in the dumps, but I was surprised at how much I went in the OTHER direction - it's been really exciting, especially as I'm getting things put away, putting stuff up on the walls, etc.
Remember to try not to focus on what you're leaving behind, but rather on what's ahead of you - worked for me and I'm feeling GREAT.
BTW, I didn't post this because I DON'T think you're doing great right now, just an observation from one transient to another.
Keep up the good work and good attitude. And as Bruce Dickinson would say...really explore the studio!
Kev
Niiice. LOL. I'm exploring buddy....I'm exploring alright.
Right now, I'm not really sad about it. Life is throwing me obstacles and it does me not good to get upset about them and fight them...I just need to get past them and keep moving forward with MY life.
I am getting excited about the new place. Something just for me.
You know...I do keep coming back to a conversation the W and I had way back last August or September. She said that she wanted us living in two seperate houses, doing our own thing but sharing time together with the kids and getting to know each other again.
I'd like to do that if we can. Not sure if we'll be D'd doing it, not sure if it will make us better friends or if it will save our M. Just kind of looking forward to spending some time with her - yet be independent from one another at the same time.
I know she needs to continue down this road of gaining her independence and her confidence back. I'd need her to have that if we were able to ever have anything together too. I need her stronger then she has ever been. So this is the road that needs to be taken. I really do believe that. From there, we'll just have to see what the future holds. Maybe I'll find someone else, maybe she will or maybe we'll find each other. Who knows...but I'm starting to look forward to whatever the future holds.
I'm starting to look forward to whatever the future holds.
He shoots, HE SCORES!
Or as Marv Albert would put it...YES!
Thanks man. I'm starting to realize that although I can't really control how this plays out...I'm just confident that someway, somehow, regardless of HOW it plays out...I'll be happy in the end. It may be with my W, it maybe with someone else...it may even be by myself (although I doubt it)....but I'll be happy. Wanna know why? Because that it something that I CAN control! That is a choice I can make.
I hear ya. I came into this not being "good enough"..as did she. Well I know I am now....
Just got this fromt the W:
-----------
So, maybe you can take the van somehow, I could grab it at your work on the way to the hospital tomorrow?, so you have it for Sat. and getting the bikes over there? Maybe you can drop S5 off at my house in the morning, cause it will be so early. He's adamant that he doesn't want to do it.
(Boss)is having a b-day party for (his W), starting at 3pm, i might want to try and stop by... we'll see... i'm going to take the kids to my parents house to have a dad's day dinner with dad that night... then depending on where you are on sat nite, etc... you can meet us at the (Restaraunt) on sunday am at 10am?
And, I'd like to arrange a meeting with the new mediator for a week from today, next thursday, that is. For around 6:00. It's in Plymouth (not sure where, I'll find out), think you can get down there by 6?
-------------
Guess she's just going to keep driving to the hoop on this. Oh well.
Roll with it my brother.....
She is moving down her chosen path, that is just fine for you. She will need to go through with a new mediator to stand by what she has already said to you. That is fine, you said yourself she may need to do this if there is ever to be a chance to heal and have a good R.
Your ok dude...... thats all that matters... as they say, sit your happy a$$ on the curb and watch the freak show roll on by.....
Ian
Hey Scott-
Not sure if you have been or not, but at this stage of the game it will probably do you good to count on her driving this train until she explicitly indicates or says otherwise. I've been in the position where you look for any and every little thing as a sign that this is not the case, or that she's having second thoughts. One of the key parts of detaching is not having expectations (as you already know) - and that includes not expecting her to change her mind from where it's at right now. I know that sucks though.
Kev
I'm ok guys...really. Do I wish she would stop the train? Of course. Do I expect her to. Of course not. Nothing I can do. She wants to do this and that is exactly what she'll do. Nothing I can do to change it.
I told her that "that all sounds fine" in my response but then she had to email back confirming that the time worked. "Yup - that should be fine".
swashy,
I know how it feels...and you are right, nothing you can do to change it. I looked for little signs and stuff that the D train might be stopping. Not sure why XW felt the need to follow thru and I may never know.
Ok...so I have kind of been putting this off...putting this up here. Just been unsure what I was going to do and didn't feel like taking heat from people. But since she keeps driving to the hoop...I guess I need to keep moving on.
There is this girl who I have known forever that lives around here. We talk once in a while, etc. I haven't told her what is going on with the W and I...but I also don't really talk about the W to her...so I think she has an idea. She never brings up my W either. She's Dd and is always telling me to keep an eye for a nice guy for her. She's VERY attractive, takes a genuine interest in me, very complimentary, etc.
Well I got an email from her last week saying "Lets get together for a lunch date or a coffee date". I have always in the past run the other way when presented with such offers. BUT...Told her that may not work with the new job but that maybe we could get together for drinks one night. "I'd love that" was her response. I was actually thinking that next Thursday would be a good night...but don't think it would be a good idea for me to do that after mediation...just in case I'm hurting.
So I'll pick another night.....but I feel like if she has made her choice and is continuing to push for this...then I do need to move on. Will this go anywhere - who knows. Not sure I'm really ready for it to go somewhere...but I think I need to force myself to start looking at a life without my W.
I have never once in our 11 years of M...or our 15 years together cheated on her, had an EA or PA or ANYTHING. Not even close. She has been with someone for 3 years now....may still be with him (or someone else) for all I know and wants to D me. She has told me recently that she is not with him...but she has told me that before and it was a lie. I will not do anything that I am not ready to do...but I do feel like I am ready to at least go out and enjoy a woman's company.
Thanks HS - Yes - I have hoped and hoped that someday she would realize that I was not the problem. That the solution to her happiness is within her. That she would open her heart, trust, love, believe and try. I know that I meant it when I stood on that alter and vowed for better or for worse in front of my family, friends, God and most importantly...HER. And we have had our fair share of worse...but I believed we could also have better if we both truly wanted it. She chose not to believe that...not to keep her vowes. Nothing I can change about that.
I've avoided doing this in the past because I know how it can be a slippery slope. Especially when I have done without attention for so long. At least 7 years now. It makes me nervous that I may actually like it I guess. I'm scared to be happy with someone else because, to me, it means breaking those vowes.
