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Posted By: Wolfman Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/11/19 08:54 PM
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2867989&page=11
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/14/19 12:25 PM
So yesterday I got a text from my w about who has the kids tomorrow and what time. Usually I do on Mondays but since last Wednesday was a holiday and I had them and then Monday is a holiday and I have them again she asked if she could have them for a little on Monday. I said that was fine. That conversation happened about a week ago. Then yesterday when she text me about what time we would each have the kids, we agreed on a time. I said great at the end. She then had the nerve to text me this:
You know not for nothing but a thank you here and there wouldnít kill you would it? Still to this day you take me for granted... very sad.
I replied I say thank you all the time. I said go back and look at all the texts.
She said: believe what you want.
I went back in the text messages and in the last week I said thank you 4 times. So I screenshot each one, circled the thank you and text her back. Of course no response. It just goes to show how much they rewrite history to fit their story. Itís also so sad how they truly donít see anything good in us, only the ďbadĒ or even make up the ďbadĒ. That was a perfect example of how she thinks I am this ďpersonĒ to justify her reason for wanting a divorce. Not for nothing I do t know why I even needed to say thank you we were coming up with a time for each of us to have the kids, if anything itís my day with the kids and she should be thanking me. This MLC is horrible how it messes with their minds. How it makes them ďhateĒ their spouse and make them believe that this person who was dedicated to them for so long to be this horrible person. I have known for a while that my w is ďgoneĒ. Things like this only confirms it more and more. I miss the woman I married, this ďnewĒ person is like nothing I have seen before. Just looks for anything to blame me for or get mad at me for.
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/14/19 12:38 PM
Spray her with Holy Water and see if she spontaneously combusts..lol...Its a victim mindset Wolf. We have it too because we are being left behind. Its hard to accept, but time and space like everyone says here. They as well as we, need to realize that we are the core of our issues and by giving time and space it only allows us the fortunate experiences of realizing such. (If we ever do?)

Question. If you validated her feelings...Do you think she would have responded differently? Obviously providing her with facts and logic that you said thank you 4 times didn't prompt an apology from her. To argue or even ask them. "How do you think I take you for granted?" Would probably only ensue an argument. Remember these are feelings and emotions you are dealing with here, with a side of narcissism and victimhood. Still doesn't mean she doesn't feel these things. Validate it. You don't have to agree with it, or prove her factually wrong. It will be good for you to learn, practice, and fine tune your emotional intelligence for yourself. What do you have to lose? You've already lost the M.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/14/19 01:57 PM
W,

IH nailed it and it has always been my frustration with you. You're a year in and claim to be a changed man but still make the same mistakes by trying to argue your points and use logic and reason. Perfect chance to validate her feelings and instead you probably pissed her off with the texts.

Be the lighthouse not the storm.
Posted By: AnotherStander Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/14/19 01:59 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
You know not for nothing but a thank you here and there wouldnít kill you would it? Still to this day you take me for granted... very sad.
I replied..."


DON'T REPLY. Just don't! She baited you into a good ol' round of fisticuffs and you took the bait.

Quote
I say thank you all the time. I said go back and look at all the texts.
She said: believe what you want.
I went back in the text messages and in the last week I said thank you 4 times. So I screenshot each one, circled the thank you and text her back.


{slaps forehead} So what purpose did this serve? Do you feel like you "won" the argument? No one wins an argument. Have you ever heard this saying... "Don't wrestle with a pig. You both end up dirty, and the pig likes it." I'm not saying your W is a pig by any means, but she WANTED you to engage. Some people need attention, they don't care whether it's positive or negative as long as it's focused on them. Quit feeding into her narrative!
Posted By: Thornton Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/14/19 02:10 PM
I love the pig analogy, AS. lol
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/14/19 03:51 PM
Originally Posted by AnotherStander
[quote=Wolfman]

DON'T REPLY. Just don't! She baited you into a good ol' round of fisticuffs and you took the bait.

{slaps forehead} So what purpose did this serve? Do you feel like you "won" the argument? No one wins an argument. Have you ever heard this saying... "Don't wrestle with a pig. You both end up dirty, and the pig likes it." I'm not saying your W is a pig by any means, but she WANTED you to engage. Some people need attention, they don't care whether it's positive or negative as long as it's focused on them. Quit feeding into her narrative!


^^^ Great analogy.

I think I was doing a poor job of summarizing earlier in my last post. What I was trying to really say is, and even though I am horrible at putting this into practice, is?... Ok here... Wolf if a co worker, friend, or associate that wasn't speaking to you, and was discontent with you, particularly if they were caught up in there emotions, came up to you one day and said: "You never thank me for anything, I feel so neglected and unappreciated! " Would you go through the trouble of circling 4 thank you's from a text message, to defend yourself, and your position to say "See... I say thank you all the time!" I know you have the urge to provide proof, and logic in doing so, to try and burst their delusional bubble. But in doing so, it dismisses their feelings. I kmow its hard to turn off the logic as a guy. But try putting someone else's feelings first before your own, and acknowledging theirs. Even if you know it not to be true. You are not there to be right or wrong, you are there to be empathetic, to put someone else's feelings before your own first, then depending on how the interaction goes, and if they are open to it, without giving unsolicited advice, challenge them on their thoughts and beliefs. Not everyone perceives the world the way we do, and we all have to be better understanding and practicing of that.

I wish I realized this a year ago, and I wish I did a better job at putting it into practice, I couldn't get it until now, and the only reason why I get it now is because I am just starting to turn the mirror on myself, and because of time and space.

I think a lot of us here, if we weren't so close to another person, (or used to be) wouldn't respond this way to someone who wasn't our spouse for several reasons. One being we aren't that close to their feelings and situation, two, we are somewhat emotionally removed from their emotions, and there situation, like an outside observer, three we are not as emotional attached, four there are no constants or absolutes as always and never in life, and five its easier to have compassion for someone when we step outside of ourselves, our self centeredness, and put someone elses experiences, emotions, feelings, and situation first. Its almost like you have to play the role of a therapist, or a disciple if you will... Know what I mean?
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/14/19 04:02 PM
Also Wolf. I don't mean to dismiss your feelings either. I totally get how you, how we all feel vilified, and the rewriting of marital history by our spouses for their unwarranted justifications for leaving. I totally agree with you. Hell I will gladly validate that and stand by it. But guess what? Notice something there? They are our feelings. That is the way we see the world through our experiences. Not everyone views the world that way. (Like our spouses.)

What if I said to you. Wolf you are wrong for feeling that our spouses vilify us, and their justifications are unwarranted and unmerrited? (See what I did there?)
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/14/19 05:29 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
She then had the nerve to text me this:
You know not for nothing but a thank you here and there wouldnít kill you would it? Still to this day you take me for granted... very sad.


Hi Wolf,

Is your goal to keep feeding the fire???? If so you are doing a great job.


Why do you have such a high need to be right? Why do you respond to these type of messages from your Wife? These are not questions to answer for us. They are questions for you to ask yourself and then decide that is is not important to be right. Decide that it does not even warrant a response.

It is just her pushing your buttons to get an emotional response from you. When she does this and you react, it is her controlling you.


LISTEN, there are 4 fingers pointing back at you while you are pointing at your W. We can see what you can not. Stop judging her. How hard is it for you to change your behavior? How much harder do you think it is to change someone elses behavior? She is not going to change until you change the way you interact with her. Even then, it will take her significantly longer. Why? Because you KNOW you need to change and she does not know she has to change. You have a whole team of people supporting you. She does not.


Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/15/19 05:04 PM
I validate her feelings all the time. I guess I am just tired of being the villain. Just once I wanted to prove to her I am not this monster she thinks I am. I know I am using logic and it gets nowhere, but for me I needed to. I was going to go any further with it. I was not going to go back and forth. I know itís against DB principles but I did it for me. Validating there just would have justified those feelings of hers that I ďdidĒ take her for granted. When that is completely false. Is it truly not ok for me to stand up for myself once and a while? This was the one time I had concrete proof that she is delusional. If it was about something I said and did with no proof I would have validated those feelings like I always have. And not for nothing, but her not relying back shows that she knows that she was wrong. So couldnít argue with the proof. Am I using logic, yes. Does that work with her, no. But it helps clear my conscious.

AS I love the pig analogy.

Itís funny when I told some of my friends what happened they all said good for me to show her how messed up in the head she is. Yet on here everyone says I am wrong. I agree with validating and I use it all the time now, not just with my w but my d and even my friends. So they understand that I understand how they feel. But once I a small while I think there is nothing wrong in standing up for myself. To say that she is wrong. I never said she shouldnít feel taken for granted but donít say Iím not doing something when I am.

Yesterday I went to pick up the kids, of course they werenít ready. I went in to tell them to bring their socks for the trampoline park I was going to bring them to. My w says they are dragging their butt and she has been trying to get them going for 2 hours. I responded that is very frustrating when they donít listen and arenít moving their butts. Then my d started to say she didnít want to go. I said I am taking you mini golfing and to the trampoline park, it will be a lot of fun. My w then said everytime you come around they are so difficult. I said I understand how that can frustrate you and they should not behaving that way. I told my w I will speak to the therapist about why they are difficult when they go from her to me. I told the kids letís go and we left. She then called me after 5 minutes while I was in the car, I was thinking we forgot something. Again she says to me I donít understand why when you come around they are so difficult and when they are just with me they are great. 2 things here: 1. She forgets that she tells me all the time how difficult they are for her. 2. She is trying to make it seem like it is my fault. I was not taking the bait. I just said that is hard on you. When they behave like that and I will speak to their therapist about the transition. So I can and do validate all the time. She was looking for an argument or for me to say it has nothing to do with me. She was setting me up and I didnít buy it.

So I know how to validate and when it was just with those text messages I needed to prove she was ďcrazyĒ but not so much for her but for me. That I do the right things and I am a good person.
Posted By: Thornton Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/15/19 05:21 PM
I can relate, Wolf.

I struggle with not defending myself as well. My W went on a smear campaign (again) after leaving me (again) and just bashed me to anyone who would listen. It took everything in me to not respond in kind and prove to everyone that they were being manipulated into choosing W's side.

Looking back, I am so thankful that I did not respond to W's character assassination of me. The truth will eventually come out. Also, I think in the end and once emotions calm down, W will look back and see that I maintained my integrity and she will realize that she lowered herself to talking sh*t about me. I would much rather be able to look back and feel proud of myself that I didn't take the bait.

So, don't respond to W when she baits you. It's all bullsh*t and doesn't deserve a response.
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/15/19 05:25 PM
Wolf I'm going to agree with everything you just said here. If that is the case. As far as the phone call after you left. It doesn't sound like memory issues being affected by overwhelming circumstances. It could be bait into an argument for attention from her. Or because she constantly says the same thing over and over practically every week. Maybe she is trying to inappropriately not only describe her experiences with the kids before you come over, but also in her own sense of reality and emotions, hint drop that the kids don't want to go with you and wind up acting difficult before you pick them up. I'm paraphrasing here. But As if to say " Gee Wolf? I can't seem go figure out why the kids always act up just before you pick them up? Do you? I Don't seem to have an issue with them... Isn't this pattern of behavior interesting?"
Sounds like blame shifting to me. You weren't there yet, had nothing to do with it, and had no control of the kids behavior before you arrived. So yeah. Keep acknowledging it, but don't take responsibility for it or justify it for her. I think you did a good job. Maybe you should ask her? Why do you think that is? But be prepared for any illogical answer you may get.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/15/19 05:31 PM
W,

Just a few comments:

I still donít think you understand the purpose of validation. Maybe something to read up on.

There is an old saying ďdo you want to be right or do you want to be marriedĒ. Why do you need to prove it to her to clear your conscious if you know your right?

Why do you need to speak to the therapist about the exchanges? Why do you talk to them?
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/15/19 05:35 PM
BTW, your W sounds like a narcissist and they will take any kind of attention including negative attention and nothing is ever their fault.
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/15/19 06:43 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
So I know how to validate and when it was just with those text messages I needed to prove she was ďcrazyĒ but not so much for her but for me.
I believe this interaction was much better. Do you?

The goal is not to be right. The goal is to make the interaction happen as quickly and smoothly as possible.


Focus on tactics and strategy with her. Document the interaction here (and/or in a journal). You can write down what YOUR truth is.

I always talked to the kids therapist about parenting issues. I weighted his advise EXTREMELY heavy. I would then use it during parenting convos.


