Steve’s journey forward pt. 2

[Steve_]

Previous thread Link

https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2917844&page=11

[SteveLW]

Steve_, I do get the sense that you are in a much better place emotionally than you were a few weeks ago. I wish you would coparent without being around her at all, but you get to decide that. Everyone is different. I need to remember that just because I wouldn't want to be friends with my ex-W that it doesn't apply to everyone. I know my ex-GF tried for years to be "friends" and I just wasn't having it.

I think you could really improve yourself most by getting into a good PTSD IC treatment program. I think that along with all you have learned would set you up for potential long-term success in your next R with right person. But that again is up to you.

Keep moving foward!

[joejoe1]

Steve,

Reading your threads, it sounds like you are in a much better place emotionally. I'm glad you are able to go around your ex and not be drawn in. But just some advice, allow her a chance to figure out her life now, without you as an option.

Can you paint the room? Yes
I understand it's for your daughter, but sooner rather than later, you STBXW will have to learn how to figure out situations without you.

Figure out a way to inform her you are no longer an option, it's best if she start learning how to find a contracting company or person, or she can paint herself to do things in HER life. This is the life she chose. A life without you! Allow her to live that life without you. If you ok with being friends with her find. Friends doesn't mean ACCESS.

You are no longer her husband and placing yourself in that role in any fashion doesn't allow both of you to grow.

I'm glad you are deciding to take your time with this new lady, being high value doesn't stop you from hurting others or from getting hurt.

I also agree with getting out and meeting people and moving forward with your life, it doesn't help to be a hermit.

I spent a lot of time in behavioral heath for all kind of reasons before COVID, it helped. My counselor was a cool dude.

Keep moving forward and posting.

[Steve_]

Thank you guys!!!

I really have made a lot of short work in the last month. It was just a general level of acceptance I needed to face. Yes the stbxw still refers to me as “my handsome baby daddy” which grinds my gears but she seems good in her la la land today. I have finished painting the room, I did a great job. I wil assemble my daughters bed (it’s like a little house it’s a pain) put the furniture in and go home.

The new girl in my life mentioned yesterday going up this way for a baptism of her adult friend who is embracing her faith coming up. She wanted to come by and see me, I honestly would like that. It’s not for a couple weeks which will allow the ex to get into the groove of the finality of this. I will take her up hiking and fishing for a day. That’s my plan. And it will be super fun.

I did pick up and extra work day this week. And I have been talking to therapists as well. One from the VA and 2 more from work. And honestly I feel good about where I am. I know I got a ways to go but I’m a hell of a lot better now. In the 8 months I have

Stood alone for my M
Got into therapy and medication
Kept close with the in laws who adore me
Got my own place last second
Cut off my financial ties
Got my credit score over 50 points up
Lost 65 pounds,
Spend lots of time alone, fishing, etc.
Stayed away from bars and dating apps.
Stayed away from alcohol in any kind of excess
Renewed my faith.
Had enough and pushed the D to conclusion.
Read lots of books.
Spent a lot of time with my kids and RC cars outside and in the mountains
Got my degree and signed up for a new IV /blood transfusion certification class which is coming up soon .

So thus far I feel like I’m doing pretty good considering all that’s happened.

[SteveLW]

Thank you guys!!!

I really have made a lot of short work in the last month. It was just a general level of acceptance I needed to face. Yes the stbxw still refers to me as “my handsome baby daddy” which grinds my gears but she seems good in her la la land today. I have finished painting the room, I did a great job. I wil assemble my daughters bed (it’s like a little house it’s a pain) put the furniture in and go home.

Keep working on detachment. The fact that her "pet name" grinds your gears shows you still have a ways to go. This is not a 2x4, lots of LBSs struggle with full detachment. But I will say that if recognizing you still have a ways to go means NOT accepting the invite to help paint the room, then you should not. Think of HER living space as HERS and yours ad yours. Would you have asked her to help paint your D's room at your new place? (And I REALLLLLLLLY hope the answer to that is no!)

The new girl in my life mentioned yesterday going up this way for a baptism of her adult friend who is embracing her faith coming up. She wanted to come by and see me, I honestly would like that. It’s not for a couple weeks which will allow the ex to get into the groove of the finality of this. I will take her up hiking and fishing for a day. That’s my plan. And it will be super fun.

Who cares about the EX's groove?!? More attachment. Do not decide to things based on the EX's feelings on it. You go do you. I am not advocating spending time with this new gal because I think you are LONG ways away from being a healthy half of a couple (your continued attachment to STBXW proves that), but it shouldn't be because of your ex. I really wish Steve_ had more male friends. I think male bonding right now would do you a lot of good.

I did pick up and extra work day this week. And I have been talking to therapists as well. One from the VA and 2 more from work. And honestly I feel good about where I am. I know I got a ways to go but I’m a hell of a lot better now. In the 8 months I have

I am a big advocate of staying busy, and one of the best ways to do that is to work, especially if you are paid by the hour! Working and earning money is always good use of time. I remember several years ago I had two jobs. It was amazing how fast my savings grew as one benefit of working a lot is you aren't spending money!

Stood alone for my M
Got into therapy and medication
Kept close with the in laws who adore me
Got my own place last second
Cut off my financial ties
Got my credit score over 50 points up
Lost 65 pounds,
Spend lots of time alone, fishing, etc.
Stayed away from bars and dating apps.
Stayed away from alcohol in any kind of excess
Renewed my faith.
Had enough and pushed the D to conclusion.
Read lots of books.
Spent a lot of time with my kids and RC cars outside and in the mountains
Got my degree and signed up for a new IV /blood transfusion certification class which is coming up soon .

So thus far I feel like I’m doing pretty good considering all that’s happened.

Pretty good list. I don't agree with all of these. (Mainly Stood alone for my M since you did that for far too long, and kept close with the in laws since this seems to keep you attached to STBXW). But yes you have come a long way Steve_. I do worry that you think you have arrived. Like I said in your last thread, when you came here you were 10000x overly attached to exW. Now you are down to 50x, but the needle is moving in the right direction. I would have loved for you to come here and said:

"Ex W just invited me to help paint D's room at her place. I am considering doing it. Thoughts?"

Doing that beforehand would have given you insights into why it was or was not a good idea. As I've told you 100 times, no matter what any of us say here it was still within your power to decide to do it, no matter how many of us hated the idea! These are all issues you need to work on in IC:

- Why Steve_ seems to gravitate to female companionship instead of male companionship
- Why Steve_ avoids getting feedback that may go against what he wants to do
- Why Steve_ continues to be impulsive, doing what feels right or good at a given moment, instead of stepping back and looking at the bitter picture
- Why Steve_ refuses to admit that when he does the last bullet, he then refuses to admit it was mistake and digs in on the decision with rationalizations (It was for my D so I did it!, etc)

So Steve_ continue working. Continue moving forward. Continue looking for areas to improve. I R'd with my W over 3 years ago and I am still constantly looking for ways I can improve and be better as a man, as a husband, and as a father! (Oh, and as a Christian too!)

[Steve_]

I appreciate all the feedback!

I agreed to paint the room because of the reasons I stated for my daughter but also because they still live with the in-laws. Had it been like the ex's new place or somewhere with an OM there is no way in hell I would have agreed. I know I have work to do to detatch, things are much much better but I still sometimes get a little washed over with sadness. And the sadness is mainly the loss of the nuclear family I wanted all these years, a little worry about what kind of OM will eventually replace me and how the children will get along with the things their mother does. She has been working a lot more and gave up on the extra curricular stuff for extra cash which I applauded her for and supported her working more at her actual job.

I do not have regret, and I am so thankful to god and to many of you for that. I felt like I really did a good job hanging in there for a long enough time, really giving it my best shot before taking a knee and I knew I needed to do that before moving forward. Especially so if the ex decides to try some attempt to recon later, I can feel good about the 1,000 chances shes blown and keep moving forward knowing she had her shot and no looking back on coulda, woulda, shoulda.


I asked her if she would be able to watch the children for me or help me find coverage for a weekend coming up, just 2 of the nights I would have the children. (I have not in the 8 months of separation asked her for any child care favor, but Ive done plenty). The times I have hung out with my work buddies I did it at my place with the kids around or I did go to a bar/restraunt with them a couple times but on a friday night after work. I always took up 100% of the time I got with the kids and worked my leisure around that. She agreed to watch them for my two nights and one day and she asked if it was because I was "taking my girl out" and I was just kinda caught off guard with that question.. but I answered "maybe" she said "make sure you take her somewhere nice, dont be a cheapskate, but not too expensive" and I was a bit baffled. Then she said "thanks for all the work you did at mom's house, I appreciate it, and If you need anything let me know"

Again im sure there is several layers of nonsense there but face-value seemed nice. The sunday all day before my friend arrives in town for the evening I will take my kids to the trampoline park and let them run wild, do some arcade games, just go ham. Im gonna also take them swimming in the morning, the apartment complex I stay in has 3 different pools and the kids absolutely love swimming so Ill take some advantage of that for sure. Plus I need to tan badly, I am the epitome of white after so much covid lockdown.

If the ex asks for any kind of favors or unneccesary interaction i will respond with "maybe, let me see" and then post it here. I do feel like I was definately taken advantage of on the painting and house work and I didnt like the way that felt, but I did it anyhow, for future things I will come here before giving her an answer.

On other news my 3 work buddies I have been helping study all got over 96% on their first nursing school mid-terms so that was great! Im proud of the three of those weirdos. I have been trying to focus on getting some more income going to have more options for leisure time for myself and my kiddos. That and the upcoming school work and IV therapy certification course. I know I have a ways to go but thus far I just take it day by day with slow deliberate steps and trust in god to show me the way forward. This is all I can really do.

[LH19]

She has been working a lot more and gave up on the extra curricular stuff for extra cash which I applauded her for and supported her working more at her actual job.

Steve I am a very curious guy. Can you give more details?

I do not have regret, and I am so thankful to god and to many of you for that. I felt like I really did a good job hanging in there for a long enough time, really giving it my best shot before taking a knee and I knew I needed to do that before moving forward. Especially so if the ex decides to try some attempt to recon later, I can feel good about the 1,000 chances shes blown and keep moving forward knowing she had her shot and no looking back on coulda, woulda, shoulda.

huh?

Again im sure there is several layers of nonsense there but face-value seemed nice.

So we see this a lot with KitKat. You guys open the door for friendship. Your ex's respond and act in a friendly manner. Then you guys think there is an motive but they are really ok just being friends.

If the ex asks for any kind of favors or unnecessary interaction i will respond with "maybe, let me see" and then post it here. I do feel like I was definitely taken advantage of on the painting and house work and I didnt like the way that felt, but I did it anyhow, for future things I will come here before giving her an answer.

I am confused? Thought you were good being friends?

[Ready2Change]

she asked if it was because I was "taking my girl out" and I was just kinda caught off guard with that question..

This is called fishing and you should have been expecting it and had an appropriate response ready.

but I answered "maybe" she said "make sure you take her somewhere nice, don't be a cheapskate, but not too expensive" and I was a bit baffled.

Still fishing with indirect criticism of you.

[Steve_]

She has been working a lot more and gave up on the extra curricular stuff for extra cash which I applauded her for and supported her working more at her actual job.

Steve I am a very curious guy. Can you give more details?

Yeah, she was dabbling into doing some things under the table with some bad people for quick cash. I accepted I could not control her actions but had to voice my opinon, seems that it worked and she cut ties with the folks she was working for. (I cannot go into detail, but it was essentially moving products for people that were not licensed to be distributing it). For cash under the table type of deal, nothing felonious but still wrong.

I do not have regret, and I am so thankful to god and to many of you for that. I felt like I really did a good job hanging in there for a long enough time, really giving it my best shot before taking a knee and I knew I needed to do that before moving forward. Especially so if the ex decides to try some attempt to recon later, I can feel good about the 1,000 chances shes blown and keep moving forward knowing she had her shot and no looking back on coulda, woulda, shoulda.

huh?

What I meant by that was that I have no regrets looking back on how long I stood for my M alone because I can move forward never having to wonder well if i did X, Y or Z or I didnt try A,B and C, damn.. maybe I should have gave it longer, maybe I should have blah blah etc.. No I dont have that. I exhausted every possible means to salvage this M to the detriment of my own self-respect for a very long time. Even my children are at the point they just want to see daddy happy and they know mom is not nice to their dad. Thats when I really truly felt it was time to move on, when my kids were asking me if I was gonna live alone forever or find a better person, that kinda hit me. I told them "I dont know what god's plan for me is but maybe one day"

Again im sure there is several layers of nonsense there but face-value seemed nice.

So we see this a lot with KitKat. You guys open the door for friendship. Your ex's respond and act in a friendly manner. Then you guys think there is an motive but they are really ok just being friends.

Yeah I do hope that is the case LH, I dont mind the friendship deal, but I will kind of keep that at a distance as well, because she is such a manipulator she cannot act responsibly with her emotions around me. "As friends" she still wants to flirt, touch me and send me kissy emojis and other inappropriate things that I don't respond to. This has been some big game to her, and only since a few weeks back when I completed the D has she began to accept that this isnt funny and its reality.

If the ex asks for any kind of favors or unnecessary interaction i will respond with "maybe, let me see" and then post it here. I do feel like I was definitely taken advantage of on the painting and house work and I didnt like the way that felt, but I did it anyhow, for future things I will come here before giving her an answer.

I am confused? Thought you were good being friends?

I am okay just being friends, but she still reaches out in either a disrespectful way or a manipulative way, she still believes that the lies she tells work. So I have to keep her at a distance and really cut out any sort of activity with her unless it is absolutely necessary and she can act mature and responsibly. My goal is to be close friends again some day, the affair and all the breakdown of the M was saddening because we really were BFFS before all this went down. And that is one of the harder parts.