OK, i think i've found the serious thread....
and Scott - really!!!! What the h3ll are you waiting for!!!???!!!
I say go for a date with this lady, but keep it all light. Yes your emotions are up and down right now, yes there is part of you still hoping that W will come back to you, you're not really in a place to start a R with anyone else. But having a few dates, i don't see why not.
You say this lady is D'd too ... maybe you should share a little with her what is happening with you (you don't have to go into details) but it would be good at some point, if you do date this lady, to point out you are still a bit raw and might be a little up and down.
Only you will know the best thing to do .... I hope Tiara Ty drops in soon on this one, but I say GO FOR IT but GO SLOW!!! I think it's good to have a little flirt and it will do your self confidence no harm at all. Us girls can be a lot more understanding when guy says "let's be friends" than guys can (BIG generalisation I know, but hey I am thousands of miles away in the grey UK and so generalisations will have to suffice).
I think it may also help "you" to get the bit about life moving on, with or withou W. I believe there are 2 "yous" in us - the one who knows the right way and the feeling child who just wants something. Reconciling the two is a fine and difficult art.
PS I know part of you will be hoping that by going on a date with this lady your W may just buck up and notice you more. She might, she might not. Do not date this lady if you're just hoping to make your W jealous. No expectations, remember?
I know Speed. I just see it on here time and time again. People who find someone else and then give up on their M. I just don't personaly think that is right. That is what most of our WAS do. They find something easier and fun and they chose that instead of what actualy may be the right choice.
Thanks Jen...just makes me nervous I guess. It has been so long.
You know..I've thought about telling the W. But I don't think I will. I asked her point blank if she was seeing or wanted to see OM when we first seperated. She said that she wasn't but that she wanted to but didn't think it was fair...well guess what? She already was. So I really don't see any reason to bing it up. If she asks, I will tell..I will not lie...but I also think that if I were to tell her...then she would just take it as some ploy to get her back anyway. It's not. This is about me. I have suffered for so long. I have gone without. I just want some company.
This girl is sweet, nice, smart pretty and I just have a lot of respect for her and how she has lived her life. She has never treatd me wrong and we have known each other since HS.
Thanks sweetie! You rock. Go get tiddled and have some fun. That sounds SO much more fun than it really is.
S2H,
I think as long as you are both on the same page regarding the marriage being done, and you want to date and are ready for it, then it's okay.
The part that I'd think about is you said something to the effect of it meant breaking your vows. If you feel that you'd be breaking your vows, then I guess, I'd say think about it some more. To me, my vows are done and the marriage is done. I'm not ready yet (but maybe will be soon) but I don't think I'd date if I felt it would be breaking the vows. The paperwork of a divorce is going to take some time, but H has decided that is what he wants, and so really, to me, we're already divorced, it's just the formality of it that needs completion.
Dana
Not sure what tiddled means? I know what I think it means however I don't believe it was meant that way?
I am with HS, I like to tiddle.
Tiddling is fun. And it makes your finger smell nice.
I see you and I have the same definition of tiddling.
Hey Eddy. I'm glad you posted about this gal inviting you on a lunch or coffee date. It seems as though you're giving this careful thought and I'm sure you'll do what is right for you. We are so deserving of good company but also so vulnerable right now. To make decisions that will serve us well into the future takes real effort. Keep your goals in mind when making these decisions and set boundaries for yourself beforehand.... my $.02
Hi swashy. Long time no post. As you know, I've been a little.... preoccupied. Quoting you in bold, cobbling from bits of three of your posts:
Just been unsure what I was going to do and didn't feel like taking heat from people.
F--- what other people think. Do what you think is right. And try not to hurt anyone, either yourself or her.
She's Dd and is always telling me to keep an eye for a nice guy for her.
Hey, what about..... Ah, nevermind.
"Lets get together for a lunch date or a coffee date". I have always in the past run the other way when presented with such offers. BUT...Told her that may not work with the new job but that maybe we could get together for drinks one night. "I'd love that" was her response.
Bingo. We have bingo.
So I'll pick another night.....but I feel like if she has made her choice and is continuing to push for this...then I do need to move on.
Yep. What I keep hearing is that the best way to release old memories is to start making new ones. And while it doesn't do to just dive right into a new relationship to numb/escape the pain... If one continues not to lose sight of the things that landed us here in the first place, and use reserve, good judgment and a certain.... wariness about falling into old habits... Why not?
Look at this another way. What's the worst that could happen here?
Will this go anywhere - who knows.
Does anyone? Ever?
Not sure I'm really ready for it to go somewhere...
So, all the more reason to enter the water gently, with all the caution and wariness of a cat in a rocking chair factory.
Plus, awareness of this very fact is a good thing.
...but I do feel like I am ready to at least go out and enjoy a woman's company.
And why the heck not? Women are kinda fun, no?
I have hoped and hoped that someday she would realize that I was not the problem. That the solution to her happiness is within her. That she would open her heart, trust, love, believe and try. I know that I meant it when I stood on that alter and vowed for better or for worse in front of my family, friends, God and most importantly...HER.
You know full well about this one... She has to want to and believe she can. Will she ever? Hmmmmmm. Probably not until the tables are turned on her.
It makes me nervous that I may actually like it I guess. I'm scared to be happy with someone else because, to me, it means breaking those vowes.
Two things about this:
OK. If there's the guilt issue, then decide on your internal set point for when your M is truly over. For me, the courthouse and hearing the judge say the words "divorce granted" was the key to take off my ring... What's yours? Then set the boundaries for I'm not going to do X before that. AND, if X still happens, then don't feel guilty about it.... Boundaries, bubba.
. They find something easier and fun and they chose that instead of what actualy may be the right choice.
And of course the right choices are:
continuing to solve the problems that got you here.
sticking to behaviors that you're comfortable with.
Are you escaping here? Or just enjoying the moment. I think you know full well what the answer is.
I've thought about telling the W. But I don't think I will.
None of her business anymore.
If she asks, I will tell..I will not lie...
Good. Stick to your values, but you're under no obligation to volunteer anything.
