D Bomb - DivorceBusting.com

So my wife of 4 years told me a few weeks ago that she was unhappy in our marriage and needed space to be away from me and our daughter and my stepson. My daughter is 2 and my stepson is 9. She said she was going to go out with friends on the weekends. She said that we were done and we could go do and see whoever we wanted. She doesnt love me anymore and wants to move out in a few months once she saves up the money.

After 2 weeks of going out with her friends I find that she is having a physical affair with a guy she met out. I didnt blow up or expose what i know about the 2 of them. I had my blow up the 2 weeks before that when she told me she was done with us. I want to work on our relationship and i know it is a long hard road. She wont go to MC so i am seeing a counselor on my own.

She gets 2 nights a week to stay out overnight and i get 2 nights a week. I have been taking advantage of it going out with friends and sleeping over at my brothers. She only knows that I am not coming home at night and has started saying things about how she can never "touch" me again now that I have been with another women. As a side note I got a cold sore a week ago. I havent had one in years. I was going to kiss my daughter goodnight and I then remembered I had the coldsore so i told her i couldnt kiss her tonight. So my wife chimed in saying yeah, Daddy has cold sores from kissing other women. I found out after reading my wifes texts the nect day that her affair partner had a cold sore and gave one to her which I then got. I told her that if she was to stay here in this home the talking about being with other people in front of our children needs to stop.

She had a terrible upbringing bouncing from foster home to foster home as her parents wanted nothing to do with her. She is close with her sister but other than that she has no family and only a couple work friends as she is quite introverted.

I owned the marital home before I met her and their is not much she can take from a divorce after i spoke with a lawyer about my sitch.

She is trying to guilt me into helping to take care of her stepson after she moves out. I told her I love him but he is not going to be my responsibility once we are D.

We hadnt slept in the marital bed together for the last year as things between us has not been good for a while. She had slept in there with our daughter every night. I told her I am splitting time in the master bedroom now. She started yelling how she hates me right now etc but she has accepted and is honoring it.

She has no where to go for Thanksgiving and asked if she was still welcome to my parents for the holiday. I told her yes that was fine. Now she is asking me to drive her son 2 hours to drop him off with his father for Thanksgiving week. I am thinking I should tell her no and that she needs to start figuring this stuff out on her own for when I am no longer in the picture.

I have been doing a pretty good job of detaching and not responding to the childish comments and have got better at saying, I am sorry you feel that way." I want so much to try to work on things but I know that distance and indifference are probably my best routes to take ATM.

Sorry for being all over the place. Their is so much more to add but I dont want to write a novel on my first post. Any thoughts and suggestions would be great.

Welcome to the board

Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.

Yes first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/
http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm

and Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htm

You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!

Get out and Get a Life (GAL).

DETACH.

Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.

Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:

I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072

Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095

Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414

Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566

Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096

Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153

For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554

Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forum...ain=57819&Number=2578224#Post2578224

Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1

Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764

Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574

The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619

Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon

Sorry you're here.

Take back the master bedroom full time. She wants out she can get out.

Rethink Thanksgiving. She wants out, so why play family on the holidays?

Continue to GAL and detach. Don't react emotionally, think things through.

What happened between you two that you weren't sleeping together for a year?

Thanks for the tips so far. I had been distant with her the last year plus. Not showing her the attention and affection she wanted. I liked having the tv on at night in the bedroom and she didnt. My back hurt in that bed (I was fat and out of shape then) as part of my revival I have lost 50 lbs and work out 4 days a week. So those things madr it so I gradually stopped sleeping in the madter bed and let her take it over completely. It was my choice. We still had sex up until 2 weeks before the bomb but their wasnt a lot of intimacy.
I was also drinking 4 days a week during that last year. Mostly because of the direction our marriage was going in. I have stopped that too.
So she kept hounding me about driving her son up to VT to his fathers for Thanksgiving. It is a 2 hr drive and it would only be helping her out because my stepson doesn't even want to go. She wants me to do it so she is not inconvenienced with the drive and potentially losing money at work to get the time off to take him. I told her I wont have an answer until tomorrow at the earliest because I wasnt sure if I have plans or not. This was my text to her after she asked me to take him, "Unfortunately i dont know yet but if another day or two is going to make you miss an alternate plan then please go with that for the trip to vt." So her response was, Why cant u be decent about this, your off that day. Ur making me dislike u more and more, is that what you want?
So I didnt respond to that text. When she came home I told her I might have plans. Then she got angry. Then for the first time I brought up the fact that I knew that she was having an affair. I told her that i have too much self respect to let her own me by doing her bidding given what she is up too. I told her I wasnt going to wait around. That I make plans and go out and have fun.
I think Thanksgiving is too close to change my mind about now but heck, ahe might just excuse herself from the holiday for us at this rate.

