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http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2742047&page=1As most of you are aware of my current situation, I will spare the details. Please see previous thread for more.
As I have continued my successful GAL, 180 and Detachment journey, I feel that this weekend I saw possibly the first signs that it may be working for a possible DB one day.
A few examples below of things that happened over the weekend.
1. While we were sitting together at son's baseball game, my wife took interest for the first time in a long time in my Saturday evening plans. The plans had nothing to do with her but she asked twice what I was doing and who it was with.
2. She took notice and mentioned my new shirt, asking "where did you get that", in a sarcastic tone.
3. She made a joke about something that is a running joke with the both of us. We both laughed.
4. When dropping off my son so I could go out for my plans, she ask "do you plan on changing your outfit before you go because that doesn't look good and girls won't be attracted to that". I told her yes, I am changing. I know this sounds negative, but why would she care what I wear?
5. Today, she called me to talk about some things and asked me how my event was that I went to. I was brief and told her that I had a great time.
6. We were talking about some other things and then she said to me "well, if you were not so busy going to the gym, going to events and out buying clothes...then you would understand. Again, sounds potentially negative, but why does she care?!?!
7. She texted me a pic of our son for no reason and completely out of the blue. I didn't respond.
There are a few other minor things that I can't recall right now. Not looking for comments that I need to stop mind reading or stop caring, etc. and to focus on myself. I am focused on myself as you can see from the beginning of the post. Obviously she is beginning to notice...
Thoughts, comments, next steps?
Thoughts, comments, next steps?
I don't want to rain on your parade or burst you bubble, but it is WAY to early too count your success. My W will still joke and have good conversations with me. She will bring me food. She will check my mail when I am traveling. She has even bought me clothes. She will do lots of things with me and this has been happening for a year since my BD date. But, she is still not wanting to get back together.
I say this to you because you cannot rush this. You can't. If you do you will push her away as fast as you can blink. Take your time and try not to read into anything she does.
[quote=selloutAs I have continued my successful GAL, 180 and Detachment journey[/quote]
Can you truly say you're detached, here? Truly?
I'm thrilled for you that you are having positive interactions, but would caution against reading too much into it too soon.
Sellout, it's great that you're having positive interactions. Sometimes it's those little victories that help us keep going. That said, I'm going to echo the others and caution you against reading into things too deeply right now.
We all come here feeling like our situations are unique and others just don't really understand things like we do. While that is true, it's also true that human behavior is human behavior. When you have been around these boards for a while, you'll start to see the same patterns repeat over and over again. The individual details and circumstances differ, but our stories are much more alike than they are different. No one wants to discourage you. No one will be happier for you than this group of people if you reconcile your marriage. Others are just looking out for you and trying to share the wisdom of collective experiences.
Problems that lead to marital separation and threat of divorce do not develop overnight. They don't resolve overnight either. It's a marathon and not a sprint. If your W came to you tomorrow and said she wanted to reconcile, your DB journey wouldn't be over. The problems that led to this point still have to be addressed and repaired or else you'd just find yourself right back in this same position later. There are no quick fixes. Reconciliation is just the beginning of trying to work out your issues cooperatively. DBing is a lifelong journey--not just emergency resuscitation.
It is very, very common for spouses to act as yours is doing and for there to be a lot of back and forth. It's neither good nor bad. It's just the way these situations tend to play out. If you read others stories on the boards, you will see it over and over. It has been my personal experience too. Again, this is not to discourage you. This could very well be the first steps of her turning back towards the marriage. Or it just might be part of the process. That doesn't mean it won't eventually work out. But you are signing yourself up for a potentially rough road if you continue to micro analyze every little move she makes.
The reason everyone tells you to detach is so you aren't obsessing over every interaction and trying to find meaning that may or may not be there. We have all done it, but it makes you crazy. Your marriage saving energy can be put to use in better places. Detachment doesn't mean you stop caring about your W or give up on the marriage. But you can't control the outcome here. Your W is going to do what she wants to do. Your power and control lies within yourself. Don't waste your time trying to mindread and overanalyze her. That will not help you bring her back. Just continue putting your energy into becoming a better man and husband that she will WANT to come back to. You don't need to understand what she meant when she commented on your clothing or sent you a text in order to do that.
Anna, I just wanted to say that is one of the most well written and succinct explanations of DBing and detaching that I've seen! Every time I read about DBing and Detachment it clicks just a little bit more...and this time even more so. Thank you!
Sellout...hang in there!
I was in your shoes once many moons ago, unfortunately i hate to break it to you those actions by her doesnt mean much. Mine went all out to buy me gifts and stuff when she was out of town even when we had been separated for months. Any chance she gets she wants to chit chat and talk (mostly about her life). The weirdest one was before we separated she wanted to have a quick peck or kiss before work. It didnt mean she was interested to get back together.
