gathered some old posts.....hope they help

When you start out on this journey, it is about your marriage and your spouse. But really and truly, YOU are the most important thing in all this. Your feelings, your spirit, your drive, your beliefs. Dbing is about saving yourself, and sometimes it saves marriages.

As you go through all the stages of grief over what your marriage once was, you begin to realize some things and that is when the growth begins.

I think we can all say that our marriages weren�t perfect. No marriage ever is.

So, looking within is where you start. You need to think about the things that need changing.

While none of us wanted this, none of us saw it coming; we are given an amazing opportunity. We get to start anew. We get to go back to thinking about who we are and what we want.

When we begin to make changes, slowly at first, with trepidation, trying on this new person, it is scary. And then, eventually we become who we were meant to be.

We should learn that no one can make us happy and it must come from within. When that happens, the real healing begins. We can�t really love someone else, until we love ourselves.

When I began this, I wanted to make a roadmap. I started to think about some questions I wanted to ask myself. What did I want to see when I looked back? Who did I want to see? What did I want to show my son?

I knew I wanted to be able to look myself in the mirror and know that I did everything possible to save my marriage. I wanted to be able to say I acted with dignity, courage, strength and grace. I wanted to see that I had grown and changed. I didn�t want to fail at this opportunity of showing my son how to get through life�s tough parts. I wanted to know that I did nothing to interfere with my son's relationship with his father. I knew I was not responsible for their relationship, but, I was responsible to cause no harm to it.

So, with this roadmap, I figured out how to move forward and detach. I learned to believe in me and I knew that I trusted in Him. I knew because of that, I would be ok.

I learned that the hardest part in all this is in letting go. But, that is the greatest act of love. It doesn�t mean you are giving up. It doesn�t mean you do not care. It is saying that you hear your spouse; you honor their feelings, and cherish them enough to lovingly allow them to walk their journey.

With that mindset, you begin to detach so that their actions and words do not affect your actions and words. You are allowing them to live their life, and figure themselves out and you are allowing yourself to do the same.

When it is time, the hope is that no matter what, you come to a place of forgiveness. That is so important. You do not want to carry that anger and bitterness around with you forever. It saps your energy. It weighs you down. Forgiveness is a way to honor your relationship, your marriage. It is an acceptance of what is and the letting go of expecting something different.
My friends, I know how devastating this is. I know that it is a pain which you have never known before. I know that you feel lost and powerless. Please know you will not always feel that way. You will get through this. You will be ok. You will come out the other side stronger and wiser.

Believe it.

I have been here a long time. I have seen marriages restored and marriages irretrievably broken. I have seen people become who they were meant to be and those who never quite become whole.

This journey you are on, this process, is very hard. You did not ask for it. God knows, you may wish it never happened. But we do not ever know what is going to happen in life. We think we have it all mapped out in our heads. It rarely goes that way.

So, when we are given a challenge like the one we have been given, there are a few ways we can go.

We can give up, cut our losses and move on.

We can fight with all we have until we cannot any longer.

We can learn and grow and become who we were meant to be.

We can accept that life sometimes is really tough or rail against the devil and blame him.

The thing to remember is this. We, all of us, may sometimes feel like we have no choice in this and blame it all on our spouse or ourselves for that matter.

But we pay a huge price when we do that.

We do not look inside. We do not do the work. We continue to blame whomever we blame.

We sell ourselves short when we do that. We lose an amazing opportunity when we do that.

We miss out on taking control of us and OUR life.

And in reality, that is the only thing we have control over.

So, yes, this succks. It really does. It's hard and it's heartbreaking. But it is also so powerful.

When we begin to understand that we have control over our part of the journey - whether we quit or not, whether we grow or not, whether we accept or not, man, what power we have. What an opportunity we have, what great lessons we can learn.

When it gets really tough, take some time, back away, regroup, find some peace in whatever way you can at that moment.

When you are ready, get back on your path. Dig deep, find your footing, stand strong.

We have power in all this.

We have choices we can make. We can choose how to behave, what to feel, how to love.

I will tell you this. No matter what happens, you will not regret that you stood if you do the work.

You will not regret that you were someone who loved so much you were willing to let your spouse go.

You will not regret that when you realized you could do it no more, you were able to look back and see that you acted with dignity and courage and strength.

This is a journey you were meant to go on. I believe that with everything I have.

I was thinking today about my friends here and I wanted to share my thoughts regarding an OM or OW.

Those of you who know my story, know that there was an OW.

I remember how crushed I was to find that out. It was mind numbing, really. I felt like someone had reached into my heart and squeezed it as tight as they could.

But I also remember what I promised myself at the start of all this. That I would always act with dignity.

And so, I did not have any contact with her.

I knew her from H's past. She was his first GF many years ago.

She was very smart, well educated, and married.
I remember for a brief moment thinking what does she have that I didn�t?

Then I realized, she did not have anything that I lacked. But I had many things that she lacked. She did not have my character, my heart, my compassion. She did not have my morals, my dignity, and my strength.

She did not even have my h, not in any real sense. She had a shell of a man, a broken man, a man who was lost and in crisis. She was, quite simply, a band aid.

So, I made a decision not to give her any of my headspace. She was not worthy of it.

Their affair was a house of cards, built on lies and deceit. There was no substance, no respect, and no character. It was two broken people looking for a life raft in the middle of a hurricane and a tsunami.

You cannot have a relationship sustain where its foundation is the breaking up of a marriage.

I knew that it could not endure with all those things as its cornerstone. How could it?

And it didnt.

When I spoke with my xh about it sometime later, I asked him, "Did you really think that relationship was going to last?"

His answer, "No, I knew deep down it would not. I was hurting and wanted a quick fix. That was all it was, I know that now. During my affair, while the adrenaline was pumping, so, too, was the guilt. But I didn�t know how to fix it or me. And so, I didn�t."

So, my friends, do not give the OP any of your power. Do not give them any of your headspace. Do not give them any credence, because they are not worthy of it.

Remember who you are. Remember what you are made of. Stand with dignity and remember that character and compassion and loyalty matter.

And they do not.

The feeling that you won�t get through this will go away.
Really embrace the fact that you did the best you could with the knowledge and tools you had at the time. Had you known better, you would have done better.
Own only your own stuff, let your spouse own theirs.
Your spouse is in a life crisis. It is their journey. Let them walk it. Your job is to get out of the way.
Any changes you deem necessary to make have to be real and for you. If they are not, it doesn�t serve you well and doesn�t help the situation.
Always act with dignity.
Use the feelings of anger you will have as a way to propel you forward. Feel them, and then let them wash over you and let them go. Otherwise it will weigh you down and sap your energy.
You may feel you need your spouse, but in reality, you don�t. You want them. There is a difference.
Never, ever get in the way of your children�s relationship with their other parent.
Your children are looking to you to show them how to navigate through life�s difficulties. What a gift you have been given. Make sure you show them well.
This journey is a wonderful opportunity to become the person you were meant to be � the very best you.
Forgiveness brings you freedom and peace.
And something so important � always remember that you are worthy. No one can take that away � except you.

I have learned that while there are many similarities in a MLC, there are also some differences.

Generally, though, the MLCer goes through some stages. Not all of them go through each one. Not all of them go through them in the same order.

They go in and out of them. Up and around again while trying to figure out their stuff.

They are trying to figure out what they want, who they are. They are trying to reconcile what behaviors will stay from before the MLC. What things they will keep from during the crisis. What do they want their lives to look like now?

They have to decipher and accept what brought them into the tunnel.

Because all this inner turmoil is happening, it causes them to sometimes revert back to some of the behaviors from the beginning of it all.

They need to reconcile what happened in that stage and then close the door on it.

It is normal for them to revisit a lot of it.

This really is the time for you to let them know you are around, but, let them see you are giving them a lot of space. This time is crucial. They are extremely fragile. They are working really hard.

It is all part of the process. It is all part of the journey out of the tunnel.

I know it is so hard to watch. I know that your first instinct may be to want to reach in and pull them the rest of the way out.

But, while you can be there guiding them from a distance, this part really has to be done by them. If it isn�t, they may need to finish it later.

So, hang in there. Remember how far you've come. You are getting closer to the finish line.

Now is not the time to quit. You can dig in just a bit more.

I truly believe that you all can do this.

I have absolutely no doubt at all.

My friends, I have seen many MLCs -on here and out there.

