Old thread:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945981&page=11Ready2Change: “ Better might be "You do what you need to do." or "Do not tell people to ask me. It is none of their business" or "I have no intention on telling anyone anything until we are officially divorced."
I think that if W were to bring this line of conversation up again (I don’t want to have R talks or engage but I want to listen if that happens), I might say what you have suggested above and tell her, “you can let them know that you left me, it was your decision. You can own it.”
Also I remember the other night when she and I went out, she told me, “I have don’t have my home, my things, or relationships with my kids or my friends.” My inside thoughts: “you have left all of that.” My response: “That’s really hard.”
She also said her friends (which I understand to mean her new “friends”) all have said, “it’s no wonder you left,” to her. She said they told her that before she saw the sense in it.
I have been owning that I failed and my part in the demise of our M. I need to also be accurate (not necessarily with words) that W blew it up. Accept her accept reality.
Also I remember the other night when she and I went out, she told me, “I don’t have my home, my things, or relationships with my kids or my friends.” My inside thoughts: “you have left all of that.” My response: “That’s really hard.”
This is perfect. Not saying your thoughts, rather identifying her emotional state. Do it with everyone (Your children especially) until they ask you for your thoughts.
She said: "I just need to be able to tell people, like so when people ask me about you, I can say, “We’re separated. Ask him.”
“ Better might be "You do what you need to do." or "Do not tell people to ask me. It is none of their business" or "I have no intention on telling anyone anything until we are officially divorced."
I might say what you have suggested above and tell her, “you can let them know that you left me, it was your decision. You can own it.”.
So I misread what she said to you. I was responding thinking they were asking about the state of the relationship, not about you personally.
This is how:
H:"Anyone asks, tell then I am doing great!"
If it was a discussion the state of the relationship:
Red: Keep the desire to blame out. Even the "left me" should be "Moved out"
So back to the big picture:
1) Avoid R talks like the plague.
2) If you get into R talk, Listen and reflect back what emotional state you believe she was in. Be the first to leave.
3) Filter your thoughts and words down to simple statements. (I am thinking, I am not sure, I will think about that)
4) Do not share your emotional state with her. Control it. You are content no matter what storm is going on (IE her drama).
5) Dancing- Make every woman you interact with laugh. Practice reflecting their emotional state (most likely will be the not so scary emotions...a lot better than angry or sad or frustrated that you are most likely dealing with coming out of W). Holding eye contact (if that is an issue) with the women watching you dance.
This list is just my 2cents. You should have your own list that is longer, more detailed, in the order that you think is important. It is always a work in progress.
R2C is currently working on holding other peoples attention longer in conversations. I have 3 people request for me to finish my story after the conversation went a few other directions. I got asked a simple question that I used to Segway into a more interesting response.
I am doing everything I know to do and reaching out for help to remain well and continue to plot my course, follow the plan and do what I understand to be right - Lord help me! I have not been having interactions with W since that outing on the weekend but I am very unsettled especially when she sends texts.
Focusing on my health and my priorities right now: exercise, nutrition, prayer, family, close friends, GAL.
Really makes me think twice or much more than that before agreeing to another meetup with her. I have found that after around 3 days of no texts from her and not seeing her I start to feel much better.
Ok so about my plans:
Volleyball
Work on my house
Sailing and fishing with my friend again
Celebrate eldest S birthday
Dancing
Been enjoying life. It’s beautiful - not always easy but yet beautiful. I’ve been taking care of things at my home looking after S taking good care of myself, GAL (time on the water with friends, good food, live music, dancing). Looking forward to camping and friends and adventuring. Got more home reno goals to keep after as well.
In the meantime, supporting eldest D(single mom, lives out of state)with stuff from a distance (video calls, listening to her challenges with work and raising a young one, building connection) as well as in person (have been visiting them when I can, strengthening bonds, creating memories and sharing vision for the future).
Another golden night this week. Watched eldest S pitch a gem complete game (3 hits 5 strikeouts) low scoring win. I sat next to my dad for the whole game (anyone seen field of dreams?). Dad almost went to heaven himself a couple times this year with some close calls. He told my sister one morning in the ER a couple months ago, “This could be my day.” Any and every moment like this is precious. S beamed in post game photos with grampa and family. Dad was a baseball star pitcher way back when. He has not had the stamina nor energy to get to many games this season and when he did he only stayed an inning or two. Sometimes he and mom tried but just couldn’t get there.
Youngest D is away having a great time with friends. She called for a nice video chat last evening. I’m investing in therapy, got lots to process. And getting emotional work done outside of therapy too.
I actually started and stopped this update post several times this week and finally was able to crystallize a few thoughts this morning.
I have slept better the last 2 nights in a row. Had a hard time for a week or so after I went out with W weekend before last. I haven’t been reaching out. Had some extra therapy this week. Minding my own business looking after my side of the fence. Had a great time dancing last night. Enjoying summer. Out with friends tonight. Think I’ll dance tomorrow night again.
Another good sleep. Heading out on the water this morning with friends. Some downtime this afternoon and family then out dancing with friends tonight.
Been able to step aside more for W to have her own relationship with youngest S. They will be spending time together this morning. Thanks BF and DnJ for helping me to see the importance of this for me (stepping aside).
Continuing to move forward focusing on priorities. Living reality of life as a single man functionally. Not looking for another relationship nowhere near that but want to DB well and grow so that I will eventually be ready for a good relationship whether that’s with W or another woman.
Acceptance is sinking in not without sadness and anger but I am dealing with it.
Really been enjoying my garden. Enjoyed a community event with kids today. Will be working on house this week and expect to start back at work next month.
Anger surfacing. I am considering that I may be at a place of hiring a lawyer to protect myself, fairness and our family from the free radical type effects of W’s choices and behaviours.
W has gone out of country for a month. She hasn’t told me any details (and I didn’t ask). She did say that she hasn’t told eldest D (said that D would not understand W spending money on herself instead of going to visit D) or S (not on speaking terms with S) about the trip but she has told our 2 youngest.
So a month break. Time being a gift I plan to use it well. Be the lighthouse for my kids. Enjoy myself. Get things done.
A lot of texts and emails from W before she left. Not much at all required a response so none given. Most of it was directive of how she thought I should be more thrifty with spending money and such.
Lots of feelings surfacing for me, some tears and anger and grieving loss.
Will continue to GAL, therapy, follow through on goals and discern my way forward. Answers will emerge.
Good Morning Rock
Keep moving forward.
Minding my own business looking after my side of the fence.
If I may, change fence to street. Our word choices can subconsciously build barriers, as in a fence/wall. A street still identified the separate paths of you and W, without a barrier, and can still clearly denote when one crosses over it (and gets back on their own track
).
W has gone out of country for a month. She hasn’t told me any details (and I didn’t ask). She did say that she hasn’t told eldest D (said that D would not understand W spending money on herself instead of going to visit D) or S (not on speaking terms with S) about the trip but she has told our 2 youngest.
I’m glad you have stepped back from the relationship between kids and Mom. This is a different time to keep doing so.
If you four are anything like my four they talk, well text mostly, among themselves quite a bit. Your two youngest will most certainly mention Mom being gone for a month on vacation. Stay out of this! Whatever, if any, resentment a kid or kids have regarding Mom’s spending/investing of time and/or money, you don’t need transferred on to you.