This is about me. I have suffered for so long. I have gone without. I just want some company.
Who doesn't?
This girl is sweet, nice, smart pretty and I just have a lot of respect for her and how she has lived her life.
Just remember, there's a lot to be said about the "view from a distance" or the "oh jeepers, she's so beautiful and so perfect and so smart, and.... phase". Fine line here; watch out for signs, but not to the extent that it prevents you from having fun.... Gee, wonder who we know that might do that?
She'll have her own issues; watch out for them. She probably leaves the cap off the toothpaste, leaves her thigh-highs hanging over the shower curtain rod so you practically strangle yourself..... Comprende?
Take care bubba, and thank the divine creator you're not hairy, grey-bearded, and with a big belly. You'll be swatting them off with a 2x4....
Thank you everyone. Obviously this is not an easy step for me to take and I appreciate all of you checking in on me.
Dana - I still get the tinglies when you call me S2H.
I certainly don't see having drinks with an old friend as breaking my vowes. I guess I need to just keep an eye on my own moral compass to keep it from going somewhere that it may. Because I guess I don't beleive they are over at this point.
And a wonderful 2cents at that F21..as always. Thank you!
Doug, "Hey, what about..... Ah, nevermind." give it up dude..aint gonna happen...plus I think you are all set anyway.
You asked what the worst was that could happen...I guess I could be happy...right? Doesn't sound so bad to me. And don't worry, I certainly do not see myself falling fast and hard. Just looking to go out and have some fun with someone. I will not move faster than I am ready to. And I'm a snail when it comes to this stuff. There is another peice the steady eddy thing...slow and steady. All is good. I feel good.
Actually emailed her back...we may do something this weekend. I will of course keep you all posted.
Slow and steady is the name of the game.
swashy,
just following along in your thread since we seem to be contemplating the same issues right now. Let us know how it goes.
Thanks guys! I'll be sure to keep you all posted.
Stayed at my buddy's house last night, which was good. Right now, when I'm not at the house, I'm staying with friends. I feel like a burden sometimes (although they certainly don't make me feel that way) and so I'm excited to get my own place. However, I also will need to make sure that I fill the nights where I am kidless...with stuff. I'll still need to make plans and do things.
Anywhooo...talked to Rob for a while last night - thanks Rob! I guess I was looking for confirmation from him that I was doing the right thing...for me. He seemed to agree that I was. I trust Rob's input a lot and so that really meant a lot to me.
My buddy and I got up and were on our bikes at 5:30 this morning. OUCH! A few of his neighbors do this ride every week. What the hey. However....I felt like A$$ on the ride. Horrible. Couldn't figure it out. Well....I took my Trazodone at 11pm last night, up at 5am, downed two cups of coffee, jumped on my bike and then these clowns decided to go from 0-100 in the first 2 miles. Ugh. I had to bail and sneak back. I really think I still had the Trazodone pumping through me. Really lightheaded, got dizzy...not good. I'll remember to give myself 8 hours before riding in the future.
Had a long talk with my buddy's W this morning. She's a smart girl and really seems to understand all of this stuff. Just a good conversation.
And here I am...back at work. I have to take my D to her dress rehersal tonight for dance. Then tomorrow morning the kids have their PMC ride....woo hoo. Should be fun. But tonight will be a busy night for me.
Hey Eddy. Happy Friday!
Glad you're getting your own place, that's exciting and should be really good for you. Nice that Rob was able to make you feel good about what you're doing. He's so good at this stuff. Sorry you had a disappointing morning on the ride. It happens. At least you're out there getting on your bike! And sounds like you have a good idea as to what caused your lightheadedness. I always hated when a group wouldn't warm up at the beginning of a ride, or always had to race. What is up with that anyway? The could get faster if they learned how to ride slow some of the time. Well, you got a good convo in with a friend... everything works out.
Riding with rookies F21...riding with rookies.
Thanks for checking in....I feel pretty good right now. Doing my best to turn these lemons into the best damn lemonaide I can. Thanks Kev!
Ya know...I just realized something. Back in the fall, I used to wait up for her to come home from school at night. I couldn't wait to hear about her night, etc. Well she is about to swing by my office to switch cars with me. And you know what....I'm really NOT looking forward to seeing her. How sad.
Well she came and went. It was fine. I got happy W today. I'm sure it will be something different tomorrow. And SHE called ME manic once. HA!
Swashy
Do you think you could go back into sexual issues forum and
change the title to your response of prefers to masturbate?
Everytime I scroll down the screen, it says Swashy prefers to
maturbate...LOL...you're blowing your image...
Thanks girl. Apparently Ty and all have been having their fun. Hope the new title works better for everyone.
Hi scott. hope, you are good.
Very good sweetie. Thanks for asking. Tired..but good. You?
tired and hot. (its like 103 here today).
Oooh. that kind of hot. gotcha.
get your mind out of the gutter
just thought it was a "princess" thing to say.
HA! Sorry...I forgot my royal lady. ok..back to the gutter.
at least i have not kicked ya to the curb
HA!
So I took S7 & D6 to the PMC bike ride this morning. I had signed them up for the 3.3 mile ride. It is a 3.3 mile course and you can choose to do 1, 2 or 3 laps. Well they were really excited to do it. We finished the 3.3 miles and they said they wanted to do it again....uhhhh, are you sure? YUP! Ok, off we go. They did great. Stopped on the 2nd lap for some water, but just for a second. They were the last group to start but they were passing bigger kids the whole time. We finished the 2nd lap....Lets do it again! NO WAY! You sure? YUP! So we did it. D6 had to walk up a couple of the hills on the last lap but she was DETERMINED! They did AWESOME! I was so proud of them. We had a really good time. YAY!
Just got an email from my "friend". Sounds like we're going to get together tonight. Litte nervous...little excited. Should be fun. Wish me luck.
Hey Eddy. Sounds like you and your kids had a great time this morning... made a wonderful memory. Have fun tonight!
Thanks guys! F21, you should have seen them....truly awesome to see your kids doing a sport you love so much...and doing it well. Truly proud of them.
