Hello there,
First post. I have always been very attentive to my W and I decided to pull a 180 to get her attention. I went out with my friend to a concert but did not tell her.
Sorry, a little background is needed here. My W has not told me her whereabouts or plans for at least 2 months now. She is very busy with her neighborhood organizations and helping with a campaign for office. She does respond call back sometimes when I call or text. I found her in pics with another guy on fb. She swears she is not seeing anyone and if she is " I will be the first to know". She has been to his house and out dancing w him. He posted video on fb (don't you know your friend's friend's can see your activity?) We do live together but there is no touching except for sex which involves no kissing. We sleep under separate blankets in the same bed. I pay the bills and she does not cook, clean or eat at the house. She is always on the phone with friends (male or female) and does not look at me while talking. She does not let me see who she is on the phone with. She has been buying new clothes every pay day (including sexy underwear). She is planning to spend her birthday at the end of this month somewhere without me.
So back to the concert. She called me at the concert and I told her I went out and she got really upset and said that was messed up. She also asked if when she goes out could she get me as the driver for uber (I drive UBER on weekends) I said no I would have to be in her area.
The following Monday I came home from work and she interrupted what I was talking about and asked if I will sign the papers uncontested. I did not know what she was talking about. She was referring to the D papers. I became flustered and we made a date for her to leave the house. I also apologized for not telling her my whereabouts and have laid low ever since. Should I have stuck to my guns I have been a doormat for my W and need help.
Welcome to the board
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm and Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htmYou may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH. Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...224#Post2578224Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.
Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
Keep strong and learn about yourself!
Keep talking to people on here and in the real world!
I just re-read Sandi's list of rules to abide by.
These 2 are my favorite:
32. Do not believe anything they say and 50% of what they do. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because he/she is hurting and scared.
33. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel.
I am hopeful but need to stay plan focused and prayed up.
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
Will do thanks for the advice.
My wife has 2 playlists on my spotify (we share the account) that have the most depressing breakup and divorce songs. If you want to get an idea how bad it is, google babyface's love marriage and divorce. There is a song on there where Toni Braxton wishes nothing but pain on the ex
Next Post
My W has basically walked all over me since here " i don't love you anymore BD almost a year ago" She goes out any/anytime she wants and does not say where she is going. She has said she would rather go to Hell than stay in this marriage (we are Christian). She made a revenge list of things she will do to hurt me (take away access to youngest daughter, sleep with other men, leave me in financial ruin) that she keeps with her phone at all times. She even takes the list with her when we go to church. I bought her tix to see her favorite singer in concert for Christmas and she took someone else to punish me. On Valentine's Day she received a portable cooler from a man but she would not say who bought her the gift. She did not get me anything for Valentines Day. My wife is punishing me for the lies I have told in the past (problems with hiding money and lying when caught has been an issue) She said she forgives me but I see no evidence of that. I have sought counseling for my issues and am continuing to work on that. I pay all the bills, (she does not work) come home and do the chores and get dinner going (with help from my oldest daughter). I want to kick her out but I have not seen anyone on the boards who has done so. Please advise if you have taken this course of action and what have been the results.
I am especially hoping Sandi2 replies.
Nate please stick to one thread until you get to 100 posts.
I am sorry but your previous post was merged to the wrong thread so I copied it and put it here above.
My W has basically walked all over me since here " i don't love you anymore BD almost a year ago" She goes out any/anytime she wants and does not say where she is going. She has said she would rather go to Hell than stay in this marriage (we are Christian). She made a revenge list of things she will do to hurt me (take away access to youngest daughter, sleep with other men, leave me in financial ruin) that she keeps with her phone at all times. She even takes the list with her when we go to church. I bought her tix to see her favorite singer in concert for Christmas and she took someone else to punish me. On Valentine's Day she received a portable cooler from a man but she would not say who bought her the gift. She did not get me anything for Valentines Day. My wife is punishing me for the lies I have told in the past (problems with hiding money and lying when caught has been an issue) She said she forgives me but I see no evidence of that. I have sought counseling for my issues and am continuing to work on that. I pay all the bills, (she does not work) come home and do the chores and get dinner going (with help from my oldest daughter). I want to kick her out but I have not seen anyone on the boards who has done so. Please advise if you have taken this course of action and what have been the results.
I am especially hoping Sandi2 replies
Nate, I'm sorry to hear about what's going on in your sitch... Your going to want to provide some more information to really get some good feedback, such as how long have you been married, what have you been doing in the last year since the ILYBINILWY speech, what did she say the issues where, when you say you hid money, what what were you hiding it for.. Ages of kids, how was your sex life prior to ilybnilwy speech, etc..
I can tell you if Sandi does stop by, your gonna need to put a helmet on... Have you been working on getting a life?
You said that she doesn't work, how does she pay to go out, are you footing the bill for that? If she wants to go out, let her figure out how to make the money to pay for it...
NateM,
The vet's will show up. My advice to you is LISTEN TO THEM. This is a very serious situation and you need to show no fear and follow their advice. She is disrespecting you BIG TIME. No Respect, No love. This can be fixed. You can do this, but you have to go "all in" or it is all for not. Just take a deep breath, step back, and don't do ANYTHING right now. Keep posing and wait for the advice.
Nate, I'm sorry to hear about what's going on in your sitch... Your going to want to provide some more information to really get some good feedback, such as how long have you been married, what have you been doing in the last year since the ILYBINILWY speech, what did she say the issues where, when you say you hid money, what what were you hiding it for.. Ages of kids, how was your sex life prior to ilybnilwy speech, etc..
I can tell you if Sandi does stop by, your gonna need to put a helmet on... Have you been working on getting a life?
You said that she doesn't work, how does she pay to go out, are you footing the bill for that? If she wants to go out, let her figure out how to make the money to pay for it...
Married 13 yrs
Dated 4
3 kids 2 stepkids 1 from our marriage
Since the speech, I have been trying to be the nice guy and avoid trouble. I clean the house, I cook dinner (my stepdaughter helps she is a better cook). I spend more time with the kids.
She says the issue is I have lied too many times she does not know if she even likes me let alone be married to me. I have lost 52 lbs and weigh what I did in high school. (she says I look Ethiopian and need to gain weight)
Since last year I have tried to show I have changed. On christmas I broke down and cried twice once in front of family (her mother included) when mom was praising me for being a good man and stepping in to take care of my wife and her kids when her ex left. ( I met her a year and a half after they split). i cried again later when a good friend who is a Christian marriage counselor asked what is wrong and kept probing me. I told him the situation and him and his wife got involved. These people know my wife better than me so it seemed like a good progress. We met later that night after family had left and began to talk about the marriage. i explained I had lied about spending money (our 401k is down from 15k to 1500) and that I had done that (spent money, checks in the mail, etc) without her knowledge in the past. After the meeting we prayed and it was quiet. My friend told me no to touch any money without permission from my W and I agreed.
Later that night I confessed another issue with money I did not mention (I drive uber and they give incentives to new drivers) The amount of the referral changed and when I told her she thought I was lying again.
We got past that (in a rather ugly way, she made a revenge list and listed every possible way to hurt me and set a timeline. She also said she would rather go to hell than to stay in this marriage)..since then it has just gotten worse. She seems to only enjoy time with me in the backyard when we are tending to her garden. My home life consists of no communication with her, no touching, she does not look at me when she talks to me. She is always busy on her phone either playing spades or sodoku or solitaire or talking/texting one of the people on her various committees she is on (one friend of hers is running for congress, she is on his committee. they have a radio show she is co host. she is on the neighborhood council, she is a part of LGBT committee. she is a part of First 5LA and best start) we still go to church together and even attend marriage class LOL.
