I am so glad that I found you all!
My husband (ex) and I have always had an intense relationship with lots of highs and lows. For quite some time now we have not been truly happy but we kind of accepted it and lived as roommates.
We are both self employed. Last summer, when the economy tanked, my business took a real hit. I still paid for our health insurance, my car and gas, but stopped bringing home a paycheck. I didn't discuss it with him because honestly we never discussed much of anything and it really didn't seem like a big deal because I make much less than he does.
When fall came, he had a large payment due with his business and accused me of taking his money. We had our regular expenses and I was using more of his income than usual to pay our bills. He flipped out and accused me of socking away money so that I could leave him. (I wasn't. Not even close.)
He became completely distant from me, only seeing all the negatives with us. I became defensive and we hit a huge wall. At this point, he started talking about divorce and talking to anyone who would listen about it. He told me that one of these people was a divorced woman he was friends with. Warning bells! I believed him that it was casual and did not even realize how attached he had become. Found out just last week (after 8 months of being divorced) that he had been calling her 4 or 5 times a day and in the middle of the night starting 2 months before we were divorced. It makes sense to me now why counseling did not work... nothing I did was enough for him and he could not see anything but the negative - especially when comparing me to his EA.
We "fast-tracked" our divorce and neither of us has been ok with it since then. For the first four months, I kept feeling hurt and rejected and defensive, believing that the next step would be the one to make everything better. But it never happened. He was pressuring me to reconsider and I was resisting.
At month 4, he finally backed away. I suddenly realized that the choice I was making was not the choice I wanted for my life. I took a hard look at myself and realized how my reactions and assumptions were making our relationship impossible. I did not feel like he even liked me, much less loved me. When I realized that he did, I saw all the things that he had been doing to show me love but that I had rejected. I knew that we could fix things.
I went to him and apologized from the heart, I think for the first time ever. He told me that he wanted to start dating his EA. I was devastated. I have since spent the last 4 months trying to convince him to give me another chance and tell him that I truly, unconditionally love him. He has responded by telling me that he has moved on, he wants me to leave him alone and that he does not ever want to go back to what we had. (I don't either - I want something better for us.)
Three days ago I looked back at the cell phone records from 10 months ago and discovered the EA. I confronted him with it and he went through several stages of denying it, then not. At that point, I felt that I could finally back off. I have felt this way several times before in the past 4 months, but every time I get angry and back away from him, he reels me back in by telling me he never wanted this and he wants his family in the worst way, but he does not trust that I can change. Then I am right back to hoping we can work it out! It is driving me insane!
After reading the "going dark" section here, I have spent the past few days leaving him alone, talking to him only about the kids. It does appear to have had some effect on him, because he has already called me, talking in friendly terms. He even asked me "how my date was". I did not go on a date, and have not ever. He told me that he could just tell by my voice that I was going on a date. Huh? But in the interest of mystery, I did not confirm nor deny, only told him that I was going to only talk about the kids as he had asked. This seemed to really confuse him.
I was feeling positive when he called again this afternoon, out of the blue (unheard of for 4 months!) just to chat. I was friendly but wondering what he wanted. He mentioned that he was almost done getting the house refinanced so that my name would be off... something that was supposed to be done last May. Then he said he would like to help me look for a new house. In my mind, I was screaming "I don't want a new house, I want to live with you and my kids in our own house!" but I kept my mouth shut and just said thank you for letting me know. He offered to let the kids and I live in his house if he by chance moved out. (He has made this offer before, but said that it would be in lieu of child support since he is paying the mortgage. I can't afford that.) I said I didn't think we would probably take him up on that so he could have the clean break he wanted.
We hung up with no stalling on my part - I'm proud of me! It took every ounce of self-control I had not to call him back and beg him to reconsider before following though with the refinance. That is why I find myself here, journalling my story. I know that I have to give him the breathing room he needs. It is so hard for me because I felt like I spent 4 months rejecting his attempts to fix us (although I see now that it likely would not have worked then because of his EA and my lack of self-insight) and now I feel like I can't tell him enough how sorry I am, how much I unconditionally love him, and how important our family is to me. I believe in my heart that we will be together and it kills me to see him not even give me the chance to show him I have changed.
Sometimes we can't see the forest through the trees. If anyone has insight or words of wisdom for me, I would appreciate it. I have forgiven him (and me) and am now just trying to remain patient.
Thanks for reading! I feel stronger already!
Hey Irish542....Good name by the way. Sounds like you have been doing a decent job except....'for the last 4 months trying to convince him' STOP this IMMEDIATELY. That is pursuing and it usually backfires especially doing it for 4 months. He asked 'how your date' was: Sounds to me like he is curious and fishing for info: Nice work on your part there. DO keep that up, but don't overdo it. He MIGHT be rethinking this whole deal, so do not corner him. Been a long day for me and did not absorb your entire post, so I'll be back and read it again when I have more brain cells to work with. hang in there, it sounds like you guys may have a shot.
Bearsfan,
Thank you SO MUCH!