Yes. Use these four weeks well.
I’d not answer any texts or calls from W during this time (if she even does try to remain in contact). You control you. Let her go, for the entire month. Focus on you, the kids, the yard, baseball, dancing, bbqs, friends, etc.
A lot of texts and emails from W before she left. Not much at all required a response so none given. Most of it was directive of how she thought I should be more thrifty with spending money and such.
After her living away for a year I think she has lost the right to tell you, direct you, how thrifty you need to be. Ensure you pay your share of joint expenses, and the rest is your’s to do with as you choose. And yes, giving no response was perfect.
I am considering that I may be at a place of hiring a lawyer to protect myself, fairness and our family from the free radical type effects of W’s choices and behaviours.
You should definitely have some legal input and know your rights and such. You need not yet act upon any of that information, however you should know it.
Will continue to GAL, therapy, follow through on goals and discern my way forward. Answers will emerge.
Yep. As one continues things become calmer and their emotions more settled. The real big answers do present themselves when one is calm and at peace. And one usually doesn’t even know there even was a question.
Have a great day Rock.
D
.. how she thought I should be more thrifty with spending money and such...
Buy a new motorcycle...go for rides...
Thanks guys.
I have been having some conversations with my financial planner getting my portfolio updated and tidied up and gaining more understanding. I also will talk to L about some questions.
DnJ you said:
“ After her living away for a year I think she has lost the right to tell you, direct you, how thrifty you need to be. Ensure you pay your share of joint expenses, and the rest is your’s to do with as you choose. And yes, giving no response was perfect”
As we have talked about on these boards, for a period of time our financial arrangement had been working reasonably and I did not see a reason to change it. That time may have arrived for the reason that I need more autonomy and privacy from W’s input and interference.
I am considering stating that I will contribute 50% to our shared mortgage and house insurance costs and I will look after my own personal and household expenses. Considering. I don’t know of that’s the right way to go.
Therapist recommended that once W returns from overseas, I tell her, “I will need to make some decisions for me and our family. What are you willing to do? Will you work on the M? I am interested to hear your plans?”
Does this sound like an ultimatum? I don’t want to force or accelerate an outcome I don’t want. I do want to move forward in healthy ways for myself and our family. And I want to be true to what’s important here regardless of outcome. In reality the bad has already happened. We do not have a M relationship whatsoever. The old one is done.
I think I can answer my question. I already know the answer. She has shown only the opposite. She has shown she is not interested in the M and is running as fast an and hard as she can in the opposite direction. So I don’t need to talk or ask or engage and no R talks. Engage and I lose. It’s like swimming up stream
Just act and move forward well.
^^^^^
That was nice to read.
ACTION. GO Rockon!
I am choosing not to bring up W or her trip with our kids. They haven’t been bringing it up. Youngest S has mentioned her casually in conversation here or there about things in our history (camping or dinners or something) and it has been simply conversation that I have with him with the focus on him. I listen and support and I’m honest and available to my kids. Continuing to GAL and get things done.
Hello Rock
As we have talked about on these boards, for a period of time our financial arrangement had been working reasonably and I did not see a reason to change it. That time may have arrived for the reason that I need more autonomy and privacy from W’s input and interference.
As you answered, no real need to discuss with W.
If you want more financial autonomy, then get it.
And of course, it is good practice to reflect and ensure, before implementing a new major change. (You mentioned this as well.
)
Has W been upholding her share/obligations? If so, what would be gained by formalizing it? Realize, your gain is not from the financial side. It’s autonomy and privacy, which sounds quite reasonable.
Are these financial changes things you would continue if you and W were to reconnect? If yes, then it is a good indicator that you are doing this for you, and not some attempt to get a reaction from W. (By the way, if my XW and I ever patched things up and got back together, I’d keep my finances separate for a good long while. A very long while.)
I’d not give W an ultimatum regarding this. (I spoke a bit of ultimatums on Peter’s thread.) You’d more just inform W of what you are doing going forward regarding the joint monies and bills.
D
So I might be having a bit of a realization. As I have said some time ago W told me it’s been almost a year we’ve been separated and instead of being in limbo it’s time we tell more people (and in the conversation she had she explained the news is going to spread like wildfire because “we are kind of a big deal” around our shared circles in our town - I don’t really know what meant by that part).
With her out of the country now for a month and as I am starting to socialize with summertime community events more I anticipate being asked about her. (Eg this weekend will be getting together with extended family gatherings and attending concerts). I have been wondering what I say and feeling pressure to come up with a script.
But I am taking the pressure off myself this afternoon. I can keep my trusted circle of support as small as I want and that feels better to me. When others ask how or where she is I can be honest and reserved with my comfort level and keep loaded leading statements out of it.
Friends: “hey where’s W?”
“She’s on vacation.” “Taken a trip.”
Peripheral Friends or family : “ I heard W has moved out.” “So you’re separated.”
Me : “ya, hey what’s new with you? What’s going on this summer?” Or “Ya she’s staying with her mom.” Really that’s enough said.
W has talked about how she has been avoiding this circle of our friends and has not even seen my dad because she has not been wanting to face these conversations.
Just now had a good connect with D and S in as they sitting together in our living room. I was doing something else in the next room. D said, “I miss mom. (Brother,) you miss mom?”
S: “ya I’ve been seeing some selfies she’s been sending me from her trip.”
D (working on craft): “Dad, you miss Mom?”
Me: “yeah” (stopping what I’m doing and attending to how D is doing. She seems in thought)
Later on when S went outside.
D: “ you are really there for me and I just miss talking to mom about stuff too. “
Me: “ yes I could see that. She means a lot to you she’s your mom.”
After some silence
Me: “ could you reach out to her to talk about stuff? Could you write some things down to talk to her about?”
D: “ya thanks for talking about this Dad”
Me: “anytime”
Please man, stop protecting her. She's out.
Hi Rock,
You have been here for about 9 months, not 9 days. You appear stuck. Not sure why DBing is not clicking with you.
How many new attractive behaviors are now part of your core being?
How many old unattractive behaviors are now now gone from your behavior?
Just ask yourself these questions. Don't tell us your answers.
Make two lists, one of attractive male behavior, the other unattractive male behavior. Again these are your private lists. Live life behaving like the attractive male.
So I might be having a bit of a realization. As I have said some time ago W told me it’s been almost a year we’ve been separated and instead of being in limbo it’s time we tell more people (and in the conversation she had she explained the news is going to spread like wildfire because “we are kind of a big deal” around our shared circles in our town - I don’t really know what meant by that part).
With her out of the country now for a month and as I am starting to socialize with summertime community events more I anticipate being asked about her. (Eg this weekend will be getting together with extended family gatherings and attending concerts). I have been wondering what I say and feeling pressure to come up with a script.
But I am taking the pressure off myself this afternoon. I can keep my trusted circle of support as small as I want and that feels better to me. When others ask how or where she is I can be honest and reserved with my comfort level and keep loaded leading statements out of it.
Friends: “hey where’s W?”
“She’s on vacation.” “Taken a trip.”