Ok Speed - No Farm Animals - got it! ....wait...maybe they are ok...shoot...I'm confused now...ok...exactly what IS off limits for you guys?
Thanks guys! F21, you should have seen them....truly awesome to see your kids doing a sport you love so much...and doing it well. Truly proud of them.
I can only imagine. That is awesome!
Yay Scotty---
About tonight. IT is about YOU. Nothing more, nothing less. I hope that I catch you in time, but I doubt it.
Enjoy yourself!
SOOOO....I had a great time last night. A friend of her's just bought a new condo - so she, my buddy and I all went up to visit her. I remember her friend from HS. She is also very attractive and happens to be recently D'd. So both ladies looked great. We all had a great time, went to a bar, danced a bit and hung out. It was just a very fun, somewhat flirtatous night. Her friend at one point said "It has been a very stressful couple of years for me and I can't remember the last time I had a good belly laugh and I have had several tonight, so thank you guys". I thought that was a very cool compliment.
Very nice to have a fun evening with someone who was taking a genuine interest in ME. I just felt very relaxed, I felt funny, I felt attractive. It has been a long time since someone has made me feel that way. I know it is comparing apples to oranges, so I'm not going to do that. I would love nothing more than to work on my M - but unfortunately I do not have that option. But the alternative that has been handed to me just doesn't seem nearly as scary as it did before.
Glad you had a great night!!!
Woo Yay Scott - sounds like a great, light and fun evening, just what the doctor ordered
I like what you say that yes you would like your M to work but you can't force it, you've come a looooooooong way since your early posts, Scott - well done.
HS - More? Maybe. Different? YOU BET! Again, apples and oranges and I know that. I've had apples for 11 years straight...and I just bit into an orange. Kinda liked it....but I know that someday oranges may not taste so great either.
No kidding ay Jen? I am such a better person now. So much more self aware. I've grown a lot over the past 10 months...and last night my confidence jumped a ton too. Have to say it felt GOOD to have two attractive ladies genuinly interested in me...making them laugh and smile. I needed that. Ton of good looking, younger guys crawling around that place last night and they had an "ick, whatever - so back to you" attitude.
Got a text from her this morning wishing me a happy father's day too....
Guess I should also mention that I met the kids and W for brunch this morning. It was very nice, everyone was in a good mood....nice. Then of course she tells me that she really needs to study and then she has to work at 2pm...so at 11am...on father's day...I've got the kids for the rest of the day. Don't get me wrong, I love spending time with the kids. But I spend a lot of time with my kids and I kind of look at father's day as a day to do whatever I want to do. Was hoping to get out on my bike..but oh well. I told her to go ahead, she did feel bad...her school is important. But in the same breath she was telling me that she has been trying to study but she hasn't gotten anything done because she's just not into it...been procrastinating. So I guess I kind of feel like I'm not getting to really enjoy my father's day because she's been too busy "looking up recipes instead of studying".
oh well...par for the course. there is something else I'd like to do..play golf like Ian is! ugh.
...but last night was fun.
Thanks buddy. I know it was my choice...just kind of wish it was a choice that I didn't have to make. I'm ok..no biggie.
The little guy doesn't like to ride so much and there is a big difference between going for a ride and going for a ride with the kids. I'm sure you can understand that. I'll do something fun with them and I'll make it a good day anyway.
Thanks Speed. Hope that didn't come off the wrong way. Appreciate the thought.
Nice, Eddy!
Sounds like a good time was had by all.
and...
Happy Father's Day, Scotty too Hottie!I think you are too nice and teach your W to take advantage of that. I'm sure you'll make the most of your day and enjoy it, but you deserved to do what you felt most like doing today... but that was up to you to make happen, wasn't it. Glad you got a confidence boost last night. Sounds like the gals enjoyed themselves too. Have a great day. Cheers and hugs to you for being a great dad.
I think you are too nice and teach your W to take advantage of that.
I think you are 100% right. I'm trying to stop but it goes against my nature and it's a hard habit to break. I'm always trying to do for her...always have. I think I've done it so much that she doesn't even recognizes what I do anymore and she certainly doesn't seem to appreciate it. Well if she is not going to be my W then I do need to stop doing for her. Or at least when it means that I am losing out somehow. We'll see if she starts to recognize it after I stop I guess.
Working on it F21...working on it.
swashy,
just checkin in how things went...sounds great. Kinda makes you feel normal again doesn't it? I'm surprised your WAW couldn't smell the other ladies scent on you at brunch...
She wouldn't get close enough to me.
I think you are too nice and teach your W to take advantage of that.
I think you are 100% right. I'm trying to stop but it goes against my nature and it's a hard habit to break. I'm always trying to do for her...always have. I think I've done it so much that she doesn't even recognizes what I do anymore and she certainly doesn't seem to appreciate it.
Working on it F21...working on it.
Swashy,
You sound a lot like me. I am sort of in the same dilema. I always try to do things for people but you know sometimes it is nice to be appreciated for it. I have always done what I could for my for my wife or suprised her with little things. The appreciation for those things definitly decreased with time though. I still do things but I wonder if I should continue. If you read my other posts, I mentioned that she said that she really doesn't like me getting her things or doing stuff for her because it makes her feel guilty. It is just my nature. If I go buy a cup of coffee here at work I will usually get someone else a cup too. That kind of thing! Oh well...your not alone.
no need to be close...they can smell another woman a mile away...
hurting - I replied on your thread.
Nice Cincy...in that case...she probably did. Whatever - I know I had fun!
I sent her an email this morning letting her know how much fun I had, etc. She sent one back.... I think I need to tread lightly here. This has the potential to move much more quickly then I am ready for.
I sent her an email this morning letting her know how much fun I had, etc. She sent one back.... I think I need to tread lightly here. This has the potential to move much more quickly then I am ready for.
Hmmmm......
So, I have a question. Yes, once again I am here to bust your _____!! Ok, not really.
I was under the impression that you had already told her how much fun you had. Now let's be honest here. The email was sent to let her know you hold an interest in her? That you could see something come of this and wouldn't mind it? She responded back and that just opens the door of communication a little bit more?