H:"W, I talked to the therapist. He said the kids behavior is normal under these type of circumstances. He recommends Bla bla bla and I agree. What do you think?"
Posted By: Many worries Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/15/19 07:15 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
Yesterday I went to pick up the kids, of course they weren’t ready. I went in to tell them to bring their socks for the trampoline park I was going to bring them to. My w says they are dragging their butt and she has been trying to get them going for 2 hours. I responded that is very frustrating when they don’t listen and aren’t moving their butts. Then my d started to say she didn’t want to go. I said I am taking you mini golfing and to the trampoline park, it will be a lot of fun. My w then said everytime you come around they are so difficult. I said I understand how that can frustrate you and they should not behaving that way. I told my w I will speak to the therapist about why they are difficult when they go from her to me. I told the kids let’s go and we left. She then called me after 5 minutes while I was in the car, I was thinking we forgot something. Again she says to me I don’t understand why when you come around they are so difficult and when they are just with me they are great. 2 things here: 1. She forgets that she tells me all the time how difficult they are for her. 2. She is trying to make it seem like it is my fault. I was not taking the bait. I just said that is hard on you. When they behave like that and I will speak to their therapist about the transition. So I can and do validate all the time. She was looking for an argument or for me to say it has nothing to do with me. She was setting me up and I didn’t buy it.

So I know how to validate and when it was just with those text messages I needed to prove she was “crazy” but not so much for her but for me. That I do the right things and I am a good person.



I would have said something like, "Oh really, I never knew a child who was difficult some of the time. It must be nice knowing they are 100% perfect with you. Well it looks like I have some learning to do."

Validation
Posted By: AnotherStander Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/15/19 07:51 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
I guess I am just tired of being the villain. Just once I wanted to prove to her I am not this monster she thinks I am. I know I am using logic and it gets nowhere, but for me I needed to. I was going to go any further with it. I was not going to go back and forth. I know itís against DB principles but I did it for me. Validating there just would have justified those feelings of hers that I ďdidĒ take her for granted. When that is completely false. Is it truly not ok for me to stand up for myself once and a while? This was the one time I had concrete proof that she is delusional.


Sending your W screenshots with stuff circled, to you a point was made, but to her it just looks like you're being petty and that you have a need to be "right". If you listen and validate you're not AGREEING with her, that's the beauty of it! You don't agree or disagree, you just acknowledge that she feels a certain way and that it's her right to have feelings.

My girlfriend is extremely headstrong and stubborn, completely different from my XW. So in the last few years I have had to make some big adjustments. Early on if I felt she was wrong about something then I would try to "prove" to her why I thought so in nearly the same manner that you're doing. All it did was make matters worse. She would be PO'd and I certainly did not feel vindicated in any way. And as an added bonus it almost guaranteed there would be no intimacy for a while. What I've learned to do is validate, no matter how ridiculous her comments are. As a small example (but based on history it could have become a BIG fight), one time she got angry and said I "never" text her first in the morning, that she always has to text me first. I was thinking "what the H is she talking about?" I go back and look and 2 out of the previous 4 days I was the first to text good morning. So what did I say back to her? Well screenshots would have been tempting, LOL! But I told her I could understand how that would be frustrating and I would try harder. Sent her a good morning text the next day and she apologized and said she had been feeling bad the day before because her monthly was starting and she realized now that she was exaggerating. She also thanked me for being so understanding. Now THAT is a win!

At the end of the day I want a happy, loving relationship (and the intimacy that goes with it) more than I want to be "right".

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but her not relying back shows that she knows that she was wrong. So couldnít argue with the proof.


But how did it make her feel? She was probably really steamed about it. And that's what you want to avoid. If you being right results in her being angry, then you didn't win anything.

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Itís funny when I told some of my friends what happened they all said good for me to show her how messed up in the head she is.


Well it's your friends' job to validate you. She probably showed the texts to her friends and they all patted her on the back and told her she was right not to reply when you were being such a know-it-all jerk, right? On the other hand we are the neutral third parties. Her friends are biased towards her and telling her what she wants to hear. Your friends are doing the same for you. We try to help you see the bigger picture.

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Yet on here everyone says I am wrong.


Just to clarify, we're not saying you're "wrong". We are saying that keeping the peace requires you to be the lighthouse on the rock- solid and unmoving even when she's crashing her angry waves against you.

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My w then said everytime you come around they are so difficult. I said I understand how that can frustrate you and they should not behaving that way. I told my w I will speak to the therapist about why they are difficult when they go from her to me.


Great response!

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She then called me after 5 minutes while I was in the car, I was thinking we forgot something. Again she says to me I donít understand why when you come around they are so difficult and when they are just with me they are great. 2 things here: 1. She forgets that she tells me all the time how difficult they are for her. 2. She is trying to make it seem like it is my fault. I was not taking the bait. I just said that is hard on you. When they behave like that and I will speak to their therapist about the transition. So I can and do validate all the time.


Good.

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She was looking for an argument or for me to say it has nothing to do with me. She was setting me up and I didnít buy it.


Don't assume conspiracies around her actions. She has health problems that affect her memory, correct? Maybe she really did forget the convo. You did the right thing in repeating the validation, that's all you need to do. Repeat, then hang up.
Posted By: sandi2 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/15/19 08:51 PM
Quote
She was looking for an argument or for me to say it has nothing to do with me. She was setting me up and I didnít buy it.


I suspect this method has worked in producing arguments over which one is correct. Is this really about proving she is wrong, you are right, or that it has nothing to do with you? I suggest you have this overwhelming urge just to prove to her that you are not the bad guy she tries to paint. You feel like the villain b/c of your own mindset. Stop buying into that mentality. Have more self value, self confidence than needing to "prove" or "defend" yourself. Like MWD says, choose your battles wisely. Is this really the hill you want to die on?

I don't doubt that she was looking for an argument, but it was more about pushing your buttons. She uses this method b/c it works so well. Even if you are able to show her in black & white that she is wrong.........you still lose. The way I suggest you try is to let it run off your back like water. Let it go, Wolf. ((hugs))
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/17/19 01:51 PM
Originally Posted by LH19
W,
There is an old saying ďdo you want to be right or do you want to be marriedĒ. Why do you need to prove it to her to clear your conscious if you know your right?


You are right. I just feel like I let her get away with everything so she probably thinks she is right all the time. Which usually I donít care. But I was just tired of her making me out to be a villain and I wanted to realize I am not. I know, logic doesnít work. I have heard that saying recently and wish I knew that saying a long time ago. I donít want to be right I want to be married. But itís too late for that.

Originally Posted by LH19
BTW, your W sounds like a narcissist and they will take any kind of attention including negative attention and nothing is ever their fault.


I think she always was a little selfish, but she has really pushed the limits. She has actually told me she just wants to be free and do what she wants and when she wants. She doesnít want to have to answer to anyone anymore. I get that, we have been married since we were 25. She was a mother at 28. So now she feels like itís her time, I just would t expect it at the expense of the family. But thatís just my way of thinking hers is very different, obviously.


Originally Posted by IHCLACS

Sounds like blame shifting to me. You weren't there yet, had nothing to do with it, and had no control of the kids behavior before you arrived. So yeah. Keep acknowledging it, but don't take responsibility for it or justify it for her.


Right now everything seems to be my fault. It use to really bother me and I would try to explain why it wasnít. Now I know that is just how she is right now, global warming is my fault too. So for those times she blames me for ridiculous things I just validate. The kids acting up before I get there is ridiculous to me and I know I have nothing to do with it.

Originally Posted by Ready2Change

The goal is not to be right. The goal is to make the interaction happen as quickly and smoothly as possible.?"


I am going to work hard on making the interactions as quickly and smooth as possible. I am so tired of all of this. Unfortunately this is never going to go away.

AS A lot to quote there. At the end of the day I want a happy, loving relationship (and the intimacy that goes with it) more than I want to be "right". As I agree with this now. Unfortunately there is no more intimacy between us, I just want peace I donít want to interact with her anymore. But if I do, quick and peaceful. I will try and be the lighthouse but unfortunately her boat has crashed. She is ďgoneĒ, the woman I married no longer exists. But I will remain strong.

Originally Posted by sandi2
Quote
She was looking for an argument or for me to say it has nothing to do with me. She was setting me up and I didnít buy it.


I suspect this method has worked in producing arguments over which one is correct. Is this really about proving she is wrong, you are right, or that it has nothing to do with you? I suggest you have this overwhelming urge just to prove to her that you are not the bad guy she tries to paint. You feel like the villain b/c of your own mindset. Stop buying into that mentality. Have more self value, self confidence than needing to "prove" or "defend" yourself. Like MWD says, choose your battles wisely. Is this really the hill you want to die on?


You are right I want to know I am not a bad guy. LH has told me numerous times logic doesnít work. I am tired of her making me out to be the villain and that any problem we had in our marriage was all my fault. She Makes it out to be that she was perfect. So yeah after a while I get fed up with all the accusations. But I keep ďspeaking Chinese to someone who understands English.Ē
Posted By: AnotherStander Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/17/19 02:28 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
AS A lot to quote there. At the end of the day I want a happy, loving relationship (and the intimacy that goes with it) more than I want to be "right". As I agree with this now. Unfortunately there is no more intimacy between us, I just want peace I donít want to interact with her anymore.


I do understand that, but what I mean is in ALL our relationships (friends, family, coworkers, clients) it's better to let go of the need to be "right" in favor of maintaining a relationship on good terms. This was a big 180 for me because before BD I wanted to be "right" to a fault, and I wanted to prove my point until everyone admitted I was right. but even when they did it didn't bring any sense of "victory", it just made me realize how stubborn I was being about it. So like I said before, validation is a handy tool because you're not pushing your agenda to be "right", nor are you admitting you are wrong. It's a neutral, non-confrontational stance. It has made my relationship with my GF much better, and has also improved my relationships with all other people in my life.

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I will try and be the lighthouse but unfortunately her boat has crashed. She is ďgoneĒ, the woman I married no longer exists. But I will remain strong.


That's all you can do. You can't bring the old her back, although she may come back some day on her own. So you be the best "you" that you can be.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/22/19 01:44 PM
AS Thank you for that.
Not sure what I was suppose to do yesterday. So yesterday it was my day with the kids. At 8:10 I brought them back to the house like I always do. And I always put them to bed been doing that even before the split. When I went upstairs I noticed 3 boxes of my stuff that she packed up. My heart just dropped. I know this is coming but every step closer is making it real. Denial stinks!! The kids went into the bedroom where she was and sat down with her on the floor. They started to watch a show on tv. So I said that my stuff in the boxes? She said yeah but you donít have to take it today. You can take it when you have a chance. I said ok. Normally she makes the kids go to bed because it was their bedtime but she let them sit there with her. I did not want to wait there, so I went over to my kids gave them a big hug and a kiss and left. No sooner I get into my car she texts me, ďWhat happened?Ē I said ďnothing, why?Ē She said you seemed off. I said I just miss my family. She replied Iím sorry, didnít want it to be this way. So I didnít respond anymore. Then about an hour later she text me, ďyou ok?Ē I wrote no not really. She wrote, why today? I simply said we are getting close to the end of our marriage. Going to bed now have a good night. She text me ok with a sad face.

Seeing my stuff boxed up really got to me. I know it had to happen sooner or later. Just hard to see this really happening. I also just wanted to tell her the truth that I did miss my family. All the other times I try and act happy and that everything is wonderful, this time I could not hide it. I didnít even know why she asked if I was ok? I donít want the divorce and she knows that, and now you just packed up all my stuff and are basically throwing me out of our house. She expect me to be happy about this????
Posted By: curtis7 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/22/19 02:05 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
I think she always was a little selfish, but she has really pushed the limits. She has actually told me she just wants to be free and do what she wants and when she wants. She doesnít want to have to answer to anyone anymore. I get that, we have been married since we were 25. She was a mother at 28. So now she feels like itís her time, I just would t expect it at the expense of the family. But thatís just my way of thinking hers is very different, obviously.
Wolf, you are describing my W, itís like they are twins separated at birth. Or reading from the same script at least.

I feel for you on missing your family. Once divorced it is gone forever. You may be family, but not a family. Stay strong Wolf. Your W is missing out on a good man. One day she may realize what she gave up. Good luck.
Posted By: Thornton Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/22/19 02:25 PM
That's tough, Wolf.

I know how hard it is to see that stuff, it makes everything seem so final.

