Divorcebusting.com
Posted By: DB346 WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/18/18 11:11 PM
I've been lurking here for a couple months and I've finally reached a point that I feel like I need to post here.

My WW and I have been married for 12 years with one S7. She blindsided me with BD in late April and moved to her parents' house the next day. Within a week she was meeting with a lawyer. About 6 weeks later I received a proposed separation agreement.

Shortly after BD I discovered very unusual text message usage during the previous several months. I have since confirmed that this was an OM that went from EA to PA after she moved out.

I've read DB and DR and all of Cadet's homework. I have struggled very badly with deciding whether there is any chance to save my family and further, whether I can come back from this. I was convinced that I wanted to stand for my marriage, but after several weeks of nearly NC we recently talked. In this conversation I confirmed that I knew of the A and discussed my requirements for a separation agreement regarding custody of S7. I made mistakes in this conversation by letting the topic veer in to discussions about our MR and OM that I didn't want to get in to.

In our state you have to be physically separated for a year before filing for divorce, unless you have a limited number of 'at-fault' circumstances. Of course adultery is one of those circumstances. The problem I am having is determining whether I have any hope of saving my family, or if I could even move past the betrayal if she ever came around. She has hit me with all of the typical WAW/WW script/history re-writing and ILYBNILWY, etc.

There is no question whatsoever that I HEAVILY contributed to her WW mindset. I spent the last 2-3 years (maybe longer) suffering with depression. I can honestly say that the last few years I have been in such a fog that I struggle to identify what year certain events happened. I shut down and other than going to work I basically didn't/couldn't function. I would basically come home and close myself off from my family and suffer alone. When I DID spend time with them I would get angry way too often. I didn't take good care of myself and I was depressed and embarrassed by my weight and didn't want to go anywhere. Basically, I wasn't being a good husband or father. I don't blame her for losing respect for me and feeling like she didn't love me anymore. I own that, and understand why she would be thinking of leaving me. When she walked out on me, it was like a switch flipped in me. The fog cleared and I realized that I had to make MAJOR changes to myself. I've lost between 60 and 70 lbs in under 12 weeks, I immediately turned my life back to God, got involved in a new church (taking S7 with me as well), begun serving at church, reconnected with friends, started IC, started meditating, reading the bible daily and have met with a pastor from church. I am taking better care of myself and the house and have completely dedicated myself to being the best dad I can be.

I love my wife and my son with all my heart and I would give anything to go back and do things differently. I know that I can't look back now and have to just keep moving forward, but I am having such a hard time. I KNOW that I have to let her go and trust God, and when we were virtually NC I was doing so well, but talking to her the other night has set me back to feeling like i did on BD. When I can think rationally, I know that I will get through this and be OK even without her, but I am having so much trouble truly letting go.
Posted By: Cadet Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/18/18 11:22 PM
Originally Posted by DB346
I've read DB and DR and all of Cadet's homework.

Well then I will just say welcome.

If you want me to re-post them I will be glad to do it
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/18/18 11:24 PM
Please do. I need to re-read them often to keep myself focused.
Posted By: Cadet Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/18/18 11:35 PM
Welcome to the board

Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.

Yes first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/
http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm

and Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htm

You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!

Get out and Get a Life (GAL).

DETACH.


Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.

Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:

I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072

Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095

Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414

Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566

Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096

Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153

For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554

Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forum...ain=57819&Number=2578224#Post2578224

Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1

Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764

Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574

The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619

Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
Posted By: DavidUK Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/18/18 11:53 PM
I could have written a lot of that. I've not got proof of A. I would really like to know for certain. At least you know.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/18/18 11:56 PM
I wish I didn't know. Having her compare him to me and tell me how much happier she is without me crushed my soul. And the worst part is that I have at least 11 more years of having to deal with her and raise our son. Right now that is feeling like a lifetime of torture...
Posted By: DavidUK Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 12:45 AM
My W says she is now 'in a happier place'. I've no proof of A (other than she was showing all the classic signs). I want to know.

It will be 11 more years for me too. My kids deserve so much better. They deserve W & I to try but my W won't at all.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 12:55 AM
Yeah, mine is completely unwilling to do any counseling or make ANY effort to save our marriage. I'm just struggling with doing the only thing I CAN do and letting go of her, our marriage and what I thought our future would look like and just put all my trust in God. I gave the option for me to go ahead and file so the divorce can be done in a few months rather than waiting until the spring, but she would rather do the separation agreement. I got the impression from things she said, that she doesn't want him to get dragged in to it. She also seems to not want the adultery filing despite her claiming to have NO REGRETS.

If we can agree on custody terms for our S7, I'm willing to do the separation agreement, though if our marriage is truly over I feel like the shorter timeline to D and closure is appealing.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 12:01 PM
I have been thinking a lot about how I feel like I was in such a fog for the last couple years. I have memories of things we did and places we went, but I honestly have trouble remembering what year they happened in. It got really bad just over a year ago and started to have horrible panic attacks when I decided to leave my job of nearly 10 years. I couldn't see for myself that I was fighting depression and just thought it was anxiety about the big change I was making. But, the panic attacks finally prompted me to go to the doctor, who gave me a prescription for an anti-depressant to try to level off my anxiety. Since I wasn't able to recognize that I was depressed, he presumed it was just situational. My wife didn't like me taking the medication and actually encouraged me to stop taking it after a couple months.

Looking back to a couple months pre-BD, she was trying to push me to start taking it again...she KNEW I was struggling with depression, even though I didn't realize it. She was trying to get me to start taking it again because she knew she was having an EA and was going to leave me to pursue a PA.

I love my wife with all my heart, and I want her back, but right now I know I have to work hard to get ME back.
Posted By: Cadet Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 01:11 PM
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.

Originally Posted by Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.

It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.

We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.

Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
Posted By: SteveLW Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 01:30 PM
DB, I came over to your thread due to your posts in mine. Obviously there are a lot of details that you haven't shared, but you shared enough for me to at least give you some things to think about.

First, I am anti-divorce. I am anti-divorce just based on personal preference, because families in my mind should stay together. I am anti-divorce due to my religious beliefs, because God hates D and his plan from the beginning was one man and one woman for life. I am anti-divorce for societal reasons, because many of our problems in society are directly and indirectly related to divorce.

However, when a PA is involved all bets are off. First, I still prefer that families stay together, but for many a PA is a bridge too far. For some there is no coming back from that. I think I would struggle with taking my W back if she ever physically cheated. Second, God gives that one caveat on divorce in the NT "except for fornication". And third, while society is impacted by so many divorces, again, PAs are so destructive and damaging that the same societal problems can occur from adultery even if the marriage were to be saved.

DB I say all that to say that NO ONE could blame you for going right now, securing a lawyer, and filing for D with her being at-fault for adultery. I live in a state where that is no longer an option. There is no-fault D, and there isn't even an option for filing for D with cause. It can be stated in the No Fault D that one spouse claimed the other cheated, but in states where at-fault D's for cause can be filed I encourage the victim of adultery to explore it and have it ready as an option.

However, i would caution you against doing it for expediency. When it comes to DBing, slow and steady wins the race. I would never encourage you to file before you've done the work to prepare yourself. GAL. 180s. Detaching. All of those things must be done and must be your priority. If once you do this work you fill you should file for D, I think in your sitch you are FULLY justified.

