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Posted By: Newbie20 Being a doormat vs. accepting interaction - 12/02/19 12:36 AM
Hi everyone. I had to take down my first thread because it had way too many details in it. You just don't know who is reading here. I have spend the afternoon reading Bluwave's many threads and the issue of being a doormat comes up over and over vs. detaching/GAL etc. I'd like to hear some feedback on that.

Quick review: Steve and Ready2Change have responded to me before so I think they know who I am. Steve was pretty disgusted with me initially but I was a quick study and earned his approval wink. For everyone else: my H filed for D a few weeks ago after a 2 year separation. There is no OW and never has been . He became hopeless after a long period of basically a roommate marriage. I made BIG changes and it seems to be working to some extent. He has moved toward me, asking me out for meals several times this past week, showing an interest in what I am doing and basically acting as if nothing ever happened.

Here's what is bugging me. He doesn't act like someone who really wants a divorce. I have read story after story on here and have seen nothing like mine. I don't know how to deal with this. I don't want to be a doormat but I also want interaction, when it is offered. I also don't want to be strung along for months and then have him toodle on down to the courthouse and do it anyway. My gut tells me that isn't going to happen but who knows?

I don't want to confront him this early in the process and put him on the spot but should I down the road if this continues? I am in full GAL mode, trying to detach my feelings from this but still able to be triggered so I'm not ready to draw the line (yet). At some point I will be but there are a few small obstacles I need to overcome.

I spent a long time reading poster Bluwave's threads and a theme that comes up over and over is let them go, don't be a doormat. I get that, I really do. I think at least on the surface I have let him go. I literally leave him 100% alone. He initiates all contact. Not a single day has passed in MONTHS that I have not heard from him. His tone toward me has changed a lot - much less hostile and more friendly.

I don't know what to think or what to do.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Being a doormat vs. accepting interaction - 12/02/19 01:07 AM
I would say to continue doing what you’re doing because it’s working. You have to have infinite patience and your expectations tempered during this process.
Originally Posted by Newbie20
I don't know what to think or what to do.
You have to think of this as a new relationship with a new man.

You have to make him believe he is pursuing a new woman. Reinvent yourself. Make it exciting. Don't be easy. Don't always be available.


Inhale all the dating advise that is out there.
Can anyone give me some advice + update.

After the events talked about above, which had me pretty optimistic, the momentum got derailed when my H had to go out of town to attend a dying relative and did not tell me he was doing it. Without going into ugly details, that caused a bit of a psycho reaction on my part (which I did not know I had in me but was triggered by things that would have made anyone in my position crazy without information). Once I learned the truth, and he actually took the time to explain to me why I was wrong, I quickly apologized, took full accountability, and stated I would not bother him anymore. Well, he doesn't want me to not bother him. The day he came home he sent me a couple of "business" texts which I didn't answer, and then a personal one. Nothing earth shattering but one that indicated he thought of me and what my interests are. So, on the surface, no harm done, but the tenor of the communications since then have been much less warm with a few small exceptions. He has not missed one day contacting me, actually since the BD, and he is the first one to reach out every time. I do not. He still seems to be interested in what I am doing somewhat. He also confirmed to me that he meant to put me on the company health insurance for 2020, at least for now I guess, and he knows that if he divorces me, I can't be on it.

Here's the problem I have. He can in theory at least, go down and finalize this divorce he filed in 2 weeks. That is causing me gigantic stress and fear. About two weeks ago, I asked him straight out if he was going to it and he said he didn't want to talk about it. Wow. I gave him a chance to tell me he was going to and he didn't.

Simplistic advice about GAL, focus on yourself, etc. is great but doesn't address the root cause of my stress. Should I confront him and ask what he is doing? I really don't want to. He has not given me any indication that he is doing this; i.e. hasn't asked me to separate joint accounts, etc. I feel like if I did that, I would not get a definitive answer and would damage/maybe kill the interaction we still have which is finally beginning to warm up ever so slightly. I absolutely know this is not fair to me but I feel like if I want to have any chance of salvaging this situation, I need to continue just being with him when he reaches out and trying to rebuild emotional attraction. I have I think managed to get some going. The court won't dismiss the case until May so there is plenty of time.