I can vividly recall going through the same thing during my BD's with W. Every time she left me, she would change her Facebook profile pic, load up all her stuff and clothes, start partying and posting all kinds of pics on Facebook like she didn't have a care in the world. Luckily for me, I never reacted to any of that stuff and she ended up coming back 3x.

So, just because things seem so final, it doesn't make it true.

Lastly, dude you have to stop with the "miss my family" texts etc. When you do that, you actually make it easier for your W to detach from you. You have to come from a position of strength (Even though you don't feel strong at all) because you want your W to start to second guess herself. Stop acting sad, and start acting like you had an epiphany and now realize things are going to be good for you with or without W.

Show (not tell) your W that she is making a mistake, because you are now a man only a fool would leave.
Posted By: ovrrnbw Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/22/19 02:36 PM
Wolf,

good job at keeping the interaction short. If D seems imminent, perhaps consider not responding to statements, only questions.

Quote
No sooner I get into my car she texts me, ďWhat happened?Ē I said ďnothing, why?Ē She said you seemed off. I said I just miss my family. She replied Iím sorry, didnít want it to be this way. So I didnít respond anymore. Then about an hour later she text me, ďyou ok?Ē I wrote no not really. She wrote, why today? I simply said we are getting close to the end of our marriage. Going to bed now have a good night. She text me ok with a sad face.


I would save these types of open hearted convos for someone who values you, not for someone who does not want a R with you. I wouldn't eschew these convos to be mean, but only to be real.

Quote
She has actually told me she just wants to be free and do what she wants and when she wants. She doesnít want to have to answer to anyone anymore.

Quote
So now she feels like itís her time, I just would t expect it at the expense of the family.


I felt this way just yesterday. Mainly it was because I didn't want to do what my W wanted to do. Feelings come and go. I realized I was being dumb. Just validate those feelings. I mean, wouldn't it be nice to have less responsibility? You should have just asked her what beach she'd like to be on then? A lot of times we just want to play this fantasy out loud for a few moments. Entertain it and it passes. Try to explain it away and it becomes something negative.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/22/19 03:34 PM
Curtis where are you at in your relationship? You can share a little on here. I will try and get to your story.

Originally Posted by Thornton

Lastly, dude you have to stop with the "miss my family" texts etc. When you do that, you actually make it easier for your W to detach from you. You have to come from a position of strength (Even though you don't feel strong at all) because you want your W to start to second guess herself. Stop acting sad, and start acting like you had an epiphany and now realize things are going to be good for you with or without W.

Show (not tell) your W that she is making a mistake, because you are now a man only a fool would leave.


I hear you. The reason why I said that was because when we first got separated I was very upset, even cried in front of her. You what she said back then, I didnít know you cared that much, I had no idea this would hurt you this much. So I guess I want her to understand that this still bothers me, that I love my family. I know LH is going to yell at me because that is me using logic and they donít. I just donít ever want to hear her say I thought you wanted the d too. Or you seemed fine with us getting d thatís why she kept at it. Or something along those lines, I think you get what I am saying.

Originally Posted by ovrrnbw

I mean, wouldn't it be nice to have less responsibility? You should have just asked her what beach she'd like to be on then? A lot of times we just want to play this fantasy out loud for a few moments. Entertain it and it passes. Try to explain it away and it becomes something negative.


She is definitely living in a fantasy. I know itís starting to catch up with her. Especially the financial aspect. She said she is now doing tutoring. She said that was something she would never do in the past. She thinks by running away from me life is going to be easy and fun and she can do what she wants. I donít know when and if ever, she will realize this is not what itís cracked up to be.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/22/19 04:37 PM
W,

First off I am sorry you are having a rough time. Second off I donít yell at you I try to explain whatís going on.

Right now you are still operating under the illusion of action where you still believe you can say or do the right magical thing to stop your pain. Unfortunately like we have told you in the past it doesnít work that way and in fact she this is reinforcing her that she is making the right decision.

So the crock of bs she gave you early on about not knowing you ďcared so muchĒ you are going to believe? Even though we tell you donít believe anything they say and half of what they do. Deep down you donít believe it but you rationalize it because you want a reason to pursue.

Lastly, as I have discussed in the past she is thinking on emotions and the way she feels now is how she believes she will always feel. However we all know itís not true. Why? Because feelings and emotions change. So because you begged and pleaded on bomb drop she thinks youíre always gonna feel that way. The minute she knows she canít have you back, thatís when sheíll start to rethink things.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/23/19 03:06 PM
Originally Posted by LH19
W,
Lastly, as I have discussed in the past she is thinking on emotions and the way she feels now is how she believes she will always feel. However we all know itís not true. Why? Because feelings and emotions change. So because you begged and pleaded on bomb drop she thinks youíre always gonna feel that way. The minute she knows she canít have you back, thatís when sheíll start to rethink things.


Thatís the hard part for me. For so long she made me believe all I cared about was myself and that I was selfish. I know now I wasnít at all. Did I do things for myself once and a while, sure, but there is nothing wrong with that. She had me believe for so long doing things for myself, like going to the gym or going fishing 3 times a year was horrible. So I have to retrain myself to think differently. So, you are right I have to detach better and distance myself. Itís so counterintuitive. Itís funny the minute I donít cater to her she starts with how selfish I am, or vindictive. And Iím not going to lie it reels me back in. I need to do a better job.
Posted By: ovrrnbw Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/23/19 04:05 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman

Originally Posted by ovrrnbw

I mean, wouldn't it be nice to have less responsibility? You should have just asked her what beach she'd like to be on then? A lot of times we just want to play this fantasy out loud for a few moments. Entertain it and it passes. Try to explain it away and it becomes something negative.


She is definitely living in a fantasy. I know itís starting to catch up with her. Especially the financial aspect. She said she is now doing tutoring. She said that was something she would never do in the past. She thinks by running away from me life is going to be easy and fun and she can do what she wants. I donít know when and if ever, she will realize this is not what itís cracked up to be.


What if she's right? My W would have been right. I treated her poorly. She lost respect for me and had enough of my crap. I can do 100 times better than I was doing, and that means that literally almost anyone could have treated her better. I think that's just taking responsibility for how bad of a H I was. I haven't read your whole thread so I don't know what's going on exactly but think about it. That's why you need to worrying about your side of the fence.

If she truly is in lala land you can't do anything about it but make it worse. So stop doing what doesn't work. But maybe she is right, that the person you were being may have been hurting, or not communicating well, or arguing silly points, and was going to hold her back from happiness. Is there anything there that you can make positive growth on?
Posted By: 44tries2 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/23/19 05:09 PM
Wolf, I literally could have written your last post myself.

Ovr, you make some great points. It is very difficult when you have been manipulated to believe you are the bad guy. And that is the part of Wolf's post that I related to. Being told over and over again how selfish I was, when in reality I was trying so hard to compensate for this apparent deficiency that I was just catering and giving up everything in order to not be "selfish".

It is important to be able to identify the real areas needing positive growth, because we all have them and have not been perfect Hs. But I warn you and encourage you, Wolf. Don't approach it from your W's narrative and start going down the road of believing everything she claims about you. I know how easy it is. Work on knowing and trusting yourself and identifying your true areas needing work, from the place where you know your truth and your W has not infected it.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/23/19 09:24 PM
OVERRNBW look do you really believe you treated her badly? Or did she convince you of that. Look no one is perfect and it looks like they wanted the ďperfectĒ husband. There is no such thing and just like we did, take the good with the bad. Was your w ďperfectĒ? I would assume not yet you loved her and stuck by. Can we always improve and be better? Sure. But m is about compromise and learning to take the good with the bad. I did everything for my w. I did the food shopping, cleaning, landscaping, bills, pick up the kids from school, help them with their hw, balance the check book and cleaned up after dinner. I have 2 careers and always put my family first. Yet she says I took her for granted and did not love her. All those things I did to help her and because I loved her. Then if I asked her to put her stuff away because itís been out for 2 months I was horrible and put pressure on her and didnít appreciate her. Give me a break. I get thatís how she feels and she is entitled to her feelings but there is nothing more I could have done. Anytime she asked for help I ran. Then she has the nerve to say when she would get home from work I didnít greet her at the door all the time. What am I a puppy dog??? This is one of the BIG reasons she wants the divorce.

You asked if there is anything I could make positive growth on, sure I guess the way I speak and phrase things. I speak bluntly and I guess that was hard for her when we got older. I always spoke that way and she was fine with it for 20 years. But sometimes she said I was mean how I asked her things. So fine, I will work on that. Honestly I was Mr. Niceguy for so long not anymore. I will focus on me and what makes me happy.

Originally Posted by 44tries2
Wolf, I literally could have written your last post myself.

Ovr, you make some great points. It is very difficult when you have been manipulated to believe you are the bad guy. And that is the part of Wolf's post that I related to. Being told over and over again how selfish I was, when in reality I was trying so hard to compensate for this apparent deficiency that I was just catering and giving up everything in order to not be "selfish".

It is important to be able to identify the real areas needing positive growth, because we all have them and have not been perfect Hs. But I warn you and encourage you, Wolf. Don't approach it from your W's narrative and start going down the road of believing everything she claims about you. I know how easy it is. Work on knowing and trusting yourself and identifying your true areas needing work, from the place where you know your truth and your W has not infected it.

I hear you. I gave up so much to make her happy. Any complaint I acknowledged and tried to help her. I started to go to the gym at 8:30 at night to help her out the kids to bed. She complained that I played flag football so I quit, she complained about me playing baseball so I quit. And yet look where it got me... here. Getting d. I gave up my life for this family and just like your w 44tries my w would call me selfish. She even had the nerve to complain that when I would go to work and she had to watch the kids she would complain that I left her and she had to watch the kids. I was going to work.

Today I was eating lunch with some colleagues who happen to be female. One lost her husband to a heart attack 7 years ago and another to suicide 8 months ago. They were saying some real interesting things. How they love being alone, that they can come and go as the please, no one to answer to, they can eat what they want and when they want it, they will never get married again. Both these women are in their 40s. I asked you donít want a companion? Both said no they donít want to be tied down, they enjoy their freedom and their kids. Is this a new ďbugĒ that a lot of women get? I have spoke to a few others who said they just love being single and not having to answer to anyone. Is it no one wants to work on anything? That we have become a culture of very selfish people? That we want what we want and no one else will tell us otherwise? What is going on today? Sorry for the ramble but I have a lot on my chest and I am just getting angry!!! Thanks for listening!!
Posted By: ovrrnbw Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/23/19 09:42 PM
I feel your pain Wolfman! I know you're mad. Mad is another way of saying you're hurting. I've been there.

Originally Posted by Wolfman
OVERRNBW look do you really believe you treated her badly?


I know I did. You probably weren't as bad as me, but here I am with my W again.

Originally Posted by Wolfman
I did everything for my w. I did the food shopping, cleaning, landscaping, bills, pick up the kids from school, help them with their hw, balance the check book and cleaned up after dinner. I have 2 careers and always put my family first. Yet she says I took her for granted and did not love her.


This story is as old as time. All that stuff you did goes right out the door when she feels unloved, uncherished! When you guys started dating, is this how you wooed her? Or were you going out and having fun, talking on the phone, learning about each other, teasing each other, playing slap n' tickle? I think I know which one!!!!

Originally Posted by Wolfman
You asked if there is anything I could make positive growth on, sure I guess the way I speak and phrase things. I speak bluntly and I guess that was hard for her when we got older. I always spoke that way and she was fine with it for 20 years. But sometimes she said I was mean how I asked her things.


Your attitude comes off as this is not that big of a deal, but how we say things matters more than what we say. You're ultimately the one who has to live with it, either way.

Originally Posted by Wolfman
Is this a new ďbugĒ that a lot of women get? I have spoke to a few others who said they just love being single and not having to answer to anyone.
Believe nothing they say and only half of what they do....maybe they are still heartbroken, maybe no one is interested, maybe they are lying? Women tell men they aren't ready to date and then the right guy comes along two seconds later and they're ready for him.
Posted By: LovingIt Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/23/19 09:51 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman

...
Today I was eating lunch with some colleagues who happen to be female. One lost her husband to a heart attack 7 years ago and another to suicide 8 months ago. They were saying some real interesting things. How they love being alone, that they can come and go as the please, no one to answer to, they can eat what they want and when they want it, they will never get married again. Both these women are in their 40s. I asked you donít want a companion? Both said no they donít want to be tied down, they enjoy their freedom and their kids. Is this a new ďbugĒ that a lot of women get? I have spoke to a few others who said they just love being single and not having to answer to anyone. Is it no one wants to work on anything? That we have become a culture of very selfish people? That we want what we want and no one else will tell us otherwise? What is going on today? Sorry for the ramble but I have a lot on my chest and I am just getting angry!!! Thanks for listening!!
...