We know she is not your 1st choice, but she is an available attractive woman whom you could see yourself getting close with. Or, is she an opportunity to make your W jealous in hopes that you get her back?
I'm NOT saying that any of this is wrong. I just want you to take a look at you! Feel this one out. Focus on Scott. Not on W or her.......
You got it...tread lightly. I am going to dinner with a woman this Saturday and I keep telling myself it's not a romance or nothing thing. It's a meet new people and make new friends thing.
I had fun! I had a lot of fun. It was relaxed and comfortable. We seemed to fall right back into our old groove. We clicked right away. So yes, I wanted to contact her and let her know, again, how much fun I had and to let her know that I would like to hang out again.
That said...right now...I don't think I'm ready for it to go any further than hanging out and having fun. However...by her emails and the conversations we had on Sat night...she certainly seems...interested. However, she is starting to ask about the W....in an assuming all is AOK kind of way...when I think she probably knows full well that it is not.
SO...I have to let her know that not all is ok. Only fair to her. And I have to let her know what I am looking for right now - a friend to go have some fun with.
If my W continues on this path or if I make the decision that I'm done...then we'll see where life takes us I guess.
Hi Scott,
I'm REALLY glad you had a great time the other night.
I think it would be very easy to get caught up in the excitement of having beautiful women taking an interest in you, and decide it was time to chuck the old M right out the window. And if you did, I can't say anyone would blame you. I wouldn't! You've stood for your marriage for a very long time - much more than the vast majority of people would or could.
But on the other hand, I'll just caution you to not make any hasty, emotion-driven decisions. If you decide to move on, don't do it because something really tasty is being dangled in front of you. Do it because you really are done and ready for that step.
Whatever happens, wishing you the very best!
HS - that makes a LOT of sense...and I'm trying to get myself there. Thank you!
Rob - not a chance buddy. I'm fully aware that I'm comparing apples and oranges. I totally understand that. Right now, I guess my take is that saving my M really is no longer an option. SHE has made that decision for me. This is about me accepting that and moving forward with my life. A life that isn't nearly as scary as I thought it was prior to Saturday.
Obviously, I'm still a married man and I have an obligation...if to nobody but my kids...to work on my M if that opportunity presents itself. Not sure if it would ever work between us...but I would at least have to try.
So...I talked to my "friend" last night and filled her in with what was going on with me. It went really well. We talked for almost 2 hours. Having gone through this herself....she was able to give me some good insight, etc. Just a really good conversation.
Here's the thing that struck me. Something I forgot about her. She tends to come across as a bit of a ditz...however, she is very intelligent. Well...the ditz thing is kind of a card she plays for some reason. Not sure why. Well I forgot that she can drop that and actually have a really meaningful, intelligent conversation when she wants to. Well she did that last night.
Haven't REALLY known her for 20 years...so I forgot this part of her and it just kind of surprised me I guess. All the more reason to take this super slow.
Talked to the W briefly this morning about logistics, etc. No biggie. She reminded me that our D's dance recital is this Thursday...that was the night she was trying to schedule a meeting with the mediator...never heard back on that but I guess that won't work.
Something I forgot about her. She tends to come across as a bit of a ditz...however, she is very intelligent.
.... because things are ALWAYS not as they appear to be...
My D6's dance recital is this weekend too. I am so looking forward to it. I am sure your D will look beautiful and it will pull at your heart strings as you watch your little girl grow up a bit more. enjoy.
Hey Speed...would you mind giving me more? Seriously, I'd love to know what you would have done differently.
Hey Eddy. I'm glad you had a good convo with your friend. Sounds like she is looking even more attractive to you? Is that why you say....
All the more reason to take this super slow.
??
I think you should use all the reasons you can to remind you to take this super slow. I think it's great that you are opening yourself to friendships with the opposite sex. I think it can be very healthy. Just be careful and know your plan, so that you know your boundaries and you can reach your goals.
Thanks F21. Yeah...she is. And I'm kind of wrestling with this a bit. I think there is no mistaking that I'm attracted to her and I have little doubt that she is attracted to me. She sent me an email yesterday (before our talk and a big part of why I had the talk) saying that she was envios of my W and that my W was very lucky. And there have been a lot of those types of comments. So...I felt it necessary to let her know what was going on...although she probably had already guessed that something was up.
I made it very clear that if my W wanted to work on the M, that depending on where I was, that I would probably at least try and work things out with her. I still feel obligated to "try" I guess. So as long as she understands that going into this...and as long as I don't move any faster than I am comfortable with...I think we'll be ok.
But you are also talking to a guy who was just...uhhh..."re-born"...so that temptation to move more quickly is...well..there. Gotta think with the big head is all.
Ok Swashy, here we go. It is extremely important that you recognize what this is. You layed this out there as a friend that you were hanging out with and I believe that's what you had in mind....sort of. I believe that you may have needed to see if you could be around a female with "interests" in you and be comfortable with it.
Now you need to figure that out. I think it's great you called her and filled her in on your sitch. She needs to know 100% of where you are at because after the fiasco that you both have been through itr is imperative that honesty and being up front be a huge part for the two of you even if it does end up just being a friendship.
So what did you feel Scott, that's what I imagine all these folks want to know. Was there any spark? Any romance? Any warm and fuzzy feelings in your loins? I am not asking this way just to get a laugh, I want to hear all of it, just as all these folks do. I understand she's just a friend, but reality is that when you have been without the attention of a woman because your wife is so damned closed off for as long as she has been. Feelings occur my friend.
I am not saying you would pursue that or even are looking for that, but it is ok to have those feelings after so long. Hell it may even help you to figure out your wife, I mean really, can she even be that woman and give you those feelings, not today, thats for sure.
Bottom line Swashy, you deserve to have love, you deserve to be desired, and you deserve a female friend. Your wife is none of those right now, she's just the mother of your children and nothing more. Her choice, not yours, but it is reality. She's shut herself off to you and you don't deserve it.
Just my thoughts buddy.... I have a semi just thinking about what a great time you had........
Ian
Hi swashy,
You post on my thread so often and I am not very good at being recipical. When I read your current posts I am at the same time envious and yet glad I am not in it. For me right now I know that I could not deal with it, well at least correctly. My first impulse would be full steam ahead.