You've been friendzoned. It may lead to more or it may not. I'd say dont get too excited and just do you. Focus on what you want to do, what if you were not married or tied down. What ambitions or activities do you want to do etc.
In others words stop analysing everything she does. It lets her knows you are still into her.
One thing Ive seen Sandi write about WWs is that while they dont really want you, they also dont want someone else to have you either. They really like that security of a Plan B. So when she sees you wearing new clothes or having plans, her curiosity is piqued, because she starts to wonder if there is a chance that she might lose you. That doesnt mean that she wants to be with you necessarily - but she could be feeding you a few crumbs to entice you to stay 'on the hook' for her.
Im not saying that youre necessarily on a bad path. What I do see from you is a LOT of confirmation bias. I believe that you want so badly to R, that you are interpreting every little thing she is doing as pushing you down that path. What we are trying to see is that the data you are getting is incredibly noisy, that its hard to show a trend in just a few days - watch for a few weeks; are you seeing continued behaviors that suggest a trend?
I would continue to advise you to read and reread some of the threads on detachment; you say you are working on it, but I read lots of posts about your W and the outcome of this, and not so much about your activities, your interactions with your child, etc. You say you are GAL and making all of these personal strides; share them with us so we can get a more well rounded view of you!
Yes I just want to confirm similar behavior patterns. My W is so deep into her A right now but when the topic somehow comes up that I would be with another woman or date after the D there's a drastic change in her.
I will easily admit that I am not fully detached from my W yet. Its difficult to do when you are living in the the same house. If she fixes me an egg for breakfast I have remind myself this is the same woman that is about to walk out the door to see the OM. The only things that will start to make me believe she is changing is if I can see true remorse in her actions and there begins to be some pursuit of me.
I believe the small acts of kindness she shows now are just the leftovers of 25 years of companionship and feelings of familiarity in how she treated me throughout the M. You have to be careful to separate those things out.
Thanks for all of the great responses. Yes, I am trying to do a better job of not analyzing each and every thing that comes out of her mouth and what she is doing. When your entire world is shaken up by a catastrophic event like this, its hard not to think of every scenario, angle, etc.
Specifics about my GAL - gym (have lost 35 lbs and not starting to pack on some muscle. Have reconnected with some old friends, journaling, reading, become much more spiritual, therapy, group divorce recovery meetings, become more involved with son.
If I am understanding everyone correctly, the moral of the story is that I need to NOT worry about what she says and does. I get it.
Thanks.
Sellout, Thanks for being so transparent and sharing your seemingly positive/hopeful experiences. To all who've replied, I appreciate your honesty in reading into those experiences.
I'd admit to trying to read into every positive interaction I've had with my H...clearly it's a habit I/we should stop.
I think the biggest challenge I struggle with (maybe many of us do) is finding a balance between the possibility of hope in our MR or ignoring it and continuing down the path to prepare for a legal divorce. The legal actions involved in a divorce often bring more hurt and bitterness to both parties and seem to contradict the ideas to support R.
180, thank you so much for the kind words.
Sellout, you got it! Don't worry about what she says or does right now. There will be many ups and downs in this journey and if you place too much importance them, you'll be riding a constant emotional rollercoaster. On top of that, thoughts and feelings change. Why stress yourself out about something she feels today when it might not be that way tomorrow? THAT'S what you're detaching from--things that don't matter. Then you will have more emotional energy to concentrate on the things that do. Keep up all the great work with the GAL'ing and 180s and try to trust the process. If your changes start to reach your W's heart, she will let you know. You won't have to wonder.
I believe the small acts of kindness she shows now are just the leftovers of 25 years of companionship and feelings of familiarity in how she treated me throughout the M. You have to be careful to separate those things out.
Bingo. Think nothing of it as she surely doesn't. Especially when she screwing someone else...
is finding a balance between the possibility of hope in our MR or ignoring it and continuing down the path to prepare for a legal divorce
Um, what? Possibility of hope on whose end? As the saying goes, crap in one hand and hope in the other and tell us which fills faster. Is it possible? Sure. Likely? Doubtful, but it can happen. The important thing to remember is that you work on yourself and not worry at all about what the other person is doing.
They are on their own road, and it only has room for them. After all, why would you even consider trying to go on someone's road where you aren't wanted?
I'm trying to formulate a complete though on the name of the thread, is "winning" your W back your goal? or is becoming a better man, parent and husband for a future woman? (might be your W might not be) and is this what you're in for, a "Victory"?
I believe your victory would be what I said above. Be the best Sellout there is out there!
I'm trying to formulate a complete though on the name of the thread, is "winning" your W back your goal? or is becoming a better man, parent and husband for a future woman? (might be your W might not be) and is this what you're in for, a "Victory"?
