A new year, a new perspective - DivorceBusting.com

howdy folks,

thought I'd get a new place for the new year.
trying to keep the focus on the possitive and the progress vs. wallowing in the negative.

I'll have to take some time and set some new goals for this new year.

all in all things are going very well.
seems like h is here to stay and I assume the appartment will be going soon. (not that he uses it much anyway..actually yesterday he could have gone there to take his nap after the storm but came here instead!!

)

we are making progress, will there be an occassional outburst and backslide, of that you can be sure.

I am looking forward to this new year and plan to make the best of it. lot's of new things in sight for me when I finally quit being afraid and go after them.

the winter gets me down, especially being a stay at home mom of two little ones, the spring isn't all that far off and then I will be able to breath again.

LL

LL,

Quoting lostlove:
I am looking forward to this new year and plan to make the best of it. lot's of new things in sight for me when I finally quit being afraid and go after them.

It always takes lots of courage to make changes and challenge oneself. I admire your courage and am glad things are going well. Keep up the good job to help your H come home and stay happily married. Hey, he is home already, isn't he?

It is always a great feeling to see loved one belonging to each other.

Chuck

Quote:

Hey, he is home already, isn't he?

yes chuck, you are right to point that out, h is home, every night without fail (well except for if it's snowing and he's out plowing)

guess I am still stuck on waiting for some grand gesture from him, like a new marriage proposal or something! the sappy romantic in me..gee wasn't it grand enough that he woke up to reality and came home to his family???

LL who is thinking of some goals to write up so ya'll can remind me of what I should be focussing on when I get in a mood. (and any of you that have read me long enough know that is sure to happen from time to time!!

)

LL

Hey LL I'am glad to see you on this post. I have one question what was your secret to sucess.

hey 27,
no secret, just let go, take care of you, make yourself a better person and leave the rest up to the guy in the sky!!
accept that whatever happens happens and you will be ok regardless!!

LL

Quoting lostlove:
no secret, just let go, take care of you, make yourself a better person and leave the rest up to the guy in the sky!!accept that whatever happens happens and you will be ok regardless!!

Trying to get there LL. I'm ready. A door on my heart closed today after H was a complete idiot on phone last night. That "angry guy" showed his true colors, and I do not like that man.

Why do I even want this man in my life anymore? Ready to move forward without him. Maybe one day he'll come back my way, but I am not waiting.

Happy New Year!

mal Rebuilding me in 03!!

Let's hear it for the refresh button at the end of the year!

LL you are so cool -- put them rules down one- two- three.
I am so happy you are renewing things with your H. Good work, grrrlll!

I really relate to wanting a romantic ceremony, new vows. Sounds like we are at similar places.
My H is also home and seems happy. What next?

"I want more R talk."

But I do not talk about the R. Taboo subject. Amazingly, however, now
that I'm silent on the subject, he's beginning to talk about "us."
He reminisces a little, looks forward a little, cuddles "his grrrlll."

"I want to have another wedding ceremony."

The old me would be bitter by now that he hasn't "read my mind"
and asked me to marry him again.
The new me doesn't demand any particular words,
but lets him re-connect "in his own way."

"I want him to shut down his other place for good."

I do not like him maintaining that apartment.
But I will not talk about his other place with him.
Taboo subject. Bite your lip, Bridget.

Old me would have: dramatized my pain over him moving there,
made subtle digs about how it's a financial drain,
pushed him to close it down in a symbolic gesture (stake thru heart of OW)

New me will: let him re-frame his "bachelor pad" as an "office space,"
will (gulp) drop by there when he asks me to come over so he can show me
something he's working on, will see his gesture as HIM putting stake thru
heart of his "other life apart"

"What goals next?"

-- Find peace with what happened to us/accept reality
(including H being MALE with all the trappings)

-- Fit myself squarely in the picture (meet my own true needs,
I get to play, I get some toys, I can have online friends,
I can be fit, I can fit in)

-- See happiness (lighten up)/talk back to the distorted negative
(no more catastrophizing mindreading dire predictions
blaming labelling shoulds perfectionism)

-- Learn to play kick-ass guitar

Let's keep checking in to see "what actions" we come up with, eh?

Cheerio, B

Cheers,

Bridget

Hey, LL - love your new digs. Glad that H has found his way back home - hopefully to stay!

You and the other ladies on the Piecing board (Hoping (Sue), Tielbeagle (Lisa), Lily and too many others to mention) are an inspiration to us poor guys who struggle to get a clue concerning our relationships with our W's!

Looking forward to what 2003 brings for all of us!

Hey LL,

Please feel good about the fact he's with you. Romantic gestures are tough for guys....well not me, but I'm atypical. Again, cut him some slack and go easy on him. My sense is he realized what he was close to throwing away and probably needs to come to terms with some guilt for putting you through it. You've shown him you'd be OK with or w/o him so don't put in additional pressure on him!

Again...my $0.02.

Jim

Quote:

You've shown him you'd be OK with or w/o him so don't put in additional pressure on him!

hey jim, thanks for stopping by.

you are certainly right about that. one of the things he said he feared about comming back is that I was doing ok without him, sure it took me a few months but I was ok. (way to act as if) even said to his mother "what if she doesn't like me" huh?

I know I need to lay off waiting for some grand gesture and learn to appreciate the small stuff, cause hey after all before he left it was the small stuff that I was looking for.

LL

I cant waiy to post here.I think I am on the right track.

Hey LL,

Yeah, I think I know where you're coming from with letting our Ses know we're okay. I'm reinvigorated to do just this...and do it NOW!

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I know I need to lay off waiting for some grand gesture and learn to appreciate the small stuff, cause hey after all before he left it was the small stuff that I was looking for.

Ahhh...truth reverberating in my ears. I think we all need to constantly take stock in the little stuff and definitely not get caught up on that one gesture. Patience, right? Ugh!

You're sounding great, LL. Thanks again for your support.

bellis

LL, thing sound good at your house..hang in there with the cabin fever and the little kids...spring is just around the corner..I like what Jim said about men and romance though...I so want my h to be that "kind" of guy, but he never has been..so why would I think he will become one!!!
Take care
Sue

Hi LL,

Great new attitude. Thanks for your advice and inspiration. You've taught me I'll be okay. I think I have hope.

Dotto

How is LL today?

jethro

thanx for asking,
I am a bit down, it's snowing AGAIN!! which is very nice for the money and it does make things all purty and stuff BUT, it takes h away, out to plow, down in that area, getting stuff ready, waiting it out, taking a nap at the appartment cause when he called buddie he was already asleep himself.
so LL is insecure and tired and feeling a bit like a litte girl afraid that her hot new boy friend is going to cheat on her with every little blondie that talks nice to him, ya know.

time to get over it, cause ya know what. I aint to shabby myself!!!

and h knows that, and isn't going to run off with any little blondie, not the pittiful sad woman who is now leaving her h as a result of their stupidity and will be alone cause my h made the right choice in comming home to be with ME!! and not with anyone else, think he's learned his lesson the hard way.

LL

LL

LL, I'm sorry you're feeling down. I know what you mean about the snow. I thought this before, but never told you: I lived in AK for about five years, so I have a pretty good idea about the demands that kind of weather puts on those who plow...and their loved ones.

Hang in there!

jethro

ll, was thinking of you because i heard it is snowing up your way. of course just freezing rain here! thanks for boosting my pma on my thread. i feel better. lisa

ya it's snowing up here, supposed to get like 20" ugh!! it's not so much that i don't like the snow, I do, hey I've got 4 wheel drive. it's that h left this am at 9:30 and I don't know when I will see him again but i know that when I do...he will be exaughsted from the storm. also a little bummed cause these storms are not totaly predictable there is some waiting time and sometimes that waiting time is spent down there ( bout 25 miles south of home) so this afternoon h had lunch in a resteraunt (by himself but the one he took ow to) and then waiting for more snow to fall went to the appartment to get some rest. just the mention of the appartment bugged me, he didn't intend to go there was going to buddies but buddie was already asleep so he ended up at the apartment. just unsettling for me but h knows it and called as soon as he woke and was talkative and told me to call him when I am going to sleep (otherwise I would not have still have hard time calling him as if it's still not ok)

I worry sometimes, I don't want to push him away and it seems the way he came home was by me just "goind dark" and acting "as if" well what do you do once they come home????

I think this morning I told h like 5 times that I love him, even once called him and said "do you know" h "know what" "how much I love you"
I haven't said it for so long I want to say it all the time but can't.
I suppose now it is safe? he is home right?

LL

ll, 20"! geez, that's a lot of snow. the restaurant, it's not chilis is it? that used to be one of our faves so when he left he brought Sk. there a lot. i haven't been since.

i think it was nice you told h how much you love him, it probably made his day. do you let him tell you first usually? i do now.
i am tired of painting, we are working on the house(inside). i can only do it after d goes to bed. i get up with her every morning. i wish i had more alone time. you must relate having 2 little ones! i joke with my h that the only reason i go to work is so i can go to the bathroom in peace!

i hope your weekend is good despite the snow!lisa

no it's not chili's (he did take her out to dinner while we were separated but I assume all she was worth was a trip to the 99) , I think because it was a year ago that i found out about her and then after h's leaving and comming back again learned that he had still been seeing her despite the fact that he told me he wasn't I'm kinda iffy. seems different this go around though, he doesn't get angry when I ask. today I said to him that I'm scared, he said he knows he hasn't been around much 'cause of the snow storms but assures me that he is with no one but me.

ow is a customer (i hope not come the spring but guess I have to leave that up to h, he knows my thoughts)
and someone plows the driveway, I just hope that is not on h's route. last thing I need is for her to be bringing him out a cup of coffee, saying oh how are you doing??? bla bla bla.

anyway!!

LL

she needs to find another man to "plow her driveway"

hopefully her own. the fact that your h didn't get mad really shows he has nothing to hide. he is not with her. he loves you. he is home with you. he has children with you. he has a past, present and future with you. she was make believe, an escape, not reality. bty, is she still married? sick? and aren't there other companies she can call for her landscaping needs? can you h refuse to go to that job? lisa

as far as I know she is still married, it was only august when she finally asked her h for a d and the last I knew her h was still living in the home.

there certainly are other landscaping companies in the town that she could well get (she may not be able to afford landscaping once she does get the d, doubt her h will be as generous as mine was going to be with me)
it basically comes down to a business decision for h to make. I have argued with him about keeping that house on his customer list but really I can't make the decision for him... he knows my thoughts and honestly if he knows what is best for him he will drop them. thing is he does have other customers on the street (culdisac) and one of his fears is that they'll drop him (ya whatever if he's good they'll keep him regardless of who cares for that house but then again people are weird) I recommended that he contract the street out to someone else (he has done that with some other customers when the load got heavy) then all that comes through him is the paperwork and he does not have to go there.
at this point I think h now knows what he has to lose by keeping this woman in his life and it really isn't worth it.

I keep having an urge to send this poor pathetic woman an annonomous copy of dr. why would I want to help her save her m now that I've got my h?? cause I am a sap!!

LL

You know LL, he has to make his own decisions and whatever that may be, it is not up to you to really judge wether it is the right decision or not. I completely understand your worries, but at some point, for the marriage to be rock steady, you will have to let go and simply trust him again. And maybe this "test" is exactly the time to do it. Dont question his decisions, but be there for him and support him. He may very well sens this trust and love you even more for it. So let him plow her driveway if he must and stop worrying. He says he is with you, it is perhaps time for you to truely believe it

!

Steph

Quoting lostlove:
why would I want to help her save her m now that I've got my h?? cause I am a sap!!

LOL. You are just a woman with a big heart.

I did agree with Lisa; it is not appropriate for your H to keep plow the OW's driveway. Looks like you guys got it all planned out. But, as you know, you have to decide the timing of it. Even though your H is home, it may need another while before you can make such a request...

