Part 1
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2891605#Post2891605Part 2
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2893247#Post2893247Well I’m over a 100 post in part 2 so I’m opening a new thread.
Small recap
Me 37
W 33
5 kids S16.D15,D12,D11,D8
Married 15 plus
Together 16 plus
BD March 6th. Been a roller coaster night mare since.
I would highly recommend looking last 2 pages of part 2 because things got really out of hand today.
CW, I’m honestly not making any decision over the next few days other than what to have for breakfast lunch and dinner. I’m emotionally worn down and totally shot. I don’t have it in me. I feel like a total zombie emotionally. There not high, they’re not low, they’re just not there. Idk if that makes sense.
Sandi, I appreciate your prayers. And I mean that. It means a lot coming from someone like you. And yes, today was absolutely the day I draw the line in the sand. Never again. I understand in time, especially knowing who I am as a person. (I’m naturally very forgiving and tend to look at the positives someone brought to my life and dismiss the negative). I will miss her. And that’s ok. I miss or will miss the person and relationship I had. Not what is. And that’s the reality. But she told me today as far as I’m concerned my eldest daughters life could be in danger. This isn’t hearsay. This isn’t something someone told me. This is something I heard. I can’t make an excuse. I can’t dismiss it. The reality is my W is either in extreme psychosis or has a horrible drug issue. Either way, she threatened my child, my little girl. Threatened to me, that her life could be danger. The same child back when I was 20 and found out I was having my 1st babygirl, I left the hospital literally screaming out my car window I was going to be a father to a little girl. That was one of my proudest moments. No...oh no...my daughter will never be on a list. And if you put her on a list, you will have to go through me first.
As far as the OM W, I looked just to make sure, but we talked 3X in the month of April. 1 was to give me a recipe for a casserole. Once was to say happy birthday. And the final time was a school related question. Since our children go to the same school and she asked for the link to login into her stuff done since she hadn’t gotten it. We may have talked for a total of 20 mins in 30 days. Oh I did send the OM W my kids letters they wrote about abuse so she could use that to help keep her sons away. So I guess 4X. There is no romantic feelings on my end. And when we talk it’s only ever on Facebook. I think it’s just a jealousy issue for my W. She has always hated that I get along better with woman than men. So she’s just low blowing or trying to figure out if it’s going that route romantically. It’s not and won’t. But if you really think it’s inappropriate I’ll unfriend her and not talk to her anymore.
today was absolutely the day I draw the line in the sand. Never again. I understand in time, especially knowing who I am as a person. (I’m naturally very forgiving and tend to look at the positives someone brought to my life and dismiss the negative). I will miss her.
Quick tip.
I have made a few videos filming myself.
Film yourself talking, so that in the future, you can look back and help yourself understand how you reason and how you feel today. Video and sound makes it SO much easier to connect with the feeling you have when "drawing the line".
Thanks Mumin I’m gonna try that today actually.
I’m still gonna journal here as well, just because feedback is always a good thing.
Journal.
Had a uneventful evening and night. Nothing happened. No one heard from the W. I have no idea if she got picked up or not. We did make carrot cake and watched the first 2 Maze runner movies. I didn’t sleep very well as usual. I’m just thankful for no bad dreams.
Today woke up and still my emotions are just flat out muted. I still feel like...almost nothing. I’m almost thankful for it. It’s better than feeling constant anxiety, confusion and pain. We’ll see how today goes.
Joseph, very sorry to hear you're going through this. I do have a question for you, what does "OM W" stand for? I am not familiar with that abbreviation, normally "OM" means "other man" as in a woman's affair partner. "OW" is "other woman", "OP" is "other person". "W" is "wife". So "OM W" is throwing me off. It sounds like it's a female friend of yours? If so then just understand that for the time being you've got to tread very carefully. You're building a case against W as you well should, but she in turn will try to dig up whatever dirt on you that she can. Do you have a lawyer? If so then talk to him/ her about what precautions you should take right now, but I suspect they will tell you to live like a Franciscan monk for the time being. Good luck and try not to let her drag you down too much!
Hi AS
I just use OM W to indicate other man wife. So the AP wife.
Yes I have a lawyer. At this juncture I’m not to worried about what she’s doing or going to try to do.
Journal/update
Well whatever happened my W last night she did text the kids this morning. The usual good morning love you guys. Well D11 responded with stop texting and calling me. I’m blocking you. D12 said me too. And than D8 said same. They came and told me what they did. They don’t wanna be bothered by her anymore. But don’t wanna get into trouble.
And good freaking gravy the W just sent a screenshot of it as I was typing this out. Lol I swear, what does she think I’m gonna do about it? Well, there goes my emotional zombieland. I’m actually quite angry now.
And yeah. Absolutely not responding
Hi Joseph,
Why were D11/D12/D8 particularly short today? Did you tell them about what transpired yesterday? What are your thoughts on continuing to allow unsupervised calls and texts with their mom?
D11 wasn’t home last night. She doesn’t even know something happened. So for her it was completely random. D11 hasn’t seen or talked to her mother since Easter. As far as I can remember right now anyway. D11 is just like S16 in terms of their attitude towards her. They want nothing to do with her. They don’t want to see or talk to her. They’re absolutely disgusted with her in every way shape and form. I guess D11 just got tired of seeing her name pop up.
And yes I know everyone is supposed to be on lockdown etc stay at home orders etc. But I’m prioritizing my kids mental health. I’ve known her best friends mom for years. They’re great people. And I know my D is 100% safe with them. The parents are very familiar with what’s going on and the mom is absolutely wonderful about it. She made it very clear they won’t even go out into the yard without her. And if for some reason if W showed up and knocked on the door no one will answer.
As far as D12 and D8. They said if D11 can do it so can they. I just got done emailing my atty. she said as long as I’m not the one telling them to do it than it’s fine. And I’m not so it’s fine. It’s really sad my family has come to this point. But heck. Wasn’t my choice. I didn’t cause this and she can deal with the consequences of her behavior for once instead of running to me to fix it. I have interfered for the last time in trying to get them to have a relationship. She doesn’t deserve a relationship with these awesome kids. And if she ever does fix her ridiculously cruel behavior it’s still on her to fix it with these kids and leave me out if it.
As far as unsupervised texts or calls, no. I’m not ok with it anymore. And I’m glad they blocked her. I’m glad they’re finding their voice and sticking up for themselves. Honestly as sad as this sounds watching them do this, is making me stand up a little taller.
Funny how a day can go from emotionless to trash to the absolute best day. Said screw it and asked if I could hang out with my brother. He said yeah come over. Took the kids. Ordered food. Had a fire. Talked, got a lot off my chest. Than the hour car ride home me and the kids blasted 90s and early 2000 music and sang at the top of our lungs. It was freaking great. I haven’t been this happy in this moment in a long time
Joseph, good job not letting your W pull you into her drama. Try to remain as neutral as possible when it comes to the interactions between her and the kids. You don't want to encourage them to cut her out of their lives, but you don't want to "force" her on them either. If they want to talk about it to you then listen and validate but don't try to sway them one way or the other.
And be "grey rock" with your W. She thrives on drama, so don't give her any fuel. When you interact with her in person, on the phone, and via text be as colorless, bland and boring as possible. She rants and raves? You don't reply. She stomps her feet and makes threats? Don't reply. She asks you something regarding kid visitation or whatever that does require a reply? Respond with the bare minimum required information presented as flatly as possible and nothing more.
Glad to hear you had a great day, may there be many more to come
Thanks AS. I’m trying but I never seem to be able to for long
Journaling
I called CYS for an update about the evaluation for my daughter. They said they finally heard from my W yesterday and she gave them a sob story that I have made the kids hate her and am forcing them to say these things about her. That she didn’t just walk out because of her boyfriend but because I’m abusive and she was unsafe. That she tries to talk to the kids but i keep her from talking to her. And they can check their cell phone. (Well that explains the more constant attempts). I guess her group message in the morning followed by an attempt at night with never asking to see them is ok. And the amazing part, it almost seemed like CYS believed her. The caseworker actually said idk what’s going on. But I guess they still are going to do the evaluation. So I guess I have that going for me. Smh. I feel so defeated. The things that’s happened to my children and she’s gonna actually get to be left alone with them because she can put up a front like no ones business and there’s not a thing I can do about it. I can guarantee she’s going to fight it the whole way and somehow end up getting some sort of custody. I’m absolutely terrified something is going to happen to my children.
I get that it is frustrating AND for every legit claim out there... there are several false claims.
My H got called into court over some family drama that his XW had filed claims to CPS. She prevented him from seeing his kids for 12weeks. These were NOT legit claims. Had to go to court. Judge didn't even want to hear from the CPS person once the issue was displayed in court... NONE the less my H lost 3 months with his kids who were being toyed with by his XW.
Its a very difficult line they walk - they miss some obvious abuse and then those who really didn't abuse get caught up in a vicious cycle.
Take a deep breath. Love your kids. Love your W from a very long distance. Protect your kids as much as possible from anything happening in an adult world - your S, poss D, the AP, etc.
HUGS. Take it one hour at a time and one day at a time.
Thanks KC. I always appreciate when you chime in. You’re a very caring individual. I know there are false claims,
I do. After journaling I took a deep breath and thought what can I do to help myself and my kids. And I remembered she admitting to hitting D15 if she was in trouble. I emailed the screenshot to the case worker. I haven’t heard back, but at least I tried. And that in itself helps.
Thanks KC. I always appreciate when you chime in. You’re a very caring individual. I know there are false claims,
I do. After journaling I took a deep breath and thought what can I do to help myself and my kids. And I remembered she admitting to hitting D15 if she was in trouble. I emailed the screenshot to the case worker. I haven’t heard back, but at least I tried. And that in itself helps.
So turn your focus to what you can do to help D15 heal.
AND - as much as possible leave your W out of it.
Validate your daughters feelings. Listen. Don't make excuses for W. Don't crucify W either. Talk about what you can do to make your home a safe place.
Your L should be able to help you establish boundaries - Like W can only call to talk to the kids on Tues/Thurs at 6pm. Kids will not be force to answer or communicate if they don't feel up to it. Encourage your kids to NOT to respond to their mom with mean, hateful comments but instead drop the convo. You an even go so far in that she is only allowed to contact kids via skype on iPad or something so she is not blowing up their individual phones.
HUGS!
People who work in CPS get very frustrated by the volume of false claims. It eats up resources, jams up the court system, and limits their ability to address serious and critical cases.
I'm in a similar boat, scared about case workers deciding my fate over false claims, etc. Just stand up for yourself, demonstrate how you are a good father, and avoid mudslinging. People who work in the system see this ALL the time.
Journaling/looking for advice.
Car payment still hadn’t been paid. So I figured it out and paid it myself. Didn’t realize I wouldn’t need my account number for the automated system. So I could have easily avoided the other day if I tried a little harder. Smh
Got a few text yesterday from the W. Idk if it was her talking to CYS. However they were short. I don’t ever wanna talk about the marriage again. Followed by only talk to me about our divorce and kids only. I didn’t respond.