It could be that as you do that work, that your WAW may take notice and come to her senses. That is always the hope.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 01:46 PM
This is exactly what I'm struggling with. I am every bit as anti-D as you are, but I always thought PA was a hard boundary for me. However, the more I search for God's guidance on recovering from infidelity I am constantly led to God's desire for us to reconcile.

I know I am not truly ready for a D, but that may just be me still struggling with attachment since it's not been quite 3 months since BD. I'm just unsure whether I truly want her back or if I'm just afraid of letting go.
Posted By: SteveLW Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 01:50 PM
Originally Posted by DB346
This is exactly what I'm struggling with. I am every bit as anti-D as you are, but I always thought PA was a hard boundary for me. However, the more I search for God's guidance on recovering from infidelity I am constantly led to God's desire for us to reconcile.

I know I am not truly ready for a D, but that may just be me still struggling with attachment since it's not been quite 3 months since BD. I'm just unsure whether I truly want her back or if I'm just afraid of letting go.


Probably both. And there is NOTHING wrong with working through that. I think God's desire would be for you both to reconcile. But he won't hold it against you due to her infidelity to not reconcile. She will be judged for what she has done, however.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 02:05 PM
The thing is, after talking to her the other night I am concerned for her. I mean, believe nothing they say and half of what they do, right? But, besides telling me that she has no regrets, she made a comment that it was like God brought him to her. I had to stop and tell her not to blame her A on God. But, to me this was just an indication of how far gone she is. She tried to reason that it's not an A because there was no physical contact of any kind before she moved out, just 100+ text messages back and forth for the 3-4 months before that. I know the A will fall apart, and she is setting herself up for a lot of pain. I mean, does she actually think she has a future with a guy that would pursue a married woman and help destroy her family? If the fog starts to clear at all, she is going to be hurting, and I hate that for her, but it's not my problem to solve.

She's holding on to every tiny thing I have ever done wrong in the last 14+ years and has so much resentment toward me. A lot of them are valid, a lot aren't. I just have to figure out how to stop wanting to fix her or save her and figure out how to save myself.
Posted By: SteveLW Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 02:31 PM
DB, you have the right attitude even if you aren't there yet.

Everything you said she is saying and doing, the rationalizations, the holding your mistakes over your head, this is all playbook for WAWs. This is how they ease their guilt. The "God sent him" is to try to make what she is doing is right. The "it isn't an A because we weren't physical until I moved out" is all her trying to convince herself that what she is doing isn't wrong.

Deep down she knows better. And so does everyone else. The fog is thick over her eyes, but you are right to focus on trying to save yourself. Get yourself right. She'll either come to or she won't. But you WILL be fine. Trust God.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 02:53 PM
Thank you Steve. I appreciate the encouragement. I know that I logically know what I need to do, and I think that if we didn't have S7, I would have already just filed for the 'at-fault' divorce and resolved to push through the grieving process.

I just feel like I let her and S7 down by not realizing that I needed help for my depression sooner. It is hard to forgive myself for the pain I caused my family because I wasn't able recognize and deal with mine. Your post about the WAW building up to this over 2+ years definitely applies in our situation.

I am getting better constantly, and I've made huge changes in myself and my life already, but I am having so much trouble with seeing myself as ME and not seeing myself as her H, as part of US. One of the MANY books I've bought or read since BD is Codependent No More, and I need to start reading it. I definitely lost myself in our M, but I don't know if that was part of the contribution to my depression or if it was a symptom of my depression. I'm hoping IC will help me sort that out.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 07:23 PM
My wife is a beautiful woman. In fact in the last year and a half I helped her get started working out and she has gotten in great shape. I got a subscription for one of those beauty box things for Xmas 2016 and she started to get more in to makeup and her hair (I know some of this SHOULD have been a red flag at some point). She looks absolutely amazing. The problem with all of that, is that through our entire R, while I was always physically attracted to her, my attraction, and feelings of love for her were never about her looks. My attraction, connection and love for her was always about WHO she was. She has worked very hard to look great on the exterior, but she has lost what made her so amazing. I can look at her now and I see a beautiful woman, but I don't feel an attraction to her. I don't see the woman I love anymore.

While I believe I HAVE let her go, I'm starting to realize that I've let go of who she is NOW, but I'm struggling to let go of who she was. I'm in love with and struggling to let go of a ghost. I think this is one of the biggest reasons I am having trouble deciding whether I even want her to have a change of heart and come back. I've seen some posts here that indicate that once the WAW/WW change, they aren't ever the same person again. If that is true, I'm not sure I would even want to R.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/19/18 10:53 PM
I still had a 90 day refill available on the anti-depressants so I filled that today, hoping that it will help calm down the extreme lows I find myself in whenever my mind wanders to my W. I got the report today confirming the A, so if I wanted to file, I can do that. But, I just have a mental block against it. I just want to make sure I get joint custody of my son, and our state is heavily pro-mom, so if I do file, and she decides to fight instead of agreeing, I could end up only seeing my son every other weekend and a couple hours during the week when it's not my weekend, and that would absolutely kill me.

At the same time, she's moved on and it feels unfair that I should have to sit by and wait until nearly next summer to be able to even THINK about moving on. My faith and my personal convictions won't let me be with anyone else while I'm still married, even if SHE is. Why should I have to live through another anniversary, now that I know our last one was already a lie?
Posted By: arsh18 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/20/18 03:26 AM
Sorry about your sitch DB, it is classic WW behavior. Read up on so many other sitches here you will realize itís all about her at this time. Focus on your job, your son and yourself. Donít let depression get you. Your S needs you. How is she with your son? Is she still a good mother? - arshi
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/20/18 12:37 PM
Thanks Arshi. No, she's NOT being a great mother right now. She spends virtually no time with our son since BD. Spends all her time with OM and will show back up at her mother's at or after his bedtime, at least on the nights she doesn't just stay at OM's apartment. With her parents apparently supporting her A and decision to tear our family apart I feel like I have to be the strong/sane parent. I'm trying my best, but I feel like I'm struggling just to get by right now.
Posted By: SteveLW Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/20/18 12:48 PM
Don't be too hard on her parents. Remember, she is feeding them the story that you are Satan right now. Just stay strong and steady and maybe one day their eyes will open to the truth.
Posted By: Vanilla Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/20/18 12:53 PM
DB

I love your attitude on your child, children come first. Whilst grandma and grandad may be a safer pair of hands than WW right now they are not a parent.

And please don't assume that because WW is their daughter that they are appeasing and supporting. They may be tolerating so they can stay a safe pair of hands.

Don't mind read, you may P in the soup.

V
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/20/18 12:59 PM
I have tried my hardest to not blame them for her behavior, but it's hard. Ever since I moved here they have been my family and support. It's hard to not feel abandoned by them as well.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/20/18 02:58 PM
Met with a good friend early this morning. He has been very supportive through all of this. After that meeting I sent her a text letting her know that on the weeknights I have been spending with our son that I would be keeping him overnight going forward. I feel like every time I take him back to her parents and she doesn't come home to him that I am letting him down. It feels like she is using custody of our son as a way to maintain some control over me, but I feel no obligation to her as long as she involved in the A with OM and behaving the way she is. I just want to do what's best for my son.

