Midlife wife crisis9 - DivorceBusting.com

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Another rough day. My w was just spitting fire. All because I went to the house to pick up my d and my d gave me a hard time as always that she doesn�t want to go with me. So of course w takes out on me that it�s my fault that we should have left right away. I asked my w a couple of days before if it was ok for me to bring some stuff over to make breakfast. She said it was fine. Now because my d doesn�t want to leave right away I get blamed. My d was saying she didn�t feel good but every time she has to go with me it�s the same excuse. W said it�s not fair that she is a prisoner in the house. I said I understand how you could feel that way it must be frustrating. She gets so mad when I validate. She goes oh I know you know. She said it must be nice you can come and go as you please. But I am stuck here all the time. I�m saying to all of you. I don�t know how she could say that. No one and I mean no one goes out more than my w. She is literally only in the house to sleep. Again I said I can see how that can be frustrating. Then she says, you say your goI guess to change and nothing has changed. I asked can you tell me what hasn�t changed. She said the communication. You were suppose to feed them then go. I said I am sorry that it is not working out like it was suppose to. I went back into my d room at that point and said to her I�m leaving with brother and I will be back in an hour when I get home you need to be ready or we are going to have a bad day. Then I left with s. Oh wait as I was leaving she said you guys like to torture me it�s not fair how all of you treat me. I really wanted to laugh out loud. Then I left. Man I have never seen someone so angry at life like her!!! She is just a miserable human being. Oh and I kept thing of all of you about validating. A couple of times I was going to lose my cool and I thought about all of you. Thank you. I hope that was better.

W,

I would suggest you stop have any contact with your W that is unnecessary. Pick up the kids and be gone. Also, it may be time to push along the D so you can get your own place.

Lastly what are your boundaries? The more you allow your W to treat you like $hit in front of your daughter the more your D will lose respect from you.

Originally Posted by LH19

W,

I would suggest you stop have any contact with your W that is unnecessary. Pick up the kids and be gone. Also, it may be time to push along the D so you can get your own place.

She started the refinance process so I can buy my own place. It looks like September is when it should be done. I need my own place I don�t want to talk to her or be around her anymore. She is nothing but negativity and misery!! I am done with her. It hurts a lot though to be with someone for almost 20 years and watch her flush it down the toilet. I miss having someone that cares for me the way I care for them. I know it will come in time but for now it still stings. And it�s not so much her it�s just missing that bond with someone.

I was at a bbq today and just watching a lot of the couples interact bothers me/ hurts. Like I said I just miss that interaction.

LH how could I have set up a boundary? I sometimes feel so lost when to validate and to basically walk away.. thanks

W,

First off don't validate $hitty behavior. Remember that everything right now is about respect so your boundaries should be around high she treats you.

As for the other couples just remember that many of them aren't happy in their marriages and are looking and envying you.

Originally Posted by LH19

W,
First off don't validate $hitty behavior. Remember that everything right now is about respect so your boundaries should be around high she treats you.

I guess this where I get confused. When do I validate and when do I set boundaries? I must be really mixing this up. I thought her feelings are her feelings and I should validate them. Obviously after a little while if she gets hostile verbally that I should say I am done with this conversation and walk away.

At this point it really doesn�t matter what I do it won�t change anything. I just have to get my respect back at this point. But when I feel like I am doing that everyone tells me I am arguing. So basically just walking away in a nice way is setting boundaries and getting my respect back?

If she�s being a biotch and talking down to you it is not to be tolerated. Once you get your own place things will start to get better.

Feelings are different than beliefs. Feelings are angry, sad, happy....

Google Images:
Emotions and Feelings Charts | Three to five for Twenty-Four

W:"I went for a walk in the park today"
H:"I bet that was peaceful"

W:"We always did what you wanted"
H:" Bla bla bla frustrating bla bla"

W:"You are a <censored>"
H:"I understand you feel that way. "

or

W:"You are a <censored>"
H:"I am done with this conversation until you decide to be more respectful"
W:"Bla bla bla bla bla <censored.> bla bla ...."
H:Quietely walks away

or

W:"You are a <censored>"
H"When you resort to name calling, I feel.....If you....I will....if it continues, I will......"

Having conversations with my kids, I had to state this frequently:

"Hate the behavior and not the person"
"Describe the behavior and how you feel"

BAD:

"I hate you"
"You are a blank blank"

Better:

"I am frustrated because you left the sink full of dirty dishes"

LH I have a question for you. Are you still married? Just wondering how you did it. I read some of your situation when you first came on here. I can�t belive you hung on for 2.5 years. Now that is strength!!!

I am starting to get very hateful towards my w!!! I am seriously losing a lot of love for this �monster�. I feel like it�s time she just becomes a colleague. We are in the business of raising our children. I am tired of being Mr. Niceguy. I will treat her like a colleague for now on. It�s sad how much love I have had for this woman for so long and quickly diminishing. I really don�t know if I even want her anymore. The one thing I have seen. She is becoming more and more angry in general. How she just wants to get away from me and the kids. So much she booked a 4 day trip with her girlfriends. And she says she deserves it. Lmao you deserve a vacation for destroying a family??? Go for it. I could use the piece and quiet. She has become so miserable it�s unbearable and I feel bad for the kids!! I think she is starting to notice my detachment. Because she thinks I am being mean just being cordial to her. She asks me all the time what�s the problem. I say everything is great why? She is not use to be not being lovey dovey with her and always been concerned with her. Man I wish I did this sooner. It was just hard for me. The rope is slowly dropping.

W,

I've been divorced for a year it's a thousand times better then WW bs! You'll get there too if you put in the work.

No more whiny posts from you about your w. Start posting your GAL activities, goals, plans for the future, how you're improving your relationship with your daughter.

Took the kids out today to a bouncy house place with their friends. Then took the kids to a playground and then dinner. Afterwards went back to the house w was not there so I stayed with them and had a good time just goofing around with both of them. My d will have fun with me when w is not around. When she is around she tries to show her how much she hates me. Tomorrow going to try and hustle in my real estate career. Going to go to the gym first then hustle.
Don�t know if it is a no no but I have been seeing someone who I am really started to get interested in. Looking forward to seeing this person tomorrow night in the city. It�s nice to have someone who cares about me just like I care about them. This person and I have such a good time and have a lot in common and have the same ideas on what we expect in a relationship.

W,

IMO you are not even close to being ready to date and this reeks of your codependency tendencies.

Quote

Another rough day. My w was just spitting fire. All because I went to the house to pick up my d and my d gave me a hard time as always that she doesn�t want to go with me. So of course w takes out on me that it�s my fault that we should have left right away. I asked my w a couple of days before if it was ok for me to bring some stuff over to make breakfast.

I don't understand your purpose in preparing breakfast at W's place, when you know how your D acts about leaving with you. Have you tried my suggestion of telling your W you will pick the kids at xx time and to have them ready to leave when you pull up in the driveway? That way, you bypass the drama in the house, plus it puts the responsibility of having the kids ready on her shoulders, instead of everything being your fault. Don't go inside the house to plead with your D. If she isn't waiting by the door, then leave without her. Your W will get fed up with her, and will see that D gets her fanny in gear. As long as you persist in going inside, it's going to fall on you.

Quote

My d was saying she didn�t feel good but every time she has to go with me it�s the same excuse. W said it�s not fair that she is a prisoner in the house. I said I understand how you could feel that way it must be frustrating. She gets so mad when I validate.

Perhaps she feels you are patronizing, rather than sincerely validating.

Quote

Again I said I can see how that can be frustrating.

Since this seems to make her angry, try saying something else, rather than repeating yourself. Check out Wonka's validation cheat sheet.

Originally Posted by LH19

W,

IMO you are not even close to being ready to date and this reeks of your codependency tendencies.

I get what you are saying. I�m just dating. Codependency? Look I loved my wife and family and yes it is hard for me to go through this divorce. I have dates 2 other women already and I was not attached to them. As a matter of fact I stopped seeing them, not the other way around. So I didn�t need them. And those things just happened. This is one of the ways I am GAL. I am dating. It nice to see what else is out there. Makes me wonder how I ever fell in love with my wife. These other women had been very caring treated me like a king which my w never did. The reality for me is I have been in This situation for a year. I fought hard for my w and has done nothing. I have no more fight in me anymore. I want to live and enjoy the company of another. I don�t know LH how you did it for 2.5 years. There is no reason for me to fight she is a very stubborn woman and would rather die than admit she was wrong. Besides she ABSOLUTELY loves this new life. Where I have the kids and she can go out all the time and party. She is NOT coming back. I have a better chance of hitting the lotto. Seriously!!!

I wish things worked out like Steve did and is working things out. But that will never happen. This is what my w does, she cuts people out of her life permanently. Granted we have kids together but we will NEVER be a couple again. Honestly I don�t know if I want to anymore either. Dating has opened my eyes to how I should have been treated in this relationship. As an equal. Not me doing everything for her since day 1. I listen to these other women how they handle life and responsibilities. My w, all she did was complain about life. She had the nerve to say to me a couple of times,
That she never thought that she would ever have to cook, clean or work. I mean really. She knew my profession when we got married. All she ever did when we got married was complain about how much she hates to cook and clean. Work has its ups and downs for her. I have said it before and I will say it again. I was duped into getting married. She just wanted to be the first out of her friends to be married. I see that now. She wanted to be first to have kids. And now she feels like it was all a mistake because she is �missing� out on life. She doesn�t want to be a mother or a wife anymore. That�s enough of my rant for now!!!

Originally Posted by LH19

W,

IMO you are not even close to being ready to date and this reeks of your codependency tendencies.

THIS^^^^^^

Earn your way out of your MR before you set yourself for the same mistakes with someone new.

Originally Posted by sandi2

Quote

Another rough day. My w was just spitting fire. All because I went to the house to pick up my d and my d gave me a hard time as always that she doesn�t want to go with me. So of course w takes out on me that it�s my fault that we should have left right away. I asked my w a couple of days before if it was ok for me to bring some stuff over to make breakfast.

I don't understand your purpose in preparing breakfast at W's place, when you know how your D acts about leaving with you. Have you tried my suggestion of telling your W you will pick the kids at xx time and to have them ready to leave when you pull up in the driveway? That way, you bypass the drama in the house, plus it puts the responsibility of having the kids ready on her shoulders, instead of everything being your fault. Don't go inside the house to plead with your D. If she isn't waiting by the door, then leave without her. Your W will get fed up with her, and will see that D gets her fanny in gear. As long as you persist in going inside, it's going to fall on you.

