Old Thread:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/foru...ain=63050&Number=2905523#Post2905523So hopefully this link worked. I usually am savvy. LOL
Anyway, H came home after being gone all weekend. When he left, he did not tell me or even D25 that he was leaving for the weekend or when he would be home.
My last post discussed I gave him power over my anxiety because he did not even say hello.
I need to work on the "what ifs" this seems to be an issue with me. I need to remind myself he is gone from the marriage.
So I just got home from work a little while ago. H is in the bedroom, door shut. Now I wonder when he decides to poke his head out. It is the elephant in the room that he left and did not tell anyone. I know if this was D25, even though she is not a kid anymore, common courtesy lends itself to letting your people in the home you will be gone so there is no worry. I obviously cannot confront him and maybe he is expecting this.
I think if I say hi when i see him, I am lying. I am mad.
But let's face reality, he doesn't care if I was put out by him leaving. What am I going to do, divorce him? It is like leaving a job after you gave notice, if you mess up what are they going to do, fire you?
So any advice on what to say or how to react? Also, this could be ongoing for a few days.
PLC
I know if this was D25, even though she is not a kid anymore, common courtesy lends itself to letting your people in the home you will be gone so there is no worry. I obviously cannot confront him and maybe he is expecting this.
Common courtesy.
When you were writing earlier this weekend about H's abrupt departure with no word, my first thought was how it is a common courtesy to let your people know that you are leaving and when you will be back and how dare PLC be put in this position. Honestly, it triggered me, so please don't let me project onto you.
However, I have been learning some tough but necessary lessons recently and here is one that may help you in your situation.
My natural state of existence is to love, nurture, support, help and hold people. My children, my FOO, my friends, even strangers. If someone is in distress or in need, I will stop and ask 'are you OK? How can I help?'. My children have watched me pull over our car to ask someone if they need help (a broken down car, a person sobbing as they walk down the sidewalk, you name it, I can't just watch suffering without addressing it). It's just who I am.
Even in my recent challenging interaction with H, I wanted to ask him if he wanted to take dinner to go (oh, the cooks in us, food=love, huh?). Today, while making an anti-inflammatory medicinal concoction, I thought 'I have extra, I should share with H, he could use it right now.' But that is not my role. I might be able to help, sooth, share, be present for 7.5 billion people in the world, but H CANNOT be one of them right now. Which is fighting every fiber of my fundamental personality.
And yet, at the same time, it is the only way I can show respect (care, love, nurture, help, hold, understand) H right now. He has asked for this. He doesn't want my care (nurture, love, understanding) right now. In fact, if I offer it to him, his declining my offer puts him in the position of being the bad guy (unlovable, ungrateful, horrible, because who actually DOES this to a loving human being).
So my job, and yours at the moment, is to step away from our nature and let our H's path be our H's path, unsullied by our loving, concerning personality. It is the only way we can show them respect in their own language.
(((PLC)))
(((SAGE)))
Your name suits you to a T.
You're right. There is so much nurturing that is second nature. I need to let him navigate without any interference from me. He would not appreciate it, and may resent it.
We both know too well that our H's did not ask us for any nurturing.
This is the biggest test I am dealing with in my life right now. H did not appear at any time while I was around yesterday. I hear him leave for work this morning. I work from home on Tuesdays and in the past he would come home during the day and stay in the room a bit. He would say hello if he saw me. I am curious to see what happens today, however, I have my IC appt. (by phone) today, so I will take a drive and have that call. I also have physical therapy this morning and I will be gone for that. I don't ask D25 if he comes home. I do not want to place her in a weird position. She knows where I am (common courtesy) but I doubt very highly he asks where I am.
There is a weird thought that I just want to see how long he can avoid me. Because he is. Normally, when he is sequestered he still will appear for a snack or to check his mail. I also want to know what he will do when he sees me. I will be friendly. Keep him surprised. He expects naggy PLC. Nope. She's not here.
Thank you Sage!
Well, I had two chances to say hello and I didn't. He didn't either for that matter.
The first time, he came home and I was working at the dining room. I did not turn around and he did not say anything.
The second time, he came into the room I was in, heading to the kitchen and I got up and went outside.
I totally planned on saying something, but I am mad. I know I can say it the next time. But I do want him to know that I am not going to think it is ok to just take off. I realize that his journey has left me behind, but I do expect COMMON COURTESY. So should i extend a common courtesy and be nice?
He did not exhibit this behavior while married, but I know he knows that I would have gotten angry and reacted in a bad manner. By being silent that is not the old me.
Any suggestions?
My suggestion is a lot more global.
Imagine you are watching an anthill on a sunny afternoon, lying in the grass as we did when we were kids. You watch them move to and fro and build things and come back and carry a crumb with great labor, etc.
You would not take each ant movement that seriously. It would be silly to say, "Oh, that ant moved to the left. No way, he is going to the right! Why didn't I realize he would go to the right! I should have known that! Should I give him another crumb? No, I shouldn't, then he will know I want to give crumbs!" Etc.
My suggestion is to see your H right now as you would those ants. If you want to watch with a little curiosity, do so. But know that nothing you say or do means much to those ants. They are laser focused on their own lives. They don't really notice you, and if you leave your post to stop watching, it won't impact them.
One day, your H might not be an ant. He might be a man again. He might be worth loving again. But right now, he is like an ant. Leave him to his work. Go for a bike ride. Build a house. Read a book. The ants will still be scurrying about if you come back to check on them, but they won't really notice what you are doing.
I hope that doesn't sound cold. We here do care about you and what you are doing, and we send you love and courage! I just mean that you must let H go and stop noticing his every move.
Good Morning PLC
I totally planned on saying something, but I am mad. I know I can say it the next time. But I do want him to know that I am not going to think it is ok to just take off. I realize that his journey has left me behind, but I do expect COMMON COURTESY. So should i extend a common courtesy and be nice?
Yes, you should extend courtesy. Be kind and cordial. Courtesy begets courtesy; cold begets cold.
Remaining silent when mad is a wise move. You planned on saying something. I figure whatever was planned, was not planned in anger. However, you got mad and emotionally highjacked, once seeing him. It is amazing how quickly our feelings can get the best of us. And how quickly those feelings will dissipate when not reinforced.
You need to lead with compassion. That advice is mostly for you, and somewhat H.
“I do want him to know that I am not going to think it is ok to just take off.”
“I do expect COMMON COURTESY.”
I agree. Those would be nice to achieve. How did you demonstrate those to H?
Both of these are expectations. The second actually uses the word. Unmet expectations lead to resentment. Remove your timeline, your deadline from H coming around and starting to behave properly and letting you know when he is going / returning. Your expectations are going unmet. Remove the timeframe and move it back to hope.
I hope H will extend me some common courtesy, next time he leaves. This is a lot less demanding of a certain outcome; it feels different.
Extend your common courtesy and say hi to H. Then see how he responds. If an opportunity, to let him know that you’d appreciate him telling you his planned return date when he leaves, presents itself then take it. If not, be patient. You cannot force things with an emotionally troubled person. You can lead by example. You can choose to be better.
See your ego in all this. Your inner voice needing to be right. Let it go. I totally understand how hard that is. Of course H is being self-centred; he’s in MLC.
He did not exhibit this behavior while married, but I know he knows that I would have gotten angry and reacted in a bad manner. By being silent that is not the old me.
Silent is better than exploding at H. Good for not “outwardly” being old you. How are you reacting inside?
Do a big 180 on this - for you. Treat H like a roommate. “Hi. How are you?”. Let go your anger and old habits.
D
Tough situation indeed living with a MLCer
Read over Ha Whos thread because she lived with her MLcer for a long time
I agree that being kind and cordial is best and you did good to not blow up at him
So if silence is the next best thing, so it is, we are only human and this stuff is hurtful for the LBS
What could you say to him that would help you?
Gerda, Dnj and PT,
Thank you for your responses.
Ego got in my way so I ignored. This is not what I wanted to do. What I wanted to do was say hi like he never was gone. Not full of emotion, just "hi".
Gerda, the ant analogy is a good one. I can understand what you are saying. One behavior or response will not dictate what he does or doesn't do. All I prefer is that I do not push him any further out the door.
Dnj, you are right, common courtesy with a "roommate" would be to say hi upon a return. I do not know if I could say anything about letting me know when he will be back, but like you said, if the opportunity lends itself.
PT, I will look up Ha Who. What I could've said? I don't know. Maybe just saying hi. Then I wouldn't feel like a kid. (well he doesn't say hi so I won't) I am an adult. No need to be at his level of rudeness.
I need to remember all of these thoughts when I am presented with this situation.
Have a great day!
PLC
My birthday is Sunday.
I expect nothing from him. I have not seen him since before he left on his little vacation.
Last year, it was my first one post BD. I gathered up all of my courage and went to dinner alone. No one knew (only D25 does this year) and everyone assumed we were together celebrating.
Each day that goes by since his return with no talking is becoming so normal and somewhat sad. Inwish I would have spoke to him when I had a chance. I think I would have felt better now.
Anyway, I am going to do something for me.
PLC
Hello PLC
Say Hi to H.
You won’t regret it.
Next time you’re making snacks, or maybe better - go make some snacks and say “Hi H. I’m making some popcorn, would you like some?”.
No pressure. No expectations. Just an offer of popcorn.
H is mixed up and emotionally immature. You need to be the bigger person, the adult in the room. Lead by example. Break the ice and then let him do what he will. You wish would have spoken. A week from now you still will, unless you do something about it.
(((Hugs)))
You got this.
By the way, I like butter and salt on my popcorn. If your making some.
D
Thank you Dnj,
You’re right. I’ll break the ice. I can’t now, because the door is shut and it is dark in there. So tomorrow I will make the effort.
PLC
Well I didn’t have to break the ice.
He came home, I was in the den on the phone And he walked in, said hi.
He brought home some cookies and scones from the bakery. He didn’t have to.
I thanked him.
