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Old thread- DB, Not enganging Had a great IC session. Focusing on me. Manifesting the best I want in life by focusing on positive thoughts, consistent actions. W is her own person and outside my control and my area of concern. Shes finally starting to work next week so thats a positive step. Be grateful for what you have and hopeful for what you want. Cheers to all
Glad you had a good session with your IC. I am pretty new to all this but it really is about working on you, your wants and needs, and not bothering to try and control anything but you. Good job and hang in there!
Just got this from W... advice?
I’ve been up w D4 since 12. Doubt she will be able to go to school. If you can help at some point feel like I’m dying
If you chose to help your D4, then that's fine. But helping doesn't involve the 3 of you all together. Helping is you going to pick up D4 and bring her back to your house and let W take care of herself. Don't ask if she needs anything, don't stay, nothing. If your D4 needs you, then get her. Your wife if a big girl and can take care of herself.
Thank you Ginger. Unfortunately I have a 130 appointment closer to W house so for D4 all I can do is pick her up after that which was the plan. I was supposed to get her at 315 after school. So I guess that is my answer? I’ll pick up D4 as soon as I can - after my 130 appt.
Ideally there would be a way for me to create some positivity or breakthrough between us. But I suppose there’s nothing really I can do except be my best self.
Just going to say I have a lot of work today and will be there as soon as I can which will be around 3. Good luck. Hope D4 is feeling ok.
Want to throw in more positivity but pointless to even waste my mental energy.
Ideally there would be a way for me to create some positivity or breakthrough between us. But I suppose there’s nothing really I can do except be my best self.
Huh? How so? Your idea of positivity unfortunately is very codependent with her where you cater to her.
Positivity is taking care of your daughter if you can. You have to stop making everything you do about her. She's go you wrapped around her little finger
I want to help but it’s inappropriate and we’re not even close to being together. I say things here instead of to her.
I said - Sorry it was a rough night. I have to work and have a meeting. I’ll pick up D4 as soon as I can. Around 3
Did, I know you replied already. She needs to FEEL that you are not there for her. Use less words in response.
"Busy, be there at 3". (unless D4 needs to go to Dr now or something).
You’re right my response was weak.
You’re right my response was weak.
it wasn't weak. It was way too wordy. Your biggest problem with your interactions with your STBXW are that you say too much.
Remember the principle:
Do not answer unless there is a direct question. In the event of a direct question, answer (in your own time, not right away), but with as few words as possible. Yes or no questions get yes or no answers.
ovrrnbw nailed it with his suggestion.
You picking up daughter is helping. Everyone is right about their opinions on your response. A simple "I'll try to get there as quickly as possible, prolly around 3". I feel like such an $ss for saying this, but this is why we have all told you to set up schedules and such. Not bc things like this don't happen, but you are a grown man who doesn't even know how to respond to a woman you have been separated from for almost 20 months.
When my first husband and I split, we immediately started the visitations. We did not interact daily. In fact, we converse more now than we did back then about the girls. The fact that you to interact is very confusing. It's almost like you guys are still together just living in separate houses. And the Feb time frame is around the corner.
Please put a schedule together for the daughter. It will be easier if you start this now.
The fact that you to interact is very confusing. It's almost like you guys are still together just living in separate houses. And the Feb time frame is around the corner.
Loves this is great. I believe it is because of the voluntary support Did is providing. There is no need for her to do the hard work of filing for D to get spousal and child support as long as Did is offering it up each month voluntarily. This is why the suggestion is to never agree to support until order to by a court.
I believe that if he stopped the support, she would either agree to work on reconciliation or file for D. I feel that Did is too afraid of the latter so he continues to offer it up. She has threatened him with "If you stop support then I will lose all respect for you." She knows how to manipulate our poor, dear friend Did.
I also believe that either Did will have to file himself, or stop support. Otherwise he will go on in limbo with her being fat (resources wise) and happy as long as the money keeps flowing.
I'll add to Steve and Loves in this way: Did, you've never really stopped responding to her for more than a few days. If you would have, things may have improved. She still thinks you're there no matter what, but she needs to feel your abscence fully, for longer than she wants to, if she is ever to decide if that's something she wants to try to regain.
Picked up D4 today.
W says - Hope she sleeps better. It’s crazy how much a little quiet and rest can do.
Just ignore her?
Your responses didn’t load. I’ll stop the support in February
And I’ll ignore her.
It´s not about ignoring her Did...it´s about detaching, far more complicated...
Get your own schedule about D4. Then go dark/dim. How´s GAL going?
Keep the evidence that W can't cope with your child and that the child is more settled with you because you could use that in a court case to have the child resident with you.
The 2x4 four person combo attack did the trick. Short and to the point or no response at all. She needs to know she has lost me. I haven’t replied to her text from yesterday and today will just text. Please pick up D4 by 10am tomorrow.
My schedule is constantly changing. I’m a realtor which requires showing houses based on tenants availability. And stuff pops up as property management requires. I’m a lacrosse coach and program director tournament, practice, training schedules and what in coaching vary weekly and seasonally. I have a start up business for recruiting high school players which also has appointments as customers come in via online marketing. Also meetings for business I try to schedule during D4 school as much as I can. Currently I have bunched practices and trainings to tues-thurs but then tournaments and events are weekends. In the spring I coach HS lacrosse which is every day and game schedule varies. My schedule is very difficult no where near a 9-5. But it also allows me to have 50/50. The only way to have a set schedule is to use day care or a babysitter all the time. At this point it’s week to week.
GAL is going pretty well. I’m writing this book which is therapeutic and a passion project. I know it may not seem like it on here as I obviously still struggle with how to treat w but I’m going to treat her like an ex. She doesn’t treat me that way as you see with texts and sht. But Ive accepted divorce I’m not scared of it even if it’s sad. I deserve better and detaching I’m much more detached that I was a month ago. It’s easier not to respond and I barely give her attention when we’re briefly around each other with D4.
I’ve learned an immense amount about myself. I’m committed to coaching men down the road. I was depressed and emotionally unavailable. Now all I want is human connection and a healthy relationship.
This weekend I’m going to a pro lacrosse game with a group of kids I coach and some friends. Coaching sat all day and sun am. 1/24 I go to Vegas for a tournament. I go to the gym 3-4x per week. I’m working with a business / life coach on a weekly call. I’m building my future and I’m proud of the man I am today. I’m aware of some of my issues from childhood and working on them. I get lunch with friends 1-2x per week.
I continue doing Ic with a counselor I really like. She has called W my drug of choice. Mentions that if her words and actions don’t line up there can be no trust and no relationship.
Appreciate the blunt advice on how to treat W.
Did,
you're pretty busy, and with your schedule you will always have some communication going on with your daughter. Just remember to not be cold or rude to your W. You just aren't there for her anymore. When you do interact, be pleasant and smile a little, just don't over engage.
You will make a great partner for someone, so keep working to improve yourself for whoever that may be. It could be your W, and it could be someone else. Learn from your mistakes and learn from all of ours too. That's my big takeaway - how are you going to be better for having gone through all of this? Where are you mentally? Still hurt and trying to hurt back? Or are you getting smarter and stronger and working towards being who you really are instead of an emotional and overreacting type of person.