Does anyone have any advice?
No advice (I am new to all this, i.e., just 1 month and a half past BD), just virtual hugs and support. Hang in there.
Posted By: kas99 Re: Being a doormat vs. accepting interaction - 12/30/19 02:04 PM
Are you sure he's filed?
Let's just say, I'm in that business and I know.
Posted By: Mario Re: Being a doormat vs. accepting interaction - 12/30/19 03:11 PM
I'm a bit confused. You said that he's filed, but have you been served? I think you said you know the business and you know that you would get notice of all his legal actions (or if you have an attorney, they would)

I assume your state is a no fault state, but that doesn't mean that you wouldn't get notice or be part of the process. If that is the case, you don't need to ask him. My state has a case lookup so you can't see the status of the case at any time on the court's website. Obviously, you can't see the individual documents unless you are part of the case.

Is he doing this pro se?

Posted By: kas99 Re: Being a doormat vs. accepting interaction - 12/30/19 03:29 PM
Quote
Here's the problem I have. He can in theory at least, go down and finalize this divorce he filed in 2 weeks. That is causing me gigantic stress and fear. About two weeks ago, I asked him straight out if he was going to it and he said he didn't want to talk about it. Wow. I gave him a chance to tell me he was going to and he didn't.


This means if you confront him now he isn't going to tell you the truth. He's already filed so your options are limited. My situation is different from yours in that there is OW so I filed a month ago. I was going to have to file soon for support anyway the OW just made the decision as to when easier.
We're both attorneys. I signed a waiver which caused the move back toward me I talked about earlier. My feeling is that he will ultimately not go through with it but the limbo land is causing me huge stress.

The legal technicalities of this are not an issue. There is no dispute over property. What I am trying to deal with is how to salvage this thing in the face of what looks to me like a reluctance to go through with it vs. the idea that he now can do it if he wants to.
Posted By: kas99 Re: Being a doormat vs. accepting interaction - 12/30/19 09:29 PM
It must be difficult now that he's taken that next step. My WAH hasn't even been served yet and I'm having doubts. He talks a good game but I know it's over. He wants a D he just doesn't want to pay for it. I am so sorry you are here.
Can I ask for some advice here? My husband's case is at the point now that he can go to court and finalize it at any time whether I like it or not . He has made no move to do it. He attempts to interact with me every single day. I use no contact inasuch as I never ever initiate anything. I respond intermittently to his texts but in a very brief and businesslike way. I don't feel comfortable being his buddy while he's in the process of divorcing me.

Yet I feel like the ship may be slowly turning around. I can't point to any one thing but the totality of what I am seeing. I don't know what he thought single life was going to be like in his mid 60s but he hasn't really done any of the things he was going to do with his life when he was free. I absolutely know I cannot ask or press or pursue in any way and I will not. I kind of think he wants me to. I just get that feeling but again, could be wrong.

I really would prefer to be completely dark but I feel like I should interact a small amount and give him a chance to backtrack if he is going to. But I don't know. I really don't like talking to him while this is going on. Sometimes I get triggered by stuff he says (never let him know that though).

Is there a way to deal with this; i.e., limit contact without giving the message you are no longer open for business?
Originally Posted by Newbie20
Can I ask for some advice here? My husband's case is at the point now that he can go to court and finalize it at any time whether I like it or not . He has made no move to do it. He attempts to interact with me every single day. I use no contact inasuch as I never ever initiate anything. I respond intermittently to his texts but in a very brief and businesslike way. I don't feel comfortable being his buddy while he's in the process of divorcing me.

Yet I feel like the ship may be slowly turning around. I can't point to any one thing but the totality of what I am seeing. I don't know what he thought single life was going to be like in his mid 60s but he hasn't really done any of the things he was going to do with his life when he was free. I absolutely know I cannot ask or press or pursue in any way and I will not. I kind of think he wants me to. I just get that feeling but again, could be wrong.

I really would prefer to be completely dark but I feel like I should interact a small amount and give him a chance to backtrack if he is going to. But I don't know. I really don't like talking to him while this is going on. Sometimes I get triggered by stuff he says (never let him know that though).

Is there a way to deal with this; i.e., limit contact without giving the message you are no longer open for business?


I feel like your anxiety is running the show. Which is understandable. Have your read DB lately? The ship does turn slowly. He could divorce you and that doesn't necessarily mean it's over. You stated you made big changes after several years. He is looking for consistency. Will these changes stick, or is just for the short term? How committed is she? Is she doing this for her or for me? You are doing a great job of not pressuring or pursuing, I would keep that up.