Several of them up close. I have spoken to those who survived a MLC and those who are still stuck.

I have seen marriages survive and marriages irretrievably broken. I have seen MLCers come out of it, and some who never do.

I have seen LBSers stand and not stand. I have seen some who wish they did and others who are glad they didnt.

The thing of it is this. I accepted that this was a crisis. I knew it without a doubt.

My xh had stood with me through some very difficult times. We had a history, a life.

And so, knowing these things, I knew that for me, it was important to stand.

I wanted to honor a long term marriage, my only child's father, my vows, and the man I had known and loved all those years.

I had my roadmap of how I was going to act. I accepted that I could not control what my h was doing, or whether or not he looks inside. I could only control me.

I knew I had work to do. I knew what I would be able to withstand and what I could not.

This path is personal to the individuals on it.

I will say that it is important not to lose oneself in it all. It is important to know when the cost is too great. It is ok when you cannot do it anymore. It is important to take care of you and to protect your heart.

It is also important to be true to yourself. It is ok to have hope, to believe, just as it is ok to feel worn down.

I will tell you that I do not regret what I chose. I do not regret who I have become. I do not regret that I loved so deeply.

We cannot fix them. But we can take this as an opportunity to look within. We can learn and grow and let go.

I want you to make your decisions based on your beliefs from a place of strength. I want you to understand that life gives us hard stuff sometimes.

And the ability to rise above them is a testament to the human spirit.

I understand and respect whatever decision one makes for oneself.

I want for all of you to be the best you can be. I want you to know without a doubt that it all matters, who you are, what you stand for.

I believe in love, honor and commitment. I believe you should say what you mean and mean what you say. I believe that you can do anything you want to if you try hard enough. I believe that some stories dont have happy endings. But, that doesnt mean you cant make your own.

I know my friends on here struggle with understanding all this.

I get why they do. It is craziness, this crisis.

To see someone you have loved, have lived with, have shared a life and a history become someone so foreign, is so hard to understand.

And I know we are programmed to try to figure stuff out.

But sometimes in life, it just isnt possible unless it is happening to you.

You can sympathize with someone who has cancer, but, cant possibly know what it feels like to have it.

You can ache for someone who has lost a child, but, cannot feel the depth of their pain unless you have, too.

And that is ok, you know. It is ok to say I just dont get it, dont understand it, cant get my mind around it.

It is not a weakness in you, a lacking in you that you cant.

Sometimes things simply are what they are. And we just need to accept that.

When someone has cancer or has lost someone, you have empathy; you have compassion, regardless of whether or not you can completely feel their particular pain.

These loved ones who are in crisis, deserve that as well.

It doesnt give them a free pass, not at all. But we love them, and so, we should try to feel for them.

There is plenty of time in the future to figure out how you will deal with the fallout if they come through this.

Plenty of time to decide if you can forgive, what you need, what you want the relationship to look like if it comes to that.

Sometimes it is best to live in the moment. Sometimes it is ok to just accept what is at the time.

So, do your best for as long as you can. Honor your long time relationship the best way you know how.

Remember your life story with them.

Live your life, take it one day at a time, and accept what is right now.

I was about you all on here today while I was flying a kite with my kiddies at work . It was
such fun, so wholesome, freeing, light.

Anyway, I got to thinking about how life should be like that. Light, peaceful, freeing, fun.
That should be the goal. - to have those feelings at some point in a day or a week.

To be totally free of all this, all these thoughts, these feelings for awhile.

To find the beauty in the simple stuff. To enjoy a laugh, a walk in the park, a sunset, a hug.

That is really what life is all about, I think. Those moments.

And that led to me thinking about all this.

I feel that this crisis is going to play out whether we like it or not.

We can decide to ride it out or not. We can decide to be bitter or not, angry or not.

All our choice.

So, since it is going to happen regardless, continue to move forward in your life. Continue to grow and change and love.

Time is passing anyway.

Worrying will have absolutely no affect on the outcome. But, letting go, moving forward, and making changes can.

And if they dont, well, it will be time well spent.

While this is probably one of the most difficult things you will ever face, you will survive it.

If you are unsure what the future holds, well, it holds you.

There are no easy answers, no short cuts, no magic pill. Trust me on that.

But there is you. Always you.

As you are all at different parts of your journey, I thought I'd share some thoughts.

In the beginning, when you are blindsided, distraught, filled with hopelessness, it is too hard to see what you need to see.

So, you just try to get through the day, the hour, the minute. And that's ok. This is a shock to the system.

Then when you get your footing a bit, you hopefully start to feel a little less unsteady.

If you choose to walk this difficult path, you have to really believe that you will be ok, that you will feel happy one day again, because if you dont, you stay stuck. When you begin to detach, and let go of the anger and sadness, you begin to move forward.

And I am sure you have said to yourself, there goes UR again, telling me to detach and let go. Easy for her to say.

I wanted to tell you that I get that it isnt. I get it because I have been exactly where you are. I get it because I fell so many times, and I backslid and I was filled with despair. I came kicking and screaming into db.

Many 2x4's later, many tears later, many prayers later, I began to get it.

It is a mindset, you know. A choice, this letting go. It is a prayer to your spouse, to the universe.

It is saying that I hear what you are saying, I see that you are hurting, I understand that you need to do this. And I love you enough to let you.

It is in the holding on by us, that can stop the forward motion in them. They cannot be free to take those steps, if they are looking over their shoulders.

An amazing thing happens when you finally do let go. They feel lighter, but, so do you. You are no longer bound by their actions or their words. You are no longer tied to their emotions. And so, you are free to find your path, your voice, your strengths.

So, I wanted you to know I feel your fear, your questioning of the process, your anxiety, your sadness. I feel it because I've felt it to my very core.

That is my prayer for all of you. That you get that it is ok to detach and let go. It doesnt mean you dont love them, it means you love them very much.

Sometimes you just have to take a leap of faith and learn to believe that you love and honor the relationship enough to want your spouse to be happy, in spite of what may happen.

But what it really says is that you honor you, and trust in you, have faith in you. So much so that you are willing to do the work, find your way, become who you were meant to be. And that maybe, you will find your way back to each other. And if you don�t, you will be ok.
I think that we should just do the very best we can. And maybe, if we are very lucky, happiness and peace comes from knowing we did.

You know I have had some pretty crappy stuff happen in my life
Yet every day I choose to find a reason to laugh. I find a reason to feel blessed; a reason to appreciate what life has to offer.
You can choose to look at the bad side of stuff or the good side. You can choose to see all the good things in your life or all the bad things.

Your choice.

The thing about having a negative outlook is that it doesn�t serve you or your sitch well.

The way I figure it is this. All that stuff in my life that isnt good, is going to be there either way. I can add to the misery or find a way around it. I can let it get to me or rise above it.

I know that if I allow it to change me. If I allow it to beat me, I lose me. And that is not an option.
I can live in the past. I can feel sorry for myself. I can blame other people.
But that gives the power to someone else, something else.
And I am unwilling to do that.

I get to choose my life, my heart, my thoughts, my happiness. And each and every time, I choose me.
The choices we make, the stands we take, the lives we touch and love, all matter. It all matters.

I get how you are feeling and thinking because I felt and thought the same things.

I thought if I could keep telling him I want him and I want to work on our marriage enough times, that this day would be the one when he would say, Ok, Ur, I feel the same way.

Until it didnt happen.

The thing of it is this. There are reasons why your spouse feels the way he or she does. Some of them are true, some not, but they are their feelings so they are valid to them.

When you keep on telling him the things you do, you are invalidating his feelings. You are telling him, I know the words you are saying, but they are wrong, because I want you and I want to work on the marriage. Doesnt matter what you want or what you feel, it only matters what I feel.

I get the hanging on for fear that they will move away if you dont. But picture someone holding onto your pants leg as you are trying to move away. You keep shaking your leg to get them off, but, they wont go. So you shake harder and move further away, all in trying to stop them from hanging on.

When you db, you are saying, I hear you. I hear that you are saying you dont want to be married, you dont know how you feel, etc. I hear you. You dont have to agree with it, but, you do have to respect their feelings.

When you make changes it means you heard them. When you give them space. You heard them.

You also give them the opportunity to think. They arent hearing the noise of your words, because that is what it is to them at this point.

When they have time to think and they feel heard and they see changes, it gives the best opportunity for them to look towards you.