PLC
Glad the ice is broken. Can you move on without confronting H? I think that would probably be best. BUT it's you that has to live your life so ultimately you decide if you need to or not. Examine why that need is there if so. Usually it's because the other isn't behaving the way we think they should. As LBS we find it hard to accept that things have changed and what was once normal has changed. To the WAS there are no longer any obligations for anything. The old "rules" no longer count.
Maybe H didn't say anything out of spite but I doubt it. Maybe he didn't even think about telling you. The new H has no accountability. But the most likely is he avoided a situation of conflict.
Plus I think the gest with the goodies from the bakery probably shows he knows he has something to make up for so at some level he realises he wasn't correct with you.
The LBS gets to decide their limits and boundaries. It's important. But it's crucial to pick them wisely. Being where ye are at is him not letting you know that he's got plans a big issue for you? Common courtesy aside. I know it's not nice to be on the receiving end. You have to decide how big a deal it is for you.
If you can't let it go, ask yourself why and be sure it's something that will help you going forward. Not all our issues that seem important are in the scheme of things, but we do get hung up on them for various reasons.
Best wishes
Good Morning PLC
I do think the treats were a bit of an apology, a somewhat acknowledgement that he did wrong. Even if it is mostly subconscious to H.
His path is mostly about how he feels. The last few days of you not reacting like you used to, may have given him some pause. Dare I think, maybe even a feeling of “hey, PLC didn’t deserve to be treated that way”. However, that will be short lived, as feelings are. So don’t get your expectations up on him being better next time. Or worse. Or the same. Ah, the path of zero expectations.
With the ice once again broken, remain kind and cordial. Thanking him for the cookies and scones was a good thing to do. It was common courtesy, acknowledged his actions, and responded kindly to his greeting. A fine example to demonstrate. He was watching, make no mistake, he watches you. And he may even follow your lead.
Good begets good. It’s the timeframe we get hung up on. Be patient.
Reflecting upon this latest event, and your 180 of not being confrontational. How do you feel? What do think of this “you”? Better, worse? Would you like non-reaction, letting go, to be more your default?
he knows that I would have gotten angry and reacted in a bad manner. By being silent that is not the old me.
I will be friendly. Keep him surprised. He expects naggy PLC. Nope. She's not here.
We discover our beliefs, our values, our defaults, ones that we may not even realize. We have the amazing opportunity to strengthen ones we like, and alter or discard ones we don’t.
It takes time to reinforce feelings and thoughts into a belief, a value.
Yes, naggy PLC wasn’t here. She might pop up now and again; remember these feelings and thoughts, control your actions and reactions, and eventually it becomes second nature, it becomes a belief.
I absolutely believe in you and your abilities. What do you believe?
D
I do not need to say anything to him about his behavior. There is no benefit to this. You both are right, he is in and out of consciousness regarding this MLC.
I embarrassingly need to state somethings-after looking back on MY behavior this week, I of course had no contact with him (I didn’t even see him, really) I was naggy to my D. We increasingly became more at odds with each other. I think this was because of my uncertainty of his actions up until yesterday.
I need to 180 on my behavior with her as well.
Dnj I believe I can do this. You posted earlier about there is no try, I am all in.
This morning, he came home with more sweets, we were cordial.
PLC
Hello PLC
Our feelings, our resentments towards our wayward spouses will come out, it needs too. This sometimes is directed at other people; people undeserving of such feelings. Work those resentments out with yard work, a good walk or run, a puzzle, whatever - it allows time to let the feelings pass.
Your interactions with your daughter reminded me of something from my situation; a caution, or tale, depending on how one sees things.
Back at the beginning, when my children were receiving some attention from XW (such as it was), I had feelings of jealousy. I was jealous of my children talking to their Mom because I so wanted to speak with XW.
Feelings that go unrecognized, will go unreconciled and unaccepted.
Now, I’m 99% not jealous. There are some rare times when that feeling pops up. I do laugh at myself for such a thing, and it goes away. Feelings are real, and so fleeting.
We all have embarrassing moments. We all learn and grow.
Dnj I believe I can do this. You posted earlier about there is no try, I am all in.
Excellent!
D
Hi Dnj,
The jealousy is very true for me.
I have even told my IC that I feel jealous. I am learning to let that go.
I have no reason except what you stated. How can he spend time with her and not me, too?
I am working past this, today I can say I’m fine, but if they go somewhere I have that knowing pang. I just need to to continue learning to get through it.
Let’s see what the rest of the day brings.
PLC
Thank you Dnj and job!
It has been an uneventful day. D and I are going to get a nice late lunch early dinner soon from a restaurant of my choosing.
Since we are in the LA area, this morning, she and I took a drive to see where a tv show renovation was. It was fun. H was home and has seen me and did not acknowledge my day. It is not expected, so I actually do not feel bad. I would actually be surprised if he did.
I was wondering what to do if we should include him in lunch plans, but he answered my question by leaving to go who knows where, so that took care of itself.
Non pandemic, I would be trying to get tickets to see game 7, but I will settle for a nice millionth night in a row in.
I really appreciate that you wished me HBD. Today, I have received phone calls, texts and messages from many friends from afar. I know I am not alone.
Thank you,
I’m in my head today.
I have had way more good days than bad, so maybe I am due?
H avoided my birthday so maybe this is a residual sadness? I did not expect him to, but anyway...
Today I just feel like giving up. H avoids me at all costs unless he absolutely must speak to me. His NC is something legendary. (Lol)
I know we are on separate journeys and I should be living my life separate from his, and I think I have done a real good job of doing that.
Why am I so affected by his consistent actions?
PLC
PLC, I don't know how you are able to handle this in-house separation. I personally think you are doing an excellent job.
It has been a month for me and it is driving me insane to the point where I have decided to leave. I am so incredibly angry that all I do is unintentionally throw daggers at my W resulting in some nasty arguments. At least you are able to remain detached an continue GAL. I am failing at both miserably.
HI Mar252,
THank you for the compliment. I am just doing me.I am sorry that you are going insane. I really don't get a chance to throw daggers since H literally will walk in, turn and go into the bedroom.
Yesterday, the cable went out. It was about 6:30 pm. He came into where I was sitting, already wearing his pajamas (at 6:30 pm!) and asked if the cable went out. When I responded, it was like I was speaking to a sleeping kid.
I have dealt with this teen for almost 18 months. I told him if he liked, I could come and check if it did not reboot. He agreed. About ten minutes later, I got up and the door was already closed so I did not bother.
Everyone here that knows my situation, knows that not cooking for him is hard for me. That hurts. I will get over it. I just need to focus on me. You need to focus on you.
Just know that we all have bad days, if you are chosing to stand you will need to learn to detach. You can make it through. If I can, anyone can.
(((Mar252)))
I just came home from work.
H is in his room. I heard his phone ring. I could tell it was work, it escalated, he was yelling so loud I could hear clearly with his door closed. He is so angry.
Some times it is good he leaves us alone. He never got this angry with me or our D, but I can see he has anger within him.
Maybe things aren't going too well and he is taking it out on the caller.
Not my problem.
Now off to make dinner for me and D.
The MLCer in crisis can be an angry guy. My ex actually got sent to anger management classes by his work during the time after his affair/first MLC.
I think that he has been mad at me at different times. In fact, the first BD in May 2019, he was pretty angry and when I tried to calm him down ( he felt I was nagging so much ) he announced he no longer wanted to be married.
I understand this has been a long time coming, but I also know that that day, he did not plan to BD, but it presented itself and he could say something.
As we all know, it has not been all sunshine and rainbows for him since then, and for me? I am doing ok.
After I posted my earlier post about just giving up, I had to go somewhere. I had the radio on my station and cranked it up and sang along. I instantly felt better.
I also realized, since his little weekend get a way a couple of weeks ago, I have not heard his phone pinging all night long. I don't focus much on his behaviors, I just realized I hadn't heard anything.
Me? I am relaxing watching the game, rooting on my Dodgers. I'm happy.
I got into an stupid disagreement with D tonight. Sometimes the walls close in. She already apologized.
H was in the bedroom, door closed. I discovered he is going to be out of town this weekend with the uncle. I haven’t seen nor heard from him since he stumbled out of the room the other night to tell me the cable wasn’t working. He was super angry yesterday on the phone, but not with me.
I know I am standing, this is what I want. I just get sad when he really just ignores so much. As you can tell, it comes and goes and I am sure having a disagreement with D has made me sensitive tonight.
I made myself a little list of to-dos for the weekend, and i am looking forward to accomplishing these things.
I just wanted to post tonight as I’m feeling low.
PLC
((PLC))) Hope you are feeling better today. Sending you positive vibes!!
Hi Mar252
Thanks for the positive vibes. I’m still feeling sad. I know it will pass. But it stinks feeling this way.
I began my to-do list, and that will keep me busy.
PLC
Well, I can't shake this sadness.
Today, D and I went out. She mentioned that "Dad was at his uncles last night, he sent me pictures" She also mentioned she told him to let her know when he was headed home and she would unlock the door.
I asked her if she asked him where he was and he apparently just let her know out of the blue. When he left without a word a couple of weeks ago, he did not reach out to either of us.
I just responded, " I miss your dad".
It just hit me. I miss my H. I have been focused on GAL and moving forward, I have supressed these feelings of missing him. And oh, how I miss him.
PLC
Hello PLC
Sadness / depression precedes acceptance. (((Hugs)))
I do understand and empathize my friend. I miss my W. And I miss my kids’ Mom. Still. Not all the time. There are moments however.
I was playing the piano, and above it on the wall is a picture of my four kids, taken at Christmas many years ago. It must be around a decade old that picture. Their faces so young and happy, standing in front of our old upright piano all decorated with Christmas lights. W, I, and kids - we were a family.
Boy, I can sure pour the emotions into song recalling those times.
I do miss my wife. And XW is not W.
The guy running about, who looks like H, isn’t that loving H you miss. Old H is buried under denial and justifications. He may surface; he may not. The road to that understanding, to that acceptance, is a sad one.