[LH19]

I am okay just being friends, but she still reaches out in either a disrespectful way or a manipulative way, she still believes that the lies she tells work.

So Steve I think the question that needs to be asked is why do you want to be friends with some who had lied, cheated and treats you in a manipulative and disrespectful way?

[SteveLW]

I do not have regret, and I am so thankful to god and to many of you for that. I felt like I really did a good job hanging in there for a long enough time, really giving it my best shot before taking a knee and I knew I needed to do that before moving forward. Especially so if the ex decides to try some attempt to recon later, I can feel good about the 1,000 chances shes blown and keep moving forward knowing she had her shot and no looking back on coulda, woulda, shoulda.

Steve_, I am glad you can look back without regrets. I think you could have done that weeks, maybe even months ago. But it isn't my sitch, it is yours. However, I think there is a 180 opportunity in the future, that from now on you will be self respecting enough to not tolerate such a long period of disrespect, and stand for YOURSELF sooner and pull the plug. Right now you have a tendency to grab on due to your codependent nature, and not let go, even when you should. Let your self-respect outweigh your fear of losing what you have.

Just an observation. I fear that if she came back and made promises right now you would take her back. I hope I am wrong, but I fear that you would run back IF she said the right things. That is why I say you've come a long way but still have a long way to go. I think you try to convince yourself that YOU are moving on, when really she has given you no choice.

[Drh2001]

Reading your WW's comments to you reminds me of my own WW. There is absolutely no moral compass at all. Ruled by emotion and emotions steer the action. No remorse.

Your WW knows what she is doing is wrong - but doesn't care. I mean really doesn't care - it's as if some force is driving her to not really ponder over what she has done to you and her children.

[Steve_]

So just checking in:

To answer your question LH, I remain friends for the sake of my children, and because as a Christian I have to try to go to sleep without hate in my heart, I also have to realize that yes she was absolutely horrid to me and continues to be morally corrupt, but I must set the example for my children and give her some grace as the mother of my kids, but I say friendship loosely, if she becomes disrespectful or anything I instantly disengage/hang-up etc.

About a week ago she admitted to going back to OM she left me for, told me it was "my fault" since I had "gave up" and paid the filing fee at the beginning of May. I just laughed at that. And explained how I patiently waited for 8 months.. She said "you just wanted to rush things" I told her no, and its okay, I accepted it all, im alright where I am now.

She seemed to be angry after hearing that I had been seeing a different woman, she acted very happy for me and then the tune changed to "wow, you really downgraded" and some other nonsense, she took it upon herself to inform my children. Which they were totally fine with and happy about but I was far far far from ready to tell the kids I had seen another lady. It will be a loooooong time before this girl meets my kids if ever. She has a long process to go through with me first and I am in no rush to get into a serious R any time soon. I know The ex did it to punish me since the children and her family figured out she was back staying overnight with OM she left me for again. (she cannot be alone, she is a monkey brancher, there is no future in that R with him but whatever, she is sick right now and spinning). It seems she got a hold of social media on her mothers account and seen a snap chat of me out hiking with the girl I'd been talking to. Not her face or anything just trees but her voice was in it making a joke. Then she somehow did this female investigation and found out who she was. Its rediculous really...

I just maintained a positive attitude and told her I want her to be happy as well. Yesterday she came to pick up the children, she was 4 hours late. I asked her why, and told her its too late for them on a school night. She told me well you can watch them "you are still my husband legally, I didnt pay the last $700, so its not been finalized yet" I responded with a smile, and said, actually I called earlier asked about the case, was told there was a balance and i paid it. its all done. (I showed her the recipt, I knew she had the money she was bragging about her stocks going up 2k) it was a manipluation tool and it cost me more than I had, but I want to be free of that. She looked very disturbed. Then asked me if my friend was coming up this weekend and thats why I wont be having the kids. I told her Im going up hiking for memorial day, and that I do not ask her whereabouts on her days off. She looked upset. I told her "listen, I know its hard, now its real to youl, but for me It was a long time ago, I had to process all the stuff you are going through now, I told her it would be okay, and I told her I would be here for the kids for sure no matter what".

Other than that I applied for 4 new state jobs to increase my monthly income by 3,000 ish. Hopefully I land one, I feel like I will. Things are looking up and I dont feel anything towards the WW, I see how sick she is and It makes me sad but other than that I do miss the potential R once in awhile, but I know its fantasy that will never happen, and I move on.

[Steve_]

oh and DRH, you are 1,000% correct!

She needs therapy, and reality badly. But by the time she got healthy enough for an R it will be no less than probably another year or two. And I already lost 11 on her.. No thanks.

[Ginger1]

You talk way too much dude.

And there is a fine balance between friends and civility. You could sleep at night without having a friendship with someone who isn’t capable of friendship. It’s not a Christian thing. It’s you still you either need to have her know enough to want her to come back, or you have to make her think you moved on so she wants what she can’t have.

You are monkey branching too by the way. You seem to not be able to be alone either

[Steve_]

I was alone for 8 months before I even went on a date ginger. But I know there are extremists here that feel i need to be single for years, and date multiple women casually to "find out what i want" but im 36, I know what I want and dont want.

I was not looking for this girl, I did not go on dating apps, bars, clubs, anything. I did go out with girls a couple times from work, who shot thier shots at me but I wasn't feeling it. Was'nt ready and they had a messy kinda life, or were just wild looking for a good time on my dime. Believe it or not, I am not a moron, just was an NGS doormat for the ex for far too long. This is not some game to get her back.

The worst mistake I could ever make is taking her back... I came to terms with that well before I even entertained the idea of even having dinner with another woman. I want to be happy with someone dependable and loyal. And that is not WW. But of course I read and regard all opinons. I just wanted to point out that I didnt go out looking for a replacement or a woman to mess with like 90% of the modern world does. I took my time and made peace with this all first. And again she sort of fell into my life as friends just chatting. Never intended anything more.

[Ginger1]

No extremists here. She was in and out of the picture for 8 months, you have been completely a bd fully attached for 8 months. You never stopped,
And took some time for yourself in a state of not being attached to her. There is nothing extreme about what I’m saying. You have 2 kids who need you to focus on them and your own healing because you are still manipulative just like she is and still very attached.

You’ll do what you want, but it 10/10 times it hasn’t worked for anyone in these boards, and you better hope you don’t end up with another baby on board like wolfman did.

[Steve_]

Yeah no baby gonna happen, I am not that stupid believe it or not. And I know what a rebound is and is not. I feel at this point no matter what I say it will be 2x4'd. WW was never in my picture, she never came back, never attempted it, still wont. I live totally alone with my kids this entire time. I just had a hard time accepting more of what I already knew. But I Gotcha, I will be extremely careful and again this girl is like 4 hours away living wise so thats why im okay with it, It has to be done slowly to be healthy.

She has to focus on her school, this will take at least 13 months of her being down there, I need to get a better job and find more income. There is no moving in, no being together more than a couple days a month, thats the pace i need right now so its good for me and for her, There is no rush here and we have a good friendship primarily. But assume what you will.

[LH19]

About a week ago she admitted to going back to OM she left me for, told me it was "my fault" since I had "gave up" and paid the filing fee at the beginning of May. I just laughed at that. And explained how I patiently waited for 8 months.. She said "you just wanted to rush things" I told her no, and its okay, I accepted it all, im alright where I am now.

Steve you really need to learn to just say "I understand you feel that way" You are trying logic and reason to manipulate her back.

She seemed to be angry after hearing that I had been seeing a different woman, she acted very happy for me and then the tune changed to "wow, you really downgraded" and some other nonsense, she took it upon herself to inform my children.

Interesting it has been 3 years and my ex has never heard from me who I am dating. You are d for a week and you tell your ex to make her jealous. Then you guys include the kids because you are both toxic people.

There is no future in that R with him but whatever, she is sick right now and spinning).

Speculation. They could get married tomorrow.

I just maintained a positive attitude and told her I want her to be happy as well.

Do you really Steve?

Yesterday she came to pick up the children, she was 4 hours late. I asked her why, and told her its too late for them on a school night.

Why would you ask her why she's late?

She told me well you can watch them "you are still my husband legally.

huh?

I didn't pay the last $700, so its not been finalized yet" I responded with a smile, and said, actually I called earlier asked about the case, was told there was a balance and i paid it. its all done. (I showed her the receipt, I knew she had the money she was bragging about her stocks going up 2k) it was a manipulation tool and it cost me more than I had, but I want to be free of that.

Steve just to be clear you try to manipulate each other

She looked very disturbed.

Speculation. You have no idea how she felt.

Then asked me if my friend was coming up this weekend and that's why I wont be having the kids. I told her Im going up hiking for memorial day, and that I do not ask her whereabouts on her days off.

No comment with a smirk.

She looked upset.

Speculation. You have no idea how she felt.

I told her "listen, I know its hard, now its real to you, but for me It was a long time ago, I had to process all the stuff you are going through now, I told her it would be okay, and I told her I would be here for the kids for sure no matter what".

Manipulation

Other than that I applied for 4 new state jobs to increase my monthly income by 3,000 ish. Hopefully I land one, I feel like I will. Things are looking up and I don't feel anything towards the WW, I see how sick she is and It makes me sad but other than that I do miss the potential R once in awhile, but I know its fantasy that will never happen, and I move on.

Steve you are not even close to moving on and you are going to take down this other woman in the process.

[Thornton]

Hey Steve,

I agree with Ginger but I also know most people get that huge sense of relief after being in pain for months when a new person expresses interest. The brain chemicals and endorphins trick us in to believing this person was an angel sent from God and that they are an ideal partner. The honeymoon stage is very addictive.

While I don't agree you are anywhere near ready to date, I also know you have convinced yourself that you are ready and will act accordingly.

That being said, be very careful Steve. Go super slow and keep your attachment (you are a codependent btw) to a minimum. If this relationship does not work out as planned, all that pain that you experienced with your WW leaving will come rushing back 10 fold.

Also, do not stop going to therapy and working on yourself. You are as broken as your WW is and need therapy to work through your core issues. This will only serve to help your relationship with the new girl if you keep Steve and your healing as priority #1.

Tread carefully man. We've seen this a million times here, and 99% of the time it doesn't end well.

[Steve_]

ok, cool. I see what this is, go ahead and 2x4 away folks. Zero point to continue "defending myself" here. My M ended, wasnt worth saving, I tried to give it time and patience, tried to move forward gracefully. I do not want my M back, its a bad Idea, I want to move forward and be happy. To the point I spent the $700 to make sure it was done, and I dont believe in divorce, that was ethically and financially hard for me to do. A month ago I went down there and signed the waiver to avoid paying the filing fee. But everything I post is some "manipulation tactic" its not. I want to move on, this girl is not someone I would consider hurting in any way. She is a good person and a family friend I know I cannot just dissapear back to WW when she pretends to "get better" its not real. And I dont need anyone, but for now this girl and I get along, see eye to eye and I have hid nothing from her. It is a friendship, But again think what you want, it takes a lot but once I am done I am done. And I would not use anyone to get over anything, I am not a morally empty man. I am not manipulating here, I accepted defeat and i want to be happy, I genuinely want my ex to get better and find her own happiness and I know that will not be with me, yes it hurts but it is what it is. But regardless of what I say here it will just be seen otherwise. No point in going on. Thanks for trying to help me do the things to bust this divorce but it did not need to be saved. I will continue to just move on day by day.

Like I said I am aware of what a rebound is, and that is not healthy, they do not last, and most people do that. If I wanted a rebound I would have done it with the 3-4 different girls at work that were willing the past 6 months. I cannot use people and i wont. Period and end of story.

[LH19]

Steve,

I am not even saying you are intentionally using this woman what I am saying is this is most likely going to end very badly. I have been around a long time and I have a knack for reading between the lines. My advice is straight and to the point in case someone wants to stop and say "maybe he's right". If you think for a second that your sitch is over and you have moved on I am afraid you are in for a rude awakening. I just hope that somehow your children are able to overcome what you guys are putting them through.

Peace.

[Traveler]

Hi Steve, you seem confused by the word "extreme". You called Ginger's view that you're not ready to date extreme, but 4 of us are on that side and you alone are on your side. Your position is on the fringe.

It's obvious you are still emotionally attached to your ex. Rather than solving your co-dependency by taking time to learn to be a whole person by yourself, you're filling the hole in your soul with another woman.

Dude, you claim to value this lady, but your actions say you don't. Imagine if you told her you needed 3-6 months alone and then pursued her as a healthy individual?

[Steve_]

Cwarrior I can garuntee that if I said I been alone with nobody and everything final with the ex for 3-6 months, still there would be people that will tell me (thats not long enough, you need years.. etc.. the trauma is so deep.. etc etc.). Just like how my PTSD therapist expected me to have this horrible issue for all the stuff I have endured but I do not. I accepted it as part of my job and reality, I miss my friends and I regret some of the lives ive taken because it was a person after all, but what happened I cannot change and I never did anything personally to compromise my integrity.

It will take me YEARS to be absolutely okay, used to the changes and truly accept that this part of my life is over completely to where it becomes normal. I know that. But I also know my wife had been cheating and dumping me over and over for years. Which is why I am resolute here. Regardless if it doesnt work out with this girl my wife will never be a healthy option, and after all she has done to me it would be rather pathetic to return to someone with such little respect and regard for me as a man. My NGS, lack of self-esteem and toxic co-dependancy was so bad for so long I do not see fixing this ever. Yes I would love to remain a nuclear family, but I feel so much damage was done for so long a period between one another and I can face my music and learn from my mistakes, but I cannot fix a lack of morality in a 33 year old woman. She will always ne narcissitic, that will not change, and I cannot go back and un-do what I have done.

