Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/20/22 01:44 PM
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/20/22 02:20 PM
Originally Posted by Elbereth
I should get alimony or a lump sum instead, what value some of the money would have if other considerations are considered (withdrawal fees, etc).
I could have rolled the dice and paid more monthly up front and then taken her back to court to modify the agreement once she and OM were official but my lawyer wisely counseled me not to. "People lie" she said.
Not sure if she had inside information or not (all the lawyers in these small towns know each other) but as it turns out I doubt if I would have had an argument that being with OM meant that she was financially stable so might have been stuck with higher support payments anyway plus the pain of going back to court regularly for modifications.
Where I'm trying to go is - get good advice from professionals and go with your head and long term interests in mind and not your heart or anger. For me, the fact that I have a deal that will not suddenly change under-foot is a big positive and allows me - and I presume my xW - to make long term plans regardless of changes in the circumstances of the other party. Others might be tempted to roll the dice - and certainly none of us can predict the future as is attested to by the fact that we're here talking about this sort of stuff
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/20/22 02:24 PM
Off to lunch on the farm with my Brother and family. Probably a good thing. Thinking about H this morning and really want to reach out, and I want to see him to talk to him to hold him. i know everyone says it gets better. I don't see that right now. I miss him every second of ever day. I hate what he is doing. I don't want a life without him. God this hurts. Why isn't our love stronger than this? How he dosent miss me and our life, I undersand MLC, but just don't understand how H can not see through this fog he is in. He is/ was one of the smartest most level headed people I knew. I keep thinking maybe that person is still in there somewhere.
But he has been drunk ever weekend since he left, hell he has been drunk ever weekend for the last 9 months. Drinking can really destroy a person and there life. I guess partying is more important that his life.
Talked with a girlfriend yesterday, trying to set me up. No!! I have zero intrest. So sat a thought about that last night too.
Hate my life right now, all the years of love and happiness, just gone for no good reason.
But he has been drunk ever weekend since he left, hell he has been drunk ever weekend for the last 9 months. Drinking can really destroy a person and there life. I guess partying is more important that his life.
Talked with a girlfriend yesterday, trying to set me up. No!! I have zero intrest. So sat a thought about that last night too.
Hate my life right now, all the years of love and happiness, just gone for no good reason.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/20/22 04:28 PM
I really hope you try alanon.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/20/22 09:54 PM
Hi Bttrfly, yes I am going to try another group, the first one I was in just didn't feel right.
Just got back, it was a beautiful day, went on a horse drawn slay ride through the woods. The horses where Belguim something... What a magnificent animial. It is almost 50 here right now, it was nice to get out and get some fresh air and be in nature. Total gave me spring fever. But tomorrow will bing a cold front and a 2 day snow storm. Back to winter...ugh.
Just got back, it was a beautiful day, went on a horse drawn slay ride through the woods. The horses where Belguim something... What a magnificent animial. It is almost 50 here right now, it was nice to get out and get some fresh air and be in nature. Total gave me spring fever. But tomorrow will bing a cold front and a 2 day snow storm. Back to winter...ugh.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/21/22 02:53 PM
No contact yesterday, really thought I was going to break. Going out with my family helped alot. I picked up my niece and we had a hour and a half drive each way to the farm. We had good talks there and back. Made plans for everyone to come to the pool this summer.
After I dropped her off I cried the rest of the way home. I wanted to talk to H about what a great day I had, how beatiful the country side was, the horses and the barn cats. I wanted to share my day with him. But I can't, he dosen't care about my day, dosen't care that I miss him or that he is tearing me appart. He just doesn't care, after 21 years.... Why would he care, he has OW to hang out with and share his life with now, I am nothing to him.
Later last night I had a, thats it moment and felt better for a while. Felt like..screw him, I am done, he doesn't deserve my thoughts, he doesn't deserve me. Started to focus on all of the bad in him, the selfishness, the world revolves around him. Everything and anything in our marriage that would make me angry and see him for what he has become. I wanted to just let go and not care. This is his choice, nothing I can do about it. Felt some strength, then bam... gone this morning.
I need so need it to be spring so I can get outside an stay busy.
After I dropped her off I cried the rest of the way home. I wanted to talk to H about what a great day I had, how beatiful the country side was, the horses and the barn cats. I wanted to share my day with him. But I can't, he dosen't care about my day, dosen't care that I miss him or that he is tearing me appart. He just doesn't care, after 21 years.... Why would he care, he has OW to hang out with and share his life with now, I am nothing to him.
Later last night I had a, thats it moment and felt better for a while. Felt like..screw him, I am done, he doesn't deserve my thoughts, he doesn't deserve me. Started to focus on all of the bad in him, the selfishness, the world revolves around him. Everything and anything in our marriage that would make me angry and see him for what he has become. I wanted to just let go and not care. This is his choice, nothing I can do about it. Felt some strength, then bam... gone this morning.
I need so need it to be spring so I can get outside an stay busy.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/21/22 04:15 PM
((Stella)) Good job on the no contact. It's hard.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/21/22 05:10 PM
Good Morning Stella
Good job! I’m proud of you.
No contact is so difficult when first starting out. You are crafting new pathways in your mind; a better (not bitter
) way of thinking and feeling. All of which is influencing your convictions.
You did perfectly, felt the anger - screw him, I am done, he doesn't deserve my thoughts, he doesn't deserve me - and then let it go. You didn’t act upon it. Very well done indeed.
Feelings are fleeting. Let them flit and find your inner self.
These moments will rise and fall. Each time, when not reinforced, becoming less in amplitude and frequency.
Continue walking the path. You so got this.
D
Good job! I’m proud of you.
No contact is so difficult when first starting out. You are crafting new pathways in your mind; a better (not bitter
) way of thinking and feeling. All of which is influencing your convictions. You did perfectly, felt the anger - screw him, I am done, he doesn't deserve my thoughts, he doesn't deserve me - and then let it go. You didn’t act upon it. Very well done indeed.
Feelings are fleeting. Let them flit and find your inner self.
These moments will rise and fall. Each time, when not reinforced, becoming less in amplitude and frequency.
Continue walking the path. You so got this.
D
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/21/22 07:09 PM
And epic fail just now....
H called and like a idiot, I answered. I should not have answered, I know...Kept calm for most of it, should have ended the convo, but nooooo I had to push it. So mad at myself right now, like I just had to dig for more pain. WTF is wrong with me. I have no will power when it comes to H.
So of course I brought up our M, R and D. Everything I should not have. My frustration with him and this whole sitch, just got the better of me...ugh!!!!! As to be expected, H shut down, I ask a question and he goes silent, would not answer any questions, said he thought I had moved on already, I told him I had not slept with anyone. Asked him if he really thought that my love for him was that shallow, he said no. Said he would always care for me and he "thinks about everything all the time" I asked what he ment by that, "just everything" ok a no answer answer...
The tipping point for me was when he brought up a friends XW who just got married over the weekend to a man she had a A with. This man use to work with H, I know both of them. This man is a trainwreck, hasnt been able to hold down a job or be faithful to the friends XW, but they got married anyway. My H said he told the XH(whom he is really good friends with) about the wedding and the issues with the new H. Said he thought his friend would like to know what a trainwreck his XW and new H are and have been and will be. To give his friend a feel good moment..... This frustrated the sh!t out of me. Seriously he can see it in others but not himself. WTF!!!!! So he can see how bad that turned out but can't look at his own [censored] show.
I know He has convinced himself that he is really in love with OW. I need to just let go, I need to just give up. But no, what do I do, tell him that in my gut I can't give up on us. OMG could I have been anymore pathetic.
Why am I so weak with him. Like anything I say will ever make a difference. I know it won't, but stupid me just had to try. I am so frustrated with myself. I told him, that I missed him and that we were still a option, that it was not to late. That our M was worth more than his A, that we know each other better than anyone else knows us, after 21 years together you don't just through that away... and I just get silence..... Dumb, dumb, dumb......
H called and like a idiot, I answered. I should not have answered, I know...Kept calm for most of it, should have ended the convo, but nooooo I had to push it. So mad at myself right now, like I just had to dig for more pain. WTF is wrong with me. I have no will power when it comes to H.
So of course I brought up our M, R and D. Everything I should not have. My frustration with him and this whole sitch, just got the better of me...ugh!!!!! As to be expected, H shut down, I ask a question and he goes silent, would not answer any questions, said he thought I had moved on already, I told him I had not slept with anyone. Asked him if he really thought that my love for him was that shallow, he said no. Said he would always care for me and he "thinks about everything all the time" I asked what he ment by that, "just everything" ok a no answer answer...
The tipping point for me was when he brought up a friends XW who just got married over the weekend to a man she had a A with. This man use to work with H, I know both of them. This man is a trainwreck, hasnt been able to hold down a job or be faithful to the friends XW, but they got married anyway. My H said he told the XH(whom he is really good friends with) about the wedding and the issues with the new H. Said he thought his friend would like to know what a trainwreck his XW and new H are and have been and will be. To give his friend a feel good moment..... This frustrated the sh!t out of me. Seriously he can see it in others but not himself. WTF!!!!! So he can see how bad that turned out but can't look at his own [censored] show.
I know He has convinced himself that he is really in love with OW. I need to just let go, I need to just give up. But no, what do I do, tell him that in my gut I can't give up on us. OMG could I have been anymore pathetic.
Why am I so weak with him. Like anything I say will ever make a difference. I know it won't, but stupid me just had to try. I am so frustrated with myself. I told him, that I missed him and that we were still a option, that it was not to late. That our M was worth more than his A, that we know each other better than anyone else knows us, after 21 years together you don't just through that away... and I just get silence..... Dumb, dumb, dumb......
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/21/22 07:14 PM
S,
Don’t be so hard on yourself. We all have setbacks. Get up, dust yourself off and restart the clock.
T
Don’t be so hard on yourself. We all have setbacks. Get up, dust yourself off and restart the clock.
T
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/21/22 07:24 PM
((Stella)) - we've all been there and done that. Just reset the clock and keep going.
Just check out some of us "old-timers"'s early threads - I just read back to January 2017 whooo boy was I messed up. I remember calling my wife then when I realized that she'd been stringing me along and had gone to see OM. Any of the questions I demanded answers to where met with silence and weeping.
It's hard to see right now, but you're doing fine.
Just check out some of us "old-timers"'s early threads - I just read back to January 2017 whooo boy was I messed up. I remember calling my wife then when I realized that she'd been stringing me along and had gone to see OM. Any of the questions I demanded answers to where met with silence and weeping.
It's hard to see right now, but you're doing fine.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/21/22 08:30 PM
Hello Stella
We all had setbacks. All of us!
And by the way, these moment are needed. I’ve often said, setback is improperly named. This is forward progress, even though it appears to be setting back somewhat.
You need to prove this situation, to prove what you know, to yourself. It’s part of the process, and part of gaining your strength and fortitude.
Breathe. Be gentle on yourself.
You are not weak. Nor are you stupid. You have demonstrated great strength and character. And I do admire your affinity for rationalizing and understanding.
Remember what I said about bargaining? Such a weird stage of grief. We will try, bargain, almost anything to regain our once normal emotional security. To somehow not have the loss. This is our last ditch emotional efforts. Perfectly normal and healthy. Don’t fret.
Better not bitter.
This exchange with H was for you. You needed it. That’s why it transpired. You are crafting and strengthening beliefs, values, and convictions. I know that is difficult to see, have faith and stay to the light. Your dividends will far outweigh this temporary suffering. That which emerges from the crucible is so worth it.
Absolutely nothing is wrong with you!
How do you think one gains strength or will power? Wisdom comes from experience. And experience usually comes from “incorrect” actions or decisions. One who does everything “right” has little opportunity for experience. You are now wiser then before. Use it well. (((Stella)))
I suspect the 24 hour rule will get more scrutiny next time. And yes, there will be a next time from H.
My greatest best lessons and wisdom gained came from failing at something. I’d never experienced being cheated on like this, or a divorce, or much of anything of my situation. My goodness, the experience and, thankfully, the wisdom gained. I’d not trade it back. The gains we make are so very worth all this.
Stand back up. Dust off. Breathe deep. Shoulders back. Head held high. You really are doing fine.
D
We all had setbacks. All of us!
And by the way, these moment are needed. I’ve often said, setback is improperly named. This is forward progress, even though it appears to be setting back somewhat.
You need to prove this situation, to prove what you know, to yourself. It’s part of the process, and part of gaining your strength and fortitude.
Originally Posted by Stella20
Why am I so weak with him. Like anything I say will ever make a difference. I know it won't, but stupid me just had to try. I am so frustrated with myself. I told him, that I missed him and that we were still a option, that it was not to late. That our M was worth more than his A, that we know each other better than anyone else knows us, after 21 years together you don't just through that away... and I just get silence..... Dumb, dumb, dumb......
Breathe. Be gentle on yourself.
You are not weak. Nor are you stupid. You have demonstrated great strength and character. And I do admire your affinity for rationalizing and understanding.
Remember what I said about bargaining? Such a weird stage of grief. We will try, bargain, almost anything to regain our once normal emotional security. To somehow not have the loss. This is our last ditch emotional efforts. Perfectly normal and healthy. Don’t fret.
Better not bitter.
This exchange with H was for you. You needed it. That’s why it transpired. You are crafting and strengthening beliefs, values, and convictions. I know that is difficult to see, have faith and stay to the light. Your dividends will far outweigh this temporary suffering. That which emerges from the crucible is so worth it.
Originally Posted by Stella20
So mad at myself right now, like I just had to dig for more pain. WTF is wrong with me. I have no will power when it comes to H.
Absolutely nothing is wrong with you!
How do you think one gains strength or will power? Wisdom comes from experience. And experience usually comes from “incorrect” actions or decisions. One who does everything “right” has little opportunity for experience. You are now wiser then before. Use it well. (((Stella)))
I suspect the 24 hour rule will get more scrutiny next time. And yes, there will be a next time from H.
My greatest best lessons and wisdom gained came from failing at something. I’d never experienced being cheated on like this, or a divorce, or much of anything of my situation. My goodness, the experience and, thankfully, the wisdom gained. I’d not trade it back. The gains we make are so very worth all this.
Stand back up. Dust off. Breathe deep. Shoulders back. Head held high. You really are doing fine.
D
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/21/22 09:58 PM
Thank you.... I needed to hear that.
I am just so disappointed in myself for being so weak with H.
Why do I keep trying? Why can't I just let go? Why do I keep hoping for a different answer any answer? Why do I keep hoping that he is still in there? Why am I having such a hard time excepting that this M is over, that we are getting a D? Why do I keep holding on, and hoping? How can this be happening? Why do I even want this anymore? Why am I even telling him that there is still a chance? It means nothing to him. But why be nice to me, why call me, why even talk to me???
Yes, I see the bargaining, yep...(big sigh)...Some of the crazy stuff in my head...what is/has happening to me. I use to be so confident, happy and sure of myself. I use to laugh, I'm trying to be that women again, just really hard to see through the trees.
I wish I had a fast forward button for my life right now.
.
I am just so disappointed in myself for being so weak with H.
Why do I keep trying? Why can't I just let go? Why do I keep hoping for a different answer any answer? Why do I keep hoping that he is still in there? Why am I having such a hard time excepting that this M is over, that we are getting a D? Why do I keep holding on, and hoping? How can this be happening? Why do I even want this anymore? Why am I even telling him that there is still a chance? It means nothing to him. But why be nice to me, why call me, why even talk to me???