She still lives with me today, go figure :{
Prior to the BD our sex life was mundane. Very routine and she slowly stopped kissing me as much (she blamed my morning breath) I also struggled with impotence prior to losing thee weight. The impotence has returned recently. I told her about viagra she did not want me to get it she said i never needed it before.
To try to make up for this I bought her tix to a concert for one of her favorite singers. The concert was in January and she took someone else. She did not say who she took with her. I was upset with her when she came home but we ended up having sex that night.
In regards to GAL, I workout during lunch (which helped me drop the weight, but really I think it is stress). I stay at home a lot because she has our car (it is in her name but I pay the insurance, gas and car loan)
thanks @blueboy, much appreciated
thank you @cubebot much appreciated
Nate, I'm sorry to hear about what's going on in your sitch... Your going to want to provide some more information to really get some good feedback, such as how long have you been married, what have you been doing in the last year since the ILYBINILWY speech, what did she say the issues where, when you say you hid money, what what were you hiding it for.. Ages of kids, how was your sex life prior to ilybnilwy speech, etc..
I can tell you if Sandi does stop by, your gonna need to put a helmet on... Have you been working on getting a life?
You said that she doesn't work, how does she pay to go out, are you footing the bill for that? If she wants to go out, let her figure out how to make the money to pay for it...
Married 13 yrs
Dated 4
3 kids 2 stepkids 1 from our marriage
Since the speech, I have been trying to be the nice guy and avoid trouble. I clean the house, I cook dinner (my stepdaughter helps she is a better cook). I spend more time with the kids.
She says the issue is I have lied too many times she does not know if she even likes me let alone be married to me. I have lost 52 lbs and weigh what I did in high school. (she says I look Ethiopian and need to gain weight)
Since last year I have tried to show I have changed. On christmas I broke down and cried twice once in front of family (her mother included) when mom was praising me for being a good man and stepping in to take care of my wife and her kids when her ex left. ( I met her a year and a half after they split). i cried again later when a good friend who is a Christian marriage counselor asked what is wrong and kept probing me. I told him the situation and him and his wife got involved. These people know my wife better than me so it seemed like a good progress. We met later that night after family had left and began to talk about the marriage. i explained I had lied about spending money (our 401k is down from 15k to 1500) and that I had done that (spent money, checks in the mail, etc) without her knowledge in the past. After the meeting we prayed and it was quiet. My friend told me no to touch any money without permission from my W and I agreed.
Later that night I confessed another issue with money I did not mention (I drive uber and they give incentives to new drivers) The amount of the referral changed and when I told her she thought I was lying again.
We got past that (in a rather ugly way, she made a revenge list and listed every possible way to hurt me and set a timeline. She also said she would rather go to hell than to stay in this marriage)..since then it has just gotten worse. She seems to only enjoy time with me in the backyard when we are tending to her garden. My home life consists of no communication with her, no touching, she does not look at me when she talks to me. She is always busy on her phone either playing spades or sodoku or solitaire or talking/texting one of the people on her various committees she is on (one friend of hers is running for congress, she is on his committee. they have a radio show she is co host. she is on the neighborhood council, she is a part of LGBT committee. she is a part of First 5LA and best start) we still go to church together and even attend marriage class LOL.
She still lives with me today, go figure :{
Prior to the BD our sex life was mundane. Very routine and she slowly stopped kissing me as much (she blamed my morning breath) I also struggled with impotence prior to losing thee weight. The impotence has returned recently. I told her about viagra she did not want me to get it she said i never needed it before.
To try to make up for this I bought her tix to a concert for one of her favorite singers. The concert was in January and she took someone else. She did not say who she took with her. I was upset with her when she came home but we ended up having sex that night.
In regards to GAL, I workout during lunch (which helped me drop the weight, but really I think it is stress). I stay at home a lot because she has our car (it is in her name but I pay the insurance, gas and car loan)
I had to jump offline yesterday when the W came home. So she is always buys, never available, but we still attend church together and even marriage class together as to save face.
I have admitted to my wrongdoing and have chosen a better path. I lied to not upset W. That is really a cop out. Adults do not hide when they do wrong. Is that not what I taught my kids to do? Face problems?
So my W had a talk with me and said she did not believe tha she gave me any indication she wanted back into this relationship. We agreed on a date of her moving out the house which is after June 24, the date my youngest graduates midddle school.
Here it is:
W,
I've been through some very tough moments since you decided to leave, as you know. My love for you is so deep that I just couldn't wrap my head around the possibility of life without you. To a person like me, I honestly expected to marry only once and to remain committed for life, it has been a severe shock to see our relationship begin to unravel.
I cannot believe how utterly stupid I have been. When I think of the mountains of disrespect you have shown me I want to throw up for being so weak. I actually believed your character and inner strength would rise above the temptation to do such things. I thought this whole thing would just work itself out. I see now that I was dead wrong.
I was crystal clear when I said if you want to date other people, you cannot do it here. I will not tolerate your behavior nor will I enable you to do so. You need to find a place to stay other than here.
I can no longer allow you to hurt our family. I do not think (mention of our kids) deserve to be taken down this broken road with you. I do not know where you got the idea that you could sleep in our bed, under our roof, wear clothes I paid for, go to church together, go to marriage class together, drive a car I pay for and hide the fact that you are having an affair? I can hear you saying to yourself, “What an idiot. He thinks he is impressing me, but it's too little and way too late, now. I could care less how he works his tail off, because it has no affect on my feelings.” Your arrogance is astounding to me. You have turned into a selfish being that I do not recognize anymore.
You were my first real love, and I’ll never forget the memories that we shared. You married me of your own free choice. I did not blackmail you or twist your arm or offer you a bribe. It was a decision you made without pressure from me. So I will not pressure you to stay with me. I will pray for you and trust that God will guide you in the years ahead.
Nate please stick to one thread until you get to 100 posts.
Why are you not getting my message?
Do you not believe what I am writing?
I am starting to think maybe something else is going on here that I do not understand!
Nate, do not give her that letter, it will only push her further away... Just work on you and let her do what she's going to do. If you say anything about moving out, just say something like "that is what is best, I will not be a part of a 3 person marriage and I am willing to let you go"...
Nate, do not give her that letter, it will only push her further away...
YUP.
sorry about the stick to one thread part. I understand now
DO you understand that I REALLY want to give her that letter.
Her birthday weekend is coming up (yes I said weekend) and she plans to spend it without me.
I am trying to nip this thing in the bud, she has only known me to be super passive. I would like to take my balls back now please and thank you.
Sorry if that sounds mean, but that is what I want to tell her.
She goes out every night and does not tell me where she is going. She does not call at all, I initiate all the convo.
I did not talk to her (initiate conversation) on Thursday and Friday and she got mad at me!
She said on Saturday when I said good morning, "You haven't been talking to me before why start now." It just burns me a little bit each time.
BTW I do not think telling her to leave will push her further away. She has threatened to do so at least twice (One time she had a bag of clothes and sat in the car until I folded and said she did not have to go) and the other time she was upset (would not tell me why) and said she needed to think because I was kicking her out, she was unhappy and blamed me for it. I crumbled again and said she can stay.
So I have not shown her that I have the guts to go through with it and she is fine with that. Also, we had a talk one time about how I was holding on and she said ,"I wouldn't put up with it if that was me. I don't why you do it (she meant give up on the marriage). I said, " I guess you and I are just 2 different people."
So you see, over and over I have played the doormat and over and over she is almost begging me to man up to her.
