Hey everyone,
Been a few weeks since you heard from me. My old threads are archived due to the risk of my stbxw finding them although that might just be me being paranoid.
Recap for those that don't know about my sitch -
- joined this forum early May 2019
- I was desperate to save my marriage after W became cold and distant beginning of February 2019. Never begged or pleaded but I initiated a few R talks which of course made things worse.
- I was ready to end the relationships but was talked out of it by kind souls here at the forum. I was reacting on emotions a lot so that would have been a bad idea.
- I earn a lot of money, stbxw is struggling and I have a solid prenup which means she leaves with nothing.
- things became a lot better after I joined the forum. We started spending more time together. Her partying and staying out late stopped completely.
- mid June we went to Paris together and although it was a great trip, there was no intimacy.
- I work with famous artists so end of August I went on a month long tour. After about two weeks I found out my W brought home a man and had sex with him in our apartment. I was crushed and told her she needs to move out and when I come home, she will sleep on the couch until she finds some place else to stay.
- the next day I felt completely different and felt I could forgive her until AnotherStander talked sense into me and made me realize how serious her lies and selfishness were.
Today:
Came home from the tour Sunday, September 22. W had cooked lunch and cleaned the apartment and was very humble and nice to me. I acted cordial and polite. That evening I was meeting a woman who is interested in buying the special we recorded for the artist I was on tour with. I showered and dressed nicely and told W I was going out for dinner that night. This was strictly a business meeting but I didn't mind the side effect of seeing her worried. And she sure seemed worried when I left.
During dinner I get a text from her asking if it's ok if she goes to bed. I didn't see the text until hours later and thought it was weird at first until I realized she probably plans to sleep in the bed.
I came home half past midnight and found her in bed. I thought about waking her up but didn't and went to sleep in the bed with her as well.
The next day while she was at work I wrote to her and said I've put some sheets and pillows on the couch in the spare bedroom(there's no bed there). She just responded "ok". From then on she slept there and not together with me.
Picked up the keys to the apartment I found for her on Sept 27 and agreed she would move out the next day. The new apartment is only 366 square feet so it's tiny compared to the big place she's lived in with me all these years. So September 28 I help her move out and it was all going well. When we finished moving she burst into tears which I've only seen her do maybe 5 times in the 10 years we've been together so I was surprised.
W: I don't want this...but I have to try
That stood out for me. Does she still think she is just trying this out? I remained calmed and said I'm sorry that you're sad about this. But the messed up thing is that I felt guilt for kicking her out suddenly. It was hard to see her sad. I left and came home and felt for the first time sadness instead of anger on a while. All her things gone. It smoked a cigarette which I haven't in a very long time. 30 minutes later I get a text from her.
W: would it be ok if I sleep home, just tonight? There's so many weird sounds here and I don't want to be here alone. Please, just tonight? We can watch a movie or something?
I'm so sorry everyone, I know I shouldn't but I told her it was ok. She can spend the night with me. I couldn't say no.
She took a taxi over and was happier than I've seen her in a long time. We watched a movie and since there was no couch left in the apartment now that it was moved to the new one, I allowed her to stay in the bed. She may have expected us to cuddle, I don't know for sure, but I turned my back and went to sleep.
And that's that. I've filed for divorce which she's not agreeing to so court will force us to do the 6 months waiting period because of that. On Thursday I'm supposed to meet her for the last time to hand her the divorce papers and take a few things that are mine but after that I've told her I want no further contact with her.
It's much harder than I thought to be alone in the apartment. Today until Wednesday it's fine because I have a three shows with another artist which helps keep my mind off things. But it feels so empty to be at home. I'm working out like crazy, down to 9% bodyfat so I look ripped. I've started growing a beard which I've never done before. But I feel all the things I thought I'd grown out of. It feels like I'm dying. I miss her so much. I've asked my brother and his W to come stay with me this upcoming weekend and that will be great. But I dread being alone. I'm usually an introvert and thrive being alone. But now that scares me more than anything else.
Anyway, just wanted to give everyone an update on my sitch.
Me: 38
Stbxw: 35
No kids
Mini bd: February 6, 2019
ONS confirmed Sept 7, 2019
Told her to move out: September 8, 2019
W moved out: September 28, 2019
Divorce filed by me: September 23, 2019
6 month divorce waiting period starts counting on October 3, 2019
Thanks for the update B. Be strong there. Learn to know yourself, evade those anxiety triggers.
Trust yourself. Take your time.
DB
(((Ben)))
Hi Ben, I've been thinking about you, wondering how you were doing. Good to hear from you. I have a feeling your W may start to come out of the fog now that the reality of her actions are coming home to roost. Their fantasies of a fantastic new life with one or more OM's rarely come true. She still has a long way to fall though. Despite the pain I think you are doing the right thing, as long as she lived with you she would never learn to miss you and nothing would have changed. I have a friend who posts here sometimes who has been in a similar limbo for over 2 years now and his W is as disconnected from the M as ever. So rest assured you are on the right path.
And let me just say I am VERY impressed you've hit 9% bodyfat, that's incredible! I've been cutting weight for months trying to get down to 10% and it is hard, hard work! I made a run at it a couple of years ago and made it to 12% but man, at that point the weight loss slows to a crawl. I'm doing good to lose a pound a month once I'm in that range. I've cut about 8 pounds so far, 2 more to get to my intermediate goal and then another 4 or 5 to reach my final goal of 10%. I have no desire to cut more than that, it gets very hard to maintain, especially at my age. So congrats, that's really amazing!
Thank you Neffer and AS,
It sure feels like the second part of this journey has started. Maybe what you say will happen but itīs a scary yet slightly exciting feeling not knowing what awaits now. Not that my life was predictable in any way before this happened but this is on another level.
I donīt know where Iīll be even a few months from now. But I have a feeling Iīll be fine.
Thank you AS, Iīve worked very hard with two work outs per day since early February and weighing my food and almost no sugar. I will do my last bodpod fat measuring on October 10 and from then on start building again. My goal was 8% but Iīm happy whatever the next result is. I canīt wait to start eating more food again!
12% is great as well! When I started I was at 30.6% and it took so much intense hard work to get to 14 I remember. Good job!
Ben, you will be more than fine, you are headed for great things!
WOW you started at 30%??? I am even more impressed now! That is truly astonishing. Excellent work! I hear you, running a caloric deficit for so long AND working your body to the limit every day is unbelievably taxing. When people ask me what kind of workout is needed to get ripped I'm like "oh man you don't really want to hear this but..." LOL! That old saying "abs are made in the kitchen" is 100% accurate! I have some friends at CrossFit who are very strong and fit but don't look it at all because they refuse to give up beer and Mexican food
They no doubt have a hard, chiseled physique under there but it's hiding under inches of fat. Can't see it until that's stripped away! Anyway let me know what your final reading ends up at, 8% would be incredible, that's getting into bodybuilder contest prep territory!
The missing and the loneliness is the the worst. Give yourself a bit of time and you will adjust and soon will come back fighting fit . If she wants to get a great man back after what she has done for you it better be out of this world. Great idea on having the family over at the weekend . Stay strong my Viking friend , you can do it
Thanks AS,
Yes, I saw pictures from the day before BD and I remember at the time thinking itīs not so bad but Iīve come so far now. And yes, what really made it for me was cutting out sugar almost completely. When I get cravings, I eat some blueberries and it really helps. Iīve had cheat days but theyīve been maybe once a month and I do intense cardio that morning.
Tryhard, thank you. Itīs so strange how big the apartment feels now. But I also want to practice calming myself down and enduring the pain of being alone. I still find myself feel excitement when the phone does that one buzz which means itīs from the Facebook messenger app, I know itīs most likely from her then so I have a long way to go as well.
Speaking of that, every day she has found a reason to message me about something. Yesterday it was a picture of clothes hangers only to tell me that she packed them in one of the boxes so I can get them on Thursday when I come because itīs a "shame to throw them away". I responded "ok, thanks". Today a few hours ago she messaged again -
W: Oh, I just realized you have all the recipes for stews we make big batches of. Need to take pictures of those. Especially the beef chilli.
Me: Sure, Iīll send some pictures when Iīm back home
4 hours later -
W: what was the name of that lamb dish we always had delivered from the Chinese place?
Me: Sandstorm lamb
W: thank you
5 minutes later -
W: "come back pork" what dish is that?
Me: Thin bacon slices. You wouldnīt like it
W: ah okey, think we had it before. Didnīt like it
Assuming sheīs feeling lonely in that apartment. Iīll allow some interaction until we drop off the final things on Thursday.
I feel you fam . I dont have the answers for you , I guess its still being done n love with someone that doesnt deserve it . I have deluded myself but every ding on my phone is an emotional disappointment when it isnt her . I guess the process is to get back to where we need to be to have the attraction and the right balance.
Journal -
So yesterday I went over to give her the divorce papers and pick up the last few things. This was supposed to be the last time we see each other but it wasnīt much that happened. I gave her the papers, explained what she needs to do, we hugged and I left.