I had the kids unblock their mother on their phone so she can’t say I manipulated them into hating her and she’s trying to talk to them but I won’t allow it. I just told the kids I’m sorry but it was the advice I was given after I told my ATTY what my W told CYS. It just gets in front of something she could make an issue out of. She’s going to try to claim I brainwashed the kids and made them hate her etc. kids don’t have to respond (of course one did) but just leave her unblocked for now.
Yesterday she was absolutely the nicest she’s been to D12 and it actually annoyed me because i can see the manipulation coming. W texted her Hi D12. D12 told her basically that she abandoned her and she doesn’t need to say hi. Her Mom responded with I know you feel that way and I hope one day you can fight thru it. God is really made D12 angry. Replied work thru what? You abandoned me! I told D12 no more replying for now. Let it go. She’s just trying to get you to say something she can use in court.
W tried calling every kid at a decent hour for once, they still didn’t answer. D15 sent her a Tiktoc video she made. Basically alluding to her mother being abusive and abandoning them. W didn’t reply to her. Which is really really unusual. Normal she’s got a smart *** remark back for them. I’m actually glad she didn’t. Don’t get me wrong. But still....it made me even more suspicious.
This morning the W wrote all the kids. “Good morning everyone. I love you guys and I hope you all have a great day. I have some interviews today but if anyone gets bored they can call me. I’ll be around.” I know that sounds innocent but...I’m not taking it that way. Idk. It’s the most she’s texted at a single time in 2 months. She never ever asked them or told them they can call whenever they want. She’s never told them what she was doing with her day either.
I would love someones opinion here. Is this her trying to get back in their good graces because of her finally talking to CYS? I have filed for custody but I’m 99.9% sure she hasn’t been served yet. Could she be trying to set up her own custody case? Seriously I know it’s only a day, but This is a complete 180 on how she’s treating them. Or is this maybe her realizing she’s been a crap mom for years and this is the beginning of her making amends? Or could this even be manipulation towards me because she is aware I started checking their phone far far more often? I mean on one hand she said to never talk to her about our marriage again...but on the other hand it wouldn’t surprise me at all if she used the kids to try to get back. idk. And no I don’t want that, I just want to be mentally prepared. She still takes me off guard half the time.
J,
You will drive yourself crazy trying to mind read what she’s thinking.
I really don’t think she has any thoughts about coming back to the marriage so that should set your mind at ease.
Hey LH,
Yeah I will absolutely drive myself nuts trying to mind read. It’s a skill I need to seriously work on. The skill of stop trying to do it. I’m not concerned about her wanting to come back for any right reason. I’m just thinking, she’s unemployed, I do wonder if she misses the kids, and it wouldn’t surprise me if she tried to get back in our good graces or come back to the marriage for a few months to make CYS go away and save money by living with me. Or heck even steal money from me. That I don’t put past her. But no I don’t think she’s in the mind frame at all let’s work the marriage out. Neither am I don’t get me wrong. But I have been known to be a sucker for her when she cries. I mean heck, she cried last week and I took her and D8 to breakfast. That’s the kind of stuff I gotta do much better at.
The biggest problem for most people in this scenario is the feeling that you've lost control over your life and your future.
For years you've lived by a certain set of rules -- that if you're a good husband, you can count on your wife supporting you.
Because you're married, your relationship is a source of stability in your life.
etc. etc.
When that's suddenly ripped away and you can't understand (a) what you did to make it fall apart so suddenly, (b) why the person who used to be your partner seems to have had a complete personality change and (c) why you can't seem to do anything to make it better, it is totally destabilizing.
Your brain doesn't like this instability, and it doesn't like the unavailability of a remedy at all! Its panic-inducing.
Because of this lack of control and the fear that comes with it, you desperately, desperately want to regain your feeling of control and stability.
Your brain convinces you that the quickest way to do that is to get your wayward spouse back. If you can do that, then all the old rules still apply and there was just a temporary blip on the radar.
As a result, your brain will *compel* you to want to pursue, and everything else is a justification to allow you to do what you want.
Step back and look at some of these situations -- a person's wife cheats on them for years with several OM's. If that comes to light, a rational person would say "this woman has issues" and head the other way right? But in reality, we see time and again that the LBS convinces themselves that this cheater is the best person in the world, and they want to have them back more than anything.
WHY? Because the loss of control is devastating. The loss of control is something our brains can't process or tolerate.
If you see this in yourself, that you have lost your feeling of control, then you can come to the conclusion that this is what you need to deal with, not what your wife does or doesn't do.
J, she may very well try what you state above.
But then there is what you will allow. And I don’t believe you will allow that to happen for you and your kids sake. So it’s irrelevant right now.
Protect yourself, protect your kids. That’s it right now. That’s all you have to do.
Take care
Idk. It’s the most she’s texted at a single time in 2 months. She never ever asked them or told them they can call whenever they want. She’s never told them what she was doing with her day either.
I would love someones opinion here. Is this her trying to get back in their good graces because of her finally talking to CYS?
That would be my guess.
Or is this maybe her realizing she’s been a crap mom for years and this is the beginning of her making amends?
Not likely. That's LBH thinking!
I thought you said she was a great mom until her own mother passed away.
Or could this even be manipulation towards me because she is aware I started checking their phone far far more often?
I think she trying to cover her own a$$ b/c she had CYS called on her, and she might lose her kids.
I mean on one hand she said to never talk to her about our marriage again...but on the other hand it wouldn’t surprise me at all if she used the kids to try to get back.
I believe I gave you the same warning the she met you and D8 for breakfast. If she can soften the kids' feelings toward her, and get them to the place where they'll beg you to reconcile.......she may think it will wear you down. Know what I mean?
And no I don’t want that, I just want to be mentally prepared. She still takes me off guard half the time.
Are you absolutely certain you don't want it? If so, then you should be able to see through the more obvious manipulation attempts, and if you can't, then you can always check with the board. Just remember, don't believe the things she says. A statement such as the one she made to you about never talking to her about the M again.......is made in anger. You took it to heart, but I guarantee you it would not stand in her way if she wanted to talk about the MR. You have to be suspicious about everything she says/does. In other words, she is not trustworthy. And Joseph, if she wanted to come back home tonight.........you have a mouth to speak up and tell her no. Just b/c she wants to come back, doesn't mean you have to let her. If she threatens to call the cops, then let her. You can call CYS!
If you really mean you're done with her, then you've got to emotionally let go of the rope tied to her.
LH,
You hit the nail on the head. Point blank. That last message was like looking into a mirror of my mentality. I gotta stop worrying about her and what she does. I had that mentality that I can only control what I do. I did. And I lost it. I gotta get it back.
Ginger,
no I won’t allow it. I can’t. Not after what she did to my kids. For some reason I can make excuse after excuse and be ok with what she does to me. Or says to me. But I have a completely different mind frame when it comes to my kids. I get very protective and know what’s best and feel what’s best.
Sandi,
I thought she was a great Mom til her mom passed away. But that was 2 Years ago. However, the more I learn the more the kids open up, it’s becoming clearer I was wrong and it started right around the time her mother became unable to talk in any real way you could understand or move because of her disease. Right around the time her brother blamed her for what happened to her mom. And that would have been a year before she died. That seems to be when the physical abuse started towards the kids when I went to work. And yes you absolutely gave me that warning and that’s why I questioned if this may be an attempt or a start to one. Seriously it’s because of you I even considered this was fake. If I’m being completely honest...do I want her back?? No I don’t. I know it’s not what’s best for me and it would be a disaster for my kids. However, I’m having a hard time dropping that rope. I will, I know I will. But do I miss her still, yeah I do. I miss what I thought I had or what I thought she was. But I will get there.
If I’m being completely honest...do I want her back?? No I don’t. I know it’s not what’s best for me and it would be a disaster for my kids. However, I’m having a hard time dropping that rope. I will, I know I will. But do I miss her still, yeah I do. I miss what I thought I had or what I thought she was. But I will get there.
That's completely understandable, to miss the person you knew & loved years ago.....and who loved you in return. I do want to clarify something I said in my previous post. I said, "You have to be suspicious about everything she says/does. In other words, she is not trustworthy." I think when a LBH wants to reconcile his M so badly, it's easy to read into the things his W says or even the action she does. He wants her words/actions to indicate that she is having second thoughts about their M, or feels guilty, or that she may be getting her eyes open........etc, etc. He really wants to link it with her giving them another chance. I think that's only natural for a LBS. However, it will keep his thoughts tied to every little word or act from her.
When the LBH can emotionally detach himself from his WW, he will begin to think more objectively, and accept that she is not the same girl he fell in love with. This WW is not trustworthy, period, so the LBH must view her from that position.........or risk that old familiar pain, time after time. Even if they reconcile, he has to continue to view her as untrustworthy, until she goes through affair withdrawals, and there has been a
sufficient period of time where she works to make amends. Her words, actions, and attitudes should consistently be in alignment.
If you are done with her, then you have to figure out how to stop clinging to the dream that she will not only return to the M, but that she'll return to the person she was in the past. I often tell LBH's that the one thing that scares the WW most about reconciliation, is that her love/desire for him will not return and she'll be stuck in hell for the rest of her life. The solution is for her to follow through with the right actions, first, and her feelings of love/desire will eventually catch up. I challenge you to do the same. If you are done, then behave as if you are done with her.
((hugs))
Thanks Sandi. I appreciate you taking the time to explain it like that. You’re right. I do need to act like I’m done. And eventually I will be fully. Basically I need to act like her. And deep down I know there is no reason to have contact with her. There just isn’t. She’s not who she use to be. She’s not a good mother and she’s made it very clear she isn’t interested in being my wife anymore. Hard reality all the way around
You know it’s funny...basically I need to actually DB properly to get over her. Ironic
The beauty about DB is that if executed properly it will give you the best chance to recon and help you move on.
So today is the day S16 turns into S17. I walked into his room at 11:59pm last night. I told his girlfriend who he was FaceTiming with “you know I think you’re awesome, so don’t take this personal”, and I hung up on her to ensure I was the first to say happy birthday. My son was laughing so hard. And you know my luck as I was laughing with him D8 tore into the room at midnight and beat me to it anyway lol! S17 called his girlfriend back and she laughed so hard. They really are a good couple for as young as they are.
D15 made my son a great picture/video montage for his b-day. My son is a “mans man” but this is absolutely going to get him. I can’t wait to see his reaction.
I hate we are in lock down and I can’t take my son for a birthday dinner and since it’s supposed to rain all day we can’t do much. But we’re gonna do the best we can with what we got.
Today is also the 2nd Anniversary of my MILs passing. She was a wonderful woman and I still miss her. She was more of a mother to me than my own. I truly was blessed to have met her. But D11 acts so much like her it’s a blessing to have that piece of her around me.
