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Posted By: neffer Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 01:22 AM
Thank you all. Thanks for giving me the tools to see through my mist. So thank you Sandi, Vanilla, AnotherStander, for the wisdom shared, patience and dedication. Gordi, Cocconut, Joseph9, Maika, for the honorable journey that you share with us, AndrewP, Gordie, Caliguy, EasTN, Zues, Artista, Parkema, Doodler for the truth behind the jokes, always appreciated. And thanks to all of you who shared your life stories. I am sharing mine now.

I decided I could not start my sitch apologizing. It got to be being grateful to the community in this site. I came across DB more than a year ago looking for answers. I was returning from the twilight zone and my head was a mess. I was looking for myself and I am still searching. I am a perfectionist, so the decision to write my story has to go through my stupid filters. It is a long way from mind to action I am sorry for not having shared it sooner.

I am a (former?) wayward husband. 24ys R and 19 ys M. Have a 13ys S. W had uterine cancer 13ys ago, S was a baby then so he is our only child. The light of our lives. W and I worked shifts raising up S. She works the mornings (still does) and I worked afternoon till 22hs. So rarely spent time together as a couple during the weeks. As S grew up we were still drifting apart. Each of us having health related stressing jobs. We always worked hard trying to get a living. Things where we live are not easy but it is what it is. We had jobs related with what we both studied for, no complains. Sharing time during weekends and trying to be a happy family after all.

OW was a single mother. Came to work where I did and was considered a very professional worker. Ass time went by we became friends , I felt the need to protect her, being a single mother, struggling to raise her S (I recently found some answers for those feelings I had at that time). After an year and a half OW started pushing and I did not knew how to cope with. I am writing this after some years of IC and some truth developments in my life. Things have changed in my head from that time: my inner journey to myself In that time I felt the need to be accepted, some NGS and things related with that kind of personality. It was very hard for me to say NO to something. That took me to the abyss. My work mates where all into the wayward atmosphere so they all started pushing to link me with OW. One of them was a kinder friend, we had more than 45ys of friendship. He was a long friend with OW too. So they all knew of my problems with my W and started questioning about my happiness. So depression started to develop. And OW started to push forward.

As I previously stated, all of this findings came to light after myself going to IC. I do not mean to avoid taking responsibility of my actions. I am the main responsible for my wrong decisions. I did not knew how to cope with the feelings I had developed to OW. I remember waiting for the weekends to avoid seeing OW at work. But she kept pushing and we started the PA. After that I got lost in the fog of sex addiction, manipulation and lies. Relation with OW was the on-off type. I knew I did wrong and depression kept growing. I lied to W, I betrayed family. I tried to finish R with OW so many times but it was impossible because of being together at work. We kept that kind of relation 2 years. On and off. I was destroyed inside, keeping my family on one side and OW on the other. I am very sorry for what I became, some kind of Mr Jekyll and Hyde. I left my family home two times. Once for a week and then for a month. I went to my mothers house, where I was raised. But every time I came back home: I always felt the need to protect my family, my W and S. The feeling of leaving W and S was overwhelming. My W did not knew nothing of my double life of course. Nobody who knew me would imagine that happening. I felt so low

After ending things with OW for the 1000s time, she contacted my W and told her everything. I begged, pleaded, cried she gave me the chance to stay in M. And I took it. We went to MC and I went to IC. My mind was destroyed. The addiction to OW was very strong. OW was the love of my life, my soul mate, we were to be together till the end of time. Ahh, those feelings
My W did not make me work hard to get back to M. And I quitted IC and left again some months later and went to the on/off relation with OW. I read here that WW leave looking for freedom. I felt that too. I needed to be free. Well, you do not find freedom leaving your family. You find freedom taking care of your mind problems, of your own history. Depression was growing again and I started looking for answers. Went to IC again. I was exploring my big MLC. I missed my W and S and could not live without them. I told OW that for the 1001 time. I needed to go home. And my W let me came back. Still looking for answers.

What I found my father died 25 years ago. I was 23 then. I have a brother and a sister. I am the older one. I met my W one year after my father passed away. She only saw photos of him. The day we got married she heard some people who were from my mothers town talking about me. That I looked just like my father. And she said no, he is quite different, his brother and sister are the ones that look like him. What she got as an answer made her shudder: he was not his father, his father is alive Well, W never told me what she heard. And she felt I lied to her not telling about my living father. I did not knew that. Sometimes, when we had an argument she stated that she knew my secret, sometimes it was my mothers secret. She was mean about that. And I began thinking what it could be. That discussion took years and years and was one factor of our drift away too. I was afraid of asking my mother unconsciously I knew the truth. I remember confronting W and saying I know the truth, my father was not my father I do not really why I said it, nobody told me that. I knew it. Anyway, I consider my father was the one who raised me. We had a hard relationship, maybe if I had known he was not my father but he took me as a son I always struggled of not knowing how to love him when I was a teenager. It is hard to have that feelings about a parent. My father was not my friend and I did not knew why. I am sorry for not knowing how to love you dad, really sorry.

