Time Will Do the Talking - 05/26/10 08:54 PM
Hi all,
Haven't posted in a long time.
Been almost 2 years since the divorce. It took me a long time to get over things - maybe too long in the eyes of some, maybe about average in the eyes of others. I have to admit that I'll probably never REALLY be over the D - I think the emotional scars will be there for the rest of my life. But I've taken time to heal and move on and while I may not understand why things happened the way they did, I chalk it up to the fact that neither me nor my XW had the skill set to deal with each other in a way that the other needed.
A few months ago, I found myself reflecting back on the whole experience to a friend, saying "I know deep down that the marriage could have been saved if my XW had been willing to talk about the problems rather than stonewalling and seeking out OM." It took me a long time to learn the ridiculousness of that statement - put another way, it would have worked if my XW had been someone else. But she wasn't. She's the type of person who stonewalls and has affairs rather than try to work through any problems. And more importantly, she'll always place herself and her own ambitions over everything else.
Now, don't get me wrong. I pretty much failed as a husband - I didn't help around the house enough, I didn't make her feel loved, I didn't initiate enough activites, etc. - complaints I think many have heard. So she had good reason to shut down. But I think we all want a second chance and sometimes our companion is willing to grant that, sometimes not. If my XW had been someone else, I know that second chance would have repaired the damage, because I hadn't been in a good space (depressed) and needed to be jarred back into action and I'm wholeheartedly willing to address the problems and work towards solutions. But that wasn't the case - she said nothing and didn't offer a second chance. And who's to say she wasn't right? I think she was operating in a way that was most true to herself. And her approach is probably what makes her most happy - maybe not ultimately but certainly in the short-term. Granted, I don't think those kinds of choices will ever provide the basis of a lasting relationship, but she may not be the kind of person that really wants a long term relationship. She's happy focusing on herself and not really thinking about what I call the collateral damage. I know, that sounds a bit snippy, but to be honest, society values long-term relationships over flings, so when you enter a relationship, you expect a little more effort. And I value long-term relationships over short-term, so her approach is both alien and unacceptable to me.
In any case, I've finally posted because here it is, almost 2 years post-D. I wouldn't say I'm back on top, but I've moved on. I currently work on a freelance project with my XW, at her urging, and that arrangement is fine. I think she's very skilled at what she does. But I also find that I have no respect for her as a human being, whatsoever. I think she's a user and a fake - someone who values surface acquaintances over deeper friendships. Other co-workers remark that they find her always on the defensive, acting like any disagreement is a personal attack. That said, I'm perfectly able to divide work and personal life, and to be cordial and businesslike, although clearly my personal knowledge of her bleeds over.
What's odd is that my XW seems to press the boundaries. Not much, but enough that it makes me uncomfortable. I don't know if this means I'm not over things or what, but I find myself reacting. Yet when I think about it, her actions aren't beyond those of an acquaintance. When we have business travel, she wants to coordinate travel plans. On holidays and birthdays, she gives me a small gift. When we meet, she touches on personal subjects that have involved both of us, but not overly so.
I'm not trying to suggest I think she wants to get back together. I don't think she does at all. Nor would I want to. I do, however, find my coping mechanisms from the last 2 years getting in the way. If I look at our interactions in the light of other business acquaintances, I don't see anything out of the ordinary. Certainly I travel with business associates and I get gifts from co-workers and talk about past experiences with my casual friends. But because she and I share an emotional history, I find myself placing more importance on her invocation of those memories and I end up feeling like I need to overreact to compensate. In other words, if a co-worker gave me a gift on my birthday, I'd get them a gift on their birthday. Reciprocation. But my XW giving me a gift on my birthday, with a note that acknowledged the gift was related to a past experience (hence she knew I'd like it), makes me want to throw up a higher, more secure wall. I wont reciprocate. I won't travel with her. I won't acknowledge a shared past, because that means admitting to emotions that might be a bit too raw, still.
I guess it's all about relationship management. I decided to write her off, but she still is clinging on - more so than I would have imagined. And that confuses me, because she's the one who didn't want this.
So why am I posting? I guess because I want feedback on how to act. There's all this advice about forgiving for your own good, taking the high road, parting as friends if it can be managed, etc. There's also being true to your core values, your N.U.T.S., in somewhat common parlance, which might mean not valuing this kind of shallowness. So I guess I'm looking for input on situations where you've both moved on, but you want to make sure you've both moved on. Is gift-giving normal? Is acknowledging and fostering past connections a good idea? Should you really treat an X the way you would treat a co-worker or even a friend, or does a past history change that relationship enough to forever alter things? In other words, what does friendship with the ex, especially when you don't share children, really mean?
thanks in advance for your thoughts - lodo
Haven't posted in a long time.