D15 asked if I was gonna reach out with some words of comfort to my W because of what today is and the fact my S17 will not talk,text, or see her. (He’s been DBing her since BD lol). I thought for a minute. No, no I’m not gonna reach out. She made it clear unless it was about our divorce or kids do not contact her. If she wanted me to comfort her she wouldn’t have had an affair, she wouldn’t have hit you, and she surely wouldn’t have walked out on everyone. She can find comfort or whatever she needs today from the new people in life. D15 says I know but they won’t be able too. No one knew her Mom but you. I told her I understood but D15, at the end of the day, it’s not my job nor does your mom want it to be my job to reach out with comforting words. She’ll get through the day just fine without me. D15 gave me a hug and went upstairs.
It’s finally sunk in. Nothing is ever going to be the same and there’s not a darn thing I can do about it. Time to make new memories instead of pining for the past ones.
Happy BDay to your son....
I too had to celebrate a bday in quarantine... At least he has his rock of a dad and siblings!
I'm sure you can come up with something to do at home to celebrate. At least there is take out!!!! I hope its a beautiful day and perhaps you can picnic outside.
HUGS!
It’s finally sunk in. Nothing is ever going to be the same and there’s not a darn thing I can do about it. Time to make new memories instead of pining for the past ones.
Yep!
It’s finally sunk in. Nothing is ever going to be the same and there’s not a darn thing I can do about it. Time to make new memories instead of pining for the past ones.
Wise words! True even if you reconcile some day.
My boy ended up having a good day. His girlfriend did surprise him by coming over with a few presents gave him a hug and left. She wasn’t allowed to stay long. Sat in chic-fil-a traffic for 45 mins to get the dinner he wanted. Absolutely worth it. The STBXW brother called and said Happy Birthday. I was absolutely shocked considering he’s never remembered before. Took D8 to Walmart she wanted to get D15 a Mother’s Day present. I thought it was cute. Got her a teddy bear, a movie and some candy. So all in all a good day.
In the evening my son asked if I was ok with him blowing off his Mom considering what the day was. I told him I had his back no matter what he did. He asked if I talked to her, nope and she hadn’t reached out either. He told me she had FaceTimed him and he declined it. Than she sent him a text saying she knew he didn’t want to talk or see her but Happy Birthday. He deleted it and moved on.
She didn’t say anything to the girls all day.
We have prayed as a family at 8pm pretty consistently every night since the STBXW left. During prayers I prayed to god what the right thing to do is. I did decide after all to text her something.
Me: Psalm 34:18
The Lord is close to the brokenhearted and saves those who are crushed in spirit.
No one can understand what you feel today. But I will pray you found peace. And I will pray you sleep even just a little tonight.
She did respond 2 hours later
W: Thanks (insert my real name). No sleep last night. Doubtful for tonight. We both know these are the hardest days... minus march 9...S17 B’Day. And Mother’s Day.
I didn’t respond. As clarification March 9 was her mothers birthday. I know I broke the NC and I know it wasn’t my place to say anything to her anymore. But honestly when I prayed I “got the feeling” it was the right thing to do. And it didn’t give me anxiety and I had no urge to keep the conversation going.
Most importantly though, I’m at peace today.
Stuck to NC today. She asked the kids in a group text who’d be willing to see her tomorrow for Mother’s Day. 8 hours later D15 responded no one wants to see you. The W responded wow. That’s messed up thanks guys. D8 said you’re welcome. I told D8 no more smart@$$ responses. You’re better than that. Gotta give the W credit. She hadn’t tried to involve me or get me to help.
Wish me luck for tomorrow
Well I done messed up. I have scheduled e greeting cards to go out to people on certain days. And I completely forgot about the Mother’s Day one going to the W. I haven’t been checking my email like I should and if I had I would have known it was coming. Well she got it and texted me
How am I supposed to have a good day when my kids won’t even see me on Mother’s Day. It’s pretty messed up.
Do I respond to this?
You don't.
You can't fix why the kids won't speak to her - that's her issue to resolve.
Ignore.
You haven't been able to do so far... but trust me... ignore her. She will come back at you with more anger. But, ignore. She will see you are respecting yourself for a change because you always cater to her.
Let her see the new Joe!
Journaling for the day!
Woke up still at peace. Don’t have the anxiety or sense of dread or doom that I have. Had an absolutely crazy dream last night that I was walking with someone but I couldn’t see anyone but knew they were there and could hear them. They warned me in a month my W would try to come back. It was a warning not a joyful thing. Not a relax everything will be fine. I know it was just a dream but man it was weird.
Had the email incident as I spoke of in my previous entry. I didn’t respond and nothing else came from it. Did log in to make sure that didn’t happen again.
Kids woke up and said happy Father/mother’s day to me. Kids did not say anything to their mom. Which didn’t go unnoticed. All of a sudden I heard all these phones go off with a text message. And than giggling.
W: Good morning children. I love you all. Thanks for the Happy Mother’s Day wishes....oh wait. nevermind. Hope you guys have a fabulous day. Would have been great to see my own children on Mother’s Day.
No one responded as usual. But D12 says to herself would have been great to see you everyday before you walked out.
I hope everyone has a great Mother’s Day today.
J,
I don’t know what the answer is but this sounds very unhealthy. If they are not going to respond then why not block her. Speak to CPS and a lawyer if you have to.
Hey LH
She was blocked for a few days and than accused me of manipulating them into not talking to her and “poisoning their minds” my lawyer did actually tell me it was fine if she was blocked (as long as I didn’t tell them too) but it would be easier so she doesn’t have a defense if she wasn’t. CYS is CPS in my state. So they’ve been involved since April 21st I believe. D15 actually has an evaluation on Monday the 18th paid for by CYS which I can use to get a PFA and custody. Its an evaluation for abuse. It goes on D15 record tells she’s 23 and would stop my W from getting a job related to children in anyway til than.
I’ve covered my bases. It use to bother me she’d play the victim to the kids. It’s just another sign of her extreme immaturity and where she’s at mentally.
Journaling
Today my W called me 3x in a row and finally texted please answer. I finally answered. I assumed something horrendous happened. She’s never done that. Not even when things were fine.
She crying her eyes out because of the kids. S17 wouldn’t talk to her on his birthday. No one has sympathy for her that her mom died they day. Her own kids didn’t talk to her or see her on Mother’s Day. She was crying so hard I asked her if she was safe. She said there’s no guns in the house she’s at. I said that not what I asked. She said she was fine.
She told me I was doing the wrong thing again by not forcing them into talking to her and she’d never do that to me. I just let her talk. I wasn’t looking to argue. When she was done I just said I’m sorry you’re going through all this and are hurting.
She than told me they needed their mother, and than turns around and said when the day comes that they come to her and want them to fix something she’ll tell them to “sit on it and rotate”. (Now that’s a saying I haven’t heard since she was a teenager). I told her the kids are doing fine and they’ve really bonded with each other. And not to worry about them. But I am really sorry she’s hurting so bad.
We did talk for 30 mins or so. She broke down 3 or 4 separate times crying about the kids and how they won’t talk to her and it’s killing her. I am honestly concerned for her mentally right now. Idk if she’s hiding it from others and just couldn’t with me or what. But she’s not ok. She’s going to have a break down. As a human being I do actually feel bad.
We had absolutely no relationship talk at all, but at the same time she found away to make sure I knew she didn’t want to be with me and we were done and she was done with me. I have no idea why or what the purpose of that was. Every time she said something like that I just said I understand. I didn’t tell her I agreed or didn’t want to be with her either or that I did. That’s what’s I had done for the past 3 weeks if we talked. I really really don’t know the purpose of her saying this. We actually agreed to get divorced a few weeks ago. (At the time I just didn’t mean it)
I’m honestly concerned for her and her well being. She is honestly losing it and it’s genuinely scares me. She actually made the comment she won’t kill herself because she doesn’t want to give us the satisfaction. I did say that’s not going to give anyway satisfaction and won’t solve any problem.
Crazy just crazy
I'm so sorry.
This is [censored] terribly.
If you are concerned for her safety you can call local law enforcement for a welfare check.
But, do you at all see that she is still manipulating you??? Calling 3 times. Texting you to answer. Crying and blaming you.
I don't have any real answers for you. I'm not in your situation but this still reeks of manipulation.
HUGS!
Hi Joe,
By your account, it sounds like you listened and did very little talking, with what talking you did do confined to double-checking that she's not suicidal and expressing sympathy she's hurting. Can't go too wrong with that! Sorry your situation is so crazy, but glad to hear you have that CPS evaluation scheduled in a week!
Hi KC maybe it was manipulation but honestly I don’t think so this time. In all the time I’ve known her I’ve never heard her cry like that. In the middle of a sentence than dead silence. Several times I thought she had cut out. No, she was crying so hard she couldn’t breath, and when she could finally catch her breath...the audible crying...horrendous.
CWarrior. I absolutely just listened. And told her how sorry I was and well validated her. She called me names and didn’t hold back on insinuations. During all this she managed to yell at me for paying her car payment and paying her medical bill copay she didn’t pay before. (I saw the claim on the aetna account and just paid it). I didn’t take the bait. I didn’t defend myself or make a smart ass remark. I just said I’m so sorry you’re hurting. I didn’t talk about myself or say yeah well other people are hurt too or any of that. I just let her feel what she was feeling and listened.
Nothing about this changes anything. The evaluation will still happen. We still aren’t getting back together. (She made that perfectly clear) and I feel the same. I am moving forward with full custody and a PFA for D15 when the evaluation is complete. I just will pray my rear end off that it doesn’t put her over the edge.
I did tell her brother about what happened. Told him he needs to keep an eye out for her. He owes her that.
Man my head is spinning. Dreamt all night about the W. I woke up a legit 5 times. I hate these days. I hate whenever I talk to her I end up losing ground emotionally.
I’m glad on one hand I answered the phone just in case she was actually in trouble. But now there is a part of me that wishes I wouldn’t have for myself.
I’m starting to wonder if maybe emotionally I don’t want a divorce but I know it’s what’s for the best and I’m fighting myself over it internally.
J,
There’s a quote I recently came across that has changed my perspective on life and I think pertains to you. “Life will present us with people and circumstances to show us where we are not free”. You are not free of your W and are still completely attached to her. It’s gonna take some time to break the unhealthy attachment. In time you will and you will also learn to walk away from people who do not value you.
99% of the people who are on this board suffer because they are unable to accept reality. You will get through this and you will grow from it. It just takes time and lots of it.
Joseph, I think what most WAS's are going through is a mental illness of some sort. It's not something to be taken lightly. Thankfully it doesn't usually lead to suicide, but there has been at least one instance of it on these forums. I am not current on your situation, but if she still has some custody of the kids I would talk to your L about changing that first and foremost. She should not have unsupervised visitation if she's a danger.