I was where you all are. I remember the hurt, the pain, the sadness, the anger, etc.

Mine was a 30 year relationship. He was my family. My first real love, my only child's father.

And when all this happened, I remember thinking, my life, my past, my future, was torn away.

I thought, there is no way I can survive this. I will never feel happiness again.

I went through the stages of grief - disbelief, anger, sadness, etc. And some other stages, too. Feeling rejected, resentful, and betrayed.

I allowed myself to feel them all. Worked through them all, for as long as I needed to. But I felt stuck.

So, I started to think about my sister burying two babies and my friend whose young child had brain cancer. I thought about the atrocities that women and children suffer around the world.

And I realized I can survive this. I can. I have to. There is no choice. I had a son who depended on me; who was watching me. He was leaning on me and learning how to get through life.

What did I want to show him? What did I want for me?

Deep down, I knew I would survive. I had survived a great many really difficult things. But, I wanted to be able to do more than just survive all this.

So, I had to really see why I was hanging onto a lot of it.

Because I knew if I continued to hang onto it, it would stop me from moving forward.

I knew that anger was holding me back. I was angry at him, at her, at MLC. And that was ok, for a time. But I realized that remaining angry at him or her was not going to change anything. But it was changing me. And I was no longer willing to sacrifice myself.

The Ow didnt care if I was angry, neither did my h. So, what was the point of continuing to hold onto that? That was just giving her my headspace and both of them my control.

And I also thought, what if, God forbid, he had passed away?

I would have been devastated, yes, but, eventually, I would have picked myself up and lived my life.

So, I knew it was the feelings of rejection and betrayal that were the real rocks around my neck.

I thought a few things. One, that he was in crisis. And two, that those feelings werent serving me well.

I was wearing them like a shield. Using them to stop what was needed to get in. And that is acceptance. Doesnt mean I have to like it all. Doesnt mean I have to understand it all. But I did have to accept it.

And when I did, it lead me on the road to forgiveness. That is ultimately where one needs to be.

If you can accept that this is how things are right now, with the understanding that they will not always be this way, you are on your way.

I think it is important to know that your spouse shouldnt complete your life. They shouldnt be responsible for your happiness. What a terrible burden to put on anyone.

They should enhance your life.

I remembered that there were days when I was angry, sad, disappointed and upset in my marriage. I think everyone can admit that.

And so, there are days that are like that in my life. But there are days of great joy and happiness.

There are no guarantees that life is going to be what you want it to be. And sometimes, stuff happens.
It is all how you handle plan b that makes all the difference.

Life is about growth and change. It's about accepting its rewards as well as its challenges. It is about having hope and understanding that we really do not know how its going to turn out. And that's ok. Because we can survive and thrive and learn. We can feel love and sadness, happiness and hurt. Its all a part of it.

But what we shouldnt ever do is accept that we are not worthy of experiencing it all.

No matter how your sitch turns out, whether you reconcile or not, celebrate the fact that you have survived, you have grown and you have lived your life in the best way you know how.

I wanted to write about boundaries
A good friend of mine wrote these and I know he wouldn�t mind if I reposted them.

Think about , very specifically, what you want boundaries on.

List them out and read them (aloud) to yourself. Sometimes reading them aloud will give you a new perspective on them. If they sound funny , then find out why they do,because they might not be a boundary that you need to relay....

Make sure, 100%, that your boundaries are NOT for you to "punish" in any way...

Watch how you deliver them. Make sure that you word them without coming across as controlling.

Closely examine the words "you", and "I" . Anytime one uses those words, there is a strong chance of using guilt, or blame.

"Always" and "Never" are words that can make us hypocrites....try to stay away from them as well.

Make sure that YOU feel good about saying them, and they are only to protect your emotional being, or physical in some cases.

Make sure that you are willing to die on that hill. Meaning is it worth it to even state them.

Do NOT overstate them. Say what you want ONCE, and rest on that. Don't explain yourself, you have your reasons, just like they have theirs.

Then you need to back away, and live with those boundaries, and let them live with them. They will cause them to spin a little, but that isn't your problem now.

Use tact, not anger. Tact was described to me as telling someone to go to hell, and they look forward to the trip.

Be the person that you want to be, regardless of what happens. You are setting a boundary, not to induce a reaction, but regardless the reaction.

As you travel through all this, you will come to realize that you are grieving. Grieving the loss of your marriage, your spouse, the life you thought you were going to have.
Even if you reconcile, it will be a different marriage. They will be different, and so will you.
So, it is important to feel each stage of grief in order to move towards acceptance.
You don�t want to get stuck in any stage. And I feel, in particular, the anger stage.
Don�t get me wrong, it is healthy to feel angry. And you should use the anger to propel you forward. Use it to make changes, to figure stuff out.
It is when you remain angry that it becomes unhealthy.
Because holding onto it weighs you down. It becomes a shield and takes away your ability to see the rest of your journey.
After some time, I realized that anger wouldn�t change the situation. But, it would change me. And I was not willing to sacrifice myself.
I had to decide to change my mindset. I had to realize that the anger wasn�t going to allow me to move to acceptance.
Accepting that this is how it is right now, but, knowing that it doesn�t mean it would always be like this.
I know there are those who struggle with their anger towards the OP. I so get that. But here�s the thing. When you release your anger against them, it is the first step towards controlling your own life. It is you saying, I am better than this. I am in control of me and my life. I get to choose how I am going to live it.
The goal should be that anger is not the driving force any longer. It served its purpose, it helped you cope, moved you forward. But it should not be a permanent part of your life.
The hope is that when you release the anger, you are on the path of forgiveness
Forgiveness is a decision to let go of resentment and thoughts of revenge. The act that hurt or offended you might always remain a part of your life, but forgiveness can lessen its grip on you and help you focus on other, positive parts of your life.

Forgiveness doesn't mean that you deny the other person's responsibility for hurting you, and it doesn't minimize or justify the wrong. You can forgive the person without excusing the act.
Forgiveness is for you.

Thank you so much for all of these! Very valuable words and I'm going to bookmark this page when I need a reminder of my worth.

Very beautiful words, uR. u R truly an angel.

As always uR, your thoughts and words are inspirational!

Thank you Ur.

Thank you for posting this.

Thank you for everything that you have posted to me as well.

You've been here with me since the beginning of my mess and I truly appreciate it all.

.....even the 2x4's.

Tad

Hey SBR, Jersey, Pud,and NLT, thank you for your kind words. I am glad if this helps in some small way.

Hi Tad, you are very welcome. You will get to where you need to be when you are ready. I know it without a doubt.

Hey there

I have been reading your words for quite some time now, sometimes over and over till they really settle in.

You get it, all of this MLC madness.

You are several years post bomb, but you still understand how devastating that is.

We are all at different parts in our journey here, yet you always seem to know just what to say at each point. Every hurt, frustration, disappointment, moment of sadness or hopelessness, you are there to guide us along.

Thanks for this thread - now I'm gonna go read it again

uR.. thanks you so much for posting. You have truly helped so many people in their journeys. You are such an inspiration to all of us. How to stay strong, stay focused, enjoy life. You are a warrior!

Reading your posts have helped me stay strong and given me a lot of inspiration.

thanks,
-cp

<3

Oh T, you brought tears to my eyes. You are so kind. Thank you for your words.

Though it has been several years, I remember how I felt. And I remember the special people on here who were there for me, who pulled me through. I never forgot them.

I hope I help, as I was helped. I care a great deal about all of you.

CP, thank you so much for your kind words. I am so glad if I am able to help you through this difficult time.

It all matters, helping each other, rooting each other on, praying for each other.

Thank you all for letting me be a part of your lives. I am honored.