Another question, if I don't do something am I not letting her cake eat all over me?
Sorry, I am on a tear right now.
You know what bothers me the most? Her phone. Her secrecy with her phone and how everything shuts down when she gets a text or a call. The kids notice too. It does not matter where we are or what we are doing, the phone gets priority.
Even if she is dead tired and falling asleep, if the phone buzzes she will check it.
How do I deal with my rage over the phone?
The letter doesn't come across as manning up. It comes across as whining.
I'm not familiar enough with your situation to offer a good suggestion of what manning up in your case would look like, but I know this isn't it.
I'm more sympathetic than I sound, I promise. Sending the letter is not in your best interests.
Nate,
I looks exactly like the letter I wrote, the next day she mentioned that she had found some council online that referred to a book that I was reading that contained the basic information. It did no good for me, I would recommend not giving it to her. Take your balls back through action, letters are just talk...Another mistake I have made in this mess that we find ourselves in.
Ok in regards to GAL
I do not have a car to do much in the afternoon/evening when I get home. I commute via the bus and would have to commute to do extra activities.
I have movie night with my kids on MON night, Tues is book club (silent reading with the kids) Wed is free night, Thurs the kids and I go grocery shopping in the evening. Friday evening I take my youngest to martial arts class.
At work I have an office job but we have an awesome gym upstairs. I lift weights and attend yoga classes M-F.
As for the weekends they are lonely. My wife will be gone all day and I just sit at home.
If I had a car I would cross off some things on my bucket list:
Learn Salsa
run another marathon/maybe try an triathlon
Find another church to attend
attend a solid bible study during the week
get new clothes ( I lost 52 lbs since last June)
have a ton of friends over on weekends (barbecues, play card games/ board games)
go out to movies with kids
So you think that your 180 should be more pursuit of her.
More of the same.
That you will get her back by loving her back into a relationship with you?
Sorry it does not work that way.
Don't send the letter.
You deal with your rage by STF up and stop trying to do what has not been working so far.
@Rose888 @coffee_ I thank you for your advice it is very helpful.
I am just not sure why this letter would not help. Am I not setting my WW straight?
Also there is a question of what do I do if she does not leave? I would have to move out (abandon the kids) and stay somewhere else (most likely my parents who happen to live 2 doors down.)
Don't leave, it is the worse thing I could have done, I am now in a mess where we leave at different times.
I see that my posts are very scattered, so I do apologize for that. I assumed my situation was so bad that doing a 180 or going dark would be the solution.
@Cadet I don't see where me giving the letter is not a sign of me doing a 180. I really want to make this marriage work, but I do not see how unless I go to drastic measures.
Don't leave, it is the worse thing I could have done, I am now in a mess where we leave at different times.
Hence the reason why I should not send the letter?
Lets start out with basics.
Have you read the Divorce Remedy book?
How about the homework I gave you?
Especially Sandi's threads(5) and the pursuit and distance thread.
Right now my first suggestion besides reading the homework is to do NOTHING, you are spinning very badly and likely to do the wrong thing.
We need you to slow down and get yourself under control first!
OK?
Don't leave, it is the worse thing I could have done, I am now in a mess where we leave at different times.
Hence the reason why I should not send the letter?
The letter is just a bunch of words.
If I was advising her I would tell her to trust your ACTIONS not your words.
The same goes for YOU
My first post says to believe NONE of what she says and half of what she does.
@Cadet
Thank you, I do need to slow down.
I have the book, read the few first chapters, started defining what my goals were, skipped ahead to infidelity and then stopped reading.
My whole situation has been on 10 since I read some of her texts back on October. She was talking about breaking up with me with a guy she is seeing they also talked about her need for sex. I have been going downhill ever since. I have asked her about seeing someone else and she has always denied it. Since I read her texts I know she is lying.
So now I have a liar on my hands who says she is leaving me because of my lies (insert irony here).
I have begged her begged God, gotten friends involved, told my mama and nothing has worked.
I don't want my M to die.
Don't leave, it is the worse thing I could have done, I am now in a mess where we leave at different times.
Hence the reason why I should not send the letter?
The letter is just a bunch of words.
If I was advising her I would tell her to trust your ACTIONS not your words.
The same goes for YOU
My first post says to believe NONE of what she says and half of what she does.
So if my actions speak louder than words, than I would do the following:
Seek financial planning advisor (I have 2 now)
Find a Christian counselor who specializes in lie addiction.
Find a way to earn extra money to pay back my 401k
Don't leave, it is the worse thing I could have done, I am now in a mess where we leave at different times.
Hence the reason why I should not send the letter?
The letter is just a bunch of words.
If I was advising her I would tell her to trust your ACTIONS not your words.
The same goes for YOU
My first post says to believe NONE of what she says and half of what she does.
So if my actions speak louder than words, than I would do the following:
Seek financial planning advisor (I have 2 now)
Find a Christian counselor who specializes in lie addiction.
Find a way to earn extra money to pay back my 401k
Oh, and have a bulletproof positive attitude
Sorry for the spelling error
Oh, and have a bulletproof positive attitude
This...yes.
Oh, and have a bulletproof positive attitude
This...yes.
@focus22
Yeah, I am definitely going to need God's help with that one
I'd also like to chime in to say do NOT give her that letter. you put your thoughts down on paper, got em out of you, now throw it away. It won't change anything.
Work on yourself, that's the only thing you are in control of. Everything else will fall into place.
You can't control anything she does. That's her jam.
You can only control yourself.
You can do that by *deciding* to take a step back and do absolutely nothing in the moment, for the time being,
That then gives you the space to start to think, to start to process your feelings a bit and to bring yourself back to yourself.
That then gives you a sense of coherence and dignity in this utterly awful situation.
Not to say that it's not really, really difficult. But what are the alternatives? Begging, pleading, losing your sense of self and dignity?
I did that for years. But I've decided I'm worth much, much more than that.
Ok I can hear everyone yelling at me to not send the letter.
Are there any boundaries I can set at this time?
We have a joint checking account. Should I close it?
What about her cell phone? Should I stop paying the bill?
What about the car? Should I stop paying the note?
These thoughts plague me, I don't know how to set proper boundaries in this relationship.
BTW the WW has this master plan:
leave after June 24
Get hired to work in November (she is staff volunteer on a political campaign)
divorce me
run for office in March
make money and live happily ever after
NateM,
So what is your master plan?
Gain Peace of Mind (mental peace)
Pay off debt (financial peace)
Buy 2nd home (first one was foreclosed on, bad loan and bad with money)
raise kids
learn/ practice new hobby (muay thai or brazilian jiu jitsu) (physical peace)
learn to speak Spanish
become better cook
Serve at a new church and work in a new church ministry
Work from home if possible
complete college degree
vacation /camping with family
more family time (family peace)
Oh, in regards to church the WW and I are Sunday School teachers
Focus on your plan.
It is a good one and will help you move in the right direction and heal.
This is the DB way my friend. Focus on you. Be the best man and father that you can be.
I must be really jacked up from this, because in my mind I am thinking I should bust this thing wide open (her A) kick her out, let her deal with the consequences and then she will come to her senses and come back to our marriage and save our family.
I have seen her waiver a few times in the past, now she seems so determined to end the marriage. It is scary and is sending me on a back and forth roller coaster.
Focus on your plan.
It is a good one and will help you move in the right direction and heal.
This is the DB way my friend. Focus on you. Be the best man and father that you can be.