This evening she messaged me a link to a restaurant, asking if I have heard of it. I responded -
Me: W, Iīm trying to move on with my life and forget the previous. I canīt talk to you anymore. I understand that we have to speak at times to sort the details of our separation but once that is all sorted we canīt speak at all.
She hasnīt responded. Iīm not sure what the right response from me there should be but I meant what I said. I want to forget about her. I canīt have her messaging me unless itīs important.
Iīm not sure what the right response from me there should be
In my opinion? Exactly what you sent her. Technically it's not DB'ing as described in Michele's books, but I'm a firm believe that in many cases like hers "tough love" is the only valid approach. It helps you detach and it helps her learn to miss you. I think you did great.
Thank you AS,
I am getting better but I know I will have ups and downs. So Iīm glad Iīm back at the forum now. You guys have saved my life and changed me as a person. Everyone sees it, everyone are amazed. I wish everyone would learn the things Iīve learned here and by reading some of the book recommendations Iīve been getting here as well.
I think everyone here should expect feelings to cycle between good and bad days. I felt depressed yesterday. Not just because Iīm coming home to my apartment alone these days but also because Iīm having a hard time accepting that this is the reality for so many people.
I see couples now, wondering if they will experience this. And chances are many of them will. I had no knowledge of this before it happened. No one tells you or prepares you. I thought couples can just break up and all that but not that one spouse can become cold distant while still not leaving the marriage/relationship and feeding you crumbs to keep you around as plan B. I look at my friends and wonder if they will go through this at some point.
Today I feel better though. What helps is to have something to look forward to. I know a professional photographer so on Monday, Oct 21 I will go to his studio to take some pictures of myself. This may sound vain but after all my hard work Iīve never looked this good. Not now, not in my 20s. I did my final bodpod measuring and I still have 9.2% bodyfat, my goal was 8 but thatīs fine. Iīm happy with this result. So for the photo shoot Iīm prepping by following a routine that models do before a shoot that takes 7 days. So I start Monday. These photos will just be for me. Not to post anywhere. Just so I can look back and see that this is how I looked at my peak.
Iīm saying this because having something to look forward to instantly got me in a better mood. Anyone reading this and trying to find GAL activities, it really helps to have something planned.
Have a great weekend everyone!
I love it Ben! Well done on getting down to 9.2%, and great idea on the photo shoot!
Yes pretty much all long-term couples have gone through it, are going through it or will go through it. I honestly don't know a single exception. I've known couples that were together for 50+ years that went through terrible times. No one is immune. I think older people come from a generation that held marriage in higher esteem and tended to work harder to make things work out despite the rough times. That's why the divorce rate used to be lower. It wasn't because they had perfectly happy marriages, it was because when they went through the loss of love and associated fallout they both committed to working hard to get it back on track. Unfortunately these days marriage is not held to the same standard it used to be, so WAS's are encouraged to walk at the first sign of trouble.
Good job Ben. It gets easier. Im post divorce now and I am feeling a lot better. I still miss seeing my kids badly. But I am no longer being mistreated by my exww.
I actually got into music production recently as its its something I have always been interested in but truly mever had the time and my exww scoffed at me buying equipment. Now I bought it all and have been cranking out songs. I really enjoy it. Keeps me busy. Keeps my mind busy.
You held your ground well and are handling everything superbly.
Thanks AS and ST,
AS - Iīve heard though that the bodpod isnīt 100% accurate. For that you need a dexa scanner but there are none where Iive. But just looking at me in the mirror Iīm certainly happy with the results. Also good to take some pics for a future Tinder profile I suppose.
ST - Iīm glad to hear you are feeling better. We were so close to having kids and Iīm glad we didnīt now but I still have a hard time looking at couples walking with strollers. Makes me sad to think about what could have been.
I was also in to music although very amateur. I had started learning to play the guitar but when W moved in I stopped. No one wants to hear practicing
Iīm now going to buy a digital piano and start trying to learn some songs Iīve wanted to know how to play. Music is definitely therapy so thatīs a great idea.
Thank you so much!
Just got a message from STBXW -
W: Do you have X today?
(X is my pug, and he was basically ours but Iīve been paying all his expenses and the one who mostly took care of him)
Me: Yes
W: Can I please come by?
Me: No, why would you do that?
W: I just feel so down, and I miss X, and you. Maybe just 15 minutes
Me: I donīt want to be your friend. We were never friends.
W saw the message but responded 30 minutes later with -
W: I know...
I hate that I feel sorry for her. She was so cold and selfish for many months, sending me into a depression with anxiety Iīve never felt with such intensity before. She took so much and gave nothing to our relationship after BD. And I can still feel her pain of being alone in that apartment.
Anyway, taking my pug out for a walk. Today is two days before the photo shoot and the most difficult day of all since Iīm I can only eat less than 30 grams of carbs the entire day. But tomorrow is carb load day so thatīll be fun.
Journal -
There has been no communication since the last message from W. As we are getting close to the end of the year, I realize that the apartment Iīve sorted for her is not for that much longer. So I have a question to the vets here -
Just to remind everyone of my sitch - I have a prenup which means W gets nothing once we are divorced. However, I canīt protect the apartment with a prenup due to local laws. They will give it to whoever needs it the most. Since I make a lot more money than her, they would say that I can afford to buy a new one instead of keeping this. So I wrote a separate agreement before we got married stating that if she doesnīt claim this apartment, I will give her approx 15.000 USD cash.
The day she moved out I told her I would wire her the money in a few days to which she said she doesnīt want them yet, she is worried she might spend them(wise decision, I believe she would have spent them too). So I only wired her a small amount so she can buy basic things for the new apartment. As for the apartment itself, it costs me about the same, around 15.000 USD which wasnīt in the agreement that I would pay but I did it anyway just to get rid of her. She has it until February 29. Last week she messaged me and asked if she could get another small amount from the divorce money I owe her to which I said yes, but I need her to legally change her address with the tax office. Once she has done that, she can no longer claim the apartment I live in now. She questioned it at first, asking if she shouldnīt wait until end of February but I told her I canīt wire any more money until she has done that. A day later I got confirmation that she has changed her address.
This means she can no longer claim the apartment or demand to move back in. However, I know itīs IMPOSSIBLE to find a rental apartment in our city. She doesnīt have the money to buy one either. So I have a feeling she will be reaching out when itīs getting closer. What would the recommendation be? I donīt know what she will do. She has two friends she knows well enough but they live with their boyfriends so she canīt move in there. Her only option is to find a guy to move in with and that is not something she would want. Not in such short time.
Obviously I canīt have her move back in here but if it comes to the point where she has absolutely nowhere else to go, Iīm not sure I can be cold enough to let her end up on the street. What would you do?
Not your problem anymore. I know it seems cold but it's the truth.
She will figure it out when she doesn't have you to fall back on...I didn't go back and read your whole situation but I think I remember her sleeping with someone else while you were away. You didn't create her issues and you can't solve them. Drop the rope completely.
I understand and Iīm sure she will sort something somehow. But Iīm also not a monster. Even if it was my worst enemy, I would still help in a crisis situation so itīs not about wanting to solve her issues or dropping the rope.
Havenīt given this much thought at all, still plenty of time left so weīll see what happens.
I agree with Jac. Ben, you've got to quit rescuing her. She's 34 years old!!! She fired you as husband, she has relieved you of your responsibilities to her. Just leave her to figure out her issues. If she has to suffer a little because of her choices then so be it.
Also I think you did the right thing in refusing to let her come by for a cake-eating visit.
Thanks AS, but I donīt agree about the rescuing. Thatīs not my intention with what I wrote. In my opinion, that would have been me trying to help her find a permanent residency or something like that. I think what I asked for is a bit more complicated than her having to suffer a little. But never mind, it was an imaginary scenario that most likely wonīt happen in the dramatic way I pictured it. Sheīs no fool so Iīm sure sheīll have a better plan than waiting until the last minute to contact me for help.
Yeah of course. No way would I want her in this apartment for that reason. Without even thinking of it probably, she revealed her intentions. When she wrote "maybe just 15 minutes" it was obvious this was just to sooth her anxiety. She didnīt ask to come over to talk for example. She just wanted to see the pug and play family for a moment to help quiet her mind. Maybe even a temp check to see if I was willing to have her over when she needs it and feels down-
The last week or so Iīve felt great being home alone again. Iīm so happy I donīt have kids with her. Not seeing her makes it MUCH easier to move on.
I agree with Jac. Ben, you've got to quit rescuing her. She's 34 years old!!! She fired you as husband, she has relieved you of your responsibilities to her. Just leave her to figure out her issues. If she has to suffer a little because of her choices then so be it.
Also I think you did the right thing in refusing to let her come by for a cake-eating visit.
Journal -
There has been no communication since the last message from W. As we are getting close to the end of the year, I realize that the apartment Iīve sorted for her is not for that much longer. So I have a question to the vets here -
Just to remind everyone of my sitch - I have a prenup which means W gets nothing once we are divorced. However, I canīt protect the apartment with a prenup due to local laws. They will give it to whoever needs it the most. Since I make a lot more money than her, they would say that I can afford to buy a new one instead of keeping this. So I wrote a separate agreement before we got married stating that if she doesnīt claim this apartment, I will give her approx 15.000 USD cash.
