K. Time for a complete re-think of everything.
Old thread "It's a world of laughter"
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2860908&page=1Disney it seems has lied to me about many things, especially the random woodland creatures who help with the dusting. Which I'm about to get to here on a Saturday. So perhaps abandoning the prior theme is appropriate.
Anyone who has known me for any length of time will become aware that I am somewhat of a "nautical cove" or to paraphrase from BlackAdder "Yes! Well, he's a sort of wet fish."
In recognition of my upcoming trip to Madrid, I encourage you to join me in this rollicking old tune. Drinking rum while doing so is optional. Sadly in my house the rum has been all gone since this past Christmastide when it is mixed with chicken milk. Those who get those references have been following along far far far too long.
Farewell and adieu to you, Spanish ladies,
Farewell and adieu to you, ladies of Spain;
For we have received orders
For to sail to old England,
But we hope in a short time to see you again.
(Chorus:)
We'll rant and we'll roar, like true British sailors,
We'll range and we'll roam all on the salt seas;
Until we strike soundings
In the Channel of old England,
From Ushant to Scilly 'tis thirty-five leagues.
We hove our ship to, with the wind from sou'west, boys,
Then we hove our ship to, for to strike soundings clear;
'Twas 45 fathoms with a white sandy bottom
So we squared our main yard
And up channel did steer
So the first land we made, it is called the Deadman,
Next Rame Head off Plymouth, Start, Portland, and Wight;
We sailèd by Beachy,
By Fairly and Dungeness,
And then bore away for the South Foreland light.
Now the signal it was made for the Grand Fleet to anchor
All in the Downs that night for to meet;
Let go your shank painter, / Let go your cat stopper
See clear your shank painters,
Haul up your clewgarnets, let tack and sheets fly
Now let every man take off his full bumper,
And let ev'ry man drink off his full glass;
We'll drink and be jolly
And drown melancholy,
And here's to the health of each true-hearted lass.
And yes - I actually know most of those nautical terms. Yarrr.
Not sure if I'll have a fire tonight in my fire pit or watch the Disney Treasure Island, Muppet Treasure Island or Hornblower with Gregory Peck. Theoretically on my tablet I could do fire and movie. Hmmm. I "am" unsupervised.
I have the version with Charles Laughton and Clark Gable. I find it a bit "fluffy" but that was the way they did films back then.
I actually read William Bligh's book that he wrote after the mutiny. It's more or less his log book as he certainly wasn't an author. An interesting and complex man. He was James Cook's navigator and rose through the ranks rather than buying his commission which was more common.
Dealing with melancholia. I think I'm in the depression stage of grief with a mix of bargaining and acceptance.
I ended up not watching a movie nor having a fire. I did sit up with my book for a while and woke up this morning with a pounding headache from a hangover.
I'd had a dream that B had texted me multiple times saying that she had made a horrible mistake and wanted to come home. The reality is that I messaged "her" at dinner time with a picture of my dinner and saying that I missed her. Her response was "yummie".
When I dragged my butt out of bed I saw that the dishes hadn't been done since Friday so for my penance I made a pot of tea and cleaned the kitchen. I'd tossed the various leftovers that B had been saving yesterday so that added to the pile. She was actually fairly decent about using things up.
I didn't bother making myself a breakfast. For one thing there were no clean forks and for another I have no appetite.
I need to stop paying attention to or contacting B. It's over done and gone. Contacting her does nothing at all for me other than cause pain. It may make her feel good that "we're still friends" but my being all sad, unless she's sadistic can't be good for her either.
It is weird seeing the empty places where her stuff used to be. I went in to the laundry room this morning and paused turning the corner because I'd gotten used to over half of it being taken up with her unpacked boxes. The floor is open and clear. It's a pretty big room. My ex-wife used to also have it packed full of stuff and I suppose I'd gotten quickly used to not being able to use the full room again.
I did hear from 20 something that she may indeed be getting a house soon and moving her stuff out too. That will empty out the spare room, front porch and storage area under the back stairs. I'll need to date someone with "stuff" I suppose. At least I have a couch now. But oddly still no paper towel holder. I noticed yesterday that the old one that I had asked S24 to send to his mother is still in his room.
What would have been my 30th anniversary is tomorrow. It's been weighing on my mind a lot lately. When I was in my relationship with B it weighed a lot lighter. Now it's a cloud obscuring the sun.
I need to pay some bills this morning including sending my ex her monthly payment. I'd thought of including a snarky note but won't.
Busy day here and a busy week upcoming. I may or may not cut my grass. I didn't last weekend but at this time of the year it doesn't grow too fast. The weeds are poking up fairly high. I have ironing and of course dinner to make. I'd promised my friend at the cafe that I'll be there for lunch today which will do me no end of good. And I do think I'll go for a walk in the woods first. I have meetings at the Toronto corporate office on Wednesday so may or may not have a work from home day. It'll be the first time I've been in that office in about a year - usually there's no reason. I have some friends in the downtown area that normally I'd be trying to get together with for a beverage and visit but I don't know as I'll be up to that.
I know that this will pass. I look online at the dating sites and know that I am very not ready to jump in to the pond for some time. My friends are all being encouraging telling me that there is absolutely someone better out there for me. It's flattering but feels like pressure.
Well - sitting here staring at this screen isn't getting stuff done and if I don't do it, it doesn't get done.
Off to the woods.
Good Morning Andrew
I’ve also noticed that those random woodland creatures do very little dusting. They do help themselves to the orchard, the apples, apricots, peaches, cherries, raspberries, hmm I forgot what the last two trees are...oh wait...plums. My goodness, I was drawing a blank. Haha.
I am proud of your views and progress regarding B. A lot happened in a matter of days. I did want to pass on my feelings and support, busy, and you had lots already. I did, and do, feel for you.
My views run with the authenticity of your 6 months. B and you had something. It was really. Please do not rewrite that. Remember the good, the great, and the not so great times for what, and as, they were.
B has some baggage to sort through, that’s all. Not every store needs, or has, a villain; sometimes the two heroes just part ways.
My nautical friend you’re writing a new chapter in your story. Another enjoyable trip to Madrid, hopefully without the biting bugs. Yeah I’ve read and learned a lot from you, mostly archaic pirate terms that apparently do not belong in company memos.
A new car on the horizon. Just an interesting thing I’ll pass on. I commute far enough, that the gas I save commuting with my Prius, that money is enough to pay a car loan. If you travel enough distance the new car becomes free or earns money, relative to what one did pay before. Perhaps your new C-HR will have a similar cost benefit; I know you travel a lot.
I would also buy that temporary garage for your boat. Get it seaworthy and get sailing.
And $100 for a trade in - take it. She has 540,000 km on her, and a broken front end needing $1500 of repairs. You might get a little more privately and a lot more stress getting rid of it. A few months of insurance while it sits awaiting a sale will quickly erode the extra profit, and you have limited parking. Me and S20 maybe loss some potential money by trading in his car, but it was sure easy. Just dropped off the car and took the new one, no fuss. Not sure how much a value that holds for you, it was worth it for me.
Enjoy the day.
DnJ
Definitely STOP contacting B.
What you're experiencing,I think, is not so much the loss of B as the loss of having SOMEONE in your life. It's awfully nice to have a companion and you were ready for that. Once you've recuperated from this then you'll definitely be ready for a new woman.
I'll need to date someone with "stuff" I suppose
Haha you can put that in your profile "I have room for your stuff" lol
Yeah, contacting her is only going to make you feel worse. And I agree with KML. You are feeling the loss of someone in your life, not B herself in particular. I know your feelings were real, but you too had essentially nothing in common and barely spent time with each other. You miss knowing someone was there . When you are ready, someone compatible who chooses to spend quality time with you experiencing life will come your way. That stuff is Pretty darn important to a long lasting relationship
I’ve been told off in the past on here by Job for drinking too much, if it made me contact H.....remember?
Now it’s your turn! When one ‘has a few’ it’s so easy to end up texting, emailing etc.
Things you wouldn’t do sober. Go easy on the beer Andrew
Andrew,
I'm sorry you're feeling down and depressed. Take care of yourself and try to get some social interaction.
My suggestion for a movie with old wooden ships is "Master and Commander" with Russell Crowe.
My suggestion for a movie with old wooden ships is "Master and Commander" with Russell Crowe.
That's a fun film. If you watch carefully as they are rounding Cape Horn you can see some poor sod out on the head trying to have an - ahem - peaceful moment while the ice and storms are all around. A teaching moment if you watch it with your boys. I thought that was a fun and clever touch. Some good performances including by the HMS Rose. It was designed by Phil Bolger who was pretty upset at what they did with it. I built a sailing canoe he designed and had to learn how to use a three sided architects rule in the process. I still have the ruler around here somewhere. The boat was given away when I downsized the fleet. At one point I think I had 4 or 5 boats of different sizes that I'd built. I just have a Gavin Atkin designed Mouse Boat, my Peter Stevenson designed Weekender and much of a "One Sheet Skiff" that's been needing a bottom put on it for a while and a person much smaller than me to use it. I think I suggested that you make one with your boys at one point.
A "sailing" movie I quite like is Captain Blood which features one of the best sword fights going between Errol Flynn and Basil Rathbone. You also learn a surprising amount about gout too and the trade in Irish slaves to the Caribbean - something that most people have never heard of.
Went for a nice walk in one of the local nature areas. It would have been nicer if I'd remembered bug spray but I contributed my part to the local ecology in terms of the mosquitoes and deer flies who are probably rubbing their tums and burping now. It helped clear my head. Lunch at the cafe where my friend was sympathetic but also teasing about my reclaimed single status. It was slightly awkward because the other person working there at least used to be a very good friend with my ex. Grass is cut, had a nice soak in the tub which helped the bug bites and now time for ironing.
Haha you can put that in your profile "I have room for your stuff" lol
That is one of the funniest things ever. I may actually use it. It says a lot too which is one of the best things I like about it.
You miss knowing someone was there.
I think you are exactly correct there. Even when she wasn't here, it was so comforting to know that she would be. I suppose that's one of the things that us long-time married folks yearn for more than the other fringe benefits of having a partner. Knowing that when things get tough that someone has your back. Knowing that there is someone to talk to after a long day. That part was difficult with B because she never really understood my white collar world, the politics and the priorities. To her a job was just something you did to make money at.
I’ve been told off in the past on here by Job for drinking too much, if it made me contact H.....remember?
Now it’s your turn! When one ‘has a few’ it’s so easy to end up texting, emailing etc.
Things you wouldn’t do sober. Go easy on the beer Andrew
Thanks Westo - heard and understood.
I commute far enough, that the gas I save commuting with my Prius, that money is enough to pay a car loan. If you travel enough distance the new car becomes free or earns money, relative to what one did pay before. Perhaps your new C-HR will have a similar cost benefit; I know you travel a lot.
I would also buy that temporary garage for your boat. Get it seaworthy and get sailing.
Something to consider. I always wondered at the efficiency of a hybrid when you use so little of the benefit of charging it up at home. I always assumed that the additional weight would decrease performance over long distances. When I go to my Toronto office it's about 320km round trip. About 1/2 that to the acid plant. I do 2 days / week at each.
I don't think that the Prius would take a hitch all that well and pull my sloop. It's about 1500 lbs. It's funny when I was talking to FSL on Saturday she referred to my next car as my "forever" car - 'cuz I'm really really old I suppose but my thought is that as long as they last at least as long as the payments I'm doing good. Old Rocinante has as a 2010 has certainly done her duty and then some.
I have few doubts on being able to sell her easily. The $1500 that I would put in could easily be about $400 by someone who just wants to "make do" and only replace the one front shock to get her through a safety check. Thinking about it, I'll probably target around the end of September. My salesman at the dealership knows that I'm serious and if a deal on rates or price comes up he'll probably contact me. I did hear that the new car inventories are rather over-built - the share prices of some companies that sell in to that market have taken a beating in recent times. It wouldn't surprise me if there are deals to be had this fall.
I'm going to wait on the the shelter to go on sale. They often do. It would be nice to have it before Halloween when I take The 'Bear out and decorate her as a pirate ship. It would be handy to just slide her in and out and not worrying about the weather.
She may have made that "forever car" comment because in ten years we will likely not own cars, just call a self-driving car to take us to wherever.
FSL is on a similar level of sophistication as B. So it is unlikely that was her take on things.
On the other hand CL posted a rant about how the next generation will be very plugged in and was well aware of China's social scoring initiative.
Where I am in my rural area it is a toss up between cultural fit and just looking for a kind heart.
I am more likely to find a kind heart than someone who has memorized Monty Python.
CL does have a Tardis Christmas ornament. But she also has a lot of other issues going on.
"I got better". Lol Monty Python. You might have to date a bit older for that.
You know I have to chime in, but it really is out of love, Andrew. STOP contacting B. I said before and I'll say again, it is a lovely sentiment to want to remain friends, but to what end? What good does it really do either of you to do so? I understand it from those who share children or other responsibilities that might make regular (or even intermittent) contact a must, but you and B had a nice time and had feelings for each other, but clearly, you were not on the same page, so what good does it do to preserve a friendship? It is like picking a scab...it just keeps opening the wound.
FSL is on a similar level of sophistication as B. So it is unlikely that was her take on things.
On the other hand CL posted a rant about how the next generation will be very plugged in and was well aware of China's social scoring initiative.
Where I am in my rural area it is a toss up between cultural fit and just looking for a kind heart.
I am more likely to find a kind heart than someone who has memorized Monty Python.
CL does have a Tardis Christmas ornament. But she also has a lot of other issues going on.
PLEASE, I implore you, do NOT go down the CL road again either. Regardless of whether she got her crap together after your last bout of interest in her, she is not "the one" either. She friend-zoned you, albeit maybe out of necessity at the time, but I didn't get the sense that she was ever truly honest with you and that she maybe even played to your obvious feelings for her a bit. I could be wrong, as those are just inferences based on what you were telling us and no actual knowledge on my part, but I don't think I am. I think you were enamored of her beauty, her intelligence, her position and I think you tipped your hand because you are a demonstrative guy and I suspect that she liked the attention since she was going through D but she continued to hold you at arm's length. Women don't do that to men that they REALLY have feelings for (beyond friendship, because I do believe she truly thinks of you as a friend). How is that for a bunch of mind-reading? LOL That's exactly what it all is, but my point here is that, right now, you are hurting and you are looking for some type of comfort, be that from continuing to reach out to B and feeling validated when she responds back in some way or thinking about CL and going back down that road or whatever. I was always on team FSL, but you compared her to B in this post, as far as "level of sophistication", so that tells me that maybe she isn't right either, because clearly, with B, you were settling. You don't need to settle, Andrew. You are a great catch. There is some amazing woman out there right now just wishing, hoping, praying to find you and when the time is right, y'all will find each other. In the meantime, don't settle and don't allow yourself to be friend-zoned and just take what crumbs someone will throw you. You deserve SO much more than that.