Vegas sounds like an awesome time, will you have time to go out after lacrosse stuff?
Thanks ovr you’re abaolutely right. I try to be kind and smile. But it doesn’t feel good being in her place. I pay for it. She seems entitled. And it’s draining and a negative emotion. Her place is nicer than mine so it’s a weird feeling. Since she’s earned 0 dollars and I’m on the lease. So I try to get out of there quick. Not sure if next month I just take 1000 off the support and pay the rent or all the way to 0.
She just texted me let me know when you’re at the y I’m here exercising. I’m dressed for a lunch and will be pleasant. I tend to be black and white. All or nothing. And need to work on that. I’ve learned so much and know enough to know I’ve got a lot more work and learning to do.
Work is going so well. I’d love to share it with W but I know what’s meant for me will manifest itself in time if I do my best in all aspects of my life. I trust the universe and my higher power.
For Vegas I will have time to go out and enjoy plus I’m going to get to some sites the first day I’m there. Likely going on a trip in spring as well. If I were in a relationship with w these trips may be different and her opinion is it’s unfair or whatever but hey I work and earn decent money so I’m going to do my thing. With or without her.
Thanks all and much love.
W says - You’re a really good dad. I hope you know it
Say nothing since not a question... Just say thanks I try my best? It does mean a lot. And feel good for her to say that but I know I shouldn’t say that.
Do you guys see how it’s hard for me to know how to respond?
Thank you
Why is that hard?
No direct question that requires an answer = no reply
If it were me, I'd just reply "thanks" and leave it at that. She did give you a compliment that you appreciated so why not? If it was your neighbour, you'd respond in kind. If my H sent me a compliment and it just went off into thin air with no acknowledgement from me, he would likely think I was mad at him and not replying to punish him or just plain being rude. He also probably wouldn't send another compliment my way for a long time. If you want to reply, you could wait awhile to do it so she doesn't think you're just sitting there waiting for her to text you. Honestly...I think we make a big deal out of this stuff. If she was standing in front of you and said the same thing to her face, would you just turn around and walk away? If not, a short text "thanks" would suffice. But that's just me and how I would handle it. Don't know if that's right or not.
Thanks. You’re a good mom too?
I don’t think it matters much but some vets might feel differently.
Just Thanks or no response
Just said thanks. Then she asked how’s d4. I said incredible.
Really missing my stbxw nothing id rather do than hang w her and D4 on couch. Busy weekend with a lot of coaching and GAL now back to reality just me and D4 in our 2 bedroom condo.
(((Did))) I know that feeling Did. Today is a beautiful sunny day and I am looking out at the water thinking what a great day it would be to go out on our boat with the kids. Sigh... different life. Anyway...no words of wisdom to offer, I’m afraid. I just wanted to send you a virtual hug and tell you that you are not alone.
D4 is pretty sick been nurturing as best I can went out for a bunch of food and meds made soup all that good stuff. Anyway D4 been asking to ft mom. Texted her said she was driving expected a call back. D4 upset later asking for mom again. W is very nurturing. Texted her. She said she’s not home but could ft. I knew what that meant. Meanwhile D4 crying asking why she won’t ft. I said D4 is upset and wants to talk to you.
D4 barely spoke to her but W looked good hair done up. Obviously at a guys house sitting on the couch. I don’t know why I even allowed ft to happen. I pushed for it. It’s like I want the pain. And at this point why should I expect any different. She was alone maybe for a couple months early on. But Gd dam that sht still hurts like a btch. A month ago or less she told me she really misses me of course like an idiot I ran over there. She’s out doing her thing I’m sure having wild sex as she seems to be into these days. I’ve read stuff about the weakest kind of person is one that jumps from relationship to relationship. Doesn’t really feel any better though. Honestly why do I even want her I guess I’m just as weak. And my self worth is just as low internally.
Tomorrow I’ll drop off D4. Not going into her place. Mistake to spend any time there whether I’m on the lease or not.
Looking for advice not as much on the feelings but action. NC no FT. I’m on her lease but she wouldn’t not pay and ruin her credit. Been paying $2325 could go down to $1325 - rent or just 0. I’ll consult an attorney but they won’t have any advice except 50/50 is best case scenario and that her not taking half of equity in investment property or Ira is better than I’ll get in court. Honestly I don’t really care about the money. I want to be strong, independt, unavailable, not care anymore.
She knows February was my timetable. Obviously there needs to be some conversation in February. Or I can just say the separation and leeway doesn’t work for me. There will be no more voluntary support unless or until we divorce. Don’t really wanna give an ultimatum. She has spent little time trying to make money. I’ve enabled her. I need to get over her move on. Her norm is divorce and split custody. That’s what she had as a kid. And what she seems comfortable with and subconsciously working towards even when she has come back. She never made action to make it work.
Thanks so much. I really hope to hear from vets.
Did,
I am not a vet, but I want to comment and lend support. You share a kid you can't go NC. I get where a child is sick, hurt, etc you want to bend over backwards to help them. All you can do is do your best. In these sitchs there is just going to be times when the WS is not available and you have to deal with the fallout. This is your opportunity to learn to be a better nurturing parent. You are the father, but because of what it is, when D4 is with you then you are one parent. So you will have to learn to fill in for both roles. I fell like It will make you a better overall parent.
As far as you getting upset when D4 FT your WS, well maybe go and read the detachment thread again. Read about letting go more.... not just here, but read elsewhere. I am not an expert since I am just working through this myself. Once you get there from what I understand and am experiencing you can still feel the hurt and sadness, but you don't go into a tailspin of emotion. You don't ride the rollercoaster, you just watch it pass you by.
Why does she know about this Feb timetable? I think this is wrong for a guy who doesn't want to divorce and still really hasn't given her much time or space. I think she's never lost Did, but Did lost his W. As soon as his W shows the first hint you are there for her with your cape on.
I don't know why you still paying for her to have the party girl lifestyle and run around with other guys.
Why would you tell her about the change in your voluntary support?
ACTIONS are greater than WORDS. Don't tell, do.
She asked about the timetable a few weeks ago. And I told her. I probably should have just said I don’t know. I have give. Her a lot of time and space but yea she has always known she can get me back.
Just completely stop paying support or pay just the rent as child support. Realistically / legally it’s all voluntary unless we divorce. So I could just not pay.
Definitely going as dim as possible. I want change. Can’t keep doing the same thing expecting different results.
I will take action. Little to no contact and less or no support on February. Advice appreciated on how to DB and handle this change without coming off as a complete ahole thanks.
Give her $0 until court ordered otherwise. That is zero dollars. That means NO MONEY. That means not a red cent!!
Talk to your lawyer, but from my research this is the usual advice of divorce lawyers.
She has been expressing interest again... when she asks about the lack of support what do you recommend I say? She will see it as an ultimatum or perceived control. She has also seemed interested... Im going to continue pulling further away. Asked me how Im so strong today in front of D4. She seems very weak and down. Told me she had a $400 gyno appt. And went out with a guy last night because she was feeling weak. Said she has been doing everything shes supposed to do to heal, reading, resting.. but its hard. Meanwhile Im struggling to maintain my real estate business. But still Im strong because I have to be. As a role model, a man, a dad, a coach, a leader. I told her that and left it at that. Yes too much communication.