Don’t worry that you haven’t shaken the sadness. It takes a while for our emotions to find their way.
You are doing just fine my friend.
D
Thank you Dnj,
It's so absurd. How did this happen?
I know this is something from his past that he is outrunning. I just wish I could help.
PLC
Dnj,
I am a little confused. You stated that sadness/depression precedes acceptance. What does that mean for me?
I accept that I should stop standing? I feel that I have accepted that he does not want to be married.
PLC
Your sadness is preceding your acceptance.
Your path.
It’s not about standing. It’s not about H. It’s about you.
I feel that I have accepted that he does not want to be married.
I know you understand and accept your feelings about H.
You haven’t accepted your feelings about you yet. That’s the sadness. As we process and understand the situation, we discover ourselves.
I have suppressed these feelings...
Do you want to be married?
Do you want to stand?
Are you happy with your beliefs and values? Proud of them?
Can you love?
Do you believe in your vows?
Etc...
We do find indifference. And we do find our feelings again.
Indifference is part of our defensive mechanism, a healthy and needed state. Later, as we heal, we find indifference fades and our feelings return. We are no longer so hurt and distraught as we once were, so the mechanism unwinds.
This has to happen. One cannot accept their feelings if they are locked away.
You stated that sadness/depression precedes acceptance. What does that mean for me?
You continue on your path. You keep standing! You keep gal and focus on you.
Finding acceptance requires one to believe in what they are accepting. Feelings are too fleeting to base acceptance upon. Accepting one’s feelings is based upon one’s beliefs.
Beliefs are
influenced by our thoughts and feelings. And our thoughts and feelings are
lead by our beliefs.
That is not as circular as it may appear. One’s beliefs lead them, and beliefs can be influenced - strengthened and altered.
It looks to me like you are questioning your values. Testing them. Ensuring they are strong. For what good are beliefs and values if they crumble under pressure. We do this, emotionally test ourselves, to ensure our beliefs, to ensure our acceptance. It’s important to be able to believe in one’s self. To know your strength.
Sadness and depression comes when facing your situation, seeing it for what it is. All the emotional bargaining has failed, and you stand. It becomes you and your beliefs upon the cusp of acceptance. Continue walking the path. Your feelings are real, your sadness is real, and it will change - follow your beliefs.
Sadness / depression precedes acceptance.
This is normal and perfectly fine. And quite healthy. It just takes some time to get through to the other side. Be patient. You will be amazed at what you are going to find.
D
Hi PLC... I am so sorry for your sadness right now. I too have been sad today, it must be the moon.
I would like to chime in on the acceptance piece of your conversation with DnJ. Only because I believe for the first time in my sitch, I finally understand and feel acceptance.
Acceptance for me feels like 'meh'. Neutral. Neither terribly bothered by H's actions; nor completely immune from them (immunity might be what complete indifference feels like?). Just neither here nor there. The things that used to really trigger an internal emotional response in me just don't as much anymore. When they do, I am more curious about what that means in terms of my own journey and self-development, than what that means in terms of my R with H.
I can honestly say that if H were to come banging down my door with flowers and a new ring and begging my forgiveness and love back, I would ask him for time. Not because I don't trust his intentions or think he has more work to do on his own journey, or anything about him really. But because I know that I have more work to do on my own journey and that will need to come before I am capable of any R.
I have accepted H's journey. It has taken me a long time, but he is where he is right now and it has very little to nothing to do with me. And though I came kicking and screaming to this party, I am learning so much about myself that I am not sure I would change anything at the moment.
Someone could have written these exact words to me and I wouldn't have fully understood until I reached this place in my heart where I am now. It is all a journey.
(((PLC)))
Thank you Sage and Dnj,
I think I just have the feelings that I have been I different for finally screaming to be heard.
I am sad, I am so sad that this happened. I have been numb almost a year and a half and it is finally weighing on me. All that I thought could happen hasn’t happened, but I am not seeing a way back from him. Me, yes. I am willing to stand I am still in love and I want this to work.
I know that we need work, this isn’t a come home and all is well, but will this happen? Who knows. I now feel like bargaining with him ( I won’t) I feel like going into the bedroom when he’s there and climbing into bed asking what happened? I haven’t felt like doing that ever. His indifference to me is so hurtful.
Since he has traveled so much of our marriage, I was very confident and able to take care of things here because I had to. I treated all of this vacancy as a business trip. I guess this was my limit, because it hurts.
I know that I will be ok, I may be sad, but I’ll ultimately be ok. I just want him.
PLC
Dear PLC,
Since a very long time I too had a difficult evening last Saturday. Don't know why, it just hit me in the car, while driving to get my children from their sports.
I also had a lot of times when I just wanted to go to him and shake him up, this is simply because sometimes we can't understand how they can hurt someone so much.
This is not the person you married and loved all these years.Try to look at him in a different way now.
Physically it may be your husband, but spiritually he is a different person now. These are the exact words my father in law uses. I see he is my son from the outside, but I don't recognize him anymore from the inside.
If you accept this, it will gradually get better.
Be strong, work on yourself, believe me, it will get better! We are all there for you and for each other!
Hi Eagle3,
Thank you for chiming in. I took some time and read your situation. I see how you see as my therapist would call them, “thaws” where maybe he speaks then he reverts back to his current person.
I need to remember, the person that is ignoring me is not the H I married.
I did have a couple little thaws, last night I made dinner, he had come home early due to weather. When dinner was ready I texted him that dinner was ready if he felt like it. He just responded thanks so I went ahead, ate dinner and began cleaning the kitchen up. He came in for dinner, took it to the bedroom, ate then came back and thanked me.
I just told him he was welcome.
The second one, was I came home from work for lunch and he was home. The bedroom was closed so I did as I usually do, made lunch then relaxed. He came in said hi and asked if I was home on lunch. I replied then mentioned how windy it was. He responded back about where he had to be this morning. When I went to leave the bedroom door was ajar, so I announced I was leaving and he said bye.
Do I think this means anything? No. But I do appreciate that he can speak to me. I do not plan on letting him know when dinner is ready every night. But I am trying to show him I am not going to get mad that he took off for the weekend.
You’re right. We are all here for each other. This is all I have unless you count my therapist!
PLC
Hello PLC
Well done speaking with H during those “thaws”. MLCers do peek out of the tunnel every once in a while. They do keep tabs on us.
Keep doing what you’re doing. Continue to live and be a safe place for him to land. His poking his head out, thanking you for diner, asking about lunch, etc... is interesting. What it means is still too early to tell.
A week or so ago the ice was broken. Keep leading the way. Show kindness, compassion, and common courtesy. He is watch, and seeing if you will rip his head off for all the terrible stuff he’s done. You haven’t and that has maybe set him back somewhat and he is taking notice.
I suspect he will dip back into the tunnel. They do like to process things, all hidden away from the LBS.
A question: Yes, it is not your job to inform H every night that super is ready. However, why are you purposefully planning not to?
Just go about your evening, and if H’s door is open tell him there is food on the table. Or text him. Or not. Kind of see what is going on that day and go from there. But to forward think not to?
One of my most painful realization in my situation is - without communication nothing is going to get better between XW and I.
Of course, at the beginning the MLCer doesn’t want to talk to us. Time and space are extremely important. And they still are, you just got to follow H’s lead on that.
However, with ice broken, and a few somewhat cordial comments, why stop? Let H lead the pace of things. You are more than willing, I think, to speak with him. Extend the olive branch without expectation. At times he will reach back, and other times he won’t. Just do it with no pressure. Saying goodbye or that a meal is ready is a pretty good opening for him to talk when he feels ready.
You are demonstrating a good role model to him. Eventually he has to emulate it back. Hopefully.
And I think it is too early to be crawling into bed with him.
Boy oh boy, I remember there are some wild feelings with indifference waxing and waning. Weather the storm. Calm seas are ahead.
D
Hi Dnj,
Side note, wherever you live sounds beautiful. Where I am, we barely see stars even at night. Lucky you.
You asked why I was not planning on telling him each time, (when there is an opening) well, I don’t want to appear to eager. It seems that in the past, I would have these little exchanges he would seem to think I was getting a little too close for comfort and shut it all down. Of course, that is my interpretation, but it makes sense.
Right now, he came home and went to the fridge. I mentioned there were leftovers and he declined and ate his sandwich he purchased the other day. The dogs were hanging around hoping something would get dropped and he asked me a question and I took that opening to tell him a story about the larger one, once I put her in a sweater, her reaction was to put her head down and look away from me. He smiled.
Once done, he went to his room. I do see this time, today, that he is making himself visible. I have been through this long enough to not expect anything and I definitely don’t expect this to be long.
But I will take it and extend that olive branch when I can.
In all of my introspection while sad this last week or so, I know I am able to forgive and move forward. I now know that. Will he know this and want it? Let’s hope. But either way, I like this version of me instead of angry me.
PLC
The surprises are continuing.
I work from home on Tuesday. I was eating my lunch when in he walked with bags of fresh loaves of bread, six to be exact. Along with a container of freshly baked cookies. This is all from the bakery we like. He said, “here I got some bread” I made sure to thank him.
One of the loaves is a garlic cheese, I said maybe we would have pasta tonight. So I will make pasta, use the garlic bread for toast. I will also make sure he knows when it is ready.
This is such a change from him in recent weeks. I am glad I have my IC appt today, I need to talk this over.
Thanks!
Wow.
Six loaves!
It’s funny isn’t it. The good things get us wondering too.
Make pasta. Enjoy the smells and tastes of fresh garlic bread smothered in butter, accenting a nice pasta dish.
Definitely let him know when it’s super time. Might even suggest he eats at the table with you. Something along the lines of, as he is picking up his plate - “oh, I was hoping you’d join me. The bread smells so good.” Methinks he is looking for a warm welcome. Although he may not realize it yet. (Remember no pressure - he’s a timid squirrel)
D
Well, I made a nice sauce and boiled some pasta. D25 came home and said she could smell how good it was outside.