Peripheral Friends or family : “ I heard W has moved out.” “So you’re separated.”
Me : “ya, hey what’s new with you? What’s going on this summer?” Or “Ya she’s staying with her mom.” Really that’s enough said.
W has talked about how she has been avoiding this circle of our friends and has not even seen my dad because she has not been wanting to face these conversations.
Wow, that’s a hell of a lot of your life you’ve completely wasted thinking about what may or may not happen. Don’t you have better things to spend your time on?
This is why I pulled back from your threads, because you still are trying to convince yourself you are strong/detached/happy without her, when the reality is that you’re not yet one step along the journey to being detached.
R2C is right. You need to walk into a new therapists office and declare “My wife has left and is divorcing me, I’m completely broken and entirely dependent/attached to this relationship. I need long-term professional help to detach and move on.”
Until you do that, this ain’t going anywhere. You need to try something DIFFERENT.
So I might be having a bit of a realization. As I have said some time ago W told me it’s been almost a year we’ve been separated and instead of being in limbo it’s time we tell more people (and in the conversation she had she explained the news is going to spread like wildfire because “we are kind of a big deal” around our shared circles in our town - I don’t really know what meant by that part).
With her out of the country now for a month and as I am starting to socialize with summertime community events more I anticipate being asked about her. (Eg this weekend will be getting together with extended family gatherings and attending concerts). I have been wondering what I say and feeling pressure to come up with a script.
But I am taking the pressure off myself this afternoon. I can keep my trusted circle of support as small as I want and that feels better to me. When others ask how or where she is I can be honest and reserved with my comfort level and keep loaded leading statements out of it.
Friends: “hey where’s W?”
“She’s on vacation.” “Taken a trip.”
Peripheral Friends or family : “ I heard W has moved out.” “So you’re separated.”
Me : “ya, hey what’s new with you? What’s going on this summer?” Or “Ya she’s staying with her mom.” Really that’s enough said.
W has talked about how she has been avoiding this circle of our friends and has not even seen my dad because she has not been wanting to face these conversations.
Just now had a good connect with D and S in as they sitting together in our living room. I was doing something else in the next room. D said, “I miss mom. (Brother,) you miss mom?”
S: “ya I’ve been seeing some selfies she’s been sending me from her trip.”
D (working on craft): “Dad, you miss Mom?”
Me: “yeah” (stopping what I’m doing and attending to how D is doing. She seems in thought)
Later on when S went outside.
D: “ you are really there for ume and I just miss talking to mom about stuff too. “
Me: “ yes I could see that. She means a lot to you she’s your mom.”
After some silence
Me: “ could you reach out to her to talk about stuff? Could you write some things down to talk to her about?”
D: “ya thanks for talking about this Dad”
Me: “anytime”
And this is a 24 and 26 year old having this conversation huh?
That’s exactly where I’m at. Ready to try something different. I need to.
Keep focusing on me yes. Look after my home and family and get back to work successfully and healthy. Keep GAL.
Otherwise though something different to get better and to detach.
You need to walk into a new therapists office and declare “My wife has left and is divorcing me, I’m completely broken and entirely dependent/attached to this relationship. I need long-term professional help to detach and move on.”
Until you do that, this ain’t going anywhere. You need to try something DIFFERENT.
Wise words.
You also need to find a whole new friend group. People that do not know your W or your kids. Drive 90 minutes if you need to.
That’s exactly where I’m at. Ready to try something different. I need to.
Keep focusing on me yes. Look after my home and family and get back to work successfully and healthy. Keep GAL.
Otherwise though something different to get better and to detach.
These statements contradicts themselves.
We don't have a choice but to take what you say at face value, but I...and I'm sure others, are having a really hard time with this.
Rock you staying the course has gotten you absolutely no where. Your kids are adults, and your daughter is closer to 30 than 20, but these conversations sound like they are coming from younger kids...and even than...I'm struggling to understand why people in their 20s are still stuck on their parents divorce a year later. You're obviously co-dependent on, well your wife and kids, and I'm wondering if your kids are co-dependent on you and your wife. Your kids are in the mid 20's sitting around the house a year later saying they miss mom. Why? Why do they miss mom? Why can't they talk to her, see her, visit her or do whatever they want when Mom's in town? Or is it Mom's gone for a month and that's the issue? Your divorce should have absolutely zero to do with them. They shouldn't be as stuck as your Rock, and in your own sadness that you continue to wallow in with the aww shucks attitude, your entire family is stuck. That's not being a lighthouse or rock. That's holding your kids back, and how you don't see that just shows how deep you are in your despair.
I hope you understand you NEED COUNCILING one way or another. That would be your something different to get detached. No need to tell us about dancing, or visiting friends, or conversations with the community that should have happened 8 months ago...move forward. Get you and your kids in therapy as soon as possible. Stop screwing around hoping as long as you stand still she'll eventually come back. Quite honestly, if your spouse was this horrible woman, she would have called the police on your for stalking. She would take advantage of you financially at every turn, and she would turn the kids against you.
None of this is happening, you know what she's doing, moving on. You know what you are doing, giving her every reason to never look back.
Sorry for the harshness, but as someone who does have full custody of minor children that were abused, it burns my *** to see you basically write out your adult kids are regressing, and you are flat out ignoring it by not addressing you or them.
Rock, you need a girlfriend.
Respect!
Rock, you need a girlfriend.
Respect!
I get why you are saying this - because it would move Rock forward rather than being eternally stuck.
But I don’t think that’s a good way to do it. I couldn’t imagine the pain or damage that this situation might inflict on a new girlfriend. Imagine if 6-12 months down the track, new girlfriend found out that she’s been used as some sort of cheap tool for Rock to try and solve his co-dependency issues.
I’m also sure that nut-job ex-wife would easily manipulate this new relationship. She’d pretend to want Rock back - he’d burn bridges with the new girlfriend, come crawling back - and then ex would laugh in his face. This entire marriage’s dynamic is incredibly unhealthy, and there would be all sorts of attempted manipulation from both sides if another person appeared. Plus, Rock is so co-dependent he would only take a new girlfriend to try and manipulate his ex-wife back. No-one coming into a new relationship deserves that!
Step 1 - long term professional intervention to detach and work on co-dependency issues
Step 2 - (only after step 1 is a success) - find a new girlfriend
This train wreck doesn’t need a third carriage.
21 and 20 both of whom have significant special needs with those of S21 being more severe.
I have been forming this new friend group and it has been refreshing.
Not really tracking with you through all this here Joseph though you make many valid points I’m in therapy - looking after myself and home and family. And to suggest that this shouldn’t affect our kids and it’s not about them well that’s an interesting take - just not an accurate read on how things go all the time.
I don’t see W as a horrible person at all. She has made choices though that have consequences and I am not attracted to who she has become and the way she is living.
Besides therapy how would you recommend I approach this?
Nowhere near ready for a gf
#1. Your update about anger surfacing and you need to protect your family from free radical behavior because she went a month long trip would suggest you do see her as a horrible person but if I misread that than ok.
#2. All your kids are adults; it’s been a year. Here’s the rub for me Rock. Your kids miss their mom, you understand that, haven’t said she’s a bad mom, but she just left 2 of her kids with “significant special needs” for a month…..