Funny about my name... I'm not even Irish, but my husband (rather, ex-husband) is. I picked it up as a good password a long time ago and have used it ever since for lots of things because it's easy to remember.
I know that I have to stop convincing him. The ironic part is that if I look at my reaction when he backed off and let me think, I realized that I wanted to work it out. My brain knows that he needs this time and breathing room if he is going to come to the same conclusion. I just get overwhelmed by the feeling that he needs to hear it from me because I have not been one to say those things in the past. But I know he knows how I feel.
We have kids, so I do have to talk to him pretty much everyday anyway. He was coming to pick them up this morning - we are living with my parents right now - and I told him I was just heading out for a run after coming back from the gym. He didn't want to go in and get the kids (my mom finding out about the EA just a few days ago has him a little skittish) so I told him to stop when he saw me running and I would get in with him and go back and get them. He did, and the first comment he made was that I wasn't wearing enough clothes. Really? He asked me again about the date, I asked how he could tell by my voice that I had a date. He said I just sounded happy and I told him I WAS happy. Then dropped it.
At the same time, he was coming from spending the night at his girlfriend's house with her kids. Reality check!
He was taking the kids to go work with him for the day, they did not want to go. He said it was "his" day and they had to. He ended up making my 8 yr old son go (although he was in tears about it) and letting my 10 yr old daughter stay.
Told him I was going to take our son to do an activity at the fair tomorrow night. He said he wanted to come and help. I told him not to worry, I could handle it and had people to help me if I needed it. That ticked him off, with him saying that he was not going to have another man helping his son do that. Again, really? He has his girlfriend helping my daughter with an activity and sees no problem with it, even telling me to stay away from the activity if it is "his" time. Seems to only be a problem if the situation is reversed.
I am here writing again because I need to talk it out and am doing my best not to contact him. He gives me mixed signals constantly, especially when I back off, but in the end it seems that his choice is to work things out with his girlfriend. Why can't I get that through my head? I am getting better though.
First of all hi.
I can relate to your sitch. Briefly I had an EA, stopped when my H found out. My H then tried all sorts to get us working together which without realizing it I was resistant to. Looking back I had a major MLC/empty nest syndrome depression type of thing. Once I was out of that I was ready to start again with my H (a new relationship, not going back to how it was before). It was too late my H had already checked out. He now has OW who was my best friend, not sure whether it started before he left or after (could me mad not knowing but have learnt to let that go). I too can see the irony in the sitch. You have insight though, you know it works when you back off.
Do not try to convince him with words, it won’t work. My H told me that he could see the sense in what I was staying but didn’t want to do the work, it was too late.
You sound like you’re doing OK with the detaching/going dark. He seems interested, remain cautious though, you need to take things slowly at this stage. You have the advantage of kids which keeps you talking, always look/smell good when you meet. Also perhaps you should be developing interests outside of the marriage or GAL as they say here. You live with your parents so hopefully they are able to mind the kids a bit. Doesn’t have to be much just a couple of things that will surprise your H, hopefully spark an interest and give you both something to talk about other than kids.
You can't control him or what he does with the OW. And you shouldn't worry about what you have no control over - easier written than done I know.
Good luck, keep it up.
Thank you Bonny!
Wow, the last few days have been a rollercoaster. Thursday night he asked me to bring my daughter out to the house to him when we were done. I told him I would bring some pictures and video of the kids that they had been wanting to show him. My plan was to drop off and go.
When I got there, he complimented me on how I looked and asked if I would like a drink. I was confused, but said sure. I figured I would let him take the lead. We looked through the pictures together (a trip to Yellowstone that the kids and I took last month) then I told them to give me a kiss goodnight so I could go home and they could go to bed. He asked if I would stay and talk after they went to bed. Again, I said sure.
It gets stranger. He just talked and I let him. We talked a little about scheduling (which he said was his main issue to talk about) but it drifted off to talk about the OW. I told him that was not my business and I really didn't want to talk about it, then got up to leave. He came over and grabbed my hand, then pulled me over to sit on his lap. ?!?!?!?!?
He didn't even seem to realize what he was doing. He sat me in his lap, kept talking, touching my arms, my face, my hair, my mouth. I tried not to respond. I finally tried to lay my head on his shoulder, but he pushed me back as though I had come up on him from across the room. I started to stand up and he just adjusted me on his lap and kept talking.
That was MAJORLY confusing to me. Nothing else happened and we kept talking, mostly about his confusion and me responding about the things I have learned. I told him that this was his journey and no one could make it for him. He brought up the OW again and seemed concerned that we were going to have some kind of altercation in public somewhere
(That's not me at all!)
At that point I told him that I had no control over him or his actions and he had no control over mine. I told him that I forgave him but that I still had a ways to go to forgive her. Then I left, thanking him for the nice evening.