When it was time to eat, I texted him “There’s pasta if you want”. I went on about my business, toasting the yummy bread he brought home. D and I ate. I looked at my phone and he had not seen the message. A little while later, he texted, “ok thanks”. No sign of him, but I still am encouraged, because usually he would say “no thanks”.
So we will see.
Hi PLC,
Quickly had to look up the word "thaw" as I didn't know the meaning.
it is indeed just the right word to use. LOL
You are handeling the situation in the best way you can do.
My husband was constantly at home during the first COVID wave. He practically did not go outside and had enormous ups and downs. It is by no means easy to deal with and it weighs on your family. That is why you regularly have these sad feelings.
It makes it a bit easier for me at the moment because he is away on average for 4 weeks and then @ home for 1 week. This means that we have a sort of peace for ome time in a row.
This of course makes it easier to be completely disconnected from him emotionally. I also feel that I am much stronger and finally feel like I don't need him anymore.
I'm there for him when he needs me. He sends messages daily, I never initiate myself. When he sends I always answer. He's much more involved with the family now than anything I've seen in recent years, even if from a distance. He also feels that I am not putting any pressure on him and I feel that altough in a very slow way, this is helping him move forward.
The relationship between the two of us is respectful, and has been like this for about 3 months now.
Patience, patience, patience...the thing I used to hate the most, since the last 2 years I had to learn to embrace it. And I'm actually happy sometimes that this all happened to me as I learned so much about myself.
In all of my introspection while sad this last week or so, I know I am able to forgive and move forward. I now know that. Will he know this and want it? Let’s hope. But either way, I like this version of me instead of angry me.
PLC
I really like the above. Try to keep this feeling. It will not always work, but it helps so much to get rid of that angry feeling. Don't do this for H, do this for you...
Thank you Eagle3,
My H traveled so much, I really feel it helped me in the beginning.
Of course at the first BD, within a week he was gone for three months for work, where I know he met up with OW #1. During that time, D was home for a week or so. Otherwise, I was on my own. It helped me become stronger.
My H does not reach out for anything really. I would like if he did. Maybe someday. What he does do is buy food as described above. I make sure he knows I appreciate. In some way I know he needs to be acknowledged. And he should be.
As I mentioned, I have found forgiveness. This has made me feel peace.
PLC
Have you read the Five Love Languages book? Do you know what his Love Languages are? It's a little tricky but you CAN try to speak his love languages without appearing to be pursuing. Example - if words of affirmation is one of his lOve Languages, thanking him for the food is a good move. You could also casually comment "Oh, that shirt looks good on you " or (without laughing) " have you lost weight?".
Hi kml,
I think you were the person who recommended that book to me a while back.
Yes, I was able to get it digitally from the library. It has been very helpful.
I will say this week (well, sun-weds) can’t count today yet, I have had interaction from him. He did not eat with us on Tuesday, but last evening after we ate, he came into the room asking if there was leftovers from the pasta we had on Tuesday. There was and I mentioned how good the garlic cheese bread was and he replied.
He’s not a chatty person, but this is a lot for him lately.
PLC
PLC,
I just shared a lengthy post on May's thread and I think it applies to you, too. It probably applies to every person on this earth, to be honest. It's all about detachment, self-love and finding yourself again.
I know that a lot of what we share here is journaling our thoughts and experiences of our current challenging situations, and getting support for those micro-interactions that we all struggle with. But I see a lot of focus from you on H. If he's nice, you feel good. If he's ignoring you, you feel bad.
How can you break this cycle? Where are you, dearest PLC, in all of this? Who are YOU, deep within your own self? What are you worthy of? How do you want to feel?
Someone shared a journalling practice with me that has been really helpful. Set a point in time in the future, say 2 years from now. Write in the present tense how you are feeling, what is happening around you, where you are at physically and emotionally. Are the birds singing? Is the sun shining? Does it warm your face with its glow? What are you feeling inside? Make this intention reach into the realms of what may feel impossible now. Where is your relationship at? Both with H and within yourself?
Put energy into where you WANT to be, not where you are at now.
This list (you may have to read it daily, affirm it within yourself) will help you live your way into that perfect, future moment.
The only person you can change, is you. And I have every bit of faith that you will get there.
((PLC)))
HI Sage,
I will have to read your thread on May's.
I will say lately, I have been sad when he ignores me. The thing is, it is expected from him. I do not reach out to him, except lately to let him know dinner is ready if he wants.
This behavior is new. I have actually done ok alone, it is just when he decides to interact with me and even D. You see, there have been recent times where no one sees him. He leaves in the morning without a word and returns and stays in the bedroom until morning.
I agree that I should journal the future PLC, but I think that it would be a confident PLC standing for her marriage as she has for the last year and a half.
Of course, there are boundaries. If H crossed one, I would not stand any longer.
I can't help but observe his actions, as they are different of late. I would love to know what this all means, but I do want him to know that I am still around. I am not making it easy, i am not discussing us, but I am here.
It is a hard path, but my choices are up to me: stand or move on. Right now, I am standing.
PLC
Hello PLC
I agree that I should journal the future PLC, but I think that it would be a confident PLC standing for her marriage as she has for the last year and a half.
Of course, there are boundaries. If H crossed one, I would not stand any longer.
Hmmm....
Interesting. H has the power to make you stand down? Really?
You ask me before what I mean by stand for you. Consider that.
If H’s actions can make you stand down; it is his actions that allow you to stand. What are
your reasons?
Take control of your life. You choose to stand or not. H doesn’t choose for you.
Confident PLC standing for her
marriage beliefs and herself.
It’s your choice. And a pretty good path, IMHO.
D
Dnj,
I’m confused. I am standing for my beliefs. What I mean by boundaries, if he got OW pregnant, if he became violent. That’s what I mean.
As you know, it is hard to show independence while the spouse still lives here.
I don’t seek him out, I don’t tell him my plans. I do my own things. It is only recent that i have felt ok to tell him about dinner.
Please let me know what I am doing wrong.
PLC
What I mean by boundaries, if he got OW pregnant,
Why is your boundary based on HER fertility or use of birth control? He’s shtupping her either way. The action is the same regardless of the outcome. So why isn’t your boundary around him continuing to sleep with another woman while married to and living with you?
Well, first of all, she lives out of the country, so he is currently not seeing her daily. I think if he was to get her pregnant regardless of MLC and dealing with that, I’d be dealing with a child. I don’t want to. That’s his problem. If he’s stupid enough to be even more reckless than just sleeping with OW to bring a child into this world, well I’m done. Period.
Detachment would be done. I absolutely refuse to deal with that. Even if he realized his error, and wanted to work on our R I wouldn’t. I would truly be standing for me.
Good Morning PLC
Thank you for clarifying. I do see and empathize with that view.
The bringing forth of an innocent life into an MLC world does happen. And it makes a bad situation so much more complicated.
And yes, violence doesn’t get tolerated.
And there is STD, jail, and other unsavoury outcomes that can happen. One of my hang ups was, a tattoo. If XW got a tattoo. Something like a heart with her and OM scribed within it. However, something like that changes nothing with the how and why I’m living right now. A child, a tattoo, whatever, doesn’t change
my life. Like you said, that would be their problem.
Please let me know what I am doing wrong.
Wrong and right are not as firmly carved in stone as one first believes. Empathy allows one to see and feel different views and the rightness of those. Wrongness comes from our ego and our judgemental self looking upon others, meanwhile actually judging ourselves.
I don’t think you are doing wrong. And I like to focus on the good or the “right” parts anyhow. After all, what we focus on becomes larger.
You are asking questions, looking within, and listening to suggestions. You are open to change, and show a willingness to realize your own beliefs which might need altering. And strengthening those which you like.
I have to get going to work. I’ll pop in later.
D
Hi Dnj,
Thanks for your reply. I just feel weird. I am encouraged by his talkative-ness. But in reading replies, am I supposed to completely detach and ignore?
For example, he came home today, came in for no other reason then to say hi. We discussed voting in our area. He then asked me about his truck registration tags. I had not realized we had not received them. He asked if I could help and I asked him to take care of D25 smog and i could look into the truck. Normal household things.
As boring of a convo this is, he is speaking to me. We all know how in the recent past he would come home to hibernate.
I am not thinking that this is it, that he wants back in, but he IS initiating contact. Today marks 6 days in a row with him speaking to me on his own.
Now tomorrow, he informed me he has to work. I didn't ask, nor did I tell him my plans.
I have noticed him being more there for the dogs (as silly as that sounds) and in the morning, I hear him tell D25 (remember, she's sleeping in the living room) goodbye. Or I hear goodnight to her. I have not heard that at all. It is all new behaviors.
I for my part, am going to work, running my errands, cautiously going out on the weekends in the day and as we all know, cooking what I want. I am being friendly.
Heck, maybe he is being friendly because he found OW3. ( I think OW2 fizzled) Maybe he has an exit plan and is happy because of that. I don't know. I cannot exhaust myself wondering. If I did, I could make it a full time job.
Anyway, doing wrong or right, as you know is more of am I DBing or not DBing. I suppose the best way would be complete detachment, but with him living here, there is a measure of cordialness that I am trying to maintain without bending backwards to please him.
I look forward to your response.
PLC
Hello PLC
Let me ask you something. Do you see this, H and his new behaviour, as positive? As steps forward?
Do you remember reading MWD’s DB? And the solutions journal? Wouldn’t these new behaviours be seen as good steps?
It is only 6 days. And it is only a bit of speaking. And showing consideration for the the dogs. And telling D25 goodbye. Still, H had a conversation with you. Yay.
MLCers do tend to unwind themselves in the reverse order of those they hurt the most. As in reconnect with pets first, friends, kids, then lastly LBS. From least risky and most likely to accept them to the person they betrayed and were most unfaithful to.
A lot of times this happens in small spurts. Little peaks out of the tunnel; like a scared squirrel. You are not pressuring, not yelling, not flailing around all mad; you are being a nice safe place to land. So the squirrel is still here; he hasn’t ran off.
