Divorcebusting.com
Posted By: Ready2Change Quotes Found on Divorce Busting (14) - 02/16/23 11:25 PM
As I read through the forums on Divorce Busting, I like to grab the nuggets of gold and share.

My advise, commit to personal growth. What you judge in others, you condemn in yourself. Take all the focus off of your spouse and address your own issues. How hard is it to change your own behavior? Now think how hard (almost impossible) to change someone else.

If you have kids, commit to being the best parent ever. Frequent and equal contact with both parents is important. You are responsible for your relationship with your kids. Let your spouse be responsible for their relationship with the kids. Learn new ways of parenting. Lots of great books out there. Most of the relationship skills dealing with spouse will also help in parenting.

Set goals for the future and keep taking steps to get there. Do this in all areas (SPIES - Social, Physical, Intellectual, Emotional, Spiritual.) Get in alignment (Beliefs, Thoughts, Body Language, Tones, Words, Actions) with your core values.

Try new ways of interacting. Read about boundaries and learn how to set and enforce them. Be in the present. Let go of the past and do not fear the future. Learn ways of being more attractive, especially in your behavior. Learn ways of being seductive (indirectly attracting). This is an extremely important set of skills to understand.

The best way to respond to a particular event? Initially, the best action to take is no action. Do your homework here. Do not react emotionally. Stay neutral. Seek wise council here. Evaluate all the different options and the possible outcomes of each. Challenge your current beliefs. Make a choice and live with the consequences, good or bad. Things are predictable. Read and read and read. Get mentally ahead of your spouse in the whole process ASAP, they are ahead right now.



As far as your spouse, until you have enough info to prove this wrong, assume there is another person (Hint: This is your first 180). Do not reveal anything about what you know and how you found out. "We both know that is a lie." is a great way to deal with any deception.



I wish everyone well during these difficult times. Remember that everything will be OK no matter what the WAS chooses.

"You can handle it"-Coach

Books:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2061094#Post2061094

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My Sitch:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2061092#Post2061092
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2943745#Post2943745

Originally Posted by Rejoice
I looked in his truck, and found the letter.
I was snooping, and I have apologized to him for that.
Originally Posted by SteveLW
You apologized for what? Having a suspicion and finding exactly what you were looking for? PLEASE (and anyone else reading this) never ever apologize for finding proof of your suspicions! I hate when a cheater tries to turn the blame around on to a snooping spouse! That is just flat out wrong. It is never ever worse to snoop than it is to be cheating and the cause of the snooping!
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2943773#Post2943773

Originally Posted by bttrfly
No way to polish the turd that is divorce. However, since this is your current reality, I will pass on the advice given to me here and by my lawyer and our mediator when I faced the true end of my marriage: treat it all as a business deal.

Your old marriage is a company dissolving. The two principals are dividing assets and liabilities.

Do all you can to keep a business frame of mind during the negotiation process.

Allow yourself to collapse into the emotions away from the lawyers, kids, well intentioned friends, family and even posters here, including myself. This is a very private walk you have to make by yourself.

For me, I'd already spent a lot of time during our protracted negotiation really trying to figure out what I wanted, what my core values are, and how to best express them through this process while protecting myself and my son. In hindsight, I have no regrets about taking that approach.

If any of this resonates with you, use it with my blessing.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2943914#Post2943914

Originally Posted by Dats000
Coming from someone with extremely high anxiety, I’m telling you that detaching, following Sandy’s rules, exercising, reading self help books, stretching, meditation, meeting with my IC weekly, getting back into photography, etc. allows me to get out of bed in the morning, go to work and be the father that my kids need. None of this stuff came easy. Example: exercise, I had to make it a goal to just do 5 min so it wasn’t so overwhelming. Now I’m doing over 3 miles a day. You can do this!
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2943994#Post2943994

Originally Posted by Rockon
I have been using time and space for me. At first when I was learning about it I thought I was doing it for W giving her space and it’s true she said she wanted space so I was respecting that. But I learned from these boards the ideas of giving her more space than she is asking for and having the gift of time for me.

So I am taking big breaks from worrying about W and her behaviors and living my life instead. Not reaching out to her checking my intentions/motives before doing so if I think it’s necessary and then using less words.

And if she and I do talk or spend any time together, I am settling my nervous sure before with regulation/relaxation skills and not focusing on W unless we are speaking with each other. In that case I focus on listening and being present and not reacting.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944010#Post2944010

Originally Posted by bttrfly
D = Don't
E = Even
T = Think
A = About
C = Changing
H = Her
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944085#Post2944085

Originally Posted by Mach1
Newer posters, take the time to go back and read the archives....



Starsky309 / puppydogtails

Coach

Forrestgump

MrBond

Sandi

Jack_3_Beans

Bworl

Ericmsant

Truegritter

Lostforwords

Cat04

AmyC


Those will/can serve you well.....
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944119#Post2944119

Originally Posted by job
Tagging on Cadet's posting about this is according to script. Yes, it is. Generally, they begin distancing themselves from us, then the kids, pets, home and old friends and family. If and when they begin to come to their senses and start to wake up, the reconnection will be in the exact opposite order.

They have to distance from us and the children because they don't want to feel guilty or have second thoughts about what they are doing. In crisis, they go back in time to a place where it all the hurt or lack of validation began. Once they get back to that place, their journey has begun and need to figure out the why, what if, etc. of how they feel. They need to learn that they are not at fault for what transpired back then. Childhood drama plays a huge role in all of this, but depression is the number one factor that travels with them throughout.

All you can do is be the best parent you can be for your children. Let them know that you are there to listen and encourage them. Right now, believe it or not, you are the sane parent who is their lighthouse in the storm. Keep the focus on you and your children and dig deeper for patience and understanding.

This was one of the first Mantras : "What is best for my kids is best for me". Using this as a guide for all of my decision during the storm and afterwards. For example, is talking bad about their mother good for them, no, so don't do it.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944178#Post2944178

Originally Posted by Dats000
I have been reading up on gratitude and how it’s a learned behavior it’s not something hardwired into our bodies. Unlike negative thoughts which is something that’s hardwired into our body from our ancestries. And that gratitude relieves stress and anxiety and makes us happy. They had an exercise that a person could do called gratitude check. you could do by yourself or with someone else. I started doing it with my kids. if any of us start saying negative things someone can say gratitude check to the person and that person has to list 10 things that they are grateful for and specifics about it. It’s a fun activity. My daughter loves it and I actually feel really good after doing it. something to consider with your kids or yourself. Some things that I was grateful for yesterday was a beautiful day for a walk in the wilderness with my my dog that’s been by my side through this, my new shoes that made my feet feel so good when I was walking. My counselor that every week tells me how great I’m doing and reminds me how much I have improved, how much this forum has helped me when I don’t know what to do so I just get online and read, write/journal, receive advice from such wonderful people I’ve never met before, the nice meal I had for lunch at one of my favorite restaurants how good that food was, etc..
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944191#Post2944191

Originally Posted by DnJ
Please don’t borrow trouble. Worrying why H is seeking a conversation is nonproductive. Fear breeds fear. It steals your time. It steals your present. (((Hugs)))
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944285#Post2944285

Originally Posted by Kind18
Don’t be too harsh on yourself. Lock this experience in the memory bank so that next time it occurs you can think to yourself “I’ve seen this BS before, I’m not falling for it.”

The only way to learn how to walk is to fall over a few times. You’re doing great 👍

In terms of getting sucked into a discussion about your changes being temporary, you need to have some standard lines in your head that you’ve practiced and have ready to go.

Next time he says he thinks your changes are temporary, how about these:

a) “Hahahaha… You can believe it or not, I couldn’t give two sh**s what you think. My changes are for me 🤷‍♂️”
b) “Don’t worry, it won’t be you that benefits from the new and improved me 😉”
c) “Omg yawn-fest, this conversation is so boring, I’ve got better things to do. I’m going out!”
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944272#Post2944272


Originally Posted by MikeP
Her words exactly: "I want, to want to be here."
Originally Posted by DnJ
That’s different than “I don’t want to be here”, in my opinion. True it’s not the grand committed statement of wanting to work things out. However, that’s not how these situations go. It took a while for her to stray and decide to want to leave, it takes a while for that to unwind. It starts with a whisper of doubt. The tiny voice and realization of what they might just be tossing away.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944273#Post2944273

Originally Posted by DnJ
A great many ideas of divorce busting pertain to dealing with our emotionally distance spouse. And there is almost always a directed hurtful and disrespectful display from our spouse too.

Kids are usually collateral damage during bomb drop and its aftermath. And sometimes they are even targeted, not merely just within the blast radius, rather blasted directly.

Divorce busting encourages self control, realization of what one truly can control, and fosters accountability and self respect. Just a few of the tenets of DBing. Principles of life that kids certainly do benefit from.

A lot of situations the kids are still wanted by both parents. In some cases kids are weaponized and become pawns in a battle they want nothing to do with. And in some cases, like my own, kids are “divorced” from their own parent. Just tossed aside.

I’m a big proponent of gently steering children towards understanding, compassion, empathy, acceptance, and forgiveness. Depending upon the situation, and how inquisitive the youngsters are, depends on how much needs to be, or should be, shared. It’s a tricky landscape, especially when the LBS is freshly hurt, like the kids are.

I was particularly fortunate to find forgiveness rather quickly, along with understanding and compassion. I encouraged those lessons with my kids, having many conversations with them. And I’m a pretty hopeful empathic optimistic guy, so they got lots of that too. smile

Like I said, I was fortunate with what was placed in my path after bomb drop. A lot of fantastic information and lessons blessed upon me.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944353#Post2944353

Originally Posted by Dats000
I truly believe that God brought me to this marriage saving site as a gift when I was weary and carrying the heavy burden of my W request for a divorce. This was his way of teaching me to deal with my pain and how how I found rest for my soul. If I didn’t act on reading DR and GAL, detaching, doing a 180 things wouldn’t have gotten better. I’m definitely not out of the woods, but definitely in a better place and definitely a better person. I also know my work in improving myself is something that I have to work on the rest of my life if I want to be the person I want to be.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944361#Post2944361

Originally Posted by bttrfly
Some people would say as long as their spouse is fooling around, they are not interested in working things out.

Other people would say, "You know what? I'm ok being part of a three way relationship. I'm ok waiting this out regardless of what other people think."

Still other people would have yet a completely different take on this situation. There are as many people as there are opinions.

The worst thing anyone can do, IMHO, is to take a survey. So what do you do instead?

Don't worry about anything or anyone else's opinions, mine included.

Figure out what YOU want.

Meditate.

Pray for guidance.

Sit quietly, trusting that the answers will come.

Then act accordingly.

You need to be completely true to yourself, AS YOU ARE TODAY, and when it's time to take any action do so FREE FROM FEAR.

What do I mean, AS YOU ARE TODAY:
* grief changes you
* betrayal changes you and the dynamic of your relationship
* you know who you were when you were single
* you know who you were in your marriage
* figure out who you are NOW, post BD

THE ONLY WAY to figure that out is to put in the work: quiet, peace, prayer/meditation.

Deep work which requires time, effort and patience.

I strongly suggest you read the archives and study the women who posted here: Sotto, Cat04, Grace, Rosalinda, to name a very few.

Read and keep re-reading the DR MLC chapter, if you think that an MLC is what's going on with your husband.

DO understand that he is not on your team at the moment, so treat him accordingly. What do I mean:

* Don't play games - don't be deliberately vague to make him jealous. That's baby stuff and stupid. He doesn't need to know any details about where you're going or who you're having dinner with if you're going out, but keep it vague because he's no longer in the circle of trust. Don't keep it vague because you're hoping for a reaction; that will come back and bite you in the @$$ every time.

* Snarky may feel good in the moment, but doesn't necessarily further your goals. In other words - don't get into a race to the bottom. Does anyone really want to win a race to the bottom? If you're in that race, and you win, what have you actually gained? My experience is it's much better to be kind, compassionate, yet firm and no-nonsense, striving to always take the high road.