You're doing a good job....let him do the pursuing. Geeeez. Second time he asked you about the 'date'?? Unreal! Are all of our ex's on here nuts?? Ok, don't try to overdo it with the "I'm happy" part. Because they will catch on if you do. You're doing all of the right things...sounds like he is really waffling here. I've also read not to be available every time he tries to contact you. You may want to implement that into your strategy. As someone told me...be mysterious, and if you have to tackle yourself to keep from trying to 'convince' him, then tackle yourself. He has doubts, so don't let the fish off the hook by pressuring him.
Thank you, thank you!
Honestly, I really AM happy. Finally. Not as happy as I would be if this were all resolved, but I have made changes in myself that I am happy about. I really am serene about pretty much everything else in my life. I am very blessed and this is in God's hands and in His time frame. Not mine!
I have stopped trying to convince him because we really were not in a happy marriage. We COULD be, but I'm scared that even though he says he won't go back to the old relationship, he might not be really willing to make the changes necessary. I know that I can make a big impact all by myself, and I have before. But all those worries will work themselves out in time. I don't need to worry about them now. I just need to stay patient.
I did take my kids to the fair and he came down to help my son with his activity. Lots of mutual friends were there and I think it freaked him out to be in public with me. I do look happy and I think some of his friends assumed we were working things out - in fact one asked him (he told me) and he said no. Our kids also got emotional when it was time for me to leave and he accused me of stirring up drama. He got very angry... major setback.
I tried not to react though, and tried to stay patient. Strangely again, he called the next day and asked if I had a good time last night. I wasn't sure what to say, so I just told him that I felt that it was a little too intense for him and I apologized for putting him in that position. He seemed surprised by that. He told me that he was going to back off with the OW and try to figure things out by himself (but I have heard that before.) I told him that there are a lot of people who care about him and want to help him through this. (I really think he is in a MLC.) He just needs to let them. Then I said goodbye.
Haven't talked to him since yesterday morning. Will probably see him at least briefly when he drops the kids at home this evening. I told him that I had a few plans for this week and offered to let him have the kids during that time. Didn't tell him what they were, although they are pretty boring. Yay for mystery!
Sounds like you're on the right track - keep it up.
Your H sounds confused and it's important that you give him the space the work it out in his own mind, remember no relationship talks whatsoever. When he drops the kids off keep it brief, let his anger yesterday wash over you - that's for him to deal with not you.
Thanks Bonny!
He had the kids all weekend and I couldn't talk with them at all. I tried to assume that there was no cell service where they were and that was why. (Good for my PMA) He finally called after 9:30 Sunday night to tell me they were almost home. I was pretty mad but kept it in, just said thanks and asked to talk to the kids when he started telling me about his weekend. He said they were asleep and resumed telling me what they did. I was having a little trouble understanding him with the cell reception and did not respond much. I thought he was pausing and getting ready to get off so I said, "ok then, see you pretty soon" and he said "oh, ok, I'll let you go". Told him I didn't mean to cut him off... but I would see him later.
When he got here I went out and got the kids' bag, he brought them to the door, piggyback rides and hugs. I know this is the hardest part for him (them too). I think he may have asked if he could talk to me a minute but I didn't really hear him and he didn't say it again. Started to ask if he could have them tomorrow but I said I really wanted to be able to spend some time with them. Finally said their goodbyes and headed on his way. Trying not to wonder, but a part of me does... where did he spend the night after that?
I know that even if/when he decides that he wants to consider reconciliation, he will still have lots of things to work through. So I am staying patient. Not going to call him again until he calls me. Only reason I will call him tomorrow is if he has the kids and I want to talk to them. I will not let his confusion get me down. I have seen some positive changes and reactions in him and I will focus on those and appreciate them.
Thanks for being here!
Wow Irish! Clearly he's thinking and confused. That lap thing is amazing!
My only advice (like I know wth I am talking about-ha!) is to be very sure of what your standards are for a new relationship. (Either with him or someone else.) Actually, I think the stakes/standards should be higher with him given the OW, etc.
Keep it up, girl- you're doing great!
Yep he’s still confused; he does seem to be wavering a bit. You’re doing great; patience is the hardest thing though. I would give it a couple of meetings more and then maybe gently test the waters? Casually offer him a cup of tea next time he picks the kids up, he may say no and then you will know that it’s too soon. If it’s a yes great but you must appear that it’s no biggy either way.
Do you need to call the kids when they are with him? Or would it simply be an excuse to interact with him? If it’s the first do it if not don’t. It’s the kid’s time with him and their relationship is for them to decide and develop without you at this stage. Took me ages to get that one – I really have to bite my tongue here and don’t always succeed to practice what I preach.
Trixi’s right it would be good to give some thought to what YOU would like to see in a new R too.
Your reminders to know what I want in a R are hitting home with me.
I have made the choice to unconditionally love my husband (or ex-husband) and put my family back together. Every time I try to completely detach and move on I get pulled back to this. I know in my heart that it is the right thing for me. But it takes courage and patience to stay the course.
At times I do think to myself "What am I doing? WHY do I want to be with someone who does not want to be with me?" Should I move on and date someone else, hoping that the feelings will follow?