^^^^^^^^
What Dawn says above
I am also in agreement. CL absolutely thought of you as a friend, but no more than that.
You need to find someone you are compatible with and shows you an equal level of love and respect. Go forward, not backwards !
A giver Andrew that will love and appreciate all of the kind things you do not put you in the friend zone for it.
Thanks for the loving kicks all
Today would have been my 30th anniversary. I woke up alone, fed the cats, decided to take a sick day and have a good wallow. The cats were thrilled that they got to come up on the big bed with me which pretty much only happens on days like this.
Tomorrow will be a better day. But for today, I'm going to wallow for a while.
It's ok to wallow. Really it is. Just don't unpack and live there. Tomorrow WILL be better. Wallow it out today, then move forward tomorrow.
Work is slow right now anyway so I don't feel too bad about taking a mental health day. I've answered some emails.
Went for a walk around the block and did the "country block" which was about 8 3/4km or for those who still are using old school measures is about 5 1/2 miles. I took my time, listened to the birds, stopped and looked at the wildflowers, avoided the road-kill and it took me a bit under 2 hours.
I think that the last time I did that particular walk was last year and I was freaked out when I encountered my ex-wife on that back road. I mused when I was out there that if I had just gone straight I would have ended up at the store she works at / lives above but that would be all sorts of bad news. Given how things are in my world right now, I almost expected to see her there today.
S24 was curious about why I was home but completely understood when I mentioned that today would have been 30 years. Which is only part of what I'm processing.
I did stumble across some dishes of B's last night when tidying up, messaged her "are these your's" and she asked me to set them by the door tomorrow along with some of her baking ingredients she forgot. There was no ILU - just polite and business like. I'm going to have a sweep around the house to see if there is anything else left but I don't think so.
The inescapable conclusion is that it wasn't working for B and I. I wasn't happy. She wasn't happy. I was somewhat oblivious to how unhappy she must have been but the fact that once the weather turned nicer she never spent much time here would have made that hard to know. When we were together everything seemed fine other than the battle over the gravy that one time. I was putting out an effort and cutting her a lot of slack because I knew about her issues with her son and didn't want to steal time away from her going to her cottage as this could be the last year she has it. I was doing what I thought a partner should do. Be patient and supportive. I was though also firming up my boundaries about not wanting to move any time soon and keeping the cats. I still can't shake the feeling that as I mentioned to a friend - that she was trying to turn me in to a more acceptable version of her ex-husband. Her note that she texted me stressed both how much she realized that she needs to deal with her baggage and that while she thought she could fit in my world, she just couldn't.
I went on to my phone and deleted all the text messages from B. No sense in keeping all of those around. We are still connected on FB for now at least. It's funny in some ways seeing what she has / is posting. It does appear that she has gotten on board with the idea of having a camper trailer when the cottage inevitably sells and she was also musing with a friend about going on vacation to PEI again. It's a darned shame she's utterly broke. Not my issue to worry about any more.
I'm going to be ok. I know this. My walk helped me process a lot as does examining my entrails here. I probably don't have to process / rethink much more but I do need some time and distance. I think my trip next month will mark a turning point for me.
Anyone have any suggestions for foods to try when I'm in Madrid? Having a picture or two from there will certainly make my OLD profile stand out I would imagine from the shirtless dudes wearing sunglasses and holding fish.
I've never been to Spain but I'm pretty sure you're required to have paella, and maybe on another night tapas. And yes, get some good photos of you sightseeing, I'd definitely be more interested in a guy online who has photos like that (as opposed to the one guy who had a photo of himself, in a bathrobe, holding a live duck.) Especially because yOUR photos won't have an ex obviously cut out of them.
Hello Andrew
Ah a 5 1/2 mile walk to clear the fog. Glad to see that.
I went on to my phone and deleted all the text messages from B.
I am impressed. Well done!
Take care. Get a good sleep. Tomorrow will be better.
DnJ
Slept like crap last night - sorry DnJ
Not too surprising though. I'm still getting used to an empty bed and also the extra sleep / resting from the morning perhaps sabotaged me a bit.
Yesterday I went carefully around the house and found a surprising amount of B's stuff here and there. She had said on the weekend that she'd by by today - not sure why not Monday - to pick it up. I sent her a message this morning to let her know that it was by the side porch door and what the bag looked like.
She thanked me, asked after my welfare and in the 8 brief lines over 3 messages used 22 exclamation points. I counted. I did let her know that I had taken a mental health day and was working through things. I carefully was polite but not affectionate.
Each day, especially reducing / eliminating contact will be a better day I'm sure. I am glad that while I am upset, that things are essentially amicable. I'm trying to treat this as a learning experience.
I changed the photo on my desk at the plant this morning, replacing the one of B&I and my kids with just the kids. B was so very pleased by having taken that picture on one of our earlier dates and was thrilled I had it on my desk as she never had that happen before as her ex was blue-collar.
I do worry about her but know that I got fired from that job. I wish her well and will cherish the memories she gave me. I have some small momentoes of our time together. A small stuffed cat she got for the house sits on the piano and I ordered a new bow tie - my first new purchase in a while - that will provide a link to those memories. In part perhaps because of her reluctance to unpack anything, her imprint on the house was very light - an indication perhaps of that she didn't see staying there. The new sheets she felt we needed are packed in a blanket box as the spare room sheets and the lawn chair she wanted for me that only she ever used is in the shed where it will probably stay as I usually sit out on the benches I made.
Thinking about her I do wonder and also doubt if she will ever get the life that she had in mind. I do know that she did have to use the food bank a couple of times when she was living with S38. As essentially a SAHM for most of her marriage who worked minimum wage retail when her kids got older, her own resources are limited. She's not very social and surprisingly has a very small circle of friends most of whom she's known for 30+ years. She did talk about how men would flirt with her but even she knows that the ones that were pushy were looking for no strings attached extra-marital fun.
We don't hear about it / talk about it much here but for a significant portion of society being suddenly single at our age can be I'm sure difficult. For me, I'm coming in to my peak earning years, have modest savings and expect a reasonably comfortable retirement. It's not the situation for a great many others though.
It wouldn't surprise me to find that B when she eventually gets her inheritance and settlement that she blows through it very quickly and then ends up with nothing for retirement. Again not my issue. But the thought of that and what could have been for her / us makes me sad. She may choose to suck it up and move back in with her STBX - from what I gather financially they weren't doing all that well either especially since he took early retirement at 50 and then they blew through their savings. A consumer proposal dealt with much of their unsecured debt but I expect that the mortgage on the marital home is large and it will be many years before they could be deemed credit worthy if they ever are. His pension pro-rated to be taken 15 years early, even if it was based on a decent salary, would be modest. B did say that his pension only covered the fixed living expenses and they needed her's to buy groceries. And on top of that there's the whole moving back in with a man who deliberately and callously carried on not one but two affairs plus taking her away again from being able to see her kids and other family regularly. But it does give her the small house on the lake again with 2 dogs and no cats. Her biggest gripe about the cats beyond the shedding was the fact that owning pets tied her down and prevented her from traveling on a whim.
Moving on ....
----------
S24 - soon to be S25 was pretty patient with me yesterday. I was surprised though before dinner (I reminded him of left-over scalloped potatoes) when he said he needed to "pop in to town for a few minutes" and asked if I needed anything and that he'd be right back.
3+ hours later when I'm in bed, I hear him come in in a mad dash, race up to his room and then back out presumably to his Monday night poker game that he was late for.
I got up to have a drink of water and my blood pressure meds I'd forgotten and on the counter was a birthday card from his sister - no postage so presumably hand delivered by his mother. He gets home from poker a bit earlier than usual and for pretty much the entire night I hear him up and down the stairs, rattling around in his room etc. I think the best I did was only an hour or so of actual sleep at any one stretch.
This morning I find a very thoroughly defrosted steak in the microwave. Presumably his dinner plans were rather derailed by his mother. It does make me curious as to what's up but I'll probably never know. Since he's a known conduit for intel and also that it's no secret that I'm suddenly single again thanks to sympathetic friends tagging me in every "single person / needs cats" meme going I would presume she knows my current status even though she's blocked there are lots of mutual acquaintances that I am sure pass gossip in both directions.
I can't imagine that she got through yesterday unscathed as well - but then gain - I will indeed never know. Similarly to B, I'm to the point where I wish her well in the life she has chosen - whatever that may be.
Andrew,
You should put a bottom on that skiff of yours and go sailing. It'll take your mind off of the worries de jour.
For me, I'm coming in to my peak earning years, have modest savings and expect a reasonably comfortable retirement. It's not the situation for a great many others though.
Baby boomers have done a lousy job generally of saving for retirement. I'm fortunate in that my ex's medical group required you to commit to a certain contribution to the 401K when he was first employed and that was unchangeable; even though we signed up for the lesser of the two options it still added up to a good amount. Plus he has a defined benefit pension which I will get a portion of. I also managed to keep us out of debt and we made some sweat equity in our home ownership over the years so with all of these income sources plus my own social security I will have a secure although not extravagant retirement.( If I were to be with a man who had similar resources though I would be very comfortable.)
Not so for many of my friends however. If I ever reach the point where I don't have family living with me I rather expect to have to provide housing to one or two friends who will be poor in old age.
Computers are not my friend today! I had a big long response typed out and then accidentally hit a wrong key and eliminated it. So, apparently, besides being technologically challenged, my computer was trying to tell me to stay in my own lane.
In lieu of typing it all out again, I will just say this: I'm sorry you are hurting. I hope that you can get to a place where B is just a pleasant memory to look back on and smile. Use it as a learning experience for future reference. Take care of yourself and look toward the future. You have a trip to Spain coming up!
You’re pointing out just another way you guys were incompatible Andrew. And the way things are being worded kind of sounds like you feel like she should have stayed with you because her life would have been more comfortable financially and physically. But that’s not what you want and to her credit - it doesn’t sound like that was a motivation for her either.
I think a better fit is out there. And the one good thing about a failed relationship is that you learn what you don’t want for the next one. Adam ruins everything has a great episode on dating.
I think this takes time, and no contact or going gray really does work in the beginning. Sorry you’re hurting though.
And btw - her financial problems are NOT your responsibility. You offered her an opportunity to get to a better place - financial planning, free housing - if she's not willing to change her outlook, well, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink.
And btw - her financial problems are NOT your responsibility. You offered her an opportunity to get to a better place - financial planning, free housing - if she's not willing to change her outlook, well, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink.
But if you can teach it to play a piano then you really have something.
I think that you've hit on something important here. It's undoubtedly a "guy thing" but I know that during my marriage that a lot of my feelings of worth were around my ability to provide for my family.
Neither B nor I made any sort of significant issue of the fact that after she moved in that I just automatically did things like pay for groceries without asking for "her share". She did kick in a few bucks here and there and we did talk about what the incremental cost of her living here. But it was never an issue. I knew that especially since she was still funneling money to S38 that she just didn't have the cash.
It did cause some worries that I shared here on being taken advantage of, but it also is part of the confusion on why she left.
Old habits and attitudes are hard to break
Well - I'm annoyed.
Yesterday SIL1 discovered that she had "accidentally" reconnected with my ex on Facebook. She excitedly relayed recent posts by my ex that were full of anger and angst plus a few that of her going camping presumably with OM etc. Blah - whatev's. No real difference from the past 3 years. I asked her to please not relay any pictures of them as a couple and was told that there was nothing - again - whatev's. It's entertainment for SIL1 and really means little to me after all this time.
But then she said that she had chatted and passed on the information that I was split from B which got the response that she already knew having been told by S24.
Now that bit ticked me off. Not that it's any secret or anything and not even so much that SIL1 felt a need to broadcast my personal business to someone who I don't want involved in it, but the confirmation that S24's mother had been yet again leaning on him for intel. That did explain why when I got home from work yesterday that he stayed in his room and I only got the equivalent of grunts from him which is fairly unusual. Less so after he's spent time with his mother.
I do recognize that I told both kids a long time ago that I had nothing to hide from their mother and that S24 has been a long-term conduit of information. But really ex-w??? Get over it. At least have the decency to not put the kids in that sort of difficult situation to satisfy your curiosity. I have lots of people outside the kids who seem to be eager to pass on the little they find out about her life. I'm sure she has the same.
Grumble
I got a "thank you" message from B last night for leaving her stuff out. 2 sentences, 6 exclamation marks. I responded that if she recalled anything else missing to let me know and I'd have a look. No exclamation marks were used nor emojji. I find that I'm moving from the WTF to the being ticked off stage with her. It is pretty plain that her real reason for moving out was indeed the house. Which makes little sense to me. I can see me being attached to it, having lived here more than half my life and not wanting to move for that reason and also some very practical ones. I'm not going to apologize to anyone for that. But she was very well aware of the fact that I have this place, presumably even before her first ILU. I recall on I think date #3 her asking if I could see her living with me which struck me as odd and to which I was non-committal. I expect that she was very sick of being in her crowded apartment. She would be so exhausted that she would be falling asleep any time she sat down. I can see her perhaps having been uncomfortable here if there were a lot of reminders of my ex here or if S24 being around was an issue but as far as I could tell neither of those things were a problem. It was the size and the stairs. Yes, it's big but I do the cleaning and not all that big at 2000 sq ft not counting the basement.
It could be argued in some ways that for B that being with me was her attempting to "settle" and that she just couldn't. I was too different for her. I'll probably never know. But certainly something to keep in mind. There are perhaps all sorts of ways that people "settle".
Grumble again.
Well - enough ranting for now. I'm up early as I need to be at the Toronto corporate office for meetings at 9:00 am.
Blah
Oh Andrew. You NEED to tell SIL1 you don’t want to hear anything AT ALL. Nada. And that’s ok. Ahebcan get her ah!ts and giggles by online stalking her or whatever, but she also keep that info to herself. It does you zero good and I do believe hurts a little.
And before you get super PO’d that your ex is using your sone for a conduit of information.......your S may have very well just said that in conversation. Because B was living where your son also lived and your ex could have just said “what’s new” . And this is very very likely. No need to freak out about her trying to “pull” information from him.