I realize you all think I am the same steve that has sat here and been torn up for ages over this. In a few small ways I am sure. But I want a relationship in my future where I dont have that NGS, that I go into it with self-respect, honestly, patiently. I will watch for red flags and adress them boldly, not tolerate any mistreatment unless I genuinely deserve it and then communicate effictively about it. I cannot help that I had repeated my mistakes for 11 years with this woman, I was so manipulated I couldnt even stand on my own feet as a man. I will not let my son see me go down like a b***h in front of his mother or return to that type of life.

The reason I am even seeing this other woman is because she is vetted by family members as a healthy person that does not get around, that has a career, that enjoys children and has a good head on her shoulders, a good family, and is an absolutely great communicator. She is not materialistic, she saved up her own money living alone to put herself through school. I am 1000% certain that as time goes on there will be some issue, nobody is perfect. But when she presented herself into my life without even looking for her and we got along effortlessly it was mirroring things that a healthy relationship is supposed to look like. No expectations, team work, laughter, things are fun and light, honesty and trust. And to me I would have been an idot to not give a woman like that a shot who was interested, especially me being 36 with two kids and her with none and just turning 31. I know there is a HIGH probability that this will not work out. A lot of relationships post-marriage or long term relationships do not. Her and I have discussed it, we have talked about what if the WW came back acting right.. like I said she is my close friend above all first, and there is nothing we do not openly discuss like adults. I would like this to work with her, but I will be absolutely fine if it does not. Either way I am moving forward, finding a better job for more money to have a better life for my kids and I. And I am never going back to the shell of a man that was so unhappy for so long again. I did not deserve that, and my kids dont deserve to see that.

And I will continue to pray that god points me in the direction I need to be and follow that path. I will be okay no matter what.

[Thornton]

I know it feels like we are hammering away at you, Steve.

I have been in your exact same situation before and defended myself as well. I was 100% convinced this new woman was perfect and I paid the price for it when things ended.

Broken attracts broken, it just does. It's uncanny how it happens and its a subconscious thing that we aren't even aware is happening.

Because this woman is attracted to you, tells me she has some underlying issues. Not because you are a bad guy, but because she knows your story and remains attracted to you.

Think of it this way. A healthy woman would see your situation and think to herself "this man is nowhere near ready to date. He's been through the ringer with his ex for years, I think I'll hold off from seeing him until he has had some time to process the end of his marriage and his codependency". And no, 8 months is not enough time to process the end of a 10 year long narc/codependent marriage.

Again, I know you will do what you will so my best advice is to go super slow motion with this girl.

[SteveLW]

Steve_, not sure why you feel the need to defend yourself or that you feel that getting approval here is necessary. In my sitch, I got 2x4'd for buying a new house when we were only a month into piecing. It was my life, my decision, but appreciated everyone perspective even if most of it was "are you crazy?!?"

So you do you. When you update here, people's opinions here are just that, their opinions. Take them for what they are worth, then go do what you want. People here call it like they see it. They are right way more often than they are wrong, but you still get to do what you want.

tl;Dr:

Steve_ gets to choose what he wants.
Posters here get to tell him he's crazy for it.

[Steve_]

I do not agree with some of the things posted here. But I know had I stuck to the advice when I first came I would be wayyyy better off than I am not and a lot farther along. But it is what it is. I had to go through my journey. I do understand broken attracts broken, I get that 100%. I know I am not okay, and there will be times seeing my ex gets to me. But I will bat down that mirage of whatever it is quick through reality, history and prayer. I’m not turning back. And sure sometimes I would want to, but she isn’t even offering and again, I know it would not be ever what I could have with someone better. I would be settling and nobody should ever settle. People come into our lives as blessings or lessons and my ex was a lesson, a really hard hitting one.

I will take things with this gal very very slow. It’s good that I won’t see her more than a couple days a month. She is invested in school for 2 years down there she just started. I need to get my next better job and really get myself into a better living Sitch that I am comfortable with. Sure it’s [censored] to have a long distance R but I think it’s actually a blessing because most of what we have is communication and time. And if I end up making it with this girl it will be in the most healthy way. There will be no way to jump-start anything here. I will not move away and she will not chance her life plan. We agreed on that before the second date. We both know we got work to do, and to be responsible and healthy we will take our time, do what makes one another happy, discuss anything that doesn’t and be realistic about our expectations here. Personally for me I have none of her. I cannot have any of anyone or I will be doomed to repeat NGS over again. And I won’t. I will be extremely cautious. But for what I have seen thus far everything is good. We will see if anything changes.

[Traveler]

Cwarrior I can garuntee that if I said I been alone with nobody and everything final with the ex for 3-6 months, still there would be people that will tell me (thats not long enough, you need years.. etc.. the trauma is so deep.. etc etc.). Just like how my PTSD therapist expected me to have this horrible issue for all the stuff I have endured but I do not. I accepted it as part of my job and reality, I miss my friends and I regret some of the lives ive taken because it was a person after all, but what happened I cannot change and I never did anything personally to compromise my integrity.

Steve, check your assumptions. I paused dating for 4-5 months, and the board was highly supportive when I resumed dating. Several of us supported another poster dating. It's often obvious when you're over an ex and moving away from co-dependence. In my 16 posts, I made two mentions of my ex, and that's not because I hide when I'm thinking about her. She just isn't very relevant anymore.

I would have been an idot to not give a woman like that a shot who was interested, especially me being 36 with two kids and her with none and just turning 31.

I see a scarcity mindset in you, the same one that believed your XW was such a catch she could win any man. I'm 40s with 2 kids and I just dated a 33 y/o with no kids. What of it? It's not that unusual.

[Steve_]

I made that assumption based on advice I already got on this board. I’ve been told I am so bad it will take me YEARS to date healthily. That was in a thread awhile back. I’m sure someone will drop in to reinforce it.

[Traveler]

I made that assumption based on advice I already got on this board. I’ve been told I am so bad it will take me YEARS to date healthily. That was in a thread awhile back. I’m sure someone will drop in to reinforce it.

It could take months, it could take years. That's up to you and how seriously you take your issues and how hard you work to change them (e.g., working through self-help books, seeking licensed therapists).

[LH19]

[quote][/quote]

I made that assumption based on advice I already got on this board. I’ve been told I am so bad it will take me YEARS to date healthily. That was in a thread awhile back. I’m sure someone will drop in to reinforce it.

That would be me Steve. It is of my opinion you are still highly attached to your ex that cheated on you multiple times for the last 11 years. You are still trying to manipulate her back because you view it as the only way to be happy and ease the pain. So based on my observation and based on my experience of dating post divorce I feel 2 years of you focus on yourself and your kids which may make you ready to date. That of course doesn’t take into account the setbacks you will have when your ex starts messing with your opinion.

As SteveLW said this is my opinion and you can take my advice as you see fit.

[SteveLW]

I made that assumption based on advice I already got on this board. I’ve been told I am so bad it will take me YEARS to date healthily. That was in a thread awhile back. I’m sure someone will drop in to reinforce it.

This is why you need to be evaluated by a trained professional. The poster that told you that isn't a trained professional, and had not done a psych evaluation on you. They may be right. They may be wrong. The only way to know for sure is to get a professional to do a psych eval.

[Steve_]

Yep and yep. I understand what your saying LH, I get it. I do still do IC, just cause my divorce is over doesn’t mean my work is. Matter of fact I feel like I should push harder to hit my goals. That’s why I applied for the state jobs, and am lining up a better future that has nothing to do with XW. I don’t feel bad at all for her, this fallout was her call. It’s the kids that I worry about. But I feel like as long as I do my best job for them they will be okay. That’s all I really can do. I won’t let up now and just go back to old Steve that got ran over or got comfortable. All the reading, posting, books, videos, hours of chatting with family and friends over the past 8 months. That’s staying with me. Otherwise I have learned nothing.

Am I ready to be out there dating women, bringing them around my kids? Ready to move on with another woman as a serious part of a new R? No, but is it okay to have someone who is long distance to spend time with a couple days a month that we make each other happy and could lead to more over time? Sure. As long as I walk slowly and carefully. That’s my plan. I will continue building, if you are not growing your are dying.

[LH19]

Steve,

Curious as to why you would feel bad for your EX wife? She seems to be happy and as you stated you want her to be happy so nothing to feel bad about.

As for dating the girl you are going to do what you’re going to do. You admit you were never good at taken advice so I certainly don’t except that to change. Maybe it works out and maybe it doesn’t. Only time will tell.

[MrBrside]

Steve,

IMO you are just as wayward as your ex.

You statements just leave rational people shaking their heads.

You have been alone for 8 months ! - WTF ? Do you really thing that? - For 7.5 of these months you had ( and still have ) an unhealthy attachment / codependancy issue with WW.. Your reasoning / rational is just, well nil.. You act on emotion.

You know broken attracts broken - Yet you are dating. - emotion not rational.

When you stop posting and asking for advice on a weekly basis, and are ready to move on with your life without the need for help is a starting point - then add a minimum of 6 months to 2 years onto that date, before even thinking of dating.

Oh and you said WW asked as to why you wont be having the children - Becuase you have plans ?

Where is the rock in that Steve. If we believe your previous posts, WW is a poor excuse for a mother. You should be taking care of your children whenever you can - WW isnt a good mother, so you fight to spend as much time with them as you can !
oh but i need a life / i need to take my date out / i need to do my own thing / hmm i fancy a hike this weekend - No.. Wrong answer -

Your kids have seen to much - more than most seperations with manipulation from both you and WW... If your ex is the miserable excuse of a mother you make her out to be, you step up and have the children whenever you arent working. They have a mother who brushes them off when it suits, but now you decide not to have them so you can go on a hike - i suspect with this new woman ! - Sounds like the actions of a WW to me.

You want to see how a real father acts - A father who became the rock. Read josephs posts on his kids and WW. You are a millions miles from his action.

We are all wasting our time with you IMO.. Like i said, rational people are trying to reason with a WW mindset - and anybody on here knows your cant reason with emotion.

[Traveler]

we make each other happy

Agreed, Mr Brightside. Steve, if she’s a healthy person, she doesn’t need you to make her happy. I suspect you still struggle with the idea of being complete and happy without a romantic partner so you think that’s how others work, too. If you can set aside your selfish desire for her to fill a hole in your soul, we’re telling you your co-dependency and other issues are more likely to hurt her than help her. If you feel any compassion for her, this would be the basis for letting go, until you’ve done the self-work needed to be a healthy partner. In 3-6 months—or 2 years if you don’t prioritize things like weekly therapy and self-help workbooks—you’ll be ready to make her life better, or that of whomever happens to be single then. Again, I’m 40s, have kids, and can date early 30s women with no children. This is not the toughest demographic to date imho. In my thread, 1 of my first 3 dates was from that group. That’s not because I’m highly special, although my self-esteem is high enough I was comfortable asking them out.

[Steve_]

Yeah Cwarrior it was a loose statement, I guess more fitting would be to have said "we are happy with the way things have gone and although tough we have that temperance and grace to understand this situation"

MrBrightside: I can say that your reply was not received well, personal attacks on me being a WH? That is absolutely nonsensical. First off since I have had these children I've done 75% of the parenting. And since the separation occurred in September I have not had a wild hair to just take a single day off from work or childcare to go dating anyone or for anything stupid. . I remind you I am a psych nurse, I work 12 hour shifts, full time would be 3 days a week, I work 4 a week so that I can provide more for the kids when I have them. The other 3 days I have the kids all day/night. And I am not an Ipad Dad. I don't gallivant my fatherhood here, I didn't come here for that advice, getting pretty sick of people telling me not to post about XW and post about all the healthy things im doing for myself and my kids.... that is auto pilot stuff, I dont need advice for that, why would I type up taking my kids to get ice cream and how many days its been since I had an argument with the XW? That isnt the issue...I came here to try to save an M and realized over time that I shouldn't. I didnt come to that conclusion with temporary emotions, it was over time, with logic and reasoning, and based on history and the likelihood of recidivism regarding cheating in the future. At any rate this is the first time I have asked for any "time off" for myself to out, for me. The only other time was when I took days off to take the W to hawaii and obviously that didnt pan out so I went fishing. And yes, with my kids.

To the rest of you guys: Since this is the end of the road for my M I appreciate you guys getting me through the last 8 months. I turned to this board, friends, family and faith instead of women, alcohol and stupid choices. Im glad for that. But as I post about the days and interactions that im sure 100% of you guys leaving a divorce have had at some point in your lives (if you can be that honest) what I seem to be getting is a bunch of divorcees that are jaded, making personal attacks and a truckload of assumptions. I dont need that negativity in my life. So I think Im done posting here.

I appreciate you guys who are able to convey the message in a manner that isn't disrespectful, but at this time in my life I revert back to the #1 thing Sandi said its all about respect. I have by previous posts made myself a person who tolerates disrespect and I wont anymore, not from a XW, friend, family member or a discussion board. Hopefully yall can help some M's that can be saved. Thanks for the time. Believe it or not I am in a better place. And I appreciate you more than you know.

Cheers

[Thornton]

Sorry to see you go, Steve.

Keep working on yourself and best wishes going forward.

[JosephS]

Good luck and best wishes moving forward.

[Traveler]

Socrates says, "An unexamined life is not worth living". Good luck, Steve! I'm actually a romantic at heart. A more stable joy awaits when you're ready to dig deeper into your co-dependence. (:

[SteveLW]

Steve_, I honestly think that the perspectives here could really help you over the course of the next few months, and you might even learn quite a bit in the post D forum. But it is your call. I've enjoyed posting with you and reading your updates. Good luck my friend! I pray for nothing but the best for you in the go forward!