He has commented to a friend that maybe he should just "bite the bullet" and get back together with me. Why would I want that? Can't I see that I deserve to be with someone who loves me and WANTS to be with me?
I do need to talk to my kids everyday. They are 8 and 10. I try to be positive with their time with their dad. He was not really around before (during our M) because he was always working. It is hard for me to not be with them all the time because I imagined that we would be together alone after the D. That has not been the case. He has become a more attentive father and my kids love it.
I have slipped and spoken to him about personal things. He has asked me repeatedly about the "date" and pressed for details even though I did not confirm that there was one. He then said, "That's why I'm not with you. You can't give me a straight answer without a debate. (OW) would have just answered the question without getting into a fight." That crushed me and I told him that there was no date, I just did not want to talk about those things with him. Don't know what effect that had on him.
My kids are going to his sister's house with his mom for 5 days. I would LOVE to go do something fun, non-drama, with him. I did ask him if I could stay at the house while they are gone, since he only stays there when he has the kids and lives the rest of the time with the OW. I said I just wanted some time alone to think about things and would appreciate it. He said that would be ok if nobody else knew. He also said that he would be staying there part of the time too and that he had already told OW that. I said to just let me know what days he would not be there. I also asked if he wanted to get together while the kids were gone (SHOOT ME!!) and he said that would be ok. I told him either you want to or you don't and either is fine with me, I just don't want the drama. We will see what happens. I will not call him today ... I PROMISE!
No you don’t want to get back with him just get back with him just cos it’s the easy thing to do. You should see this as an opportunity to rebuild a new R that will be more fulfilling for both of you.
Interesting that he’s stepped up to being a father now that he has the kids on his own. Perhaps you did too much when you were together? This is a form of you pulling back and he’s stepped up do you think?
As for the ‘date’ conversation it sounds like he’s trying to stir it up a bit. I think sometimes that if the H feels that things are getting cosy again he pulls back, remember a reasonable conversation may make him feel guilty, it’s like he’s cheating on OW. His loyalties are split.
Why would he not want anyone else to know that you were staying at the house? Split loyalies again? You’ve asked to spend time with him, see if he picks up on the invitation and takes the initiative.
He had said that he was going to be at the house last night, but I didn't really expect him to be. He usually ends up at her house regardless of his "plans".
I called him (GRRR!) to see if he was really staying there or if I could. I left a voice message saying that I was headed out to pick up a few of my things but I would not bring anything to stay in case he really was staying there. I got a text back that he was staying there tonight. Thought that was odd, so I called him back to let him know that I just wanted a few things from the barn so I would be out but not stay. He said no, he had "company".
Please, is it not bad enough that he has my house, all my furniture that I have left there until he refinances and gets my name off so I can get a place of my own? He has been spending ALL his time at her house... WHY does he now need to take her there to sleep in MY bed? This is what went through my head at the time...
I flipped out a little and did tell him NOT to sleep in MY bed. He said he would talk to me later about it and hung up. I tried to call back but he wouldn't answer. (my mistake) I just sent a text asking "What is wrong with her house?"
I went ahead and went to the barn at the house and got my things. Did not go to the house, was only up there 5 minutes and left immediately.
An hour later I get a call from him asking "What are you doing to me?" He said she was just out there to help him clean. Insinuated that she was never planning to spend the night, but I don't believe that. Said they fought and she got mad and left. I don't think that is my fault, sorry. I was not really in the mood to listen, he said he would call me back, I said don't bother.
He tried to call me two more times last night and I didn't answer either call. Not going to call him today, even to see if the house is still available for me to stay in. MIGHT text him to ask later this afternoon, but ideally I will not contact him and will just ask him IF he calls me. If I don't hear from him by tomorrow I will text and ask if I can spend Thursday night there. I mean, good grief, it's still my house and all my belongings there.
Had a REALLY emotional day yesterday and not going too well today. I think I might be able to detach now. It just feels like I am sort of giving up.
Did text and ask if I could stay at the house.
He called back, I let voicemail pick it up. Said that it was fine for me to stay out there by myself and that he would probably be by at some point and we needed to talk. He said not to call him back and he would call me tomorrow. I just texted him back thank you, I just need some time alone to think.
By myself? I wonder if he meant that I would not be staying there with him (obviously!) or that he did not want ME to have company? He did ask when I first brought it up if I needed a private place to have someone over. Whatever.
It was nice to have the house to myself. I did not call him but did text him back that I was sorry that I jumped to conclusions about them sleeping in my bed, but that it was just one of those hot button issues about respect (my kids are another such issue) that I have a hard time being rational about. I apologized if I made his evening uncomfortable. I did not get a response and really did not expect one.
This morning I called early-ish so I would hopefully get his voicemail and told him how much I appreciated being able to stay at the house. It was just peaceful, had a sense of normalcy and let me get off the "crazy train" for a little while. Told him that if I was taking his space I would not stay there again, but if he didn't mind I would like to stay there the next two nights as well.
We will see what happens today.
Hi Irish,
I guess I'm a little confused.