Yes, I see the bargaining, yep...(big sigh)...Some of the crazy stuff in my head...what is/has happening to me. I use to be so confident, happy and sure of myself. I use to laugh, I'm trying to be that women again, just really hard to see through the trees.
I wish I had a fast forward button for my life right now.
.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/21/22 10:40 PM
Stella,
Long story short it just your brain trying to protect you. It doesn’t like uncertainty and it’s tricking you into pursuing your husband. That’s why NC is for you and you should block him on your phone letting him know you will communicate only through email.
Long story short it just your brain trying to protect you. It doesn’t like uncertainty and it’s tricking you into pursuing your husband. That’s why NC is for you and you should block him on your phone letting him know you will communicate only through email.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/22/22 12:43 AM
as others have said, we've all been there. this is not a linear path. as long as you learn something from each step in the journey, you're making progress.
xoxoxo
xoxoxo
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/22/22 03:42 AM
Change his name in your phone to something derogatory, like F—-Face. You might be less likely to answer the call.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/22/22 04:28 AM
Thank you everyone, your support and experience is so much needed and appreciated. Thanks for being here today for yet another Stella meltdown.
Bttrfly- I am learning, and yes, it is a rollercoaster for sure. This is gonna take awhile.
Kml- i have it listed as a**hole. and his ringtone is bullsh*ter alert sound.
Dnj. yes 24 hour rule, I need to make that my standard.
L- I don't feel comfortable blocking him yet, maybe someday.
Big hug to everyone
Bttrfly- I am learning, and yes, it is a rollercoaster for sure. This is gonna take awhile.
Kml- i have it listed as a**hole. and his ringtone is bullsh*ter alert sound.
Dnj. yes 24 hour rule, I need to make that my standard.
L- I don't feel comfortable blocking him yet, maybe someday.
Big hug to everyone
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/23/22 03:13 PM
A few comments from H from the other day...
"I have always done everything for everyone else. (when I asked what, no answer) When was the last time you did something special for me? I have been unhappy for 2 years. Yes we had a good life. Everything accumulated over the years"
What accumulated over ther years? He never mentioned one word to me about not being happy. I am not a mind reader. Said somethings should be unspoken, when I asked what he couldn't answer. WTF????????????
You don't blow up your marriage and emotionally murder your wife without talking to her.
"I have always done everything for everyone else. (when I asked what, no answer) When was the last time you did something special for me? I have been unhappy for 2 years. Yes we had a good life. Everything accumulated over the years"
What accumulated over ther years? He never mentioned one word to me about not being happy. I am not a mind reader. Said somethings should be unspoken, when I asked what he couldn't answer. WTF????????????
You don't blow up your marriage and emotionally murder your wife without talking to her.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/23/22 03:32 PM
Originally Posted by Stella20
"I have always done everything for everyone else. (when I asked what, no answer)
Originally Posted by Stella20
When was the last time you did something special for me?
Originally Posted by Stella20
I have been unhappy for 2 years.
Originally Posted by Stella20
What accumulated over ther years?
Originally Posted by Stella20
He never mentioned one word to me about not being happy.
Originally Posted by Stella20
I am not a mind reader. Said somethings should be unspoken, when I asked what he couldn't answer. WTF????????????
Originally Posted by Stella20
You don't blow up your marriage and emotionally murder your wife without talking to her.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/23/22 04:23 PM
Hi Stella,
I agree with LH. All of us who have had someone walk away (or even parented teens) get it's hard in the moment to LISTEN/VALIDATE (hear them) instead of ARGUE your view and invalidate theirs. Strategically, what will you do the next time he’s trying to open up about his feelings and you’re not in the mood to listen?
Couldn’t or wouldn’t? He had just told you—unlike the issue he spoke up and questioned you about a moment earlier—that he wanted to leave this issue unspoken. This is his feeling now. It may change.
I agree with LH. All of us who have had someone walk away (or even parented teens) get it's hard in the moment to LISTEN/VALIDATE (hear them) instead of ARGUE your view and invalidate theirs. Strategically, what will you do the next time he’s trying to open up about his feelings and you’re not in the mood to listen?
Originally Posted by Stella
Said somethings should be unspoken, when I asked what he couldn't answer. WTF????????????
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/23/22 04:39 PM
Originally Posted by Stella
I have always done everything for everyone else.
“You’ve been so busy trying to please other people, you ignored your own desires.”
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/23/22 04:44 PM
Yes, I should have said I understand, but instead, I asked him what he ment by that. Was he talking about mowing the lawn or doing chores around the house? H was always the planner, always had to make sure everyone was having fun. Coming up with games to play so that everyone was interacting. Took care of his Grandma. He never had to take care of me, we took care of each other. At least thats what I thought.
Have I done anything special for him, not in recent years. I would always pick out cards for him that spoke to my love for him. I would pick up a shirt or small gifts while out shopping that I knew he would like. But grand gestures, no I don't think so. For this last xmas, before I knew he was going to move out, I had our the lyrics to our first dance song from our wedding, printed on a canvas. Too little too late. I always told him how much I loved him, how good he looked in certain shirts, how it brought out his eyes, how handsome he was. I would smoother his face with kisses, grab his behind, hug him, touch him. Smile when I would see him.
Yes, we got into a rut the last few years, got too comfortable, going through the routines of everyday life, but I never doubted our commitment to each other.
I feel so lost without him, I don't know how to get through this. Talking with him does nothing. My love and belief in our M, means nothing. Just through it all away and move on
Have I done anything special for him, not in recent years. I would always pick out cards for him that spoke to my love for him. I would pick up a shirt or small gifts while out shopping that I knew he would like. But grand gestures, no I don't think so. For this last xmas, before I knew he was going to move out, I had our the lyrics to our first dance song from our wedding, printed on a canvas. Too little too late. I always told him how much I loved him, how good he looked in certain shirts, how it brought out his eyes, how handsome he was. I would smoother his face with kisses, grab his behind, hug him, touch him. Smile when I would see him.
Yes, we got into a rut the last few years, got too comfortable, going through the routines of everyday life, but I never doubted our commitment to each other.
I feel so lost without him, I don't know how to get through this. Talking with him does nothing. My love and belief in our M, means nothing. Just through it all away and move on
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/23/22 05:04 PM
Bear this in mind - the typical WAS is in a depression. They don't know WHY they are depressed, so they look around for an answer. The first thing they see is their spouse. And of course there are always SOME things that irritate you in a marriage. So they decide YOU are the reason they are unhappy. Especially they decide this if they have already started an affair with someone that is giving them rushes of infatuation. They feel better! It must have been you!!!
Often, in their search for justification for their affair, they will come up with ridiculous things. My ex told me I "walked too heavy" - and not only that, I "taught our daughter to walk too heavy"!!!! Now first of all - I checked with several people and no, there is nothing unusual about my gait. But if there WAS, and my daughter had the same gait, wouldn't you assume it was genetic? What kind of crazy person thinks I was giving our daughter lessons in walking heavy to annoy him???? Someone who can't find any other excuse for his cheating.
One woman here, I remember, was 5'8" 135 lbs - and her H told her he left her because she was too fat!!!
Now - validating is still a good approach. You can validate his feelings without taking responsibility on yourself. The examples given above were good.
Also- bear in mind, he might be a narcissist. If so, you having a back problem and no longer being able to bowl with him is an intolerable annoyance for a narcissist, where everything is about THEM and you having any illness or disability does not evoke empathy but irritation.
Yes, you might have gotten a little preoccupied with your back pain and a little comfortable in the relationship. But a GOOD partner would have been solicitous of your health, and able to tolerate a short period of less excitement in a long term good marriage. I doubt if you had done anything different that the result would have been any different. This is not likely to be about you.
Also, his alcoholism plays a role. We don't know which is chicken or egg - did he start drinking more heavily because he was depressed, and left the marriage to be somewhere that he wouldn't feel guilty about drinking so much? Or did he leave the marriage so he could drink more? Who knows? But it's definitely a problem.
Don't believe half of what he says - watch what he does. It's good to examine your role in the marriage so that you won't repeat mistakes in the future - but like most marriages here with MLCers, you were not the cause of this. His own issues are the cause. You could probably pretzel yourself into the perfect woman and he'd still come up with some other excuse.
And you're absolutely right - a healthy person experiencing those feelings would go to their partner and try to repair whatever they thought was wrong in the marriage first.
Often, in their search for justification for their affair, they will come up with ridiculous things. My ex told me I "walked too heavy" - and not only that, I "taught our daughter to walk too heavy"!!!! Now first of all - I checked with several people and no, there is nothing unusual about my gait. But if there WAS, and my daughter had the same gait, wouldn't you assume it was genetic? What kind of crazy person thinks I was giving our daughter lessons in walking heavy to annoy him???? Someone who can't find any other excuse for his cheating.
One woman here, I remember, was 5'8" 135 lbs - and her H told her he left her because she was too fat!!!
Now - validating is still a good approach. You can validate his feelings without taking responsibility on yourself. The examples given above were good.
Also- bear in mind, he might be a narcissist. If so, you having a back problem and no longer being able to bowl with him is an intolerable annoyance for a narcissist, where everything is about THEM and you having any illness or disability does not evoke empathy but irritation.
Yes, you might have gotten a little preoccupied with your back pain and a little comfortable in the relationship. But a GOOD partner would have been solicitous of your health, and able to tolerate a short period of less excitement in a long term good marriage. I doubt if you had done anything different that the result would have been any different. This is not likely to be about you.
Also, his alcoholism plays a role. We don't know which is chicken or egg - did he start drinking more heavily because he was depressed, and left the marriage to be somewhere that he wouldn't feel guilty about drinking so much? Or did he leave the marriage so he could drink more? Who knows? But it's definitely a problem.
Don't believe half of what he says - watch what he does. It's good to examine your role in the marriage so that you won't repeat mistakes in the future - but like most marriages here with MLCers, you were not the cause of this. His own issues are the cause. You could probably pretzel yourself into the perfect woman and he'd still come up with some other excuse.
And you're absolutely right - a healthy person experiencing those feelings would go to their partner and try to repair whatever they thought was wrong in the marriage first.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/23/22 05:08 PM
Originally Posted by Stella20
Yes, we got into a rut the last few years, got too comfortable, going through the routines of everyday life, but I never doubted our commitment to each other.
Because you are a normal caring healthy understanding person. Your husband is not and this speaks a lot to his character.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/23/22 10:41 PM
Thank you all,
I just feel so defeated and beat down. I called the doctor just now to see if they could give me something to help, have a appointment tomorrow morning with Doctor and counsling appointment tomorrow also. I feel so weak, so sad, so lost. Was talking with my sister all day and I just can't pull myself together today or for the last 3 days. Feel like I am just sinking deeper and deeper into depression and hopelessness.
I just feel so defeated and beat down. I called the doctor just now to see if they could give me something to help, have a appointment tomorrow morning with Doctor and counsling appointment tomorrow also. I feel so weak, so sad, so lost. Was talking with my sister all day and I just can't pull myself together today or for the last 3 days. Feel like I am just sinking deeper and deeper into depression and hopelessness.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/23/22 10:53 PM
Some do benefit from an antidepressant to get them through the acute phase of loss. Also remember exercise, vitamin D, sunshine, music (NOT sad music!) can all help as well.
I personally love the movie She-Devil with Roseanne Barr - a satisfying story of a woman dumped by her husband for Meryl Streep's insipid romance-writer OW. She gets her revenge in ingenious ways. NOT that I am suggesting trying for revenge - but it is satisfying to laugh about it on the screen!
I personally love the movie She-Devil with Roseanne Barr - a satisfying story of a woman dumped by her husband for Meryl Streep's insipid romance-writer OW. She gets her revenge in ingenious ways. NOT that I am suggesting trying for revenge - but it is satisfying to laugh about it on the screen!
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/24/22 12:21 AM
Kml,
I started tanning to see if that would help, not alot of sunshine right now around here.. Easing back into exercise too. I just can seem to pull myself back together latley. Go to bed angry and sure of myself with a forget him attitude and wake up crying. Which today was all day.
Just thinking about his comments the other day, still blaming me, looking at little issues and blowing them up to justify his actions. It f-ing hurts like he!!. Just drives home the fact that he is not a healthy mature person.
I started tanning to see if that would help, not alot of sunshine right now around here.. Easing back into exercise too. I just can seem to pull myself back together latley. Go to bed angry and sure of myself with a forget him attitude and wake up crying. Which today was all day.
Just thinking about his comments the other day, still blaming me, looking at little issues and blowing them up to justify his actions. It f-ing hurts like he!!. Just drives home the fact that he is not a healthy mature person.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/24/22 01:27 AM
Stella I’m really sorry you’re struggling. This is why no contact is so important. If you go to the newcomers thread and read KitKats story she’s been doing the same thing for two years now and refuses to block him and it is emotionally breaking her. These leeches will try anything to keep you emotionally invested. It took my exw about 18 months to realize that I will discuss nothing but minimal amount to coparent. Take care and be patient with yourself.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/24/22 02:04 AM
Thanks LH, 2 years!!! I can't stay like this for 2 years.
I hate no contact, but I am seeing that having contact is causing me to spiral. Ever time I expect to talk to my old H, and it isn't him, he is not in there right now.
Although he says, " I am the same person I have always been:...then he is nice to me and talks to me about what our friends are up to..why??? why be nice, why talk to me about these things? And then blow up and start spewing stuff that came out of him over this last summer??? I cant take all of the mixed messages anymore.
I used to be such a strong confident women, this is wrecking me. My head gets it, my heart doesn't want to let go. But I have to stop this, I can not continue to feel like this, it is breaking me.
I know I have to let go of who I thought he was.
If anyone ever invents a pill to cure MLC, they would be rich.....
I hate no contact, but I am seeing that having contact is causing me to spiral. Ever time I expect to talk to my old H, and it isn't him, he is not in there right now.
Although he says, " I am the same person I have always been:...then he is nice to me and talks to me about what our friends are up to..why??? why be nice, why talk to me about these things? And then blow up and start spewing stuff that came out of him over this last summer??? I cant take all of the mixed messages anymore.
I used to be such a strong confident women, this is wrecking me. My head gets it, my heart doesn't want to let go. But I have to stop this, I can not continue to feel like this, it is breaking me.
I know I have to let go of who I thought he was.
If anyone ever invents a pill to cure MLC, they would be rich.....
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/24/22 06:10 AM
Hello Stella
I understand what you’re feeling. Lots of these suggestions are counterintuitive and will feel like the wrong thing to do, it is not. (((Hugs)))
No contact is for you. It’s not to wake up H. It’s for your mental and emotional health.
We all start in an emotional feedback loop which reinforces our hurting feelings. It is difficult to let go of our spouse. To let go “the dream”. Do place your focus upon you. This is critical for you to influence your feelings. You do control your thoughts, and can influence your feelings and beliefs - influence your heart and soul.
We do break somewhat during this process. It hurts. It wrecks us. And it is a blessing, if you make it so. You can, will, examine which pieces you reassemble and which you discard. Become the strong confident woman, even more so. Become the best version of you.
Actually, you need to let go of who you think he is right now. Who he was, is just that - who he was. MLCers become the opposite of who they once were. You have proof right before you. The alien guy looks like H, sounds like H, even has mannerisms like H, yet he is so much different. Your mind and heart are just struggling to accept what they see and hear.