Slarty welcome and sorry you are here.

"We hadnt slept in the marital bed together for the last year as things between us has not been good for a while."

This stood out. BD was a foregone conclusion. You should have been working on this for a year. Now you are playing her game with the nights away. I like the GAL, but go home at night. Do as ovr says and take back your MBR fulltime. Also, do as he says about thanksgiving. Why play the happy family because she doesn't want to sit home by herself?

I would highly suggest you look into Nice Guy Syndrome. Maybe read the book No More Mr. Nice Guy. I am detecting some passive-aggressive tendencies.

Slarty, I would do all of the reading cadet sent you. Valuable stuff. I would get Divorce Remedy and read it. The actions you should be focusing on are: GAL. 180ing (self-improvement), and detaching. Detachment is not distance or coldness. If that is the dynamic then you are doing it wrong. Cadet's reading above will help.

Everything the others have said is true, though I would make one adjustment - while not sharing a bed for a year is a red flag, it's not just you who should have been working on your M, she should have, too. That's not to shift blame but I don't want you to feel more shame than you need to. If you are like me, and, as Steve pointed out, you may have some Nice Guy Syndrome (NGS) so that's like me, you take a lack of overt conflict as peace and overall "good". So, yes, you (and I) failed to identify and address issues that would be obvious to others, but so did our Ws.

I'm heartbroken for you - your W sounds like she's gotten a lot out of the relationship with you and is now walking all over you. I had a tough time cutting my W out of my family events - for a while I literally said that "I want us to be a family as long as we can, up until the day the papers are signed". Get out of that mindset as quickly as you can. She wants to leave, sleep with other guys, start a new life? Fine. No Thanksgiving with your family. It's not punishment, it's a boundary - she's firing you and, by extension, your family, she no longer gets to participate.

Beyond that, as you'll repeatedly hear, Get a Life (GAL) - do things that YOU want to do, go out, take a class, pick up an old hobby... whatever it is, do things YOU want to do for YOURSELF, not to show anything to your W. I'd recommend building a broader social network, go out with colleagues, take your kids to the park and meet other parents. If you've been dependent on W it's time to be able to let that go (it's being taken from you after all).

Quote

She said that we were done and we could go do and see whoever we wanted. She doesnt love me anymore and wants to move out in a few months once she saves up the money.

After 2 weeks of going out with her friends I find that she is having a physical affair with a guy she met out. I didnt blow up or expose what i know about the 2 of them. I had my blow up the 2 weeks before that when she told me she was done with us. I want to work on our relationship and i know it is a long hard road. She wont go to MC so i am seeing a counselor on my own.

She gets 2 nights a week to stay out overnight and i get 2 nights a week.

Youre new here, so you need to dive in and read as much as you can of the stuff Cadet posted, ask as many questions as possible, etc., but...

The above, to me, speaks volumes. She is done, done, done, done, done. She's not even making any bones about it: "We can go out and see whoever we want"... Really? She's your wife. Y'all have a family together. You are getting good advice from the others already, here, and you took a step in the right direction by "calling" her on her PA... but then again you already knew and she had already told you explicitly that she was going to do something just like that! She's told you the marriage is over. Which means you are no longer her husband, no longer there to bail her out or do nice little things for her... You've been "fired" (as sandi2 is fond of saying.) So #1, you dont try to nice up to her or cozy up to her and #2 you don't take any crap or disrespect from her. Respect, (you will find, if you read through sandi2's posts and threads) is crucial for a woman to feel love for her H... without it there can be no love and no hope for reconciling. That means you don't tolerate her yelling at you, abusing you, taking advantage of you, disrespecting you with comments like "Daddy's kissing other women" in front of your children... get my point? You should read up on "boundaries" in the stickied threads and consider setting some after you are comfortable with the concept. Boundaries are for you, but they are not just "demands" that certain behavior cease, but, rather, lines which, if crossed, will result in stated, predictable outcomes that you control. It is often a difficult concept for newcomers and can be hard to grasp and can be ineffective or even backfire if you do not fully understand how its done.

