Living with disdain (OK, I avoided the word hate)

Preparing a new thread

FIB -

You have such a difficult situation right now with an accusing and angry live in WAW. And to get that lien on the mortgage from your father in law just adds to the frustration. All I can tell you is that I know for a fact that things are going to get better for you.

KerryK...don't get me choked up. Thanks..it's real rough right now...for me. It's my own personal struggle now...to not fall backwards. Thanks.

FIB

Still hangin with you to my friend, and if yours follows in any way how the kids mom and I interact then it will always have its ups and downs.

The trick is being the rock that is big enough to weather the constant chipping and not be cast aside!

My money is on you FIB!!

cire

Hey Fib, so sorry things are so difficult for you. Its not right, not fair - well, basically it sucks. But, keep your eye on the prizes, my friend - your children. You will get through all this, you have to, for them. And for yourself. Keep on keepin, on. You could do it. One moment at a time. I have faith in you.

Proverbs 25:21-22 (New International Version)
New International Version (NIV)
Copyright � 1973, 1978, 1984 by International Bible Society

FIB- You are doing the right thing, agape love is not a feeling its an action and you can still have boundries, but we are called to this......you have the right idea..there is so much comfort and wisdom in proverbs and psalms, it might helo if u read a chapter from each book every day..

Proverbs 25:21-22

21 If your enemy is hungry, give him food to eat;
if he is thirsty, give him water to drink.

22 In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head,
and the LORD will reward you.

FIB,

I was also the one who ultimately filed. And I had such a hard time with that, too. I also felt that HE should have to file because HE was the one who broke up the family.

However, with some distance now, I can honestly say that it is not that meaningful. The actual divorce papers, what it says on that judgement, is merely the final step in a long, long battle: the battle to save your marriage.

Your W broke up your marriage and your family when she decided to have her first OM. When she decided that she "deserved better" than you (as Ford said). When she decided to no longer put any effort into your R.

I believe that, someday, you will see that filing was, ultimately, a gift to yourself and your children, protection for all of you from further emotional and psychological harm.

Love,
Nicola

I want to thank everyone for your ongoing support. I am going thru another rough period...increasing nasty comments from my STBXW...feelings of loss....and trying as best I can to avoid victimizing myself as the cause for all of this (well, the TOTAL cause.

Two nights ago, my son came into the bed with me. He has been needy of late. He has not been showing any drive in soccer. In the dark and quiet, I asked him:

Me: Hey..S8....can you tell me why it seems like you don't want to go after the ball in soccer? You know, daddy doesn't expect you to score or be the best...just to try your hardest.
S8: Well, dad...the other guys are so much faster than I am.

Last night, the kids piled into the MBR. They have reading logs and last might was my turn to read. I read to my son the fairy tale about the tailor who made himself a sash that said "7 in one blow"...how he defeated and outsmarted several giants. The moral of the story...ingenuity. I tied this in with how he could use ingenuity to beat the faster soccer players.

FIB

Thank you nicola...that was an insightful post. When things get dark, I try to recall some her comments from the past and it helps me keep going. I am sure that the present living conditions is what makes this so tough right now.

Thanks so much for still being here.
FIB

FIB,

It breaks my heart...

That you are in so much pain
That you're kids are old enough to understand that Mommy and Daddy are planning on living two separate lives
That you worked so hard to save your marriage.....but, have no strength to continue that fight
That your wife probably sees you as the walk-away-husband
That you and your W cannot see your woundedness clearly now (you will later)
That each of you sees the other as the source of their pain
That some here encourage D as the answer and seem to believe it is the strongest move

I am happy that....

One way or another your pain will subside
Underneath all the pain is an ember of love that you and your W share
You are doing everything you can to show your W forgiveness and love
You find the strength every day to be the incredible father your kids need
There is ALWAYS hope that you and your W will reconcile and experience the glorious love that God intended a marriage to deliver

Hey FIB, I don't even know what to say at this point except try and keep your chin up buddy. I also want to make sure you know we are all here for you through all of this. If you need anything at all, Frank D can point the way.....

Ian

wow, what a guilt filled post.

maybe it isn't a matter of being strong, but rather good common sense.

you can jump in front of a bus as long as like, but the mofo is still going to run you over.

FIB

this sucks, no two ways about it. in a perfect world, we wouldn't have this crap happen.