B’s main reason for moving our was not your house. She could have said “I don’t think this living situation is working, but I would love to continue to date” your house is an object and we do t let those we love go because of objects. She truly has so much of her own stuff to work on and I think that is the bigger reason she left. She is choosing to make her grandson and her grandkids her life too. She’s got a lot to figure out which should have done before jumping into an R with you and moving in, especially as a married woman. You are light years ahead of her A. This had nothing to do with you or your big house, or you cats. It’s all about her
sorry Andrew. SIL1's actions would have annoyed me on two fronts: spying on exw and then communicating with her about your personal life.
Divorce means the window into each other's personal lives is not only closed, but also locked and the room darkening shades are drawn tight.
I'm glad you set a limit. Your life isn't someone else's spectator sport.
You're going through the stages of grief re: your breakup with B. That's good. That's progress towards healing, even though it feels unpleasant.
Good luck today in your meetings. xoxo
and - what G said about B's breaking up with you. Her circus. Her monkeys. Unmanageable and in need of her attention. You are certainly light years ahead because of all the hard work you've done over the past 3 years.
xoxoxo
It is pretty plain that her real reason for moving out was indeed the house.
It has NOTHING to do with the house. Seriously. As mentioned above, if it was just the house she would have moved out but kept dating. Or slept on the couch downstairs to save her knees. (Didn't you say she's in a basement apartment now, so she still has stairs, right?). That was just her lame excuse (like my ex saying I "walked too heavy". ) The fact that she couldn;t come up with anything else just means YOU were not the problem.
Nobody in their right mind would be talking about you selling your house and buying a new one after dating for only a few months. Nobody but the type of woman I talked about before who sees men as a means to what they want. If she wanted you to make financially stupid house moves just to satisfy her after so few months of dating, well, it tells you a lot about her.
Also, I still deem it suspicious that this came up after she saw her ex. Entirely possible that she slept with him, or will reconcile with him, or just realized she wants somebody to indulge her financially again like he did (even though it led to financial ruin.).
Also, I still deem it suspicious that this came up after she saw her ex. Entirely possible that she slept with him, or will reconcile with him, or just realized she wants somebody to indulge her financially again like he did (even though it led to financial ruin.).
Not to mention that you're B's third boyfriend during her very extended trek to toward divorce (or not). I predict that in a few months you're going to be thanking God or the stars or the magical leprechauns that B ended things when she did.
But, I'm very sorry it's dragging you down. I'm hoping you'll get out and socialize, or do something, anything, to take your mind off of your relationship woes.
And yeah, tell SIL that you don't want to hear anything about ex and don't want her telling ex about your life. Period.
I agree w/all of the posters. B is using any excuse for why she left. Who knows what the real reason is, but I bet, in time, the real reason will come to light and it will not be about you, your house or your adorable cats. We all agree on one thing...B knew what she was getting into. She had been to your house and she knew that there were stairs, your son was living at home and yes, those adorable cats live there too.
When you suggested she move in, that is the time that she should have spoken up about the all of the BS excuses that she has used in the last week. No, Andrew, it's not you, your house or your cats...it's something else and B doesn't have the backbone to be honest w/you.
The best thing to do is let her go and if she sinks, she sinks....she's not your problem. You can't fix her because you didn't break her. She needs to get her act together because no one is going to want to take on B and her adult son and grandkids full time. Any relationship she has is doomed if she continues down the path she's on...but. like I said...she's not your problem.
I do think at some point, you will be glad she left. Right now, it hurts because you got use to having someone around the house....let her go. Do not contact her again. If you find other things that might belong to her, pack them up and put them on a shelf. If she truly needs those left behind items, she'll contact you.
Keep the focus on you!
If you find other things that might belong to her, pack them up and put them on a shelf. If she truly needs those left behind items, she'll contact you.
Or just mail them to her - NO NOTE.
You didn't do anything wrong here so there's nothing to ruminate on - this is about HER. And I agree, you miss her mostly because it was awfully nice to have someone around and in your bed - when you come back from Spain, you'll find somebody better suited.
But then she said that she had chatted and passed on the information that I was split from B which got the response that she already knew having been told by S24.
Now that bit ticked me off. Not that it's any secret or anything and not even so much that SIL1 felt a need to broadcast my personal business to someone who I don't want involved in it, but the confirmation that S24's mother had been yet again leaning on him for intel. That did explain why when I got home from work yesterday that he stayed in his room and I only got the equivalent of grunts from him which is fairly unusual. Less so after he's spent time with his mother.
I do recognize that I told both kids a long time ago that I had nothing to hide from their mother and that S24 has been a long-term conduit of information. But really ex-w??? Get over it. At least have the decency to not put the kids in that sort of difficult situation to satisfy your curiosity. I have lots of people outside the kids who seem to be eager to pass on the little they find out about her life. I'm sure she has the same.
Grumble
Oh Andrew...dear, sweet, lovely, kind, caring man with so many amazing qualities. Why do I always feel like I'm playing devil's advocate when I read your posts when I do truly think the world of you? Ginger already touched on it, but SERIOUSLY? You've speculated all along that S24 is the "conduit" of information from your house to his mother (and that makes sense SINCE HE LIVES WITH YOU!!!!), but seriously, why are you so torqued at her? I highly doubt that she is just sitting around plotting on how to extract information at any given time from your son. I would imagine, just like G said, it was more a part of casual conversation and S24 doesn't even really think about what he's saying. And, maybe his response towards you afterward had more to do with the fact that he realized he'd said something in passing that maybe he shouldn't have and he felt awkward around you because of it. I don't know your XW so she well may be totally evil, but I somehow just don't picture her putting the "kids" in a bad spot for her own curiosity. (By the way, your "kids" are ADULTS and are completely capable of knowing when someone is trying to manipulate them for information and I would think, knowing that you are their dad and you likely raised them to be self-sufficient, intelligent people who can speak up for themselves, that if S24 felt uncomfortable or felt like he was being manipulated or "pumped" for info, that he would speak up and say, hey, not mine to tell.) And, for the record, she told SIL1 (who has a VERY big mouth, by the way) that she heard it from S24, but there was no context as how she heard it so even if he hadn't told her, she would've likely heard it somewhere else. But I say all that to say, as I say to you quite often, SO WHAT? Why does it matter what she knows and when she knows it? You live in a small town and word gets around. If you have nothing to hide from her as you say in your own words, then why do you care? Having said all that, I totally understand your frustration with SIL1 in blabbing your business. She needs to butt out post haste.
As far as B, totally in agreement with what everyone else has said. It isn't about your house or you or the cats or S24 living there (she is the LAST person who should be commenting on that when she was having to live with her S38 in order for him to have custody of his own kids). It is about B. You may never know her real reason. I suspect doodler is right in that you may very well realize at some point down the road that she actually did you a favor in walking away.
I know you are hurting and I'm so terribly sorry. I really do think you are a wonderful guy. You are kind, funny, caring, intelligent, have a wide array of interests and you are quite handsome as well and if all that wasn't enough, you cook and clean and iron. Whew.....are you into older women, because my mom would be SO in love with the fact that you iron? You ARE a catch and I hope that you come to realize that and that you find an amazing lady who also knows.
Hang in there, quit worrying about XW, tell SIL1 to kindly step away from your personal business, and just focus on you. Did I mention you have a trip to Spain coming up? I want us to focus on that.
If you find other things that might belong to her, pack them up and put them on a shelf. If she truly needs those left behind items, she'll contact you.
Or just mail them to her - NO NOTE.
EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
What a long day. Up at 4 and just now at 8:30 sitting with a PB&J for dinner and a big glass of water. I miss the ability to come home to someone who could relate to my day of debating the different ways of calculating profit on a railcar of polyethylene and then finding out that the 2/10 curve had inverted. Haven't had that since my ex left and it would usually be something that she would just roll her eyes at and ignore. B honestly had no clue about most of this sort of stuff and I never worked on enlightening her. Just focused on the superficial about my day and asking about her's.
Thanks all for rallying around. It's late and I still need to make my lunch - off to the plant tomorrow and then the marketing office on Friday. No rest for the wicked. I read your responses earlier on the subway and had a few hours to muse about them.
Sooooo - I should be applying the LRT?
1 - be a man only a fool would leave - I've been assured that's checked although personally I have my own doubts
2 - be sad but accept her choice - check
3 - act as if she's not coming back - check
4 - no pursuit - check
5 - stop communicating. Become "mysterious" - check-a-roonie
If I'm doing this right B should be on the doorstep by mid-afternoon Saturday if she's not shoved out of the way by my e-wife?
Semi-more seriously, your comments reminded me that after much pressure the reason my ex-wife came up for wanting to leave was that sometimes when I complemented her I didn't sound sincere. Perhaps right up there with "walking too heavy" - whatever that may be
Busy day expected tomorrow and again Friday. Fact finding meetings and then strategy meetings. Much less boring than my normal days lately although most people would perhaps find this sort of thing boring.
I did see a deer wander out on to the road and stand and stare at me while I came to a stop - waves to bttrfly! (hope your car stuff works out for the best)
Time to make tomorrow's lunch and - brace yourselves - leave the dishes for later. S24 has left a fair pile. He cooked his steak last night after I was in bed and has done at least 2 other meals since plus this morning's breakfast dishes of mine.
Thanks again all - big hugs to everyone.
Sooooo - I should be applying the LRT?.
That technique is for saving a relationship.
This one is not salvageable.
I'm sorry.
xoxoxo
Andrew,
You cannot compare the end of this R with your ex leaving. B hasn’t shared your life for 20 odd years, producing children and a lifetime of memories.
She has not reached the stage your ex did of ‘is this it? I’ve done the wife and mother thing. Time for my MLC and wanting a life back’.
This is a fledgling romance, that hit the skids, as countless do.
You will see, as others have said, she has done you the biggest favour.
I know you’re hurting, but please look now to your Spanish trip (thank God you booked it) and enjoy every minute.
You will be absolutely fine. You know this.
Agreed - LRT is NOT for dating!!!!! When this stuff happens in dating, it's a sign that this person is not the one for you and to move on. LRT is for long term relationships where you have kids and history and a reason to try to salvage it.
LET GO needs to be your mantra.
I think that LRT stuff may have been Andrew's post breakup dry Canadian humour coming through.
Y'all....OMG......here is how my week has been: computer issues (likely operator error), budget constraints that are leaving me frustrated and just general brain overload. I have been reading these posts since last night going "what the h3ll is LRT?" A light bulb just came on.....last resort techniques.....got it. DUH! Lord have mercy, come ON Friday!
Focus on Spain, Andrew.....focus on Spain. I can't wait to see pictures!
I think that LRT stuff may have been Andrew's post breakup dry Canadian humour coming through.
I used smiley icons and everything too!!
No B contact again today in either direction. There's nothing to say that hasn't been said and saying it again makes no difference. My ex cashed her monthly support payment late this morning. Without comment as always. It's raining lightly over the rail yard where a group of visitors are getting damp in their bright orange "I'm not safety certified" hard-hats. SIL2 sent me a link to a nice looking roll-top desk for $50 which turned in to $100 when I asked if it was solid wood. It's staying where it is.
S24 never emerged again last night - only mumbled through the door. His birthday plans are more or less finalized. His mother hasn't done anything for him on that day for a bunch of years so I don't expect plans to be very messed up. He knows that there is cake from the cafe around the corner. I need to get candles. D27 says she'll "probably" call in for the happy birthday singing. I got him an auto-club membership for his birthday which will probably be his present for the next few years as a renewal. The menu plan is uncertain but I own food. I was thinking of getting a butternut squash for Sunday dinner though. We both quite like that as either just baked or made in to soup. Even though my repertoire is somewhat limited, I like to think I'm a decent cook. I do focus on quality ingredients. I think B left a partial jar of store brand "Miracle whip" in the fridge that I will dispose of. She preferred it to actual mayonnaise. If you were to have walked in to my house in March or again now, you'd only notice that some of 20 something's stuff has been moved from the front porch to under the back stairs and that the futon has been replaced by a couch. Nothing else is different. It's as if B never was there.
I chatted a bit with SIL2 who actually knew B's S38 back in the day. She's unsurprised that he's the source of so many issues and somewhat surprised that he's alive. The story she tells me speaks to a much darker past than I think B realizes. SIL2 also thinks that the idea of me dating someone like FSL who is in her late 30s as well is a good idea. She does agree though that dating someone my own age or even a touch older might make more sense. Not that that is going to be happening right now unless that mythical woman falls from the sky offering me pizza. It's been a long since I had pizza. Possibly close to a year now that I try to think of it. I like pizza.
My travel agent says that some of my info for my trip to Madrid is in the office but I still don't have a firm itinerary and won't know my hotel for sure until 2 weeks prior. Annoying as I like to have everything organized and numbered.
I may start the kitchen renovation this weekend tearing down the false ceiling put in in the 70s. Or maybe the 60s. I won't have to cut the grass. At this time of the year around here it grows rather slowly and I did cut it last week.
Yeah - life moves on.
High five requested. Blueberries - one of B's favourite things - are in season at the local pick your own place that I'd tried to get her to a few times. Since she was never around on weekends, we never went.
I didn't let her know.
PS - weekend plans might have changed. One of the "temporary" garages I was looking at came on sale yesterday and the Canadian Tire local to where I was at had one that is now in my shed. The better one that I really wanted came on sale this morning but over-all I'm saving about $150 sticking to the one I already bought.
We now return to looking at bills of lading for TDG Class 8 products.
Thank you.
Andrew, I swear if my younger sister is ever widowed I'll have to introduce you. (Not to be morbid but her husband IS older and an occasionally dry alcoholic). She's smart and nerdy, picks her own berries for jam every year, would LOVE someone who wanted to go to things like that but also happy to hang out at home quilting, loves cats, hardworking and down to earth. And her house has three stories so she's not afraid of stairs!!!
Seriously though - there's a woman like my sister out there for you somewhere, and when you find her she'll be THRILLED.
Andrew, I swear if my younger sister is ever widowed I'll have to introduce you. (Not to be morbid but her husband IS older and an occasionally dry alcoholic). She's smart and nerdy, picks her own berries for jam every year, would LOVE someone who wanted to go to things like that but also happy to hang out at home quilting, loves cats, hardworking and down to earth. And her house has three stories so she's not afraid of stairs!!!
Seriously though - there's a woman like my sister out there for you somewhere, and when you find her she'll be THRILLED.
LOL - I believe that Dawn has already called dibs on me for her mother. I believe that one of the conditions is that I have to be able to say "y'all" with a straight face. One of the curses of my life - I'm such a "great" guy ...... for somebody else
Appreciate the sentiment and smile though.
^^^^i hear that. I’m such a great girl for someone else.