Does the process work for the marriage in the long run? Has anyone had their marriage restored? I have been in panic mode for some time now, I honestly don't know how to get off the crazy train.
learn/ practice new hobby (muay thai or brazilian jiu jitsu) (physical peace)
For what it's worth, I really enjoy Muay Thai. Very practical for burning calories and self-defense, and hitting things is very therapeutic
NateM,
Have you read DB or DR?
It is important that you understand at this point in your sitch, that you focus on you. The MR can not be worked on by one person. You can not control 2 people. So focus on you is all you can do.
Read cadets homework closely. Read DB/DR and stay the course.
The goal is to become the person only a fool would leave. If you become that person, and the fool leaves, then you may attract the person that you deserve down the road. But more importantly,mic the fool leaves you will be okay.
I know that answer may not be the one you want to hear, but it is the only viable option at this point.
@EDF
Thanks for the +1 for Muay Thai I am looking forward to participating.
I also want to regain that self confidence martial arts provides to not be so weak when talking to the WW.
NateM,
Have you read DB or DR?
It is important that you understand at this point in your sitch, that you focus on you. The MR can not be worked on by one person. You can not control 2 people. So focus on you is all you can do.
Read cadets homework closely. Read DB/DR and stay the course.
The goal is to become the person only a fool would leave. If you become that person, and the fool leaves, then you may attract the person that you deserve down the road. But more importantly,mic the fool leaves you will be okay.
I know that answer may not be the one you want to hear, but it is the only viable option at this point.
I read DR
That is actually awesome advice for me. When I met my WW I was a club dj. I was the man at the club and everyone wanted to come party at the club. I have since then settled down and only occasionally work weddings, no clubs.
But the fact that I was in high demand attracted WW to me. Also, I really was not interested in her back then because I really was all about djing. We were friends and then started having a lot of sex and next thing you know we are together and were virtually inseperable from that point on.
FYI,
It would tick her off royally but I could just come home and start playing music like I used to do back in the day. She ALWAYS ends up coming in the garage and dancing a bit or opening the garage door to see where I am at.
NateM,
Have you read DB or DR?
It is important that you understand at this point in your sitch, that you focus on you. The MR can not be worked on by one person. You can not control 2 people. So focus on you is all you can do.
Read cadets homework closely. Read DB/DR and stay the course.
The goal is to become the person only a fool would leave. If you become that person, and the fool leaves, then you may attract the person that you deserve down the road. But more importantly,mic the fool leaves you will be okay.
I know that answer may not be the one you want to hear, but it is the only viable option at this point.
I read DR
That is actually awesome advice for me. When I met my WW I was a club dj. I was the man at the club and everyone wanted to come party at the club. I have since then settled down and only occasionally work weddings, no clubs.
But the fact that I was in high demand attracted WW to me. Also, I really was not interested in her back then because I really was all about djing. We were friends and then started having a lot of sex and next thing you know we are together and were virtually inseperable from that point on.
I think I was a more complete man then. Happier (I work at an insurance company during the day) More confident (hard to care about one when there are multiple offers on the table) Life was good and I was in control. I have since handed the reigns over to the WW and have been choked and horsewhipped by her.
The thing that we all have in common (WS and LBS) is that we've lost ourselves somewhere along the way.
So this is a process of finding ourselves again. The things you used to be interested are a good start. But why not try new things as well? You might find you like a few of those things too.
I've discovered how much I like the company of other people, how interested I am in what they have to say and share with me. I've become a very sociable person over the past few months because of that and I don't really feel lonely now.
I wasn't really very sociable when I met my H, and throughout our relationship either. I was much more of an introvert, quite private and much more shy too. And I think now that my H actually carried most social interactions (he did enjoy that though, he was a total extrovert). Anyway, I'm actually really enjoying meeting new people now, and making deeper connections with some of the people I already knew a little.
I know there are going to be more interests for me to try and foster.
But this whole process takes time. It takes time and patience to try things, try new things and to find yourself. And time is the thing that you must give it for the process to flow, settle and deepen. You, as a human being, deserve that.
Hope that helps.
The thing that we all have in common (WS and LBS) is that we've lost ourselves somewhere along the way.
So this is a process of finding ourselves again. The things you used to be interested are a good start. But why not try new things as well? You might find you like a few of those things too.
I've discovered how much I like the company of other people, how interested I am in what they have to say and share with me. I've become a very sociable person over the past few months because of that and I don't really feel lonely now.
I wasn't really very sociable when I met my H, and throughout our relationship either. I was much more of an introvert, quite private and much more shy too. And I think now that my H actually carried most social interactions (he did enjoy that though, he was a total extrovert). Anyway, I'm actually really enjoying meeting new people now, and making deeper connections with some of the people I already knew a little.
I know there are going to be more interests for me to try and foster.
But this whole process takes time. It takes time and patience to try things, try new things and to find yourself. And time is the thing that you must give it for the process to flow, settle and deepen. You, as a human being, deserve that.
Hope that helps.
Isn't it funny that it feels like time is running out. Like if I don't do something now, all hope will be lost. She will fall into another man's arms they will get married and all will be lost.
I felt like that too, Nate. Time...every second was excruciating (especially early on).
Thing is, time passing is one of the things that helps shift your perspective towards something else. There are other things you need to do to make this shift (GAL, working on yourself...all those things), but it all takes time.
Taking time to decide how you want to react, taking time to post here, ask questions, get answers, process the information...none of that is wasted time. You're learning things, so that is never wasted time.
It is in that space that change starts to happen. You're giving yourself that time and space. You're giving yourself that gift. That's what makes you an adult.
Get where I'm coming from?
The thing that we all have in common (WS and LBS) is that we've lost ourselves somewhere along the way.
So this is a process of finding ourselves again. The things you used to be interested are a good start. But why not try new things as well? You might find you like a few of those things too.
I've discovered how much I like the company of other people, how interested I am in what they have to say and share with me. I've become a very sociable person over the past few months because of that and I don't really feel lonely now.
I wasn't really very sociable when I met my H, and throughout our relationship either. I was much more of an introvert, quite private and much more shy too. And I think now that my H actually carried most social interactions (he did enjoy that though, he was a total extrovert). Anyway, I'm actually really enjoying meeting new people now, and making deeper connections with some of the people I already knew a little.
I know there are going to be more interests for me to try and foster.
But this whole process takes time. It takes time and patience to try things, try new things and to find yourself. And time is the thing that you must give it for the process to flow, settle and deepen. You, as a human being, deserve that.
Hope that helps.
Isn't it funny that it feels like time is running out. Like if I don't do something now, all hope will be lost. She will fall into another man's arms they will get married and all will be lost.
Nate, the M was over on bomb drop day... Time is your friend cause you can still have her in your life while you prepare yourself to move on with or without her... Me personally, if she didn't work, I would cancel the cell phone... If that's her life line, I would snip it, unfortunately for me, my W makes about what I make (just a little more actually), so I just kept everything as normal, but if she didn't work, I woulda cut out all support.
Take some time and just worry about you, she's only worried about her and your chasing her, turn the tables around.
I would cancel the cell phone...If that's her life line, I would snip it.
Can I just chip in quickly here, with a thought I had on reading this?
This sounds a bit like doing something out of anger, or at least a desire for tit for tat.
To me, this is getting caught in a dynamic where there is someone else involved (and that someone else is her). So your focus isn't on yourself with that train of thought and that action. You're doing something to get back at her for what she's done to you. You're not detaching with that (as I see it anyway, but I may be wrong).