Quoting lostlove:
just the mention of the appartment bugged me

Really, I know how upset you must feel about the apartment, as it must have reminded you of the unpleasant memories. However, don't sweat on the small matter. In the grand scheme of your H's coming home, this is not going to matter. See how much understanding he showed to you when you said you were scared. He really knows how you feel, but just give him a little bit more time to sort out "his" best thing to do. Remember, Martians hate women telling them to do things...

Is his love language act of service? I see him working very hard for his family, but not really big on making an occassion (like making fuss of a proposal to you...) I see his actions speak lots of love and caring for you and your family. Give him some credit for working hard in the days like this. Geez, 20" out your neck of woods

? That is lots of snow and lots of $$$

(more importantly, lots of work...

)

Chuck

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Is his love language act of service? I see him working very hard for his family,

I honestly don't know, cause when he was fully adimant about wanting a d, he still wanted to pay for the house and provide (very well) for the kids and ME, he wanted to cut the lawn, brought me a drink if I happend to be here at the same time as him, talked of putting in a pool for the kids and I etc...all this while he was "in love" with ow and planning to be with her. he wasn't doing these things for her? so then what is his love language?? dammed if I know, don't think he does either.

I have been feeling down lately and I don't think it has anything to do with h. when h left I had already started to loose the pregnancy weight and just kept loosing over the summer, got to the point that people were asking if I was eating, my clothes (even the new ones) were hanging on me, I was getting to be skin and bones, a month or two before h's return I got my appetite back and now that h is back it seems like I am always hungry (and no their is no pregnancy inducing hunger) so since h's return I have put back on 10lbs. and I don't like it. maybe I'll find a new gym to join and just keep the cookies that I bake in the freezer (I hate them cold but h and son don't mind them that way so if I keep them there I wont eat them)

also have been thinking alot about what I am going to do with my life. what do I want to be when I grow up?? do I have to grow up??? I will be 30 this month, is that bothering me?

so things to do soon.

find a new gym in the area that doesn't cost a fortune. preferably one with an in house day-care for patrons. (hey why not right as long as it's clean)

go tanning (may help with the cabin fever and a tan is always purty)

find a part time job, could settle for walmart but would prefer to find a halfway house for teens or something like that needing night help.

talk to friends sister who is a hs guidance councelor about her job (pay, schedule, requirements etc)

get back to keeping the focus on me.. and letting h be h.

oh spring please come soon!!!

LL

LL:

I am slowly making it through your threads. Right now for me it's been just 3 mos since H left. That's right about where I am in reading your sitch. I am having the same frustations you were having at that time.....tired of fighting it. So I am truly at the point of detaching and completely letting go and let God. I hold onto my faith that God will see me through this. And that He will work on both myself and my H individually so we can one day be together again.

I would appreciate it if you would go through my threads and give me some insight as to what you think I've done right and/or wrong so far. Meanwhile, I still have a lot to read up on your's. I think when I stopped reading last night I was up to August.

Thanks for your time.

Quoting lostlove:
a month or two before h's return I got my appetite back and now that h is back it seems like I am always hungry

We saw that at the brewery. Nachos anyone?!

SI

Quote:

We saw that at the brewery. Nachos anyone?!

SI

awww! c'mon now I wasn't the only one eating them and they were good! plus I hadn't eaten dinner and you could've said something nice like we'll LL I've seen you and I don't know where you're hiding this supposed 10lbs!
ya damn martian!!

LL

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I worry sometimes, I don't want to push him away and it seems the way he came home was by me just "goind dark" and acting "as if" well what do you do once they come home????

Well, although my W was at home, she wasn't mentally. Tell you what, LL, when you discover the answer to this question, please pass it on my way. I don't know what the hell to do?!?!

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think this morning I told h like 5 times that I love him, even once called him and said "do you know" h "know what" "how much I love you"
I haven't said it for so long I want to say it all the time but can't.

How does he respond, LL? Does he reciprocate those words? I understand this need, and I also understand that by saying it it's more pressure. Maybe in your sitch it's not quite as much pressure as in mine.

You talked about doing this and that (like a job) to keep yourself busy. Do you think if you really went after it, it would be the same as when you acted "as if" to get your H back? In other words, do you think by doing your own thing, it will bring your H closer? Seemed like it worked before...

jethro

Quote:

You talked about doing this and that (like a job) to keep yourself busy. Do you think if you really went after it, it would be the same as when you acted "as if" to get your H back? In other words, do you think by doing your own thing, it will bring your H closer? Seemed like it worked before...

it was a bit easier for me to do my own thing before, because we were separated and h came to "visit" the kids, when he came (after I realized it did no good to play happy family) I'd leave, I had every tues and thurs night free, every other sat night free, and every sunday free to do my own thing!! now it seems I need permission or need to make a request, hell h left yesterday morning at 9:30 am and still isn't home and it's 6 pm the next day, yes he did stop by some time round 4am to plow our driveway but it's me and the kids as usual!!

so last night on the phone h made a big boo boo!! he was rambling of what he had to do and said then I'll have to come up their and plow "your" driveway, when I said I wish you hadn't said that, he said oh I'm sorry s's driveway. even worse, so then he had to go..I called back and said, "what'd ya go plow her driveway and get sucked back into that world that this is my house?" he had to go, the truck was stuck.

well when h did come in at 5 am he did apologize but whatever.

I really don't know if I can live with all this. I'm trying and sometimes things are going well and other times I think the only reason I am doing this is because of the kids. but if h is still seeing or talking to or thinking about ow, why bother????

oh do I need a life, and I think the next time I see SI i'll have to give him a good whack for his 2cents comment..sheesh of all things to pull out of my posts...way to go boosting a fellow dbr's pma SI good thing you don't have your own thread cause I'd really tear you a new one right now!!

LL

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just let go, take care of you, make yourself a better person and leave the rest up to the guy in the sky!!
accept that whatever happens happens and you will be ok regardless!!

I just read this on one of your posts here... and I think it might be along the lines of how I am thinking right now. I just feel like I need to "let it go"... accept that it is over, and get on with my life. Is that a bad attitude to take?

Quote:

I just feel like I need to "let it go"... accept that it is over, and get on with my life. Is that a bad attitude to take?

certainly not!! it is the only attitude to take. acceptance is key. accept that whatever happens happens and you'll be ok. that way your ready for anything!!

LL

Thanks LL,
I seem to remember you saying that you had basically done the same. Is that correct?

yes jw,
when I finally just "gave up" and accepted that h just wasn't comming home. That is when things started to change. that is not to say that I stopped "wanting" for h to come home, or gave up all hope that he ever would, I simply just accepted it. Hell I even started to worry what if he decides to come back and I'm not sure if I want him to, what will I do then? luckily enough h decided to come back before the point of no return (if there even is one).

LL

Thanks LL,
I just wondered. Because I am inclined at this point to do just that. I think it will give me more "peace". I still would like for her to come back, but thing I will function better if I just let go.

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I really don't know if I can live with all this. I'm trying and sometimes things are going well and other times I think the only reason I am doing this is because of the kids.

I hear ya, LL. Boy, do I hear ya...

In terms of doing things you want and getting out of the house, can you not make some demands? I mean, I know the weather drives a lot of your H's work, but what the hell? Can't something be worked out? I can't help but think this would help both of you...

jethro

I am tired, tired, tired!!! there never seems to be a "right" time to talk about things, and honestly I don't think h wants to talk about things. he seems to just want to go along merrily and let things just be! wtf? you can't just put things under the carpet, there are obviously issues in our r that need to be worked out, talked about, dealt with etc. or we will simply find ourselves in the same place again!

there just never seems to be a right time with h and it is bothering me.

so h finnaly made it home tonight at about 8pm after I had put the kids to bed.
I had asked h to bring home milk for dd for the am, he did but he knocked it over in comming in the door and called for a mop. I told him to just leave it there and I'd clean it up before I went out to get more milk. h came in, I made his dinner, he sat and talked about how much snow we have here and that he'd probably go down to work area tommorrow to get the bobcat to clean it up (yup we got that much) I said nothing, then h said well maybe I can have employee bring it up cause I really don't want to leave tommorrow

. h said his head was spinning, I asked why, he said so much to do, I said well don't worry about here you have enough to worry about. I then got ready to go get the milk, h thought I couldn't get my car out cause his truck was in the way...thought for a sec then said I suppose you could just take it...let me know I'd have to back down the driveway cause he didn't plow the turnaround, was ok by me. then all of a sudden h (who couldn't clean up milk) decides he's gonna turn the truck around. ya whatever go run and erase the calls from your second cell phone. so then I ask h when he last spoke to ow..he says a while ago I don't know (ya whatever) I said honestly when. h says a couple weeks ago...no no about a month ago before the first snow to find out about the drive and where to put the snow...like he hasn't been plowing this driveway for years???

so that's that I leave in his truck..(btw ow's h still living at house he answered when I called. shame on me I hung up, I need to grow up don't I)

low and behold there lies h's plow list and the lists of his employees as well...yup you guessed it contrary to what h says to me...her house is on his list clearly defined as "my list"

whatever...I came home and told h I will not trust him as long as he keeps lying to me.

before I left I let h know that I am seriously considering getting a job and putting the kids in daycare..I do not want to pretend to be a happy housewife when I am not.

h's response what did you think it would be like having kids. you knew you'd be home with them.

h wants to live his life and apparently if I am not to make waves in it I am to live his life too or be made to feel like less of a woman.

honestly how many women today stay at home alone in the woods all day long with nobody but two little kids...waiting for somebody to come home who she never knows what his mood will be??

I feel like a kept woman and I don't like it. why should I have to live under his thumb? why should I if I want to have something for myself have it only at night??

should I just be like him and his mother...make the decision all on my own and just tell him??

obviously I am a bit angry right now.
h has tromped off to bed angry. to my bed. great so now when I want to go to sleep there'll be a sweaty dirty (unless he stopped at his lovely little appartment to take a shower I noticed that the truck has already been swept out from the storm) grumpy man!

I just want to go home!!!

LL

LL, take a deep breath..relax..don't let the weather,cabin fever two small kids get the best of you.(Boy that all does sound depressing!!)You have been doing so great..so strong..Your h is home..if he still wanted ow do you think he would be there??? You have to give both of you the chance to heal and mend your hearts, your marriage,your trust, everyting that has been broken...take a day at a time..slowlee.If you really want to get a job..go for it..
Are there any kind of "Moms Day out" programs near you to leave kids a few hours a week? Anything to give you alone time..I remember those days, but would not trade them for anything.
Hope tomorrow is a better day for you..
Sue

tommorrow is always a better day for me, but unlike h, I am not good at just putting yesterday behind me without resolution. h can go to sleep and fall asleep (I cannot never have been able to even before all this the day just re-plays in my head)
tommorow I will wake on eggshells with h, not knowing what to expect. h will wake and "act as if".
I just want a real r, if this is real I don't like it.

I just want peace!! I want to breath! I want to know that I can run over to my h and hug him and not have it be "persuit" I just want to be me damn it!!

LL

I really don't know what to do anymore...seems like all I am doing is pushing h away again and I don't want to. I just want some resolve and I don't feel it happening. maybe it is a case of my looking for to much and not seeing the trees through the forest, maybe there are baby steps and I am still looking for the grand gestures. it just felt so good when h first decided he wanted to try, perhaps that was because then I was detached and now that I have gotten comfortable I have once again latched on and become dependant again. or have I just fallen under h's thumb. is it him? is it me? I don't know.

there are so many things I want to do even simple things around the house. I am here all day long just looking at the walls, I hate white walls but h grew up with stark white walls, I want color even if subtle...I want to experiment with decorating. why shouldn't I? if h were still out I would, I would not wait for fil to do it, I would not ask h's opinion (though I now know that he hates the color of the master bath! it is deep blue

he thinks it should be white)

Is it me? allowing myself to fall under his rule and then resenting him for it?? probably

I hate this..right now I so just want to crawl into bed and cuddle my h, but I wont because I don't want to be rejected and then angered more.