Just my 2 cents...

1. They lost their H... not wanting to be in start a new MR with someone else is not necessarily the same as them wanting to leave their H or MR.

2. Times are different today... in a lot of situations both spouses work with relatively equal paying jobs, so W don't necessarily need a bread earner anymore, where as back in the day, a lot of W may stay in bad abusive MR because they are financially dependent.
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/23/19 10:24 PM

Hi Wolf,

Do you think W thinks of you differently now?

Do you think she misses you?

Have you made significant changes to the way you interact with her?
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 01:15 AM
Originally Posted by Ready2Change

Hi Wolf,

Do you think W thinks of you differently now?

Do you think she misses you?

Have you made significant changes to the way you interact with her?


I do think she thinks of me differently. She has said a few times, I see how you have changed. That I am more calm and listen a lot better. More loving all around with the kids.

As far as her missing me, I doubt it. Or at least thatís what she shows me. The way I interact with her, thatís a tough one. I am kinda torn. Sometimes I joke around with her but then I feel like that is pursuing so I stop but then it seems like I am cold. So I just try to be neutral. There are so many conflicting articles and podcasts on how you should interact with an ex. I donít know whatís right and whatís wrong. I just know I am coming to the end of my rope with her. Like many people have said, why should I keep giving when I am getting nothing in return. Someone else deserves that love and attention and I deserve it back. I deserve so much better. And even though you all have told me that this is how she feels ďright nowĒ may not be that way a week from now, or a month or a year. Which could very well be true but I donít want to wait anymore.

Originally Posted by LovingIt
Originally Posted by Wolfman

...
Today I was eating lunch with some colleagues who happen to be female. One lost her husband to a heart attack 7 years ago and another to suicide 8 months ago. They were saying some real interesting things. How they love being alone, that they can come and go as the please, no one to answer to, they can eat what they want and when they want it, they will never get married again. Both these women are in their 40s. I asked you donít want a companion? Both said no they donít want to be tied down, they enjoy their freedom and their kids. Is this a new ďbugĒ that a lot of women get? I have spoke to a few others who said they just love being single and not having to answer to anyone. Is it no one wants to work on anything? That we have become a culture of very selfish people? That we want what we want and no one else will tell us otherwise? What is going on today? Sorry for the ramble but I have a lot on my chest and I am just getting angry!!! Thanks for listening!!
...

2. Times are different today... in a lot of situations both spouses work with relatively equal paying jobs, so W don't necessarily need a bread earner anymore, where as back in the day, a lot of W may stay in bad abusive MR because they are financially dependent.

Today times are different. Iím sorry for what I am about to say but the whole idea of both parents working is what ruined families. Look I know today unfortunately both have to work most of the time because of how expensive everything is. But not having one parent around to raise their children has been horrible. And with social media itís ďkillingĒ relationships. Many people think they are missing out on something because what other people post, or their life is not that exciting. I know social media is one of the ruination of my m. My w was constantly comparing out life to everyone elseís. Thatís all I ever heard about. How so and so did this or so and so would do that. And I would tell her that is not always true what they post and we do have a great life. But she was blinded by FB. I wish I could sue them for ruining my m!!!
Posted By: LovingIt Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 01:58 AM
Originally Posted by Wolfman

...
And with social media itís ďkillingĒ relationships. Many people think they are missing out on something because what other people post, or their life is not that exciting. I know social media is one of the ruination of my m. My w was constantly comparing out life to everyone elseís. Thatís all I ever heard about. How so and so did this or so and so would do that. And I would tell her that is not always true what they post and we do have a great life. But she was blinded by FB. I wish I could sue them for ruining my m!!!
...


Smart phones have also impacted relationships - both good and bad. In one way it helps people connect digitally, but also people are more distracted in person. I know my WW and myself would often sit around and be on our phones browsing newsfeed / social media, or checking e-mail, instead of living in the moment with each other. Not to mention all the secure messaging makes it easier to start casually messaging OP.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 12:16 PM
W,

So Facebook ruined your life WTF??? Based on the info you gave here over the last year IMO your relationship dynamic "ruined your life". You were together for 8 years before you had kids am I am guessing life was pretty good then you were probably doing things as a couple, you were playing softball going to the gym and she probably had her own things going on. Then you had kids and early on it was great your guys were new parents and you were doing family things and life was great. Kids start getting older and your W takes on the role as the main caretaker for the kids and most of her attention goes to the children. Suddenly Wolf is number 3 on the list and he's not getting his needs met. So he doubles down on the housework, grocery shopping, yard work, stops playing baseball and going to the gym. Now as for your W, she doesn't want a butler she wants a H who understands her, appreciates her, listens to her and treats her special. So now Wolf is getting bitter that he is doing all these things and he is still not getting his needs met so he tries even harder to make her happy and takes another job for 5 vacations a year. Guess what she's still not getting what she needs and Wolf is still not getting what he needs. W can't figure out how wolf can be so stupid to not know what she needs. He should know! So now the passive aggressive comments are thrown at wolf and he doesn't stand up for himself or argues with her to defend himself. W loses more respect for him because he allows the disrespect and guess what now his daughter is starting to take notice. Wolf gets reinforcements from his friends and friends wives "I don't get it you do everything around the house, yard, take her on all these vacations how can she not be happy?". So now Wolf is sure it's her or MLC or something. Outsiders never know what truly is going on inside. If that was the key to happiness rich people would never get divorced. So now youre two people who are angry, bitter about not getting your needs met and it came to a point that your W is done. IMO you're both equally unhappy it's just that you're identity is REALLY tied to being married and you're able to think logically about time with kids, finances and without working hard on yourself you will more then likely end up in the same dynamic again.

My story is the same in that my ex and I were two people who had no clue on how to communicate and meet each other's needs while on the outside seeming to have it all.

My advice to you is stop blaming, Facebook, MLC, the fact that your W can support herself and doesn't need you to take care of her financially and learn from your mistakes. Learn to listen, communicate, command respect and stay away from covert contracts.

The beauty of it all is those things will be what brings her back.

Lastly, if you can have zero expectations, be playful with your W if you want. You should be playful with all women and it's good practice for you.
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 12:25 PM
Been saying this for months with the smartphone, the FB, The politics, news feeds, reality shows, tv media distractions, the fact that once they ain't feeling it, they are one click away from replacing you...Too many choices...They have 100's of dating apps at their disposal. My M started going to hell once the smartphones got into our home around 2015. Nothing but distraction and lack of connection. Add to that the two income trap in our society. Wolf the two "widows" in their 40's who are absolutely loving their freedom. It just goes to show you how we are utilitarians, for what we can provide. Children, life insurance, financial security, experiences, travel, being social, spending time with the only people they may ever love unconditionally, their kids. They get a whiff of what life "could be like" from influences like social media, reality shows, tv, Rom Coms, their friends, everything is a comparison to you and what you bring to the table. Its a deluded sense of reality to them on a hamster wheel of "the grass is greener" compartmentalized into check boxes.

Does he do this for me _✔ Does he make me feel this way about myself? ✔ Does he provide this experience ? ✔ Does he still make me laugh? ✔ Does he greet me everyday at the door with his tail wagging? ✔ Is he boring? ✔ Can I do better? ✔ Do I know my worth and does he provide it? ✔ What would life be like 5 years from now with him if I stayed based on current behavior and conditions? ✔ Are we still compatible? ✔ Why does he spend so much time on his own personal pursuits and doesn't pay attention to me? Does he fulfil my expectations? ✔ Is it me or is it him? ✔ Is he romantic? ✔ Does he spend money on me to have a good time? ✔ XYZ's husband does/feels this this and that for his wife. ✔ Can I do better? ✔ I'm not feeling emotions from or for him and not feeling sexual torwards him? ✔ Is it him or is it me? ✔ I don't feel romantical anymore. Maybe I should google articles on it, seek therapy, and talk with GF's and family about it?† (More validation justifying their viewpoint from a biased perspective) Do I trust him? Well he doesn't make me feel XYZ so it must mean I don't. Are his actions consistent? Is their another man out there or hobby/lifestyle/person that can fulfil my needs? What do I want to do with my life if this is all there is? ✔ How much responsibility does he handle in comparison to what I think I do? Why doesn't he put me first above his family, activities, and passions? Are we growing together? Does he fulfil my desires? Is he as thoughtful as I am with romantical gifts?

Its amazing when you look at bigger picture how they are completely smitten, always in the mood for sex when you first meet them, they think you are an independent go getter who is new and exciting, spontaneous, mysterious and interesting,† they want a relationship, they want marriage, they have been 8 are you expected to be an entertaining dancing monkey consistently? Either you are the steward of the relationship, or they are. And when they are. Expect the list if expectations to be never ending and never satisfied.

I'm only illustrating this to show a comparison and exaggeration botg Men's and Women's though processes, feelings, logic, emotions, and perspective can EASILY SABOTAGE A RELATIONSHIP. Im not saying we are all like that, that the generalizations are all the same, but it is a learning tool of how to relate to how they think much differently from us† In her mind, once the rings come off she has checked out. Once she removes her emotional attachment from you, she pulls away like a stranger. In your mind it isn't over until the D papers are signed. In your mind. This radical change in behavior makes you feel betrayed and you can't understand what is going on and for what reasons. In your mind logically you know with enough patience, skill set, active communication, and willingness to understand a future M could be great. In your mind, all this undesirable change and lifestyle change provokes an insecurity in you that you can't even begin to imagine, for you're future, your kids, your family and life.

Complacency, distractions, resentments, comparisons, money, difference of opinion, your self worth, theirs, expectations (realistic or unrealistic) trust, lack of follow through, provisions, considerations, attitude, etc. All are wants and needs and are relationship killers. We live in a microwave culture where it's right now, quick, entitled, disposable, unsatisfied, ungrateful, neglected, misunderstood, me, me, me. I want I want I want, I deserve I deserve I deserve.

Let me guess?† As a guy? The only thing that is probably going through your mind when you walk through that door every day is something like this?: Hi. Are the kids fed, Im hungry what's for dinner? Are the bills paid? Will I get few hours to relax to watch baseball and spend time with the kids? Peace quiet and freedom. Can I help with anything dear?† I have a report tomorrow I have to finish and papers and lesson plans to grade. I'm in the mood tonight. Am I going to get any? I have to clean/mow the lawn, fix the pool, attend PTA, come up with the plan vacation, etc. do do do go to go... If you had a bad day and it has nothing to do with them, They take it personally. (Your grumpy) If they have a bad day, you take it personally. Arguments, $hit tests, logic vs. reasoning, misunderstandings, nagging, criticalness, insensitivity, invalidating, desire to cheat, demands, continuous violation of boundaries, unsolicited advice, power struggles, all these things both sides are guilty of and we never see their side until its too late. So learn ftom it. I know this is hard to accept but she will never love you unconditionally for you and vice versa. Romantic relationships have performance conditions. Just the way it is.

Is it any wonder why we all feel neglected and think we can do, deserve better? Welcome to life in the 21st century. Its hard to make time to keep the spark going which they rely on to maintain feelings for you, and have appreciation and value.

You see? In the beginning the courtship was exciting, the newness was exciting, the thought that it would always remain the same when you got married was a prospect. They emotionally† wanted to marry you and you them. The honeymoon phase. But tgthenen the trials of life and test of commitment really reared its ugly head. I bet the first 3 to 5 years of being married were great. Then around the 6th or 7th year real life set in. Family issues health issues, self esteem issues, money issues, etc. This is where real commitment comes in. A lot of people today have been conditioned to quit and move on if something isn't serving them. To start over and rebuild if they're not feeling it. To question compatibility, etc. Its human nature to serve our own interests. I bet you felt as though around a certain time in the marriage you've got a bait and switch scenario. Men marry for personality, sex and children. Women marry for resources, children, and social status. One is practical the other is emotional. I think a lot of them don't want to be tied down in late 30's early 40's because they want to do more with their lives other than be a mother, wife, worker, etc. Hence the MLC. We are both losing our youth and questioning what we have done with our lives and where it is going? Its short sighted at best. That's why they change their minds much later if they ever do.