The day she moved out I told her I would wire her the money in a few days to which she said she doesnīt want them yet, she is worried she might spend them(wise decision, I believe she would have spent them too). So I only wired her a small amount so she can buy basic things for the new apartment. As for the apartment itself, it costs me about the same, around 15.000 USD which wasnīt in the agreement that I would pay but I did it anyway just to get rid of her. She has it until February 29. Last week she messaged me and asked if she could get another small amount from the divorce money I owe her to which I said yes, but I need her to legally change her address with the tax office. Once she has done that, she can no longer claim the apartment I live in now. She questioned it at first, asking if she shouldnīt wait until end of February but I told her I canīt wire any more money until she has done that. A day later I got confirmation that she has changed her address.
This means she can no longer claim the apartment or demand to move back in. However, I know itīs IMPOSSIBLE to find a rental apartment in our city. She doesnīt have the money to buy one either. So I have a feeling she will be reaching out when itīs getting closer. What would the recommendation be? I donīt know what she will do. She has two friends she knows well enough but they live with their boyfriends so she canīt move in there. Her only option is to find a guy to move in with and that is not something she would want. Not in such short time.
Obviously I canīt have her move back in here but if it comes to the point where she has absolutely nowhere else to go, Iīm not sure I can be cold enough to let her end up on the street. What would you do?
It sounds like you deliberately tricked her to get her to change her address. I doubt you informed her of all the consequences of changing her address.
(spare me the 2X4s folks, I know you will say it's not his responsibility to inform her of the consequences)
Congrats. You get what you want. But I don't know if your courts would see it differently.
What a strange comment. This is how our exchange was after I told her I need her to change address -
Sent October 16, 2020
W: why do I have to change address now?
Me: Because that is why Iīm paying you this money. In the agreement I wrote that you will get that money if you donīt claim the apartment. By changing your address with the tax office you are giving up your right to do so.
W: Is that allowed? Should we not wait until after these 5 months are up?
Me: Itīs actually not allowed what you are doing now. You are required by law to change your address with the tax office if you donīt live here anymore.
W: Ah okey, Iīll do that now then
Thank you, yes I got what I wanted. And I have absolutely no regrets. My courts will most certainly not have any issues with how I handled this. Even if she wasnīt informed of the consequences there wouldnīt have been any problems for me. Things work different here. It is her responsibility to find out what her rights are here. But that said, as you can see, she was well informed before agreeing to change her address.
What a strange comment. This is how our exchange was after I told her I need her to change address -
Sent October 16, 2020
W: why do I have to change address now?
Me: Because that is why Iīm paying you this money. In the agreement I wrote that you will get that money if you donīt claim the apartment. By changing your address with the tax office you are giving up your right to do so.
W: Is that allowed? Should we not wait until after these 5 months are up?
Me: Itīs actually not allowed what you are doing now. You are required by law to change your address with the tax office if you donīt live here anymore.
W: Ah okey, Iīll do that now then
Thank you, yes I got what I wanted. And I have absolutely no regrets. My courts will most certainly not have any issues with how I handled this. Even if she wasnīt informed of the consequences there wouldnīt have been any problems for me. Things work different here. It is her responsibility to find out what her rights are here. But that said, as you can see, she was well informed before agreeing to change her address.
if you say so.
If you are seriously questioning my honesty here, donīt bother posting on my thread again. What reason would I have to not tell the truth? Do you just read posts here assuming the worst in people? If you have been reading my threads from the beginning I have been clear about this. We drafted an agreement stating that she gets that amount provided that she doesnīt claim the apartment. She has asked for money several times, not just these two times. Itīs gotten to the point where I had to say something.
Since I donīt have time writing every single detail, I wrote a shorter version. What I wrote in the previous post is copy paste from my messenger conversation with her.
My apologies if it came off that way.
Oh, I'm sorry. I thought you meant that but sorry for jumping to that conclusion.
Oh, I'm sorry. I thought you meant that but sorry for jumping to that conclusion.
No I was a bit harsh in my response. I didn't mean it like that, but it came out bad. I just wanted to make sure you were protected from all angles. again, my apologies.
Thanks AS, but I donīt agree about the rescuing. Thatīs not my intention with what I wrote.
I may have misunderstood then, were you asking about the timing on giving her the rest of the 15k? I thought you were thinking about trying to find a place for her, or extend the arrangement on where she's staying now.
Sheīs no fool so Iīm sure sheīll have a better plan than waiting until the last minute to contact me for help.
Well hopefully she is smarter than that but that's the exact scenario that landed my girlfriend in my house for a few months! Waited until the last possible second to renew her lease only to discover she couldn't, and then couldn't find another place right away. This was a few years ago, she's a bit wiser now!
When she wrote "maybe just 15 minutes" it was obvious this was just to sooth her anxiety. She didnīt ask to come over to talk for example. She just wanted to see the pug and play family for a moment to help quiet her mind.
Hard to say, I mean she could genuinely miss you, that's usually what happens when you minimize contact like you've done. I wouldn't be surprised if she starts pinging you more. But it's still going to take a good, long while before she really hits bottom.
Not seeing her makes it MUCH easier to move on.
I don't wish separation on anyone, but I know that it helped me a lot as well. It was very painful at first but once I started getting used to being alone and found things to do to fill the time I actually started enjoying it.
Did you have your photo shoot yet?
Thanks AS,
In hindsight, it was silly of me to ask that question. Iīve sometimes been in situations where I need to answer something fast and Iīve thought to myself I wish I could discuss with you guys first. So I was trying to think of scenarios like that. And I thought of the worst possible scenario which would be I get a call from her, crying and saying she has nowhere to go on that day and what I would do in that case. Since she has no friends or family living here who can help, I donīt know if I could have just hung up the phone on her and tell her to deal with it, even if she fired me as husband.
But a scenario like that wonīt happen. She wouldnīt wait until Feb 29 to tell me that, she knows of the chances that I would say no and wouldnīt risk being homeless. So most likely, if sheīll ask, she would ask in December or beginning of January and then I donīt have a problem telling her that this is her problem since she still has time to ask someone else for help. So Iīm sure sheīll find some solution.
I would never extend the rental period for this one, itīs terribly expensive to rent this apartment for her and the only reason I did that in the first place was to get rid of her. After she brought another man to our home, I didnīt want her here anymore and her staying with me wasnīt helping either of us.
I have been 100% dark so yeah, I think she must miss me a little bit at least. And the pug. And for a long time after she moved out, she would text me about random things constantly. Seems like she was trying to make up reasons to be in touch. At one point when she asked for a restaurant recommendation I told her to stop writing to me unless itīs important. Interesting to think about what makes a person in her state of mind hit rock bottom. She has nothing from her old life left.
Yes, I did have the photo shoot on Monday but I messed it up in the preparations a bit. I was drinking 2-3 gallons of water and then on Sunday, the day before the shoot I could only drink 5dl(2 cups) of water the entire day. I do that to get the lean look for the photos. So after almost zero carbs the entire week I was supposed to carb load on Sunday but I misunderstood the instructions. I thought they meant that you were supposed to eat 800 grams of carbs that day but when I looked closer, he meant you should eat carbs and see how you look throughout the day, if you start looking bloated you stop immediately. He just meant he eats 800 grams but the guy is twice my size. So the next day I was bloated for the photo shoot.
However, it still looked great compared to how I used to look and the photographer was much more pro than I thought. He knew all these tricks to make me look good. Asking me to blow air out the side of my mouth and sniff in. Had no idea why but when I saw the pictures they looked so cool! I went and bought almost a whole new wardrobe for the shoot and tried on different clothes. But he knew exactly what I was after. He took pictures as I was getting dressed and my muscles looked like they were popping out because of how I hold my arms when I put on a shirt for example. As I was there, I noticed he had pictures of several famous Scandinavian actors so I realized he is the real deal. Taking pics of action stars certainly had given him the experience to make mine look as cool as possible
Not sure what to do with the photos though. I have still only seen a few, he is editing many of them and will send them to me within a week.
And I thought of the worst possible scenario which would be I get a call from her, crying and saying she has nowhere to go on that day and what I would do in that case.
I completely understand, that's basically exactly what happened with my GF! Granted she wasn't my ex at the time, we were already dating. But I don't think either of us wanted her moving in with me that soon. Anyway I know what you mean, I would feel obligated to help in that position as well, even if it wasn't necessarily the "best" thing to do.
But a scenario like that wonīt happen. She wouldnīt wait until Feb 29 to tell me that, she knows of the chances that I would say no and wouldnīt risk being homeless. So most likely, if sheīll ask, she would ask in December or beginning of January and then I donīt have a problem telling her that this is her problem since she still has time to ask someone else for help. So Iīm sure sheīll find some solution.
Good, sounds like there's nothing to worry about then.
