Last threadSince my final divorce hearing is in less than a month, I thought it was time for a fresh title.
Yesterday's changeover was a bit awkward. X picks up S2 at 6:30am. This plan was designed over a year ago when I had to leave for work at that hour. Now I work from home, and the early morning pickup once a week is kind of a nuisance, but X has stalled on implementing a new agreement which would eliminate this visit.
So yesterday, S2 climbed into my bed around 5:30am. I checked my phone and went back to sleep expecting to be woken at 6:15am by my alarm. Next minute, I woke up naturally and checked the time - 6:45! Argh. One missed call from X but my phone was on silent. I quickly called him and he answered on the first ring. "Hello" he barked. I apologised sincerely and said I'd have S2 out in a minute.
Threw the phone down and roused the little boy, who was not pleased to be woken from his slumber. He grumbled and cried as I forced him into clothes, and as I hustled him towards the front door he started to wail "Please pick me up, I need a cuddle!" So I took a deep breath and took a minute to connect with him before handing him over. X didn't say anything when I apologised again.
S2 told me that OW had breakfast with them that morning, so I've got no idea what's going on there.
Regarding Christmas-- I've drafted an email response along the lines of the suggestions received here. I'm glad my thoughts were aligned with everyone else's. I was planning to send it yesterday morning, as I do most of my other emails in the hour before work when I'm child-free, but didn't want to rock the boat further after the awkward changeover. I'll send it Sunday when S2 is with X.
The only reason I want it finalised quickly is because there's not currently a legally enforceable agreement. Meaning if X decides to withhold S2 again, he can without recourse. I've been trying to get this new agreement enshrined since the weekend he withheld him in August. I pointed out that the increased time can begin immediately and his child support will be reduced immediately, but that hasn't had any effect. Yes, it would have been nice to have had this finalised before things got bumpy with OW. I tried!
Regarding his mother-- he said I promised her that X could have S2 this Christmas. It's simply not true. Given that I expected to have S2 every Christmas up until last week, it's a claim that holds no water. And I find it quite manipulative to invoke family members in a custody discussion because he knows that holds a lot of emotional weight with me. Like messaging my stepdad asking him to tell me to do the right thing. That was distasteful. And now this. Regardless, S2 and I have had Christmas organised for a while now as we have to work around multiple different schedules (yay for blended families!) so it'll be X's turn next year.
I know it seems like this is a high-conflict situation, but he has actually folded quite easily on the majority of negotiations. I state my position, he says his piece, I respond coolly and calmly with either compromise or explanation, he goes silent. After a couple of weeks, I pick up the thread again, he ignores the previous issue, and moves onto the next. So we plod along. The problem is that Christmas is the final issue, which I believe is why he continues to kick the can down the road.
I can't wait to be divorced!
The only reason I want it finalised quickly is because there's not currently a legally enforceable agreement. Meaning if X decides to withhold S2 again, he can without recourse.
It is really uncomfortable not having a legally enforceable agreement with kids. It can play into a lot of fear and distrust. I'm sorry you have to deal with that.
I find it quite manipulative to invoke family members in a custody discussion because he knows that holds a lot of emotional weight with me. Like messaging my stepdad asking him to tell me to do the right thing. That was distasteful. And now this.
Very manipulative.
I'm sure he has a justification for what he did in his own head. It's convenient to be able to live life without being self-aware about one's own cognitive distortions.
I know it seems like this is a high-conflict situation, but he has actually folded quite easily on the majority of negotiations. I state my position, he says his piece, I respond coolly and calmly with either compromise or explanation, he goes silent. After a couple of weeks, I pick up the thread again, he ignores the previous issue, and moves onto the next. So we plod along. The problem is that Christmas is the final issue, which I believe is why he continues to kick the can down the road.
Well, it's not high-conflict because you have chosen not to feed the fire. DB at work!
I completely understand your frustration with trying to negotiate with this type of person. It can be really maddening. I think you are handling it perfectly.
I can't wait to be divorced!
Freedommmmmmm!!!
Thanks U! I hope freedom is on the horizon for you, too.
With the start of a new thread, I forgot to say a big hi to our friend OwnIt-- so glad to see you back here! Your lovely post gave me a welcome boost last week. I hope you stick around again.
Back to my sitch. X picked up S2 this morning as usual. I reviewed my email and sent it. Not long after, I received a response and it was more of the same nastiness:
"Yet again you've gone back on your word"
"I will be taking S2 two years in a row to make things fair"
"You know as well as I do that 5pm changeover means that S2 will be tired and grumpy and have to go straight to bed"
Which is all nonsense. The irony of being chastised for not honouring a prior agreement, let alone one that doesn't exist, by him!
All I can do is reiterate what was said in the previous email, I suppose. X is due to bring S2 back in two hours, so I think I'll wait to respond until he is back in my care. Or maybe later in the week. I still fear his reactions. But he knows that I'll go back to communicating through my L if he is abusive or aggressive, so we'll see.
Scout, I second that about OwnIt!
I wanted to encourage you not to send your Rude Dude anything when S2 is with him. I noticed once when I did that that my Rude Dude started firing off similar and very long texts while my D11 was with him, which meant his rage was seeping over their visit and no doubt traumatizing her even if it was just simmering under his surface. And just in general that he spent like an hour of their visit composing these stupid diatribes. So now I leave a window of like two days before her visit and then during her visit where I don't respond to any insanity or inanity.
It will not work to negotiate visitation with a Nuddy Buddy. Surely my experience is a convincing testimony! Why are you corresponding with him or responding to him about that? I blocked mine from e-mail and only use text, and only for arranging timing. If he brings up anything else, I either ignore it or tell him I can't discuss that with him and he will need to bring any issues to court, but when I had a lawyer I referred him to the lawyer. You seem to sometimes be getting tricked into negotiating with a terrorist and then trying to justify yourself based on his delusions, and it is truly pointless and will only reduce your life span.
If you want to say anything, I would just say, "I really don't want to weaponize S2, and I know we both love him very much. Let's move the discussion to the lawyers and just stick to the schedule til we figure out any changes. Have a fun visit!"
That said, maybe you can shift one thing and make him feel like he won and end that morning thing -- could you add to something like the above -- "But since I am working remotely, we definitely could do a later start time for the morning visit so he wouldn't be grumpy and tired when you pick him up."
"Yet again you've gone back on your word"
"I will be taking S2 two years in a row to make things fair"
"You know as well as I do that 5pm changeover means that S2 will be tired and grumpy and have to go straight to bed
Bait... all of it.
I still fear his reactions. But he knows that I'll go back to communicating through my L if he is abusive or aggressive, so we'll see.
You know, people say things like "FEAR = False Expectations Appearing Real" or "fear is not real" but the fact is that it is truly exhausting dealing with people who employ these emotionally manipulative techniques (whether they are just angry or actually have some sort of personality disorder or something else).
Why are you corresponding with him or responding to him about that?
I’m confident I can handle this on my own. X doesn’t have a lawyer. I do, but obviously it costs money when she corresponds on my behalf. The last time I used my lawyer as a shield, X became enraged and abused both her and me over email. I’m trying to manage this to prevent it escalating to that point again.
When I said I fear his reactions, I meant fear for my safety, and S2’s. I meant family annihilation reactions. Chris Watts-style. Scott Peterson-style.* You’re not wrong, Unchien, about the mental exhaustion in dealing with people like this (and I don’t mean to downplay at all what you’re going through) but there’s a different level of danger when the male is the antagonist. I live with this fear on a daily basis and especially when S2 is in his care— so yes, Gerda, that is a good reason to stop responding to emails during that time.
My goal is to keep it out of mediation and definitely out of court. Something like 98% of all custody agreements never see the inside of a courtroom in Australia, so I’m not too worried. I mean, we have agreement on 99.5% of the parenting plan! I don't rise to the bait and I don’t address any accusations. Grey rock has become second nature. I have hope.
Parenting question for the vets.
Tonight when I put S2 to bed, he said “I don’t like Dad”. I asked why. He said “Because I only like Mama”. I replied “It’s okay to feel however you feel. I love you no matter what. But you know it’s okay to like both of us at the same time”. He also asked me if I loved his dad. I said “No, honey. I used to love him, but he’s not my friend anymore.” This unleashed a barrage of “why”s but I steered the conversation elsewhere. Did I do okay?
He has been verbalising more positive thoughts about his dad recently eg. “Dad is my friend” to which I always respond positively. I think it’s a good thing he feels that way.
*This fear could be influenced by watching too many Dateline episodes. Not really. Maybe a little bit.
He also asked me if I loved his dad. I said “No, honey. I used to love him, but he’s not my friend anymore.” This unleashed a barrage of “why”s
You handled it brilliantly up until this point. This is where a child is trying to figure out how, if his parents could fall out of love with each other, could they fall out of love with him.
Also I wouldn’t say something like “Daddy’s not my friend” as he’s likely to repeat that to your ex.
Perhaps a better approach might be something along the lines of “sometimes grownups stop loving each other, but mommies and daddies ALWAYS love their children” or, since that’s not 100% true and your little smart cookie might notice that, you can just tell him “but I will ALWAYS love you” and point to how YOUR mom still loves you.
As for the comment about liking you best - normal little boy stuff. Not necessarily a sign of anything off, especially since he didn’t give any obvious issues as examples. Little boys love their mommies.
Oh, and stop watching dateline. Be aware, but so far your ex just seems to still be focused on “winning”. Once things are finalized I suspect things will calm down more.
BTW what’s your relationship like with your ex MIL? If it was good, and if she’s a reasonable person, you might try communicating with her directly on the Xmas thing, as ex is likely either misinforming her or using her as an excuse. If she doesn’t know about his cheating on you btw, you should tell her if you think it will put her more in your corner. At the same time though, blood is thicker than water. Don’t count on her, but you explaining to her how equitable the Xmas plan is might reassure her. ( Your ex might be painting you as some horrible person who is going to keep their grandchild from them).
Tonight when I put S2 to bed, he said “I don’t like Dad”. I asked why. He said “Because I only like Mama”. I replied “It’s okay to feel however you feel. I love you no matter what. But you know it’s okay to like both of us at the same time”. He also asked me if I loved his dad. I said “No, honey. I used to love him, but he’s not my friend anymore.” This unleashed a barrage of “why”s but I steered the conversation elsewhere. Did I do okay?