Plus, bonus points because it infuriates the hell out of the spouse - hey I'm no saint - I said striving to take the high road. We're allowed to enjoy watching them squirm from time to time, given what we're put through.

That aside, by taking the high road you will get respect. They may not show it or say it in the moment, but trust me, you will get validation on this down the road. It's never ever wrong to take the high road while refusing to be a Persian carpet for someone to wipe their dirty shoes on as they walk all over you towards the door, or try to turn the door into a revolving one.

* DO understand that it's ok to listen, validate and respond with, "Thank you for talking with me about where you're at. I'm not ready to respond yet, as you've given me a lot to process and think about. I'll let you know when I've thought about this some more." Wash, rinse and repeat that as often as necessary ... see my next point.

* DO not be pushed into a conversation that could be detrimental to your end goal, BUT before you can even know what your end goal is YOU NEED TO KNOW WHAT IT IS YOU WANT and WHAT YOUR PERSONAL BOUNDARIES/DEALBREAKERS ARE.

* DO be honest, but non-committal until you know what you want.

* DO treat him like you'd treat a nosy co-worker who wants access to more information about your personal life than they have a right to know. Be polite, but you owe zero explanations that you don't want to give. This is hard to do if you don't know what your personal boundaries are. How can you uphold them if you haven't spent time really working on knowing what those boundaries are?

* DO understand that you deserve someone who loves you as much as you love them, is as honest, loyal and loving as you are. Is that your husband? Is he capable of that level of accountability, selflessness, honesty and loyalty? Does that remain to be seen? If he's truly in a MLC, it takes much longer than a few weeks or months to come out of that, with or without another party in the mix.


But most importantly, do YOUR work. In my experience, it took months to get my mind and heart to really separate myself mentally from my marriage, my husband, my family so that I was just me, Bttrfly, envisioning my life moving forward, what my core values were post BD, how I wanted to embody them regardless of the outcome of my marriage, what kind of relationships I wanted with friends, family, co-workers, even strangers. By doing that work, and doing it with vigilance and dedication, the rest became crystal clear.

This is the real work, and within that work are the real answers to any newcomers' questions.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944426#Post2944426

Originally Posted by bttrfly
You're constantly validating why she left, every single time you engage with her the same old way. For the sake of yourself and any hope you have of a recon down the road, STOP IT.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944400#Post2944400

Originally Posted by BttrFly
I want you to think long and hard about your attitude and tone towards her. IF she hits bottom, IF she decides she wants to turn her life around, WHY would she come to you if you lead with self-righteousness, anger, ultimatums, moral superiority, control? She'll have enough guilt, shame and remorse without you adding to it. In fact, guilt, shame and remorse often keeps someone in active addiction long past the time when they actually do want to seek recovery. Don't add to that stumbling block. At the very least, it's not kind, nor is it compassionate.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944464#Post2944464

Originally Posted by Kind18
I see a lot of myself in people who arrive here. Weak, scared, living in fear, and allowing themselves to be treated like sh** because they’re desperate to save a marriage. An over riding principle of DBing is that what you did before didn’t work, so you have to try something new. For me, that something new that people need is self respect, strength - and helping them to realize they can’t manipulate or engineer their partner into seeing what they want them to see.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944546#Post2944546

Originally Posted by Kind18
I absolutely believe you need to be getting professional help with managing your emotions on days when you are down. We can’t do that for you here. We can identify what we think is going on, and how you should DB it, but this really needs some counselling to assist with getting past these difficult days without falling into old patterns.


Originally Posted by Kind18
When people say on this site “drop the rope”, it means “stop trying to analyse, control, manipulate or fix things.” Any attempts to do so will just cause you grief and potentially make reconciliation less likely.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944580#Post2944580
Quote
Would you say that it is fine to congratulate W on special occasions?
Originally Posted by Kind18
Personally, I wouldn’t advocate that at all, but I’m sure some people may disagree.

One way ticket to the friend zone.

This is a common theme on this site atm. Lots of people who should be DBing, GALing, digging deep on their personal flaws with IC, and becoming a new and improved, positive person who is attractive to be around and who doesn’t define themselves through their partner or relationship.

Instead, there’s lots of people coming here just seeking validation on forcing interaction “can I ask her on a date to discuss kids, can I send him a Christmas card, he sent a message with an xx at the end, are we getting back together?”

I don’t wish to hijack your thread TMS, but this DB website isn’t to seek advice on every single interaction and message and call. It’s about a change in thinking, it’s about correcting your own flaws with professional help, it’s about growing to be happy whether or not you’re in a relationship, it’s about ignoring them completely and taking a good, long, hard look in the mirror and accepting your only job is to repair your side of the fence and then waiting to see if they decide to fix their side.

Temperature checks, R discussions, manipulating to spend time with them, see them, talk about stuff, find out through friends what they’ve been up to, make them see you’ve changed… it’s all a ticket to pain and grief, and less likely to lead to reconciliation.

Everyone’s journey through DBing is different. For me, that journey was:

1. Learning how to show empathy better
2. Accepting that I made poor choices and rushed choosing a partner
3. Delving into why an unexpected bomb day destroyed me so much, and discovering with an IC I wanted to work on my emotional resilience
4. Realizing my ex had significant mental health challenges which I thought I could fix but which were way beyond my understanding
5. Accepting I’d been mentally abused during my relationship, but that I’d allowed it (and working out what I’d do in the future to have enough self respect to never let someone treat me like that ever again)
6. Accepting that some relationships are, simply, unhealthy

How did I do this? By getting professional help, by completely cutting off my ex while I worked through it.

My journey ended with me deciding she’s a manipulative, horrible person and me realizing I’m actually the catch here. 18 months post bomb day I entered a wonderful relationship with a NORMAL person, and I’m grateful every day that I have my self worth and respect back. I also know now if my current relationship ends one day, I’ll be totally fine 👍

What’s my point?

Well, I guess my point is that this amazing journey to the other side that I took would never have happened if I hadn’t dropped the rope. You can’t be attached, following, analyzing, going for dates, having relationship talks, sending birthday gifts while simultaneously doing the personal development deep dives required.

DBing really is simple if you look at it holistically. You stop being butt hurt, sad, manipulative and focusing outward. You turn completely into yourself and dig/discover like you’ve never done before, until you have your own needs/wants/personal flaws and aspirations sorted. And once that’s done and you look outside again.

Maybe your spouse likes what they see and looks back in.

And so, I guess to answer your one line question, no - don’t send her a birthday card 🤣 It’s a waste of time, when you could be doing much more important things.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944648#Post2944648

Originally Posted by TellMeSo
From your experience, does it mean that the only way is to divorce?
Originally Posted by Cadet
I will rephrase what is said here.
Since I can not also pick lottery numbers or predict what the winning numbers will be.

Most people that come here end up divorced.
Understand that the name of the board is DIVORCEBUSTING.
MWD nor I believe in divorce.

Will you end up divorced?
If I was a betting person I would bet YES.
Is that the end of the story?
Maybe yes maybe no.
Here is where you get a say in this.
That question is why this board is here.

One of my good friends from here divorced(a bitter contested one)
and now is remarried to his spouse.
Their are many examples of reconciliation and success stories.

Love is a choice and you have to choose to Love everyday.
What that looks like is up to you.
You can't control others - only yourself.
So many of us do not choose divorce.
We can choose what happens after that.

The normal advice is that the LBS gets to choose in the end.
And if you have not yet gotten to choose then it is not yet the end.

I know that this is all hard stuff.
All you can do right now is to make yourself into a person that only a fool would leave.

I hoe all of that helps.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944667#Post2944667


Originally Posted by TellMeSo
I am trying to justify her actions myself to understand why this happened better.
Originally Posted by DnJ
What works best is that which you can control - your thoughts, actions, and reactions. One can stick to their values and principles, and let their spouse do whatever heavy lifting towards divorce that they feel they need to do.

I found rationalizing and understanding good things to pursue. Not so much justifying or demonizing their spouse’s actions, rather working to understand how and/or why they could do the things they do.

Detachment is no longer being uncontrollably dragged about by one’s spouse’s behavior and words. Moving ourselves into a more rational realm helps alleviate the emotional responses and triggers and fears.

Understanding is a basis of empathy, compassion, acceptance, and forgiveness. An interesting journey seeking intellectual understanding while simultaneously emotionally letting go. In my view one should seek both of these while also figuring out their convictions. That is a lot on one’s plate, and it takes a while to sort it out. One has to go slow. For you can only eat the elephant one bite at a time.

D
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944773#Post2944773

Originally Posted by TellMeSo
Today she even told me that she does not want separation agreement signed anymore. She will not do anything and just wait until we can officially divorce. It was strange to hear this as yesterday she was pushing this heavily and even mentioned that she will proceed with divorce through "loopholes" in the law now by herself. Today she was saying completely opposite things. Yesterday she told me she does not trust me anymore, today she said that "no worries, I trust you".
Originally Posted by Kind18
This should be made a sticky. R2C, can you add this to your thread?

It demonstrates two VERY clear DB principles:
1. It matters not what you say/do/be/admit to/want. All that matters is that most WAS/WS have no idea what they’re doing, what they want, how to get there - and they’ll burn the world down while simultaneously flip-flopping wildly. It’s a dumpster fire, and you just need to let it burn.
2. TMS, you spent significant energy trying to analyse the conversation. Significant time thinking - did I say the right thing, what does her reaction mean, have I pushed her further away, how does it align with DB principles, what do others on the board think happened…. All this fear driven analysis about what it all meant … and less than 24 hours later, the entire script has been flipped. It’s a good lesson - don’t waste your time analysing and worrying about how SOMEONE ELSE may think, want or do. You do you - calm, measured, honest and honourable. Next time you want to spend hours of your life trying to analyse her, remember what just happened. You’re better off sinking that time into hobbies, fitness, holidays, personal development, education and living life the the full.

Originally Posted by TellMeSo
I offered her help packing her things.

Absolute boss move 😎. Well done!

PS: Everyone is welcome to post nuggets of wisdom with a link to the source in my threads as well.
Posted By: Cadet Re: Quotes Found on Divorce Busting (14) - 04/04/23 06:29 PM
Originally Posted by R2C
Everyone is welcome to post nuggets of wisdom with a link to the source in my threads as well.

Great advice!!!


whistle whistle whistle whistle
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944889#Post2944889

Originally Posted by Kind18
She most likely is having that affair.

The BEST way to deal with that is to do NOTHING. Don’t investigate, don’t ask, don’t demand to know why she’s out late, don’t stalk, don’t search her phone. The reality is that, IN HER HEAD, an affair is justified. So once you find out and tell her you know or make demands she end it, most likely she will feel threatened. She will probably say some typical WS bullshit like “This is why I had to leave you.”

The only way anyone ever snaps out of an affair fog is if they simultaneously work out FOR THEMSELVES that it’s the wrong thing to do, and simultaneously stand to lose everything suddenly.

If she admits to an affair, say nothing. No arguing, begging, pleading or crying. If you seem unaffected, it will confuse her. Then, the next time she leaves the house, move all her stuff into storage. Like everything! Then text her “I no longer wish to share my life with a cheat. Your stuff has been moved to storage at xxxx. The code to access is xxxx. My lawyer will be in touch.”

If she’s having an affair, that’s the best chance you have IMHO of turning things around.

Don’t do or say anything the old you would have done. Do the opposite. Confuse her. Bring female friends (platonic) over for beers. Go out and party. Imagine her being around is a bit of an inconvenience.

99% of men (like me) who come to this site are submissive by nature, or have been beaten into submission by someone threatening to leave us. Men who are confident, outgoing, attractive and confident in themselves don’t come to this site - because if a woman is leaving them, they say good riddance and let them leave.

Please work on your own confidence and self love with a professional counsellor. You deserve someone who treats you well. And at the same time with your counsellor, identify what you did wrong in the marriage, identify your own faults - and prioritize the hard work to fix them.