2.5 years of abuse. you proved yourself.

lord know I wish you whatever is best and gives you happiness and you kids peace.

it isn't a "strength" thing.

sucking up years of ABUSE serves what purpose?

she doesn't have cancer, she isn't mentally ill.

she is what she is.

and the kids are watching.

Get another tape recorder.

nothing wrong with an anti cockold tape. you have something better in mind?

Originally Posted By: ford

nothing wrong with an anti cockold tape. you have something better in mind?

She stole his previous digital recorder. I thing having some of her verbally abusive audio has some merit.

ahhhhhh

missunderstood your post, frank.

totally agree.

hope you're doing well.

ford,

This isn't about guilt....or abuse...or proving oneself...or victimhood...it's about forgiveness and love...pure and simple. I can't even fathom the pain you have endured which would lead you to your conclusion.

In the courthouse. The lake....the leaves are now changing. I still sit here in disbelief. It still is a nightmare....still hurts....mostly when I hold my children

Thanks so much for your support. It means so much.
FIB

I would just say that FIB has done NOTHING that was unforgiving or unloving in regards to his wife.

The flip side to that is that she has also done NOTHING to indicate an interest in healing the rift between them.

Her actions are NOT the actions of a woman who WANTS to come back, but feels her husband has moved on. They are NOT.

Her actions are self-indulgent and self-justifying. She has turned the tables on FIB with her accusations NOT because she wants back in and is hurt that he is done, but because it plays well for her and allows her to point fingers at him and away from herself.

There has been NO remorse for her actions, not even a simple apology for breaking their marital vows.

No, it is clear that this woman has not recanted her actions/words one little bit. Every thing she says now, that some interpret as "baby steps" or perhaps a sadness that the marriage has ended, is instead nothing more than a calculated plan to cover her own backside and hurt FIB as much as possible in the process.

Phoenix has written on another thread that there are many on this board who go way beyond what is rational or healthy in clinging to a spouse who has made it clear that they are done. I agree. Standing or not standing is a personal decision that is made based upon the COMPLETE knowledge that each of us have of our OWN situations.

There is no cookie cutter mold that works for every situation. And no, I'm sorry to say, not every marriage CAN be saved. Ultimately it takes two people to make that happen. Sometimes your spouse simply refuses to come back to that point.

We should be as careful about our standing as we are about our surrendering to the inevitable, that is true. We can stand in a toxic way just as we can choose to move on for the wrong reasons. Both sides are dangerous.

I honestly believe that FIB has done as much as could have been done.

I also believe that were he to continue hanging on to the hope that his wife will return, if he were to allow the status to remain quo so to speak, he would simply endure more pain, more betrayal, and eventually break.

It's time for his wife to be gone, to do all the wonderful things that she thinks life has in store for her as a single woman. It's time for her to find out just what she once had in her marriage with FIB.

I too believe in miracles. I too value the preciousness of marriage. I too wish and pray that every situation on this board would resolve favorably. Two years here has shown me that it simply does not happen all the time.

A miracle can still happen here.

But if it does, I believe it will be long AFTER the divorce.

And there is nothing to be gained by suggesting in any way that FIB should continue to endure life with a person who has long ago abandoned him emotionally and physically.

Blessings FIB,

Bill

Quote:

I would just say that FIB has done NOTHING that was unforgiving or unloving in regards to his wife.

I rarely post on FIB's thread (although we have regular contact off the board) because I shudder at the inevitable response of the "move on" crowd that jumps in to rationalize Divorce. That is not what this site is about...there are other places for that. Your opening premise is flawed...not even FIB would make this statement.

Perhaps part of the problem is that we all project our own sitches onto others. Maybe the "standers" are recruiting others to stand like them? What of those that have endured divorce. Nobody is recommending "clinging" to our spouses. What good comes from dire predictions of FIB's W's motives and thought processes? Have you met her? I see LOTS of encouraging signs in her actions. Is she perfect? Far from it...as are we all.

Sorry...just trying to be one of the few voices trying to encourage FIB (and others) that there are some out here who believe contrary to the "move on" mentality.

Faithful, you don't get to classify me as part of ANY crowd, let alone a "move on" crowd. I post to more people than just FIB, and my advice is not predicated upon an assumption that moving on is better than working on your marriage.

That makes your presumption about MY post flawed.

Obviously I was not suggesting that FIB had NEVER done anything unforgiving or unloving towards his wife. I do not have the benefit of knowing much about their life pre-bomb.