I went into the house because I wanted to make them breakfast. Just trying to be a good dad. But as always it backfired on me. I will do that, tell her to have the kids ready by a certain time. I am telling you now I already know her response. She will say, oh so now it�s my responsibility to get the kids ready for you. You just come and pick up the kids and don�t have to do anything and I will have to deal with them. I could probably put that in quotes. No matter what it�s alwasy my fault or I am making her do something for me. I can�t win with anything. Sandi since you have been down this road, were you like that? What do I say or do when I will always be wrong. And I feel she just gets more resentful with everything I do. Like I have other motives.

W,

Who gives a flying fuch if she gets resentful towards you. Stop trying to please her. I�ve asked you several times if you read NMMNG. You never respond. That book is DB 101 especially written for you. Everything you do is for her love and approval and when she doesn�t give it to you then you double down harder. She treats you like $hit and then you try even harder. Then you come to the board and state that you can�t believe she�s doing this after all you do for her. Rinse recycle repeat. Your acts are not genuine you want something in return. That�s selfish. Dating right now while your married is selfish. Abandoning your kids because you couldn�t deal with your W is selfish. Expecting her to stay in an unhappy marriage is selfish.

I�m sorry for being harsh but you just don�t get it. There are no short cuts. You have to do the work. Stat by reading NMMNG!

How old are your kids that they need someone to get them ready?

Wolf, first I think you did a very good job validating, when your W spews and you just validate then it makes you look like the calm and collected one and her the loose cannon. So well done.

Second I 100% agree with the others that you need to forget about hanging out at the house with W. This is where 99% of your problems seem to happen, you're just hanging around there finding excuses to stay "for your kids" (I suspect you are making excuses to be around W). Spend your kid time AWAY from W. When you pick them up then get in and get out.

Regarding your D's behavior, she's doing that because you're pandering to her. If you just pick her up and leave then eventually she'll quit doing it. This is the exact same behavior pattern as when you start taking a kid to daycare. They cry and cry and hold their little hands out to you like they are the most pathetic thing ever. OF course you want to run over and give them one last hug and kiss, and maybe one more and one more after that... but what do the daycare teachers tell you to do in response? LEAVE. Because you know what happens? As soon as you're gone they're walking around playing and doing stuff and enjoying themselves. So you take them, you drop them off, and as they're crying and putting on a show you ignore it and leave. After a week or two they quit doing it because they decide it's not worth their effort if they're not getting a reaction. It's just a life lesson for them, they're learning what they can and can't get away with. Once they adapt then everything goes smoother.

So go pick up your kids and leave. In and out. Interact with W as little as possible. Treat her like you would a business associate. If D throws a fit just quietly whisk her out to the car. Don't yell at her or anything, just don't react to the tantrum.

Originally Posted by LH19

W,
Who gives a flying fuch if she gets resentful towards you. Stop trying to please her. I�ve asked you several times if you read NMMNG. You never respond. That book is DB 101 especially written for you. Everything you do is for her love and approval and when she doesn�t give it to you then you double down harder. She treats you like $hit and then you try even harder. Then you come to the board and state that you can�t believe she�s doing this after all you do for her. Rinse recycle repeat. Your acts are not genuine you want something in return. That�s selfish. Dating right now while your married is selfish. Abandoning your kids because you couldn�t deal with your W is selfish. Expecting her to stay in an unhappy marriage is selfish.
I�m sorry for being harsh but you just don�t get it. There are no short cuts. You have to do the work. Stat by reading NMMNG!

I am a bit confused with your comments. When I try and do things for her I am being too nice and a doormat basically. But when I do things for myself then I am being selfish. So which is it? My IC suggested I not stay in the home because it was not a good environment for my kids. Looking back I wish I did stay. And say forget her. You know there were many things I did In This relationship that was not selfish: cleaning the house, taking kids to activities, food shopping, taking care of all the bills, taking care of the dogs, picking up second job, cooking half the to
E, taking care of the pool, when her or the kids hinted that they wanted something I would surprise them for either a birthday gift or Christmas gift. So me GAL is dating I don�t see what�s wrong with it? At this point we are only married on paper. Also, I don�t want her back into an unhappy marriage. I want her back in a new and improved marriage where everyone is happy. If wanting a new marriage where everyone is happy then I am selfish there too.

Originally Posted by LH19

How old are your kids that they need someone to get them ready?

It�s an on going battle. We don�t actually help them get dressed but have to remind them over and over again about getting married. My w and I have different opinions on discipline. She is more laxed and never sticks to the punishment. If it was my way I would say it once and after that there would be consequences, when we were married she said I was being too harsh and now look. My d is 12 and s is 9.

AS and Sandi you are both right. I will just pick up the kids for now on. I won�t hang around the house. You are right AS most of my problems come when I am around her.

LH you are right I won�t care what she thinks about her getting the kids ready for me. Oh well if she gets mad.

Man this is no way to live. Honestly I just feel like a zombie going through the motions of life. Also I did not read NMMNG. I will pick that book up and read it. I have always been a confrontation avoider. Something I need to work on. Although my w would always say I always stand up to her and not anyone else.

W,

I�m going to try one more time and until you read the book you will not understand. When you do things for people expecting something in return that�s being selfish.

Yes doing things for people who treat you like $hit is being a doormat. Not sure why you can�t understand it.

12-9 are old enough to get themselves ready.

Btw the way I would look for a new IC

Originally Posted by LH19

W,
I�m going to try one more time and until you read the book you will not understand. When you do things for people expecting something in return that�s being selfish.

Yes doing things for people who treat you like $hit is being a doormat. Not sure why you can�t understand it.

12-9 are old enough to get themselves ready.

I am looking to buy the book. Reading reviews and I need this book.

Let me give you all an example of how my w is and I stood up to her. The days I have the kids are Monday, Wednesday and Friday. (This is for now until I get my own place). So Sunday she asked me if we could switch Friday and Saturday. That she made plans with the kids in the morning and it�s her parent�s anniversary. I said I�m sorry I can�t I already made plans with me and the kids. She says this:
So when you ask me to switch it�s fine but when I ask... no? See how it�s always on your terms? You can literally come and go as you please... yet on the nights I don�t have the kids I either have to come home early or get a sitter? And now you can�t answer my call?

I told her I am sorry but Friday is my day and I already made plans. My buddy ( I said his name)from South Carolina was coming up and we made plans 2 weeks ago and that is the only day I would be able to see him and his family. This friend of mine is also my son�s godfather. I said, I can�t answer the phone right now I am busy.
So in spite she told my kids that she was not going to have them Friday and they were not going to see their friends either that they will be with me all day. So of course my d is upset with that. But I was able to get my d to understand and she wasn�t happy with it but ok with it. But I know my d once we hang out with my friends (they have 3 kids) she will be fine. Just trying to show mom how much she loves being with her.

Originally Posted by LH19

Btw the way I would look for a new IC

I don't know enough about your IC to second this, but what I do second is NOT settling for IC just because you've gotten comfortable with them. ICs are like anything else in life. There are good ones, bad ones, and in-between ones. There are good ones that eventually the time comes to move on from them, even though they were good. ICs shouldn't be any different than anyone or anything else in life, shop around!

Quote

Sandi since you have been down this road, were you like that? What do I say or do when I will always be wrong. And I feel she just gets more resentful with everything I do. Like I have other motives.

My sitch was a little different, b/c my kids were grown and we did not physically separate. I had a lot of resentment toward my H, but I did not act like your wife. Women know, just like kids know, how far to push.

Quote

Your acts are not genuine you want something in return. That�s selfish. Dating right now while your married is selfish. Abandoning your kids because you couldn�t deal with your W is selfish. Expecting her to stay in an unhappy marriage is selfish.
I�m sorry for being harsh but you just don�t get it. There are no short cuts. You have to do the work. Stat by reading NMMNG!

I am a bit confused with your comments. When I try and do things for her I am being too nice and a doormat basically. But when I do things for myself then I am being selfish. So which is it? My IC suggested I not stay in the home because it was not a good environment for my kids. Looking back I wish I did stay. And say forget her. You know there were many things I did In This relationship that was not selfish: cleaning the house, taking kids to activities, food shopping, taking care of all the bills, taking care of the dogs, picking up second job, cooking half the to

I can only imagine how you feel as if you can't do anything right with your W........or us. Please get NMMNG and read it cover to cover, and I think it help you understand a lot better what the board is saying. You don't have to spend time reading NMMNG reviews, b/c we rate it highly and have been encouraging you to get it.

It won't take long to read it.

W,

Telling your W you have plans is not standing up to her. Sorry I can�t help you I have plans. If she respected you she would say �ok. Thanks anyway�.

Either way who gives a f if she spews bs at you. Off a ducks back as Steve would say. After several times of you not caving in and not reacting she�ll stop.

Originally Posted by Steve85

Originally Posted by LH19

Btw the way I would look for a new IC

I don't know enough about your IC to second this, but what I do second is NOT settling for IC just because you've gotten comfortable with them. ICs are like anything else in life. There are good ones, bad ones, and in-between ones. There are good ones that eventually the time comes to move on from them, even though they were good. ICs shouldn't be any different than anyone or anything else in life, shop around!

I get what you both are saying, how do I know when one is good and one is bad?

Sandi that does not make me feel any better, it sounds like my w was way worse than you. It is what it is. I have to move forward.

Quick question, tomorrow is our 15 year anniversary. Say nothing and do nothing, correct? It saddens me that I know tomorrow will mean nothing to her. I always tried to go above and beyond on our anniversary. Planning trips, massages, expensive dinners. To think 15 years ago I should have run the other way!! I remember my dad saying, you sure you want to do this? Anyway, advice on what I do tomorrow? Am I right say and do nothing?

Send flowers, chocolates and renew your vows.

LH smacks his face with the palm of his hand.

Lol. I got it. Nothing. Thanks LH

Or my personal favorite... A broom and a vibrator.... Could go with the nuclear option. D papers. My mediation date is 10th anniversary..lol

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Quick question, tomorrow is our 15 year anniversary. Say nothing and do nothing, correct? It saddens me that I know tomorrow will mean nothing to her. I always tried to go above and beyond on our anniversary. Planning trips, massages, expensive dinners.