Thank you for sharing such a powerful message uR!! So needed this:)

Thank you for compiling these posts, uR. You have taught me the meaning of letting go and what it means to detach, and have been helping me to be able to live it. I remember you telling us that you are grateful for your H's MLC, and knowing all the crap he put you thru, thought uR, you are out of your friggin' mind!�

But I've started to feel that way too. MLC has given me the opportunity to see that there were many things about me that were bad, and which I have been able to change. Many mistakes I have made in my marriage which I will not make again.�

I woke up afraid, very afraid, uR. You know that a few days ago my H told me that a big reason he does not leave me for his OW is because he fears his mom would never accept OW and he does not want to lose his mom. Yesterday H spent the whole day with his mom. I know one reason was to feel her out on this subject.�

My MIL knows H is in a MLC, and has been mostly supportive of my efforts to stand. Sometimes she forgets and tells me to kick him out

But....she's his mom. What mom would not accept her son's new wife, even if she did not like her?�

I do not know what MIL said to him, but know that either OW's cause or mine received a big boost from her opinion. He returned cheerful, and acted perfectly normal, and this filled me with dread. �

So this morning I have been praying and suddenly remembered what you taught me about detaching. That we need to move forward, and not let our spouse's words and actions affect our feelings.�

And then I found this thread, and read all the things you wrote. About forgiving. About acceptance. How telling H that his crazy beliefs are not real or valid invalidates him. �About boundaries. About honoring ourselves and believing in ourselves and moving forward.

I cried while reading reading all that, but feel peaceful and calm, and accepting. Strong.�

"If you can accept that this is how things are right now, with the understanding that they will not always be this way, you are on your way."

i'm on my way.�So see, you were an answer to my prayer uR. God bless you.�

I wonder if this thread can be made into a sticky note? Do they still do that? It is a great reference.

Rosa, I am not grateful for his MLC as that caused a great deal of pain. I am grateful for my journey, though. I am grateful that I was able to look inside and deal with all my stuff. I am grateful that I have become who I know I was meant to be. Do I wish I could have done all that without going through all of this? Absolutely. But that is not how He wanted it to happen.

I do like to see that you wrote that there were things about you that were bad. You do not have a bad bone in your body. �And you did the best you could with the knowledge and tools you had. You are so hard on yourself, my Rosa. You love him deeply, you had his back, you took care of him.

I am so glad that you feel better, my friend. You will get through this. Trust in Him and yourself. You can never go wrong if you do.

You are on your way, RL. I am here rooting you on!

uR, Thank you so much for this post. I need to read and re-read these.
I have learned so much from you.

EDIT -Rosa, meant I do not like to see you write that there were things about you that were bad.

Lost, thank you for your kind words and glad if I helped in some way.

Hey CP, dont know if they still sticky note. Thanks for the thought.

This it TOTALLY sticky worthy!

Thanks Pud. Just hope it helps..

Wow! I had already read some of these, here and there, but when brought together in one post, they are very powerful. I am reading and re-reading! Thank you, uR! You have such a gift for sharing with others the wisdom you've gained on your journey. You are a strength to me so many times.

Thank you so much, Angela. Just paying it forward. You are doing great.

hey ur -

great stuff that probably everyone in the world needs to read EVERY morning.

and well put. didja ever think of writing a "survivor's guide to mlc? or life or whatever??? it doesn't have to be a huge book- one of those little things youpickup by the checkout- and then find yhou put where you sit every morning to thumb hru- think about it.

there is not alot of "good news" out there every day- but ten, as i say it- there is if you look for it isn't there?

it's all in the looking - the perspctive. i don't claim to be all "in total control" here. i have truly mastered the "getting thru a day" thing. i've really switched my perspective around about not worrying about the future. this mlc and of course, my mother's sitch - have taught me that we CANNOT KNOW what will happen tomorrow - we're lucky if we're still alive & cranking along- i'm grateful for that.

i can capture moments of pleasure- and enjoy some things that were all "black" in the beginning of this debacle - so glad of that. loosly i feel optimistic that someday i'll feell hapy and lucky again- like i used to. i always thought it was because of my r with h - i like being "connected". maybe tho, just maybe - it's because of who i am. i am not one to go around being miserable - don't believe in it. it feels mightry like a waste of my time and life-

I am never in fear that i'll die from this- anymore. the grief has subsided and mostly the ANGER just passes thru. not even so much tho- mostly i guess if i'm feeling something BAD it's frustration at his "blindness" - but then ii know it's out of myh hands - allllll THAT. how he'll act, what he's doing- just beyond my ken or conrol.

i YTHINK i'm detaching AS Best i can. there are whole days that go by without thinking of him when he's gone.

i try and figure what i'd do differently if i won a lottery- or met a wonderful man. those seem to be two big issues - love and money.

i think if i won the lottery i'd bedoing the same old thing. if i met a man- i'd explore that "friendshiip" and see what it was -

i'm not sure now that i say it out loud what that tells me. maybe i'm on the right road.

i'm not sorry i loved so darn un-stintingly. it was mighty nice - i felt loved - i love that.

i don't hate him and i don't wish he was dead - boy are you ever right about not being able to get your brain around (sometimes) this new diferent person inside the skin of the person youloved for sooooo long and shared soooo much with.

i'm bad at viewing it as "him in crisis". he may well be- when i picked up that book tht fateful morning- it seemed to figt like a glove - allll the syumptoms and what was going on.

it was the tip of the iceberg - maybe. maye not- i srugle alot with "figureing it all out" - then come to your conclusion that i just DON'T GET TO KNOW. it's going to be like that i think inh my life- just an unexplainable thing. a BIG THING- but never a sufficient understanding. like my fav sister dying from alcohol- sooooo much "stuff" atached to that for her and me- i will never ever truly be inside of it or her head. it's done and over tho- i don't go back there alot. can't and move forward too -

i'm thinking i'm geting acceptance here- somewhat anyway.

i do not havew total total total detACHMENT- i still wonder what he's doing sometimes - i still resent it when he's with her and she's got my companion. (yeah- i know - oh well huh?))

we had a nice trip- he is nice to me - i do n't want to be his sister or friend (only) - it's wierd. maybe tht is my "stuck" bit- the notion that at the end of the day i'm his big "it" in life - or i'm havin my own life somewhere else.

i still don't think it's a right action for me to tell him to get the heck out of my life and stay away. i am coasting along- he pretty much just does as he pleases. he thinks he's living alone - and trying to see what he wants.

i'd say my non-detachment comes when i want to sream at his head - well you jerk- you're "havin it all" and so what the heck do you want from me? go stinking have it it all - have her- hope she jumps on you, busts your spleen and you both die in a love-fest there on the bed. whattya want from me? i am not having fun, i didn't have the wisdom to stack extramen around in life in the sidelines - so i could shake one out and put him on when things got tough. i'm just puddlin thru on my own- i want to have fun too. [censored] to be me huh?.

i bite it back- i move on - i don't stew or be ratty. i'm pretty sick of "actin as if" but don't have anything else to get me by- so i do.

idk where i am, all things being considered. he hangs in here - paying bills - coming here (not enough for me- but hey) and doing whatever the heck he thinks he's doing with his life.

i'll tell you what i do not like and do not understand and i'm sure has some nmessage in it that i cannot fathom. this business of him having all the freedom in the world one would want (not married to me - no legal entanglement) and yet not walking out of my life or tossing me out of his.

he's got (at this moment - no kidding) 3.5 houses that hje owns out;right - he could easliy and most generously give me this stinking half of house- walk away- and be free. he has it within hispower at any moment in time to walk away free and clear with nary a glance over his shoulder. why not just f'ing do it- be free- quit making me even know.

neither of us can seem to totally cut the cord. he swears he doesn't want to ever marry anyone- he needs to be free. he keeps himself attached at all tijmes tho. im gthe persoj who always wanted a "group" to be attached to - i k now i'm a pack animal. he's equally attachie - even more than me- but thinks he's a "lone wolf" - i think i'm a bit less delusional aboutmy own addictions and flaws.

wtf - i am one confused dude- he is too. we're a real pair.

i tend to think in life - he is very good at looking afgter number 1 first - i was very good at overlooking everytghing in the universe becasue if i'm in love - i'm really nutty that way. i seem to put others first - it's nothing i hate aboutme necessarily- but i can see it sends a wrong message and is not a very good m.o. i'm not sayin i'm swell here- i'm saying i'm too easily influenced or - well, i'm too easy..

that is the thing about me i am having rouble scaling back from and making a change about. i still believe all the same things in life- but i additionally believe people are opportunistic and self- serving first and foremost and i need to factor that in a bit more in life.

it is not ALWAYS a good thing to be so egocentric i always think i can do it, i can take it, i can fix it - what in the world is that anyway??? and who the heck do i think i am? .

"didja ever think of writing a "survivor's guide to mlc? or life or whatever???"

uR, Nero has found the solution to your financial situation. You know how all of us feel that you would make such an excellent counselor, but you can't afford to go back to school right now? You can write this guide! I even know the perfect name for it: "You Are Worthy"! It would be a kazillion copy seller, uR! I am damned serious about this.