It makes me so sad sometimes when he smiles at me and I can see her in his face so clearly. He is such a sweet and sensitive kid. I just don't understand how she can do this to him.
Posted By: arsh18 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/20/18 03:36 PM
I do the same with my in laws, vilify them and think they should have supported me and not him. Think they are being inhumane, but I am really making them scape goats of my anger. Remember children always come first, they are also doing exactly that for their own child. Focus on your son, he has no part to play in this but is suffering the consequences. Donít beat yourself on how she can be so callous, I do the same itís of no use. Shower more love on your son whenever you feel WW is not doing it.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/20/18 04:00 PM
Thank you Arshi. I know my situation isn't unique. In fact, it feels like she's reading from the same script as all of the other WW's I have read about on this site. Somehow though, that doesn't relieve the pain she has caused. I'm doing my best to just focus on the future for myself and my S. I trust that God will get us through this, I just hate that I will have to miss out on such a big chunk of his life and memories. I feel like depression already robbed me of so much time with him in the last couple years and that guilt is making me irrationally want to fight for a MR that is already over.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/20/18 07:46 PM
Talked to my lawyer today. She is going to send over our proposed changes to their separation agreement proposal. I am way more calm and level today than I have been since I talked to her earlier this week. I just want to get this done and secure my time with my son.

I definitely was hurt to find out that she left me for someone more than 20 years older, but I'm not sure why that bothered me as much as it did.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 12:20 AM
I'm skeptical of how calm I've been today. I know it isn't the anti-depressants, because SSRIs just don't work in one dose. I even saw her for a couple minutes today picking up my son and it didn't effect me the way it usually does. I was just too excited to pick him up for the weekend. This is the first day in 12+ weeks that I've actually felt like I'm going to be OK. Didn't break the streak by having a day with no tears, but haven't hit the kind of low I've been hitting. I really hope I can keep this up and keep getting better.
Posted By: hongaku Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 12:28 AM
It's a roller coaster sometimes, man. Up, down and around again. Sometimes you just have to let the tears come when they need to, but always try not to in front of your son, for his sake.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 12:49 AM
I never let him see me get upset. If I can't hold it together I go into another room and get it together. It's gotten a lot easier as time has passed.

I made a promise to myself when I was a kid that MY kids wouldn't have to grow up like this. I may fail to save my marriage, but I will do everything I can to make sure he has the best childhood possible. It hurts that my marriage is falling apart the same way my parents' marriage did, but I believe she won't abandon our son the way my father did after HIS affair.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 02:45 PM
Woke up this morning feeling sad, but not horribly. It's just that when my S is here with me overnight and we get up in the morning on the weekend I feel her absence so much heavier than I do during the week when I'm all alone. I know that with my depression SHE felt alone for much of the last couple years, even though I was here. I wish I had been able to see through the fog that was clouding my mind and realized then that I needed help. I don't blame myself for her choosing to have the A and tear our family apart, but I don't think I'm just an innocent victim. I absolutely could have done better, and I know that I WILL do better. I trust that if my W and I aren't able to R and start a new, better, happier MR, that God has bigger and better plans for me. I just have to pray for the strength to keep fighting through the pain.

I got an email from DivorceCare today that explains why this hurts so badly in a way that I could relate to"

Quote
"Unfortunately, people make decisions that lead to the breaking of marriage bonds. To better understand the extreme pain of separation and divorce, think about what happens when a marriage bond comes apart. The married couple does not revert to being two individuals again. Instead, they become two parts of the same one-flesh marriage, torn away, with huge, gaping emotional wounds."

ďPeople will say, ĎWell, my husband and I separated.í Thatís not true. You tore, and thatís where the hurt is. You actually tear, and parts of you go with the other person. Thatís why breaking a relationship is so difficult because you lose a part of yourself forever.Ē
Posted By: Vanilla Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 03:22 PM
I personally didn't find divorce care very helpful at all.

It made me quite despairing, full of doom. It is images like those that made me unhappy and downright depressed.

It's almost as if some of it is written to put the D decision as a crime.

I know others took comfort it in it.

So if you find it unhelpful or depressing, stop for a while or for good.

V
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 03:40 PM
I haven't actually started DivorceCare yet. It doesn't start for about a month and a half. I've just been getting their daily emails. Saying that, my faith, my personal conviction and my experience growing up with divorced parents make me VERY anti-D. I want nothing more than for my son to be able to grow up in a happy home with his mom and dad in a happy marriage.

I know that I made a lot of mistakes in my marriage that led to my wife not feeling love for me, but even in my deepest depression I have always loved her. I am going to continue to focus on my son, take care of myself and continue to get the help I need to beat my depression. Hopefully, someday, I will have the chance to decide whether I can rebuild a life with her again. I just have to completely let go of her and accept that it is already over.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 04:29 PM
All that peace and calm from yesterday is gone today. I'm having to sit in a different room from my son right now to not let him see me get emotional. I knew that feeling from yesterday wouldn't last, but I didn't expect it to flip this far the other way. What am I even trying to hold on to? She hasn't loved me for at least two years, and she's having an affair. Why am I letting this tear me apart like this?
Posted By: DavidUK Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 04:42 PM
DB345, it is because you are a good person and you and your son can be proud of that.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 05:06 PM
I like to believe that I'm a good person, but all the things she has said to me, and the self-reflection I've done have shaken that belief. I've lost the love of my life, and I'm looking at having to start over at nearly 40. I'm going to miss at LEAST half of the rest of my son's childhood. I'm going to miss holidays with him. I will be nearly 39 by the time we will be able to file for divorce (assuming we come to a separation agreement and I don't end up filing for adultery sooner), and I won't date as long as I am still married.

I need to stop feeling sorry for myself.
Posted By: LoneWlf Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 05:14 PM
I need to stop feeling sorry for myself

DB thanks for your input on my thread. And you are exactly right when you say you need to STOP feeling sorry for yourself. First of all this makes you look weak and unattractive to W. You need to show calmness and confidence.
And now you have a choice- To wallow in self pity or to dust yourself off, get up, chest out , chin up and move forward. You know what to do. From your response on my thread I think you can appreciate the saying that we taught my son when he was young. It says- Just do your best- And let God do the rest !!! Stay Well and Blessings!
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 05:20 PM
Thank you LW. My hope and trust right is ONLY in the Lord. He is the only one that will be able to make my life whole again, with or without my wife.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 07:35 PM
Just having a hard day. Feeling way too down. Fortunately a friend just asked if I wanted to bring my son over to swim with his son. S7 will have fun and that always makes me happy. I'm just missing my W so bad today. It just hurts so much to know she is with someone else.
Posted By: Ste7e Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 10:14 PM
DB I feel for you brother. This is so hard for me and I dont have a child so this must be even harder for you. But the flip of that is also very much in your favor. First off you have a child to bring you joy and trust that because you and WW have this bond there is a chance of Rec down the road.
For now though you need to feel what you are going to feel to be able to move to where you need to get to.
I like you have a lot of regret about the lost time with W while in the depressive fog. But we need to not get stuck in the past we are here now and we need to make this time count! There is always hope in the future but if we dont do the work on ourselves now to be the men we need to be when the time comes all this suffering will be for nothing. Make this suffering count make this the point to change your life and yourself forever!
Root out the cause of the depression in you and slay that demon! Pray to your higher power to give you the strength to do this now. If you can do this you then have a fighting chance. Trust me you can be better than whatever BS your WW sees in other man. And you have a couple major advantages over this other guy so if you can tighten up your game logically you will win. So wipe that self doubt out and turn the pain into a spark of fire to keep fighting. What I have been able to figure out so far for myself is that without fail it takes me at most 24 hours to bounce back from whatever major low I am feeling. And I gain some good time on the flipside and that time grows longer and longer before I feel low again. So trust that even when it feels darkest it will pass.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/21/18 11:37 PM
Thank you for that Ste7e. I have zero doubt that her relationship with OM will fall apart. I'm just not interested in being plan B. I think that's one of the hardest things for me to process right now. I never wanted to lose her, never for one second believed she was capable of doing this, always wanted to spend the rest of my life with her. But, now that she's done this...I feel like I'm trying to convince myself that I actually want her back. I don't feel like I know who she is anymore.