What I know is what he has shared in the two years I've known him on this board.

I will say that, other than the fact that he is human and has sometimes expressed his frustration, I cannot recall a time that he has been unforgiving with his wife. Or unloving.

I remember a guy who extended his wife EVERY opportunity to come BACK from her dalliances with multiple other men.

I remember a guy who carried the load at home when his wife was too busy to cook, clean, or even care for their kids. I cannot recall him throwing that up in her face on those occasions. He simply did what needed to be done.

I think what you're trying to say now is that since he has made his decision to file, he no longer is open to his wife's positives. I would ask, what are they?

The fact that she asked him to go pay for the pumpkins?

The fact that she has made dinner and offered him some?

The fact that her lawyer says she doesn't want a divorce?

The fact that at some point in time SHE said she didn't want a divorce?

Are these some of the positives?

Because I will remind you of these things as well...

The pumpkin trip brought NO conversation, NO loving involvement such as holding hands, and basically NOTHING except allowing HIM to pay for the pumpkins.

The dinners that she now makes are no more impressive than the many meals that FIB prepared during her mental and emotional abandonment. It is simply something that needs to be done. None of these meals came with a loving invitation to dinner either. Keep that in mind.

Her lawyer has said she doesn't want a divorce. Then FIB goes home to the continued cold shoulder, criticisms, and hostility. Where is the consistency there that would indicate she does NOT want a divorce.

You provide good counsel Faithful. And you're a good man, I believe that completely. I do not want this misinterpreted as an attack on YOU per se. Even you have to admit that YOUR situation was NOT the same as FIB's. Your wife wanted out, but she did not repeatedly violate your marriage vows with another. She did NOT use you to cover for her with kids so that she could meet clandestinely with another man. She did NOT spew the vitriolic hatred that FIB's wife spews on him on a regular basis.

Infidelity, especially repeated infidelity, is a strong thing to swallow. Yes, some find a way to forgive and move on, somehow finding a healing place. But I submit to you that MANY, perhaps even MOST, do not. And for those that do, a STRONG statement of commitment by the offending spouse is almost always a need before the left behind spouse can be moved to trust again.

There has been nothing like that from FIB's wife. Unless of course he's left that out somewhere.

I grieve for his situation, just like you do. We see different sides of the matter, but I think we share the hope that the pain will soon come to an end, and all the family can reach a point of healing.

No, I'm not a member of the "Ya'll should just move on!" Club.

But I'm also not afraid to believe that sometimes moving on is in the best interests of those who are being continually abused by a spouses poor behavior.

Divorce is NOT a scarlet letter. And it does NOT preclude the possibility of healing and restoration in the future. If a miracle is to come, it can still come.

You know FIB well enough to know that he is a man of character, and that he is a man who has loved his wife truly and faithfully.

Blessings,

Bill

Bworl,

Thanks for the response! As always I agree with much of what you write. Thanks for not making your response a personal attack on me....as mine was not intended that way either. I don't want to get into a point by point discussion....suffice it to say that everything I see as a positive...somebody else would see it differently. Most importantly, FIB is not seeing these things as a positive right now. My ONLY goal is to help FIB consider looking at her actions differently.

Quote:

Yes, some find a way to forgive and move on, somehow finding a healing place. But I submit to you that MANY, perhaps even MOST, do not. And for those that do, a STRONG statement of commitment by the offending spouse is almost always a need before the left behind spouse can be moved to trust again.

This is probably the one part of your post that I am 180 the other direction. The idea of an "offending spouse" is foreign to me in that I believe that describes ALL of us. But if you insist on classing the WAS or MLCer as the "offending spouse", in my experience they will almost NEVER make a "STRONG statement of commmitment" early in the restoration process. If this EVER comes, it will be well down the path of restoration. And the trust thing...goes both ways. Believe it or not, the "offending spouse" often has as much mistrust of the LBS as the other way 'round. It's either a vicious spin downward...or upward if one spouse decides to stop it.

FIB - in the courthouse? speeding ticket? $\:\)$ Just trying to add a little humor to your ohsoserious life/thread.

Quote:

Believe it or not, the "offending spouse" often has as much mistrust of the LBS as the other way 'round. It's either a vicious spin downward...or upward if one spouse decides to stop it.

Oh yes, I agree. My H told me often in the beginning the he did not trust me. Whether he had reason or it was a his own reflection, it was his feeling that he could not trust me and I have to honor that - and, work on regaining his trust in me. Pretty ironic when he is the one.....

