Old thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...652#Post2630652I am starting to accept what is going to happen
I do not know when this will happen or how the progress will go
It will be what it will be ....
Make this thread the STFU and live for Ghost thread
Take care. Rd
RD you will be pleased to hear that I have had at least three STFU moments today
I have to think about looking for a house or a flat
I have so much crap at home just the thought of me having to de clutter makes me not to want to start doing this
Ok name change time Phoenix was gone
Ok name change time Phoenix was gone
I LOVE your new name. Now please go make it true! I love it, I really do.
AtPeace, have you ever heard of the flylady? She has a website and several years ago my H was developing a clutter problem. (OK, I was too, but he really took it to a new level.) I used the flylady's tips on decluttering and it really helped. She has this thing called the 27 thing fling. Grab a garbage bag, right now, and whatever room you are in, throw away 27 things. It can be magazines, old socks, expired meds, old toiletries, whatever. Every day do this. Some days grab a bag for the donation pile instead of the garbage. But every day get rid of 27 things. The first day you might only get through 1 or 2 drawers or half a closet. After a week you might work your way through an entire room to come up with your 27 things. After a month or two you are going to be really searching through your entire house to come up with 27 things. It works. We are pretty much on top of our clutter problem now, but maybe 1-2x per month I still do a 27 thing fling, just for maintenance. 27 is a good number because it makes you stretch a little bit, but its usually do-able. I found this method to be very satisfying, maybe it will work for you.
I like this name - much more peaceful and zen-like. Definitely something I'd like to strive toward
Ok so I am seeing things a little calmer I am not spinning so much and I can even see how over the past six months I have been running scared I have been frantic
Ok so persuing is not good and I have been doing this through my fear of being alone and I see all I am doing is pushing her further away so this has now stopped.
It may already be too late I do not know all I know is I have to start changing my thinking process if I am to either make a difference to my M or Make a Difference to myself.
Beginners mindset .....humm...put myself in her mindset
Actions rather than words THIS ....might be a good starting place
I think back over the marriage and there have been many times where we have argued over a relatively small things these are things that she is now making into a bigger issues and for her they are bigger issues.
I read on someone else's post and I will add to it here I do not see how divorce selling the house choosing to see th children 1/2 the time ....becoming single parents to 4 children swapping the kids over twice a week or three times a week for the next 16 years with me staying in contact with my wife and her staying in contact with me through our children. Can possibly be better than staying in trying to work things out
She knows that we both love our children unless she has an alternative master plan then there is going to be a lots of swapping over of children
I sometimes say to her I just want to make things better and she immediately says will better for you is asked getting back together and having sex no it's not but I don't know how I can let her know that's not what I mean getting back together could be any number of things it could be spending one night with each other going to the cinema once every couple weeks enjoying each other's company it might be going to the theatre it might be going out for a drink going for a meal once every week or every couple of weeks and just try andget along and see if our friendship grows.....but I can say this to her without it seeming pursuing
So I need to back off and give her space
We have been separated for about six months but we're married 17 years together 25 years and although we have been separated for the past six months we have probably spent as much time together if not more doing things for the children and doing things together
Ok so something that she felt very strong about was that she felt I was being controlling and that she would not go out with her friends or even add males on Facebook through fear of it upsetting me do you think I should just turn round to her and say look I do not mind if you add people on Facebook I to you like I do not mind if you go out for a meal or a drink with someone else the bottom line is she is not with me and even if she was with me and if we ever did get back together this is something that would very much after change to allow her to do these things and to live her life the way she wants to live it.
The marriage we had we could never ever go back to I just do not see why with all my changes that I'm doing why we cannot get to the stage where we have a very different marriage but she is not right now prepared to give it a chance
So all I can do is keep working on me andbecoming a better person and who knows what that might bring
Oh give it a rest already!!!
Your wife does not care if you go out flying a bloody kite. Leave her the [censored] alone already!!! What is it that you do not get? Is English hard to grasp for you? Can I tell it to you in German? Hör auf!!!