Unfortunately because of the nature of the broken relationship between LBS and WAS, the LBS is not really in a position to help the WAS because they typically don't want ANY help of any kind from the LBS, and in fact resent it if the LBS tries to help. My suggestion after making sure the kids are protected would be to call a suicide hotline, explain the situation and see if there's any kind of anonymous assistance that could be provided to your W.
Well...if she was suicidal yesterday she’s back to being a pain in the @$$ today.
W: Do you have a min to talk about our divorce?
Me: Yeah
W: sent a screenshot of an online divorce application.
W: Would something like this be ok with you?
W: if it is can you pay for it?
I took a few mins to see what the online stuff is about. Seems somewhat legit
Me: yeah I can do that. But you’re gonna have to give me your address so I can send you the paperwork. (On a side note how ridiculous is it that I have no actual idea where she is 2 and a half months after she left)
W: Well... you’re probably gonna have send it to (Her brother and sisters in laws house) because (her friend where she’s supposedly is staying) isn’t ‘comfortable’ with me giving out her address.
W: or to my dads
Me: I’m not trying to be difficult but I’m not sending it to your dads. Hes not right in the mind and I’ll never know if you got it. And as far as your brothers, no I’m good. After you told me yesterday you made a complaint about your brother and his pot smoking because he sold your Dads bike who knows if you two will be talking by then or if he’ll even have a place to live.
W: I’m not allowed to give you (her friends) address sorry.
Me: Honestly that’s kind of ridiculous. Was this an attempt to see if I still wanted a divorce? W you know my address and you know the address I’m moving too. When you have your own place just file and we’ll go from there.
W: You’re being a child. You’re acting like you don’t want the divorce not me, I said send the papers and gave you options. Seriously.
I’m gonna be honest. Being called a child because I’m not sending legal paperwork all over the place where I’ll never be able to prove she got it annoyed me.
Me: The options you gave me are send the paper work to a literal brain damaged individual or to someone you just completely screwed over by making a complaint because he sold your dads bike. You told me yesterday you don’t really have a relationship with your brother. Those aren’t real options. I’m done talking about this. When you get your own place and you’re allowed to give out an address let me know.
W: whatever
I probably could have handled that better,I.e. just shortened that last part to I’m done talking about this. On the bright side I do feel better now.
Hi Joseph,
Me: But you’re gonna have to give me your address
Oof. You're back to telling her what to do.
W: I’m not allowed to give you (her friends) address sorry. Me: Honestly that’s kind of ridiculous.
Arguing! It's her choice whether or not to give you her address. She's said no. You're not entitled. If your attorney asked you to get her address, tell them she refused, then move onto next steps. It's very plausible whomever she's staying with--OM or friend--doesn't want the drama of you knowing their address.
Additionally, your inability to accept this boundary, would increase concerns (if I were her) that you may not accept other boundaries--e.g., later use that info for other purposes.
When you have your own place just file and we’ll go from there.
Again, telling her what to do.
W: You’re being a child. I’m gonna be honest. Being called a child ..
It's fairer to say you're acting "bossy"--like you're her boss and she's your employee.
Her: You’re acting like you don’t want the divorce not me, I said send the papers and gave you options. Seriously.
Me: The options you gave me are send the paper work to a literal brain damaged individual or to someone you just completely screwed over by making a complaint because he sold your dads bike. You told me yesterday you don’t really have a relationship with your brother. Those aren’t real options. I’m done talking about this. When you get your own place and you’re allowed to give out an address let me know.
W: whatever
I agree, your actions don't seem consistent with a goal of getting her a copy of the divorce papers. I wonder what you real motive is in pushing, pushing, pushing for her current address.
Have you been a little controlling in your M? You can see it reflected here.
Your divorce with 5 kids seems to be a little more complicated than an internet divorce. You have a lawyer, right? Let them handle it.
A little back story
I’m not willing to send legal paperwork that someone can say they didn’t get it. So I’d send it certified. I ran into this issue with trying to serve her for custody and ended up having to pay for a constable to get it to her. Still don’t know if that happened. We had agreed a while ago to send everything certified and it was her idea.
Her father does have a literal brain injury. He can’t sign for it. And I personally know he’ll go weeks without checking his mail
Her brother lives 2 Hours from her. And he is a massive pot head. And he was one of the places I tried to send custody paper work too that she “never got”. So the odds of her getting it that way are remote.
I don’t care where she lives. I know it’s in a town 30 mins east of me.
What I don’t want are the games anymore and I feel like that’s what she’s playing at.
As far as controlling in the marriage she never said a word prior. And I’ve never had anyone said
It before now. Maybe I’m coming off this way because I’m just tired of the bs anymore. I do appreciate you pointing it out though because I don’t wanna be that way
I’m not willing to send legal paperwork that someone can say they didn’t get it.
Then don't. You're not entitled to her address, and she's not entitled to you sending papers. A TON is going on in your life right now and I get this is hard. Here's another way the conversation could go down.
You: I'll mail you the paperwork tomorrow if you share your address.
Well... you’re probably gonna have send it to (Her brother and sisters in laws house) because (her friend where she’s supposedly is staying) isn’t ‘comfortable’ with me giving out her address.
W: or to my dads
You: Those don't work for me because I need proof you received them. Your residence would be easiest.
W: I’m not allowed to give you (her friends) address sorry.
You: Okay. I'll check with my attorney on alternatives.
OR
You: Can we meet at a public place Thu or Fri for 3min so you can sign for them?
OR
You: <Talks to attorney to explain her constraints and come up with good alternatives, including professional process servers. Mine guaranteed service within 48 hours>
I assume you are talking about an amicable D agreement, if so then email the documents to her for her signature first, then have her mail you a hard copy for your signature and filing. If you're both in agreement on the terms then I don't think she has to legally be served, which is the only thing you would need her (work or home) address for.
well she called me from a blocked number again. We talked for an hour and fifteen minutes. It was a very constructive and a pleasant conversation. For the most part anyway.
She said she was sorry for giving me a hard time about the address. I asked her if I came off demanding or controlling. She told me no, she understands I’m getting frustrated and my feelings are hurt. She actually admitted she did whatever she could to make me mad and make my life more difficult. I told her that it was true and I didn’t understand why there’s just so much hatred for me. I don’t understand why she’s gotta give me a hard time about everything. She told me it’s because it makes it easier for her to handle what she did to me. If she can make me a bad guy who was horrible than it’s easier for her. I asked her why she would do that to her kids. I didn’t say anything specific but how could she. She told me she hasn’t felt right for years. Watching her mother die from a disease she may have and in turn the kids may have. She couldn’t handle it. She put on a brave face but she was overwhelmed and dying on the inside. She said she knows she messed up. She said that’s why I left the kids with you. That’s why I don’t force anything because I’m still not ok. She told me the best thing she could have done for them was to leave that night because of the anger she had for D15 because she told me everything.
I circled back to this morning and asked her if she really isn’t allowed to give the address. She said she didn’t know she never asked. She said as long as I don’t know where she lives it’s easier to pretend I don’t exists. She can’t call me when she has a bad day because I wouldn’t know where to come get her. I asked her if she was being abused. She said no but he has yelled at her and it wasn’t something she was use too. And I said if he ever hits you....she cut me off and said that’s why I can’t tell you where I live. Because I know you’d save me. And like I said. I’m still not ok. Something is wrong with me. And I can’t be around the kids. That statement put tears in my eyes. I did ask if she lives with the OM she said no but he’s here all the time. I asked her if she really did tell everyone I hit and abused her. She said yes and she’s sorry. (First time she admitted to that). I said so they all hate me now. She said yeah they do. I asked if she was ever going to tell the truth. She admitted she wouldn’t know how to begin because she’d lose them all as friends.
We continued on about the divorce and I told her I don’t mind waiting 3 or 6 months but I don’t wanna live like her parents. (They lived in different states for the last 18 years and they no longer acted married). She agreed and said she doesn’t wanna live like that either.
We started talking about more light hearted stuff. I mentioned I took D8 to Walmart to get Ice cream cones and tea. And we looked at the movies and toys. She asked what time I was there. I said like from 3 to 4. She said I’m surprised you didn’t see the OM. I said I didn’t. She said are you sure? I said are you sure he was actually where he said he was? She actually said no, maybe he lied. She also told me the OM father wants him to get back with his W for their boys. I didn’t really say anything to that.
I also asked her if she really reported her brother to his job. She admitted she did and felt really bad about it.
She also told me I should get a girlfriend. I told her no I’m not interested in that. She asked why, I told her i am just getting out of a 16 plus year relationship and I am not interested in jumping into anything. She said her opinion was I could use the excitement. I told her I have enough excitement with the kids. I’m ok being alone.
We ended the conversation with her asking if we can be friends. The answer I had to give her was...freeing and yet incredibly difficult.
I said W, I can’t be friends with someone who did this to my kids. I can’t be friends with someone who lied about me the way you did. If you were my actual friend, you stop lying about me, tell the truth and face whatever comes of that. But you won’t. However if you are ever abused or hit I will be there. If you are ever feeling like you did yesterday I will be there. But no you can’t call me and ask me how my day was. She said she understood. And asked me to say hi to the kids.
Sorry if this was jumbled. I actually made a left hand turn where I shouldn’t have and got pulled over in the middle of the conversation. (Got off with a warning though!)
I’m once again emotional mush. And that’s ok. But I can’t stop thinking of Sandis rules right now. Believe nothing they say and only half of what they do. It was a pleasant conversation but just writing it out...seems full of manipulation.
I will admit I think she probably told the truth about her anger and the kids and there’s something not right with her. But who knows. But how can someone ask if they can be friends with you after admitting they go out of your way to make your life more difficult? After admitting there’s something wrong with them and they can’t be around the kids but we are supposed to be friends? You won’t admit to our mutual friends the horrible things you said about me was a lie, but yeah let’s be friends. No, no I don’t think so. I think she’s realizing the grass isn’t greener on the other side. But heck what do I know. I’ve been wrong about so much up to this point. Well even writing this out was exhausting.
J,
That’s was tough to read. She’s doesn’t respect you and likes manipulating you. I feel for you and your children.
You ain’t kidding LH. Seems to be her favorite game anymore. But I have my part in it too. Nothing made me stay on the phone other than me. She may be manipulating me, but I am allowing it. And I’m finally starting to realize it. I have to make better decisions. End phone conversations when I realize it’s her. Don’t respond to texts. Move the heck on and freaking stop allowing it. It’s not all her fault. It’s mine too for continuing to allow it.
J, put all your available effort into NC.
I think you really really need it. A minimum startpoint is a week.
Mumin. Yeah I do man. Yes I do. I need more than a week. And I also need not put conditions on it like I did. If she gets hit that’s what the police are for. If she’s suicidal there’s hotlines and hospitals for that.
Being stuck in the freaking house is killing me too. I can’t wait move. But even that got held up by COVID. Underwriting is taking 2 weeks!