Maybe you weren't speaking to her in her love language though. I always tried to find special gifts for my XW for bdays, Xmas and anniversaries. Why? Because that's what I thought she wanted, because it was MY love language so I just assumed it was everyone else's too. But her love language is words of affirmation which I wholly neglected throughout our M. My XW's bday is coming up and I was talking to my D's and asked them what she told them she wanted. A rack to hang tools in her garage and a new garden hose. Gifts are just not her love language, she doesn't care about gifts at all. Your W may very well be the same. So when you say "but I went above and beyond and did this that and the other" it just makes me think you didn't know her or what she wanted. You did what you THOUGHT she wanted. And those are great things, but my point is if you neglected her REAL love language then all the gifts in the world won't make up for it.

Originally Posted by AnotherStander

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Quick question, tomorrow is our 15 year anniversary. Say nothing and do nothing, correct? It saddens me that I know tomorrow will mean nothing to her. I always tried to go above and beyond on our anniversary. Planning trips, massages, expensive dinners.

Maybe you weren't speaking to her in her love language though. I always tried to find special gifts for my XW for bdays, Xmas and anniversaries. Why? Because that's what I thought she wanted, because it was MY love language so I just assumed it was everyone else's too. But her love language is words of affirmation which I wholly neglected throughout our M. My XW's bday is coming up and I was talking to my D's and asked them what she told them she wanted. A rack to hang tools in her garage and a new garden hose. Gifts are just not her love language, she doesn't care about gifts at all. Your W may very well be the same. So when you say "but I went above and beyond and did this that and the other" it just makes me think you didn't know her or what she wanted. You did what you THOUGHT she wanted. And those are great things, but my point is if you neglected her REAL love language then all the gifts in the world won't make up for it.

My wife loved when I got her gifts. She would brag to her friends what I got her. But she didn�t have just one love language. She also wanted me to kiss her hello every time she walked in the door, kiss her good bye every time I left and goodnight. She brings those things up a lot. I get it now, easy fixes but won�t let me fix that. She is gone, she felt unloved and wants her freedom. I�m not saying I never did those things either. Sometimes I ran out to the store quick and she was upstairs, or when she got home I was on the phone doing business and didn�t run down to see her. These are the things she brings up the most why she is d me. There were so many things she would say, we will never be able to afford that. When I heard that I worked hard to get it to her. She said we would never be able to afford a Lexus, I got one for her birthday and she was estatic. She said we will never affords to go to beaches, I surprised her for our anniversary 2 years ago. A Louis Vuitton bag just because I sold 2 homes over a million dollars and made a lot of money so I treated her. I can keep going on. But it was never enough I guess. Her love language was never enough.

Sounds to me like you put her on a pedestal. That's one way to kill the attraction................

W,

See this is why you will continue to struggle because you refuse to put any effort into your situation. She is ding you because she doesn�t respect you.

All the stuff you regurgitate above is WW bs but of course you�ve been told a million times not to believe what she says you continue to eat it all up.

Originally Posted by Wolfman

She also wanted me to kiss her hello every time she walked in the door, kiss her good bye every time I left and goodnight. She brings those things up a lot. I get it now, easy fixes but won�t let me fix that.

I�m not saying I never did those things either.

You probably did these things without thinking about it, a lot of the time. 3 years ago WAW school friends husband died of cancer - very quickly - At that point we both realised how short life was and i decided to tell her "I love you" every single night before i fell asleep - even if she went bed first and was fast asleep, i ALWAYS said it when i put my head on the pillow.. No matter how i felt ( ie when we had disagreements ) i always said it.

I also used to compliment her on her looks - always have...

After BD, she stated on more times than i can remember that i never told her i loved her ????

After our 2nd council session we lay in bed together and i told her how much i loved her and how beautiful she was - her reply -

"aww thats the nicest thing you have said for months - you never tell me i'm beautiful ?????"

i lay there thinking ( this was before i discovered this site, understood the WAW mindset ) what planet are you on.. I tell you all the time ???.. At the time i was really confused by her statement - now i know its the norm with all these WAW.. But they only remember what they want to feel at the time.

Don't let it get to you - Believe nothing that they say..

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Originally Posted by AnotherStander

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Quick question, tomorrow is our 15 year anniversary. Say nothing and do nothing, correct? It saddens me that I know tomorrow will mean nothing to her. I always tried to go above and beyond on our anniversary. Planning trips, massages, expensive dinners.

Maybe you weren't speaking to her in her love language though. I always tried to find special gifts for my XW for bdays, Xmas and anniversaries. Why? Because that's what I thought she wanted, because it was MY love language so I just assumed it was everyone else's too. But her love language is words of affirmation which I wholly neglected throughout our M. My XW's bday is coming up and I was talking to my D's and asked them what she told them she wanted. A rack to hang tools in her garage and a new garden hose. Gifts are just not her love language, she doesn't care about gifts at all. Your W may very well be the same. So when you say "but I went above and beyond and did this that and the other" it just makes me think you didn't know her or what she wanted. You did what you THOUGHT she wanted. And those are great things, but my point is if you neglected her REAL love language then all the gifts in the world won't make up for it.

My wife loved when I got her gifts. She would brag to her friends what I got her. But she didn�t have just one love language. She also wanted me to kiss her hello every time she walked in the door, kiss her good bye every time I left and goodnight. She brings those things up a lot. I get it now, easy fixes but won�t let me fix that. She is gone, she felt unloved and wants her freedom. I�m not saying I never did those things either. Sometimes I ran out to the store quick and she was upstairs, or when she got home I was on the phone doing business and didn�t run down to see her. These are the things she brings up the most why she is d me. There were so many things she would say, we will never be able to afford that. When I heard that I worked hard to get it to her. She said we would never be able to afford a Lexus, I got one for her birthday and she was estatic. She said we will never affords to go to beaches, I surprised her for our anniversary 2 years ago. A Louis Vuitton bag just because I sold 2 homes over a million dollars and made a lot of money so I treated her. I can keep going on. But it was never enough I guess. Her love language was never enough.

So you gave her material things and thought that she should be happy and fulfilled? If this were the case rich guys would never get divorced. However, divorces among the rich are skyhigh? Why? Because a W wants YOU not things.

Originally Posted by Steve85

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Originally Posted by AnotherStander

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Quick question, tomorrow is our 15 year anniversary. Say nothing and do nothing, correct? It saddens me that I know tomorrow will mean nothing to her. I always tried to go above and beyond on our anniversary. Planning trips, massages, expensive dinners.

Maybe you weren't speaking to her in her love language though. I always tried to find special gifts for my XW for bdays, Xmas and anniversaries. Why? Because that's what I thought she wanted, because it was MY love language so I just assumed it was everyone else's too. But her love language is words of affirmation which I wholly neglected throughout our M. My XW's bday is coming up and I was talking to my D's and asked them what she told them she wanted. A rack to hang tools in her garage and a new garden hose. Gifts are just not her love language, she doesn't care about gifts at all. Your W may very well be the same. So when you say "but I went above and beyond and did this that and the other" it just makes me think you didn't know her or what she wanted. You did what you THOUGHT she wanted. And those are great things, but my point is if you neglected her REAL love language then all the gifts in the world won't make up for it.

My wife loved when I got her gifts. She would brag to her friends what I got her. But she didn�t have just one love language. She also wanted me to kiss her hello every time she walked in the door, kiss her good bye every time I left and goodnight. She brings those things up a lot. I get it now, easy fixes but won�t let me fix that. She is gone, she felt unloved and wants her freedom. I�m not saying I never did those things either. Sometimes I ran out to the store quick and she was upstairs, or when she got home I was on the phone doing business and didn�t run down to see her. These are the things she brings up the most why she is d me. There were so many things she would say, we will never be able to afford that. When I heard that I worked hard to get it to her. She said we would never be able to afford a Lexus, I got one for her birthday and she was estatic. She said we will never affords to go to beaches, I surprised her for our anniversary 2 years ago. A Louis Vuitton bag just because I sold 2 homes over a million dollars and made a lot of money so I treated her. I can keep going on. But it was never enough I guess. Her love language was never enough.

So you gave her material things and thought that she should be happy and fulfilled? If this were the case rich guys would never get divorced. However, divorces among the rich are skyhigh? Why? Because a W wants YOU not things.

I totally get that now. I will not make the same mistake again. Whether it�s with her or someone else.

Originally Posted by LH19

W,
See this is why you will continue to struggle because you refuse to put any effort into your situation. She is ding you because she doesn�t respect you.
All the stuff you regurgitate above is WW bs but of course you�ve been told a million times not to believe what she says you continue to eat it all up.

I just tried to give her everything she wanted. I dropped the ball. What does me getting things she wanted have to do with respect? That stuff I ate up was before we were in this situation. I�m confused?

MrBsbride I use to tell my w all the time how beautiful she was. How amazing she looked in outfits but of course just like you she doesn�t remember any of that.

Originally Posted by TBSakaJ9

Sounds to me like you put her on a pedestal. That's one way to kill the attraction................

I tried to take care of her. Most women I think would have loved that. I realize I just needed to be there for her more. More I love yous and the kisses.

W,

Ok this may sting a little bit but you don�t seem to get it. Throw out all the bs you see on tv and movies what you think a woman wants and what they really want are two completely different things. You became the woman in the relationship and she became the man. You doing all the house work. Not attractive. You allowing her to talk down to her. Not attractive. You not being the leader of the family. Not attractive.

Respect equals attraction. Say it 50 times in your head.

I have a friend who works full time and his w stays at home with one 15 year old daughter. He also does all the cooking and cleaning. He often says his wife is the boss. He has sex twice a year on his birthday and Father�s Day. That�s his reward for being an obedient husband. He�s miserable but is afraid to D.

Originally Posted by Wolfman

My wife loved when I got her gifts.

Did she though? You seem to think you know what she loved and wanted, yet here you are. Look I was there too, in shock that this happened to me because I thought I was doing all the right things. But there were things I WASN'T doing right, and in her eyes they did not make up for the things I was doing right.

Quote

She would brag to her friends what I got her.

So did my XW. Doesn't mean she felt LOVED. My XW always appreciated the gifts and made a big deal out of getting them and showing them off. But that doesn't make up for the lack of effort I put into her MAIN love language. Here's the deal- guys put a lot of emphasis on material things. They see value in others based on the stuff they have. They show their value to others through the stuff they have. Most women do not operate that way. They don't put a lot of value on material possessions. Sure they appreciate them and it's better to have them than not, but that isn't how they feel LOVED. Do you understand the difference? I'm telling you that your W didn't value that stuff from a LOVE standpoint, and you are trying to argue that surely she did because she liked gifts and showed appreciation for them. NO, that DOESN'T mean she felt loved.