I actually agree with not paying for her phone any more. But it's because she has chosen to turn away from you and the M, and has decided to focus her attentions on a new R. And as a result of that, she does not benefit from anything that you would be sharing with your mate: your bed, your closeness and intimacy, your attention (beyond the attention you would give a neighbour), and all the little things you would do for someone you were especially close to (cooking surprise dinners, washing, buying little gifts and treats, paying for stuff to make her life easier).
But none of that is done out of anger ore a desire for tit for tat. It's done because essentially the focus is now on yourself and on living your own life.
Forgive me if I've gotten details of your sitch wrong, or for anything I've said that's out of place.
So, last night the WW got really sick and had to go to ER. (Ongoing severe sore throat since Saturday) She was moaning in pain and I did not console her like I usually do. She then gets dressed and goes downstairs to the car I follow and she is in a lot of pain I help her out of the drivers seat to the passenger we go to er. The severe sore throat is not mono, they did give her a heap of meds and morphine for pain. I take her home and put her in bed At the ER she thanked me like 3 times I said that is not necessary. This morning she thanked me twice in an email.
I ask you guys is this just her guilt talking? I know for a fact she is seeing at least one other guy, not sure if it is sexual but he will be with her for at least art of her birthday weekend celebration.
I ask you guys is this just her guilt talking? I know for a fact she is seeing at least one other guy, not sure if it is sexual but he will be with her for at least art of her birthday weekend celebration.
Nate, Dbing indicates that actions not words are key. I would encourage that you do not concern yourself about whether it is guilt or not.
I would thank a stranger the way she thanked you if they helped me when I was sick in pain. I would be genuine in doing it but it would not have to do with guilt nor anything else except that I am thankful for the help.
Stay focused on you my friend.
I forgot to mention, prior to our hospital trip we had a talk.
She wanted me to go the extra mile and find a way to come home early from work to watch our youngest daughter. she had a meeting to go to but could not tell me what the meeting is for.
I said no and kept leaving the room she would call me back and ask again, woundering why I could not just oblige her. I said I can't help her and she was on her own. I went upstairs she blocked the doorway to our bedroom to continue the conversation.
Eventually the conversation turned to her actions. I said I don't understand, if you want to be single, why are you here? She said where would she go (mind you weeks ago she made a whole big to do about the fact that she talked with her sister and had a place to stay should I make her leave and that I should not tell her mom if I know what is best for me. FYI Mom is a SOLID Christian who plays no games and pulls no punches. She calls a sin a sin and would MAKE my wife apologize and end the affair.)
She saw I did not falter as in the past and said she is looking for a job (stall tactic).
I keep reading Sandi2's posts and think I will pull back but put her bed things outside tonight. We have a joint account which is all of my money (she does not work) I will cancel direct deposit and pull out the balance once a check I wrote clears.
When she asks I will tell her that I the family finances are not for the single lady.
NateM,
I thought these little signs at first (The thank you's, the apologies, the nice gestures) were signs of hope - but going on 2 months now and it's just there way of maintaining some attachment to the M. Their actions speak louder then words and small gestures.
I got a chuckle out of your sore throat - my W had Strep a while back and I couldn't help but think it came from OM. No one else in the household had it.
Yes I thought the exact same thing. Plus add in the fact that she does not allow me to kiss her. Maybe this is the reason why.
Ok not very Christian of me but if your vengeful at all - you can smile at the fact that the OM may have it too - in my case I'm pretty sure he did as my W was sending him info on Urgent Care clinics.
That was a while back, now I'm actually praying both for my W and for the OM that they may both find their ways back to their M.
lol @PacLove I know the feeling.
I have a question about a post I found under Sandi2's rules for a newcomer LBH with a wayward wife. It lists several steps to take immediately to show the WW you are serious.
I have a question about this step
8-Cut off all joint cell phone plans (you are not financing W's affair by paying for her smartphone to continue conducting her A on the family's money)
My question is do I cancel her phone # or set her up with a separate plan and leave her with next months bill. I want to just drop her but I am sure that will be construed as heartless
I ask you guys is this just her guilt talking? I know for a fact she is seeing at least one other guy, not sure if it is sexual but he will be with her for at least art of her birthday weekend celebration.
Nate, Dbing indicates that actions not words are key. I would encourage that you do not concern yourself about whether it is guilt or not.
I would thank a stranger the way she thanked you if they helped me when I was sick in pain. I would be genuine in doing it but it would not have to do with guilt nor anything else except that I am thankful for the help.
Stay focused on you my friend.
I really appreciate you guys I feel like I am seeing the light
So last night she went to a baseball game with some friends. (Actually some people from the political campaign she is a part of). That was her event that she could not tell me about yesterday. I did not ask her where she was going she decided to divulge this information when she got home. I did not engage as much as I normally do. I was playing on my phone. I did tell her a little about my day (a dog followed me home) which in hindsight I should not have said.
I need to stop looking through her phone. It is an addiction of mine. I saw her selfies (really?! how old are we?!) and group pics. She is with some men I do not know.
In my mind I thought she was for sure with the man I believe she is having the EA with.
Oh, forgot to mention. I have to stop this habit I have of waiting at the garage door when she gets home. I greet her and help her with anything she is holding. I used to follow her around like a puppy after she got home in hopes my niceness would lead to something.
I remember one time I did not greet her at the door (I fell asleep) and she was keen to complain about it.
I know I am a whupped H and I need to cut her off. It will not be as easy as I first thought. I see I was very dependent on WW for my emotional needs. Couple that with the fact we did everything together. I mean like everything.Now that is gone and I keep hopping on and off the crazy train.
I have a question about this step
8-Cut off all joint cell phone plans (you are not financing W's affair by paying for her smartphone to continue conducting her A on the family's money)
My question is do I cancel her phone # or set her up with a separate plan and leave her with next months bill. I want to just drop her but I am sure that will be construed as heartless
earlier in your thread you stated "When she asks I will tell her that I the family finances are not for the single lady."
Have that conversation with her. First sit down and figure out what needs to be separated, cell phone, car insurance, car payment, etc., then sit with her and let her know when the last payment will be made by you and that she will need to reassign them to herself and start paying them or you will cancel them at that time. Of course, if the car loan is in your name as well, you may want to consider continuing to pay.
Don't do it in a vindictive manner, let her know that since she is intent on moving out and moving on, you need to start working on getting all the finances in order and this is the first step.
I thought DBindg was about actions over words. But I guess the move I want to make would be seen as vindictive.
Hi Step Up, I am catching up with your thread, and this may turn out to be a lengthy post. I want to start with this quote from you:
I found her in pics with another guy on fb. She swears she is not seeing anyone and if she is " I will be the first to know". She has been to his house and out dancing w him. He posted video on fb (don't you know your friend's friend's can see your activity?) We do live together but there is no touching except for sex which involves no kissing. We sleep under separate blankets in the same bed. I pay the bills and she does not cook, clean or eat at the house. She is always on the phone with friends (male or female) and does not look at me while talking. She does not let me see who she is on the phone with. She has been buying new clothes every pay day (including sexy underwear). She is planning to spend her birthday at the end of this month somewhere without me.
Start right here ^^^^^^^^. She is lying to you, b/c there is an OM. She may cover up or pass it off as "just friends", but she is in some type of inappropriate affair. My question to you is are you okay with it? Is a third person in your M a deal breaker?
If you will not tolerate an open M, then you must "step up" and make a lot of changes. I know right away you have all the traits of the nice-guy. Btw, if you have not read about it, there is free download online. Please read it ASAP. When you read it, you will understand the term of nice-guy. (And it doesn't mean to be a bad guy).