After returning home I asked mom about the truth. I had asked the same earlier. She denied, offered some well planned arguments and partial truths I never met my grandfathers but I was named after both of them, they had the same name (and it is not a common name). I believed her. Then my W told me my real fathers name and I went looking for information. I found the telephone number of my real aunt and I called after getting over my fears of discovering the truth. I called and she happily answered I have been always expecting this call you are my nephew. So I confirmed what I knew deep down inside. Confronted mom and told my brother and sister. Now I am struggling to meet my real father. I have not contacted him and I do not want to do it. W and IC are pushing me to change my mind and this is where I am now. Going to meet aunt soon she lives in another country. There is more that I am not telling you, like OW getting mixed in social media with my real aunt, or my mom or my brothers, trying to burn my bridges back to my M. OW thinks she is the one to save me and to show me happiness. I do not agree with her.

Last year, I came across DB forum. Read Sandi posts about wayward feelings. All matched. Soul mate feelings and so on. I read for months, then started posting. My W did not make me work hard to get back to my M but I know I must do it myself. So I consider myself and addict and go day by day. I do not drink much alcohol, never tried any drug, even a common cigarette. But I got OW affair addicted. And I am fighting that. This is my 3rd year free of all of that. OW and her close friends had to move to another work facility even though I was in NC mode before that. W and I are closer day by day. OW visits my mind every day, mostly sex related memories so I take it for what it is now my mind playing addiction games that I will not follow. I am stronger now and above all I live with the truth. I carry the scar of what I did but I am still alive. I made the right choice. Love is a choice and I choose my family.

Sorry for taking so long to write. It is real hard for me to tell my story. I apologize for my writing too, English is not my native language. Thanks, thanks, thanks to all of you, You saved my life. Thanks.


Posted By: Cadet Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 01:39 AM
It appears the major problem with your disappeared post are three little dots ... that are very close together that was all over your post, other than that it looked ok
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 01:40 AM
Sorry Cadet, tried my best but it was not enough. You are also included in my list. Thank you
Posted By: Cadet Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 01:52 AM
Originally Posted By: neffer
Sorry Cadet, tried my best but it was not enough. You are also included in my list. Thank you


OK well hopefully for the future you can find those little dots and eliminate them, then your posts will go through.

If not I will still help you.

Thanks for your list.
Posted By: Btrow Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 01:54 AM
Thanks for sharing, neffer.
Posted By: TBSakaJ9 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 01:57 AM
Great story Nef.......I am glad you made it home and are continuing to fight your demons! That is true strength......oh no here it comes.........dam you Nef!
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 02:00 AM
I am at the microscope ... but ...

spreading points Cadet

Thank you guys
Posted By: SteveLW Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 02:12 AM
neffer, thanks for sharing. Life isn't about being mistake free, it is about learning from your mistakes and becoming better for it.

I couldn't help but think of David and Bathsheeba.

If anyone is interested read 2 Samuel 11 and 12.

Basically David made huge mistakes. But he ended up repenting of them and becoming better for it.
Posted By: marina7 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 02:20 AM
Wow, just when I am ready to throw in the white flag I read this. Wow my W is in this WAW or MLC. Is hard to see what she did to us as a family. But there's days I ask myself I can't imagine the struggles my w is going through the demons she must fight everyday. Thank you again for your insight
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 02:27 AM
Thanks Steve, living day by day.

Hi Marina. You must live your life and enjoy your family. The spark is always hard to die. Your XW must find the answers herself when/if she faces her actions. Hope but live girl.
Posted By: Maika Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 02:43 AM
Hey Nef! Appreciate you posting from the 'other side' so to speak. It is hard to confront our demons just in our mind and we play great tricks to avoid them, let alone post about them in a public forum even if it's fairly anonymous. I know it wasn't easy for you to post your story.

I wish you all the best and your W as well. Sounds like you are trying to repair and rebuild your MR, and I hope you're putting in all the work for it.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/26/18 02:50 AM
Thank you Maika. Hoping the best for you too.
Posted By: NicoleR Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/28/18 02:59 PM
Neffer, I wish my husband could read your thread. I bet he'd relate. He's a physician and his affairs have been with nurses. I guess work colleagues are where most affairs start.

I'm curious to know more about your experience. Were you still attracted to your wife during your affair? And are you attracted to her now? Do you think anything your wife would have done differently may have had an impact on you? Like if she didn't take you back easily would it have pushed you to continue with the OW or made you want back to your wife even more?