I am by no way trying to tell you what to do here, all I am suggesting is to be careful bud. None of us need to make things more confusing than they all ready are. Take care
Thanks NDDT. Yup...it's a pretty slippery slope that I have stepped out onto. And I'm barely on it really. But I guess I kind of felt like it was a slope I need to step out onto to some degree. My W has made it clear that she wants a D. She no longer wants me as her H. I then need to make decisions based on that information. Do I need to date someone..No However, if I want to date someone...I don't think not doing it because I want to hold on to my M is a solid reason anymore. I feel like that is just living in denial.
Ian...my friend...thank you for getting to the heart of it for me. Was there a spark? You bet! Romance? Not sure I'd define it that way. Warm and fuzzy in the nether region???....dude...I haven't had sex in a year and I'm dancing with two hot women...plenty of that my friend.
Can my W ever be that person? No idea man. I used to be fairly sure she could...even though she hasn't for so many years. I guess that as long as we are opposite sides of this...we really can't be comfortable with each other. And that is sad. I feel like if she wanted the M...we could be comfortable and happy with one another...or if I give up on the M...then maybe we can be that way too. Unfortunately is the latter that is happening.
She has shut herself off to me..no doubt about it. Did I deserve it? Maybe I did actually. But once everything was brought to light...I also deserved to have that wall come down and given a 2nd chance...but she refused to let that happen.
And you know what...I am tired of being alone. Our M has been going down hill for at least 7 years. We've both been lonely. She started doing what I'm doing now about 3-5 years ago. So she has had someone. I marched on alone. When it all came to light, I continued to fight and be alone. She ran away..and ran back to him. She has now made it clear she doesn't want me as her H...how much longer do I have to be alone?
I feel sorry for your W, swash. I really do - what a stupid waste of a chance for happiness with a really amazing guy.
Swashy,
I think what is important about it, in my opinion (right or wrong and riddled with my own perspective based on my relationship) is that this is a way to help you move forward. Regardless of if you never go out with this woman on an actual date or if you go out on 1-2 dates with her or whatever, this may be one step in helping you accept and move on. I've been reading Crazy Times and Rebuilding lately and they both actually discuss that for some people, it takes getting a spark or glimpse at possibilities out there, before they can move on. Right now, your wife has told you it is over and you are trying to accept that. I think one reason my counselor told me to go out and date men right now (just to have dinners, drinks, coffees or whatever but not get into anything serious) is because I've been lacking attention from the oppositive sex (in a positive way) for a long time and it feels good to get it. Nothing wrong with that if you are happy and confident without it. It also helps you to see that there is life out there after divorce, that there are women out there who you could date, and that they might treat you pretty well (because you haven't been treated so great of recent). It comes down to, your wife told you your marriage is over, the rest is just paperwork. So if you are okay starting to date based on your own beliefs and morals, then do it, by like F21 said think about your boundaries and be proactive in that reflection. This friendship may or may not even take you to a place where your boundaries come into play but good to have them in place first. Be true to you. That is what matters.
Rob - THANK YOU! You have been with me from the start and you have no idea how much that means to me.
Thanks Dana. That sounds pretty much right on the money. As I said earlier...it made me realize that the other side may not be as scary a place as I thouht it would be. She is a good woman who is making me feel good about myself. At this point...I think that is ok.
I know what my boundaries are right now. And those may change as this progresses. I have made my sitch clear to her...so as long as I stay true to my boundaries throughout this and as long as I am honest to her....I think we'll be ok.
Her friend that we went out with Sat night just emailed me asking if the "Family" wanted to come over to her beach house this weekend. I'm sure my "friend" (not sure what else to call her) probably filled her in and this was her way of getting me to let her in. So I did. Told her that I wasn't sure what Michelle was doing but I'd be around Saturday night.
Well I'm off to race my bike tonight. This week I brought my shoes. YAY!
Regardless of if you never go out with this woman on an actual date or if you go out on 1-2 dates with her or whatever, this may be one step in helping you accept and move on.
Not for nothing Swashy, but my definition of a date would be going to dinner and dancing with a female, holding hands, dancing....... So................
Ian
well...whether it would be defined as a "date" or not I don't know but I do know I had fun. However, we never did get dinner and I was STARVING by the end of the night.
Not for nothing Swashy, but my definition of a date would be going to dinner and dancing with a female, holding hands, dancing....... So................
So, if you just skip dinner and dancing and holding hands it's not a date. Is that what you're saying, Ian?
Not for nothing Swashy, but my definition of a date would be going to dinner and dancing with a female, holding hands, dancing....... So................
So, if you just skip dinner and dancing and holding hands it's not a date. Is that what you're saying, Ian?
I suppose it depends on what you are doing in place of those things J. What did you have in mind sweetie??????
Ian
Sorry...but Rob's and Ian's posts have had me thinking this evening and I just want to vent for a minute...just a minute. HOW does someone not ask their spouse about their new job? I mean what is that? I take a new job and not once does she ask what I'm doing, how I like it...nothing. I tell her that I'm going for a promotion and she says something along the lines of "well I'm sure he wouldn't give you the opportunity if he didn't think you could do it". Nice to say. But she has never brought it up since. I mean....it is like she is putting in effort NOT to be there for me. Trying so hard to let me down. I just don't understand how someone can be so selfish and so self absorbed.
She sent me a letter once when we were dating. Her dad was going to Ireland and wanted her to go but she didn't want to. And in the letter she started explaining this and her handwriting got really messy and she started say "how could I be so selfish"....then the next paragraph it was all clean again and she said she took a break and was ok. WTF IS THAT?! I remember thinking that it was so weird. Well now I get it. At her core maybe she is just that selfish. And I was raised in a family of selflessness. My parents who have nothing would give us everything. Her parents who have everything would give us nothing. Just so friggin' telling.
You get what to give hun! You give nothing but you expect the world in return. It all revolves around YOU! ME, ME, ME! WTF!