First thing you need to do is gear up as though you were going into the biggest challenge of your life. You must have all the tools and training you can get. read my threads about the wayward wife. Dont't skim over it, digest it. Read the link on detaching, b/c it's not what most people assumes. Read the link on setting boundaries. In fact, just read what Cadet posted.
So.......back to your quote above. Your W has a princess entitlement, and you are enabling her to continue. You have gone from being the respected head of the home to being in a subservient role. Maybe you have never behaved as though you were in charge, and you were the leader and provider of the family. Maybe you are not sure how to do it. You need to learn, b/c your W is carrying your b@lls around with her. So, think about it. How can you get back your b@lls?
I strongly advise you to stop treating her as a princess. She is not a princess, she's a spoiled br@t. She control your life and probably bullies you. Clearly, she has no respect for you. Nothing will work to save the MR, until she respects you as a man and as her H. Women are designed in such a way that they have to feel respect for a man in order to feel desire for him. I don't mean just doing the sex act, but for her to really desire you in her heart.........that feeling of being in love with her man. Know what I mean?
You are not making any brownie points by doing all the work at home, while she does whatever she pleases. Have you always done all the work? This dynamic must change immediately. No more miss spoiled br@t. She is a mother and a wife. She has a home with responsibilities. Those things should come first in her life.
In a healthy MR, there is no privacy between the spouses. In fact, one of the first signs something is not right is when you see her having several private phone calls. You know, like she leaves the room to talk, always has the phone glued to her, and doesn't share anything with you. But your W has excluded you from everything in her life. And, she has you under her thumb and has you stuck at home while she's gallivanting around and acting like a single woman with no responsibilities or accountability. She expects you to give her an account for every move you make.........and you apologized b/c you failed to tell her?? Yes, you most definitely are a doormat for her to wipe WW poop off her shoes.
You seemed surprised by the D papers. Has she discussed divorce with you?
Hi Step Up, I am catching up with your thread, and this may turn out to be a lengthy post. I want to start with this quote from you:
I found her in pics with another guy on fb. She swears she is not seeing anyone and if she is " I will be the first to know". She has been to his house and out dancing w him. He posted video on fb (don't you know your friend's friend's can see your activity?) We do live together but there is no touching except for sex which involves no kissing. We sleep under separate blankets in the same bed. I pay the bills and she does not cook, clean or eat at the house. She is always on the phone with friends (male or female) and does not look at me while talking. She does not let me see who she is on the phone with. She has been buying new clothes every pay day (including sexy underwear). She is planning to spend her birthday at the end of this month somewhere without me.
Start right here ^^^^^^^^. She is lying to you, b/c there is an OM. She may cover up or pass it off as "just friends", but she is in some type of inappropriate affair. My question to you is are you okay with it? Is a third person in your M a deal breaker?
If you will not tolerate an open M, then you must "step up" and make a lot of changes. I know right away you have all the traits of the nice-guy. Btw, if you have not read about it, there is free download online. Please read it ASAP. When you read it, you will understand the term of nice-guy. (And it doesn't mean to be a bad guy).
First thing you need to do is gear up as though you were going into the biggest challenge of your life. You must have all the tools and training you can get. First, read NMMNG, then read my threads about the wayward wife. Dont't skim over it, digest it. Read the link on detaching, b/c it's not what most people assumes. Read the link on setting boundaries. In fact, just read what Cadet posted.
So.......back to your quote above. Your W has a princess entitlement, and you are enabling her to continue. You have gone from being the respected head of the home to being in a subservient role. Maybe you have never behaved as though you were in charge, and you were the leader and provider of the family. Maybe you are not sure how to do it. You need to learn, b/c your W is carrying your b@lls around with her. So, think about it. How can you get back your b@lls?
I strongly advise you to stop treating her as a princess. She is not a princess, she's a spoiled br@t. She control your life and probably bullies you. Clearly, she has no respect for you. Nothing will work to save the MR, until she respects you as a man and as her H. Women are designed in such a way that they have to feel respect for a man in order to feel desire for him. I don't mean just doing the sex act, but for her to really desire you in her heart.........that feeling of being in love with her man. Know what I mean?
You are not making any brownie points by doing all the work at home, while she does whatever she pleases. Have you always done all the work? This dynamic must change immediately. No more miss spoiled br@t. She is a mother and a wife. She has a home with responsibilities. Those things should come first in her life.
In a healthy MR, there is no privacy between the spouses. In fact, one of the first signs something is not right is when you see her having several private phone calls. You know, like she leaves the room to talk, always has the phone glued to her, and doesn't share anything with you. But your W has excluded you from everything in her life. And, she has you under her thumb and has you stuck at home while she's gallivanting around and acting like a single woman with no responsibilities or accountability. She expects you to give her an account for every move you make.........and you apologized b/c you failed to tell her?? Yes, you most definitely are a doormat for her to wipe WW poop off her shoes.
You seemed surprised by the D papers. Has she discussed divorce with you?
First of all @Sandi2 thank you soo much for taking the time to read my input. I have been reading every post from you I can get my hands on. I printed the 37 rules and some other articles which I read constantly. I have the list of 13 steps the LBH needs to take including move my financial assets out of her grasp and cancel her portion of the family cell phone.
I have not asserted myself AT ALL.
I will not tolerate an open M It violates me, my family and my God.
I have not always done the housework, quite the opposite. She has kept the house clean and prepared meals in the past. That has been slowly dying. She is always gone so she does not eat at home much but she will come home and complain about the condition of the house (dishes in the sink, clothes on the floor, front door not locked, etc.)
She has not only talked abut D she made a revenge list with a timeline to intimidate me. She tried to get me to say yes I will sign the papers. She has also threatened that she will put me in the poorhouse and I will have to go on welfare to support myself.
It is vicious to say the least.
Mind you, she has been married before (first husband cheated on her with someone from the church) so she has been down this road before. I do not believe this to be an idle threat from her.
Oh, and yes I have read every article I can find on the WW. It was a relief to hear my situation being described to a T.
Oh, and yes I have read every article I can find on the WW. It was a relief to hear my situation being described to a T.
So here is the plan
Leave work early
remove money from joint accounts
get home and remove money stashed in house for Maui trip (yes we were planning to go to Maui as a family)
When she gets home tonight have here sleep outside the MBR
Tomorrow morning cancel her phone.
When she calls on the way to her trip I will tell her to have her OM help her with the bill.
So here is the plan
Leave work early
remove money from joint accounts
get home and remove money stashed in house for Maui trip (yes we were planning to go to Maui as a family)
When she gets home tonight have here sleep outside the MBR
Tomorrow morning cancel her phone.
When she calls on the way to her trip I will tell her to have her OM help her with the bill.
um, seems like a lot real fast. If your doing it to get a reaction from her, you want to hold back until your not emotional. I think the actions you want to take are fine, I'm just not sure you are doing them for you, instead of to hurt her.
I am not doing it to hurt her, more to get her attention and show I am serious since I have been so passive.
Remember she has planned a weekend getaway with this man and she does not know that I am onto her affair.
The list I was reading from Sandi2 said she should take a hit with a hard, maybe painful consequence of some kind.
This is my best chance to get her full attention, especially if she has to cancel plans and come home early.
One more thing to keep in mind, my WW was a very strong Christian at one time. This level of evil is something I have never seen in her before. It is like she is under a spell or something. I know that I must act out of love and genuine concern for her soul.
And mind you, if she wants to come back that is fine, but only if she accepts full responsibility for her actions, is remorseful and we mutually agree to forgive our pasts with no resentments. She will have to follow my accountability plan and seek christian marital counseling with me.