These crisis people bring up wild justification for their new narrative. My XW blamed me for the furnace blowing cool air on her. For my work truck burning too much gas, while she was trying to save the planet. (My personal vehicle is a Prius, but no matter to her. ) And so on. And yes, having XW say this while sounding like J was hard to figure out at first.
You do not need to let go of past H. The past is immutable. You shared a life together. It was even a wonderful life. Just set that aside for now. Place it in storage for a while. Cherish it. Do not dwell upon the past, nor go for strolls down memory lane - it is far to easy to get lost, and you will reinforce emotions and thoughts you do not want to reinforce right now. Don’t worry, you won’t forget, or loose anything you don’t want to. I promise.
I have a question for you. Do you feel more anxious or depressed?
If I may, you are anxious.
Anxiety comes from living / focusing / worrying on the future. Depression comes from dwelling upon the past. Peace comes from living in the present.
It’s not past H you need to let go of right now - it’s your future. It’s that dream. It’s letting go who you want H to be, and accepting who he is right now.
Once you let go the future, your anxiety will turn to depressions as your focus turns to the past. This is a normal and needed part of the healing process.
When my wife left, I lost my bright future. It was ripped away. I would never experience a 60th wedding anniversary, not have a loving wife beside me during the weddings of our children, not be on the same speaker call when we hear about the birth of our first grandchild. Retirement plans, grandkids, vacations, etc. All destroyed. I was sad and distraught. On top of that loss, my impending doom of a divorce loomed. Oh, I was such a bundle of anxiety, adrenaline, and nerves; with a splash of depression just to mix and stir and darken everything.
Once I accepted that my planned wonderful future life was over. My attention, turned to my past. As one accepts the loss of their imagined planed future, it affects our past. We “feel” it deleting. Never again, to walk hand in hand with J, to hear her laugh, to be her most special man, etc. Never will I get to dance with her again, nor travel and talk for hours, nor be a family again.
Depression is a dark stage of grief. Full of feelings of absolutes and negatives.
Once I worked and walked through that, life bloomed again. My purposefully kept squishy heart began to feel and love, far more than I felt it was even possible during the grief and loss. Bird sang again. Color exploded in the world again. My past returned. Without pain. All the cherished memories. My immutable past does not haunt me; it is actually up lifting.
My future exists again. Yes, it is not the one I had planned. Nor is it something I fret over. My divorce was finalized years ago, and provided me a stable solid foundation. And I crafted from there. I find my future plans are not firmly envisioned, a more general idea.
Acceptance, peace and contentment, letting go and accepting of a lost future, accepting and remembering an unchangeable past, does happen.
There are plenty of milestones along the path. In my view, you are currently working to let go of your still held future. Detachment and indifference are coming.
Be patient and focus on you.
D
I understand what you’re feeling. Lots of these suggestions are counterintuitive and will feel like the wrong thing to do, it is not. (((Hugs)))
No contact is for you. It’s not to wake up H. It’s for your mental and emotional health.
Originally Posted by Stella20
I used to be such a strong confident women, this is wrecking me. My head gets it, my heart doesn't want to let go. But I have to stop this, I can not continue to feel like this, it is breaking me.
We all start in an emotional feedback loop which reinforces our hurting feelings. It is difficult to let go of our spouse. To let go “the dream”. Do place your focus upon you. This is critical for you to influence your feelings. You do control your thoughts, and can influence your feelings and beliefs - influence your heart and soul.
We do break somewhat during this process. It hurts. It wrecks us. And it is a blessing, if you make it so. You can, will, examine which pieces you reassemble and which you discard. Become the strong confident woman, even more so. Become the best version of you.
Originally Posted by Stella20
I know I have to let go of who I thought he was.
Actually, you need to let go of who you think he is right now. Who he was, is just that - who he was. MLCers become the opposite of who they once were. You have proof right before you. The alien guy looks like H, sounds like H, even has mannerisms like H, yet he is so much different. Your mind and heart are just struggling to accept what they see and hear.
These crisis people bring up wild justification for their new narrative. My XW blamed me for the furnace blowing cool air on her. For my work truck burning too much gas, while she was trying to save the planet. (My personal vehicle is a Prius, but no matter to her.
) And so on. And yes, having XW say this while sounding like J was hard to figure out at first. You do not need to let go of past H. The past is immutable. You shared a life together. It was even a wonderful life. Just set that aside for now. Place it in storage for a while. Cherish it. Do not dwell upon the past, nor go for strolls down memory lane - it is far to easy to get lost, and you will reinforce emotions and thoughts you do not want to reinforce right now. Don’t worry, you won’t forget, or loose anything you don’t want to. I promise.
I have a question for you. Do you feel more anxious or depressed?
Originally Posted by Stella20
Although he says, " I am the same person I have always been:...then he is nice to me and talks to me about what our friends are up to..why??? why be nice, why talk to me about these things? And then blow up and start spewing stuff that came out of him over this last summer??? I cant take all of the mixed messages anymore.
If I may, you are anxious.
Anxiety comes from living / focusing / worrying on the future. Depression comes from dwelling upon the past. Peace comes from living in the present.
It’s not past H you need to let go of right now - it’s your future. It’s that dream. It’s letting go who you want H to be, and accepting who he is right now.
Once you let go the future, your anxiety will turn to depressions as your focus turns to the past. This is a normal and needed part of the healing process.
When my wife left, I lost my bright future. It was ripped away. I would never experience a 60th wedding anniversary, not have a loving wife beside me during the weddings of our children, not be on the same speaker call when we hear about the birth of our first grandchild. Retirement plans, grandkids, vacations, etc. All destroyed. I was sad and distraught. On top of that loss, my impending doom of a divorce loomed. Oh, I was such a bundle of anxiety, adrenaline, and nerves; with a splash of depression just to mix and stir and darken everything.
Once I accepted that my planned wonderful future life was over. My attention, turned to my past. As one accepts the loss of their imagined planed future, it affects our past. We “feel” it deleting. Never again, to walk hand in hand with J, to hear her laugh, to be her most special man, etc. Never will I get to dance with her again, nor travel and talk for hours, nor be a family again.
Depression is a dark stage of grief. Full of feelings of absolutes and negatives.
Once I worked and walked through that, life bloomed again. My purposefully kept squishy heart began to feel and love, far more than I felt it was even possible during the grief and loss. Bird sang again. Color exploded in the world again. My past returned. Without pain. All the cherished memories. My immutable past does not haunt me; it is actually up lifting.
My future exists again. Yes, it is not the one I had planned. Nor is it something I fret over. My divorce was finalized years ago, and provided me a stable solid foundation. And I crafted from there. I find my future plans are not firmly envisioned, a more general idea.
Acceptance, peace and contentment, letting go and accepting of a lost future, accepting and remembering an unchangeable past, does happen.
There are plenty of milestones along the path. In my view, you are currently working to let go of your still held future. Detachment and indifference are coming.
Be patient and focus on you.
D
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/24/22 02:37 PM
Reading your posts takes me back four years. I so remember being where you are. It was the absolute worst pain I had ever felt… and the most anxious I had ever been. D is right…it was more about grieving the future I thought we would have than it was about grieving the loss of him. The person who cheated on me repeatedly and lied to my face for years while pretending to be my committed husband is, objectively, not someone anyone should miss. My head, like yours, knew that the entire time but my heart took some time to catch up.
I think it is a good idea to see your doctor Stella. I have always been a really strong person and I’m also a therapist so I know all about how to work through issues. Very difficult to do, however, in the beginning, when the trauma of this situation messes with your chemical make-up the most, it’s almost impossible. I was soooo anxious which is completely normal when one’s life as they know it gets ripped away in moment. I reluctantly went to my doctor and she prescribed an anti-anxiety/anti-depression medication that I think really helped to stabilize my emotions a bit so I was able to get through it.
One of the things that helped me is I wrote out a bunch of quotes on sticky notes and put them on my mirror so I could read them each morning. I’ll share a couple of my favourites with you…
“It is truly a frightening thing to face, see, and embrace the unknown, but you can do this. All it takes is opening your mind and heart to the vast, and endless possibilities of what you can become within yourself.”
“He REPRESENTS stability, validation, and a resumption of your ability to have control over your future. That is really what you want. You want what he represents to you based on where you are right now. Step back and realize he is NOT those things.”
“It is much easier to act your way into thinking differently, than it is to think your way into acting differently.” [This is a quote I read to get me up and moving instead of curling up into a ball and staying home.]
“Boundaries are the first line of defence to preserve your self respect.”
Keep posting Stella. It will help you get through this. (((HUGS)))
I think it is a good idea to see your doctor Stella. I have always been a really strong person and I’m also a therapist so I know all about how to work through issues. Very difficult to do, however, in the beginning, when the trauma of this situation messes with your chemical make-up the most, it’s almost impossible. I was soooo anxious which is completely normal when one’s life as they know it gets ripped away in moment. I reluctantly went to my doctor and she prescribed an anti-anxiety/anti-depression medication that I think really helped to stabilize my emotions a bit so I was able to get through it.
One of the things that helped me is I wrote out a bunch of quotes on sticky notes and put them on my mirror so I could read them each morning. I’ll share a couple of my favourites with you…
“It is truly a frightening thing to face, see, and embrace the unknown, but you can do this. All it takes is opening your mind and heart to the vast, and endless possibilities of what you can become within yourself.”
“He REPRESENTS stability, validation, and a resumption of your ability to have control over your future. That is really what you want. You want what he represents to you based on where you are right now. Step back and realize he is NOT those things.”
“It is much easier to act your way into thinking differently, than it is to think your way into acting differently.” [This is a quote I read to get me up and moving instead of curling up into a ball and staying home.]
“Boundaries are the first line of defence to preserve your self respect.”
Keep posting Stella. It will help you get through this. (((HUGS)))
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/24/22 03:32 PM
Oh yeah… KML’s suggestion to change your H’s name on your cell phone is a good one. I did that too because seeing his name would trigger me. I didn’t pick a derogatory name though because I felt like it would keep me angry. I started with “No One Important” and then it became “Nobody”. After the divorce, I changed it to “Kids’ Dad” which is an accurate description of who he is to me now…. nothing less, nothing more.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/24/22 04:15 PM
I haven’t changed my H’s name on my phone yet, but I did change his picture to a clown face. It did help.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/24/22 04:24 PM
Stella, I have good news and bad news. The good news: nothing else will ever come close to hurting as much as this. The bad news: this is going to take a while. It's a process. Once you get through this (and you WILL), you will not believe how much stronger you will be, and how much confidence you will have in yourself and your own abilities.
I know none of this is much of a comfort now. LH isn't wrong about blocking your stbx. I couldn't do it, but I did eventually get really good at not answering and letting him go to voicemail. That way I could gird my loins, so to speak, before listening to his messages.
Stella, I strongly suggest you take this time to try to figure out some things about YOU. What are your core values? Easy question? Well, dive deeper. Really think about what makes you YOU. What are the qualities you most admire in others. Which of those qualities do you embody? What is most important to you? Really important to do this exercise. I know when you're feeling so full of grief it's hard to focus on anything else, but spend even 5 minutes a day just focusing on YOU and what YOU want and what your core values are will help you.
Once I really understood my core values I could see so clearly how I wanted to proceed with my life, and most especially with the divorce negotiations. I used my core values as my yardstick for my behavior and responses to exh. Did I do it perfectly? Most assuredly NOT, but I had a standard to shoot for. From there it was a lot easier to figure out what I wanted, what was important to ME. If my husband followed along, great. If not, at least I was closer to a life that had meaning to ME.
I'm so sorry you're having such a hard time right now. It won't always be like this, but since it is like this right now, be very gentle with yourself. xoxoxo
I know none of this is much of a comfort now. LH isn't wrong about blocking your stbx. I couldn't do it, but I did eventually get really good at not answering and letting him go to voicemail. That way I could gird my loins, so to speak, before listening to his messages.
Stella, I strongly suggest you take this time to try to figure out some things about YOU. What are your core values? Easy question? Well, dive deeper. Really think about what makes you YOU. What are the qualities you most admire in others. Which of those qualities do you embody? What is most important to you? Really important to do this exercise. I know when you're feeling so full of grief it's hard to focus on anything else, but spend even 5 minutes a day just focusing on YOU and what YOU want and what your core values are will help you.
Once I really understood my core values I could see so clearly how I wanted to proceed with my life, and most especially with the divorce negotiations. I used my core values as my yardstick for my behavior and responses to exh. Did I do it perfectly? Most assuredly NOT, but I had a standard to shoot for. From there it was a lot easier to figure out what I wanted, what was important to ME. If my husband followed along, great. If not, at least I was closer to a life that had meaning to ME.
I'm so sorry you're having such a hard time right now. It won't always be like this, but since it is like this right now, be very gentle with yourself. xoxoxo
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/24/22 04:59 PM
Two lines that got me through this stage:
First is the Buddhist concept - all suffering comes from desire. Once you let go of wanting what you can't have right now, the better you'll feel.
The second: "Let go or be dragged". Once I ACCEPTED what was happening, I stopped suffering. I was able to look forward to the new life I was creating for myself, explore ways to change and improve myself, etc etc.
None of this is to say that he won't come back at some point - he may. But clinging to that hope right now just hurts you. Create a wonderful new life for yourself, and if he's destined to come back, he will find you in that great new life. And you can decide then whether you want him back or not.
The crucible of this change will make you stronger, and enable you to change in wonderful ways if you let it. It made me fearless - after all, the worst had happened, the thing I had fought against and feared for so long. And I survived it. By comparison, nothing else was scary. Learn to play the drums and other percussion in my 50's, and get up and perform in front of several thousand people? No problem! Have a new boyfriend break up with me? Small potatoes! Really, I feel like almost nothing can hurt me after that.
First is the Buddhist concept - all suffering comes from desire. Once you let go of wanting what you can't have right now, the better you'll feel.
The second: "Let go or be dragged". Once I ACCEPTED what was happening, I stopped suffering. I was able to look forward to the new life I was creating for myself, explore ways to change and improve myself, etc etc.
None of this is to say that he won't come back at some point - he may. But clinging to that hope right now just hurts you. Create a wonderful new life for yourself, and if he's destined to come back, he will find you in that great new life. And you can decide then whether you want him back or not.
The crucible of this change will make you stronger, and enable you to change in wonderful ways if you let it. It made me fearless - after all, the worst had happened, the thing I had fought against and feared for so long. And I survived it. By comparison, nothing else was scary. Learn to play the drums and other percussion in my 50's, and get up and perform in front of several thousand people? No problem! Have a new boyfriend break up with me? Small potatoes! Really, I feel like almost nothing can hurt me after that.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 01:00 AM
Hi Stella, I haven't posted on the boards here in a very long time and I am shocked that I can actually get in to post. I long ago thought my password or account had been dropped. I have tried off and on over the years to log in but never could. Tonight for some reason I tried a password version and it worked! I am so glad it did.
You have been getting great advice from people who have been around the block. I have a few things to add. First of all, I understand how awful it is. You would not wish the pain on your worst enemy. The depression, the sadness, being barely able to function... wanting to reach out and knowing it won't help... So hang in there. It will get better. It may take a long time I am sorry to say. So you really need to take care of yourself in every single way you can.