He has been verbalising more positive thoughts about his dad recently eg. “Dad is my friend” to which I always respond positively. I think it’s a good thing he feels that way.
You did fantastic on the first part of S2's questioning. Perfect responses. But on the final question regarding your feelings, I agree with being completely honest with kids. And I also agree with KML-- S2 might be a bit too young to understand that Mama can love someone and then not love them. Young children are narcissists by design and every question is them trying to make sense of THEIR world and their place in it. (Rather than really wanting to know your deep feelings or the world at large). Having said this, I am not encouraging you to reframe the question for S2 or change your answer unless he asks again. Too much focus on something makes kids nervous.
You are doing great with encouraging a R between S2 and his dad. And I truly believe that once things are settled with the custody agreement and the D, you will find yourself much less bothered by everything to do with exH and that will show in every aspect of your life: questions from S2, your reaction to H's behavior and your fear of retribution from H.
Having said that last part, if you feel like you might be in any sort of danger, I strongly encourage you to take appropriate steps in getting things documented-- can you require that both you and H get psych evals done prior to finalizing the custody agreement? Have you spoken to your psychiatrist about your fears and ask for suggestions? It is not completely uncommon in the US for psych evals to be a part of a parenting plan-- it tends to be more palatable when both parties are subject to them. And certainly since H's 'kidnapping' episode, that would be an easy sell to any court system here.
((scout))
Perhaps a better approach might be something along the lines of “sometimes grownups stop loving each other, but mommies and daddies ALWAYS love their children” or, since that’s not 100% true and your little smart cookie might notice that, you can just tell him “but I will ALWAYS love you” and point to how YOUR mom still loves you.
Those are good examples! I felt totally out of my depth with that question and especially being asked “why”.
BTW what’s your relationship like with your ex MIL?
It’s non-existent. I sent her a message in March to thank her for her kindness in welcoming me into her family but that I was filing for divorce after finding out about X’s affair. I made a point to say I would never keep S2 away from his dad and would always encourage his relationship with their family. She wrote back (after confronting X, unbeknownst to me, and him denying it) a brief message saying she was glad I’m moving on, she loved X and S2, and would keep in touch. Never heard from her again.
When X kidnapped S2, my mum called her to ask if he knew where they were. She said that X must be so fed up being denied access that he just had to take him. My mum was shocked and told her that I’d been offering overnight visits since the start of the year, but X had yet to take him. X-MIL told her that wasn’t true and my mum said “I helped Scout write the email.” She got off the phone pretty quickly after that. So no, she’s not a reasonable person and she doesn’t know me at all if she believes I would do that.
I have absolutely zero doubt that X has smeared, trashed, and destroyed my character to his family. Their view of me is based on his word and not what they know of me as a person. But they didn’t know me very well. X didn’t tell them he even had a girlfriend until we’d been dating for three years and living together. My interactions with them have always been surface level because that’s how they interact as a family. I always thought it was a weird dynamic and very different to my own family.
can you require that both you and H get psych evals done prior to finalizing the custody agreement? Have you spoken to your psychiatrist about your fears and ask for suggestions?
I don’t know if that’s a thing here. X would NEVER agree to that. He thinks that field of science is a waste of time. I haven’t needed to see my psych since April (except for a one-off appointment after the kidnapping incident) but I could do that again. I know that family annihilations are extreme events and probably unlikely to happen. However there was an incident earlier this year in my city where a man trapped his ex wife and kids in their car and set them all on fire then killed himself— over a custody dispute. It really rattled me at the time. Too close to home.
If your ex is feeding his mother that much misinformation, it might behoove you to get to be closer to her, if only to combat his misinformation. I can testify that being the family member of a cheater is awkward. But she is your son’s grandmother. You don’t want her badmouthing you (due to misinformation) when he’s older.
Maybe you could start in a stealth way - “ hey, S2 and I are going to be out your way on an errand, would you like to join us for lunch at Blank Cafe? “
Mmmm... X bailed me up at the front door the last time he found out I'd been in contact with his mother. I'm reluctant to reach out to her because of what he might do in response.
Hello scout
Tonight when I put S2 to bed, he said “I don’t like Dad”. I asked why. He said “Because I only like Mama”. I replied “It’s okay to feel however you feel. I love you no matter what. But you know it’s okay to like both of us at the same time”. He also asked me if I loved his dad. I said “No, honey. I used to love him, but he’s not my friend anymore.” This unleashed a barrage of “why”s but I steered the conversation elsewhere. Did I do okay?
You did fine.
I love seeing a child all inquisitive. It is especially heartwarming to see that when S2 is being put to bed. He feels safe, secure, happy, trusting, and loved so much that he opens up. Bedtime is when they are starting to mull over and organize the happenings of the day. It shows S2 has had good days when he asks such questions.
The barrage of whys is pretty common. Especially for an understanding-seeking child. He asks why, because he is wondering and seeing if his ideas are right.
What is he actually after? Of course he wants to feel loved. By you and Dad. The big reason for the question is S2 is ensuring his “normal” is still ok, valid, and true. Children challenge there views all the time. And they will challenges your views all the time.
It’s how one ensures their reality is true. S2 won’t long for Mom and Dad to love each other and have all those family events; for he doesn’t know different than what he is experiencing. His normal is different than your normal was growing up. The big answer S2 is seeking - that his “normal”, his world view, is proper.
Is it ok that sometimes I do not like Dad?It’s fine you told him that Mom and Dad aren’t friends. S2 sounds pretty smart, and there is a reason he is asking. He is ensuring his view matches your’s. Of course not as well articulated or understood by him, still nonetheless his wee mind and heart are growing and accumulating knowledge and acceptance of his world.
As I said, you did fine. And I know how these questions can come out of left field. When S2 said “I don’t like Dad”, it would have been interesting to respond not with why, but “oh, you mean like how you don’t like broccoli?”. He would still expand the conversation, just not from a direct question of “why”. I imagine his response would have been something like “No, not like that. I mean...”. A less direct approach of why allows a more freewheeled response.
You’re doing good scout.
D
Scout, I am afraid of my H. Very afraid. No one understand it because he never hit me.
We never thought they could do any of the things they did. It makes sense that they could do more than what they did so far.
I filed a police report and then another. About the harrassment and gaslighting. I think the police even called him once and let him know that they were on the radar. I just wanted it on record that I had been afraid, especially because mine keeps threatening to move back if I don't come up with more money to pay him his ED, even though ED is not settled. I want to be sure that no judge would let him come back.
My point is -- your fear is real. It might be based on something psychological or it might be a fear of physical violence that could happen. No one knows until it does or doesn't happen. But your fear of his abuse is real, it is there because he has driven you to that fear. And his behavior with S2 is scary to me.
I just want to validate your feelings. I have been there. Even just now, seeing a text from my H, my limbs were shaking like they were full of battery acid, my heart racing. I ask myself why I am so afraid and I don't know. But when I went to the family justice center and told my story, they signed me up for services. They see abuse for what it is and don't question it like we do.
The big answer S2 is seeking - that his “normal”, his world view, is proper. Is it ok that sometimes I do not like Dad?
This made so much sense. Thanks D.
Gerda-- thank you for validating and sharing your experience. Your H is so unpredictable; being afraid is a sane response. It's a great idea to have an official record of abusive behaviour. I'll keep that in mind.
On Thursday, I sent what I hope will be the final email on the parenting plan matter. There is nothing else to discuss. There is nothing else he can possibly argue. He will either commit or stonewall. If he stonewalls, I'll initiate mediation as a formality and then a judge will enforce the plan we've agreed upon. It's so stupid. We already have to attend a hearing to finalise a divorce that was financially settled months ago. Now it's a possibility that we'll have to attend a hearing to finalise a parenting plan that's not even in dispute. What a waste of time and money. What a pest he is.
Pest aside, life continues to be awesome for me and S2. It's summertime. We spent the weekend at the beach with friends who just moved here from Kansas. The kids played in the ocean while we had beers and spicy Thai food and talking about the endless possibilities life has given us. S2 is brown as a berry after two full days in the sun and surf.
He's also old enough for the first time to understand the rituals of the holiday season. Every night after dinner, we walk barefoot around our quiet suburban neighborhood to look at Christmas lights. It's warm and dusky when we leave home and dark when we get back. The solar fairy lights hanging from our roof come alive while we're out walking. "Look, Mama!" he exclaimed the first night. "Santa came to turn our lights on!"
As part of this brave new Christmas arrangement with X, I've been thinking about what's important to me regarding the holidays and what beliefs I want to instill in S2.
1. Joy. Building excitement and anticipation throughout the holiday season with decorations, the tree, advent calendar, gingerbread house etc. We are loving the ceremony of lighting the tree before dinner each night.
2. Giving. Last week I took him to pick out small presents (socks, earrings) that he will be responsible for gifting to our family before he opens his own presents on Christmas or Boxing Day.
3. Fellowship. I've bought a ham with all the trimmings to bake for a Christmas orphan dinner and he can help me out in the kitchen, prep the table, welcome guests etc.
4. Gratitude. I want him to be amazed when presents appear under the tree, but to also understand how lucky and loved he is. I know he's still very young, but writing thank you cards seems like a good habit to begin.
I LOVE this time of year!
Good Morning scout
Oh my goodness. Lol. Walking around barefoot in the warm evening air looking at Christmas lights.
Around here, it’s trudge in the dark through feet of snow, a biting wind, enduring frostbite, for a glimpse of those twinkling lights. Hahaha
It’s not quite that bad. We just have to bundle up lots. Let’s see: socks, boots, long underwear, pants, ski pants, shirt, sweater, parka, mitts, toque, and scarf..... <Kid - “I need to go to the bathroom.> (Sigh). <Undress and start again.>
Nice hearing how tanned S2 is.
And wonderful to see the beliefs you are installing.
Christmas is a magical time of year. Regardless of the weather outside, it’s warm in our hearts.
D
scout ~ I really like your idea of the 4 values to instill and how to put those in practice. I may have to steal that idea =) I've seen similar ideas to organize gifts for children (something to read, something fun, etc.) which I like as a counter to the consumer-mania that Christmas feels like sometimes.
Regarding the annoyance of the parenting plan, I hear you on the stupidity of wasting time and money on these things. I've had a lot of that in my situation too. You do a great job keeping consistent, which is about all you can do.