I have been 100% dark so yeah, I think she must miss me a little bit at least. And the pug. And for a long time after she moved out, she would text me about random things constantly. Seems like she was trying to make up reasons to be in touch. At one point when she asked for a restaurant recommendation I told her to stop writing to me unless itīs important.
I remember that. I think all of that is her way of trying to keep you on the hook as Plan B. I also think she doesn't even know what Plan A is, she's just waiting around for it to land in her lap.
Interesting to think about what makes a person in her state of mind hit rock bottom. She has nothing from her old life left.
I think what will happen is you will detach and quit missing her and either start dating someone else or be content not to date, and THEN she'll decide she might want to recon. There's no telling though.
I was drinking 2-3 gallons of water and then on Sunday, the day before the shoot I could only drink 5dl(2 cups) of water the entire day. I do that to get the lean look for the photos. So after almost zero carbs the entire week I was supposed to carb load on Sunday but I misunderstood the instructions. I thought they meant that you were supposed to eat 800 grams of carbs that day but when I looked closer, he meant you should eat carbs and see how you look throughout the day, if you start looking bloated you stop immediately. He just meant he eats 800 grams but the guy is twice my size. So the next day I was bloated for the photo shoot.
That's really fascinating stuff! I've never contest prepped. I wish I could contact you privately to learn more about this, my girlfriend does modeling shoots and wants to do one with me but I would want to be super ripped first, LOL!
He took pictures as I was getting dressed and my muscles looked like they were popping out because of how I hold my arms when I put on a shirt for example. As I was there, I noticed he had pictures of several famous Scandinavian actors so I realized he is the real deal. Taking pics of action stars certainly had given him the experience to make mine look as cool as possible
Not sure what to do with the photos though. I have still only seen a few, he is editing many of them and will send them to me within a week.
That's really awesome! I love it! Hard to top that for GAL
As for what to do with them, why not post some on FB? You worked hard to look that good, you should be proud of it!
Thanks AS,
Thing is that I havenīt thought about her much at all. Her moving out is the best thing that could have happened for my mental health. But it feels like cheating in a way. Iīm making it very easy for myself. Detaching that used to feel so hard seems like a piece of cake when I donīt see her.
Now, if I was to run in to her with another man at this point, that would be horrible for me and I would probably be very affected by it. But I live in a big city so fortunately itīs not that likely.
Thanks, yeah I donīt understand why the direct messages donīt work here. Most forums have that function. Iīm going to step it up a notch now and work out even harder. Trying to build more muscles for next year so that seems like a good goal to have.
I deactivated my FB account when things ended with W. We have too many mutual friends and I felt I needed a break from it. I unfriended her first so she doesnīt pop up when I activate it again whenever that will be. But I still have Instagram where I blocked her. So maybe there
Her moving out is the best thing that could have happened for my mental health. But it feels like cheating in a way.
Yeah I hear you, you go from mourning the loss of your W to suddenly feeling pretty good about yourself and life, and there's actually some guilt attached to that! I think it comes from the sense of loyalty you had for that person for so long. When I started dating again I felt like I was the one cheating, even after we were divorced. It's hard to turn off that loyalty!
Iīm going to step it up a notch now and work out even harder. Trying to build more muscles for next year so that seems like a good goal to have.
Great goal! I've been doing bulk/ cut cycles for years but man, at my age the cutting keeps getting harder!! If I do another bulk cycle I'm going to do some more research on clean bulking, I tend to get a little sloppy with my eating.
I deactivated my FB account when things ended with W. We have too many mutual friends and I felt I needed a break from it. I unfriended her first so she doesnīt pop up when I activate it again whenever that will be. But I still have Instagram where I blocked her. So maybe there
Yeah, great idea! I like IG more than FB anyway. Check out #hotrodmonsters on there, there's a cool guy that makes little ceramic car sculptures that posts under that hashtag. Just sayin'
Journal -
Almost 10 months now without sex. I find myself thinking about it more lately.
The 6 months waiting period before I can finalize the divorce ends April 10. A week or so before I will have to send them a written confirmation that I wish to proceed. Again, this waiting period is because w refused to agree to the divorce.
I don't think I want to wait until we are legally married before seeing someone else. We would be divorced if she had just signed the papers.
Any thoughts on when it's ok to start dating again?
Haven't heard from stbxw almost two weeks now since denied her coming over. The exception being me emailing her when rent was late. She apologized, said she forgot and wired immediately. No communication since then.
Ben, I think you're handling this fantastically.
IMHO you've separated, filed for divorce, and cut contact--there's nothing ethically wrong with dating anytime. I would be honest about how long you've been separated and that your divorce is in progress. I had sex quickly upon splitting and the first wasn't great sex but it was therapeutic. I began seriously dating after 3 months, and I'd say I got really successful after 6 months with dating, love, and sex--had three women fighting over me! After a short spell, it was so easy and effortless compared to my ex-wife. Dates were impressed I wrote full sentences, dressed nicely, brought them flowers, and went for the kiss.
Re: dating - I second CW about being fully transparent about your divorce status, if you choose to go that route.
Also, something I am very cautious about is that I would not want to dive right into a new relationship and repeat the same mistakes I made before.
Thanks CW and U,
I've downloaded a few different dating apps now and by the looks of it, I have a great advantage because of my latest photo shoot. Most profiles I see have blurry photos in low quality. But perhaps men try harder than women since they sort of have to.
Thing is I don't think I've ever really been on a date. I met my w through her sister who was my close friend and the same with the previous relationship. So I'm not as confident about dating as I am in other aspects of life. I am good friends, however, with some of the world most famous pick up artists so I think I'll start with going out with them next time they're in town or even travel to see them.
I will absolutely be honest about my status although maybe not write that on the profile. And will most certainly not jump in to a new relationship. That would be a disaster at this point!
Feeling a little nervous but also excited to be honest. I'll update soon and let you know how it's going.
Just moments after I wrote this last post I get a text from w -
W: Hi, just checking, are u ok? Had horrible dreams, just need assurance
I didn't respond for about an hour as I was working out
Me: I'm fine, thank you. All good
W: Ok, good to hear
Funny I haven't heard from her at all and the moment I downloaded the dating apps I get that text. So either she senses me moving on or she's found this page and knows what I'm writing here.
Ben, my attitude about dating is similar to what CW posted. If you feel you're ready then go for it. There are others here who have religious and/or personal views that it's wrong unless you are divorced, and I respect their opinions. But in the end it's your life and your choice.
I started dating well after S but before D. I think it was about a year after S. I had been with my XW for almost 25 years, so it was a big struggle for me. I really wrestled with the feeling that I was the one cheating on her (ironically enough), just because I had programmed myself over the years to be devoted only to her. I even struggled with ED during that time. My emotions were all over the place. But after a while I adjusted to the "new normal" of it all.
I've downloaded a few different dating apps now and by the looks of it, I have a great advantage because of my latest photo shoot. Most profiles I see have blurry photos in low quality. But perhaps men try harder than women since they sort of have to.
Yes indeed you have a big advantage not only because you have excellent, professional photos, but because they are you and they are current! One complaint I heard over and over again was that men frequently use photos of themselves that are quite out of date, taken before they gained 40 pounds and turned grey or lost their hair! I also heard about a lot of men who used photos that weren't even them. They just show up to these dates with no explanation of why they look old and fat instead of like the supermodel in their profile! Anyway what I often heard from women is they just wanted honesty. They didn't care if someone was carrying a few extra pounds or grey or whatever, it was that when you lie in your profile then that makes them wonder how they can trust anything else about you. So just being truthful and honest and using professional photos is going to move you to the top of the list.
Also, especially here in America, men treat women poorly. I could not believe the stories I heard about men expecting the woman to pay for a first date, or asking them to split the bill. Are you kidding me? Or they show up in shorts and a t-shirt and are impolite as if they don't know how to behave on a date. I got so many compliments for simply holding a door open for a date, or pulling their chair out, or helping them with their coat. That's all just normal stuff for me but to them it was unexpected. So dress nice, listen to them talk, don't make it about you unless they ask questions, be a gentleman, be respectful and you will be in very high demand. Plus I've seen pictures of you and know you're a good-looking dude, your biggest problem is going to be deciding from among many admiring women
So I'm not as confident about dating as I am in other aspects of life.
It was the same for me. I didn't know what to do, had not been on a date since I was in my early 20's and there I was in my 50's trying to date! But like I said above, dress nice, be a gentleman, be relaxed and confident. That's really all there is to it. You'll do great!
Funny I haven't heard from her at all and the moment I downloaded the dating apps I get that text. So either she senses me moving on or she's found this page and knows what I'm writing here.
When you said you hadn't spoken to her in 2 weeks my first thought was that you would probably hear from her soon. So yeah, it was probably just because of the lack of contact.
Also you might edit your signature, some people that don't know you are separated might wonder why you are talking about dating when your signature says you're still living together!
Life has mysterious timing sometimes. Ease your mind. Keep walking Ben.