We took a trip a couple weeks before BD, and I remember sitting across from her at dinner one night and feeling like I didn't recognize her. I mean, it was her, but it was like it was someone else in her body. I long to be with the woman I fell in love with, but I'm not sure I want to be with the woman she has become...
Posted By: mtb1981 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/22/18 12:22 AM
Originally Posted by DB346
Thank you for that Ste7e. I have zero doubt that her relationship with OM will fall apart. I'm just not interested in being plan B. I think that's one of the hardest things for me to process right now. I never wanted to lose her, never for one second believed she was capable of doing this, always wanted to spend the rest of my life with her. But, now that she's done this...I feel like I'm trying to convince myself that I actually want her back. I don't feel like I know who she is anymore.

I feel you on this thought. I have struggled with it myself. At the beginning, I think I would have done anything to get her back. At this point, after all the crap she's pulled, I don't want to be with someone like that. You're exactly right when you say you don't know who she is anymore. My W has become a complete stranger and someone I would not want a relationship with. The problem is we have history together, and that's hard to just forget...
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/22/18 12:33 AM
Originally Posted by mtb1981

I feel you on this thought. I have struggled with it myself. At the beginning, I think I would have done anything to get her back. At this point, after all the crap she's pulled, I don't want to be with someone like that. You're exactly right when you say you don't know who she is anymore. My W has become a complete stranger and someone I would not want a relationship with. The problem is we have history together, and that's hard to just forget...


It's not just the history, but we had a FUTURE. At least, I thought we did. I know the last couple years were hard on her. It was hard to be ME, I can't imagine the way it had to have worn on her. But, now that I finally understand that I was fighting depression and I'm getting myself back, I see how great that future would be.

I realize now that SHE knew I was depressed, even if I didn't...But, she gave up on me.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/22/18 01:33 PM
S7 came in and woke me up this morning. That is so much better than the alarm clock. I'm so happy he is here, but I still feel alone. I'm not even sure that I actually want to be with my W anymore, but I can't help but feel horrible about the fact that while I'm struggling to keep it together in front of my son she's off with someone else. After all our years together, I just don't mean anything to her. Why do I let it bother me so much? My only concern is making sure that I get at least 50/50 custody.

If it wasn't for our son, I probably would have already filed for the at-fault divorce. She has lied to me at every step since BD. She lied about the text messages, she lied about there being an OM, she lied about who he was and how she met him. She has constantly lied to our S about where she has been or where she's going and why she didn't come home to him. She even lied to me about who recommended her lawyer to her (I know because she's given me at least two different stories).

I don't believe anything she says, because I CAN'T believe anything she says. And the only actions I have to work with are her pursuing the A with OM above everything else in her life, including S7, and her pushing for the separation agreement (seemingly to try to keep from facing an at-fault filing for adultery). So, I am moving forward with the separation agreement as long as she agrees to joint custody. If she decides she wants to fight, I will move forward with filing.

I'm letting her go...she's already gone. I know that I will come out of all of this better, stronger and happier, regardless of what she does. I just have to do the work, trust God and fight through the pain to get there. Now I need to go get ready to take S7 to church.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/22/18 05:01 PM
This just gets worse and worse. Son and I drove past W's parents' house on the way home from church and they were apparently having lunch with the whole family. W's brother and sister's families were there, as well as both W and OM's cars...so obviously her family is FULLY aware and supporting her A. I just don't think there is any coming back from this. I just have to move on with my life.

It's just hard to hold back the hurt of being able to be replaced so quickly. She threw me and more than 14 years away like trash. I feel like I should just let her have what she wants and go file for divorce. If she pushes back on the custody thing and won't agree, I am DEFINITELY going to at this point. She has no respect for me, our son or herself. I'm just done.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/22/18 05:47 PM
We aren't going to be able to keep this from our son anymore. She has him at the house with all of his cousins, so he is going to find out about OM. Why would she do that?
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/22/18 06:33 PM
Any advice from anyone regarding how to handle the questions he is inevitably going to ask about this? I don't want to lie to him, but I want to be sure that my explanation to him is age-appropriate. I can't believe how selfish she is being.
Posted By: mtb1981 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/22/18 07:51 PM
I don't know, man... That's a tough one. I wouldn't lie to him, but I would also be careful to word things in a way that you don't sound like you're making W out to be some sort of monster. Off the top of my head, I would say something like "Mommy doesn't want to be married to me anymore, I don't know why, but there is nothing I can do about that. Just know that I love you very much and will always be here for you no matter what"...

As far as the other BS of her being at her parents' house with OM, you just gotta let that roll off your back. No good in getting bent out of shape about it and letting it consume you. Like you said, she's already gone. Let her go and don't let her actions affect you. Who knows, someday she may snap out of this and will want to have a new MR with you. Then again, maybe not. Right now, it's important to minimize the damage and effect it can have on you. Let her do all the dumb $hit she wants to. You just get busy to being awesome...
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/22/18 07:53 PM
I'm only mad about him being there because my son spends a lot of time with his cousins and I know one of them will say something about him being there...I didn't want to have to address that with him, but I feel like we won't have a choice now.
Posted By: mtb1981 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/22/18 08:02 PM
I get that you're mad about it, but what can you do about it?... Nothing. You can't control what she does, so you have to accept it and train yourself to not be bothered by it. It's not an easy task, but with time you can get there. I don't know what else to tell you. You asked for advice on how to deal with the situation and talk to your S about it, but you're only focused on and still way too hung up on stuff you have no control over. What can can do is decide how to react to it and decide what you're going to tell S if he asks. Stop wasting your time being mad about it...
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/22/18 08:15 PM
I'm only upset that I will have to explain her A to my son who is obviously going to be confused. I can't control what she does with her life, but I'm just upset that she isn't making our son her priority over the A. No matter what I think of her and her bad choices, I don't want my son to think anything bad about her. I'm just upset that she isn't doing better for our son.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/22/18 09:23 PM
I know she is only 37, but I have had a strong feeling like this is a MLC. That was just based on comments she has made about her age and the fact that she said things like she's never been on her own...she really doesn't have any friends. The problem is, she had no intention of being on her own...OM had already been in the picture for months at the time she left. But, the going from being a GREAT mother to all but abandoning him is troubling. I guess I know what I have to do either way. I can't save her from herself...
Posted By: arsh18 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/23/18 03:05 AM
I keep doing this why analysis too. And as many people know of the sitch there will be so many whys from all of them. Call it irresponsibility, immaturity, depression, infidelity the truth is WAS are selfish individuals who for now rank as the bottom feeder of the human character spectrum. Abandoning children is unpardonable in my opinion. Be strong for your son, you know he deserves the best so make sure you give it to him. Reading thru those MLC threads helped me see how hopeless some sitches were, some of them need to be kicked out to the curb by the LBS but for every person their own sitch is hard. Hope you find strength- Arshi
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/23/18 01:33 PM
Thanks Arshi. I feel like yesterday just made it very clear to me that I have to just save myself. My marriage is over whether I want it to be or not. Maybe she comes around some day, maybe she doesn't, but there is nothing I can do now to change her mind, or to undo the damage she's done. So, I will go back to as close to NC as possible and just focus on improving myself, beating depression, enjoying my time with my son and meeting new people that don't know her and don't know us as a couple.