Quote

She said we would never be able to afford a Lexus, I got one for her birthday and she was estatic. She said we will never affords to go to beaches, I surprised her for our anniversary 2 years ago. A Louis Vuitton bag just because I sold 2 homes over a million dollars and made a lot of money so I treated her. I can keep going on. But it was never enough I guess.

She showed appreciation outwardly, but she may very well have been developing resentment inside. She said you can't afford XYZ so you went out and bought it. Honestly I'm surprised she didn't read you the riot act, it's what my XW would have done. She would have explained (rightfully so) that the money should be spent on important things such as college funds for the kids rather than frivolous feel-good items.

Your arguments are pretty common- "how could my wife leave me???? I gave her a nice home, I have a steady income, we always had nice cars, I bought her nice gifts, we had great vacations" etc. etc. So many guys come here saying that. I think I did too. But that's not how women measure happiness. We're trying to project our ideas of happiness onto them, while ignoring their REAL needs.

To add to what L said......did you ever tell her "no"? Put her in her place? Stand up to her? At some point in time she stopped viewing you as "the man". That dove tails into the bed room as well. I won't go into details but most women want to be handled a certain way in that regard as well. They want to be submissive to their man and please him. It's not about being submissive to her and pleasing her.

There are quite a few really good reads out there than can hopefully you gain a better understanding.

Please post those reads! My situation had me doing a 180 into doing housework...need to figure out how to incorporate that with what I�m reading in this thread.

Originally Posted by LH19

W,

Ok this may sting a little bit but you don�t seem to get it. Throw out all the bs you see on tv and movies what you think a woman wants and what they really want are two completely different things. You became the woman in the relationship and she became the man. You doing all the house work. Not attractive. You allowing her to talk down to her. Not attractive. You not being the leader of the family. Not attractive.

Respect equals attraction. Say it 50 times in your head.

Thank you for the 2 x 4. At first I was definitely the man in the relationship. But when I did things for myself she started to say things like I was selfish. I didn�t care about anyone but myself, so I gave up my sports and didnt go to the gym till 8:30. I am definitely going to get my man card. That validation stuff is great but I feel it�s making me weak. LH keep it coming please I am learning a lot. Man was I blind.

Thank you everyone else for chiming in too. I really appreciate the advice.

Man she tried to really set me up today and trying to control me but I am done with that. My IC said yesterday my w is acting like a spoiled teenage brat and to treat her like one. If she throws a tantrum will I give in to it? Nope!!! I will
Not let her words bother me, control me or manipulate me anymore. She really tried today. I have to run but I need to share what she did today. Not falling for this $hit anymore. Her words have no more power over me.

AS you are so right, no more material things. Just me and that�s it.

Originally Posted by TBSakaJ9

To add to what L said......did you ever tell her "no"? Put her in her place? Stand up to her? At some point in time she stopped viewing you as "the man". That dove tails into the bed room as well. I won't go into details but most women want to be handled a certain way in that regard as well. They want to be submissive to their man and please him. It's not about being submissive to her and pleasing her.

I use to stand up to her all the time. I just got tired of fighting and started to back down. That was a mistake. I know that now.

Most of us learned the hard way and TBH knowing what I know now their were red flags all around my Xw that I ignored before we got married.

Good women will make it easy on their man. Those women have a high self esteem and will let you lead the way, make mistakes and grow. They are submissive, and won�t be full of drama. They won�t fight you, or argue with you. They will also let you know when your failing and give you an opportunity to course correct.

They won�t pull the BS that most of us dealt with. You won�t be blindsided and if they D you, you will know it is coming because they will want to work at before it gets to the point.

If I ever get married again what I mentioned above is probably at the top of my list. Obviously I have to be attracted but in 20 years when I am 66 looks won�t be as important.

Dam L will be 70!

Here�s what happened yesterday. So I text my d to be ready at 12 that I was picking them up and leaving. I text my w how did the session go with my d�s IC? So she calls me and says are you coming soon to pick up the kids, I said yes have them ready for me when I get there I just want to go. She said can you come in for a minute want to talk to you about your d�s IC, I said can�t you tell me over the phone she said I will tell you when you get here. That was my first mistake I should have said I don�t have time. As soon as I walk in I notice that there is dog puke in the dining room. I said kids I am here get your stuff ready we are leaving in 1 minute. My w was in the kitchen and I walked in I said
M: hi and what did the therapist say?
W: the therapist said that she is doing better.
M:what else?
W:that was basically it. Oh and did you see the dog puked in the dining room? I said
M:I saw, she is puking again?
W: yep and of course I am left to clean it because no one around here cleans it for me.
Just for all the readers I always took care of the husky�s mess the shitzu the kids did. Once I left my w had to take of huskys mess and I would hear about it all the time. My husky is 16 years old they never live that long so unfortunately now on a rare occasion she makes in the house of pukes, certain foods are hard for her to digest now.
M: I know it�s so frustrating the kids don�t just clean that stuff up.
So my kids came over to me and said are we leaving yet. I said yeah.
W: isn�t SOMEONE going to clean up the mess before you leave?
My son said fine I will clean it up. I said to my d you should help him.
W: you can�t have the kids clean it up, I will do it. She said that with attitude.
W: this is ridiculous I have to do everything around here.
My son helped her clean it up. Once they were done.
W: this is no way to live, bye. And she stormed out.
If that wasn�t a set up for me to clean up the puke I don�t know what was. I�m sorry there was not much to validate and I was not coming over just to clean up puke for her. Before these conversations I would have ran to do that. Nope. Don�t try to trick me into coming in the house then for me to clean it for you. Sorry. I�m picking myself up off the floor and no longer being her doormat. My gut was saying just have the conversation over the phone about d�s IC. Now I know.

LH that will be my motto: Respect = attraction.

Great job!

Now be aware that it will take months more like years for these consistent actions for you to see progress. Don�t come back in a couple weeks and say this isn�t working.

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Here�s what happened yesterday. So I text my d to be ready at 12 that I was picking them up and leaving. I text my w how did the session go with my d�s IC? So she calls me and says are you coming soon to pick up the kids, I said yes have them ready for me when I get there I just want to go. She said can you come in for a minute want to talk to you about your d�s IC, I said can�t you tell me over the phone she said I will tell you when you get here. That was my first mistake I should have said I don�t have time. As soon as I walk in I notice that there is dog puke in the dining room. I said kids I am here get your stuff ready we are leaving in 1 minute. My w was in the kitchen and I walked in I said
M: hi and what did the therapist say?
W: the therapist said that she is doing better.
M:what else?
W:that was basically it. Oh and did you see the dog puked in the dining room? I said
M:I saw, she is puking again?
W: yep and of course I am left to clean it because no one around here cleans it for me.
Just for all the readers I always took care of the husky�s mess the shitzu the kids did. Once I left my w had to take of huskys mess and I would hear about it all the time. My husky is 16 years old they never live that long so unfortunately now on a rare occasion she makes in the house of pukes, certain foods are hard for her to digest now.
M: I know it�s so frustrating the kids don�t just clean that stuff up.
So my kids came over to me and said are we leaving yet. I said yeah.
W: isn�t SOMEONE going to clean up the mess before you leave?
My son said fine I will clean it up. I said to my d you should help him.
W: you can�t have the kids clean it up, I will do it. She said that with attitude.
W: this is ridiculous I have to do everything around here.
My son helped her clean it up. Once they were done.
W: this is no way to live, bye. And she stormed out.
If that wasn�t a set up for me to clean up the puke I don�t know what was. I�m sorry there was not much to validate and I was not coming over just to clean up puke for her. Before these conversations I would have ran to do that. Nope. Don�t try to trick me into coming in the house then for me to clean it for you. Sorry. I�m picking myself up off the floor and no longer being her doormat. My gut was saying just have the conversation over the phone about d�s IC. Now I know.

LH that will be my motto: Respect = attraction.

Puke happens. And now that she's made her bed she has to clean it up! Good job Wolf. Also, when she said "I'll do it" I would have said to S and D, "come on, let's go!" Do not let her crazy hold you up.

If she wanted your s or d to clean it up then she should have asked them not you. Otherwise good job!

IDK, but I think it is better that you did go inside so that you had a chance to decline her request.

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Here�s what happened yesterday. So I text my d to be ready at 12 that I was picking them up and leaving. I text my w how did the session go with my d�s IC? So she calls me and says are you coming soon to pick up the kids, I said yes have them ready for me when I get there I just want to go. She said can you come in for a minute want to talk to you about your d�s IC, I said can�t you tell me over the phone she said I will tell you when you get here. That was my first mistake I should have said I don�t have time.

Thank you everyone for letting me know I did the right thing. I�m not going to lie I felt bad seeing her do it but I know it�s what I have to do. I will work hard at getting my respect back and not being a doormat. How do I k ow or what�s the difference between not being a nice guy and getting my respect back and just being a jerk?! I guess at this stage of the game for me if it even matters.

W,

You have one good moment and already you want to go back into please her mode. Buy and read the book!

Why would you feel bad that she has to clean up the dog $hit in her house?

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Oh and did you see the dog puked in the dining room?

"Yes I wasn't going to say anything because I'm sure you are embarrassed about that. But yes, I nearly stepped in it, you should really get it cleaned up, you wouldn't want to have to clean off my shoes in addition to the puke. "

Then leave with the kids.

OK not exactly validating, but sometimes validation is inappropriate.

Originally Posted by LH19

W,
You have one good moment and already you want to go back into please her mode. Buy and read the book!
Why would you feel bad that she has to clean up the dog $hit in her house?

Trust me I am not going into please her mode. I was just saying that I am listening to you guys. Because for a split second I did feel bad, but then thought about everything everyone has been saying and it felt great not to do it. Trust me that feeling was for a split second, that�s it. I will be ordering the book. Look forward to reading it.

Originally Posted by AnotherStander

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Oh and did you see the dog puked in the dining room?

"Yes I wasn't going to say anything because I'm sure you are embarrassed about that. But yes, I nearly stepped in it, you should really get it cleaned up, you wouldn't want to have to clean off my shoes in addition to the puke. "
Then leave with the kids.
OK not exactly validating, but sometimes validation is inappropriate.

That is funny. Not that I care but she would have got so mad if I said that. I wish I thought of it and I would have.