LL

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should I just be like him and his mother...make the decision all on my own and just tell him??

Would it help?

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I just want peace!! I want to breath! I want to know that I can run over to my h and hug him and not have it be "persuit" I just want to be me damn it!!

You know, I've only had my W back for about a week...well, maybe I should say, so far the alien has been gone for a week--I think you know what I mean. In any case, I find myself wanting to be more affectionate also...like I used to. But then I second-guess myself. Do I...don't I? Should I...shouldn't I? Will plan X bring my closer to goal A, or will plan Y? Ugh!

In any case, LL, I'm sorry you're feeling down. Maybe in the morning (which is all of a few hours from now and you probably won't get this) YOU should act "as if."

LL, your posts scream, "get me out!" I think you've answered all your questions. Let's see, your H is back home and NOT with OW. Good. You are falling under old habits of dependency. Bad. You're going crazy with white walls all day long (cabin fever). Bad. Solution=get out and do your own thing. Perhaps your focus on other thing will relieve some of the focus you have on H, thus reducing pressure for yourself (and maybe pressure for H?). Just MHO. God forbid I walk on eggshells with you. I do it all day long here!

jethro

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Solution=get out and do your own thing. Perhaps your focus on other thing will relieve some of the focus you have on H, thus reducing pressure for yourself (and maybe pressure for H?). Just MHO. God forbid I walk on eggshells with you.

trying to do it, thinking about doing it, but the guilt of feeling like a failure because I couldn't deal with staying home with the kids creeps in. I don't know? I want to stay home with them, but then I want a life too, maybe it's just the winter and the sit getting to me, I didn't feel this way over the summer and then the baby was still baby, (not that 1 1/2 isn't a baby but you get my point)

I know having my own life and my own things will take some pressure off of h. I am still involved with the book club that I started over the summer, actually getting some others involved too...just had a lag with it due to the holidays.

also trying to start doing something each week with a few girlfriends, some in the area and some from hometown. dinner & movie or just girlie chit chat. just to get away. the holidays I guess are just a bad time for it.

looked on line yesterday for a health club and found one that looks appealing and has childcare..so maybe I'll go take a look and join up get in shape again!!

my c keeps pushing me to go back to school, I don't think I am ready for it yet and what's the rush anyway? I already have the bs.

crapper, was going to take a shower while dd slept and h and son are outside but dd just woke up! what to do, I need a shower. maybe I'll just take dd in with me, used to do that with son, poopie though cause she's already dressed all cute and christmasy, we're going to my moms to make up for christmas...and all the cousins will be there.

hopefully I can just keep on keeping on and try to make the best of every day and every sit. learning what is worth a fight and what isn't. I goofed last night and i know it. I was focussed on the other cell phone. should have just said "oh thanx for turning the truck around" but you can't erase yesterday can you? you can only carry on.

LL

Quote:

trying to do it, thinking about doing it, but the guilt of feeling like a failure because I couldn't deal with staying home with the kids creeps in. I don't know? I want to stay home with them, but then I want a life too, maybe it's just the winter and the sit getting to me, I didn't feel this way over the summer and then the baby was still baby, (not that 1 1/2 isn't a baby but you get my point)

I think it's very admirable you staying at home with the kids, and I wouldn't suggest not doing that by any shape of the imagination. My W does this and I think it's one of the most important things a mother can do. I think one of the things that drove my W to do what she did was that she was at home all the time and didn't do ANYTHING else (except go to the gym). This really got to her because she's pretty outgoing and is a person that needs to keep moving. You strike me as the same type of personality. I understand that living somewhat remotely makes it even more difficult on you, but YOU have to think of YOU. Put on the thinking cap to see what you can come up with. Perhaps a part-time job (1 day a week) or something? Local, volunteer work? I don't know, but I'm convinced it would help that PMA. I'm also convinced you can do something and not sacrifice staying at home with the kids.

Take care, LL.

jethro

Quote:

I'm also convinced you can do something and not sacrifice staying at home with the kids.

you are right, and it would be a sacrifice that I am not willing to make. They are only little once and for such a short time, s will be starting pre-school next year and on it goes from there...do I really want to give (or pay someone else the pleasure) these precouse years away just so I can have a life?? certainly not. I have looked into local gyms and think I've found one that has on sit child care. that is a good thing gives them a little play time with someone other than "ma-ma" or as dd says "ma-mee" and gives me the opportunity to workout and hell if they've got a hot tub, chill for a bit. so there's that and then I have been rattling my brain a bit thinking there must be some local home for teens or something like that that could use some evening help even if 2 nights a week (walmart is ok but I do have a degree rotting away so why not do something that would look good on a resume)

so these things are in my head..now just have to get motivated and do them.

h and I got along fine today, I was mistaken last night he did not go up to our bed. he went to son's bed, found him there when I went up, asked him to please come to bed. he did, I hugged him and that was that.
I didn't bother him this am, I got up with dd and then son woke eventually I made breakfast and then let h know it was ready at 9...I even made him coffee.

h still seems a bit distant...maybe my own perceptions? his buddie seems to be lonley again today cause he called this am, then again while we were on the way to my moms, and now h is on the phone with him again (though this time I think h called him). he knows I am at the puter and yes he knows I come to this site. so maybe that is why he is downstairs talking to buddie.

for now I think I will just go about my business and let h lead, I'd rather be persued anyway.

LL

Quoting lostlove:
I think the next time I see SI i'll have to give him a good whack for his 2cents comment..sheesh of all things to pull out of my posts...way to go boosting a fellow dbr's pma SI good thing you don't have your own thread cause I'd really tear you a new one right now!!

Quote:

oh do I need a life

apparently

Quote:

I just want peace!! I want to breath! I want to know that I can run over to my h and hug him and not have it be "persuit" I just want to be me damn it!!

definitely Combat Fatigue. We really need a DBers' USO Club. Preferably one that serves nachos.

SI

SI,
I do not find you in the least bit ammusing and barely tollerable. if you don't have anything productive to say to me then why don't you practice keeping your mouth shut!!

LL

ll, if you want to feel better about your h, come read about what a winner mine is. i hope that damn tatoo gets infected!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Quote:

so these things are in my head..now just have to get motivated and do them.

Motivation... Isn't that at the crux of everything? Change doesn't just happen...change is a result of making something happen (the quote is something like that)... You know, LL, I've said this before, but this is one of the reasons my W went wacko on me. Please motivate yourself to do something. Who cares whether you use your degree or not right now. In a few years the children will be in school and you can begin to use the degree again. Anyway, my .02...take it as you will.

Sounds like you have some ideas, so that's definitely a start. Just keep moving in that direction...

Glad to hear you and your H are getting along. In terms of him being distant...jeez...who knows. I think I now realize that when my W is distant, it's the guilt alien coming back. At least, that's what I assume so I don't start going down the dark path of thinking she's changing her mind about our R.

Have a great day, LL.

jethro

thanks jethro, (all I can think of is jethro tull, any relevance?)

today I called one of the local gyms that have onsite childcare...I have an appointment to meet with one of their trainers next tues night to look over the club and see if I'd like to join.

this afternoon I called the mountain club to see if there is availability for h and I for the end of the week, there is but we'll have to wait til this evening to make the reservation. (the weather

) there were many times while we were dating that we'd be up there for a ski trip and we'd have to come back so he could plow. major bummer but what can ya do.
suppose I could just say to h tonight. look I'd like to go anyway if you have to leave you have to leave but I'd like the getaway for myself. (I already have my friend comming to stay with the kids) good idea? bad idea? I do have a vaca comming to me (h went to superbowl last year and then to miami for a game in sept)

tonight I have an appointment with my c. think I will ask him about any places in the area that I might get a part time job at. I know I could just work anywhere but honestly I don't want to. I would feel much better if I were doing something with some meaning.

LL

Quote:

all I can think of is jethro tull, any relevance?

YES! Well done, LL! JT's one of my favorite bands. I love their eclectic/folksy/Celtic style.

Quote:

today I called one of the local gyms that have onsite childcare...I have an appointment to meet with one of their trainers next tues night to look over the club and see if I'd like to join.

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look I'd like to go anyway if you have to leave you have to leave but I'd like the getaway for myself. (I already have my friend comming to stay with the kids) good idea? bad idea?

Hmmm... I don't see why that would be bad, but why say anything? I mean, you don't know if he's going to have to come home to plow. Perhaps just act "as if." If he does have to leave, then tell him you want to stay then. Besides, if you put that out there now, he'll think you're okay with him leaving (which I know you're not)...and you will lose your vacation credits for somewhere else...

Let him work for you, LL. Don't let the guy off so easy.

JMHO...

jethro

LL, if I could delete the offending post, I would. It was not my intention to offend, and I apologize.

SI

Quote:

LL, if I could delete the offending post, I would. It was not my intention to offend, and I apologize.

SI

thank you, was that so hard?? next time just keep the nacho comments to yourself 'k?

LL

ok so c very much wants me to go back to school. I don't think there has been a session yet since the idea was first brought up (by me) that he hasn't mentioned it. My mention of getting a part time job was his window of opportunity this time.

I'd love to go back to school, work on getting that masters so that by the time the kids are in school full time I can get right to the real job. but h seems to have an issue with the money? I wonder if it is just the money or if there is some other resignation in there.

when we met I was a junior in hs and h was a sophmore in college, h never did finish, dropped out to start his business, I continued on to get a bs and worked.
I have brought up the going to school thing with h and is doesn't seem like a possitive in his eyes, says why don't I see what I can do with the degree I already have now. thing is I know I will need the masters to get any decent job (isn't that the way) and why not work on that now while I am home with the kids rather than wait til they are in school work somewhere else making the money to pay for it. I don't see that it would be any huge financial burden, hey h, here's a thought, give up the appartment and use that rent money to pay for my schooling?? what d'ya think of that. $ for school issue solved. my viewing the appartment as your still not being fully commited to our m gone. two issues resolved in one shot. hmmmmmm? that makes too much sense though doesn't it. oh but let me guess the money for that apt doesn't come from our household budget? so then neither does my schooling!

ugh!!!

LL

Hi LL. Thought I'd stop by and leave some smiles behind......

hey mal,

thanks for the smiles. I'm always happy to have a visitor.
was just trying to catch up with you, but your too damn popular over there it's hard to read it all. was in the middle of a discussion about your e-mail from h. and a possible appology to him for an encounter.

I'll be reading ya!!

LL

Hi LL, just wanted to tel you that I am reading...just dont have much to add...but thanks for your input on my thread

.

Steph

LL, sounds like you have been doing alot of soul searching..do what you think would be the most fulfilling to you right now.. and still be able to take care of your kids and home..don't get into overload like I see so many young moms do..work, kids, home..they are so stressed and tired and guess what suffers?? all of the above..do some fun thing for you while you can..theres always time for serious work when the kids are in school..I only worked part time (2 days a week) until my kids were in high school..they are only young once..just getting out around other people will help..something I did not do and now can see that I was too foccused on home and family.
Take care
Sue

I am tired of the snow, tired of h having to be out all hours because of it, tired of my insecurities over ow, is she truly gone?? I did feel like she was gone and now I am not so sure.

I am not enjoying the way I feel in regard to h lately and it is seeping over into other parts of my life.

I just want all of this behind me and I don't know what the final outcome of it all will be.

is h once again talking to ow??

will h once again leave?

if h is still having second thoughts and is going to leave I wish he would just do it!!