If she has a change of heart some day and comes back around, I will have to decide then if I am still willing to start over. I don't know if I will ever be able to make myself completely give up hope, but I have ZERO expectation that we will ever be together again. It hurts, and it isn't the life I wanted, but I have to accept reality and continue living and MAKE a better life for myself and my son.
Posted By: neffer Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/23/18 03:08 PM
Hi DB. It is hard but it is what it is. As you are saying, you must control your own life. You canīt control hers. Keep that in mind, get the power from it: you controlling your life. Your W must do her own journey to whatever she wants, sometimes it is no easy to face reality. I am a survivor from the dark side, it is hard there too.

So keep it strong and be the best father for your son. Nobody is going to change that bond. Remember that.

Be strong man, take care of you and your son.
Posted By: SteveLW Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/23/18 03:18 PM
MLC have no age limits. Anyone can have one at anytime.

One thing I heard is NEVER mention a MLC to someone you suspect of going through one.They will take a great offense to this and it will be counter-productive. For the person in the midst of a MLC they would categorize it as anything BUT a crisis! For them it is awakening. They feel great about the changes they are instituting and they think they are moving forward better than ever. So for the LBS so say "I know you are having a MLC" or "You are just having a MLC" or any other statement worded similarly, it will likely just infuriate them. So do not mention it no matter how much you might want to.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/23/18 03:21 PM
Thanks Neffer. I won't give up hope that we could be together again, but the only thing left for me to do is let her go. Sunday's sermon, as is so often the case really hit me. The pastor basically ended it by saying 'let it go'. Just trust God. I feel like I have been getting in my own way with that, but I am done. I am putting her and our marriage in His hands and continuing on with my life without her. I miss her, but I miss ME more. I'm really glad my IC is back from vacation and I have an appointment this week and next.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/24/18 01:29 PM
Thanks Steve. I don't intend to mention it to her. In fact, I don't think we will really be having any contact that doesn't involve our son for a good while. The last couple days I really felt like I was just done. That I didn't want to fight for the marriage anymore and that I was ready to just move on with my life. But, I knew better than to trust that feeling. Today I just feel very sad. Not about any particular thing, just overall HEAVY sadness. I realize that i just really don't know what I'm doing.

I don't feel any desire to see or talk to her. I didn't respond to the text message she sent me this morning and am not even a little bit tempted. I'm actually glad to have the time and space away from her, but I still struggle to actually feel genuinely happy yet. I still just feel so lost and confused. Thank God I have an IC appt tomorrow.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/24/18 07:17 PM
Fortunately, that extreme low passed fairly quickly, though I haven't bounced all the way back to where I was the last couple days. I think I am struggling with myself trying to decide whether I have it in me to ride this out, as I feel fairly certain that it's some sort of MLC, or if I just need to shut the door and work toward moving on.

Either way, I've let her go. Her A and her gaslighting/rewriting history/blatant disregard for me has made that fairly easy now that I have confirmed the infidelity. It is especially after seeing that she's introduced him to her entire family. At this point, D seems inevitable. I know lot can happen in 9 months, but I'm not sure I believe that she will ever admit to wanting to R, even if she did, and I doubt that she would do the work to rebuild our relationship. I've been thinking long and hard, and I can't honestly think of a time she ever apologized to me...for anything. How can I hold out hope for her to be able to make up for her A, the hurtful things she has said and done to me since BD and for blowing up our family?

I think I will feel better if/when we get the separation agreement worked out. At that point there's nothing to do but wait and ride out the rest of the 12 months until one of us can file for divorce. I suspect she's counting the days, so I won't exactly be caught off-guard by her filing. If anything I would be confused if she DOESN'T.

Hi DB346,


What type of support do you need? What are your current short term and long term goals?
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/26/18 08:22 PM
Thanks for taking an interest R2C. I don't really know what type of support I need right now. At this point I honestly feel pretty detached from my WW. The more I've read about MLC, the more it seems pretty clear to me that this is what my W is going through. I'm just confused right now, because I am having a hard time deciding whether I feel I can actually stand for my marriage through this, or if I need to accept this as the end and begin to move on. I just don't know at this point if I can get past everything she's done, and continues to do, even if she ever does come around.

I've been doing as much as I can to GAL. Spending awesome, quality time with my son, spending more time with friends, reading and working out. I volunteered to serve at church at least one Sunday a month. Trying to meet some NEW people that don't know my W, so that I can spend time with them without talking about her. I'm in IC and have started taking ADs and I'm spending almost no time in the type of misery I was for most of the last 3 months, though I do still have moments where I feel sad.

My primary short term goal right now is to get a separation agreement finished, and secure 50/50 with my son. Once that is done, I will have a much clearer picture of what my time and financial situation is going to look like going forward and I will be able to think about things more than a few days/weeks ahead.

I have goals I want to reach in terms of my weight, strength (lifting) and health. Things that I fell away from when I was fighting a losing battle with depression. I have some projects at the house I want to do, but have been reluctant to because of the uncertainty of my financial situation.

There are a couple 'trips' I want to take my son on. A couple are short-term goals, one is a longer term goal.

In general, I feel like I'm in a MUCH better place this week than I have been since BD, but I don't fully trust it. For instance yesterday was the first day since BD (3 months) that I didn't shed a single tear. I virtually haven't today either, other than getting sad reading some of the posts on this board that remind me of what I'm going through. All I'm trying to do right now is live MY life, and keep getting better every single day. Keep being the best day I can be every single day. And NOT worry about what she's doing because there is nothing I can do about it.

It isn't hard to not worry about what she's doing anymore. Maybe because now I know what she's doing and who she's doing it with, or maybe it's because I'm finally letting go of the rope, but I don't actually find myself thinking about her constantly. I don't find myself missing her most of the times I think about her. I just find myself wanting to stay away from her, not talk to her and just let my lawyer work on getting the separation agreement done and waiting out the rest of the year required by our state to see what happens in that time. She'll either come around, or she will file for D. I don't expect her to leave it hanging in limbo any longer than she has to.
DB346,

That is one of the best responses I have read on these message boards.

Your head is in the correct place. Keep DB'ing. Keep setting goals. Keep working on you. Thing will become clear as you move through this process.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/26/18 08:50 PM
I really hope so R2C. I definitely still love my wife, but when I look at her or talk to her I don't recognize her at all. It's like she's a complete stranger. When this all started, and even after I KNEW about the A I was sure that I wanted her back but after talking to her last week, I really don't know anymore. Right now, I don't even want to think about her. What she's doing has no impact on what I need to do.