It's too bad that so many people get hurt when an affair happens, including yourself, your wife, and the OW. Many of us here have the impression that the spouse who is cheating is happy but your post implies that's not the case. You may have been happy with the OW but not happy with what you did and with many aspects of your life. It's good you're working to address all of your issues.

I hope you do get a chance to meet your real father.

Thanks for summarizing your story for everyone here!
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/28/18 11:46 PM
Hi Nicole, thanks for reading my thread. I think you summarized my sitch very well.

I will try to answer your questions. You konw it is difficult for me to say what I felt for my W when high in the affair. Guilt, shame, depression for the situation.

Before the PA I felt I had to protect OW and her son. After knowing my truth and a lot of IC I discovered it was related with my own fear of abandonment. OW and son were my mother and I. And I had to protect them. But I was leaving my W and son so the conflict was a very strong one. OW did a lot of pressure about being happy in life. But I was never going to be happy leaving my family. That defined my on-off pattern relation with OW. She pushing and I stepping back ... keeping contact at work, mind manipulation, sex adiction, you know ... an endless situation.

OW was my soul mate during the affair ... all those feelings that affairs produce. Well, it nearly destroyed my life.
My W and I lost ourselves through the M. I was attracted to OW but I knew I was not going to be happy leaving my family. Getting attraction back to my W was/is a slow process. IC and latter this forum helped me to realice where I was standing and where I was going. I am in peace with myself now. Still fighting OW related adiction sequels but really concious of where I am.
Posted By: SteveLW Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/29/18 12:22 AM
neffer, addiction is blamed too much today. It is called willpower. Most people think they have no willpower and can't control themselves, but it simply not true. You CAN cut off OW and stay away from her. It IS within your power. No one gets to say "I couldn't help myself", everything we do is a choice.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/29/18 01:25 AM
I get it Steve, thank you. I have been NC for more than two years. My mind plays games sometimes but my willpower prevails. IC and reading this forum have helped me a lot. Thanks again.
Great post Neffer, thank you for sharing. I hope people read this and understand that a wayward wife or husband is NOT living a glorious life full of satin sheets and rose pedals. A lot of LBS's seem to think their spouse is a huge "winner" while the LBS is a loser, and that the spouse is enjoying the spoils of victory every day whereas the truth is far from that. You really highlight the internal struggles a wayward goes through. It's easy to say "well then just quit OP and go back to your spouse" but in some cases it really is an addiction as you say and addictions are not something you can turn on and off like a light switch.

And thank you for mentioning me as helping you, it's good to hear I contributed in some small way to your recovery. Congrats on your hard work, keep at it.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/29/18 02:12 AM
Thanks AS. You did help indeed and you keep doing it day by day. Thank you.
Posted By: DnJ Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/13/18 01:42 AM
Hello neffer

You have an interesting story. I am glad you found your way back and decided to share your insights of the journey. To read what it was actually like was most illuminating. Thank you.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/13/18 01:56 AM
Thank you for reading my sitch DnJ. I wrote it to share a view from the dark side...

All my respect for you and my best wishes for you and your kids.
Posted By: Davide Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/13/18 03:41 PM
Neffer,

This is the first time I have seen your story. Thanks for being open enough to share your missteps and errors with us, it provides a great perspective of the other side of the story. There aren't too many WHs on this forum that I can think of. I can only imagine how hard it is to fight the shame.

Also, I wanted to thank you for giving so much support to the newcomers on here who are still very lost on their journeys,(and those of us who are not so new, but still a bit lost!) It really helps.

Ests en la eeuu ahora o todava en la tierra del mate?

D
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/13/18 03:54 PM
Thanks for passing by D. We are all a little lost in life, whats important is to keep moving maintaining our values.

I live in the land of mate D. Mate, ftbol (soccer) y el asado. Have you tried it?
Posted By: Davide Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/13/18 04:18 PM
Cmo no!

I have had my share of goodies from la parilla, although in recent years I have mainly given up red meat. El bife de chorizo was my favorite when I lived down there.
Posted By: Grace21 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/13/18 05:28 PM
Thanks for sharing. My H has said he feels so damaged by his affairs. I wish he could read your post. Perhaps he is doing his own searching and will find similar words of encouragement to help him deal with whatever demons he has - and they are significant, I think. I am praying that he uses this time apart for self-reflection. He has a wife that wants to give him grace and start a "new" marriage together. I don't know if he will ever be receptive to that.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/13/18 10:06 PM
Hi Grace, thank you for your post. Your H must want to do his own search, as you said. Be patient and keep DB.

My best wishes for you and your family.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/13/18 10:10 PM
D
Originally Posted by Davide
Cmo no!