I believe your victory would be what I said above. Be the best Sellout there is out there!
Agreed. She is irrelevant. A spine is.
The next steps are to continue as you're doing only step it up a notch. Have the greatest time of your life without your wife. It makes you very attractive. Find some amazing activities and do them. Hang out with new people, male and female. It works. Trust me, I know. It works.
Someone talk me of the ledge... I am getting my MOJO back and starting to care less and less (at least at the moment). I am wanting to pick up the phone and really tell wife what I think of her and what she is doing and tell her to have a good life (not really). Other than for our son why would I want to take her back now? I have plenty of women that I could choose from and I am sure have a real good time with. Should I do it?!?!?
No, you shouldn't do it. Come on sellout. Your emotions are all over the place.
One minute you say that you are detached, the next you want to flip out on your W. If you were detached, you would not have these emotional highs and lows.
What happened that you are in a different place from this morning?
Sure, you can have plenty of women and have a good time. Isn't that one of the reasons you find yourself here to begin with? Own your sh!t and fix it. If you don't fix it, you will find yourself in the same situation with a new person.
Your right but needed to vent. She is just so unappreciative of things I do. So annoying.
Here's a news flash. You enable her behavior. That's the role you are playing.
You will no longer be enabling her when you choose to have some boundaries. This isn't all on her. Look in the mirror buddy.
You have choices in this that will influence the direction of your sitch. It begins with you. Either you choose to lead or continue to follow her lead.
Your right but needed to vent. She is just so unappreciative of things I do. So annoying.
Quit doing things for her and with her. Especially without any expectations.
Remember the golden rule for DB, when in doubt do nothing. You will only regret it if you do. Find something to distract yourself from the urge to call her. Go run three miles or something. Also read BluWave's posts on the mindreading. Her H came back and she could discuss with him certain things she was convinced he was thinking or doing at different times. Guess what, she was dead wrong. None of us can read minds. Stop reading the tea leaves and don't be premature in declaring victory.
Someone talk me of the ledge... I am getting my MOJO back and starting to care less and less (at least at the moment). I am wanting to pick up the phone and really tell wife what I think of her and what she is doing and tell her to have a good life (not really). Other than for our son why would I want to take her back now? I have plenty of women that I could choose from and I am sure have a real good time with. Should I do it?!?!?
Good. You're really starting to GAL, detach, and move on. Not faking it like so many LBS/BS's do. When I first started DB'ing I was faking all that stuff and I learned that doesn't work. They see through it and know they still own you. If you truly GAL, detach, and move on then they'll see it's for real and if there's any chance then that'll bring them back. It did for me. The thing is, you might realize the truth, that you really are too good to be cheated on and you deserve better.
Yeah, I was being sacarstic when I was saying these things last night. Obvoiusly I wouldnt do that and jeapordize all of the hard work Ive put in thus far. But on the other hand it is nice to have feelings like this every once in a while that you know you are going to be ok whatever happens.
She has been very nice to me lately. Nothing extradinary but certainly better than before. Like many have said here, it probably will not be a sudden act where she calls and says lets work on the marriage but rather a lot of small things along the way (temp. checking).
The hardest part of all of this is putting your pride and ego aside. Do others agree with this?
Need everyone's opinion on something.
I read everywhere that time is your friend on saving your marriage. Our divorce is in the works and have a few months to go I would assume. She hasn't mentioned the divorce in a couple of weeks. She did make a comment a few weeks back that she wanted to potentially delay it so our son could stay in his house through the summer and have his friends over and swim in the pool, etc...
With that said I have two options:
1. Advise my attorney to slow play the divorce to buy time to continue to DB and see what happens. This info would be Top Secret and my wife, nor her attorney would be none the wiser. I would still keep my wife thinking that things are progressing along as normal. I am the petitioner and can play the cards how I want.
2. Tell my wife absolutely not and keep moving with divorce to "force her hand" into making a decision.
People say that when the For Sale sign shows up in the front yard it gets real for them and sometimes that is a breaking point. This is also a risky move.
Thoughts?
I am pretty sure it has been mentioned many many many times that you cannot force her hand into making a decision.
That is not saving and rebuilding a marriage. That's being forced into a choice.
Let me as you a serious question.
Do you want to go back to the marriage you had, or do you want your issues remedied and want to build a new stronger marriage?
because if you try to "force" her hand and she chose to stay because she was forced into it, how will that strengthen your marriage? You'll end up right back here.
This is stinks. But there is no quick and easy solution.
If you do get divorced, you do realize you can get married again, right?
Ginger1: I agree 100% that I would not and don't want to go back to same marriage as we had before. With that said, things are already in the works for that not to happen: I.e. - me working on myself to become a better man, father and hopefully husband. She would obliviously need to work on herself as well.
So, if I understand you, your vote would be to stall out and buy some more time?