I understand the feeling that you want to go dark, but what do you want? Do you want a chance for your marriage to work? If so, I would keep detaching, but not shut him out. I think you are doing the right thing by responding in a business-like way. Remember, you are becoming your best, most authentic, passionate self. FOR YOU. Even if the marriage doesn't work out, you still did this for you and for your future. Try not to worry so much about it being finalized. To me, there appears to be interest in you still on his part. But if he does finalize it, you can say you did everything you could, which could make it easier for you. I know this is so hard!
Not only is your anxiety running the show, but your hyper-focus on what he is or is not doing is running the show. Going dark doesn't mean you ignore him. Newcomers get this wrong all the time. Going dark means that you do not initiate contact. And you follow some very specific rules related to contact:

If he calls you, don't always answer. You don't want to be available to him all the time. When you do answer, listen and validate. And then be the one to end the call. "Sorry, I am busy, I need to go."

If he leaves a voicemail expressing needing to talk to you, then text him back: "Sorry, been busy. I will be available tonight at 7pm if you'd like to call then."

If he texts you, and the text is just informational: "Went to talk to the lawyer today, he said he will have papers to you to sign by the end of the week." then you do not answer the text. Period.

If he texts you a direct question, answer in your own time (not right away because remember, you are busy!), and then when you do answer in as few words as possible. Yes or no questions get yes or no answers.

So based on this, when do you call or text him first? The answer: NEVER

To answer this question: "Is there a way to deal with this; i.e., limit contact without giving the message you are no longer open for business?" the answer is that YOU DO WANT TO GIVE HIM THE MESSAGE THAT YOU ARE NO LONGER OPEN FOR BUSINESS! That is the only answer that will get through to him. Any other answer means that you are still there, hanging on for any crumbs you throws you, and are still his Plan B no matter what he says or does. That is an awful message to send. Sending the message that: "Ok, you asked for it. You wanted to be apart. Well you got it! I am moving on!" is the only message that might make him see what he stands to lose.

Grow a backbone. Be the strong person we all know you can be. Go dark according to the rules above. Remember what DR said about the "as if" attitude. Trust me, it works.
Got it. That is the most comfortable for me too.
Posted By: may22 Re: Being a doormat vs. accepting interaction - 02/01/20 01:01 AM
Hi Newbie,

What's up? You piqued my curiosity with a post on someone else's thread the other day and I've been wondering how you are doing! Check in when you have a chance!

xx May
I'm doing well. Just got a new house and have completely walked away from the turmoil. He wants it, he knows where to find me. 100% detached. I feel liberated, joyous. Looking to the future.
Posted By: wooba Re: Being a doormat vs. accepting interaction - 02/01/20 01:23 AM
Originally Posted by Newbie20
I'm doing well. Just got a new house and have completely walked away from the turmoil. He wants it, he knows where to find me. 100% detached. I feel liberated, joyous. Looking to the future.

Good for you!!! Keep being strong!!
Posted By: may22 Re: Being a doormat vs. accepting interaction - 02/01/20 01:27 AM
Congratulations!!! So exciting-- I'm really happy for you. Cheers!!
I'm looking for a younger stud muffin to keep me company. LOL. I'm a cougar and I didn't even know it.
Posted By: Mach40 Re: Being a doormat vs. accepting interaction - 02/01/20 03:24 PM
Wow, great thread... and the rules Steve85 talk about are hard at first to do, but many have said they work.
Was there any friends or family that told you anything about what the heck was in his mind? Something was obviously bothering him to go forward.
I didn't ask. I just stopped caring.
Posted By: Mach40 Re: Being a doormat vs. accepting interaction - 02/02/20 02:16 PM
Originally Posted by Newbie20
I didn't ask. I just stopped caring.

Well alright then.. Good for you...
Posted By: Newbie20 Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/05/20 07:10 PM

Hi, everyone. My WAH and I had lunch today and he told me he wants to reconcile. He's dismissing his case. It's my birthday.

It's going to be a long road to put this thing back together but I want to try to do it. Thank you to everyone who helped me. I think it was the giving up and walking away that did the trick. People, listen to Steve. He annoyed me in the beginning but he is right and I am a fan. I may stick around and try to help others who find themselves in this nightmare.

Anyway, happy birthday to me.
Posted By: may22 Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/05/20 08:02 PM
Happy Birthday Newbie!! smile

Please stick around. I'm really happy for you and I'm sure you'll continue to get some good advice here as you work through the next steps of reconciliation.

Can you give us more details of exactly what changed? I'm curious to know more-- you were pretty dark already, I think, but responsive to his texts etc-- then you went totally dark per Steve's post above? NC? Just actually achieved the final detachment in your head?

I hope you keep sharing!
Posted By: Newbie20 Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/05/20 08:30 PM
I never believed from the start that mine would actually go through with it. But he sure put me through hell. In the last few weeks, I made a whole bunch of money and that alleviated my irrational fears of becoming a bag lady. The other point was, he couldn't take any of it. I felt like I was getting more control over my own future. That helped. Then I just started getting mad at myself for being jobbed like that. Finally just said, "the hell with it" and walked away in my mind. Just exhausted myself, like someone at the wailing wall in Jerusalem. Then I met some guys who were interested in me, although I didn't reciprocate. All together, it added up that there is life after this mess.