Good luck!
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2944917#Post2944917

Originally Posted by Rejoice
I set a goal for myself:
-zero mention of OR or OW
-go the entire time without letting him see a single tear or even an angry face (completely UNBOTHERED, even if he's lying or at OW's place.)
-when he tries to bait me into an argument because he's feeling guilty about what he's doing, immediately state that I don't have time for any negativity in my life, I'm too busy, and leave the room.

My plan, since I do well with deadlines, is to be *perfect* in this way of detaching from the situation for 14 days.
Then I'll reassess, take a few days away to "help my sister with the baby" and really let him think.
For my GAL and PMA, I'm needing to mostly ignore this awful situation. I was still too emotional about it and not detaching properly.

H has noticed.
The first two days he tried to bait me into arguments (I think he stopped at OW's place and was looking for me to give him a reason to justify it.)
I told him I had no time for it and to have a good night.

The third day he wanted to have a heart to heart. He talked a lot about how I used to act (controlling, disrespectful) and stated that he sees I've changed but he needed to talk about the past. He said again that he's afraid the changes aren't permanent.
I validated him and didn't comment further.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945004#Post2945004

Originally Posted by URS0
I thought she was having a mid-life crisis but more and more I wonder if maybe she just isn’t the person I thought she was.
Originally Posted by Kind18
And what difference would it make if you knew it was option A or option B?

It matters not.

Trying to understand a WW/WAW is a ticket to the crazy house. What if I told you 1+1 = 3? Would you spend days thinking on it and trying to work out how I came to that conclusion?

I had real trouble with this, because I’m a problem solver in my job. I am trained to seek out facts, determine what (if anything is wrong), work out the correct solution and then apply it and then periodically take stock to make sure the solution is working. I approached my divorce the same way initially, and it’s a monumental waste of time. You can’t make sense of that which does not make sense. Once you get your head around that, you’ll DB much more effectively.

Read my thread on exercise, it has some stuff about rumination and why it’s not helpful. Better off spending that energy on things you can control.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945042#Post2945042

Originally Posted by Kind18
He needs to feel the pain and simmer in the oven for a while.

The only caveat is that if he’s depressed and you think he’s at risk of self harm, you have a responsibility to tell someone. Many mental health or depression help lines have a system where if you ring them and provide his details, they’ll give him a call and give him the opportunity to talk to someone.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945299#Post2945299

Originally Posted by DnJ
You invest intellectually.

One finds detachment. Unties their emotional response from their spouse’s words and/or behavior.

While this is occurring, tenets of divorce busting are learned, utilized, and lived. This is a rational pursuit which meshes well with efforts towards detachment. DB is not an emotional response, rather a well thought out approach and controlled action/reaction to one’s situation.

Focus on you, which is basically removing the excessive focus one places upon their spouse during this time. Get a life. Act as if. Lessen/remove the pressure exerted upon W. Give plenty of time and space. Kind and cordial to W. Dial expectations to zero.

When one’s emotions are not driving their situation, they have a better ability to become the best version of themselves. To not walk on eggshells. To find their convictions and stand for them.

DB, at its heart, is us investing in ourselves. And that give us the best chance at saving our marriage. You’ve got the gift of time. Use it well.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945338#Post2945338

Originally Posted by DnJ
MWD does mention imagining a large red stop sign to halt one’s runaway emotions and thoughts.

A snippet from the internet of the stop technique for anxiety.

S: Stop. Whatever you're doing, just pause momentarily.
T: Take a breath. Re-connect with your breath. The breath is an anchor to the present moment.
O: Observe. Notice what is happening. What is happening inside you, and outside of you?
P: Proceed. Continue doing what you were doing.


It’s a simple and effective, a temporary redirection of yourself to gain influence upon your emotions. I’d also suggest that whatever feeling you are temporarily “stopping”, you seek to explore during your scheduled time. Feelings are indicative of things within, stuff which needs to be expressed and felt and let go. Otherwise it builds up.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945107#Post2945107

Originally Posted by SteveLW
Your wife and your situation are unique and it's impossible to predict whether she'll be one to return or to stay gone for good. I always say, as long as there's breath in your bodies there's a chance she'll try to return eventually. That may be even after you've both moved on with other people.

As far as friends and family, be careful with their advice. They cannot guide you objectively. Likely the majority want to see you two back together, so that want will cause them to give you advice with that goal in mind. It's better if you don't even discuss it with friends and family. That's what IC is for. Friends and family should be supporting you emotionally, spending time with you to get your mind off of things. Not giving you advice. You can help them by saying "I don't want to talk about it" anytime the subject comes up.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945449#Post2945449

Originally Posted by MA1970
I'm fairly new to this too. My own experience is exactly like yours. There are days / hours / minutes that I feel strong & am able to let go of the rope and there are times I'm hanging on to it like a lifeline. My head tells me to let go but I've noticed that the specific emotion of fear keeps bubbling away and pulling me into that tug .

One of the big things that helps me is taking a step back and thinking of time as my friend. I was with H for 26 years & BD was a few months ago! There is plenty of time for R if that is what lies ahead. My inability to manage uncertainty & desire for control keeps me hooked in. I want an end date but I could well shoot myself in the foot if I push too much for that.

I just allow myself to experience the sadness. I'm grieving for my life that was.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945526#Post2945526

Originally Posted by URS0
I did meet her......She knows I feel the marriage could be saved and at one point she asked me to explain how I think that could happen. We’ve had that discussion before. I’m proud that this time I simply told her I don’t think it’s helpful for me to speak to this when you have been very clear in your actions that you don’t want any part of our marriage. She didn’t have much of a response which was an indication to me that as expected it wasn’t a sincere question but an opportunity to shoot holes through my truth to soothe her own self-conscious. It was around this point she said “I just need more time.”
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945520#Post2945520

Originally Posted by Kind18
You need to get comfortable with people being upset with you. The majority of people who come to this website tend to be more passive people. We are generally poor at people being upset with us.

You need to reframe it. Maybe he got upset because he realized you’re right? Maybe he got upset because he had a bad day?

HOW HE REACTS IS HIS RESPONSIBILITY, not yours.

Perhaps if he’d had a few more home truths like that during the marriage, he wouldn’t have got to the point where he blamed you for everything and decided to leave?

Honestly, don’t worry about it a second longer! He’s probably forgotten about it already, you should too.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945571#Post2945571

Originally Posted by Pattnee5
This only dawned on me the other day when H asked me about my day and then proceeded to tell me about his and some work stuff. In the past the moment that would happen I would completely zone out and do something because I was “busy”, but realization came during that conversation was I made sure I turned all my focus on H listened attentively and it was like his world lit up( that’s when I realise how terrible I had been in the past) I just smiled nodded validated a few times about someone who annoyed him. Lightbulb moment, and his whole persona changed and H then proceeded to do everything around the house while I was out. It’s amazing what something like this can open your eyes to the errors of your ways in the past. ....I am just focusing on the only thing I can control and fix and that’s me.
Posted By: Mach1 Re: Quotes Found on Divorce Busting (14) - 05/17/23 03:21 PM
Some really great posts on this thread.

https://www.divorcebusting.com/foru...ain=49692&Number=2159647#Post2159647
Posted By: Rockon Re: Quotes Found on Divorce Busting (14) - 05/17/23 03:50 PM
Just wow
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945609#Post2945609


Originally Posted by SteveLW
My best advice for you is to be careful using excuses as to why you cannot effectively DB. We've seen several posters here buck the advice in order to do what they felt they should do impulsively. In every one of those cases they ended up getting exactly what they were trying to avoid. Humans have a natural tendency to create that which they fear the most. DBing is about bucking that trend. That's why it is counter intuitive, because doing what comes naturally is what causes us to create what we fear the most.

The advice here feels uncomfortable because bucking what comes naturally feels uncomfortable. Unfortunately, it's the only way to change the dynamics of your situation.

Keep on keeping on, but do it differently if you want different outcomes.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2161276#Post2161276

Originally Posted by TrueGritter
Unconditional love is when we love despite the foolish choices of our spouse, when they fail to do what we desire, regardless of any choice they make. This love alone has the power to heal all wounds, deliver self respect and remove all doubt for you and your spouse. It allows love and healing to flourish.
This is how we need to be loved. And this is the paradox.
That we only get this when we give it.

And now is the opportunity.

There is no GREATER opportunity you will ever have in your life then NOW to express this kind of love.
To do this takes greater courage than most people will ever understand and will ever know.
And you have received this wonderful gift only by going through the experience. By the trial.
By the tragedy.
What greater thing could you aspire to do. EVER.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945679#Post2945679

Originally Posted by DnJ
Divorce does not necessarily constitute the end. As long as there is love, there is hope. You can still divorce bust even when divorced or preparing for one. Divorce/separation is just the business side of all this. The emotional/healing journey is the true landscape of DB.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945688#Post2945688


Originally Posted by Kind18
Divorce can be a brutally hard, life-changing event.

But there’s every possibility you will look back on this time as your finest hour.

One day when you’re looking back, you’ll be immensely proud that you tried to save it, that you worked hard on your flaws, that you got out of your comfort zone to sing “The Wheels On The Bus” … and perhaps, whether your marriage is saved or not, it was the best thing that could have happened to you.

I came here four years ago, completely broken. I now look back on the last four years as the hardest, but also the best and most rewarding time of my life.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945789#Post2945789

Originally Posted by DnJ
Of course, affairs really cloud and confuse the situation. There is no martial problem that is going to become better by adding another person. OP1, OP2,… are all symptoms. Band-aids. A desperate attempt at feeling better. Such an illicit relationship is built upon lies and deceit. It’s like building on sand, it requires tremendous effort to keep things held together and stable. (By the way, I do realize your situation currently has no confirmed or suspected affair. Just sharing a bit of information. And for those reading your story too.)
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945825#Post2945825

Originally Posted by PeterB
One tactical approach to help your journey towards becoming an 'emotional rock' is to hit the slow-motion button at the right moment. Slow-motion also helps in more prolonged situations, like simply living through your day. Often, one comes to conclusions or assumes a particular state of mind rather quickly, even when there are no immediate provocations like a live argument. Slow motion is to move through the state-machine of your mind slowly. It allows you to deliberate which path to take toward your next state. This deliberation involves becoming conscious of the nature of the input (e.g., a cruel jab at you two hours earlier or, at this moment, a sense of entitlement that you should not be discussing your problems with your sibling, etc.) and your own processing of that input.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945861#Post2945861

Originally Posted by DnJ
Detachment, indifference, and such are emotional states. Decisions made and actions taken based upon emotions usually lead to regret.

Stick to the path. You thought about things. Decided things. Before this moment. Before your temporary reprieve from your feelings. Follow that. Follow your reason.

With the emptiness and silence of W and her behavior, look inside yourself. Find you. Your values. Your motivations. Know thy self.

This void is temporary, and I suspect will unwind and reassert itself a few times. Do not fritter away your opportunity in all this. It’s still a grueling road to truly find peace and acceptance.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945877#Post2945877

Originally Posted by Terapin
I'm struggling at times, but I just think after a while you gotta say 'F it', and focus on yourself (and kids).

One 'trick' that's seems to help me some is, every time I start to feel sad for the sitch, the demise of 15 years, the future plans, etc, I think to myself 'this person doesn't feel the same or share the same plans. Why would I let myself be hung up on someone like that?' It at least turns my mood from sadness to anger. After a while, my anger has lead to somewhat of an acceptance/detachment.

This probably isn't the best route to go, but I think you gotta find something that works for you. Something that keeps you from dwelling on the negatives of your situation. Whether that's GAL, some kind of mind trick, etc.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1913882#Post1913882

Originally Posted by Cat04
What you do now will not fix your M, but everything you do now may fix your M.

That may not make a lot of sense but it is true. As your W works through this, she will remember how you treated her during this. How you reacted, how you either tried to direct her, or how you were there to just listen, be her friend.

Knowing that what she says is untrue, is good for you because it helps you to not sink to your rock bottom, but you don't have to throw it in her face each time either.