Really though, I read your post and we do relationships very similarly. We should really start respecting our own needs. We could be the perfect mate...... but it’s honestly not enough. The other person has to be stepping up to the plate tkl
Andrew, I swear if my younger sister is ever widowed I'll have to introduce you. (Not to be morbid but her husband IS older and an occasionally dry alcoholic). She's smart and nerdy, picks her own berries for jam every year, would LOVE someone who wanted to go to things like that but also happy to hang out at home quilting, loves cats, hardworking and down to earth. And her house has three stories so she's not afraid of stairs!!!
Seriously though - there's a woman like my sister out there for you somewhere, and when you find her she'll be THRILLED.
LOL - I believe that Dawn has already called dibs on me for her mother. I believe that one of the conditions is that I have to be able to say "y'all" with a straight face. One of the curses of my life - I'm such a "great" guy ...... for somebody else
Appreciate the sentiment and smile though.
I did, in fact, call dibs on behalf of my lovely mother. You’ve seen her on my Facebook, so you know what she looks like. You can ease into the y’all thing and it will become 2nd nature....just like “eh?”
Yeah but my sister is 7 years younger than me and therefore close to Andrews age
Btw Andrew have you ever read the book A Sailor of Austria? I think you would like it. Historical novel about a submarine captain of the Austrian-Hungarian empire during WWI. Hilarious and fascinating at the same time.
Btw Andrew have you ever read the book A Sailor of Austria? I think you would like it. Historical novel about a submarine captain of the Austrian-Hungarian empire during WWI. Hilarious and fascinating at the same time.
I checked and my village public library has a digital copy available for loan. Because of the 2 week limit for a book and limited reading time I'll have to time it right. Perhaps for my flight to Spain. It seems like a fun read. I'm a big Patrick O'Brian fan which probably is no surprise.
------
Minor vent. Home after a long week. Enjoying a beer (Molson Canadian) and working on the grocery list. I have far too many of those Google Home devices and if I say "Hey Google I'm Home" it starts playing old time swing and jazz. The internet knows me far too well I suppose. My musical tastes have certainly shifted in the last few years. Unsurprisingly to my readers, B was a big fan of Nickelback - and yes, I have that in my library too and enjoy it from time to time. It used to be mostly Country, Blues and what I think of as Texas Blues (ZZ-Top, Stevie Ray Vaughan)
The grocery list is much easier now that it's back to the two of us. Found 2 bottles of expired salad dressing (Pre B) and dumped them. After some reading am thinking of changing from the almonds that B preferred as a protein addition to cashews. D27 pointed out to me some time ago her concerns about the environmental impacts of almond farming especially in California. Given my high blood pressure, cholesterol and related issues, I believe that cashews are a good choice for that. And I found a huge block of cheddar cheese added to the 3 blocks already in the fridge. It seems that my ex is marking her territory and broadcasting her association with the milkman again. Le sigh. I'd told S24 that I didn't want to see that cheese in the house again but suspect that he was pressured.
S24 is I believe working at the pub tonight. I do think that something(s) is bothering him but nattering at him wouldn't be helpful. I'd noticed an official government issued delivery of THC that had arrived some days ago and when I was in his room it also seemed to have been fairly rapidly consumed. I believe that recently he's been going through - ahem - locally sourced as well a fair bit. He knows my attitude about it. I don't approve but won't tell him no. I'd hoped to discuss the menu for Sunday. Current plan is cubed butternut squash, cauliflower with cheese sauce, farmer's sausage with fried onion and then salted caramel cake (made by my friend) for desert. I have all this already except the cake which I pick up tomorrow morning.
Watching Ginger go through her own break-up shortly after mine has been enlightening and helpful - sorry Ginger. Square pegs and round holes indeed. Thinking back it's astounding how resistant B was to put a toe in to my world. Oddly for someone who professed to love to cook I think we only grocery shopped together twice and she seemed uncomfortable being with me even at the grocery store. Perhaps it's odd to me given my history where my ex was always front and centre making sure that everyone was well aware that I was her posession. I find that the itch to contact her, to worry about what she's up to is in some ways at a comparable level to my feelings about my ex-wife already.
Like with Ginger I think that there were a lot of layers of things going on with B that undoubtedly I will never understand.
There's a bunch of stuff going on at work and personally that I wish I had a partner to talk to. I don't. I'll have to navigate it without advice but I know that even my ex had detached from wanting to listen beyond a superficial "he's unhappy with his high paying job - he must be depressed" commentary I got in the last year or so of marriage.
Hey, if my breakup can help others, I’m happy to have something good come from it. Bending and conforming to make someone happy work doesn’t work. It’s doesn't bring two people together. It doesn’t change the fact they are two different people. There is a certain amount of differences that are healthy in a relationship, but both sides have to want to work and grow with those differences. For sure, one side can’t do all the work. I sure as heck tried that one too many times. And it doesn’t work.
I see you one day, strolling around town, hand in hand with a lovely woman window shopping and stopping for some pie. Happy and chosen for who you are with a woman who puts in what you do
Hello Andrew
Lots of caring advice I see. You are indeed in good hands around here.
Your LRT comments - funny! Perhaps being a fellow Canadian helped with the humour. I think you needed one more smiley face.
eh?
Glad the temporary shed came on sale. Now you just need a new car deal you just can’t let pass by. Here’s hoping.
I’ve been following along and agree with the others, no need to rehash it.
I do however, think you need to get some pizza. Really?!?!? An entire year! On purpose? My goodness!
Quick! You and I, an extra large meat lovers pizza and 6 beers. I can’t drink alcohol so you’ll need to cover for me. Be there in 5 minutes. Hahaha . But seriously, if I was closer, we be going.
Take care Andrew.
DnJ
I love Sunday mornings.
For most of my marriage that was the "only" day of the week that I was allowed to ask for sex. Sometimes she would even agree
But that's the way I thought things worked and was content with that. For the last 5 or 6 years of my marriage we would also go out to a favourite cafe for breakfast then do the groceries. "Sunday supper" wasn't a "thing" back then although I was always happy when an effort would be made.
I was thinking this morning on how nice it would have been to have B waking up next to me but then thought "oh yeah - after she moved in she was away most weekends at her cottage". So it wasn't a thing.
Sunday mornings were very painful for quite a long time after bomb-day. It was a big empty space that used to be filled with love. Now they are calm and peaceful oasis where nothing much "has" to be done and my time is my own.
I really have no idea what is going on in B's life and will admit to only modest curiosity. I expect that this weekend she's at the cottage as usual. I am somewhat surprised to not hear from her in the "we're still friends aren't we" way but whatever. I did check and she's not been on the POF site so we can all hope that she is working on herself. I also updated my profile. Having read quite a few female profiles my theory is that the best one is only a paragraph or so with just a couple of pictures and a light-hearted tone. Too long and too many photos comes across as desperate. Too little - like B had - makes it look like you're not taking it seriously. I did update the headline as kml jokingly suggested to say "I have room for your stuff" which I expect will certainly stand out. Being noticed is 80% of the battle. That is extremely funny to me, says a lot and is certainly unusual. My subscription is paid up through to the start of February - so no real rush even when I turn it back on which is planned for the end of September. I have been getting blasted with ads lately for a new dating site called Hily usually presented with a teenage looking girl being all excited and suggesting that I stop wasting my time and just hook up. No. Thank. You.
I managed to get the framing for the new shed all up yesterday. It was tedious and there were some parts where I certainly could have used an extra pair of hands but one pair is all I got. S25 (his birthday is today) got up shortly before going to work. He did assist with some advice about placement of the shed though. At 24' long and 12' wide it takes up a "lot" of space. One bit that was really annoying is that the over 100 bolts were of three different lengths but the same thread size and all packaged together. I ended up taking them in to the kitchen and carefully sorting them by size into separate bags to be sure that I used the right bolt for the right connection. Actually sorting and identifying all the parts was I think one of the longer bits of the build so far. The instructions are all pictograms as well which generally only make sense after you've already built the darned thing.
I BBQ'd a steak for dinner, cleaned the kitchen and then sat out with a small fire in my fire pit and a good book with my book light. The sort of evening that B had often talked about sharing with me. The sort of evening that I have done regularly for the past 3 1/2 years.
FSL wasn't working yesterday but her boss was - who is also single, very pretty and also closer in age to me. I do know that she has a boyfriend who doesn't live with her and that usually when he is referred to it is accompanied with an eye-roll. She seemed extra friendly yesterday. Undoubtedly sympathy for my reclaimed single status. I had a haircut in the morning and my barber both called me a pig for thinking of dating someone under 40 and also encouraged me to ask FSL out. I don't know. Certainly not doing anything for a month or so.
I did pick up my tickets for my Madrid trip including a pre-booked ticket for the Prada museum. It should be good and undoubtedly exhausting. I need to decide if I will upgrade to first class when I get my seat / boarding pass. I'm a bit bigger than the average bear and while I'm noticably smaller than I was 4 years ago, economy airplane seats are still a bit of a tight fit.
Well - thunderstorms are forecast for later today although right now the conditions are very nice. The nights have been cooling down quite a lot making perfect sleeping weather. Time for me to get S25's cake out of the fridge along with the garlic farmer's sausages I'll be cooking.
Time for my cat to find a new snoozing spot and for me to get outside and stare meaningfully at the instructions for the shed.
Happy Birthday to your son. I'm sure he will enjoy the cake.
You made quite a bit of progress on your new shed.
It won't be long and you'll be in Spain. I really hope that you can just focus on you and the trip while you are there.
Enjoy your Sunday.
Being a single parent is tough. Being a single parent to a narcissistic child is tougher. S25 (as of today) is a "lot" like his mother. He did show up for dinner. Ate about half of his favourite foods that I made for him. Made some sarcastic remarks about his cake although I'm sure he enjoyed it. It almost felt through the whole dinner that he was looking for something to complain about. I think even his sister who called in from Virginia to sing Happy Birthday to him saw that things were off today. I carefully gave him no hooks to dig in to. I've experienced this quite a few times - just venting here tonight.
I am positive that he neither knows nor appreciates the effort I put in to both Sunday suppers and his birthday. I reassure myself that I'm doing these things because they are important to me.
Days like today I really wish that I had someone I could lean on to who would tell me that they're proud of me and that I'm doing a good job in tough circumstances. I also sort of wish that S25 was his mother's problem but that isn't going to happen.
PS - the shed got completed. The 'Bear fits in quite nicely and I now need to make patching her up a priority.
I still have three shirts to iron and then off to bed for me. I'm so very very tired.
Days like today I really wish that I had someone I could lean on to who would tell me that they're proud of me and that I'm doing a good job in tough circumstances. I also sort of wish that S25 was his mother's problem but that isn't going to happen.
Andrew,
Yes, I miss having someone to lean on as well.
I just thought of the perfect job (in my humble opinion) for your son, he should join the military. Food, shelter and a paycheck. What could be better? And, he'd probably learn to appreciate what he has with you as a dad.
I’m sorry your son was unappreciative if what you had planned for his birthday.
Your son sounds depressed to me. Do you think he might be? His moods appear very labor for a 25 year old. Maybe something a 16 year old boy would be experiencing through puberty, but not a 25 year old guy. Maybe in one of his better moods you can talk to him about it??
And the military sounds like a good plan.
Good Morning Andrew
S25 does sound a bit depressed. Anger turned inward, perhaps. I would suppose, having my own kids tell me their feelings in this, that when he looks at his life it is not how he imagined it. He’s is 25, got a great Dad, a sort of Mom, living at home, GF?, steady job?, job he likes?, outlook towards future?, and so on. You know, the weight of adulthood pressing upon him. It will take some time for him to get out this funk and accept things. Our children have a path and journey to walk as well. Divorce has lots of casualties.
From what I’ve read in your post, S25 is showing good signs towards accepting and embracing his life. I will add my own very personal opinion, even though I did tell myself I should stay out of this, the use of our country’s new legal drug is another way to escape one’s problems/reality and not face them. I’m not a fan of it. Instant gratification doesn’t last, hard work does.
Hope today is good for you, and son.
DnJ
Quick question, has he changed in his manner since B left? Btw, fwiw.....I’m proud of you.
You are an amazing dad.
I am sorry that your son acted like he didn't appreciate all of the work you put into making his birthday special. I am sure the food and the cake were delicious.
Andrew, you have been doing a great job trying to work a job, take care of the home and be there as a supportive parent to your son and your daughter throughout all of this. It's time to really focus on you. Your son will work out whatever is bothering him. You do not have any idea what is going through his head at the moment and like you said, no point I stirring the pot. When he's ready, he may very well come talk to you and you might be surprised as to what he may have to tell you.
For now, just know that you've done a great job of juggling everything. Hope this week is a better one for you.
morning Andrew ... I will share what people tell me - how they act outwardly towards us is often not a true reflection of. how they really feel. I agree with everyone else -you've done a great job keeping all the apples in the air. time to stop juggling for a bit and take care of yourself.
btw I also agree with DnJ ... I see the same here, in the aftermath of recent legalization. hard work is the shortcut, as a friend recently said.
xoxoxo
Good morning all. Thanks for the input. I'm feeling physically and emotionally exhausted again. It was really tempting to crawl back in to bed like I did last week but I can't do that.
I honestly couldn't say whether S25 is depressed or not. From where I sat it looked like angry entitlement. An attitude he's had most of his life. He was polite but it really felt like he would rather have been "anywhere" else than at that table.
I would like for him to put down the bubble pipe, get a proper job and become independent. Is he depressed? I certainly would have been if I were in his situation. When I turned 25 I was engaged, working a well paying job and had been on my own for about 7 years. I remember my wife throwing me a surprise birthday party at our apartment.
I don't see him joining the military. He once referred to it as more or less a "job of last resort" which sadly it is for many people. And at 25 with very poor eyesight I don't know if they'd want him. Taking orders certainly wouldn't sit well with him either.
He's cruising along, presumably burning through his savings with car payments and his herbage. He has been getting two evenings a week working at the pub for which I presume he's being paid in cash. How long he can sustain that is anyone's guess.
Quick question, has he changed in his manner since B left? Btw, fwiw.....I’m proud of you.
You are an amazing dad.
Thanks Westo. It's hard to feel it. His attitude is more or less the same as it's always been. Other than perhaps being a bit more sympathetic towards me for a week or so, he doesn't seem to have noticed or missed B at all. He's always been a bit of a "cold" person and doesn't form close attachments to anyone. Never has. He can be charming and engaging when the mood hits and he and B got on rather well I felt. Even though I am sure that he has some interest in the opposite sex he's not had a girlfriend since he was in his mid teens and that was only for a few months.