I tried so hard for so many years to give her what she wanted. She never thought about me and my feelings. I was laid off a week before our third son was born. I was really stressed out, taking care of our other two while she was in the hospital and I was freaking out trying to find another job. Was I stressed? YOU BET! But did she come to me and say "It'll be ok, we'll make it work"..something? Anything? NO! I just find out in her C appointment how "I wasn't ther for HER!" What about ME! I always tried to be there for her and she never even tried to be there for me. Gosh...I wonder why I was so unhappy.
Ok...off my soapbox. I'm ok. Deep breaths. Guess I just needed to get that out.
Eddy.... GOOD vent!! I LIKE it!
I know what it's like living with a deeply selfish partner. Your life is going to get better.
Ian....
Me, nada. I just thought you might've been trying to suggest something with that statement. Guess I don't give you men enough credit.
Eddy.... GOOD vent!! I LIKE it!
I know what it's like living with a deeply selfish partner. Your life is going to get better.
Ian....
Me, nada. I just thought you might've been trying to suggest something with that statement. Guess I don't give you men enough credit.
Darn J, I was hoping you were hitting on me....
Swashy, great vent, I mean fricken fantastic and very Alaskaish....
Look my friend, somewhere along the way, your wife took a wrong turn and lost sight of what is important in life. She used to think of you all the time when you were dating. You have told me stories of the things she would do for you when she would come and see you, and give you what you needed. She has lost that somewhere.
My best guess, she lost herself when she had the kids. She lost who she was as she became so enthralled in the fact that her role would always just be as a mother and wife and nothing more. She lost sight of the fact that you can be a mom, a wife, and an individual. She must find her own way back to herself and unfortunately that is hard to do as your wife because that you are what reminds her that she is a wife and mother. This is not your fault, it's just reality.
Swashy, I have told you this before, unfortunately us loving them is not enough to give them all that they need sometimes. The problem for you right now is that the way that she is behaving (which in my opinion is atrocious) is not anyone who you would want to be with because as she is now she could not possibly be what you want in a partner. That is a reality that just sucks, but it is a reality that we must face.
I feel bad for your wife my friend. You have worked very hard to rediscover yourself, become a great dad, husband, and man. You have actually passed her right by because she is standing still. That's a very tough place for you to be in because while you were doing all this you thought she would rediscover herself as well. She has not my friend, instead she has woven a cacoon that she feels will protect her from all that she has done. Will she emerge a butterfly, maybe, maybe not. When she does come out of that cacoon, you might still be there for her, or you may have moved on with someone else. If so, her loss....not yours.
It's really just such a shame that she can't wake up and smell the god damn coffee. Realize that she has three prcious little one's that er being affected by her decisions and insecurities. See that her piss poor choices and selfishness are not just affecting you and her, but the kids as well. I have told you before I would love to have her ass in a room for a few hours, just the two of us... I would sure as hell enlighten her as to teh affects of her poor choices. Give her a little lecture about this bandaid fireman boy who has the morals of a big ole pile of dung. Teach her a little lesson about self esteem and realizing that most selfish people are that way because they have such an extreme lack of self esteem that they take it out on the one's that they love.
When you told me about this date Saturday night Scott, I ould hear the happiness in your voice from actually having someone give two rats asses about you. IT fealt so good to hear that tone in your voice and know that you would clearly see that it is possible to have someone who can give you what you deserve and it doesnt neccesarily have to be your wife in the end.
Anyway, sorry about this long tangent here buddy, buut your vent was inspiring to me. I love you bro, and I want nothing but the best for my friend. You deserve to be happy and be loved by someone other than me and ty
.
Ian
Darn J, I was hoping you were hitting on me....
lol. I guess I do give you men enough credit.
You deserve to be happy and be loved by someone other than me and ty .
Oh, so you don't count the rest of us? And that was such a good post until this, Ian.
Yep, Eddy... you deserve to be happy. Just take things slow and don't settle.
Darn J, I was hoping you were hitting on me....
lol. I guess I do give you men enough credit.
You deserve to be happy and be loved by someone other than me and ty .
Oh, so you don't count the rest of us? And that was such a good post until this, Ian.
Yep, Eddy... you deserve to be happy. Just take things slow and don't settle.
Come on J, you can't discredit the whole post because of that.
AND.....
I know y'all love swashy also, just not physically like ty and I do
Scott - great venting, dude!
Ian - great response! (It must be "Feel Sorry for Swash's WAW Week"!)
One thing struck me...
HOW does someone not ask their spouse about their new job? I mean what is that? I take a new job and not once does she ask what I'm doing, how I like it...nothing. I tell her that I'm going for a promotion and she says something along the lines of "well I'm sure he wouldn't give you the opportunity if he didn't think you could do it". Nice to say. But she has never brought it up since. I mean....it is like she is putting in effort NOT to be there for me. Trying so hard to let me down. I just don't understand how someone can be so selfish and so self absorbed.
My W did this kind of thing. In many cases, it wasn't "unconscious selfishness" - it was very deliberate. And (as usual) it was about HER, not about me. She was afraid that by taking any kind of interest in what was going on for me, by showing any sort of support, she would encourage me to rely on her and get some of that ol' WAW classic, "False Hope". But it wasn't about saving my feelings, it was about building a wall to protect herself. She was AFRAID to reach out to me in any way - couldn't afford to make herself vulnerable in the sitch as it stood at that time. Sad and pathetic in a way, but true... Maybe some of the same things are happening with her?
Scott I read your vent and saw a lot of my W in there. In the Air Force certain milestones are a big deal and family is expected to be there when you achieve one of these milestones.
One is promotion. The AF makes a big deal out of promotions and puts on a huge production each month for promotees. My last promotion was a big deal because I was being promoted to MSgt, that is a big deal because you are considered a Senior NCO. I had beg her to come to the ceremony.
Re-enlistment is another big deal. She didn't even attend my last re-enlistment ceremony. Really made me feel like crap.
I know office parties are not always attended by spouses however we always try to get families involved in them. Christmas parties, picnics, etc...she wouldn't even consider going.
She pretty much ignored my career for the better part of the last ten years. However on the other hand we all had to endure endless talk about her career.
I supported her in her career. I listened when she talked about her day or what happened at work. I encouraged her to go for promotions and celebrated with her when she got one.