Others?
No, my vote is let things flow as they are going to flow. Don't stall, don't push. What is meant to happen will happen.
I agree with Ginger.
Your wife is going to cake eat as long as you keep feeding her. She gets to stay in the house, have your son 75% of the time and have a boy friend. Oh yeah, and a husband who accepts all this and picks her flowers.
You stall on the divorce and she will cake eat all summer long.
My vote is the same as Ginger's. Don't push, don't stall. (But if you wanted to ask your attorney to have a conflict on the first available court date? I don't think that'd be a bad tactic.)
Assuming you stick to the DB rules, I think time is your friend when your spouse's heart needs convincing.
I say what a bit longer. W still needs to be convinced your changes are permanent before being forced to make a decision. Just stay calm for now and if you feel this way a few weeks/months from now. Then push the issue.
Agreed with everyone. I don't want to force her hand, I want her to "want" to come back under the right circumstances. I figure that when all of this shakes out and the divorce is near final it would have been appx. 8-9 months of separation. The good news is that neither one of us has mentioned the divorce in over 3 weeks.
Question: The longer DB goes on and the less time you visit, speak, communicate with spouse: how do they know you are still interested in working on marriage?
Example: I am GAL, 180, Detaching - and then months go by and we slowly start drifting apart...how does/will she know I still want to work on marriage? Do we ALWAYS let them to be the one to bring it up? What if they are scared of rejection and don't want to bring it up?
Make sense?
If they really, truly, want it, they will risk the rejection.
^^^ Yep. Or they will come up with countless silly reasons to contact you.
Yeah, understood. She is now questioning me on why I don't response to texts sooner in the evenings and what I have been doing in the evenings.
No, you shouldn't do it. Come on sellout. Your emotions are all over the place.
One minute you say that you are detached, the next you want to flip out on your W. If you were detached, you would not have these emotional highs and lows.
What happened that you are in a different place from this morning?
Sure, you can have plenty of women and have a good time. isn't that one of the reasons you find yourself here to begin with?
Own your sh!t and fix it. If you don't fix it, you will find yourself in the same situation with a new person.
Please see that this^^^ needs to be read again, Sellout....
what is different about you as a h now, than before?
I'm not talking about your w, but you. You are here and she is not, and you are all you control.
Here is a small 2 x 4 given with the best of intentions.
If you cannot control your own emotions better, why expect her to do so?
I DID control my emotions. Instead of doing what I said, I vented on this board. That is the definition of controlling my emotions. People don't walk around like robots. Come on guys. I am not all over the place. I don't ever initiate conversations with her, when she calls/text me, I am calm, nice and soft spoken and the first to end the call. Its all good.
Question: The longer DB goes on and the less time you visit, speak, communicate with spouse: how do they know you are still interested in working on marriage?
Example: I am GAL, 180, Detaching - and then months go by and we slowly start drifting apart...how does/will she know I still want to work on marriage? Do we ALWAYS let them to be the one to bring it up? What if they are scared of rejection and don't want to bring it up?
Make sense?
You have said the Div was retracted and refiled multiple times. So one or both of you is far too reactive. And in most eyes your time line is very very short.
Your post above and signature block make it seem to me that you think if things are not all better by next month, then all is lost. That is Reactive and fear based.
here is the math of it, which I think I've posted to you before but here goes...
Small consistent changes + sufficient time = change she can believe in.Stop rushing this. You really do each have issues. No judgement meant by that comment.
I mean, what was the m like when you both were happy?
What would SHE say the problems are?
What are you doing on your end of things now?
I don't mean how much you are working on getting her backbut on your own inward work? To become a better man, h and dad?
How is your son handling all this?
Question: The longer DB goes on and the less time you visit, speak, communicate with spouse: how do they know you are still interested in working on marriage?
Example: I am GAL, 180, Detaching - and then months go by and we slowly start drifting apart...how does/will she know I still want to work on marriage? Do we ALWAYS let them to be the one to bring it up? What if they are scared of rejection and don't want to bring it up?
Make sense?
The only thing I can think of is do you really want your W back if she's not pursuing you?
I've struggled with many of these same thoughts as you. Keep focusing on yourself and becoming a better version of yourself. If you're W can't see that then that is her problem.
New minor development:
While discussing coordination efforts with son on phone with wife yesterday she said 2 things that stood out to me:
1. Each and every time I answer the phone with her, I am upbeat and positive. Yesterday she said, "wow, you sure sound happy". My response, was yeah, I am happy. Continued into conversation.
2. I have been taking my time in responding to her calls/texts now and certainly don't initiate any. During the call yesterday she made the following comment "why do you take so long to respond to my texts at night". I told her that I've been busy and hadn't had a lot of time. Her response was "what are you so busy doing?" my response, "working out, reading, journaling, Bible Study, Etc..." She didn't really have much of a response.