[LH19]

Steve,

The point Mr. B was trying to make is you are a person who makes decisions based on emotion and not logic and reason. These are characteristics of WAS and usually bad decisions. Logically you know you should WAW from your ex wife. Emotionally you are not there. We can see it clearly through your actions. You have never been able to clearly embrace DB and trust the process. You really need time to just breather and get up everyday, workout, work and take care of your kids for a really long time. You are 17 years younger then me and have plenty of time for new relationships. I know we have been tough on you at times but that is because we clearly see your intentions were not quite lining up with what you are saying.

Anyways good luck and stay in therapy as long as needed and realize your WW is going to continue to make your life miserable for a really long time.

[Steve_]

Wanted to post an update. I considered how valuable these forums have been and I dont want to just "wing-it" going forward. Still doing IC, and GAL, lots of awesome stuff with my kids, working overtime every week. Doing well. Exercising and so on. Life is good. Helping my buddies through nursing school and lots of fishing, driving RC trucks when I can sneak in a day off. But a couple things have changed which added to my life. (Sorry will be long/ been awhile).

During the process of this divorce about month 7 after EW left I began talking to my sisters best friend on the phone. At first just to chit-chat. Nonsense, stuff about being nurses, just whatever. That went on for another 2 months. Meanwhile I continued to push out the legal stuff for the D, signed it and finalized it. Once I felt like I was done, everything was over legally and I was just going to worry about my kids and a better job thats about when my now GF ended up sort of falling into my life. I waited until all the paperwork was paid off and finished to go to dinner with her (for moral/religious reasons). Anyways, I know it is not recommended by most here, that being alone for 8 months was not quite enough for some of you I just felt open to whatever god had planned for me. I was reluctant especially after all the crap I had gone through but I just sort of allowed things to flow naturally. Never went to bars or got on apps or any of that crap. I planned on being devastated and alone for years. I was not looking for anyone. But here I am and I did not expect to be in this postion. Anyways I wanted to kind of post an update on the post D, Whats going on with me and EW and kids and see if you guys think Im okay or I need to fix stuff. Im open to the commentary and do appreciate it as long as its constructive.

So on the EW front. Essentially I was done waiting on her to fool around with OM or pretend to be single when they "split up" about 90 days after she left me for him, This was in Jan, she was now "single" again and she went on this "dont wanna be with anyone thing" but the entire time over the next bout 4 months she still saw OM here and there and so on. She CANNOT be without some kind of R. (I was surprised she did not try to reconcile, but Im glad she didnt now). So in the end of april before I met my now GF I informed EX that I was completing the D, that I would eat the remaining fee and that I was sick of waiting on her to figure her life out and I wanted to move on and allow someone else to be possible if that works out since she was not interested in fixing the M. (Immidiately upon hearing this she returned to OM..again..lol).

As I told yall I met with my now GF for dinner and everything was great, it is effortless, we talk about anything and anything, she knows the entirety of my sitch, and is up on current events. I left nothing in the closet because I wanted to be up front, if she cannot handle it she can go, point blank and period. GF is very supportive but does worry about how crazy the EW is and it does concern her at times us dealing with her in the future if things work out. I understand that, the EW is nuts and makes terrible choices to be fair. Otherwise we talk daily, we read christian based books and videos about healthy relationships together. Last time she visited me beginning of June she gave me a book from a pastor she follows and had a lot of the things important to her highlighted. She is a great communicator and doesnt sugar-coat what she wants/expects. Its the type of deal where we were really great friends before she visited me a few times and an R just sort of happened due to attraction/compatibility. She does live about 5 hours away and is currently in school (she just moved there) and she has NOT met my kids. Her and I discussed how eventually it would be essential but we both understand that children must be protected from major drastic life changes. My GF is very private, not into social media, we dont post things up of us or anything and we have only been in this R for about a month and she is very slow-paced about it and deliberate as I am. She told me her goal is an M and children, a good nursing career, and she isnt interested in casual dating, she is a devout christian and those are all things I've wanted myself as well. My kids know about her, know her name, and want to meet her but I wont allow it. (Ive only known her about 90 days) not long enough. My EW knows about her and seems really happy for me and supportive, my ex-IL's know as well and are really happy for me, my friends and family and everyone is really behind me. It was her birthday today and I have to work but I will travel to see her next week, my children made her birthday cards, my EW even offered to let me use her car since it is a lot more reliable for the long-distance drive (i declined of course) but it was nice.

The EW has now broken up with OM again, in lieu of a new OM, this guy is no BS a celebrity from hollywood, he is a producer and rapper of european style music. He is in his 40's and has a couple kids, has been D'd before. I found out about this guy because he bought my son a playstation 5 and offered the EW a new car, tried to gift things to me which I declined, but he did have EW call me and face-timed me, he was pleasant, and very interested to meet me. He highly seeks my approval I can tell. I could not believe it when this happened as I have heard the guy's music before and i was like.... wtf... has my life become reality TV? Anyways, this new OM has met the family, my kids, even me all in the span of two weeks....... I talked to my GF about how insane that is, she agrees. Her and I have gone 3 months without even planning a meet anyone and they just fired it off like willy nilly. How insane my EW is with just not planning her life, not considering the future and not even realizing how volitile this all is.

I did attempt to talk to her in a friendly way about it. She was receptive, I told her to be really careful with this guy, because people like that have a flavor of the month, and I really dont think it would be appropriate to have him around the kids before she understands if this is a healthy long-term kind of thing. She said "I am being careful" but literally had him over with her and the kids at the IL's place where they live. Sure he seems like a nice guy, but I know all about "nice guys" and this dude has a bugatti... this could get real ugly real quick.. I trust nothing about this. I have begun documenting all this for court purposes in case it goes sideways. I included the parts about the OM. I cross my fingers and hope for the best and I do truly hope my EW is happy and in a good R with this guy but its doubful based on her track record...

I was invited to fathers day dinner at the IL's house, my EW and I are nothing more than friends, she will occasionally call to ask how Im doing, offer to pick up little things if i need them, the H/W issues are pretty much dead. So with her things are cool, she even got my GF a gift to give to her and told me that she hopes to be friends some day. The GF said yeah "maybe in the very distant future when she gets healthy"..

For now Ill go to the dinner with the family, her new OM will be there, itll be good to get to know who is around my kids (even though I got no choice) i figured if he is willing to be friendly ill keep my friends close and enemies closer kinda deal. I trust no-one with my children not even thier own mother.

For now im not planning on doing anything drastic, just taking life day by day, focusing on myself, my kids, working on that NGS, and reading books about healthy R's. Exercising, looking at getting a better job, applied a few places. Doing the best I can to just keep my head up and try to remain happy with as much crazy as everyone else can be.

[LH19]

This is awesome!

It's like the opposite how two people should act after divorcing with young kids.

Had to look up Bugatti. Sweet ride!

On a side mote, I would have took the gifts.

[Traveler]

Ive only known her about 90 days.. we have only been in this R for about a month.. she is very slow-paced about it and deliberate as I am.. My kids know about her, know her name, and want to meet her.. It was her birthday today and I have to work but I will travel to see her next week, my children made her birthday cards...

Oh, Steve. I'll let someone else explain why this is harmful for your kids. I truly wish you the best and am glad you posted an update. May this lady be a bit less crazy than your last GF. (:

[Steve_]

I got that cwarrior, but my kids were just curious who I was talking to on the phone. For my daughters birthday she got her a simple gift. Again I know that it can be a really bad idea to introduce children to a person who may be a transition only, which is exactly why I have not let them meet, face time, anything. The only thing the kids know about the GF is her name and it was her birthday so they wanted to make little cards to add to a gift box I was putting together. Thats the extent of it. And thats after 3 months. I do not plan on introducing them to her or anyone to her for a long time, once I know where my life is going and that she will be part of that. For now there is no point to brady bunch things like that.

I still dont get how the EW can have this dude over like that, him buying them all these elaborate gifts, only hanging around him for less than two weeks but I guess his celebrity status overrides logic and common sense, even my in laws are okay with it.... crazy...

[Traveler]

I got that cwarrior, but my kids were just curious who I was talking to on the phone. For my daughters birthday she got her a simple gift. Again I know that it can be a really bad idea to introduce children to a person who may be a transition only, which is exactly why I have not let them meet, face time, anything. The only thing the kids know about the GF is her name and it was her birthday so they wanted to make little cards to add to a gift box I was putting together. Thats the extent of it. And thats after 3 months.

29 days ago you told STBXW you two were friends for 2 months, and after you divorced you planned to pursue her. Your first date was set for two weeks later. To be in a relationship a month means you declared yourselves in a relationship within a day or two, well before going on your first date. How many dates have you been on? Is this your first long-distance relationship? I'm guessing so. Many people are hesitant to have a second. Read up on them. Some work, but they're often more fantasy than substance.

I got that cwarrior, but my kids were just curious who I was talking to on the phone.

If protecting kids trumps dates, phone calls happen outside the kids' earshot or not at all. Yesterday, I went for a sunset walk to find time to talk to one of my ladies for 14 minutes. I'll admit I have not always been so mature, but my kids don't know (probably--kids are clever!) I'm on date 5-6 with two different women. (:

For my daughters birthday she got her a simple gift.

If protecting kids trumps dates, gifts are not shared so soon. Years ago when a 5yr friend, 2mo lover gave me a gift, I said something along the lines of "Thank you, it's too soon, but I appreciate the effort. I'll save it for Christmas." We weren't dating by Christmas. I eventually donated it.

Steve, you can date without exposing your kids. Just prioritize that and it'll happen.

[Steve_]

I can see the confusion here Cwarrior.

I started talking to my sisters long-time best friend march 19th. Everything for the "d" was done as far as I had known at that time. Minus a filing fee which I refused to pay. I did not meet in person my GF until april 28th. And her and I agreed to date exclusively 5/31.

I went down to the L's office to pay the damn filing fee so XW couldnt hold it over my head april 28th. Before I went to meet her. Couple things that allowed me to be okay with this was that 1). My family has known this girl for years, knows her habits and was part of her daily life. They vouch for her, they like and trust her over the course of those years. 2). She is a person of faith and that is central to our R. There was zero of that with the EW. No moral compass.

I dont date for the sake of getting laid. Its not part of my beliefs, nothing wrong with those who do, just personally I dont like making temporary sexual/romantic connections with people unless they are with a purpose. Id prefer to be alone rather than invite several women into my life for "fun". Some would call me co-dependant but lots of those people have multiple women they date and lie to one another about like Rollo Tomassi says "spinning plates" or CW, etc etc....

For me I was 100% interested in saving my M until I realized that was a bad idea. That it would never change, and even if it did I couldnt forget what was done and how bad it got. The reason my kids got exposed was because of XW. I asked her to watch the children for me so I could go out of town. (first time ever in the 9 months we been seperated). She made assumptions and told my kids "daddy has a girlfriend" to take the guilt off of herself for having a boyfriend since before BD.

I sat down with my kids and asked them what they had heard, asked them how they felt about it, asked them if they were angry or wanted me to wait longer. Both of them told me they want me to be happy and feel I tried everything for their mom. It was sobering really. So due to the kid's mom blasting this issue into my kids life and them being okay with it, I didnt really feel the need to hide it. Especially since I dont plan on dating multiple come and go girls. She got into my life because she has a career, no kids, a strong faith, and is very supportive and actually encourages me to grow as a individual. We have been "official" but only between us, no social media, no posts of any pics nothing like that.

Yes the long-distance thing is rough. But I feel like it is okay because I dont need a woman literally in the middle of my life at this time. And I also belive that if God placed her in my life and this is meant to be then it will be, if not I will learn from it and keep going solo. Im okay with either. I feel alright about this girl since she has been close to my family and is a good person on all 4 corners, not just rose-colored glasses, we talk hard-ball questions, its not a teenage fling.

Maybe not the best time to start an R, her and I both agreed. But one thing we also realized was this. (pardon if you arent religious).

Adam was given Eve by god after he had been on his purpose tending to the garden. He had worked to maintain it and did well, and at some point after being alone God gave Adam his partner Eve. The bible doesnt say how long Adam waited for her, and its good, because if there was a time line I bet a lot of people would take that like literal dating timelines. I still worry that its all too good to be true, and it probably is, but I deserve a partner like this girl has been and who's goals are similar to mine. And so far I have no reason to pass it up (yet).

[LH19]

Steve,

The not sarcastic point is your kids I trying to deal with the divorce and you are both already with other people. This will be confusing to them. You ex is definitely a circus act so as you’ve been told many times before you need to be the rock. Again you ask for feedback and we give it.

As for your in-laws being ok with the rapper. Did you ever hear the saying the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree?

[Steve_]

Definately LH, I see that right away, dude is allowed to fast forward since he has $$ thats a cultural thing for sure. Materialist people these types are.

As far as the kids go, I know its soon, but I do my very best to ensure they are okay with things and comfortable. Thats my duty as a dad. Far as mom goes, me and my GF believe she is gonna run off with this dbag and end up giving me the kids just about full time, (hopefully).

[SteveLW]

Steve_,

It is your life. You get to decide how to live it. Would I like to see you be happy by yourself (and these past 8 months do not count because you were trying to get your XW back the entire time!) for quite a while longer before jumping into something new? Of course. I would like to see you stay business ONLY with your XW. I would like to see you planning your own father's day rather than glomming on to your EX's family event.

But this is your life! You get to decide. I am just a stranger on the internet. I do hope you stay in IC if you ever were. I think you still have a lot to deal with to become a whole person.

Most ironic part of your post: "She CANNOT be without some kind of R."

Sometimes it is easier to see weaknesses in other people than in ourselves.

But I am glad that you are doing better than you were 4 months ago. I still can't get over the V-day actions. But that is an example of WHY I say you have not been alone for 8 months. Do I think you are past falling for your EX's manipulation? I do. But do I think you've done all of the work necessary to be the best Steve_ you can be? No. But no one except you can force that.