I have had my share of goodies from la parilla, although in recent years I have mainly given up red meat. El bife de chorizo was my favorite when I lived down there.



The bife de chorizo is called entrecot in my country. I live cruzando el charco, get it D?
Posted By: Davide Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/13/18 10:50 PM
Sip. Te entiendo.

You're making me want to visit again! I'm looking at international schools for next year, so who knows?
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/13/18 11:08 PM
Well, if you can do it you have a place waiting for you here where I live. It happens to be the place that all the people of the country you visited want to go for summer holidays...they say we have the best beaches of South America...(I personally prefer Brazil... but well I live here...)
Posted By: Davide Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/14/18 12:56 AM
Ah... I get your "point." It is pretty far to the east, no?
Posted By: NicoleR Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/14/18 02:00 AM
Hi Neffer,

It's really helpful to hear a different perspective from your thread and contributions here. One thing I wonder is if you feel you're being fair to yourself, OW, and your wife by returning to your wife if you feel that OW is your true love and soulmate? I'm just wondering because clearly you thought returning to your wife is the right thing to do, and I agree that it is, but it must be painful for all of you to be in the positions you're in knowing that you and OW still have feelings for one another. Do you still see OW at work or anywhere in real life? Does your wife seem to feel happy and content to have you back? I'm just curious....thanks again for sharing!
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/14/18 03:07 AM
Originally Posted by Davide
Ah... I get your "point." It is pretty far to the east, no?


hahahaha D, headshot!
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/14/18 03:20 AM
Originally Posted by NicoleR
Hi Neffer,

It's really helpful to hear a different perspective from your thread and contributions here. One thing I wonder is if you feel you're being fair to yourself, OW, and your wife by returning to your wife if you feel that OW is your true love and soulmate? I'm just wondering because clearly you thought returning to your wife is the right thing to do, and I agree that it is, but it must be painful for all of you to be in the positions you're in knowing that you and OW still have feelings for one another. Do you still see OW at work or anywhere in real life? Does your wife seem to feel happy and content to have you back? I'm just curious....thanks again for sharing!


Hi N! You are right about those feelings. I had them. Thats why Im so grateful to this forum. I came across Sandis list of waywardness. Those were my feelings...they are different now. It takes time...time is a key factor on our sitches.
I dontt see OW at work. Part of the staff of my coworkers were trasferred to another facility two years ago. She was one of them.

W and S are happy to have me back. So am I.

Thank you for posting N.
Posted By: sandi2 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/26/18 08:27 PM
Thank you so much for sharing your story. I'm just sorry I didn't see it when you first posted. I'm not able to stay on top of things as I once did (or thought I did). I only remember one other WH posting on the board, but he didn't stay long.

Thank you also for the kind words about how much our posts have helped you, b/c it is really encouraging. I was still wayward when I arrived on the board, and I give a ton of credit to the mentors I had back during that time. It played a big part in my decision to end my A and stay with my H. I was on this board from the minute I got home from work, until I would nearly fall asleep at the computer every night. Years ago, we were able to contact members privately, so I was getting extra help in my time of feeling weak and tempted. I went through several months of hard withdrawals, and another several months of what I suppose could be determined lighter withdrawals. In a minute, I'll tell you why I think it took me so long.

I was very depressed after ending my A. And, I was struggling with some health issues (before and after the A) and doctors had switched my meds around, until it's a wonder I have any sense at all. I didn't want to take responsibility for having an A, but I finally did. I was not thrilled to be staying in my M. It was just the right thing to do. That's what some LBS's don't understand. The decision to stay in the M, doesn't mean all the emotions are immediately set right.

I think there are some significant differences in a wayward W and a wayward H, simply b/c of the differences in women and men's makeup. For example, you felt protective over your W and son. That's how men usually see their responsibility, or their role as the protector over the family. Maybe that's why it is so shocking when we read about some WW who left her own children behind in order to be with the OM.....or live like a girl gone wild. There have been several WW's to come & go since I've been a board member, and every single one was alike in their type of mindset, etc. Anyway, it would be interesting to compare notes with a former WH.

It took me nearly two years before I felt like I had reached the point of having the energy to work on my MR. Now, I don't want that to discourage you. I'm just being real with you. This was me, but it's not to say it will be you. You see, I made the decision to do the right thing, end my A and stay in my M. However, my feelings did not change for some time. Yes, I ended my A, and went totally NC with OM, etc. But......it did not stop the fantasizing in my head. And, those little games your mind likes to play....the "what ifs" or "what may have been". Then I realized I was keeping the A alive in my mind. I could stay busy during the day, come to the board at night, but once I finally went to bed....here would come the fantasizing. I didn't know how to turn it off. Truth was, I hadn't really tried as hard as I'd like to have admitted. Then something else hit me. Call it God or whatever (I call it God), and that was the fact I had not shown any remorse or even given a humble apology to my H. Why? B/c I wasn't remorseful! I still had a chip on my shoulder. Well, no wonder my feelings for my H had not changed!