#3. I didn't suggest this shouldn’t effect your kids. I suggested they shouldn’t be as adults, really at any age, still this stuck on their parent’s divorce a year later and they need IC. If you wanna twist that into something I didn’t say to play the victim feel free too, it’s your life.
#4. I asked if this was between the 24 and 26 yr old….
When did you start therapy and how often are you going?
I would honestly suggest you file for divorce and save yourself. You’re so unhealthily codependent and you don’t even see it.
Rock I popped in after a few months hiatus to find out that you’re still stuck. In your defense you are getting conflicting advice. You are being told to believe nothing she says, feelings are fleeting and to detach and you’re also being to to divorce her and get a girlfriend.
I still would like you to answer the question if you can just sit with your feelings for a day without the help of your kids, priest, garden or dance instructor? If the answer is no we have a bigger issue then your wife tramping around another country.
You have to save yourself first Rock.
Joseph I value your input and respect your opinions. I need help with some blind spots. I don’t view myself as a victim.
Been in therapy the whole time including intensive ptsd treatment which was 4 times/week. Now once or twice a week.
Hi Boat yes attending to and feeling my feelings.
Rock, you need a girlfriend.
Respect!
I get why you are saying this - because it would move Rock forward rather than being eternally stuck.
But I don’t think that’s a good way to do it. I couldn’t imagine the pain or damage that this situation might inflict on a new girlfriend. Imagine if 6-12 months down the track, new girlfriend found out that she’s been used as some sort of cheap tool for Rock to try and solve his co-dependency issues.
I’m also sure that nut-job ex-wife would easily manipulate this new relationship. She’d pretend to want Rock back - he’d burn bridges with the new girlfriend, come crawling back - and then ex would laugh in his face. This entire marriage’s dynamic is incredibly unhealthy, and there would be all sorts of attempted manipulation from both sides if another person appeared. Plus, Rock is so co-dependent he would only take a new girlfriend to try and manipulate his ex-wife back. No-one coming into a new relationship deserves that!
Step 1 - long term professional intervention to detach and work on co-dependency issues
Step 2 - (only after step 1 is a success) - find a new girlfriend
This train wreck doesn’t need a third carriage.
I know Kind. I know. I'm just shaking the tree a little...
Nowhere near ready for a gf
You are right Rock. Keep walking your road, keep your pace.
Don’t get me wrong.in this journey I have wanted to run from my feelings but I decided to change that and face them.
Rock,
I appreciate the fact you keep coming back, I respect that honestly. I'm not really this much of an a-hole I promise. I'm trying to shock you out of this sir. Get you out of your comfort zone. There's a comfortable town that exists in everyones world. It's call Rut. Alot of people get stuck there and can't get out.
Your kids need more support Rock, and you can't give it to them while you are this stuck. I know this from first hand experience.
The truth is a lot of marriages can't be saved. This isn't a magic bullet, but what DB will do is allow you to save yourself. Once you've saved yourself, became the man you should have been, the idea is that attracts your wife back into the fold.
You marriage is over Rock, I'm not saying there can't be a 2nd chance with your wife, but I am saying the old marriage, the old ways, they are over, and they should be, as that's what got you here in the first place.
Lets try this...and be 100% honest. What exactly do you need? Do you need more aggressive call outs? More supportive calls out? Are you goals still the same?
What can we do to ensure you start moving forward? I've been where you are sir. I've been straight up broken as a man, a person, a father and husband, but I made it to the other side. I put myself back together better than ever and have learn so much. What can we do to get you to our side of the river?
You have got an impressive year long amount of good advice here, Rock.
Free yourself man. You deserve it.
Respect.
Thank you Joseph I believe you and respect the road you have walked and the man I understand you to be. I am trying really hard and not getting there. I know DnJ aka Yoda will say do or do not. So that’s where I need to focus - to discern my path and follow through on the steps to get there.
Believe me I am tempted to throw in the towel say f it get a gf go on a big vacay myself and forget about my responsibilities. I know that’s not right for me. But also staying stuck in a rut and getting rag dolled emotionally is not right for me. Being nice without strong boundaries and action is not good for me nor my family.
My goals right now:
Be strong and healthy for me and for my family including kids, grandkid, my parents. That includes getting back to work well. I have been following all the steps, am on track, and I understand so much more now about how to do this and what I need to do to be well in my profession. I excelled in my career until I became unwell and couldn’t go on. That includes getting support for my kids as you have pointed out. That includes taking good care of my home which I have been doing.
Healthy boundaries with W and her family. That means space to me. And not making rash missteps and decisions based upon my feelings.
Community, friendships, being a healthy mature single man who happens to be separated from a M that is over. Not dating.
From this group, I wouldn’t really change a thing. I value the time and thought you all put into this space and to me. I would prefer you don’t pull punches. What I really need is honesty and compassion and I keep coming back for more of that.
My mind does struggle with understanding and implementing DB to be sure. It is counterintuitive in some ways and these things are not openly talked about in the circles that I come from.
I struggle with the concept of no R talks. Sometimes on these boards I will lose a question. Or dilemma to the group “knowing” the DB answer but still wrestling with it. As F2C said, come here and run it past us first. I have actually not been having R talks. Yes there was that time I accepted a “date” with W about a month ago and she initiated a big talk. I listened validated and STFU. And it took a big toll on me.
My mind goes to a place of if we don’t talk through and deal with stuff am
I just being stuck stubborn and cowardice? Would a 180 be to face fears and talk it through and make some steps in a direction- any direction without ultimatum or pressure?
I don’t know. I think she would perceive it as pressure and a reason to escalate things. It seems to me that I need to act rather than talk.
I recognize that we are not at a place of working on the M. And I think I am closer to what Kind and R2C have just posed to Peter Pan.
We are all #TeamRockon here man.
Sometimes we see you going down in circles. You need to circle up.
You have the tools. Get your goals, your confidence and respect, and keep moving forward.
In your defense you are getting conflicting advice.
Just more options on the choices one can make. What worked for one person can backfire for another, and vise-versa. Each of us have to evaluate the choices, make a decision, and live with consequences of that choice.
Waiting is a good first option. But that should have a time frame. For one person, that might be a month. For another, 6 months. Some 1 year. While waiting, you focus on making positive change to yourself. One change at a time. My changes are different than another persons changes. But, most of us that arrive here have common issues that should be addressed.
On the other hand, waiting looses respect and does not increase attraction. It also allows cake eating.
Some here will tell you to go left, while others will tell you to go right. I believe you should have the skills to go completely left, completely right, or anyplace in between, and immediately change as needed. Do this in all areas. Just don't go in circles. That doesn't work.
Rock, you realize it's ok to be selfish every once in a while right? Even god took a day off my friend. You always mention the community, friends, and family, these are all good things.
You know what's better every once in a while? Me, my motorcycle, my JBL clip on the handle bars, phone mounted for emergency's, rescue kit in back pack and the I'm taking an F it day attitude.
100% serious, I never felt better than I did after a 2 or 3 hour ride. I saw roads and scenery for the first time after "driving" on them for 20 years. I appreciated the beauty of the world around me on a level I never would have prior. I don't live in a city, so there are plenty of back roads around me that I have absolutely screamed my lungs out on at 60ish MPH as well.