I can only hope that his attitude will result in him becoming independent. He spends most of his time at least when I'm home sitting in his room listening to podcasts mostly. It's funny how I never even considered asking him to help build the shed and conversely how he never offered.
I don't know what his relationship is with his mother but they do have very similar personalities. The fact that she apparently yet again didn't recognize his birthday, especially such a milestone one is just baffling. I rather expected at least this year for there to be some negotiation about where he would spend dinner but nothing. He had dinner and then went out to play poker with his buddies.
I can still feel the hole where B was or rather where I felt she was. It's pretty plain for whatever reason that she has no interest or intent on coming back. There's a temptation to jump back in to the pond again right away but that's not a good idea at all. I do still have a level of WTF about how that ended. She just walked away without seeming to have any remorse or regret. The part that annoys me just like with my ex-wife was the fact that neither of them seemed to put any effort at all in trying to deal with any issues.
I also feel reluctant at present to put myself back "out there" again which is undoubtedly good. The fear of ending up in a situation like I was with B is palpable. I dared to dream this past winter that love and commitment were things that could happen to me. Trust of all sorts is a huge problem right now. There really is no one other than myself that I can lean up and trust to hold me up. And I feel very tired.
Well - enough of this nonsense. It is a lovely sunny day here at the plant. And I need to something more productive than this post or reviewing and updating drum and tote labels.
Sending hugs Andrew. News are new to me. Just like Ginger´s sitch, it´s glad to see where you are standing. Two pro DB soldiers there!
Just like I told G, do what works. For yourself.
Patience with your S25. Patience.
((((Andrew))))
He's always been a bit of a "cold" person and doesn't form close attachments to anyone.
It sounds to me like your son has issues that really need addressing. Could he perhaps be a bit on the autism spectrum? Or does he just have severe social anxiety? His lack of social life and close connections would have me worried. My mildly Asperger's son has only really dated one girl (who was a whack a doodle - thankfully he soon came to realize that) but luckily he's very extroverted and does have (similarly Aspie) friends.
It's hard to realize but our kids did not grow up in the world we did. Leaving home at 18 and getting a job that pays your way in the world is not easy now the way it was for our generation. Mental health has declined for reasons that aren't readily apparent. Your son is probably using pot to medicate his anxiety and/or depression. Instead of growing impatient for him to move out, I would suggest you focus on doing more things with him, seeing if he's open to seeing a counselor. He may need a lot of help figuring out his place in the world. Unfortunately when divorce hits at just the wrong developmental stage, our attention as parents gets drawn away from helping our kids to launch. It definitely affected my kids.
Being a single parent is tough. Being a single parent to a narcissistic child is tougher. S25 (as of today) is a "lot" like his mother. He did show up for dinner. Ate about half of his favourite foods that I made for him. Made some sarcastic remarks about his cake although I'm sure he enjoyed it. It almost felt through the whole dinner that he was looking for something to complain about. I think even his sister who called in from Virginia to sing Happy Birthday to him saw that things were off today. I carefully gave him no hooks to dig in to. I've experienced this quite a few times - just venting here tonight.
I am positive that he neither knows nor appreciates the effort I put in to both Sunday suppers and his birthday. I reassure myself that I'm doing these things because they are important to me.
I'm so sorry your son responded in that way, Andrew. I get what you are saying about reassuring yourself that you are doing it because it is important to you. I have been there myself with my girls. I have to keep reminding myself sometimes that it IS about me and that I do these things because I enjoy them, not because I am looking for external accolades. The really frustrating part comes when I back off and don't do something like this and people get their feelings hurt, but when I do it, they respond as your son did, so it is almost like you are d@mned if you do and d@mned if you don't, you know?
I know in the past I have been pretty vocal with you about things and I don't do it because I think I'm right or I think my way is the only way...it is purely my opinion and I think that you are open to receiving other's opinions, even if they aren't similar to yours. And, after all, I'm just some weird woman on the internet, so if you don't like what I have to say, you don't have to "listen", right? Anyway, having said all that, I can see why several have said that S25 seems depressed and the weed usage brings up a whole other issue, but to me, one of the core issues seems to be that S25 lives a somewhat child-like existence. You yourself refer to him as a "narcissistic child" in this post. He may well be narcissistic and like his mother, but he's a grown man. Ginger says that he seems to be more like a 16 year old than a 25 year old and I just wonder if that is not a product of how he currently lives. He lives in your house with limited responsibilities (I realize he has a car now, which gives him a modicum of responsibility that he didn't have before) where his basic needs are met through NO action on his part. Sure, he cleans his room and does his laundry and cooks some of his meals, but does all of these things using the items that YOU provide for him. When he cooks, he doesn't clean up. Other than his car payment, he doesn't appear to have any responsibility. Based on what you write, I had hoped that the whole car thing would push him to be more independent, but it seems to almost have had an adverse effect, though the fact that he's actually keeping up with his car payment is obviously a very good thing. I didn't say much about the weed before when you mentioned it because I know I'm the square of the group when it comes to that sort of stuff, but I was glad to see a couple of others mention that, while a lot of people jump on the bandwagon of what a great thing it is, there is some seeming real-life proof that those who are heavy, long-term users just tend to be generally less productive. Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to start a debate or question what others feel on this subject, I'm just saying that there does seem to be some evidence that supports that belief that while it may be particularly harmless, that doesn't necessarily make it a good thing, if that makes sense.
Maybe it is my strict southern upbringing, but some of the things (the weed smoking included) that S25 does in your home strike me as disrespectful. Again, I get that I'm a goody two shoes where weed is concerned so maybe it is more common than I realize, but It just seems unusual to me. I know you want S25 to be independent and to make his own way in the world, but I think a part of you secretly likes having him around, even if he is super moody, because it gives you someone to fuss over.
Take solace in the fact that, whatever S25's current mood is, you are an awesome dad and if you weren't, he wouldn't be sticking around. He'd have long ago found any excuse to get out from under your watchful eye.
Offering a counterpoint - I'm pretty sure my depressed, anxious younger son wouldn't be alive today without marijuana. I'm not saying people can't have problems with addiction to it, and daily use can definitely affect many people adversely. But it can also be a lifesaver for some people. I wouldn't focus on his use but on WHY he is using.
(And I say this even though I personally don't like it and haven't smoked since I was 20!)
It sounds to me like your son has issues that really need addressing. Could he perhaps be a bit on the autism spectrum? Or does he just have severe social anxiety? His lack of social life and close connections would have me worried. My mildly Asperger's son has only really dated one girl (who was a whack a doodle - thankfully he soon came to realize that) but luckily he's very extroverted and does have (similarly Aspie) friends.
It's hard to realize but our kids did not grow up in the world we did. Leaving home at 18 and getting a job that pays your way in the world is not easy now the way it was for our generation. Mental health has declined for reasons that aren't readily apparent. Your son is probably using pot to medicate his anxiety and/or depression. Instead of growing impatient for him to move out, I would suggest you focus on doing more things with him, seeing if he's open to seeing a counselor. He may need a lot of help figuring out his place in the world. Unfortunately when divorce hits at just the wrong developmental stage, our attention as parents gets drawn away from helping our kids to launch. It definitely affected my kids.
I think I largely got off lucky as far as the divorce affecting my kids much. They were both out of the house when it all happened. I was pretty well recovered by the time S25 moved in with me. I'd already given up on his mother having a change of heart well started on the divorce.
I don't believe that S25 is on the autistic spectrum anywhere. He is engaging and charming when around people (other than me). But he has zero close friends and seems fine with that. From what I understand a common trait among Asperger's is that they will develop an intense interest in things. He doesn't. If something is interesting he'll look into it and when it bores him he moves on.
I am pretty confident that he has some depression issues and the self-medication may well be part of his response to that. I don't know. He refuses to talk to a counselor or open up about any of his personal feelings with anyone. Last year I pumped a buddy of his that he plays poker with that could perhaps be his closes friends and was told that S25 doesn't talk about his home life, his parents, nothing.
I'm so sorry your son responded in that way, Andrew. I get what you are saying about reassuring yourself that you are doing it because it is important to you. I have been there myself with my girls. I have to keep reminding myself sometimes that it IS about me and that I do these things because I enjoy them, not because I am looking for external accolades. The really frustrating part comes when I back off and don't do something like this and people get their feelings hurt, but when I do it, they respond as your son did, so it is almost like you are d@mned if you do and d@mned if you don't, you know?
It happens fairly regularly. It was just a bad time for me to have to experience it again. Not that there's ever a good time.
Maybe it is my strict southern upbringing, but some of the things (the weed smoking included) that S25 does in your home strike me as disrespectful. Again, I get that I'm a goody two shoes where weed is concerned so maybe it is more common than I realize, but It just seems unusual to me. I know you want S25 to be independent and to make his own way in the world, but I think a part of you secretly likes having him around, even if he is super moody, because it gives you someone to fuss over.
Take solace in the fact that, whatever S25's current mood is, you are an awesome dad and if you weren't, he wouldn't be sticking around. He'd have long ago found any excuse to get out from under your watchful eye.
Yep - disrespectful. It's generally not overt but I do believe that he doesn't have a large amount of respect for me. It does make me walk on eggshells around him though. As I've maybe mentioned - it's like living with a taller, hairier version of his mother. The apple did not fall far from the tree.
He knows my attitude about the weed. I don't like it to be in my house, don't think it's healthy but also recognize that he is a grown man and that I'm not a tin-pot dictator who thinks that this is a big enough issue to have conflict over.
I actually don't fuss over him. 95% of the time he does his own thing and I do mine. I clean and cook because I like a clean house and enjoy cooking. I share a meal with him on Sunday because that's "important" to me.
An boy oh boy yes - would I like him to move out. I actually thought that B being in the house would have made him uncomfortable enough to incent him to move - but nope - he just adapted. Having him move out would "very" open up my own social horizons. Having someone over for sexy-time is certainly much more awkward knowing that he's in the next room. And I hate walking on eggshells - afraid that I'll set him off.
Having him there keeps him stuck in the life of a 17 year old boy in the body of a 25 year old man. He doesn't know his way out of it and TBH - anything I've suggested to him with varying degrees of persistence just haven't stuck. I know that he is more than capable of making his own way in the world. He just won't. He, like his mother will listen to suggestions, even agree that they are a good idea and then just no do it. I've sent him job postings - even ones in the village and he passively refuses to apply. I've suggested counseling. He refuses to go. I've even suggested that he consider going back to school. Nothing.
He doesn't want to be there either I'm sure. He is very embarrassed when he encounters former class-mates who are getting married, having kids, buying houses. Generally speaking he goes out of his way to avoid interacting with me around the house.
I can't do it for him. B I think helped by her less than subtle nudges on him to move out (and take his cats). His mother also maybe stepped up at that time too. But B is gone. There's no telling what his mother is thinking but that threat to her "ownership" of him and I is no longer threatened so she'll probably just idle along too. She may even push him to stay "so that Dad's not alone".
Sigh - I'll be better. But I'm really not seeing any active path towards any changes. The only one that comes to mind is when his bank account gets empty. I won't be making his car payments for him and if his mother has to cough up for those, she'll certainly get on his case.
Sigh - I'll be better. But I'm really not seeing any active path towards any changes. The only one that comes to mind is when his bank account gets empty. I won't be making his car payments for him and if his mother has to cough up for those, she'll certainly get on his case.
I have no doubt that things will get better and that, at some point, S25 will spread his wings. While it is none of my business so you don't even have to respond, I had assumed that he was at least making his car payment and the above quote suggests that he is not, but that you are doing it for him. That is the type of thing I was referring to when I talked about you fussing over him. Yes, I know you don't follow him around and do everything for him and I fully realize that you cook because you like to cook and you clean because you prefer a tidy house, but my point with the fussing was that, even in a little way, as long as he is there, you DO have someone to take care of, maybe not overtly, but in some way. If you don't cook, I'm sure he does, but the fact that you like to and are willing to do so for both of you works to his advantage. And, the fact that you prefer to have a pretty clean house also works to his advantage because when he does cook for himself, he typically leaves the mess for you to clean up.
The long and short of it is, you love your son and he loves you, though at his age, it is likely still somewhat uncool to admit that. I know I have said this before, but honestly, if her father or I would've allowed it after she got out of high school, our middle daughter would STILL be living with one of us and letting us take care of her and she's 28 with 2 kids.
While it is none of my business so you don't even have to respond, I had assumed that he was at least making his car payment and the above quote suggests that he is not, but that you are doing it for him.
Nope - the loan is in his name and he's making the payments presumably burning through his savings account. If he runs out of cash, I won't be the one stepping up. I would expect that his mother is on the loan as a co-signer so she'd need to step up for that. It is literally none of my business.
Speaking of sons, sea and sailboats, you should check out the YouTube channel "Sailing La Vagabond." It's an Australian couple that have been sailing around the world in a 45 foot catamaran. They recently had a son and the baby is so much fun to watch. I'd forgotten about baby giggles and squealing laughter. Somehow it's soothing to see a small family sailing to various port with a baby on board. Tons of vicarious pleasure.
In my experience, some kids need to be kicked out of the nest to spread their wings. Not only is it better for them, it's better for the relationship.
It's going to be hard for any child to respect an adult who walks on eggshells around them.
T
While it is none of my business so you don't even have to respond, I had assumed that he was at least making his car payment and the above quote suggests that he is not, but that you are doing it for him.
Nope - the loan is in his name and he's making the payments presumably burning through his savings account. If he runs out of cash, I won't be the one stepping up. I would expect that his mother is on the loan as a co-signer so she'd need to step up for that. It is literally none of my business.
You know who should really be stepping up for that????
Him!
I mean your ex might want to not to hurt her credit, but I would let him deal with the fall out of not making payments.
Went to bed early last night. S25 was cheerful, making his supper so I didn't bother with the few dishes that were out.
This morning I found a large plate in the fridge with a few pieces of birthday cake on it. I think the one I got him was better but this one appeared to have been more shared. Maybe it was from his mother? No clue. The plate looks like the ones that he's brought home from the pub with leftovers on it. His mother left taking her "good dishes" that we were never allowed to use. I doubt she'd let him take one of those back home. Other than figuring out what to do with the dirty plate and the rather nice large metal bowl that is covering it's not my issue. Generally I set the clean plates on the counter and if they are still there a week later I move them to his room. He gets the hint. And has a large number of clean containers that had leftovers from his mother in them in his room.