Thought provoking...
Anyone???
Im having trouble answering your posts, because they are all kind of the same. You post something where you show your W is confused and then ask if we see hope or change. We tell you to stop focusing on W and you snap back that you are. And then the cycle repeats.
Yes, there is hope that your M can be reconciled.
Yes, your W is confused and will give off 'signals' that confuse you if you try to analyze them in detail.
I dont see how those answers will change anytime in the near future.
I have to ditto Kaizen here. And I think you are missing the point that 25 made above. You won't get any better advice than that from someone who has seen it all now.
Thanks all. Good to know some think there is still home. Ill just keep up the DBing and see what happens.
Question: The longer DB goes on and the less time you visit, speak, communicate with spouse: how do they know you are still interested in working on marriage?
Example: I am GAL, 180, Detaching - and then months go by and we slowly start drifting apart...how does/will she know I still want to work on marriage? Do we ALWAYS let them to be the one to bring it up? What if they are scared of rejection and don't want to bring it up?
Make sense?
You have said the Div was retracted and refiled multiple times. So one or both of you is far too reactive. And in most eyes your time line is very very short.
Your post above and signature block make it seem to me that you think if things are not all better by next month, then all is lost. That is Reactive and fear based.
here is the math of it, which I think I've posted to you before but here goes...
Small consistent changes + sufficient time = change she can believe in.Stop rushing this. You really do each have issues. No judgement meant by that comment.
I mean, what was the m like when you both were happy?
What would SHE say the problems are?
What are you doing on your end of things now?
I don't mean how much you are working on getting her backbut on your own inward work? To become a better man, h and dad?
How is your son handling all this?
I am making the slow, consistent changes and trust me, she notices. I would almost bet that she is in the stage now of "seeing if it will stick". My son is doing ok. HE doesn't like talking about it and keeps it to himself which isn't that great. We both (mom/dad) always tell him we are here to talk when he wants to.
Yes, I am the reactive one. I was far too reactive in many circumstances from 1/1/17 to about a month ago. I filed for divorce, retracted, filed again and then she said she wanted to retract and then filed final time.
We have not been to court yet, and she hasn't mentioned anything about divorce in about 3 weeks. She is now calling/texting more regularly sometimes just to tell me some story that has no relevance.
One thing that stuck out to me in the DB book is...do what works and stop doing what doesn't work. The goal here is to get my wife back and it seems that she is slowly opening up the communication lines.
I went to my Counselor yesterday and he made an interesting recommendation:
He said: "I know you really well now and know your story. What I don't know is the other 50% of the story. I would like to get your wife in here to my office by herself and he the other 50%, that way I can help you become the better man and father that you want to be."
At that point a light bulb went off in my head and then Dr. confirmed my thinking. If she would agree to come in to visit with him with it could certainly acomplish 1 thing (him hearing the other 50% of the story) but......... it could also potentially open a door where should could start to hear about the poistive changes I am making in my life, get her some vent time and who knows what could come out of it.
I briefly mentioned it to her this morning (after she called to tell me a meaningless story) and she said she would think about it.
Thoughts?
[quote=25yearsmlc][quote=sellout]He said: "I know you really well now and know your story. What I don't know is the other 50% of the story. I would like to get your wife in here to my office by herself and he the other 50%, that way I can help you become the better man and father that you want to be."
Hi Sellout,
My IC also recommended the same thing. I thought it was a very good idea and I waited a few months before I thought about bringing up the request to my wife. You are fortunate that she will think about. My wife threw it back in my face saying she had no interest in my counseling or how I am processing the breakup of the marriage. To me it is just more of a sign that my wife is moving further and further away from me. I was reluctant to bring it up in the first place for those months because I knew I was giving her an open net to just hurt me.
In your case, it seems a good sign that she will consider it. I'm interested to know how this goes and if it is helpful.
[quote=25yearsmlc][quote=sellout]He said: "I know you really well now and know your story. What I don't know is the other 50% of the story. I would like to get your wife in here to my office by herself and he the other 50%, that way I can help you become the better man and father that you want to be."
Hi Sellout,
My IC also recommended the same thing. I thought it was a very good idea and I waited a few months before I thought about bringing up the request to my wife. You are fortunate that she will think about. My wife threw it back in my face saying she had no interest in my counseling or how I am processing the breakup of the marriage. To me it is just more of a sign that my wife is moving further and further away from me. I was reluctant to bring it up in the first place for those months because I knew I was giving her an open net to just hurt me.