Validate, not defend. Show her that you are different. Don't try to tell her, she won't hear it right now. But she will see it. If it is true. Believe me, they know when it isn't. That alien radar works really well.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945885#Post2945885

Originally Posted by DnJ
Living in the past brings depression. Living in the future brings anxiety.

Living in the present brings peace and calm. Ground yourself in the present moment. Be in the present moment.

Dig for patience and let the future unfold on its time.

You are correct, H is dealing with many variables. Mute your expectations and let him deal with them. He is still walking his path on his timeline.

H needs to rebuild that which he destroyed. It’s part of his healing. This is not some mean holding back on your part, rather an allowing (and encouraging) him to catch up to you. After all, you’ve grown and healed significantly in this time. Be a beacon. Let him decide and choose to catch up.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945909#Post2945909

Originally Posted by Rockon
I’ve been having a lot of self reflection and am starting to quiet my mind more to process what I’m going through, what my emotions are telling me and who I am and what God is bringing me through. This is helping me to be more honest about myself..

The anger is settling and not driving me now like it did for awhile. It comes up, I recognize it, I acknowledge it, “I’m angry about that. That is wrong. That hurt me. I’m still healing from that.” Maybe some choice words to myself and an increased pace in my walk or run or intensity of that exercise set or riff on my guitar. And then I move through it (for now) and onto what I want to be doing. The sadness episodes can take a bit longer at times with some deep sobs and tears and pain.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945940#Post2945940

Originally Posted by Kind18
DBing requires you to GAL, learn who you are, find what makes you tick, navigate a separation calmly - and to become a confident, happy, accountable and independent person.

That’s a journey that takes time, and it needs to be 100% completed before you even consider another relationship.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945967#Post2945967

Originally Posted by PeterB
You have plenty to give. Even if your M does not survive, you need to be there for your children and for yourself, so you must redefine yourself - you are everything and more without your current wife. If the M survives, you will do everything to make it better. Even if it does not, become the best version of yourself because both you and your kids need that.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945965#Post2945965

Originally Posted by MA1970
Look at how you can make your life richer for yourself. I remember at the start of this nightmare, I was going out, getting dressed up purely with the intention of H seeing me in the video doorbell to try & evoke a response. I now go out without giving him a second thought. It's for me. My enjoyment, my pleasure.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2945966#Post2945966

Originally Posted by URS0
I read something today that resonated with me. I think it goes to the heart of DB and I will share it here:

"Many bad things happen in life and it is a mistake to try to sentimentalize these moments away by saying that they must be happening to serve some higher good. But sometimes, when suffering can be connected to a larger narrative of change and redemption, we can suffer our way to wisdom. This is the kind of wisdom you can't learn from books. You have to experience it yourself. Sometimes you experience your first taste of nobility in the way you respond to suffering."
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2946077
Originally Posted by Sunflyer
I'm not sure if this is the right section of the forum for this, so if a moderator wants to move it, feel free.

Watching my marriage crumble around me has been a learning experience. Although it is not I who wants to end it, I realize that even if it were to be restored, it would have to be completely different from what it was before. And if a new relationship should replace it, that would have to be very different from this one too.

I decided to write out what I have learned from my experiences, as well as what I would want a new relationship to look like. In the process, I not only acknowledged my faults, but also extolled my own good qualities. I found that indulging in self-promotion is very empowering and is helping me realize that I am not to blame for everything. It makes me realize I have many good qualities and those should be shared with the right person (which may end up being my spouse or maybe not).

If you read this, I am sure you will recognize some elements of Michele's writings and those of you that have contributed to my threads will probably see elements of the advice you have given. It's rather long, so I will break it into two parts below. Maybe it will help someone. And if it doesn't, it still gave me benefit to crystallize my thoughts.

Originally Posted by Sunflyer
Part I:

I have thought about what my marriage has taught me. It has taught me about mistakes I have made. It has also taught me that there are things I will and will not accept in a relationship going forward. Here are the things I have learned:

1. There is no substitute for constant affirmation of someone’s importance. Women especially require that they be told frequently how beautiful, special, and desirable they are. I will do that much more in a future relationship.

2. Some small time for togetherness must be scheduled each week. It doesn’t have to be a dinner date; it can be a walk in the park or watching the sun set. The many commitments that press on our time must yield somewhere. In my life, my relationship will come first, and I expect my woman to view it the same way. Any money- or profit-making ventures are secondary. Of course, I will support anything she wants to do, but time for us has to be there each week. It was a mistake not to schedule this in the past. Any future relationship I find myself in must make time for this each week. I am worth it.

3. Physical intimacy is important to me. That does not just mean sex. It means touching, holding, caressing. And trying to fit in sex on vacations, etc., doesn’t always work when there are lots of other things planned, or when kids are involved. Any future relationship I find myself in must make periodic time for overnights or weekends devoted to nothing but physical intimacy. No visiting tourist sites, no planning anything except for meals. When no meal is scheduled, we are in the bed, no clothes on, doing something that makes us feel good and close. Touching, talking dirty, [censored], sleeping in each other’s arms, whatever. This has to take place at least a few times a year. Not negotiable, and I am worth it.
Originally Posted by Sunflyer
Part II:

4. Related to #3, I have learned that I am good in bed. I know this not because my ego is large, but because my lover told me so. I have learned that telling someone you want to go to bed with them purely for lustful reasons is fine, even if you are married to them. Someone who recognizes the joy of sex doesn’t object to being told this; they welcome it. I am also a considerate lover who puts high importance on making sure that the woman I am with receives any pleasure she wants. Her pleasure is just as important as mine. I regularly ask my lover what I can do for her, and if she wants me to [use your imagination] all she has to do is say so, and I will. As far as I am concerned, I exist to make both of us feel good. I am good at sex and willing to become better. I am worthy of a lover who wants this. I am worthy of a lover, period.

5. I will only bear my portion of the responsibility for mistakes made in a relationship. It takes two people to make a relationship fall apart. If my partner feels unhappy with her life, or doesn’t know what she wants from life, and that is affecting the relationship, that is not my problem, and I will not bear any guilt for it. Why? Happiness and unhappiness do not come from, and are not caused by, external things or other people. They come from within. We choose happiness or unhappiness. If someone else (including my lover) chooses to be unhappy, I can’t control that. I can control my own happiness only, and I am absolutely worthy of happiness.

6. I no longer believe love is an emotion; it is a choice. Some people believe that love goes away as people change over time. The only way it “goes away” is when we stop doing loving things. If we have stopped, but then start doing loving things again (the things we used to do that brought us together), love will return. Someone said marriage is falling in love with the same person over and over again. There is truth in that. We can choose love like we choose happiness. If my partner decides that she doesn’t want to do loving things with me anymore, then I am worthy of someone else, who will.

7. I am an intellectual, introverted guy who walks the straight and narrow (mostly lol). I don’t drink, smoke, abuse drugs, or indulge in similar behaviors that might abuse my body. I work hard and provide well for myself and my other financial responsibilities. These are not liabilities or the characteristics of a “boring, uninteresting guy”; they are virtues. And a woman who values me will not think that I am unworthy of knowing because of them.

8. I am a “catch.” I am a prize for someone, the right someone. I should stop myself when I am tempted to think otherwise.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2946116#Post2946116

Originally Posted by Terapin
W just said she wants to tell our son tomorrow. This pisses me off to no end, as it's 4th of July weekend, his birthday next Thursday, and surgery the following week. Just another example of how insensitive and selfish she really is. I told her this is like the worst time to tell him, but she said "maybe, but we need to get this done asap."
Originally Posted by DnJ
I understand how the timing of her wanting to inform son is upsetting to you. You cannot control when or what W would blurt out to son or others. You can only control you - your thoughts, actions, and reactions.

Being livid is understandable to such a trigger from W. And it is fleeting, unless you reinforce it. You can control your thoughts/reactions regarding her insensitivity, and in such influence your emotional state. When/if W has this conversation, would son be better served by Dad being PO’d or calm? And which state would serve you better?

I do get it when one’s spouse is hellbent on their plan. Anyone who stands in their way will get mowed down. That is a likely scenario for son and his feelings. You, his Dad, will be his rock in all this. Be open and honest, and of course age appropriate with him.

Do not demonize his Mom. Realize, son knows he is half of her, half of his genes come from her. He will already question his own character because of the genes he carries. Any attacks on his Mom will be felt and internalized by him. (My kids saw their Mom and her behaviour, and had plenty of questions.) Ensure you encourage and reinforce that choice and decisions are not genetic, he controls himself. His fate is up to him.

Yes, that’s a lot of life lessons for such a young lad. And those lessons will not occur during the conversation, rather over the next weeks, months, and years. The bond and relationship you and he will foster through such will become stronger than ever. Though, he will lash out to you as well, since you are the strong stable parent in his life.

You do have a pre-warning, a heads up from W. You cannot control or know what she will say. You do control you and what you will say. So, what do you want to impart? Not specifically, more a general idea as the conversation evolves.

I’d suggest remaining factual, and not blaming W. And most importantly letting son know this is not about him in any way shape or form. Kids are egocentric and will take on the blame of stuff, even when they aren’t at fault. Working through that particular, and normal, response of son will require some open discussions at his pace over time.

Like before, let W do the heavy lifting, you more respond without necessarily helping nor blocking. At times that path feels like a razors edge. However, it turns out that path is quite solid and firm, and much wider than one first sees.

D
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2946322#Post2946322

Originally Posted by Kind18
It gets better. It’s going to be alright, you just have to be patient.

Imagine you’ve just gone to Disneyland. Your H has climbed aboard the tallest, fastest, most unsafe and decrepit rollercoaster and it’s just pulling out of the boarding station. His carriage has started the chain lift to the top to begin the thrill ride. Let’s name that rollercoaster, I dunno, “MLC” or “Affair Partner”.

He’s calling out to to you from his carriage as he goes up the hill. Telling you it’s going to be great. He doesn’t need the safety of the ground or you.

So you start yelling at the top of your voice to him and the ride operator:
“I want to go on the ride with him!”
“Reverse the carriage back into the station!”
“I should never have agreed to come to Disneyland!”
“You’re supposed to be down here with me!”
“It’s really dangerous! You don’t know what you’re doing!”
“Accelerate the ride so it’s finished in 5 seconds, not 5 minutes!”
*Shakes fence violently*

As you scream hysterically from the ground, what effect do you think your words or actions are going to have? Will the carriage suddenly stop and reverse back in? After waiting months/years for this exciting ride, will he suddenly decide he wants to get off and stand next to you on the ground?

Absolutely nothing you do or say is going to make one bit of difference. He decided months/years ago this is what he wanted to do.

All you can do is stand there and wait for the ride to finish, and it will seem like an eternity.

And chances are, when the ride ends and his carriage finally pulls into the station, he might be so addicted he wants to go again.

And maybe, by the time the ride is finished and he wants to get off, he might find you’ve got sick of his s*** and you’re no longer there waiting for him.

That’s how this rollercoaster works. It’s just like divorce.

1. You can scream, shout, argue, beg, cry and try to control/manipulate the situation (and make zero impact) - or you can accept there’s nothing you can do to stop the ride from happening.

2. You can stand there and waste your day (your life) waiting for him to come back, or you can realize you are at Disneyland (alive on the earth) and go find a million other fun things to do.

3. Perhaps, half way around the ride, he will see you on the other side of the park, driving dodgem cars or sliding down water slides, and he’ll decide Disneyland is more fun with you than without. He sure won’t want to get off the ride if you’re still there waiting for him in a puddle of tears.