Thanks Nero!

I agree, uR is such a great writer with so much knowledge, not to mention courage and strength. I would buy your "You are Worthy" book in a heartbeat!

UrW,

You could even simplify it and make a daily affirmation or meditation book. Just positive writings to help keep up the PMA during a MLC crisis.

It would be the bomb!

Heather

P.S. We'd all buy it!! :-)

Those are some pretty good posts Darlin....

OMG, guys - Nero, CP, Rosa and Lois, you just made my day! Thank you so much for saying that. And no, I have never thought of writing a book. Oh goodness, I couldnt do that. But I so appreciate the vote of confidence. More than you know. Love you all.

My friend, Mach, thank you for writing that. I hope you know how much it means to me. You know how I feel about you and how much I respect your opinion.

Nero, my friend, I want you to know that I see who you are. I see the kind of person you are inside.
.

You are right, we do not know what tomorrow will bring. But, we can have great hope that it will bring something good. Or we could strive to enjoy what it brings.

I cannot tell you how happy it makes me to hear that you are capturing moments of pleasure and that you now see the possibility of true happiness one day. I most certainly think you are on the right road.

You should never feel sorry for how you love. It is who you are. And I think you're pretty great. You know, Nero, you will get to where you need to be when you get there. There are not timelines, no straight roads here. Everyone's journey is unique to them.

And you are right, he could just walk out of your life. He chooses not to and I think that is telling. If you are not ready or willing to remove him from your life, then you should not. As long as you are not getting lost in the process.

I know what you are saying about putting others first. I am the same way. But I have slowly began to learn, very slowly - LOL!, that it is ok to take care of me, too.

This is all a process, my friend. And you are looking within and hashing some stuff out. As long as you are doing that, you are moving forward.

I am so happy for you.

I was thinking today about acceptance and how that can help aid you in healing. We don�t have to like or agree with what is going on in our lives, but, we should accept that this is how it is right now. Doesn�t mean it will always be that way.

When we resist or hang onto what is happening, it forces us to act in a way that doesn�t serve us or the situation well. And so, we begin to live in fear. When there is fear, there becomes an inability to do or see what needs to be done.

I know all about fear. I lived in it most of my life. I allowed it to dictate my actions and my feelings. But, whenever I have faced the fear, and accepted what is, it lost its power. And all the things I thought was going to happen , never did.

I thought I would never get through this. I did. I thought I would hurt like that forever. I didnt. I thought I would never trust again. I have, I do. I thought I would not be able to survive on my own. I have.

I have learned to trust me again. I have seen my strength. I have looked fear in the eye and beat it down. Mostly. LOL!
I still struggle with it. That is the truth. But, I am not going to give into it. Too high a price to pay.

The sooner you accept that this is what is for right now, the sooner you can start to do what needs doing.
The truth is, that you will all survive this no matter which way it goes. You will be ok. And if you do the work, you will laugh again, love again, trust again hopefully with your spouse.

Do not let fear stop you from what you know you should do. Do not let it keep you stuck. Do not let it take away your power.

That's exactly what I needed to read tonight.

Thank you UrWorthy. Thank you. :-)

Heather

You're welcome, Heather. You are doing great!

yeah- fear- it's a creepy little bugger.

i wonder. iknow i'm a fearful person- well, was alot worse at other times of mylife. i guess that's the downside of being all "possessve" of what you have that you feel is SOOOOO IMPORTANT to you and your happiness.

the mere thought of loss- it squashes you rite down and all your gumption with it. . the good news i guess about the bad news is that you get squashed rite down into the turf - and then when you realize you're not dead - not likely to get dead- and in fact begin to pick up and get going again- it's something like "victory". knowing you have nothing left pretty muich to "lose" and you're not dead - and even laugh now or then. or alot- even if it's not good ole "happiness"laughing- even seeing the humour in your plight is something.

i keep thinking of an article that says even ifyou make yourself laugh - and it's fake as heck- your body releases something or another that helps you feel better. i'll take it- good ole fake attitude improvement- any improvement at all- real or fake.

no shame. that's me- no shame at all. that's what i like about the feeling like a human being rite there sholder to shoulder with every other person alive on the planet. may have more money or more looks or less of both- but we're allllll the same more or less under the skin - ta da!

i could sure be a good monk or cult member- i can honestly tap into it - that feeling of being all one...(

oh well-

ya know- i wasn't really kidding about the book thing. i have a tiny little book i picked up one morning in a book shop- three bucks or something. cutefunny drawings and maybe 25 or so pages- something like "just be yourself" kind of stuff. i don't even particularly like some of he little proverbs or "tru-isms" - but i love the book.

i went and got one for my neice - struggling sometimes with life, job, family, h ,anxiety & etc etc - alllll of the things we all do. she loved it- got one for her sister- got one for neice up here- one for her sister- somehow picking up that little thing- seeing one little "thought" that applies so well- and "reminds" me - makes me get up, dust yourself off and face another day.

no kidding- if you could distil it all into about 20 or so little "thoughts" think of allll the people who would pick it up on a bad ;morning (most of them lately) and just get their brain going down the rite trail with a thought that "united" them a bit- welllll.....

i love that kind of stuff- and mind control as well

think about it man- da da da dummmmmmm......

so- would you wear a disguise and a wig for your first interview with oprah???? would you need to be unknown? or just go for it- and bam it all out there in life as your real self???

xxoo thanks for sharing your stuff man- it makes such a dif to alot of us -

I just love you, Nero. Really and truly. I hope you know just how amazing and unique you are. You put a smile on my face whenever I read your posts.

Thank you so much saying that about me writing a book. Rosa is all over the idea. LOL!

The thought of helping people or touching their lives would mean so much to me. But I am not a writer nor do I think for a minute that anyone would read something I wrote. Nice dream, though.

And I think you know the answer to the Oprah question. I would just be me, thats the only way I know how to be.

I see that there are those of you somewhat new to this.

First let me say, I am so sorry you are going through it.

I used to write to someone and say I cant wait until they get to the good part. To which they would say, Um, UR? Are you crazy? LOL!

Dont get me wrong, I wish I didnt have to go through all this. I wouldnt wish it on anyone. But I dont think that the lessons I've learned, the changes I've made, would have been possible without this journey.

The most important thing to remember is that you will be ok. Carry that with you. When things get tough, pull it out. When you want to quit, pull it out.

And you will be, you know.

This MLC monster, is only as powerful as we allow it to be. I used to try to envision it as this big red ball that I carried around.

After awhile, it got heavy. It wasnt even my ball. It was his.
So, why the heck was I carrying it? I threw it back to him.

I needed to pick up my own ball. And I chose a pretty lavender one with flowers on it. And in my ball, was all the things I wanted to do, all the changes I wanted to make. It was heavy at first, to be sure. Because it was also filled with all the stuff I needed to sort through.

But each time I did, it became lighter. Every day that I got through, it became lighter. So that all that was left was all the good stuff.

Dont make that big red ball any heavier than it already is. Throw it back to him. Let him carry it.

You pick yours up. And fill it with all the things that make you happy. Fill it with dreams and hopes.

You only get this one life. This one chance. Dont be weighed down by someone else's stuff. Leave them to it.

You do yours.

uR,
That post has inspired me. Thank you for the visual imagery!

It's really helped me to see (!) how to detach and let the ever-present burden go.

I'm focussing on my ball - it's sky blue and sort of like a medicine ball at the moment - there's a lot I need to do. Hope it will soon be like one of those floaty beach balls.

Thanks so much for sharing your wisdom.

Hey NLW, you're welcome and good for you. Hope your balloon is in the air someday soon.

I have seen that we have some new folks here. I wanted to say sorry you are here, but, you have landed among some very special people.

I know the pain in the beginning. It is hard to breathe at times. Hard to concentrate, hard to get your mind around what has happened.

I want you to know it will not always feel like this. You will feel strong again, whole again, happy again. You will.

It will help if you do a few things. One of the best things you can do is to accept that this is happening. You don�t have to like it, you don�t have to understand it right now. But, the sooner you can just accept that this is your life at this moment, the sooner you can begin to heal.

If you fight against it, if you wish it wasn�t, you stay stuck. You cannot move forward holding onto all of that. That is just wasted energy. Energy better spent on you.