If you two are divorced, why are you so upset that he's seeing someone? I mean, isn't that one of the points of getting divorced -- not to have marital obligations anymore?
David's wife,
I'm not upset that he is seeing someone, per se. I do not question that he stays with her at her house every night that he does not have the kids. He keeps telling me that it's "not serious" but he really likes her. He has sent me SO many mixed and confusing signals, I really don't know what to think. I am trying hard to give him the space he needs to figure it all out.
My problem was the sleeping in MY bed. They have a place (her house) to be together. She does not like coming over to "his" house because my things are still there. I have been living in a bedroom at my parents' house, with my kids in an adjoining bedroom. I did not take my things from the house because it just felt vindictive and not right for the kids when they came over. I feel like it is a respect issue - I am freely letting him use my things, including my bed, and I don't understand why he has to sleep with her in it when they have another place with no issues. Is that clearer?
They had a big fight and he told me we "might have to start thinking about" getting my things put in a storage unit. I told him to just let me know, I had been leaving them there to be kind. He understood that but she does not. Oh well, go ahead and rock the boat and throw fits, OW! Let's give him some more to think about!
Doing much better not calling him. Have texted him each morning a short thank you for letting me use the house, let him know I would probably not stay there tonight. He called me each day and we had a short chat, he initiated all the subjects and I said goodbye first. Seems hard, but I can remember a month ago when he would not even look at me and would NEVER call me. So I am making progress.
I know from his friend that he is still confused and does not know what he wants. He has told me that he and the OW talk a lot and her house is a "neutral" place. Does not make sense to me.
So the issue is not who he's seeing -- it's where they're sleeping?
What are you getting out of this relationship?
Stacy
Stacy,
Obviously I would rather that he was not seeing her. I know that we are divorced and he has every right to date whomever he chooses. It is really no different than anyone else here... I can't control his actions, even more so since we are actually divorced, and can just let him know my feelings then leave him alone to make a decision. The "where" issue is really just one of my boundaries that I do feel that I have some control over.
I know that he feels torn and confused. He has many changes to make in his life and I honestly do not want to be in a relationship (marriage) with him if he does not want to make those changes. I have committed to my family and made changes. He sees them but does not trust that they are real yet. I think he is an idiot for telling me he still has feelings for me and still continuing to see his new girlfriend, but my choices are move on or be patient. I have prayed and prayed about this and know in my heart what I want. I just need to continue to let him make his journey and see what God's will for our lives is.
It seems like he is still wanting to cake eat. You know, has the OW, but wants you to be his friend or whatever.
How old are your children??
My kids are 8 and 10.
I know that he seems to have it all right now. It frustrates me to no end that he will tell me that he doesn't know what he wants but he chooses to spend so much time with her. When we are together, he seems honest but scared and confused.
I am trying to distance myself as much as I can while still remaining open. I feel that I need to be less available to him. I have stopped pursuing him and we have gone from him avoiding me and being defensive and angry to him initiating calls and talks with me. So in a sense, that is harder because as I pull away from him he opens up more to me about his conflict, which keeps me hanging.
Distancing and remaining open is tricky that's what I'm trying to do.
Carry on not pursuing. Sounds like you're doing Ok, if it's working keep at it.
Have a good weekend
Update time.
My XH decided to travel several hours away last weekend to visit his son (my stepson) and his old friends. I saw this as a positive move, him doing something alone for himself and giving himself time to think. However, it suddenly hit me Fri evening that he probably took her with him. Seemed ridiculous but possible, and it turned out to be true. Ugh.
Anyway, for the past several months I have been praying nonstop for God's will in my life. I have asked not to be reconciled with my XH but for God to show me the path for my life clearly and give me the patience to follow His plan. I feel that it is His will that my family be together and every time I try to give up I am brought back to this.
This weekend, it suddenly occurred to me that I have not ever prayed for my XH to be shown his path. After all, he is the one who claims to be confused and lost. So I prayed like crazy for God to make his will known, to show XH his path, to give him clear signs as to what he should do.
Lo and behold, XH came back after his weekend away and called to talk with me. (I had still not called him.) I asked how his time was and he said not too good. He said, basically, that he felt awkward and unsettled the whole time and he wanted to have his family whole but was scared and still confused and did not want to go back to what we had. Wow! Do we doubt that prayer works?
Yesterday (the next day) I did not call again. He came to pick up the kids and asked if we could talk. Again, he talked and I listened as he told me how confused he was about everything in his life. On one hand he will tell me how much fun he has with her and how everything is easy, but they fight because she feels that he is not over me. On the other hand he tells me that he wants to have our family back but is worried about all the fights and tension we used to have.
I find myself tied in knots again. He said that he doesn't know why he is talking to me and he doesn't want her to know we are talking. He says he doesn't want me to think that he is coming back.
Today I called to talk to the kids and he asked to talk to me. I asked how he was doing. The kids had mentioned that they went by the OW's work. (Made me sick but I did not mention it to him.) He said he was ok and that they had just stopped by her work to fax something. I pointed out that it was his business and I had not asked. (Why does he justify it to me?) He started to say something about getting some of his own furniture and dropped it, saying he would talk to me later.