FIB, is your W a different person/W/mother now than she was a year ago, 2 years ago?

I will get to your comments.

Hurting.

The judge is portraying me as a wealthy MD hiding money. That if I don't pay the mortgage next month she will put me in jail.
They do not believe any psych issues existed with my W:
-where are the prescriptions?
-why wasn't she hospitalized during the M?
-that a one night stand is being made out to be mental breakdown
-the law guardian sees us both as fit parents
-that the LG likes my W and enjoys working with her

Today, my W's mother showed up for support

My L is now talking about me giving up the home in exchange for protection of my future income....that she hopes for joint physical without a guarantee of equal visitation......

I am sick...........

FIB

fib

I dont understand, what about the fact that she committed adultrey and all the while you have been trying to reconcile....and what about the three men.....and be trnasparent with your money.....let them know you have nothing to hide.....

I dont understand how the judge could portray you like that. Is there not some financial papers that show what you earn and what the bills are?

I am sick too hearing about such lies and injustices done in divorce court. I am hoping to not have to go to court in the coming month because you just never know.

The days will come shortly when you see your life on the rebound.

FIB, unfortunately people have a tendancy to only look at the cover rather than reading the book. This includes Judges who tend to get so judgmental instead of factual.

Your lawyer needs to show exactly what your income is and exactly what your current financial situation is. As far as the judge making a determination about your wifes mental well being, maybe your L should ask for a psyche eval.

One of the thoughts that keeps popping into my head, and understand that I am not in your shoes and only think about how I would want to deal with it, is that I would keep fighting. I would not negotiate for future earnings I would stick to my beliefs on what is best for you and your family. Sometimes judges lash out in hopes that the party they are lashing out at will get scared and settle/compromise and then the judge has a freed up docket and can get a round of golf in or go to a titty bar.

My point is this, Judges make personal assesments of people sometimes because it is the easy thing to do rather than having to actually work at finding the truth (which is what they are paid for by the way. Then when the person they target does not back down and sticks to their guns those same judges finally do their job.

Do not be to quick to back down simply because this judge is throwing some bullshit your way.

Ian

Great point by Ian.

What kind of judge can put you in jail for not making a mortgage payment?

FIB, what can I say? I am so very sorry about all that you are going through! It is so obvious that the judge does not know you, the man you are, as we do. I do not understand how she can accuse you of hiding money!

So, is your lawyer proposing that you let your wife have the house? If so, who pays the mortgage then?

I agree w/ what Ian wrote.

I wouldn't settle for anything you don't have to! While there is a certain amount of compromising in a divorce...some things are worth fighting for more than others!

Please, as always, know that you are in my prayers! Things will not be this way forever! God always sees us through the storms!

deb

FIB, sorry it's so tough.
I had a judge with an attitude too. Too bad these people get personally involved.

Weighing in on the "move on or don't move on" discussion, of course it is FIB's call. But I too have read the stories and thought "this is salvageable."

Originally Posted By: bworl

FIB goes home to the continued cold shoulder, criticisms, and hostility. Where is the consistency there that would indicate she does NOT want a divorce.

Sorry, Bworl, I don't see how "cold shoulder" implies "must divorce now." I get that it has been a long time.

I'm not saying it's a black-and-white call.

But when I read the stories from FIB, in between the lines I read hurt and pain, and that, I feel, is where the urge to divorce is coming from. It's a power struggle at this point.

I don't judge anyone though. We have all been through too much - no one can judge another here.

I'm sorry, but I don't think Bworl has EVER told FIB to divorce his wife....much less told him to "divorce now". My interpretation was that he was pointing out that FIB's wife's actions are not those of a woman wanting to or, much less trying to, save her marriage.

You're absolutely right, the first time the words "divorce now" were used, was by me.

But the point I am making still stands.
bworl said
sometimes moving on is in the best interests of those who are being continually abused by a spouses poor behavior.
which is true. Abuse is no good.
The question is, what is abuse and how much is too much?

and of course it is an individual decision. The most personal decision in the world.

SirPrizeMe, I totally agree w/ what Bworl wrote. "SOMETIMES moving on IS in the best interest of those who are being continually abused by a spouse's poor behavior."