I will say it appears you are being a good dad (except for the new GF so quickly thing). I've always felt you were a good dad! Keep up that good work.

[Steve_]

Thanks SteveLW,

I 100% agree I have work to do, this will be a process that will take years. I planned on being alone, going through the feels rebuilding my life and so on for at least another 9 months to a year. What happened was far sooner than I expected. But I am glad she is 5 hours away, because I still get to be alone and focus on my kids and purpose 90% of the time. Thus far we have 3 days lined up this month to spend together, other than that Im home with my kids or working and she is in school. Im glad there is no rush and the distance keeps us focusing on communication and not something more physical.

Honestly I know It was too quick and I keep an eye out for red flags and toxic behaviors from both her and I. I gotta be careful, but honestly my GF has been nothing but a blessing. Whether or not she stays in my life long-term I can't say, but I am certainly grateful for her.

I know you dont see those 8 months as me being alone, because I was trying to fix my M. But I lived my entire life alone, on my own, own place, own bills, kids on my own, all of it. Once the EW left she was gone and I left 2 weeks later. I have not spend hardly any time with her in that entire time. Over time I embraced that this would be life now. And decided to push the D forward on my own since I was ready. I was over it, and I wanted to be happier. Could I have waited longer? Absolutely, was it perfect timing for me to meet my now GF? No, not at all. But I didn't want to shut the door on an awesome person because statistics say "you need XXXX amount of time." If I had any intention of taking this thing lightly, rebounding, or just having fun, never would have let her in. I see what you guys are seeing, usually a R this quick after a D is a recipe for disaster and hurt kids. I am keeping that on the forefront of my mind, continuing to read, research, look at long distance R's, watching youtube vids about moving on in healthy ways, parenting alone, parenting with a new partner, etc. I have read more books than I did ever during the end of my M. I still do IC through the VA.

Lately I have finished an IV/Blood withdraw cert for my license,
I've applied at 5 different jobs and have an interview coming up,
repaired the relationship with my mom and sister my EW helped isolate me from and I talk to them daily

now I am just working on maintaining a decent friendship with the Ex and IL's until they move away.

day by day, im doing the best I can, thank you guys so much for all the help.

[LH19]

Steve,

I think you are missing the point but I will not waste mine or your time trying to explain. I understand that your GF wants kids. Is that something you are willing to do at this point in your life?

[Ready2Change]

I am not following your sitch, but I am interested in how many women you had to sift through to find your GF? How many dates with this one did it take to determine she was GF material?

[SteveLW]

But I didn't want to shut the door on an awesome person because statistics say "you need XXXX amount of time."

So this stuck out at me. First it isn't statistics. It is mental health. After the ringer you went through with your EX you needed time alone to mend and heal. To get past the traumas and hang ups. To not be suspicious when the new GF mentions a guy's name she is friends with thinking "Here we go again!" Etc.

But also the fact that you were afraid to shut the door on an awesome person. I guarantee you that if you had told this woman "sorry, I am not ready for an R right now", that in a year or two or whenever, when you were ready to date again, there would be other awesome people out there to meet. The fact that you think this woman is awesome in such a short amount of time has me wondering if you went from one over-attachment (your EX) to another (your GF). You've known her for what can be measured in weeks, and you are already talking like you are ready to marry her and have kids (or maybe in the reverse order!).

Again, your life. You get to decide. But it isn't XXXX statistics. It is about working through emotional baggage and setting yourself for your next MR to be a success.

If you had asked before you started talking to this woman on the phone "guys, do you think I should start dating someone, to the point where I call them my GF?" I think you know what the answer would be.

Maybe you will buck the odds and this will work out. But if you look up D statistics for 1st, 2nd and 3rd marriages, I think you'd be shocked at what you see. 2nd and 3rd marriages fail at even higher rate than 1st marriages. I think that is a telling statistic.

[Traveler]

usually a R this quick after a D is a recipe for.. hurt kids.

Steve, it's simpler than that. Set aside the odds against any particular person working out--especially adding in you've only been on 1-2 dates, are a rebound, have tons of baggage, and are long distance. You want a GF. Your kids do NOT need to be involved. They don't need a new mom. They don't need to wonder what GF's role may be. They don't need the instability of people coming and going in their life. You have all your kid-free days (and kid-free moments on kid days) to focus on your need for a GF.

It's simple. Don't announce your GF on social media, to your XW, or to others likely to tell your kids. Don't call GF in front of your kids. Don't give your kids gifts from your GF. Keep adding to this list as-needed to ensure your dating life does not impact your kids. You can't undo that they know, but you can stop all of the above to downplay her--and stop gift exchanges, stop mentioning her, etc.

I dont date for the sake of getting laid. Its not part of my beliefs, nothing wrong with those who do, just personally I dont like making temporary sexual/romantic connections with people unless they are with a purpose. Id prefer to be alone rather than invite several women into my life for "fun". Some would call me co-dependant but lots of those people have multiple women they date and lie to one another about

I'm having date #5 with MsTallChemist tonight and had date #5 with MsDoGooder last week. They are 2 of 6 women I've dated this month. I'm a true multi-dater! I've been intimate with none of them and they both know there are others. Why so many women, why so many dates? To get to know them and find a great match! How many do my kids know about? Zero. I bet both ladies would bolt if I were crazy enough to propose it! Dating is the process of getting to know someone to see if they might be a great match. (:

[Traveler]

But also the fact that you were afraid to shut the door on an awesome person. I guarantee you that if you had told this woman "sorry, I am not ready for an R right now", that in a year or two or whenever, when you were ready to date again, there would be other awesome people out there to meet. The fact that you think this woman is awesome in such a short amount of time has me wondering if you went from one over-attachment (your EX) to another (your GF). You've known her for what can be measured in weeks, and you are already talking like you are ready to marry her and have kids (or maybe in the reverse order!).

Absolutely. If you truly believe you're a man of high value, your fear of losing a woman of high value shouldn't be too high, because there are many out there, and there will be many out there in a year. Committing before a first date smacks of a scarcity mindset, fear, and low self-esteem. Low value.

[wayfarer]

So let me get this straight you're GF is a good Christian girl who hasn't been married, has no kids, and is in nursing school right now. So how much younger than you is she?

I know you think you know you and everything is fine. And the kids are fine. And exW is fine. And exW's new beau is fine. The exIL's are fine. And new GF are fine. It's not fine. Literally none of this seems fine except maybe ex-wife doing pretty much what I would expect her to do.

You don't drag your kids into your first post D relationship within weeks. It's been weeks. This is just god awful parenting. Yeah your new at this but this is pretty common sense stuff. My daughter knew my now H. She had been around him for years as we had been friends. She was also 10 almost 11 at the time not 5, and I still waited 5 months to bring him around outside of normal group interactions that she would expect him to be there for and I definitely didn't start spilling my guts about my shiny new bf who wasn't her dad. It's weird. It's caustic behavior. And as a psych nurse I would think you would understand how confusing and traumatic this time in their lives are. You don't need to muddy it more with another side plot.

As far as exW and exIL's. I'm very close with my exIL's. They have done a lot for me and my daughter as I was a teenager when I had her. Granted I think some of that in later years was guilt over how poorly their son treated us. But most if of it is simply that they are good people and family is forever. They check on my grandparents. They were so supportive when my mom passed. They just brought me and my husband a housewarming gift and wanted a tour of the new house when they came to pick up D18. We have and have had a very healthy happy relationship. But when I left my ex, in the process of the D, and immediately after the D we kept our distance. Only spending time together if it was specifically related to my daughter. Because that's what's normal. Breathing room is expected and necessary at this time in your life. It's weird you're not taking it.

My exH has unmedicated mental health issues. He's a functioning addict/alcoholic. He treated me like crap and in turn I was a horribly toxic person because frankly I was too scared, too broke, and too hopeful for my own good to just leave so lashed out in awful ways. We are not friends. We will never be friends. But we are friendly. Our daughter just graduated high school and we enjoyed each other's company during the ceremony. But you can't imagine the sigh of relief I felt when he decided he was driving back home an hour away instead of coming to dinner with us. Not because I can't stand him, but the veneer wears off. He will grate my nerves if we start exceeding 4 hours. Because he's just as crappy a person as he ever was. He's just not in my space any more. He checks in on D18 regularly. Sends me funny meme occasionally. But that's pretty much it. I have friends. I don't need him as one. And once again in the immediate period of the D we did not hang out. We did not send funny memes. We were not friendly. That first year ee functioned on business only at all times.

You are incredibly enmeshed in this family and with your stbxw. You need to get your co-dependency in check. An you really shouldn't be in a relationship with some 20 something who's looking for a husband. None of this has a happy ending for anyone involved here.

It's your life. Do what you will. But nothing you're saying makes any sense for the emotional health of anyone important here. I really truly do hope you're in IC.

[Steve_]

Well, to address some of this here. I’ll make it short and to the point.

I keep my IL’s close because when my kids are not with me they are with them, living in their home, and they have supported me and the kids 100%. They disagree with D but can do nothing about it. They provide the safe environment my Ex did not when she catapulted the children Into living with OM. I’m glad they are stable there and I want them to remain there down the street safe and 2 mins away as long as possible. This is why I am active with them. (I do not hang out EW) I do not contact her unless she calls about them or the IL’s moving to Arizona needing help. That’s it. (LH19 you said some time ago the ex wanted to friend zone me and I didn’t see it, now that I have accepted it, things are a lot better and pleasant). Should have done that long time ago.

Also, GF again I’ve known for 3 months, my mother and sister have known her for years.. her past relationships all of it, her and my sister are best friends. She is 31 not “20 something” she has a good career, good moral values and has a long record of being dependable, honest and a genuinely good person. That is why I didn’t pass her up.

I have gone out with other girls, 4 of them from work/ friends, they are the typical Instagram chicks, got kids from exes, or wear designer crap they cannot afford, had no real career or goals and spend zero time with god or in church. Just copies of my ex or close to them. A couple were a lot nicer and had decent jobs a couple other nurses but bo connection with god. And if they don’t answer to anyone then the morality Is not there… I won’t budge on that for any woman. I need that in my and my kids life in a partner.

I did not disclose my now GF to my kids, my ex did. I kept the fact I went out with other girls and I was talking to this one a total secret. Until a month ago I asked for days off to go out and the Ex found out somehow. I do not have ex on social media, I don’t have GF on social media. Her Facebook posts and mine are pretty much non-existent. She has met nobody on my side except my mom grandmother and sister from working with them for 6 years. I know I am 100% wrong and this is going to crash and I’m F’ing up in your all’s opinion. But I depend on nobody, I try to remain positive and maintain a graceful relationship with my Ex and and ex in-laws. I don’t need them but I don’t need issues. I rarely communicate just when things come up I will be pleasant. As far as my GF goes it’s not like she’s over at my house folks.. I just agreed to be exclusive with her for our religious purposes. Because that’s who I am, I don’t expect anyone else to respect that.

[SteveLW]

Steve_, please do not get upset. We are trying to help you. Again, you get to decide all of this. But we've seen all this before. I hope for you and your kids sake this all works out. I wish you the best, I really do.

[Steve_]

Not upset at all.

Just the jumping to conclusions going on here is a bit frustrating. But i dont mind explaining to the ones that post how what THEY did in their sitch is not identical to mine. Sure based upon the emotional attachement/connection/level of trauma etc each of us needs a different approach. I came here looking to save my M, realized it shouldnt be saved. Moved on, trying to have a happy life, do things a better way this time. Make better choices and have a better understanding of where I went wrong. Thats all im trying to do here, avoid the same mistakes/ do better.

[Ready2Change]

Thats all im trying to do here, avoid the same mistakes/ do better.

Yup.

Even in my current relationship, I have to do lots of self reflecting. After thinking about each posters issues, makes it easier for me to apply things to my relationship.

[SteveLW]

Not upset at all.

Just the jumping to conclusions going on here is a bit frustrating. But i dont mind explaining to the ones that post how what THEY did in their sitch is not identical to mine. Sure based upon the emotional attachement/connection/level of trauma etc each of us needs a different approach. I came here looking to save my M, realized it shouldnt be saved. Moved on, trying to have a happy life, do things a better way this time. Make better choices and have a better understanding of where I went wrong. Thats all im trying to do here, avoid the same mistakes/ do better.

This is what I want for you too, Steve. However, I do not think you're going about it the right way. But it's your life.

[Steve_]

I understand and I don’t get upset, I put my situation here to keep myself grounded. To hear the 2x4’s. Once I got infatuated and looked past every single red flag.. for 10 years. I was so conditioned to be disrespected and manipulated I didn’t even know better. I don’t want that ever again. Nobody but god determines my value as a man. Not my marriage my friends or my income. I don’t regret for one minute the effort I put into my M and the lengths I went to trying to save it. I only regret that I allowed myself to feel so poorly of myself for so long over a girl.

I absolutely get that things seem to good to be true and usually they are. I get it, end of the day I’m a combat vet and a psych nurse. I get reality. Especially after what happened with my M and how bad I got. This girl I have now in my life is free to leave anytime, I’ve told her this. I do not need her, I am good on my own now, and I like it that way for now. But she adds a little bit of goodness to my life. A friend, a partner to do things with, someone to lean on and also to be there for, and someone I look up to as far as our faith Goes. She is a beautiful girl too but I knew I liked her before I ever saw a photo. Her personality and who she is on the inside is why. Hopefully she doesn’t blow it. But if she does there is 11 billion people in this world (roughly) more than half are women. I’ll be alright.

Heading to the gym, thanks for all the feedback.
I strive to shoot for what makes me happy but looking reality in the eyes too. That’s what I’m focused on right now.

[LH19]

Steve,

Do you plan to have children with this woman? If not, you should let her know.

[MrBrside]

I do not need her, I am good on my own now, and I like it that way for now. But she adds a little bit of goodness to my life.