One thing that I am having a really hard time getting past is her parents inviting the OM in to their home. I'm not even sure why it bothers me as much as it does. I don't really care about it being disrespectful to me, but it definitely makes me view these people that I loved and considered my family in a VERY different way.
Originally Posted by DB346
I definitely still love my wife
You do not need to be "In love" to keep loving her. Keep loving her.
Originally Posted by DB346
It's like she's a complete stranger.
Normal.
Originally Posted by DB346
What she's doing has no impact on what I need to do.
Correct. Always "Do the right thing".

Originally Posted by DB346
One thing that I am having a really hard time getting past is her parents inviting the OM in to their home. I'm not even sure why it bothers me as much as it does. I don't really care about it being disrespectful to me, but it definitely makes me view these people that I loved and considered my family in a VERY different way.
Out of your control. You have no idea what story your X has told them.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/26/18 10:25 PM
You're right R2C, I don't know what she's told them.
Posted By: neffer Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/27/18 03:00 PM
It is ok being bothered with that staff but, as R2C says, you canít control that.

Just keep moving forward, one step after the other.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/27/18 03:27 PM
Thanks Neffer. I'm not obsessing over it or anything. Honestly, I just feel hurt by it.

I feel like I've completely reached acceptance, and I feel good about the level of detachment I've gotten to. I know I don't need her and at this point I don't know if I even want her. Fortunately, I don't have a need to make that decision right now. I'm on my own path and living my own life. If she asks to be a part of my life again some day things might change, but right now she is not a consideration in my plans or decision making in any way. I'm only worried about what is best for me and for my son.

Despite the amount of pain she caused me, I will always love her. She's the mother of my child and the woman I planned to spend the rest of my life with. I'm definitely not in love with her, but I will continue to love her from far, FAR away and try to remain open-minded regarding R while preparing myself for D and life without her. It's in God's hands now.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/27/18 11:08 PM
Had a pretty good today, but now that work is over and I'm home I'm just feeling a little empty. I don't have my son this weekend and I miss him. Not missing WW which feels like progress, but I'm really hating feeling like a part-time dad.
Posted By: bhappy2 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/27/18 11:28 PM
Plenty to do:

Sign up for chess on chess dot com

get a really good book

Go get your favorite food and netflix tonight away

Go sit outside and breath...

No emptiness, go get your happiness... right now. No one is holding you back except you.

Peace...
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/28/18 06:23 PM
Feeling OK today. Still miss my son, but I don't think that is ever going to change. Had to go shopping today because all of my clothes are way too big now. Feels good to be buying smaller clothes, but not very excited to spend the money right now.

Still not missing WW, but I am feeling lonely.
Posted By: arsh18 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/29/18 01:41 AM
DB, go watch a movie. Join some activity or class that is completely out of your comfort zone but you have been intrigued by it.
Get enrolled in courses on coursera or edulix, something so different from your specialty that you have tons to learn with it.
Plan your days alone to the minute so you hardly have any time to brood or miss your S.

Really like how you say loving her from far, far away. Distance and time are the key ingredients for all our sitches.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 07/29/18 01:46 PM
Thanks for that Arshi. Fortunately, I'm not really brooding or focusing on missing him, but it's hard not to miss him. I don't miss WW or honestly even think about her very often anymore. The thoughts I do have mostly pertain to logistics going forward. I am going to be OK and I might even already be very close to that now. I still love her, but I deserve someone that loves me too. She's made her choices and she will have to live with them. I have accepted that this is the life I now have to live and I am going to make the best of it.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/03/18 12:43 PM
Been a hard couple of days for me. Not because I miss WW, but because she is being very difficult about custody of our son. I want 50/50, but she only wants to agree to give me every other weekend and a couple evening visits during the week. She is so angry and hateful toward me, yet she tries to project those feelings to me. Accused me of wanting equal time with my son only because of my anger and resentment toward her and that my hatred of her is preventing me from doing what's best for our son. I don't have anger or resentment toward her, and I definitely don't hate her. She hurt me, but I know that I can't control her or make her be the person I thought she was. I just want to move on with my life but she's using our son to try to maintain control over me. This is just causing me so much stress. Unfortunately, it looks like I am likely going to end up needing to file for an at-fault divorce because I don't think we are going to come to a separation agreement and I'm not willing to let this continue this way indefinitely. I have no protection right now and that is not a good feeling.
Posted By: SteveLW Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/03/18 12:59 PM
Do you have a L?
Posted By: neffer Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/03/18 01:09 PM
Originally Posted by DB346
I have no protection right now and that is not a good feeling.


Why is that?
Posted By: LH19 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/03/18 01:40 PM
D,

Most courts understand the importance of male role model and award 50/50. Do not discuss it with her anymore. Do not accept less then 50/50!
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/03/18 02:27 PM
LH,

I do have a lawyer, but our state does not default to 50/50. There is a very real possibility that I only end up with every other weekend and a couple hours one or two nights during the week that I don't have him on the weekend. But, I won't ACCEPT less than 50/50. If I end up with less than that, it will be forced on me.

Neffer,

I have no protection because we have no separation agreement, and this state isn't very pro-father. Things have been OK here in the summer, but school will start soon. And it's during the school year that she is adamant about not splitting custody, because she 'doesn't want to yank him back and forth'...Which is why our proposal was for alternating weeks, so that he had stability through the entire week, then had the weekend to settle back in at the other house before starting another week of school. It is a COMPLETELY reasonable solution, but she wants total control.
Posted By: neffer Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/03/18 03:03 PM
Hang in there DB3!

Get L advice again. Do what is the best for your S. If you think youīve got it, stick to the plan.

Stay calm. I know it is hard but it is what it is now. Remember itīs a marathon...
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/05/18 03:43 PM
So, I talked to my L again. Her advice is to file for adultery. I am having a very hard time with that because I never wanted this divorce, but doing this is my best hope for getting equal time with my son. It's also hard because I realize that this will likely kill any remote hope for R with her, but I have to do what's best for my son. I know my MR has been over even longer than she's been gone, but it really looks like my best hope for MR 2.0 is going to be with someone else...
Posted By: neffer Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/05/18 07:08 PM
The future is uncertain DB3. But you must protect yourself and your son. Stay strong man. Your WW should face reality or not. You must do it.

Sending you a big hug.
(((DB3)))
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/05/18 09:37 PM
Thanks Neffer. All I ever wanted was to spend the rest of my life with her. I guess there was a part of me that hoped we would be able to agree on the separation agreement because there might be a chance that we might reconcile before we could file for D. But, the truth is that she is in a relationship with someone else and she is putting that relationship ahead of our son. I've had to comfort him multiple times when he's been in tears because he misses his mommy, and even when he's supposed to be with her she isn't there. It breaks my heart to see him hurting. I have to do what's best for him.
Posted By: ovrrnbw Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/05/18 10:33 PM
You don't have to file, it's just a suggestion. You need to choose for yourself.

Lawyers make more money when you do this, and they unfortunately have an interest that is different than yours.