And, what YOU said is very true, as well...it is an individual decision. I came from a m that was abusive in a lot of ways. Only at the time, I didn't see everything that was going on...I was TOO close to the sitch. Many people tried many times to point things out to me that weren't right. Now that I am away from that, I can see what others tried so hard to tell me.

No one here wants to see FIB and his w divorce. But, we DO want FIB to find some peace (and happiness) in his life. As my therapist told me once, HE will know when enough is enough.

Wasn't trying to argue w/ you SirPrizeMe.

FIB, we are here for you! Keep being the man that you are!

deb

yes, yes, couldn't agree more, deb13.

Hey Frank,

We spoke last night and so I understand how really hurt you are right now.

Discussions about "standing" or not are doing FIB no good folks. No good at all. FIB was just hit by a piano pushed from a building; so he doesn't need to hear that it is safe to stand in that same spot again tomorrow.

His W sicked the dogs on him. Don't blame the lawyers or the judge. His W is behind this. She is taking him to the cleaners. She intends to take his house, his kids, and whatever money she can find. Then she will have him thrown in jail for hiding the rest of the imaginary money. If he avoids jail, she will demand for him to pay her mortgage and monthly support. She is using the fact that he is a doctor against him - he must be rich, he must be a poor father b/c he works long hours, he used his medical knowledge and his doctor buddies against her in an attempt to paint her as a psycho or something. She is stealing his stuff to use against him. She is making his life a living hell. And her father is taking his pound of flesh as well and most likely financing this to boot.

Yea FIB ... continue to "stand" in your nightmare.

It really does little good to say I have stood in your shoes. To be a victim of a court system where mom usually wins and dad loses. A system where the mom can do no wrong and the dad must be hiding something or doing something wrong. A system that assumes the man is lying at best.

It really does little good to say I understand how hurt you are. How things were placed in court records painting me out to be just a step above a common criminal. How the woman I loved painted me to be a monster. How someone I trusted betrayed that trust. How she believes, along with the court, that it is best for the kids not to see their father at least 50% of the time.

It really does little good to say that this will pass and things will get better b/c right now that does not seem possible.

All I can say is that I am proud to know you.

I am proud that you took a blow that would have destroyed a lesser man.

I am proud that you continue to treat that bit!h with respect and love.

I am proud that you are modeling the correct behavior for your children.

I am proud you are staying the high road - with chin up.

Remember Maximus.

From General to a beaten slave.

Yes Frank, one day you will see light. One day you will scream to the crowd:

ARE YOU ENTERTAINED!

Strength and Honor.

Nothing to add FIB. I'll keep you in my prayers.

So sorry this is happening to you.

((((((((((FIB))))))))))

Spitty

FIB,

I don't think I've ever posted to you before, but I saw a comment on another thread about "what FIB went thru yesterday" so I wanted to stop by and just offer some support.

This is rough.

Filing for divorce last summer was the toughest decision I've ever had to make in my life, and I will always remember the day I (as Chocolateeyes) announced it on the SSM board. While the overwhelming majority of people were supportive, some were pretty judgmental, and it stung pretty bad. I don't see that same thing here, but what I mean to say is that this is a VERY tough, VERY personal decision that ONLY YOU can make. I see posters who I respect a lot, posting on opposite sides of this issue. At the end of the day, you'll have to do what you feel is best for you and your kids, not in that order.

Somehow, I know that you will.

Manly, Sopranos-style hugs,

Puppy

Originally Posted By: Jeff223

I am proud that you continue to treat that bit!h with respect and love.

Whoa - Jeff - was it really necessary to use that word about FIB's W?

HE is the one going through this and HE is, as you said, treating her with respect. Do not those of us who don't even know her owe her that much at least?

I know you care about him; I just don't think that helps matters.

~Nicola

FIB, thinking of you, praying for you and your children, and wishing there was something I could do to make all of our heartaches go away. It is tough times for a lot of us right now. But I know in my heart that it matters how you have conducted yourself. It matters.

Quote:

Whoa - Jeff - was it really necessary to use that word about FIB's W?

You are right Nic - I was harsh and I apologize. My emotions got the best of me.

Sometimes talking to someone directly becomes too personal. A 1000 miles separates us - I wish I could have been there in NY last night. I lost sleep that I could not be there.

I wish I could say something positive about FIB's W. Words came easily two years ago when I saw a disturbed woman who was in and out of MLC and uncertainty. I rejoiced when FIB declared his M saved at one point. I told FIB he was wrong to think there was an OM#2, and then OM#3. I took her side again and again as FIB tried to save his M.