In your case, it seems a good sign that she will consider it. I'm interested to know how this goes and if it is helpful.
resolut, I am sorry to hear that it turned out that way for you. I am in no way out of the woods as she has agreed to nothing. Even it she does agree it could really only mean for the first part (help me become better man, father) and she could have no interest in what it could possibly do for our relationship. I figure that it was worth the risk of asking. I will let her think about it for a little while and then possibly move to a scheduling for her to go see him. I figure is she could get into the hands of a "professional" that could only increase the odds of us DBing.
I would like to get everyone's opinion on something.
Over about the last 3 weeks or so my wife has become more and more talkative, friendly, texting more, telling me random stories of things that do not matter and just more generally upbeat and positive. I have gone along with all of this and played her game. She is still dating other man.
She or I hadn't mentioned the divorce status in almost a month and no relationship talk either.
Many of you have advised that I am Plan B for her in the event that the OM doesn't work out. With that said, I told her the following on Friday morning:
ME: "Based on the recommendation of my therapist, support groups, mentor and a lot of prayer, it is best if you and I have minimal communication. Keep it to the facts and ***son*** coordination. This is the best way for me to heal and move on with my life. There is a Ton more about this etc... but that is the long/short of it. Last, it finally hit me last night that the last time I was ever to be at THAT house, was Easter night, on the front porch, walking away. Who would have thunk that 5 months ago?!?!? How depressing. When the house sells, I plan to hire a mover to come and pack whatever I end up with and personal stuff. I can't ever come back there.
HER: "You're right. It's very depressing. I tell you everyone how sad it is that you've worked so hard to have this nice house that you're not even able to enjoy. [censored] for everyone. I'm sorry. I will give you space"
I helped our son buy her a Mothers Day gift and she texted telling me thanks (i told her it was from our son and not me). She said she knew and said she LOVED it with heart emjoi's etc...
Other than that, I have had no communication with her. Just wondering if I made a mistake? She was obviously opening up to me by having friendly conversations, texting for no particular reason other than to tell me meaningless stories, etc.
Thoughts?
If she's with OM, there's really nothing you can do but try to move on and hope that she wakes up before you lose your feelings for her.
You literally cannot work on your R if OM is in the picture.
So in your opinion did I make the right move on my comments to her about not texting me about stuff other than coordination issues?
Hi Sellout, in one of the newbie readings I believe it says to never give away any DB or LRT tactics. They're for you only. That seems to be what you're asking about? In my situation my W can care less about how I am processing things.
Also, be careful about what you interpret. I have not fully learned this yet but interpret nothing of your WS words and only some of their actions. This is what I'm currently stuck on.
I think you did the right thing with the Mothers Day gift. Similar to the approach I took. My W even told me not to acknowledge it.
I think you did the right thing, Sellout. You have to let her go before she will ever consider coming back.
Thanks all. Makes me feel better about my choice. Ultimately, I figured, she isn't going to miss me if I am always there for her stories, jokes, needs etc. Her not mentioning the divorce is another animal all together.
sellout...you made the right choice. That is one of the boundaries that I have been recommending to you for a long time. I know it isn't easy, but it is something that needed to happen in order for you to make progress.
Now, you have to remain consistent.
Thanks LITB. I can honestly say that is was very difficult. However, even based on her initial response of saying "I'm Sorry" feels like that she may even be questioning the whole thing. She has made ZERO progress on divorce, plans, preparation, packing to move, etc... She is either in denial or doesn't want a divorce. Crazy times.
Sellout,
You did the right thing and you need to stick to your word. If you go back on your word she will continue to cake eat through the summer. Let the D process play out and if she wants to stop it she will let you know.
IMO you need to call your lawyer and get 50% custody of your son.
That is my plan. I am sticking to my guns (not being rude or mean) and let it play out.
I'd say the concept is good but the execution is meh. Next time I think you should use your actions and not your words to convey your beliefs. Just stop conversing with her on those other topics rather than make a grand statement about it, you know?
But it's a good step. Now stick to it.
Thanks Kaizen. I did try to ONLY execute it and I got hit with messages from her like "why are you ignoring me", ""you are so transparent on not responding to me", etc... and that is why i decided to tell her as much. I think we are good from here. Thanks.
Hi Sellout, shes just wondering why she doesnt have you wrapped around her finger. When she asks you "why are you ignoring me" you can just say you are focusing on you or i am learning to move forward.
I might even go as far as saying, "nothing much to talk about if you are still w OM .... or since we are separating" but only if you truly mean it and are headed that way.
I think your choice was a good one. You placed a healthy boundary (boundaries are for protecting yourself, not trying to control others) and now you must stick to it. You also made sure her final impression of you was a good one, keeping it light and happy reminds her of your good qualities. Truly she is a fool for leaving you.
I need a MAJOR hit with a 2X4!!! After the baseball game yesterday, we embraced in a hug, took a selfies together (that i was tempted to send to OM), and went to dinner together as a family. Had good times along the way and have been friendly today. Stupid!!!!!