How do I avoid R talks if he is bringing it up SO MUCH? I try to stay upbeat. I try not to bring things up and just respond if he does. Do I need to actually change the subject and RESIST the R talk? I have been letting him take the lead.
If you can mostly just listen to him -- that's what I'd try. Stay calm and upbeat -- don't ask too many questions.
I'm also seeing pursuit by my ex -- although I have no idea if he is still w/OW.
It's weird, they think they love these people -- like now that he has OW, he's pursuing you.
Does that mean we turn into OW if we get involved?
I haven't been responding to my X - ignoring so far. He lied so much and for so long, and I just have not one speck of trust or regard for him.
Just weird.
Stacy
That's so funny Stacy, about becoming the OW! I actually read something around here about how now we can be the prize, the fun unattainable mysterious girl... the OW. I know that they fight about his feelings for me. Kind of cracks me up to think about it. Let THEM have the arguments, while I sit here peaceful and happy. (Right?)
Glad that you are where you want to be.
Michelle
Let THEM have the arguments, while I sit here peaceful and happy. (Right?)
HA - good one - and SO true.
Stacy
Well, I have been doing very well with not contacting him. He, however, has called or come by and talked to me EVERY DAY.
I know he is still confused and I am trying to keep patient. I really don't think he saw OW for any length of time last week. He was strangely forthcoming with his whereabouts even though I didn't ask. He keeps telling me conflicting things. I was encouraged that he told me about several conversations he had with friends about possible reconciliation. He also went out of his way to talk with my parents. I think he is testing the waters to see how the world would feel about this. He has always been very worried about what people think of him, especially his friends.
Last night he called from out of town and I gave my phone to the kids to answer. They spoke with him then he asked to talk to me. Small talk, about his conflicted feelings.
This morning I called and left a message because my daughter wanted to talk with him last night and I thought he could wake her up on the phone. Again, he called back and I let him talk to the kids, then he asked to talk to me. After we talked for 15 minutes, he told me that he thinks we are maybe talking too much (I didn't point out that it is he who asks to talk to me every time) and maybe "if we go through with this" (?) he should get some of his own furniture and put mine in storage, which he offered to pay for.
I told him whatever he wanted to do was fine. He needs to make his own choices. I think he is finally thinking things through for himself. Every day is a new personality and I think I am getting better at rolling with the punches.
Hey Irish....Saying hi....Have some catching up to do....have to read some of your back posts....Let's see how well you have been DBing. Think we will grade you this time.
Wow , you ARE doing a good job. We are going to give you an A-. The only thing that bothers me is that you may be TOO available to him. I'm hoping that others read this and chime in on whether they agree with me or not. I have read several times that you can't be too available and you need to add mystery. On the flip side, it sounds like he is REALLY waffling and leaning toward you more than OW. That is just MY opinion and I could very well be wrong. This sounds like a very fluid situation right now so you will need to tread very carefully indeed. Let's see if others concur with me. Don't want to steer you wrong.
You're doing well keep it up. Watch the signs does he want to come over more often? Let him, show him what he's missing, but continue to be non committal.
Here's my big question: I do NOT initiate R talks. He does EVERY time. Do I need to refuse to talk with him about it?
This is seriously driving me insane. Every day is a big high or low on the roller coaster.
Last weekend he came back from a trip and was REALLY conflicted. It had been my high school reunion and he was sure that I was there giving my phone number to people. He came back and asked me to talk with him awhile and told me that he thought he was doing the right thing and needed to stay away from me. I was so confused after that but really irritated too. He was taking the kids to an awards ceremony that evening and I told him if it would make him uncomfortable I wouldn't go. Turned out I didn't go but my mom and his mom did. They sat with the kids and even though my daughter saved him a seat he chose to sit with the OW instead.
My Mom called and told me about this. I was really upset for the kids and called to talk with them, then talked to him and told him I felt that he was making a conscious choice. He said he was. I didn't talk to him after that.
The next day he calls me and asks if I am healthy. What?!? I told him that was not his business, that I have people to talk to an so does he. He kept badgering me so I hung up on him. Haven't done that for a long time. That evening he comes over, asks to talk to me, hugs me, pours out his heart to me. Tells me he's going to talk with his parents and NOT (specifically) going to the OW. Daughter tried to call him, couldn't reach him, tried parents house, they hadn't seen him. Didn't hear from him until midmorning the next day. Said he had a "meeting" to "sort things out". I said, to talk about your future with OW? He said yes. Was cold and distant again. GRRRR!!! How do I deal with this?
An old friend from high school - who was also a college boyfriend - heard about my situation and has been texting/calling to see how I am doing. He went through the same thing and does have a lot of helpful male perspective. He is single as well and I SO DO NOT want to get into an emotional connection situation. It has been innocent so far but I know how these things can get out of hand. It's almost cliche. But he texted me when my X was right there and it drove him crazy. He instantly wanted to know who it was and how often I talked to him. Was angry that I was texting instead of "being with the kids". Ha, ha, ha-ha-ha-ha.... Seriously. I am amazed by the total lack of insight there.