What does it all mean? Sorry, it is too early to tell. However, I do believe these are positive steps for him. Well, of course these are. He is somewhat reconnecting with his daughter and you.
I do not believe the best way is complete detachment. Nor complete indifference. A person within a mental and emotional crisis mostly wants to be heard. They want and need a connection. At first that cannot be with the LBS, for we are the very bane of the MLCer’s existence. They have projected much upon us. With time and space, and fate, and karma, and no small amount of luck, some actually look within themselves. And of those, some do their inner work.
Is H one of those lucky few? Perhaps.
You need to keep you expectations low. H will not meet them, not yet, not for a while. And unmet expectations will create resentment.
You need to lower your indifference, your detachment, your protective walls - just a bit. I know you have empathy for H. You have understanding. Compassion. Maybe even some forgiveness. H will have a very hard time believing that. It will take time, and small steps for him to see that. You must go very slowly. Let him lead the pace.
Dig very deep for patience and lead your life. Live and demonstrate your beliefs. He is watching you. He is following you. It’s ok to invite him to be beside you once and a while. Depressed people really desire to be on a better path, to be in a better place. Seeing someone happy and loving life is quite a draw. Be a beacon. And by the way, a lighthouse shines; it’s the ships that follow. Remember your role in all of this. You cannot make him, he must want too, he must decide too.
And as things progress H will become more comfortable and share more and more with you. He will also test you. Keep your values and boundaries of respectful interactions. Those tests are much like those from a teenager. They need to know that we will love and support them, even when they fail, especially when they fail.
A MLCer has a difficult road back, and I suspect they would have a very hard time believing we could forgive them. Live well and (slowly) show him different.
H is interested in you. Curious of the person you have become. Keep moving forward and let him catch up. The door is ajar, and he might even want to walk though it. Stay calm and live with peace and gentleness. No sudden moves PLC, and lets see where this goes.
And by the way, you are DBing just fine.
D
Hi PLC and DnJ, I hope you both had a nice weekend!
I wanted to make sure my comment about detachment came across with the right intention. It has taken me a long time to understand what detachment really means in the context of a R. I have read the detachment thread several times over the past six months, but now I know what it really feels like and can live the words.
I don’t believe that detachment negates love, compassion or friendliness. Nor does detachment require one to change one’s status on standing or not standing for their M. Detachment should be a standalone concept, one that you can exercise in a healthy R or an unhealthy one.
Through the process of detaching, I have found MORE love, compassion and understanding towards H. Because I am protected from his projections, his anger and his emotions. I can choose to lean in to them, or to be a silent observer. My emotions and feelings are no longer at the mercy of his. It is an incredibly liberating place to be and probably the most healing for me.
Finding detachment is for YOU. It is not a game or a tool to win H back, nor a motivation for instigating D. It is a place of existing in acceptance, with strength. Detachment allows you to objectively observe yourself within the interactions with H. H has less impact on you because detachment acts as a filter between the outside world and your inner world. You get to choose what to let it and what to keep out. In its most simplistic form, detachment gets you out of the trees and into the forest.
I am not sure if this helps at all. I am new to this space of detachment, but it feels really healing and powerful to be here.
(((PLC)))
Hi There,
Dnj, in answer to your question, do I see this as a step forward?
I can say it is a better step than what he has been doing. This weekend he volunteered what he was doing, thanked for dinner and on Sunday while he was out, D and i went ahead and ate (no waiting for him, ever) he came home and asked what we got for dinner.
He went to take care of D's smog and he called ME to come and pick him up as there were repairs that needed to be done and it was going to take a while. I didn't even think about it, but D could have used my car and picked him up. He could have called her. Interestingly, when i picked him up, his vibe was very uncomfortable to be in the car with me. LOL. I just drove home and went inside.
He has continued to speak to me, sparingly, but he does. Yesterday, he was home when I came home for lunch. He came in and told me he was going to be working overnight. (not unusual) I just responded ok and i slipped and told him to be careful. I tend to believe him, as he has not told me anything lately and I do not ask.
Now, could he be lying? Of course. But I do feel detached at least what I think is detached and I am not changing things for him, asking him anything or doing anything for him without some discussion.
Now could he be peeking out of the tunnel? I think he could be. I also agree, he is a scared squirrel. One wrong move and back into the tunnel he goes. This is where I am detaching.
I am home today working. Let's see if I get any baked goods. (haha)
PLC
Update, he brought me cookies.
Lol - the Bakery Barometer.
Good Morning PLC
Lol. Cookies. kml’ s bakery barometer maybe isn’t far off.
What do you think H’s love language is? Or one of them? Receiving/giving gifts? Acts of service? Just curious. H is seeming to be showing affection / olive branch at the moment. Interesting.
It been something like 10 or more days of him actually speaking to you.
And of course all those baked goods.
He came in and told me he was going to be working overnight. (not unusual) I just responded ok and i slipped and told him to be careful.
That’s not a big slip.
How did he react to your well-intentioned warning?
I would think he likes seeing a bit of your compassionate side. He is looking and “hoping” you are safe. And still running as well. Perhaps he might even decided to land in the near future. Hard to say. It’s his path and his trauma.
Keep doing what you are doing. Kind and cordial. Living your life. Let H catch up to your fine example.
Have a wonderful day.
D
Bakery barometer-that seems to be right.
I read love languages, and I think he is acts of service. I make sure to thank him. Over the weekend, D wanted to get dinner, and for the first time in a while, I asked if he would want anything and he did, and he thanked me after we got the food. (He did not eat with us)
When I told him to be careful, he was walking out of the room and said either , “ok” or “I will”. I almost told him I loved him. That is how “normal” the convo was, I almost slipped into an old pattern.
I spoke to my IC yesterday and she continued the advice i have been given here. “Detach” be aloof.
We all agree he is that scared squirrel, so I am not trying to spook him.
Thank you.
Well, I have really been focusing on what I am doing and not trying to gauge his life with how he speaks or treats us here.
I realized that I was hopeful with him chatting, bringing treats to eat.
He still is, but nothing else has changed. I understand that if this is a peek out of the tunnel, I am not to throw a welcome home party. I was realizing I was looking to see what or if he would talk to me. After a year and a half, i would have thought I would be better.
So this last Friday, I made steaks and potatoes and a salad for D and me. He had left earlier in the evening, without a word, so instead of waiting to see if he was going to be around, I cooked. He came home after we ate and opened the fridge. I know he was looking for food. Well H, let us know when you'll be back and that you want to eat with us, and it is not a big deal to throw another steak on the BBQ.
Aloof is my plan.
Hi PLC
Friday’s supper - well done.
If I missed out on a steak dinner I’d let you know the next and every time! I love steak. Lol. Medium rare please.
D
Thank you Dnj,
It was tasty. It’s been awhile since we’ve had them. Medium rare, too.
Oh, this H of mine, is such a confusing person.
Let’s see if tomorrow brings me anything...
PLC
Today, I worked from home. No baked goods. In fact, he seems to be back in the tunnel.
I was thinking about planning Thanksgiving. We are staying home. Will he? I was sad thinking about it, got over it, and am planning a meal for me and D. He’s welcome, of course, but she and I will plan to our likes.
Last year, he was gone, so I don’t expect much. Better that way.
(((PLC))). I can’t imagine living in limbo for as long as you have. I did it for four and a half years but the difference is that I didn’t know that is what I was doing. Had I known what my H was actually up to during that time, I don’t think I could have lasted. Anyway...knowing or not knowing, it is very, very hard to live with a ghost. I hope you and D have a great Thanksgiving...with or without your H. (((HUGS)))
Thank you DV,
When I sit back and look within myself, I really have a determination to not give up. Call it stubbornness, faith or anything in between. I do feel he is 100 percent MLC, but with that comes the uncertainty that he may never recover and deal with what has caused this (if he even knows what that is).
One thing, from reading situations here, I know that in some respects I am lucky. Even though he is at home, and he has left without a word for a weekend, he is normally home every night. He comes home during next day from work and as far as I can tell if he is with friends, they all have obligations and they aren’t necessarily going out to meet people. Covid has helped in a strange way for him not being able to freely go places and the same reason has made it hard for me to GAL freely.
This limbo from H and covid has been long and yet, for the most part I’m ok. Having D here has been fun, but if she was still out of state, I know I’d be ok, as it was just H and I with the BD for about six months before lockdowns came along and with it our D coming home. I have friends, family and hobbies. As my IC would say, I am comfortable in my own skin. H isn’t. So for me in a weird way, this in certain aspects is easier for me then H.
As for thanksgiving, I think I will make a special plan for something fun, maybe a movie to stream, since we aren’t heading out. I of course would like him at the table, but if not, we have had plenty of meals without him present in the last 18 months.
I appreciate your comments, DV. You said it perfectly, he is a ghost living here, I never thought of that that way and it is spot on.
PLC
Hi All,
It has been status quo here.
Sometimes I just think, "file and get him moving on his way" then I think about what I was standing for even if he has forgotten his vows.
Again, no rudeness or R talk from H. I am making Thanksgiving plans for D and I and as i previously mentioned, he is invited if he chooses.
The Bread giver came today instead of tomorrow. Last week, there was none.
Sometimes I wonder if he thinks this is a horrible mess he can't get out of, or if he truly is waiting for me to take care of the Divorce filing.
He makes little comments and observations whereas before he really stayed away from the household.
Time will tell all.
PLC
I feel really sad.
Tonight, I as scrolling through social media and came upon a beautiful picture of a place I’ve wanted to visit. I showed D as she was nearby. I said something about of how pretty it was but I won’t visit when it is winter. She responded “why don’t you move there?” I know she meant it nicely, but it stung. If I move, I’m moving on.
I responded, that I had a lot here. (Parents, sisters family, niece and nephews) But what I really meant was my H is here.