Is the disease you mention happen to be Huntington’s disease?
Is the disease you mention happen to be Huntington’s disease?
Yep. It’s a freaking nightmare to watch. When I met her mother she had a full time job. By the end...I wouldn’t wish that on anyone.
Ginger are you in the health care field or have experience with it? I’ve never ran into anyone who’s ever heard of it. I have to describe it as a mixture of Alzheimer’s and Parkinson’s. MIL had chorea too
Yes, I am a nurse and I have seen it my career.
I will be honest, I find it to be one of the worst neurological diseases along with ALS. It’s females who get it and it’s genetic. You can find out you are going to get it without symptoms through genetic testing.
You could describe it as a cross between severe Parkinson’s and Alzheimer’s especially at the end.
There are not many reasons in this world why a woman would do to their kids what she has done . This might actually be one of them. I am in no way excusing her behavior . But I could almost imagine somewhere inside she thinks She is doing all of you a favor. So she doesn’t have to be your burden. So the kids don’t have to see it. So you don’t have to care of her. She probably thinks that maybe if she pushes you all away now, it won’t hurt as much when she is gone . Often times the parent feels guilt if they could have possibly passed this down to their daughter
But make sure you hear this to. You can let her manipulate you or the kids. You can’t try to fix this for her either. Don’t tell her what I told you either. She will probably just deny it. She needs to realize this on her own. Just be the lighthouse.
But remember, no matter where this is all coming from , you can’t let her hurt your kids either anymore. You have a dry yo protect them, just as she might think she is by sabotaging everything .
My heart truly goes out to all of you.
I would honestly hope she doesn’t feel that way. That she would be a burden. That would be god awful but I guess it’s possible. She was trying to figure out how many more car payments she had on the phone and I could tell she was straining and I told her with the figures she provided me. She said thanks. Damn Huntington’s kicking in. She’s known about genetic testing for years. She just wouldn’t get it done. She said she was afraid if she found out she would give up.
Thing is she’s only 33. We had so many good years left. I always told her I would never abandon her. Heck, I work for the Railroad. My retirement is absolutely rock solid. I’ve been there since I was 23. I can go early at 54 or have a full retirement at 60. At 54 she’s either 50 or 51 and at 60 she’s either 56 or 57. I told her I was prepared for what was coming if she had it and I would take care of her and make sure she passed away on her terms in her own bed. I meant it. It wasn’t hollow. It wasn’t someone talking who didn’t know what was coming. I knew. I watched. I saw. I was prepared. I told her countless times when I said in sickness and in health I meant both. Not just the good times.
And truthfully I’d rather go through her having Huntington’s than this. If shes afraid of being a burden than she missed the mark, because this is a nightmare I wasn’t prepared for.
I will protect my children. I did it this evening. After dinner I heard D8 talking on her phone. No one calls that kids phone unless it’s FaceTime. I knew who it was. I asked her who she was talking too. She said mommy. I said you aren’t allowed to talk to mommy unless daddy is in the room honey and you know that. (And yes I made that rule and yes I expect D8 to adhere to it because of the stuff that came out of her mouth next) What is mommy saying to you? Mommy asked if she could come to our first dinner when we move in the new house and she wanted me to ask you. I said oh did she? And was it supposed to be a secret that mommy asked you to ask Daddy? My little 8 years old face became so sad. I said honey don’t you worry. You didn’t do anything wrong. I love you so much. Just next time mommy calls you can answer but you come get daddy. You promise? She said yes. I said I love you baby. Can you say goodbye to mommy now and tell her daddy needs to talk to her. She finished up. Said goodbye. I took the phone told the W to hold
on a minute. Took D8 to S17 room and told him to watch her for a second. Got back on the phone and said if you ever pull a stunt like that again on my daughter you will not talk to her. You will not manipulate my child into doing your dirty work. You will not give my child false hope that me and you are ok or will be or things will go back to normal. And that kind of stuff does it. Why wouldn’t you ask me yourself? She said because I knew you’d say yes to D8. I told Her I was done and hung up.
We talked for an hour and fifteen minutes.
That's about an hour and fourteen minutes too long. You should ONLY be talking to her about critical items such as child visitation. The rest is just her controlling and manipulating you.
She actually admitted she did whatever she could to make me mad and make my life more difficult.
And that is going to continue for quite some time. DETACH.
I asked her why she would do that to her kids.
You can't guilt her into snapping out of this. She's on her own path, all you can do is stay out of the way.
I asked her if she was being abused. She said no but he has yelled at her and it wasn’t something she was use too. And I said if he ever hits you....she cut me off and said that’s why I can’t tell you where I live. Because I know you’d save me.
Read this older post from Zeus on his attempt to ride in like a knight on a white steed to save his damsel:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/foru...t&Number=2772942&nt=4&page=1Your W is being very frank with you. She does not want your help, assistance, rescuing, etc. in any way shape or form. You have got to quit trying to be there for her and be her shoulder to cry on and such. It's not helping your sitch and in fact is just slowing down her journey to the bottom.
We started talking about more light hearted stuff. I mentioned I took D8 to Walmart to get Ice cream cones and tea. And we looked at the movies and toys. She asked what time I was there. I said like from 3 to 4. She said I’m surprised you didn’t see the OM. I said I didn’t. She said are you sure? I said are you sure he was actually where he said he was? She actually said no, maybe he lied. She also told me the OM father wants him to get back with his W for their boys. I didn’t really say anything to that.
First, stop all the idle chit-chat with her. Second, ANY mention of OM should be a full stop end to the conversation. Don't have friendly convos with her about OM, that implies your acceptance and even approval.
She also told me I should get a girlfriend. I told her no I’m not interested in that. She asked why, I told her i am just getting out of a 16 plus year relationship and I am not interested in jumping into anything. She said her opinion was I could use the excitement. I told her I have enough excitement with the kids. I’m ok being alone.
They all say that. It's just a temp check to see if you are still Plan B. If she ever brings it up again just say you will get to that when the time is right and leave it at that.
We ended the conversation with her asking if we can be friends. The answer I had to give her was...freeing and yet incredibly difficult.
I said W, I can’t be friends with someone who did this to my kids. I can’t be friends with someone who lied about me the way you did. If you were my actual friend, you stop lying about me, tell the truth and face whatever comes of that. But you won’t. However if you are ever abused or hit I will be there. If you are ever feeling like you did yesterday I will be there. But no you can’t call me and ask me how my day was. She said she understood. And asked me to say hi to the kids.
You know what a much, much better response would have been? Here it is:
"No."
Don't use a zillion words when one works perfectly fine.
I will protect my children. I did it this evening. After dinner I heard D8 talking on her phone. No one calls that kids phone unless it’s FaceTime. I knew who it was. I asked her who she was talking too. She said mommy. I said you aren’t allowed to talk to mommy unless daddy is in the room honey and you know that. (And yes I made that rule and yes I expect D8 to adhere to it because of the stuff that came out of her mouth next) What is mommy saying to you? Mommy asked if she could come to our first dinner when we move in the new house and she wanted me to ask you. I said oh did she? And was it supposed to be a secret that mommy asked you to ask Daddy? My little 8 years old face became so sad. I said honey don’t you worry. You didn’t do anything wrong. I love you so much. Just next time mommy calls you can answer but you come get daddy. You promise? She said yes. I said I love you baby. Can you say goodbye to mommy now and tell her daddy needs to talk to her. She finished up. Said goodbye. I took the phone told the W to hold
on a minute. Took D8 to S17 room and told him to watch her for a second. Got back on the phone and said if you ever pull a stunt like that again on my daughter you will not talk to her. You will not manipulate my child into doing your dirty work. You will not give my child false hope that me and you are ok or will be or things will go back to normal. And that kind of stuff does it. Why wouldn’t you ask me yourself? She said because I knew you’d say yes to D8. I told Her I was done and hung up.
Try to insulate D from this, don't let her get stuck in the middle. If W is not allowed to talk to D without you being there then block W from D's phone so that W has to call you to talk to D. Just be very careful here, are you doing this on the advice of your L? If not then you need to talk to him/ her about it, and if you don't have one then get one immediately. What you're doing could be construed as threats and attempts to block W from access to her children. If she's a potential danger to them then by all means you should, but just make sure you're doing so within the boundaries of the law.
Also you're implying you'll go over and get in a fight with OM if he strikes W. That's a very good way to land yourself in jail with an assault charge, and potentially lose all your parental rights. And guess what, W will be right there by OM's side laughing at your expense. If she EVER calls you and says he struck her, then tell her to call the police. Do not go over there, do not call the police yourself (unless she asks you to because she's physically unable). STAY OUT OF IT. She's going to do things you dislike or even hate. Those are HER CHOICES and she's got to make them and live out the ramifications.
Hey AS
Thank you for taking the time to quote and point out where I went wrong. I know I am way to chatty with her. It calms me to talk to her for some reason still. And I know it’s bad for me. I’m (slowly) accepting it. I know things will never be the same, but it use to make my heart happy to hear her voice. Which is exactly why I need to detach and actually go NC period. After last night, things changed inside me
I actually read the Zeus story last night. It hit home trust me.
My lawyer has advised me and what I can and can’t do with the kids. And the state is investigating her for abused. D15 has her evaluation this Monday. I’m ok there.
And no I’m not insinuating I’d fight the OM. Well at least not trying too. What I was trying to say, and she did know it, was I’d pick her up and bring her here so she was safe. And trust me I know that’s no better. I can’t let her poor choices become my problem.
Last night after she did that to my sweet little girl..it lit a fire under my @$$. My older 4 are done with her. They don’t let her affect them. They’re happier and more out going and doing really well. I’m very impressed with them. However my 8 year old just started to accept what her mom did to her siblings. And now my W threw her through a loop. I spent an hour last night letting her sit in my lap and having to explain that mommy isn’t coming back again. She just kept crying but said but mommy wants to come have dinner with me. And maybe she’ll see how good of a family we are and she’ll stay. Smh. I just hugged her and hugged her. But on the inside I was seething.
What she did to S17 and D15 is heinous. But they’re working thru it would their counseling and getting better and better. The changes I’ve seen in them....but to my D8...no. Idk, but the F her instinct kicked in. I’m absolutely disgusted with her as a human for doing that to my babygirl. MY babygirl. She set her back to square 1 and that’s exactly what she intended to do.
Idk what the heck is wrong with her, if it is guilt, Huntington’s, remorse or just flat out evil, but no she won’t be doing that to my baby girl again regardless of what she wants say or does.
J,
Unfortunately you most likely are never get the answer as to why. You owe it as a father to protect your children. She is going to test you so be prepared for that to happen.
Stay strong man!
I know I am way to chatty with her. It calms me to talk to her for some reason still. And I know it’s bad for me. I’m (slowly) accepting it. I know things will never be the same, but it use to make my heart happy to hear her voice. Which is exactly why I need to detach and actually go NC period.