You must learn to forgive yourself. The way to do that is to remember that whatever you did or didn�t do in your marriage was never with the intent to cause harm to it or your spouse. You did the best you could at the time.

I know that you are going round and round in your head, thinking, if I just did this, if I just said that. You have to try to really believe that this crisis was supposed to happen. There was absolutely nothing you could have done to stop it. You just don�t have that kind of power.

So, there are a couple of ways you can go here. You can stay with the mindset that you are a victim and that there isn�t anything you can do while this is happening. You can do nothing and let the chips fall where they may or you can take this journey.

You have power in this. You have control in your part of this. And the best way to navigate through it is to become your strongest self. The only real way to do this, is through it.

If you do that, a few things happen. You become who you were meant to be. You show your children what it is to be strong and to overcome what life throws at you. You see what you are made of.

Dbing is about saving you. And sometimes it saves marriages.

They were supposed to have this crisis. They are broken and need fixing. But, that�s their part. They need to figure out how to do that. You cant hurry it along. You cant do it for them.

The thing about this for you is, what are you going to do while they do that?

I know I felt as you did. I was angry and sad and distraught. I thought I would never make it through it. I did.

I had to decide who I wanted to see when I looked back at all this. And I knew I wanted to see someone I could be proud of. I wanted to see someone of courage and strength and honor.
I did the work. I looked within. I changed and I grew. It was so hard. But I am glad I chose me.

Choose you. You will never be sorry you did.

Hey there my old friend

Hiya True. You found me.

You just brought the biggest smile to my face. How are you, sweetie? I so hope you are doing great! I think of you often and miss you.

True, so nice to hear your voice on here again.

Great post Ms Worthy

A Truegrit sighting???

What is up TG?

U were a major help/influence to me a while back. Thank you!!

hey hi-

thanks for giving a darn. there you are- sayin hi and wondering what's up- it's much much more than most people in life... no kidding. you give alot of inspiration...

have a wonderful day

xxo

I realize that I ruffled a few feathers here yesterday, and I am good with that.

I spoke of absolute truth in MLC, and what it meant.

The MLC forums have changed since I called this section home a few years ago....

And as I thought about it, I realized that the amount of powerful, insightful posts were different....

I want to share one in particular, that really helped me to see my path, and my role in understanding MLC...

I remember the feeling when I read this, the pain, the emptiness, the empathy , most of all ?

The hope that I gained when the light bulb came on.

God Bless you Doofus (Amy), and thank you for this once again...

; )

I think something else that should be pointed out is an MLCer MIGHT also pretty much stop talking to whomever they were closest to. They may get a whole new circle of friends. Or they might push everyone away.

I stopped talking to my sister, who has always been my best friend. But by the time that happened, I'd pushed my husband so far away he couldn't have known that was happening. We lived apart and I'd been out of touch with him for a long time except regarding the house or kids. There was ZERO communication with him unless I HAD to and I would go to great lengths to avoid that. I didn't like the man. I know now that what I really didn't like were the things he made me see about myself. We could have none of THAT! I should also note that when I stopped talking to my sister was when things were beginning to change INSIDE of me. I was getting the first inkling that my story (my rewriting of the marital history) wasn't going to hold water much longer. The cracks were starting to appear. That's when I stopped talking to EVERYBODY.

In my case, through the initial period of deep MLC which manifested outwardly between March '02 & March '04, I'd spun such brilliant BS that everyone thought I was right to want a separation/divorce. In March '04, my husband left for the second time. I'd gotten rid of om before that but was still trying to live it up. I was crashing hard and fairly regularly. I still managed for another year to outrun reality though it did creep in occasionally. My husband stopped fighting for me when he left the second time. That was the biggest jolt. It was good to have that pressure off for awhile though. By summer 2005, I was coming apart at the seams. Completely. I'd exhausted myself with the things of the world that had enticed me, I was looking at families and missing my own. For the first time, I started to see that there had been good times. I had REALLY forgotten them. There are still times as recently as a week ago that I'll remember something and mention it to my husband and he'll look at me as if to say "did you JUST remember/realize that?" and if I were to answer, I'd say yes. MLC stole a big chunk of the good things about my marriage. It seems I get them back a little at a time. But I FORGOT. I did not see us as my husband saw us.
So you (husbands of MLC wives) really are holding something precious that no one else has; you're holding the real truth about your lives together. You're the only one that's going to understand her when she comes back. You're all that's going to be familiar and if you're not there...

Anyway after a while, I started seeing how I had contributed to the bad times. By October 2005 I was completely broken and flat on my face in repentance. Thinking of it still makes me cry.

I was a mean MLCer.

I convinced myself and everyone around me that my husband was the biggest SOB that ever walked. I BELIEVED it. I twisted every argument we'd ever had but ESPECIALLY as he fought me THEN.
I had all my family in support of my efforts.

Eventually, and it took a long time, I convinced my husband we were really through.

He stood for over 2 years, though.
Alone.
Without a message board or a clue about MLC.
He just believed in me and in us.

It seemed when in order to save his own sanity he had to let go I started waking up.

You might think that's a shame.

But the rest of my story is still being written.

I don't know why I wrote all that.
There are some new people here I guess.
Trying to determine if there's hope.
Thinking there is hope if it's MLC.

To you I'll say this: If you don't humble yourself at this time, if you let pride make you bitter and vengeful, she will never feel able to ask your forgiveness. And THAT ALONE IS PARAMOUNT to her coming out of MLC a better and stronger person.

You see, the hardest thing for her will be forgiving herself and she can never do that unless she can come back and talk with you.
Love her or not, leave her or not, you've got to make yourself a person (because you are THE person) she can come to and apologize. This is when you're going to have your feet held to fire and you'll find out if your love is really unconditional.

While she's lost, you have work of your own to do.

This isn't just her journey.

You're also here for a reason.

------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted By: Goinbatty
Amy, not only the new folks benefit, but some of us "old timers" do also. Perhaps my x will also "wake up", and I'll be better prepared in part thanks to your posts. On the other hand, perhaps she never will and that's why its important for folks to look after themselves and move along. For the new folks, yes, you can do both. Important to note, some few never do "wake up" and remain stuck.
Thanks again Amy.

-----------------------------------------------------

I am of the opinion that the reason for that is pride.
Especially in men.

The HARDEST thing for me was turning around and saying I'd been wrong. I had to also go to my mother, my sister, my aunt and worst of all, my Grandma, and tell them, try to make them understand, that I did not see things for what they truly were and that I bore a good sized chunk of the blame for the state of my marriage. See, if your spouse is an unchanging ass and you have an affair, you've justified yourself. I did. But if you find out your perception was flat-out WRONG, you just become an adulterer. It was hard to realize that's all I was. Lost though I may have been, I'd prayed for God to show me myself as HE saw me and THAT is just ONE thing He showed me about myself. Each visit, each phone call looming before me back then was another opportunity for me to just run. I came so close...
Facing my husband was the worst.
It was a long process.
That "talk" was actually more a series of talks.
But I could have cut and run at any time and I sure as hell wanted to MANY times. But when you find yourself face down in the carpet night after night for 2 weeks straight and all you can do is cry and say "help me" because you can ACTUALLY feel the pain you've caused the one who loved you the most in the world, you'll do whatever He requires and He required that I go to my husband. He required that I go to my family and set things right.

I think all MLCers wake up.

I just don't think they all "own up".

It is the single most difficult task I have ever undertaken in my life.

UR....

Thanks for the hijack ....(like you had a choice though)

: p

I needed to read that today. Thank you Mach.

Thank you, Mach.

I had read part of that post from Amy last year during some of my darkest hours. And it gave me hope.

Looking at it from this side, after my H has come back home, and is mostly in acceptance, I can see that he had the same profile of emotions as did Amy.

Staying was the hardest thing I've ever done in my life.

And now...I needed the reminder today to forgive him and let his past go. Forgiveness isn't a one-time action. I think it's a verb...a state for mind. We keep forgiving.

Thanks again

Thanks Mach. This ripped my heart out, and will help us all stand another month, another year. It's the choice my first MC gave me 4 years ago. He said someday my H will wake up and realize the pain and destruction he has caused, and will become the best husband that he can. It's my choice whether to stand and have him be my excellent husband, or give up and have him be OW's excellent husband. Thank you.�

PS I guess men know how best to help other men, but still think it was harsh

"I think all MLCers wake up.