Been almost 2 years since the divorce. It took me a long time to get over things - maybe too long in the eyes of some, maybe about average in the eyes of others. I have to admit that I'll probably never REALLY be over the D - I think the emotional scars will be there for the rest of my life. But I've taken time to heal and move on and while I may not understand why things happened the way they did, I chalk it up to the fact that neither me nor my XW had the skill set to deal with each other in a way that the other needed.
A few months ago, I found myself reflecting back on the whole experience to a friend, saying "I know deep down that the marriage could have been saved if my XW had been willing to talk about the problems rather than stonewalling and seeking out OM." It took me a long time to learn the ridiculousness of that statement - put another way, it would have worked if my XW had been someone else. But she wasn't. She's the type of person who stonewalls and has affairs rather than try to work through any problems. And more importantly, she'll always place herself and her own ambitions over everything else.
Now, don't get me wrong. I pretty much failed as a husband - I didn't help around the house enough, I didn't make her feel loved, I didn't initiate enough activites, etc. - complaints I think many have heard. So she had good reason to shut down. But I think we all want a second chance and sometimes our companion is willing to grant that, sometimes not. If my XW had been someone else, I know that second chance would have repaired the damage, because I hadn't been in a good space (depressed) and needed to be jarred back into action and I'm wholeheartedly willing to address the problems and work towards solutions. But that wasn't the case - she said nothing and didn't offer a second chance. And who's to say she wasn't right? I think she was operating in a way that was most true to herself. And her approach is probably what makes her most happy - maybe not ultimately but certainly in the short-term. Granted, I don't think those kinds of choices will ever provide the basis of a lasting relationship, but she may not be the kind of person that really wants a long term relationship. She's happy focusing on herself and not really thinking about what I call the collateral damage. I know, that sounds a bit snippy, but to be honest, society values long-term relationships over flings, so when you enter a relationship, you expect a little more effort. And I value long-term relationships over short-term, so her approach is both alien and unacceptable to me.
In any case, I've finally posted because here it is, almost 2 years post-D. I wouldn't say I'm back on top, but I've moved on. I currently work on a freelance project with my XW, at her urging, and that arrangement is fine. I think she's very skilled at what she does. But I also find that I have no respect for her as a human being, whatsoever. I think she's a user and a fake - someone who values surface acquaintances over deeper friendships. Other co-workers remark that they find her always on the defensive, acting like any disagreement is a personal attack. That said, I'm perfectly able to divide work and personal life, and to be cordial and businesslike, although clearly my personal knowledge of her bleeds over.
What's odd is that my XW seems to press the boundaries. Not much, but enough that it makes me uncomfortable. I don't know if this means I'm not over things or what, but I find myself reacting. Yet when I think about it, her actions aren't beyond those of an acquaintance. When we have business travel, she wants to coordinate travel plans. On holidays and birthdays, she gives me a small gift. When we meet, she touches on personal subjects that have involved both of us, but not overly so.
I'm not trying to suggest I think she wants to get back together. I don't think she does at all. Nor would I want to. I do, however, find my coping mechanisms from the last 2 years getting in the way. If I look at our interactions in the light of other business acquaintances, I don't see anything out of the ordinary. Certainly I travel with business associates and I get gifts from co-workers and talk about past experiences with my casual friends. But because she and I share an emotional history, I find myself placing more importance on her invocation of those memories and I end up feeling like I need to overreact to compensate. In other words, if a co-worker gave me a gift on my birthday, I'd get them a gift on their birthday. Reciprocation. But my XW giving me a gift on my birthday, with a note that acknowledged the gift was related to a past experience (hence she knew I'd like it), makes me want to throw up a higher, more secure wall. I wont reciprocate. I won't travel with her. I won't acknowledge a shared past, because that means admitting to emotions that might be a bit too raw, still.
I guess it's all about relationship management. I decided to write her off, but she still is clinging on - more so than I would have imagined. And that confuses me, because she's the one who didn't want this.
So why am I posting? I guess because I want feedback on how to act. There's all this advice about forgiving for your own good, taking the high road, parting as friends if it can be managed, etc. There's also being true to your core values, your N.U.T.S., in somewhat common parlance, which might mean not valuing this kind of shallowness. So I guess I'm looking for input on situations where you've both moved on, but you want to make sure you've both moved on. Is gift-giving normal? Is acknowledging and fostering past connections a good idea? Should you really treat an X the way you would treat a co-worker or even a friend, or does a past history change that relationship enough to forever alter things? In other words, what does friendship with the ex, especially when you don't share children, really mean?
thanks in advance for your thoughts - lodo