My advise. Get red pilled on relationships today. Watch for the red flags. Learn from your mistakes, correct them, and use them to better yourself, avoid the pitfalls you fell into, setup a new life for yourself (You can't wallow in negative change that is not benefiting you any longer.) detach, self differentiate, grow, move forward. Learn more about the opposite sex, current times and trends, try not to let it make you bitter, forgive them and yourself, give you and them time and space as feelings change. Realize just how different we all think individually and how the opposite think. There are generalizations to look for but there are also individual characteristics to that we are unique. Again learn learn learn and try and keep it balanced. Don't let it make you bitter. They validate abd justify their side, we validate and justify ours. Somewhere we have to learn to view the world through the other side's lense to really understand one another and why we do, act, feel, what we do.
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 12:34 PM
LH19 is right take accountability and responsibility for your own decisions and actions. Realize what got you here in the first place and change them. It's one thing to realize what outside influences can impact things it's another thing to realize how you play a role in things directly we can't shift the blame on to outside influences all the time. We are only responsible for our own choices thoughts and decisions
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 12:44 PM
Well I guess you guys are right. None of us should ever get in another relationship again because someone on FB is always going to have a better one.

Google: Abundance vs Lack mentality
Posted By: ovrrnbw Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 01:19 PM
Thanks LH,

I was going to type something out but that sums it up.

Wolfman, I think you might be well served to work on detachment from these things you mentioned that are bothering you. In time (several months) you may start to see things differently and you will be happier.
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 01:30 PM
Originally Posted by LH19
Well I guess you guys are right. None of us should ever get in another relationship again because someone on FB is always going to have a better one.

Google: Abundance vs Lack mentality


LH19 not sure what you're implying by that or what kind of meaning you're assigning to it? I don't see what Facebook has to do with having another relationship after the last one has failed? What I am saying though in my last post is that it is a distraction. it can be a relationship killer if you're constantly glued to your phone and not interacting with another person in the same household that you share for whatever reason that might be. Some people falsely use it as a comparative of their lives to others. Some use it just to waste and kill time. Some use it to search out other people. Some people use it to organize events and stay proactive and certain things some people use it to promote their business. The point that I was trying to make is. we reach out from work connections with strangers on a daily basis than we do with the people that are closest to us, or so we thought so I'm naming it as a relationship killer. We are going from a virtual world with many options into reality with some options. Online dating is practically a meat market. Swipe right swipe left we're practically people shopping. Instead of walking up to someone of interest organically and having a conversation with them whether they are sharing our interest or complete strangers. What I'm trying to say is the very thing that we are pursuing on social media is a very thing we wind up not just going out in the world and doing. it's more talk and sharing of opinions and values that it is I'm actually going out into the world and sharing experiences and getting to know someone organically. Also the standards that people put up on their profiles, and also the delusion of that even though what this person's likes may share some of our values they may actually not when we meet them in real life. Having the same Hobbies passions and interest doesn't necessarily mean you share the same values with another person. Also disqualifying People based on their status attractiveness looks lifestyle in a virtual world wind up having the opposite effect of what you're there for in the first place. You are there to meet people and you want to do an exactly opposite because of selectivity. social media makes connections but it also takes away the human interaction. The virtual reality offers us so many choices but so little experiences. 50 years ago people used to have socials 4 gallons and meeting other people. 30 to 40 years ago. Even 15-20 years ago people went to nightclubs to "hook up" and meet people. The last 15 years has been online dating. I used to be able to capitalize on it as an average Joe. but it was still a numbers game. now forget it 80% of the women out there looking for 20% of the top guys. if your profile ain't right if you're picturing just right if you're not selling yourself and if your profile doesn't say the right things you won't even be considered. There's also a dual mating strategy going on too. Either you have money and status and are economically viable being a beta. Or you are attractive good looking have good genes and make them feel emotions and are alpha. I'm not disagreeing with you with the abundance versus lack mentality. I totally agree with that. We can't play victim or blame shift our circumstances. but there is something terribly wrong with the relationships in our culture today the expectations that come with it, and the double standards. maybe I'll get into to the subject on my own post at a later time instead of hijacking Wolfs.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 01:42 PM
Well instead of posting endless posts playing the victim, why not taking that energy and put it towards becoming the top 20%?
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 03:38 PM

This post by LH is your golden bullet.

Originally Posted by LH19
your relationship dynamic "ruined your life". You were together for 8 years before you had kids am I am guessing life was pretty good then you were probably doing things as a couple, you were playing softball going to the gym and she probably had her own things going on. Then you had kids and early on it was great your guys were new parents and you were doing family things and life was great. Kids start getting older and your W takes on the role as the main caretaker for the kids and most of her attention goes to the children. Suddenly Wolf is number 3 on the list and he's not getting his needs met. So he doubles down on the housework, grocery shopping, yard work, stops playing baseball and going to the gym. Now as for your W, she doesn't want a butler she wants a H who understands her, appreciates her, listens to her and treats her special. So now Wolf is getting bitter that he is doing all these things and he is still not getting his needs met so he tries even harder to make her happy and takes another job for 5 vacations a year. Guess what she's still not getting what she needs and Wolf is still not getting what he needs. W can't figure out how wolf can be so stupid to not know what she needs. He should know! So now the passive aggressive comments are thrown at wolf and he doesn't stand up for himself or argues with her to defend himself. W loses more respect for him because he allows the disrespect and guess what now his daughter is starting to take notice. Wolf gets reinforcements from his friends and friends wives "I don't get it you do everything around the house, yard, take her on all these vacations how can she not be happy?". So now Wolf is sure it's her or MLC or something. Outsiders never know what truly is going on inside. If that was the key to happiness rich people would never get divorced. So now youre two people who are angry, bitter about not getting your needs met and it came to a point that your W is done. IMO you're both equally unhappy it's just that you're identity is REALLY tied to being married and you're able to think logically about time with kids, finances and without working hard on yourself you will more then likely end up in the same dynamic again.

My story is the same in that my ex and I were two people who had no clue on how to communicate and meet each other's needs while on the outside seeming to have it all.

My advice to you is stop blaming, Facebook, MLC, the fact that your W can support herself and doesn't need you to take care of her financially and learn from your mistakes. Learn to listen, communicate, command respect and stay away from covert contracts.

The beauty of it all is those things will be what brings her back.

Lastly, if you can have zero expectations, be playful with your W if you want. You should be playful with all women and it's good practice for you.


This is my story with my X. This is the story of soo many here.
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 03:44 PM
Originally Posted by LH19
Well instead of posting endless posts playing the victim, why not taking that energy and put it towards becoming the top 20%?


Working on it. Moving in a week. Starting up a new business. Making plenty of plans with friends. Going to build up social circle, plan for vacation, activities, church, band. Making bucket list plans. ROLLING SOLO. I already wasted a year worth of my life as far as having new experiences dwelling in this. I learned a lot as a result of it though. Time to live it.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 03:56 PM
IH,

Thatís the best post you have made to date!
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 04:19 PM
LH I didnít mean that FB was the only thing. I know I have my faults and I have been working on them, it is also hard to work on them when it has to do with showing her love. You said about me helping her out and being a butler. I am confused then, if she asked for help with those things, I shouldnít have done them? I was trying to help her out. She complained that she was overwhelmed with everything so I tried to help her. I do realize beside that I could have just been more loving to her. Random text messages and going out on date night. Just trying to make her feel special. I know this now but itís hard to implement those things when we are about to sign papers to be divorced. And look there were times I did stand up to her. What happened we had a major blow out because she never quits. Look i took the family out to dinner at least twice a week, granted it wasnít just the 2 of us. Many times I asked her to go out for a drink and she said no. She doesnít like to drink, yet thatís whatís she does all the time now. I said to her numerous times letís put the kids to bed early and have a movie night. She would say, you know I am tired and will probably fall asleep. I said that was ok. But we did t do it. Or if we were both home at the same time and kids were at school I would take her out to breakfast. Itís like I tried and tried. But the few mistakes I made she could never let go. She brings up fights we had 10 years ago. When does someone let them go and move on? I guess never with her.

IH good job with your GAL. I definitely can do better. Even to this day my life still revolves around my kids.
IH I get what you are saying about social media. It has really changed the dynamic of relationships. People are so worried about others that they forget about their own life. I looked up abundance vs. lack mentality. My w had lack. Never enough, always something wrong, jealous, she hates to praise people, never wanted to think someone was better than her. I was the opposite, trying to find the positive.

Here is a real open ended question. If so many of us have almost the same story and I have read a few. (Scary how almost to a ďtĒ the wives did and said the same things.) How come leaving us was so similar to each and everyone of our stories, why is there no solution? Itís like if there is a problem with a gas tank on a car and you know how to fix it then you should be able to fix the gas tank of every car. I feel like so many of us have got here the same way yet we canít fix it the same way. Like I said a real open ended question. Maybe Sandi can chime in, she went back to her husband.
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 04:47 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
Itís like if there is a problem with a gas tank on a car and you know how to fix it then you should be able to fix the gas tank of every car.
Most people don't know how to fix the gas tank, and find it easier to just replace the car.


Even those that do know how to fix the gas tank, they never have, so they let fear stand in their way. Still easier to replace the car. Everyone tells them the car is old and they should get e brand new one.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 04:48 PM
W,

It's hard to explain the entire dynamic to you in one paragraph but if her complaints are valid then you should help her. But of course that doesn't mean do everything. Also, you do it without expectation. Why do you comment you're less angry and more calmer now? What were you angry about?

Most of the advice I'm giving you is for your next relationship. To use a car analogy, you can't let everything go in a car for multiple years without maintenance and then take it to a mechanic and say fix it. He's going to tell you it's too late and to take it to the junkyard.

Again another response from you completely bagging on your wife. What are you trying to save? Your marriage sounds horrible.

As for your last point I have thought about being an advocate for having classes in school and college about comminucation and especially how men and women communicate differently. Out of all the semi-useless classes I have taken in my life, a class that can keep families together sounds way more important.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 04:57 PM
I just got some angry text message from w. She is so angry that she has to buy me out and pay off a loan we took out for the kitchen remodeling. Here is what she text me.

I need a concrete amount from loan. I donít have extra $ to throw around. As it is I already have to come up with $xx. Do you think Iím made of $? So once again, Iíve been getting f*#ked all along!!!!! We need to discuss this ASAP.

I am so tired how this is what she wants but she thinks she is getting s*#ewed. How do I respond? Itís non stop with this woman!!! She wanted divorce but I guess itís not what she thought it would be and is now projecting.
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 04:57 PM
Originally Posted by LH19
It's hard to explain the entire dynamic to you in one paragraph but if her complaints are valid then you should help her. But of course that doesn't mean do everything. Also, you do it without expectation.
Also, she should be doing things for you.

It all comes down to respect and love.


Woman:"Will you buy me a drink?"
Man:"Absolutely, after you buy me one"



Men should love their woman. Women should respect their man.
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 05:04 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
I need a concrete amount from loan. I donít have extra $ to throw around. As it is I already have to come up with $xx. Do you think Iím made of $? So once again, Iíve been getting f*#ked all along!!!!! We need to discuss this ASAP.


You have infinite choices.


1) No response.
2) "I understand your frustration"
3) "I don't have extra money to throw around either."
4) Send me a proposal and I will review it.

Do you have any others?

Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 05:12 PM
I wouldnít respond until her attitude changes.
Posted By: AnotherStander Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 05:23 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
Today I was eating lunch with some colleagues who happen to be female. One lost her husband to a heart attack 7 years ago and another to suicide 8 months ago. They were saying some real interesting things. How they love being alone, that they can come and go as the please, no one to answer to, they can eat what they want and when they want it, they will never get married again. Both these women are in their 40s. I asked you donít want a companion? Both said no they donít want to be tied down, they enjoy their freedom and their kids. Is this a new ďbugĒ that a lot of women get? I have spoke to a few others who said they just love being single and not having to answer to anyone. Is it no one wants to work on anything?


You talk about this like it's some kind of affliction or that there's something wrong with them. These women have both been through hell, and perhaps they choose to go to the grave remaining loyal to one man, even after his death. I applaud them for that.