I realize sometimes I comment on fear on your thread and I think I will refrain going forward. It's a sensitive topic for me from my situation, but mine is not yours.
hi Scout,
I love the focus on joy, fellowship, giving, and gratitude for S2. I think it is really smart to do this consciously from an early age. One thought on gratitude-- while I was raised to always, always write a handwritten thank you note, I also remember it feeling like a chore and the guilt that weighed me down for not writing them on time (still to this day).
When my girls were little, instead of written thank you cards I'd film little clips of them playing with their new toy or trying on their new clothes and saying "thank you Grandma and Grandpa!!" or whatever to the screen. S2's the perfect age to be soooo cute in a little video like that and he can participate far more than in a written card... and the recipients will love it. Now my kids write TY cards or call or facetime the giver to thank them personally, but I still love those little magical clips and their tiny little voices from when they were little.
And DnJ... we also live in a warm place for the holidays, but the kids would love a white Christmas! And there is something so lovely about bundling up and going out in the snow, and coming back to a warm house and hot chocolate. Enjoy
Status update: Five more days until my divorce hearing. Silence from X on the parenting plan front for the last couple of weeks, though he continues to show up for visits. OW seems to still be in the picture despite the existence of X's Tinder profile.
I just remembered something X said during the final R conversation.
He asked himself rhetorically "Do I regret the last eight years?" then shrugged and said "meh".
It's kind of mind-blowing how little he valued everything he achieved from age 21-29 (23-31 for me). Those eight years encompassed both of our careers going from entry level to management (though I always outearned him), buying land and building a new home, getting engaged and then married, and finally, adding a planned baby to our family.
At least he went out on top, I guess?
Fingers crossed all goes well at the hearing. I feel there is a good chance he'll try SOMETHING crazy before then, but I know you'll handle it like a pro.
That is truly mind-blowing. If his thought processes worked like yours or mine. Honestly, it is so so sad, tragic really, to try to imagine what it must be like to be him, inside his head, meh about basically your entire adult life up until that point.
(As a total aside, I don't know why I keep engaging on those other threads over on Newcomers. I had actually started a whole response after yours on 1hedlite's thread to back you up on the SAHM comment, then I decided it wasn't necessary... but then couldn't help myself.
I also almost told this story but didn't... I know a woman whose husband cheated on her and left her (weirdly very similar circumstances to mine-- H traveled a lot for work, younger woman, long distance affair, two young kids) and apparently he said to her during BD that if only she'd worn nicer clothes around the house, not just yoga pants all the time, maybe he wouldn't have cheated. I found this so ridiculously gross that I told my H who also found it ridiculously gross and now we joke about wearing nice pants all the time. Even my lying cheating H thinks that is sexist and stupid.)
May, I'm hoping he will ignore it and not show up (he's not required to appear) but we'll see. The hearing is very much just a formality.
I try not to think about the rest of his life because it does make me feel sad for him and for S2.
Ugh, yes, that guy. That comment hit a nerve due to things that happened in my sitch, and I'm sure I came across a little bit ~triggered~ but I'm glad to hear I wasn't the only one who objected. Did your H give you any outlandish reasons for his affair?
Just wanted to share a bit of S2 cuteness. We were stuck inside all day due to heavy rain and getting on each other's nerves. After I snapped at him yet again while tucking him into bed, I gave him an apologetic cuddle and said "I still love you even when you're naughty." With a big smile, he said "And I still love you even when you're cranky." This kid!
Scout, he is too cute!! I love him! What an awesome sense of humor for a 2 year old. I also love how perceptive and loving he is.
My H has stuck pretty resolutely to my not having sex with him as the reason for the affair. Which I can't really call outlandish. If I ever told him I felt I hadn't been honoring him enough as a husband and a father, he would definitely take me to get checked out by a mental professional.
How is all the Christmas stuff going?
I also almost told this story but didn't... I know a woman whose husband cheated on her and left her (weirdly very similar circumstances to mine-- H traveled a lot for work, younger woman, long distance affair, two young kids) and apparently he said to her during BD that if only she'd worn nicer clothes around the house, not just yoga pants all the time, maybe he wouldn't have cheated. I found this so ridiculously gross that I told my H who also found it ridiculously gross and now we joke about wearing nice pants all the time. Even my lying cheating H thinks that is sexist and stupid.)
You might find this shocking, but I don't really agree on that. Of course any H must love his wife no matter what pants she is wearing, and that's no reason to leave anyone. I have only one boob left and certainly would not expect that to influence my H's love.
But that said, I do think a lot of women get casual about that stuff, and I think it can make a man feel taken for granted. Why not dress up for him when he is coming home? Would you want him to stop showering because you are just both around the house? I've been alone for many many years and I really long for that feeling of dressing up for a man, even if it's just to put on some eye make-up to meet him at the post office and to see the ol' flame in his eyes. Looking back now, I realize that my H wasn't interested in me for years, because I did try to look nice for the most part and not take that stuff for granted but I don't think he noticed me. I'm not sure he ever really did, but that's another story. I do think a lot of women take their men for granted, I see this all the time with my friends, and I think that men do want to feel that you do want them to feel the flame all these years later just as you did when things were new.
Reminds me of Beyonce's "Hold Up" where she is remembering that she did try to keep it sexy but it wasn't enough.
Something don't feel right because it ain't right
Especially comin' up after midnight
I smell your secrets, and I'm not too perfect
To ever feel this worthless
How did it come down to this? Scrolling through your call list
I don't wanna lose my pride, but I'ma .... me up a ......
Know that I kept it sexy, you know I kept it fun
There's something that I'm missing, maybe my head for one
[Refrain]
What's worst, lookin' jealous or crazy? Jealous or crazy?
Or like being walked all over lately, walked all over lately
I'd rather be crazyAnd that was BEYONCE! So I don't think it is EVER our fault. But I do think it's a way to show love and respect to your man because you WANT to make him feel cherished.
I also recommend Michele WD's Ted Talk on the Sexless Marriage, it's pretty eye opening.
Checked out by a mental health professional, May? Haha. I told X that I hadn't respected him as the head of the family when I was trying to get him back. This was when I was following the philosophy of someone else before I found DB. Cringe.
I actually received an email from X this morning about holiday plans-- NOT the parenting plan. He wants to take him for an adhoc Tuesday overnight next week for a family event. Then he cancelled his Christmas Eve visit citing his work schedule (complete with sad crying emoji that makes me think he's lying, but whatever).
I don't have a problem with any of this but the issue is he's completely ignoring the unsigned parenting plan. He wouldn't have to email to ask for an adhoc overnight if he just signed the damn thing. He could have every Tuesday overnight! I've been sliding back into complacency regarding my fears of non-return-- not trust, I do not trust him. But I've made it very clear what the consequences will be if he pulls another stunt like that, which gives me a certain amount of peace.
He also wanted to confirm the Christmas Day agreement "as discussed". This is part of the new parenting plan and so far I've pushed back on implementing anything in the new plan until he signs it. On his part, he's tried to circumvent this by implementing things that have not yet been legally enshrined. I think that's a VERY slippery slope. That's not how this works. It's not how any of this works!
Do I write back demanding signature? Do I run with my feelings of complacency? If, as it seems, X really truly doesn't want to care for S2 as per the new agreement, am I better off not forcing it and allowing adhoc visits and just being the single stable parent? The glaring problem is that without his signature, I don't have a legally enforceable agreement.
What do I dooooooo
Scout, what happens with the hearing without a parenting plan signed? I was under the impression that he could do another "kidnapping" type thing if you didn't have that signed, and you wouldn't have grounds to complain (or call the police or whatever). Am I misremembering that? If you go through the D decree, are you not obliged to give him any overnight visits at all?
And for Christmas-- does this mean you get S2 for Christmas Eve and he wakes up with you Christmas morning and then goes over to X's? yahoo!!!!!!
That indicates to me that patience and holding off on saying anything does seem to serve you... but I'd still be nervous without a signed parenting plan if it means he can pull another stunt like he did before. That would worry me.
I wonder... given all the recent communication if he doesn't want to sign the parenting plan because he doesn't want to be locked into weekly overnights? He only wants them when it is convenient for him? What if instead of demanding signature you said okay, do you mind signing and sending back the agreement, and confirming (if you are OK with this) that you are always good to take S2 anytime if things come up for X on his nights?
Gerda... I know I did take my H for granted and the SSM was really not okay. It had a lot more to do with me and how I saw myself than how I felt about my H. I do wish I had come across Michele's TED talk earlier (I have seen it now) and understood how important sex is in a MR. I really didn't get it. That all being said, I still liked getting dressed up and putting on makeup to go out with my H, and I'd still like to have an R with a man where I cared what he thought about how I looked and vice versa. If my H and I ever get to M2.0, or in my next R with a man regardless, I would want to keep things sexy and fun at some level, not get totally buried again in the motherhood and work stuff, and keep in mind that I'm a woman as well as a mom. I just really bristle at the idea that a woman SHOULD do that to keep a man, that it is somehow legitimate to cheat on your wife if she "lets herself go." But I absolutely agree with you that in a healthy MR each partner spends time and energy ensuring the other feels loved and cherished, and that is one way to show you care.
Oh and also, Scout.. you are going to be the single stable parent regardless of whether or not he signs this agreement. But I do think you need something legally enforceable.
May-- In Australia, parenting plans are completely separate to divorce. For tomorrow's hearing, the judge only needs to hear that the child is sufficiently provided for. There is nothing to be decided other than the legal end of the marriage.
You remembered correctly. I currently do not have a legally enforceable parenting plan. I'm not obliged to give him any time whatsoever. I would not be doing anything wrong, legally, to withhold S2 and make X go through the court system to get his parenting time. If I had legitimate concerns for S2's safety, this is what I would do.
Regarding Christmas, he hasn't explicitly agreed to the ongoing schedule. Just this year's arrangement, which was never really up for debate anyway. That's my concern with allowing it to go ahead without having signoff on the ongoing schedule.
Yes, I do think that he doesn't want to be locked into a legally enforceable agreement. The agreement we came to is more time than he was asking for back in February, which is appropriate because S2 is nearly a full year older. And yet, still no signature.
I wonder if I went the other way, and just said let's lock in the current arrangement and I'll allow age-appropriate adhoc overnights, would that be more attractive? But S2 needs his visits to be stable and predictable, right?
On the topic of 'not letting things go', I do actually agree as long as it is reciprocal. For me, I wasn't about to do my hair and makeup and put on nice clothes at 8pm, only for my X to come home an hour late without a notice, sit with me long enough to eat the dinner I prepared, then disappear into the office to burp, fart, and play video games all night long. No thank you ma'am!