Yesterday we went to another awards party for the kids and I sat with him in the back - he was very uncomfortable because this was "my" activity with them. He started the R talk again and told me that if we got back together it would just be for the kids and the best he could do was TOLERATE me. Wow. Talk about giving me a great reason not to pursue him.
So, bearsfan, help me out. He is pursuing me to tell me he doesn't want to be with me, or rather that he does want to be with me but doesn't think he should, depending on the day. Should I actively pursue friendship with other men, allowing him to think it might be more? I don't really want to give him another reason to think he shouldn't be with me. But at the same time, it sometimes feels like he just wants me dangling there.
Just another journaling update.
XH has been out of town for the weekend again. Did not take OW with him this time. Still, he did not call the kids at all the whole time. I stayed strong and did not call him.
His mom called and told me he had broken his cell phone and would like me to have the kids call him. Not sure how that works, but whatever. Called him and they had to leave a message, then he called right back. Not sure how that meant he couldn't call before, but again, whatever.
Didn't talk to me except to ask if he could have the kids Monday. I said sure, trade Monday for Tues (his day). He sounded irritated and said never mind, I'll just have them Tues. I then handed the phone right over to the kids.
We will see what his attitude is like tomorrow!
I have determined that if I have truly handed all of this over to God, then everything is happening according to his schedule. If that is true, then this roller coaster is happening just as it should.
I know that it took me some time to come to many realizations about myself and discover that I wanted to make our marriage work. When my XH was wanting to reconsider, I was not ready. If we had gotten back together at that time, it would not have worked because I had not completed my journey. God needed that time to work on me and change me.
I need to remember that God needs this same time to work on him. I am seeing the turmoil that he is going through ... that roller coaster is proof positive that God is working on him. Until he is finished with his journey, and God's timing is right, anything we do on our own will not work.
I plan to come back and re-read this and remind myself of this every time I get impatient or frustrated by his flip-flopping and slow pace of self-realization!
You are going insane? Geeez! Didn't you read the DB warning label????? DBing can cause insanity.
LOL bearsfan! Well, super, I guess I really am right on track then!
The rollercoaster continues...
A great week for the most part, he spent LOTS of time with the kids (and in turn VERY LITTLE time with OW) and gave me lots of compliments. Opened up several times but I did not get sucked in TOO much. Asked me once when we were joking about something "Why weren't you like this when we were married?" I was, don't you remember?
He also commented once that he just wanted to be with someone who wanted to do the things he wanted to do. I said, well you are now so.... And he said, "I don't know."
Over all, my low expectations and being off the roller coaster have made it a good week!
Enjoy the break from da roller coaster while you can...trust me on this one. Because one day...you're going to be thrown right back on it! Just think of yourself as the main character in a Stephen King novel...you may get a break here and there, but sh*t will happen again. Actually.....There is a King novel: Riding the Bullet!! Oh, this guy gets to go on several um, unpleasant rides on the 'bullet' which IS a....ROLLERCOASTER!!! I'm not making this up either.
Yeah, back on the rollercoaster again today. After a pretty good week last week, he seemed more distant on Thursday before he left for the weekend. His weekend to have the kids, but he didn't take them. He said because he would be getting back late Monday night before their first day of school.
I suspected that OW would be going with him, but was not sure because he had told me earlier that she would not be. Well, change of plans, because she did.
I see the positives in this that he did not take the kids with him. That would have been unbearable for me.
I called him to let him know that the kids were here and after a very short, very cold conversation (I asked if she was there with him and he confirmed) we hung up.
Why? Why can he come to me with these signals, insinuating time and time again that he is "cooling off" with her, then go away for a long weekend with her? The last time he said that he was backing off with her, I told him that I had heard that a million times now. He was surprised by that.
I can't control him. I know that. He is making his own choices and I am making mine. He seems to be emerging from the MLC behavior a bit, actually THINKING about things, but I don't know. I keep asking myself how much longer I can hang on here. Or rather, how much longer I SHOULD.
Hey Irish-
Well, I don't remember where I read this, but someone posted that when we are so used to not getting anything, a crumb will seem like a feast. I keep mulling this over because I feel like if my H didn't give me crumbs here and there, I would be long gone.
Alas, my poor memory, I can't remember if I posted the following either- but with that--I was telling my counselor awhile back that sometimes I feel very strong because I am still standing, and at other times I feel very weak...because I am still standing. He said it back to me like this "You are strong when it comes to withstanding abuse, but weak when it comes to walking away." ouch. (Keep in mind, the "abuse" is just that my H is waffling.)
I have to wonder in your case if it's a good time to "go gucci". Have you been on any dates? If so, did your XH know? If so, how did he respond? Maybe I shouldn't say "dates". More like chillin' with a new guy friend.