LL

LL - I wish that I could trudge through the snow and give you and your darling kids a great big hug. But seeing that I'm down here in NC, this will have to do:

((((((((((((LostLove))))))))))))

I've been keeping up with your sitch but haven't gotten any flashes of insight. Like you, I don't like how I am feeling about my spouse either. What we both understand is the power of choosing to love someone unconditionally - that no matter how they treat us, we can rise up, look beyond it and embrace all parts of them.

Like you I have my doubts about what my final outcome will be. One thing that I do know is that you WILL be - strike that, you ARE - a winner. You show that every day to your kids - you show that to your H even though he may not deserve it. OW does not deserve to be on your radar screen at all - act as if she does not exist any more. I never cease to be amazed at the grace, charm, strength and feminimity that you and the other lady posters show here.

I hope that you make your day a good one and I'll try to do the same...

OK.

Quoting lostlove:
I'd love to go back to school, work on getting that masters so that by the time the kids are in school full time I can get right to the real job. but h seems to have an issue with the money? I wonder if it is just the money or if there is some other resignation in there.

gotta be something else--in the long run the tuition is a lot cheaper than being separated/divorced and paying for two households.

Quote:

give up the appartment and use that rent money to pay for my schooling?? what d'ya think of that. $ for school issue solved. my viewing the appartment as your still not being fully commited to our m gone. two issues resolved in one shot.

And gets you out and doing things. Three issues.

SI

Quote:

I have brought up the going to school thing with h and is doesn't seem like a possitive in his eyes, says why don't I see what I can do with the degree I already have now.

Sounds like your H has insecurities. When you've expressed doing your own thing in the past how has he handled it--encouraging or stifling? Just curious, LL.

jethro

Quote:

When you've expressed doing your own thing in the past how has he handled it--encouraging or stifling?

depends very much what "my own thing" happens to be.

ie: when I told h that I had called the gym to sched an appointment to look at it to join up, he was happy for me.

h does not ever discourage me from going out and doing things with my friends or making new ones.

when I mentioned the possibility of getting a part time job h was all for it and suggested when I was going to be at walmart that day why not pick up an application even asked about it later to see if I had.

but for some reason my going back to school seems to be some kind of threat? I don't know, could be a money issue, perhaps he doesn't really know how much it would cost and is thinking of it like undergraduate school with a big bill? or maybe he feels threatend that I may meet more people "like me" there, maybe a man more like me?

anyone who knows h, would never see him as insecure or sensitive, infact most view him as pretty confident in himself.

think that for now I will work the gym thing in, do some research on school costs and potential for earnings with and without the masters and at another time bring it up with h.

we are planning to leave tommorrow evening for our mini ski trip. there is still a threat of snow leaving the possibitly that we will have to cancel. that really bites and I don't see it as all that neccissary, I mean after all he does let his employees go away for ski and/or snow-mobile trips. why can't the boss get a break????

oh well, not for me to say I guess?

LL

Quote:

maybe he feels threatend that I may meet more people "like me" there, maybe a man more like me?

This was my first thought...

Quote:

anyone who knows h, would never see him as insecure or sensitive, infact most view him as pretty confident in himself.

IMHO, I have to say that any S that behaves like our Ses is not confident. My W did what she did out of insecurity. Is it possible your H did the same and is threatened by you really taking yourself up a notch? Maybe he's always felt inferior because he never finished school like you? Like I previously said, I'm simply thinking outloud and throwing this out there, as I have no clue either way...

jethro

Hey LL.
I rec'd an email from my H. Would you mind checking out my thread? I need some advice. Thanks!

HI!!!

could you read my post please and tell me what you think.

Thanks
Steve

LL, hope you get to go on that trip..it would be so good for both of you..glad that you are going to check out the gym..it gets you out and is good for you!! We all seem to be a little restless with our spouses..we all just want things to be done and go on with our lives with or without them..we have to hang in there for the long ride.
Sue

ll, i am not sure if you have said, but exactly what is h's apartment for, i mean why is he keeping it? can he rent it out to make money? or is he renting it from someone? it makes sense that giving up the apartment would free up money for other things. i want to go back and get a masters too but i can not figure a way to do it right now. my h is not all that supportive about school either. he dropped out of highschool and got a ged then went to several communtiy colleges. he is looking in to go back now. i am going to try to take a spanish class. I think it's great you are going to a gym, to, but i fear i wouldn't be motivated enough to use it! have a great trip! lisa

Quote:

but exactly what is h's apartment for, i mean why is he keeping it? can he rent it out to make money? or is he renting it from someone?

when h left last spring, he first went to mom & dads, then to sisters and then finally took a basement appartment. why he still keeps it??? he doesn't seem to use it much anymore, cept for when it snowed last week (actaully hasn't stopped yet

) he took a nap there in between plowing runs. he knows that it has to go but it is now up to him to do it. it's a bit of a convineince thing...so he doesn't have to drive all the way home at the end of a storm or if he's out with buddie (though the last night game he did come home) perhaps he is holding onto it for a while as a "just in case"
I try not to think about it and honestly had forgotten about it til the last storm when he stayed there.

oh well.

the trip is still up in the air, due to get more snow, trying to see if employee can cover. I won't know the plan til tommorrow. way to live a life ha?

LL

send some of that snow this way! it has been snowing but no real accumulation.i hope you get to go. lisa

Gosh LL. It seems like you always have snow there. That must get pretty old. Where are you again?

We just had a light dusting last night, and we were all jumping for joy. We never get snow hear near the ocean.

Hi LL,

Hope the trip is on. I survived the leaving. Went away but it's so empty here.

I'll check in soon.

Take care of yourself.

Dotto

howdy folks,

thanks for checkin in, still don't know about the trip. h is still trying to get past this little storm (a couple inches fell over night) and see about what to do about the upcomming snow. for now it's still on. but I am not keeping my hopes up.

so here's what's buggin me now.

I get these disgusting e-mails from women wanting to screw me. just got one titled, horny housewifes who want to do you. with a message from sara saying she is into anal sex just like I requested. now these are all liked to sites so they may just be spam but it seems that they come and go, mostly only occuring during the winter. h claims that he is not into any of that stuff and most of the time I believe him but I am leary cause he has mentioned and interest in the "shocker" though he would never do that without my permission and why would I think h is a sex crazed lunatic anyway? it seems I have more drive than he does. he can be pleased (fully) by simply pleasing me.

it bothers me and most of the time I just ignore it or send it of to spam but ugh!!! I don't need this crap. how do I get rid of it??

LL

LL - we get the same sort of crap but that only started after we signed up for cable internet about four months ago. It bothers my W as well but she cannot blame that one in any way on me.

Your ISP should have a procedure for reporting spam / offensive e-mails, etc. If it is like ours (Road Runner through our Time Warner cable service), they ask that you forward the e-mail to them so that they can log and track. What happens after that, I have no idea...

I hope that your weekend getaway happens - God knows you deserve it! Also hope that H gets a clue and starts "pleasing" you...

I am so friggen tired of my h's job!! it is more important than anything and takes up ALL of his time. He still does not yet know if we are going away and it it now 1:30!!!
I would like to know wtf I will be doing and I am sick of having to wait and see, wait and see.

what kind of a friggen company does not allow a person a vacation??? h's employees get more benifits than he does for cryin out loud.

why is it possible for h to let a major employee take snow mobiling trips when there is a threat of snow (so what if it is an inch or two) when he himself can't do the same??? if he can get employees route covered why the hell can't he manage to get his own covered??

I am pissed off and have told h that I will be going anyway with or with out him, if his boss (uhm, h is the boss?) is not considerate enough to give him a few days off well I don't know what else to say!!

so great, I will be going away by myself, I don't mind that much need the rest anyway. h is now pissed at ME? and I can't stand this anymore.

h is busy all summer long, and when the winter comes is busy too.

I am sick of his job. I have been pushed aside for his job for the better part of 13 years and I'm sick of it. tell your customers to go [censored] themselves they are apparently more important than ME!! hell you even went beyond the call of duty and were a "friend" to one who's husband wasn't doing his job!!

I should have married a man with a 9-5 job!
or I just should not have gotten married at all!

LL

> Winter in Massachusetts
> >> > DEAR DIARY:
> >> >
> >> > AUG. 1
> >> > Moved to our new home in Massachusetts.
> >> > It is so beautiful here. The city is so
> >> > picturesque. Can hardly wait to see it
> >> > covered with snow. I LOVE IT HERE
> >> >
> >> > OCT. 14
> >> > New England is the most beautiful place
> >> > on earth. The leaves are turning all
> >> > different colors. I love the shades of red
> >> > and orange. Went for a ride through the
> >> > hills and saw some deer. They are so
> >> > graceful. Certainly they are the most
> >> > peaceful animals on earth. This must be
> >> > paradise. I LOVE IT HERE.
> >> >
> >> > NOV. 11
> >> > Deer season will open soon. I can't
> >> > imagine anyone wanting to kill such
> >> > an elegant creature. The very symbol
> >> > of peace and tranquillity. Hope it will
> >> > snow soon. I LOVE IT HERE.
> >> >
> >> > DEC. 2
> >> > It snowed last night. Woke up to find
> >> > everything blanketed in white. It
> >> > looked like a postcard. Went outside
> >> > and cleaned snow off the steps and
> >> > shoveled the driveway. We had a
> >> > snowball fight today (I won).
> >> > When the snowplow came by we had
> >> > to shovel the driveway again.
> >> > What a beautiful place. Mother Nature
> >> > in perfect harmony. I LOVE IT HERE.
> >> >
> >> > DEC. 12
> >> > More snow last night. I love it. The
> >> > snowplow did his trick again that
> >> > rascal). A winter wonderland.
> >> > I LOVE IT HERE.
> >> >
> >> > DEC. 19
> >> > Snowed again last night. Couldn't
> >> > get out of the driveway to get to work
> >> > this time. I'm exhausted from shoveling.
> >> > Damn Snowplow!
> >> >
> >> > DEC. 22
> >> > More of that white [censored] fell last night.
> >> > I've got blisters on my hands from
> >> > shoveling. I think the snowplow hides
> >> > around the corner and waits until I'm
> >> > done shoveling. That [censored]!
> >> >
> >> > DEC. 25
> >> > "White Christmas" my busted ass.
> >> > More snow. If I ever get my
> >> > hands on that son-of-a-bitch who
> >> > drives that snowplow, I swear I will
> >> > castrate the dumb bastard. Don't know
> >> > why they don't use more salt on this
> >> > freaking ice.
> >> >
> >> > DEC. 28
> >> > More of the same [censored] last night. Been
> >> > inside since Christmas day except for
> >> > when "Snowplow Harry" comes by.
> >> > Can't go anywhere. The car is buried
> >> > in a mountain of white [censored]. The
> >> > weatherman says expect another 10
> >> > inches of this [censored] tonight. Do you know
> >> > how many shovels full of snow 10 inches is?
> >> >
> >> > JAN. 1
> >> > Happy freaking New Year!. The
> >> > weatherman was wrong (AGAIN).
> >> > We got 34 inches of snow this
> >> > time. At this rate it won't melt until the
> >> > 4th of July. The snowplow got stuck
> >> > down the road and [censored] for brains had
> >> > the balls to come to the door and ask to
> >> > borrow my shovel. I told him I broke 6
> >> > shovels already, shoveling out the [censored] he
> >> > plowed into my driveway. I broke the 7th
> >> > shovel over his head.
> >> >
> >> > JAN. 4
> >> > Finally got out of the house today. Went
> >> > to the store to get food and on the way
> >> > back a deer ran out in front of the car and
> >> > I hit the damn *#! dear. Did about $3,000.00
> >> > damage to the car. Wish the hunters would
> >> > have killed them all last November.
> >> >
> >> > MAY 3
> >> > Took the car to the garage in town today.
> >> > Would you believe the body is rotting away
> >> > from all the salt they keep dumping
> >> > all over the roads. It really looks like a piece
> >> > of [censored].
> >> >
> >> > MAY 10
> >> > Moved to Florida today. I can't
> >> > imagine why anyone in their right
> >> > mind would want to live in the God forsaken
> >> > State of Massachusetts.

gotta love new england!!

this sounds very frustrating!!!! maybe you could get a boy friend just for going on trips. JUST KIDDING!

at least you don't get repeat emails for penis enlargement techniques like i do. oh and i love the ones i get about sexy wild co-eds who will do it with eachother for my pleasure. i know i get these because of my h was very into on line porn before he hooked up with sk. i haven't figured out how to stop it, but i never open it. now maybe when i get one about sexy naked firefighters i will.

lisa

LL - Loved the Winter in Mass.