Funnily enough, yesterday I was chatting to S2's teacher when I picked him up. She mentioned that I used to appear drab and dull and lifeless and now I look so vibrant and happy and confident. That was a nice validation.
(((scout)))
Another step forward.
D
Yay!!! I mean, it seems like a weird thing to celebrate, but in my case, by the time it finally got done, I wanted to throw a party. And in your case, I think the realization of how disturbed and toxic your ex really is, probably makes this a relief for you as well.
First of all, Congratulations!!!
Secondly, I had a couple thoughts on what you wrote below:
He also wanted to confirm the Christmas Day agreement "as discussed". This is part of the new parenting plan and so far I've pushed back on implementing anything in the new plan until he signs it. On his part, he's tried to circumvent this by implementing things that have not yet been legally enshrined. I think that's a VERY slippery slope. That's not how this works. It's not how any of this works!
My X does this too (pointing to arbitrary conversations in the past), and it is annoying.
We actually have legally enforceable signed documents, but she will point to things "as discussed" from a year ago that are different from our (more recent) documents. And even then she is often twisting what we supposedly "agreed" upon. It's verrrrrrrry slippery as you say. I chalk it up to a person grabbing any evidence they can to justify their position, ignoring what doesn't fit, picking what does.
I used to spend a lot of time wondering -- is my X truly calculating and diabolical, or do people with unhealthy coping strategies just default to these distortions of reality and not even realize what they are doing? Same goes for other toxic people.
I don't really care anymore though... my guess is most of them are just unhealthy and not pure evil.
I think you are doing the right thing, keeping your guard up. I like to think that my trust can be earned, but I'm not going to grant it freely.
Congratulations again! An early holiday present!
Congratulations Scout. What a relief to finally have it all wrapped up. I’m super happy for you!
Time to breathe and enjoy the freedom!
(((Scout))) I hope this only makes the many possibilities that lie ahead for you that much more real, the future all the more open.
Thanks everyone.
It was pretty straightforward. My L and I sat in her office and she conference called into the court. There were several other divorce hearings before mine. The registrar asked if both parties had representation. I did, X didn’t turn up at all. My L confirmed that we were proceeding with the application and that nothing had changed with regards to custody. The registrar said he was satisfied and granted the divorce. Badabing, badaboom.
S2 woke up vomiting at 5am this morning. There was a gastro outbreak at his daycare last week so I guess he finally succumbed. So we are chilling at home watching old school Disney movies today. He’s currently sucking on ice cubes every ten minutes and I’ll give him some vegemite toast and hydralite soon.
Today was supposed to be my last day of work before two weeks’ holiday. I was planning to go into the office because our chefs are making a big Christmas feast. Check out the menu! Pretty bummed to be missing out, but gotta take care of the little man.
Bourbon and Pineapple Glazed ham
Cranberry and Hazelnut Stuffed Turkey Breast
BBQ Bugs with Burnt butter and lime
Char-grilled white Peach, Haloumi & mint salad
Duck fat potatoes
Grilled Asparagus, Water cress, Parmesan and truffle
Pavlova, Mascarpone, Honeycomb, fresh figs and Persian fairy floss
Congrats, Scout! And that menu looks amazing... but I need a LITTLE Aussie English translation. Are bugs lobsters? And fairy floss is cotton candy, right? maybe someone can drop by with a plate!!
Poor S2, that is no fun. Although getting to watch movies all day when sick has always been an enormous silver lining for my kids. Hopefully he can keep everything down and you guys can enjoy some old school Disney together!
Oh my, that menu! Can't you get someone to bring you a plate?
Sorry about the little guy - I can't count how many times I caught the stomach flu from my kids when they were little. Make sure you're stocked up on stuff for yourself in case you catch it.
What a Christmas dinner!
Hope S2 recovers quickly.
Scout, if you have time, you might read 1hedlite's recent couple of posts about her H over on Newcomers. They were really really hard to read. (Getting this context is also making me feel even worse about some of the advice that was posted by male posters on her thread early on.) I wonder if you might have any thoughts for her. Her description of her H reads like someone with full-blown NPD. I think she could use some support.
xx M
Congrats, Scout!
This has been a long and painful journey for you, but your wisdom and inner confidence has seen you through so far. I think the best is yet to come for you and S2!!
And OMG, that menu.... the peach salad and Pavlova sound particularly enticing to me right now.
Hope you are having a great weekend!
May, I can take a look at her thread. Btw, you were spot on with your Aussie English translations.
Thank you, Sage! I’ll head over to read your update next.
There has been some back and forth between X and I today because S2 is still sick. He was up vomiting every half hour from 12-6am. It’s X’s Sunday, so I messaged him at 6:30am saying I’d let him know if S2 seemed well enough for a visit later in the day. He replied instantly that he’d love to see him if he was feeling better. I didn’t respond, then 45 minutes later he asked “do you need anything?” He NEVER asks if I need help.
At lunchtime, I texted that S2 hadn’t vomited for a few hours and was keeping down food, so X was welcome to take him for the afternoon. I prepped S2 for the pickup. But X had evidently changed his mind, because he declined. Probably for the best in case S2 was still contagious, plus the little fellow really just wanted to be home with his mama. But at least X can’t say that I was attempting to withhold access or something.
The weird thing was how... respectful... X was in his messages. He thanked me and said he hoped I don’t get sick. That’s literally the first time he’s ever shown me any consideration since the day he left a year and a half ago. Seriously!
I am not sure that there is anything worse than watching your tiny child retch for days. I always feel so helpless when my babies have a tummy bug. It is so much more physical and visceral for them than it is for adults. (((S2))) I'm happy he's feeling a bit better.
You did the right thing in offering time with S2, but it really is for the best that X declined, for all of your sake.
And as confusing as it is, it must feel nice to have a couple of thoughtful texts from X. A few messages where you didn't have to have your guard up, didn't have to pre-meditate your communication. I am sure he will be back to being an a-hole again in the near future, but for a moment, you get to feel what coparenting would feel like if you weren't coparenting with a cluster B human.
Maybe his generosity will last through the holidays?
Either way, YOU, dearest Scout, are deserving of respectful messages all the time. From everyone you interact with.
((Scout))
Hello scout
Good to see S2 is on the mend.
Well done with X, stating son’s condition and offering the visit as son seems to be getting better. Of course, overall it is better that S2 stayed home and rested. This successful and respectful interchange has laid the ground work for another good resolution the next time a sickness or something unforeseen arises.
The weird thing was how... respectful... X was in his messages. He thanked me and said he hoped I don’t get sick. That’s literally the first time he’s ever shown me any consideration since the day he left a year and a half ago. Seriously!
Two things come to mind:
First: Dog training. Reward the good behaviour and ignore the bad. X was respectful and displayed empathy. Shock!
Acknowledge it. A simple and sincere thank you. I know you won’t go overboard, and I want to ensure you that is the right response.
Second: Divorce and the finality of it. That changes a person. The loss, whether wanted or not, sought or not, becomes real and will be grieved. X’s situation is not all sunshine and roses. Divorce is the end of something and the start of something. X is starting to realize and face his life and his choices. That will probably start and stop as he progresses; nonetheless he is changing.
From where he was over the last year and a half, a change would be either become completely absent or become a better person. (My XW became absent) He might revert now and then, however with your boundaries and ground work he will need to remain respectful.
I know this is only one episode, so far. However, anything, including changing, starts with one action or step. More will follow, it’s just a matter of when and how often.
Take care.
D
I am not sure that there is anything worse than watching your tiny child retch for days. I always feel so helpless when my babies have a tummy bug. It is so much more physical and visceral for them than it is for adults.
Absolutely. It was tough on the poor kid. He woke up screaming every time he needed to spew. Quite the jolt to the system being woken in that manner (for both of us).
A few messages where you didn't have to have your guard up, didn't have to pre-meditate your communication.
It was just... easy. A welcome change after months-- no, a full year-- of tense negotiations. Partly, I think, because I am now so confident in my position, my boundaries, and my character that I can communicate in a more relaxed manner. He asked to make up the missed time and I didn't hesitate to say yes. I could have insisted that he sign the parenting plan before agreeing, and would be right to do so, but this seems to be a better way to manage him.
S2 is with X tonight for a family Christmas event and sleepover. He confirmed the location and provided emergency contact information. I didn't feel the slightest bit of anxiety or fear or distrust in letting him take S2; in fact, I waved him off gladly. I need a break after five straight days in the house with a bored, grumpy and sick toddler. I think I'll take myself out for dinner and catch up on The Crown.
First: Dog training. Reward the good behaviour and ignore the bad.
Just like parenting!
X is starting to realize and face his life and his choices. That will probably start and stop as he progresses; nonetheless he is changing.
Whether he is capable of change or not remains to be seen. Kml would probably argue not! I think it's more likely that my carefree attitude alleviates the obvious guilt which usually activates his attack mode. When he asked to make up the missed time this weekend, I said no, sorry, we're busy. He replied no worries, how about the following week? I said sure, just let me know where he'll be staying and who I can contact. Like I said, it was just easy.
I think I've reached the state of meh. It's nice here.
Good Morning scout
Yes, your confidence, boundaries, and character makes things easier. Well done.
Instead of X’s change, let’s say growth, which still remains to be seen.
I think I've reached the state of meh. It's nice here.
It is rather nice.
Funny, how acceptance isn’t quite what we think it’s going to be. It’s more just meh and peaceful. Gone is all the drama and stress. Emotional understanding opens up a new part of one’s path.
D
I just sent S2 off with X for 24 hours... with my phone in the front pocket of his bag.
Merry Christmas?!
Good Morning scout
Merry Christmas to you and your’s.
Did you send your phone along on purpose?
How was Christmas? Was S2 feeling better?
S2 spends Boxing Day with X and then back home. (((Hugs))) Nicely done scout.
D
Merry Christmas, D and family!
I accidentally left my phone in the bag as I’d come straight from Christmas lunch at my parents’ place. D’oh. It’s lucky I didn’t leave my wallet in there as well. I was able to lock the phone remotely, turn on two-factor authentication, and set an emergency contact to be notified if X tries to unlock it. It’s a horrible feeling knowing my private conversations etc are within his reach. On the plus side, I can track the phone online and see where S2 is if needed.