Today will be a great day meeting up with a bunch of friends with their kids at the winery. They have live music the kids can run around and the adults eat and drink wine. The best is, I told you all how she made plans on my day with the kids and I told her I already had plans with the kids. Well one of th families that she made plans with is now coming out with me. To the average person it wouldn�t be a big deal. But to her I know she is going to be very angry. Don�t care though.

Not to disagree with AS, but I really think you need to limit your words. While AS' response is funny, it is a bit too passive-aggressive for my liking.

Did you see the dog puked?
"Yes."
I guess I have to clean it up like everything else around here.
"Yes, I can understand how that can be frustrating."
-blah blah blah-
Listen. Validate. Collect your kids. "We've got things to do. Bye."

W:"Bla bla bla puke"
H:"Yes, Let me get the kids out of here so you can focus on cleaning it up"

Listen, You should not be going into the house for any reason. We already brought this to your attention. You did not listen. You now see why.

Quote

So I text my d to be ready at 12 that I was picking them up and leaving. I text my w how did the session go with my d�s IC? So she calls me and says are you coming soon to pick up the kids, I said yes have them ready for me when I get there I just want to go. She said can you come in for a minute want to talk to you about your d�s IC, I said can�t you tell me over the phone she said I will tell you when you get here.

I suggest that from now on you make it a personal rule to not talk to her before picking up the kids, other than texting what time to have the kids standing at the door. If she says she has something to talk about, tell her to email you. I think that's how you need to have discussions after this stunt she's pulled. No matter what she tries, don't have a discussion inside her house! In fact, don't go into the house at all, b/c she does this same manipulative bs every time. If anything needs to be said, it can be through texting or email. If she asks can't you go in the house to talk, plainly tell her "no". Don't make up some excuse of being late, just tell her you aren't going to do that any more. You don't have to give her explanations.

I think a nice guy can get so focused on validating, until he's standing there validating a woman who is disrespecting him. You sounded as if you were siding with her and blaming the kids for not cleaning the puke. She didn't want the kids (at least, not her daughter) to clean it up. The issue is she deliberately planed to dramatically act out her "woe is me" scenario.........AGAIN. This is how she beats you up. She expects you to take care of everything, but the minute you open your mouth to the D......she chops your b@lls off, right in front of your own kids. She is teaching them to disrespect you by displaying her own lack of respect. You should have told the kids to get in the car, walked out without saying another word, and left her....... with the puke!

I am concerned about that little 8 year old boy living there with those two females! He is a copycat of his father, and his sister is copycat of their mother. By the time he's grown, it is frightening to imagine the damage your W and your D will do to him. When you aren't there, he's probably the catchall for whatever they don't want to deal with. I hate to think he will grow up believing that the man's role is catering to some pampered, controlling, woman. Hopefully, his daddy is going to have a positive affect in how he deals with the fairer sex one day.

Hi there. It�s been a few days but a lot has gone on. First off I have been reading NMMNG and all I have to say is wow, that is me. It�s sad to see that is nice guys really do finish last. I�m about 70 pages in and I love it. It�s really got me to open my eyes. You all are right about me not going in the house. There is no point. A lot has happened thee last few days.
So last Monday my w text me that she wanted to switch days Friday and Thursday (I have the kids usually Friday). I told her she could not that I already made plans for me and the kids. Of course the typical spew through text, that I do t want to switch why would I do that? It�s not fair, blah blah blah. I just text her back sorry you feel that way but it�s my day with the kids. I didn�t respond to anymore texts. My buddy moved to South Carolina and was coming up for the week so we made plans 3 weeks ago. NOt changing them for her. Evidently w made plans with friends of ours to go to the beach before she asked me, not my problem. So she had to cancel on them. Let�s just call them and. And Ames. Smith just so it�s easy to follow. Everything is top secret with her so I did not know this. So Friday just as I�m about to head out the vineyards to meet up with my buddy and other friends, Mrs. Smith called me and asked what I was doing? I said I am going out to the vineyards. What are you doing? She said you w was suppose to go to the beach with us but cancelled and some of the other families did too. I told them come out to the vineyards then. She said sure. At the vineyards I pulled mr. and mrs Smith aside and said be prepared she is going to be kissed at you guys for coming here with me. They both said why? I said I know how she is just be prepared. They said we are not here to pick sides. I told them I wasn�t asking you to or never would ask you too. I don�t care how many times you hang out with w but I know how she will respond. They said if she says anything we will deal with it. I said ok but you are warned.

Sunday mr and mrs Smith were having a birthday party for their son who was turning 10 at a bowling alley. Mrs smith sent out a group text to all the parents about the party I was on it and so was my w. Party started at 2 I got here 2:10. As I walked in I see my w sitting by herself texting away and not talking to anyone. Which I thought was odd. I went over and said hello to the parents her sister and brother in law the kids and I said hello to my w, I got a very cold hi. I just figured it must be one of the odd days for her. Keep back 500 feet. Lol so I�m talking to all the parents at the party and then I get a text from her. �You really are something. I�m so glad I didn�t buy into the I changed bull$h*t. You are the same nothing has changed.� Totally confused I wrote what�s the matter. She responds you make me laugh it�s all done ... Karma. I know I shouldn�t have engaged but asked what are you talking about. She wrote live with yourself. I need to keep reading NMMNG, I probably just would have left it at that. I went over to her and said what�s going on? She said I see right through you and how phony you are and so does everyone else. You and everyone here is phony. Once she said that I knew it was about the vineyards. At that point I just walked away. Then 15 minutes later she gets up and storms to the front of the bowling alley. Mrs smith goes after her to talk to her. They are in the front of the bowling alley and you can see my w is laying into her. Mr smith says to me what�s going on, I said to him it�s about the vineyards. He said you think I said I am pretty sure. So my w is yelling at Mrs smith during her son�s birthday party for about 10 minutes. Her sister goes we want to do cake but we need my sister here. I said I know. She said in 2 minutes I�m going over there to get my sister that this is ridiculous. About 1 minute later my comes speed walking back to the party. Mrs Smith is slow walking you can see she is really upset. We sing happy birthday to her son then my w grabs the kids and leaves, the party wasn�t over. So I asked mrs Smith was that about the vineyards? She said yes. That my w said that she betrayed her by going, that she should have told her she was going out there with me(that makes me laugh, they have to report to my w). That she didn�t know I was going to the birthday party. Mrs smith said I was on the group text, she said she didn�t see my name, mrs smith said well that�s not her problem. Last w said to mrs smith that she should have told her I was coming to prepare her and that for now on let her know when I will be around so she is prepared. Prepared for what? Were we going to have a boxing match? Does anyone else have a w that is as crazy as mine?
These have been friends of ours for 10 years going away together, the kids call us uncle and she said she is done with them. They betrayed her trust and will never trust them again.

Wolfman - Sometimes the blowback to addressing your NGS is very very strong. That doesn't mean you are wrong. Good job standing your ground.

I had a very similar situation arise this weekend. My W asked for one of my days because she prematurely invited friends to visit. I said "no". She flipped out on the phone: "I gave you this last week blah blah blah". It was tense.

But then we went to MC the next day, and she brought up that she recognized that I had the right to say no, and that just because she did something for me in the past did not entitle her to anything (... covert contracts ring a bell?). I was glad to see that shift in her mindset. I hope it will minimize our co-parenting conflict going forward.

Another thing... we have mutual friends, and we are trying not to involve them in our drama. I told my W... you can invite them to do anything you want, and you don't have to tell me. But let's make sure we tell this couple that you and I don't necessarily tell each other everything going on, so it's possible some weekends we may both invite them to different things. (This happened a few weeks ago and it was really awkward for our friends). It's hard to see my friends spending time with our kids when I am sitting home alone, but... hey this is my new reality, right? That's my issue to deal with, not my W's, and certainly not our friends.

Your W has her emotions and she has to deal with that. She can be mad at you, mad at the Smith's, that's really on her. You invited the Smith's to the vineyard knowing your W may flip out... even though my own NGS has me cringing, you did not let your W's potential reaction affect your decision. That is fantastic.

One last thing - sometimes I find in addressing my NGS that this sense of superiority can creep in ("I'm handling my emotional sh*t better than you!") If you find that happening for you, I'd suggest adopting an attitude of compassion towards your W and her struggle to manage her own emotions.

Unchien at first it didn�t think about it bothering her. Then it dawned on me how she is. But enough people on here have told me I can�t worry about what she is going to think. I did so much of that in the past. Now I am going to do things that are good for me and my children. I am not going to be mean or nice, just indifferent. I�ll validate when necessary but also not let her dictate anything or walk all over me. The book is helping but I still have more to read!! Thank you everyone for the recommendation.

Way to stand your ground wolfman, you can�t nice her back. Despite the spew you are acting in a way that demands respect. Be wary she may switch to being nice to you in an effort to manipulate. Try not to fall for it and continue focusing on yourself and your needs.

Nothing really new to report. Things are moving along. W is suppose to have the appraisal done soon on the home. I just needed a safe place to get these emotions off my chest. I have been at this a year and still being here hurts real bad. I can�t imagine how a mother would want to put her kids through this d when things were really not that bad. I know that�s from my perspective and hers is completely different. But if she were to look at the big picture logically she would have seen these were easy fixes. Just my logical brain at work. I have really come to believe that she is so happy with getting d because now half the time she is free to do what she wants. No more being a mom or wife. It�s sad that someone who expressed to me how important family is has taken this road. How she didn�t even want to try, not even once and making it work. I read on here and I have talked about the �fog�. Is there really one? I have not seen my w even remotely look like she was coming out of it, like I said I really believe she loves this new found freedom. Does that last forever too? I�m sorry I am just hurting today, I really miss my kids when I don�t have them. That�s another thing she is going away for 4 days in a week with her d girlfriends. She said she needs time away, she needs a break. Really?? I have the kids half the time and on those days you go out with your friends. From everyone�s experience do eventually this �party� life get old? Do they at some point say I miss the family dynamic? She actually asked me when she goes away if I want the kids? Seriously?? Those are my kids and love them with all my heart, just because you want to run away and have no More responsibility doesn�t mean I want to. Let�s put it this way too. My Siberian husky is 16. That�s really old for a big dog to live that long. Well she has a little trouble walking on occasion, when she sits for a while it�s hard for her to get up, but once she is up she is fine. My w said the other day, I think we should put her down. I said why, because she can�t always walk, I said she is just slow getting up but once she is up she is fine. She then proceeded to say to me, then you can take care of her. She doesn�t want any responsibility and basically wants to put my dog down because she doesn�t want to take care of it anymore.