When we are in our 20's and dating we have not established a career yet, we don't have kids, we don't have many responsibilities, we don't have a permanent home. It's easy to devote a lot of time to a new R, and it's also very easy to take your pickup load of belongings and move in with them somewhere. Relationships are really easy at that stage of your life. When you are in your 40's or later you've established a career, you have kids, perhaps even grown kids. You have a home, you have a busy schedule where nearly every minute is allocated to something. The little bit of spare time you do have is precious and you want to use it for something you personally enjoy. Where is the time there for a new relationship? At that age you're not embarking on a new adventure with someone, you're trying to figure out how to squeeze them into your already-busy life, and you're trying to sort out what will happen if it gets "serious", do you want to bring this stranger into your family? Your home? Are they even going to want to leave their home to move into yours? And if they do, are they going to want to change all your furniture around? Do you want to see their belongings taking up half your shelf space? What if they are a slob and leave the bathroom dirty every morning? Etc. etc. etc. It's a big, big, BIG deal, believe me. I 100% understand their attitude and honestly I feel much the same way. I have a girlfriend, but her impact on my life is pretty minimal. We text, we go on a date every other week and other than that my life is unchanged. I have had all the above thoughts and yes, I too have thought it would be easier to be single then to try and restart a life with someone new.

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That we have become a culture of very selfish people?


What is selfish about remaining single? Selfish is getting into another relationship because you think you need to fill a hole in your life. Remaining single is strength, independence, self-reliance. EVERY SINGLE LBS HERE should spend some time single to sort themselves out before embarking on a new R.

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Look i took the family out to dinner at least twice a week, granted it wasnít just the 2 of us. Many times I asked her to go out for a drink and she said no. She doesnít like to drink, yet thatís whatís she does all the time now. I said to her numerous times letís put the kids to bed early and have a movie night. She would say, you know I am tired and will probably fall asleep. I said that was ok. But we did t do it. Or if we were both home at the same time and kids were at school I would take her out to breakfast. Itís like I tried and tried. But the few mistakes I made she could never let go. She brings up fights we had 10 years ago.


Yes, so what does all of that tell you? You actually did try, and this journey she's on is more about her than it is you or anything you did. Could you have been a better H? Yes, we all could have. Would it have made a difference? No, probably not. If you had been the perfect H you would more than likely still be here, and be even more confused about why.

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Here is a real open ended question. If so many of us have almost the same story and I have read a few. (Scary how almost to a ďtĒ the wives did and said the same things.) How come leaving us was so similar to each and everyone of our stories, why is there no solution?


Why is there no solution to depression? Because medical science does not understand affairs of the mind well at all. And walkaways, they are dealing with mental issues they don't even understand themselves, it's similar to depression. No one understands this, it's what we've told you pretty much since the day you arrived here. You don't, we don't, your wife doesn't, the medical field doesn't. Maybe some day there will be better understanding of this, but for now, we DB.

Wolf, you've got to quit asking "why". It prevents you from moving onward and upward. You've found literally a thousand different ways to ask why, and we've given you one answer for all of them- WE DON'T KNOW WHY. That's the only answer you will ever get.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 05:27 PM
Donít validate? Just ignore her?
Posted By: AnotherStander Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/24/19 05:29 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
I need a concrete amount from loan. I donít have extra $ to throw around. As it is I already have to come up with $xx. Do you think Iím made of $? So once again, Iíve been getting f*#ked all along!!!!! We need to discuss this ASAP.

I am so tired how this is what she wants but she thinks she is getting s*#ewed. How do I respond?


Stick to business. "I am available on XX day between XX and XX to discuss, let me know what time works for you." Ignore the emotional part of it. If she continues to rant and rave then establish a boundary. "I will not be spoken to in this manner. If you wish to discuss this in a civil manner then I am happy to listen, but if you are going to launch personal attacks on me then the conversation is over." Don't validate personal attacks.
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/25/19 01:11 AM
Yes ignore the emotional part of it. Go "grey rock" Look up "grey rock method" for dealing with narcissist. Don't respond to any emotional attacks or provocations. Keep it business as usual. Or don't respond at all. Probably the latter is best, unless you want to get down to business and settle this?
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/28/19 03:18 PM
AS the k you I will just stick to business. I am doing better with setting Jon kinda ties and not allowing her to speak to me this way.

Originally Posted by IHCLACS
Yes ignore the emotional part of it. Go "grey rock" Look up "grey rock method" for dealing with narcissist. Don't respond to any emotional attacks or provocations. Keep it business as usual. Or don't respond at all. Probably the latter is best, unless you want to get down to business and settle this?


Thank you I read it and it makes a lot of sense. I will continue to be they ďGrey rockĒ.

Very sad right now. Just got an email from the lawyer to set up a day to come in and sign the paperwork. Never did I ever think she would follow through with all of this. The ďbelieve nothing of what she says and half of which she doesĒ didnít hold true with me stbxw. She followed through and everything said was true. I will be strong and go in with my head held high. Thatís all I can do. I guess it is official for me to start my new life. Honestly I feel bad for my kids. They deserve to have both parents present, and not be bouncing back and forth. Thank you all for trying to guide me, I made many mistakes but I also learned so much. I will be the best boyfriend/husband in my next relationship. I learned about validating and it has been great. The other saying I think about all the time that many of you have said was, ďwould I rather be happy or right?Ē I choose happy for now on!!!! I recognize what I contributed to the downfall of my marriage, I also know it is not all my fault. I feel like a wrecking ball has hit me and I need to pick up the pieces and put my life back together. Honestly I hope she finds happiness because that is what she is searching for. I will find someone who is better than my wife. I can only look forward at this point. No more looking in the rear view mirror. I was really hoping I would have been a success story.
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/28/19 03:51 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
I was really hoping I would have been a success story.
Signing the paperwork is not the end. Just a step in the process. Keep focusing on improving your behavior. You will be a success story either way. She may have a change of heart in the future.



The key is you will a much healthier person. You can look at yourself and make positive changes. Fix you. You will be a great dad. These relationship skills directly translate to parenting.

Keep distilling information. Learn new ways of interacting. At some point, you may be leading W through her personal growth.


Marathons are very long.

My signature:Persevere = happily being patient over a long period of time
Posted By: AnotherStander Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/28/19 04:25 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
I will continue to be they ďGrey rockĒ.


Just to clarify, we talk a lot about being the rock and the lighthouse, but that is not the same thing as going grey rock. Grey rock is a technique you use on psychopaths, narcissists and toxic people to get them to leave you alone. You basically make yourself as emotionally neutral and boring as you can around them so they lose interest in trying to get a reaction out of you.

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Never did I ever think she would follow through with all of this. The ďbelieve nothing of what she says and half of which she doesĒ didnít hold true with me stbxw. She followed through and everything said was true.


Removing pressure doesn't always stop the D process unfortunately. But you tried and you should be proud regardless.

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Honestly I feel bad for my kids. They deserve to have both parents present, and not be bouncing back and forth.


I do agree, but this happens all the time and kids are indeed resilient. It's certainly not optimal but they will come through it fine.

Quote
The other saying I think about all the time that many of you have said was, ďwould I rather be happy or right?Ē I choose happy for now on!!!!


The full saying is "Would you rather be right or happily married?" The idea being would you rather constantly argue with your wife or GF expecting that at some point she will admit you're right (which probably won't happen anyway), or would you rather let go of that need to be right and instead focus on listening and validating which diffuses the situation and allows you to continue on happily in your relationship with her. Of course it's rhetorical, everyone should answer they would rather be happy, so the point is we should quit trying so hard to argue that we are right and they are wrong. Because in the end what matters is how they feel and how we feel, and we should try to make them feel like they are heard and respected even if we don't believe what they are saying. Because if we make them feel like that then they will want to make us feel like that as well.

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I was really hoping I would have been a success story.


Success does not have to mean recon. I survived the mess. Two of my kids are now grown, out of college, moved out and working. I pay my bills, I do stuff I love, I have a great GF. I love my life. Would I love it better had I reconciled? I believe my life is playing out exactly as it was supposed to, call it God's plan or destiny or whatever you want, but it was inevitable. So I spend ZERO time thinking about "what if". Right?
Posted By: ballast Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/28/19 04:43 PM
Wolf...I'm sorry to hear that it's come to paperwork for you and all of the emotions and feelings that represents. Been there, done that. BUT I'm also happy for you as that means your future and hopes and goals and dreams and perhaps amazingly hard to believe HAPPINESS once again awaits you.

You've done all you could, learned alot and improved yourself beyond perhaps what you ever thought possible. Look forward buddy and be that great Dad...lots of good things in life yet to come for you!

-B
Posted By: Thornton Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/28/19 05:24 PM
Wolf, your story isn't over. Even if you get a divorce, it's just a piece of paper. Lots of couples that divorce end up remarrying each other down the road.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/28/19 07:29 PM
AS, R2C, Ballast, Thornton, Thank you. I wish I knew and embraced the saying, ďDo you want to be happily married or right?Ē I choose happily married. I know that is gone, so for my next relationship I will choose happy.

AS Iím not proud, my m failed. I know I am not the only one to blame. But itís no different when the kicker in football misses the winning kick, we still lost and it still hurts. I tried real hard and I am proud of what I learned. I truly appreciate everyone who has come on here to help me. I met some great people and I am thankful for that.

As far as us getting divorced. There is no way we will get back together. To me that is the period at the end of the sentence, itís done. Honestly, if she tried to get back with me later on, itís not happening. I canít be put through all this hurt and pain and then go back to someone who has caused it. Not only the emotional and mental pain she has caused, but her breaking up the family, seeing my kids go through this!!! And last the financial hardship she has caused me. For me I fight till the end, the end is us signing the papers!!! Very sad!!!! I will continue to post and try and help others out, not to make the mistakes I made. MLC [censored]!!
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/29/19 12:53 PM
Wolf how are you doing with the transition of finding singleness independence and self-differation of W? Slow transition? Any new discoveries? Up and down? One step forward two steps back? Any progress in this area?
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/29/19 01:46 PM
I am falling apart today. I am on the verge of a nervous breakdown. Monday we sign the papers. I wish there was something I could do or say to change her mind, give me a second chance. This next week is going to be so hard for me. I donít want to be divorced, I want my family back, I want the love we had as a family back. How can a few situations destroy an entire marriage?? How does she not remember the million great times we had?? How does she think divorce will make this better? I know these are questions I have asked a million times. Sorry for the repetitiveness. You donít have to answer. I just looking for comfort and Iím venting because I am so hurt!!!
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/29/19 02:33 PM
Here is a good question. What does XW represent to you then? Family, love, good times, memories, companionship, intimacy, things they knew about you that no one else knew or saw? A life together. Unity, etc.

What does she represent to you now? Her now is something that makes her want to break free, be independent, have freedom. It could have to do with her? It could have to do with her experiences within the M. I know it feels like a great loss on all fronts. But what if we idealized someone into someone we thought we knew and we really didn't. They accepted a life that they didn't really want, but thought they did when they got married. Now they are looking to re neg and escape from that. they either want to break free and explore another life or explore another size themselves or developed themselves in a way they are a better version of themselves even if it seems contradictory to what we are seeing. They could be getting toxic or they could be even hurting themselves and some of these Pursuits but we have to let them fail and remove ourselves from them. You cannot control another life you have to let them make their own choices just like your children

What if we ignored those red flags. What if we put our own lives on hold for the sake of this other person? I think our mistakes here Wolf are as much as we are hurting, as much loss as we feel over all this. It is not for nothing. It will make us a more calmer, better, resolving, decisive, motivated, boundary enforcing version of ourselves. That is able to communicate more effectively, be more assertive, empathetic, not give away ourselves but be a compliment to the right person.

Wolf there are other areas of your life you can find fulfilment in. I know our ex spouses were the center of our worlds, and pursuing other areas of life feel a little empty at times, but the divorce is simply a settlement and a piece if paper. Yes a nail driving one in the coffin, but it doesn't have to affect the rest of your life or other areas of your life. We have choices. Its just a matter of picking ourselves up off the groumd,out of the hole, and get to making those choices for our lives.

There are days where I still go numb at the thought of what my life has become. There are days where I get scared of what it may possibly might be from the loss of it all. There's some days I think about some of the choices I can make to make a better person out of myself and to better my circumstances. How we go about thinking about this and changing I thought pattern just how we change our Direction and course. I'm trying to look at it this way. It's the end of our marriages it's not the end of our lives. We have choices how we think how we feel and what we do with them.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/30/19 01:37 PM
Originally Posted by IHCLACS
Here is a good question. What does XW represent to you then? Family, love, good times, memories, companionship, intimacy, things they knew about you that no one else knew or saw? A life together. Unity.