Also, good job on taking the back the MBR... I wouldn't even make it part time I'd go back there full time. She's the one who has dishonored the marriage and the marital bed, if someone is to leave, it should be her. Respect. Demand it. Calmly, firmly, without yelling, screaming, cursing, or insulting... but demand it.

Finally, not sure how fully similar your sitch is to mine given your W's background, this being a second marriage, etc., but my sitch did arise in the context of a "sex-starved marriage" and a lack of intimacy between W and I long before OM came into picture. It can be hard, as a LBH in such situations to understand the importance of detachment, pursuit/distance dichotomy, etc., since the "fix it" male mind naturally gravitates to "if distance and lack of pursuit and intimacy was the problem before, the fix must be to ramp up the attention and pursuit". This is not so, especially with WW's. One of the most profound and helpful quotes i have seen on these boards is "she will never find you so attractive as when you are walking away."

At any rate, I might suggest reading some of my own threads, if you're up for it, (my first one starts here: https://www.divorcebusting.com/foru...ain=60292&Number=2740576#Post2740576 ) but my saga was loooong, and my sitch (like anyone else's) had some very unique elements. But some cautions-- I screwed up a lot, didn't follow the playbook in some respects, and the path i took in some instances doesn't jive with what has typically shown to work and not to work. But if you read it with a critical eye, and keep in mind that 1) everyone's sitch is different and everyone's perspective is colored by their own sitch but also 2) that in nearly every sitch you will find similarities, inspirations, and other useful nuggets if you look close enough. In sum i guess i'd say: dont expect to "do what hoosjim did" or "do what Steve85 did" or "do what TxHubby did" word for word step for step and assume your life will come out perfectly. Youre unique and your sitch has unique elements. Try to find the common threads while at the same time staying true to the foundational bedrock DB-ing principles, and you should be fine. Anyhoo, I think i made it to like 15 or 16 threads before we finally made it the reconcilliation phase, so there's a lot of stuff in my thread to cut through. Yes, we made it, but it was long, and painful, and i can understand why many don't and then that even when some do get to that point the LBS decides "ya know, i don't need/want this anymore". It's hard, but not impossible, and there is hope... but it requires work, first, on you, and, then, if God and both of you are willing, on the MR.

Good luck, God bless, we're all here for you if you need us and we're all pulling for you.

Originally Posted by crdcheck

Everything the others have said is true, though I would make one adjustment - while not sharing a bed for a year is a red flag, it's not just you who should have been working on your M, she should have, too. That's not to shift blame but I don't want you to feel more shame than you need to. If you are like me, and, as Steve pointed out, you may have some Nice Guy Syndrome (NGS) so that's like me, you take a lack of overt conflict as peace and overall "good". So, yes, you (and I) failed to identify and address issues that would be obvious to others, but so did our Ws.

I'm heartbroken for you - your W sounds like she's gotten a lot out of the relationship with you and is now walking all over you. I had a tough time cutting my W out of my family events - for a while I literally said that "I want us to be a family as long as we can, up until the day the papers are signed". Get out of that mindset as quickly as you can. She wants to leave, sleep with other guys, start a new life? Fine. No Thanksgiving with your family. It's not punishment, it's a boundary - she's firing you and, by extension, your family, she no longer gets to participate.

Beyond that, as you'll repeatedly hear, Get a Life (GAL) - do things that YOU want to do, go out, take a class, pick up an old hobby... whatever it is, do things YOU want to do for YOURSELF, not to show anything to your W. I'd recommend building a broader social network, go out with colleagues, take your kids to the park and meet other parents. If you've been dependent on W it's time to be able to let that go (it's being taken from you after all).

crd struck on something that I failed to mention. RESPECT

You start with respecting yourself. Do you respect yourself by not sleeping the MBR fulltime? No. So start respecting yourself.

Second, attraction for women is closely tied to respect. Once a woman loses respect for you the attraction goes with it. So this is why commanding respect is so important. This is what taking back the MBR is all about. I can't think of a single sitch here where the LBH gave up the MBR and successfully reconciled his marriage. Maybe there has been one, but I can't think of one. Taking back the MBR doesn't guarantee reconciliation, but not taking it back essentially guarantees against it.