I have been hanging out with a lot of friends lately. Just watching the wives with their husband makes me sad. I miss that dynamic I also realize my w wasn�t really like that with me. I see such love between these couples I miss it!! Sorry for the long rambling post but I just needed to get this off my chest. Just feeling depressed today. It�s funny everyone who knows us says one day my w is going to wake up and realize what she had. I hate that comment because I wish she would wake up now!!! So many of my women friends say to me, why would your w at 40 want to go back into the dating scene when she had a great family and life? My response to them always is, I have no idea.

W,

Have you talked to your W about maybe having more custody since she likes her freedom so much?

I think part of the reason you are so stuck is because you are projecting a fantasy of this perfect family life and marriage if your W just made a few changes. I would argue you are in a fog right now. You are ignoring reality and that is why you are suffering so much. Your W will most likely take a look behind her some day but I'm not so sure she will see any changes. Just the same nice guy who is a people pleaser and likes to wallow in his misery. What's the status of you getting your own place?

What Have you learned from the NMMNG book.

LH. I have learned so much from the book. Actually was reading it just now. This book is me. Everything in this book is what I have done and experienced. I never would have thought being a nice guy would have so much blow back. Unfortunately you are right of this fantasy family. I tried to be the opposite of my father by helping my w with everything and being around all the time, and look where it got me. I know my w sees the changes in me already, her accepting them is another story. I am definitely make a lot of changes. Went back to playing baseball, playing flag football hanging out with more of my guy friends. All the things my w took away from me because she said I was not home enough.

Also I am not ignoring reality. It just has been a very slow process for me to accept it. I know this is how it is, there is nothing I can do but make myself the best me possible. You say I�m in a fog, what exactly do you mean by that? Outside of this forum I am different. I show confidence, happiness, energy. All of my friends said they have seen such a change in me. This is my safe space to vent. My kids have noticed a change in me too. They say I don�t yell and scream anymore like I use to. I�m more patient with them. Now my w is constantly yelling at them and I am talking with them.

When I say your in a fog I meant your stuck in your own fog and don't seem to moving forward. I get that you like to vent here but to me it doesn't seem to be productive. We can't help you when you keep saying the same thing over and over.

Wolf,

Originally Posted by Wolfman

I have been at this a year

What have you accomplished in this time?

Quote

when things were really not that bad.

Things were really bad. You were just using the wrong measuring stick. You are still using the wrong measuring stick.

Quote

But if she were to look at the big picture logically

She makes decisions based off of feelings and emotions. Two different measurement systems.

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How she didn�t even want to try, not even once and making it work.

She did. You were the one not trying. She finally gave up. Then you woke up out of your fog.

Quote

I really miss my kids when I don�t have them..... She actually asked me when she goes away if I want the kids?

Then you take them every single time she offers. You document it. At some point, you then change up the custody agreement.

Quote

Just watching the wives with their husband makes me sad. I miss that dynamic I also realize my w wasn�t really like that with me. I see such love between these couples I miss it!!

So she wasn't like this with you but you miss it??

The million dollar questions:

How long do you want to keep punishing yourself?
Are you still stand for your marriage?

Originally Posted by LH19

When I say your in a fog I meant your stuck in your own fog and don't seem to moving forward. I get that you like to vent here but to me it doesn't seem to be productive. We can't help you when you keep saying the same thing over and over.

Thank you for clearing that up. I know venting is no productive but it does make me feel better. Thanks for kicking my butt!!! I am moving forward I got my second career moving again. Reconnected with friends, going to the gym 5 days a week, going out more with friends and by myself, back into playing sports. So I would say I am moving forward just on here you hear my worse. Just the mornings are bad, for some reason those are the times I am moist depressed. But I get my butt to the gym and then I feel better. Soon as school starts again it will be a healthy distraction. I know it doesn�t seem like it but I am listening to you guys. This forum is my support and when you give it to me straight it helps, may not seem like it but it does.

Originally Posted by Ready2Change

Wolf,

Originally Posted by Wolfman

I have been at this a year

What have you accomplished in this time?

Quote

when things were really not that bad.

Things were really bad. You were just using the wrong measuring stick. You are still using the wrong measuring stick.

Quote

But if she were to look at the big picture logically

She makes decisions based off of feelings and emotions. Two different measurement systems.

Quote

How she didn�t even want to try, not even once and making it work.

She did. You were the one not trying. She finally gave up. Then you woke up out of your fog.

Quote

I really miss my kids when I don�t have them..... She actually asked me when she goes away if I want the kids?

Then you take them every single time she offers. You document it. At some point, you then change up the custody agreement.

Quote

Just watching the wives with their husband makes me sad. I miss that dynamic I also realize my w wasn�t really like that with me. I see such love between these couples I miss it!!

So she wasn't like this with you but you miss it??

The million dollar questions:

How long do you want to keep punishing yourself?
Are you still stand for your marriage?

Read what I wrote at the top what has changed in the past year. Thank you for hitting me with this. I work from logic and she works from emotion. What you said makes sense, all of it. As far as the million dollar question, I am ready to move on, I know the way I speak on here doesn�t seem like it but I am. I miss the 4 of us as a family. That�s all. I need to get over it and I know it will get better. I feel better. I am off all of my AD. Yes I am doing this with the doctor watching me. I don�t cry as much. I try and find the good in life each day and focus on that.

Originally Posted by Wolfman

I read on here and I have talked about the �fog�. Is there really one? I have not seen my w even remotely look like she was coming out of it, like I said I really believe she loves this new found freedom.

It took my XW years before she started acting like her old self. And she has slowly been transforming to who she used to be, although she does still retain elements of the "new her" too. She's gone through a transformation of sorts. My XW actually loves her "freedom" too, she's doing a lot of traveling now. We never did much traveling during our M, but it wasn't a priority for her then, her family was her number one priority. She still loves the kids and yes she loves me and she enjoys doing stuff with them and with me. But she is much more independent now. More power to her, I think it's great. You've got to get to that point too, where you no longer blame her but accept that whatever she is going through is bigger than you and bigger than her and she needs room to explore it and see where it goes. Maybe it'll lead back to you and maybe not, but if you truly love her you will be happy for her no matter what.

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I really miss my kids when I don�t have them.

Of course you do. But it's inevitable that they will grow up and move away at some point anyway. Much as a joy as parenthood is, it's fleeting. You need to find who you are as a person as well as a parent. And when you have your parenting time be the ultimate dad. When you don't have them then be the ultimate Wolfman.

Quote

Let�s put it this way too. My Siberian husky is 16. That�s really old for a big dog to live that long. Well she has a little trouble walking on occasion, when she sits for a while it�s hard for her to get up, but once she is up she is fine. My w said the other day, I think we should put her down. I said why, because she can�t always walk, I said she is just slow getting up but once she is up she is fine. She then proceeded to say to me, then you can take care of her. She doesn�t want any responsibility and basically wants to put my dog down because she doesn�t want to take care of it anymore.

You should really make arrangements- move or whatever it takes so that the dog is under your care. That's a lot of responsibility that your W doesn't want. That is a VERY advanced age for a Husky.

I am very confused on what to do. My w is going away on Monday for 4 days. Where do I stay in the house? Do I stay in the master bedroom? Or the basement couch? It smells down there and like mildew. I hate this!!! My own house and I feel like a stranger!!!!

All of you were so right. Should have never left and gave her that power. I am so mad at myself!!! Mr. Niceguy has done nothing but set me back!!!

Stay where ever you feel comfortable.

Originally Posted by Wolfman

I am very confused on what to do. My w is going away on Monday for 4 days. Where do I stay in the house? Do I stay in the master bedroom? Or the basement couch? It smells down there and like mildew. I hate this!!! My own house and I feel like a stranger!!!!

All of you were so right. Should have never left and gave her that power. I am so mad at myself!!! Mr. Niceguy has done nothing but set me back!!!

This is a no-brainer, sleep in YOUR master bedroom in YOUR bed.

Originally Posted by Wolfman

I am very confused on what to do. My w is going away on Monday for 4 days. Where do I stay in the house? Do I stay in the master bedroom? Or the basement couch? It smells down there and like mildew. I hate this!!! My own house and I feel like a stranger!!!!

All of you were so right. Should have never left and gave her that power. I am so mad at myself!!! Mr. Niceguy has done nothing but set me back!!!

Do you want to move back in? This is a good opportunity.

Originally Posted by Ready2Change

Originally Posted by Wolfman

I am very confused on what to do. My w is going away on Monday for 4 days. Where do I stay in the house? Do I stay in the master bedroom? Or the basement couch? It smells down there and like mildew. I hate this!!! My own house and I feel like a stranger!!!!

All of you were so right. Should have never left and gave her that power. I am so mad at myself!!! Mr. Niceguy has done nothing but set me back!!!

Do you want to move back in? This is a good opportunity.

I know it is but she already started to refinance. So one she refinances it won�t be my house any longer anyway. Should be done real soon. So I don�t feel like there is a point to. When I would have to move right back out.

As far as where I am going to sleep, it will be wherever I want to.

Last 2 days have been rough. I went away Saturday and Saturday night I got a call from my w that my dog was not doing well. My dog had to be put down. She was 16 years old. And of course because I wasn�t around I just keep hearing how hard it was for the kids to go through this. I just validate that it is hard for the kids to experience it. I�m tired of her complaining that she had to take care of it. I was away for one night, like I knew that was going to happen. Again, not that it matters but again I�m painted as the bad guy because I wasn�t around. Meanwhile she just left for 4 days. So she can go away for 4 days I am gone 1 night and I am bad? Again it doesn�t matter what she thinks or says just tired of the double standard. I am exhausted of this �new� life. I was just watching the movie click and would love to fast forward 2 years. Maybe by that point my life would be better.

Sorry to hear about your family pet Wolf. Im sure it was hard for everyone, and you, especially not being there, maybe it was a blessing you werent? Get used to the double standard though, and make a mental note of it because they all do it.

I have to laugh. I was going to go into the master bedroom to put my clothes in there and she locked the bedroom. What a b*t�h!! Guess I will be sleeping in my sons bed!!!