I haven't seen anyone yet recommend the book The Journey from Abandonment to Healing by Susan Anderson. I found it very helpful. I do think it was from that book that I learned there is a physiological connection between spouses that is broken when one leaves the other in addition to the emotional connection. This is part of why we want to reach out and reclaim that connection.
Only it's not possible because your husband is not thinking like you. He is not at all on the same wavelength. You could talk to him all day and he will never come back to the same planet. He is in a different universe.
What my mother told me was "you have to face it". So I did. I hope this might help you--Oh one more thing! The post it notes around my house, on mirrors, on the fridge, anywhere I could put them said Trust Yourself. Simple. Meaningful. True.
You have been getting great advice from people who have been around the block. I have a few things to add. First of all, I understand how awful it is. You would not wish the pain on your worst enemy. The depression, the sadness, being barely able to function... wanting to reach out and knowing it won't help... So hang in there. It will get better. It may take a long time I am sorry to say. So you really need to take care of yourself in every single way you can.
I haven't seen anyone yet recommend the book The Journey from Abandonment to Healing by Susan Anderson. I found it very helpful. I do think it was from that book that I learned there is a physiological connection between spouses that is broken when one leaves the other in addition to the emotional connection. This is part of why we want to reach out and reclaim that connection.
Only it's not possible because your husband is not thinking like you. He is not at all on the same wavelength. You could talk to him all day and he will never come back to the same planet. He is in a different universe.
What my mother told me was "you have to face it". So I did. I hope this might help you--Oh one more thing! The post it notes around my house, on mirrors, on the fridge, anywhere I could put them said Trust Yourself. Simple. Meaningful. True.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 05:11 AM
Thank you everyone, for all of your advice and for hanging in here with me. Makes me feel less alone to have found such a group of great caring people who have been through this, are still in it, and to listen to me, talk me through this and understand this whole circus...really thank you!!
H texted this morning, I did not respond.
The Doctor perscribe something to take daily, and my counslor today said that should help some. I felt so, I don't know, angry, embarassed being at the doctor. Not sure why, but I felt the same way when I went to my first counsling session back in July. Mad because I am in this place because of H.
Yes, it is the anxitey, and incredible sadness, lossing the future that was planned with H, blowing up a life that was good, wasting everything we worked to build together. The lose...of what was suspose to be a lifetime together. The promises made and now broken. The life that was so intertwined. The pain that he has put me in, while he goes out and lives this fantasy life with no concern of how he has hurt me. Sure he says I'm sorry, but there is no compasion in it.
Counslor talked alot today about alcoholics, recommended a intervention...Ha..that ain't gonna happen. Can you imagine... Talked about going to more Alanon meetings, there is one at a church near by I guess I will try that one next. Talked about my seperation anxitey too, practice mindfulness. I brought up MLC with him, but he was more focused on H's drinking and having to hit rock bottom. He isn't gonna give up drinking.. Whats the saying..man takes a drink, the drink takes a drink, the drink takes the man.. plus add MLC.. he's gone...drinking is his only true love....
Yes, I like the posts it, I just ordered a cork board to hang in my office. I have been taping stuff to the wall, but my cat, Archie, is obsessed with tape and keeps riping everything down...goofy cat. My fur babies and this thread have really been saving me. I swear the cats know when I need some love from them.
I also started journeling again today, that helped in the past. Might head up to my brothers place this Saturday, they live on a lake about 30 minutes away. Ice fishing and a cook out, not the beach I'd like to be at, but I have to get out of this house.
One day at a time for now, right..Let go or get dragged. I have been getting dragged..its my own doing..talking to him, reading into his words, trying to keep the connection. Just torturing myself.
Thanks everyone, time for bed, goodnight
Stella
H texted this morning, I did not respond.
The Doctor perscribe something to take daily, and my counslor today said that should help some. I felt so, I don't know, angry, embarassed being at the doctor. Not sure why, but I felt the same way when I went to my first counsling session back in July. Mad because I am in this place because of H.
Yes, it is the anxitey, and incredible sadness, lossing the future that was planned with H, blowing up a life that was good, wasting everything we worked to build together. The lose...of what was suspose to be a lifetime together. The promises made and now broken. The life that was so intertwined. The pain that he has put me in, while he goes out and lives this fantasy life with no concern of how he has hurt me. Sure he says I'm sorry, but there is no compasion in it.
Counslor talked alot today about alcoholics, recommended a intervention...Ha..that ain't gonna happen. Can you imagine... Talked about going to more Alanon meetings, there is one at a church near by I guess I will try that one next. Talked about my seperation anxitey too, practice mindfulness. I brought up MLC with him, but he was more focused on H's drinking and having to hit rock bottom. He isn't gonna give up drinking.. Whats the saying..man takes a drink, the drink takes a drink, the drink takes the man.. plus add MLC.. he's gone...drinking is his only true love....
Yes, I like the posts it, I just ordered a cork board to hang in my office. I have been taping stuff to the wall, but my cat, Archie, is obsessed with tape and keeps riping everything down...goofy cat. My fur babies and this thread have really been saving me. I swear the cats know when I need some love from them.
I also started journeling again today, that helped in the past. Might head up to my brothers place this Saturday, they live on a lake about 30 minutes away. Ice fishing and a cook out, not the beach I'd like to be at, but I have to get out of this house.
One day at a time for now, right..Let go or get dragged. I have been getting dragged..its my own doing..talking to him, reading into his words, trying to keep the connection. Just torturing myself.
Thanks everyone, time for bed, goodnight
Stella
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 06:25 AM
Ahhh yes… the “sorry” word. One word that is supposed to fix it or excuse it somehow. I remember being so incredulous when XH tried to use it with me and for the longest time I didn’t let him. Sorry is what you say when you accidentally bump into someone and spill their coffee…or you get into a disagreement with someone and say something you don’t mean. Sorry can suffice in those situations. But saying sorry when you lie to your spouse daily for months (in my case years) and break every promise you ever made to them? I told XH it was like taking a knife, purposely stabbing me directly in the heart and then saying, “oops…my bad.” It’s a hollow, meaningless word in this situation.
Glad your doctor prescribed you something Stella. I ended up taking my medication for about four months before I weaned myself off of it. It obviously didn’t change any circumstances for me but it definitely helped even out my emotions a bit so that I could function and begin to work on detachment. And when it finally came, it was such a relief. You will get there too Stella. I know it doesn’t feel like it right now. I wish I could give you a magic formula to skip ahead a few steps but I can’t. Unfortunately the only way to get past the pain is to go through it. (((HUGS)))
Glad your doctor prescribed you something Stella. I ended up taking my medication for about four months before I weaned myself off of it. It obviously didn’t change any circumstances for me but it definitely helped even out my emotions a bit so that I could function and begin to work on detachment. And when it finally came, it was such a relief. You will get there too Stella. I know it doesn’t feel like it right now. I wish I could give you a magic formula to skip ahead a few steps but I can’t. Unfortunately the only way to get past the pain is to go through it. (((HUGS)))
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 12:48 PM
Good Morning Stella
Good for you.
We all start out that way. It’s normal.
Let go with understanding and compassion. Let the feelings surrounding the connection fade. Let go without demonizing H. In my view, that’s the shortest path through the suffering to get to where you are wanting to be.
Yes, people in crisis need to hit rock bottom before they will change. Mix drinking and MLC, and it’s a deep hole to fall into.
The LBS hits their own rock bottom as well. Thing is, rock bottom is where and when a person decides it is. Most hurt LBS can and do decide they’ve fallen enough. Choose, and continue to be, better not bitter when you climb back out.
D
Originally Posted by Stella20
H texted this morning, I did not respond.
Good for you.
Originally Posted by Stella20
I have been getting dragged..its my own doing..talking to him, reading into his words, trying to keep the connection. Just torturing myself.
We all start out that way. It’s normal.
Let go with understanding and compassion. Let the feelings surrounding the connection fade. Let go without demonizing H. In my view, that’s the shortest path through the suffering to get to where you are wanting to be.
Yes, people in crisis need to hit rock bottom before they will change. Mix drinking and MLC, and it’s a deep hole to fall into.
The LBS hits their own rock bottom as well. Thing is, rock bottom is where and when a person decides it is. Most hurt LBS can and do decide they’ve fallen enough. Choose, and continue to be, better not bitter when you climb back out.
D
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 02:11 PM
Originally Posted by Stella20
I brought up MLC with him, but he was more focused on H's drinking and having to hit rock bottom.
Stella my exw's brother was/is an alcoholic. Spent time in jail for 3 dui's. If you were to meet him you would think he was a great guy. 95% of people on this planet could get 1 dui. To get 4 means you make really bad decisions and just don't give a flip. My ex BIL wasn't a horrible guy, he just made many bad decisions in life and only cared about himself. Those types of people live chaotic lives and never are content with a sense of normality. To have peace in your life you are going to have to let him go. If 4 duis are not rock bottom I hate to fathom what his rock bottom might be.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 02:57 PM
Originally Posted by LH19
Stella my exw's brother was/is an alcoholic. Spent time in jail for 3 dui's. If you were to meet him you would think he was a great guy. 95% of people on this planet could get 1 dui. To get 4 means you make really bad decisions and just don't give a flip.
I'd like to re-frame this ^^ LH --- It's not that an alcoholic just doesn't give a flip. It's that the alcoholic has absolutely no control once they put booze in their system. It's not a moral issue. This is an illness, like MS, Cancer, Diabetes. The booze controls everything. They simply cannot stop themselves. It's terrifying to see someone you love in the grip of this disease.
The alcoholic needs FIERCE compassion - compassion for the hell they are living, FIERCE meaning that compassion holds a FIRM boundary so the damage they inflict on themselves doesn't destroy you, the person who loves them.
BOUNDARIES. They are for you. Stella.
Interesting that about two years before BD his Gma passed.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 03:03 PM
Originally Posted by Iwondertooo
Hi Stella, I haven't posted on the boards here in a very long time and I am shocked that I can actually get in to post. I long ago thought my password or account had been dropped. I have tried off and on over the years to log in but never could. Tonight for some reason I tried a password version and it worked! I am so glad it did.
You have been getting great advice from people who have been around the block. I have a few things to add. First of all, I understand how awful it is. You would not wish the pain on your worst enemy. The depression, the sadness, being barely able to function... wanting to reach out and knowing it won't help... So hang in there. It will get better. It may take a long time I am sorry to say. So you really need to take care of yourself in every single way you can.
I haven't seen anyone yet recommend the book The Journey from Abandonment to Healing by Susan Anderson. I found it very helpful. I do think it was from that book that I learned there is a physiological connection between spouses that is broken when one leaves the other in addition to the emotional connection. This is part of why we want to reach out and reclaim that connection.
Only it's not possible because your husband is not thinking like you. He is not at all on the same wavelength. You could talk to him all day and he will never come back to the same planet. He is in a different universe.
What my mother told me was "you have to face it". So I did. I hope this might help you--Oh one more thing! The post it notes around my house, on mirrors, on the fridge, anywhere I could put them said Trust Yourself. Simple. Meaningful. True.
You have been getting great advice from people who have been around the block. I have a few things to add. First of all, I understand how awful it is. You would not wish the pain on your worst enemy. The depression, the sadness, being barely able to function... wanting to reach out and knowing it won't help... So hang in there. It will get better. It may take a long time I am sorry to say. So you really need to take care of yourself in every single way you can.
I haven't seen anyone yet recommend the book The Journey from Abandonment to Healing by Susan Anderson. I found it very helpful. I do think it was from that book that I learned there is a physiological connection between spouses that is broken when one leaves the other in addition to the emotional connection. This is part of why we want to reach out and reclaim that connection.
Only it's not possible because your husband is not thinking like you. He is not at all on the same wavelength. You could talk to him all day and he will never come back to the same planet. He is in a different universe.
What my mother told me was "you have to face it". So I did. I hope this might help you--Oh one more thing! The post it notes around my house, on mirrors, on the fridge, anywhere I could put them said Trust Yourself. Simple. Meaningful. True.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 03:28 PM
Originally Posted by bttrfly
Originally Posted by LH19
Stella my exw's brother was/is an alcoholic. Spent time in jail for 3 dui's. If you were to meet him you would think he was a great guy. 95% of people on this planet could get 1 dui. To get 4 means you make really bad decisions and just don't give a flip.
I'd like to re-frame this ^^ LH --- It's not that an alcoholic just doesn't give a flip. It's that the alcoholic has absolutely no control once they put booze in their system. It's not a moral issue. This is an illness, like MS, Cancer, Diabetes. The booze controls everything. They simply cannot stop themselves. It's terrifying to see someone you love in the grip of this disease.
The alcoholic needs FIERCE compassion - compassion for the hell they are living, FIERCE meaning that compassion holds a FIRM boundary so the damage they inflict on themselves doesn't destroy you, the person who loves them.
BOUNDARIES. They are for you. Stella.
Interesting that about two years before BD his Gma passed.
BF I have friends who are classified as alcoholics who don’t drink and drive. It a completely different breed who get multiple duis. It’s like people who multiple children out of wedlock and don’t care. 1 could happen to almost anyone. When you have four you just don’t care.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 03:51 PM
Or you’re just really severely alcoholic. You’re assuming, LH, that alcoholics always have control over their decision making. Some severe alcoholics become delusional, irrational or simply do things in blackouts they can’t even remember doing. I don’t think you understand the disease of alcoholism.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 04:06 PM
LH some are sicker than others.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 04:22 PM
Hello Stella
In all of this situation you can control only one thing - you. You cannot control H. Be it alcoholism, be it MLC, be it both; you cannot control nor fix it/him. For you did not break him.
You control you. Be compassionate. Be fierce and fearless in that pursuit. (I do love the fortitude that brings.) Compassion has a component of indifference and boundaries to it. It absolutely requires those components, else wise one gets dragged into the mire.
Accountability still exists and can be enforced and maintained. That does become tempered with culpable and non-culpable, and still held accountable though.
Compassion, validation, acceptance, forgiveness, and such is not a free pass for H. They are your tenets of life; one’s you are strengthening and crafting. Build strong and well. For you only control you.
D
In all of this situation you can control only one thing - you. You cannot control H. Be it alcoholism, be it MLC, be it both; you cannot control nor fix it/him. For you did not break him.
You control you. Be compassionate. Be fierce and fearless in that pursuit. (I do love the fortitude that brings.) Compassion has a component of indifference and boundaries to it. It absolutely requires those components, else wise one gets dragged into the mire.
Accountability still exists and can be enforced and maintained. That does become tempered with culpable and non-culpable, and still held accountable though.
Compassion, validation, acceptance, forgiveness, and such is not a free pass for H. They are your tenets of life; one’s you are strengthening and crafting. Build strong and well. For you only control you.
D
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 04:24 PM
Originally Posted by kml
Or you’re just really severely alcoholic. You’re assuming, LH, that alcoholics always have control over their decision making. Some severe alcoholics become delusional, irrational or simply do things in blackouts they can’t even remember doing. I don’t think you understand the disease of alcoholism.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 05:28 PM
Bttyfly,
Yes, it is a illness, I have talked to my counsler about it and what it does to a persons brain. It shuts down parts of the brain that control logical thought. H had 3 DUI's in his early 20's and the forth one when he was 41ish.
Nothing I can do about it. He is not going to make this right. Right now I have to focus, I just had the worst anxitey attack, called my sister and talked me through it. Never had one that bad, my brain just went off the rails, hard to explain. Took everything I had to just get through the last 3 hours.