So start commanding respect (NOTE: THIS IS DIFFERENT THAN DEMANDING RESPECT). Your W was mad when you came back to the MBR part-time. But you did gain a little respect back with that. However, you will gain a lot more respect by taking it back fulltime.

So on the topic of driving my stepson 2 hours so he can visit his father for Thanksgiving week, should I tell my WW that it is her issue to figure out now or should I help out? Again it doesnt really benefit my stepson as he doesnt even like going to his fathers. It would be to make my WW life easier and the texts I got in response from her were manipulative.
The reason I told her I wasnt sure I had plans was because I was waiting on a call back from my counselor as to how I should proceed. My MC told me to tell her no that I cant do it. I have a lot of faith in what the board members have for experience here too so I would just like another perspective. Also any suggestions on how to have that convo would also be greatly appreciated.
Also in regard to spending the night out on my 2 nights a week that we had agreed to my MC suggest I not come home. But Steve85 here suggest I not play her game which has boiled down to her spending 2 nights a week at her APs house and go jome after my GAL session. Any thoughts here too? Sinve I stayed my last 2 nights she jumped to the conclusion that I was sleeping with another woman so I see where mybe my MC was wrong on me spending the night.

Also one more thought. I am not sure how hard of a line to take during this seperation as she left because of how unhappy she was with me. By taking a hard stance I am afraid I am not working on creating an environment she wants to come back to.

Personally, I would think it is Bio-dads responsibility to come get step son and drop him back off. After that, I would think it is Bio-Moms responsibility to honor any agreements she has with the father.

How can you command respect?

MBR: Sleep there every night.

Read all of these threads:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=userposts&view=started&id=41275

Originally Posted by Slarty

Also any suggestions on how to have that convo would also be greatly appreciated.

H:"W, I think it is best that I don't drive SS to Bio-dads."
W:"Bla bla bla"
H: validate here feelings.

or

H:"W, I decided it is best that I don't drive SS to Bio-dads."

I really appreciate the feedback Ready2Change.
So an update, I still havent had the talk about my stepson yet. She texted me tonight that she doesnt know what she wants. That her heart and mind go back and forth. She also said she doesnt think she can make it on her own financially. I told her I wouldnt want to work on us if it is just for financial reasons. Then I said, I know it is tough but the way we treated each other over the last year or so, me drinking, not sleeping in the same bed, no intimacy is not worth the sacrifice due to financial reasons alone. I continued, I have thought through the financial impact and although it [censored], I want an intimate caring relationship more. So I am doing the things necessary in my life to make that a possibility.
Then she said, "I wanted to kiss you this morning to see if there was still anything there. But I didnt, bad idea"
My response was, "Yes, bad idea. If we are going to try "us" again we need to take it slow and start over."

Originally Posted by Slarty

She texted me tonight that she doesnt know what she wants. That her heart and mind go back and forth.

"That sounds very frustrating, is that how you feel?"

She also said she doesnt think she can make it on her own financially. I told her I wouldnt want to work on us if it is just for financial reasons.

Yes I can see how you would be concerned about that.

Then I said, I know it is tough but the way we treated each other over the last year or so, me drinking, not sleeping in the same bed, no intimacy is not worth the sacrifice due to financial reasons alone. I continued, I have thought through the financial impact and although it [censored], I want an intimate caring relationship more. So I am doing the things necessary in my life to make that a possibility.

Then she said, "I wanted to kiss you this morning to see if there was still anything there. But I didnt, bad idea"

"It sounds like this is a confusing time for you, would you agree?"

My response was, "Yes, bad idea. If we are going to try "us" again we need to take it slow and start over."

Slarty, LISTEN and VALIDATE. All the stuff above that I crossed through, that is 100% relationship talk and she absolutely does not want to talk about the R right now. That's all pressure at a time she wants zero pressure. Read the links Cadet posted, especially the ones on validation. Read DR. Read Sandi's rules every day. Use those rules as your template on how to behave.

Originally Posted by Slarty

I really appreciate the feedback Ready2Change.
So an update, I still havent had the talk about my stepson yet. She texted me tonight that she doesnt know what she wants. That her heart and mind go back and forth. She also said she doesnt think she can make it on her own financially. I told her I wouldnt want to work on us if it is just for financial reasons. Then I said, I know it is tough but the way we treated each other over the last year or so, me drinking, not sleeping in the same bed, no intimacy is not worth the sacrifice due to financial reasons alone. I continued, I have thought through the financial impact and although it [censored], I want an intimate caring relationship more. So I am doing the things necessary in my life to make that a possibility.
Then she said, "I wanted to kiss you this morning to see if there was still anything there. But I didnt, bad idea"
My response was, "Yes, bad idea. If we are going to try "us" again we need to take it slow and start over."