About 10 hours in bed. I probably slept for in the neighbourhood of 8. When B was living with me it would often be well after 9:00 before we would get to sleep and she would wake me up at 3:30 like clock-work. I do get more sleep at least although I certainly enjoyed being in bed more when she was there.
Unsurprisingly I had some incredibly vivid dreams last night. One larger one that I remember rather clearly involved me being stranded off the coast of California, B organizing the rescue and then nursing me back to health. For a brief time I felt that I had someone I could count on. It was a nice feeling. I had others that I believe were of a common theme that I've had for a while where something is broken, usually plumbing or flooding related and I try to fix it, often unsuccessfully. I've always dreamed very realistically and yes - in the night did reach out in my dream and felt B next to me and then reached out awake and she wasn't. Sometimes the dreams are in the first person, sometimes the third.
I woke up with an urge to invite B out for coffee and a visit or to contact her son to see how she's doing. Generally all bad ideas. I was a bit startled as I was heading out to work on hearing a noise from my pocket and my phone had "butt-dialed" her. I hung up before she could answer. Cosmic harmony is rather persistent.
I'm sure she knows that I miss her and regret that things didn't work out. The fact that she was so very uncomfortable in my home and my world is sadly I think an insurmountable obstacle. If she were willing to give it another and honest try I would also probably be willing. I honestly don't know if that is possible for her. I was certainly willing to accept her as she was. There were a lot of things that we could have done together that we would both have enjoyed but we didn't. Her only focus was going to her cottage, dealing with S38's drama and her grandkids. There's a lot that could be said in the "what if" category but the reality is that it didn't happen.
She, like my ex-wife know exactly where I am and that while I may be currently taking a pause am not standing still.
Well - I'm supposedly well rested and have a busy list in front of me. Time to get to it.
i'm thinking his co-workers gave him a bday cake.
i'm sorry you're feeling sad.
you're processing all of this. it takes that fickle Biatch we know as Time.
xoxoxo
T
While it is none of my business so you don't even have to respond, I had assumed that he was at least making his car payment and the above quote suggests that he is not, but that you are doing it for him.
Nope - the loan is in his name and he's making the payments presumably burning through his savings account. If he runs out of cash, I won't be the one stepping up. I would expect that his mother is on the loan as a co-signer so she'd need to step up for that. It is literally none of my business.
You know who should really be stepping up for that????
Him!
I mean your ex might want to not to hurt her credit, but I would let him deal with the fall out of not making payments.
I remembered you had said it was in his name with his mother co-signing, but something about the way you phrased that paragraph made it sound like you were helping him out. Like I said, none of my business so didn't even really require a response (unless you want to say "butt the h3ll out" which I would totally understand). Having said that, I do agree with G, though. He's 25 now and it is time he learns to step up and deal with issues rather than being bailed out by XW or whoever might step up to help him.
I think Rose had an excellent point too, about him not respecting someone who walks on eggshells for fear of upsetting him. That's a hard spot for you to be in, Andrew, and I do feel for you.
So why would you want to give it another shot with B?
It would only work if she wasn’t who she really is. She really is who she is. Her life is her life, her choices are her choices.
So, it would work only if she was who you wanted her to be. See what I am saying?
B is the person who loves her cottage, prefers to save S38 and dedicate majority of her time to the grandkids. This is who she is. She isn’t the woman walking around town with you or staying at home on a Sunday doing the house thing and Sunday supper. It isn’t who she is. It’s who you want her to be.
You miss the presence of another. I get that soooo much. But she isn’t the one. The one will come.
Posting a lot lately. There's actually not much going on. A bit of a novel today. I'm just too lazy to open up my other diary today.
I've been getting progressively more worried about the economy lately and some of the turns it could make. I'm fairly unhappy with work at present and have been for some time. But every indication is that we are heading for a fairly strong recessions. There's the standard economic indicators, my own belief that the stock market has been fully valued for some time if not a bit over-valued, some dodgy things that I've been hearing about the stability of commercial credit both here and abroad etc. I did see some things cross my desk lately where our suppliers are really pushing for us to sign on pretty much "any" new business whereas before they were only interested in big deals. Companies, especially in the auto sector seem to be pulling back quite firmly. Staying where I am even though uncomfortable may be wise. Certainly going in to anything speculative such as a start-up is dangerous.
I've heard through the rumour mill that pressure on my boss to retire is mounting and he just won't. One theory I heard which sounds plausible is that he's hoping for a packaged buy-out rather than an early retirement. I think he's only in his early 60s. I don't know. He's a jerk, abusive and most importantly to me, not good at his job. I've been able to largely avoid him for the last 16 years but it's getting harder lately with the company now being so much smaller.
I wish I could just spend a week at home doing nothing. My week of summer vacation back in June was packed with projects and accommodating B. I did spend some time just sitting on my butt. I went back and re-read what I wrote then and yeah - I was annoyed at her for not being around or participating in what was going on. Ah well - hopefully lessons learned.
A friend of mine who mid-divorce reached out to me to say that when I was in his geography to let him know and we'd go out for a beer. I had been thinking of reaching out to him yesterday but then noticed on social media that he lost his mother. It wasn't too unexpected. I sent sympathies.
When I got home surprisingly S25 had his car in the driveway. He'd gone clothes shopping - I would imagine on his own for one of the first times in his life. He was looking for shorts but was unable to find any that suited. While he was there he helped me move the boat around in the new shed and we managed to get the utility trailer in there too. It's a bit of a tight squeeze and to work on the boat I'll probably need to slide the utility trailer out but boy oh boy has the parking space increased. I had been worried. When B was here we both parked in the side drive and it was tight. With the shed and utility trailer out it wouldn't have been possible. Now - lots of room. I'm glad I thought of that in the middle of the night.
He let me know that I was welcome to the last piece of his other cake that was in the fridge. It was black forest made by his friend who is a chef. He's from Switzerland and told S25 the story about how kirsh is made and used.
Supposedly one of the uses is by farmers on their cattle. Must be happy cows I expect.
I had been wondering about this friend and his marriage recently. They've been together for probably 15+ years and seem fairly happy but he's been spending a lot of time recently drinking and playing poker with S25 and others of similar 20 year younger age. His wife just spent a week "up north" with the boys and I had been wondering why their dad wasn't part of the adventures. They are real estate agents so have a pretty flexible schedule. I hope all is OK. They're nice people and were a big help when sorting out the value of my house came up. Having gone through a divorce I suppose it's natural to see problems where they don't exist.
The new bow tie I ordered arrived yesterday. Many of my ties have some sort of story or meaning behind them. Certainly any that I buy new do. This one is to remind me of B, how fond I was of her and the good times we had. I mentioned this to S25 when I opened the parcel and got an eye-roll and what could be interpreted as a "you've got to be kidding me" glance. Not that it matters any more but I do wonder what he actually thought of B. They got along fine but other than with me, S25 gets along with everyone. And he and I are generally fine.
After dishes I sat out front on my bench with my book on a lovely summer evening and watched the traffic drive by until it got too dark. My next door neighbours got in to a loud fight which they regularly do. I know that was one of the things that bothered B. For me it's been going on for so many years that I just ignore it. I did overhear "him" say "where would you get another boyfriend" and her respond "Andrew lives next door" - the argument got quiet at that point. It did make me LOL. The guy is IMO not much of a prize. He at one point mentioned that he had to go to mandated anger management class. We get along fairly well though and I have no intention of dating his girlfriend. I do often wonder though why she puts up with him but how can we know - other than the loud arguments - what actually is going on behind closed doors.
We had a lovely rain-storm overnight and when I woke around 3:30 I could hear the rain pounding down. A perfect time for a cuddle with someone special. Since it's just me I sighed and went back to sleep. I have noticed my CPAP numbers gradually getting better. Perhaps related to me getting used to the new bed?
I'm trying to treat my experience with B as a "teaching moment". I still am fond of her and I'm not angry at "her" more at what she chose to do. Outside of me / us though I was wondering what I could have learned about her as a person from what was available. She did say that she was big on family and certainly spent lots of time with GS3/4 but that was mandated and her son leaned on her a lot for that. She never really saw the others very often though other than talking to her daughter pretty much daily.
Looking at what was / is visible about B on social media one thing that struck me before and certainly does in hindsight is how little others interact with her. I know that she has 2 really good friends who live farther away who based on what I know about them probably spend a lot of time online, like B does. B pretty much never posts anything about her own life which is fine but I've noticed that nobody seems to pay attention to what she does post. Occasional likes from her STBX and when she tags a kid or gk they don't really seem to notice either. And I know they are active. Her "friend's list" is in the hundreds even though she is I believe rather discriminating on who she adds.
Is her relationship with her family damaged and I was just seeing a warm loving family that perhaps doesn't exist?
I do know that social media isn't an indicator of real life but it is one of the windows I will have on anyone new.
Like anyone I can't help but think through what went wrong, what went right in that relationship. Even though I think it was one of the killers, I do firmly believe that standing up for boundaries around not moving and not getting rid of the cats was right. Her attitude did seem to dim a fair amount when after first being accommodating when she was pushing suggesting that I could move in 5 years instead of 10 I hardened it down to saying that there was no way I would move unless it made sense either because I couldn't maintain this place any more or if it made sense financially. The cats too - where I changed from if S25 and his cats move out that's a good thing to if S25 moves out his cats certainly can stay here too - I don't think went over well.
Will she change her attitude on those things given time couch-surfing with her son? It's not something that I can plan on. When she left it certainly seemed quite definite that for her it was a one-way trip. No - "I need to get my cr@p sorted out an then re-evaluate". It was I need to get my cr@p sorted out and I can't see living here with you because I don't fit in to your world.
Not sure how to test that in a new relationship. Like with Ginger's M - she said all the right things, she did a lot of the right things. We didn't have enough time dating for me to learn if she would follow-through and TBH - her moving in was more of a case of she needed to move "somewhere" and we both felt that her moving here was the best choice.
I need to give these things thought before I jump back in to the pond. I am absolutely an amateur at this with no desire to go pro. I just want someone who I can share my life with and who will share their's. Someone comfortable in their own skin who has a kind and caring heart.
I have noticed that many single women at lest in this area are entrepreneurs running a variety of businesses from retail like the flower shop or gift shop to more home based. I think that there is a large number of single women of my age who are happily living their lives, perhaps interested in finding someone but not involved in the OLD world. I perhaps need to get out and about more to find them.
I am down 4 pounds as of this morning since B left. My weight fluctuates by about 6 pounds from week to week so it could just be a temporary down turn. I am back eating pretty much exactly as I was before B was here. The only change is I now eat a small handful of cashews every day instead of a hummus wrap and I've learned to make a really nice mushroom omelet. The "home cooked meal" that B insisted on me having on Mon/Tue/Wed are no more. She was never around on the weekends to cook so that stayed the same for me.
Payday today - I need to pay my bills including my VISA bill for my trip. Money has already been transferred out of savings. It's so comforting to know that it's all planned and I can just "do" things like this. A regular paycheque is indeed a good thing.
I think I'll take myself out for wings tonight like I used to as well. It's been a "looong" time since I've done a solo night out and the wing place I like going to the next village over, B didn't really like their food.
Well - that's about all for now.
Not sure how to test that in a new relationship. Like with Ginger's M - she said all the right things, she did a lot of the right things. We didn't have enough time dating for me to learn if she would follow-through and TBH - her moving in was more of a case of she needed to move "somewhere" and we both felt that her moving here was the best choice.
That's the key - you need to take a lot more time dating before you do something like living together. It takes a long time for people to show their true colors. Even if someone seems like they need saving, don't do it - especially not so early in a relationship. How they figure out their own stuff will tell you something. Anybody you're going to date is a grown woman and should be able to handle her sh!t without being rescued.
I agree it's an unsteady world out there economically so staying put in your secure job could be a good idea, unless you have enough FU money and money in retirement savings to take risks.
Wow - blowing through this thread again.
Summer seems to be coming to a rapid end. I have to close the windows at night as it is getting cool out. It does make for a more comfortable sleeping temperature than the mid-summer with a post-menopausal woman with severe hot flashes cuddled up next to me. I do miss that though.
Things slowing down in my brain I think. I had the idea yesterday morning to put some lights up in my new shed so that I could work on my boat regardless of the lighting. I knew that I had a part spool of romex left over from when I rewired the house 30 years ago so I picked up a plug, pigtail outlets and cages for them at the hardware store on the way home. Being unsupervised, I put everything together when I got home while still wearing my dress work clothes, got it installed and working just as it got really dark. I'm rather pleased with the result. The wire I had was about 5 feet longer than I needed so I scored on that too. It felt really really good to make the plan for the shed, and then when it came on sale as expected to execute the plan quickly. It's like the pre-bomb-day times in many ways when projects got started and then done rather than stalling.
S25 got home from his shift at the pub while I was relaxing with a beer and seemed to be in a more or less good mood. It turned out that he had been saving up some grievances. He accused me of scratching up his car when taking a ladder out of the garage - something which I denied. I haven't used that ladder in a very long time and certainly am careful around his car. He also accused me of losing an extension cord of his which looks identical to 10 others we have in the house and that he doesn't remember seeing for over a year. Shrug from me. He also accused me of telling people that his mother bought his car for him. That one struck a bit closer. I prevaricated by saying that I have told people that his mother helped him buy a car but that he was making the payments.
Low conflict but he was certainly seeming to be working at putting me in my place. Le sigh.
He also said that he wouldn't be home for Sunday supper which got another shrug from me. Since he didn't tell me what his actual plans are I can presume it's dinner with his mother but whether it is or not it really doesn't matter. It was good that he had the courtesy to let me know before my plans were finalized.
People here may well be proud of me though. I'm proud of me. I had been intending on pushing the subject on Sunday over dinner - one of the few times that we interact - and brought up the subject of him moving out. I wasn't pushy or aggressive, just stating the fact that it was indeed high time that he got independent and on his own. He didn't seem startled or put out and agreed with everything I said. I think that the combination of him being yet again frustrated by how difficult it is to live with me
along with my suggestion hit the mark this time. But then again he has a history of agreeing and then doing nothing. I did mention how awkward it was having B around and also said that I was intending on starting to date again in early October.