Did I mention I wasn't sleeping too well, either? Okay, so finally I started praying that God would help me to feel remorseful, b/c I knew I should be and that I needed to apologize sincerely to my H. Oh boy, when it came, it nearly killed me. My H had stayed up late and I was tossing & turning in bed. I went to him to apologize, and I was so broken he could barely understand what I was saying......but he "knew" what I was trying to do. Afterwards, I went back to bed and slept for the first time in forever. It was still tempting to fantasize about OM, but I started praying every time those kind of thoughts started. Guess that was a good antidote b/c one day I realized the fantasies had stopped.

I'd like to say that that took care of everything, but it didn't. However, it was a start. It would take time for my feelings to catch up. I had to start doing things on purpose (as the kids say). In other words, I had to do things out of my "will" rather than waiting on my "feelings". For example, I willed myself to treat my H with respect. Eventually, the feelings caught up, and I truly did/do respect him. I had so much hard work to do on my heart/mindset. I had to get rid of all those unresolved issues from the past. I had to forgive my H for a host of things. I didn't want to, but God made me realize if my H could forgive me, who was I to say I wouldn't or couldn't forgive him. WW's are very prideful, and that's why humbleness is important. I had to let go of a bunch of old cr@p. It really is a process the wayward spouse has to go through, IMHO, to find their way back again. The LBS has to go through their own healing and forgiving, and so does the wayward spouse. They each have their own different type of process to go through, and then they have to work together to piece their MR together. It's tough!

Some MR's can bounce back faster than others. Frankly, I have doubts when a LBS starts talking about how quickly their WS is progressing and everything is lovey-dovey. Maybe that's just me, or maybe it's b/c I know how much work is involved.

Well, I don't think I've told you anything you don't already know, or read where I've said it. I just want you to know that it can get better. I feel that I was extremely blessed to have the H I have (yes, the one I disrespected so badly) and received the help from some wise people. Although you may be still struggling, you can become stronger by remaining on the board, paying forward what you have experienced/learned.....and are still learning. Piecing is not for sissies, that's for sure. Don't give up. I thought I would never be happy again. I thought I missed my chance when I let OM go. I was wrong on both counts.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/26/18 09:19 PM
Thank you Sandi for the words youve written. It means a lot to me. Im still fighting. Im fighting my mind, my fantasy world with OW. Im doing IC and we talked about it last Friday. W didnt make me work hard to get back home but I knew I have to do it myself. Of course I chose my MR because I knew it was the right thing to do. Some cells of my heart still long for OW and a few of my pillow demons whisper she is the love of my life...No way!

Well I chose my family and Im writing this with pride and joy. Go figure! More than two and a half years from our last contact with OW and my mind still plays treacherous games. So what you have posted Sandi fits perfectly on where Im standing. Thank you for sharing your wisdom with us. Im not very religious but there are signals that I cant ignore. You have contacted me writing an exact description of what Im going through at these days. I have no words to describe this. Thank you Sandi, from each fiber of my heart, thank you!

Im fighting, fighting every day and I will not surrender. Im standing where I have chosen to be: with my family. And Im proud of my decision.

Thats why I will be eternally grateful to my DB brothers and sisters. Really you have saved my life.

Love you guys.
Posted By: TBSakaJ9 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/26/18 09:42 PM
You da man Nef! Never waiver....
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/26/18 09:47 PM
Never man, learning from all of you guys. The bright lighthouses.
Posted By: RR17 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/27/18 03:04 PM
neffer, you are a unicorn. ( I mean that in the nicest way) The WH that has come here and transparently shared your story and struggles from the other side. This makes you a tremendous asset to this forum.

You have been a perpetual cheerleader in my sitch and I really thank you from my heart.

Logically, I think we LBSs know that it isn't always easy for the WW/WH, but emotionally we often don't care because of our own struggles and pain. This is where I believe your contributions shine brightest.

You and the others like Sandi help us to both better understand what the opposition is feeling and thinking and this ultimately helps us to forgive and commit to doing the hard work necessary. This is huge!

Thank you for being here.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/27/18 03:17 PM
Thank you for your kind words RR. Just trying to give a hand from the dark side. Always with love and PMA.

Sending a little more patience just for you, thank you for passing by.
Posted By: Davide Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/27/18 03:50 PM
Neffer, hermano, let me just add my voice to the chorus expressing gratitude for your kindness and unique contributions to this community. There is nothing dark about the space from which you are operating. You may have made mistakes in the past (we all have), but the manner in which you have taken responsibility for your life and actions and have actively reached out to help so many of others in distress is truly admirable.