Common WAW script. My W said it was like she was in the double drive-thrub at McDonalds and didn't know if she should take the far lane or the near lane. Later she could see benefits and detriments to either decision. Remember, they are on their own emotional rollercoaster. Makes me think of the old rock song "Should I Stay out Should I Go". Empathize with her, as those contrary feelings can't be a good place to be.

Remember, believe nothing she says and half of what she does.

A lot to learn

Also I probably buried myself even more this morning before I read about validating her feelings a little more. I told her that if we are going to work on reconciliation she needs to stop her affair and I also told her I was sleeping in the MBR every night going forward.
I need to make her feel more comfortable rather than ramping up the pressure.

Is their any suggestions as to what i should say to alleviate some of that pressure I put on her or should I just let it lie. After thinking about this and putting myself in her shoes her head is probably going to explode with all this feeling, emotion and additional pressure I added between last night and this mornings communication with her.
I wish I was picking up on all this faster.

Stop saying anything else to alleviate pressure, anything else you say will come off as pursuing... just give it time and space at this point.

Don't worry about it, we all make the same mistakes in the beginning.

She's having an EA/PA with OM... so according to the vets (Sandi, LH, etc...), you are probably okay to be a bit firm with her to set your boundaries, so you don't have to make her too comfortable right now.

You'll have more opportunities to find the right balance for your sitch in the future.

I'm still trying to find the right balance between not being angry / cold vs being too available vs listening / validating.

Slarty. I�m new at giving advice. So take this how you will.

Don�t drive stepson for thanksgiving. She has told you she doesn�t want you as a husband. With her actions and her words. This means you shouldn�t be doing husbandly favors for her

As for her going back and forth. She is an emotional train wreck. You can�t fix her. Only she can do that. My W still gets extremely stressed about the tiniest things. Like the dog being in the way of where she is walking. Please don�t read too much about her �not knowing what she wants�. I find it interesting that her next comment was about not making it financially. Remember believe nothing of what she says. She will say things that will string you along. It�s best to unplug from her mess. Focus on you.

I�m sure the vets will slap me and draw lines through my comments if I mis spoke. I�m sorry your here friend. Just know that you are in the company of people who truly care

Originally Posted by Slarty

Also I probably buried myself even more this morning before I read about validating her feelings a little more. I told her that if we are going to work on reconciliation she needs to stop her affair...

No more relationship talk. She's done, all the R talk is falling on deaf ears. Your demands mean nothing to her right now.

Quote

...and I also told her I was sleeping in the MBR every night going forward.

I fully support you on this part. It will probably make her mad but the point is to start earning your respect back.

Quote

I need to make her feel more comfortable rather than ramping up the pressure. Is their any suggestions as to what i should say to alleviate some of that pressure I put on her or should I just let it lie.

As Loving mentioned, you take the pressure off by not saying/doing anything. Leave her alone. She wants time and space, so that's exactly what you should give her. And not for a day or two, but for months and months. This is a marathon and you've got to treat it as such. No quick fixes here.

Quote

After thinking about this and putting myself in her shoes her head is probably going to explode with all this feeling, emotion and additional pressure I added between last night and this mornings communication with her.
I wish I was picking up on all this faster.

No one thing got you here, it was an accumulation of things over a long period of time. Likewise no one thing is going to fix it, or really make it much worse either. It's a pattern of consistent change stretching out over a long period of time you're working towards. So don't sweat these convos, they didn't help but probably didn't hurt much either. Adjust your actions and keep moving forward!

I am so glad I found this place. The support system here is tremendous and is giving me the confidence to continue fighting for my marriage. Providing me with the tools to do it the best way possible. The collective experience on these boards is immeasurable.

Words are your enemy. Stop saying things. Start doing things. You don't say you are going to sleep in the MBR every night, just start doing it.

Originally Posted by Steve85

Words are your enemy. Stop saying things. Start doing things.