Let him take his ride. Let it all go and live your life.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2946524#Post2946524

Originally Posted by Kind18
- You’ve stated an affair is a deal breaker. You need to be REALLY careful what you say, because it can come back to haunt you - and in fact can actually encourage her to keep having affairs and keep you at arm’s length. Is that TRULY your deal breaker? If she walked in tomorrow and said “I’ve been banging Steve from accounts” would you calmly tell her to leave, pack up her stuff, throw it on the sidewalk, change the locks and file immediately with a lawyer? Because if the answer to that is absolutely yes, then that’s a great boundary and you can make it clear. But if there’s any hesitation at all, or you’d have to think about it, you shouldn’t be telling her or yourself it’s a deal breaker. Marriages do recover from physical affairs. What they DON'T recover from is weak men who verbalize a boundary and then let their wives break it. Think very carefully on this.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2946565#Post2946565

Originally Posted by Pack_19
I have re-read my entire thread over again and I have read Sandi's original thread, how lucky I was to have her take interest in my sitch. Reading that some young men were taking her first drops of advice as too aggressive made me smile, it reminded me of the day she told me she hoped her posts wouldn't make me leave the forum and all I could think was, your advice is the best thing that could happen to me now. I imagine you have not heard from her, I miss her, I wish I could hug her and thank her in person.


....

Originally Posted by Pack_19
This week will be the 4 year anniversary since BD, I struggle a lot with how much time I have needed to start moving forward on my own. Maybe this is something we never fully recover from, even if as an individual you grow and improve beyond what you could imagine. Here are some ideas I got from reading all the golden nuggets, to keep me going.

1. When you arrive here you are seeking change in your spouse. However the ugly truth is that you are the only person you can change and it takes two willing spouses to R. Thus, your best approach is to come here seeking your own change, saving yourself, as nobody is coming for you and you are not attractive when you hit rock bottom.

2. Finding the DB forum is a tool so powerful it comes with a piece of responsibility. Here you learn about growth books, parenting, boundaries, social proof, attractiveness, gender differences...if you are given all that information, you have the responsibility to use it to improve your life and therefore that of your children.

3. Someone posted on Sandi's thread "I don't care how big of a bump on a log your husband has become, you are his wife. You helped create what he is today." This hit me hard, I believe people can change, maybe many of the issues I see in W were driven by my behavior and vice-versa. Don't judge your S for he/she has become during this suffering time, in all likelihood you were also lacking as an individual by the time you had the b#lls to post here.

4. I have read a lot about forgiveness, the price you pay for it and how you must move on with it. I don't think I could forgive exW for all her despise, accusations, infidelity and the havoc she caused in what I called our family life. I don't say this from a vengeful perspective, it is just a boundary I have to set and stick to. I remember reading how weak a man can look if you set a boundary and let it be stepped on over and over. Time to put Pack first, I will find someone who admires and respects the man I have become.

5. This is how I should have reacted when I was talking about fighting for my M, thinking whether to keep or not my ring on, praying for the chance to communicate with exW about our M and yet knowing there was OM1.
"well, sorry it's come to this, I wish you every happiness, it's been a great so many number of years, give my best to OM, but I'm outta here, like NOW!"

My PIES, guiding me everyday!

P - Improve my PRs in crossfit. Marathon under 3´30". Gain 5 Kg in muscle weight, keep my wardrobe fresh. Chin up and chest out, I should be proud of the new man I have become. Practice my sexual kung fu.
I - Start a company or build a career that allows me to go racing as a hobby. Improve my driving and riding skills. Learn about men and women.
E - Improve my active listen, show empathy, stay humble and work on improving myself as a man and father. Approach more women and start conversations. Take rejection as a positive filter. DETACH and enjoy being single in all that is means. DO NOT CHASE ANY WOMAN
S - Talk to God and be a role model for my kids. Keep growing, keep improving as a man.
Posted By: Kind18 Re: Quotes Found on Divorce Busting (14) - 08/06/23 11:27 PM
Love these insights from Pack19!
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2946756#Post2946756

Originally Posted by Pattnee5
I never believed you vets when you said it gets easier and you get to this point. I remember reading DR in April while recovering from surgery and those early posts just after that boy was I a mess. I thought I was GAL but I wasn’t, I thought I was detaching but I was clinging for dear life. I did so many wrongs and never thought I could get through.
It’s nice to come through the storm and see glimmers of clear skies. Although I still have many storms to get through still to come, I feel in such a better position to tackle anything. H has lost all capabilities of getting help I think. He is a very lost man buried in MLC.
I don’t think I ever would have done anything about his drinking pre BD. I just put up with it, tolerated it and even made excuses for it. I now see how much that wore me down and made me such a weak person. What an absolute eye opener.

I must say, going to the gym multiple times a week, walking the dog and getting the miles in her little paws has been my absolute saviour. I feel so good within myself ( I was always a very fit and active person but I’m finding ways to make myself better. ) but as a whole I feel I am finding myself that I had lost so long ago.
I do laugh that as I get better, happier, dressing up more on weekends, putting makeup on again, getting my hair done, smiling, socialising with lots of friends....

I can honestly now say that DB does work, but not necessarily to get H back ( because that story hasn’t been written yet) but it works to get yourself back together, to feel better and start to heal your own heart.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2946838#Post2946838

Originally Posted by DnJ
Be excited for your future. Run to something rather than run from something. Embracing your future does not necessitate getting a divorce by the way.

Divorce splits assets and custody. That’s it.

If you need financial protection or security, then get it. If there is abuse or likewise, then get protection. Otherwise, leave the heavy lifting to the spouse who wants out. Maybe that’s you now. Might want to give that a few months to ensure you are acting on something deeper than feelings. Decisions based upon emotions will lead to regret.

Before completely upsetting the apple cart, speak to a lawyer. Ensure you know the best, worst, and most likely scenarios of outcome in all this. Knowledge is power.

Draw a line on disrespectful behavior and how you are to be treated. That applies beyond one’s spouse; it applies to everyone you interact with. That is a boundary.

Our problems arises when we overlay our ideas and expectations. Your spouse will not respond logically or rationally. They will respond emotionally. And that is why it takes so very long for them to find there way, as there emotions are all over the place. Even though the emotions are mostly hidden, they are consuming and always pushing.

Running is them trying to run from themselves. Some drink, do drugs, spend money, or sits alone and brood.

Your spouses journey is not about you. So don’t make it so.

You’ve found indifference. Now find YOU. Your convictions. Your journey. A great opportunity while the noise of your spouse is muted.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2946909#Post2946909

Originally Posted by Kind18
But there’s a bigger issue here. And that is that you are micro-managing decisions, interactions and attempting to manipulate or control things.

I did it too, so this is in no way a criticism.

You need to understand that one of the fatal things during a divorce is someone who holds on too tight. Your lack of sleep also suggests that you’re struggling with this a lot. It’s what happens when someone who manages things and is generally in charge of their own life suddenly finds themselves not in control. It manifests as posting super frequently, asking questions about every single interaction and desperately trying to solve/fix/repair/diagnose/correct/change things.

Just breathe Card.

You need a time-out.

Here’s my bits of advice:

- You need to seek out some individual counselling. They will help you with anxiety, hyper-awareness, sleep issues. It’s not a sign of weakness, but you really would benefit from a bit of a reset. Simple things, like getting stuff off your chest, mindfulness, meditation, journaling, exercise, sleep - they’re all things that a therapist can help you with. Sometimes it’s available for free - in Australia you can get six free sessions through government health with a psychologist. Lots of employers have employee assistance programs (EAP) where you can get access to some counselling.

- A marriage doesn’t fail overnight. And it never fails because of one person only. It’s like a car you haven’t had serviced for ten years, and now it’s broken down on the side of the road. You can’t just check the dipstick and realize it has no oil, top it up and drive away. Things that take a long time to be broken take a long time to be fixed. You can’t speed it up. And a lot of the time, you’re at the complete mercy of the other person. You need to imagine you’re an autumn leaf in a tornado. You’re going to get tossed about - you can either try to control everything, or you can just let it all go and go with the flow.

- What would be the point of taking your ring off? I guarantee you you’ve asked this question (even subconsciously driven) because you’re wondering if taking it off might wake her up. Or she might yell at you for taking it off, but then at least you’ll have got some validation that deep down she has some feelings for you.

- and R2C is right. Leave it on. It’s YOUR ring. If you want to stay married, keep wearing it. If in 6-12 months you decide you don’t like or want to be with this person any more, then you take it off when you don’t want it any more. It’s really important to make decisions for YOU and what you want, with no regard for what she might want, how she reacts or what other people might think. This is your life, your decisions, your commitment.

- Same goes for her. If she takes hers off or leaves it on, give it no thought. It’s her ring, it’s her finger, she can do whatever she wants.

- Other questions we see frequently along this line to demonstrate my point:
a) “Should I move into spare bedroom because she wants space?” - No. You don’t want to move, so you don’t move. If she wants to move, she can.
b) “Should I offer to drop the kids to her for a visit?” No. If she wants them, she can ask.
c) “Should I tell my family we’re separated?” If you want them to know and want their support - yes. If you don’t want them to know, then no. If you’re telling them in the hope it pressures your spouse - absolutely not.

I hope this was helpful. You need to drop the rope, get some counselling, get on top of your sleep, stop worrying about every little thing. The world’s going to keep on spinning whether you take your ring off or leave it on. Taking it off or leaving it on is also going to have zero bearing on where her you reconcile or divorce. TBH she probably doesn’t care less right now.

You do you, for you. Let her do her.

How’s the attraction stuff going? Have you bought new clothes, lost 5kg, had a haircut and wearing a new aftershave every day? That’s way more important than the ring thing. Try some go-karting, go out with some guys, join a club, go mountain biking. Do some cooking classes, take a flying lesson. A guy who mopes at home and takes his ring off? Or the fit guy who rides his motorbike with a new leather jacket and comes home late at night.

Which one is she going to choose?
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2946969#Post2946969

Originally Posted by DnJ
It’s pretty common for one to be more emotional in the morning. A technique that works for a lot of folks is to allow yourself to feeling your emotions for a set amount of time, then get on with your day.

We you get up, set a timer for ten minutes. Let your feelings go wherever they will. Impossible, dreadful, worry, fear, sad, sorrow, etc. The purpose is acknowledgement, to let those feelings be heard and expressed. Trying to stifle our emotions just bottles them up and we become a pressure cooker.

After the ten minutes, stop. Utilize the stop sign. Imagine a big red stop sign. Rein yourself in, and get ready for your day. This “controlled” feeling helps with detachment.

Attachment is the uncontrolled being emotionally dragged around, here you are purposely allowing your feelings and then pausing them. Note, the stop sign “stops” for the moment, you are really only pausing your feelings.

You can perform this technique through out the day as well. Find a safe place and just feel for a few controlled minutes. Then pause and continue. As you progress, the time between pauses gets longer. The number of necessary pauses through the day becomes less and less, until only the morning one is left. Eventually that ten minutes becomes five, then three, then one, and then zero.

So much positive stuff happens when one embraces that which they can control. You can only control your thoughts, actions, and reactions. The above technique utilizes and strengthens your control and discipline of self. One of the best discipline techniques is allowing yourself to feel in a safe manner and environment.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2947673#Post2947673

Originally Posted by Boat14
The answer is you can never ever ever give too much space. The only way to turn this around is she has to miss you. The number one enemy is pursuit. Which is what your brain is going to convince you to do. To be successful you will need lots of discipline. Most men who end up here lack discipline which is part of the reason they are here.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2947730#Post2947730

Originally Posted by Thornton
This is the recipe. You have to get to the point where she starts to questions herself and begin to think she is going to lose you, perhaps to a better woman.

You do this all silently, without peacocking and looking back to see if she's noticing. In essence, you start to truly move on with your life. If there's a chance this thing will turn around, this is usually when it will happen.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2947916#Post2947916

Originally Posted by Boat14
Your STBXW is not in MLC. She’s biologically wired to be attracted to a strong man who is exciting and has a purpose. Become that man and maybe she looks back. If not you will spend your days contemplating when your 48th hour is up so you can text her back.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2947936#Post2947936

Originally Posted by MrP
Mentally, I *think* I'm doing better at shifting focus to what's best for me and my child. I read another post where someone indicated we DBers have essentially been fired as a spouse. It has been helpful for me to think of things this way. If I'm fired, then I'm not being "paid" (in love, reciprocal care, respect, etc.) to do things I previously did. I'm balancing that with "pro bono work" like remaining polite, or helpful as I might be to a stranger, co-worker, or acquaintance, but not at the level by far I was when I was "employed".
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2947931#Post2947931

Quote
yea I honestly feel like she isnt seeing anyone else. I know I could be naive in thinking that but just have a feeling she isn't
Originally Posted by Kind18
Look, I’m no DB veteran, but I’ve been around here for quite a while now.