After a little bit, I said, “ you know I’m hoping your dad eventually comes out of what he is dealing with and we can stay married” i caught her rolling her eyes. So I asked her why. She said she can have an opinion. So I asked her if she thought it was possible, she said slim chances.
I explained, I took a vow and I even though he has broken his, I won’t. She’s a bit more cynical being 25 and out in the world, but I still have hope and I am feeling dumb. But having someone who lives here and sees his behavior tell me that is so jarring.
Am I dumb for standing? It’s been 18 months. I know some of you have stood longer and some, less. Each day I look ahead and just take care of the plans I have. I don’t include him in decisions that are day to day. In fact, I had been having some back pain, went to the doctors, ended up going to physical therapy and he had no idea. He only found out when he came home and I was leaving and he asked where I was going.
I see so much of him still relying on me for basic household things. But is it convenience? He’d have to figure out how to balance a checking account and pay rent and I think he could. (I mean he’s a grown man?) but sometimes I feel maybe that’s the only reason he sticks around?
I don’t know. Tonight is hard.
(((PLC)))
This is tough. It's okay to be sad. Just know that there are people who care about you, IRL and here, and will support you no matter what your decision is.
Your D loves you and doesn't like to see you hurting... I'm sure that is where she is coming from. Also, I think it is probably healthy to take stock every once in awhile, really evaluate your situation, and decide if you are okay with status quo or if some sort of change is better. Taking steps in any direction also doesn't necessarily mean you are no longer standing for your M-- you may just be doing it in another way. We hear over and over here that D isn't necessarily the end of an R, either. You have many roads open to you.
But I do think it is important to take a hard look every once in awhile, and be open to change. Maybe plan that trip for the spring or next summer. Try out something else new. Do something just for you and give yourself a break from thinking about him at all. And it is okay to be sad or frustrated or angry... those feelings are healthy and natural.
Hope your day tomorrow is better, PLC. Hugs.
Good Morning PLC
No! Absolutely not!
I know at times it feels like you are waiting for H. Remember you are standing for you. For your beliefs, your values, your vows, and so on.
Your daughter sees H’s behaviour as well. And she doesn’t want to see you hurting. It is nice to see that she thinks it’s possible. The slim-ness of projected probability is really a guess, only time will tell.
H’s coming out of this, being probably or not, changes little - your path is your path. You need to walk this road whether H is there or not, whether you are married or not. It really is for you. (((Hugs)))
The questions and doubts of standing are perfectly normal. Do you see how your feelings have altered your perception? How being sad has coloured things? Again, perfectly normal.
Feeling are fleeting, when not reinforced. Acknowledge your feelings. Experience them. Let them wash over you.
That is the reason not to decided things based upon feelings (like our MLCers did). Those poor souls cannot handle their emotions and the constant depression they drag around. So of course they run.
Once your feelings subside, thoughts and beliefs do return. Follow those beliefs, the ones you’ve strengthened and created. The ones you want. Your feelings will follow as well - once you accept. Acceptance is emotional understanding. It takes time to get there. And a good deal of patience.
Stand for you.
It’s ok to hope.
(((PLC)))
Have a good day my friend.
D
Thank you May and Dnj,
I admit, I let myself get consumed with sadness. On the plus side, I was exhausted when I went to bed and slept like a baby.
I think what bothers me is that D sees his behavior. I want to be a good example to her and show that when the going gets tough, you do not stop trying. Unfortunately, I do not know if H sees anything other than what is in his tunnel. I know enough to know, that regardless of what he sees or not, I know what I am doing is positive for me.
As you know, I see bits of him, but I also see someone who seems to be literally disgusted to be near me. He can make in passing small talk but if we have to be nearby for a moment or two, I feel his uncomfortableness.
I don't know if I mentioned D got a job and she is now working from home. Since H is living in her bedroom, she is living and working in the Living room. I realized yesterday, when I came home, the only "person" happy to see me is the dogs. Now don't get me wrong, I love these furry girls, but she's working and if he is home, he does not come out to greet me. I realized yesterday, it hurts. When was the last time he genuinely smiled or laughed with me? When did he begin this assent into this crisis? I don't know.
I also know that I am getting tired of the house being filled to capacity. I like the rooms used for their purposes. I have an H living in the second bedroom and a D living and working in the Living Dining room. The kitchen has her overflow since she does not really have a closet and it is stressful to someone like me who does not like chaos.
I think in order to feel a little better and exert some control in a situation that is way bigger than me, is to purge some items for donation. It will make me feel better.
TOday is work from home day for me. Let's see if he comes around.
PLC
Well, let me tell you, a therapist sometimes earns their pay more days than others. Today mine did.
I expressed my concerns over my daughters doubts, my husbands behavior and although my IC did not paint a rosy picture, she helped me take my focus on what was affecting ME and to look at the broader picture. It helped so much.
Today, he brought home soups, and a large box of instant oatmeal. He’s branching out. Bread yesterday, soup and oatmeal today. Hmmmm.
He still is very much peeking out of the tunnel and I am trying to not notice.
PLC
Good Morning PLC
It sounds like you are receiving some really good advice from your IC. We do sometimes get stuck on the details and miss the bigger picture. Good to get re-focused.
Your house does sound rather full, at capacity and spilling over a bit. Do you have a basement? Can you make another room, or space, for either H or D? A third spare bedroom/office, and get back the living room? Just wondering.
He still is very much peeking out of the tunnel and I am trying to not notice.
I agree. H is peeking out of the tunnel.
If I may, you need less “trying” and more “doing”.
Do notice when you mean too. And do not notice when you mean not too. Try is vague and increases the probability of failing. Do, and yes you may fail. Only try, and you are already half way there. Just a little mental assertiveness tip to keep your sword sharp and shield bright.
I think what bothers me is that D sees his behavior. I want to be a good example to her and show that when the going gets tough, you do not stop trying.
By the way, it’s ok to notice H’s behaviour. He is living right there, it would be near impossible to not see it. The idea is/was to detach. You’re there. So notice, acknowledge, validate (when opportunity arises), and go about your day.
Have a great day.
D
Hi Dnj,
No basement, house is normally fine for three people. I have always kept it neat and tidy. Now I have a teenage boy in one room and a disgruntled daughter in another area. If everyone kept to my wishes, it would be just fine. Hahaha
Last night, I was making dinner and he came in and asked what I was making. I just answered. I didn’t offer as I could tell he was just passing through.
This week has been a long one and it’s just weds. I am ok, and regardless of my D’s feelings this is my marriage.
I hope you had a nice birthday!
PLC
Good Morning PLC
If everyone kept to my wishes, it would be just fine. Hahaha
LOL. Hahaha
Your housemates are a teenage boy and a disgruntled daughter - good luck!
I still laugh at memories of my daughter’s room. Clothes piled two feet thick all over the floor. Bed unmade. It didn’t matter, just closed the door. She’d get cleaning, putting everything away, about once a month or two. That would last for about 3 days and then everything was pulled out again. Lol
Apparently kids grow out of this. Eventually.
You are doing fine regarding daughter. She is untitled to her feelings. And she is going to project upon you, somewhat. You are the strong stable person. Her rolling of eyes at her Dad’s behaviour and your standing is pretty standard. She is realizing how strong you are. What vows really mean. And of course realizing what Dad is doing. That all takes time to process. We really do lead by example, and kids watch and learn. And rebel, and sulk, and disgrunt (is that even a word?); and respect, admire, and love. Although those last ones are usually hidden until they figure some stuff out.
Have faith, you affect more than you realize.
D
I think what bothers me is that D sees his behavior. I want to be a good example to her and show that when the going gets tough, you do not stop trying.
Just another way of looking at this - why aren't you thinking "I want to be a good example to her and show that she shouldn't accept emotional abuse and infidelity from a partner?"
How would you feel if she had a boyfriend that was treating her the way your husband has treated you? Is that what you want her to learn, that this is ok?
Now - a boyfriend is not a husband, vows are vows, and I understand you wanting to stand especially since it seems at least remotely possible that he might come out of the tunnel at some point. HOWEVER, your message to your daughter should not be "Keep trying no matter what". The message should be "I had a lot of good years with your father and I think this might be temporary MLC madness, so I am trying to wait to see if he can come out the other side. But don't worry, I am not accepting his behavior, and if it doesn't change eventually, I will move forward with my life. " Or it might even be "this is what I have to do financially right now because I can't afford to move out, but I am focusing on my own life and not letting him wear on me".
Hi Kml,
I have tried to avoid talking about my R with my D as I do not think she needs to know all about the situation. When he told her he was going to ask me for a D, her response to him was she thought he was having a MLC.
I have discussed small particulars as needed, but she is unaware of OW, in fact, he does not know that I know. It will come out eventually that I know to him, but now is not the time.
I have told her that I am wanting to stand for my marriage and I am hoping he will come out of his fog. I do show in some ways how I am getting on with my life as I do not know my limit.
I have been looking at ways to up date the home, my choices. With the house being full, I am hoping to continue to purge and get some things that I like to make it more me.
I am really focusing on him not wearing on me, since if I want to think about it, it could bring me down deep.
D is hoping to get a work from home job in the next year and make an effort to travel abroad and stay a few months. We discussed me visiting when she finds a place. Me, not mom and dad. So that is the plan!
PLC
So I learned a lesson this weekend.
As you know H has been nice enough, bringing home carbs ( I got bread on Friday and donuts yesterday). He’s not socializing with D and I. But he is not being rude. He and I have had conversations, albeit brief, that he begins.
Yesterday, he was in the bedroom with the door closed. I could see he had the light on. It was apparent he was FaceTiming a woman. I heard her tell him goodbye and him tell her he’d text her later.
Now the lesson is for me to keep on GAL. I realized, he has been nice to us but that was no indication of him coming bout of the tunnel. He has not told me any different. As far as I know. He wants a divorce. Until he ever tells me different, I need to believe that is what he wants.
I know MLC is so confusing. I have to keep on thinking of me. I am just putting it out there, if the MLCer begins to act nice, don’t assume anything unless they tell you.