I just don't think they all "own up".

My MLCer has not woken up, but see's some things clear, while seeing other things extremely only through pain and anger.

I don't think I have been DBing as much as I have been trying to run as far away as I can, even if that means by trying to push him far away.

Is it normal for him to say, He want's to be wrong, he want's to be the slug, he want's to be hated by me?

How do we know when it's standing or just being stuck?

I will admit I am still being lead by pride, my anger and guts to want to end it is all is led by pride. When he insists on being friends w/POS is when I am chucking the whole M out of my mouth.

Thanks for posting this. It helps.

Mach, you can hijack anytime, my friend. Thats what this thread it about. Helping others.

Oh, and you do know, that I always have a choice. Just sayin.....LOL!

wow- interesting look at mlc from other side. i wonder if my h could ever bring himself to fess up and acknowledge his "part".

idk- it was such the habit of a lifetime trusting & respecting him. it's become such a sad little ratty habit now to cover up and stay "detached" as i can get- not having any assumptions or displaying any overt affection, etc.

when whoever was saying in mach's post that they had actually just forgotten any good stuff about the m - i can absolutely believe it. i could see h when he talked and he believed what he was saying - and i'm sure in his head it sounded really logical. im sure to anyone hemay have "explained" to - it sounded/sounds? perfectly logical... it was just nutty to me, who else would know the truth but me???

he's toned down alot- the past three-two-five years have been worst of my life- i guess we'll see where it all ends up. .

anyway- yeah linda- you're rite. another day-week, month- i guess we can do it til we fall over... wierd to hear such a "voice" from beyond the great divide..

eek

thanks for sharing

The poster who wrote the words that are making you guys see the other side a little bit is AmyC.

Her posts are in the archives. They are also in the prayer circle forum.

All you would have to do is search her name.

Or spend some time in the archives making an effort to really learn about what you are dealing with.

Personally, I spent about 6 months there, not posting at all and barely reading the current situations at the time.

They helped me find empathy and compassion. They gave me a very good education regarding MLC, depression, and anger. They taught me how to define for me unconditional love, forgivness, and faith. They taught me so many more things than I can even begin to describe. And they were my savior in the darkest of times.

When I say They, I mean the people. Their stories, happy and sad. Anger and frustration. Tears and laughter. The posters, Butterflymom, Snodderly (now Job), Jack3beans, AmyC, Imlin, and too many others to name.

It's part of the work. Just do it.

I'm so glad this was reposted!

This passage has given me so much comfort since I read it about 6 months ago. The "brilliant BS" helped. Convincing everyone about the sourness of the marriage--(my inlaws have bought into it completely).

To hear it from the other side and hear how they put such a spin on a lifetime of memories. I think it may be the posting that has given me the most comfort in the darkest times.

I think it speaks to me the most because when you are in the thick of it--the bottom of the cesspool--when the MLC-er/spouse you have loved, trusted etc...when that person is lost in an infatuation with someone else and looks at you with venom, I can't imagine a torture more painful. I think I'd rather have bamboo shove under my fingernails(well, maybe not) but, you know what I mean.

It's those moments when the MLC-er BELIEVES YOU ARE THE SOURCE OF ALL HIS/HER PROBLEMS AND IS IN THE ARMS OF SOMEONE ELSE--that's when these words comfort me and help me remember the truth. And, help me see the value of that truth.

We hold the truth of all these years. The LBS-er holds the truth--we have been given this responsibility to our kids and ourselves and even our spouses to hold what really happened in our marriage/lives in some special place. Especially the kids.

As a child of divorce, we weren't allowed to talk about our former lives before my dad's affairs and his leaving. Don't do that! Talk about the good times. That is family history that your kids need. Talk about good memories and even bad. It's all part of the weaving that is your family. And, I think this passage by Amy brilliantly conveys the importance of this job.

Quote:

In my case, through the initial period of deep MLC which manifested outwardly between March '02 & March '04, I'd spun such brilliant BS that everyone thought I was right to want a separation/divorce. In March '04, my husband left for the second time. I'd gotten rid of om before that but was still trying to live it up. I was crashing hard and fairly regularly. I still managed for another year to outrun reality though it did creep in occasionally. My husband stopped fighting for me when he left the second time. That was the biggest jolt. It was good to have that pressure off for awhile though. By summer 2005, I was coming apart at the seams. Completely. I'd exhausted myself with the things of the world that had enticed me, I was looking at families and missing my own. For the first time, I started to see that there had been good times. I had REALLY forgotten them. There are still times as recently as a week ago that I'll remember something and mention it to my husband and he'll look at me as if to say "did you JUST remember/realize that?" and if I were to answer, I'd say yes. MLC stole a big chunk of the good things about my marriage. It seems I get them back a little at a time. But I FORGOT. I did not see us as my husband saw us.
So you (husbands of MLC wives) really are holding something precious that no one else has; you're holding the real truth about your lives together. You're the only one that's going to understand her when she comes back. You're all that's going to be familiar and if you're not there...

Heather

Originally Posted By: cat04

The poster who wrote the words that are making you guys see the other side a little bit is AmyC.

I didnt know she had another user name.

Here is a link for all of goinbatty's threads

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=userposts&view=started&id=4718

Should keep everyone busy reading for a while.

Originally Posted By: Cadet

Originally Posted By: cat04

The poster who wrote the words that are making you guys see the other side a little bit is AmyC.

I didnt know she had another user name.

Here is a link for all of goinbatty's threads

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=userposts&view=started&id=4718

Should keep everyone busy reading for a while.

Disregard above thread I must be in MLC and confused goimbatty is not AmyC - Oh well - I should have read HIS threads first......

Cadet, you freakin crack me up.

I was talking to a dear friend of mine (yea, dont let that go to your head - LOL) We go way back on here.

Anyway, we were talking about the old days. How this forum used to be.

When I first came here 6 years ago, I was blessed to have started here with some extraordinary people.

As I've said before, I came kicking and screaming into db. And so, I got my as$ kicked daily. And I thank God I did.

Because the thing of it is, that I was not a victim. And I didnt want to be treated as one. I wanted to learn everything I could. I wanted to grow. I wanted to change.

Yes, I have had some really tough stuff happen throughout my life. Really tough. But, that is life.

So, they told me that I needed to look inside. I needed to let go, I needed to leave my h to walk his journey and I needed to do the work.

At first I thought, yea, right, easy for you to say. And I fought against it.

But they wouldnt let me. They pushed me and challenged me. They wouldnt let me feel sorry for myself. They were tough.

And I am forever grateful.

So, yes this is hard. This succks. It hurts. But you are not a victim. You get to choose how you do it. You get to dig in and figure out the tough stuff.

And sometimes it gets really raw. Sometimes it can bring you to your knees.

But there is no strength without struggle.

Take the tougher road. Dig in a deep as you can.

Dont take it personally when you are asked to do that.

I promise you that you will be forever changed.

uR,
You and your friend are right, the board has changed. It's not way it use to be. When I came here long ago, the people here were just beginning to understand MLC. We all took the time to research the various issues such as depression, personality disorders, abuse issues, etc. to be better understand what may have been the ingredients that helped the pot bubble forth.

We didn't have the luxury of a MLC Archives as we do today. One of the things that I did to help me better understand MLC and cope w/the situation, was to read everything I could get my hands on, i.e., the items I mentioned in the first paragraph. Doing the hard homework and learning to accept that I couldn't change the course of my xh's mlc was the hardest thing that I ever learned...but one thing I did not do and that is to become a victim. I stood strong and fought for myself, to save myself from going down the Yellow Brick Road w/him.

BTW, I can remember having my as$ kicked too. Posters were tougher and spoke their minds. Yes, we got our feelings hurt, but we learned to look within because outsiders could see things that we couldn't because we were too close.

Life isn't a bed of roses, but one mixed w/some weeds that are attempting to strangle the roses. When the crisis hits, we have the option to either weed the rose bed or allow the weeds to continue to grow and kill the beautiful roses. I think most that post here are more than willing to do the weeding so that their roses will continue to thrive. So, w/that being said, I urge posters to do the hard work of educating yourselves about what is going on, not just by posting, but reading the postings of others on the current forum, as well as reading the postings in the MLC archives. There is a lot of good information there just waiting to help you plot your journey.

You, the poster, will be the one to determine how your journey progresses and the final outcome will be of your choosing.