Thats what she use to represent to me, she was all those things. But like Sandy has said the WW heart goes cold and selfish and thatís what happened to stbxw. Will she come out of it? I donít know? But this is certainly not the woman I married. All for family and keeping everyone together. So to see her transform into this ďnewĒ person. Thatís where I am stuck. I think about all the good. And blocked out any of the bad. I recognize that there is ups and downs in a relationship, she did not. She only wanted the ups and now that a few downs happened she just wants to run. I canít change her nor make her do anything she doesnít want. I wish at times my mind worked like her, only remembering the few bad moments and running with that. I am trying real hard to let go and move on but a backslide. I am trying real hard to not let my mind go backwards. This has been one of the most painful experiences I ever had to endure. I know so many struggle on here too and I wish I could help each and everyone of you too.

I need to work hard at finding that strong, independent funny person I use to be. I was the person who always had a smile on my face and make everyone else smile or laugh. For the past year it has been depression and man does it stink. I have to start finding the good in life and focusing on that.

I still donít think my stbxw, doesnít know what this will entail. I say that because she will on occasion text or call me to tell me about her day. I am nice and cordial and validate her feelings about work. But once these papers are signed I donít want to hear about anything other than about the kids. I donít know if she is prepared for that. I tried so hard to show her I am a changed person, by validating a lot more, being calm, even more loving to the kids. But once my name goes on those papers I donít care about her day or problems.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/30/19 03:50 PM
I have a question. My stbxw text me this morning that my d was not behaving and that she lost her cell phone for the day. Today is my day with the kids. I wanted to do something nice with my d since my stbxw is taking my s to see the globetrotters. I have a feeling she will day to me that I am rewarding my d for bad behavior. But her behavior wasnít with me and then I am the one who is suppose enforce the punishment. Please advise.
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/30/19 04:00 PM
There's something i want to mention in your last statement Wolf. I struggled with this for a solid year. All of those new behaviors you are trying to demonstrate to her. I hope it is more permenant change OF WHO YOU WANT TO BE and act so IN ALL SITUATIONS, rather than just doing it as "technique" around you're STBXW They can smell right through that.
For the past year my constant thoughts over all this and you guys on here has given me bouts of temporary depression where I put off things I should be doing/pursuing and sleep to "reset my mind" Here's the thing Wolf. Granted its not completely wasted, Im sure you've learned a lot in the last year. But how much time have you wasted fretting over these situations for the past year trying to figure out how to cope, how to proceed, and how to get W back? Its difficult to break through to someone that you care, when they don't anymore. At least not in the marital romantical sense. You get back to being fun, funny, and independent when you do just that, and cut off the source new found misery. I know I'm guilty of it too, but these people are living in our heads and our hearts RENT FREE. When they want nothing to do with us other than to use us for the convenience of time, money, kids, their social activities, and emotional usury to have someone there to complain to as a result OF THEIR POOR DECISIONS. Start rebuilding you and focus on what is to come good and bad and make the best of your life.
Posted By: Traveler Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/30/19 04:02 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
I have a question. My stbxw text me this morning that my d was not behaving and that she lost her cell phone for the day. Today is my day with the kids. I wanted to do something nice with my d since my stbxw is taking my s to see the globetrotters. I have a feeling she will day to me that I am rewarding my d for bad behavior. But her behavior wasn’t with me and then I am the one who is suppose enforce the punishment. Please advise.

Hi Wolf, 8 years divorced, I do NOT enforce my ex-wife's punishments and I do not ask her to enforce mine. This makes life much easier, especially when my kids feel a punishment or lack of punishment is unjust.

Note, we sometimes both independently apply consequences for school behaviors, and common or school behaviors infrequently rise to a level where we share and plan actions together.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/30/19 05:50 PM
W,

You absolutely do not need to enforce her punishment.

Until you get to a point where you are not afraid of your W anymore and you realize she needs to EARN a second chance with you unfortunately you will will suffer.

I hope everything goes smoothly Monday.

Stay strong!
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 10/30/19 06:18 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
I have a question. My stbxw text me this morning that my d was not behaving and that she lost her cell phone for the day. Today is my day with the kids. I wanted to do something nice with my d since my stbxw is taking my s to see the globetrotters. I have a feeling she will day to me that I am rewarding my d for bad behavior. But her behavior wasnít with me and then I am the one who is suppose enforce the punishment. Please advise.


H:"W, I think it is best if you enforce your discipline with D during your time with her. I will do the same. Thanks for understanding, H"
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/04/19 01:30 PM
Well today is the day I sign the divorce papers. I am truly falling apart. I canít believe she is truly going through with this. I just want my family back. Iím trying to stay strong but I am so broken by this. Any comments would be greatly appreciated at this time. Thanks
Posted By: Thornton Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/04/19 02:27 PM
Hey Wolf,

We all can all remember the day when we signed those papers. If you really think about it, it's just a piece of paper. It changes nothing in regards to DBing. I've seen many couples actually get divorced only to remarry later.

Your W thinks that by signing the papers, her life is going to change and get better. The fact is, she's still W and you are still Wolf. Nothing has really changed in regards to your relationship. You are both still parents to your kids etc.

Take a deep breath and realize that your story isn't over. It's over when you decide it's over.

Keep DBing, you're gonna be ok.
Posted By: NewLife3 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/04/19 02:40 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
Well today is the day I sign the divorce papers. I am truly falling apart. I canít believe she is truly going through with this. I just want my family back. Iím trying to stay strong but I am so broken by this. Any comments would be greatly appreciated at this time. Thanks


I was there a few weeks ago. I would say the day she BD'ed me and the day I signed the papers and sent them off were the two most emotional days that I've had during this entire process that began on 8/21. I found that going ahead and allowing the emotions to consume me and crying helped me tremendously. It was my final mourning of the old M. We may have a new M in the future or we may not, no one knows what the future holds.

Like everyone will tell you, it is just a piece of paper filed at the courthouse. It has nothing to do with your R, you can have a nonexistent R and still be married or you can have a great R that is on the way to being reconciled without being married.

One thing the people closest to me have to constantly remind me is that I do not have to make a decision right now to ever have an R again with her or not. I get stuck vacillating between "would I take her back?" or "would I not take her back?" There is no use expending any energy to make that decision in my mind right now, just stick to DB'ing and becoming the best man or person that you can be and it will all fall into place in the end.

I constantly wish I could just shake her and wake her up and get her to come back to the M and drop her toxic affair. Then I remember to just step back. Control what I can control -- myself.

Living well is the best revenge, and the only way I will achieve that is by moving on and building the best life for myself and my son. I feel a little freer every single day when I realize how much of my happiness I was allowing my W to be responsible for. While this has been the most painful journey I have ever been on, I am still thankful that I am having to suffer through it because I am growing so much as an individual and father that I never would have had we stuck around in our old M.

I take solace in knowing that now that I am no longer in my W's life, she must go through this journey on her own without blaming me for the final outcome. The final outcome will either be her realizing her failures and faults as a human and deciding to build a new R with me or not. The ball almost becomes completely in their court once you go NC outside of child-related contact.
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/04/19 04:12 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
Well today is the day I sign the divorce papers. I am truly falling apart. I canít believe she is truly going through with this. I just want my family back. Iím trying to stay strong but I am so broken by this. Any comments would be greatly appreciated at this time. Thanks


HI buddy,

I know how much this skucs. It has been 10 years for me. I will never understand my X, even with all I know about relationship dynamics. Believe me, we can't change other people.

Take today one minute at a time. Make time alone to cry. Let all the tears flow. Feel the pain. Same with the anger. Feel the anger.

HUGS
Posted By: ovrrnbw Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/04/19 09:14 PM
Just wanted to offer my support Wolfman. Everyone here is hurting, sometimes very badly, and having been through a lot of pain myself I realized something: You are stronger than you feel right now. You are a worthy and valuable person. There is a bright future ahead.

You'll make it through today and be better for it.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/06/19 10:06 PM
So we signed the d paperwork Monday. So itís all done. One thing shaking that day, besides me crying all day and night, not in front of her. When I walked into the conference room she was sitting at one wide of the long table. So I sat on the other side of it. When I sat down away from her, she actually had the nerve to ask me whatís my problem? I said my problem is we are here to get divorced. What did she expect me to do? Skip in and give her a high five?? So thatís it. It takes 6-9 months for it to be done by the courts and it will be official. I know that I did not DB very well, but honestly this ďtrainĒ was heading in one direction and thee was nothing I could do to stop it. I feel a lot of emotions right now, sad, anger, lost, frustrated and confused.
Posted By: Augusto Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/06/19 10:11 PM
Praying for you. That's going to be me very soon, and I'm not looking forward to it at all. I don't understand the lack of empathy spouses seeking divorce have. I mean, it's one thing that you want to break apart a commitment, a family, but why do you have to be a jerk about it?

My W the other day told me I was being "salty" about the D. "SALTY".

And then, if I show any emotion towards it, then she'll say I'm trying to manipulate the situation. It's incredible.
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/06/19 10:33 PM



Just remember, nothing is set in stone.


We are here for you. Let us know how we can help.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/06/19 11:07 PM
Originally Posted by Augusto
Praying for you. That's going to be me very soon, and I'm not looking forward to it at all. I don't understand the lack of empathy spouses seeking divorce have. I mean, it's one thing that you want to break apart a commitment, a family, but why do you have to be a jerk about it?

My W the other day told me I was being "salty" about the D. "SALTY".

And then, if I show any emotion towards it, then she'll say I'm trying to manipulate the situation. It's incredible.


I donít get it. I said it before, if I was a total jerk, cheating, drugs, abusive, alcohol I would say I deserve it. But because I didnít kiss her hello all the time or kiss her goodnight, this is why we got d. I get them with those things maybe she did t feel loved. Ok then letís talk about it and fix it. To me those are easy fixes. Augusto I am sorry you will be going through it too. It was the worse day of my life. And for her, no problem. She has some nerve saying you are being salty. What we are suppose to be happy about breaking apart our family!!? That just goes to show how gone they are. Iím praying for you!!!

Originally Posted by Ready2Change

Just remember, nothing is set in stone.

We are here for you. Let us know how we can help.


Thank you. I know nothing is set in stone. But for the mere fact that she never swayed away from d to me means she is never coming back. Even if one day she realized she made a mistake she would never admit it. Her pride is the ruination of her.

Honestly I feel Ike there is nothing for me to talk about. Itís a done deal. Now itís times for me to pick up the million pieces and try and put it back together. Itís sad today I was just thinking, I just want to go home and crawl into my bed with her. But I have a better chance of hitting the lotto. I will try to help others not make the same mistakes I made. I feel like i should have been a dirtbag and been intimate with a lot of women the. This would be justified and would say I deserve this.
Posted By: Ready2Change Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/06/19 11:19 PM

Not sure if this applies to you, but it is a good read and important to know:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2653328#Post2653328
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/06/19 11:48 PM
Originally Posted by Ready2Change

Not sure if this applies to you, but it is a good read and important to know:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2653328#Post2653328


I have read that thread so many times. I bent over backwards for her, because that was my 180. Or at least I thought it was. One of her complaints was I never listen and did what I wanted to do anyway. So I thought by doing everything she would see I have changed. It didnít help. There was one thing looking back I truly regret and I was told numerous times about and that was taking back the MBR. I should have but yet again she convinced me being in their that I have not changed and I was vindictive. She just knew what to say to get her way. I hate her for that!!! I should have stayed there so she could have felt the pain I felt.
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/07/19 12:06 PM
Its their narritive Wolf. They expect you to emotionally play along with their narritive and react appropriately with their plan. Its like you almost have to be stoic at all times with them to keep them second guessing.Been super busy with the moving and getting life in order. But have been following you closely. Thinking of you and praying for you as well. Will try to be supportive later.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/07/19 01:42 PM
W,

I am curious you say that bending over backwards was your 180 when it seems like all you ever did was bend over backwards and got nothing in return. Seems to me like a 180 to being submissive would be showing strength.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/07/19 05:43 PM
IH thanks so much. Itís not just d it everything else. There are so many life changes and they were forced upon me. I have to totally downgrade my life. I lived in a real nice area in a big beautiful home, to now a little shed almost literally

.
Originally Posted by LH19
W,
I am curious you say that bending over backwards was your 180 when it seems like all you ever did was bend over backwards and got nothing in return. Seems to me like a 180 to being submissive would be showing strength.