Thank you AS for the kind words,
Iīm definitely a gentleman in that sense and would of course never dream of splitting the bill or anything. I was really good at connecting with women back in 2009 right before I met my w. Maybe not so good as walking up to strangers and opening sets to use PUA language but definitely good at building attraction, taking hints, telling stories and what NOT to do.
I already have a few matches on Tinder so thatīs a positive sign
When you said you hadn't spoken to her in 2 weeks my first thought was that you would probably hear from her soon. So yeah, it was probably just because of the lack of contact.
Also you might edit your signature, some people that don't know you are separated might wonder why you are talking about dating when your signature says you're still living together!
I just checked my signature and on mine it says she moved out September 28? Are you seeing something else? Perhaps Iīm doing it wrong? This is what I see:
Me: 38
Stbxw: 35
No kids
Mini bd: February 6, 2019
ONS confirmed Sept 7, 2019
Told her to move out: September 8, 2019
W moved out: September 28, 2019
Divorce filed by me: September 23, 2019
6 month divorce waiting period starts counting on October 3, 2019
Life has mysterious timing sometimes. Ease your mind. Keep walking Ben.
Thank you Neffer, these little words of encouragement help more than you think. Thank you for taking your time to write them.
When you said you hadn't spoken to her in 2 weeks my first thought was that you would probably hear from her soon. So yeah, it was probably just because of the lack of contact.
Also you might edit your signature, some people that don't know you are separated might wonder why you are talking about dating when your signature says you're still living together!
I just checked my signature and on mine it says she moved out September 28? Are you seeing something else? Perhaps Iīm doing it wrong? This is what I see:
Me: 38
Stbxw: 35
No kids
Mini bd: February 6, 2019
ONS confirmed Sept 7, 2019
Told her to move out: September 8, 2019
W moved out: September 28, 2019
Divorce filed by me: September 23, 2019
6 month divorce waiting period starts counting on October 3, 2019
That's strange, here's what's appearing below your posts:
Me: 38
Wife: 34
M: 9 months T:9 years
No children
No known OM
No BD really
Still live together
Oh! I see, Iīve made a mistake but sorted now! Thanks AS
Journal -
So this happened. 2.30 am last night I was half asleep when I get a call from a number I donīt recognize. I donīt answer at first but I get a text right away "call w". I call but her phone is off and see another text - "on this phone". I call and she answers.
She had been out with her friend at a bar just a few minutes from where I live. While she was in the restroom, her phone and wallet were stolen from her purse. For an hour she tried to remember my phone number before getting it right. As she explains she starts crying which she almost never does. She is begging me to sleep at my place, she has no money now that all her cards are stolen and is scared to walk all the way home to her place.
I told her itīs fine to stay this one night and asked in how long she could be outside. She said 5-10 minutes. As soon as she saw me she burst into tears and hugged me for a good minute or so. She borrows a t shirt and we go to bed. I ask if she is alright? Sheīs stressed about the phone, wants to report it stolen and worries someone can use her card online. I let her borrow my phone to call the bank and block the cards. For the phone, she has to wait until the morning when their phone lines open.
She then proceeds to tell me about some of the things that had been happening lately. Her best friend whom we both know very well, has had a cocain addiction for about two years. I had no idea of this and was shocked when she told me. Would never have guessed that about her. Lately itīs gotten worse when she almost overdosed but was afraid to call emergency because if the police finds out she could lose her job and her life is over.
W is crying: This..is already so sad. I mean us...our situation...and then I have to deal with her. She was my best friend and I donīt know who she is anymore. She has none of her old friends left she only hangs out with people who do drugs. I havenīt told you this but at our wedding she asked if I wanted some cocain. I asked her if she is out of her mind! Iīm getting married and youīre asking if I want drugs!! She still asked me if Iīm sure I donīt want some.
She spoke about her friend for a while before she again thanked me for allowing her to stay there. We probably fell asleep around 5.30 am. The next morning I told her she can have more of her divorce money to buy a new phone and she borrowed my laptop to order a new simcard. And thatīs it. She came home and messaged me from her laptop and thanked me for helping.
I donīt care if itīs the wrong thing to do to have her over. I will help in an extreme situation like that and I treated her like I would treat any friend in need. But that said, Iīm wondering if she wasnīt taking advantage of the emergency situation to meet me again.If she was, whatīs the point of all this then? Itīs highly unlikely sheīll be in another emergency situation so she wonīt see me again. Iīll probably never know what her motives are but clearly she is struggling in her new life.
I donīt care if itīs the wrong thing to do to have her over. I will help in an extreme situation like that and I treated her like I would treat any friend in need
Hi Ben, I applaud your "Good Samaritan" action, helping her in an emergency even if it wasn't in your best interests with no expectations of anything in return.
As CW says, its about expectations. Well done Ben. Keep that road.
Nice job Ben. I think you absolutely did the right thing for your XW. Hope she's ok now.
Thanks CW, DS9 and Neffer,
Itīs quite easy to have zero expectations these days. I think sheīs ok for now but her life sounds like such a mess when she described it. She mentioned how sheīs just alone all the time. Her best friend she doesnīt recognize anymore due to drugs(thank God my stbxw doesnīt have drug problems or an addictive personality), her other close friend travels to another country to visit her boyfriend as often as possible and will eventually move there.
So she hardly has any friends left except for one co-worker who also has a boyfriend she lives with. Sad to hear that but nothing I can do of course. Just have to leave her to deal with the mess sheīs gotten herself into.
Journal -
So my update on trying online dating is that itīs not exactly what I thought it would be. I matched with a VERY beautiful girl and felt like we really connected. I was almost nervous because she was so perfect. That attractive and same sense of humor as me and great conversation. After the third day I asked her if she had Instagram so weīre not only chatting on Tinder. I would have suggested we meet right away but she lived 2 hours away so the idea was that we would meet end of November when she would be in my area for work. When I asked her for Instagram suddenly she unmatched me and disappeared. So she was catfishing me(most likely).
Girl 2 I met last night. Well, she did not look like she did on the pictures. She must have gained some weight. Itīs fine of course but I donīt see the point of not using recent pictures. In a way I think it was better because I am inexperienced when it comes to dating and this was a good way of getting used to the idea. She was hard to read and despite me being relaxed and the conversation flowed naturally, I didnīt see any indicators of interest from her. I had taken her to a nearby bar. But as we left and walked past my apartment I asked if she wanted to come up and she said yes(I would not have guessed she would). We ended up having sex and she spent the night. Well, 10 months without sex and built up frustration was released that night
We did not speak of our past relationships and I didnīt feel like bringing up my ex so I didnīt. She actually seemed to hint that she wasnīt looking for anything serious a few times throughout the night which suits me fine.
Girl 3 I met today during the day. Instead of suggesting a bar or lunch, I suggested we go for a walk with my pug(she expressed how she was dying to meet him when we chatted on Tinder). Going for a walk was much better! Not the same pressure and both of us can easily exit if we werenīt feeling it. She looked like her pictures but a bit less attractive then someone I would usually be interested in. She suggested after the walk we grab some coffee and as we sat down, wow she was very attracted to me - playing with her hear, face almost red and seemed nervous. As we said goodbye she hugged me really tight and said she hopes we can meet again. I am not sure if I will take her out on another date.
Girl 2 is coming over to my place again tomorrow evening. She recently moved just 5 minutes walk from where I live so thatīs convenient
Journal -
You havenīt heard from me in a while. Iīve been doing well. No more dates besides those two, just been busy with work and some travel. I was really doing fine. Until today...
Just a moment ago, I was walking to a café near me to get a double espresso as I often do. On my way I walked by a guy and a girl walking in to another café near me. I turned around and noticed it was my stbxw. My heart sank...I īm doing well like I said but this is the first time I actually see her with another man with my own eyes. I figured something like this was going on since I havenīt heard from her in a while. As I wrote earlier, she came over late at night on November 2 when her phone and wallet were stolen. Then nothing until 6 days ago when she messaged and asked a random question.
Anyway, going to the gym now. I just thought I was more detached than this. Didnīt think it would bother me this much...
Journal -
You havenīt heard from me in a while. Iīve been doing well. No more dates besides those two, just been busy with work and some travel. I was really doing fine. Until today...
Just a moment ago, I was walking to a café near me to get a double espresso as I often do. On my way I walked by a guy and a girl walking in to another café near me. I turned around and noticed it was my stbxw. My heart sank...I īm doing well like I said but this is the first time I actually see her with another man with my own eyes. I figured something like this was going on since I havenīt heard from her in a while. As I wrote earlier, she came over late at night on November 2 when her phone and wallet were stolen. Then nothing until 6 days ago when she messaged and asked a random question.
Anyway, going to the gym now. I just thought I was more detached than this. Didnīt think it would bother me this much...
Yeah that's what I've found throughout this process as well.. "I'm good. I'm totally detached and could careless what she does!" Then I hear some new truth (the latest being my S4 sleeping in bed with my W and her AP) and it just feels like a dagger straight through the heart.
Just have to keep climbing that mountain. We'll both be better with more time and perspective on our side. Just gotta keep on keeping on. I find it's tough for a few days to hear a new "truth" but ultimately helps me detach even further after about 3 days or so.