The number of times there has been an affair person (AP) involved - hundreds.

The number of times there has been a AP involved when the OP came along and said “I genuinely don’t think I there’s someone else” - hundreds.

The number of times there hasn’t been a AP - maybe 1 or 2. Total.
That’s in four years I’ve been here.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news. But despite you thinking you know your wife better than anyone else, it’s almost a dead certainty there’s someone else. Chances they haven’t been intimate - pretty slim.

The sleeping on a girlfriend’s couch because she’s stressed - makes it a total certainty IMHO.

Women are monkey branchers. They’re pretty unlikely to cut the cord until they think they have a better option.

Just to give you some insight - my EXW was having an affair with one of the Dad’s from our son’s soccer team. Meanwhile she was going to church every week. This is the level of deceit involved when it comes to affairs.

One of the keys to successful DBing is to set your expectations of other people very, very low.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2947961


Originally Posted by Mach1
When you first arrive here, many of you have done an interweb search for saving your marriage, or how to stop my divorce.

You arrive here broken and bloodied from the bomb dropping, thinking that this is some sort of a bad joke, and you feel like you are living a groundhog day, hoping to awaken from a bad dream that you are having, borderline nightmare that you are living.

Most will think that they haven't said enough, or just one more explanation will help guide you past this simple moment of insanity that your spouse is having. Most will think that it can't happen to me, because we were the perfect couple that our friends said would always be together.

Most will hang on to every word that your spouse says, look at your phone 10,000 times a minute, hoping and yearning for your spouse to call you and say that they didn't mean what they said during the bomb.

You start wondering and asking questions as to why ? where ? when ? how did it come to this ?

Some will have to deal with another person firmly entrenched between you and your spouse. And you will think that if only you could split them apart, that you would get back together and everything will be just fine.

Then, as time goes on, there are some hard truths that start to slowly shine through the madness.
You start asking questions, however the questions become different. And hopefully they start to become about you instead of them. Hopefully they become about your own relationship deficiencies instead of what my spouse is doing to me.

It sukcs....BIG TIME....

It's been a hot minute since I sat in a similar place as you, and looked at these boards as a lifeline to what I was going through. The spiraling thoughts, feelings, emotions that we each face when we sit and process things inside of our own head. I would hate to think about how many hours I have spent reading here, yet it was so vital to my growth.

All that being said, what I can tell you is...

YOU ARE GOING TO BE FINE !!!!

You will get through this..

You will not only survive, you will thrive after this..

IF.......IF...

The sooner you recognize that IF you are here, reading, posting, that your marriage, as you once knew it, is OVER....dead and gone, the sooner that your healing can start...

You have been released from your position as a spouse, by your partner

That does NOT mean that your next relationship cannot be with your current spouse, it just means that anything down the road will have to be a new relationship, with new skills and tools between you.

Find the "you" that you had lost over the years...

Face the fears that have kept you stuck inside of your own head...

Realize that in most cases, those fears became a goal that you effectively worked toward...

And that for many, (by being here), your worst fear has already come true, and yet here you are, still living and breathing, so please do not waste any more time obsessing over it.

And in time, you will see this as a gift...

And I am aware that you are going to say how hard this is, and how mech ever that I agree with you, I will also tell you that nothing worth doing is ever easy. And that anything that is as important as yourself, should be worth the fight and adversity that you will face through this.

I would not wish this on anyone, however I would not trade what I learned, or who I became through that part of my life.


For now though, please understand that you will get through this....

Eat, sleep, exercise, stop looking at your phone. Stop obsessing about everything little thing that coulda, woulda, shoulda been...

Trust that in time, ALL of your questions will be answered.

In time your questions will change...

In time, the answers won't be as important as they are today...

In time, you will realize that you have had all of the answers inside of you all of this time, you've just been asking the wrong questions.

The purpose of this thread is pretty simple...

Over my time here, there are thousand small cliché sayings that helped me get through some really hard days.

Some made sense when I read them, some made sense a couple days later, and some didn't make sense to me until my thinking changed, and my focus became my growth instead of fixing anything.....






You will never talk your way out of something, that you acted your way into...

Use your anger as a shield, instead of a sword...

Your spouse isn't doing anything TO you, they are doing it FOR themselves. And it you use this time to see yourself more clearly, it can be (and should be) for you...

Your job isn't to facilitate their relationship with your children. Your job is to not destroy their relationship...

There is nothing that you can say right now that will affect your relationship, yet everything that you say right now will affect your relationship

Your fear right now belongs to you. How you handle it, will define your future...

Don't ring any bells that you can't un-ring...

Don't ask any questions that you don't want the answers to...

Stop holding your spouse accountable for your behaviors and actions...

Your marriage vows have nothing to do with your spouse...

The true test of your character happens when you are up against it...

There is a reason that the windshield on a car is so large, and the rearview mirror is so small...

Being a lighthouse in a storm, is much calmer than being a rowboat...

There cannot be a testimony without a test...

Listen without defending, speak without offending...

If you seek to understand, then you will be understood...

Be the memory today, that you want to have tomorrow...

We are all in this together.....alone...

Aim small, miss small...

If you stay in one place too long, you become that place...

Stand, but don't stand still...

MLC takes it's toll, please provide exact change...





I'm sure that there are hundreds of these that escape me. So please add any that have helped you through this...




Some hard questions I've had to ask myself...


Did I really love my spouse ?

Or were we married out of an obligation to each other and our children ?

What is the difference between Love and Obligation ??

Am I the person that I would choose to be in a relationship with ??

Do I blame my spouse for finally taking a stand ??

Can I truly forgive them ??

Can I truly forgive myself ??

What does forgiving them look like to me ??

What does forgiving myself look like to me ??

What do my wedding vows really mean to me ??

My spouse spent __ years holding this relationship together with very little help from me, what gives me the right to be angry about it being my turn ??

Do I really want the hardest thing that I have gone through, to define me as a person ??

Am I willing to sell my soul for this relationship ??

Am I willing to trade my time standing for a chance at a 50th wedding anniversary ?








Also. please know that nothing you are dealing with, or feeling, is permanent.

Everything in life is temporary, and it depends on how we choose to write the ending to our own book.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2947985#Post2947985

Originally Posted by Rejoice
The long version. I wrote this out in case anyone needs some hope and step by step ideas today.

First, Divorce Busting WORKS.
At the beginning of 2023, I lost a dear friend to covid and on the same day, my husband told me he wanted a divorce. It eventually came out that he was seeing someone else, a "friend" we were helping to leave her controlling partner.
I was absolutely devastated. I couldn't eat or sleep.
I could not imagine losing our family unit.
Miraculously, my sister in law handed me her copy of the Divorce Busting book within a few days of the devastating news. I read and reread it and took notes and immediately applied it. I messed up several times but I dusted myself off and continued forward.
To make a long story short, my H and I are not getting a divorce, he cut the OW out of his life completely, and we have been happier than ever for the last 4 months despite some terrible life circumstances.
I will put the story below, and then some fine details that might help some of you.

I read DB immediately and came to several conclusions.
1. My marriage was not over and my family would not be torn apart.
2. My H still loved me, but was very, very hurt by all the ways the years had taken a toll on our marriage.
3. He was looking for an out to the pain, and had given up hope.
4. I had a much better chance of showing him that there was hope, and that I, we, could change, if he stayed in the home. Forced exposure, basically. I knew I was signing up for absolute torment as I needed to be very calm while he saw another woman, but my family was worth it.

So step one, I asked him to remain in the home for the time being. I told him I would not bother him at all, but thought it would be easier on the kids if we transitioned to him moving out slowly rather than all at once. He agreed.

Step two, I apologized to him for the ways that I knew I had contributed to making him want to leave. On one hand it really grated on me that he was the betrayer, yet I was apologizing, but I knew I had done things to hurt him as well and it was good and right to apologize. That opened up several more conversations about how he felt and I was able to apologize to him for other things as well.

Step three was my second 180 besides being so amiable and apologetic, and besides the protection of God, I credit this step with starting the journey back to my marriage. This one is NOT FOR EVERYONE, but I took it straight out of the DB book.
I asked him if we could be "friends with benefits." I stressed that it was only until I had found someone else, (that bit clearly made him jealous) but that there was no reason we couldn't help each other out.
Michelle stated in the book that one tactic could be to seduce your partner when they come home, no matter where you think they've been.
She also made a great post on this forum about couples whose physical relationship saved their marriage. It in part saved mine for sure.
She stressed in her post and I stress to you now, if is NOT a 180 for you, if it feels wrong, or if your relationship is clearly not improving after you've been intimate for a while, it's time to do another 180.
PLEASE understand this is not for everyone and if it comes off in ANY way as if you are desperately clinging, it will never work.
I knew several very important things about my husband:
A, he was hurt above all that I had been rejecting him sexually just because I was too busy.
B, sex and even non-sexual touch are at the very top of his list in the ways that he feels love. (Michelle describes a certain type of man as "highly sexed" and it applies to my H to the letter.)
C, I felt he was telling the truth when he told me that he was not in a physical relationship with OW. I know exactly how he acts when he has not been sexually active, and it was very clear he was not. (Later I found proof in a love note from OW in which she thanked him for "not needing" a physical relationship (gag.) So, I knew I was not in danger of STDs.
So our R was a good candidate for this 180. Yours may not be. Proceed with caution.
It is important to note that I asked him for "benefits" when he was in a space where he felt more comfortable with me.
1. I hadn't blown up at him for the ghastly thing he was doing,
2. I was clear that I would give him his divorce with no issues,
3. I had apologized,
4. And then I had spent several days just being happy to see him, with no judgement, when he got home from work or presumably from her house.
He agreed. And each time, things seemed to get slightly more intimate and loving.

Step four, (and mind you I'm reeling through all of this. Sobbing and praying on my knees most of the day, only to clean myself up and behave like someone that he would want to come home to by 4:30 p.m.) I made myself get a life. It helps that I already had one, honestly. I just took the initiative and spent more time with various groups of friends. I found things to occupy two to three nights per week, and I let him believe whatever he believed, but they were usually just worship services. The services uplifted me a lot and my silence about where I was going made him very jealous.
GAL was the last piece that saved my marriage. The curiosity and jealousy as he saw me getting dressed, doing my hair and putting make up on to leave the house were plain as day. He tried very hard to act like he did not care but I know him.

To sum this piece up,
1. Immediately go no pressure. Detach from your emotions and make your changes RIGHT AWAY and STICK TO IT. I was bitter and critical before, I got back to who I really am inside and showed that woman to him every single day. He noticed my changes immediately. ACT AS IF you have had an awakening and you're going to be happy--because you have and you are!
2. Decide whether or not intimacy is for you
3. Get a life

Note: Detachment is NOT withdrawal!!
I FINALLY understood this concept after reading an excellent post from a wise DBer.
It is simply not taking things personally.
We can meet anger or indifference with love when we are detached from the actions of another.
It's controlling how we respond.
Think of it as if your spouse is just a friend--you care about them, but their actions do not have to affect you or your emotions at all.
You MUST be able to show them your real, happy, self that they fell in love with if you want them to remember how much they love you.
...
As time went on, my H made many comments about how he noticed I had changed but he was afraid the changes were not permanent.
I told him that it's fine, my changes were not for him. I said he woke me up to how bitter I was and I just didn't want to be that person anymore.

He continued to visit OW. I ignored it as much as I could.

He also had several more rather loud moments of letting me know all the ways I had hurt him over the years. I responded apologetically, telling him I was sorry I had been bitter all of those years and that I hoped he could forgive me someday.