Mil gracias!
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/27/18 04:16 PM
Un abrazo grande hermano! Gracias por pasar.

Keep DBing Davide, be proud of the road youve taken.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/27/18 04:21 PM
Hey Davide, got the news from the suspended final match? What a shame! Now they are saying the match is going to take place in Paraguay... awful...
Posted By: Davide Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/27/18 04:51 PM
Really, I had heard Miami as a possible site.

What a shame to move it away from La Capital Federal!
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/27/18 04:53 PM
They are going to have G20 meetings there soon. Mamma ma...:(
Posted By: sandi2 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/27/18 06:43 PM
Quote
W didnt make me work hard to get back home but I knew I have to do it myself.


I have had a lot of LBH's ask me what my H did to get me to stay in the M. It wasn't what my H did. He was not the one coming to the board for help. I was. The way I see things, it's the person who is showing up on this board that's getting the "tools". The LBS may be trying to do something to keep the M together, but you and I were the ones who showed up here. As far as I could tell (in my fogged out condition), it didn't appear that my H was doing anything. Honestly, I didn't want him doing anything, but just leave me alone. He did tell me, when I told him I decided to stay, that he expected me to put 110% effort into working on the MR. It ticked me off! Remember, I had not reached the point of feeling remorseful, and was just trying to do the right thing. To me, he sounded self-righteous. I felt I had always been the one who nurtured the relationship, but maybe that was my own arrogance, bitterness, or short sightedness. Inwardly, I still wanted to blame him for my affair. I know that he wasn't being self-righteous, and he had every right to say what he did. I just couldn't muster that much emotional or physical energy b/c my heart wasn't on the right place, yet.

When you are trying to do the right thing by sheer will power......and you don't have the desire feeding your soul....you aren't going to produce as much energy. Does that make sense? Yes, I had ended my A and gone NC, was being transparent, etc. In other words, I was not engaging in any overt WW behavior. However, I was still very resentful toward my H, and at the time....still did not feel respect for him. I was careful not to show any outward disrespect, but my heart had a lot of processing to do. Many LBS's would not and could not understand how on earth I would have such audacity, and that I should be so thankful and humble that my H loved me enough, yada, yada, yada. See, they have a different mindset from the wayward. They have that strong desire and drive for their M to work and are willing to put up with most anything to save it.....where as the wayward spouse who is coming down from an addictive affair.....cannot share that kind of spirit, feeling, or energy until s/he has fully gone through withdrawals, IMHO. It's easier when you experience all the warm fuzzy feelings and have that passion in your soul. When I ended my A, I just felt terribly sad and empty of any positive feelings or hope. I was trying to resign myself to settle for living in misery for the rest of my life. I don't know if it's that way for everyone, but based on the information I've read, I'm pretty sure it's true for WW's. Maybe you can give us some input from the WH side.

So, the wayward has stopped the affair, but it takes time and going through a process to fix the damage to her/his heart. The LBS is not the only one who was damaged in this ordeal, the wayward spouse is damaged too. Not in the same way as the LBS, and the damage came from our own hands, but we are certainly a mess when we end an affair. Why can't LBS's get it through their heads that ending an affair is just the first step, and it is not an automatic fix to the MR problems? How can we (as a recovering wayward spouse) feel emotionally alive and healthy until we rid traces of the affair and OW/OM from our heart? Well, it may seem easy enough in the opinion of someone who has never experienced it, but I'm here to tell them that the addictive pull works on you like anything else that's addictive. That's why you have to deal with it like a porn addiction, drugs or alcohol. That's why you can't have contact of any kind with the former affair partner. Listen, coming through those flames is not easy. I encourage the LBS to support their recovering WS when they are going through the withdrawal stages.

I drew so much strength from the board. Strangely enough, one of my most effective mentors was a lady who had a recovering wayward husband. At that time, he was back home and they were piecing.....but they had been through so much, and her wisdom spoke to my fogged out brain, and helped me tremendously. I also butted heads with a couple of strong minded LBH's who had had wayward wives, and I think at the end of the day, we learned something from each other. Anyway, I will always appreciate the people who were on the board back then. We still have some dedicated folks on the board today. And, I am still learning from the LBH's. I've learned from them about the pain my own H went through, more than I learned from him telling me.

Okay, I wanted to ask a couple of questions. Are you struggling to forgive yourself? That's a biggie, isn't it?

Have you read any material from the Gottman Institute on healing and loving again after an affair? Many sources address healing for the betrayed spouse, but there are actually some who address both spouses and the challenges they face as a couple after an affair. I don't know if you and your W are in any type of couple's therapy, but I would encourage you to check out Dr. Gottman's material.