Well so much for boundaries. She knows she has you wrapped around her little finger. Let me guess, you paid for dinner.
What is your plan moving forward?
Yep, paid for dinner. My plan...well not real sure. She thinks I am dating someone and that is somewhat serious (neither of which are true). However when she stated this I didn't confirm or deny which pissed her off. Its such a messy situation. She told OM she had dinner with me and he was pissed stating that he thought I was trying to get her back, etc... what a warped situation that I don't know how to get out of.
Sellout,
She is enjoying getting attention from both of you.
IMO you have one move. Starting now no contact other than if it concerns your son. Detach and GAL. Move forward with the divorce if she wants to stop it she will.
Hugging her and taking her out dinner when she is in an open affair makes you look really weak.
One day at a time.
You are sooooooo right. Its all about self control which I am obviously lacking. Uggggg, I hate this so much.
Don't beat yourself up. BUT, learn from your mistakes so you don't repeat them.
After the baseball game yesterday, we embraced in a hug, took a selfies together (that i was tempted to send to OM), and went to dinner together as a family. Had good times along the way and have been friendly today. Stupid!!!!!
This is why I said that the words you said to her didnt really matter. If you cant back them up with your actions, then not only do they not mean anything, it means she cant believe the next thing(s) you say.
She told OM she had dinner with me and he was pissed stating that he thought I was trying to get her back, etc
Why are you talking to her about OM?
what a warped situation that I don't know how to get out of.
You know how. We're telling you how. You just dont want to do it.
So my wife now thinks I am dating someone (which is not true but I also didn't deny or confirm). So for the last 3 days since she started to think this she now doesn't talk to me. She went from super chatty all of the time, going to dinner, texting a lot...to now, no contact. Since she is no longer allowed to cake eat, perhaps she is mad at me for something? Logic?
She's projecting. When people cheat, they often become paranoid about their partner being with someone else.
She's projecting. When people cheat, they often become paranoid about their partner being with someone else.
Meaning what exactly?
For example, your spouse may be thinking about transferring all of the money out of your joint bank accounts into her private account. Because she's consider that, she thinks you must be thinking the same thing.
Little do they know, most of us are so blindsided and dumbfounded, that all we want to do is make things better. It's evil meets innocence.
Sellout,
She's testing you to see if she still has you wrapped around her finger. Stay NC unless it regards your son.
It appears to me by her actions of being mad, calling me names and now not contacting me, that she still has feelings for me. What sad is that it really is a sick game that people play to see how far they can go or how much they can get away with. well progress it seems. yes, NC for sure. No dinners, etc...stay tuned.
So my wife now thinks I am dating someone (which is not true but I also didn't deny or confirm). So for the last 3 days since she started to think this she now doesn't talk to me. She went from super chatty all of the time, going to dinner, texting a lot...to now, no contact.
Basically, my answer is 'so'? We cant read her mind, so theres no point in trying. Is she upset because she doesnt like your boundary? maybe. Is she busy with OM and doesnt give a care about you? maybe. Does it really matter though?
Since she is no longer allowed to cake eat
She isnt? You posted that you were 'friendly' on Tuesday. Thats TWO days ago. This whole situation can take years to finally unfold - look for long term trends, not slight bits of noise one way or the other.
It appears to me by her actions of being mad, calling me names and now not contacting me, that she still has feelings for me. What sad is that it really is a sick game that people play to see how far they can go or how much they can get away with. well progress it seems. yes, NC for sure. No dinners, etc...stay tuned.
Sellout,
I don't think you see the error in your approach to DB'ing. You are so focused on your W and her ways, that you don't even realize the role that you continue to play.
Every minute spent focusing on your W/OM, is a minute wasted on not focusing on yourself. That is time that cannot be replaced. I suggest to invest all of your time on self improvement. Either you choose to lead the way by fixing yourself, or you choose to let her lead the way. Her way has kept you planted in the front seat of the emotional roller coaster, which is a clear sign that you are not detached.
Read back through your threads. You will see patterns of instability. I know the emotional roller coaster scks. Please don't skim through people's advice. Read it and try to understand how it can help you navigate through your sitch.
So dust yourself off and start focusing on yourself.
-GAL - fill your calendar with things to do for YOU.
-Work on Detachment - read about it, understand it and practice it (GAL is a key component to get there)
-Consistentency on your boundaries
-Read Sandi's rules and follow them
Here is a question for you. Describe what your ideal partner would be like. For example: communicative, humble, confident, considerate, etc.
Once you have described your ideal partner. Make it a goal to become that person.
Now I just gave you my time. I'm challenging you to do something with it.
This is why I said that the words you said to her didnt really matter. If you cant back them up with your actions, then not only do they not mean anything, it means she cant believe the next thing(s) you say.