While there she asked me to sit on bed with them when dropping her off I said I dont think I should and gave D4 a hug and left.
The fact that you can repeat that much of what she has been up to and blah blah blah is a major indicator that spoke to her for too long. Do not go in her house, do not let her in your house. And drop offs or pick ups should take about 30 seconds. No lingering. For real deal, you need to stop letting her tell you about her life. Don't let her show interest. Get on about your business.
I say this bc you need to start moving on. You will only do that if start to actually do it. Stop looking at these "breadcrumbs" as anything more than what they are.
She's moving closer because she asked you a timeline for a reason, you gave her an answer, she is approaching it, and she knows just how to reel you in to continue to keep getting things exactly as she wants it.
She's moving closer because she asked you a timeline for a reason, you gave her an answer, she is approaching it, and she knows just how to reel you in to continue to keep getting things exactly as she wants it.
Yep! This!
Stay strong, Did!
W says -
She’s still very sick.. idk if she should go to drs or what.
Will google it a bit but I haven’t slept in 2 days
Struggling and feeling sick, unable to take care of myself at all
I have meetings today and coaching this afternoon. Free at 530. Wanting to swoop in and save the day. Won’t do it.
Any advice on response?
You don't know and you don't need to know if she should go to the Dr. She's an adult. She was able to figure this out before she met you, right? So she can figure this out for herself.
Is she asking you a question? If so, respond "yes" or "no". If there's no question, don't respond. I'm going to hammer this to death. She wants you to come save the day, but a couple days ago she told you she has a new OM. It's his problem and you need to let it be his problem. And if he doesn't want to meet her needs then oh well. But you can't go take care of her and not get what you need, expect, and REQUIRE from a relationship. Your W is not well, but she won't get better if you keep playing into her demented open relationship expectations.
Don´t start another cycle Did, please...
D4 is the one who has been sick for a week. Not W. I only responded about D4. Does she have a fever... discussing D4 going to dr. I didn’t reply at all about W health or even say sorry I hope you feel better or anything.
She told me she went out on a date because she was feeling week the other day. OM I don’t know. But it doesn’t matter.
She told you she went on a date? What a........... I won't say the words.
D4 that is it. If she is sick and she is not getting better, take her to the Dr. I hope she feels better soon.
Your W sure is a piece of work.
I get it. Sorry. I misread the post. So if D has been sick then act accordingly.
Hope she gets well soon.
Found some treasures:
Fool me once shame on you.
Fool me twice shame on me.
Fool me a hundred times, I must be a LBS.
: )
I assumed she was at a guys house. She told me she went on a date because D4 was repeatedly asking to ft and she was out. The circumstances don’t matter. I’m not paying any support in feb. She can be a part of my life and commit to working herself and our marriage or she can take steps to get divorced and do the work herself.
Did, hang in there buddy. YOu've been dragged through the ringer by her. We've tried to encourage you to empower yourself to not allow that to happen anymore. It sounds like you are progressing in that regard! Know we are pulling for you and I continue to pray for your sitch.
Yes. We are all team Did here man. No more "she"s in your posts. Cmon man!
Stay strong man.
Did,
Been reading up on your sitch, and boy do I see so many parallels between your and my sitch.
I am slowly but steady realizing the same things you are, and I too get fooled and played like a stradivarius. I say no more. I say, lets heal, be strong for our kids, find joy in what we have, and change what we can and want too. Let the rest be, because it is not up to us to persuade, empower, or control our crazy former partners.
I dare you, to not "blog / journal" one single entry containing WW for the rest of January. I will do the same. If you have read my sitch, you know that I need to as well
.
Love is all around us, so embrace it, open up for it, and dont waste your energy on someone who doesn't want to be loved. Maybe down the line, maybe not, but hey, live in the moment, because, your daughter is growing bigger, wiser and more beautiful by the day - I know since im sitting writing this, after having just tugged in my own D5. Do not miss out on ANY of these special moments, because you are busy trying to please / read the mind of a woman that hurt you so profoundly. Dedicate yourself to you and your daughter and let every piece of the puzzle fall in place naturally. Maybe that spouse piece will be familiar, and maybe it will be a whole new adventure. Carpe diem my friend, carpe diem..
played like a stradivarius
Whoa.I had to go to the dictionary there.
Did, you can do this.
Did,
how'd the weekend go?
Hey ovr thanks for checking in. Sorry for typos from my phone here between jobs. I came here to post my first blog article. Wonder what you guys think? I’ve gotten some good feedback so far. Going to make a Facebook group for divorce, expired relationships and separation. In hopes of generating a bit of a platform to start coaching people and finish my book by the end of the year. I still have to go back and clean it up a bit and make the website look better before really getting out there. If you read it you’ll know who I am but that doesn’t really matter to me. I have no secrets.
https://thecatalystforchangedot.wordpress.com/2019/01/17/the-catalyst-for-change/Weekend- Coached all day Saturday got dinner with my dad. Wrote, workout, haircut sun then got D4. Had IC yesterday dropped D4 to w. During IC we talked about the end of this separation and how to approach it with w.
3 Bullet points. Understand how damaging the past was. Take accountability. That is no longer who i am and I can’t change the past. No more talking about it or other partners traumas etc. This separation has gone long enough and I don’t accept it anymore. This is what I want in a relationship starts with mutual respect and a safe space to grow with a partner who is inspired and admired etc. appreciate the fact I have D4 half the time and work hard as F to maintain multiple businesses and grow as a man. That will not stop and should be fing inspirational to a woman like god I love this man who works so hard on himself as a dad and to support us. W has said you’re a great dad miss you etc. so wonder if she will jump at her last chance. But I doubt it.
You Can level up and grow with me or not. What I want but don’t expect to happen is to be in a space when you’re dating someone and have a drawer at their place maybe sleeping together a couple nights per week. I’m not scared of divorce and I expect that to be the outcome. If she doesn’t want what I want I’ll tell her to go do the work to get the divorce. If it’s mediation she can split the cost. I will not bring up money. And I will not be paying anymore until the divorce agreement is in writing. If she wants to start spending time together and working on growing together. I may pay rent only which is $1000 less than I’ve been paying. Highly doubt this is the outcome. And if she says let’s date to get to know each other or anything like that I will say that doesn’t work for me. No more breadcrumbs.
Are you in or are you out. This convo will happen when I get back from Vegas. Next week.