Trixi,
I have been out with girlfriends and in groups, but not on dates. MY XH has several times "accused" me of going on dates, or being interested in someone else. He wanted to know all the details and said he was "just curious". It did seem to bother him a lot and that seemed to be when he was coming back to "check in".
I have wondered if I should pursue male friendships, but I really worry about the reaction of my XH. I know that is foolish! I have been talking more with my college boyfriend friend (who lives 10 hours away) and it is really nice to have that validation that you don't get from the XH. Lots of interesting insights, because he has been down that road too. His advice was to make a big move on MY terms (like start dating or move all my things out of the house) and put the ball squarely in his court, showing him that I am moving on to live my life. Sounds like good advice, but scary.
I asked him once why he just didn't cut it off with me and he said that he was waiting for me to do it. He does not have the strength, or whatever, to. So I worry that playing hardball will send him a message that I have let him go and he is now free from making that decision himself. Kind of like he couldn't reconcile even if he wanted to, so better to just move on because I made a choice, not him. Stupid? Maybe.
I am having a very hard day because I keep fighting with my thoughts and emotions (plus PMS, yay!). I know that he has been gone with her for 5 days, basically. But I also know that he was closer to me last week than he has been for MONTHS, maybe even a year, and he really seemed unsure of his feelings for her. He can't have all those conflicted feelings then just turn them off in one day. I know that his best friend and his friend's young son were also with him this past weekend, so it wasn't like a romantic getaway. But he still chose to take her with him. This was supposed to be his weekend to have the kids and he did not take them. Don't know if her kids went, would guess not. I know he has only called our own kids once since he's been gone. Guilt? It's the not knowing what is in his head that drives me mad!
Have you thought of backing away completely? Yes he may move on but alternatively it will force him to examine what he actually wants rather than having you and OW dangling. Scary though. Remember you don’t have to do it forever just try it as a strategy for a couple of weeks and if it doesn’t work then reestablish contact. Monitor results to see what works.
Concentrate on you and your PMA, GAL stuff and all that. And why not date? Stop obsessing. I’m great at giving out this advice but find it almost impossible to do myself.
The scary thing about backing away completely is that I did that at the beginning, for four months, and he did pursue me BUT then he got over it. That's when he decided to start dating OW. So I'm afraid that I am just showing him that it's just going to be that way again.
I just can't keep doing this, though. This morning was the 1st day of school and he called after I dropped the kids off. Wanted to talk to them, but too late. Asked how it went and I told him that our 8 yr old son was having a hard time (very emotional). He went on with that for a second, then said "Not that you care, but..." and started to tell me about his weekend. Casual, like nothing had happened. I know he is confused but NO. I freaked out in my head a little and told him I had another call coming in and I would have to call him back later. He said that was fine.
Did not call him back yet and get sick at the thought of it. I am back to not being able to eat much and feel like throwing up and crying. NOT GOOD PMA!!! I am not going to call him or talk to him until I get myself under control again. I know he is going to cycle back to me and back to her again, over and over until he gets something figured out in his head.
I wonder if school starting will have an effect on him. He seems really concerned about the kids and this will be a big reality check after the easy non-scheduled summer he had with them.
Wow.
I had spent the weekend praying HARD that if it was God's will that our family is reconciled, He would build a wall between XH and OW and draw them away from each other.
This afternoon, the OW called me. Not sure how she got my cell phone number, I guess XH gave it to her. Told me that she wanted to be sure that we were both being told the same story. I asked 3 times if he knew that she was calling me, she said yes. So she told me what he was telling her - that I was calling him constantly, stalking him, dropping by to see him or asking him to come see me - and I told her that I had stopped doing that a month ago. But that he had been talking to me every day, stopping by to see me, etc.
She asked me several more things, then asked what I had been told about her. I was very nervous about telling her because I didn't want her to go back and twist the story to XH. But then I decided she did have a right to know and he knew she was calling, so... I told her.
She told me she was going to tell him he had to make a decision. I told her that I didn't think that would work because hadn't she been asking him to do that all along? We hung up and she told me to feel free to call her if I had any questions.
XH called me upset (of course) and questioned me. Some things were over the top, not sure if she embellished or he did. I told him that it was between her and him, that I just answered her questions.
Called his friend to get feedback on what I should have done and he said "I probably shouldn't tell you this but OW called XH and told him it was over. If he tried to contact her any more she would get a restraining order." My feeling is we'll see. The roller coaster rises and falls on a daily basis around here.
BUT ... I say again, is there any doubt that prayer works? This was so totally out of the blue. It stopped me in my tracks when I realized what happened.
Any opinions on what I should do now? I plan on laying low for awhile, not getting sucked into the drama, and letting him make the next move. After what she told me though, his road back just got considerably steeper.
Scary, scary.
He called to let the kids tell me goodnight and told me he wants to talk to me after they go to bed. Should be calling back soon. Sounds upset.
Going to take all my strength to have this conversation, all God's strength too. I'm freaking out a little here.
Already said he wants my stuff out of his house by this weekend. Said he's not mad at me though, so ????
Pray for me!
Does anybody know what happened to Irish?