You know what was also healing for me...me, my brother, 2 shotguns and a picnic table that was recently replaced that needed to be "chopped" up for the fire. That was a very good day.
I'm not saying these things are for you, but you know what they did for me? Gave me my outlet, Rock, find your outlet, get your self respect back, and take care of yourself.
You know what's better every once in a while? Me, my motorcycle...I have absolutely screamed my lungs out on at 60ish MPH as well. ....find your outlet, get your self respect back, and take care of yourself.
While riding, I would stop at every bar I came across, I would order a water. I would focus on remembering peoples names and their story. I would make every interaction about them. I would practice all my listening skills. I would people watch. Notice how the guys were behaving. How the ladies were behaving. How they would interact. Listen to two ladies talk behind me and taking note of HOW they talked, NOT WHAT they were talking about.
You know what's better every once in a while? Me, my motorcycle...I have absolutely screamed my lungs out on at 60ish MPH as well. ....find your outlet, get your self respect back, and take care of yourself.
While riding, I would stop at every bar I came across, I would order a water. I would focus on remembering peoples names and their story. I would make every interaction about them. I would practice all my listening skills. I would people watch. Notice how the guys were behaving. How the ladies were behaving. How they would interact. Listen to two ladies talk behind me and taking note of HOW they talked, NOT WHAT they were talking about.
Me? I went to the gym. Smashed that sucker once, sometimes twice daily.
And I renovated the house. Granted, that was easy because I was unemployed due to COVID BS. I only made a modest profit, because once the house was renovated, it was sold and I only got 30% or so of the profit.
But it didn’t matter.
It gave me purpose, direction, a reason for getting up. It meant time spent with my brother, my father and friends.
And the gym gave me my sleep back. It wasn’t an overnight cure to rumination or my mind tearing itself to pieces trying to think my way out of things… it meant that by the time I got in to bed, I was so physically exhausted that I would actually fall asleep and get 6-8 hours.
That made a huge difference to my mental health and mindset.
Go ride a motorbike. Go to the gym. Go chop some firewood. Buy a dog.
Do SOMETHING!!!
From you last few posts I’m starting to peer back in, and wondering if you’re finally starting to turn the corner after twelve months.
Caveat on the rest of my post: Sorry to be blunt and rather morbid… but then I’m not known around here for being gentle 🤣 And like Neffer, maybe rattling your tree will help you.
The average life expectancy of a man in the USA is 73. For some perspective:
- if you’re mid forties, you have less than 30 years left. Maybe 28 years until you’re in the ground Rock
- if you’re 53 or older, you have less than 20 years left. Let that sink in. Remember how on your 21st birthday you felt like you had grown up and made it to adulthood - if you’re mid fifties, you have less than that time it took you to make 21 left to go
- even if you’re only 37 years old - you are more than half way through your life.
Think on that for a minute. It’s incredibly sobering.
You’ve just wasted a whole year of your last 20-30 years pining after a, frankly, sick and twisted woman and your dysfunctional relationship together.
Do you think perhaps now, it’s time to let that go and get on with living your life?
If she comes back in 5-10 years well so be it… but I wouldn’t be throwing away what’s left pining for something that is very unlikely to happen (and which sounds toxic anyway).
Time to make some choices.
Alternatively, you could come and live in Australia. Here the male life expectancy is 81 years. And if we all wore sunscreen to prevent melanoma, it would probably jump to 85. That would give you an extra ten years 🤣🤣🤣
You have a way of crystallizing things Kind. Think I should get a motorbike and ramp up the intensity of my training. I had a great dr visit today - reviewed my bloodwork and blood pressure with the nutritionist and internist. Bloodwork all excellent. It’s encouraging and reinforcing to go for it more and live my best.
I have been hiking, dancing, playing tennis but I want to build some more muscle and get leaner. Got a big bag of oats. Eating a lot of fruits and vegetables. I love steaks and I grill my fair share but going for more fish and chicken. And beans and seeds and nuts.
Was out at my sons baseball game tonight with youngest son and my family including my 85 yr old dad who still works out and works a bit and my mom who has a razor sharp wit and who also still works a bit. They are the happiest and kindest people I know.
I hope I’m starting to turn the corner and hit my stride in the right direction.
So I had therapy today as well- forgot about that really enjoyed the full day. Talked about what is sustainable for me for the near future where I need to focus my energy and time. Discussed if I do this well, the unsustainable will become evident.
So zeroing in on what needs my focus and attention, R2C, Joseph, Kind et al you are helping me calibrate my sites.
Meeting with L and financial adviser. Getting things in order and educating myself to be in a position of strength for myself, family and future.
Well done Rock 🫶🏻 sounds like you are very grounded and balanced.
Thanks P5 I am all over the place at times but come back to grounded with learning - and some 2x4s here and there
Celebrated youngest S’s birthday here at our home. Had a wonderful party with a guest list that he compiled: his siblings, my parents, his uncles and aunts from both sides, a few of his close friends and MIL.
After guests had left, S told me, “I have things to say, but I think I need to be quiet and think,” then after I said, “ok,” he began to thoughtfully express his appreciation for me and his home and the party with people important to him.
I had quiet tears and gave him a hug.
W has been video calling, texting and emailing almost every day over the last week while she is away, sending selfies and other photos. There had been no contact either way for the first week. I have responded on rare occasions but not . For example, she asked for photos from the birthday party saying, “So fun. Wish I was there ☺️,” and I sent a few. She said, “Looks like a really wonderful party. You are brave to have all of those people over!”
I replied, “It was wonderful full of so much love.”
W video called (I didn't answer) and also texted earlier in the week acknowledging what I am doing caring for S and said, “I wanted to make sure you’re okay and see if you wanted to talk about it at all.”
I responded after 24 hrs by text, “thank you we are all doing very well.” Shortly thereafter she video called while S and I were driving in the car. S accepted the call and had a conversation with her. She told him about her trip. Mentioned a girlfriend who is on the trip with her (news to me) and some of the food and activities. W asked S how he is doing and he gave her an update basically saying he is doing great. She said hello to me and I said hello. W also asked S to show me photos she had sent to him. He did that later.
She texted me after and said “I’ll talk to you guys later. Have a fun day. 🥰”
I’m checking in here for some perspectives and guidance, DnJ, Kind, R2C, Joseph, and also thinking about you P5 with your H away on his holiday. This adds up to a lot of emotional turbulence for me and I’m managing ok. Staying focused following the plan for me.
I’m processing that this is a time for me to be cautious and stay within what limits are reasonable for me. For example, that was a lot of family and social for the party etc. and I need to continue GAL.
I’m checking in here for some perspectives and guidance, DnJ, Kind, R2C, Joseph,
Best thing to do is reflect on every interaction with W and determine how well you behaved in line with your DBing goal behaviors.
You can also step out of your yourself and peer into the interactions. Would an outsider see that she has more respect for you? Did her attraction increase of decrease? You can ask yourself 10 more questions like this.
My 2 cents: Since your posts are still bringing up W, you are not fully DBing. You are well out of triage.