Be calm, be yourself, and make your own decision.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/05/18 11:50 PM
Obviously I don't have to file, but school will start again soon and she is using the school year as an excuse to try to limit my time with him. I love my wife, but I can't make her love me...my only priority is my son.
Posted By: fade Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/06/18 05:13 PM
I often see people in your position give things up in a separation, ranging from kids, money, to the house, to try to somehow placate their wayward spouse in the hopes that this will avoid making them mad or make them want to come back. This never, ever works and is in fact the worst thing you can do for any outcome. If you get divorced, then you have given up everything to your WW for nothing and you will forever regret ever doing so. But it also makes reconciliation less likely - I have never, ever seen a WW want to come back after "winning" the divorce. They only ever seem to want to come back when they have no money, are losing the kids, cant find a good husband prospect and suddenly realize you are the best available option. And by that point, very few BH's I have worked with seemed to want them back!

The most 'successful' mindset I have seen for someone in your position is to give up any notion that you can control whether you divorce or reconcile. Being married is a consensus decision and you cant control their decisions. But you can control yourself and that is really what will determine how happy you will be either way. And luckily the actions you need to take are exactly the same - just take care of yourself and put yourself in the position of maximum strength, for yourself and for your kid.

And since you have an attorney, let them be the 'bad guy' in negotiations while you stay above the fray. Im not sure what your attorney is suggesting. I dont have any guidance on whether or not you should file under adultery, because every situation is too different. But here are some things you can do either way to help you gain your strength for any eventuality:

1. Keep detailed, daily documentation of time and activities with your kid. Do everything you can to wiggle yourself into more time with them while WW is in la la land with OM. Make sure to call or facetime every single day. Document if your WW blocks your communication. You should have an entry every single day, starting today.
2. Get a more consultations with the top attorneys in your area in order to get a wider range of advice on how filing under adultery could work, but also doing so prevents your WW from hiring them. If you are up front that you have an attorney but want other opinions they will give you more realistic advice rather than the sales job.
3. Look into emergency orders to stipulate no contact with dating partners and get right of first refusal.
4. Gather admissible evidence of adultery. You can hire a service to do electronic forensics to find proof on your jointly owned electronics and accounts. Or a PI to document what she is doing now. Look for even circumstantial evidence of alcohol, drugs (including prescriptions), DUI, leaving your kid alone or leaving your kids with OM. Hire a PI to run some background checks on OM. They can find things you can't. Have all of this in your back pocket for when the time is right.
5. Stick to your plan. Do the 180. No conversations without documentation. Accept that nothing you say can influence her in any way, and assume every single thing you say, text or email to her will be used against you and read out loud in court. Dont negotiate on anything you arent willing to lose. You can negotiate over the candle sticks. But custody and any other untouchables are stipulated in the filing and she can go talk to your lawyer about those things.
6. Take care of yourself, force yourself to get out and meet people, start an outdoor or physical hobby, eat super healthy and hit the weights hard. Slowly but surely you will feel (and look) much, much better, and situations always have a way of improving when your mental outlook improves.
Posted By: arsh18 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/07/18 01:07 AM
I read up Fade's advice a few times DB, sounds very solid, make sure you follow every step. I am going to look up older posts by Fade at some point, I am certain to learn things with his posts.
The WAS will never tell you truly what they want, it is just a terror tactic, trying to hurt you with words to instill fear in you to get something they want. You wouldnt know how serious she is with custody until you actually sit down with her to negotiate mediation or work thru lawyers. If she knows it will hurt you to instill thoughts of losing S then she is going to use it. Remember they are the other half of us who knows us the best, they also know which nerve to pinch to cause the worst pain. Stay strong, as time passes you will know what she really wants
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/07/18 03:09 AM
Both of us already have lawyers...she retained hers within a week of leaving. I already have all the proof needed to prove adultery. I'm just not willing to give up my son and feel like she has forced me to not really have any other option but to file. She hasn't had OM around our son at all, but she leaves him with her parents most of the time on 'her days' to spend her time with OM. I've definitely asserted myself to spend more time with my son since confirming the affair. My ONLY priority right now is to do what's best for my son and fight for as much custody as I can get.

Saying all of that, I have definitely reached the point that I have accepted the end of my marriage. I don't think there is any scenario that doesn't end in D. Even if she did a complete 180 and wanted to R right now, I don't think I would be willing to take her back. I would still want, at the very least, the separation agreement with 50/50 custody and I wouldn't be willing to have her move back to the house. I'm not even sure I would want to date her, let alone resume our MR right now. I've spent every minute of free time, and then some since she left working on myself, while she has done nothing but lie, cheat and manipulate. I would need to see her make more of an effort than I think she is capable of doing to convince me. But, none of that matters because she is still actively involved with OM and we are almost completely NC.

I tried to have a conversation with her about custody before my last conversation with the lawyer, but she jumped in to gaslighting and blame-shifting, which came as no surprise. So, I'm done trying to discuss it with her. My lawyer is VERY pro-dad, and is also very familiar with WW's lawyer, so I trust her advice on this, even if it wasn't what I really wanted to do. I know that WW is betting that I won't pull the trigger because she still doesn't believe that I have let her go. I honestly believe that she thinks I'm still hoping that she will come back and that I won't push, but this was HER decision and I am not going to protect her from the fallout.

I'm definitely still hurting over the situation, but I have definitely 'dropped the rope'. I feel no attachment to her anymore. I'm comfortable with filing for divorce, I'm just uneasy and nervous about still ending up with minimal time with my son. She has no respect for me, and no concern for the pain she is causing me or our son, so I am not worried about her reaction to me filing for adultery.
Posted By: neffer Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/07/18 09:33 AM
Stay strong DB3. Itīs hard but you must get your respect back.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/07/18 04:41 PM
Neffer,

I have gotten back my SELF-respect. She had made me doubt myself so much, for so long that I started to believe it. But, I have put the work in on myself since BD and I realize that I am a very good dad, and a good person/friend. I've lost like 75 lbs in a little over 3 months and physically feel much better. IC and church have been very good for me mentally and spiritually. I'm doing the things I need to do, even when I don't want to, because I am determined to come out of this better than I ever was.

I thought I had married the woman of my dreams. We have a beautiful son, we own a home, both have good jobs. But, it wasn't enough for her. I won't beg her, or anyone else to love me. Trying to play nice isn't going to get me anywhere. The consequences for her choices are hers, and she can deal with them. I just have to do what's best for my son and myself, even if it means filing for a divorce that I never wanted.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/11/18 05:12 PM
Lawyer forwarded me the draft of the Complaint for Divorce, and the Motion for Temporary Hearing regarding custody...it was really painful to read. I never wanted this, but I feel like I don't have a choice. If she would have just done the right thing and agreed to 50/50 custody I would have been happy to sign a separation agreement and let things play out as they will. But, now I feel like she's forced me to do this. I can't help but feel like this is what she wanted all along.

I haven't given the approval to file it yet. I wanted to take the weekend to think and pray about it, but I don't see what alternative I have at this point...
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/13/18 01:44 PM
Emailed lawyer the approval to file...That was very hard to do, but I feel like I don't really have a choice. Just having a very hard day.
Posted By: neffer Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/13/18 03:22 PM
Stay strong DB3. All of this is part of a process that takes time. Use that time to improve yourself. Keep DBing and remember the marathon thing...
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/13/18 04:57 PM
Thanks Neffer. The one thing I did do right immediately following BD was to focus on improving myself AND being the best dad I could be. I failed miserably at detaching until I stopped being in denial about the likelihood of her having an affair, read the books, stopped focusing on her and established some boundaries.