And again with the mind reading! YOU DO NOT KNOW WHAT YOUR WIFE THINKS. And even if you did, her thinking is skewed. She would be rewriting history to justify her actions and you would be bad guy No. 1. Who gives a rat's ass what she thinks? For [censored]'s sake... I would be also pissed if my W was adding males on FB. You are not a terrible person if you felt the same... My W, prior to BD, felt very strongly that there can be no friendship between a man and a woman, that is always leads somewhere.
So again, focus on you and your kids, stop snooping, and for the love of god, let your wife be!
time to get that motor running here comes a big spin..tonight my W is going out for a friends birthday meal and usually she would come home but no not tonight nope she is hitting the night club she honestly does not give a [censored] monkeys about my feelings her insensitivity
Or do I frame the above my W has not been out clubbing in weeks she has been working her ass off and deserves going out with a friend to let her hair down
Time to get a grip
At Peace. your W left you 8 months ago. Due to money / kids you still live in the same house W has told you she no longer wants a M with you.
You can frame it anyway you want , it doesn't matter to W You need to accept this because it's reality
You said yourself your seprrated W can do as she pleases to you she being insensitive , to her she's going out and GALing. Your obviously worried that she might meet someone or such like and that's a possibility but even if she is , you have no control When you were together you had no control W will do what she will and that's what you have to accept
Boundaries are not control They are your way of protecting you. Please read the reconciliation stories on here Almost all of them involve the LBS letting go and accepting having no control.
Your talk of how it's easier to get back together , that part is true and if the two of you were willing then of course that's the best option That option is not open to you. I'm not sure if you e read my thread but my W , lives in a one bed flat , her car is c@ap and has not tax or not , she lives on a shoe string and her OM is a bipolar drunk who has serious mental issues. W is on anti Ds and has talked of suicide Would it not be easier for my W to try again , yes of course but for her own reasons she doesn't want to. Her family don't understand , her friends don't understand BUT it doesn't matter , it's her choice
You have a choice , you can carry on like you are , obsessing over what could have been or you can accept what is
I know you said you are going to see an I/C but I think it should be top of your list.
I'm speaking from experience here. I was like you and even had the benefit of W telling me she is unsure of what she wants and thinks she's having a breakdown or MLC ( her words ) , stil I snooped , obsessed and was driving myself crazy with " if only " I went to a L/C and she put me on the right path. I'm still not healed but I don't let thoughts control me all the time
Come on buddy , you need to sort this for you and yours. The futures not written and hope is always there but Atpeace needs to live upto that name
Take care. Rd
You should frame it as "she's a big girl and can make her own choices."
I have some thoughts on your letter interpretation, but I may not be able to post it for a few days until I get to a laptop.
Be at peace, AP
I just do not see why with all my changes that I'm doing why we cannot get to the stage where we have a very different marriage but she is not right now prepared to give it a chance
Good stuff from rd, I wish some of it got through to you. I understand why it wont, but in time hopefully you pick up more of it before her actions force you to. One way or any other you will, it's just a matter of how much hell you put yourself through.
No more thinking about WHAT W is thinking or doing. Worry about you. If she's going out to the club to blow off steam, to enjoy her friends, get attention from another man, or even meet up with another man to hook up what difference does it make? Can any of those things be controlled by you?
She's an adult and has left you, you two are done right now. It [censored] but it's life now. You can miss her, grieve for her, even still DB with her in mind, but you have to stop the fear from getting to you.
Stop trying to justify her working on the M because its the what's best for the kids. It seems you haven't changed from the old M anyway because you still cling to her and for all the wrong reasons. It's not even that you love her as much as it's just your fear of being alone and how hard life will be starting over. What she said was true, her coming back is what's best for you right now and the things you tell her (even if they are true) only reassure her she was right.
So, what are you going to do now instead of cycling and spinning again? The big posts of what you need to be doing are pointless if you don't do them.
Here's something I want you to think about for a while. You said 3 years ago she was nearly out the door and you changed some so she would stay (I think, forgive me if I'm confusing stories). You said those changes didn't last and it was becaue they were for the M and not you. You have even said if the changes stuck then and you did more work you might have saved it then. How is now different from then if she comes back to you tomorrow? Nothing would have changed and you would be back here in 3 years again. You changing for you is only part of the equation, the rest is her and out of your control.