I am sorry that H will not be going away with you for the weekend

but glad that you made the decision to go by yourself anyway.

Still trying to figure if that makes sense or not - I get too confused sometimes...

Maybe H will see this as an indication that you are going to have a life regardless of what he does. I hope that you really enjoy the time away - you certainly deserve it and have earned it.

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at least you don't get repeat emails for penis enlargement techniques like i do. oh and i love the ones i get about sexy wild co-eds who will do it with eachother for my pleasure.

yes I do!!

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i know i get these because of my h was very into on line porn

my h denies having any interest in porn, hell even his office (landscapers) bathroom is full of sports illustrated and lawn equiptment magazines not a one playboy in sight!

Quote:

maybe you could get a boy friend just for going on trips. JUST KIDDING!

in the past (before all this crap with ow and sep and d talk) I did make that remark to h, thing is then it wouldn't be just for trips, would be for sex! (cause he wasn't puttin out!) for companionship (cause he was too damn tired from working all the time).

h always just said...go ahead!! now I wish I had!!

I don't know!!

h's job has been the downfall of this r. maybe I am just not the woman for him, not because we are not compatable, not because we can't have fun together (well when he's awake we can) but because his job demands (or rather he allows it too, he is the owner for christs sake he does not have to personally take on as much as he does, control freak wont let go and let his employees have more responsibility) too much of him and I want more of a man than that he be a provider!!! this is not the 1950's and I aint sittin at home in an apron waiting to bring him the friggen paper so he can put his feet up and smoke a pipe while I finnish up the ironing!!

what to do what to do!!

LL

Quote:

Still trying to figure if that makes sense or not - I get too confused sometimes...

me too!! I don't know will it just piss him off?? will it piss me off? aawww piss!

LL

well apparently it worked? I guess? wasn't doing it to make it work was just saying that I'd go alone cause damn it! I want and need to get away, having h come too was just a bonus factor so I said I'd be going anyway!

well h just called 2:20 and said he still doesn't have any more info than he did earlier (meaning the weather is still ? and who will cover his route is still ?) but WE will plan on going?

he is at his office now (this I know cause he knocks me off line of aol that is the same acct) and checked the weather, has to bill out this past storm and finnish up some stuff so wont be home right away but when he does get here we will get in the car and go!

but i guess it's all

anyway!! right??

LL porn thing still buggin me, h seems to only use the puter to check the weather and listen to the pats, BUT what if those are just the screens he keeps up for when I walk in the room...oh stop your mind from wandering LL!

LL - glad that H decided he wanted to go after you decided to go just for you! Don't question the why - just go and have a wonderful weekend!

Quote:

porn thing still buggin me

LL, this is just spam that everyone gets. I just got one for impotence!

Really, don't let your mind wander too much in that direction...

Some time ago I read (somewhere) a story about a man who really dedicated his life to work, but his M suffered as a result. This ended up biting him many years down the line, but he took the initiative (at the threat of his M) to change his hours. Since he did that, not only did his W feel better and his M was stronger, but he felt free from the bonds of his work. My point? Clearly your H's work is a significant problem with your R. Can you seriously talk to him about changing things, or do you think your sitch is still too delicate?

I think this control over one's company is stronger for those who've raised themselves up by their bootstraps and have become successful on their own after lots of hard work. To me, given your previous posts, sounds like it might fit the profile of your H???

Good luck.

jethro

Quote:

I think this control over one's company is stronger for those who've raised themselves up by their bootstraps and have become successful on their own after lots of hard work.

yes, h dropped out of college at the end of his sophmore year (to be an accountant no less, they work crazy hours too!) without the support or encouragement of his family, actually they were dead against it. so with no support or encouragement from his family, he dropped out of school and set out to start his own business (landscaping) I was there from the begining!! I worked for him, yes in the trenches getting dirty and all, my dad helped sign for a truck when no one else would, my neighbor let him borrow equiptment til he could by his own, my neighbor gave him customers, my friends dad gave him customers, my dad got him hooked up with a mens club and got him customers through that.. eventually his business grew to a point where he has two shops full of all kinds of equiptment, 4 trucks, 8+ employees and so many customers that he has to contract some of the work out!!

all this he has done on his own, yeah you'll note that I was there along the way helping him with all kinds of stuff, hell before all the employees came along I use to go out during the snow storms and shovel or snowblow the walkways for him (did it to be with him and cause i liked it and he payed good) but I think it became embarrising for him to let his woman do grunt work with the guys around.

he knows that work is an issue for me and therefore for us..I was just reaching a point that I was comfortable with his working so much and then whammo ow!! I am dealing, I know being married to a business owner has it's drawbacks as well as it's rewards, just waiting for more of the actually reward. the money is nice but I would like more time with the boss

LL

Quote:

he knows that work is an issue for me and therefore for us..I was just reaching a point that I was comfortable with his working so much and then whammo ow!! I am dealing, I know being married to a business owner has it's drawbacks as well as it's rewards, just waiting for more of the actually reward. the money is nice but I would like more time with the boss

I understand, LL. I'm just afraid that five or ten years down the line you'll become a WAW because your H spent too much time at work. Is this not a rather large red flag?

Just trying to help...

jethro

Quote:

I'm just afraid that five or ten years down the line you'll become a WAW because your H spent too much time at work. Is this not a rather large red flag?

huge red flag!! but something that hopefully we are working toward fixing. h is understanding that alot of the complaining and nagging I did was due to his not being around and h now realizing that some of his not being around was due to my nagging. yes in the begining he HAD to be working, he was the only employee, but as time went on he had a bit more freedom, but by then he was spent on me and therefore saught the companionship of ow (he would say it just happend, she was after all a customer he didn't have to seek to far)

h realizes the danger of overworking I realize the danger of nagging him about work.

the winter is the winter, can't really schedule when it will snow now can we??

but the summers should show some of what h has learned from this experience (hey after all ow is married to a working man as well don't think h wants me to be like ow now does he?? NOPE!!) I have heard h mention scheduling himself a day off midweek or even being able to come home early. actually when we first moved in to the new house h did come home early every day...then I started to "pressure" for the second baby and all went to hell!! that is also about the time h started to hang with ow.

relationships... a work in constant progress.

LL

WHY???

Quote:

Hi there
I got your email from Erica and I just wanted to tell you strait up, I really like 2 [censored]! She told me u're into fuckin' too. Lets hookup for a juicy weekend (maybe even this weekend) and cum together!can't wait to [censored] like rabbits,
Jennifer
You can get emails like this one, and even more hardcore emails from each of the80,000 active married women at SexAffair.org! They can either email you directly with their desires, or recommend you to their girlfriends in their exclusiveSex Forums! Since there are way more women then there are men in the site,you are guaranteed to get laid at SexAffair! Wherever you live, you'll find SexAffair girls online and waiting to [censored] you tonight.
So cum and [censored] a horny housewife right now, they're all hungry for sex!

is this what the world has come too??? are people really this sick and twisted?? imagine if my poor grandmother had e-mail and got stuff like this. I am soooooo perturbed!!

LL

LL - Even though it is the middle of winter, it appears that something like this should be handled soon before Spring hits. Get H to provide a couple of ideas as a starting point for some serious talking and work from there. Great opportunity for each of you to work on those active listening skills so that you minimize any misunderstandings. Great opportunity for a win-win all the way around.

BTW - did I already say "Enjoy the weekend!"?

Hi LL,
Thanks for dropping by and giving my thread a bump ^ and the kind words.

I've been dropping by yours every now and again to check in, and how I wish could offer words that would ease your struggle, but little from my personal toil seems to apply to yours.

...but if nothing else, I can surely send you some smiles your way ...

Until you figure out the answers to the big questions you're seeking, job, school, life in general, etc..., help sooth your soul by taking little timeouts for yourself too. I can picture you being the one saying,

"Calgon take me away..."

Do your kids take a nap at the same time of day? Next time the winter blues set in, set up some candles and potpourri, lather up those suds in the tub, then put the kiddies down and give yourself the full attention you deserve.

Who knows ... you just might have a "light bulb" moment. Alot of people do their best thinking the bathroom ... some on the "throne", others in the shower or tub ...

well, you get the gist?

Make sure you keep doing those little things you enjoy doing for yourself. (like those flowers you sent yourself. I think that was very ). If you think you're a little to thin and want to gain those ten punds, how 'bout a little fun doingit ... a hot fudge sunday or rocky road icecream, strawberry shortcake with lots of whipcream ... get the picture?

I sure do hope your weekend trip exceeds all your expectations. You certainly deserve it.

Will keep checking in when I can...

'til later,
KAW

Hey, how ya doing? Hope you and h get to go on trip..but if he doesn't then go and enjoy some much needed time alone..and have fun too..
The email stuff..I thought it was something I had done..I guess i did type in "sex" once just to see what it brought up(sorry, it just came out that way!!!!) Now I get crap all the time..I think my h told me there is some kind of block you can request to stop it, but I have not..and I never open any of it..maybe I should just to see what it is..I did have my freind buy a playgirl magazine once cause I had never seen one(I know I lead a sheltered life), anyways it was sick...there is no normal male that looks like they do.

Enough about sex...cabin fever is really setting in..LL, I think I can relate to your h never being home, except mine has a 9-5 job..but the past few years he has a part time job at our church and all the other things he does..so he has not been home much..but now I see that he has not wanted to be here..give him time to get it all together..he is home..that is a giant step..let the rest fall into place at whatever pace it needs to. You know the pushing thing won't work.Have a great week end
Sue

Jethro hoping not to see LL for a couple of days because she's having fun on the slopes!

Hi LL ... me agian,
Here I was giving you advise I hoped would help some ... only to find out by stopping by Acorn's thread that you had just given her the same ... so I'm telling you nothing you already didn't know ...

You truely are one special lady and your husband is damn lucky to have you making such an effort to keep your marriage.

Hope you are skiing your heart out ...

'til later,
KAW

Hi LL,

Hope all is well on the slopes. The snow should have helped.

Talk to you when you get back.

Dotto

LL,

Have fun hitting the slope and enjoy the benefit of having snow, instead of feeling depressed at home...

Let us know how it went...