Amazing advice

This is a rough first night taking back the MBR full time. Our daughter sleeps in there and my W is saying she can never sleep with our daughter again. That she is stuck on the uncomfortable couch. Her dog that sleeps in the bed wont stay on the couch so she doesnt have him either.
I know that I have been told this is for the best especially with a WAW who is having a PA, but man. It doesnt feel right now like it is helping us at all. Especially with all my relationship talk yesterday and this morning piled on. She is going to have a complete meltdown with all this pressure. I feel like I am pushing her more in to the arms of the OM.

Hey slarty it�s tough isn�t it mate. You just gotta trust the process and trust the veterans. Good luck buddy

Hi Slarty (is that a Hitchiker's Guide reference?)

Sounds like a trying situation certainly. As has been said before, focus on your actions. No letters. Try not to bring up R talks all the time. Just DO stuff. And also once you've done it, don't announce it; let your spouse see that you've done it.

Originally Posted by DaB35

Hi Slarty (is that a Hitchiker's Guide reference?)

Sounds like a trying situation certainly. As has been said before, focus on your actions. No letters. Try not to bring up R talks all the time. Just DO stuff. And also once you've done it, don't announce it; let your spouse see that you've done it.

Yes it is a Hitchikers reference, haha. Thanks for the encouraging words.

So this morning the WAW asks if I was going oit all night tonight as Friday has been my day to go out and I had been spending it over at my brothers. After sleeping on the couch overnight she said she needed to get some sleep. I told her I was going out but not overnight. She said she is going to sleep in the bed anyway and that I had better not snore. This is the first time in over a year that we are sleeping in the same bed.

Second she asked if I was going to be gone all day Sunday. Again this is my other day to go out. I told her I would be gone for the afternoon and early evening. As suggested by fellow DBers I am not "playing her game" and spending overnights somewhere anymore. Just GAL during the afternoon amd early evenings on my days.
I confirmed she would be home by 1pm on Sunday as Saturday night and Sunday mornings are her night to go out. Just so i knew when to make plans for Sunday. She said she wasnt sure if she was doing that or not. This was normally her night to go see her OM. I kept all responses short and simple.

I have been reading a lot about validating spouses feelings and this I see is where many of our issues arose in our marriage. We escalate conversations because we try to invalidate the other and "win". Rather than show empathy and understanding of where the other person is coming from. This is going to take the most practice for me. I am so used to doing the opposite that although I want to be saying the right things I have only been making things worse. I think I am going to do some practice with my brother. Having conversations and validating feelings in mock scenarios with him.

Is she still seeing OM? because you don�t share your bed with a wife who is currently cheating on you

Originally Posted by Slarty

I have been reading a lot about validating spouses feelings and this I see is where many of our issues arose in our marriage. We escalate conversations because we try to invalidate the other and "win". Rather than show empathy and understanding of where the other person is coming from. This is going to take the most practice for me. I am so used to doing the opposite that although I want to be saying the right things I have only been making things worse. I think I am going to do some practice with my brother. Having conversations and validating feelings in mock scenarios with him.

Hi Slanty,

Fantastic! I've read a book on listening, but my favorite video on the right attitude to listen, understand, and validate someone is just 3-minutes long. Google "Brene Brown Empathy".

Validation is a tool you can use with anyone--partners, children, customers.

I still feel defensive if someone snaps, "You promised you'd be here at 8 and it's 8:15!" I just don't respond with minimization "It's only 15 minutes"/"I'm only late once in a blue moon.", by ignoring them "::shrug shoulders::"/"Well, let's get on with it.", by defending "I didn't PROMISE"/"I can't control traffic.", by attacking "You're usually the late one"/"You should've told me if the timing was SO important", or bizarrely "I know how you feel."/"You're angry again." I first try to understand where they're coming from.

Once you validate, they often back down and are more receptive to your story. Note, validation doesn't imply agreement or being agreeable. You can understand and validate without agreeing at all.

It's hard practicing validation with someone who's suddenly re-written your history in a negative light, but if you manage to do it now, imagine how much easier it'll be if you reconcile or start anew. And in my personal experience, it does increase your chances of reconciling and/or being on better terms.

Originally Posted by CWarrior

It's hard practicing validation with someone who's suddenly re-written your history in a negative light, but if you manage to do it now, imagine how much easier it'll be if you reconcile or start anew. And in my personal experience, it does increase your chances of reconciling and/or being on better terms.