So, get your [censored] together (for you) just in case she gets her [censored] together.
Rd500 thank you for dropping in your help right now is really helping me through this
Fogg buddy I am reading between your beautifully written post and I love you for your honesty ....man Huggs
Your first line and your last line say buckets and i really do need to get my ass together for me before she gets hers together
No more thinking about the W at peace comes first
So so I push to sell the house
Do I start the divorce process
Buckle down its going to be a bumpy ride
No and no unless it's for the benefit of AP
Do things just for you. Don't be an ass to W but treat her as a neighbour.
This is your reality now and it's your time to shine. Will you be happy again , of course and keep that in your mind when it feels grim
Take care. Rd
PS
STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU
Ghost, go declutter your house, go out dancing, go take your kids out. Do something. Stop thinking and just do something active.
Pho thank you for your msgs I will try the de cluttering 27 items at a time
RD I have stfu today all day right now I need to sleep I feel shattered but in the morning I really have to believe in the DBing principals
W is out clubbing so sleeping will help me to take my mind off things
Good night and thank you all
AP (ghost)
Ok so I am seeing things a little calmer I am not spinning so much and I can even see how over the past six months I have been running scared I have been frantic G, You are still spinning, you are doing donuts on your future. You ARE running scared of being alone and losing the comfy life you had. You still havent told me 5 things you love about your W. If you cant come up with them why stay married? For convenience?
Ok so persuing is not good and I have been doing this through my fear of being alone and I see all I am doing is pushing her further away so this has now stopped. It hasnt, it will continue as all the other times you said the same story.
It may already be too late I do not know all I know is I have to start changing my thinking process if I am to either make a difference to my M or Make a Difference to myself. Your M is dead and no defibrilator will jump start it. Think about making a difference to G in order to start this possible new M. It does not have to be either one or the other.
Beginners mindset .....humm...put myself in her mindset NO there you go again ... thinking you know what she is thinking. You always make this mistake.
Actions rather than words THIS ....might be a good starting place I think you said this many many times already.
I think back over the marriage and there have been many times where we have argued over a relatively small things these are things that she is now making into a bigger issues and for her they are bigger issues. To you they were small maybe not to her. Additionally many frequent busts over small things hide a big issue. Maybe she saw and you did not. Maybe she is also rewriting for her benefit. You do not know the truth unless you honestly analyze and find out
I read on someone else's post and I will add to it here I do not see how divorce selling the house choosing to see th children 1/2 the time ....becoming single parents to 4 children swapping the kids over twice a week or three times a week for the next 16 years with me staying in contact with my wife and her staying in contact with me through our children. Can possibly be better than staying in trying to work things out Bla bla bla again more of the same G If she does not want you or stay with anything will be better than what she has, can you not grasp this? if you were in prison with all luxuries would you want to stay or would you prefer to be free and face a lot of work?
She knows that we both love our children unless she has an alternative master plan then there is going to be a lots of swapping over of children Maybe that is her masterplan and there may be lots of swapping if it comes down to that be prepared.
I sometimes say to her I just want to make things better and she immediately says will better for you is asked getting back together and having sex no it's not but I don't know how I can let her know that's not what I mean getting back together could be any number of things it could be spending one night with each other going to the cinema once every couple weeks enjoying each other's company it might be going to the theatre it might be going out for a drink going for a meal once every week or every couple of weeks and just try andget along and see if our friendship grows.....but I can say this to her without it seeming pursuing It is persuing and what do you have to offer different than what she was getting and didnt want. How close are you to offering what she might want? Do you really want to become a housemate for the rest of your life with her? Are you really ready for a life of celibacy if that is what it will come down to?
So I need to back off and give her space YES!!!!! oh and STFU
We have been separated for about six months She has not you though. but we're married 17 years together 25 years and although we have been separated for the past six months we have probably spent as much time together if not more doing things for the children and doing things together And ? ...