I no longer can. I believe she is only out for destruction. She is destroying FIB and her marriage and indirectly her children. A 'scorched earth' policy - what she cannot have she will destroy. That indicates a problem but I do believe she knows full well what she is doing.

That is the sadest part. For that she deserves my prayers.

I was wrong. It is not my place to judge or label. However, FIB needs to deal with this for what it is, with eyes wide open. Turning a blind eye to her behavior is not the way.

FIB, protect yourself and your kids so that they are not denied a father and a dependable provider. Weigh your options carefully.

You have our support.

The most difficult test of all.

"Though He slay me, yet will I trust in Him."

Job 13:15

AmyC, let me guess, when you see a sleeping dog, you walk over and pet it, don'tcha?

FIB,

I grieve for you and what this week has brought. Wish I had an answer for you, but I know I don't, so I have to leave you with letting you know that we are praying for you and yours, and wishing for the best ending possible.

I agree with those who say you must fight. Perhaps that is just my sense of injustice inside rising up and refusing to crumble in the face of her perceived victory, but I really think now is the time you must stand firm. You have two years worth of posts on this site. Two years worth of journaling about what was going on between you and your wife. Is this potentially of use in helping the judge understand that you're not a wacko money hungry MD?

This may be where it gets nasty. Can you do that FIB?

This woman is trying to destroy you. Please don't go down without a fight. The odds are stacked against you, but you have a good lawyer, you are on the side of RIGHT...there must be something that can be done. Judges should not be predetermining situations. What in the world did you do all the financials for if the judge is just going to indiscriminately decide that you are hiding money???

Do not give in.

Please.

If it takes a battle, let it be a battle.

This is a dishonorable woman who has broken her vows repeatedly. She does not deserve to GAIN from her moral failings.

You remain in our prayers.

Blessings,

Bill

Originally Posted By: Bworl

You have two years worth of posts on this site. Two years worth of journaling about what was going on between you and your wife. Is this potentially of use in helping the judge understand that you're not a wacko money hungry MD?

I think this is an exceptional idea. That would be quite a compelling, contemporaneous, detailed account!

Puppy

Hi FIB, I am so sorry. I do think you should put up some sort of a fight though.
I have been reading off and on for the two years and I can tell that you are a good man, surely a learned judge could see it too.

Prayers and Hugs to you.

Whatever, SPM.

FIB:

If your attorney is not fighting the presumptions that have been made by the judge, get a new one with some balls. I understand that will delay things however you can't let her your wife cause the level of destruction she is trying to cause because you won't cave into that third-party message that she doesn't want a divorce , etc...

When financial discovery is compelled in a divorce case, the judge doesn't review it. It is only the attorneys that do so. Your wife has a monster of an attorney and yours doesn't seem to be very proactive. No matter the spiritual battle, you have got to pick yourself up by the bootstraps and position yourself to fight for yourself and you have to do it RIGHT NOW.

Pay next months mortgage so you don't go to jail and start gathering whatever evidence against your wife that is necessary to level this playing field.

Do it for your kids.

You don't have to get as dirty as she is however facts are facts and you CAN NOT let her do this to you.

Additionally, there are strong undercurrents in your sitch that have nothing to do with divorce busting. I would urge you to consider them and try to listen out for a message you quite possibly have not been open to previously. I have found time and again that you become quite open to revelation knowledge when you're flat on your back.

AmyC

Originally Posted By: AmyC

Your wife has a monster of an attorney and yours doesn't seem to be very proactive.

I agree.

As much as your W has been at fault and done many, many things to hurt you, she cannot "force" a judge to make a decision like that. She must have one helluva L - one who plays dirty, sounds like.

That doesn't mean you have to play dirty too, however; full financial disclosure should ensure that you do not lose everything over this.

That said, I did have to pay 1/2 of XH's debt accumulated while we were married, and I had to buy him out my house, which is worth 3x what it was when we bought it. And he's the one who cheated and bailed.

Whatever happens won't be fair, but I certainly hope it will at least not be atrociously UNfair.

N

Originally Posted By: Jeff223

I took her side again and again as FIB tried to save his M.

Jeff,

I know you care very much about FIB. And I wasn't implying that you have to take her side, or defend her, or that he should turn a blind eye to her behaviour. It's just the language you chose that I didn't like.