Hey Job, we also had a ton of fun back in the day, didnt we?

For those of you new to this, I just wanted to say a few things.

Although it is hard to see through all the heartache this causes, try to find compassion for your spouses. They clearly are not the people they once were. They are in pain, too. Unbearable pain, at times.

Imagine for a moment, feeling as if your life is out of control. You are deeply unhappy. You dont know why. You just know that you want the hurting to stop.

You try everything you can, and it is still there. You become someone opposite of who you are. It is still there. You lash out at your spouse, alienate your children, act out, regress. And still the deep sadness continues.

They feel as if they are swimming in a lake of mud. Trying to get out, flailing about, unable to reach the shore.

I know their actions are devastating. I do. I know there are times when you are so angry with them, so disappointed, so deeply pained.

And I absolutely understand when you cannot take it any longer.

Until then, remember their pain, too. Allow them what they need. Space, time, no pressure. Let them walk their journey on their own. It is the only way they can get to the other side.

Take the opportunity to find you. Become strong. Become who you were meant to be.

Leave them to it.

You find you.

Yes, we did have some great fun back in the day. We got our hands smacked quite a bit...but we learned the lessons that we needed to learn. We are survivors no matter what.

Things sure have changed around here.

Thank you. I needed that reminder right now.

You got that right, Job. We are survivors. Man, did we get our hands slapped. LOL!

I do remember the fun, and the parties, and the pool boys. Oh yes, the pool boys . .where are they now when we need them?

And the WASbuster bus . . . .

OMG, Bea, I forgot about the pool boys. So funny! Such a great bunch of people.

Who can forget the pool boys? We really did have a great bunch of posters back in the day. We could have our little parties here and in the real world. Why we were even able to put other sites and our email addresses here. It was just a different time and now w/all of the identity theft, stalking, etc., you just never know.

I can still remember having my fingers whacked a few times and my feelings hurt, but you know what? I was determined to show the posters that I could tackle my issues and I didn't allow what they said to keep me down very long. Boy, those were the days!

I guess we'll have to a search for some new pool boys pretty soon!

Yes, Job, a different world. Progress is not always a good thing.

Forget my hands being whacked. I would get a headache from the two by fours.

I could still remember saying to myself -after sitting and chewing on what they posted - oh yea, well, I'll show you. LOL!

Ah, new pool boys. Thats a nice thought. Heehee

uR,
Didn't the posters also refer to the pool boys as cabana boys?

How can I forget the two by fours! That's during the time frame when they were used all of the time. Whack!

It's not to recall some of the things we use to discuss here...but the times have changed and people want quick answers to resolve their issues here and unfortunately, there are no quick fix responses to help them.

It use to sadden me when posters would inquire about my marital status or where I was w/my situation, and when I advised them that I was divorced, I could pick up a little bit of cooling in their postings, as if the advice provided wouldn't be good enough to save their relationships. Again, they didn't realize that only they can change their own situations, i.e., whether their relationships are saved or if they end up making the journey all on their own. Oh, well...they all will learn what needs to be learned in their own time. Just as we did.

Bust on my friends. Life is far too short to sit around watching the paint harden or the pots boil...get out there and live your lives.

One of the best memories I have is the "edit" button. They need to restore that function, as it would alleviate additional postings with corrections.

Correction to Paragraph 3:

It's nice to recall some of the things we use to discuss here....help them.

Quote:

It's not to recall some of the things we use to discuss here...but the times have changed and people want quick answers to resolve their issues here and unfortunately, there are no quick fix responses to help them.

Guilty.

I read this and googled go cart racing. I first thought about it because it's something which could increase D11's confidence--then it occurred to me. Hey! I've always wanted to race. My dad races with my brother--vintage cars.

I could race go carts. Just read the getting started online pamphlet on a race site.

See Job! We listen. Some of us are just denser and slower than others. he he he.

You guys are awesome, patient and a Godsend. Don't forget that.
Heather

Not to be competitive here, but I got sore hands and a bruised head. But good for me.

There were one or two posters who I think did go a bit OTT with their harshness, including one guy who flatly refused to believe there was such a thing as MLC, but you know even that caused me to think about what MLC was, and if it was 'authentic' or me just unable to accept a situation and thus putting a label on it.

Originally Posted By: job

One of the best memories I have is the "edit" button. They need to restore that function, as it would alleviate additional postings with corrections.

AGREED!

However I dont think it is going to happen.

Originally Posted By: Fisherman

Originally Posted By: Cadet

Why don't you use the PREVIEW button.
In my business you measure twice and cut once.

smile smile smile

We've been over this before.

It's not the same. It's only a preview.

From 3-10-11

I know that you and Fish loved to quibble this....

Mach, how the heck did you dig that up? LOL!

How I miss my Fish...sigh.....:)

It has been a while since I've seen the Gordon's fisherman.

Is he trapt somewhere?

This is not a preview it's the real thing...

Darlin'

Yippee! My boys are back. LOL!

Hiya True. You made me smile.

Originally Posted By: Truegritter

It has been a while since I've seen the Gordon's fisherman.

Is he trapt somewhere?

This is not a preview it's the real thing...

Darlin'

He is probably at home...

Polishing his 'slicker'

Some things never change

: )

Mach, it is still not ok to say anything about Fish. You be nice. Ya hear?

I forgot how you liked that knucklehead

Um, yep, True. I did, still do. So, you best remember that, LOL!

You always held a special place in my heart.

And oh yea, that Mach guy, too. LOL!

Originally Posted By: Mach1

Some things never change

Nope some things never do!

WAVE - Hi Mach!

Originally Posted By: Cadet

WAVE - Hi Mach!

Hey there my friend...

Things going well ????

Originally Posted By: Mach1

Originally Posted By: Cadet

WAVE - Hi Mach!

Hey there my friend...

Things going well ????

Its as good as it gets.

Thanks for asking.

Well well well....looky what we have here....

Originally Posted By: Mach1

He is probably at home...

Polishing his 'slicker'

Some things never change

: )

They sure don't. Sharpening my hooks. You ready?? And before you go any further, I refuse to tank this wonderful young lady's thread.

Originally Posted By: uRworthy

Mach, it is still not ok to say anything about Fish. You be nice. Ya hear?

Thank you, thank you, thank you so very much my dear!

I've been missing you bunches!

Originally Posted By: TruegrittaAAHH

Is he trapt somewhere?

Felt like it for a while, but not anymore.

Originally Posted By: TruegrittaAAHH

This is not a preview it's the real thing...

Darlin'

You got that right! Now go make a thread cupcake.

Looking forward to catching up with you Miss B!

Hiya Fish. So happy to see you here. No worries on you boys being on my thread. And I miss you very much, too.

Ok, here we go. LOL!

No no, I am going to behave from now on. Can only hope that most of the shenanigans are buried so deep in the archives that one would be Mach's age by the time they came across them.

Looked what got dragged up in the net...

Hiya Fish

Originally Posted By: fisherman

Well well well....looky what we have here....

Originally Posted By: Mach1

He is probably at home...

Polishing his 'slicker'

Some things never change

: )

They sure don't. Sharpening my hooks. You ready?? And before you go any further, I refuse to tank this wonderful young lady's thread.

Okay, WHO stole Fish's login...????

Whoever you are, I can tell that you aren't Fish....

"Here" is used, AND spelled with the correct context... ^^^^

: )

It's still good to here from you Fish

Originally Posted By: Truegritter

It's still good to here from you Fish

I totally agree...

It is good to here from you Fish...

HEAR HEAR !!!

Preview button.

Rotflmfao!

Originally Posted By: fisherman

No no, I am going to behave from now on. Can only hope that most of the shenanigans are buried so deep in the archives that one would be Mach's age by the time they came across them.

You behave...

Mach can have those posts here in about 15 seconds flat...

Although he has slowed a bit over the years

Good to see everyone here...

Those shenanigans were good times. Really good times. Miss them.

And thank you for calling me young lady, Fish.

True and Mach never did. Just sayin....

Just one more reason why I love you.

uR,
It's been fun reading and laughing at the antics from dear friends that have come back to visit. I can't believe Fish returned and I hope he's doing okay.

uR, have you given any thought as to what your new thread title will be? I can't help but think about how you have a gift of reaching out and touching others w/your compassion, kindness and knowledge of life. You make all of us realize that friends are a gift from heaven and they should be treasured always. Don't you agree?