Steve,

You were never on your own... Never - you spent months and months trying to manipulate your Ex wife back. Virtually from the day you joined until your GF came along. You may have not been living together, you may have not been physcial, but mentally, you mind was on on thing - wife.. Remember the expensive wine ????

You monkey brached to your current girlfriend, which took your focus of the ex.. Mentally, you have always been attached to somebody.

Hence IMO you found a quick fix.

Re the children being aware. Predictable but not good. I've never pussy footed around my opinions of being a childs rock, but the fact they know soo soon is shocking.. From their perspective, they will always be wondering if you will par them off the way your Ex wife did. I know it worried my children, as they were very aware that their mothers attention was elsewhere when OM was around. I told my children that would never happen and ive stuck to it.

I recently came out of a 7 month relationship and my children were totally unaware of the lady.. clueless..

I didnt call / text her when i looked after my children and i asked her not to call / text me until i instigated ( ie when the children were asleep / gone )
She started to ask to meet my children and i just said no.. not happening..

Rational and logical people - people with their heads screwed on and who dont let emotion cloud their judgement /actions know this - The childrens happyness and mental stability should come above anything, - them knowing they wont have to share me with somebody on their time.

[Ginger1]

I am going to hijack for a quick second here

MrBrside, I have always mentally high fived all of your advice. But I would like to know if I could pick your brain a bit for personal reasons. Did you ever have any intention of including this woman fully in your life? After 7 months did you think it was fair to her just to be someone in the shadows and to be your girlfriend only when it was convenient for you? How do you think it made her feel after 7 months she had to
Totally vanish from you in any way while your kids were around ? I understand being a rock for your kids, but should a woman after 7 months only be important when no one else is present ? She’s. Human too. She invested in you too. It’s natural to date for that long and want to get to know and be involved with the most important parts of their lives . And not to be someone in the shadows. I understand if you felt like she was never going to be the one. But do you think anyone is ever going to be the one to be a little more involved in your kids lives or even in your life while your kids are around ?

Do you think this is a healthy relationship to have with another woman ? Is it fair and healthy to her ?

[MrBrside]

I am going to hijack for a quick second here

MrBrside, I have always mentally high fived all of your advice. But I would like to know if I could pick your brain a bit for personal reasons. Did you ever have any intention of including this woman fully in your life? After 7 months did you think it was fair to her just to be someone in the shadows and to be your girlfriend only when it was convenient for you? How do you think it made her feel after 7 months she had to
Totally vanish from you in any way while your kids were around ? I understand being a rock for your kids, but should a woman after 7 months only be important when no one else is present ? She’s. Human too. She invested in you too. It’s natural to date for that long and want to get to know and be involved with the most important parts of their lives . And not to be someone in the shadows. I understand if you felt like she was never going to be the one. But do you think anyone is ever going to be the one to be a little more involved in your kids lives or even in your life while your kids are around ?

Do you think this is a healthy relationship to have with another woman ? Is it fair and healthy to her ?

Fair point, but one i can easily answer.

When i believe ( and i know that introducing children and other factors can change this ) that this is a "for life" or long term partner.

I wouldnt have spent 7 months of my life if i didnt see her that way, but you dont know somebody after 7 months

Theres a lot of stuff out there about how you don't see the real person for at least 9 months - sometimes upto 2 years..

Well after 7 months in this situation, i was starting to see things that didnt align with my values, such as parking is disabled spaces ( i asked her to move the car and she laughed and said theres another disabled space ) , mentioing that she would drive under the influence, as long as she felt fit to drive etc. Trying to get me to change the way i dress because i dress fine for my town, but im not "trendy" enough for where she lives ( she lived 15 miles away in a very fasionable / city lifestyle place ).

These little things are / were not immediately visable ( especially as we have been in lockdown for most of 2021 ) , but are a game changer for me.. She was not prepared to change, as she sees no issue with these things.. Hence i moved on and am happy - and happier knowing i didnt make a silly mistake of introducing my children to her.

[Ginger1]

Thanks for answering, and fair enough. If she isn’t the type of person you want around your kids, she absolutely shouldn’t be introduced.

I have a daughter, been single mom for just about the entirety of her nearly 14 year old life. So I get it. But I’ve been encountering men who when there kids are present, the rest of the world does not exist. I had a boyfriend like that for a year and even when my daughter and I were in the room, we barely existed. I understand where men usually get less custody and when people don’t see their kids everyday, but do we do our kids favors when they get 100% attention all the time? My ex boyfriends kid was knocking kids off their seats and stabbing his classmates with pencils in preschool because he was so used to undivided attention, he didn’t like when he didn’t get it at school. I guess what I am saying is that there is a balance in there somewhere , and I understand it can be difficult to find and we are all trying our best

[SteveLW]

Theres a lot of stuff out there about how you don't see the real person for at least 9 months - sometimes upto 2 years..

I am in the 2 year camp. Most couples haven't even broken wind around each other at the 9 month mark............

[Ginger1]

The problem with 2 years is that if your families don’t mesh, your kids can’t stand eachother, 2 years in is a long time to find that out. It honestly doesn’t work that way at all. And if there is a couple who are looking to expand on their family and have more kids, 2 years to introduce kids, a year to see how they get along. Another year or 2 for kids….. it’s a little much.

But to each their own. I am am not an advocate of too early, especially fresh out of a marriage. But too long can be detrimental as well.

[SteveLW]

The problem with 2 years is that if your families don’t mesh, your kids can’t stand eachother, 2 years in is a long time to find that out. It honestly doesn’t work that way at all. And if there is a couple who are looking to expand on their family and have more kids, 2 years to introduce kids, a year to see how they get along. Another year or 2 for kids….. it’s a little much.

But to each their own. I am am not an advocate of too early, especially fresh out of a marriage. But too long can be detrimental as well.

Oh no, Ginger, I meant it takes at least 2 years to REALLY know someone.

[MrBrside]

Thanks for answering, and fair enough. If she isn’t the type of person you want around your kids, she absolutely shouldn’t be introduced.

To me its about getting the right person. 2 weeks, 2 months or even 6 months does not reflect most people's true personalitys.

It was probably LH ( sounds like the kind of thing he would post ) that said "for every red flag, 6 are hidden.. lol

I had a date last weekend with a lady who was with a man for 9 months after her seperation. ( husband cheater )

Two regrets she had..

1 - she met the 9 month guy too soon after the ex husband walked out - like a month later. She admits her head wasnt in the right place.
2 - introduced kids after 4 months..

7 months in and she has concerns over anger and agression ( the way he spoke to people when ordering food when they went for a meal etc ) , which had been masked for 7 months.
9 months and he was abusive ( verbally ) to her..

He had children and she had children.. Her children were upset becuase they lost their new friends.

I think i my initial thread, i mentioned my WW introduced OM to the children 3 days after leaving.. 2 weeks later and they found him in her bed - my middle and eldest daughter were so upset. Ive seen first hand how this stuff goes.

its also the long term impact... Ironically my WW's earliest childhood memory is mum and dad arguing when he left ( cheated on her mum) .. My WW was about 3 at the time

She spent a month sleeping in bed with her mum.. both just a mess and upset.. Until 1 day the paperboy ( he was an old paperboy as he didnt have a job ) came to deliver the paper and WWs mum and paperboy hit it off.. from that point, she was not allowed into her mums bed any longer becuase paperboy was there.. True story, but one of my WW's earliest memories and it caused a lot of resentment.

Point being - 35 years later and she used to always reflect on these memories - and it went full circle with her and my children.

But I’ve been encountering men who when there kids are present, the rest of the world does not exist.

Depends on the context i suppose. I have my children just shy of 50% of the time. In that time, its our time. Again, my children have been WW just ignore them / snuggle up with OM and told them to go outside, speak on the phone to OM for 30 minutes etc and they vent on these things.

Hence, i listen - and be the best Dad i can.

With the 7 month lady, she got to see me whenever i did not have the children. If and when i do introduce somebody to the children, that person would be in "our time"..

I am also very up front with dates.. ie i wont text you when i have my children and i wont introduce you for a long time. They know where they stand.

[MrBrside]

The problem with 2 years is that if your families don’t mesh, your kids can’t stand eachother, 2 years in is a long time to find that out. It honestly doesn’t work that way at all. And if there is a couple who are looking to expand on their family and have more kids, 2 years to introduce kids, a year to see how they get along. Another year or 2 for kids….. it’s a little much.

But to each their own. I am am not an advocate of too early, especially fresh out of a marriage. But too long can be detrimental as well.

being honest..

I would rather my kids experience 1 relationship breakdown every 2.5 years if things dont mesh, than every 6 months..

Just my opinion, but thats 3 less upheavels in their lives..

Wanting more kids does impact on that, but if you stick a logical hat on ( sorry i know i love that word ) i would rather wait 5 years ( 2 year intro, 3 years blending ) rather than another relationship breakdown.

[MrBrside]

MrBrside, I have always mentally high fived all of your advice. But I would like to know if I could pick your brain a bit for personal reasons.

oh and FYI - ive always considered you one of the most logical people on here lol

Hence this wont apply to you.. BUT

Walk away after 1 drink red flag for me is if a lady introduced her children to people very soon.. ie weeks / few months.

I had a date with one lady who took her child on the date and left him playing in the beer garden while her and the date got drunk !!!!

It is very common.. A lot more common that i ever though it would be - and to me it shows selfishness behavour.. ie once introduced we can all do thing together and i get to see new partner more etc etc..

Broken people or people who dont care about the kids will apply this practice -

Healthy people pay the bill, kiss on the cheek and run lol

[LH19]

[quote=MrBrside] You monkey brached to your current girlfriend, which took your focus of the ex.. Mentally, you have always been attached to somebody.

I have a sinking suspicion his focus is still on his wife.

Hence IMO you found a quick fix.

Yep like a heroin addict getting another fix

I recently came out of a 7 month relationship and my children were totally unaware of the lady.. clueless..

I had two short exclusive relationships 3-4 months each in which my children had zero clue were going on. I did meet the one girls son which was her idea not mine. To each his own.

I didnt call / text her when i looked after my children and i asked her not to call / text me until i instigated ( ie when the children were asleep / gone )

So I didn't set these boundaries but it was sort of a mutual respect thing. I would answer texts when I could but not if I was engaged. We would plan calls at night. We would meet early in the morning for a run or walk before my kids woke up.

She started to ask to meet my children and i just said no.. not happening..

I never experienced this but have respectfully declined if I wasn't ready.

To me there are so many factors in play. Age of children, how long have you been divorced, how long have you been dating, do you see a future, children's maturity.......etc.

[LH19]

It was probably LH ( sounds like the kind of thing he would post ) that said "for every red flag, 6 are hidden.. lol

It does sound like my usual words of wisdom but I can not take credit for it lol.

Point being - 35 years later and she used to always reflect on these memories - and it went full circle with her and my children.

Same with my WW. Her dad moved out when she was 14. She often talked about how traumatizing it was for her and the worst time of her life. 30 years later she does the same thing when my son was 14.

[Steve_]

To bat down a whole bunch more assumptions:

I have my kids 43% of the time. On my days with kids I don’t get on the phone with GF until they are in bed, or in the evening. I don’t call/text all day long. It’s bad even from an attraction standpoint /hat tip to CW.

I am not monkey branching lol. Maybe someone should re-visit that term. That is when you literally are in one R and then you find the next R and transition over. That’s what my EW did. She left me for OM, then left OM for current OM. She allows no gap. Y’all act like I spent time with my EW during this, I had been alone, her with OM since early September. Yes I tried some things to see if I could get her to shake it off and come home but obviously to no avail.

I don’t mind the 2x4’s here but sometimes you guys need to understand too that faith can be a big part of someone’s view on an R. Not just the “dating game” if it was not for the exact lack of red flags (thus far) I would not be exclusive with this GF. But the way we both are that’s how it is. We agreed if it doesn’t work and we don’t end up together long term we will be a good learning point for each other and respect whatever time we had.

She does want kids, I am okay with that, it would be nice to re-live that with a partner who is actually a good partner I missed a lot of the joy of that process due to the toxicity. I explained to her this would be a couple years from now but something I’m okay with. If things work out for us.

Did this happen quick? Yes.. unexpected ? Yes! Was I looking for an R? Hell no. Do I believe god put her in my life for a reason when I forsaked a lot of “hot girls” at work trying to “help me get over this” yea..for sure.

If I thought she was a play toy. I wouldn’t even have bothered. I don’t need that. No offense to casual daters, just people coming in and out of my life casually doesn’t line up with my beliefs.

[LH19]

Not just the “dating game” if it was not for the exact lack of red flags (thus far) I would not be exclusive with this GF.

Steve I do not know your girl friend but I can promise you that if she is many years younger and she is willing to immediately jump into a relationship with a broken man who has a couple kids and a looney toon exw a month after his marriage ended. There are RED FLAGS! You are just to caught up in emotion right now.

She does want kids, I am okay with that, it would be nice to re-live that with a partner who is actually a good partner I missed a lot of the joy of that process due to the toxicity. I explained to her this would be a couple years from now but something I’m okay with. If things work out for us.

So again you are already planning a family. Crazy talk.

No offense to casual daters, just people coming in and out of my life casually doesn’t line up with my beliefs.

This doesn't have as much to do with your beliefs as it does with your abandonment issues. You keep kicking the can down the road. Have you read Wolfs thread?