NewLife: That's just gross. What's wrong with her? Sorry for the threadjack.
Thank you Newlife, I needed to hear that and it already feels better today. Iīve been feeling anger about this and still do. I paid for a new apartment for her on a completely different side of the area we live in so that we wouldnīt run into each other. That was our agreement. Then she decides to bring her new dude to a café 2 minutes walk from where I live.
Considering it was 11 am on a Sunday it sure wasnīt a blind date. Itīs most likely someone she spent the night with. There are dozens of cafés near her new apartment. Thereīs absolutely no reason for her to go to this one.
But yeah, the upside is I think you are right. It will help me detach even more, knowing she has zero respect for me.
Iīm so sorry you had to hear that about W! I just read your thread and that pisses me off! But glad to hear you are taking it the right way. You deserve better than this.
Hey Ben, sorry this incident got you down but every time something like this happens it just helps drive home that you took the right action with her. You're right, it clearly shows a lack of respect. It's almost like she wanted you to catch her since she was doing this out in the open in your own neighborhood.
It seems VERY suspicious that this was early on a Sunday near your home because A) like you said it sure seems like an overnighter must have happened beforehand and B) since she lives on the other side of town, this implies it was someone she was involved with before moving out. I think you know you deserve better than this and it sounds like you got right back to detachment so that's good!
Thank you AS,
I am considering emailing her to say that I got her the apartment so we wouldnīt run in to each other and that she should honor that agreement. Would that be bad?
I have a feeling this is the guy she had here at our place and if this is the case, he is married. But Iīm not sure this is the case.
Also, I went to see my therapist just now. I had told W that if she wants to see one, she can go to see mine and I will pay for that(as you probably remember) but today I found out that she missed two appointments and cancelled them the same day which means I will get charged for those. After she missed the second one, she said she doesnīt have time to go to therapy at this time so she didnīt schedule a new appointment. I told the therapist that I wonīt be paying for her anymore so if she calls again, please tell her that.
Clear to me that she is not dealing with her emotions, she is running away from them and seeing this guy instead.
...
Just a moment ago, I was walking to a café near me to get a double espresso as I often do. On my way I walked by a guy and a girl walking in to another café near me. I turned around and noticed it was my stbxw
...
Is she an officially an XW now? Or is that just how you mentally view her. Just curious because that's how I'm mentally referring to mine now.
I am considering emailing her to say that I got her the apartment so we wouldn't run in to each other and that she should honor that agreement. Would that be bad?
...
Don't bother, it just shows that she got to you. Detach further.
Similarly, I ran into my WW and her OM at a club, and just said "hey", and continued to enjoy night after getting my emotions in check. Not going to let someone else impact my enjoyment of life.
...
Clear to me that she is not dealing with her emotions, she is running away from them and seeing this guy instead.
Sounds like my WW. Not surprised... I suggested that she go see an IC on her own, and she never bothered looking into it. They don't think there is anything wrong with them, or have any sense remorse yet to want to work on themselves / relationship.
Fine by me if she wants to continue her life like this. I hope she carries her baggage and issues into her next relationship.
I am considering emailing her to say that I got her the apartment so we wouldnīt run in to each other and that she should honor that agreement. Would that be bad?
I agree with LI, don't bother. You want to leave her with the impression that you don't care. Don't cross the street to avoid her, don't comment on who she's hanging out with. If you say something then she'll think "oh yeah, he's still Plan B" but if you don't say anything it'll make her wonder why you don't care anymore. "Is he seeing someone? Has he really forgotten me already? Has he moved on?" I wouldn't be surprised if she finds an excuse to contact you soon if you remain silent.
I found out that she missed two appointments and cancelled them the same day which means I will get charged for those.
Unbelievable. There's really no end to her disrespect.
I told the therapist that I wonīt be paying for her anymore so if she calls again, please tell her that.
PERFECT. No need for you to say anything to W, let the therapist handle it.
Clear to me that she is not dealing with her emotions, she is running away from them and seeing this guy instead.
Probably so. That's just going to prevent her from doing the growth that she needs to do. But that's her journey, you tried to help, now it's all on her.
No, by stbxw I mean soon to be ex wife so we will be divorced by mid April next year if I still want to proceed with it. And I most certainly will proceed with the divorce.
Thanks, youīre right. And Iīve thought about that too. In a weird way, I felt sorry for the guy I saw with her. If heīs fallen for her, I have a feeling heīs in for a rude awakening at some point.
AS, right??
The more I look back at this, the more I see these recent events as a blessing.
The lack of respect amazes me. Crossing my path with the guy she is seeing, knowing I live right next to the café they walked in to, after I paid for a very expensive apartment for her to move to for the specific purpose of not running into each other , missing appointments twice after I agreed, even after filing for divorce, to pay for her therapy and letting me find that out on my own.
I donīt want to celebrate to soon, but I feel I needed to see this. It will help me detach. I will be ok.
AS, right??
The more I look back at this, the more I see these recent events as a blessing.
The lack of respect amazes me. Crossing my path with the guy she is seeing, knowing I live right next to the café they walked in to, after I paid for a very expensive apartment for her to move to for the specific purpose of not running into each other , missing appointments twice after I agreed, even after filing for divorce, to pay for her therapy and letting me find that out on my own.
I donīt want to celebrate to soon, but I feel I needed to see this. It will help me detach. I will be ok.
You're on the right path. Keep focusing on yourself.. Keep climbing that mountain to success. We will find much better people to spend our lives with on the other side of our divorces. Yes, it hurts so much right now to see these types of things, but I promise they are helping us on our journey to 100% detachment. In our WW's current state -- they care absolutely nothing about us.
I never could have imagined someone so close to me could betray me with no remorse so quickly. Lessons learned, I will never allow myself to be this vulnerable with anyone ever again.
Thank you Newlife! I think it was Steve who recommended this a while ago but I think everyone should read Intimacy & Desire by Dr.David Schnarch. That book has helped me tremendously these past few months. Iīm reading it a second time now which Iīve never done with a book before!
Earlier today I had to contact W since rent was due and she hadnīt wired it to me yet. Instead of the usual Facebook messenger I emailed to remind her it was due. She responded that sheīll wire it now with a smiley emoji.
I decided to respond with the email below. I know it was a bit long but after finding out about the missed appointments, I decided I will deduct those costs(about 140 USD per therapy session) from her settlement money. As you can see, I didnīt make it clear to her that I will do just that, Iīll let her find out the day she asks for the money. Also, so you understand what Iīm referring to, she has several boxes of her things in my apartment still as her place is too small to fit all her things.
Any input is welcome
"ok good. So you have two more rents to pay before you need to move out. In January, I will send your things to a storage room as close to you as possible. The sooner you get them from there the better for you as itīs quite expensive. I have a list of all the deductions to be made from the money I agreed to pay you, including the recent ones.
Please remember that by Feb 28 latest the apartment needs to be empty, unless you can move out sooner. You can then send the keys to me that day with any delivery service.
She hasnīt responded to that. Not yet at least.
Thought of an interesting GAL opportunity. While I was visiting a friend a few weeks ago, his girlfriend told me that she had tried to use the app "couch surfing" for a while but it wasnīt going so well. Couch surfing for those who donīt know is an app or website you join where you can ask people from anywhere in the world if you can stay with them for free, sleep in the guest bedroom or their couch.
My friends girlfriend was saying itīs basically a dating portal, none of the women she would write to would answer her and she didnīt want to stay with me. Dating portal, I thought to myself. Say no more...
I joined and offered to host only those who I found to be interesting and attractive. So from Saturday to Monday I have two Ukrainian girls staying in my guest room. They want me to show them around to all the cool bars and cafés and I am more than happy to do so. Weīve been chatting on the app for a few days, getting to know each other.
I donīt care of course if anything romantic happens while they are here, but Iīm beginning to realize, I am free, I can do whatever I want now. I can go anywhere I want, see anyone I want. Get to know new people, make new friends! There are benefits in being single! Many of them!
Thats fuching awesome dude. See you need no help!
You sound like a great catch. Your wife is an idiot.
Thanks LH and KC,
Onwards and upwards!
Insert "Jaws" theme here...
:-)
Journal -
stbxw responded just now to my email I sent her with details on her moving out, the one I posted on Nov 25. This is what she wrote -
"I haven't had time to respond to your other email about the apartment, so much stuff going on as you know, and a lot at work etc.. But it will be fine in time.
And about the apartment, I found another one and are most likely moving this month. I will know for sure on Tuesday, so I'll let you know more details then. It's in XXX(the are I live in), so best is if I could get my stuff from your apartment, because it's closer. If you don't want to see me, maybe you can give your keys to someone, or just give me the keys and I'll fix it while you're away. But I certainly don't mind you being there of course. "
Her selfishness knows no bounds, that is clear for sure. She doesnīt say where is moving exactly, but itīs the same area I live in. I live in a city with a population of close to 2 million and she chooses to live in the same exact area. This is what I responded to her email -
"Thatīs fine, what Iīll do is that Iīll bring your things down to the first floor and then you can just come and get them from there. Iīll just open for you and you can take it from there.