If she doesn't know that you know about the A, then maybe confront her with that knowledge first, then tell her that you will not live in a 3 person Marriage, and until she has NC with the OM, this is what you are doing.
She has always denied the A, whenever I asked/accused her.
I just know for sure because I have read the texts on her phone this week.
When I put her out the MBR I will tell her that I will not tolerate an open M.
But I will still go through with the plan so she knows I am serious.
Hello StepUp,
I'm so sorry for the situation you are in.
Boundaries are a good thing, but you need to be very cautious in how you present/implement them. Remember to keep you eye on the goal of reconciliation. Does your plan get you the response you are looking for?
Knowing what to do and what not to do at this point is crucial. Feel free to give me a call at 303-444-7004 to discuss how we can best help you determine what to do next.
Cristy
Resource Coordinator
The Divorce Busting Center
303-444-7004
I wish I could tell you guys last night went smoothly and that I passed with flying colors. I did not.
It was really difficult.
Sandi2, you were right, she is going to fight me to the death.
I moved the money to a separate checking account and have the money we stashed for the Maui trip but did not tell her what I have done yet.
She came come at about 11 or so, happy and dancing from wherever she had just came from.
I told her I thought she should sleep in a different room. She asked why, I said I think we should separate as this is not working. No mention of the affair as I thought she might become defensive again and deny the whole thing.
She went downstairs for a while. Then she started packing her stuff. She wanted me to stop her, I did not. She then asked me to put our daughter in the car with her so as not to wake her. I did not dispute/ I obliged. (She had said prior she had arranged to stay with her sister should she ever want to leave) She left. I did not stop her. She called me to say she was dropping off our daughter and she was going to go sleep in the car tonight. I said sleep in the car? No answer.
I put our daughter back in her bed (she was sound asleep the whole time). I went to bed. Maybe an hour later she is in the bedroom. She says her back is hurting (she has chronic back pain) and she is sleeping in the bed. I sit up and look her in the eye. I get up and attempt to hold her and said we can reconcile this. She pushes me away and does not want me to touch her. She gets in bed I massage her back for 10 mins and go to sleep.
Don't take this the wrong way, but WHAT!!!!! Let me ask you, are you willing to live in a Open Marriage? You need to man up and let her know what you will not accept, and what the consequence is if done. She doesn't want you to touch her but you give her a massage, dude, man up.
Let her know you saw the texts, tell her you will not be in a open marriage, tell her you will not share your marital bed with a cheater. Do not give her back massages or mixed messages. Tell her what she will need to do to get back in the M, and stick with it. I'm gonna go grab a quote from Sandi2 on being a lighthouse. Tell her all of this with confidence, stay strong and let her know you mean it..
To sum this another way...........the H must take a stand. He is the lighthouse. She is out there in the waves being tossed around by her emotions. When she looks at him, she needs to see him standing tall and strong. He shines a beam of light to show her how to get back into a healthy MR. It is up to her to follow the lighted way or remain in stormy waters. When he tells her what it will take to save the MR, that is shinning the beam of light..........he is showing her the way back. It takes a great deal of strength to stand firmly and not crash under the strain. If the lighthouse is sending mixed messages.......well, you can see what a mess it could be.
Amen Coconut, thank you so much!
I rarely stand up to the WW, I will pick myself up and press ahead
I feel that I have lost all my credibility because I folded last night. Not sure what is going to happen next. My gut tells me D papers will be waiting for me to sign when I get home tonight.
Step up, you'll be ok, a mistake doesn't end everything, but it does set you back. The key is consistency, and a mistake breaks up the consistency.
When you say you rarely step up to your WW, I just want to make sure it's clear that we are not suggesting you get angry, or loud, or any other attack mode. It's letting her know that you are not ok with something, and what the consequence of such action is if it's done (boundaries). I.e. We are married and it is not ok for you to come home at all hours of the night, I will be locking the doors at 11pm... Or, I will not live in or be a part of a open marriage, I will not share the marital bed with a cheater, etc... Re read the validation and boundaries links that cadet gave you on page 1.
Also, edit your profile to identify your sitch, just go to my stuff, then click on edit profile and go to the bottom.. See my stuff below this to get an idea of what to put.
Step up, you'll be ok, a mistake doesn't end everything, but it does set you back. The key is consistency, and a mistake breaks up the consistency.
When you say you rarely step up to your WW, I just want to make sure it's clear that we are not suggesting you get angry, or loud, or any other attack mode. It's letting her know that you are not ok with something, and what the consequence of such action is if it's done (boundaries). I.e. We are married and it is not ok for you to come home at all hours of the night, I will be locking the doors at 11pm... Or, I will not live in or be a part of a open marriage, I will not share the marital bed with a cheater, etc... Re read the validation and boundaries links that cadet gave you on page 1.
Also, edit your profile to identify your sitch, just go to my stuff, then click on edit profile and go to the bottom.. See my stuff below this to get an idea of what to put.
Not violent, nowhere near. just passive, allowing her to have her way in most situations
The list I was reading from Sandi2 said she should take a hit with a hard, maybe painful consequence of some kind.
I think this is when she knows the H is aware she's lying and there is some type of inappropriate contact with a third person.
I had to laugh when I read about her packing and wanting you to stop her, then sitting in the car wanting you to go get her. This is so typical of women.
I agree that you should confront her. My point in the WW threads about confrontation is for the H not to think confrontation, alone, is going to stop the A or wake her up. Many men think it will shock the W back into sanity again, or to see remorse......but it doesn't work. Confrontation should be to inform her that you know the truth and you plan to take steps to protect yourself. He doesn't have to tell what those plans are. He is not the one in the hot seat.
In your case, I believe you need to approach her and inform her that you know she's been deceitful. If she starts pulling you in by asking, "How, when, what did she do", don't start giving her details, b/c she is going to lie her way around it. Don't reveal your souce of intell, b/c she will turn it around and make it all about you invading her privacy. Just tell her you are aware and you will not tell her how you received the information (as though someone might have told, instead of suggesting you read it).
Whenever things arise about the money, her not sleeping with you, etc., just tell her, "I believe if the situation were reversed, you would have no problem understanding where I stand at this time".
Here's the thing........do not argue with her. Don't avoid her, but don't try to "explain" your reasons for what you do. She knows perfectly well why! It's just a woman's way of pulling in the man to argue and someway try to make him think he is wrong. Make your statement, then turn around and walk away.
Another response you can give when she is wanting something crom you is, "Considering the situation, I'm sure you will understand my refusal".
With a wayward, you must stand up to her. You simply cannot show a few moments of strength and then cave b/c she's squeezing out some tears or having a pity party. You did great the other night.....until she complained about her poor back. It may feel or sound cold, but you have to toll the line, b/c she will manipulate you like crazy. She has manipulated you all this time.
Did you search for no more mr. nice guy?
So.... this post will not be what you expected.
Friday evening she comes home and calls me to get in the car with her. She asks why there is only 3 bucks in the account and when was I going to tell her. I said today when she got home.