Update: He left yesterday morning, I had no idea if he was going to be gone for the day or if he planned on coming back for food.
It ended up he had to work. When he came home, I was prepping to put things in the oven. So I just said, we are eating in about and hour, will you be joining us (me and D) he surprised me and said yes.
When food was ready, he actually came and sat with us. He put the tv on something he was interested it (we were casual since just three of us). He commented he liked the food and he actually again seemed like normal H. He even inquired as to what my family was doing since we normally spend the day with them.
When he was done, he announced he was going to bed.
I did have anxiety earlier in the day, thinking how rude he would not even tell me he was not going to be here, but it was for nothing. Last year, he skipped out to be with OW in her country.
Anyway, I hope all that celebrated yesterday had a good day.
Hi Friends,
It’s been about a month since I stopped by. Nothing new to report. H is hot and cold. I just do my own thing. For the holiday, I wanted to stop by and see my parents from a distance since we will not be hosting due to covid warnings. I asked him yesterday via text when he’d be home from work because I wanted to take some baked goods to my parents and he surprised me and said we would go today.
He held up his end and we went and had a nice visit outside on the patio, with mid seventies as the temp, it was pleasant. As soon as we were in the car to go, he was texting his friend and when we got home, they took off. He didnt return until 6:00 pm. It was just our D and I for dinner and she and I watched some movies and relaxed.
In this last month, he has continued to talk to me about money things. I am still the one who handles everything, and he has off and on spoken to me with little chit chat and at least once a week he has continued to bring home food for us. I do not speak to him about our R, yet I am polite.
I just wanted to journal this moment, as status quo has been a while.
I hope everyone enjoyed their day.
Season’s greetings PLC.
I am glad to read an update from you. I was wondering how you were doing.
Sounds like you are doing well. Let H run hot and cold. Let him chit chat, off and on with you. Continue to focus on you and keep living your life.
It is wise to remain away from discussions regarding R, and to remain polite. Kind and compassionate. H continues to brings food home and you continue to acknowledge.
I know the status quo looks somewhat at an equilibrium. Remember a MLCer’s progress is slow and mostly hidden internally. H taking off with his friend after visiting with your parents; so teenager-like, he is still growing up.
And of course you are moving and progressing as well. In case you don’t see your advancements like I see them. You’re doing really well my friend.
Did you get some nice gifts? From D (or H)? For D (or H)?
Mid-seventies sitting on the patio.
Here, it is -25C with a -37C windchill. Ain’t sitting anywhere outside except in my car with heated seats. Lol.
Take care.
D
Hi all,
Hope everyone has started the new year off on the right step.
I just had some journaling observations about H:
The week heading up to NYE, H worked overnights. He didn’t tell me, but did text our D and tell her. I only discovered he was working because I mentioned to her that I didn’t know if her dad would be home maybe she informed me he told her. He had been very teen like the weekend after Christmas, not wanting to be home.
New Year’s Day, he did not work, but stayed in the room with the door closed. On Saturday, he began cleaning out the garage, he continued today, also doing his sheets and clothes in the laundry. He has always been a neat person, but for the last 18+ months the garage has not been touched. He wandered in around dinner time, and ultimately ate in the other room with something else.
He’s just alone. He is still strong (online, at least) with OW2, his chit chat has disappeared.
I am just giving him space, it’s hard, but nothing new that I haven’t been working on since the bomb drop happened. Just writing it here to remind me.
PLC
Hi, PLC—how are things going for you and D in the new year?
Hi Cardinal,
Thank you for stopping by. This new year has been fine for D and I. She just found out that the temp job she landed in October, wants to extend her a full time job, so that is a weight off her shoulders.
I came on today, to post that I am feeling lost with H. I have seen actions around the home that I have not seen since before BD almost two years ago. I was encouraged by that. Also, when he comes home from work, he will now come in and pause to say hi to the dogs and if I am in the room, me.
But with this action encouragement, I still am 99 percent ignored. I am fatigued. We have been staying home, (live in LA county, so we have been in the epicenter of covid) so he will stay in the room. Periodically, he will eat what I make, and he still will bring home fresh baked breads.
I am embarrassed to admit that I saw some texts that I was texting him back before bomb drop, I was angry and hurt and really a nagging wife. He was already sleeping on the couch, (beds too small, dogs take up room, every challenge I responded) and I had had surgery. I had a text stating, “if you can’t stand to sleep in the same room with me, you can come check on me” this was literally three days before he left town and I believe, met OW1.
So with this reminder, I can see that his behavior was coming long before I realized what it was. It hurts.
I also, heard a podcast that some said, “why did I want to be with someone who didn’t want to be with me?” Does H love me and want to be with me? I don’t feel it. But with this thought, I think, “well, PLC, in the last two years, he has not made one effort to physically leave.”
So, limbo is it for me. I really am stuck, because I do love him and want a second chance.
Cardinal, how is your new year? I am sorry to lay all of this out here, I am just sad today.
PLC
Hello PLC
Sorry you’re feeling down today. (((Hugs)))
It is great news to see daughter has been offered full time employment. That is definitely a weight off her shoulders. Yay!
I am embarrassed to admit that I saw some texts that I was texting him back before bomb drop, I was angry and hurt and really a nagging wife.
You aren’t anymore. You’ve made changes. Ensured those changes were for you and made them permanent.
I am feeling lost with H. I have seen actions around the home that I have not seen since before BD almost two years ago. I was encouraged by that. Also, when he comes home from work, he will now come in and pause to say hi to the dogs and if I am in the room, me.
But with this action encouragement, I still am 99 percent ignored.
It is interesting to see actions that have been absent since BD. I understand the encouraging feelings that brings, and the feelings of being lost.
Being ignored 99% of the time - is being seen 1% of the time. It has to start somewhere.
Yes, things are in limbo for sometime before they shift. However, that shift starts to happen unseen and internally. Consider you own shift in attitude and outlook over the past two years. H’s transformation would be even more hidden and slower.
H is reaching out, now and then. Talking to the dogs, and even you. And still bringing bread. And he hasn’t made the effort to physically leave. All factual and positive. Very good stuff. Be patient and give H plenty of time and space. He needs to be the one to reach back - well actually reach forward. Right?
So, limbo is it for me. I really am stuck, because I do love him and want a second chance.
Continue moving forward.
Yep, limbo is difficult. One gets stuck on that which they focus upon. Focus towards your future.
A second chance is usually wanting a do-over. It is looking back and not towards the future.
Stuck because you love him. How are you stuck? You can love H and move forward, live your life, work your job, have fun, and such.
Stuck because you want a second chance. How are you stuck? You can move forward and have a second chance. In fact, a true second chance would only happen if you moved forward. Wanting a do-over is being stuck.
Live forward. Live the new and improved you. Demonstrate your altered, strong, permanent beliefs; you know, like not nagging. And do it for you.
If the future holds an opportunity for a reconciliation, it will be a new relationship. That second chance comes from letting go the do-over.
Perhaps H is slowly moving in the right direction. Great. You keep moving as well. No pressure. Time and space. Let him figure out that he does want you. It’s a tough path to walk my friend.
My XW has been absent for over three years. I so wanted a second chance too. Then I realized I had a second chance - and took it. There are two second chances, one of which we don’t see for a while. Even though it is right in front of us.
... because I do love him and [I] want a second chance.
... because I do love him and want [us to have] a second chance.
The first is your life and changes and values. The core of yourself. Finding your way. Saving yourself. It’s
your second chance at your life. This is the chance we don’t recognize. Embrace it. Fully. Fearlessly.
The second, second chance is a bonus. And the first one must happen for the second to have a chance.
D
Hi PLC. Do your own thing. Limbo is a tough place to be, especially during covid with the tough restrictions in your county. (I have f&f there). Do you, be cordial, and let him be. Don't read into anything, you go batty.
"Do I want to be with someone who doesn't want me?" I said this to a friend today. And that was part of my situation. No. Why would you? You can care/love for someone sure, but being in love... you know. We all know. Don't settle for what was.Build yourself up and see where that takes you.
Hi All,
Well things are the same here. H has made no effort to move out and there are times when he starts speaking first for just day to day conversations.
He is still greeting the animals now when he comes home and he will more often then not, greet our daughter. If I am in the room, he does speak hello to me as well.
I am just going to keep on living my way. I will continue to be cordial and open as needed.
PLC
Good Morning PLC
This is good. A slow running stream, instead of the torrent of a fast paced river. Be cordial, kind, and go with the flow.
H has made no effort to move out, and even opens up a bit now and then. Allow H to float along at his pace, while you continue to live your life. Keep doing what you’re doing.
D
Thank you Dnj,
I do get moments of distress, and I stop and really look at the situation. We all know it is hard, but as each day passes, I ultimately am glad he is still here and that he does interact once and a while.
Living in Los Angeles County, covid is FINALLY beginning to not have as high of numbers. We are still not eating at restaurants and still staying home most of the time. I am surprised that H is doing the same, so he is here on the weekends. With him being home, get this, he heard me pull up from being at the market, and he came out to help bring in the groceries. I remember to always thank him for whatever effort he makes. If I am too chatty he does retreat, but it doesn’t last long. It used to be like an over correction where he would shut down for days.
I continue to work on me. That’s the only thing I can update!
PLC
Good Morning PLC
Yes, the only thing we can actually control, change, or update is us. Our thoughts, our actions and reactions, and our outlook of the world.
I look back on my situation and “it” hasn’t changed. XW is still the same. However, I am not. So, with accuracy, my situation did change. My view changed, well I changed my view. Same external inputs, same external events, yet different outcome and viewpoint.
We are part of our situation. We are embroiled within it. We can never escape it - for it is our life. That is acceptance; finding peace within the storm. A peace that calms our storm, whilst our spouse’s storm rages.
Living a good life obviously affect us. It also influences those around us; our kids, parents, friends, colleagues, the checkout gal at the grocery store, and so on.