When it seemed he was getting too comfortable, making demands of me as if I had to uphold our marriage while he did not, I wrote him a note.
Again, this is not for everyone and it must never come off as desperate.
In the note, I thanked him for our new friendship.
I told him that I appreciate it that we can move forward as good, communicative co-parents.
I said I wanted to assure him of a few things.
I said that as I begin dating, I will be sure to honor him as my friend and my children's father in two ways: I would not introduce any new interest to the kids until we became very serious, because that's not fair to the kids.
I would also not tell my new interest anything that would cause disrespect for H, and I would promote a good relationship between all involved at all times.
He got the clear message that I would absolutely be moving on. And of course, none of it was a lie. If necessary I absolutely would have moved on, I would have eventually tried dating and I would have made the best of it as promised in my note. But I didn't let on how much I didn't want that to have to happen.

I also redoubled my time outside of the home and did plenty of things that had him questioning what I was up to. In fact, when he took the kids to see his family without me for a week, I made an appointment and got a tattoo I had designed after the passing of my beloved grandmother last year. And then I hung out with my tattoo guy for a while (strictly platonic, just two artists chatting, but my H was insanely jealous.) When he heard about it, he got very angry. Then he called the next day saying he'd thought a lot about it and he wanted to work things out with me, but he needed more time to know that my changes were actually real.

I gave him his time, although it was torture.
I continued to be his friend, maintain the home and be a good mother.
By June he had told OW that he didn't want a relationship with her.
By mid-June he had cut her off and blocked her on all platforms.
We had some excellent talks about our relationship, rebuilding trust and going to therapy.
It's now November, and despite the sudden passing of my father in July, and the sudden passing of another of my best friends in September, our marriage is better than ever. I'm not sure that we were this happy even in the beginning.
2023 has been the worst year of my life. But I have my family intact and I can thank God and divorce busting for that.

Additional items:

Things that helped with my emotional state:
•Prayer and trusting in God to change hearts
•Praising God even in the pain
•How to Save Your Marriage Alone by Ed Wheat, M.D.
•Reading success stories on this site
•Read Divorce Busting/Divorce Remedy all the way through, took notes, read again.
•Staying busy and having a life. Distraction is key.
•I wrote out every verse on marriage that I could find to remind myself that God is on my side, the side of healthy marriages.
•I searched online for prayers to read aloud for the return of an unfaithful spouse, when I was at my lowest points and couldn't find words to pray on my own.
•Read several books on healthy marriages that put things into perspective.
•Winning your Husband Back by Gary Smalley

I prepared answers to give him:
•When he brought up my changes, I predetermined to respond gently that my changes were not for him.
•When he brought up the past or reasons he was upset with me, I predetermined to respond that I can see why he is hurt and ask him to tell me more about it. If appropriate, I predetermined to tell him he was right and that I am sorry, and ask him what would help him feel better.
•When he told me something like "I saw her today" I predetermined to tell him that I appreciate him being so open and honest with me.
•When I didn't know where he'd been, I predetermined to be happy to see him and if possible, be intimate with him, as suggested in DB.

I started a notebook just for the situation. It helped immensely.
I'll list here some of the things that I put in it, because they give finer detail about how I handled the situation.

I wrote a "daily list for survival" and did it.
•Pray
•Exercise
•Shower
•Get dressed
•Look nice for when he gets home
•Read the Bible (Psalms in particular)
•Journal
•Tidy the house
•Do the laundry
•Start dinner
•Be completely unbothered
•In every way, be someone he feels safe and happy about coming home to.

I wrote a list of reminders and reminded myself daily:
•My battle is with my own pride, not with him. He's lost right now.
•I can't change a single thought in anyone else's mind--all I can do is show him who I really am and leave it to God.
•My words and actions need to create a good night together. No matter what nastiness he brings. One day at a time will win my family back together.
•As a Christian, my job is to love unconditionally, radically even. Jesus looked at his tormentors as he died and asked God to forgive them. I can do no less if I am determined to live out my faith.

I read a lot about what most husbands desire in a marriage, there are a lot of good books about this.
I put notes from these books in my notebook.
I found the acronym BEST and reminded myself of it often:
Blessing: be a blessing to him, speak well of him, stay silent if that's what is really needed in the situation. Give him approval, encouragement, support, affection, and a peaceful home life. Benefit him, appreciate him, and pray for him. Men are typically very reactionary and he will likely become a blessing to you as well when he sees your behavior.
Edifying: respect, admire, defer to, adore. A man encounters many things daily that tear down his ego. He would love for you to build it back up in any way you can. He likely criticizes himself enough, try to never criticize him. In short treat him the way you would like to be treated.
Sharing: time, interest, activities, ideas, and goals. Listen to him and share his troubles. Care about his interests and goals. Work with him.
Touch: warm and non-sexual touch is very important. Give him a massage, cuddle, hold hands. Men do not get enough of this in general.
These ideas might sound old fashioned or even patriarchal, but in our society we so often want excellent treatment from others without being willing to put such respect forth first. Why not give it a shot and see how your marriage improves?

I wrote a list about who I am, because I realized that in the last 14 years or so I had allowed life and bitterness to dull my shine.
I titled it "Getting Back to the Real Me"
It contains things like: I'm funny, upbeat, loving, and a good mom. I'm very clean and organized, a good listener, I think things through so I'm not quick to be reactionary. I volunteer. I paint. I dance and sing when I'm really happy. I play classic rock REALLY loud. Et cetera.

I wrote a list about who my husband is. I used a personality typing system called the Enneagram to learn more about his personality type and determine what he might need from me that I had not been providing.
A big thing I learned through this is that for my husband's type, he most values strength, decisiveness, and straightforwardness.

Also in my notebook, I copied this list from somewhere on the divorce busting forum and rewrote it in order to try and commit it to memory as well as adding a few of my own comments:
1. Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or implore.
2. No frequent phone calls
3. Do not point out good points in marriage.
4. Do not follow him/her around the house.
5. Do not encourage talk about the future.
6. Do not ask for help or backup from family members.
7. Do not ask for reassurances.
8. Do not buy gifts.
9. Do not schedule dates together.
10. Do not spy on spouse
11. Do not say "I Love You". It only reminds your spouse that something is wrong and makes them feel pressured.
12. Act as if you are moving on with your life. Be HAPPY AND CONTENT.
13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive.
14. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse- get busy, do things, go to church, go out with friends.
15. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words. If you never had time to listen before, be curious about their day and listen carefully when they speak.
16. If you are in the habit of asking your spouse her whereabouts, ASK NOTHING.
17. You need to make your partner think that you have had an awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you are going to move on with your life, with or without your spouse.
18. Do not be nasty, angry or even cold- just pull back and wait to see if spouse notices and, more important, realize what he will be missing.
19. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment.
20. Show him/her someone he/she would want to be around.
21. All questions about marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while).
22. Never lose your cool.
23. Don't be overly enthusiastic.
24. Do not argue about how they feel (it only makes their feelings stronger).
25. Be patient
26. Listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you.
27. Learn to back off, shut up and possibly walk away.
28. Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not my in turmoil).
29. Be strong and confident.
30. Know that if you can do 180, your smallest CONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say or write.
31. Do not be openly desperate or needy. Yes, you are hurting more than ever and are desperate and needy. But that is temporary and not the real you.
32. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse.
33. Do not believe any of what you hear and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because they are hurting and scared. Alternately, they are pushing at you to get a reaction that will help them justify their ugly choices. Do not take bait.
34. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel.
35. Do not backslide from your hard-earned changes.
36. NO CONVINCING! The more you try to tell someone their feelings, the less they believe you.
37. Determine what they are probably getting from another relationship and try to give that to them in a calm and detached way. Hint: it's usually acceptance just as they are, despite their flaws and mistakes. If you were picking at them, knock it off. A time will come when you can discuss your hurts with them.
38. Don't focus on the end result right now. Accomplish small goals.
39. This is about really changing your behavior, not fooling them into staying.
40. Assuming anything serves no purpose.
41. If they are fighting with you at all, they are conflicted and feeling guilty. Get away from the fight as if your life depends on it. You cannot argue your love back to you, they are trying to get a reaction to justify what they're doing. Walk away and let them sit in their guilt.
42. Don't spend too much time alone. Your brain will fixate on the pain.
43. Do and say the unexpected. Be fun.

I made a list of his complaints about me.
He volunteered a lot of good information on this topic, in his efforts to justify a divorce. You have to know your spouse and weed through what they're saying for the truth, they are going to be hurt (and exaggerating somewhat) because of the situation.
I will write out my list here, I should probably be embarrassed by my failings, but I want anyone struggling to know exactly how open and honest they should be with themselves:
I always expected him to change first
I rejected him sexually just because I was too busy or feeling down about my looks. (Too busy to make time for the needs of the person I love most in this world? Yikes.)
I was quick to blame him for problems instead of finding solutions
Critical
Disapproving!
Judgmental
Unsupportive
Indirect and slow to communicate my needs (when I new full well that he just needed it spelled out for him clearly. He is not a mind reader.)
Unforgiving/bitter
Jumping to conclusions
Too quick to vent feelings to friends instead of him. (This made him feel as if I thought he couldn't handle it where I to bring problems to him directly.)
Controlling
Less than helpful--as in, I'd ask him to do a project for the house but never volunteer to do it together (or if it's a task I physically couldn't do, at least spend the time with him and encouraging him.) Now I'm not lazy, I would be doing other work while he worked, but he needed to feel more prioritized.
Not discussing decisions with him first
When he brought up a problem, I did not always take accountability right away. I would argue instead of listen when he really needed me to listen.
Complaining
Trying to do things on my own instead of asking for his help. He wants to help, to feel valuable, needed and appreciated.
Impatient when he made mistakes

On the opposite page, I made a list of how I can improve on these negative behaviors.
Combined with this, I also googled what respectful behavior looks like. My brain was such a muddle, that I trusted a list from the Internet more than my own ideas. But I knew I'd allowed the years and the bitterness to make me disregard my husband in a lot of ways, and I needed to begin treating him with compassion and respect again, even if we were only moving forward as co-parents, because after all he is a fellow human being. The list turned out to be pretty solid.
**** I encourage you to Google what respecting your husband or wife should look like for yourself. I only wrote down the things that I knew applied to my behavior, but the list I found was extensive and may contain things that you should look at it within your own behavior.****
And then I implemented that list as much as humanly possible, but NOT just because I wanted to keep my family intact.
It's also because I needed for myself to be a better human being to all. If I can see my nasty behavior and continue in it, what kind of person am I?
I knew I would die with deep regrets had I not changed, or rather, not changed BACK to who I really have been all along, a kind and loving person who got a little warped along the way by life.
I'll give some examples, but essentially this list was just the reverse of the negative list:
Stop what you're doing and look at him when he speaks so he feels like he's important to you.
Smile at him.
Encourage him
Say yes to him when you can
Avoid criticism especially in front of others
Defend him if others speak ill of him. (Doesn't everyone want this?)
Keep him company while he does things that he's interested in
Make time, your other things can wait. Memories with the ones you love can't.
Try to tell him things in a factual way, men's brains tend to appreciate that.
Take care of his needs as much as you can. (Again, this may sound patriarchal, but it truly isn't. Giving a gift to your spouse in meeting their needs is so rewarding. For me, I actually enjoy being a professional artist part time and using the rest of my time to be a good homemaker. So it's easy for me to have a welcoming home and a good meal on the way when my husband comes home, cold and exhausted. It may be very difficult for you to do the same, but I bet there are other needs you can meet that would help your spouse feel like a million bucks.)

I also wrote a list of goals as suggested in divorce busting.
Remember to keep your goals small and look for tiny improvements as you consistently show your changes through your actions.
Mine started with tiny things like "he will initiate physical contact in a non-sexual way"
And worked up to things like, "he will not feel the need to lock his phone" and "he will ask me on dates" and "he will apologize and make right what he's doing."
As of the end of June, all 25 goals were met.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2948010#Post2948010

Originally Posted by Mach1
I'm not gonna focus too much on where HE is...I'm gonna ask you some questions about where YOU are...