How is your W doing? Is she showing much anger/resentment? Does she seem vindictive? Do you think she would be willing to receive couple's therapy, or work with you in reading information that would help? I feel many couples believe they can figure it out on their own, but how many of us have those skills? Most of us need help from an unbiased and experienced professional.

I was warned that my OM would probably contact me at some later point. Sure enough, about a year later (can't remember exactly) he called me......at work. He started off the conversation as though we were picking up where we left off. It freaked me a little b/c I had read too many fatal attraction stories....so that warning helped me to be calm and give a firm response. I told him in no uncertain terms that the A had been the worst mistake of my life, that I loved my H and was going to make my M work. I think he got the message loud and clear b/c I've never heard from him again. I consider myself very, very blessed, b/c everyone does not get away from the AP as easily.

I want you to know that you are not alone, Neffer. You can get through this withdrawal period. Don't give up. I hope your IC is helping.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/28/18 01:09 PM
Hi sandi, thanks for your answer. Reading what you posted here makes me remember the first time I came across this forum. What you had posted then and what you are saying now could have been perfectly written by me. All your descrption matches my feelings inside the mist, the twilight zone. So I get it when you say we are trying to do the right thing without will power. Its like getting on board a sailboat knowing the course to take but sitting there waiting for the winds...Well they are not coming along. We had to row. So we rowed, then it came the breeze.

So this forum was/is the wind I need/ed. I surreptitiously followed for nearly a year, then I became a member and slowly dared to post the now usual stupidities wink. Just like you, Im getting the strength from my DB brothers and sisters, the crew of the sailboat.

I told you on my previous post that actually Im focused on getting away of the fantasy life I developed. I need to live my real life. I remember reading something that you posted years ago when you said you even wanted your H to dissappear to have the idylic R with OM. Well I felt something similar when my waywardness times. Im much better now and moving forward, away from the mist. Like you said I treat myself like and adict and take my days one by one. Im not blaming adiction on the choices I made or Im making right now. I take care of my actions and I have the strength of will to be the captain of my boat (thank you Steve!).

W has done her own work. I have been encouraging her to do some IC but shes very stubborn. Ill keep trying. Im working on my NGS behaviors that got the MR in danger. We are in a better place, on the same boat and sailing with S13. Each day is better than the previous. Sometimes we come across triggers that make W sad or angry...well I validate and face the storm. I know I have damaged her, I live with that every day. She is the lighthouse, I love that girl. I dont know if I have forgiven myself...I dont dare to think about it. I never blame W on nothing of what I did. Maybe we are both accountable for the disconection we had somewhere on the MR but the steps I decided to take after that are my own failure. Thanks for the advice on what material to check. Im doing that.

Im still doing my inner voyage. Still fighting fears. Actually Im figthing my fears of knowing my real father. Im still protecting my mother secret so I must keep working on that. Those were some MLC triggers some time ago. Need to resolve that, abandonment and childhood related feelings.

Thank you Sandi. Being yourself in my position times ago let you know how much you have helped me. You are my Jack Three Beans! THANK YOU!

Ill keep fighting, never give up. I am where I have chosen to be. Standing here. S13 and W sailing with me. Cant ask for more.

Life is living. We must enjoy that journey, hapiness is there, on that endless road.
Posted By: sia Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/28/18 05:26 PM
Sandi and Neffer, such great advice here, as always thanks so much. As a LBW it is so hard to understand the extreme WS perspective but reading here helps so much. Also, I am not sure most WAS have the grit and commitment you possess, it might be value system or just personalities. To make mistakes is human, if we hadnt none of us would be here WAS or LBS.
Neffer, In your own sitch, did it take declining of your A to get clarity or was it seeing your W let go that reminded of what was being lost?
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/28/18 05:36 PM
Hi Sia, thank you for passing by. The A didnt decline then, I decided to stop it. Like many times before. That time OW chose to call my W so you can imagine the rest...I stayed a month out from home, still seeing OW. But that was not my place. W showed me her light and her love letting me go.
Posted By: DejaVu6 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/28/18 05:44 PM
Hi Neffer. Really appreciate reading about your journey. Wondering if you have read any of my sitch? It would be great to have your insights. My H has been emotionally "gone" for four years at least. I want to keep hope alive but, at the same time, I feel like doing so really gets in my way and is setting me up for more bomb days ahead. So how does one let go but still maintain some kind of hope? It seems to me that the two are not compatible. frown
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/28/18 05:57 PM
Hi DV. Thanks for posting. Yes I have read your sitch. Your H must want to do his inner voyage to heal himself. Easier to say than to do. You have travelled a long way DV...keep your light shining. Hope is a resilient spark, it hides somewhere. But you need to live your life girl. So keep your hope there but control your expectations. You are a role model for your kids, teach them how to have a healthy life. You must give them the example.