[Steve_]

More extremes… it’s like the sith, dealing in absolutes here…

Her saying “my goals are a family and a marriage” and talking about family and marriage so that we both understand that is the ultimate goal we both have (assuming things work out) is not “already planning a family”

I communicate everything with her. It was important for me to know her relationship goals, what she is looking for, and to understand what is going on. I told her that would be years from now. Like “hey, not gonna happen for a long time”

If you call that convo “already planning a family” c’mon man… I call it healthy communication as adults about what your relationship goals are, not playing games and then coming out with it 6-8 months later after all this attachment has been made. And yeah I sometimes wonder why she is willing to work with the crazy EW and the strange sitch, I have asked her this straight up, her answer was pretty much “yeah I know I’m 31 you are 36, I know you have kids and I don’t, but I have not met a man who is able to talk to me, he straight up with me, and who has such a record of being a good father and took his commitment seriously, who is strong in his faith”. That was essentially her answer. She’s had 2 LTR’s first one didn’t wanna commit after 6 years to an M and the second wanted to propose and buy a home at 1 year. Too fast for her. But you are totally allowed to use your extremes here, I get it. I’m keeping my eyes open, waiting for the big reveal of something wrong..until then I’m just taking it easy.

I’m not looking to get married anytime soon, not looking to move closer or have her come here any time soon. She is 5 hours away. I like that for awhile. I get to dictate how much time I invest and ensure it’s not too much. Still work on myself and have my privacy with my kids. This is why I’m okay with her. I would not be doing this if she lived in this city I do and I wouldn’t be doing this if my family did not know her so well as a well rounded woman.

[LH19]

Fair enough Steve. I think the distance is a good thing and eventually this will fizzle out. It will be interesting to see what happens then.

[Ginger1]

I really appreciate the responses. And thank you!

I’ve been at this for so long an important every stage of my child. She’s known 3 men. None destroyed her when we broke up. She took some good memories, but brushed it off just fine. She can tell me which guy was her favorite to this day. I have always been a very engaged mother , but I guess with nearly 75% custody, my time with her was not totally kid focus. I would take the time out to text someone if I was dating. I would respond and not be off limits. If I was actively engaged, of course I wouldn’t drop what I was doing. But I guess I learned to spread my time with her focused on her needs, house work, and me time. And I allowed for me time when she was with me because I needed it and I don’t think it makes for detriment to children if you say “please take 30 minutes for yourself while mom/dad takes 30 minutes to themselves. Whether you chose to take that time reading a book, flipping through your phone, or talking to your significant other . Hours on end? No. 30 min? Doesn’t make you a bad parent or any less engaged in their lives.
But yea, we should only allow partners in who are going to be positives on our kids lives. Absolutely. I wouldn’t have it any other way. For me, personally, now I think I could only handle a guy with kids my daughters age, or older now.

Anyways, Steve, it’s monkey branching because you were emotionally attached and trying to actively get her back the whole 8 months. Your ex may have not been in a relationship with with you, but you were emotionally attached to her the whole time. Until this woman came along. Therefore, monkey branching.
And any woman who enters the situation you are on and where you ha e been at is a red flag. I’m sorry. As a mostly emotionally healthy woman I would run from the hills from your situation. Until it was settled and you were truly settled . But you will try to convince us and we will try to convince you , and no one will budge, so you just have to do you. Just watch for those kids. Look at wolfman. He lost his daughter due to a similar situation. Tread carefully

[Thornton]

Hey Steve,

I figured I would chime in with my .02

I was once in your shoes about 14 years ago. Coming out of a painful divorce with a looney bipolar (diagnosed) ex wife. I tried for months to save my marriage, I was a mess for a long time.

Then I met her. A gorgeous woman at work. She checked all the boxes I was looking for. Christian - check. Family oriented - check. Ambitious - check. Loyal - check. Physically attractive and fit - check. Looking back, I didn't stay single long enough to process my stuff, I was still broken even though I didn't feel broken.

This woman blew my ex out of the water! We started dating and she admired the hell out of me. We got along great, we had things in common, we worked out together, amazing sex. You get the point.

We started making plans for our future. We talked about kids, a house, which churches we liked in the area. Like you, I literally thought that God himself had put this woman in my life for a reason. All the signs were there, this was God's doing.

Things were awesome for about a year (you know, the honeymoon phase right?). Then some of my old broken behaviors started popping up, and she started to show red flags as well. 3 years later, after working so hard to make things work, we split up. Again, I was devastated. Except this time it was worse, wanna know why? Because what I didnt know was that I never processed the end of my marriage, I was now mourning two broken relationships.

Let me tell you man... mourning the end of a marriage is tough for anyone. But throw another 4 year broken relationship with the woman that God had sent me on top of it, was almost unbearable.

Ive been where you are, learn from my mistake and don't have a repeat broken relationship because you never spent the time alone processing your stuff.

[wayfarer]

People give you personal examples because it's a way to humanize our advice. No every one's situation isn't yours. Not every scenario makes sense. Human variable, circumstance, whatever. But it's always the same thing. 8 people say "I don't know man? Do you think that's a good idea?" 8 different ways and still like a petulant teenager you retort with "Well your life isn't my life."

You do you. You're going to do that anyway. Bull dozing headlong into life. If that's who you are so be it. Just don't ruin a friendship for your sister. And don't confuse the sh!t out of your kids. That's what I think literally every one here is asking. If you can't be mindful of your own emotional health please take care of the emotional health of others.

That's it. That's all. Be mindful and kind to others if and when your choices affect them. Own what's yours in that situation. And do better in the future. Good luck, man. I truly think you're going to need it.

[MrBrside]

Steve,

I know you don’t appreciate the things I post.. they are not meant to upset you, just my attempt to make you reflect..

When I found out about my WW and before I found this board, a close friend ( husband of 30 years cheated on her ) gave me a piece of advice..

Don’t believe what they say as they convince themselves of what suits them and then believe their own Bulls**t...

Sandie says a similar thing...

In a post on my thread, one of the vets ( guessing AS or Steve) said something along the lines of “their perception is their reality”

The point being, as a LBS you know what they are saying is incorrect, but they believe it..


Where am I going with this... ( this is where I suspect you will get annoyed)...

I upset you a few weeks back by saying you had a wayward mindset.. i meant in the context that all your actions are driven by emotion and not logic...

The first thing that came to my mind on your recent update 2 days ago was “gosh, this guy really does believe his own bulls**t...”

And like no amount of reasoning with a WW ( we gave all tried with our waywards) makes them see reality, I feel we are all doing something similar with you..

I sincerely do hope you have a positive future and prove every person here wrong.. unfortunately I don’t think you ever really handled things properly in the past.

[Steve_]

Hey Steve,

I figured I would chime in with my .02

I was once in your shoes about 14 years ago. Coming out of a painful divorce with a looney bipolar (diagnosed) ex wife. I tried for months to save my marriage, I was a mess for a long time.

Then I met her. A gorgeous woman at work. She checked all the boxes I was looking for. Christian - check. Family oriented - check. Ambitious - check. Loyal - check. Physically attractive and fit - check. Looking back, I didn't stay single long enough to process my stuff, I was still broken even though I didn't feel broken.

This woman blew my ex out of the water! We started dating and she admired the hell out of me. We got along great, we had things in common, we worked out together, amazing sex. You get the point.

We started making plans for our future. We talked about kids, a house, which churches we liked in the area. Like you, I literally thought that God himself had put this woman in my life for a reason. All the signs were there, this was God's doing.

Things were awesome for about a year (you know, the honeymoon phase right?). Then some of my old broken behaviors started popping up, and she started to show red flags as well. 3 years later, after working so hard to make things work, we split up. Again, I was devastated. Except this time it was worse, wanna know why? Because what I didnt know was that I never processed the end of my marriage, I was now mourning two broken relationships.

Let me tell you man... mourning the end of a marriage is tough for anyone. But throw another 4 year broken relationship with the woman that God had sent me on top of it, was almost unbearable.

Ive been where you are, learn from my mistake and don't have a repeat broken relationship because you never spent the time alone processing your stuff.

Out of all the responses this was the most helpful. That is a concern I have, things seems so great. She checks all the boxes, is not in the same leauge as my ex not even in the same sport, way above. This to me seems sometimes alarming. My friends, family, even the kids (what little they have heard) and the ex and even the in laws all approve of my "moving on" and so on. I am torn between just cutting it off and being alone for longer for the sake of being alone and processing the M ending, or continuing on carefully because I do see that if I can keep my emotions in check, keep on working on myself and my bad habits and so on, this girl might be a really good partner for me. (so far she is great).

I dont have trust issues with her or communication issues. I know something will come up NO relationship is perfect. I think right now im okay since she is far off and if things are gonna fizzle they can fizzle, if they are really meant to be then the distance will help prove that. So im okay with continuing on but I dont want to hurt her, myself or my kids just to be with "someone" I guess now that she is in my life and I look forward to seeing where this goes, I just want to figure out how to move forward in a way that will be the most respectful, healthy and logical way while giving her a shot. She is a great gal. I do believe god put her in my life, I am just not sure for what exactly yet.

[SteveLW]

Steve,

You keep accusing us all of making assumptions. We can only know what you tell us. It would be a pretty useless forum if every response to the LBS was "oh, tell me more since I don't want to assume". And you also have a tendency to hyper focus on the 10% the responder got wrong without acknowledging the 90% they got right.

For instance, it is impossible for you tell us anything about this OW that would erase the fact that you went from rushing out to buy your cheating wife flowers, a card, dinner, and wine on Vday, and then to less than 4 months later you have a GF. When we point out the impossibility of you being ready for a new R that quickly, you start hitting us with "because of faith" (huh??) and not wanting to be bound by XXXX statistics. Again, you gloss over the huge beam in your eye to try to pick slivers out of ours due to what you call "assumptions".

Nothing I can assume changes your actions on Vday nor the mere 14 weeks later having a GF!!

You keep making the point of "well I moved the D forward", but I'm pretty sure you were already talking to this OW before you did, or if at minimum of you're honest you'll admit you at least knew about her before you did.

Just like your lack of trying to really DB, you are doing what you want and trying to justify it after the fact. How many times did you send an update where you broke every tenet of DBing, and then tried to justify why it was okay to do what you were doing despite the chorus of responses telling you otherwise!!

So this girl might be the second coming. It doesn't change the fact that it is too soon. Too soon for you. Too soon for her. Too soon for your kids. Too soon all around.

In my 30s I met several women that would have been amazing matches for me. But the timing was wrong because I had already met and married my W. Using your logic, why should I miss out on something great just because I met them after I was married?!

I'll apologize in advance if this response is full of assumptions.

[SteveLW]

Hey Steve,

I figured I would chime in with my .02

I was once in your shoes about 14 years ago. Coming out of a painful divorce with a looney bipolar (diagnosed) ex wife. I tried for months to save my marriage, I was a mess for a long time.

Then I met her. A gorgeous woman at work. She checked all the boxes I was looking for. Christian - check. Family oriented - check. Ambitious - check. Loyal - check. Physically attractive and fit - check. Looking back, I didn't stay single long enough to process my stuff, I was still broken even though I didn't feel broken.

This woman blew my ex out of the water! We started dating and she admired the hell out of me. We got along great, we had things in common, we worked out together, amazing sex. You get the point.

We started making plans for our future. We talked about kids, a house, which churches we liked in the area. Like you, I literally thought that God himself had put this woman in my life for a reason. All the signs were there, this was God's doing.

Things were awesome for about a year (you know, the honeymoon phase right?). Then some of my old broken behaviors started popping up, and she started to show red flags as well. 3 years later, after working so hard to make things work, we split up. Again, I was devastated. Except this time it was worse, wanna know why? Because what I didnt know was that I never processed the end of my marriage, I was now mourning two broken relationships.

Let me tell you man... mourning the end of a marriage is tough for anyone. But throw another 4 year broken relationship with the woman that God had sent me on top of it, was almost unbearable.

Ive been where you are, learn from my mistake and don't have a repeat broken relationship because you never spent the time alone processing your stuff.

Out of all the responses this was the most helpful. That is a concern I have, things seems so great. She checks all the boxes, is not in the same leauge as my ex not even in the same sport, way above. This to me seems sometimes alarming. My friends, family, even the kids (what little they have heard) and the ex and even the in laws all approve of my "moving on" and so on. I am torn between just cutting it off and being alone for longer for the sake of being alone and processing the M ending, or continuing on carefully because I do see that if I can keep my emotions in check, keep on working on myself and my bad habits and so on, this girl might be a really good partner for me. (so far she is great).

I dont have trust issues with her or communication issues. I know something will come up NO relationship is perfect. I think right now im okay since she is far off and if things are gonna fizzle they can fizzle, if they are really meant to be then the distance will help prove that. So im okay with continuing on but I dont want to hurt her, myself or my kids just to be with "someone" I guess now that she is in my life and I look forward to seeing where this goes, I just want to figure out how to move forward in a way that will be the most respectful, healthy and logical way while giving her a shot. She is a great gal. I do believe god put her in my life, I am just not sure for what exactly yet.

Please take LH up on his advice to go read Wolfman's threads. He too met the perfect girl almost immediately on giving up on his WAW. And it had caused all kinds of issues for him. His kids are older, but trust me, your kids aren't missing as much as you think.

[MLCxH]

I am torn between just cutting it off and being alone for longer for the sake of being alone and processing the M ending

Steve, I think the reason the vets are not resonating with you is because they are overlooking the important fact that a lot of their advice is probably more applicable before you entered the new relationship. Now that you are already in the relationship and have already introduced your GF to your kids, it is a different scenario since you don't have a time machine to go redo things.

There are examples of people leaving relationships and getting into another one quickly and somehow making it work, which should give you some sense of optimism. However, in my opinion you need to do the work to properly balance the needs of your new relationship with those of your kids. You will need to enforce boundaries, not mislead your GF and continue to be a rock for your kids. Not easy to do, but other people have done it and perhaps you can too. Good luck!

[Ready2Change]

Hi Steve,

I have typed multiple responses to you, but deleted them.

Things just don't add up to me. I am confused and frustrated. I would like to help, but not sure how.