As far as guidance, someone here recommended you need a girlfriend. I would change this to "the skills" to get a girlfriend. Then, you need skills to keep a girlfriend. Before that, you need skills to walk away from women.
One skill to practice here is to not bring up your W. Talk about Rock. The more specific, the better.
Examples: "I met two new people this morning. I made one of them laugh."
I get that R2C. I had been refraining from bringing up W here but I am wanting to come here and talking about this stuff instead of keeping it to myself and impulsively acting out emotionally.
I was dealing well with W’s absence and focusing and following through on my path. And now I have been finding W’s contact to be intrusive and potentially destabilizing for me. Therefore I am doing what it takes to stay on my path. Following though on my clarified values.
Reflecting on the interactions I have had with her while she’s away, what I’ve been doing well:
24-48 hr rule responding when it makes sense for me when I’m ready and when it’s important
STFU
Acknowledge and validate others emotional state
No R talks no pressure not initiating
GAL
Not so well:
I’ve been experiencing some emotional distress at W’s contact and having some challenges disciplining my mind and choosing my thought track and influencing my own well being - actually as I this that out maybe I’m doing this pretty well.
As far as working on those skills without getting a gf, R2C, I have been doing that. Yes with the party etc that has been appropriately intensive with family, guests etc with focus on S22 - btw didn’t bring W at all in those settings and circles. But I got right back to focusing on Rock, GAL with new friend group : mixed of various ages and yes being friendly and fun and walking away from W not giving the signal that I want to date. Community health for me. And social skills.
Glad your son had a good party. Always a blessing to be there. I’m just gonna take your last 2 post point by point.
#1. She says “so much fun wish I was there”…Rock you realize this is lip service? She planned a trip that purposely missed the birthday. No she didn’t wish she was there or she would have been. She was exactly where she wanted to be.
#2. So many people=unnecessary chit chat.
#3. Has anyone heard this “female” friend that was news to you on the video call? We sure we shouldn’t be taking the fe part out of that word?
#4. She not concerned about your child with special needs, she concerned about you. That right there tells us all you aren’t as ok as your want us to believe.
Rock I’ve alluded to this before, I really believe you use the special needs to keep contact more often than necessary. If it was that dire than why is she leaving for a month? And if it is that dire, why are you trying to fix a relationship with a woman who doesn’t seem to much care it’s dire?
I honestly believe your wife thinks you guys are friends and has been placating you through a lot of this.
Do you have a history of self harm or threats of self harm?
As for advice, don’t talk to her again while she’s gone. I can almost guarantee she’s on a trip with another man, and even if she isn’t it doesn’t change the fact there’s nothing to talk her about. She can converse with her children just fine without you. As a matter a fact I suggest you tell her to stop sending you anything.
Thanks Joseph I appreciate the input. Yes I totally get that she made her choice about this trip. And I have to assume it’s with OM. The female friend’s name that W mentioned is someone I know to be her friend but I had not been aware that friend was travelling with W but whatever.
I don’t understand point #4. Her checking in to see how I’m doing is new (since BD that has been exceptionally rare).
You said, “Rock I’ve alluded to this before, I really believe you use the special needs to keep contact more often than necessary. If it was that dire than why is she leaving for a month? And if it is that dire, why are you trying to fix a relationship with a woman who doesn’t seem to much care it’s dire?
I honestly believe your wife thinks you guys are friends and has been placating you through a lot of this.”
So that is true that I did accommodate more contact than I wanted with W in the fall and winter and I justified that because of S’s unique care needs and out of respect and honor of their relationship. I decided to change that approach shortly after I decided to stop facilitating family togetherness with W.
Now I am being more consistent in necessary communication only. And leaving W’s R with that S up to her as I have been doing with regards to our other young adult kids.
I have no history of self harm nor threats. W has done that to me however on occasion since BD.
She may be temp checking, she may have had an argument with the OM and used you to feel better, she may feel guilty missing the birthday. It really could be anything, but it’s not her wanting to return to fix anything.
Maybe it’s time you sit down with your kids and ask if they’d like to see a therapist. I think you’ve been there for them more than most, but regardless of their needs, they are adults, you won’t be around forever, and they need to learn to have a relationship with their mother that’s separate from you. That’s just general advice from all the posts not just this one.
Honestly Rock, I don’t know you obviously, but you just seem like a shell of a person. Like the very definition of trudging through this.
I do believe in fixing marriages and I believe marriages can even come back from affairs.
I really believe in your case your only chance with your wife is to make her your ex. Grab this situation by the short and curly’s and, divorce her, become the best version of you and see if that catches her attention.
Even if you don’t wanna file, you are stuck and really don’t see it and that needs to change for you to have a chance.
Do you happen to live in the mid Atlantic region of the USA? I feel like you need a weekend with me lol.
Not close to the mid Atlantic but there is such a thing as air travel nowadays!
“ Maybe it’s time you sit down with your kids and ask if they’d like to see a therapist. I think you’ve been there for them more than most, but regardless of their needs, they are adults, you won’t be around forever, and they need to learn to have a relationship with their mother that’s separate from you.”
I have been having this conversation with them including yesterday afternoon with youngest D. She has started IC now and also last night D went and had dinner with a close friend (a solid kind strong married woman mentor) and she told me they talked a lot.
I am at the place to make changes and become unstuck. Im not ready to file today but that could change. I’m not a robot.
I need to live like I am single. Single and not dating. And the best version of me. It’s not built in a day but rather consistent effort in clear direction.
I think nobody here is prompting you to file for anything Rock.
Date yourself. That's what I meant when I said you needed a GF. Enjoy your best version. Be proud of the road you are taking.
Be the lighthouse for the ones around.
Keep detaching and DBing. You wait for no one.
Let’s try something different.
What’s something you’ve always wanted to try but have had some reservations about it? Me it’s sky diving. I wanna go so bad but I can’t wrap my head around jumping out of perfectly good plane. Scares the hell-o out of me. Lol. I’ll tell you what, if I went it would grab a whole lot of attention from people that know me though. And for someone who really knows me very well may wonder if I’m about to die because I finally did it. Lol. It would be so out of character…but if I was divorce busting, that would be something I would do.
My ex never allowed me to get a bike. Always talked about how dangerous it was. How I was stupid for riding one when I was a teenager (I don’t disagree there and it’s a flat out act of god that I’m alive)….so when I got one, it caught her attention and she knew I was moving on and boy she scratched and clawed when that happened. You know a few weeks ago she told me she thought I was having a mid life crisis when I got one. Yep at 37 after everything I was going through it must have been a mid life crisis. But that wasn’t the point. I did something for myself that was out of character that I loved and it got her attention so much so she explained it away as if I was in crisis.
I think it’s against forum rules for me to give out to much about myself or where I am, but I’m about an hour away from the liberty bell around a lot of people who think horse and buggies are the best way to travel. If you ever find yourself in this area let me know. Lol
Now that I’m thinking about it, the cliff notes version of what I’m trying to say it,
Take back your life. Take back control. We got one life to live and we don’t get another day tacked on the end because we wasted time.