Stay strong there DV. Proud of who you are: the lighthouse.
Posted By: DejaVu6 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/28/18 06:22 PM
Thank you. I don't think I've ever worked harder at something than I have this. As much as I love this board and the people on here who have given me so much support, I am looking forward to the day when I don't feel compelled to log on multiple times a day to remind myself of my goals and to boost my mind set. I want this to become something that I just DO without having to think about it much. smile
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/28/18 06:28 PM
You are getting the tools to do that. Then you have the will power. Set the sails!
Posted By: sandi2 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/28/18 09:33 PM
Quote
You are my Jack Three Beans! THANK YOU!


That's one of the nicest complements I have ever had. I couldn't hold a light to him, but thank you for such kind words!
Posted By: AndrewP Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/29/18 01:20 AM
Originally Posted by sandi2
Quote
You are my Jack Three Beans! THANK YOU!


That's one of the nicest complements I have ever had. I couldn't hold a light to him, but thank you for such kind words!
Your light shines differently but similarly Sandi. Jack was Coast Guard (yes I know this) sailing the seas to keep all safe. You are the leading lights guiding the sailors home.

And yes - I am a sailor who has been lost at sea - and a fan of the Swallows and Amazons. Doubtful you'll get the exact reference but you'll get the intent I'm sure.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 11/29/18 04:12 AM
Originally Posted by AndrewP

And yes - I am a sailor who has been lost at sea - and a fan of the Swallows and Amazons. Doubtful you'll get the exact reference but you'll get the intent I'm sure.


I was a fan of Sandokan Le Tigre Della Malesia when I was a child. Nice memories!
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 12/21/18 01:51 PM
Getting into my sitch just to wish you all Merry Christmas my dear DB brothers and sisters.

Keep following the light of wisdom that reach into our lives and illuminates our roads.

I will never be able to thank you enough. Love you all.

Merry Christmas!
Posted By: RR17 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 12/23/18 02:36 PM
Merry Christian to you and thank you for your continued support.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 12/29/18 09:26 PM
Happy new year dear DB brothers and sisters. Wishing the best for you all for the new year.
Posted By: FlySolo Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 12/31/18 04:56 PM
... and you Neff

A heartfelt thank you for all your support this year. Your words have comforted me at the darkest of hours.

hugs to you.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 02/12/19 12:52 PM
Well its summer here and I have lot of work...

Just want to say how sorry I am for not being here as usual. Im trying to follow you all but simply I cant right now. Im very sorry.

Im not gone, Im still here!
Coming back soon.
Posted By: Davide Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 02/12/19 01:43 PM
No apology necessary, neffer! You have given so many of us so much support!

Cudate, hermano!
Posted By: RR17 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 02/13/19 12:02 PM
Thanks neffer, for your continued support, your commitment to understanding, and your insight into the dark side. wink
Posted By: DnJ Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/16/19 02:19 PM
Happy Fathers Day neffer.

Hope you and yours have a great day.

DnJ
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 06/17/19 12:30 PM
Thank you DnJ. Where I live, Fathers Day is 2nd Sunday in July.

Hope you did have a great day. My best wishes to all DB Fathers. Keep on moving toward the light.

Hugs to all of you.
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 12/29/19 09:45 PM
Im back from holidays. Just posting to wish my DB brothers and sisters a happy new year 2020.

Respect and love yourselves. Theres the starting line.

Love you all. Thanks for sharing your love with me.

Happy 2020!
Posted By: LH19 Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 12/29/19 09:56 PM
Good to have you back Neff. Happy holidays to you and your family!
Posted By: IronWill Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 12/29/19 10:03 PM
Happy holidays, Neffer! smile
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/27/20 02:18 PM
Im still here guys. This year has been really complicated. Its everything ok at home.

Logging just to pay tribute to Jack Three Beans, one of the brightest lighthouses of this site.


Will be back soon.

Sorry. Miss you all
Posted By: SteveLW Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/27/20 02:44 PM
Thanks neffer, your insight is missed on the forum! And I have to say, second only to my WW, you are my second favorite wayward spouse! (Okay, tied for second with sandi!)
Posted By: neffer Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/27/21 02:20 PM
A whole year has passed and I haven't been able to rejoin yet...I hope to do that soon.



Jack Three Beans

Always remembered

Strength and honor
Posted By: Drew Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/27/21 04:51 PM
Virtus et Honus, Jack.
Posted By: Mumin Re: Just Thank you all. A very big Thanks - 10/28/21 06:52 AM
Strength and honor Neff!
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