Yes, it is a illness, I have talked to my counsler about it and what it does to a persons brain. It shuts down parts of the brain that control logical thought. H had 3 DUI's in his early 20's and the forth one when he was 41ish.
Nothing I can do about it. He is not going to make this right. Right now I have to focus, I just had the worst anxitey attack, called my sister and talked me through it. Never had one that bad, my brain just went off the rails, hard to explain. Took everything I had to just get through the last 3 hours.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 05:38 PM
My floor in the hospital is where all the alcoholics go. They come in withdrawl. They come in with liver failure. They come in with massive GI bleeds.
They are also frequent fliers. We get to know them well until they don’t make it out of here alive. I work with the psych APN and social worker closely on these cases.
Alcoholism is a disease. It’s likely a severe disease if you have gotten 4 DUI’s.
I’m the midst of being piss drunk, yea, control on rational decision making is not there.
However. Majority refuse help and treatment for their illness. There is treatment, and there is help. But most don’t want to do the work. We have one 35 year old right now who says he has no desire to be sober. We offer every resource . Those with families offer support. They don’t want to do the work.
So, while there it may true while they are under the influence and don’t have proper decision making capacity, there does come a point when you have to take responsibility for your health and your disease and do the work and take the treatment. In your sober moments and on your 4th DUI there needs to be a time to take personal responsibility and say “my disease might kill me and can possibly kill others. I need help “ and actual get the help and do the work.
I have been personally and professions affected by mental illness and addictions. And I fully believe in them. But when the behavior that is associated is dangerous to yourself and others, help is offered, your addiction is not an excuse not to take it and personal responsibility needs to be taken
They are also frequent fliers. We get to know them well until they don’t make it out of here alive. I work with the psych APN and social worker closely on these cases.
Alcoholism is a disease. It’s likely a severe disease if you have gotten 4 DUI’s.
I’m the midst of being piss drunk, yea, control on rational decision making is not there.
However. Majority refuse help and treatment for their illness. There is treatment, and there is help. But most don’t want to do the work. We have one 35 year old right now who says he has no desire to be sober. We offer every resource . Those with families offer support. They don’t want to do the work.
So, while there it may true while they are under the influence and don’t have proper decision making capacity, there does come a point when you have to take responsibility for your health and your disease and do the work and take the treatment. In your sober moments and on your 4th DUI there needs to be a time to take personal responsibility and say “my disease might kill me and can possibly kill others. I need help “ and actual get the help and do the work.
I have been personally and professions affected by mental illness and addictions. And I fully believe in them. But when the behavior that is associated is dangerous to yourself and others, help is offered, your addiction is not an excuse not to take it and personal responsibility needs to be taken
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 06:11 PM
Some say they don't want help and mean that. Usually that's the booze talking. Some say they don't want help, but really do - they just don't know how to stop, cannot imagine life without booze.
I've been involved in 12 step programs since I was 22 years old. I've seen and heard a lot. There is hope, but the person has to hit bottom and find their own way. No one can do it for them. Covid has caused an exponential uptake in active addiction of all kinds. People with multiple years in recovery have fallen off the wagon and in some cases died.
Yet, there is hope for recovery. As long as the person is alive, there is always hope. The key is understanding that you're powerless over their addiction be it to alcohol, sex, drugs, whatever. Focus on yourself. Pray for the person. Set boundaries for yourself. Stick to them as best you can. Move forward. Heal. Live your life. They are on a separate journey, and that is ok. No one knows the future, or what it holds for anyone. Focusing on yourself gives you back your personal power.
This is not easy, but you can do it, Stella. This is why I believe programs like Alanon are crucial for the family members affected by this disease. Check out online meetings as well.
I've been involved in 12 step programs since I was 22 years old. I've seen and heard a lot. There is hope, but the person has to hit bottom and find their own way. No one can do it for them. Covid has caused an exponential uptake in active addiction of all kinds. People with multiple years in recovery have fallen off the wagon and in some cases died.
Yet, there is hope for recovery. As long as the person is alive, there is always hope. The key is understanding that you're powerless over their addiction be it to alcohol, sex, drugs, whatever. Focus on yourself. Pray for the person. Set boundaries for yourself. Stick to them as best you can. Move forward. Heal. Live your life. They are on a separate journey, and that is ok. No one knows the future, or what it holds for anyone. Focusing on yourself gives you back your personal power.
This is not easy, but you can do it, Stella. This is why I believe programs like Alanon are crucial for the family members affected by this disease. Check out online meetings as well.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 06:34 PM
Yes Stella - my ex wasn’t an addict but he had had several concussions, and when he finally left it was hard to watch him drive off what I considered to be a cliff. We are used to caring for our spouses after such a long marriage. But he was on his own journey and he had fired me from that job of caring for him. He’s not my responsibility any more, and although he’s messed up his relationships with our kids (entirely separate from the divorce) he seems to be managing well enough.
Focus on your life going forward. Think a bit about why you tolerated his alcoholism for so long and how you can avoid an active alcoholic partner in the future.
What was your anxiety attack about? What were the words you were telling yourself?
Focus on your life going forward. Think a bit about why you tolerated his alcoholism for so long and how you can avoid an active alcoholic partner in the future.
What was your anxiety attack about? What were the words you were telling yourself?
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 06:40 PM
Originally Posted by Stella20
I just had the worst anxitey attack, called my sister and talked me through it. Never had one that bad, my brain just went off the rails, hard to explain. Took everything I had to just get through the last 3 hours.
Those attacks are sooooo hard.
Glad you could talk with your sister.
You explained it perfectly. Sometimes it’s hour by hour, sometimes it’s minute by minute.
You’re doing great Stella.
D
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 07:57 PM
I just had to go back to bed, not sure if it was this new drug Escitalopram 10 mg or what but the attack I just had was real and bad. Thank god my sister answered her phone, told me to take my Alprazolom for the anxitey, it helped. I took the new drug yesterday and was fine. Today was 2nd dose. All I know is my brain just went completely haywire, and shot me down to the depths of hell. I feel better now, went back to bed for the last few hours, still not feeling 100%. Shacky anxcious.
I and others have talked to H about his drinking over the years. Friends have stopped going to major bowling trips with him because they said the got sick of playing "wheres H" and who's turn it was to babysit him. Since BD when I have mentioned his drinking being a problem or that he has been drinking heavy, he says "I know". IMO I don't think he can imagine his life without it.
After his 4th DUI he had to quit cold turkey for 8 monts, he was on house arrest and had to wear a alcohol monitoring device. We could not have any booze in the house, the policy would show up sporadically to check up. He also had to have the interlocking device on his car for a year and a half, and could not drink very much the night before or his car would not start. We live in a nice neighborhood, it was all very embarassing, I was so mad at him after this happeded. And I told him how mad and disappointed I was, how it was disrespectful to our life for him to be so irresponsible. I was so mad then that I had thought about leaving him, I told him all of that. But we worked through it , I didn't walk away. Now he gets ubers or his friends pick him up for everything. Well, now the OW just drives them all over wasted too.
He was mugged in Vegas once, got taken overnight robbed and dropped on the street. They took everything from him. He could have been killed. At first I did not believe him but there was a police report. I really don't know what needs to happen for him to hit rock bottom. He has to want help, but I don't see that happening. I wish it would, I wish he would see the damage he has caused, that he is causing to the people that really do love him.
The more I learn about alcoholism and the effects, I really see that it is more that, than the A. If he hits rock bottom and reaches out for help, I will be there for him. D or not.
He has a friend that he was close to from High School who distroyed his life drinking. In and out of jail, homeless, half way houses. He stopped hanging out with him because he could see where his life was leading and there was not helping him.
His step brother, owns a bar, is now 2 years sober, his Grandma was a alcoholic and got clean when H was 3.
I and others have talked to H about his drinking over the years. Friends have stopped going to major bowling trips with him because they said the got sick of playing "wheres H" and who's turn it was to babysit him. Since BD when I have mentioned his drinking being a problem or that he has been drinking heavy, he says "I know". IMO I don't think he can imagine his life without it.
After his 4th DUI he had to quit cold turkey for 8 monts, he was on house arrest and had to wear a alcohol monitoring device. We could not have any booze in the house, the policy would show up sporadically to check up. He also had to have the interlocking device on his car for a year and a half, and could not drink very much the night before or his car would not start. We live in a nice neighborhood, it was all very embarassing, I was so mad at him after this happeded. And I told him how mad and disappointed I was, how it was disrespectful to our life for him to be so irresponsible. I was so mad then that I had thought about leaving him, I told him all of that. But we worked through it , I didn't walk away. Now he gets ubers or his friends pick him up for everything. Well, now the OW just drives them all over wasted too.
He was mugged in Vegas once, got taken overnight robbed and dropped on the street. They took everything from him. He could have been killed. At first I did not believe him but there was a police report. I really don't know what needs to happen for him to hit rock bottom. He has to want help, but I don't see that happening. I wish it would, I wish he would see the damage he has caused, that he is causing to the people that really do love him.
The more I learn about alcoholism and the effects, I really see that it is more that, than the A. If he hits rock bottom and reaches out for help, I will be there for him. D or not.
He has a friend that he was close to from High School who distroyed his life drinking. In and out of jail, homeless, half way houses. He stopped hanging out with him because he could see where his life was leading and there was not helping him.
His step brother, owns a bar, is now 2 years sober, his Grandma was a alcoholic and got clean when H was 3.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 09:14 PM
Kml,
I don't know I was fine last night, woke up tood the new meds with some food and it started shortly after. To be completly honest, I was having thoughts of ending it, and fear, strong thoughts. My sister and my cats saved me this morning. This is destroying me down to my core. Right now I just feel completly wiped out.
I don't know I was fine last night, woke up tood the new meds with some food and it started shortly after. To be completly honest, I was having thoughts of ending it, and fear, strong thoughts. My sister and my cats saved me this morning. This is destroying me down to my core. Right now I just feel completly wiped out.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 09:52 PM
Please let your doctor know about that. Sometime antidepressants can trigger suicidal thoughts in some people.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/25/22 11:12 PM
Hello Stella
I experienced anxiety and had suicidal thoughts after J’s departure. It’s a terrible hellish landscape to walk through. (My own personal rock bottom by the way.) Ripped apart, right down to my core. And yes, brain all haywire, trouble breathing, scared, sweaty, feelings of dread and doom.
I was so ashamed of myself and what had happened to me. I believed J’s poisonous words; she was my wife, and she had my absolute trust and faith. Gosh, what a horrible time that was.
I did get a prescription for antidepressants and had actually lied to the doctor when he asked; I didn’t tell him of my thoughts. Luckily, I read the entire warning paperwork and discovered how it might increase suicidal thoughts. I was so scared, I certainly didn’t need anymore of those, so I never did take any of the drugs.
If I had only told my doctor, he probably could have provided me some better relief. Funny, not sure why I didn’t, he is a trusted family friend. He’s been over for piano concerts at my house and Christmases. Shame I suppose. Emotion is powerful stuff.
At that time, I had not found this place. I was pretty alone. Guess I’m just letting you know you are among friends who understand and care about you.
D
I experienced anxiety and had suicidal thoughts after J’s departure. It’s a terrible hellish landscape to walk through. (My own personal rock bottom by the way.) Ripped apart, right down to my core. And yes, brain all haywire, trouble breathing, scared, sweaty, feelings of dread and doom.
I was so ashamed of myself and what had happened to me. I believed J’s poisonous words; she was my wife, and she had my absolute trust and faith. Gosh, what a horrible time that was.
I did get a prescription for antidepressants and had actually lied to the doctor when he asked; I didn’t tell him of my thoughts. Luckily, I read the entire warning paperwork and discovered how it might increase suicidal thoughts. I was so scared, I certainly didn’t need anymore of those, so I never did take any of the drugs.
If I had only told my doctor, he probably could have provided me some better relief. Funny, not sure why I didn’t, he is a trusted family friend. He’s been over for piano concerts at my house and Christmases. Shame I suppose. Emotion is powerful stuff.
At that time, I had not found this place. I was pretty alone. Guess I’m just letting you know you are among friends who understand and care about you.
D
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 12:15 AM
Thank you,
Yes, I have had the suicidal thoughts, and I lied to the doctor too. I did read the paperwork and it does say it increased suicidal thoughts as well. I will not take it tomorrow and call them back on Monday. I have been resting all day and trying to drink alot of water to help flush it our. I have had a heavy aching in my chest, shakes, pounding heart beat, cant get warm, throughout the day. It seems to be getting better, my head is still foggy and have a headache. I was so scared this morning, I can not even explain the fear. I have never felt like that, the fear and panic, hard to breath. I was ready to check myself in for a 72 hour hold.
I kept thinking of my fur babies and there is no way I could leave them, and my family, called my sister once it all crashed in on me. Sure felt like rock bottom to me, I don't want to feel like that again.
Thank you, D & K
I do not like what this is doing to me. I also called and made another appointment with my IC for this Monday.
Yes, I have had the suicidal thoughts, and I lied to the doctor too. I did read the paperwork and it does say it increased suicidal thoughts as well. I will not take it tomorrow and call them back on Monday. I have been resting all day and trying to drink alot of water to help flush it our. I have had a heavy aching in my chest, shakes, pounding heart beat, cant get warm, throughout the day. It seems to be getting better, my head is still foggy and have a headache. I was so scared this morning, I can not even explain the fear. I have never felt like that, the fear and panic, hard to breath. I was ready to check myself in for a 72 hour hold.
I kept thinking of my fur babies and there is no way I could leave them, and my family, called my sister once it all crashed in on me. Sure felt like rock bottom to me, I don't want to feel like that again.
Thank you, D & K
I do not like what this is doing to me. I also called and made another appointment with my IC for this Monday.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 12:47 AM
One of the best things to come out of all this (there's a best thing? out of THIS? What's she talking about!!!!) is the opportunity to regain yourself. The young you, the independent you, the you before you married and had to twist yourself into half of a couple.
The you that gets to decide what to do, when to do it, what to eat, where to travel, who to visit. Find that girl again.
The you that gets to decide what to do, when to do it, what to eat, where to travel, who to visit. Find that girl again.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 01:47 AM
You never have to feel like this again, once you get through this, Stella. Never. And you will get through it. Keep trying to flush out the meds. Talk to the dr. If it's not better tomorrow, call him. Someone has to be on call.
You are not alone, Stella, we are all here for you. xoxo
You are not alone, Stella, we are all here for you. xoxo
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 01:56 AM
Originally Posted by Stella20
Yes, I have had the suicidal thoughts, and I lied to the doctor too.
Don’t fret. You and I, we are in good company.
Originally Posted by Stella20
I have had a heavy aching in my chest, shakes, pounding heart beat, cant get warm, throughout the day. It seems to be getting better, my head is still foggy and have a headache. I was so scared this morning, I can not even explain the fear. I have never felt like that, the fear and panic, hard to breath. I was ready to check myself in for a 72 hour hold.
Looking back from the perspective of four years, and plenty of reading and talking to folks, you my dear Stella are quite normal. (In case you were wondering. I know I certainly was worry about myself back then.) And, I believe these emotions and fears and all, are revealed as our minds and hearts heal enough to be able to accept them. Before then, our mind keeps these from us so we don’t just fall completely apart.
I can assure you, these horrible emotions are temporary. Necessary, yes. And temporary.