I hear you, I had those same feelings after BD. Every once in a while I would see a glimmer of the loving, caring person my W had once been and I would try to grab onto that and pull that person back out to replace this stranger she had become. But over time the old version of her lessened until she completely disappeared. It wasn't until years after D that she started talking, looking and acting like her old self again. It's been almost 9 years now and she never did "go back to normal" although I'd say she is maybe halfway there. This is a weird thing to go through for sure. Just when you think you know someone!
My lawyer has advised me and what I can and can’t do with the kids. And the state is investigating her for abused. D15 has her evaluation this Monday. I’m ok there.
Great, that's perfect! Sorry for not being up on your sitch, I've been super busy lately and kind of crash into threads here and there
Glad to hear you've got it covered!
And no I’m not insinuating I’d fight the OM. Well at least not trying too. What I was trying to say, and she did know it, was I’d pick her up and bring her here so she was safe. And trust me I know that’s no better. I can’t let her poor choices become my problem.
Exactly. It's tough to let go, no question about it. But you have to for your sake and for the kids. I had a step-sister that was addicted to heroin. Kept skipping school, stealing stuff from my dad's house to fund her drug use, stole her grandmother's wedding rings, stole her mom's car and totaled it (and put the keys back like nothing had happened). They did all kinds of intervention counseling and such with her. Nothing worked. Finally the counselor flat-out told them they needed to kick her out of the house, that she was beyond help. Why? Because she didn't WANT help. The counselor said all she would do is drag them down with her. Here's the thing, if your W knows you'll ride in to rescue her from her bad decisions, then you are unwittingly ENABLING her bad decisions. She knows she never has to pay the price if you step in to intervene, right? She needs to pay for her own bad decisions. She's got to feel that before she'll hit bottom and hopefully rebuild herself.
LH
I got this. I truly do. This forum has been a god send. Honestly if it wasn’t for you guys I would have been to blinded to see what she was doing. I would have thought oh thank god she’s seeing the light and starting to treat my kids better and she’ll be back soon. And maybe she would be if I allowed it. I have no idea. But it won’t be real, I’d be right back here in a month or 2. Maybe a year. But I’d be right back here. And I’d lose my kids on top of it if I did that. I couldn’t say she’s a danger to them because I let her back. I would lose even more than I have.
Because of this forum I know what real remorse is. What a real reconciliation looks like. And it’s absolutely nothing like this.
Fact is, I have a full time job, a roof over me and my kids heads. Food in me and my children’s belly’s. And clothes on our backs. I have my kids full time. And here I am crying and losing my $hit because of someone who doesn’t love really any of us and left. I’m a lucky lucky man. I took my many blessings for granted. Things could be a heck of a lot worse. I want my self respect back. Because she took it multiple times. I want my confidence back because she stole that too. And I want my quite cockiness back because she’s made me meek. And I allowed all of it over a period of time. I’m honestly disgusted with myself for allowing myself and my children to be trampled on, manipulated and general treated like possession and toys she decided she was done playing with.
Never ever again. I’m back and I’m not going anywhere ever again.
AS
You don’t have to ever apologize for not being completely up to date. My sitch has been all over the place and I always appreciate any advise I can get. There’s always something to take from someone else’s experiences
And yes, she will be paying for her own decisions from here on out without my intervention
Welp already had my first test. Got a text from the W
W: I need freak out on you about child clearances
Me:
W: I just got an email, saying that I was investigated in October 2019. And that’s still pending investigation and there’s another one pending investigation. What the ****? Why is there two?
Me:
W: sends a screen shot of the report she ordered on her self
Me:
W: This is absolutely ridiculous
W: What is that lady’s number? I’ve had enough now.
(Now I know she’s talked to this lady so there is no way she doesn’t know it...so....
Me:
I did call the lady to find out what the October one was. It was because that was the last time D15 said she hit her. 2 open cases for physical abuse and one for extreme mental injury. The physical abuse one was closed because there wasn’t any proof.
I felt no urge to respond. I felt no urge to help her. I felt nothing. Well I’m about to watch a movie and start tacos.
Amazing strength!!!! Way to go JOE!!!
I need some of that!!!!!
Pat yourself on the back and have an extra taco.
Never ever again. I’m back and I’m not going anywhere ever again.
I am so proud of you! You know she'll continue trying to manipulate, threaten, test, etc., until she's convinced it doesn't work with you. The way you didn't say a word to her text rage, is
perfect. This is a new day, a new determination, a new man, and a terrific daddy!
Wow--great job, Joe! None of those required a reply and you didn't reply. Not easy but good stuff.
Welp already had my first test. Got a text from the W
W: I need freak out on you about child clearances
Me:
W: I just got an email, saying that I was investigated in October 2019. And that’s still pending investigation and there’s another one pending investigation. What the ****? Why is there two?
Me:
W: sends a screen shot of the report she ordered on her self
Me:
W: This is absolutely ridiculous
W: What is that lady’s number? I’ve had enough now.
(Now I know she’s talked to this lady so there is no way she doesn’t know it...so....
Me:
I did call the lady to find out what the October one was. It was because that was the last time D15 said she hit her. 2 open cases for physical abuse and one for extreme mental injury. The physical abuse one was closed because there wasn’t any proof.
I felt no urge to respond. I felt no urge to help her. I felt nothing. Well I’m about to watch a movie and start tacos.
All LBSs need to see this.This is great progress and strength of will to not respond.
Joseph well done. This is what needs to happen. Once you are fired as someone's spouse you have to stop acting like their spouse. WASs will take and take and take as long as the LBS gives and gives and gives. You cannot nice them back, and LBSs need to understand that. I see so many that think they can.
Well done!
Thanks for the support everyone. Seriously it means everything. I realized over the last few days me being there just made me her personal doormat. And honestly how can my kids respect me if I don’t respect myself. And “nicing” her back is just my own brand of manipulation and I don’t wanna be that way either.
On another note, after being harder to find “new anyway” than a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow my copy of the divorce remedy came today. I’m gonna read it today. See what’s in there. I’m sure there plenty in there that will help me grow and be a better person and partner.
On another note, my kids are still sleeping. The peaceful looks on their faces my heart melts. I love them to pieces. I’m so lucky to have them.
Well unfortunately the loop my W put D8 through never stopped. I had to take D8 phone this morning and gave her my iPad to FaceTime with friends on. It’ll be under my ID. My D8 got up and texted her mom this morning. My W has called the kids the past 2 nights at or after 11pm. Way to late. No one answered. Anyway
D8: why do you call so late
W: I’m sorry I fell asleep on the couch watching a movie
D8: talking to you makes me sad
W: I’m sorry honey
D8: Are we ever going to be a family
W: We are a family just not like what we used to be. Like me and Daddy aren’t going to be married anymore but that doesn’t make us any less family
D8:yes it does
W: how
D8: because you make me cry and no one sees you
W: I would like to see you guys a lot. But I ask and no one wants to see me
W: how do I make you cry?
D8:I cry because you hurt me
W:how did I hurt you?
D8: you left
W: well I’m sorry
D8: can you stop calling me at night
W: we both know I’m not gonna stop calling you. I would really like it if you answered the phone.
D8: no I won’t and I’m going to block you so I stop being sad
W: D8 stop. That’s not nice and I haven’t done anything
D8: you left me
W:I’m sorry you feel like I left you, but D8 try to understand it didn’t have to do with you why I left. I’m sorry that you don’t fully understand now but maybe when you’re older you’ll understand.
D8: you broke our family. I’m blocking you now bye
Smh the crap never stops I swear. Anyway like I said D8 can’t have her phone for now. These things can’t continue to happen. My W did send me a screenshot of the conversation within 30 seconds of being blocked. And than added “we are back on the drama train”
I did respond, I know I could have gone NC here, but well, honestly imo this required a response. And my atty told me to respond because of D8 saying she blocked her. It was a little wordy by not bad compared to my usual standard.
Me: I can’t fix what you broke. It’s not my job anymore. She feels like you broke her family because of another man. And she feels abandoned by her mother. And I can’t make that better.
W: Well thanks for all your help. This is exactly why I don’t come tell you anything. So don’t ask me why I don’t tell you anymore.
I didn’t respond to that. I actually haven’t asked in a while why she doesn’t tell me when the kids ignore her. So I honestly don’t know where that response came from. But oh well. I slept 2 hours last night (work related things).
Next time I’m gonna sleep longer before I respond. Probably could have done with a simple...I can’t or won’t fix what you broke. Or something like ok good luck? Idk either way still feeling good emotionally and mentally. Well for myself anyway. I do feel bad for my littlest lady. But all I can do is make sure she knows daddy is here and never going anywhere.
Just as note, my w has asked the see the kids twice in 3 weeks. And she asked them, not me. So...I’m not sure how that would have worked out when I wouldn’t have known. (I mean my kids obviously told me she asked and they didn’t want too, but still)
hmmmmm... I don't think her screen shot deserved a response.
And, the comment about not coming to you anymore... Uhmmm... hello, she JUST DID.
Your L should be able to set some direct boundaries about when she is allowed to call AND well 11pm is not going to be that time. Typically its like Tues/Thurs 6-8pm etc.
You need to get some stuff in writing and you need to cut her off. You took ONE huge step the other day and remember how good that felt???
Don't beat yourself up... its takes some serious time to remove yourself from the crazy train. :-)
PEACE and LOVE!!!
Hey KC. I thought it might just because of the on going custody dispute. And my ATTY wanted me to respond. So I did. I don’t wanna go against my lawyers advice.
I’m looking for more of how could I have said it better.
As far as custody we haven’t even been to mediation yet. So really all I can do is control if my kids respond unfortunately.
I’m ok with having to respond. I didn’t do it to have a conversation or be Superman. I did it so she can’t say she’s trying and I’m ignoring her or making it hard for her to have a relationship with the kids. Though she doesn’t deserve one at all, I have to do things the legal way. And right now the W wants to leave it up to the kids to talk to her or see her and they don’t want too outside of D8 so it’s manageable. I just can’t wait to get everything legally done.
I don't think her screen shot deserved a response.
Yes, I agree!
my ATTY wanted me to respond. So I did. I don’t wanna go against my lawyers advice.
Edit: Legal advice takes precedence over relationship advice.
boundaries about when she is allowed to call
When his ex-wife chooses to call is mostly outside Joseph's control. Where he can effectively set boundaries, is on when he and his kids see and respond to her calls.
I’m looking for more of how could I have said it better.
When your attorney recommended you respond, what guidance did they give you on what to say?
All the atty said was don’t write a paragraph. Don’t admit that you told her to do it if you did. (I didn’t). Basically she didn’t say much. My atty is at the point where she hates my W and can’t understand what my W doesn’t understand about the fact she cheated and walked other people have feelings.