Chuck

hello all and thanks for stopping by,

well the trip went ok. started out very good. h came home from plowing and took a shower while I finished our packing, then we were off on our way. the drive was nice and h was talkative, the next day was very good til lunch time when we were finishing up lunch h called one of his guys to check how they were doing with the storm.
all was well and h was letting employee know what drive ways to sand and mentioned just make sure to get to the day care. (ow does day care in her home so that is what I assumed he was talking about) didn't settle with me but I just left it alone and said nothing but did get up to go to the bathroom. when we went back out to ski some more h asked what was the problem. I said....this is why it is not productive for our m for you to continue to service that house.
h mumbled something about perhaps eventually I wont.
whatever just didn't settle right with me. but I ski'd off.
put in a few more runs then decided I'd like to go take a nap told h he could go ski the diamonds while I slept. (i am a woosy skier) h decided to come in but went to the bar while I slept (didn't thrill me much but wtf)

that evening we both got massages. h took the male and later let me know it was so that I wouldn't get angry at him for taking the woman. (what if I wanted the man??)
then we went back to the room and I poored a bath with way too many bubbles and turned on the jets. invited h in. then h decided we should get dressed and go down to dinner. I told him he'd have to shave my legs first, which he did, then we drained the tub and took a shower. then got dressed. (all that work up and no good stuff?) so we went down to dinner and had a few drinks. h then said why don't we play a couple games of pool and then go up and cuddle, I said why don't we skip the pool and just go up and cuddle. so we went up chainged into our pjs and h fell asleep. I wathced er and then went to sleep myself.

woke this am and decided I didn't want to ski, it was cold and snowy and I was hurtin from the day before (for those of you who don't ski, it is more than just sliding down a hill on two boards!! and we hadn't been in a couple years) h agreed so we took our showers (separately this time) got dressed checked out and headed of to breakfast. then stopped at a mall to get some stuff for son and my gf who was minding the kids. stopped at a pub for a beer and a drink then came home.

the whole ride home was a r talk. h doesn't have any more to say about his r with ow. is standing strong in that it was not at any point a pa. claims that no matter what he did it was never enough for me. he was never good enough for me. ( oh and that's why the one thing that I wanted from you, you gave to someone else??? all I wanted was for us to have a r not for you to just work and give me stuff)

basically I've realized that I cannot share with h, my hurt, my anger, my frustrations or my insecurities. as doing so only serves to push him away. so then I will let these feeling stew and he will never hear them. fair? no! but not much else I can do and h and I also discussed this.

so basically the whole ride home was crap til we were about 5 min from home and h suddenly realized what it was that infected our time that had been going well. (h is apparently a little thick)h asked what was it that set you off? h has another day care that he services that is in a complex that is also cared for, it is one of his primary customers when it comes to plowing as there are people dropping of their kids at 6am. I did not know of this other day care and was assuming it was her. h did not pick up the connection that I had made???

so when we got home gf was thrilled to see us (she doesn't have kids so spending that much time alone with two was an eye opener for her) we started to clean up the house then h took son outside so son could play in the snow and he could clean up the walkways with the snowblower.

h sent son in eventaully and stayed out for another 15min. I made some soup for son and h while I put dd to bed. h had been walking around in his underwear looking rather attractive and I let him know. told me well let's get these guys settled and then. well let's see. while I was putting dd to bed, h and son sat on couch watching tv. h fell asleep. I took son up and put him to bed. came back down and told h son wanted a kiss. h got up and went up to kiss son goodnight. I stayed in kitchen finishing the cookies I had been baking for our guests tommorow night. h never came back down. is asleep on sons bed.

so then??
I don't know??
I must have to much testosterone!

LL

Quote:

Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm just afraid that five or ten years down the line you'll become a WAW because your H spent too much time at work. Is this not a rather large red flag?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

huge red flag!! but something that hopefully we are working toward fixing. h is understanding that alot of the complaining and nagging I did was due to his not being around and h now realizing that some of his not being around was due to my nagging.

Hi LL,

This is so similar to my situation - my H has been "absent" basically since our son came along. And I know it is his choice to work so much. I also know I drove him away by telling him I needed more support at home and resented him working so much.

It also struck me, about your H's reaction to you wanting to go back to school...since he doesn't seem to mind you doing other things, do you think he is threatened by the thought of you being more educated than him, and potentially more financially successful in a career? Friends of mine have pointed out that my H seems to be going to extremes to prove himself in his work (I have more schooling than he does). I think it's a male ego thing. Not their fault (I don't think of my H as particularly "macho") but it is deeply engrained!

rjj

LL!

Quoting LL:
we went back to the room and I poored a bath with way too many bubbles and turned on the jets. invited h in. then h decided we should get dressed and go down to dinner. I told him he'd have to shave my legs first, which he did, then we drained the tub and took a shower. then got dressed. (all that work up and no good stuff?)

No lovin' in the tubbin"?!?! That bites! I don't think you could have screamed your intentions any louder.

Quoting LL:
claims that no matter what he did it was never enough for me. he was never good enough for me.

Deflecting OW guilt?

Quoting LL:
so when we got home gf was thrilled to see us (she doesn't have kids so spending that much time alone with two was an eye opener for her)

LOL!

Okay, LL, I'm gonna get you now. So, in your post you mentioned many of the frustrations that you had with your trip--no lovin' in the tubbin', H at the bar, phone call, R talk in the car. But, what I want to know is, what GOOD things happened? Did you have fun? C'mon, lay it out!

Quoting RJJ:
Friends of mine have pointed out that my H seems to be going to extremes to prove himself in his work (I have more schooling than he does). I think it's a male ego thing. Not their fault (I don't think of my H as particularly "macho") but it is deeply engrained!

Well, RJJ, we are the proverbial providers you know...

jethro

Quote:

do you think he is threatened by the thought of you being more educated than him

I already am more educated than h. I have a degree and h dropped out to start his business. while we were away we also discussed my going back to school and h doesn't seem to have an actual problem with it. thinks it would be good for me etc. it seems though that it is something that I will have to pay for myself? I get a job. put money away for myself and eventually go back to school? I don't know?

well I think that one of the main problems causing tension in this m is h's libido. has been a problem for years. I want it more than he does. I set things up like the bath and then nothing. I get frustrated and from there it goes.

maybe I should read sex starved m.

LL

Quoting lostlove:
well I think that one of the main problems causing tension in this m is h's libido. has been a problem for years. I want it more than he does. I set things up like the bath and then nothing. I get frustrated and from there it goes.

LL,

Unfortunately, I can sympathize here too!

rjj

Hi LL. Just stopping in. My H seemed to be more in the mood than me. But that was because his "getting in the mood" was diff from mine. He just didn't try hard enough to push my buttons. I like a little romance first.

But as far as the techincal side. No complaints. After 16 yrs, things worked well, if you know what I mean.

Had a great interaction with my H today. Yes, it was a SAM encounter. However, H was not as alien, and I enjoyed talking to him. You'll have to stop by and read about it.

ok so here's an example of bad dbing on my part but what a weird reaction by h.

I offered to fold and stuff this months bills for h's business, (i used to do it all the time til preg with #2 then job went off to new sil) so h accepted and brought the bills home yesterday.
well when I started folding I gave h ow's bill and asked that he do something with it so that I wouldn't be tempted to do something nasty with it. h took it and ripped it up in little peices and put it in the trash? well say's I, now how will you get paid? h says I'll just print up a new copy. and that was that.

so again an evening of no lovin'. h watched football and eventually at 11 I went to bed. then more bad dbing? I went back down and let him know that I feel that the main cause of our problems is that our sex drives don't match. that I want it more than he does, that I get angry, resentful, depressed, feel unatractive, un-feminie etc. then all the little things become a source of frustration to me.
basically the conversation just got no where til h just said "you're just misserable" well I responded to that with " no youre the misserable one, I am letting you know as I have let you know so many times in the past what I see as a source of our problems and instead of wanting to do something about it you just tell me I'm misserable.
if you continue to want to ignore this very real problem and make it my problem alone I can assure you that this r will be at risk.

so looking forward to michelles new book. hoping that h actually heard me (sometimes he says nothing or says something stupid like "your misserable" and then takes possitive action later without words) so well just wait and see.

I really want this r to work out in a way that we can both be happy and not have to fully compromise who we each are to make it work.

LL

Hi LL.

Quote:

well when I started folding I gave h ow's bill and asked that he do something with it so that I wouldn't be tempted to do something nasty with it. h took it and ripped it up in little peices and put it in the trash? well say's I, now how will you get paid? h says I'll just print up a new copy.

Hey, that's great. In his own way, he gave you a kind of release. I think that was thoughtful, no?

Quote:

went back down and let him know that I feel that the main cause of our problems is that our sex drives don't match. that I want it more than he does, that I get angry, resentful, depressed, feel unatractive, un-feminie etc. then all the little things become a source of frustration to me. basically the conversation just got no where til h just said "you're just misserable"

LL, I'm kind of getting stuck on some of this stuff myself. Not so much sex, but other "expectations." I think it's so frustrating for us because we're trying to work things out, we're trying to act like normal M couples do, but our Ses are not normal and they don't give in the way we need (or request) them to. Hence, your next remark:

Quote:

I really want this r to work out in a way that we can both be happy and not have to fully compromise who we each are to make it work.

I hear ya, sister...

jethro

Hi LL,

Wish things had gone better. But I think tthe R talk and your being honest about physical needs is good in spite of everything. Give him time to let your comments sink in.

I'm around. Give me a call if you want to chat.

Dotto

LL,

Hey, sounds like a good ski trip, with the exception at the end of course.

Well, I have to say that it is really hard. Think about your separation for a moment, what were the things you thought about that you would like to change? Are these permanent changes you made to yourself? If I remeber correctly, one of them was keeping your mouth shut, right? I think you did very well for that regards when you were on the slope as you kept your unhappiness under your throat.

One thing struck me funny is that your H did not think of why you were angry until almost the end of the trip. You've got to give him credit for thinking that hard during that time. This is someone that is trying to please you, albeit a bit slow to your standard (hack, I probably would still be puzzled if my mate was treating me like that. Call me slow if you will). Otherwise, he could have just left you alone, being agitated by your persistent inquiry of his PA with OW, not he has too many rights to be angry, though...

As for the, eh, libido issue, I would say it is indeed a common problem. As dotto has mentioned it, it is good that you recognize that, even though right now there is not much that you can fix until your H realizes that.

IMHO, I think the bigger issue is really a communication. To be fair, you could not expect your H to figure out what went wrong as you became unhappy of the day-care place your H is working on. You did a good job keeping your mouth shut, but your mood was soured and you made sure that showed. I think you know that this is not the best way to interact.

Same thing with the bills you are folding for him. Now I realize that how much love were putting to those invoices I got from contractors. But protesting OW's invoice was perhaps not necessary; he could have been there personally to collect the fee if that is what he wanted to see OW. Even though I can understand that you were hurt seeing that invoice, it would just aggrevate your H as he would feel that his actions were not appreciated. It is good, though, that he tore up the invoice: He got to vent his unhappiness while showing his restraint. He could have driven away to see her or gone back to his apartment being annoyed.

Same thing with libido.

All I wanted to say, LL, is that there has to be a better way for you to express frustration with each other, especially from you like sex and hints of OW, because I see a bad communication pattern still remains, no matter how hard you try to keep your mouth shut or how hard your H tried to please you and stay home. On the other hand, I also recognize that there was not much you can do as you cannot force your H to work on the issues you think important, in a way you think that is constructive, like in C. But you really have to work on it, perhaps starting from yourself, as I am just concerned that this would lead to a destructive path unless you two know you just need a fight for a little bit once upon the time.

I thought of a book by Susan Page "How one of you can bring the two of you together". Its philosophy is pretty similar to DB, but from a quite different perspective in terms of improving interactions from one of you. I think there are a lot of good points that may be applicable to you.

So, LL, I apologize for the long, rambling and attacking post. What was I thinking when I recommended a relationship book to a well-read, big hearted person like LL? But just something I feel very important as you have recognized some of your problems, but it appears that there are frustrations what you can do about them. I definitely share that frustration and wish you luck. If you are truly displeased or offended, just whack to me with a 2x4 on my thread or next time you see me...

Chuck

BTW, I saw Sex-Starved Marriage was available already on the shelf of B&N last night...