So you see Scott I know what you are talking about. The good news is I never really needed anyone to pat me on the back. I can do a good job and feel rewarded without anyone saying good job.
Well thank you guys...wow. Rob - no, I agree 100%. It is deliberate. I know that. But that also means that she is deliberately hurting me in some ways. And it's not like it's just been since the bomb. She hasn't been there for me for YEARS.
And Ian...you are right...she used to be there for me. She used to surprise me with nights away in the city. She'd show up and tell me to pack a back we're leaving. She used cook these big meals and I'd catch her watching me eat...and she'd tell me how she just loved to watch me eat. She used to tell me how great I was, etc. I don't know however...if she has ever really been there for me emotionally....when I've been going through a tough time. Maybe she just thinks I'm a guy and I don't need that?? Not sure. It's funny, most Ws tend to try and drag that stuff out of their men....not mine.
And I understand that the reason she stopped doing this stuff was because I was being a jerk. I get that. And I understand that I was being a jerk because (or at least partly) she stopped doing this stuff. Vicious cycle.
And Ian...I'd be more than happy to stand by and wait for her to come out of her cocoon...but she doesn't want me to. Instead she is kicking me away. I want her to emerge. I want her to understand the lesson of you get what you give. I really don't think she understands that. She's always so concerned with what she is getting...from everyone in her life...and how they let her down...her mother, her sister, me. But what does she do for us? Nothing. I don't see her being there for any of us. Maybe...just maybe...she doesn't get what she wants from the people in her life because she doesn't give them anything.
It's just sad because I have worked so hard to rediscover myself, change myself, better myself and I feel like I am such a different person than I was a year ago. Such a better person. But she can't trust that. She can't forgive me for the past and focus on the possibility of a new future. And i want to be MORE for her...but I can't until she lets me in. I can't force that. Love is a two way street. Again...you get what you give. I feel like she has sat on the sidelines and just observed me....how can anything grow from that? She'd have to do her part...but she is unwilling to because of fear, guilt, shame...whatever it is. And that is just a sad way to go through life. And you are right Ian...everyonen around her...especially her children will pay the price for this shortcoming of hers.
You get so much more out of life if you approach it with love, faith and trust. If you do that...I think anything is possible. She is approaching it with anger, doubt and fear. But it takes a very secure person to be able to do that...and she is not. And that sucks...and there is nothing I can do to change that.
Sorry Fender..missed you. Yup..I guess it is just pretty typical selfish behavior which drives all of this. There is no room for selfishness in a M. If you can't think of the other person instead of yourself...you'll never get what you want. Thanks man.
Gotcha, but do not think that I am in anyway reccomending you wait until she come out of that cocoon. I am not, you already wited ten months for that.
No offense, but if she was making any, and I mean any efforts, then maybe I would say that to you. She is not and you don't deserve to live that way. Making blueberry muffins doesnt count either.
What I was more saying is it's a crying shame that she doesnt see that if she just gave you something you would wait and see. Instead she chooses to act in the manner that she is acting.
Funny thing is Scott, lets assume all this goes forward and you are divorced in 6 months. She will move on to a new relationship, or the one with assmonkey fireman boy, and it will fail. It will fail because she isnt aware that she needs time to become a good woman and discover herself. So instead she may end up being one of those women that have multiple failed marriages because they do not deal with their own issues. Very sad for her.
You on the other hand will have a wonderful relationship with the next woman who is lucky enough to land you. All that you have worked on, discovered about you, fixed in your relationship skills. Wow, thats gonna be one lucky woman......
Never mind the fact that you will have all of us watching and kicking your ass if you screw up.
Ian
No Ian...I'm not saying I will stand and wait. I'm saying I could if she wasn't kicking me away. I came to her 9 months ago and said - don't judge me yet, I'm changing. Well...although I'm not 100%...and maybe never will be because this is a lifelong journey...I think I'm good enough to be judged. But a good judge doesn't just look for the negatives. You trust the positives too. She can't seem to do that. If she came to me and asked me to wait because she needed to figure herslef out...I'd do it. I would. But she is not asking for that...she is telling me she doesn't want me here anymore. Ok.
Yes...I think you are right...she hasn't really changed, she hasn't focused on herself like she should have...and it is very possible that whatever R she gets into will follow the same path our's did...because she will judge and take and neve give. Sad...and I hope to God that doesn't happen - for her sake and my kids sake....
That said...I think she kind of knows this about herself and she may never get M'd again. She may have some guy that she just tries to keep on the back burner. Whatever. Her life to do with what she will.
She wanted a more than what we have. I mean there is a tension between us. She doesn't want this M anymore because it is not comfortable and she probably doesn't feel trusted, etc. Fine I get that. I don't want a M like this either. But that isn't just going to magically happen. She would need to step back in and TRY for that ever to happen (YOU GET WHAT YOU GIVE). But she was too worried about hurting me to ever try. Well in the end...that only hurt me more. Now I have to go through life knowing that my W never even wanted to try and save our M. And I told her when this all went down that I would resent her if she didn't at least try...and on some level I probably always will. How could I not? She said for better or worse...well apparently that was bullsh!t. Just makes me sad to know that when push came to shove...she didn't have what it took to do what was right...to face the obstacle with love, faith and trust. Which is so much harder than facing with with anger, doubt and fear....but it is the right thing to do.
She had her opportunity to step up and have some faith and try to make this work...but she didn't. And I know in my hear that if she could have done that...it would have worked. I know it. Oh well. All I can do now is move on with my life having learned a lot about myself, about realationships and about life. You are right Ian....because of all of this...whoever does end up with me will be very lucky.
I want to end up with Scott today!
OMG ROFLMAO! Thanks Rob....I think. Too funny.
I want to end up with Scott today!
+1
jeepers...didn't see that one coming speed! LOL.
I feel like I'm getting a pretty good handle on my job. Still trying to learn the technology, etc but I'm making some good points to my boss on things and he seems to notice it. Good stuff. Really hope this pans out for me. Nervous about affording the new place on my own. I can do it..but money will be tight if I don't get this position.