My ex never allowed me to get a bike. Always talked about how dangerous it was. How I was stupid for riding one when I was a teenager (I don’t disagree there and it’s a flat out act of god that I’m alive)….so when I got one, it caught her attention and she knew I was moving on and boy she scratched and clawed when that happened. You know a few weeks ago she told me she thought I was having a mid life crisis when I got one. Yep at 37 after everything I was going through it must have been a mid life crisis. But that wasn’t the point. I did something for myself that was out of character that I loved and it got her attention so much so she explained it away as if I was in crisis.
Oh this is great. Makes my head spin. In my dreams I’d book a trip just for myself, to someplace I’ve long wanted to go to but she doesn’t, and say, “Remember how I’ve always said I wanted to go to XXXX? Well, my flight’s booked, I’m leaving on [date]. See ya!”
Not the most practical thing right now, but I’m definitely going to think about other desires along these lines.
I think it’s against forum rules for me to give out to much about myself or where I am, but I’m about an hour away from the liberty bell around a lot of people who think horse and buggies are the best way to travel. If you ever find yourself in this area let me know. Lol
One of my favorite areas to visit. This was on our short list of possible retirement locations in better times.
If you have always listened to country music, listen to death metal. Or vice vera. (for like 6 months).
Any ideas of some things that are out of character you’d like to try? You gotta pull yourself out of your comfort zone.
Get a motorbike
Go on a wilderness off grid trip
Start a band
Dancing has been an example so far in this category. Was never a dancer and found it intimidating but now I’m going for it and enjoying it. Getting positive feedback on my progress.
Lets practice improving your posts:
How about expand on this:
The more specific and detailed the better. A couple ideas to get started: New or used? Road or Dirt? Time frame with a date....
Probably a cafe racer not too big. Used in good shape that I can take care of.
I’d like to get it now and I have been looking but I have a few other priorities to take care of so it might be realistically next spring.
Sent D off to camp this morning where she will be leading teen girls. She is a strong, resilient, beautiful young woman and I’m very proud of her. So it’s S and I. We are doing very well. Some extended family are in town so lots of family fun planned. I will carve out my GAL time. Dancing tonight, kayaking tomorrow. Enjoying my friend group. Healthy social and fun. Wearing my wedding ring is a helpful reminder of my reality. At dances some people have asked about my wife. I don’t mention much (they are not in my close circle of trust). I just say, “this is for me. I have finally decided to learn to dance.” Have done some social things outside of dance with mixed small groups. Not dates. Going to a birthday party next weekend from that group.
Enjoying some steaks with decent red wine in my price range recently off the grill just for me in the evening. I love good food and I’m getting such satisfaction from cooking. Been moderating my red meat for health but nothing quite like it.
Have had very encouraging dr appts recently that confirm the health progress I’ve been making and inspire me to take it further.
Definitely thinking of how much I would enjoy a bike for the rest of this summer.
What can you do now that would pull you out of your comfort zone? I’m glad you found dancing and are enjoying it, but let’s amp it up.
Can you buy a $200 beater bike to start working on to turn into a cafe racer?
Can I ask a quick question? Have you ever seen Risky Business with Tom Cruise? There’s a line in it that says “Sometimes you just gotta say WTF and make your move”….I take that as sometimes you can’t analyze every aspect of a situation before you make a decision, sometimes you just gotta go for it.
I’m not talking about your marriage but I am talking about you. I think you are taking the smallest of steps, but the real reason I push so hard rock is you can’t save your marriage without saving yourself.
.. it might be realistically next spring.
I have been thinking about this statement since you posted it. I agree with Joseph. 6 months out is not where you should be focusing your changes. Today, tomorrow, and this week.
Ok guys a sense of calm this morning and yes I’m going to talk to my friend who has a bike and who sells cars and I’m going to move this timeline up. This is not a reaction or anything except something I want for who I want to be.
Having a great week camping with youngest S and small group of good friends. Lots of sun, sand, waves and fresh air and lots of really great food. Good getaway.
Sounds perfect Rock, keep up the focus on you & the kids lives
When does the motorbike arrive?
Checked out a couple bikes. My imagination is fired up.
Looking at a bike today. Getting some good guidance from my friend. Continuing to face and feel my emotions and process grief. I think a bike could really fit well with this process.
Been having limited intermittent interactions with W and they have been difficult for me. When I have had breaks from her I have begun to do better. She is back from her trip and has told me that she is stressed and bored on some occasions and happy healthy and rested on another. She took youngest S out a couple of times this weekend and that required some communication and coordination regarding his needs.
Some examples of the interactions I have found difficult:
W called me on Saturday because her (our) car was not driving properly and she pulled off to the side of the road. I didn’t answer her call at first and she texted saying she needed me to call her right away. She was distressed and said “Why won’t you answer your phone? I need help.” I replied calmly that I don’t always have my phone with me and asked what she needed. I drove over and assisted her with the car. She was on her way over to take S out.
Yesterday morning W reached out to discuss some things from her time with S from the day before.
She brought up some things from my week of camping with S and how S had told her that it was hard. She said that I had given the impression that it was great (it was!). I asked for more specifics about what S had described as hard. She didn’t elaborate and went on to say I’m not telling her everything and that I project this glossy picture of my life. She also brought up a difficult time a few weeks ago that S told her about from when she was away on her trip. She asked why I didn’t tell her about that. I told her that we managed that difficult time well and I would be happy to talk more with her about it. She told me she didn’t want to.
She then went on to say that she was trying to plan another activity with S later that day (yesterday). I replied that the vehicle was ready for them (I had vacuumed and taken complete care of the vehicle in preparation). They went out later for an hour or so. I returned home and W criticized me on the state she had noticed my (our) other vehicle in (it needs a wash and vacuum post camping). Without becoming defensive, I replied that I’m taking care of it and I had to go since I had dinner in the oven.
I’m writing all this here as some of my process. I want to avoid analyzing interactions. But to acknowledge that it is strained and difficult and I am working on myself and how I show up. And I’m being honest with myself that interacting with her takes a toll on me.
She doesn’t respect you Rock. Until that happens you have zero shot at reconciliation. Stop catering to her and stop being her whipping boy. Until you do so you will continue to suffer immensely.
Stop catering to her and stop being her whipping boy.
When I was single, a lady asked me to buy her a drink. I said "Absolutely, after you buy me one."
This thought process is how you get respect from a woman.
Yes it’s clear to me she doesn’t respect me. I have been establishing my self respect living what is important to me.
Just found a great project bike. Setting up a time to look at it.
Yes it’s clear to me she doesn’t respect me. I have been establishing my self respect living what is important to me.
Are you though? You took quite a bit of disrespect in your previous post, and you readily admit that. It's been basically a year, these boundaries should have been set and established a long time ago. You don't seem to quite grasp that you can not nice your way back. I'm not going to tell you to work on it, I'm gonna tell you stop, yesterday.
Also, again, your children are adults. Why in the world do you need to be the middle man? You don't, period. You know why you didn't tell her about the "difficult" time S had while she was gone? Because you handled it and there's zero point in making it an issue now, which has been how much later?
You really cleaned and vacuumed the car for them in preparation...seriously? And how did that work out for ya? Ya got scolded like a little kid because of the other car being dirty. In the future you clean and vacuum your car for a date, absolutely not in this situation.