Amazing how cold and nasty she has become. I am ready to pick the lock for 2 reasons. 1 because it�s still my house and I hate how she thinks she can do whatever she wants. 2. To sleep in a bed. I honestly think my w is the worse on here. I read many situations but she doesn�t quit, she just keeps getting colder and more bitter to me and we are a year in. It�s amazing how she �looks� at me. Like I am some disgusting horrible person. Oh well. Took my kids on a 2 hour bike ride today. Going to a friends house to make s�mores. Had a great day with the kids!!

Enjoy that bed.

Between my w and d they are really out to drive me crazy. A week ago my w told me that my s friend mom was going to take my s and d to a trampoline park for yesterday. They asked if that was ok and I said yes. Fast forward to yesterday, my d said the mom will be picking us up at 12:30. I asked how do you know? She said the mom texted her. I said to my d please text the mom and have her text me the details of today. My d said why? I said because I would like to k ow from the mom what�s going on. My d replied I just told you. I said I get it but I want to hear it from the mom and have her phone number. Again she said why do you need to speak with her. At that point I had to end this, so I said, I am the father and I am not asking you I am telling you to have her text me or call me. If I don�t hear from her you are not going. Of course right after I said that my phone rings, it�s my w. My w calls and starts off with what�s the problem? I said no problem I would just like the mom to reach out to me about the details. I have no idea which trampoline park or what time they are coming back. She said you know what time they are getting picked up. I said yes but that�s all I know. (In case anyone is just reading my thread w is away for 4 days) she said d can text her and find out all the info. I said no I am the father and the mom should be in contact with me not d. So now in her voice I can hear her getting angry. She then said that�s weird for her to call or text you. I said why is that weird? She said she barely knows you. I said I don�t know what that has to do with anything, I am the father and need to know what�s going on form the mom. Again she said that is weird that she would speak with you. I said let me ask you something. Would it be ok if I made plans for the kids with another parent and the other parent didn�t tell you anything about the plans? She said she would want to know. So I said what�s the difference? Here�s where she hasn�t lost it. Her actual reply was your a man and it�s weird she would reach out to you since you are a man. I said I am the father and have her reach out to me that�s it!! She said fine and hung up.
The mom reached out to me was very sweet and good thing she did. The time she was coming to get the kids was wrong and she wanted to take them out to lunch afterwards.
My w is trying hard to control everything and make everything a secret. I am tired of this nonsense. And will not let her control me anymore.

Great job standing your ground. Your learning.

Handled that perfectly, and made a good example out of it too. I've had similar responses and situations. It is your right to know where you child is at all times. You are their father.

Wolf, I think what you were requesting was perfectly legit, but I would suggest that you explain it to your D instead of pulling the "I am the dad and you will do as I say" card. You simply could have said "I need to know how to contact the parents you will be with in case of emergency, and I need for them to have my number for the same reason since your mother is out of town."

Great job.

And by the way, Change how you view this. Change "They are trying to drive me crazy" thought into "Teaching them how to be healthier people"

I would have family meetings with my children. I would force them to give a "true apology" following a script. Of course they hated it. Well now that they are older, SD17 is expecting a true apology from her grandmother. I am proud of her. Grandmother needs to give her a true apology.

Quote

Apologize (I am sorry...)
depersonalize (place action in larger context)
shift intentions (I was trying...)
solidify commitment to change (take concrete steps to assure no repeats)
restore balance (put energy into relationship)
Example� I am very sorry I put a dent in your car. Nothing was going right that day. I didn�t want to give it to the valet because I know how much you love your car. So when I parked it myself on the street, that�s when it got hit. I�ve already called several places and got quotes. I�ll take care of it anyway you want. You can either give me the insurance information or I can give you the quotes. I am also going to have them detail the entire car so it will look like new. That�s on me. I feel so badly about this happening.�

The last 4 days with my kids was amazing. We did so many things together and there was not a single problem. I was so happy to be with them. It�s so sad that we got to this point. I don�t know how she would want to be away from the kids for 4 days, but that is just me. I don�t know if it�s people filling her head or just her only craziness but her behavior is so bizarre. From locking the bedroom door she even stopped the mail while she was gone. In her mind I have become some kind of monster and it�s sad. How does someone go from being so in love to pure disgust? I would get it if I cheated, beat her, alcoholic and other things, but none of that happened. I have heard that this is a marathon not a sprint. No one said the marathon never ends. The usual for me, the mornings are hard and it�s when I feel the most down. I will keep moving forward and enjoying my time with my kids. Those 2 beauty�s mean the world to me!!! I miss the whole family dynamic. But I guess this is my new reality and I just have to accept it. It�s just so hard to. I miss stability!! I miss family dinners!! I miss my w and I working together to get things done!!

It is truly amazing how my w never veered from this d path!! Full speed ahead for her!! Sorry just having a down moment!!

W,

First I want to say I think you need to change up your mornings. Do you run? If not you should start. I just came back from a run and guess who I ended up passing? My ex and I playfully pushed her off the path in my the grass and she laughed. I�m 13 months past D and I still miss the family unit sometimes and guess what I bet she does too. I�m not going to let that ruin the rest of my life.

Where you�re going to get yourself into trouble and probably end up here again because you won�t take the time to understand women. We told you 100 times that this is how she feels right now. She will miss them down the road when the newness wears off. You don�t get a gold star for not beating or cheating there is so much more then that including understanding her feelings.

99% of the WW do not veer off the path once you get here so your case isn�t special.

Originally Posted by Wolfman

It�s so sad that we got to this point. I don�t know how she would want to be away from the kids for 4 days, but that is just me.

Wolfman, mid 2014 some changes were made to the schedule at my XW's workplace, meaning she would have to work 16 evening shifts each month. She was in tears as she couldn't do that to her kids. She panically applied for several other jobs just for her kids sake. Even for a position at the local cookie factory. (she works with disabled children, a job she LOVES). Early 2015 I was away from home for 4 days for work related stuff, and my kids called me crying every night that they missed me. When i got back home she told me "NEVER do that again. The kids can't be without you" .
12 months later.... BOMBDROP.

Now she doesn't see them at all every other week and sometimes go 2-3 weeks without sein them. Feelings change. And we don't get it. Maybe later she won't either, but for now it is what it is. Take the advice here, follow your path, apply DB. No one knows the future, right?

Originally Posted by LH19

W,

Where you�re going to get yourself into trouble and probably end up here again because you won�t take the time to understand women. We told you 100 times that this is how she feels right now. She will miss them down the road when the newness wears off. You don�t get a gold star for not beating or cheating there is so much more then that including understanding her feelings.

99% of the WW do not veer off the path once you get here so your case isn�t special.

I understand this is how she feels now. I k ow what you are saying about women�s feelings. I definitely dropped the ball. LH for me anytime I heard divorce it was usually those �bad� things I mentioned. This is all new to me that people get divorced because of certain emotional needs not being met. Trust me I will not make that same mistake again. I have learned a lot during this process.
Also my morning routine will change. I am a teacher and work starts on Tuesday .

Question. Tonight w wants to go over the stipulation before we give it back to the lawyer. I really want her to know I still do t want this. Is there anything I can say or do? I know everyone always says don�t talk about the relationship but I want her to know I still don�t want this!!! Even if she knows I don�t want it I feel she needs to still hear it from me. I am trying so hard to be strong here but I am faultering. She needs this stipulation done so she can buy me out. Buy me out of the home we lived in for 10 years. The home that I refinished every room. Finally made it to what �we� wanted to now have to walk away from it and there is nothing I can do. My life feels like one of those monster scenes she. The little guy is being forced to sign over his business to one of the monsters and there is nothing he can do. I know if I saw my w hurting and see how much this home meant to her I wouldn�t do that to her. I honestly believe I would have a change of heart. I�m looking for advice from the vets here!!! I think I know the answer but just thought I would ask.

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Question. Tonight w wants to go over the stipulation before we give it back to the lawyer. I really want her to know I still do t want this. Is there anything I can say or do? I know everyone always says don�t talk about the relationship but I want her to know I still don�t want this!!!

She knows!

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Even if she knows I don�t want it I feel she needs to still hear it from me.

She doesn't need to hear it. It's you that feels the need to tell her.

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I know if I saw my w hurting and see how much this home meant to her I wouldn�t do that to her. I honestly believe I would have a change of heart. I�m looking for advice from the vets here!!! I think I know the answer but just thought I would ask.

She is not you. It's easy to say what you would or wouldn't do if things were reversed, but you can't pressure her into keeping the house just b/c you love it.

Wolf im in the same exact position at the moment. BIL is actually already moving his $hit in, in anticipation of me moving my stuff out. Refi is approved and on the table. I put my foot down with STBXW that Im not comfortable with him living here until I'm moved out in 1-2 months. Wolf. She knows. She doesn't care. LISTEN TO ME. SHE DOESN'T CARE SHE DOESNT CARE. SHE DOESNT CARE!!! THERE IS NOTHING YOU CAN DO OR SAY TO CHANGE THEIR MINDS. She wouldn't have given all of her actions and all of this thought and planning to go through with this if she wasn't emotionally prepared to. She thinks the grass is greener. She might be wrong or right. Only time will tell. Let her live with her choices if she no longer values you. Your self respect and dignity comes first in your life. Before your XW, before your family, before your children, all of it. It [censored], and I know you are hurting. I am too, but I want you to try and think about it this way... If your W can make your life a living hell with what she has done in recent times. If all those lines in the sand have been crossed, if she wants out.. disrespects you, buys you out of your castle that you worked on for her, your family, etc, treats you as disposable, is no longer attracted to you, is repulsed by you, is taking a means of legal action against you, etc... What else can she do to you? LET HER GO! DISMISS HER. FOCUS IN YOUR OWN PRIORITIES, TAKE YOUR POWER BACK! If she wanted you back tomorrow? After all this could you respect her? Her decision? More importantly could you respect yourself? if you took her back tomorrow I can promise promise you that within weeks or months, not only with the same problems reappear, but you will wind up hating yourself for it and you won't be attracted to her cuz you want to taking someone back that didn't really was reluctant to get back with you in the first place. Nobody wants pity, everyone wants willingness. She will only come back because she probably ran out of options. or you made some significant changes from a far to where she perceives you as valuable again. do you really want someone to make choices like that in your life?

I'm starting to realize a lot of people here might disagree with me but this whole thing from dating to marriage it's all an attraction game and people always want someone that's more valuable then themselves or so they're perceived to be. There will be a mix of delusion and reality in their minds from both sides. But your self worth come first before anybody's.