Went NC but responsive to outreach. Outreach turned into phone calls, more outreach, etc. Then it kind of came together the last few days. I am not 100% on board but willing to give it a shot.
Posted By: SteveLW Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/05/20 08:44 PM
Originally Posted by Newbie20

Hi, everyone. My WAH and I had lunch today and he told me he wants to reconcile. He's dismissing his case. It's my birthday.

It's going to be a long road to put this thing back together but I want to try to do it. Thank you to everyone who helped me. I think it was the giving up and walking away that did the trick. People, listen to Steve. He annoyed me in the beginning but he is right and I am a fan. I may stick around and try to help others who find themselves in this nightmare.

Anyway, happy birthday to me.


First Happy Birthday! Second, sorry for being annoying. I try to be persistent if someone seems to be hesitant to at least try doing what works. I am sure the LBSs that give up the MBR get frustrated with us constantly hounding them to take back the MBR. But we do it because we know that short of that there is little hope of saving the MR.

I do want to caution you not to go all in on the R just yet. Lots of LBSs get suckered into dropping DBing because their WAS starts sniffing back around. Likely, in these initials stages, he sees Plan B (you) slipping away. And that gives him a very uneasy feeling. He needs that fall back plan to feel secure. Insecurity will cause even the staunchest of WASs to try to reestablish their Plan B option.

So proceed carefully. Remember, he is still a WAS and therefore nothing.....NOTHING he says can be believed. Make him act....and earn his way back. Based on your language about it being a long road, you probably already know this. But I wanted to annoy you one last time.....just in case! wink
Posted By: Newbie20 Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/05/20 08:55 PM
I hear you. I am not all in myself. I was pretty OK being on my own. No question, he needs to walk the walk. I have heard this BS before.
Posted By: Mumin Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/05/20 09:23 PM
Happy birthday! I'm New to this but:
Keep using the rules and principles! Keep reading!
Posted By: Newbie20 Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/22/20 06:52 PM
In case anyone cares, we straightened out our differences and are fully reconciled after 2.5 years of separation. We are too old to spend months analyzing every move and playing power games with each other. It's better now than it ever was and I am glad I will not be one of the gray divorce victims. I wish the rest of you a similar positive ending to the saga.

I think in retrospect this was a MLC on his part. It started in his late 50s amd dragged on for over 5 years. We weren't separated the whole time but he was hell on wheels to live with.
Posted By: oceangrl Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/22/20 07:06 PM
Originally Posted by Newbie20
In case anyone cares, we straightened out our differences and are fully reconciled after 2.5 years of separation. We are too old to spend months analyzing every move and playing power games with each other. It's better now than it ever was and I am glad I will not be one of the gray divorce victims. I wish the rest of you a similar positive ending to the saga.

I think in retrospect this was a MLC on his part. It started in his late 50s amd dragged on for over 5 years. We weren't separated the whole time but he was hell on wheels to live with.


Newbie, you are awesome and I am so glad to hear this. Your work on taking your own power back in this situation has been so inspiring for me. I am still working on believing I will be okay no matter what.

My husband has been going through a big fat MLC and "hell on wheels" is truly the accurate way to describe it.

I hope you will stick around on the board. We need you!
Posted By: Newbie20 Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/22/20 08:37 PM
You'll get there when it trashes your life so much that you start getting mad and thinking of ways to deal with your fears. I think your situation is very much like May's and will eventually work out if you stand your ground and don't fall for these fantasy scenarios.
Posted By: HopeCA Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/22/20 08:53 PM
That is wonderful, I’m happy to hear this as well. I like the optimism your posts and your story bring to this forum!
Posted By: Newbie20 Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/22/20 09:01 PM
I think yours will too. Draw a line in the sand.
Posted By: cardinal Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/22/20 09:11 PM
Ah, I'm happy for you, Newbie! I keep wondering if one day everything is going to click, and I'll just come to feel that acceptance you did. I'm hopefully working toward that point but going through a rough patch in my confidence. More perspectives are always good, and I hope you'll stick around too.
Posted By: HopeCA Re: Divorce being dismissed/Reconciling - 02/23/20 05:15 PM
Originally Posted by Newbie20
I think yours will too. Draw a line in the sand.



This is what I want to do. I don’t think I’m doing it well enough though. I will take any and all advice smile
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