Just focus on you. And breath. When you are within such a state, you only need to breathe. (((Hugs)))
Originally Posted by kml
(there's a best thing? out of THIS? What's she talking about!!!!)
LOL.
kml is one smart gal. She is correct. Find yourself. The young independent you.
For me, my situation was the most horrible and profoundly incredible experiences of my life. I’d never wish this upon anyone, and yet I’m very happy to have gone through it. The blessings are so worth the temporary struggle.
D
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 06:06 AM
((Stella20))
You are not alone. We are all here for you. I also had thoughts, but I couldn’t leave my kitty behind either. I think it’s natural to have these thoughts when the pain is so intense. The important thing is to not give into them. It does get easier. I won’t lie, I’m still struggling, but the pain is not as hard to bear as it was in the beginning. Just keep putting one foot in front of the other and don’t be too hard on yourself. It is painful. It is overwhelming. It hurts. It’s the worst thing to experience. But we all are surviving it and you will too. I promise. Just keep moving forward. We are walking with you.
El
You are not alone. We are all here for you. I also had thoughts, but I couldn’t leave my kitty behind either. I think it’s natural to have these thoughts when the pain is so intense. The important thing is to not give into them. It does get easier. I won’t lie, I’m still struggling, but the pain is not as hard to bear as it was in the beginning. Just keep putting one foot in front of the other and don’t be too hard on yourself. It is painful. It is overwhelming. It hurts. It’s the worst thing to experience. But we all are surviving it and you will too. I promise. Just keep moving forward. We are walking with you.
El
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 01:00 PM
My Mom and Dad are coming today, I can not be alone right now. I thought I was getting better, but the pain and hurt has just flooded me. Like I am back to day 1. How can any human being inflict this much pain onto another?
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 01:58 PM
Stella,
I’m glad your mom and dad are coming to visit. It might help to understand that your STBXH is not trying to inflict pain on you. He’s just trying to do what he thinks will make him happy. Unfortunately they to do not care or are unaware of the impact that it has on others.
Trust me you do not want an unhappy person staying in a relationship for the wrong reasons.
I’m glad your mom and dad are coming to visit. It might help to understand that your STBXH is not trying to inflict pain on you. He’s just trying to do what he thinks will make him happy. Unfortunately they to do not care or are unaware of the impact that it has on others.
Trust me you do not want an unhappy person staying in a relationship for the wrong reasons.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 02:22 PM
Good Morning Stella
It will be ok. I’m glad Mom and Dad are dropping by.
Just breathe.
A few things to consider.
You are getting better. All this emotion and pain comes raging back as denial melts away. Remember, grief is not linear.
My friend, this pain does not come from H. It comes from yourself.
H’s deed is long done. His power nearly spent. You are reinforcing your emotions. All perfectly normal by the way. It hurts terribly as one let’s go the connection. A horrible withdrawal.
You are withdrawing from the drug that is H. The loss of romantic love is reported as worse as heroin addiction withdrawal. Your mind is screaming for those endorphins that once swam around in plentiful numbers.
Focus on you. No contact. The shortest way through the boggy mire is a direct heading. It’s a slog, no doubt about that. Put pictures away. A firm 24-48 hour rule. Block him, except for one method like email. Check this email only once every 2 days at 6:00 pm, or whatever time you wish. A time that you scheduled to purposefully stir your emotions.
This is programming your subconscious and your heart. Focus on you.
Detachment will bring peace. And indifference will bring much calm.
Today
Just breathe.
Be in the moment.
It is only temporary. Fleeting in fact.
Breathe.
D
It will be ok. I’m glad Mom and Dad are dropping by.
Just breathe.
A few things to consider.
Originally Posted by Stella20
I thought I was getting better, but the pain and hurt has just flooded me. Like I am back to day 1.
You are getting better. All this emotion and pain comes raging back as denial melts away. Remember, grief is not linear.
Originally Posted by Stella20
How can any human being inflict this much pain onto another?
My friend, this pain does not come from H. It comes from yourself.
H’s deed is long done. His power nearly spent. You are reinforcing your emotions. All perfectly normal by the way. It hurts terribly as one let’s go the connection. A horrible withdrawal.
You are withdrawing from the drug that is H. The loss of romantic love is reported as worse as heroin addiction withdrawal. Your mind is screaming for those endorphins that once swam around in plentiful numbers.
Focus on you. No contact. The shortest way through the boggy mire is a direct heading. It’s a slog, no doubt about that. Put pictures away. A firm 24-48 hour rule. Block him, except for one method like email. Check this email only once every 2 days at 6:00 pm, or whatever time you wish. A time that you scheduled to purposefully stir your emotions.
This is programming your subconscious and your heart. Focus on you.
Detachment will bring peace. And indifference will bring much calm.
Today
Just breathe.
Be in the moment.
It is only temporary. Fleeting in fact.
Breathe.
D
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 02:53 PM
listen to D and LH
all you have to do for today is just breathe. focus on your breath as much qs you can. feel the inhale, feel the breath flooding your lungs hold it for a count of three then slowly, slowly exhale to a count of six. repeat. often. just breathe today honey, that's all you have to do. xoxoxo
all you have to do for today is just breathe. focus on your breath as much qs you can. feel the inhale, feel the breath flooding your lungs hold it for a count of three then slowly, slowly exhale to a count of six. repeat. often. just breathe today honey, that's all you have to do. xoxoxo
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 03:07 PM
Originally Posted by Stella20
I really don't know what needs to happen for him to hit rock bottom.
I think it's more a state of mind than anything - and requires self awareness as you point out.
Originally Posted by Stella20
Kml,
I don't know I was fine last night, woke up tood the new meds with some food and it started shortly after. To be completly honest, I was having thoughts of ending it, and fear, strong thoughts. My sister and my cats saved me this morning. This is destroying me down to my core. Right now I just feel completly wiped out.
I don't know I was fine last night, woke up tood the new meds with some food and it started shortly after. To be completly honest, I was having thoughts of ending it, and fear, strong thoughts. My sister and my cats saved me this morning. This is destroying me down to my core. Right now I just feel completly wiped out.
It was a time that I lived in much darkness.
What saved me that day was looking past the train, I could see that there was another side. I had no idea what was on it (metaphorically) but the very fact that a future could exist was enough to carry me through that very dark day.
I had been reading up on the various ways to off myself for a while at this point and wanted to have one that caused the least amount of pain for others and thought that was the "best" route as a train is rather impersonal.
I had other bad days but none so close to the edge as that one. I hope that helps you.
((Stella))
PS - My life now isn't one I could have imagined back then. It's a decent life. Not as fulfilling or rich as I might hope but in general I am content. I still have difficulty in seeing my future - it was so much easier when I was married because I had another to care for and make sure she was kept safe, happy and healthy. Now it's just middle-aged me and the middle-aged cat I adopted last year.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 06:34 PM
Thank you all for being here for me, My mom is going to stay for a couple of days. Going to church later today, and going to get out and run to a couple of stores. Got outside and shoveled the driveway, felt good to get some fresh air.
H sent a picture this morning of me holding our cat Allie, that passed 4 years ago, she was 21.5 years old. Why??? I did not respond. Same think last Saturday with the picture of Stella...
H sent a picture this morning of me holding our cat Allie, that passed 4 years ago, she was 21.5 years old. Why??? I did not respond. Same think last Saturday with the picture of Stella...
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 06:45 PM
Stella no one knows why. Most likely to ease the guilt and keep you emotionally attached. That’s why we advise you to block so these things won’t send you spinning. Eventually you will grow tired of the games.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 09:25 PM
I know it is hard to believe given his actions but your H doesn’t dislike you Stella. He’s just deeply unhappy and he thinks 1) his marriage to you is the cause and, 2) he will feel better with someone new. Not because they are better than you in any way but because with a new person, HE is a new person…in his mind (which is the only perspective that really matters when it comes to our own feelings about ourselves). And those new feelings of infatuation and risk taking (drinking to excess in his case) are as strong of a drug as heroin to his brain. That is what you are up against currently.
Deep down, however, he knows what he has done to you, he knows that you are suffering… so he sends you pictures of things that you share in a misguided attempt at comforting you and also to ease his guilt a bit by maintaining a connection. That’s it. He’s not THINKING about what he’s doing…he just doing what he FEELS like doing in the moment. The most likely scenario is that, at some point that morning, he was looking through his pictures and saw a pic of you and your cat so he sent it to you…maybe because he thought you might want it? He was not thinking about the effect it would have on you. So please don’t drive yourself crazy by trying to make sense of it.
FYI… re: anti-anxiety/anti-depressant medication… I highly doubt that you would take one pill and then experience suicidal thoughts because of it. My understanding is that these medications need to be taken for a period of time before you experience effects (good or bad) unless you have an allergic reaction. Also…doctors tend to start you on a really low dose just to make sure you aren’t allergic so it won’t have much of an effect in the early days either way. I’m not doctor, though, so KML (who is a medical doctor) may want to chime in here. FWIW…I started taking Escitalopram about three months post BD and I think it really helped take the edge off as I started to improve after that. Could have also been that enough time had passed and I was just naturally moving forward.
BTW… DnJ is right on the money when he says the person that is behind most of your suffering is you. Yes…your H left but you’re the person who chooses your brain’s focus and your activities. You have more power than you think you do. (((HUGS)))
Deep down, however, he knows what he has done to you, he knows that you are suffering… so he sends you pictures of things that you share in a misguided attempt at comforting you and also to ease his guilt a bit by maintaining a connection. That’s it. He’s not THINKING about what he’s doing…he just doing what he FEELS like doing in the moment. The most likely scenario is that, at some point that morning, he was looking through his pictures and saw a pic of you and your cat so he sent it to you…maybe because he thought you might want it? He was not thinking about the effect it would have on you. So please don’t drive yourself crazy by trying to make sense of it.
FYI… re: anti-anxiety/anti-depressant medication… I highly doubt that you would take one pill and then experience suicidal thoughts because of it. My understanding is that these medications need to be taken for a period of time before you experience effects (good or bad) unless you have an allergic reaction. Also…doctors tend to start you on a really low dose just to make sure you aren’t allergic so it won’t have much of an effect in the early days either way. I’m not doctor, though, so KML (who is a medical doctor) may want to chime in here. FWIW…I started taking Escitalopram about three months post BD and I think it really helped take the edge off as I started to improve after that. Could have also been that enough time had passed and I was just naturally moving forward.
BTW… DnJ is right on the money when he says the person that is behind most of your suffering is you. Yes…your H left but you’re the person who chooses your brain’s focus and your activities. You have more power than you think you do. (((HUGS)))
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/26/22 09:53 PM
My exh said it was "Time for something new" ...
Fast forward to last February ... son and I were talking. I said something disparaging about myself, and commented that OW/AP/2.0/Vista was probably in perfect physical shape, blonde, brown eyed (that's another thing my husband told me shortly post-BD, that he thought brown eyed blondes were his ideal for sexy - I am a hazel eyed brunette) ... my son said he had enough of me disparaging myself and since I'd clearly never seen her, he snagged a photo off her social media and showed it to me. She's 2 inches shorter than me. She's 10-15 pounds heavier than I was at BD (exh fat shamed me for the last several years of our marriage), she has the same hair, her eyes are a tad lighter hazel than mine. She is my doppleganger, per my son. She looks like she could be related to us.
Something new my sweet Italian @$$. These people are NUTS, Stella. Don't let him make you nuts, too! xoxoxo
Fast forward to last February ... son and I were talking. I said something disparaging about myself, and commented that OW/AP/2.0/Vista was probably in perfect physical shape, blonde, brown eyed (that's another thing my husband told me shortly post-BD, that he thought brown eyed blondes were his ideal for sexy - I am a hazel eyed brunette) ... my son said he had enough of me disparaging myself and since I'd clearly never seen her, he snagged a photo off her social media and showed it to me. She's 2 inches shorter than me. She's 10-15 pounds heavier than I was at BD (exh fat shamed me for the last several years of our marriage), she has the same hair, her eyes are a tad lighter hazel than mine. She is my doppleganger, per my son. She looks like she could be related to us.
Something new my sweet Italian @$$. These people are NUTS, Stella. Don't let him make you nuts, too! xoxoxo
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/27/22 12:26 AM
Quote
My friend, this pain does not come from H. It comes from yourself.
As I said before - all suffering comes from desire.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/27/22 04:56 PM
how are you today Stella? xoxoxo
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/27/22 06:42 PM
Checking in Stella. Hoping you are doing okay and getting a lot of love and support from your family.
El
El
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/27/22 08:23 PM
Hi,
I'm ok, went to church last night with my Mom, was the church we got married in, but it felt good to be there. I plan on going more, now that I ripped off that bandade. I was affraid to go, didn't know how I would handle it, but it was good. Went to dinner and came home and watch movies with mom.
Mornings are hard, but Mom and I ran to my brothers house to visit and just got home.
Tomorrow we are going to see my Aunts, one of my Aunts is a Nun, so it will be nice to see her. My whole family knows the ugly truth of everything, still makes me feel awkward, but whatever it is what it is.
I am trying to control my thoughts. The anxitey is better, but still there. I know I will get through this, just hard to see that road.
Thanks for checking in on me.
Stella
I'm ok, went to church last night with my Mom, was the church we got married in, but it felt good to be there. I plan on going more, now that I ripped off that bandade. I was affraid to go, didn't know how I would handle it, but it was good. Went to dinner and came home and watch movies with mom.
Mornings are hard, but Mom and I ran to my brothers house to visit and just got home.
Tomorrow we are going to see my Aunts, one of my Aunts is a Nun, so it will be nice to see her. My whole family knows the ugly truth of everything, still makes me feel awkward, but whatever it is what it is.
I am trying to control my thoughts. The anxitey is better, but still there. I know I will get through this, just hard to see that road.
Thanks for checking in on me.
Stella
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/27/22 09:22 PM
This just came from H's lawyer, thoughts ??? This just hit me hard also sent it to my brother.
H agrees that collectibles and sports memorabilia shall remain at the home until an
appraisal can be arranged. H wishes for an appraisal to be completed of all
household goods and personal effects, not just the collectibles and sports memorabilia. I
suggest that we jointly retain the services of Appraisers to have the appraisal
completed and that the parties share in the appraisal cost. Please advise.
H agrees that he shall maintain medical/dental/vision insurance coverage for both
he and Stella He agrees that each party shall be individually responsible for their own
uninsured costs moving forward.
Although not referenced in your correspondence to H, I would like a provision
added to the stipulated temporary order which provides that the parties shall file their 2021
state and federal income tax returns in the most financially advantageous manner, sharing
equally in the tax preparation fee, sharing equally in the refund, and being equally
responsible for the tax liability due, if any.
H reports that his January net bonus income was deposited into the joint
savings account. He is prepared to tender to her one half of the net base pay earned in
January, less $1,360.67, an amount equivalent to the unemployment compensation benefits
Stella is receiving. Moving forward (commencing February 2022), H will
provide to Stella one half of all net income, including base pay and bonus pay (less
$1,360.67). H reports that he has housing costs of $1,000 per month. He is paying
$800 for rent and contributing $200 for utilities and other miscellaneous housing costs.
Thus, he is opposed to Stella receiving any amount in excess of one half of his net
income. I believe his position to be fair and reasonable given the totality of circumstances.