Basically at this juncture all my atty says is respond and than reassures me that we’re gonna win full custody and no visitation unless it supervised by me. My wife’s only possible defense is I’m making the kids says these things or filling their head up with garbage. My atty loves to rant about what kind of mother.....and goes off. She’s been an atty for 25 years and told me she’s never seen a mother abuse their kids abandon them and than act like she’s the victim. She just wants to get to mediation.
Well it was 85 degrees today and my brother opened his pool 2 weeks ago. So we went swimming. I put up pictures of everyone having fun on social media. 30 mins later I get text messaged the kids look like they’re having fun. She’s not on my friends list. I’m private and there is no mutual friends that I know of. Really freaked me out. I didn’t respond obviously. I’m gonna have to delete my account I think.
I also talked to my atty and told her I didn’t want to respond anymore because I have every time this pops up and I think I’ve made it clear this isn’t my decision but I’m done stepping in. She said that was fine now. So I’m officially at the point that there is absolutely no reason to contact her. I actually feel relieved.
I got home from my brothers house around 9pm this evening. When I arrived I saw something I used to see everyday. Something I hadn’t seen since March 6th. My STBXW van in my driveway.
This honestly made me nervous and didn’t know what the heck was going on. I pulled into the driveway and told the kids to go immediately into the house. She got out and asked to talk. I was absolutely baffled on what to do or say. She said she was sorry for showing up, but it wasn’t fair that I wasn’t taking charge and unblocking her from the kids phones. She said she texted and called all of them around 5pm to ask about having a picnic. And than she asked if she could come in. I told her no. But I was completely speechless besides that. She was dressed up to the 9s. God she looked absolutely beautiful. Make up done, hair the way i love and a simple yet stunning sundress. She walked over to me and smiled. That smart @$$ smirk that I love. She put her forehead against mine. I don’t know why but I was frozen. Than she did exactly what I needed her to do. She asked me very quietly if I would let her talk to D15 about the evaluation.
I told her to leave immediately. I went into the house and locked the door. I didn’t look back.
I am so thrown off. I need a good nights sleep
Wow, Joe. Crazy town! Great job telling her no and going inside.
It definitely was crazy. And I don’t want to give anyone the wrong impression, kind of just sharing/venting, but she absolutely got to me last night. I didn’t sleep well and I couldn’t stop dreaming of her. And I am so disappointed in myself for it. And I’m disappointed in myself that I didn’t immediately tell her to leave. I was so taken back by her looks and initial kindness....honesty for a minute I thought she was going to kiss me and I don’t think I would have stopped her.
I think I may take the kids somewhere for the weekend. That was a lot
J,
You have to take it easy and show compassion for yourself. You had been together for a really long time and it’s going to be a really long time before you truly detach.
I think you did great!
Wow... that certainly would have been hard for anyone to resist.
I'm very sorry it wasn't genuine.
But - gooooo Joe!!!! You did it. You walked away with your pride intact and let her know how strong you are.
I don’t feel like I accomplished anything. Actually quite depressed today.
This morning I checked the automated system for her car payment. (And it’s still in both of our names). Anyway I’m being a tad paranoid because under writing for the house has been going on for now 16 days. So I guess since I didn’t just pay it the first time I checked at the beginning I must have waited til she was out of her grace period, because she now had a small late fee. Well I went ahead and paid the late fee because it still said May 1st as a due date. She must have gotten an email about it or something because i got a text that was just rude.
W: It was already freaking set up. Would you stop. It’s not freaking late. It’s within the damn 30 days.
Seriously got that about 5 mins after I paid it.
I didn’t respond but I seriously wanted too. I wanted to respond with the middle finger emoji. It’s like she doesn’t get it. If you have a late payment it’s gonna hose me out of the house and it’s gonna cost her the ability to get her own place. (If she actually doesn’t have one).
Idk. I feel like I’m 37 it’s in my name too, I don’t need your permission to pay the bill. Funny how she doesn’t seem to want to pay the mortgage or the car insurance or any other bill. Nope that’s all me. But apparently the van is sacred ground. Smh.
I’m just tired. Oh so very tired of the manipulation and so very tired of the hot and cold. The back and forth. The kindness and then the hate. And it’s a daily change almost. I think I’m gonna end up having to be like the kids and block her myself. I’m actually starting to wonder if she’s trying to drive me crazy. But there isn’t really anything to talk about. I’ve figured out how to pay the bills that I need too. I can afford everything without her help or child support. And there’s nothing left to discuss my lawyer can’t handle for me.
She was dressed up to the 9s. God she looked absolutely beautiful. Make up done, hair the way i love and a simple yet stunning sundress. She walked over to me and smiled. That smart @$$ smirk that I love. She put her forehead against mine.
OMG! Men are just too easy!............or so she thought. She knew exactly what she was doing! It was the main ingredient to her plan.
I told her to leave immediately. I went into the house and locked the door. I didn’t look back.
Good for you for not succumbing to her wicked trap.
Joseph, she is going to use every trick in the book, so just expect it. If she does anything
suddenly, throw your guard up. A change in her looks, emotions, temperament, attitude, personality.......and especially her interaction with you, should be a strong warning you about to be played. Be doubled forewarned when she starts her little sexy flirtatiousness with you. It's not a spell, Joseph. Any woman is capable of doing the same thing. So, run for the hills! Run for your life!
So, run for the hills! Run for your life!
I see what you did there.
JS, you have your head on better than many at the stage you're in. Keep it up.
Been a few days since I posted. Figured I’d give myself a few days to recover and relax from the her showing up at the house and leaving me feeling like an idiot for not immediately seeing what she was up too. Had some developments since I last posted.
D15 evaluation was today. I’m proud of that girl. She didn’t sleep well at all. We needed to leave at 9am. I woke her up at 835am and she was dressed ready and out the door before 9am. Not to shabby for a 15 yr old. I wasn’t in the room when she talked and she’s not ready to go thru everything again. But just from the 5 min convo I had with him i truly believe he’s going to be strongly in the she was abused category.
So the real news, yesterday at the grocery store I was with my kids getting food for the week. We saw the friend my W was supposably living with. She knew my W before me, but she was always very kind to me before and my kids called her aunt ****. (Leaving her name out for obvious reasons). Well my guard was obviously up because all I’ve heard is how this woman won’t let my W do anything without her and doesn’t want my W to ever leave. So I assumed my W was there somewhere in the store. How very very foolish of me. Anyway, she walks over to me and has a stern look on her face. She says she wants to say hello to the kids. To which S17 responds yeah well no one wants to say hi to you. Tell ******** (he doesn’t call my W Mom anymore. Just by her first name) wherever she is if she sees us to keep walking. I said S17, we are better than that. We won’t stoop to that kind of level. Her friend said your mom isn’t with me why would you think she is? And she said S17, don’t be like that, I didn’t do anything besides get my sister (they always called themselves sisters) away from an abusive situation. D15 immediately, ****, I don’t care what my mother told you, but my father never touched her. He never raised his voice and he didn’t do anything besides keep his family together while she broke his heart. My W friend says that’s not at all the story i was told. I cut in and said you’ve known me for years, why would you be concerned to let me have your address? And what have I ever done to make you think I was that type of guy. (Note, I was never actually at her house, she was always at ours and when the W did go over it was when I worked) I’m not going to do anything besides serve the W divorce papers. She gets a very puzzled look on her face and says, why would you serve her at my place? Why not at hers? I said we need to have an honest talk. I ask her if she’s willing to come to the park next door to the store and sit down with me for 30 mins. She agrees. So at the park the kids play on the baseball field. I said I don’t want to come between you and my W but let me show you what I’ve been told via text. I show her how my W has been claiming to still live with her. I show her my W says she didn’t want me to have her address. I show her how she denies she ever told anyone I hit her until very recent and admitted it was a lie. I show her how on my D8 birthday when she was at the friends house I had offered to let D8 spend the night and how the friend said no. I showed her the letters that my kids wrote about the abuse they faced. I told her about D15 evaluation. I told her everything. By the end of the conversation she actually was crying and gave me a hug and apologized profusely. She asked if she could hug the kids while crying her eyes out. They all gave her a big hug and told her it was ok.
So there’s not much she can’t tell me that I already don’t know except my W does live with the OM. Has for a while and is about 5 freaking minutes from me. She said they fight a lot and the OM is barely ever home. She says the OM parents don’t particularly like her and want the OM to go back to his W for the benefit of the children. And apparently his children beg him to come home all the time. But my W calls him the love of her life. She continues to apologize for everything and even calls her fiancé and tells him everything. He’s beyond mad at this news. She promises she going to set the record straight with everyone and let them know what my W is and what she’s done. I did tell her I don’t believe my W has always been this way, but while her mom was dying something happened. She said she doesn’t care. There’s no excuse to do that to your kids, leave them and barely try to talk to them. She tells me to go for full custody immediately (I do NOT tell her I already have done so).
She calls me today and wants to bring food over for dinner. I agree. When she arrives she comes with 4 of what I thought where close friends. You can tell they’re all nervous. I open the door and give the 1st friend a hug. She says they all know the truth. I said come on in. Let’s go eat in the back yard at the picnic table. They all wanna apologize and honestly I’ve had enough emotions for a lifetime so I said to them no apology needed I appreciate you all coming and attempting to right a wrong. We had a very pleasant dinner and great conversation. I had a really good time actually.
To be continued
WOW....
You are being a rock Joe!!!
Wow, Joseph!
Telling friends and family that a spouse is cheating reduces your chances of reconciliation, but your case is unique, because she's painted you as an abuser and you can prove she's lying. I'm so happy you vindicated yourself to your circle of shared friends. I'm also glad your D was brave enough to speak up. Rock on.
Alright sorry, D8 wanted to make cookies with D15 and apparently we were out of sugar. Problem has been solved! Lol
Anyway, as we are all talking and having a good time my phone starts going off. Text after text. Of course it’s the W. She is absolutely verbally going after me. Telling me I ruined her life. They are her friends and I shouldn’t have ever talked to them. Friend 1 shows me what she texted my W. It actually wasn’t horrible. It just said I know the truth. Your H knows where you live now and i really hope he files for divorce and keeps those kids away from you until you get the help you need. You don’t deserve any of them. And until you do get help you are not welcome in my life either. The other friends said exactly the same thing. It was like a text message intervention. Only way to describe it. Anyway, my W admits she drove by the house and saw friend 1s car and accuses me of having an affair with her. Her friend did decide to text her no matter what you say or do it’s not going to change the reality of the situation. And **** (her fiancé) is well aware of where I am. I don’t have to lie about my life and what I do. Again she says please don’t contact her or her family or talk about her or her family until she gets the help she desperately needs. And she does offer to help her if she’s serious about getting help.
I don’t hear from her for about an hour. Everyone leaves and promises to keep in touch and asks if they can see the kids soon again. Than the W texts me again. And than I get a call from a blocked number. I don’t answer this time. But I do look at the texts. Basically she’s begging for forgiveness and knows what she did was messed up. She wants to come home and try to fix our marriage. She loves me and over the last couple of months all she could think about was me. And please please let’s work this out.