Had a real estate appt and coaching my HS lacrosse team today. Dropped D4 at w again. I’m having her every night through wed afternoon since I’m heading to Vegas Thursday - Mon. Not sure about this stuff seeing her for drop offs. D4 has been sick now I’m feeling it and w is too. She got a bunch of meds and I asked her for some. She gave me meds. No pursuit etc. Eventually should / will have a babysitter or nanny but W is available and still not working. I have been reading some stuff about divorcing with compassion and emotional intelligence. Instead of fighting like two opposing parties. That is the page W is on. I do love her and care about her. But I will no longer enable her. Here is an article a friend sent me ;
https://www.ftdivorcecoaching.com/s...4f2d-a26d-0b745e624e7b&utm_source=soI’m sure I’m making some mistakes here. Go ahead and swing those 2x4s. I asked wife to get lunch or coffee next week already. She said with me??!! Lol. Then she said she’ll have anxiety. I said don’t worry I’ll buy. Either way. I’m ready to move on one way or another. No more anchor holding me down she can swim with me or swim without me. Or she can swim and I’ll soar. Future is bright. Feel the fear and do it anyway. Growth is on the other side.
Cheers!
Or....imagine going complete no contact unless it is about D4? You've tried all of the above before.
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results."
I don't believe you are insane.
Steve do you mean no contact no support and just not communicate what’s going on at all. And she can figure it out on her own? Or have the conversation say I’m done with the separation this is what I want. You in or out blah blah then NC.
Steve means you don't respond to her at all unless it's in regards to your daughter. Flat out ignore her, except for your daughter. You drop your daughter off as quickly as possible.
The conversation will do nothing but add pressure to your W. What's the point of it? To TELL her you're done and over her? Well she won't believe it until you SHOW her. That's why the NC. You aren't healed. She isn't healed. You both need time and space. I think this is the best course for you. And you are trying and DOING some of the right things, if only you could get your W's talons out of your back for a while.
During IC we talked about the end of this separation and how to approach it with w.
If you want to end it with divorce, which I know you don't, then you would just file for divorce and let some cop serve her divorce papers and cease contact.
Since I know you want to save your marriage, give her time and space and go NC to prevent her from keeping you attached to her. What's the longest you've gone without talking to her throughout this whole situation?
I think you are feeling pumped up and inspired to make a positive change in your life. That's awesome! You are used to success your way and now. The fact that this isn't happening very quickly has got to be frustrating. But you probably haven't even gone more than w or 3 days without communicating with your W about nonessentials.
I'm gonna read your links and I'll let you know what I think there.
And I just read your blog. Man, that's scary putting all of that out there like that. My biggest concern is your spouse seeing it. I don't know if that's good or bad, I'm definitely a more private person.
Anyways, I like what you wrote. I think you know so much. When you talk about your situation and your W, emotions come wipe out your brain and make you weak! And then you come post here and I'm like wow, this is obvious. But you've told me the same thing on my thread before! So I know how that feels man. Let me know if you update the blog any more.
Thanks for reading. What’s it matter if she sees it? I believe that’s the direction for my future. Maybe I could concentrate on a book and not do the blog... I don’t know the exact direction.
You’re probably right that she will just see me telling her what I want and that I’m done with the separation as preasure. But NC and no support she’ll see as what. A total ahole? I knew I couldn’t trust him? I feel like as who I am I should at least communicate... I don’t respect myself for paying support voluntarily. Are you in or are you out. If you’re out go get the divorce.
Then there’s the fact that NC and ignoring her has actually worked. Counterintuive mindblowing. Duh.... I guess NC. But what about when she asks about her check feb 1? Then have the conversation?
Also w keeps saying stuff like we can help each other recently. I haven’t responded but she just wants this friendly divorce thing I guess. Either way I honestly feel like I’m ready to be done with the separation one way or the other. I guess if I’m truly done I can just do NC except Daughter. Not like what I’ve thought would work ever has. Why is this any different - insanity.
ut NC and no support she’ll see as what. A total ahole?
NC and no support... well if she wants a divorce does she imagine that you'll pay her for the rest of her life and still be her little buddy forever? I think it's more of you standing up for yourself and doing the right thing. She can and probably should get a job, right? And she just loves throwing it out there that she is cheating.
I don’t respect myself for paying support voluntarily.
Man, I know what you mean. How many things have we done that made us look weak. We aren't weak, so how is it that our cheating spouses make us weak??
If you’re out go get the divorce.
She hasn't done this yet, so I'd say she's not out. Limbo it is. But take advantage of that time as something to make things better.
When she asks for her check Feb 1....hhmmm I think she can figure it out.
Did... the guys are probably going to disagree with me but if you are worried about looking like a jerk, maybe just give her a deadline to start supporting herself. I don’t know if this is something your originally agreed to or what but if it was, was it with the understanding she would find a job and start taking care of her own bills? If so, you should definitely put a time limit on it - especially if it is causing you some financial stress. She is the one who chose to leave, right? Kind of entitled of her to not have a plan that doesn’t involve you paying for everything when she is cheating on you. That is definitely cake eating.
I´ve read the post at your blog Did. Very encouraging. Like Ovr, I´m a much more private person than you are...I share Ovr concerns too...But we know where you stand with your career and whereabouts. Keep that blog growing then.
If you have a goal, don't look at the percentages, just aim for that goal.
So what´s your goal Did?
Steve means you don't respond to her at all unless it's in regards to your daughter. Flat out ignore her, except for your daughter. You drop your daughter off as quickly as possible.
Yes, that is what I meant. And I don't even care about the support at this point. I think you should have waited until a court ordered it, but if you want to provide support simply because of D4 I can understand that.
Did:
I am confused
I think we have been telling you for quite sometime now to go dark on exW and just communicate about D4 when necessary. No hanging out, making uncesssesary trip. ect. You haven't actually done it all. Maybe for a day.
Then you post about wanting to ask her for coffee. Then you post about saying you want to tell her "I need this to reconcile, else we are getting a divorce" I don't have enough fingers to count on to tell you how many times we have also told you not to do that. Because 1) it's an ultimatum. And do you want her to act on an ultimatum? That won't show real changes she wants to make. That will show her being afraid of losing her support and faking it. Are you seriously ready to follow through on that ultimatum? She knows what you want/need to reconcile. She is choosing not to do it.
You have to stop trying to force the hand. It will not yield the healthy marriage you desire. It will yield a woman who is sitting pretty not working yet getting fully supported just coming back enough to get what she wants.
I would provide support in the way of what would be ordered by the courts. If you aren't ready to pull the D trigger, atleast consult with a lawyer and get an idea of what you would be paying if you were to D. And pay that amount.
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over again and expecting different results. No matter how you word it, you keep doing the same thing and wanting to do the same things hoping it will give you the result you want.
You are doing good with GAL. You just need to drop that rope with the W already. Freedom from her chains.
Limited time today. I already talked to an attorney and the $2325/mo would be from 1-1.5 years. The mediator also said she had to work. She has since gotten her license to start working. And she is ready to start earning money. She hasn’t yet but that will start soon... supposedly.
Yea definition of insanity I understand.
I am ready for divorce. It’s not what I want but I only want her if she’s working on being healthy herself and working on a relationship with me. I refuse to have an anchor pulling me down which is how I feel with the separation. Maybe NC is the same as no support and I’m done with separation as I was planning.
I don’t know but I’ll weigh my options and won’t be talking to her while I’m away. Vegas with the boys for lacrosse tournament tomorrow morning. Of course my throats killing me and D4 has been sick as a dog. W is also sick and saying she doesn’t know how she’s going to do it by herself. I’m sick too. The difference is I got out of bed and made breakfast went to store with D4 and got meds and food. Now dropping off to w.