We might even influence our spouse. That depends a lot upon them. We have zero control over them or anyone really. That’s the beacon part of things.
A lighthouse is. It just is. Its light shines for all who will look to it, and have the good fortune to be in proximity of it.
H is still at home. H is even helping carrying in the groceries. He has the opportunity and good fortune to be within the beam of a caring lighthouse. Maybe, slowly, he will make the most of that. That is up to him. And his path is a convoluted one, full of fears and past torments.
It is good to thank H for his sincere helping out with things. He does shrink away from too much positive reinforcement, as you’ve seen. And you, correctly, have adjusted for that. At times, he is a lost little boy, or an angry teenager, or a hurt desolate man. He is a lost soul. One which is learning how to reach out - even if it only looks like carrying groceries.
His path, like ours, is internal. Perhaps his view will shift as well.
Keep living well. Work and build upon yourself. H’s path is up to him. Your path is up to you.
Shine bright.
D
Hi Dnj,
Well, I spoke too soon. H has retreated back into his sanctuary of our D's bedroom. A few times this week I never even saw him. The times I have, is usually dinner time and he meanders into the kitchen and me being me, will ask if he cares to join us, then as a teen, he responds with asking what I am making. If it sounds good, he says yes, if not no.
I spoke with my IC this week and I explained how I am having a hard time dropping the rope in one situation; I want to redo some things around the home. I know it is silly, but part of me worries if I do, he might think I have moved on and he cannot come back, but the other part of me knows nothing I do will change his mind, this is all him.
My IC also told me that I deserve pretty things. We have lived in the same home for almost thirty years and although there have been little fixes here and there, it has been a while. I would like to shake things up a bit, but I also do not want to spend a bunch of money, if I need it down the road.
He has stated I would get the home and why not fix it up while with two incomes?
On a positive note, my IC stated that I am doing very well at being non reactive to the behavior he displays.
So a little positive with the negative. So I am again going to work on what I can control. We expect some nice weather here over the weekend, so maybe I can get out safely and do something.
PLC
Good Morning PLC
...he meanders into the kitchen and me being me, will ask if he cares to join us, then as a teen, he responds with asking what I am making. If it sounds good, he says yes, if not no.
Teenager mentally. Just respond “ok”. And let him sit in his room.
I want to redo some things around the home. I know it is silly, but part of me worries if I do, he might think I have moved on and he cannot come back, but the other part of me knows nothing I do will change his mind, this is all him.
I do understand what your feeling. I wouldn’t call it silly, although I do know what you mean by that.
Your feelings are real. And like all feelings, my included, they are within the realm of irrational, as in not logically based. As you stated “I know it is silly”. Our knowing and our feeling are oftentimes different views. Treat them as such.
Getting passed your feelings of worry of what he might think doesn’t happen by dismissing those feelings. Labeling them silly actually reinforces them. Intellectually they are silly, but that turns out to be counterproductive. Instead look at those feelings and worry from an intellectual stand point and discover why you feel that way. That understanding is the underpinnings of emotional intelligence - the why of feelings. It is an intellectual understanding of the irrationally driven emotional realm.
Both views, intellectual and emotional, are true. And you can throw in the third your spiritual value belief based view as well, another true and valid viewpoint. None of these has, or even should have, complete and absolutely dominance over you. Each viewpoint shows you something. Peace and serenity comes when all views are aligned; when the “cars” are side by side.
Of all these views, intellectual is the one you can control. The others are influenced. Our control also extends to the physical, our actions and reactions. This control also influences the others.
I am having a hard time dropping the rope in one situation; I want to redo some things around the home.
Why?
The answer will probably surprise you. Irrational ties usually do. The rope you are hanging on to; you have a reason, you just haven’t understood it yet.
However, dropping the rope doesn’t require full understanding, in fact the emotional understanding results from the influence from the controlled action of the dropping. In this particular case, that action is more than just emotional and intellectual, there is a physical component to it, which makes it so much better and reinforcing - Redo some things around the house. It’s a bit of a convoluted counterintuitive path at first go. Simply put - Act as if. (Your feelings and understanding will catch up
)
I deserve pretty things. We have lived in the same home for almost thirty years and although there have been little fixes here and there, it has been a while. I would like to shake things up a bit, but I also do not want to spend a bunch of money, if I need it down the road.
I’ve take the liberty of striking through the part that is justifying your inaction and reinforcing your worrisome feelings.
PLC, yes, you do deserve pretty things. Give your home a lift. Maybe it doesn’t require a complete make over, a few new lamps, furniture, some paint, cupboard doors, a new tub and shower, whatever you want. This is a more wants than needs. This is the fruit of your life’s work, enjoying some well earned comforts.
Of course, don’t go spending all your savings
. However, worrying that you might need it down the road is looking towards a possible divorce. That is wise. And no reason to remain static and unchanging. Which is even wiser. Again both are valid and can, and do, exist simultaneously.
Tell me what you would like to do with your house. Imagine it. Describe it. That is the first step to making it a reality.
he might think I have moved on and he cannot come back
Fear paralyzed us. Holds us static and unchanging.
Updating your house might push H out the door. Or it might push him to see you are moving on AND he needs to get his act together before he loses you. Or something completely different. Or nothing at all. I don’t know that part, no one does. I do know you’d have made a pretty house.
And by the way, fear is always about us.
“he might think I have moved on and he cannot come back” isn’t about H and his thoughts - it’s about your’s. You fear you will move on and not want him back. Your statement is true, it’s the why, the viewpoint that is hidden.
A fear, a worry about a possible future change in feelings. Your feelings will change, feelings do. Feelings are fleeting. Control your thoughts. Find and follow your beliefs. And dress up your house along the way. It’s all about standing for you.
D
I agee w/DnJ. I would go ahead and make some changes, even if they are little ones. You deserve to have your home looking the way that you want it to look and it's time to do something for yourself. You don't have to go "nuts" and redo the entire home, but maybe start w/your bedroom. Change the color scheme or move the furniture around and once that room is done, then you can think about changing another room, one by one.
As for asking him about dinner, the next time...allow the aroma of what you are cooking reveal itself to him. Then, if he asks about it, tell him. Sometimes, we have to just step back a wee bit and allow them to come to us. Right now, he's a teenager/roommate. If he wants to eat, he'll let you know. In fact, he may say no and then later sneak out to eat some of that delicious food that you had fixed.
Bottom line, you need to do what makes you happy. If redoing a room does it for you, then do it. Try to remember, that no matter what you do, you can't predict what his reaction will be. You have nothing to fear but fear itself.
Your journey is all about you and rediscovering you!
PLC, I hope you are able to get outside and do something fun. And wise words, DnJ & Job! I have nothing productive to add except I agree whole-heartedly.
PLC, I agree with everyone. Even small changes can be so nice. I remember thinking last fall--should I really plant these tulip bulbs in the yard? Should I really spend money on more flowers? Will I be here in six months? Etc. Well, the tulips are coming up now, and when I saw the first bit of green poking through the soil, it gave me so much joy. I hope you can make some changes that bring you joy too!
Thank you all. Yesterday, I went to visit my sister from the curb. Just a quick hello, but I got out. Today, D and I drove with no destination in mind. We ended up in a nice area of Los Angeles and went to an estate sale in a huge mansion. It was fun to walk the rooms and see what was available. After that, we took a drive up to Griffith observatory, we were not alone in that destination, a lot of people were out in the sunshine. It was nice to see masks and that people were adhering to keeping six ft apart. After that, we drove some more and came home.
H was out, I saw on social media he was at the beach with friends. It made me sad, he would have had fun with us girls. But, this is his choice. When he came home, no greetings to either of us, he just went into the room and closed the door. I realize, I would have been so upset had I stayed home. I am so glad to have gotten out.
Cardinal, I will take your advice to heart. I will do some things around here that bring me joy.
I wonder if anyone who had a IHS, ever wondered if the person instigating was thinking against a D. Almost two years ago, he put me on this path and here we are still under the same roof. If so, how did they realize this and what did they do?
I obviously don’t want a D, and I would love to begin a new relationship together, but will I know? Will he approach, or will this be something I have to approach him and ask, if this is something he still wants?
I’m just tired.
PLC
Nothing has changed with H, but after almost two years of this, I have had a mental awakening of sorts.
I (to my knowledge) have been GALing, I have an IHS and I have not done laundry or made meals with him in mind for a long time now. He is a roommate. I had a bad day on Sunday, and I don't know what was so different, since he is still the same MLC man. But anyway, that night I really prayed and I asked for help.
Later, I was reading through the posts here and found a response that Sandi had given to someone. Nothing new, after two years, we know what we are supposed to do, but at that moment, it was like a lightbulb moment. I realized some of the things that I have been hesitant to do around here and do FOR ME need to be done.
I went to bed in a peaceful mood.
Monday was a regular workday and not a lot of any interaction.
Today, I woke up and I feel amazing. I had my IC by the phone and when she asked how I was doing and I said "great" she even responded "really?" I can say, maybe there was a further dropping of a mental rope, but I feel good.
I have really been focusing on the length of this marathon, it is daunting. I think of the things I take care of here and I know he is a grown man, but i also know things like taxes, cooking, grocery shopping (for other than frozen snacks) he leaves to me. He has an expensive hobby that I would assume wanting a D, he would sell so he can buy somewhere to live, but he is doubling down by readying for the upcoming season.
H would have to move out of the country to be with OW2, he could, but he would more than likely need to sell the items to afford that change. I also think if OW was here, I might think differently.
Anyway, anyone out there that is struggling today, take a deep breath. You will be ok, I know I will.
PLC
Wait - so he spends so much of marital funds on his hobby that it could fund a new home???? What do YOU spend money on?
No, this has been accumulated over years. He had sponsors and if he sold, it would be to pay “us” back for bonuses he kept and then he could buy something small not in the area our house is in.
I am not a spender, per se, never had been. My spending plans are some things for the home and travel as soon as we are safe to do so.
I am actually pricing things and am making a list of things I want, and budgeting to do them.