The bottom line is learn from other peoples mistakes, or make your own mistakes and learn from them.


Maybe even replace the word "mistakes" with choices. Everything happens for a reason. Make different choices and get different results.

Many of us got into serious relationships too soon. You can as well, or you can choose to be single. It is your choice. Our hind sight is 20x20.

Move slowly into new relationships after D. (Are you legally divorced?)

[Steve_]

Yes the D is over.

And MLCxH and R2C

That is why I am here. Again I wasnt looking for an R but thats what happened. I want to make sure if there is a shot to do this the right way BEFORE it goes sideways I want to do my best.

[SteveLW]

Yes the D is over.

And MLCxH and R2C

That is why I am here. Again I wasnt looking for an R but thats what happened. I want to make sure if there is a shot to do this the right way BEFORE it goes sideways I want to do my best.

Steve_, you make it sound like you have no choice in the new R. The new R didn't just happen, you consciously went into it with both eyes open.

[Steve_]

That is correct Steve.

I Just wanna keep my eyes open this time.


Happy Father’s Day to all you dads out there.

[MLCxH]

Steve_, you make it sound like you have no choice in the new R. The new R didn't just happen, you consciously went into it with both eyes open.

Yes, but that is something in the past and is not something that can be easily reversed at this time.

That is correct Steve.

I Just wanna keep my eyes open this time.

Everyone makes mistakes. Sometimes what appears as a mistake to others may actually be the right thing for you. I know an LBS who got into another relationship within weeks of separation and when divorce proceedings were still in progress and is now engaged to the new partner and happy. He got lucky and the chips just seemed to line up.

But it is good that you have the right attitude and keep your eyes open since you will not always be lucky

[SteveLW]

Steve_, you make it sound like you have no choice in the new R. The new R didn't just happen, you consciously went into it with both eyes open.

Yes, but that is something in the past and is not something that can be easily reversed at this time.

Steve_ has shown a penchant for retreating from and not facing reality. He does this sometimes by rewriting history. Rewriting history then excuses his future actions related to the subject at hand. By stating a new R "just happened" removes the responsibility from him knowing he shouldn't already be in a new R. My point in pointing out to him that he consciously started a new R is an effort to show him that he can also recognize that he has the power to end it for the right reasons if he wanted to.

He probably won't, but recognizing that he CAN is still important.

[Traveler]

Steve_, it's never too late to stop most of your risky behaviors around your kids re: your new GF. After asking for advice, about 8 different people said, "Woah, hold on there!" It's your circus, your monkeys. Realize you can take risks with your own heart to fill whatever holes are there without exposing your children.

[Steve_]

Just a check in. I fully expect 2x4's to hit so dont be shy, I can take it.

Spent 4 days with my GF for her birthday down in San Diego. It was super nice, she was really happy. She continued to tell me how she appreciates the fact that I communicate with her, how I am so easy going and unbothered by the little things that would set off her ex's before. And how this is her first birthday trip in years that she had left happier and not wondering why she is with her partner. I got her small gifts mostly things I made, nothing extravagant, she absolutely adored them because of the thought I put into them.

We discussed the potential for the incoming EW meltdown, she told me she really wants to see me draw more healthy boundaries with my EW such as not helping her with anything and being there only for medical emergencies. She told me I am free to do whatever I want, and she will be patient and understand if there is a process but that is what she wants me to work toward. I told her that she was 100% correct. And that I have cut off everything except I did assist the EW with setting up her homework for her degree and helped her get started because I believed her getting an education and real job would be beneficial to the children. GF agreed that it seemed like a good thing to do, and she understands that I try to be a patient and temperant person but she told me that my EW will use any small attachment to manipulate and wanted me to be aware of that. I took my 5 hour drive home and she went home and I considered what she said, but mostly that she will support whatever process I need to do, but I need to do it for ME not for her, and she made that really clear. She is again 1000% correct.

EW called me up yesterday about the children, she said she was out of town to go to the airport to pick up my SIL from her trip here overseas and asked if I could watch the kids an extra day (one of her days) I told her sure, no problem. Any extra time with my kids is great. And lately the kids and I are bonding more and more and they are starting to really like being here with me over going to the MIL's place. EW then informed me that she would be having to move soon, find and apartment and its because the IL's are going to sell the house and move away. (I saw this coming, they dont trust her and they shouldnt). She lamented, cried, and essentially said she hopes I break up with my GF because she is so jealous that I am happy. She also tried to deter me from continuing with my GF telling me "the kids will not like it, they are not going to like anyone but me, trust me I tried that with OM and it went badly, so dont get your hopes up to move on" I stopped her there and said "listen, first off I dont need advice from you on my relationship, its going great and I am happy, second, over the last 3 months I have asked the children how they would feel if daddy moved on, went out with another woman, and I let them have an opinion on what I am doing. The kids even made a list of what they wanted for me to have from a different woman. They have not met my GF, its only been 4 months for us, we are thinking we need to wait a longer for things to calm down, and to be sure of our R before the children meet her. And yes the chilren are still super mad about you moving them out so quickly with OM, they had no choice. This time I have involved them in my life, let them voice how they feel, and they are excited and happy for me, they want to meet her but it isnt time. I am not going to do what you did, its too detrimental." She scoffed and then I told her "Also, I will not be assisting you with your schooling, or anything if you do move, It is not appropriate to be involved in your life as a spouse would since I am no longer your spouse, and honestly it is disrepectful to my relationship. But if there is any medical emergency or custody issues I am here 100%. She just scoffed again and said "okay bye".

Had an amazing morning, I have to admit that ever since I have really let god take over my life and began minimizing contact with the EW things have gotten so good for me and so effortless. I work, pay my bills and have great quality time with my kids. Cleaned up my diet and still making progress in the gym, I just bagged up all my XXL shirts and am going to donate them. Im between a L and XL now. I applied for some more state jobs today and a couple nursing jobs with Kaiser Permanente (its an amazing employer for nurses) so im really looking forward to that. I got a letter from the attorneys office today letting me know that everything was accepted by the court the default judgment was accepted a month ago and he will be sending me the final paperwork shortly so I can have my dissolusion on hand.

My MIL called me up and asked If i could help her file her EDD for her unemployment, I knew something was wrong because she never calls me. She was in tears. Turns out she wanted to inform me that she would never throw the kids out of the home that way, the EW was lying, they planned on renting the home to her and she is pissed off at her whole family right now and refuses to go home or talk to anyone. She essentially got caught on camera at her MIL's home bringing over OM she left me for (that she allegedly broke up with 2x now) when they were not around. Funny, her OM caught on about the new millionare OM and told her to decide. Current OM actually called her new celebrity OM and told him WTF buddy.... then he left her in the hotel room and dumped her. Now she is essentially using the celebrity OM to get her apartment here in town (per her mom). I cannot help but laugh so so hard. She leaves me for OM, he leaves his wife, loses everything, OM's EW even filed a restraining order on him and he lost his kids, and my EW is messing around on him with a friend of his that is a celebrity..... Karma.... just ... Karma.

My IL's my children, all my friends and everyone in my life is so excited for me, so happy and so thankful I am out of that M. Every day I wake up on my couch or in my bed and I am greatful that god took me out of that, that my only worry in the world is taking care of my kids and finding a great career now and growing my finances. And to top it off I have a woman in my life who is patient, understanding, has a great career, and gives me really good support and advice.

I walk with caution, I keep my eyes open, I believe nothing the EW says or does, and I expect the games to continue, but I actually just laugh about it, because I know for a fact I will be 100% okay.

[Traveler]

I fully expect 2x4's to hit so dont be shy, I can take it.

You take less than 1% of advice, so no point. I'll simply repeat what I've said before--your kids don't need to know about your interactions with your XW, GFs, etc. Save them that drama and trauma. During your custody period focus 100% on them. During your ex's custody period act if a minimum level of care is not being met. I will read your update shortly out of interest and care and wish you well. (:

[Gigi123]

I have been sort of following your story, but perhaps missed some details. Still too much emphasis on xw, who cares which om and how and where.

Can i just urge you to speak with caution about your gf to your kids. Theory and reality are two different things. This is a personal example of course, h and i havent been together for 15 months, ow was introduced to kids from day 1 as a friend and then slowly progressed from there, kids actually like her. Well as much as you can like someone who as they perceive has nothing to do with their family. So my s7 has this story in his head how ow moves back with her parents and is no longer with H….he does not want to be cuddled or kissed by her, as far as he is concerned she is a stranger and he would much prefer if H lived alone because he doesnt feel comfortable in H home with essentially a stranger there. All kids are different, but there seriously is no rush in somehow bringing your personal life into your childrens life.

[Steve_]

I didnt tell my kids about my GF my EW did. Was no point in not including them in my life once they were told. Again I still dont plan on introducing them any time soon. That was fired off without my choice. Im working with what I got here, making the best of the cards I been dealt.

[SteveLW]

Why does EW know about GF? This is turning into a soap opera!

[LH19]

Steve buddy only because you asked.

And how this is her first birthday trip in years that she had left happier and not wondering why she is with her partner.

So your GF had is a pretty bad picker too. Broken attracts broken Steve.

We discussed the potential for the incoming EW meltdown

Why? When I was dating a woman I would never discuss a potential meltdown from my ExW.

She told me she really wants to see me draw more healthy boundaries with my EW such as not helping her with anything and being there only for medical emergencies. She told me I am free to do whatever I want, and she will be patient and understand if there is a process but that is what she wants me to work toward.

So you can do whatever you want but this is what she wants. Passive aggressive

I told her that she was 100% correct. And that I have cut off everything except I did assist the EW with setting up her homework for her degree and helped her get started because I believed her getting an education and real job would be beneficial to the children.

Nope. Illusion of action. If I do X she will want me back.

GF agreed that it seemed like a good thing to do, and she understands that I try to be a patient and temperant person but she told me that my EW will use any small attachment to manipulate and wanted me to be aware of that.

Because you are easily manipulated and your EXW knows it.

She lamented, cried, and essentially said she hopes I break up with my GF because she is so jealous that I am happy.

Boy she sure is an amazing woman (insert LH eyeroll)

She also tried to deter me from continuing with my GF telling me "the kids will not like it, they are not going to like anyone but me, trust me I tried that with OM and it went badly, so dont get your hopes up to move on"

I think she may want to reconcile (insert LH eyeroll)

I stopped her there and said "listen, first off I dont need advice from you on my relationship, its going great and I am happy, second, over the last 3 months I have asked the children how they would feel if daddy moved on, went out with another woman, and I let them have an opinion on what I am doing.

So now you are trying to manipulate her and some how your kids are involved in GF convos after 3 months.

The kids even made a list of what they wanted for me to have from a different woman.

WTF?

They have not met my GF, its only been 4 months for us, we are thinking we need to wait a longer for things to calm down, and to be sure of our R before the children meet her.

Good! wait another year because this girl is a temporary filler in your life.

And yes the chilren are still super mad about you moving them out so quickly with OM, they had no choice. This time I have involved them in my life, let them voice how they feel, and they are excited and happy for me, they want to meet her but it isnt time.

LH shakes his head

I am not going to do what you did, its too detrimental." She scoffed and then I told her "Also, I will not be assisting you with your schooling, or anything if you do move, It is not appropriate to be involved in your life as a spouse would since I am no longer your spouse, and honestly it is disrepectful to my relationship.

Trying to control your EXW. Were you controlling in the marriage?

But if there is any medical emergency or custody issues I am here 100%. She just scoffed again and said "okay bye".

She really has no respect for you.

Had an amazing morning, I have to admit that ever since I have really let god take over my life and began minimizing contact with the EW things have gotten so good for me and so effortless. I work, pay my bills and have great quality time with my kids.

You guys talk more then some married couples.

Cleaned up my diet and still making progress in the gym, I just bagged up all my XXL shirts and am going to donate them. Im between a L and XL now. I applied for some more state jobs today and a couple nursing jobs with Kaiser Permanente (its an amazing employer for nurses) so im really looking forward to that.

I wish you would have posted this part only. Good job Steve!

I got a letter from the attorneys office today letting me know that everything was accepted by the court the default judgment was accepted a month ago and he will be sending me the final paperwork shortly so I can have my dissolusion on hand.

Great!

My MIL called me up and asked If i could help her file her EDD for her unemployment, I knew something was wrong because she never calls me. She was in tears. Turns out she wanted to inform me that she would never throw the kids out of the home that way, the EW was lying, they planned on renting the home to her and she is pissed off at her whole family right now and refuses to go home or talk to anyone.

I am sorry to hear EX MIL but this is no longer my concern.

She essentially got caught on camera at her MIL's home bringing over OM she left me for (that she allegedly broke up with 2x now) when they were not around.

What is she 16?

Funny, her OM caught on about the new millionare OM and told her to decide. Current OM actually called her new celebrity OM and told him WTF buddy.... then he left her in the hotel room and dumped her. Now she is essentially using the celebrity OM to get her apartment here in town (per her mom). I cannot help but laugh so so hard. She leaves me for OM, he leaves his wife, loses everything, OM's EW even filed a restraining order on him and he lost his kids, and my EW is messing around on him with a friend of his that is a celebrity..... Karma.... just ... Karma.

You really think she is going to make her way back to you don't you.

My IL's my children, all my friends and everyone in my life is so excited for me, so happy and so thankful I am out of that M.

So why aren't you? You must thrive on chaos.

Every day I wake up on my couch or in my bed and I am greatful that god took me out of that, that my only worry in the world is taking care of my kids and finding a great career now and growing my finances.

Did God take you out of it or did she remove you from it?

I walk with caution, I keep my eyes open, I believe nothing the EW says or does, and I expect the games to continue, but I actually just laugh about it, because I know for a fact I will be 100% okay.

Will you? I am not so sure.

[job]

New Thread:

Steve_Moving on