Separation has been 20 months. I don’t think the leeway space works for me anymore. It no longer serves me. Maybe NC would change that. Something needs to change.thanks for support. Will consider what to do while I’m away
Please do not have ANOTHER convo with her telling her your thoughts. You have done that every month sometimes twice a month. She does not believe you. In fact, none of us do. So please, for your own dignity, don't do it again.
February is here next week and she is waiting to see how you will handle it. That is your timeline. Stick to it.
I know that I differ with some on the monetary arrangement that you have going. I think dropping it down to half would be fair. You will most likely be paying child support and to stop paying after you have been for 20 months will not look well in court. I know you do not want to hurt the welfare of your daughter also.
Have you set a visitation schedule yet? We have all suggested it and you say you will. Trust me, this will help you in more ways than one.
Visitation schedule is not possible with my work varying every week. I coach and sell real estate and have a different schedule which changes based on appointments and seasons. I am going to do a google calendar. Unsure if I should do my work schedule on there or just D4 days I can have her.
Maybe I will drop the support from $2325 to $1325 rent or half $1162.50... I will do NC. I will talk to an attorney. Something has to change. Ignoring her has worked in the past I'll go with that.
My feb deadline in MC therapy was discussed that I file for divorce at that time. No its not what I want, but yes I am ready. I am not scared of it.
The convo telling her my thoughts was to make a change. Tell her what I want in a partner. She says anything but I want that too let's try, then Im done, no support. Then comes the change being no support - W go file if you want me to support you. This separation no longer works for me. Or level up with me if you want to be more than just D4s mom in my life. I work fing hard and deserve to be appreciated and valued, I am a dad half the time and work to provide for all of us. Im a role model for kids and inspire people to change....
So yea realistically Im done with leeway. I know that. I have to be true to myself.
Unfortunately, when you are formally divorced, you are going to have to work out a schedule if she goes back to work. She won't be readily available anymore. She isn't going to bend to your schedule if she has to work.
You keep wanting to have this conversation that if she becomes what you need her to be, you' want to make it work. If she really wanted to do it that way, she would come to you and say "what needs to be done to make this work?"
You telling her what to do isn't going to work. She's got to want to do it, and if she wants to, she will, and show you by action.
You will have to come to a schedule if you divorce. Obviously. You really should come to one now. Is that too much reality? It shouldn't be. It should be reality for her. And you should get used to it also. You catering to her every time she wants a break bc she can't deal IS YOUR VISITATION SCHEDULE at this point. You make that happen. But you can't also a regular one? <laughable>
Thanks Ginger you’re absolutely right. Schedule she is going to be doing septic system designs on her computer from home and she should be very flexible. I have no issue getting a babysitter if needed and go week to week as I’ve told her multiple times.
There’s no reason for me to say anything about what I want unless she says what can I do to make this work. She lost me. She left. I’m done with the separation and leeway. No reason to talk about anything but D4.
Support next month $0 - $1325. $0 is basically telling her go get the divorce which is what I was expecting. If that looks bad should we go to court something she strongly wants to avoid then maybe just paying her rent at $1325 is best. I truly feel like there is a better future for me out there. And I’m going to go get it.
Not going to post much for a couple days. Thanks for everyone’s advice and opinions.
Airport heading back from Vegas. Going to talk to w this week. Short and sweet. Bullet points.
I realize how hurtful my actions were and I’m sorry I’m not my past and I can’t change it. When we were dating previously the foundation was extremely unhealthy. We’ve had a lot of space and time and I feel we’re both getting to a healthier place now.
If you want to have any connection or friendship with me that is part of our marriage. I recently read something that said unless you can go on double dates with your ex don’t be friends there are still feelings there.
Level up with me as I continue to better myself and my future. Or don’t.
If money comes up- I’m going to pay just the rent ($1000 less) $1325.
Minimal contact during trip. She sent me a handful of Instagram posts and Facebook posts. I didn’t respond. I did respond about D4 kindergarten discussion and schedule for next week. We will discuss kindergarten along with topics above at lunch or coffee this week. Want to do it somewhere public. Thoughts?
Did, it’s clear you want to do what you want to do, not what we suggest.
That convo should not happen if you want to listen to our advice .
But you can’t seem to help yourself.
Did,
Bro... You seem so level-headed in regard to the thoughts you put into play regarding other peoples sitches. You seem to have a lot of good things going for you, and you need to embrace that, for you.
You are stalling and repeating your pattern, and I have been there... and I have been getting the 2x4's thrown at my face for it, and im glad, because if not, I would still be there...
look at your bullet points my friend.. You see them as points to how you both have redeemed yourselves, and are now healthier, wiser and ready for round 2.. I know you will be fine with or without, but I also can read between the lines, that you really really want it to be with....
Your bullet points, will not work in your favor. You engaging in this conversation, will not work in your favor. You need to let go. Get to a the point, where she is a person you care for, because of what you shared in the past, but in the present, she is really messing you up with this repeating cycle. Let go, and then you will see clear. Work on you, be the great dad I know you are from reading your journals. Do NOT talk with her about those pointers, they will just come off as pursuit, and she will only be pushed away with the knowledge that, despite your efforts to rip loose from her, you are still detached, and she will use this against you.
Be strong my friend - this is the worst time of your life, but its time, it passes, and new time overflows the past and presents you with something great for the future, I am sure of it.... But that can only happen, if you decide to let the past be in the past.
You are the one, who makes the difference in you, nobody else. Love yourself enough to let go, only then can you let other people and even maybe your old companion, love you like you deserve to be loved.
Do NOT talk with her about those pointers, they will just come off as pursuit, and she will only be pushed away with the knowledge that, despite your efforts to rip loose from her, you are still detached, and she will use this against you.
Pretty sure he means you are still attached, not detached.
BTW, hope you enjoyed Vegas. I read your other blog post. Happy to see you working on yourself.
Airport heading back from Vegas. Going to talk to w this week. Short and sweet. Bullet points.
I realize how hurtful my actions were and I’m sorry I’m not my past and I can’t change it. When we were dating previously the foundation was extremely unhealthy. We’ve had a lot of space and time and I feel we’re both getting to a healthier place now.
If you want to have any connection or friendship with me that is part of our marriage. I recently read something that said unless you can go on double dates with your ex don’t be friends there are still feelings there.
Level up with me as I continue to better myself and my future. Or don’t.
If money comes up- I’m going to pay just the rent ($1000 less) $1325.
Minimal contact during trip. She sent me a handful of Instagram posts and Facebook posts. I didn’t respond. I did respond about D4 kindergarten discussion and schedule for next week. We will discuss kindergarten along with topics above at lunch or coffee this week. Want to do it somewhere public. Thoughts?
Did, it’s clear you want to do what you want to do, not what we suggest.
That convo should not happen if you want to listen to our advice .
But you can’t seem to help yourself.
To Ginger's point. A question for you:
What are you planning on saying to her that she doesn't already know?