We had a fun Christmas. S2 crawled into my bed in the morning and had to be reminded to check the Santa sack at the end of his own bed. He received a tub of animal figurines, books, chocolate and a bath bomb. My mum helped him wrap a gift for me— a little ceramic statue of mother cradling her infant. Very sweet. I also received two bottles of liquor (Hennessy and Casamigos Reposado) and a small leather bound set of The Lord of the Rings books. Nice!
I cooked a big dinner for my immediate family on Christmas Eve— eight adults and two kids. S2 ‘helped’ by kneading the bread dough and eating a ton of candied pecans. Truth be told, he was so hopped up on chocolate and presents and excitement that he was quite naughty and rude, and eventually received a stern dressing down from his beloved Nanny (my mum). We all went outside to swim and play backyard cricket which got some of that crazy energy out.
Here’s what I made which was very well received by the family:
- prawn cocktails
- bacon and creamed corn cob loaf
- maple glazed baked ham
- hasselback potatoes
- sauteed broccolini with garlic butter
- Japanese milk bread
- roasted white chocolate and mango cheesecake
- candied pecans
I hope all of you in DB-land are having the loveliest Christmas possible no matter the circumstances.
Good Morning scout
I figured you’d mistakingly left the phone in the bag. Look at you, all tech savvy, remotely locking, turning on two factor authentication, and even setting email notification if the phone is attempted to be unlocked (which I hope it isn’t).
Sounds like Christmas was a good time. Family and friends, and some nice gifts. The ceramic statue sounds sweet indeed. And you can’t go wrong with Lord of the Rings.
S2 being all hoped up on chocolate and excitement sounds par for the course. His temporary naughtiness is easily explained and forgiven. I love that he has a strong loving caring nanny, who isn’t afraid of a stern talking to when required.
A wonderful family.
OMG, the menu you put on. Bacon and creamed corn cob loaf, I’ve no idea what that is; but it has bacon and cream corn, two of my favourite things. (Oh my, just about broke into song, think Julie Andrews - My Favourite Things
)
Prawns, ham, hasselback potatoes (another item I’ve never heard of - the hasselback not the potato lol), cheesecake, the list goes on. Wow.
(Nope, I’m singing the tune using your menu items.)
Have a great day.
D
Your menu looks amazing!! We had hasselback potatoes too-- DnJ, they're the best. Google serious eats hasselback potatoes gratin-- soooo good. Kenji's book The Food Lab is a bible in my house.
Scout, aren't the morning cuddles the best? Mine are 8 and 10 and they STILL do it most mornings. My favorite time of every single day. I love that he came to snuggle with you before even remembering about Christmas presents.
Hoping your phone came back intact and the post-Christmas exchange went well, and that you were able to have some nice self-care time when S2 was with your ex.
xx M
Happy New Year, Scout!
I am a bit jealous of all the wonderful people you have to share meals with and to teach your S to give you a special gift and to be another adult when he is naughty. That is all priceless stuff (that I don't have!) that must make this whole LBS life much easier!
Lots of love and a happy year to come.
Happy New Year!
Scout and may, I’ve looked up hasselback potatoes. OMG! They look sooooo good. They are on my to do list! Where have these been all my life?
Here’s to 2021.
D
Happy new year, guys!
I am very lucky in that respect, Gerda. S2 does not lack for loving people in his life. Nor do I
D, hasselback potatoes are the best. You get all the crispiness of chips with the tenderness of roast taters. Boil ‘em, mash ‘em, stick ‘em in a stew— nah, just make ‘em hasselback!
My sister and I went to two parties on NYE. One was with work friends, Gatsby-themed and quite fancy, and the other was boardgames and drinks with very old friends. I liked the second one better
X asked to take S2 for an extra two hours on his Thursday visit. I said sure, just need him back by x time. He replied...
“Okie doke”
Wow. He used to say that all the time throughout our relationship. His communication to date has swung between coldly formal and overly enthusiastic, depending on what channel he was trying at the time (rage, charm, self-pity). This is different. It feels genuine. It seems like such a small thing, but considering the context, it feels significant.
I hope he doesn’t try to come back. It would make me sad to hurt him by saying no.
Funny how we can smell the difference through texts!!! My ExH few days ago typed out a sad face to me when he was commenting on something, and it felt SO weird. His texts to me also went from read and no response to a “ok” and now I actually get multiple sentences. It is interesting, but I have no interest in being his friend anyway.
Good Morning scout
Boil ‘em, mash ‘em, stick ‘em in a stew— nah, just make ‘em hasselback!
From the original version of LOTR. Lol.
Hasselback is on my todo list.
I’m glad XH is communicating and currently calmer and more even keeled.
I hope he doesn’t try to come back. It would make me sad to hurt him by saying no.
Is there nothing, or better queried, what behaviours would he need to display and tasks performed for you to even consider such a thing.
I find that is an interesting exercise. A list of things, like must have counselling, they vow to have no contact with OP (like ever again), no involvement with OP (and I mean even speaking to them) for at least full year, and so on.
This is not a list of tasks they could perform and you’d take them back. No, it is traits and behaviours they are doing to better themselves, which would make them eligible for consideration. Setting the bar as it were. It sets what you want in a partner, whether it be XH or someone else. This also defines your wanted level of faithfulness, loyalty, friendship, empathy, forgiveness, etc., and how you can recognize it when it is displayed.
What I found most interesting, I hold to those values. Setting the bar isn’t really for XW, or XH in your case, it’s for us.
We are in our most precious relationship already - ourselves. Ensure you meet your demands. Embodying those noble traits and values makes one truly happy and content.
It goes back to some of that very first advice. You save yourself. If your marriage is restored, that is a bonus. You are the most important person in all of this. Always have been.
Not wanting to hurt XH is good and noble. That displays high empathy and character.
Have you forgiven XH? What would he need to do? Of course it turns out to be nothing. He need do nothing for you to forgive. Which then significantly changes one’s view of things.
D
I've forgiven him, yes. Would I take him back, no.
This is an interesting thought exercise. Some may see these requirements as control or punishment. That's okay. The biggest indicator of changed character (not simply behaviour) would be if he fulfilled every requirement without the expectation it would lead to reconciliation. In other words, he would do the right thing because it is the right thing to do. Fulfilling these requirements would demonstrate courage, integrity, and honour. I wouldn't accept anything less.
1) Admit that he is abusive and seek counselling to change.
There's a whole universe of deprogramming that he would have to achieve. Understanding that a man's abusive attitude towards women doesn’t come from his experiences with women; it comes from his experiences with other men. To this end, he'd have to address his father's abusive behaviour with the acceptance that it might end that relationship. Recognising that no woman’s life should ever be martyred to fill a man’s emptiness. Participating in men's activism in solidarity with women’s causes. Becoming an ally against domestic abuse and intimate partner violence. Most importantly, he'd need to protect our son from being exposed to abuse, even if that meant removing himself from his life.
2) Never challenge custody, child support, or my parenting.
As the parent who had no choice but to get up every day to actually raise the child, it's my opinion that X should no longer have that privilege and honour. By abandoning his family, he has shown himself to be a defective parent and a danger to S2's emotional well-being. He is capable of being a fun weekend dad and I support that completely. He is welcome to make day-to-day decisions about parenting during his visitation time. But S2 would live with me and I alone would be responsible for his character development and socialisation. X would have input, but defer to me on all major parenting matters and accept my decisions without complaint. He would also pay child support without complaint.
3) Make a public apology in my presence.
He would need to take ownership of everything he has done and hold himself accountable to friends and family. "I had an affair and abandoned my family. I treated my wife terribly and she was underserving of this treatment. I lied to justify my behaviour and assuage my guilt. I am seeking help for my abusive behaviour and will spend the rest of my life making amends to my son. I have no expectations of my wife that she will forgive or forget and I recognise that is her right. I ask that you support me by holding me accountable for my actions so I can keep my entitlement in check." If he was feeling especially remorseful, he'd offer to repay my parents the $10k they invested in our wedding.
4) Repay the $65k it cost me to buy him out of the house.
Demonstrating desirable traits and behaviours is all well and good, but financial reparation puts his money where his mouth is. Repayment would be for S2. For all intents and purposes, X stole that money from our son. The debt affects S2's future because it affects my ability to provide for him. Now, to be clear, S2 and I are very fortunate and want for nothing. I work 0.8 FTE on a six figure salary. But the debt is an unnecessary financial burden. I recall making this point to X during settlement discussions. He said "I know I'm not doing what's right for S2, but I have to do what's right for me." This apparently means buying jetskis, bikes, car parts etc. This one still burns me.
Contact with OW is irrelevant and I have no interest in policing that. There will always be OW because I believe cheating is behaviour borne from a character flaw-- entitlement. Unless that flaw is fixed, the man is a danger to himself, me, S2, and anyone with whom he forms an intimate relationship. If a man is only as faithful as his options, I'm throwing the whole man away. Until his character demonstrates reciprocity, respect, sacrifice, and selflessness, he needs to stay out of my life.
It’s great to have a clear idea of what true repentance/reparation would look like. Usually when we grasp that, we realize how unlikely our WASs are to actually rise to that standard.
I’d never take my ex back either. There’s really nothing he could do to convince me he would be capable of fidelity, and honestly, my life is so much better not walking on eggshells around him.
Hi Scout, I just saw that you commented on my thread, I appreciate you taking the time, thank you. For some reason I felt compelled to catch up on your sitch, perhaps because we live in the same country. Funnily enough, the more I read, the more similarities I began to see in what you have been going through and what I have, more than just where we live.
You have really handled yourself admirably in the face of difficult circumstances and I have gone through and highlighted a number of things that I have read that will help me in moving forward in my situation. Like you, my STBXW walked away and didn't look back. I gave it my all to make it work, understand what was making her unhappy, trying to fix things but I got nothing in return, it was quite humiliating.
My exhusband would occasionally say he was unhappy a couple times a year, and while I stepped up to try and work on things every time he did this, he did nothing on his end. So basically, I was rewarding him for his emotional neglect while he didn’t have to lift a finger. I tried to spend more time with him, be hotter in the bedroom and make more of an effort, ask him to go on dates with me, etc. He must have known that saying he’s unhappy would warrant my immediate flood of attention for him while he didn’t have to return the favor. He used me.
Another step forward.