Whether he is home or not shouldn't change who you are and hopefully have become through all of this....Standing your ground and absolute boundaries are your only lifeline to finding something different. And you have to enforce the boundary in order for it to mean something....With any luck though, YOU should be light years ahead of him when it comes to relationship skills. I don't know you, however hopefully, you have been honing all of the things that you didn't like about yourself within the confines of a relationship. Making changes to yourself and for yourself.



So some questions.....

What does reconciliation look like to you ??

What does having a healed marriage look like to you ??

What boundaries are you putting in place to protect yourself ??

What fears and anxiety are you having over the thought of this ??

What does forgiving him look like to you ???

How can your boundaries be strong, without punishing him ?

Have you forgiven him ??

Have you forgiven yourself for your part in the breakdown of this relationship ???

Anyhoo....maybe some things to think about.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2948245#Post2948245

Originally Posted by Boat14
I spoke to a MC once who had been doing it for 30 years and he said he never once saw a woman leave a healthy, strong secure man. So my view wasn't to mope and complain that all women are no good and will eventually leave, my view was to become the healthy, strong secure man that a woman would never want to leave.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2948313#Post2948313

Originally Posted by bustorama
Be sure to enforce your boundaries with optimism and acceptance, and not out of anger or hopeless despondency. Keep in focus that you are not rejecting HER, but rather her actions and choices. There could be a place for her in your life and bed if she chose differently.

If she reacts angrily or sadly, be sure to validate her and REALLY hear her -- I hear you Wife that this is not easy. I'm sorry you feel that way. Acknowledge and accept criticisms, hear her POV, and implement your self-work, 180s and GAL accordingly.

But, ultimately, I won't abide THIS for me and the kids anymore. I deserve better, they deserve better, and you also deserve better. I hoped that we could get to a better place. But I see that you are still choosing not to act like my wife. It's more of the same. And with me getting out more, meeting people, and thinking about things, I see that things will be better for me than they are like this.

You are leading, opening a door to someplace new. She may follow or not.

You will be ok either way, because you will be living your life true to yourself and values.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2948438#Post2948438

Originally Posted by MrP
It might be silly but I put a slight dot on my hand with a Sharpie as a reminder to STFU and be more frugal with my words when I interact with W. I'm challenging myself to use as few words as possible to respond and also not initiate conversation to the fullest extent possible.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2948587#Post2948587

Originally Posted by SteveLW
No two situations are the same. There is "your mileage may vary" disclaimer is completely necessary in these kinds of responses. No two LBSs are the same. No two WASs are the same. No two situations are they same. While they tend to follow similar patterns, the idiosyncrasies of each person and marriage make them unique. My experience and what worked for me may not apply to you and your situation. My situation turned around fairly quickly. I also give head first into trying to DB 100%. I made mistakes and had setbacks. But my heart was fully committed to DB to fix me, not my marriage. In my case the marriage also got fixed. Those that do the best, whether they end up divorced or not, are the ones that focus on themselves. Not their WAS. Not their marriage.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2948634#Post2948634

Originally Posted by Kind18
This site is all about moving as successfully and quickly as possible towards reconciliation, and if not, helping the LBS rebuild their life, their self worth and confidence. In ALL circumstances, that requires at least some acknowledgement of personal responsibility so that you can see how it shapes your behaviour, and you can change it where required. This site is unlikely to be helpful unless you can accept criticism or strongly worded advice from time to time. Have a read through other threads. I can think of two posters here in the last 12 months - one of them has made excuse after excuse and ignored advice from veterans, but comes back here from time to time and demonstrates they still live a daily train wreck. The other is Pattnee. Pattnee had a few tough love type comments from time to time, but she owned things and wasn’t afraid to be called out on anything. Here she is six months later, and while her marriage isn’t saved, she’s now amazingly strong and grounded and probably 80% emotionally healed from the grief of bomb day.

You can accept everyone here is on your team and that this journey is going to be hard, or you can come here just to hear what you want to hear. It’s your call.



Originally Posted by Kind18
You can make lots of progress very quickly by working on you. You can making very little progress very slowly by trying to work on him.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2948737#Post2948737

Originally Posted by MrP
In relationships we have to be thoughtful about how partners might absorb what we say. Intent is different than impact. We know we're trying to be sarcastic or funny and it doesn't always land that way. Too much of it can wear partners down or be just as unattractive.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2948787#Post2948787

Originally Posted by Rockon
I continue to learn and grow with my realization that forgiveness is a choice and it doesn’t mean not feeling angry, hurt, etc. it also doesn’t mean suppressing emotions or ignoring what they are there to tell me.

Forgiveness is a gift.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2948971#Post2948971

Originally Posted by bustorama
If she is interested in finding a way to reconcile, she will find a way to communicate it to you. I cannot count how many of my W's calls/msgs I did not answer or return before we reconciled (hundreds, there would be multiple calls and hang ups and texts on many days). The first time I called her back was when she said she left a msg saying she wanted to meet up and talk about trying again. That was after multiple months of no answered or returned calls.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2949214#Post2949214

Originally Posted by Maturin
One of the things that has helped me keep it together during conversations with my W has been "how would this look if I posted it to the DB boards tomorrow?". It seemed silly at first but it's worked pretty well. I ask myself what am I trying to accomplish with this conversation and in general, what are the guidelines that R2C, Kind, Boat, DnJ, MrP and others have given me and what has worked in the past, and generally it's helped me to make progress in my life.

I can also say that other sitches I've read about here from both very old and active threads have helped me to manage expectations in my own sitch.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2949233#Post2949233

Originally Posted by JosephS
So, you have a job, you hate it. Something has happened. Maybe you’ve been taken advantage of one to many times. Or maybe there was one to many broken promises. Or maybe the work life balance is trash. Either way, after consideration and time for things to get better you’ve come to realize they never are. So what are you going to do? You go to work with a smile on your face. You do not give your job any kind of heads up you are about to leave, but you start looking. Finally, after searching and interviews you find what seems to be the perfect job. The money is amazing, there hasn’t been any broken promises, and the job just seems to fit you like a glove. But..there’s still the 2 weeks notice at the other job. You meander through those 2 weeks doing nothing but counting down the days, day dreaming about the new job and how happy you’ll be. Well it finally comes, the 2 weeks are over. You walk out of that “office” confident and so sure you are making the right decision you are even a little pompous about how great things are and will be. You don’t know if the new job will lie, or take advantage but at least there’s hope and you have already created the perfectness of the situation in your head so you sally forth. You don’t look back at that old nasty job that treated you horribly, until a few weeks later you remember you forgot something at the old office. Or maybe a paycheck is there and you gotta go back and put a little sugar on the situation so you can get what you need. Do you see where I’m going here?


You are the old employer she left. She found a new employer who fits her better these days. Why would she wanna go back to the old job she left when it’s the same job, boss, location. Well the only way you go back to that is when you don’t have any other choices. If you’ve made basically zero changes, you know if she comes back it’s because she needs to use you some more until she finds a new job. I would suggest if you wanna save this marriage you need to be the best job opportunity she has. If you don’t; you still need the be the best employer for the next. So basically you’re in a lose lose situation until you make some changes.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2949206#Post2949206

Originally Posted by MrP
I can remember not wanting to be alone (in the house, my car, a restaurant, etc.) and felt awful. My IC emphasized the need to "self-soothe" (not rely on others for comfort) and I had to work hard to get better about being solo. It does take conscious, sustained effort. Having made it safely back to enjoying time alone, I can't recommend enough that you put this work in.

Pick things you know you enjoy. For me, it is movies, music, books, and red wine. Or, shooting around a basketball court alone. Whatever you know you enjoy almost every time you do it. Start there and, eventually for me at least, I got comfortable dealing with some amount of anxiety, sadness, and depression on my own. You're not completely giving up your family and friends. For me, I wanted to give them a break from listening to me or propping me up. I hope you can find ways to occupy your mind when all alone.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2949338#Post2949338

Originally Posted by MrP
I'm putting this guidance from DnJ in a big (figurative) frame in my mind (and you should too Jessie):

“When you speak like that, when you are disrespectful, I will simply go elsewhere. I will not talk with, nor listen to you when you are like that.”

Any rebuttal from H does not matter. You didn’t ask him to change. You simply told him what you are going to do if/when he is disrespectful. You placed the responsibilities and accountability upon his shoulders. All you do is take your actions accordingly.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2949382#Post2949382


Originally Posted by MrP
As others have said, talk with the attorney you referenced. Talk with 3-4 more that offer free consultations. When I was searching for an L, I got lots of great information from each of the 5 with whom I spoke. Lots of what they shared overlapped, but each offered some unique wisdom about specific topics. Nobody will take care of you as well as you can yourself with the decisions you make for yourself right now. Let your L tell you what best to do in your situation.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2949405#Post2949405

Originally Posted by Maturin
Yesterday W asked to talk, and we had a civil discussion about the process and what happens next. .....Between the DB book, website, and countless other sources of material I've consumed, it's remarkable how predictable certain responses are.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2949536#Post2949536

Originally Posted by Boat14
The truth of the matter is when a woman loses attraction for a man it rarely returns. If it does it is usually when a man is killing it in life and would have zero desire to take her back. That's the catch-22 of this entire process.

Realize right now that it is going to take a really long time to uncouple yourself with her and a really long time before you are ready to date and a really long time before you find someone that fits into your new world. There are no shortcuts. Use your time wisely. Are you in your best shape physically? Have you learned what women want in a man? Have you figured out your purpose?

I promise you if you master these things you will find what you are looking for in life. If not, you may be still here ten years later complaining about what your wife is still doing to you and your family.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2949632#Post2949632

Originally Posted by bustorama
Why are you apologizing to someone who is having an EA on you (and your kids)?

Why are you engaging her at all?

Give yourself grace because little of this feels intuitive or natural when you are LBS.

When she says she wants to separate -- Yeah W. This situation does not work for me et all, either. I am making plans and moving ahead accordingly.

If she asks what ? I'm checking with a lawyer about my rights and options, I am separating my finances from yours, and I am going to see X, Y and Z for Easter with the kids.

Do not under any circumstances base your actions on her reactions or what you believe will be her reactions to your actions. That is controlling, manipulative, and co-dependent. If she acts cold or angry or whatever at you, so be it. Hear what she says, and validate her feelings. But do not be influenced or subordinate to them.

Don't tip toe or walk on eggshells or worry about the reaction of someone who is trampling all over your marriage by having an affair.

What are you trying to "achieve"? I still keep reading about she and her.

Your goal and focus should be to save, protect, and better yourself and your kids from her boundary violations.

Paraphrasing her, what do you want out of your life? To be with someone who does not value you and your efforts for your family?

What would she need to do to in order to have a chance at another relationship with you?
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2949644#Post2949644

Originally Posted by grok
If you ever wonder about how the work on this forum affects peoples lives, I'm here to tell it helped me immensely. I found these bits of wisdom because I started with the stickies and worked my way back. The threads of quotes and Sandi2's were especially valuable. Every time I found one that resonated, I would track it back to the source and read through. All those 2X4s to other people helped ME! Thank you.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2949723#Post2949723

Originally Posted by Mach1
Jack would have been a fan of you though....

Encouraging you to burn every ounce of fuel to outlast her MLC, to find a way through this while causing minimal damage. To find one more day within yourself. He would ask if she was worth it, the waiting for her to figure herself out before a bell was rung that could not be un-rung..

He would tell you that your spouse carried your marriage at times on her back, and that maybe it's just your time to carry the marriage for while.

Originally Posted by J3B
"Today is not the day I quit, maybe I will tomorrow, but let's see what tomorrow brings"

He would also tell you to use your anger as a shield, not as a sword with your interactions....

And that there is nothing that you can say or do to change this, yet everything that you say or do will change this....

LOL, yea....when that makes sense, you will be on your way....
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