Did, it’s clear you want to do what you want to do, not what we suggest.
That convo should not happen if you want to listen to our advice .
But you can’t seem to help yourself.
^^^This^^^
DID,
Please do not do any relationship ship talk with her. You have been very confident as of late and if youbti g up relationship it will make you look like a lil puppy saying "pick me, pick me!!!!" It also takes away from your feb timeframe that she is very aware of
Guys what do you want me to do. I’m done with the separation we’re getting close to two years. I’m done with leeway. I’ve talked to my Ic about this in depth. Basically she can be in or out. And if out. I’m just done. This conversation is at the feb timetable where I was planning on cutting support to $0. Now after thinking and talking to some of you. I was thinking $1325 just rent instead of $2325.
Now thinking what I’d tell someone else on here. Act like you’re divorced already. Focus on yourself. I’ve already been doing this. She says things about herself I don’t respond. All I talk about is D4.
Honestly guys I’m ready to move on with my life. We were talking about D4 school for next year today we have to decide on kindergarten. And it was a mature productive conversation. During the convo I mentioned I could get a babysitter since I will need one. Because I don’t want to see each other all the time if we aren’t together. She seemed surprised and said what are you going to hate me.
Really with the convo and date it was supposed to be this separation is over I’m done paying so much money. You’re in or out. And if she’s out I go black even more just talk about D4.
I assume your advice will be just go black now. Instead of after the convo.
So what do I do with the lunch / coffee plans? Use it as a date to show we get along and finish kindergarten talk? Cancel? Just don’t ask her out unless she asks me when / where? Explain I want mutual respect and I don’t respect myself paying so much voluntary support.
Thanks all. I have a great life. Yes I really want the marriage and my wife back if she’s full of love for me. I just don’t see that happening so why prolong it. It’s been since June 2017 a long fing time
During convo just say I’m done with separation and leave it open ended. Give her $1325. Decide on kindergarten. Go dark?
Did... I’m not 100% sure where you and your W are at because I have read so many sitchs that they are all starting to blend. It seems to me that she isn’t worried too much about losing you nor has she had to live her life like a divorced person. Take care of the business between you (childcare schedule, finances, etc...) and then go as NC as possible. Drop the rope... really drop it. You sound like you are getting to a place where you can do that. You will feel a heck of a lot better once you do. Your W, on the other hand, will not. (((HUGS)))
Did, here is my vote. Go to a good lawyer, file for D, and have her served. It will be pretty clear to her where you stand and you won't have to say a word to her.
W texted me asking if I wanted to get lunch or tea tomorrow. Earlier we had said wed. This is two years of my life. I’m not just wasting more time in this sitch. I have had major improvements across the board. If w wants something together great. If not her loss I’m sure life has something better fitting in store for me. Change needs to happen. It’s been too long and I’m done with the repetitive cycle.
I do appreciate your advice and perspectives. I will think about it as if I was advising a friend. Maybe I don’t go through those bullet points. But I’m not going to be her friend if we get divorce as she seems to desire.
Maybe I just say something quickly to alnokwege past mistakes. Say to her you know feb was my timetable what do you want? The separation no longer works for me. Level up with me or don’t. Are you In or out. Ic liked those last two points... then it’s easy to go dark and pay less and I can be the stand up man I want to be communicating. Then I’m not pursuing her as much... Just standing behind my words with feb timetable. I’m not going to overthink it but be confident and let life flow. Rather than trying to control everything.
If I get divorced that’s ok. I’ve tried my best. And I love the man that I am and the man I’m becoming. Thank you.
Did, if you want her to say she’s in “in” when she really isn’t but she says so because you gave her some verbal ultimatum, then by all means have this conversation.
If you want her to feel pressured by this “deadline “ and have her pretend she’s going to do what you want her to do, then screw you over again, by all means, give her “the speech”
If you want her to really be in, then you get a lawyer, file divorce and if somewhere down the line she starts showing you she is willing to do what it takes by actions, we’ll, I think that would be ideal.
But if you want your M to keep going through this cycle, by al means give her some speech andbultimatum.
And do you really think it’s a good idea to acknowledge past mistakes? Have you not done that over and over?
Doing the same things over and expecting different results is the definition of insanity. Andbill keep repeating that.
I am more afraid your “Hail Mary “ isn’t going to end in her saying “ok, let’s get a divorce” it’s going to end in a fake promise of reconciliation out of panic. And you’ll believe it. Because if she was honestly interested in “leveling herself up” it wouldn’t be because of threat of no support. It would be because it was a decision she made to truly grow.
you are hellbent on doing this because you like many here have thought they can all of a sudden talk their was into wanting to become a healed person and save the M I hope you are very aware of the disasteroua results it might yield.
Did, ever hear the song "Keep Me Hanging On" by The Supremes? It's been covered by countless artists. Go read the lyrics or listen to it. It describes your sitch perfectly.
This is why I don't like hard dates/deadlines/ anni dates or w/e you want to call them when it comes to these matters.
It's an added stress for many. Anni dates allow us to look back and reflect. They're good for renewal, fresh starting points too. Special days for ourselves or that we shared with our loved ones.
If your spouse does not have some sort of wake up from your anniversary date of when you got married or the first time you met, or kissed or w/e other special moment in your lives, what in the world is going to make her jump on board with your cut off date? Hey, I think that was an unintentional pun. It's the action itself. Forget announcements, if you're rdy to move on, move. if she sees you moving and wants to go in your direction, she will catch up and let you know.
This date setting, why is it important to some when they can have a full tank left? IMO these dates are rather arbitrary. Why is spending two years rebuilding yourself considered a waste of time? If you are not where you need to be emotionally or mentally for the better MR 2.0 or for the next deserving person in your life what does that say? There could be a wasted two years, but that does not put any more meaning into a cut off date than if you were successfully moving forward. Would it make sense if you were recon or piecing to say well I still have this deadline we must beat? So... if the date is to cut your losses, cut them and move on. Sounds like another tactic to goad the other person into something they never bought in to in the first place.
then it’s easy to go dark and pay less and I can be the stand up man I want to be communicating. Then I’m not pursuing her as much... Just standing behind my words with feb timetable. I’m not going to overthink it but be confident and let life flow. Rather than trying to control everything.
Separation no longer works? But its okay to then go dark? As separated?
Then the phrases that stick out, "not pursuing as much" That's a give. And the "Rather than trying to control everything." Still shows a controlling nature, even if you realize it and pull the reigns, you are saying that after giving an ultimatum, a very controlling gesture.
^^^ ultimatums are controlling, which is basically what you are giving her. "get yourself healthy so we can be together else I am going to divorce you" What do you honestly expect the outcome to be of that.
Or you can act as you want for the life you choose because you have zero control over what she chooses.
If you want her to really be in, then you get a lawyer, file divorce and if somewhere down the line she starts showing you she is willing to do what it takes by actions, we’ll, I think that would be ideal.
I will add to this by saying that I don't think Did wants a divorce so right there I don't recommend filing for divorce. But, I also think that Did has never given her space, never really gone dark or stopped pursuing her. I would recommend that he does those things.