I’ll be honest. I know it’s not real. I know every word she just said is complete non sense. But good lord have I wanted to hear them. But again that’s the point. She knows what i want to hear. I didn’t respond but I’m very tempted too. I really wanna say if you are serious and want to work on things you know my conditions. I want the complete truth. We stay separated for a year. You go to IC and anger management and than we start a religious based MCing. But again I know none of what she just said is real.
I’m staying the course. Taking care of myself. Taking care of my kids and rebuilding my life as a single father of 5 and kicking @$$ at it too!
Idk what the future holds. No one does, but i do know I have a say in it. And I choose happiness. I choose myself. I choose my kids. I decide what the next chapter looks like. I’m writing my own book. I’m not allowing someone else to have the pen anymore. Maybe one day I’ll meet someone who’s worth letting them share chapters, but they’ll never control the book again.
Amazing Joe.... stay the course.
Maybe she does hit rock bottom.... good to know that you have figured your must haves.
Hugs to you and all those kids!
Thanks KC. I’ll admit I had things backwards for far to long. I was a husband first and a father second. Completely my mistake and one I’ll never make again. I’m a father first and a person second. I deserve to be loved unconditionally. I deserve to be treated the way I treat people. With kindness and compassion. My kids deserve a good role model. My son deserves to have a man he can look up to and be proud of. My daughters need to know their dad will never crumble, don’t accept abuse and you can make it on your own. And that’s exactly what they’ll get.
CW, I appreciate the back up. I know my sitch is a little different and if I’ve learned anything it’s never take anything for granted and never say never. But if my W and I were ever able to get back together...well it’d have to take something i genuinely can’t imagine. It’d have to take her becoming the woman I knew for 10 plus years before this started. And she will never be the same. And neither will I. But if by some divine intervention that does happen...well you guys will be the first to know lol.
Wow Joesph, I haven’t read your thread before but this is so inspiring! You sound in such a good headspace right now, and your ability to parent your children so effectively through all of this is nothing short of admirable. I will keep following, and I so hope things work out the way you want and deserve!
You´ve got your RESPECT back. A first step.
Good for you J! Keep walking your road.
(((J)))
Thanks Neffer. I do have my self respect back. Amazing how long it truly was gone. I’m not gonna pretend like it doesn’t hurt. It does. I do still miss what we HAD. That’s the key word. Had. I do not miss what we have. Ive accepted this is my life. I’ve accepted though I’m not perfect, no one is, I didn’t deserve what her plan was. And that was to take my kids in the middle of the night on my birthday. I still can’t wrap my head around that one. But whatever. I believe god intervened on me and my children’s behalf. We reap what we sow. My W blazed her own path. Since she’s left she’s seen our 5 kids together once on Easter. That was the last time she saw 4 of them. She hasn’t spoken to 3 of them since than either. D15 she talked to but that was just so D15 could talk to her about the abuse. That was the day my W in text admitted she hit D15 “but only when she was in trouble” and that was the day D15 found her strength to go through with the evaluation. She’s obviously talked to D8 since. She’s been fired from the career she loved and genuinely was awesome at. She’s absolutely sowing what she reaped.
I’m good with where my life is, well where it’s going anyway. I’ve decided I can either wallow in my own pit of despair or I can climb out of it and live. We only get one life to live. Why spend it being flat out miserable.
As I said last night. Idk what the future holds. Technically neither one of us has filed for divorce which I still find amazing considering the circumstances. But we haven’t. I wanted to a few days ago or a week ago whatever it’s been. But I found more inner peace in forgetting about it for now and focusing on myself and my kids and getting custody. She didn’t want to give me the address to start the process so I’ve accepted that for now and moved onto different aspects that need to be focused on. I can’t take on everything at once and by myself. I don’t want to be overwhelmed anymore. And though I do now have her address, i just don’t care enough to move on it as of now. I’m not holding onto that thought like we still may get back together like I was and for me that’s what’s important. How I feel. And as long as my feelings and thoughts aren’t self destructive Im ok with it
But I do look at the texts. Basically she’s begging for forgiveness and knows what she did was messed up. She wants to come home and try to fix our marriage. She loves me and over the last couple of months all she could think about was me. And please please let’s work this out.
I’ll be honest. I know it’s not real. I know every word she just said is complete non sense. But good lord have I wanted to hear them. But again that’s the point. She knows what i want to hear. I didn’t respond but I’m very tempted too. I really wanna say if you are serious and want to work on things you know my conditions. I want the complete truth. We stay separated for a year. You go to IC and anger management and than we start a religious based MCing. But again I know none of what she just said is real.
She isn't
serious about wanting back.........she's
emotional b/c of the CPS, and b/c her friends dumped her all at the same time. That's all this is about. She may be saying words you've wanted to hear, but don't be fooled by them.
Since you stated a few terms of reconciliation, I suggest you don't mention them every time she brings the subject up. The reason is b/c she doesn't seriously want to reconcile the MR, she's just trying to get her friends back and get CPS off her back. It won't stop CPS, but she isn't thinking rationally, she's reacting from fear.
For her, reacting from this fear (which isn't the highest level, IMHO) means she has to manipulate the source. That's why she tried to set the trap the other day, looking all dolled up and using her body language to do her talking. If she could work on your soft spot (which is your feelings for the woman she was before her mother died), then she'll be able to patch things (falsely) long enough to take some heat off her. The two things that are her biggest concerns at the moment, are CPS evaluations and the loss of her friends. She may not lose her friends, but she knows they aren't happy with her.
Ive accepted this is my life. I’ve accepted though I’m not perfect, no one is, I didn’t deserve what her plan was. And that was to take my kids in the middle of the night on my birthday. I still can’t wrap my head around that one. But whatever. I believe god intervened on me and my children’s behalf. We reap what we sow. My W blazed her own path. Since she’s left she’s seen our 5 kids together once on Easter. That was the last time she saw 4 of them. She hasn’t spoken to 3 of them since than either. D15 she talked to but that was just so D15 could talk to her about the abuse. That was the day my W in text admitted she hit D15 “but only when she was in trouble” and that was the day D15 found her strength to go through with the evaluation. She’s obviously talked to D8 since. She’s been fired from the career she loved and genuinely was awesome at. She’s absolutely sowing what she reaped.
Your W's world outwardly appears shaky, but she may have to experience a few more consequences from her bad decisions, before she is truly ready to let go of OM and get therapy for her real issues. IMHO, she needs to realize she has brought all of these result upon herself. It's not the fault of her H, her children, her friends, or anyone else. She will need to accept the fact she can't manipulate her way in & out of their lives whenever it's convenient for her. Maybe she's always been a manipulator, IDK. Some women are very good at manipulation, and you know they are the best......when individuals she manipulates never catch on,
or they know but feel powerless. Some family members and/or friends often allow it, b/c they want a relationship with the manipulator and they feel they have to overlook it......somehow. I think the manipulator has to be convinced it doesn't work, by failed attempts.
I’m good with where my life is, well where it’s going anyway. I’ve decided I can either wallow in my own pit of despair or I can climb out of it and live. We only get one life to live. Why spend it being flat out miserable.
Music to the ears! You are doing a great job.
As I said last night. Idk what the future holds. Technically neither one of us has filed for divorce which I still find amazing considering the circumstances. But we haven’t. I wanted to a few days ago or a week ago whatever it’s been. But I found more inner peace in forgetting about it for now and focusing on myself and my kids and getting custody. She didn’t want to give me the address to start the process so I’ve accepted that for now and moved onto different aspects that need to be focused on. I can’t take on everything at once and by myself. I don’t want to be overwhelmed anymore. And though I do now have her address, i just don’t care enough to move on it as of now. I’m not holding onto that thought like we still may get back together like I was and for me that’s what’s important. How I feel. And as long as my feelings and thoughts aren’t self destructive Im ok with it
There are few newcomers who have faced the same situation and was able to find this
place within their own mind/heart. Those words, "Know thyself", carries a punch.
BTW, don't be surprised if she shows up at your front door some night, crying, saying she has nowhere else to go. You need to know,
now, how you intend to deal with her......should it happen. She's not through with her bag of tricks, yet. If other attempts fail, I think she'll call, threatening to harm herself. Just be as prepared as you can for most anything.
When she stops attempting to manipulate, and if she decides to do whatever is necessary to save her MR and her family, I think you'll see a different side of her. Instead of all the melodramatic scenes, she'll be calmer.....and won't be so emotionally reactive. Depending on whether or not she feels remorse at that stage, may determine any hint of a humble attitude. If she's expressing anger at anyone other than herself.......then I would be extremely hesitate in taking her back. IMHO, the initial goal should not be for her to move home. For example, in addition to the current child counseling, family therapy will probably be needed.....after she ends her affair, and prior to any decision of moving back home. Ultimately, the healing and restoration of the family is the goal. (((hugs)))
I am not a mental health expert by any means, nor a professional therapist. I am familiar with WW's mindset/behavior. So take this FWIW.
Hi Sandi!
Thank you for the compliments, It hasn’t been easy to find myself and “know thyself” because I wasn’t sure who that was when she first left. If it wasn’t for the support I received on this site and the other sitchs I’ve read I’d probably still be a bowl of mush begging her to come back.
But the biggest thing for me was watching what she was doing to my kids. They have been my savior. They are my world. I maybe the one who “takes care of them” but I’ll never be able to repay them for getting me out of this funk and getting my butt in gear.
I’m sure she will still try every trick. And if it wasn’t for you and LH I’d probably would have fallen for it previously. But I’m ok now. If she calls and is suicidal, I won’t answer, but I will let her brother know. If she’s texts, I’ll text back with the suicide hotline. I have my plans in place.
I had a great day today. I went to my brothers again. I grilled steaks,ribs, and 2 pork loins and baked potatoes. Everything turned out wonderful. Me and my brother and S17 and my nephew watched John Wick Chapter 2. I had seen it with my son but they hadn’t. They really enjoyed it. I also got my nephew his first real video game system and a couple of games. The smile on his face was worth the price of admission lol.
Also got some good news on the house front. Closing got pushed back to the middle of June, but the sellers are gonna let us move in early anyway which is huge. We really need this fresh start. It’ll be amazing. I do really need to close though so I can run my credit again. My 5 passenger sedan isn’t cutting the mustard with 6 people. I really need a new SUV or minivan. Plus I’ve decided to treat myself to a new motorcycle when I can run my credit. I’m excited for that more than almost anything.
Didn’t hear from the W today. She did text D8 and FaceTimed her this evening but D8 won’t answer her. D8 is very angry with her mother for telling her best friends Mom what was going on. Well her version anyway. D8 told her friend the truth. All I can do is shake my head at this point. My W really spread a wide net when she rolled out.
We’ll see what the rest of the week holds. Whatever it is I’ll be ready.