Ok so something that she felt very strong about was that she felt I was being controlling and that she would not go out with her friends or even add males on Facebook through fear of it upsetting me do you think I should just turn round to her and say look I do not mind if you add people on Facebook I to you like I do not mind if you go out for a meal or a drink with someone else the bottom line is she is not with me and even if she was with me and if we ever did get back together this is something that would very much after change to allow her to do these things and to live her life the way she wants to live it. I can imagine what it was like to live with you. You are a control freak but I think more out of insecurity and low self esteem than anything else. Unless you address that problem forget any chance of getting back or even piecing.
The marriage we had we could never ever go back toWould you want to? Why? Would she want to? Why? I just do not see why with all my changes that I'm doing G, WTF, the only real changes I have seen you make is change your member name and add new posts. What serious and deep changes have you really made G and of those, which ones really would want to make your W come back? why we cannot get to the stage where we have a very different marriage but she is not right now prepared to give it a chance
So all I can do is keep working on me andbecoming a better person and who knows what that might bring For a start it will make you a better person and if it is too late for your w will help with any future R with someone else and until then help you cope with being alone.
Seriously G,
I really wish you would stop smothering her, start working on yourself, stop contradicting yourself, stop lying to yourself and above all else stop asking questions you know the answer to.
NB: Stop mentioning about you initiating a D etc. You know full well you are only trying to get a reaction from her. The problem with using ultimatums as a bluff is if you get called out on them.
G I think you are a smart and intelligent person but with a lot of insecurity issues looking for an easy way out. If you truly think your R and W and kids are worth fighting for then stop whining and start growing a pair and follow the advice here. Not mine but someone's. It has been proven that your way isnt working.
Max
No and no unless it's for the benefit of AP
Do things just for you. Don't be an ass to W but treat her as a neighbour.
This is your reality now and it's your time to shine. Will you be happy again , of course and keep that in your mind when it feels grim
Take care. Rd
PS
STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU STFU
Love this RD!
V
Bob posted this on my thread
It seems appropriate
Smothering vs. Love
There’s no such thing as loving someone too much. There is such a thing, though, as too much smothering. And smothering can definitely scare someone away.
So what does it mean to really love someone, and when does love turn into smothering?
Smothering, ultimately, isn’t about love, but about selfishness. When you love someone, you want what’s best for the person, even if that means the relationship looks different from what you had in mind. In contrast, when you smother, you prioritize your own needs for closeness or connection, as opposed to what the other person wants or needs. This is one reason people can get scared away and run from a relationship.
So let’s look at some differences between smothering and love.
Smothering takes. It’s selfish. When you smother, you’re really not considering the other person’s feelings and desires. You may feel like you’re showing love, but if you’re being motivated by your own insecurity about the relationship or your own fears about losing this person, then you’re probably more in the smothering camp.
Love gives. It’s generous. It prioritizes the other person’s freedom and autonomy. When you love, you’re willing to do whatever is best for the person you care for, even if that means you don’t get exactly what you want, exactly when you want it.
Smothering demands. When you smother, you constantly ask about the future, insisting on specific answers and results. You also demand attention or reassurance from the other person, requiring repeated statements of proof of their commitment level or feelings for you.
Love patiently waits. When you love, you enjoy the present, allowing the other person and the relationship to progress at a comfortable pace. You wait for both of you to become ready for a certain level of intimacy, instead of asking for premature answers or commitments that can put pressure on the other person and scare him or her away.
Smothering disregards what another wants. When you offer continual statements of how much you care about the other person, you may feel as if you’re actually offering love and simply trying to demonstrate how strong your feelings are. But when the other person doesn’t want to hear repeated avowals of your love, you can end up coming across as needy and desperate, merely because you’re disregarding how your partner feels and what he or she wants.
Love considers and respects the other’s desires. True feelings of love don’t force themselves on another person in ways or at times that the person isn’t ready to receive them. Again, sometimes the best way to show your love is to respect the other’s wishes and allow the relationship to grow and develop more gradually. It may seem strange, but there really are times when it’s not the best idea to say “I love you” over and over again.
Smothering oppresses. It pesters and desperately grasps. It calls too often or sends too many text messages. It results from fear and can end up making the relationship feel like a prison to the other person. It’s like building a border of rocks around a campfire to contain it and to keep it from going where it would naturally go.