Give that a month or two and I imagine her tone may change. I don't see a divorce stopping this unhealthy cycle. If the cycle is to stop, Did must stop it. No frivolous conversations, no extra thoughts, simple yes or no answers to his W's questions.
Did, what would you ex say/do/think if you were to start dating someone else?
I’m just going to go in to lunch with an open mind. Ask her what she wants. See how it goes. Mention leveling up my life in certain areas and she can be in or out.
Having this date came about because counselor recommended saying w could go back and forth years.
Ask her what SHE wants? She gets to call the shots?
So what does being "in" mean to you?
She is going to give you minimal to keep herself hooked and getting paid.
I am just not following your logic, but clearly, you are going to do what you are going to do.
I think it is going to be detrimental to your own progress.
But to each his own, I think I commented enough and you have chosen your actions.
When I started dating someone else she came back last time. I refuse to build another unhealthy foundation. She can choose to be with me for the right reasons or she can go kick rocks
I agree with Ginger. In the last 2 years how many lunches/dinners/conversations have you had along these lines. HOW is this one different? From her perspective it is just more of the same. Did says what he wants, she gives no answers, nothing changes, Did starts plotting his next "discussion" with her. She learns nothing. She has to make no changes. All she has to do is wait until the cycle repeats, play coy, and allow it to die down.
Did, I believe this time is different. But will she?
Yea it’s dofferent because I’m cutting support drastically. And She told me she missed me and we had sexual intimacy late December and I told her after that not to contact me because it wasn’t healthy for me. We’re getting to an end game here. Whether it’s sad or not is besides the point. I refuse to have unhealthy relationships in my life. I will reach my potential and live an incredible life. With or without her.
So, you want her to come back because you are cutting support drastically? Is that a reason you want her to pretend like she is going to do what you want?
I’m not going to even discuss the support. I’m going to ask her what she wants. And I’m going to mention some things I’m doing with my life. Including blog / book which will be pretty personal. As well as discuss D4. If she shows no interest in being more than d4s mom in my life. I’m going to tell her she should do the work to get the divorce and that I’m done with separation and leeway. End game. Maybe we won’t even get there if we just get along well maybe I leave it at that and give more time. I really don’t have an exact plan but I don’t want this separation to continue. And I’m paying less support.
Agreed to get support in writing to go until July. Which is one year. Least amount of time. Could be 1.5 years according to attorney. I will check with attorney that this would hold up in court. And only child support after that. Had some good conversations. W mentioned she likes spending time with me. Had 2.5 hours sitting together at lunch. I still feel like it’s over and done. Going to work on detaching further. When she gets mad or upset it still pulls on my heart so more work to do there - detaching. Nothing else to be said. Going dark unless she is serious about wanting to recon.
Did, any consideration, if you are really done with separation, at filing for D? I know we are an anti-D board but man its been two years. I think you should cut-bait at this point. Plus that sends a very clear message without you saying a word that you are done with separation.
I wish AnotherStander would chime in. He always says eventually the LBS is usually the one to file for D. She is going to coast in limbo, doing anything she wants, until you make the next move.
I’m open to filing. I’m going to think about it but may do it relatively soon. Maybe that will be my gift to myself for my 34th birthday feb 10th. She is of the opinion that marriage doesn’t matter and she was committed to me because she was committed and not because of a piece of paper saying we’re married. I asked her what she wanted or how she felt about us. And she said she is very introspective and couldn’t give me an answer right now ina. Public space. She didn’t say anything about me directly and has always hesitated on saying nice things about me since the separation. She did say that she was dating someone or had a second date planned with this person. I assume it’s more than a second date. As they normally downplay it.
Knowing I was just in Vegas and both of us had been dating other people. I never talk to her about my dating life. But did early on in separation. She brought us up being friends at that time when I used to talk about these two girls I dated. Over a year ago. She also said she was dating to fill a void and was never healthy and she’s feeling better now. I talked about some of the things I’m into in regard to writing and coaching people on happiness and how to use break ups as a way to grow. She played devils advocate.
Definitely no reason to talk about anything but D4. She definitely needs to know I’m done. Very open to filing. Not really that mad or sad. Kind of just is what it is a little disappointment. But I guess what I expected.
In meantime I’ll write something saying support of $2325 to end in July and only child support to be paid after that as is to be determined by an agreement by both parties. That’s a better deal than any attorney could get me.
Got D4 going home from school. Then going to the gym and will work out hard to get rid of any anxiety knowing she’s out. F it. I’m moving on. Maybe I should just file.
You know that I changed my hard stance on support because of D4, but you were all set prior to lunch to drop it to only rent. What changed between then and now.
Fact that we agreed to one year of support from July. And that she could get more than that if she wanted to through the courts system.
She asked me about something I said about the wording I used to drecribe something about writing my book at lunch. I guess I just don’t respond at all.
She asked me about something I said about the wording I used to drecribe something about writing my book at lunch. I guess I just don’t respond at all.
- Is it a question related to your daughter?
- Is it a question related to any shared finances you might have to deal with ?
if not, then do not reply - she is a big girl, and she chose to handle her life on her own, when she decided you were not part of her future plans.
Stay strong.
She asked me about something I said about the wording I used to drecribe something about writing my book at lunch. I guess I just don’t respond at all.
Temp check. At this point you should refer to her as The Thermometer as that is all she seems to do (temp check you).
Thinking about it I do reallymiss her. She’s deep smart gorgeous sexy. I really like talking to her. But she’s not kind and doesn’t show me love. She’s hardened to me as Sandi says her heart is hard. Seeing other couples where the girl is rubbing the guys leg or leaning all over him during a meal. I’m a physical person that’s what I want. It’s sad. There’s nothing I can do but move on. Being that I do still want the relationship I’m not sure it makes sense to file. Just go dark I suppose. And commit to it long term.
I did not respond. I will not talk to her about anything but D4 and financial / divorce. No help with housing decisions for her or work or anything else.
For those who have read my blog why does it matter if w sees it? Going to go public with it at some point. Going to reach my goals. Not stay stuck in this space I’ve been in.
Going to write agreement for us to sign before paying any more support. All business. I said everything I had to say personallynyesterday. She said she liked spending time with me and I will not allow any more cake eating. Time to man the F up.
$2325 to be paid for 1 year as alimony/ spousal support + child support in 12 monthly payments which started July 2018.
June 2017- June 2018 w supported by shared credit cards after w left the marital home and separating.
Child support to be determined in June 2018.
There will be no splitting of any property or other accounts or funds after this support.
Custody shared as close to 50/50 as possible. Schedule to be re-evaluated as needed when w starts working.
Did, when you were courting her, did you do the chasing? Or did she?
You mention: "She’s deep smart gorgeous sexy."
If she is smart why isn't she earning her own living yet?
I heard a saying years ago that has stuck with me: "The one that loves the least, controls the relationship." Has she always controlled your relationship with her?
I agree you need to move on. I still get the sense that you are looking for that "hail mary" that I think Ginger mentioned. That you are hoping with one more day, hour, or minute she'll wake up and be the girl you married again. I think every thing you do is to gauge if she has taken a step toward or away from you, or remained in the same place.