It was this quote that really resonated with me. This would come from my STBXW once or twice every couple of years and I would work really hard to address her concerns with no corresponding action from her end. After a while it just made me feel like giving up. You mentioned that you wanted your XH to come and meet you with S at the train station, that would have made you feel really happy. I used to take our S to the bus stop and train station to wait for STBXW and we'd wave and be really excited to see her. Recently she told me the reason she didn't want to have sex with me all those years was that she never felt loved or appreciated.
Anyway, just thought I'd share how useful your posts have been for me and its quite inspiring to see your progress, keep up the good work!
Hey OB, I have a hunch that we might live in the same city.
It’s funny seeing things I wrote a while ago pulled up again. I’ve hashed and rehashed my X and my marriage to death because it was necessary at the time, but the words have served their purpose and I no longer feel the desperate urge to reflect and make sense of it all. It happened. It’s over. The wound has healed cleanly because I leaned into the pain until it didn’t hurt anymore.
I’m glad you found them useful anyway. However, I do still spend a teeny bit of time puzzling out this parenting stuff.
My X is a performative parent: he only acts the part if he has an audience. Fortunately for me, he has never put in any effort to find one other than his immediate family and OW and co. He seems to spend a lot of his parenting time with OW’s family. It makes me wonder if he has many friends left. I don’t think he’s very comfortable on his own with S2.
As many people predicted, now that we’ve agreed on a parenting plan for the next two years, there’s complete silence on his end about actually doing it. So we’re still on the same visitation schedule put in place when he left nearly two years ago. Two hours twice a week and every second Sunday.
He’s never asked or tried to phone or video chat, doesn’t follow up when I inform him our son is unwell, doesn’t try to make up missed visits. He literally doesn’t exist outside of his visitation time which, according to S2, consists of ice cream, TV, and being anywhere except home alone with his dad
Not sure what’s going on with X this week but he has been really late to every changeover without any notice. I haven’t said anything because it hasn’t impacted my time yet. This morning when I opened the door, S2 stared thoughtfully at his dad for a long second, then said “Dad, Mama is not your friend”. X replied “I’m not Mama’s friend? Aww.”
I’ve hashed and rehashed my X and my marriage to death because it was necessary at the time, but the words have served their purpose and I no longer feel the desperate urge to reflect and make sense of it all. It happened. It’s over. The wound has healed cleanly because I leaned into the pain until it didn’t hurt anymore.
I love this so much. I'm nearing the end of the rehash, leaning into the pain as I need to and I'm finding that I need to less and less.
*Re: "Dad, Mama in not your friend." my kids are older (19,23,27) - eldest said that if X tells him one more time "I love your mom" he's gonna punch him dead in the face. lol Your son is wise beyond his years. They see it.
X emailed today to say he’s going out of state for a month on Monday. No mention of this prior to now. Very odd as we are currently in a new lockdown and travel is heavily restricted at the moment. Unusual behaviour for him as far as known habits of work or leisure. He’s going to miss S2’s birthday.
He has organised XMIL to care for S2 on his next Sunday visit, but wants me to drive 30 minutes to XSIL’s house to drop him off because they’ll be too busy preparing for X-niece’s birthday party to pick him up. Am I wrong, or does that sound like a ‘them’ problem?
He has organised XMIL to care for S2 on his next Sunday visit, but wants me to drive 30 minutes to XSIL’s house to drop him off because they’ll be too busy preparing for X-niece’s birthday party to pick him up. Am I wrong, or does that sound like a ‘them’ problem?
my opinion: sounds like not your problem. ; )
Sounds like not your problem to me, either.
That being said, *if* you care *and* it is really NBD to you, you might consider doing it and demonstrating your commitment to supporting S2's relationship with that side of his family. (Also, it might be nice for S2 to participate in his cousin's BD party-- is that why they can't come get him?) Maybe there is something close to her house that would be a fun excursion for you to do on your own or earlier in the day with S2, a hike or a beach or something? Possibly could be viewed as a good excuse to get out and do something different.
If I were you I'd also be weighing COVID questions, and maybe a birthday party isn't a great idea.
Anyway, I'm sure you'll make the right choice!
Hi scout
That’s a ‘them’ problem.
XH gone a whole month and missing son’s birthday. So much for his wanting of more time it seems.
I’d probably bow out of resolving their conflict for picking up S2.
D
I do want S2 to attend his cousin's party. I just think that getting him there is not my responsibility. In fact, that's a wife job. And I sure ain't that anymore. Not to mention the indignity of being treated like a chauffeur when I would have been an invited guest if circumstances were different. I feel that it's insensitive and entitled on their part. They are welcome to pick him up earlier or whenever suits them.
Not sure what time the party starts, but X's usual pickup time is 8am. I can't imagine the party happening that early. SIL has a husband to help her with party prep. FIL or MIL could stay behind if extra hands were really needed. I only get one day a fortnight off from parenting and those 9 hours go fast. And I'm staring down the barrel of four weeks without a break.
I know I don't need to justify my right to say no. Still working on that, I guess.
In other news, I spent a few hours at the hospital with S2 yesterday. He's had a chesty cough for the past week and the doctor wanted him checked for bronchitis, pneumonia and of course COVID. So they put us in an isolation room while they performed various tests (the little guy did so well). Once we were cleared for (just a nasty viral infection) I informed X of the situation via text and said I'd update him once the COVID test result came in.
He never even bothered to respond.
Scout, may I offer a different perspective? This doesn't turn on whether it was right or wrong for him to have asked or whether it is your responsibility. I personally would rather be the one to transport my child 1/2 hour by car than rely on unnamed others, arranged by a flaky ex-husband to do so. While I know you have lots and lots of time with S2, as the parent of one child in college and another soon to be, I can tell you that the times we spent in the car driving places were some of the best times we spent talking, laughing, singing, playing I spy, you name it. Forget about your Ex. Always, in every case, do what is best for S2. Let that be your driving force and the consideration that dictates your actions.
Scout, may I offer a different perspective? This doesn't turn on whether it was right or wrong for him to have asked or whether it is your responsibility. I personally would rather be the one to transport my child 1/2 hour by car than rely on unnamed others, arranged by a flaky ex-husband to do so. While I know you have lots and lots of time with S2, as the parent of one child in college and another soon to be, I can tell you that the times we spent in the car driving places were some of the best times we spent talking, laughing, singing, playing I spy, you name it. Forget about your Ex. Always, in every case, do what is best for S2. Let that be your driving force and the consideration that dictates your actions.
I totally second that. Every single part of it. And add to that that nothing that you do is going to teach your H or his family to see things rightly. Just be the light to your kid.
Hey OB, I have a hunch that we might live in the same city.
It’s funny seeing things I wrote a while ago pulled up again. I’ve hashed and rehashed my X and my marriage to death because it was necessary at the time, but the words have served their purpose and I no longer feel the desperate urge to reflect and make sense of it all. It happened. It’s over. The wound has healed cleanly because I leaned into the pain until it didn’t hurt anymore.
This is where I need to get to. Logically I know I will, but doesn't make the path any less difficult.
I think you live a bit further north than I do from what I gather.
Scout, may I offer a different perspective? This doesn't turn on whether it was right or wrong for him to have asked or whether it is your responsibility. I personally would rather be the one to transport my child 1/2 hour by car than rely on unnamed others, arranged by a flaky ex-husband to do so. While I know you have lots and lots of time with S2, as the parent of one child in college and another soon to be, I can tell you that the times we spent in the car driving places were some of the best times we spent talking, laughing, singing, playing I spy, you name it. Forget about your Ex. Always, in every case, do what is best for S2. Let that be your driving force and the consideration that dictates your actions.
I totally second that. Every single part of it. And add to that that nothing that you do is going to teach your H or his family to see things rightly. Just be the light to your kid.
His Scout. After reading this, IMHO, I agree that being the light to your kid is the thing to do. I may have felt differently before, and it may not be what was planned, but for your kid, just roll with it. How lucky that your kido has family to spend time with. How lucky are the family that you are cooperative and understanding. At least you still get those hours for yourself and they are precious. (My alone time is when I sleep alone, daycare or nanny when I work. There's no dad and no family. Friends always offer to help if I need a break, so I've got that... never used it, only in emergencies.)
((( hugs ))) from one single mom to another. I don't know how s mom's with more than one do it! ((hugs to them too))
One thing I hav e learned over my many years of divorced parenting experience is to simplify things and leave the out of the equation
Do you think S2 will have a good time and it’s not a huge inconvenience to you? Then take him.
Will S2 not really care one way or another and it is a huge inconvenience? Then don’t take him!
Make your decision about you and S2. Not your ex
Thank you all for weighing in.
I politely but firmly replied that I am not able to drop him off, but any one of their family members (MIL, FIL, SIL, BIL) is welcome to pick him up earlier than the scheduled time if that helps with their plans. There is no question whether he’ll attend the party, it’s just the pickup time that hasn’t been organised on their part.
I’m apprehensive to see or speak with X-MIL. I’ll just treat her like I’d treat a checkout chick. Hi, bye etc. I recently cleaned out a cupboard and found a scrapbook left behind by X, containing all the cards he received at his birth and his first birthday. Should I give it to her when I see her? X clearly didn’t care for it, but she might.
My L emailed through my divorce certificate yesterday, must have been thirty days after the hearing. I smiled when I saw it. My wedding dress is still hanging in my wardrobe, what should I do with that thing? It would be a waste to burn it. I always intended to sell it but it would probably be better to donate to St Vinnie’s.
The sun is setting right now and it’s still very warm at 7pm. I grilled sticky chilli and mango chicken burgers for dinner, and took S2 on his bike to the park. Chatted with a few different neighbours on the way home then chased S2 around the yard with the hose. We’re having a wonderful summer. Time is flying by way too quickly.
Good Morning scout
Good job politely informing X’s family members; they are welcome to pick up S2 early. Treating XMIL kindly, as a checkout chick
, is a good plan.
The scrapbook of X’s birth and first year, along with other mementos, was left behind. There probably will come a day when X would be happy to have it back. True, there’s no need for you to be his storage locker. Yet, if you have the room, and a spare cardboard box, you could pack those kind of things up and put them away. In some future time, X may ask if you have it, or son may like to look at stuff from his Dad’s birth. Giving it all to XMIL is also a good option.
My XW left everything in her hurried exodus. She’s never asked for any of it back. Treasures and gifts from her children you’d think would garner some desire for re-acquirement, but no, not yet anyways. Maybe never. Those boxes are stored away; I’ve got lots of room. And really who else would that stuff go to? Her parents threw her away when she was young.