Lastly, AAA is a thing. Uber is a thing. LYFT is a thing, tow trucks are a thing. Come on now, this isn't your problem to fix. S wasn't with her yet, so not...your....problem.
She doesn't respect you at all, and it's painful to watch how little self respect you have as you sit there and take it.
Just found a great project bike. Setting up a time to look at it.
That's it? Nothing about the year, make, model?....
Maybe I'm seeing more to this than there is...but to me, this update explains why there's been a lack of them, and it's a decent backslide.
Hello Rock
I’m being honest with myself that interacting with her takes a toll on me.
Yep, it certainly does.
So what are you going to do? That’s do, not try. Do a 180, or try more of the same?
W needs to feel the loss before she might turn around. She goes silent for a while, starts to feel the loss, and then contacts you. Even if her reason is frivolous, she contacts you, and gets her fix.
W called me on Saturday because her (our) car was not driving properly and she pulled off to the side of the road. I didn’t answer her call at first and she texted saying she needed me to call her right away. She was distressed and said “Why won’t you answer your phone? I need help.” I replied calmly that I don’t always have my phone with me and asked what she needed. I drove over and assisted her with the car.
Some advice, or maybe even wisdom if you see it that way:
W is a grown woman, let her fail. Car troubles, so what. She can call a tow truck and look after things. It’s her idea to not be around you. So let her. Let her feel that.
That’s not mean or vindictive, it’s standing up for yourself. And it is displaying respect for W and her ability as an adult. Let her grapple with her responsibilities. She’s driving the car; you’re not even there.
If you were employing the 24-48 hour rule, this matter would have had to be handled by W. You would have simply gone about your day, doing whatever was interrupted.
Another strategy, only deal with texts and phone messages on Friday evening, or some other night once a week. You can tell her that too. I’d also add, a vague text of “call me right away” is no good. If there is truly an emergency state such. These crying wolf episodes are diluting my belief in your sincerity of stated need.
Do you recall my advice of not contacting or responding to her for her month long vacation? That was a golden opportunity for you, and likely for her too.
As for her telling you about son’s time camping and stuff. Pffft. Ignore her! W will twist and sow doubts in you.
Look, if son has a problem he needs to come to you. And you know the camping was great. Put W’s poisonous words at arm’s length. Actually, toss her words aside, and get back to focus on you.
She also brought up a difficult time a few weeks ago that S told her about from when she was away on her trip. She asked why I didn’t tell her about that. I told her that we managed that difficult time well and I would be happy to talk more with her about it. She told me she didn’t want to.
Sheesh. First she’s mad you didn’t inform her when she was away without you and family. Then she’s not pleased that you handled it. And when you offer to actually talk to her now, she doesn’t want to. So why is she bringing it up? Why Rock? Because she is using it against you. Trying to justify her feelings, decisions, and path.
Stop taking the bait. Go weekly with her. She has a weekly window of time (minutes, not hours) to discuss stuff with you. She best not waste that precious limited time on projections and frivolous garbage. Of course, that’s her choice. Once time elapses, you stop reading texts/emails, hang up. Then she’s got to wait seven more days.
I’m writing all this here as some of my process. I want to avoid analyzing interactions. But to acknowledge that it is strained and difficult and I am working on myself and how I show up.
I think a little less “showing up” for W would be beneficial. Be less available. Be doing something. And it’s ok for it to not be any of her business. In fact, I’d ensure to make it that way.
D
I walked away from your posts because it was too frustrating to see someone continually make weak decisions and find every excuse under the sun to justify ignoring advice here.
Then about 4-6 weeks ago I got sucked into re-engaging because I thought you were actually making some progress.
Fool on me.
I replied …. and asked what she needed.
You need to reframe this to what actually happened:
I positively reinforced to my mentally ill ex that I’ll continue to be her whipping boy and give her the green light to perpetually treat me like sh**.
You know what you have to do, you’re just never going to do it. Saving your marriage or at least healing from the inevitable divorce requires you to show some backbone.
DNJ would have to be the most compassionate and patient and empathetic person here, and even he’s begging you harden up.
PEOPLE ONLY TREAT YOU IN THE WAY THAT YOU ALLOW.
1974 Honda CB550 Black photos look great! It was a project on the back burner for present owner.
Have you bought the bike Rock? Sounds like something you're really interested in for you. I say go for it!!
I'm just back from pantomime rehearsals (not sure if panto is a british thing?). I am the least theatrical person you could come across. I'm very self conscious & very self critical but wanted to push myself in my GAL activity goal of improving confidence. I absolutely love it now. Not the acting (I still hate that) but the local community people are all amazing and it really is so funny doing it & I've met a bunch of amazing people.
Put your reservations and thoughts to one side & push yourself to do something just for you. Not for W or S. Just for you.
That is really great MA with the panto community!
Looking at the bike on Friday. The seller is away til then.
Yes it is definitely for me.
It’s funny what we decide to do during this time. I am commemorating my new beginning with a tattoo to remind me daily that I am strong and this experience is about self growth
Been thinking about ink for me too.
Ok as I’m starting to write this post I’m thinking ahead to DB which I know to be continue to GAL and remain focused on my principles, values and goals.
Youngest D is in the process of moving out into a great place. I’m excited for her and have been communicating my belief in her and that I see this as a great step for her. Us men (S’s and I) are taking her out to dinner tonight to celebrate this milestone for her.
W has been connecting more herself with youngest S and D without me making it happen and she has been providing support to D with her move, helping her with some packing etc.
Yesterday W tried to call me and then texted asking me to call her. I did. She wanted to talk to me about her conversation with eldest D - she had just talked with her on the phone. They have been very disconnected and W hadn’t talked with her since before her trip. She said it was a very difficult conversation and and that D was rude to her and W ended up hanging up. W also voiced to me a lot of other stress: her lack of R with eldest S, W says she has no friends, she hates her job, land there’s a lot of tension/animosity in her family. She showed a lot of distressing emotion with tears on the call. I validated her emotional state gently and expressed that I see that she is going though a lot of really hard things. And I didn’t try to fix anything for her.
It was a big call and it’s hard for me even to type it out. There was a lot to it. As I was saying I needed to go, youngest S knocked on my door. I came out still on the phone. W and S said hi. S and I planned to go for an outing. S invited W to join.
S and I went to a recreation spot and W and her mom met us there after S and I had played for a while. We greeted W and MIL. They were both friendly. W seemed fragile. She said she was spent. S and W had some time together. It was fairly brief (20 minutes?) that they were there with us.
W brought up with me in front of her mom an idea of making some together plans (going on a trip together to visit some friends). I said, “Maybe. I’ll have to see.”
Just my 2 cents:
Yesterday W tried to call me and then texted asking me to call her. I did.
I texted her back:"W, I am busy, what do you need?"
Just my 2 cents:
Yesterday W tried to call me and then texted asking me to call her. I did.
I texted her back:"W, I am busy,
what do you need?"
Yes those responses would have also been apropo
1978 Suzuki GS 550
Lights haven’t been wired in yet otherwise good to go
For clarity, I haven’t bought the bike. Going to check this new one out.
Good Morning Rock
Please start a new thread.
And best of luck with the bike.
Hmmm, new thread, new bike. Could be a thing.
D