She told OM she had dinner with me and he was pissed stating that he thought I was trying to get her back, etc
what a warped situation that I don't know how to get out of.
Sellout
you need to take in what people tell you and process it. Don't ignore it.
From LITB
...
I don't think you see the error in your approach to DB'ing. You are so focused on your W and her ways, that you don't even realize the role that you continue to play.
Every minute spent focusing on your W/OM, is a minute wasted on not focusing on yourself. That is time that cannot be replaced. I suggest to invest all of your time on self improvement. Either you choose to lead the way by fixing yourself, or you choose to let her lead the way. Her way has kept you planted in the front seat of the emotional roller coaster, which is a clear sign that you are not detached.
Read back through your threads. You will see patterns of instability. I know the emotional roller coaster scks. Please don't skim through people's advice. Read it and try to understand how it can help you navigate through your sitch.
THIS^^^^^^
Ok guys it has been about three weeks since I last posted and wanted to provide an update and get some advice.
She is still seeing OM. We had dinner (kissed), we went to counseling a couple of times, we went to brunch, we took a nice selfie together, etc... more and more. She broke up with the OM and then got back with him. More of the same mess. One weeks she wants to "possibly work on marriage" next week "I have no desire to work on this marriage"
I am now going dark. What is everyone's thoughts on telling her that I am going to start dating someone else?
Also, we finally made it to court and they decided to give us 9 months to complete mediation. Maybe that is a blessing in disguise to allow the TIME thing on here that everyone seems to think works?
Thoughts?
Why I the hell would you start dating someone else right now?
You've not posted here in almost a month and that's what you come up with - telling W you are going to date? Really? Get back to the DB basics. Do not date and don't okay games by claiming you are. Scheeeeeeesch
.
I know it's frustrating. My wife and have not had physical interaction except kissing since october. She barely kisses me but will do it all with the OM. Sometimes our physical needs of sex and affection get in the way of our goal.
I considered this myself but had to ask myself what could come of this? Not one scenario ended well. Just a recipe for for disaster. Disaster for marriage, you, and your new mate.
I am now going dark. What is everyone's thoughts on telling her that I am going to start dating someone else?
I think you're insane. The very next thing you say is "we're going to have time, which is what we need" and the above is your plan? You actually WANT to fix your M right now. At least it sounds that way. Why the heck would you intentionally make things WORSE?
Lying about dating is being cruel for the sake of being cruel. I promise you that will not make you feel better. I promise that will make you feel worse.
ACTUALLY dating will do nothing but complicate your life right now. It will not resolve your feelings about your W. It may actually make them more ambiguous. You WILL drive an even bigger wall between you and your W (I promise, no matter how high and thick the wall is, it will get higher and thicker, no matter how impossible that seems).
I remember your first thread. I remember thinking that you were a lot like me in temperament and personality. So here's what else you'll get: you get the joy of questioning if you're doing the right thing. Doing things for the right reasons. Involving yourself in someone else's life for the right reasons. No matter how many times you answer those questions affirmatively, you will ask them again, because you know your perceptions are untrustworthy and you're not sure if you're working with good data.
I also think you're enough like me to ignore this advice. But assuming you're smarter than I am, your plan to go dark sounds like a good one. Detach. GAL. Don't worry about what she's doing or who she's doing it with. IF you want your M back, that's the ONLY way it's going to happen.
Ok, got it, not dating. A friend of mine recommended hand writing on nice stationary, a letter describing my feeling and what I want. Thoughts?
LOL that's the opposite of going dark.
Ok, got it, not dating. A friend of mine recommended hand writing on nice stationary, a letter describing my feeling and what I want. Thoughts?
If your wife is living with OM, Im positive she doesnt care a bit about what you want.
She is not living with OM and the frequency in which they see/talk with each other has waned over the last couple of months. So, just out of curiosity, what harm for a letter do?
She knows what your feelings are, you have been pursing her from day one. This makes you look weak, needy and unattractive in her eyes.
She is not living with OM and the frequency in which they see/talk with each other has waned over the last couple of months. So, just out of curiosity, what harm for a letter do?
What good do you think the letter would do?
Saying the same thing yet again with pretty handwriting is going to sway her?
She is not living with OM and the frequency in which they see/talk with each other has waned over the last couple of months. So, just out of curiosity, what harm for a letter do?
Sorry, my misunderstanding. I thought you wrote that earlier, but I apologize for not going bac and double checking.
Regardless, I dont believe at this time she isnt interested in what YOU need.
Sellout,
What have you learned from all the advice that has been given to you? What have you done with it?
You said that one week your W wants to work on your M, the next she doesn't. You aren't much different. You both shift with the wind. Where do you expect the stability in your M/R to come from if neither of you are stable?
When you choose to stabilize yourself, your chances of success will increase. Until then, 9 months/5 years/10 years will not make a difference.