Your wedding dress and your treasures. Give it some time, like a full year after the divorce, before you decide. It’s perfectly ok to store the stuff away and decide later.
XW’s wedding dress (and left behind clothes) did eventually find its way to the dump. Burning it, I felt, was a better symbolic idea. However, the events of getting the dress to the dump, the rain, mud, tripping hazard
, and it’s final resting position splayed upon the garbage pile, all mud covered and rain soaked, turned out to be perfectly symbolic of a marriage thrown away.
Today I awoke to seasonable temperatures of -20C. Brrrrr. Your summer sounds wonderful. I can barely imagine chasing someone outside with the hose right now. Lol.
D
. I recently cleaned out a cupboard and found a scrapbook left behind by X, containing all the cards he received at his birth and his first birthday. Should I give it to her when I see her? X clearly didn’t care for it, but she might.
Definitely give it to her! It gets clutter out of your house, it has meaning to her, and your ex is not likely to take care of it at present. It will also make you look like the good guy, which doesn't hurt your standing with the family. This is a good thing as you will have to deal with them on some level for the next 20 years.
As for the wedding dress - donate it. It will turn a negative into a positive force in someone else's life.
However, the events of getting the dress to the dump, the rain, mud, tripping hazard smile , and it’s final resting position splayed upon the garbage pile, all mud covered and rain soaked, turned out to be perfectly symbolic of a marriage thrown away.
That was a hilarious story. Made me smile to remember it!
It will also make you look like the good guy, which doesn't hurt your standing with the family. This is a good thing as you will have to deal with them on some level for the next 20 years.
That's a good point. It might curry a tiny bit of favour with her.
I'm having some work done to fix my patio and need to borrow a small sum of money. I have no other debt so it was approved immediately. The bank valued my house almost $20k higher than it was in May last year when I refinanced!
The real estate market really is crazy right now. Remote work is being made permanent in a lot of white collar industries and people are leaving the overpriced cities in droves. Rental availability is next to zero in desirable areas and locals are being priced out. Many southerners are moving north to our subtropical state that has something like 300 sunny days a year. Though I was worried about affordability at first, it was definitely the right decision to keep the house in the divorce.
I wonder about X's financial situation. A credit card bill addressed to him came to my house a few weeks ago (we didn't have CCs when we were together). He has the balloon payment on his car loan due in Nov - around $25k. He bought a jetski, expensive mountain bike, and imported car parts as soon as he received the settlement money last year. He pays $750/month child support. And now a month-long trip out of state. I hope he doesn't get himself into a mess.
I suggest you arrange your life such that you can live without his child support money. He sounds so financially and mentally unstable as to be a poor bet for consistent payment in the future. That's rotten, but better to be prepared and have it not happen, than not prepared and have him drag you down with him.
You're doing great btw. It's a lot to recover from that kind of dysfunctional relationship and be a mum all on your own but you are killing it!
Thanks kml. Eventually I’ll arrange for child support to be collected by the state to avoid him defaulting on payment.
Today, I received another email about the birthday party saying “my family kindly asks that you pick up S2 if you can’t drop him off because the party goes all day.” Really, a three year old’s party goes from 8am to 5pm? Whether unfair or not, our current agreement is that X is responsible for both pickup and dropoff on Sundays and that, I believe, should be the bottom line.
But to throw a spanner in the works, X said that FIL would be the one picking up S2. I’m not super comfortable with that because I don’t think S2 would go willingly with him. I would rather drive him myself than force him to go upset. On the other hand, if I was the one to drop him off, I don’t feel certain that S2 would be comfortable with me leaving him alone at SIL’s place either. He has been crying when I drop him at daycare this week. I would crawl over broken glass to prevent him feeling alone and abandoned. I just hate that they’ve engineered this situation, it feels very unfair and insensitive to me, but I think it would be best for S2 if I just handle it all myself. Guess I’ll just have to sit with this anger for a bit.
I am hopping mad, like wake up in the middle of the night hopping mad. And here’s why. Over my dead body will I allow anyone to make an innocent two year old little boy feel like a hassle or a burden. Over. My. Dead. Body. I would drive a thousand hours to prevent that from happening so I’ll cancel my plans and drop him off/pick him up myself next Sunday. Thank you for witnessing this journey in real time. Hopefully now I can sleep.
((scout)) Decision made—sleep well!
Scout, I get the rage. I think for me, because OD was such a bad father, I accepted long before the marriage ended that I was the one that would have to do everything for the kids. When he left, nothing really changed. Everyone in our lives kept saying that. What's different? He didn't take them anywhere, go to their performances/recitals, etc. He was a non-entity.
My suggestion to be the one to take S2 to this type of thing was to give him stability, safety, and for you not to ride this emotional rollercoaster of having expectations of someone who will, inevitably, fail to meet them. Even as a dad.
Take S2. Make it a fun day. Make it a learning day. In time ex will lose interest in S2 and you guys will move on seemlessly, as you've done.
((( Hugs ))) Hi Scout, hope you've been able to get some sleep. Sleepless nights are the worst.
But to throw a spanner in the works, X said that FIL would be the one picking up S2. I’m not super comfortable with that because I don’t think S2 would go willingly with him. I would rather drive him myself than force him to go upset. On the other hand, if I was the one to drop him off, I don’t feel certain that S2 would be comfortable with me leaving him alone at SIL’s place either.
Scout, do you trust FIL to pick up S2? Will he be safe? I get how you feel, I really really do. And I hope that your FIL is a trust worthy person, a trusting grandparent. If he's a trusting person, IMHO, I'd accept the offer to have him picked up.
He has been crying when I drop him at daycare this week.
Those moments always tug at your heart strings. We FEEL for our kiddos and want them not to cry. I tell D4 that kids (and adults) cry when they don't have the words. I get it, and I know how you feel. Gosh, I've worked for a bit at a child care drop off at a gym, and had plenty of crying drop off. They always stop after the parents go, because they feel okay and feel trust.
I would crawl over broken glass to prevent him feeling alone and abandoned. I just hate that they’ve engineered this situation, it feels very unfair and insensitive to me, but I think it would be best for S2 if I just handle it all myself. Guess I’ll just have to sit with this anger for a bit.
((( hugs)))) Whatever you decide to do, it's your call. I was wondering the other day if they would offer to do pickup or drop off. Split the driving sort of speak. If I had to choose, I'd let FIL pick up and get S2 later. Kids parties don't really go on that long... The timeline is probably for those who want to drop by... "Come by anytime between 8am -5pm..." And you get to decide when you pickup S2. (Does he ever do sleepovers with extended family? Just curious... )
Whatever you decide, know that you're doing what's right for you. And I'm sure S2 will be fine with what you decide.
YOU GOT THIS MAMA!
Good Morning scout
How did you sleep? Are you feeling better?
X’s family and the continual engineered “problems and difficulties” are them pushing your buttons. Every time it’s another “oh wait we can’t because ____, so we need you to ____”. People treats us as we let them.
You have an agreement that specifically states who is responsible for drop off and pick ups. It doesn’t state that is the only way of doing things, it is just the agreed to default when other arrangements cannot be agreed too.
The engineering of more and more problems is just weaponizing S2. X and his family are using S2 to push your buttons. Perhaps not as maliciously or vindictively are it looks when written out so plainly. However, their intent is not for the best interests of S2. That’s pretty clear.
It is a far too common occurrence, and an unfortunate one at that, children of divorce get treated less properly than they should by their extended family. It’s an extension of their treatment towards the ex-spouse. Blood is thicker than water. True, S2 is of their blood, but he is of your’s first and foremost. X is of their’s first.
When XW left, her relatives called and promised I was always welcome, they love me and the kids, I was always a wonderful person, etc. etc. That lasted mere months. There is no conversation between them and me, or them and the kids. My children, the innocent in all this mess, are shunned as well. Why? Blood is thick. And my kids were teens and spoke their minds and hearts. Nothing like a volley of truth darts to ward off one who doesn’t want to see or hear the facts.
My kids are of DnJ. Half their genes come from me (D) and half from J. (Haha, I just realized what I typed. DnJ.) So yes, my kids are of D and J.
In divorce it only takes one. One of the parents is usually the “cause” of the family break up. Amicable, jointly decided, friendly, divorce probably happens somewhere, mostly on TV shows methinks. Divorce is messy and children usually side with one of their parents more than the other. That bloodline becomes “thicker”.
J’s family is a step removed. J threw her kids away. My kids values are definitely of DnotJ. And her extended family fades away.
You do realize you can have S2 not go to the party, right? You don’t have to play their game, and jump through their hoops. Or you can ensure S2 gets there and back.
The current dilemma and problem is the timing. You haven’t had time to premeditate what you would do. This is the engineered part of this. The short notice “problems”.
Whichever way you decide to go will be fine. The next round will be different. Consider the next time such events were to unfold. What preferred action and response would you like to have at the ready? In other words what beliefs and values do you want to follow?
I am hopping mad, like wake up in the middle of the night hopping mad. And here’s why. Over my dead body will I allow anyone to make an innocent two year old little boy feel like a hassle or a burden. Over. My. Dead. Body. I would drive a thousand hours to prevent that from happening...
You are good Mom.
S2’s uncles, aunts, grandma not so much.
I had aunts, uncles, and grandparent (and parents) that I knew I was loved and carried for, by their actions. And I had some that didn’t give a fig about my Dad, and therefore me as well. I still love the former, and ever hardly think of the latter.
People will forget what we do for them, but they never forget how you make them feel.
One cannot craft a relationship for two other people. S2’s extended family has to step up and do better, or they will fade away.
D
Masterful words from DnJ, one of my favorites in the Collected Works of DnJ.
I would add to that that once you start worrying about enforcing agreements to teach any of these schmoes a lesson, you become a slave to justice. Instead, become a disciple of mercy! S2 is the center here, where all the mercy needs to go. And sometimes it will mean NOT bringing him to a party and sometimes it will mean driving two hundred miles in the rain and waiting in a crappy dirty diner to pick him up after. (But maybe at the diner you will meet the love of your life or some other adventure!)
I will paste Portia's words on that below!
The only person to consider in these situations is S2. When the world does him wrong, you fix it if you can and comfort him if you can't. You can't fix H or the family dysfunction who spawned him. And you can decide when it's good for him to be with them because they are blood and when it's better to not expose him. As DnJ says, he will eventually decide for himself, based on the way they made him feel during that part of his life when you were the one who had to decide.