Quote:

because I see a bad communication pattern still remains, no matter how hard you try to keep your mouth shut or how hard your H tried to please you and stay home

you're absolutley right chuck, there is a huge communication problem here. I like to talk about things, what bothers me etc. I know enough now to pick my battles and let the small things go. are they really worth the fight anyway?

thing is h is a non-communicator. never complains about anything but my complaining. seems perfectly content with everything. just lets it all roll of his back. now that may work fine and well in the business world or with an aquantance but that is no way to have a true r, how can I live never knowing if h is bothered by something I do or say? how can we thrive if I never know if h is happy or sad or whatever.

I have come to the conclusion that h will probably never go to c with me, mine or any other. h does not want to have r talks (never did! wonder how we got here huh?)
I guess h just comes from the place where everything will just work itself out naturally and you don't need to do any research or talking or working to get there.
so lotta luck there.

guess I should just accept to be merely content. happy that I have a nice home two happy children and a h who is here to provide. don't know much else I can do at this point.

LL

so yesterday was a good day?

h woke with dd (or rather brought her downstairs and chilled on the couch, but that's ok I do it too) and son soon followed.
I got up @ 9 am came down and made banana pancakes and sausages for all.
h helped clean up breakfast.
h took shower.
h took son outside to play while he moved some more snow around.
I put dd for nap and chilled on the phone, on the puter for a bit.
dd started to wake.
I suggested to h that we put the kiddos in the car, grab burgers or something and head out to get bar stools for the basement (h's sports pub) and a mantel (shelf) for the wall behind the bar.
h thought that to be a good idea.
off we went, got everything we needed and decided to skip the burgers and bring home a yummy bertucci's pizza instead.
got home, ate, put dd up for nap #2 (gotta love the little ones that nap)
while dd napped son played in playroom and h watched some football (oh should say that all day buddie and h conversed about the games that were on, via cb type phone)
I suggested we put together the bar stools while dd was asleep.
h agreed so we did.
dd woke.
dd and s and I played in playroom while h watched football.
around 5:30 I brought kids up for dinner while h stayed downstairs watching football.
dd didn't want to eat and was fussing, eventually h came up to see what the problem was.
cleaned up dinner and went back down to play more. h wathcing more football.
s wanted to play football (or some faximile) with daddy, eventually daddy gave in and they chased eachother round the stairwell with the football.

dd time for bath and bed.
h set s up with video in family room.
h goes back and forth from "cave" to fr to check on s.
dd sleeping (aaaahhh!)
I chill with s while h watches football.
show over time for s to go to bed. I take care of it while h watches football.
go down to "cave" to help h hang some pics in "cave", h helps me hang mantel by my dart board.
pics hung I sit for a few, then decide it's late I'm tired.
say to h, I'm going up.
h says ok, I'm going to watch the news I'll be up in a while.
I go up, take shower and as I'm going to kiss kiddos goodnight (ya they're asleep but I can't resist the urge to kiss them before I go to sleep) and low and behold there is h getting ready to go to bed too.
hmmmm? my curiosity is peeked. (why'd he come up already?)
got spooned and went to sleep.
h said "i had fun today"
I " that's good"
h "we got some things accomplished, plus I like hanging out with you guys"
I "we like hanging out with you too"

that's that.

LL

LL,

Sounds like a great day to me. You are on a roll. I can only hope I can do things right like you. I am home today so give me a call if you get a chance!

Have a good one.

Dotto

You know what, LL? That sounds like a very nice, normal day in what would be called the LL household. Sometimes the most mundane days are the most "comforting." Are they not?

jethro

Sounds like a nice, homey day for all of you. H seems to becoming more comfortable at home...have not heard anything about staying at his apt..big step..keep it up
Sue

LL,

That sounds pretty awesome!

rjj

LL,

How incredibly, wonderfully mundane! Don't blink cuz I think you have a real family on your hands.

I envy you!

Jim

Quoting lostlove:
"we like hanging out with you too"

Ain't that true! This is a great family picture. You go, LL. You are doing great, even though you call it mundane. Hey, this is what we live for; something other than drama...

Chuck

Good morning, LL.

Discorded, Jim and the rest are right - what a picture for H to keep in his mind.

And don't think that he won't, either.

Sorry that the ski trip was not a total success - although there were some positives. Maybe the next time H sees you in a tub filled with bubbles, he'll get a clue.

BTW - got Michele's "The Sex-Starved Marriage" in the mail yesterday and read some of it last night - the first four chapters, I believe. She's done a very thorough job so far in explaining the differing causes of low sexual desire in spouses (physical as well as psychological) so that those of us who have higher libidos

can understand their point of view. Once I finish the book, I'll likely take Michele's advice and leave it where W has an opportunity to find it. Doubt she'll read it, though - complaining is her game, not finding solutions.

Quoting lostlove:
so yesterday was a good day?

Well, if that is as bad as it gets from here on out, is it really all that bad? ... not to mention that our goal is to have more good days than bad.

Ask yourself the question, what would have made it better? The answer could then be stated as a goal.

As you can see from the responses here, it is all in a matter of the point of reference.

'til later,
KAW

ok ok, I know all in all that was a pretty great day.
but, I would have prefered h not talk on the phone to buddie while we were out. but I suppose h could have just said no he didn't want to go and stayed home to watch football. (think he might have if the stuff we were getting weren't for his bar? doesn't matter I suppose)
would have been better if it ended with more than a cuddle but hey I suppose I should be happy to get that.

yesterday was another decent day...

woke.. all of us (think I stayed in bed a bit longer than everyone else though)
made oatmeal for everyone.
h helped clean up.
h was getting ready to leave, had made himself instant coffee and it was almost gone, so I made some real coffe and put it in his travel cup.
h goes of to wherever he goes?
dd nap
hang with son and get dressed
dd wake
lunch
off to do grocery shopping, was fine til about the produce dept when son wanted to touch everythin and dd kept escaping from the cart it got worse at the register...I know understand those calgone comercials.
came home put groceries away (while son checked every bag looking for his go-gurt (yuck!)
dd nap
ticklefest with son
make dinner (beef stew, son decided to throw whole onion unpealed and all into the pot, I took care of it)
wake dd
h arrives @ 5
we all eat dinner
h helps clean up woa! h takes apart top of stove and cleans it!!
downstairs (playroom) to play
7ish bath (she put jelly in her hair) and bed for dd.
h and son on couch in "cave" watching rug-rats h on the verge of sleeping.
s bath and bed.
h asks if I want a fire, sure
h sits at puter reading a sports interview and checking weather, while I watch tv.
h then joins me by the fire to watch some tv.

h must have heard what I said the other night!

watch the news.
off to bed.

so there is another good day!! that is not to say that I am not still angry and hurt by what has happened and how things were before all this that it took for h to have an a and leave before realizing he had to participate in life here. that I am not still somewhat resentfull and hurt by this. BUT I have realized that if I want things to be better I have to let them be better and not dwell in the past. that is not to say that at some point some things will actually have to be discussed, but for now, things are good.

LL

LL,

Quote:

h helped clean up.

we all eat dinner

h helps clean up woa! h takes apart top of stove and cleans it!!

h asks if I want a fire, sure

h then joins me by the fire to watch some tv.

Jeez...sounds like he's coming around to me. Another nice, normal day in the LL household?

On a side note, have you tried slipping Viagra into his instant coffee?!?!

jethro (feeling feisty)

LL - Jethro pointed out some positives so I won't repeat them - but I'll stay far away from that Viagra suggestion.

But what I wouldn't give for a nice cuddle with W even if it didn't lead to anything!

And having screwed things up in my R with W almost a year ago, I understand how difficult it is to give up the anger and hurt. But your H is choosing to be with you and your children - to participate in your daily life. And those topics will come up in the future. But you know the drill...

Have a great day, LL - and plenty of hugs for those kids!

Quote:

have you tried slipping Viagra into his instant coffee?!?!

uhm!

Quote:

h then joins me by the fire to watch some tv.
h must have heard what I said the other night! (get the idea!)

LL

Quote:

h must have heard what I said the other night! (get the idea!)

Oh...I see. I thought you meant just spending time with you, not spending time with you!

jethro

so what will actually ease my occasional feelings that ow is still around in some fashion other than just as a customer???

days like I have reported previously occuring did occur a year ago too.

one lovely afternoon, while ariving home from shopping with two babies I get a call from h that he will be later than usual, he had to take someone to the hospital, oh is everyone alright says I, no no not an emergency someone just needed a ride to an appointment says h, oh who says I a bit preturbed that someone needs him to stop his day to drive them to a pre-shcesuled apt, while I am left to fend for myself with OUR two children for appointments etc. blank says h (i knew ow's name from her previous years of inviting the crew to her x-mas parties and hearing a message inviting them to stop by and swim in her pool when it's hot, message to you fella's don't hire landscapers or outside contractors unless you or a neighbor have an eye on your w (ow is and was m)) this does not thrill me. the only reason h is telling me is because he was seen in the elevator by a close friend of my family who is also one of my best friends older sister. h spends the weekend trying to tell me she is just aquantance? (ya right like I'd ask an aquantance to take me to a cancer treatment) then a friend? then from there the beans are spilt that they are friends and he's taken her to lunch etc was a support to her because for some reason her h was not (did I bother to tell you my h was not much of a support to me during preg #2 or after the birth of #2?) so then h stays at parents for a week or so, we discuss d etc...ow actually calls me to appologize for asking him to drive her...that they are just friends etc...
I let h know I do not aprove of this friendship and it must end... h supposedly ends this friendship and we are working on us. h is more affectionate, we talk more, we actually start a weekly date night.
then come april he leaves.
when he returns I learn that he had never stopped seeing her. was stopping by her house 3x a week both before and after I knew of friendship that he was talking to her everyday both before and after I knew of friendship sooo...
how am I to know that ow is really gone???
I never did get to hear the supposed phone calls telling her the "friendship" is to cease? I know that she knows he has come home and if she has seen him (for business) must know he has his ring back on, but that doesn't matter to her he had it on the whole time he was gone til I finally took it anyway.

so what has set me off???

the looming thought is always there.

takes little...

it is winter and h still goes off to "work" left earlier than usual today, and called once in the afternoon said he would be home between x-y, did not call again til just before y saying he was on his way bla bla bla...

I will not say anything to h about this insecurity as it seems to be being met with ? I don't know how to describe his reaction, but it seems pointless to say anything just go about my business.

tonight I have my appointment to have a tour of the gym to see if I like it so at least I have somewhere to go tonight.

perhaps the only way I will ever believe is if I have h followed to know what he is doing, but then will I feel safe or ashamed??

things I want and need to believe h is not still on the fence.

h to drop appartment!
h to drop ow as customer! ( I don't want the convenient excuse of business discussion keeping the tyes)
h to pledge his undying love for me (ok so I'm feeling a little silly after venting this out)
h to start saying ily (ok jethro you can kick me for this one now)
h to show some more empathy and guilt for what has happend.

ah but then what will I complain about then???

LL

Hmmm...

Quote:

days like I have reported previously occuring did occur a year ago too.

Yes, but were they occurring two months ago? When I heard you say this I thought of a color analogy. For example, our Ses become gray when they are "thinking" about OP, then when they start acting on their feelings the gray steadily gets darker to black. So, in your sitch, I see him coming from the black back into the gray. Soon, I hope, things will be yellow like sunshine, my dear! It's kind of like a pendulum...it swung one way and now it's surpased the midpoint and is swinging the other way. Jeez...now I'm mixing metaphors. I'm gonna stop while I'm ahead...

Quote:

how am I to know that ow is really gone???

I guess you just have to trust him? I know, easier said than done, but what choice do you have? I think, and you posted this later, that you will know for sure when some of the things that used to occur when you knew he "loved" you, occur again?

Quote:

I never did get to hear the supposed phone calls telling her the "friendship" is to cease?