No that I would necessarily disagree with your assessment, mind you. $;\)$

N

ok, I withdraw whatever comments I made that pushed people's buttons. Amy, I was trying to make a joke. break the tension? But I see you guys are doing battle planning. Allow me to use the side exit.

best to you all.

FIB,
OUCH!!
Ok, do you have my phone #? Though I'm not licensed to practice law in NY and am NOT seeking to gain a client (not allowed to seek out or encourage litigation or try to get another L's client, and I need to be clear here) but I have to say the ONE single advantage of being in a fault state ---IS fault!!

Before we toss your attorney under the bus, I am assuming the judge has seen lots of docs do exactly what the judge fears and your wife's L is implying, the stereotype of CEO or MD that wants to pay off the wife and kids a relative pittance, THEN re-marry the trophy wife and suddenly have plenty of money...etc. What the judge does NOT know about your sitch, is your attorney's job to teach.

Your wife isn't the stereotypical doc's wife who slaved waiting tables to put her h thru med school only to be dumped when he got "important" and she became boring as he 'outgrew" her. (To the judge, it may look like a cliched script out of Hollywood). Your w did not put you through school, and HER A's were not merely broken Marriage vows but impacted the kids - recall that fault as a spouse does not always equate to fault as a parent TO THE COURTS...but her other behaviors as they relate to being a mom MUST be taken into account. Have you shared ALL these things with your lawyer and didn't you like/trust your lawyer anyhow? And don't forget, your w's L is posturing, a lot. The more that the w's L thinks you have, the higher the fees the W's L will expect. If you trust YOUR L, give her time. If your L stood there...well, is your L familiar with defending MD practices and their values? Your w will want a forensic accountant to assess future value, earnings, good will, etc. Sheesh, your w is making ME mad. And I think that's a good sign for you. I'm a L, true. But I'm also a doc's wife, and your wife is NOT in the victim category here. Good grief. She's one of those we "first wives" look at as one "who cuts in line" to get to our hard earned hot tub, after we've been living in trailers putting off our own careers...oh yikes...

I'm available to talk if you want --my hard drive died 6 months ago so I know I don't have your info anymore. If you can somehow pass it to me, I'll email or call you. I'll just listen if you want, from a woman's perspective. You know the most terrifying thing to most women, speaking for those of us who are fairly stable, is financial insecurity. We aren't talking about taking the guy to the cleaners. But even I have had nightmares that I'll end up in a crappy apartment my kids and grandkids won't want to visit because it'll be ghetto, and somehow I'll be so broke if h leaves again, I'll end up in my sister''s basement, etc. It's not all rational and I get that. And I'm not terribly 'off'. So, some of her fears are to be expected but will come out badly. And with your wife's history, I recall that her sense of entitlement was high (and bugged me) as she said something irritating, words to the effect that she "didn't expect to have to work at the age of 35". PLEASE, LET THE JUDGE HEAR THAT ONE...if the judge is a woman, that'll be great for YOU to have the judge hear. Betcha the judge is over 35...your wife may well come out as a gold digger = hair dresser who married you AFTER you had already finished the "unpleasant" and invonvenient and not so prestigious part of becoming a doctor...

Like I said though, I THOUGHT you trusted your L and she may just not have had her turn yet. What's she saying? And even with a perfect L on your side, you will feel "sick". Remember you are a good man, but there will be NO WINNERS in this. Hence my detesting of family law as a career. No one leaves happy, although sometimes "avenged" might apply. And is that happiness? Not to me.

Sending Major league hugs your way and please email me your number and we can chat to see where you really are. Not to give legal advice, but to tell you that you are a long way from thinking "all is lost" and your wife's L is playing poker right now. And in a fault state, well, I wouldn't want my hand "called" if I were him.

The W's "breakdowns" revealed themselves to the kids when she lay in the fetal position for long periods and you went to the hospital and you did everything inside the home, and outside the home and her physical health issues with the weight, these are fairly objective.

Plus, your wife's behavior in front of people was wacky if I recall correctly. geez, do we all have to go back to our notes? Hey, I won't lecture. I'll listen and explain anything I can as a L or a wife.

But like Bworl and many others here, I'm of the priority beliefs of; 1) best for the kids; and 2) best for YOU and... that's it for now. Nothing mean, but you gotta do what you gotta do. It's all about your children and you first, or there won't be anything to help your wife with anyway. Make sense?

((( j- )))