I don't mean to sound prideful. But you two are either working for each other or not at all there really is no halfway, and when someone has one or both feet out the door you let them go. Just like a hiring manager. Learn from all the mistakes you made in your marriage about yourself and what you contributed to the dysfunction. Correct them 180 on them have some respect for yourself. More importantly learn to recognize the signs and signals of when they're starting to leave by their actions... I can't encourage this enough learn from it. You will see it with clairity in hindsight, just like every other relationship that failed.

Wolf you wouldn't do those things as mentioned because you have honor, morals, and principles. What does that say if your W's regard to the relationship? I'm sure she has her side of things too in legitimacy. But she's going in another direction. She has her own mind, her own feelings, her own choices, and her own consequences to deal with. Let them go.

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Question. Tonight w wants to go over the stipulation before we give it back to the lawyer. I really want her to know I still do t want this. Is there anything I can say or do?

Personally I believe the best thing you can do is stop interacting with her.

Let her go over it by herself and red line it. Then you will review it.

Originally Posted by Wolfman

I really want her to know I still do t want this. Is there anything I can say or do? I know everyone always says don�t talk about the relationship but I want her to know I still don�t want this!!! Even if she knows I don�t want it I feel she needs to still hear it from me.

Wolf, here's the problem. She's done for now, so if you say anything she's just going to BD you all over again. But her feelings may change in a week or a month or a year, so you'll ALWAYS wonder if you should say something AGAIN, just in case her feelings have changed. But you don't need to say something, because if and when her feelings do change, SHE will seek YOU out. She's not going to change her mind and then sit at home saying "I wish wolf would ask again, because now I'm ready to reconcile." No, if she wants it she will make it quite clear to you.

At the end of the day you're probably going to say something anyway, because you can't stand not to. But you've got to have zero expectations, because it's not going to change anything. Paradoxically if you had zero expectations then you wouldn't need to ask. So don't ask, but if you ask have zero expectations, but if you have zero expectations then you won't need to ask

Originally Posted by IHCLACS

LISTEN TO ME. SHE DOESN'T CARE SHE DOESNT CARE. SHE DOESNT CARE!!! THERE IS NOTHING YOU CAN DO OR SAY TO CHANGE THEIR MINDS. She wouldn't have given all of her actions and all of this thought and planning to go through with this if she wasn't emotionally prepared to. She thinks the grass is greener. She might be wrong or right. Only time will tell. Let her live with her choices if she no longer values you. Your self respect and dignity comes first in your life. Before your XW, before your family, before your children, all of it. It [censored], and I know you are hurting. I am too, but I want you to try and think about it this way... If your W can make your life a living hell with what she has done in recent times. If all those lines in the sand have been crossed, if she wants out.. disrespects you, buys you out of your castle that you worked on for her, your family, etc, treats you as disposable, is no longer attracted to you, is repulsed by you, is taking a means of legal action against you, etc... What else can she do to you? LET HER GO! DISMISS HER. FOCUS IN YOUR OWN PRIORITIES, TAKE YOUR POWER BACK!

^^^This is good stuff!!^^^

Thank you for the advice everyone. I made an appointment with my lawyer to look over the stipulation. Her lawyer made changes to it. So I told her I�m going to have my lawyer look it over now because I don�t know what all those changes mean. She was annoyed. She goes how long till we get this done? Now I have to wait longer? I told her look there are changes on here so yes I have to have my lawyer look it over. She said I just want this all done and be able to move on. I said ok it will be done soon. She said I just want it to be done so she can be alone. She is enjoying her alone time and the fact that she doesn�t have to respond to anyone. She is free to do what she wants and she loves it. I knew that was why she was enjoying this divorce, the freedom. I would love to know when that gets old? Will she ever miss the family dynamic? Maybe never? I am trying real hard to move forward. I�m getting better but still have a ways to go. I can�t believe how selfish she has become but that is a mid life crisis. I just want to be the best person possible at this point.
It�s official she is done. There was no remorse there. I just need to really start accepting this and I will be better. School has started and I am not as depressed in the morning. It keeps me occupied.

I'm in the same boat as you Wolf. My W is loving the freedom of being on her own, responding to nobody. I also wonder when that will get old. But then I realize she's probably not on her own...she's likely with another guy. So...who knows but just focus on you.

Originally Posted by jac12

I'm in the same boat as you Wolf. My W is loving the freedom of being on her own, responding to nobody. I also wonder when that will get old. But then I realize she's probably not on her own...she's likely with another guy. So...who knows but just focus on you.

It�s so sad that this is what they want. Why have a family? Why have kids? I just feel so duped. How does someone change that much? She was all about family and now her freedom!! I guess I need to take her approach, enjoy my freedom. Unfortunately I am starting to lose love for her. I�ve been at this for a year now. I have stood by, went and GAL, 180, made changes in my behaviors and nothing from her. It�s time I deserve better. I am a good man with a lot of love to give. I�m not saying this doesn�t hurt, because it does but I need to move on in my life. I would love to be a family again but if she doesn�t want it then I am ready to move on. Thank you everyone for chiming in, it helps a lot!!
I don�t know about anyone else here. I am going to speak honestly, I feel like a failure for getting divorced. I tried so hard and worked so hard but she is too far gone. She is not coming back. If she ever did I am playing the lotto, better chance at winning lotto than her coming back!!!

Wolf all you can do is move on with your life. Do what you want to do and spend time with the people that you enjoy being with.

We seem to be in the same boat. I don't get it either. My W just walked away and left her responsibilities behind. I thought we had a good marriage overall. Laughed a lot together and enjoyed time with each other. But something changed...maybe it was depression or her dad dying/being sick or maybe she really just doesn't want to be with me. But as of now, she's been clear she doesn't want this life so I need to move on. And so do you.

Maybe they'll regret it down the road. Maybe they'll want to reconcile. Maybe both of us will have found someone better suited for us by then and we won't be interested in reconciling.

I'm often shocked that I'm in this position. Came out of nowhere. But...time to man up. If she doens't want to be with me then good riddance to her. I'll be ok. So will you.

Originally Posted by jac12

Wolf all you can do is move on with your life. Do what you want to do and spend time with the people that you enjoy being with.

We seem to be in the same boat. I don't get it either. My W just walked away and left her responsibilities behind. I thought we had a good marriage overall. Laughed a lot together and enjoyed time with each other. But something changed...maybe it was depression or her dad dying/being sick or maybe she really just doesn't want to be with me. But as of now, she's been clear she doesn't want this life so I need to move on. And so do you.

Maybe they'll regret it down the road. Maybe they'll want to reconcile. Maybe both of us will have found someone better suited for us by then and we won't be interested in reconciling.

I'm often shocked that I'm in this position. Came out of nowhere. But...time to man up. If she doens't want to be with me then good riddance to her. I'll be ok. So will you.

Same exact thing here. When my friends daughter drowned it made her question life. And that life is short and that she needs to live it up!! I have said it before not sure if you have been following my situation but we went on 5 vacations a year, went to dinner all the time, just always together, then that tragic event and she did a complete 180. Tonight is a perfect example of her 180. Friday nights for years she never wanted to do anything, complained how tired she always was. Ever since our separation she stays out late on Friday�s, 1-2 am. The point I am trying to make is how does someone for years never want to go out on a Friday, talk about how tired she is and to never make plans on a Friday to now staying out late every Friday? This is not the same woman I married. And I don�t think the �one� I married will be coming back. So all I can do is move on with my life.
Jac sorry you are going through this, this really stinks!!! I won�t understand nor am I trying to understand anymore how someone changes so much? How she talked about how much she wanted a family and to always be together to this!! All I know is I am not waiting anymore for her. I know I am a great guy and I deserve a great woman!!

I keep reading on here and other places about childhood issues. I mean everyone has some sort of childhood issues. Does that mean no marriage should work? My w�s childhood seemed to be pretty good from what she has told me. They traveled a lot, she got pretty much whatever she wanted, she had no chores (not a good thing) 2 loving parents, beautiful home, lots of friends. So what there caused her to stray from the marriage? If anything seeing how loving her family is and was should have made her try harder to keep our m together. Her mom was a stay at home mom and was so loving to her father. Even to this day they always hold hands, she makes it s point to sit next to him and when she does she always puts her hand on his leg. I guess the only thing I can think of is that my w resents the fact that she had to work. She has mentioned that a few times through our m. I guess her working and having to do things around the home (again she never had any chores growing up) made her think this is not the life she wants. She wants the fairytale, a lot of money, she doesn�t work, travel as much as she wants and buy whatever she wants. But she knew what I did for a living. Why now after 19 years does it not make her happy? She was happy for so long and if anything things got even better. I guess I just missed her emotional well being. It�s sad because I have learned so much from this. From everyone on here on what I have lacked, books I have read and podcasts I have listened to. I am the lover that she wants, unfortunately she is not ready to give it another chance. Maybe never again.

All I'm going to say Wolf is this. The Heart Wants What It Wants and when it wants it. Also as we know from Biblical scripture. The heart can be deceived. People are complicated. Our times are complicated. Relationships are complicated. We could scavenge all the information we want from here and other sources. I think we have it figured out and our situation out and develop the mindset on it. Only to realize it's imbalance from what we're actually experiencing from the other person's side. The best it will do is validate our experiences and that's pretty much it. We are all currently stuck in the mindset of how can this happen to us and why? it could be because of our past Behavior it could be because of what the person is currently experiencing and changing and their life. they pull away we pull away harder they pull away even further. perceptions are completely misconstrued nobody understands where each other are coming from, nobody cares nobody talks and nobody communicates and nobody's willing to be vulnerable anymore.
all this crap about what we decide and why we decided based on the information we get and we experience and all of what they decide based on what they're currently feeling in their emotions and the current situation. It's enough to make anyone crazy. Life shouldn't be this complicated and neither should people. After experiencing long enough it's enough to make you say I'm going to put this down stop thinking about it and focus on myself so that the end of the day you can't control another human being. You see things the way you see things and they see things the way they see things and apparently it's not meeting in the middle otherwise none of us would be in this situation. people want to be who they want to be in where they want to be at certain stages and phases in their life. They make good choices and bad choices and we have to let them . So Put it down let it go let it die and Say Goodbye. You are going to be stronger as a result of this. Love your kids live your life, make better choices, learn from your past commit to yourself, get through this and uncomplicate and unscrew your life. Start rebuilding. you don't have a choice but to rebuild start moving forward.

Time for a new thread and linking them both up.

https://www.divorcebusting.com/foru...flat&Number=2864718&#Post2864718

Here is the new thread. I miss my vets!!