Deferral of 2022 real estate taxes is agreed. H reports that the 2021 real estate taxes
were paid prior to December 31st
.
Finally, H agrees that he will not modify his tax withholdings or withholdings to
retirement accounts.
H agrees that collectibles and sports memorabilia shall remain at the home until an
appraisal can be arranged. H wishes for an appraisal to be completed of all
household goods and personal effects, not just the collectibles and sports memorabilia. I
suggest that we jointly retain the services of Appraisers to have the appraisal
completed and that the parties share in the appraisal cost. Please advise.
H agrees that he shall maintain medical/dental/vision insurance coverage for both
he and Stella He agrees that each party shall be individually responsible for their own
uninsured costs moving forward.
Although not referenced in your correspondence to H, I would like a provision
added to the stipulated temporary order which provides that the parties shall file their 2021
state and federal income tax returns in the most financially advantageous manner, sharing
equally in the tax preparation fee, sharing equally in the refund, and being equally
responsible for the tax liability due, if any.
H reports that his January net bonus income was deposited into the joint
savings account. He is prepared to tender to her one half of the net base pay earned in
January, less $1,360.67, an amount equivalent to the unemployment compensation benefits
Stella is receiving. Moving forward (commencing February 2022), H will
provide to Stella one half of all net income, including base pay and bonus pay (less
$1,360.67). H reports that he has housing costs of $1,000 per month. He is paying
$800 for rent and contributing $200 for utilities and other miscellaneous housing costs.
Thus, he is opposed to Stella receiving any amount in excess of one half of his net
income. I believe his position to be fair and reasonable given the totality of circumstances.
Deferral of 2022 real estate taxes is agreed. H reports that the 2021 real estate taxes
were paid prior to December 31st
.
Finally, H agrees that he will not modify his tax withholdings or withholdings to
retirement accounts.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/27/22 10:25 PM
Also,
My Atty, thinks the rent is questionable, I am pretty sure H is not on OW's lease.
My Unemployement runs out in 4 or 5 weeks from now.
And what is with the having personal effects appraised?? Like furniture and towels and my fake jewelry???
My Atty, thinks the rent is questionable, I am pretty sure H is not on OW's lease.
My Unemployement runs out in 4 or 5 weeks from now.
And what is with the having personal effects appraised?? Like furniture and towels and my fake jewelry???
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 12:14 AM
Hello Stella
Definitely speak with your lawyer.
Personal items, like gifts would not be considered marital assets. However, furniture, appliances, etc would be (IMO). Jewelry, fake or real, might be considered your’s, unless it’s an investment. Likewise sports memorabilia could be considered H’s.
If you are keeping the house, perhaps letting H keep his memorabilia for the household furnishings would be a good exchange. I don’t think you are too attached to the sports stuff, and you’d save the time, hassle, and cost of an appraiser.
Do you two have an agreed upon value of the house?
If this were for me, I’d like to see a defined time line for maintaining insurance. For example, I maintained insurance coverage for XW for two years. The maximum limit. I could have cancelled it at any time given the way things went down; it didn’t cost me any extra to maintain so why would I. There was no ruling that I had to maintain her insurance, yet I did. H may not be so generous, or could find a weird loophole, best to get it in writing.
Filing joint 2021 taxes might be ok. My first thought - which is basically a hunch since I really do not know much other than H makes 5 or 6 times what you made and you were laid off - is to not agree to joint filing. That is more advantageous for H than you. Again, this could be a leverage point though for acquiring something you are seeking.
H has shown you some of what he values. Not surprisingly it is money. Doesn’t sound like he is much interested in any of the physical stuff / items. You can use this knowledge to grease the wheels and finesse a negotiated settlement. A word of advice, let H think whatever is being proposed is his idea. MLCers are pretty flaky and forgetful, however things that they feel they want have a better likelihood of them following through on. Finesse not force usually yields better negotiating.
The calculations for alimony sound incorrect. Although I do not know your locale’s rules and guidelines. However, if you and H come to a signed compromise the courts will likely accept it. So be careful, and listen to your L. That being said, my concern is the reduction based upon your unemployment compensation. It does not take into account that the compensation is ending right away.
Alimony is easily calculated. There are pretty straightforward formulas for it. From my research and situation, alimony is based upon gross salary(s), not net. Net is such a vague and possible to skew metric for such a calculation. H’s investments could be considered to come off then the net is what you get half of. Better look at this carefully.
Have your L tell you what you are untitled to. See if it is close to what H is offering. I’d suspect it’s not. Perhaps counter offer taking a lump sum payment instead of monthly alimony (if you want). Often, especially if you leave his pension alone, the breadwinner will pay upfront rather than losing pension (which is actually time and mean having to work longer) and having a monthly payment for years and years. In your current situation with no income this could work well for you. Get your monies upfront, be uncoupled, and any future job / income would not reduce alimony. Likewise any increases on H’s salary will not increase your alimony; but H is likely to get worse before getting better, and his salary could easy change for the worse.
Just a few thoughts. For what they are worth. You know you situation best. Arrange an appointment and speak to your L and bring a written list of your questions.
D
Definitely speak with your lawyer.
Personal items, like gifts would not be considered marital assets. However, furniture, appliances, etc would be (IMO). Jewelry, fake or real, might be considered your’s, unless it’s an investment. Likewise sports memorabilia could be considered H’s.
If you are keeping the house, perhaps letting H keep his memorabilia for the household furnishings would be a good exchange. I don’t think you are too attached to the sports stuff, and you’d save the time, hassle, and cost of an appraiser.
Do you two have an agreed upon value of the house?
If this were for me, I’d like to see a defined time line for maintaining insurance. For example, I maintained insurance coverage for XW for two years. The maximum limit. I could have cancelled it at any time given the way things went down; it didn’t cost me any extra to maintain so why would I. There was no ruling that I had to maintain her insurance, yet I did. H may not be so generous, or could find a weird loophole, best to get it in writing.
Filing joint 2021 taxes might be ok. My first thought - which is basically a hunch since I really do not know much other than H makes 5 or 6 times what you made and you were laid off - is to not agree to joint filing. That is more advantageous for H than you. Again, this could be a leverage point though for acquiring something you are seeking.
H has shown you some of what he values. Not surprisingly it is money. Doesn’t sound like he is much interested in any of the physical stuff / items. You can use this knowledge to grease the wheels and finesse a negotiated settlement. A word of advice, let H think whatever is being proposed is his idea. MLCers are pretty flaky and forgetful, however things that they feel they want have a better likelihood of them following through on. Finesse not force usually yields better negotiating.
The calculations for alimony sound incorrect. Although I do not know your locale’s rules and guidelines. However, if you and H come to a signed compromise the courts will likely accept it. So be careful, and listen to your L. That being said, my concern is the reduction based upon your unemployment compensation. It does not take into account that the compensation is ending right away.
Alimony is easily calculated. There are pretty straightforward formulas for it. From my research and situation, alimony is based upon gross salary(s), not net. Net is such a vague and possible to skew metric for such a calculation. H’s investments could be considered to come off then the net is what you get half of. Better look at this carefully.
Have your L tell you what you are untitled to. See if it is close to what H is offering. I’d suspect it’s not. Perhaps counter offer taking a lump sum payment instead of monthly alimony (if you want). Often, especially if you leave his pension alone, the breadwinner will pay upfront rather than losing pension (which is actually time and mean having to work longer) and having a monthly payment for years and years. In your current situation with no income this could work well for you. Get your monies upfront, be uncoupled, and any future job / income would not reduce alimony. Likewise any increases on H’s salary will not increase your alimony; but H is likely to get worse before getting better, and his salary could easy change for the worse.
Just a few thoughts. For what they are worth. You know you situation best. Arrange an appointment and speak to your L and bring a written list of your questions.
D
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 12:19 AM
And some general advice.
Do not agree anything until speaking with your lawyer. And do not talk to H. Let your L answers his L.
Remain no contact. For sure! You are in no condition to go this alone right now. Sorry, if that sounds harsh. I remember how f’d up I was when so anxious and hurt. Lawyers do this for a living and are not personally involved.
Do not agree anything until speaking with your lawyer. And do not talk to H. Let your L answers his L.
Remain no contact. For sure! You are in no condition to go this alone right now. Sorry, if that sounds harsh. I remember how f’d up I was when so anxious and hurt. Lawyers do this for a living and are not personally involved.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 12:42 AM
There’s sports memorabilia, and then there’s sports memorabilia. My friend, whose ex was a scout for a pro sport, left his memorabilia to his daughter - she sold it for something like $30,000 (granted, a couple big items were the bulk of it). So if you have some idea of what he has, do some noodling around to see what they might be worth. My boyfriend left some signed baseballs - one by Joe DiMaggio - but the sum total would only be worth $2,000 if authenticated.
Check with your attorney, but I believe the value of the furniture would be its resale value - and unless they are valuable antiques, that’s going to be much less than what you paid for them. If you’re not overly attached, suggest splitting the household goods - I doubt he really wants any of it, he’s just using it for leverage. Call his bluff.
Now - if his sports memorabilia isn’t all that valuable, a trade for the furniture might be a good deal. But if you’re thinking of not keeping the house and downsizing, you might not want all that large houseful if furniture anyway.
And agreed - don’t agree to anything, let your lawyer handle negotiations.
Check with your attorney, but I believe the value of the furniture would be its resale value - and unless they are valuable antiques, that’s going to be much less than what you paid for them. If you’re not overly attached, suggest splitting the household goods - I doubt he really wants any of it, he’s just using it for leverage. Call his bluff.
Now - if his sports memorabilia isn’t all that valuable, a trade for the furniture might be a good deal. But if you’re thinking of not keeping the house and downsizing, you might not want all that large houseful if furniture anyway.
And agreed - don’t agree to anything, let your lawyer handle negotiations.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 12:49 AM
We did not split contents of house. We discussed who wanted what and that was that. Pretty much total agreement on that score. We were both horrified to hear from our mediator that all jewelry in our state was considered a marital asset to be split. Neither of us thought that was kind, or fair, so we left that as is, with me. I didn't try to grab 1/2 the dollar amount of his first edition collection (gifts from his mother), nor did I try to grab 1/2 the dollar value of his extremely expensive guitar collection. Nor did he try to grab 1/2 the dollar value of the antiques which were my grandmother's and parents'. Every situation is different, so, if your attorney agrees that the contents should be appraised, then do so. Who chooses the appraiser? Who recommends the appraiser? Beware anyone H/his lawyers puts forth as a recommendation.
Insurance is a big deal. Have it written into your agreement that he has to cover your insurance for the maximum amount of time. I got dumped when exh re-married, although he could have chosen to carry me (I think) beyond that, but maybe not. It's an expense you don't need right now.
Spousal support/alimony: get it in writing that when unemployment runs out, the amount changes. Get it in writing that any change in income means a re-visit. You are in a long term marriage. You are entitled to quite a bit of alimony.
Filing jointly for 2021... check with your ACCOUNTANT, not lawyer, then proceed.
Easy enough to have him prove his expenses.
-----
Stella, here's the thing: do not take any negotiations personally. This is the business side of things. This is where you'll find out if h's lawyer is a $h!t-stirrer or not. This is where you'll find out same about your lawyer. Yes, lawyers sometimes make more misery to get a bigger $ amount for themselves. Be aware.
Put your business self on front and center. You can fall apart when you aren't in negotiation mode. This is crucial to your future and your survival, so treat it like the break up of a company rather than the emotional break up of your family.. Put those emotions aside, deal with the business side, then when you're done, allow yourself to feel the emotions again. Trust me on this. It's vital.
What would you say if your best friend was going through this, and this was what her h put forth?
Insurance is a big deal. Have it written into your agreement that he has to cover your insurance for the maximum amount of time. I got dumped when exh re-married, although he could have chosen to carry me (I think) beyond that, but maybe not. It's an expense you don't need right now.
Spousal support/alimony: get it in writing that when unemployment runs out, the amount changes. Get it in writing that any change in income means a re-visit. You are in a long term marriage. You are entitled to quite a bit of alimony.
Filing jointly for 2021... check with your ACCOUNTANT, not lawyer, then proceed.
Easy enough to have him prove his expenses.
-----
Stella, here's the thing: do not take any negotiations personally. This is the business side of things. This is where you'll find out if h's lawyer is a $h!t-stirrer or not. This is where you'll find out same about your lawyer. Yes, lawyers sometimes make more misery to get a bigger $ amount for themselves. Be aware.
Put your business self on front and center. You can fall apart when you aren't in negotiation mode. This is crucial to your future and your survival, so treat it like the break up of a company rather than the emotional break up of your family.. Put those emotions aside, deal with the business side, then when you're done, allow yourself to feel the emotions again. Trust me on this. It's vital.
What would you say if your best friend was going through this, and this was what her h put forth?
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 01:07 AM
Thanks D, not harsh at all, I know I need all the help I can get right now. I value and trust everyones info and input on this cuz , yes I know I am thinking with too much emotion right now. I am trying to be strong, but all I see is the destruction of our dreams together. Makes me sad and furious at the same time. Ugh, he is such a idiot right now.
We do not have a agreed value of the house, had a rough estimate done 2 years ago for 389 but H put it down as 450. With the current market it is somewhere in that window.
My jewlery is all fake and maybe worth like 300 bucks. His collection, I have no idea, my guess 20 to 50 grand. Everything in the house, maybe 8 to 10 grand. Everything is like 10 to 15 years old, I don't have any Monet's hanging on the walls...lol He says he doesn't want anything from the house. So great I get to deal with all the sh!t he doesn't want. Like the 50 bowling balls in the basement, thanks a$$hole..
If he keeps me on his insurance that would be great, that is one of my concerns right now. I have that in my notes...
I also thought alimony was based on gross, not net and have that in my notes for my ATTY. H had said to me a few months back that he would only be paying alimony to me for 4 years, my ATTY laughed when I told him that. My ATTY thinks more like 8 to 10 years. A lump some would be over a million, there is no way he could come up with that money. I am not trying to sound greedy, but this was the life that we both promised each other and worked for.
Also H has a base pay, but most of his income comes from his monthly bonus. He takes his deferred comp (35%) out of his bonus checks.(He makes too much money for a 401k hence the deferred comp) So the 35% comes out then taxes. This would not be fair to me... that was my first thought when I read the net income part. Plus he could raise his deferred comp to 100%,(there is no limit to how much he can put into it) and I would get nothing.
Yes, I need to talk with my ATTY and will call him this week. My brother is pretty good with all of this and I have sent him a copy of the letter too.
I also have in my notes for ATTY, social security, life insurance on H, and the joint credit card that he put his $7500 retainer on, and my medical bills from my gallblader issue.
Also he should be paying me going back to December, he left on the 2nd.
We do not have a agreed value of the house, had a rough estimate done 2 years ago for 389 but H put it down as 450. With the current market it is somewhere in that window.
My jewlery is all fake and maybe worth like 300 bucks. His collection, I have no idea, my guess 20 to 50 grand. Everything in the house, maybe 8 to 10 grand. Everything is like 10 to 15 years old, I don't have any Monet's hanging on the walls...lol He says he doesn't want anything from the house. So great I get to deal with all the sh!t he doesn't want. Like the 50 bowling balls in the basement, thanks a$$hole..
If he keeps me on his insurance that would be great, that is one of my concerns right now. I have that in my notes...