I wrote about something a priest told me -- You can't fix the engine while it's hot. If you are screamingly mad, don't take any action or decide anything. Wait until the next day. Go for a run, work in your garden, etc. Make an appointment with yourself to decide on something when your engine is not hot. I sometimes have to scream at myself and writhe around on the floor and sob on my knees in or out of church, but do what you gotta do to make it through the hot engine before you actually make a decision.
The quality of mercy is not straind.
It droppeth as the gentle rain from heaven
Upon the place beneath. It is twice blest:
It blesseth him that gives and him that takes.
'Tis mightiest in the mightiest; it becomes
The thronèd monarch better than his crown.
His scepter shows the force of temporal power,
The attribute to awe and majesty
Wherein doth sit the dread and fear of kings;
But mercy is above this sceptered sway.
It is enthronèd in the hearts of kings;
It is an attribute to God Himself;
And earthly power doth then show likest God's
When mercy seasons justice. Therefore, (Merchant)
Though justice be thy plea, consider this:
That in the course of justice none of us
Should see salvation. We do pray for mercy,
And that same prayer doth teach us all to render
The deeds of mercy....
—Portia, in William Shakespeare, The Merchant of Venice
I like the idea of just doing what you think is best for S2. You’ve mentioned before that having relationships with his cousins may help take the place of sibling relationships. And it’s usually a good thing to have grandparents, unless they are toxic.
I’m with KML. Keep it simple . What’s best for S2?if you think S2 will not be comfortable being without one of his parents there, then don’t take him at all. He stays gone and sits this one out. He’s 2, he will never remember if you think he would love to go, the. Make it so that it’s the most comfortable for S2.
Leave everyone out of the equation except for you and S2
I came back to read each and every post several times and let it all sink in. Called my mother to talk it over. Didn't respond to X right away. Wrote and rewrote my response. Waited for a quiet and calm moment to hit send. And yet, some truth darts did sneak in to the email. No, I'll own it. I made it clear that I was disappointed by their attitude toward S2. No response from X.
(((cardinal)))
OwnIt - You were right. Yes, nothing changed when he left. A non-entity. Sounds familiar. But we move on seamlessly.
CanBird - I'm sure FIL would be competent enough to pickup S2, but my concern was that S2 would not feel comfortable enough to go alone with him. FIL is a cold man. S2 has had a couple of sleepovers with the family and it sounds like SIL is his main attachment figure, which makes sense as she has two toddlers of her own.
DnJ - These people are weaponising S2, this is exactly the source of my anger. I did eventually sleep, but before I did, I imagined all the things I wanted to say to MIL. He doesn't have to go to the party, correct. If there was no party, I wouldn't even consider taking him. But I believe he will enjoy it, so he will go. Thank you for sharing your experience and wisdom. I am a child of divorce. Myself and my siblings were always welcomed by my dad's family, even though my mother was the one who ended the marriage. I'm feeling disgusted by how weak these people are.
Gerda - The Merchant of Venice is my favourite Shakespeare play, thank you for bringing those words into my day. You can't fix the engine while it's hot-- I love that. I probably could have waited another day or two before responding, but eh.
kml - Still not convinced the grandparents aren't toxic, but S2 seems to enjoy playing with his cousin.
Ginger - Keep it simple. You're so right. I still care too much for the opinion of people who don't care for me.
After another screaming daycare dropoff this morning, I'm confident that I made the right decision to support S2 by taking him to the party. It's unusual for him to be upset when I leave; I can only think of a handful of times over the past two years. Poor little fellow.
One last thing. I took S2 to the waterpark with one of his friends on the weekend. When we were leaving, he asked if his friend's mum and dad were going back to their home together. I said, yep, they are, his mum and dad live together. He said my mum and dad don't live together. I said, nope, they don't. He then said "My dad is a nasty man". I was shocked and blurted out "No! He isn't!" but then realised I shouldn't be so prescriptive, so I asked why. He said "you're not dad's friend". I said no, I'm not. "Dad is my friend?" I said yes, if you want him to be. He seemed satisfied with that.
Hi Scout. Hope the daycare drop offs get better for your little guy. Is the cousins party this weekend? Sending good vibes mama.
Yes, the party is tomorrow.
I never heard a response from X to confirm the dropoff arrangement so I can only assume it’s been communicated to his family. He said MIL would be in touch, but she hasn’t. After ranting and raving internally about how it shouldn’t be my responsibility to do so, we’re off to the toy shop to buy cousin a little birthday present from S2. The present is from him, not me. It’s never too soon for him to learn that you don’t rock up to a party without a gift for the host.
He didn’t get upset at daycare dropoff yesterday. We talked beforehand about what was going to happen and how I always come back to pick him up. I explained that my work is very important and how it’s good manners to be on time. We had a quick revision of the meaning of courage— when you feel scared, but you do the thing anyway. He showed me his strong muscles and his strong heart. Gave me a kiss and let me walk away. Proud of him.
Love him! And you continue to inspire and amaze me with what a great mom you are.
Hope you can find something special and amazing to do nearby their house after dropoff that you wouldn't have done or experienced otherwise!
He showed me his strong muscles and his strong heart.
Oh, that’s such a good lad. And Mom!
Awwwww that's great to hear Scout! It's the little moments like that make a HUGE impact. The words you chose to say to S2, about being brave and strong.... kind of like mama right? YAY! That must of made you feel amazing. Made me think of "Daniel Tiger"... are you familiar? Great life lessons..
Keep on keeping on girl! Hope the rest of your day (party day) goes smoothly.
YOU GOT THIS!
Well, folks. Two hours of driving and twenty dollars worth of tolls later, it transpires there was no mother effing party.
Me: did you have fun playing with all the kids?
S2: there were no kids, just cousins 1 and 2.
Me: wasn’t there a party? did anyone else come?
S2: no, we just had a marshmallow cake and went to the park.
So it seems that one or all of them lied about the ‘party’, which they were so busy prepping and purportedly took all day, in order to duck the responsibility of collecting and returning S2. What lovely people.
When I dropped him off, they all came out on the front lawn to meet us. Awkward, I was hoping to exchange quickly at the front door. First MIL and the birthday girl, then FIL and the baby I’ve never met, then SIL... my heart rate increasing each time. They greeted me and it was incredible. Just over the top false and sugary sweet after a year of pointed silence between us. I replied hello in a neutral tone, said a few parting words to S2, and went straight back to the car.
Pickup was more of the same. I knocked on the door and S2 came running. They all followed him outside demanding one last cuddle, one last tickle, one last conversation. I took his bag and stood silently to the side feeling uncomfortable. MIL said thanks for driving him and SIL chimed in. I nodded and buckled him into his car seat— they followed again, tapping on the window until I wound it down. Even once I pulled away from the curb, they still stood there waving.
This was a hard day for me. I kept thinking about the time MIL spoke to my mother on the phone when X kidnapped S2 and called us both liars. My mouth was dry, tongue-tied, unable to speak. Probably seems dramatic. But it was not easy to be in their presence for even such a short time. SIL told her daughter to thank me for the birthday present. I wanted to say it’s not from me, it’s from S2. It says so on the card. By your own decree, I’m not her Aunty anymore.
I’m nobody to them. Just a chauffeur.
(((Hug)))
Did S2 have a fun time?
Ugh. I get it. May be useful to look at this in a pros and cons way:
Pros - S2 got to have fun with his cousins. Cousins are a valuable relationship for kids growing up.
Also - S2 got to have some bonding time with grandparents.
Cons - you were inconvenienced.
You are annoyed at ex’s family because of their lack of support (blood is almost always thicker than water, unfortunately)
You don’t want to set a precedent of always having to be the one to do the work.
Hopefully this was a one-off because ex was out of town. And now that you’ve done it, you can feel free to turn down the next similar offer if it isn’t convenient for you. And be careful not to make ex’s family suffer for his sins - only for their own.
now that you’ve done it, you can feel free to turn down the next similar offer if it isn’t convenient for you. And be careful not to make ex’s family suffer for his sins - only for their own.
This. I know you put a lot of thought into making a decision about this. Try not to regret doing it as it has been mentioned - focus on the good that came to S2.
But going forward - you know the deal and can plan accordingly.
Sorry they were stinkers.
Good reminders and good hugs.
It wasn’t done with a grudge in my heart. I’m not upset with them, nor do I regret taking him. I just underestimated how rattled I’d feel seeing them. Not sure how involved they were in the subterfuge— possibly not at all. I was polite and civil, but got choked up and had to get out of there. Party or no party, S2 chattered happily all the way home so I know he had a fun day. My day wasn’t too shabby, either.
It was both scorching and spattered with bursts of summer rain. After the dropoff, I took my parents out for breakfast and coffee. Why are breakfast burgers so good? Thick cut bacon, a runny fried egg, rocket, caramelised onion, avo on a brioche bun... mmm. Mum surprised me with a new stand for my trombone and said she was proud of me for being brave. Like mother, like mother
Later in the day I had an optometrist appointment, then caught up with a friend for some authentic (I think?) American BBQ and alcoholic ginger beer. The place has a big smoker on the veranda which spits out brisket, ribs, porchetta, sausage, burnt ends smothered in sauce. Oh, and smoked mac and cheese. No salad! We went back to his place for tea and a chat afterward. Nice to keep up with friends of ten plus years.
Sounds like a great day. You play trombone? That’s awesome!
My best friend is a singer songwriter. I learned to play the drums after my divorce in my early fifties, and not long after began playing glockenspiel and percussion for her on short tours. Now I also play vibraphone and got to play glock and vibes on her last record. And among the many other instruments on this album was a trombone! She does these amazing arrangements, with cellos, trombone, French horn, guitar, drums, standup bass, vibes, piano , banjo... plus a wall heater grate. Then we go on the road and try to reproduce the songs with just guitar, cello, glockenspiel or vibes and snare drum.
I do, picked it up at age 11 when I started high school. Recently I was playing in a local symphony orchestra, but had to give that up when X left as it was too hard to work around S2. Hoping to start again if I get the chance.
Your music sounds really unique, does it fall into a particular genre? It must be a challenge to recreate such a big sound with so few instruments. I miss being part of full symphonic arrangements, jazz bands just aren’t the same.
She's really unique and hard to describe, although labels like indie pop-rock and antifolk have been applied. It's very fun to play, especially on the rare occasions when we have had a full compliment of musicians.