You talk about being in control, happy with where you are, etc. Then tells us that at lunch she is going on her second date with another guy, and that you don't believe that, you think it is probably more than that.
Did you are two years in, this is not a new sitch where you should give her some time. After 2 years she continues to date others. If you were in the place you said you were prior to lunch you would have marched right to your L and MOVED ON. Even when you say "There’s nothing I can do but move on." it is as if there is dread and reluctance there. Compare that to the language pre-lunch. "I am pleased with where I am. I am so happy with my life. etc." So what is the truth? Are you ready to move on or are you sad and reluctant to do so?
Also, I would question the advice of your IC. I am firm believer in finding an IC that works, and not just settling for the first one you go to. We comparison shop for stereo speakers, and then we settle for the first IC that we find in the yellow pages. I would highly consider finding another IC. You're two years in. I am all for trying to save a MR but the facts of your sitch is that she has used you, manipulated you, continues to do so with no signs of changing her mind and returning to the MR, and continues to date (and presumably sleep) with other guys! Take a step back out away from your sitch a view it as an outsider, objective observer. If you were a friend of yours watching all this from afar, what would you say to you? Your IC essentially sent you into a lunch with a script (that you've said before by the way) in the hopes of what?
Anyway Did, I really think you need to move on and not just talk about. No more talks with her. No ultimatum. No "I'll do this with her and see if she is in or out." That ship has sailed. You can continue to be wagged by your tail, or you can take control and wag your tail!
She always loved me more and pursued me in the relationship. Until her door slammed shut. The IC is great and gave me three bullet points. Of D4 first. separation no longer works for me. I’m going to level up my life. Are you in or are you out. And she has told me I should divorce her. That she is my drug of choice.
Friends say the same. What is she doing for you? Nothing good. Parents say the same. So yea when I see her it and we interact I want her. It makes me feel worse and I need to listen to my intuition there. It’s Fin obvious. So no more of that. Yesterday was the last time.
It’s sad. There’s nothing I can do but move on. Being that I do still want the relationship I’m not sure it makes sense to file. Just go dark I suppose. And commit to it long term.
Hallelujah!
I did not respond. I will not talk to her about anything but D4 and financial / divorce. No help with housing decisions for her or work or anything else.
Great.
If you were in the place you said you were prior to lunch you would have marched right to your L and MOVED ON.
Or just totally taken action to remove her as a priority in his life. Steve, do you think it's possible to move on without filing for divorce?
Did, I don't know about the IC. You obviously don't agree with her on the divorce, that's plain as day. Separation doesn't work for you, but you aren't ready to divorce so it's limbo for you. You have to make the most of it! As far as making your life better and improving as a man, we all think you should do that! So do it and let your W wonder what you're up to.
Did, I am sorry, but you are even more inconsistent than she is. She is actually pretty consistent. She keeps you on the hook because you allow her to, but otherwise, her path doesn't seem to be changing. You schedule a lunch, talk for 2 hours, tell her how you are becoming a better version of yourself, tell her about a book, then she asks about it and you say "what should I do, go dark?
You are mind-Fing me, I imagine she is feeling the same way. Your words don't match your actions at all. Her words and actions seem to match, even if they aren't going in the direction you want them to.
You want to write a book, you have started a blog, but you really need to live it for other people to relate to it! If you want to help, talk is cheap, but actions are where people follow.
Please stay consistent. having these long lunches, telling her about the things you are doing, then say you are going dark, do it for about 2 minutes, then revert, how can she trust you and your changes if your words and actions don't match? But that doesn't even matter. You need to believe and live them
You need to believe and live them
This be a headshot!
Did, Ginger hit it. You haven't trusted the process since you got here. Your inconsistency stems from that. Believe the vets here. You can't DB half-heartedly. Those that struggle the most try to both pursue and pressure, while trying to do some DBing along the way. DBing is something you live, not something you dabble in.
I am always good for a headshot.....
I sued to be here under a different name. I actually joined in 2008 as a scared 27 year old with a 6 month old baby who's husband just left her for another woman.
I was just about the worst DB'er ever. Probably because my ex had been pretty horrible to me for 9 years and I was fed up and all my anger from those years plus what he did came pouring out. I was inconsistent, dark, not dark, I hated him, I loved him, I let him know it all. My ex was way out the door. He was having an A since my pregnancy. They will be married 8 years on April Fool's day.
I wish I would have DB'd more consistently from the beginning for my own sake. I was a hot angry mess. I was also the only one who was affected. I was the one losing. When I detached, and I DB'd for me, my life became infinitely better and more peaceful.
You keep saying you are leveling up, but it almost seems like you aren't really going to do that until she does, and you could be waiting forever for that.
Did, I've followed your sitch for a long time. You have consistently been given advice to not give, and then gave, and/or stop support and pursuit, which you always decided in your own logic and thinking that you "should" do. You have always come to this board with great stories and great resolve with ideas only to fold days before your own deadline and cave into what you could in some convoluted way to justify your actions. "I am done with this and am done with all support as of Feb 1". Then to say that " well, I think I agreed to July 1 to being a year, so I should maybe go ahead an give that to her to be the awesome husband that I know she sees me as". Not a total quote as I embellished the last bit, but you get my point. She doesn't see you as awesome. She doesn't even see you except as a cash register that is she leans against with a body part that you are interested in, she can cash. Sorry to be so blunt, but that is what I see. You seem intelligent. You seem to hear and understand what the veterans are telling you here on this board. Yet , time and time again YOU CHOOSE, yes, I said it, you choose to do the exact opposite of both their points, and the points you have made yourself in order to prolong this daily agony that you are in. My personal situation is to F'd up it is unreal. But I have cut off all contact and any support except with regard to my children. Am I happy about it, do I want a divorce, He!! no! But I have to, at some point, stand for myself and my children and say "enough is enough" I am too good a person to be treated this way. Did, Your W is not the person you remember in your mind. You are projecting and remembering a person that no longer exists. Can you save it? Who knows! But if you keep doing what you are doing, you are only prolonging your time, agony and financial responsibility for the unforeseeable future.
Do yourself a favor and draw the line that I have seen you draw countless times and haven't followed through. Follow through THIS time and see what happens. Either it is done, or in time she will decide to work on your MR Either way, at least you are at a point where you can move on. Together or apart. The choice is always up to you. Make it your decision, take control, be the man you are for only yourself and your D4!
Please start a new thread and link the threads together.
Thinking about it I do reallymiss her.
I miss my wife. I don't miss my ex. My ex is not my wife. She is not the person that swore to love, honor and cherish until death do we part. She is not the one that never left my side when I was sick. She is not the one that snuggled up to me on cold nights to warm her bootie. She is not the one that gazed at me when I played with the kids like I was the Greatest Man that had Ever Walked the Earth. She is not the one that loved me unconditionally. I'm sorry Did but the woman you fell in love with is gone. You are clinging to memories. You don't want to let go of this current person she is because you are hoping beyond hope that the person she was will somehow rise back to the surface. It's not going to happen. Hang onto the memories but let go of the fantasy.