Itís funny you say that. I knew I did but she made me believe in the end I did nothing. I should have listened to you!! Everything you said was right. I was afraid and I tried to give in to her every wish thinking I was going to nice her back. I should have lived my life the way it was. Let her feel all the changes of leaving. I was just so afraid and in the end who got hurt... ME!!! She experienced no loss, no change. Should have never left and never left the MBR. I thought by doing those things I was showing her I changed and was not vindictive. But she manipulated me, she knew that word would get her way!! I hate myself for being that way!!
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/08/19 05:39 PM
Been thinking about you all day today wolf how are you feeling today?
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/10/19 12:58 PM
Thought you might enjoy this Wolf. May give insights as to why internal states change. Its because of opportunity, availability, circumstance and presence. https://youtu.be/-bRy8XlRTDQ
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/11/19 01:08 PM
Hi IH. Thanks for checking in. Honestly I am stuck. My pain is still there and as strong as when it all started. I guess I am not someone who gets over this so quickly. I started to look for places to live. That was also depressing. I had this big beautiful home and now I have to go to something small and much further from my job. For me itís the loss of everything. I lost my home, wife and only seeing my children part time. And all of this and I wanted none of it. For me it [censored] because some days I say to myself I just want to go home. But that is no longer for me. When I feel down I go to the gym, I go to friends homes or call them. But for me the pain is still there. I want to sob as not feel like this and I try to think about a great future for myself. That is will be with an amazing person. Honestly Iím scared of that too. Falling in love with someone and they do the same thing. I will be so worried all the time about what I am saying or doing, that is not living. There are moments I am happy but let me tell you it is brief moments.

How are you doing IH? Whatís going on with you? Your situation sounds so similar.
Posted By: DS9 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/11/19 01:18 PM
Hey wolf sorry to hear you feel stuck mate. It takes time and if it takes you a little longer thatís ok too because weíre all different. I feel that way sometimes too so youíre not alone. Time and patience.

Are you in ic? Got a really good friend you can vent about all your feelings?

Keep your chin up buddy
Posted By: Thornton Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/11/19 02:38 PM
Hey Wolf,

I can totally relate to how you feel. I've experienced and am experiencing everything you described.

I was divorced from my first W and also lost my big house, my security, and my full-time relationship with my daughter. I lost everything. It took me a long time to heal. Rest assured, you will adapt to your reality. It's not want you want, but you will adjust. You will also find happiness again and even fall in love again. And when that happens, all the pain that you are suffering now, will fade into a distant memory.

One foot in front of the other, Wolf. Feel your feelings, admit your faults, forgive yourself, and have faith even though you can't fathom it right now, that life will be good for you once again.

Thorn
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/11/19 05:28 PM
Originally Posted by Wolfman
Hi IH. Thanks for checking in. Honestly I am stuck. My pain is still there and as strong as when it all started. I guess I am not someone who gets over this so quickly. I started to look for places to live. That was also depressing. I had this big beautiful home and now I have to go to something small and much further from my job. For me itís the loss of everything. I lost my home, wife and only seeing my children part time. And all of this and I wanted none of it. For me it [censored] because some days I say to myself I just want to go home. But that is no longer for me. When I feel down I go to the gym, I go to friends homes or call them. But for me the pain is still there. I want to sob as not feel like this and I try to think about a great future for myself. That is will be with an amazing person. Honestly Iím scared of that too. Falling in love with someone and they do the same thing. I will be so worried all the time about what I am saying or doing, that is not living. There are moments I am happy but let me tell you it is brief moments.

How are you doing IH? Whatís going on with you? Your situation sounds so similar.


These are all legitimate thoughts, concerns, and feelings Wolf. I have had the same exact thoughts and feelings. Believe it or not... Our ex's are having the same thoughts and feelings too. Another thing to be aware of is you're feelings are going to change day to day, sometimes hour to hour. Its ok to mourn be sad etc at the loss of all this. I know you feel like you lost your W your castle, and your family. Just last week I caught myself thinking of ex all day at work because I trained my mind to do that in my sich over the last year. I even went out of my way to do a few NGS things for my troubled ex last week. Took S2 for an extra day to alleviate her and brought her chicken soup since she was sick. (You better believe she took full advantage of going out dressed up though when I took him.)Had a tear or two privately in my own place after putting away 12 years of vday cards anniversary cards, pictures, etc.. (((Forever my @$$! ) They don't see it Wolf. And that's ok. I had a flood of realizations of all the good, the bad and the ugly this last week. Will update such eventually. Just the same as it comes with the thoughts. Sometimes we count the losses, sometimes we count the flaws of the relationship on both sides. Sometimes we count the good times, sometimes we are sad, angry, happy, mournful, indifferent, anxious, stressed, focused etc... Sometimes we fear revealing ourselves in the future to other people because we feel like failures from this and all other R's that enfed and scared they may see the real us that cause detriment to those ended R's I get it Wolf. And all these thoughts that can change by the hour depending on how we think about things and what influences us. I thought I would be scared $hitless of living alone with my thoughts. Turns out just in a week. Im loving living alone, having things my way, living my way, being organized my way, decorating my way, having family occasions my way, spending time with S2 my way, looking forward to upcoming events, etc. I was depressed the first few days of living alone of what I thought my life would be resigned to. It may be like this for you, it might not. Once you start doing things for yourself slowly for you completely independent of XW. It will force you to change, keep busy, remained focused, build your own life. You might start to look forward to it. The imperative however is to recognize that your feelings are not you. Although it may feel like you have 5 or 6 different personalities or sides of you going on during all this depending what you are thinking about. Recognize your feelings. Acknowledge them, feel them, honor them, But don't trust them. (Feelings) They will change through all of this. It is what got our WAR's here in the first place. They might be wrong, they might be right. They might be both and the same goes for us. Its a lot of head vs. Heart at the end of the day. It takes time and space to sort it out with clairity.

This is probably just my ego talking right now but?... Funny the other night I was cooking some awesome meals with S2 after a toy convention Sat which we had a great time at.. My home and space was perfectly clean just the way I like it. I wasn't anxious or abrasive, or irritated. So my thoughts were. I cook for myself, shop for myself, organize for myself, work for myself, plan for myself, live for myself. Etc. WTF do I need a W for? My right hand knows how I like it best...Lol...I still love her and miss her a little. But they brought pain to us at the beginning of our sich's and now we are just getting free from that pain. They are solipsistic. Its just their nature. We both can be egotistical, and stoic too. Just something to keep in mind and in check. Weirdest thing too is. Im getting date offers just in the last week out the ying yang and Im not even trying. Have to remind myself that its just for fun, not to move fast into anything, im not going to rebound anyone, and I need to be authentic, honest, and firm. Also need to remind myself not to let my ego get too validated. I might go, I might not...Wierd thing is I'm actually enjoying being alone.
Posted By: Thornton Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/11/19 06:00 PM
Great post, IH! Glad you are doing well considering the circumstances!
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/12/19 02:38 PM
IH Glad to see how well you are doing. When you talk about your situation I feel like I am reading about mine. You are really coming into your stride. I put an offer on a condo, hopefully I will get it. Getting my own place will be nice than living at my moms house. I want to be able to cook with my kids and have game night. Right now because my mom is handicapped and always sick I am constantly bouncing my kids around when I have them. I donít want them to see my mom like that all the time, itís depressing. I know what you are saying about women. A lot of opportunities. Actually going on some dates and it is great. Itís great to know there is life after d. Been on a few dates with one woman and we have so much in common and the kicker she is so sweet and tried all the time to make me happy. I donít mean in a sexual way either. With my xw it was always me trying to please her. Never reciprocated. When this woman does things for me it almost feels ďweirdĒ because I am not use to it. I know I will be alright itís just getting through this hard time. When I have my own space it will be that much better. IH I feel like you and I should go out and grab a beer because of everything we have in common itís so crazy.
This is how selfish my xw has become. I took my son to the Giants game on Sunday. I asked my xw a long time ago and she was fine with it. So it was perfect for my xw to have a day with my d to do some bonding. Instead what does she do, has her parents over in the morning and went to the city all day and night. I know she can do what she wants but to me that was so wrong to leave my d. This just reinforces how selfish and cold she has become. Itís all about her and no one else. I felt so bad for my d. This wayward/MLC lifestyle was so not her. But she is a new person and the more I see things like that the better I feel about d. Knowing there are women out there who care about family and care about their spouse/boyfriend. IH I stoped the right hand stuff a while ago!! Lol
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/12/19 08:33 PM
Hey Wolf. I would be more than happy to grab a beer with you. I forgot you are in NY I'm in Northern NJ. Totally doable. Are you in Rockland County? Plus my Mom lives right next to Giant Stadium. Lived there for 29 years.
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/14/19 12:13 AM
Too bad I didnít know that the other day. I took my son to the Giants game. We will definitely figure out a day and place to meet up. And see just how similar our lives are and how messed up our xwís are. How have you been doing IH? It been quiet with me. Just trying to find a place to live. I wish there was something close to my kids especially because they are in so many activities. It will make it easier for me instead of driving all over the place.
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/14/19 02:42 AM
Been quiet with me too. I'm loving it and my solitude.. I'm up and down here and there. I get a little pi$$y every time XW expects something of me. I'm losing $$$ with work because we've both been taking off a lot since S2 has been sick the last month. I wish you luck on finding your place to live. Its going to feel strange at first, but once you settle in a little there is some freedom from all nagging, awkward silence, people intentionally ignoring you, then making demands of you, trying to guilt you, manipulate you, shame you etc. Im loving being alone, because I've never lived alone. Im doing it on my own, my way, going forward, and not backward. If i had to live with my parent again. It would feel backward in life and dependant for me especially at our age. I'm sure you will find something Wolf. What NY County are you in?
Posted By: Wolfman Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/15/19 12:08 PM
IH I live in Suffolk county. Iím about an hour from the city.

So yesterday morning around 7:15 am I see my xw is calling me. I was about to pick up and then realized I am not her husband anymore. So I didnít. Usually those early calls are for her to complain about the kids not behaving in the morning. She didnít leave a voice mail. But about 10 minutes later she text me that the kids were giving her a hard time in the morning. So I responded what happened? She spoke about how my son was upset blah blah blah. I responded sorry to hear that. I guess she still wants moral support from me? Does she not understand she divorced me?? I am not her to give you emotional support anymore. I am just so frustrated. Then later in the day she text me if I could find out the information for her to pay off the loan we have. She wanted me to help her??? I responded I am very busy and donít have time.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/15/19 01:45 PM
Well then why are you giving her emotional support?
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/15/19 10:22 PM
If you feel as though you are emotionally being taking advantage of Wolf. Let it go to VM. If its an emergency. She will find a way to text/email/leave a VM etc.. Its funny. Initially when you do this for a few weeks or months. It feels like you are the one playing games. But slowly as you start to detach, and you realize you are being emotionally manipulated. Or your time, peace, quiet, and freedom is being taken advantage of by someone who used to be you're most intimate confidant, who now treats strangers with more plesantry and dignity and respect then you. You will start willingly let the calls go to VM. Because you will realize, they are only calling you because they want something from you or they need something from you. You will be more at peace because you won't be getting botheredn emotionally upset, or nagged as much. They are not calling you to reconcile, and they are not calling you to ask you how was your day or for idle chit chat. Your time is your most important asset to build a life, build wealth, and build a home for yourself. Don't forget that, and don't ever let anyone steal, manipulate, or take advantage of that. Especially your Ex. Remember. You are not friends. You are no longer lovers either. You can be friendly, you can still do favors, but you better expect something in return for it because believe me, their expectations are unrealistic, delusional, and a mile long. Slowly as you set reasonable boundaries with this, communications will get just a little bit more pleasant. Not a lot but a little. There may be some respect regained in a platonic sense. But more importantly YOUR SELF RESPECT.
Posted By: IHCLACS Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/15/19 10:31 PM
Just stop answering unless it has to do with the kids. Unless you are in possession of something financial or she needs your authorization on. Let her call the company, get copied documents and figure it out.

So you are out on L.I. hey? I have a cousin out on Smithstown in Suffolk who I will be visiting shortly. She is amazing and has been amazing with support. She calls me every day to check om me and has been for the last year. She's sad and is still in shock over my sich because her and W got along really really well and were probably closer then my cousin and I. If I am on my way out there over T giving. I will post here and let you know when and we can meet at a public place. It would be good to talk with you.
Posted By: LH19 Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/15/19 10:41 PM
W,

Please, please, please take these words to heart. These texts mean absolutely nothing and I mean nothing. I know you want to think she is having a change of heart but she is not. That is a minimum 2 years down the road if at all. For your own sanity and detachment, ignore every single text that doesnít specifically have a reasonable question about the kids.
Posted By: job Re: Midlife wife crisis11 - 11/15/19 11:06 PM
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Midlife wife crisis12
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