SIL1 has been glorying in her view into my ex-wife's life - and before you smack me Dawn - it really doesn't bother me. I do worry about her but in a way that also knows that she's dug her own hole and that it has nothing to do with me and that I have no part of it. The anger and angst has been ramping up in her social media posts, complaining about toxic people in her life, her job etc. One of her few remaining friends was egging her on to make changes. Lots of speculation could be made on if she's upset with OM, her boss, her family or all three. SIL1 thinks that she may circle around but I really doubt it. She is probably aware that since she reconnected to SIL1 that I'm hearing what's going on and we could speculate that she's expecting me to ride in to the rescue like I did for well over a quarter century but there's no way that I'd want to go in to that muck again. I do expect that she'll get the latest update about me on Sunday presuming that she sees S25 then. Not that he actually knows much about what is going on in my life. He sees me for perhaps 2 minutes most days. His other interaction is late at night on a Friday or Saturday in which case I'm usually up with a beer and a book if I'm up. Or on a Sunday when I've usually had a couple of beer during ironing and then wine with dinner. His impression of me is probably of a drunken sot who is sad and having difficulty coping. Which is absolutely not the case, but like a photograph only catches a moment in time without context, his limited interaction with me only sees those times. He doesn't seen me up early, doing chores, errands, keeping the house in good shape, at work, sitting with a pot of tea, going for hikes and walks. Because he's locked in his room, often with his bubble pipe these days only emerging for moments at a time.
I will be glad when he moves out. It will lighten the mood in the house and clear the air in more than one way. Hopefully my mention of October will give him a marker to aim for. I do know that with the two short shifts he gets at the pub that there's no way that he can afford rent but he has a car now. His original goal was to be moved out by his birthday which was a week ago.
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So - like Ginger, I'm having a problem letting go of the ghost that was B. Yesterday I went through my phone and removed all the call logs. I'd already removed the texts. My heavens. She called me a "lot" and for long calls. She used to call on speaker phone while doing other things and was always hard to hear. In person she has a lovely soft voice but she damaged her vocal cords quite badly after her husband's first affair - badly enough that she needed medical attention and was told that she may well eventually lose her voice - She'll still have her Italian hand gestures which she uses frequently. Her voice though when she talks louder is quite gravelly - not quite a "whiskey voice" but similar.
I made the choice to get myself a new bow tie to commemorate the good times I had with B. It arrived last Wednesday and I wore it on Thursday posting a "new tie" picture on Facebook. I think it looks nice. It's based on an illustration by children's author Sandra Boynton whose "Moo Baa La La La" book was a sure favourite in the P household when the kids were young. I think I can still do the voices.
I have similar momentos that remind me of other people, places and times. I think it's a healthy thing for me to have those personal touch-points to the past be it a picture, tie, cuff-links or whatever.
I sort of expected B to notice and react or comment. She didn't. I was dissapointed for a while but then now tell myself that it's all part of her letting go and not being part of my life. It was perhaps one of her biggest struggles in that she didn't see herself as "fitting" in my life. In hind-sight there were 1001 indicators that this was the case. That she wanted me in her world but didn't see herself in mine. Early on we had talked a lot about how different we were and how there would be a B, A and "us". We just never managed to do the "us" part.
I still follow B on Facebook and probably will until the end of September so that she can see my trip to Madrid. I think she'll like to see me enjoying myself. This week coming she's off to a production of "Come From Away" in Toronto which will be I think the first play she's ever been to. It's for one of her sister's birthday. I expect that she'll be having her room paid for and shared with one of her siblings. She's also got a wedding also in Toronto on September 14th. The same day I'm flying out which is fortuitous that that prevented my getting an invitation. If we were still together a nice gift and hotel would have been figured out. I'm sure she'll do something decent on her own although she's not as thoughtful of a gift giver as you might imagine.
After than, I'll step back even more and when I get back from Madrid then I'll give thought to if I'm ready to date again.
I do really care for B. But as people here have written to me multiple times, it's not so much "her" that I miss undoubtedly, it's having "someone" in my life. My cats while cute - Amy is atop a pile of papers watching me type - they really aren't the same as knowing that someone is "there". I'm sure everyone knows what I mean. I've never been a believer in "the one" or "soulmates" although my ex certainly was. I like to think that I can be compatible with a wide variety of people and make it work. I do know that there are as they say "lots more fish in the sea" - but there's also a lot of trash. The last time I went in to OLD I was in there for a week before B swooped in and scooped me up. Who knows who it will be next time?
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Well time for me to start wrapping this up. I have a big pot of chili started. S25 doesn't like it with kidney beans which is just baffling but it's not for him. I put in tomatoes from my patio tomato plant and fresh oregano both picked this morning by a middle aged guy in plaid PJs and down at the heels slipper (I have no shame
) It also includes 3 very tiny but presumable incredibly hot peppers. S25 suggested that I don't chop them but let them marinate and then try to fish them out before eating. That's the plan.
Regular stuff on the go today plus a bit. I think I'll swing out to the farm for a quick visit with my youngest brother, nephew and SIL2. SIL1 is gifting me a nice wing chair that no longer matches her decorating that I was supposed to pick up today but typical of SIL1 - the execution of such plans is flawed and who knows when it will arrive. My oldest brother and I will probably need to coordinate.
I'm also hoping to pull the boat out of her shed and give her a good hosing down. She needs to be cleaned first before I start working on the paint. Since she has a shed now, I can take the lines from where they are stowed and flake them down and check them out more carefully. It will be so much easier to work on her now. I should have built this shed years ago but parting with the $500 involved did take some mental effort to get to.
At the bank I also need to order some Euros for my trip. I'm going to get 100 I think and then before I leave load up another 50 on to the pre-paid Euro VISA that I have giving me 250 on that. I can reload it in Spain if I need to.
D26 is heading out on her cross-country trip today. I sent her some bon-voyage messages. She's going to be documenting her trip on her SnapChat feed and I'll also be able to track her progress live on the Life360 app we both use.
Well - tea is done. Time to shower and get under-weigh.
For the record, I don’t believe I’m the only one who has commented that SIL1 should butt the h3ll our, but I’m not going to say anything else about it. I am beginning to think you rather like her updates and the speculations about what S25 may or may not be talking about with his mother, so if you’re happy, I’m good.
Bow tie was handsome. Shed lights look great. Hope your weekend is nice and relaxing.
hello yes I've mentioned that about SIL1 ... crickets, lol.
A, honey I'm sorry but since Don pointed out on G's thread that none of us spoke up sooner, I'm trying to speak up sooner. Hope I don't offend, here goes - when someone leaves, they usually don't look back. Photos from Madrid aren't going to change anything. I don't want this to sound cruel, but what makes you think she's even looking? She didn't make time for you when she lived with you. That's not likely to change now.
You've reminded me to ask son for the rent which was due last week. His hours were cut, but the lesson is you still owe the rent $$$.
Love the lighting in the shed. Bow tie is spiffy also. She didn't comment because she's moved on bud. Best for you to grieve and do the same.
Good job on deleting the calls! Next you need to not wait to delete her from FB. You do it because you think she will enjoy the fun you are having.... come on, let’s be real with our selves here. You want her to want to be a part of the fun you are having and you hope she will see it and change her mind . I know that game. I’ve played it. It fails every time. Every. Single. Time. That’s why I delete and block my exes. And I bet them not knowing at all makes them wonder more. They don’t get glimpses into our lives when they need a “fix”
Your SIL has an unhealthy obsession with your ex. It is kind of weird. She needs to respect your wishes. And you need to be kind of firm on them.
I’m a rip the bandaid off kind of girl as of more recently. And it helps me tremendously. I don’t want to keep my self attached.
I have a dinner date tonight to fill the hole. With my bestie. And we like to EAT. Seafood. M used to call our seafood bottom feeders and said yuck. And always wanted to split appetizers as a meal. Dude, I wanted a meal!
Go back to your wing Wednesdays. Enjoy a meal with friends. Maybe, just maybe change up yourbaubday routine a bit.
Let’s evolve.
Hi. My name is AndrewP and I'm not great at letting go. (Hi AndrewP!). To scratch an itch I drove by B's youngest son's house on Saturday morning which is 2 blocks from my bank. I will say that I was both surprised and relieved to see her car parked in front. It helps. I'm very relieved to know that I was not lied to. Trust is so very difficult especially I would think during a break-up. I don't have any urge to drive past there again and I know that the odds of her ever wanting to get back together in the near term are really low. And I'm not intending on waiting for her.
I am proud of myself that last night I had very little urge to contact her and didn't. Silly - almost like post-bomb day and constantly resetting the no contact clock. There is nothing I can say that I've not already said and that she knows. Saying it again would change nothing. On a better note, we continue to have no velociraptor attacks and I don't need to reset that clock.
Other than that confession, which I was reluctant to make, there is one thing that has in some ways seriously weirded me out. Last night around 2 or so, I woke up and am positive that I clearly heard S25 say "Oh - Mom's here". Now I know that I dream very vividly. This morning there was a paper gift bag in the recycling box - that possibly S25 could have carried his leftovers in from his shift at the pub - but very unlikely, and the leftover birthday cake in the fridge was all gone. Again - there could be lots of explanations but the thought of my ex coming by the house in the middle of the night is pretty creepy. I can't imagine it to be true - but it is a plausible explanation of things.
I was woken up this morning by SIL1 who invited me out for breakfast. We were joined by SIL2, her mother and my wee nephew. It was nice to spend time with them. They were thrilled to be with a man who actually didn't mind going shopping. My nephew got a bit wound up when his aunt told him he could have a present from the store and so I picked him up and we had a nice snuggle as he calmed down. I don't see him much be we were best of friends after. I did visit with my oldest brother a bit later and got some fresh garden produce from SIL2's garden. SIL1 and SIL2's mother are co-conspirators on watching my ex wife. SIL2's mother actually sees my ex a few times a week when she picks up her lottery tickets at her store and regularly asks how she's doing in a friendly way. Yeah - my ex is not a happy camper.
For those playing the home game, D27 is currently being helped by her best friend to drive some possessions and her two cats across the US from Norfolk to San Diego. I can watch her progress live on Life360 which is kinda cool. As of right now they are just west of Jackson Mississippi making good time.
Well - time for my ironing.
Oh - and a couple of other minor things.
I bumped in to "Gift shop lady" at the cafe on Saturday. She was wearing leggings. I don't normally have a thing for very slim women but - oh my. I do believe that she's seeing someone now.
On a similar note, FSL mentioned on Saturday that she was having her mother-in-law come for a week's visit. I did know that she'd moved a few months ago to a place with a back yard. I was rather startled though. I do hope that it is a positive thing for her. She's gone through a lot.
And finally - the thing that got me back on here because I need to process - a nice lady who I've known for a bunch of years who I've referred to as "stalker lady" randomly reached out to me this afternoon via FB messenger. She's never interacted with me that way before. Her daughter was one of S25's friends back in the day and she's good friends with the owner of my friend's cafe so there's a bunch of common ground. S25 did tell me in no uncertain terms a couple of years ago that I'm not allowed to date her. We exchanged vague pleasantries both mentioning our single status and I indicated that I was busy with housework. Women it appears do fall from the sky. Going to try to keep this on a simmer - and it may just be a random thing. And I have some work to do on myself.
Tonight's menu is meatloaf, baked potato and veg with fresh biscuits. No cheese sauce - I'm feeling lazy. S25 is out "somewhere" / probably with his mother for dinner. I did find the box that his cake was in so he undoubtedly had late night munchies that involved him eating 1/3 of a rather large cake.
Happy Wednesday and more importantly - Happy National Bow Tie Day everyone! I'm working from home today and haven't decided if I'll dress it up or not.
Dealing with a moderate amount of WTF in the last few days.
Yesterday, a long term colleague of mine was terminated. I get it. He's not been much of a contributor, his work quality isn't very good, he doesn't really fit in to the updated organization, a lot of people didn't like or respect him and after the reorganization budgets are tight. On a more personal note though, he is in the middle of a 100K+ renovation that he thought he'd get government funding for - didn't - his wife is a SAHM and his daughter is special needs - which was one of the reasons for the renovation. He's probably around 60 and I expect has few job prospects. I reached out to some friends at one of our competitors and basically got laughed at with the suggestion that he might have gone over there. I feel bad for him regardless. It certainly makes me both more and less nervous. Like having a land-mine go off next to you and knowing that there are a very limited number of them.
I've been writing in my personal diary in the last while - exploring some things in a lot more detail than I'm comfortable with here. To quote Inego Montoya "Let me explain... No, there is too much. Let me sum up." was that catch-up day's entry. I hadn't updated my diary since when it was all songbirds and sunshine with B. So there was some ground to cover including as I mention - a bunch of things I don't want to share here about what was going on in her life.
There still is a fair amount of WTF going on with B and the ending of that relationship. I "know" that it was for the best that it ended and that it ended in the way that it did. I also "know" that the odds of her getting her stuff sorted out any time soon is very low. And add on to that some of the very real to her reasons that it wasn't working for her.
I had dinner with one of my best friends last night. He's been going through a lot lately. His daughter just presented him with his second grandson and he's been helping out a lot there. His wife has been out for the count with a very scary cellulitis infection that she's just recovering from now. He was glad to get out for some beer and wings and chat for a change. He, like pretty much everyone else shares my WTF on B's departure. Superficially to most people it makes NO sense. She landed a comfy spot with a - not to brag - decent guy which is from what I gather pretty rare at our age. And she walked away from it.
She is I believe off with her sisters for a few days. My friend and I can't help but wonder if her family and friends are also doing the WTF thing with her too. Being fundamentally Scots / German in my outlook, the practical things make sense. Perhaps bttrfly can give her Italian perspective
I do know that B's 91 year old mother was very happy with me, saw how good I was with the GK, how I obviously adored B, how B was respected and could live her own life without the controlling nature and related guilt of her STBX, and yes - had a big house that B could move her stuff in to out of her mother's tiny place.
It is interesting though how after the fact that some people will speak up about red flags that they see that they are quiet on before. SIL2's mother who is actually a couple of years younger than me, mentioned that it was a huge red flag to her that B seemed to be in no rush about getting her divorce. As in - keeping Plan B alive.
The plan continues to be to step away from B. It is her 57th birthday coming up next Monday. I had planned on making it extra special for her. She did say that in all the years she was married that her STBX never marked the day. I'm working on composing a brief but friendly message to her wishing her the best of days, thanking her for adding so much love to my life for the brief time we were together, and hopes for a bright future. I'll send it to her privately as a message that morning rather than the more usual public posting that I would have done otherwise.
In hind sight and looking now - B is a pretty isolated person. She spent her entire adult life from the age of 19 being a mother and wife. Her social circles were small but she is close to a couple of special friends. Because of familial conflicts which I've alluded to and the fact that she spent nearly 10 years not being able to interact easily with her kids / gk she is fairly distant from them. They certainly care about and for her, but she's not really part of their lives. She went in to in-house-separation when she was 54 I think. Left the house at her 55th birthday. Had some flings - some ill-advised. I could perhaps be counted in that list as well. Her social skills aren't that great - and yes - she eats with her elbows on the table
I certainly resisted the temptation to play the part of Professor Henry Higgins and accepted her as she was. I worry about her future. I know that it is out of my hands. It's the Knight of Rueful Countenance in me I suppose still.