Well, let's face it, LL, I heard this conversation only this morning and it doesn't really mean crap does it...now that I think about it? I mean, as soon as I left for work, my W could just as easily called him to talk it over some more? Again...trust...

Quote:

so what has set me off???

the looming thought is always there.

takes little...

I know, LL. I can only imagine how incredibly frustrating it is when you want some answers and some assurances, and he doesn't want to talk about it.

I think the only way you're going to feel right is when your H willing shows "some more empathy and guilt for what has happend." However, you said "more" here, so is there much more he can say to you to make you feel better, or is it just repeats of what he's said already? Just curious.

Quote:

tonight I have my appointment to have a tour of the gym to see if I like it so at least I have somewhere to go tonight.

Quote:

h to start saying ily (ok jethro you can kick me for this one now)

Consider kick delivered...

Take'r easy, LL.

jethro

Quoting lostlove:
so there is another good day!! that is not to say that I am not still angry and hurt by what has happened and how things were before all this that it took for h to have an a and leave before realizing he had to participate in life here. that I am not still somewhat resentfull and hurt by this. BUT I have realized that if I want things to be better I have to let them be better and not dwell in the past.

Clearly, you are trying harder to hold your fire when he is around, and he is trying harder to be around.

Both are very good signs. Better still if things work out with the health club and/or additional schooling, so you're not always stuck home.

If you can both keep doing what you are doing, you may find the "discussion" comes of its own accord.

SI

Hi LL,

Sounds like things are falling into place as a family. I'm sure that in time your insecurities will fall away and you will be happy and secure.

Thnaks for the talk today. It always helps my PMA when I talk to you. Hope we can go out this weekend. Keep in touch.

My night was okay. Check my thread.

Dotto

How's LL today? Did you have another wonderfully "mundane" day?

jethro

Acutally I'm waiting for LL to report on a "ultramundane" day!

well yesterday was yesterday. when h finally did come home it was time for dinner so we all ate, i then did the dishes, h said "i would have done that" no biggie says I.
so h knows I am going to the gym but still meanders around doing what he's doing, taking dd up to bed like as I'm going to walk out the door, so I waited with son while he put dd to bed, then said bye to them both at the door.

on way home from the gym (which I joined now just have to figure out when to start) I tried to cb h, system busy, so h must be on cb with buddie but I tried again a few times (no harm in it no way for h to know how many times I tried it) and caught a break in their conversation, ask h if he needs anything, nope. then the house phone is ringing so I get to hold on. h makes me guess who is on the linem I guess fil, mil, then buddie you guessed it third times the charm so I get let go cause he has to talk more to buddie??? ya ok. h then a bit later cb's me hey LL? ya says I? what's the temp gage on your car say? 9degrees says I. ok says h. 9 degrees F (farenheight) says I f for F-ing cold!!! well that is not much of a conversation.

I go off to the post office to mail h's invoices (aren't I nice?)

I get home s is still awake but up stairs was waiting for me.
h is sitting in front of fire, says that he started to drift off (it's barley 8:30) and there's nothing on tv. he's gonna get on the couch in a min. well I say well if your already falling asleep and there's nothing on tv why not just go up to bed?? so he goes but first stops at the puter and then says he wants to go lay down with son for a while. I suggest that this is not really a good idea (sorry bob) because though tonight he wants to what about when he doesn't want to and then son is asking him to??? so h agrees and goes to bed himself.
about an hour later I go up take my shower kiss the kids and get in bed.
h has his back to me.
I say goodnight.
h says keep warm but doesn't bother to move.
I have a hard time falling asleep tossing and turning (consider for a moment going to sleep with son myself)
wake (or rather awoken by dd at 6 am)
h still in his corner but appears to move out of it some
puts his arm around me (ah what a relief)
typical am me with kids, I made h his coffee h takes shower I make breakfast of somekind (banana bread today)
h leaves and our day goes on from there.

something is not right and I feel it!!!!

it is not simply the mundane life there is something hapening here and it is not settling right with me.is it ow?? matters not to me if it's ow h doesn't seem to be with me on "the same page" or even in the same book. I don't know.

another one of those days where h leaves at 9 and it is now 2:30 and I have yet to hear from him.

whatever!!

keep your appartment
keep your customer
don't ask me to put my ring back on
let's just exist like this, cause oh yeah it's workin!

LL

Quote:

h says keep warm but doesn't bother to move.

I have a hard time falling asleep tossing and turning (consider for a moment going to sleep with son myself)

Well, he wanted to snuggle, right? Isn't that good? My W likes me to spoon her, so she doesn't really move when I make her warm. Am I missing something here? Why would you NOT want to snuggle and go sleep with S?

Quote:

something is not right and I feel it!!!!

You know, LL, it's entirely possible that he's thinking the opposite of what you think? Maybe he feels ashamed? Maybe he's thinking about OM and regretting what he did? Maybe he's even kind of missing OM, but he's with you isn't he? If he was feeling like he didn't want to be with you, then why would he ask you to snuggle? Even if it was thoughts contrary to what you want, remember that it's two steps forward and one back.

You know, right now you and I are in very much the same boat. Today, my W is very distant and it's driving me crazy (WAW mode). I'm trying to act "happy," but it's hard. I just want to leave work and go do something by myself...not go home. I feel restless. I'm sure you do too.

It all comes down to us not knowing their thoughts. We can't really ask right now because that just causes more problems. I'm slowly beginning to wonder why I focus on my M so much instead of me. Why do the both of us? BTW, I'm very happy that you went to the "jim" last night. We will be okay, LL. Let's detach together today, okay? Cuz I need the help too...

jethro

Quote:

Well, he wanted to snuggle, right? Isn't that good? My W likes me to spoon her, so she doesn't really move when I make her warm. Am I missing something here? Why would you NOT want to snuggle and go sleep with S?

just want to clarify, h was faced away from me and stayed that way, I said goodnight, he said keep warm but did not move toward me at all, stayed facing away from me till the am for a brief moment.

I did not want to go to sons bed cause I belong in my own bed.

if h is thinking of oM that would answer a lot of my sexual concerns!

I don't know if h is thinking of ow or not, if he misses her or not.

if h was infact "only" having an ea with ow, what the hell did they talk about, or did h just listen to her?? I mean stopping by 3x a week and talking on the phone everyday with this man? all I hear him talk about to buddie is football. and to others it's work. to me it's I'll be home at x or y gotta go here or there but that seems to be it.
what the hell was their r all about????
sometimes I feel like I should just tell h, look this isn't working, you clearly are not happy with me and are only here for the kids. this is not the life I want, you can still have the kids (all be it a bit less) and go off and be with ow, hell she's making herself available for you by ding her h. so go little bird go fly away but know that I will shut the door to this birdhouse and you cannot return, life is too short to waist more of it waiting for you to decide if this is where you want to be.

tired so very very tired.

h called shortly after last post. left a message (I just didn't feel like answering) hey guys (perfect example of something is wrong his focus is on kids and not me) bla bla bla on my way should be there at x. then calls again so I answer, h is on his way home, wants to stop and bring home something for dinner so I don't have to bother cooking (gee I have a fridge full of left overs but wtf) ok says I. I am going to a cpr class this evening being held by one of my book club members. I had suggested to h maybe rent a movie for when I come home, but he didn't he suggested I find a place up here to rent from (way too rural town but I'll find it)

you are right jethro, I do not know what h is thinking or feeling and honestly I never have (and no I aint no alien, this r has sucked for a long long time) time to detach, I guess as I said to my c, my way of working on the m for now will have to be to just work on myself and bettering my life and just leave things be for now.

so I know that I don't need h, but I know that I don't want to be alone (even though I can be) so what to do what to do???

LL

Quote:

just want to clarify, h was faced away from me and stayed that way, I said goodnight, he said keep warm but did not move toward me at all, stayed facing away from me till the am for a brief moment.

LL, is all of your frustration today a result of this one event? Honestly, it just sounds like he felt crappy and wanted some comforting. Guilt? Who knows, but he requested your presence, LL.

Quote:

I did not want to go to sons bed cause I belong in my own bed.

You misunderstood what I wrote (and I can see why...it wasn't very clear). I meant to ask you why you'd rather sleep in S's bed rather than snuggle with your H.

Quote:

what the hell did they talk about, or did h just listen to her?

I wondered the same thing and asked my W what she and OM talked about. She simply made generalities like our kids, his job, blah blah blah. Well, I'm sure they talked about other wonderful things too.

Anyway, I'm drifting. I just wanted to say that I understand how you feel because our Ses are making time to talk to others when we want this kind of attention.

Quote:

tired so very very tired

I know, LL...oh boy, I know.

Quote:

wants to stop and bring home something for dinner so I don't have to bother cooking

Well, that's nice of him. Sounds like he's trying...

Quote:

I guess as I said to my c, my way of working on the m for now will have to be to just work on myself and bettering my life and just leave things be for now.

This is what both of us need to do. These are their demons, not ours, and they have to exorcise them all by themselves.

Quote:

so I know that I don't need h, but I know that I don't want to be alone (even though I can be) so what to do what to do???

Time will tell. For now, it's same'ol same'ol. See where the road takes you and see where the road takes your H. Right?

((((LL))))

jethro

Hey LL,

Sounds like things are going better, but also getting harder, for you. I think this is to be expected--you've put your R needs on hold for a long time and worked very hard.

In DR, Michele talks about letting your spouse have mourning time for loss of OW, even letting his sadness be OK. Maybe he has finally decided to let her go and is feeling down?

As for when you will feel safe and quit worrying if you're being duped, it will probably take a long time and a husband who really wants to make your feel secure, and to take responsibility for what he's done. It doesn't sound like he is there yet.

Don't forget the baby steps--and GIANT steps--you've made so far though.

I'm sorry you are having such a hard time. Having been through years of doubt during an earlier crisis in my own M, I know how painful it is, and how scary it is when you worry about the fear ever going away.

Have a great time at the gym!

Hugs,
Acorn

Hi LL,

Sorry things seem to be distant. Maybe H is just tired? Could he sense your feelings?

As Acorn said don't forget the steps you've made, both small and giant. But you need to do what will make LL happy.

I'm here for you. Maybe we can do something this week.

Dotto

LL, something has to "shift" in our brain. We have to get the idea that we don't need our S, but that it would be nice to have him/her in the picture; that we're not lower than whale you-know-what when S doesn't respond or disses us. At some point, something will click and you'll realize that he is marching to the beat of a different drummer and there's not a blessed thing you can do about it -- except to be the best you that you can, and let the chips fall where they may. Somewhere, in one of his books, Ken Keyes, Jr., describes people like us as addicted to our S. He defines an addiction as an emotion-backed demand or desire, which if not satisfied, makes us unhappy, disturbed, agitated, etc. It was a real eye-opener for me to understand that I was addicted to the M and afraid to let go. More and more, I'm accepting her going her own way, and I never ask anymore what she did, where she went, etc. If she wants to tell me, I'm around. Anyway, something to think about.
Sam

LL,
I am really behind on all the threads, but I didn't want you to think I forgot about you.

I think about all of you every day. I've just been so busy lately. And keeping up with my own thread is a lot of work. A lot of things happening with me. (Not that I am complaining or anything.)

I just wanted to pass through and say hello, and say thank you for always being there for me!

I don't know what I would do without all of you!!

Hey LL,

When is your birthday? Seems to me you said it was this month, and it's a big one too! Hope we haven't missed it!

rjj

Quote:

When is your birthday? Seems to me you said it was this month, and it's a big one too!

yup! it's monday and I will be 16... (long running joke) no I will be da da da da! 30

I am really too young to be dealing with this crap!!

LL

LL,

Just think, you got all this crap over with early. Now you can go on from here and be happy and have a wonderful life!

Many happy returns on your special day.

Dotto