I also thought alimony was based on gross, not net and have that in my notes for my ATTY. H had said to me a few months back that he would only be paying alimony to me for 4 years, my ATTY laughed when I told him that. My ATTY thinks more like 8 to 10 years. A lump some would be over a million, there is no way he could come up with that money. I am not trying to sound greedy, but this was the life that we both promised each other and worked for.
Also H has a base pay, but most of his income comes from his monthly bonus. He takes his deferred comp (35%) out of his bonus checks.(He makes too much money for a 401k hence the deferred comp) So the 35% comes out then taxes. This would not be fair to me... that was my first thought when I read the net income part. Plus he could raise his deferred comp to 100%,(there is no limit to how much he can put into it) and I would get nothing.
Yes, I need to talk with my ATTY and will call him this week. My brother is pretty good with all of this and I have sent him a copy of the letter too.
I also have in my notes for ATTY, social security, life insurance on H, and the joint credit card that he put his $7500 retainer on, and my medical bills from my gallblader issue.
Also he should be paying me going back to December, he left on the 2nd.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 01:49 AM
Stella20,
Consult your attorney and accountant and then act on their advice. Period.
It's easy to get emotional after reading a letter from your H's attorney. I remember that happening to me as well, even when I had been feeling strong for weeks, and even if what was communicated never even factored into the result. Remember it's written up in the best interest of your H, not yours, and likely also flavored to get you riled up. Take your time, settle down emotionally, and consider it rationally. As bttrfly states, it's a business negotiation at this point. The terms lay out by your H's attorney is the first lob over the all and likely not your best deal / the end result.
No need to qualify your statement with "I'm not trying to sound greedy". You don't have to explain yourself here or to your H. He is making this choice based on his own (perceived) best interest - make sure you're looking out for your best interest. Get a deal that is best for you under the law. That's not being greedy, it's standing up for yourself and your rights.
Consult your attorney and accountant and then act on their advice. Period.
It's easy to get emotional after reading a letter from your H's attorney. I remember that happening to me as well, even when I had been feeling strong for weeks, and even if what was communicated never even factored into the result. Remember it's written up in the best interest of your H, not yours, and likely also flavored to get you riled up. Take your time, settle down emotionally, and consider it rationally. As bttrfly states, it's a business negotiation at this point. The terms lay out by your H's attorney is the first lob over the all and likely not your best deal / the end result.
Originally Posted by Stella20
I am not trying to sound greedy, but...
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 01:52 AM
now you're sounding like someone with their business hat on. good goin!! you can ask your lawyer about how husband is comped and how to forestall game playing with that. if he can't come up with the lump sum, then he forgoes assets - house, retirement, etc.
he wants this D ...
he put this ball in motion.
he wants this D ...
he put this ball in motion.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 03:28 AM
Social Security is a non-issue. It works like this: if you were married for at least ten years, you have a choice when you reach full social security age - you can claim the full benefit based on your own earnings, or the spousal benefit which is 50% of his social security benefit (note: you can’t remarry until after you’re 60). If he dies, you can claim the widows benefit, which is 100% of his benefit (assuming this would be greater than yours). None of this affects his benefit or that of any future wife he might have, so it’s nothing to negotiate - it doesn’t affect him.
The only possible complicating factor might be if either of you has a government pension that didn’t pay into social security at all. Then there are issues with “double dipping” rules, which can reduce the amount of social security you get if you have a government pension that didn’t contribute to SS.
Attorneys are not all that great at the financial stuff, so good to consult with your accountant.
The only possible complicating factor might be if either of you has a government pension that didn’t pay into social security at all. Then there are issues with “double dipping” rules, which can reduce the amount of social security you get if you have a government pension that didn’t contribute to SS.
Attorneys are not all that great at the financial stuff, so good to consult with your accountant.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 02:57 PM
Thank you everyone...
I am trying to think about this as a buisness, and keep the emotions seperated but its really hard. I will have to make a appointment with lawyer for this week.
Mornings are so hard and I get better as the day goes on. Ughhhh... I hate this, I don't want this. I will never understand how anyone could do this to another person.
I am trying to think about this as a buisness, and keep the emotions seperated but its really hard. I will have to make a appointment with lawyer for this week.
Mornings are so hard and I get better as the day goes on. Ughhhh... I hate this, I don't want this. I will never understand how anyone could do this to another person.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 03:07 PM
Originally Posted by Stella20
I will never understand how anyone could do this to another person.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 05:04 PM
Good Morning Stella
Your H is running. He is doing what he feels will make him not be in pain or torment. This really has nothing to do with you. You are collateral damage in his wake.
It is true that H has placed a target upon you. This is because he cannot look to his inner self and must blame externally. He incorrectly projects upon you. Do not buy into his narrative.
Time and space. H needs it. And plenty of both. Remove yourself from his sights and the target will get placed elsewhere.
You are on two paths - emotional and business. Keep them separated.
D
Your H is running. He is doing what he feels will make him not be in pain or torment. This really has nothing to do with you. You are collateral damage in his wake.
It is true that H has placed a target upon you. This is because he cannot look to his inner self and must blame externally. He incorrectly projects upon you. Do not buy into his narrative.
Time and space. H needs it. And plenty of both. Remove yourself from his sights and the target will get placed elsewhere.
You are on two paths - emotional and business. Keep them separated.
D
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 06:01 PM
Originally Posted by Stella20
Thank you everyone...
I am trying to think about this as a buisness, and keep the emotions seperated but its really hard. I will have to make a appointment with lawyer for this week.
Mornings are so hard and I get better as the day goes on. Ughhhh... I hate this, I don't want this. I will never understand how anyone could do this to another person.
I am trying to think about this as a buisness, and keep the emotions seperated but its really hard. I will have to make a appointment with lawyer for this week.
Mornings are so hard and I get better as the day goes on. Ughhhh... I hate this, I don't want this. I will never understand how anyone could do this to another person.
Also, if morning is the worst, then give yourself permission to mourn for a specific length of time each morning, and try to put it out of your mind the rest of the day. That act of compartmentalization helped me tremendously.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 10:05 PM
Hi Stella,
Lots of good advice coming your way. I only have one comment that I can contribute. My financial folks suggested a cash payout for alimony. Their reasoning was that if he didn't pay, I'd avoid the cost of going after it later. On the other hand, my L advised payments versus a lump sum. He said there is something they add to the agreement that would make it difficult on my H if he 1) tried to get paid less in order to pay less and 2) that the value over time is harder to quantify in a lump sum. Especially if my H's pay increased later but I based the lump sum off of his current earnings.
I am not sure what I am doing yet as things are just getting started for me, but it shows that these conversations need to be had with both your accountant or financial consultants as well as your L to decide the best scenario. Also, try not to get caught up in individual details. Try to look at what will be the best full settlement result. There are many ways to get you to that result. So a loss on one thing might be a gain on something else. Hopefully this info is helpful.
Hang in there,
El
Lots of good advice coming your way. I only have one comment that I can contribute. My financial folks suggested a cash payout for alimony. Their reasoning was that if he didn't pay, I'd avoid the cost of going after it later. On the other hand, my L advised payments versus a lump sum. He said there is something they add to the agreement that would make it difficult on my H if he 1) tried to get paid less in order to pay less and 2) that the value over time is harder to quantify in a lump sum. Especially if my H's pay increased later but I based the lump sum off of his current earnings.
I am not sure what I am doing yet as things are just getting started for me, but it shows that these conversations need to be had with both your accountant or financial consultants as well as your L to decide the best scenario. Also, try not to get caught up in individual details. Try to look at what will be the best full settlement result. There are many ways to get you to that result. So a loss on one thing might be a gain on something else. Hopefully this info is helpful.
Hang in there,
El
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 02/28/22 10:11 PM
Thank you all,
Its hard to not take it all personally, I get it, it is all about him and what he thinks is making him happy.
I tell you what is not gonna make him happy.... what he is gonna be paying in alimony...
Talking to my lawyer tomorrow morning...
Its hard to not take it all personally, I get it, it is all about him and what he thinks is making him happy.
I tell you what is not gonna make him happy.... what he is gonna be paying in alimony...
Talking to my lawyer tomorrow morning...
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 03/01/22 04:52 PM
Quote
all I see is the destruction of our dreams together.
I know this is hard to see, but I want you to think of this as an opportunity to create a great new future for yourself.
In my case, my ex left after 26 years when I was in my early 50's. I "lost" the future I had envisioned with my ex, traveling together, retiring at 64 me/ 60 him, etc.
What did I gain? Multiple foreign trips with my mom and sister that made memories I treasure now that my mom has passed. My ex would have probably complained about me going on these girls' trips.
I gained a new skill - I now play drums and vibraphone and glockenspiel, have playing in a pop punk cover band, have toured with a friend who is a professional singer/songwriter, and in 2018 got to play in a concert in central park that was a tribute to Greenwich Village musicians of the 60's - hanging out backstage with John Sebastian of the Loving Spoonful, Jose Feliciano, Marshal Crenshaw, and many other famous musicians was a gas!
I'm still working and won't retire early, but my I live within my means, will be reasonably comfortable in retirement, and don't have to cope with unexpected large expenses by my ex.
I've dated several men, all of whom treated me better than my ex. Although I didn't find a lifelong mate (closest was my last boyfriend, who loved me dearly and died of lung cancer - he wasn't my ideal mate but in an imperfect world, he may have come closest of anyone I've been with ). I now look at men as the icing on the cake, not the cake.
If my ex had stayed? I would have had to deal with his erratic behavior, financial irresponsibility, critical nature, and probable eventual dementia (he had several bad concussions when he was younger).
I'm surprised to say this now, as I fought so hard for my marriage, but I'm happy to be free of him. I've had adventures I wouldn't have had if I'd stayed with him, I'm no longer being dragged down by the need to keep him happy and stable.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 03/01/22 05:30 PM
Just got off the phone with my lawyer. He said he felt good about the tone of the letter from H's lawyer, and was actually surprised that at it. I did tell my lawyer, that I would like to save the marriage and do not want this to get vicious or mean. He said that he and H's attorny have worked together in the past and that they do keep this in mind.
It will be net income for now, and H can not change his deferred comp for now. The Alimony will be based on Gross income in the final settlement.
Suggested that I put together a balance sheet with est. values of items in the house.
Said that I would have to pay for life ins. on H, and should talk to H about it, as he would have to agree to a exam for it.
He is asking for proof of H paying "rent" to OW and said that the IRS should know about her additional income....
Also told him my unemployment is running out in like 5 weeks and he will change the wording on that. Did say I could start really looking for employeement now. Thank god, I need to get back into a routine....
He didn't understand the whole 2021 tax filing issues either so he is addressing that.
I asked about continued coverage for insurance and he said that would be COBRA..which is expensive.
I also told my lawyer that due to covid, my age and mental state, that finding a job in my old profession , at my old salary, is very hard right now. I worked in corporate dining and with alot of large companies going to work from home, these jobs are few in this area...
Lawyer is responding as we speak, so more to come...
Thank you everyone for going through all of this with me.
It will be net income for now, and H can not change his deferred comp for now. The Alimony will be based on Gross income in the final settlement.
Suggested that I put together a balance sheet with est. values of items in the house.
Said that I would have to pay for life ins. on H, and should talk to H about it, as he would have to agree to a exam for it.
He is asking for proof of H paying "rent" to OW and said that the IRS should know about her additional income....
Also told him my unemployment is running out in like 5 weeks and he will change the wording on that. Did say I could start really looking for employeement now. Thank god, I need to get back into a routine....
He didn't understand the whole 2021 tax filing issues either so he is addressing that.
I asked about continued coverage for insurance and he said that would be COBRA..which is expensive.
I also told my lawyer that due to covid, my age and mental state, that finding a job in my old profession , at my old salary, is very hard right now. I worked in corporate dining and with alot of large companies going to work from home, these jobs are few in this area...
Lawyer is responding as we speak, so more to come...
Thank you everyone for going through all of this with me.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 03/01/22 06:01 PM
Quote
He didn't understand the whole 2021 tax filing issues either so he is addressing that.
Here's the deal - since your incomes are disparate, filing jointly means less taxes paid overall. However, YOU would likely owe less taxes filing separately. So you could have the accountant who does your taxes run them both way - separately and together - and have your H pay you enough to bring your tax liability or refund to where it would be if you filed separately. This would likely still save him money.
Theoretical example:
Filing separately, let's say you would get a $4,000 refund and he would owe $10,000 extra in taxes.
Filing together, there's a $5,000 refund.
If you file together, you should get $4,000 from the refund and he gets $1,000. (and he doesn't end up owing that extra $10k).
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 03/01/22 07:42 PM
Originally Posted by Stella20
Said that I would have to pay for life ins. on H, and should talk to H about it, as he would have to agree to a exam for it.
Originally Posted by Stella20
I asked about continued coverage for insurance and he said that would be COBRA..which is expensive.
I don't think this is correct. You should check. It might be family plus one, or something like that. Ours wasn't a cobra situation. Call this insurance company directly. This is a hot button divorce issue so I wouldn't be surprised if they have a party directly responsible for fielding these types of questions.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 03/01/22 08:17 PM
I don't know what the usual in your state is, but in my divorce I had to pay the premiums on my ex's life insurance (to cover my alimony if he died). I'm not sure I would have felt comfortable with him paying it, because if he let it lapse, I would have been SOL. If your ex has to go out and get new life insurance right now he might not qualify (thinking they may see elevated liver enzymes from his drinking). If he can't get ife insurance at all, this is a situation where getting a lump sum might be preferable, even though the calculations used to estimate that lump sum amount do not usually favor you. (They use unrealistically high estimates of how much that money will grow invested for the future, and unrealistically short life expectancies I believe).
As for Cobra - first of all, your H should be required to keep you on his insurance until the divorce is final. Many workplaces won't let the employee keep the ex-spouse on their insurance after they're divorced. You do get to COBRA the insurance for 36 months after the divorce (rather than the usual 18 months). It can be expensive but in my case, I made too much money to get an ACA subsidy, and while the COBRA was as expensive as the individual policy I got later, the coverage was MUCH better on the COBRA (little deductible, no copays vs what I got later for the same amount was a bronze plan with a $7500 deductible). Your best bet long term is to get a job that gives good health insurance.
As for Cobra - first of all, your H should be required to keep you on his insurance until the divorce is final. Many workplaces won't let the employee keep the ex-spouse on their insurance after they're divorced. You do get to COBRA the insurance for 36 months after the divorce (rather than the usual 18 months). It can be expensive but in my case, I made too much money to get an ACA subsidy, and while the COBRA was as expensive as the individual policy I got later, the coverage was MUCH better on the COBRA (little deductible, no copays vs what I got later for the same amount was a bronze plan with a $7500 deductible). Your best bet long term is to get a job that gives good health insurance.
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 03/01/22 08:38 PM
Hi,
Yes, he has to keep me on his insurance until the D is final.
H does not have a life insurance policy right now, so I will have to talk to him at some point about this..
I will start a serious job search now that I spoke with my lawyer. Thanks to all of you....my lawyer was very impressed by all of the questions and issues that I brought up
Yes, he has to keep me on his insurance until the D is final.
H does not have a life insurance policy right now, so I will have to talk to him at some point about this..
I will start a serious job search now that I spoke with my lawyer. Thanks to all of you....my lawyer was very impressed by all of the questions and issues that I brought up
Re: Husband MLc need help#3 - 03/01/22 08:40 PM