Sure, if you let me know on Tuesday that is fine."
She canīt drive on her own so Iīm sure her dude is going to help her move. Not sure if this is her plan, for me to see her with him to rub it in somehow. Nothing surprises me about her anymore.
The one good thing is that once she picks up those last things, we have no reason to ever communicate again.
Interesting, Ben! I've thought of Couch Surfing or AirBNB from the perspective of meeting interesting people from around the world--never thought about them as dating opportunities since the folks visiting are usually from outside my state or country. Glad you're having fun! Good luck with the move out.
Hey Ben, great response to your W on getting her stuff. You're doing awesome! Very sorry to hear about the two supermodel Ukrainian girls camping out in your spare bedroom. That sounds terribly difficult
Thanks C and AS
It was fun hanging out with the girls but I think next time Iīll host someone traveling alone. The first night we went to a restaurant and a bar afterwards and it was great, but I realized I donīt have the energy of several nights in a row! These young girls, especially being tourists, wanted to do new things all day long so it got a bit exhausting.
On another note, something that has helped me a lot is a supplement called agmatine. Anyone here ever heard about it? Itīs supposed to be used for a better pump when working out but people are using it to reduce anxiety and various other reasons. Iīve been using it for a while now and feel more calm, almost stoic in a way. The only "side effect" is that it reduces your tolerance to pretty much all other substances so you canīt use the same amount of whatever other medicine you are taking. I have friends who stopped taking AD and only use agmatine instead. Anyway, works well for me so thought Iīd mention it here.
Journal -
W emailed me to let me know she has found an apartment and is moving out of the one I got for her this month. She asked if I could wire her enough to pay two months rent deposit and from then on a specific amount each month which would help pay the rent at the new apartment. This tells me she is making a very unwise decision. This divorce money was meant to buy her new furniture or at least pay off some of her debts, but now she is using most of it just to live nice for a relatively short period of time(itīs a one year contract).
She wrote that she just needs to figure out how to move all her things since she canīt afford a car or hire someone to do it. I bet she was hoping Iīd offer to help. What I felt like writing back was "by the looks of it you have a "friend" who can help". I wrote -
"If you need more of your money to move the things let me know."
She sent two emails and explained more than she needed to, about how hard it was to find a place and that she was panicking for a while etc. I didnīt respond to any of that.
Journal -
Stbxw messaged me about 2 hours ago. I was on my way home when I saw it.
W: Hi, so I have a little issue. The company that was supposed to move all my things stood me up and Iīm in my hallway with all my stuff, idk what to do. Canīt rent a car by myself either. Do you think you can help me? It will just take one round, everything will fit in one car same size as we had when I moved out. I will pay you of course! I really really need help...
Me: Which date were you supposed to move?
W sends me a picture of all her things packed up in the apartment.
W: Right now
Iīve called 10 companies. They are all booked. Waiting for reply from the last one.
Me: Iīll get back to you when Iīm home.
Wasnīt sure what to do or what this was. I knew I canīt help her move so I thought about asking my brother if he knows people who she could hire to help her instead. But then she wrote -
W: I just got an offer from that last company if I wanted, expensive but I could take that if you canīt. Donīt want you to feel pressure.
I didnīt answer at first so she wrote again
W: What do you think?
Me: How much will they charge?
W: 2000 SEK(approx.200 usd) if we manage within two hours.
Me: Thatīs not that expensive, you should take it. Renting a van would cost 1400 sek for 24 hours but sounds like you can manage in 2.
W: Okey, Iīll do that then
Never hire this company xxxxx!
Me: Ok, good luck! Ok, thanks!
W: Thank you
Thatīs the first Iīve heard from her in a while. I assume she actually needed help but canīt help but wonder if she wants to see if Iīm still attached in some way.
I think you gave the perfect response. Comes across to me, that you have very nicely detached.
I think you gave the perfect response. Comes across to me, that you have very nicely detached.
Thank you Westo,
Itīs so much easier for me since we donīt have kids. It must be so hard for everyone here who has to see their spouse all the time.
Iīm in my hallway with all my stuff
W sends me a picture of all her things packed up in the apartment
Sounds like she was being overly dramatic (says "in the hallway with my stuff" like it was an emergency, when in fact her stuff was still in the apartment). You handled it great Ben! You didn't rush to rescue her, you didn't freak out, you calmly responded and gave her time to figure it out herself. Well done!
Oh and yes, I'd say chances are very good it was a temperature check on her part.
Thanks AS!
Yeah, completely agree. She doesnīt have to move out until end of this month so worst case she would have had to unpack few of her boxes.
Canīt believe all this time has passed and they still try to temp check.
Journal -
My birthday was December 14. Stbxw was the first one to message me and congratulate -
W: Happy birthday! (5 different emojis, birthday cake, flowers, balloon etc) Wish I could celebrate with you
Hope youīll have a wonderful day with lots of fun and joy <3
Me: Thank you very much
Honestly, I didnīt know what else to answer. I have days when I miss her still of course but itīs easy to remind myself that she doesnīt know what she wants. And Iīm not going to wait around for her to figure that out while Iīm being disrespected. Before she moved out, every time I showed even the slightest interest, she would become distant again.
My birthday could have been better. I had a wisdom tooth pulled out the day before and didnīt know that my face would swell up like it did so was a bit awkward meeting my friends. Iīve had one removed before but from the upper jaw which I understand now is a lot less painful. Only now am I starting to look normal again.
The only link between me and stbxw left now is that she needs to return the keys for the apartment I got for her and for her to pick up some boxes I have at my place. havenīt heard from her on either of those things yet. The keys need to be returned before end of this months so not sure whatīs taking her so long.
Then of course we are still married until earliest April 10.
Tomorrow I go to Athens for my final show of the year and then holiday for me! Working in the entertainment industry means hardly any days without getting hundreds of emails which is why I love Christmas. The only time of the year where Americans donīt send you emails for around two weeks, sometimes longer
Benny B Happy belated birthday! Yep keep moving forward! Dont fall for the crumbs. If she figures her $hit out and your available you will consider under YOUR conditions. If not youll find someone better. Guaranteed!
Take care man!
Happy Birthday Ben!!!! Sorry about the wisdom tooth, I only had two, one on top and one diagonally from it on bottom. Had both removed at the same time and didn't have any issues, but from talking to others over the years there's a wide variety of side effects that can crop up like yours! Glad to hear you are doing better.
Stbxw was the first one to message me and congratulate -
W: Happy birthday! (5 different emojis, birthday cake, flowers, balloon etc) Wish I could celebrate with you
Hope youīll have a wonderful day with lots of fun and joy <3
She is the queen of temperature checks, that's for sure!
Me: Thank you very much
Honestly, I didnīt know what else to answer.
No more needed, that was a good response.
I have days when I miss her still of course but itīs easy to remind myself that she doesnīt know what she wants. And Iīm not going to wait around for her to figure that out while Iīm being disrespected. Before she moved out, every time I showed even the slightest interest, she would become distant again.
It's definitely normal to miss her, but it's good that you are able to miss her without feeling the need to temp check her. You are right, she's got to figure things out on her own and if you reach out she will distance again.
Enjoy your holiday break! I'm taking off next week and half the following, definitely looking forward to it
Thanks LH! Thanks AS!
Have a great holiday!
Man Iīve been feeling down for a while lately. I was doing quite well for a while but thereīs a feeling of loneliness that I canīt shake off lately
I have some of the best GAL opportunities anyone could ask for and it most definitely helps to travel the way I do. But when Iīm home again and itīs just me, I often feel lonely. Not quite sad but not happy either. I feel a huge responsibility for my dog and have to make sure heīs had his exercise. If I donīt, if I feel heīs been bored, it stresses me so I have to make sure heīs happy when Iīm with him.
I have plenty of things planned. This weekend for example Iīm travelling to Copenhagen with a friend, we managed to secure a reservation at a restaurant thatīs very difficult to book. I know that will be fun of course but after that, when I come home on Sunday and pick up my dog, we go home and weīre just alone again...it just feels so lonely.
Dating hasnīt gone well at all. Besides the two girls I met a few times I also met a third girl who turned out to be very unstable, stalker warning is a good way of describing her so I ended it quickly. So far I havenīt met a single girl of the ones Iīve actually felt really attracted to. If we match, they either donīt write or answer when I write and when we do chat a bit they stop writing after a while. I know the best way to meet someone would be IRL but all my friends I used to go out with have kids now. At the moment, Iīm not sure how Iīm going to meet my next relationship. I know I wonīt be single forever, I just canīt picture who that person will be since online dating seems to be way more difficult than I expected.
Iīve made plans with friends but theyīre all months from now because thatīs how we need to do it these days. A weekend in April etc etc.
Havenīt heard from STBXW at all with the exception of her letting me know she returned the keys for the rental apartment a few weeks ago. Plenty of her boxes are still here and she was supposed to pick them up this month so weīll see if that happens.