Now, I feel like I'm detached and have accepted that this divorce is going to happen. I still don't actually want it, but I don't control her.

I am a VERY different person than I was when she left me. I look different, I feel different, I act different, I THINK different...I know that I will be OK and that I will make an amazing partner in my future relationship(s), whether she is ever a part of that again or not.
Posted By: 284 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/13/18 06:18 PM
I feel for you brother! I also have WW and I know how confusing things get. Keep reaching out when your mind starts racing. Have you talked with a therapist about the depression? Don't forget about yourself through all of this. Hang in there.
Originally Posted by fade
I often see people in your position give things up in a separation, ranging from kids, money, to the house, to try to somehow placate their wayward spouse in the hopes that this will avoid making them mad or make them want to come back. This never, ever works and is in fact the worst thing you can do for any outcome.....


... and get right of first refusal.



Everything Fade said was spot on.

Do not be a puppy dog and roll over.

I have 50/50 because I fought for it. Best thing I have done. My kids need me in there lives. They need their mother in their lives.

Everything else can be replaced. Your relationship with your kids and guidance you give can not.


I have a bigger house now. I have more sex now. I have a loving woman in my life. I can go on and on, but I know my kids better than my ex wife does. She wanted me to be a weekend dad. I could have agreed. That is not in the best interest of my kids.



"What is best for my kids is best for me"

Do not agree to anything less than 50/50. I had the mindset that i WOULD NOT AGREE TO ANYTHING unless it included 50/50 parenting or ordered by a judge.

"First right of refusal" is the next best thing. Anytime Mother wants to do anything without the children, You get them. Keep records and then appeal the courts with proof that you are parenting more.


Posted By: theoden Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 08/28/18 05:25 PM
DB346,

It looks like you did the right thing.

What's the news?

What's most important, is getting 50/50 custody.

Rebuild you life for YOU and you son. She may tire of the OM, she may not. Doesn't matter.

Fade is 100% right.

Showing strength, FWIW, builds attraction. It seems the best shot of your ex wanting you back it for your to file for Divorce immediately under Adultery, and getting 50/50.

You rolling over and getting your son every other weekend and letting the OM spend MORE time with your son than you do will not send the alpha male vibes to your wife. That's just being cuckolded. That's the OM knocking you off your perch and taking everything you have - wife AND son.

Getting every other weekend because the court tells you that's the way it is really [censored]. That's the law. It [censored] for fathers that way. Then you be the best dad every other weekend if that's your fate. But fight for 50/50

--Theoden.
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 10/01/18 05:45 PM
It's been a while, but there hasn't really been much to write about. I filed for a D that I never wanted, and the temporary hearing is coming up VERY soon. I have pretty much been doing well, but now that the hearing is so close I am finding myself second-guessing whether this is the right decision.

W and I don't talk at all, except for an extremely minimal amount of kid-related logistics. I have long since lost any desire to want to reach out to her. She is the one that created this situation and she is the one that would have to reach out to me to start any dialogue toward R. I won't beg her, or anyone else to love me.

I am very torn between the desire I still have to save my marriage and the desire to have some resolution to this situation, so I can stop living with this hanging over me. I still love my W, but I have taken the time since she left to honestly do the hard work to better myself. In doing so, I've realized so many things that I did wrong in our marriage and discovered how much I neglected what I wanted and needed from our relationship.

I now know much more clearly what I want and NEED from a partner. I also know that the work I've done, and that I will continue to do for the rest of my life will make ME a much better partner, whether with her or eventually with someone else. I no longer mourn what I've lost, because I can see now how unfulfilling our marriage had become, but I do long for what I see our future COULD be. It has occurred to me that it would actually be easier to start over with someone new than it would be to rebuild our MR, but I am not afraid of the hard work.

It has taken me a long time to type this post, and as I have, it's clear that I don't really have a choice but to continue on the path toward D. Fighting for 50/50 custody is the only reason I filed, and that hasn't changed. Our son is my only priority and this is really my only option at this point. I've definitely let her go and I'm not scared of getting divorced.
Posted By: Grace21 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 10/01/18 06:18 PM
Originally Posted by DB346
It has occurred to me that it would actually be easier to start over with someone new than it would be to rebuild our MR, but I am not afraid of the hard work.


This is exactly what I think my H is going through, who is moving out today. Although I believe he IS afraid of the hard work to repair/rebuild our marriage as he doesn't want to face his demons. I fear he will find it easier to feel good with a series of other women than do the work to feel good about himself for himself. But, I remind myself that that is his journey to take. Not mine.
Posted By: ovrrnbw Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 10/01/18 06:27 PM
Sorry to hear about the tough choice you felt like you needed to make. I wish you the best as go through this. Have you had any conversations with her? When did you file? When is the hearing?
Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 10/01/18 07:01 PM
She has basically been unwilling to talk about anything since BD. I filed in August, and our temporary hearing is this week to establish custody while the D is worked out. I don't know when the divorce will ultimately be settled. Our state normally requires a year of separation, but with an at-fault divorce it can be done in as little as 60-90 days.

D isn't what I want, but I don't know what other option I really have. She won't do the right thing regarding custody and she isn't willing to do any work toward repairing our relationship so I have to protect myself and our son. She can't see it right now, but ultimately SHE is the one that is losing out. She chose to pursue a man old enough to be her father, who is willing to help destroy a family. I certainly wasn't a perfect husband by any stretch of the imagination, but I have owned that and dedicated myself to being the best father and to being the best man I can be. If/when I get in to another relationship, I know that I will be an amazing partner and she will have to live with knowing that she could have had that.

I wish I had done a lot of things differently, but SHE made her choices. Now, I just have to make the best life I can for my son going forward.
Posted By: SteveLW Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 10/01/18 07:10 PM
Remember, D doesn't mean the end. it is a step in the process. Rs have occurred after D. Granted it isn't a high percentage but no one can blame you for not trying.
Posted By: EZdozit Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 10/01/18 08:29 PM
DB,

It sounds as if your sitch and mine are nearly identical and we are similar in age with young impressionable S. Only difference is I havenít been able to prove OM or not, but signs point in that direction. Lost 70 lbs in 3 months, was in a depressive state prior to BD, put all the work back into myself I immediately afterwards and since.

My WAW initially tried for an 80/20 split but I asserted myself a month after BD and have been doing a 50/50 since. S6 has made some heart wrenching comments about WAW. Including saying things like sheís being a jerk for taking you away from me, I hope mommy makes better choices to bring us all back together...a lot more. At the end of the day, I never say anything negative about WW in front of S6, but I can tell you he very much knows Iíve done everything to the best of my ability to keep our family together and likely will have some resentment towards his mother for years afterward. When he does ask questions, I can just say mommy made a choice to live apart that I canít explain but that he didnít have anything to do with it and that we would make the best of the situation for me and him.


Posted By: DB346 Re: WW having affair and pushing for divorce - 10/04/18 01:27 PM
New thread - http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2815826&#Post2815826
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