This is so hard to understand, because the other person is so submerged in that negative narrative. And they probably repeat it to friends that don't know you ... it's maddening because you'd like to remind them that things were not quite how they recall.

Originally Posted by ozman

Is she still seeing OM? because you don�t share your bed with a wife who is currently cheating on you

He left the bed and we've been coaching him to get back in it to regain some respect for himself and from her (although outwardly she'll be angry about it). If she wants to sleep somewhere else because he returned then that's her business.

Originally Posted by Slarty

This is a rough first night taking back the MBR full time. Our daughter sleeps in there and my W is saying she can never sleep with our daughter again. That she is stuck on the uncomfortable couch. Her dog that sleeps in the bed wont stay on the couch so she doesnt have him either.
I know that I have been told this is for the best especially with a WAW who is having a PA, but man. It doesnt feel right now like it is helping us at all. Especially with all my relationship talk yesterday and this morning piled on. She is going to have a complete meltdown with all this pressure. I feel like I am pushing her more in to the arms of the OM.

Your D is two? Does she have her own room? It's time for her to start sleeping in it. You do not want to fall into this pattern of your D sleeping in your room, the longer you let it go on the harder it will be to break her of the habit. There's a lot of info on the Internet about transitioning them out of the MBR, look into it. This is another way you can gain some respect, by showing yourself as a strong parental figure. As for the dog not sleeping with your W, wow isn't that a tragedy. If your W can't stand being in the same bed as you and she chooses to sleep elsewhere, LET HER. All of the resulting fallout from that decision is HER PROBLEM.

Your D is two? Does she have her own room? It's time for her to start sleeping in it. You do not want to fall into this pattern of your D sleeping in your room, the longer you let it go on the harder it will be to break her of the habit. There's a lot of info on the Internet about transitioning them out of the MBR, look into it. This is another way you can gain some respect, by showing yourself as a strong parental figure. As for the dog not sleeping with your W, wow isn't that a tragedy. If your W can't stand being in the same bed as you and she chooses to sleep elsewhere, LET HER. All of the resulting fallout from that decision is HER PROBLEM.

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Yes my daughter is 2. She sleeps in her own toddler bed in the MBR. Funny you mentuon that, as I had just painted the spare bedroom that she will be sleeping in pink for my daughters impending arrival. It still needs one more touch up of paint. That is why the W slept on the couch last night.
I didnt tell my wife i was painting my daughters room, action, not words. When my W saw it she asked what was going on.
I told my W that our daughter is moving into that room before her 3rd bday (in January). My wife asked where she was supposed to sleep. I said that was not my problem but our daughter needs her own room. My daughter loves the color and is calling it her room now.

Sorry that last post was to follow up on AnotherStanders point.

First night in the MBR together and as of now nothing to report. Which is a good thing. Thanks again for all the insight and slaps on my face along the way so far. I needed this awakening.

Originally Posted by Slarty

Funny you mentuon that, as I had just painted the spare bedroom that she will be sleeping in pink for my daughters impending arrival. It still needs one more touch up of paint. That is why the W slept on the couch last night.
I didnt tell my wife i was painting my daughters room, action, not words. When my W saw it she asked what was going on.
I told my W that our daughter is moving into that room before her 3rd bday (in January). My wife asked where she was supposed to sleep. I said that was not my problem but our daughter needs her own room. My daughter loves the color and is calling it her room now.

PERFECT. Well done!

Slarty, you moving your daughter to her room while W sleeps on the couch gives me an idea :-)

My W took over the living room, she calls it her "apartment" and has the kids recognizing it as such. Basically she's sleeping in a couch, and put some drawers for her clothes. What irks me about this is who odd it is, I had asked her to go sleep in one of the kids bedroom (I offered the MBR first, she said 'that's NOT MY (her) bed').

So she's right there in the front of the house taking that space. Problem is, we usually put the Christmas tree right there, and her drawers are getting in the way of the Christmas tree.

I really want to decorate with the kids, so I'm thinking of not kicking her out but at least rearranging that area to accommodate for the Christmas tree. Perfect time to do so is when she leaves on one of her weekend outings she does. Should I tell her that's my plan, or just do it?

It's going to irk her either way I think ...

Originally Posted by "Slarty"

I didnt tell my wife i was painting my daughters room, action, not words. When my W saw it she asked what was going on.

Impressive actions. I hope you had a good weekend.