I spent Christmas with my family but decided to just stay home for NYE with my dog. I thought it would be ok but never doing that again. I knew this would be the first NYE spent without W in 10 years but I also realized that this would be the first time ever Iīm alone. At midnight I could hear all the neighbours so yeah, not a good idea. Next year Iīll make plans for sure.
Anyway, just venting here and not expecting any advice. I know what I have to do and all. I havenīt stopped working out and I still eat a healthy diet so I look great. Would just be nice to have more to do besides work and taking care of my dog.
And thanks Job!
Just as a wrote that I wake up this morning to an email from W. As I wrote earlier one of her best friends has a cocaine addiction which I became aware of in the beginning of November which was the last time I spent time with W.
W: Hi,
happy new year, hope you had fun:)
I myself was going to be with X(her friend), but guess who didn't show up?
So I was sitting ready home alone waiting for her all evening, but she never came..
Hopefully she will get some help soon..
Anyway!
Can you wire me 2000 SEK? I got a bill I had to pay, and money wasn't enough this month.
(for anyone who isnīt familiar with my sitch, I have an agreement to pay her a certain amount if we were to separate so the money she is asking for is her money)
Me:
Thank you and happy new year !
Is she ok now? Have you seen or spoken to her since? I am so sorry to hear this and that you had to be alone. I see she always watches my instastories and likes my pictures so I hoped that was a sign she's doing better.
For NYE I was just home alone with the pug. "owner 1" had to go to Russia until mid January and "owner 2" was away as well and I wanted pug to be safe and have fun so I just decided to make good food for him and buy some new toys.
Of course, I just wired you 2000.
(I share my dog with two others who used to be a couple but split up, hence why I write owner 1 and 2)
Perhaps I shouldnīt have written that I was home alone or if that was too much information. But she wrote back this -
W:
Yeah. When I tried to call her she switched her phone off, so that was pretty s****y. I was thinking about to call you, but I assumed you wouldn't want that
I didn't answer her for days, because I was so angry and disappointed in her. But she said she was sick, which is 100% not true of course. But what can I do.
This last email was sent just a few minutes ago. Nothing to reply to I guess and sounds like thereīs a temp check in there.
B,
Major temp check. Great job not acknowledging it.
Keep being awesome!
Thanks LH! Just so everyone understands, I see the last bit could be confusing but this part below was from W regarding her friend and not me writing it about her -
"I didn't answer her for days, because I was so angry and disappointed in her. But she said she was sick, which is 100% not true of course. But what can I do."
Hey Ben, sounds about like my NYE, I've never been big on celebrating it though, it's just another day to me. I was home with my S, he was playing a video game and I think I was watching a movie with my doggo on my lap. There are worse ways to pass some time than hanging out with your fur pal
I was thinking about to call you, but I assumed you wouldn't want that
Yeah that definitely sounds like a temp check. You did well to ignore it. More will come. I still feel like she's going to want to recon at some point. She's learning to miss you. Whether she's done any work on herself is another matter entirely.
Thank you AS,
I havenīt made a big deal of NYE for many years now so I didnīt think it would be a problem. I was invited by several people to join them and bring my dog but I said Iīll just stay home. I think it would have been different if I had a kid who was home with me. It wasnīt horrible to be home with my dog but it wasnīt a pain free as I expected either. But now I know for next year at least
Iīm wondering if sheīll want to recon. Sheīs just so proud and hates being wrong. But besides that, she tends to run away from things and avoid dealing with them. Sheīs always been like that. So for her to want to face what sheīs done and deal with all that, that would be a HUGE 180 for her.
But weīll see. Feeling better today and more positive so just shows that cycling continues even when youīve come far. I really appreciate you and LH commenting, it really helps.
Iīm wondering if sheīll want to recon. Sheīs just so proud and hates being wrong. But besides that, she tends to run away from things and avoid dealing with them. Sheīs always been like that. So for her to want to face what sheīs done and deal with all that, that would be a HUGE 180 for her.
You've seen the story about my friend whose W left him and they split up the business and all that, she was one stubborn woman! I never would have thought she would reverse course like she did, but it does happen. Not every time, but you never know!
Feeling better today and more positive so just shows that cycling continues even when youīve come far.
It does indeed but over time the "lows" are shorter and more shallow until they eventually fade away. You've come a really long way from where you started!
Thank you AS, with your help Iīve come far indeed
Hi Ben,
Belated happy birthday. Glad you had some ups this month, sorry for the downs. May I ask how CouchSurfing has turned out? I'm both visiting one couch and hosting another this week. No dating intentions--just looking forward to meeting locals in the towns I visit, and fellow travelers when at home.
Hi CW,
Sorry, I have been here a few times reading and Iīve not seen that you posted. Didnīt mean to ignore you. I just opened my thread to journal a bit and saw this but first thank you for the birthday wishes
I havenīt hosted any more people lately, I wrote to one girl who replied that sheīs only looking for female hosts(so clearly not in to dating haha) but other than that itīs just been men and couples. I feel bad declining their requests but Iīm a busy man and donīt have time for both dating and hosting others. But thereīs another reason why and Iīll write a separate post about it next. But I definitely recommend that you both host and meet locals, I still stay in touch with the girls from Ukraine and I hope to visit them someday. Itīs fun to be able to travel almost anywhere in the world and have someone local guide you to all the cool spots or just hang out with. Due to my work, I sort of already have it like that when I travel but I think the more people you know the better.
How did your Couchsurfing experience go? I looked at your recent posts and havenīt seen you mention anything.
Journal -
So thereīs this girl...we matched on Tinder right after Christmas and it was a slow start. I just assumed we probably wonīt even meet like most other matches. But weīve kept in touch and have been messaging each other every day. She knows about what has happened and the time period of it all but not details on how painful it was for me and what a nightmare 2019 was.
We were supposed to meet last week but she got sick. I immediately got suspicious but saw her instastory that she was home sick in bed for a few days. So the plan is that weīre going to meet tomorrow or Wednesday. A few days ago I kept looking at my phone, hoping she would message me and got an email from W with a screen shot from the local police warning dog owners in the area since one dog was poisoned and died. She wrote please be careful with pug. I hadnīt even thought of W in a while when I got it so I answered the following day and thanked her. I also added that the pug is doing fine and attached a recent photo of him. She responded almost immediately.
W: "Aww, my cute little boy. Omg that's adorable!!! Little fat munchkin ❤️
Have to have him soon, now I have more room, and live at xxx street"
I was surprised she would give me her address and that place is just 5 min walk from where I live. Also surprised she thinks she can have him. I still havenīt responded and probably wonīt.
On Friday I had a get together at my house where some of my female friends(my W knows them very well and they used to get along) saw my pug for the first time. Three of them were cuddling with him at one point and I filmed that. Just a very cute video and part of me wanted to send it to W but I stopped myself since I had made it clear I donīt want to be her friend.
I keep thinking about this girl from Tinder. Not only is he beautiful but sheīs so different from all the others Iīve been writing with. Anyway, too early to tell. Iīll let you know how it goes after Iīve met her.
On Feb 6 itīs the anniversary of my BD. Canīt believe itīs almost been a year. I look so different physically today.(AS has seen the pics so he knows
) I feel so different mentally. Iīm proud of myself and feel thankful to everyone here for all your support. Thank you everyone!
I was surprised she would give me her address and that place is just 5 min walk from where I live. Also surprised she thinks she can have him. I still havenīt responded and probably wonīt.
Interesting that she's finding these excuses to temp check you. And what the heck, she lives a 5 minute walk from you??? That is a VERY strange move for someone that is supposedly done and moving on. She clearly knew the chances were good she might run into you being that close. Good job not responding, it's all just a little too soon for that I think.
Three of them were cuddling with him at one point and I filmed that. Just a very cute video and part of me wanted to send it to W but I stopped myself since I had made it clear I donīt want to be her friend.
So you had three mutual female friends over and filmed them and thought about sending it to W? LOL! Glad you didn't!
I keep thinking about this girl from Tinder. Not only is he beautiful but sheīs so different from all the others Iīve been writing with. Anyway, too early to tell. Iīll let you know how it goes after Iīve met her.
You already know my feelings on this, but don't get too attached until you've met! Learn from my mistakes
I look so different physically today.(AS has seen the pics so he knows)
Yes, HUGE transformation! From dad bod to ripped male underwear model
Nice work my friend!
Thanks AS,
I know how that sounds about the female friends but W knows them all and really wouldnīt mind, I have known them for close to 20 years. One of the girls husband can be heard in the video laughing at my pug being adored by them all. If W and I had been together still she would have loved seeing that video and would have shared it. But Iīm still glad I didnīt of course, it would open the door to her contacting me every day.
Youīre right, itīs not like me to think about someone this much that I havenīt even met yet. Hope this isnīt some side effect of being separated for a while. Iīll see how it feels after weīve met.
Thanks
Benny B,
I just want to warn you in advance the first date never lives up to expectations. Even if you only end up liking her a little go out on a second date. On the second date expectations will be tempered and you will have a better evaluation.
Thanks LH,
Iīll update on everything shortly. Just need to start a new thread first