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One thing that I'm healed well enough to do is to look at the Facebook memories thing every morning. I enjoy it. Even when it highlights some of the great times I had with my ex-wife. This morning I had a smile because it involved a very flirtatious exchange between myself and CL who at this time last year was certainly engaging with me. Another bright spot in my past to put behind me. I think she's well on her way towards her own healing. She is going to travel to Montreal in a few weeks to be with my oldest sister / her sort of step-mother when she goes in for some cancer biopsys. My sister is very fortunate in that for many years she's been an active volunteer with the Canadian Cancer society and this has - perhaps unfairly - put her to the front of the line for the best care. She's met a lot of politicians, researchers and doctors through her volunteer work and has a strong support network. I'm glad that CL is going out there too though. CL does have many traits that I admire and "being there" for people who need her is certainly one of them. She does also have the ability to be arrogant and demanding but she's just human. She also, I think makes a great effort to live her Faith every day and not just at church which I admire. I honestly expect that her interest in me is a thing of the past but am grateful that I can still consider her a sort of friend. I wouldn't have dated her if I hadn't liked her.
My D27 is almost to San Diego. She is currently just outside Pheonix on her road trip with her bestie and her two cats. I believe that she expects to make it the rest of the way today and that she has plans to hit the last Waffle House west of the Mississippi before setting out. I sent her a picture of my breakfast omelette (I'm getting rather good at making these) in Snapchat with the caption "not a waffle". Her big thing is "hashbrowns scattered and smothered".
I got my hotel booking for Madrid confirmed. It seems like a nice hotel in the middle of the city about a 1/2 walk away from the Prado. Everything "should" go smoothly. I have a fair bit of planning and prep work still to do not the least of which is planning on doing laundry before I depart so I have enough underwear. Ah the complexities of the single man's life.
Well - enough for now. I need to prep for a 10:30 conference call where the departure of my colleague will probably be an awkward topic. I'm not sure if I'll go out or stay in for dinner tonight. I was out last night.
Happy National Bow Tie Day everyone!
Oh man! I've been waiting all year for National Bow Tie Day and I forgot to wear a bow tie today. Disgusting.
Tomorrow is National Chop Suey Day and you can bet that I'll be wearing plenty of chop suey tomorrow.
Hey Andrew -
Sorry you are hurting. I know you are mourning loss of what could have been. But, When i read in between the lines, you mention a lot of things that you were unhappy with in B and you have done so since the beginning. Maybe a list for you too? I think you could use this type of list and loss to reflect on what your must haves for the next lucky lady will be. . What you don’t want to tolerate.
When I was on the boards earlier in the divorce I got swept away with the idea that for a healthy relationship, the one necessary factor was commitment. That it wasn’t about chemistry or compatibility (heck - that’s wayward thinking) but about two people committing to commitment and compromising through their differences and being able to fight fair. Maybe that’s true when people have kids and have been married for 10 years and their getting bored. But not people dating.
After my last relationship (who I dated because I knew he would be committed - but we did not share enough interests and chemistry on my part wasnt there). I realized, compatibility is really really really important. So is chemistry.
Based on what you wrote, you and B. Weren’t compatible and I think she saw it and didn’t want to settle. You certainly saw it, but you were willing to settle.
Another thing, I frequently pick up on in your writings is that you feel like she should have stayed with you because you could offer her comfort and financial stability. I think that’s a bad way of thinking for both of you and it’s something you might want to reflect on. Why would you want a woman that stays with you because you can offer her a comfortable life? You should want someone that wants to be around you and adores you because of who you are. Because you have hours of interesting conversation. Because you take joy in doing similar things together. By thinking it’s about what you can provide monetarily - you are giving up your power and also taking away Bs power.
As a single mom living with her parents (side note - I do have a education and professional career, I just live in the most expensive area in the country and my ex was 3000 a month on god knows what for years ). I find it really insulting that men think that way about me. It’s humiliating for me. And if I don’t feel that clique, I’m not going to sell my soul for a more comfortable life. I think B’s willingness to walk away from that is actually a redeeming character trait in her.
Anyway, here’s a question. What to you would be an ideal partnership? What traits would your dream partner have? What activities would you want you and your partner to do (example - talk for hours about current events, visit museums etc)
I think Andrew, people IRL kept quiet until after the fact is because you probably weren’t going to listen anyways and might get mad. We weren’t shy about the red flags.........
You say she wasn’t happy..... you weren’t really either. I think we all sensed that. Just like me. I wasn’t really all that happy, even if I tried to cover it up.You were polar opposites not enjoying anything together living separate lives in the same house. Sure . You are a catch. But being a catch just isn’t enough sometimes .M pretty much told me I was the perfect girlfriend. Clearly not enough to make a relationship work.
I’m sorry to be blunt, but you guys weren’t a match. And I know you like to argue you don’t have to me in a “mature”age. But you do. It’s the time of your ice you slow down and enjoy each other and hobbies and spending time together. You weren’t doing that. I’m pretty sure my dad would be miserable in his retirement if he had a wife who didn’t do things with him and lived a parallel life. They done with friends, ride bikes together on the board walk, go to co certain together, travel together and go to hockey games together.
Don’t settle for a life to have a body there. No one should do that at any age. I understand you loved her . That is something to mourn. But she did do you a favor, just like she said she was. There is more out there for you than a warm body at night. I promise you that
Thought about the money thing while I was on my lunch time walk. I wasn't sure whether to respond or not but thinking about it on a pleasant day put some context behind things.
For pretty much my entire marriage - so most of my adult life, I was made to feel that my primary contributions to the family were putting food on the table and taking care of practical things around the house. My now-ex never complimented me and when I would be proud of some accomplishment or other she would snap back that I shouldn't take on airs.
We struggled financially for most of the years we were married despite us having a pretty decent family income. The reasons for that are complex but come down to the consequences of poor choices made by us both. We certainly did do better than most of our contemporaries although most people around us, including my own children believed that we were on the lower income scales. My ex was always envious of those who had more than us and would regularly make comparisons, but would quickly say that - well - they worked hard for it.
I'm pretty confident that when my ex had her affair that one of the motivating factors for her was the fact that the guy she was chasing after was the potential more comfortable life he could offer her as a small business owner. SIL1 suspects that now that he's retired that he has a modest 7 figure net worth. That certainly reinforced that money does matter.
When I became single, many people emphasized to me that I was an open target for a particular demographic. Specifically single mothers. I come complete with a 6 figure income, no debt outside a modest mortgage (we'd gotten everything cleared off literally months before her affair), big albeit somewhat shabby house, decent teeth and hair. FSL who I was attracted to absolutely fell in to this category. So did B. I was very careful even after she moved in to give her no clear concept of exactly how much money I make. It did make me laugh because she would be outraged by the high salaries that the local nuclear plant paid and that her STBX made working there before he retired. I make similar money - I just don't flash it around. Most who have been following along perhaps remember my concern on if she was attracted to me, or to what I brought in practical terms. We'll possibly never clearly know the answer to that question although I do have to admire the fact that she left for other reasons and didn't stay just to take advantage of my good will.
So this is something I need to unlearn. Tough to do because it "is" actually true - but not for any woman that I should be wanting in my life.
Hope that makes things clearer.
And don't send that mushy birthday greeting! She wouldn't to you. If you have to say something just a simple Happy Birthday will suffice.
Anything more looks like pursuing.
I agree with KMl,
Please no soppy messages!
Agreed, no messages. But, what if Andrew sends B a picture of himself only clad in a nice bow tie?
Don’t settle for a life to have a body there. No one should do that at any age. I understand you loved her. That is something to mourn. But she did do you a favor, just like she said she was. There is more out there for you than a warm body at night. I promise you that
Hey Andrew - Anyway, here’s a question. What to you would be an ideal partnership? What traits would your dream partner have? What activities would you want you and your partner to do (example - talk for hours about current events, visit museums etc)
I am soooooooo very glad the girls made these posts. I've been thinking the very same things for awhile now but figured I wasn't the best messenger to deliver the message. It's clearly better coming from both of them. But they both have some great comments and questions, including the two snippets that I pulled out.
The biggest question perhaps, and one that you have not really touched on, is as JuJu asked "What to you would be an ideal partnership? What traits would your dream partner have? What activities would you want you and your partner to do?" A statement you made about a month ago hit me like a ton of bricks then and still really smacks me when I think of it. You talked about how all it takes is for a woman to show you some attention and you are smitten - I'm paraphrasing much of that other than "smitten." That's not enough, Andrew - not nearly enough. It almost fits some of the old jokes of all you need is someone breathing and with a pulse. Who and what that woman is has to be a part of it - not just ANY WOMAN.
Who knows why B moved on but it could very well be she knew that you were out of her league and feared that before too long you'd figure that out. She may have just not at all been comfortable. She is who she is - and that's not who most of your friends and family would envision you with. I think you know deep down B was not even close to the one for you. Thing is, if she came to your door tonight, you'd be doing back flips to welcome her home. Sure, the paid would be gone for now, but you'd be settling beyond believe.
You really deserve more, as the girls have pointed out. You really should give this some more thought. With retirement not too far off, it's even more important to have someone that you can be with 24/7 - as that's how it often is. My mom and dad are 83 and 82 and pretty much spend all of their time together. Sure my dad still does his fishing trips with his friends (the ones that can still walk or have not died) and mom goes to quilting and stuff but they are together like 95% of the year I'll bet. Imagine doing that with someone you really don't have a lot in common with. We have talked about Ginger needing to understand her value and worth. You yourself have said you and Ginger share much in common - and I think this would be true again in this instance.
Based on what you wrote, you and B. weren’t compatible and I think she saw it and didn’t want to settle. You certainly saw it, but you were willing to settle.
Don't be willing to settle, Andrew. You deserve way more than a warm body.
And don't send that mushy birthday greeting! She wouldn't to you. If you have to say something just a simple Happy Birthday will suffice.
Anything more looks like pursuing.
LOL - I've left DB far behind here. Not playing any games, not trying to manipulate any outcomes. I'll be telling a friend how much they mean to me on their special day and sending them fond wishes for a fabulous future. If they respond or not, it matters not. I'm being true to myself. I'm working on accepting that it's over and was undoubtedly never meant to be. I am exiting with my head held high as I hope is B herself. kml - you once wrote to me that a person who can easily discard isn't the sort of person I would want in my life. I've taken that lesson to heart - perhaps more than you intended. I do feel that it is both possible and appropriate to be classy during a break-up.
Agreed, no messages. But, what if Andrew sends B a picture of himself only clad in a nice bow tie?
I think I have some pictures from a couple of years ago of me wearing a bow tie and no shirt .... They are about as sexy as you could imagine. Just think Chip and Dale instead of Chippendales. My now ex-wife used to insist that I always wore a shirt during the spring bear hunt. She always regretted that Target never really had much of a presence here in Canada. Great deals on shirts if I remember correctly.
I'm not saying don't wish her happy birthday - just leave out the mushy stuff. Otherwise she'll think she can keep you in Plan B territory, like that other ex-boyfriend of hers. Don't give her the false impression that you are pining.
AS for the general discussion here about "settling" versus ideal mates - the truth is somewhere in the middle. If I'd held out for my perfect match I definitely would not have had as much great sex and good companionship as I have had in the ten years since my divorce. And I rather doubt I would have found that perfect match by waiting. I've learned a lot about what I value in a relationship and what I can let go. NOBODY that I have met or dated since my divorce would meet all the checked boxes on a list. We definitely don't want to be settling for someone who isn't meeting our needs, but at the same time, some give and take is natural.
Definitely not encouraging a few to find a perfect partner. There is no such thing. There will always be give and take and that makes room to enjoy your own interests. But incompatibility and leading parallel lives never really turns out well.
No one had ever met all my check boxes. But it’s good to have check boxes and be aware of them when choosing a partner .
Thanks all - I am so very grateful to have such good friends here.
Before job gets out her baton and waves me along, I've already started a new thread for us to continue to explore things. Perhaps with a different focus. I am very flattered by the feedback that you have all been so very kind to provide.
These Boots
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2863282&#Post2863282
Totally agree with kml on the birthday greeting. I don't see an issue with you sending her a greeting. Well, actually I do, as in I would NOT do it, but I'm not you, so I get that is who you are and you feel like you are staying true to yourself and being classy, so I get it. BUT, you should TOTALLY leave out all the mushy stuff. You can still be classy and stay true to yourself through the break up with a simple "happy birthday, hope you have a wonderful day" or something along those lines. Polite, friendly, but not sappy, mushy, romantic, lovey/dovey.
To Don's point, I agree that you are worth a lot more than what you got. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure B is a lovely woman in her own right, but I do not think that she is the right woman for you. You are so much more valuable than you give yourself credit for (like G) and you need to learn that REAL value. I, like Don, suspect that while you say you are moving forward and letting it go and all of that, if B showed up at your door tomorrow, you would welcome her back with open arms. Now, if you did that, I couldn't really say much beyond you do you, but as someone else pointed out in an early comment (I think it was Juju), if one read between the lines of some of your last posts right before you and B broke up, you were not as happy as you wanted us to believe. I think you had doubts, but like G, you were trying to out think them or put them to the side or making excuses or whatever you want to call it.
To kml's recent point above, I think that she's right that settling vs. finding the ideal mate really has a truth somewhere in the middle. Nobody is perfect. NOBODY. But, you can be familiar with the things that are most important to you and choose a woman accordingly. You have pointed out yourself, Andrew, that there were several seemingly important layers that you and B were incompatible on: intelligence level, financial acumen, general interests. Differences can be a good thing because they allow 2 people to maintain their own individual identity in a relationship, but too many differences is just too hard to balance. You need to find someone with whom you are more compatible and I think in the grand scheme of things, you and B simply weren't compatible. As much as I hate to say it, because I was SO anti CL all along, you need a woman more like her: educated, professional, earns her own money. Someone who is a saver and doesn't live paycheck to paycheck.
Sure, maintain a friendship with B, if you choose to do so (though I am probably in the minority when I say that I just never really see the point in that. I have one X from my past that I am friendly with and we talk every few months, just catching up, but everyone else is fairly non-existent in my life because I outgrew them, if that makes sense). Anyway, by all means, keep it classy and friendly, but don't let her think that you are still just sitting there waiting for her to run back to you. That isn't healthy for either of you.