I said you are living as a single lady and that is not acceptable. I ask for her phone she hands it over. I go the thread of the guy she is having the EA with. I said the convo talks about you loving to spend time with "her panda bear" she says that panda bear is gay just like her other friend "sunshine" whom i do know about who is gay. She gets uber pissed. I than apologize stating I thought she was cheating but she is still living as a single woman. She asks why I cut the money off an affair does not cost anything. I said if one suspects someone of cheating that is what you are supposed to do. so she is really mad and she was crying. she goes to sleep. She wakes up a bit later and tells me that I probably won't approve but she has been in contact with one of her ex boyfriends over the years and he is offering her a place to stay she just wants to make sure she goes over the particulars before she accepts his offer. I become irritated because she knows I do like him the least over all of the male relationships I know she has had. (she has had a close relationship with an ex as their families are very close. I met him and we are great friends, more like brothers than anything)
The next day she proceeds to ask me again what she was doing that made me think it was ok to do what I did. i said I thought she was having an affair. She cried again and then went to her bedroom drawer she appears to be looking for something and is purging at the same time. She throws away cards I have given her over the years as well as a card our daughter gave to her. I tell her I am going to put the money back and apologize again.
I will tell you I did not want to write this post. I feel stupid for caving in, but I want to believe her so badly. She is not here right now, back to her plan of celebrating her birthday weekend without her husband or family.
so to review, I have tried kicking her out the marriage bed and that failed, I have tried removing the money from the accounts and that failed.
The steps I am taking are backfiring. She is getting away with murder only because I do not want to let her go and she knows that.
oh, Sandi2 I did find NMMNG it is almost me to a T
A - Her Ex is giving her a place to stay? isnt that cheating? Like doesnt that mean they been in contact recently enough to have a conversation about living arrangments.
B - how do you know if panda whatever is really gay. you met him?
C - Has she any right to get angry and upset for you taking the money? Is it hers?
D - Has she committed or atleast says she wants to be a faitful wife to you? Faitful wives dont make living arrangments with exes.
Stop apologizing to her. She doesnt deserve it.
I really wish I there was someone here whose situation was waaay worse than mine but came through with flying colors and could tell me everything is going to be alright.
I've read that in a healthy relationship the typical reaction to being accused of cheating is generally they seek to prove they are not, to offer assurances, reassert their feelings for the spouse, etc.
When someone is cheating, they tend to try and deny, make excuses, deflect blame, make the accuser feel like they are crazy, etc.
My WW definitely followed that pattern, and eventually the truth was bore out by evidence.
Sorry, but threatening to move in with an ex-boyfriend is not a normal healthy response to a spouse raising concerns!
When someone is cheating, they tend to try and deny, make excuses, deflect blame, make the accuser feel like they are crazy, etc.
My WW definitely followed that pattern, and eventually the truth was bore out by evidence.
Sorry, but threatening to move in with an ex-boyfriend is not a normal healthy response to a spouse raising concerns!
I have to agree with the above statements. She covered her tracks, and you bought it. Look, women should not have male friends that exclude the spouses.........period! I suppose she has you believing that is what the modern couple of today does, but I will go further and tell you that they also get divorced.
Whenever a so-called "friendship" exist between opposite sexes where they have private messages, it is trouble brewing. This is not how to affair proof your M! So many young men these days think it falls into the whole equality thing.......but that is crazy. If people don't wake up and see what is happening, I'm afraid M's of the future generation are doomed.
There is another LBH here on the board, who was told by his W that her new friend was gay. Some of us tried to tell him that even if the man was gay, it didn't stop her from having an EA with him.........and whatever the guy
was.......he was still having an inappropriate R with a married woman. I am going to tell you the same thing I told him.........you are being deceived. You totally took her word, only, b/c your feelings wanted to believe her.
Now, grow some b@lls and start wearing the pants in your family. Stop immediately apologizing to your W when you think she's upset at you. (If you are proven wrong, you can always go back and apologize at a later date). She played you like a fiddle.
And to make matter worse, you are going to put the money back into the account. You cannot be wish-wash like this. She is wayward and will ruin you financially, emotionally, and every way necessary in order to fulfill her selfish desires.
Grow a backbone b/c it's going to get a lot worse before it gets better. And the only hope of it getting better is for you to stop acting like her submissive little boy and start acting like a man. Every WW wants a real man who is not afraid to stand eyeball to eyeball with her and tell her the things he will not tolerate under his roof or in his M........and he's not afraid to back it up.
You cannot afford to believe anything she says. Sure you
want to, but that doesn't do a thing to cause her to be truthful...... and certainly doesn't change the facts. It's time to wake up and get your manhood in gear.
Sorry if you find this too harsh, but I'm going to talk to you as if you were my grown son. You have to change your soft ways or you will lose your W for good. You are scared of losing her now, and that's why you allow her to do this to you? You are doing the opposite of what you need to be doing.
She will challenge you, lie, deceive, swear by all that's holy........and still be just as wayward and rebellious as ever. Why? B/c she doesn't respect you, and she won't as long as you let her b.s. you. You just have to let her know you aren't going to put up with it.
She has to see your strength. I think every woman, in a heterosexual MR, has one thing in common. She wants her H to be stronger than her. I am talking inner strength. She needs proof that she can not run over you and play games.
Decide your boundaries, and start getting them set down. Have you read the post about boundaries? Don't state a boundary until you can back it up with some consequence if it is dishonored.........Otherwise, you make a fool out of yourself.
Lose the fear of letting her go. That fear will keep you in a submissive position.
Stepup, listen to Sandhi. I was like you being super nice, attentive, did everything for my W. She told me nothing was going on, just friends etc. Until i found hard proof. They will lie, lie, lie. They will lie like crazy, my W of 11 years turned into super crazy spy level liar.
Without hard proof, trust your gut.
Hey guys,
So my WW has presented an ultimatum. Either I allow her to stay with me and there will be competition for her time and affection or sign the D papers.
Also, I a note came to the house and my oldest daughter gave it directly to my wife. It was a note for a mandatory meeting at one of the middle schools my daughter may attend next year. My WW has been talking to the director via text messages.
I want to show up at the orientation tomorrow and then resume my plan of setting the boundaries. She has never confessed so me showing up may be the unwelcome shock needed. Besides she is going to be flirting with him in front of my daughter.
Oh, I forgot
last night the ww got in the car at 10ish to go somewhere (I think it was campaign related, not sure)
She would not tell me where she was going. I asked if it was related to her talk about dating other people she said she will not answer that. I said you have your overnight bag with you. (it was her purse, not the overnight bag) She said no it is her purse.
*&*&*she also said she wished she had another place to stay if so she would be there tonight*&*&&&
I thought she talked with her x and arranged a place to stay. I also thought she talked with her sister in law and had arranged to stay with her as well.
So I am getting mixed signals again.
Was my plan to cut her off getting her attention and this was her threat to have a place to stay with her x her way to pay me back?
It does seem very odd that you kept in contact with a man for 17 plus years with no knowledge from your husband. She would mention him from time to time but never said we still keep in touch.
Please start a new thread
So my WW has presented an ultimatum. Either I allow her to stay with me and there will be competition for her time and affection or sign the D papers.
StepUp,
When I read stuff like that I get pissed-off. I don't get upset because your wife said that, I get upset because she apparently believes you'd consider that proposition.
My usual disclaimer; I'm just a guy and I don't know what is and what isn't DB, so don't act on my recommendation without input from others.
My recommendation: Sign the freaking D papers and kick her ass out. Now.
@Cadet
Do I have enough posts to do that now?
StepUp,
Now is the time to stop trying to mind read what is going on with your wife. It is time for you to focus all of your time, effort and energy into yourself and your kids.
It is also time for you to stop allowing your wife to eat cake while she carries on with her EA/PA and bullying you into doing things her way.
You are at a very fragile point in this relationship and it would be extremely helpful to know what your next move should be. Please call me to discuss our program at 303-444-7004.
Cristy
Resource Coordinator
The Divorce Busting Center
303-444-7004
@Cadet
Do I have enough posts to do that now?
Yes you have, over the limit now.
106 posts