Love offers space, respect, and trust. Love invites the other’s truest self. It frees the other to be and act and love how the person chooses. Whereas smothering encircles and contains the fire with rocks, love kicks the rocks away, allowing the fire to burn strong and free.
Smothering tells another what to think or do. When you smother another person, you tell them who they should and shouldn’t spend time with. You check up on where they’re going. You expect them to behave in ways you want them to behave, sometimes even through manipulation.
Love respects and encourages autonomy. Loving someone means allowing others to be fully themselves. Of course it’s true that in a relationship, two people rub off on each other and help each other grow and evolve, but this process needs to be built on respect and appreciation for each person’s individuality.
Smothering is insecure. Ultimately, this is the root of smothering. It can be produced by jealousy, fear, and anxiety, and it’s one of the surest ways of driving someone away.
Love is secure. Love is emotionally strong enough to respect another person’s space and to trust that what’s meant to happen will happen.
Relationships need space and air to breathe if they’re going to survive and thrive. Smothering can therefore kill a relationship by depriving it of oxygen. So remember, there’s no such thing as loving too much. The real question you need to ask yourself is, Are my actions genuinely loving? There can sometimes be a fine line between loving and smothering, but if you want a healthy and long-lasting relationship, it’s an important one not to cross.
Max
Things that I love about my wife
I love her smile
I love her charisma
I love kee caring nature and her love for our children
I love her strength and her beauty
I love the person that she was and the person that she became over our marriage
I love how warmth
We were partners and had each other's backs in times of difficulties she was my friend and my lover
I loved her touch
Max it was suggested to me that perhaps a name change might make me feel different no longer feel like a shadow of myself
I love my wife and I love my children if her master plan is plenty of swapping then this is fine if this is what it has to be ...I see family life as a unit of togetherness and I get it that this is not what we have right now
I have limited time before she tells me that the house goes on the market and she starts pushing forward with her plans
You talk to me as tho I am doing nothing to change myself to become a better person
The only thing that I can see you saying over and over is that I need to grow a pair and I need to start doing thighs for me I get this .
The changes that I am making to myself we nt going to mak [censored] difference to my W I am making these changes to be a better person to do my share of the housework means nothing to be a better father means the world to me
Ok so I am seeing things a little calmer I am not spinning so much and I can even see how over the past six months I have been running scared I have been frantic G, You are still spinning, you are doing donuts on your future. You ARE running scared of being alone and losing the comfy life you had. You still havent told me 5 things you love about your W. If you cant come up with them why stay married? For convenience? I posted the answer to this above
Ok so persuing is not good and I have been doing this through my fear of being alone and I see all I am doing is pushing her further away so this has now stopped. It hasnt, it will continue as all the other times you said the same story.
It may already be too late I do not know all I know is I have to start changing my thinking process if I am to either make a difference to my M or Make a Difference to myself. Your M is dead and no defibrilator will jump start it. Think about making a difference to G in order to start this possible new M. It does not have to be either one or the other. What does make a difference to ghost mean do things for me I realise my marriage is dead right now my W is co living with me does this not time me valuable time to wpend with her and the kids if this is something she wants
Beginners mindset .....humm...put myself in her mindset NO there you go again ... thinking you know what she is thinking. You always make this mistake.
Actions rather than words THIS ....might be a good starting place I think you said this many many times already.
My wife does not believe my words she has heard them all before and she does not believe that I can change
Since bomb date
I have continued to work hard
I have changed my working hours so I get to spend time with my children before work every day
I have booked Sunday's off work so I do not work Sunday's
I have taken my little girl to the play center to the park out for a break to my sisters for 4 Days
I have been doing much more arround th hous with regard to house chores and cooking and cleaning washing ironing as it has been said before I could be Mary flippin popping and it would not have any effect on her wanting to work on the marriage.
I have made many changes that she will be seeing in a day to day basis
I am working out and loosing weight.
I do not want to appear self centred by taking myself off and doing things for me and not putting my children first my wi used to always says that I did not do enough with the children,so I wold see what I am doing as a 180 but do not worry today I have got plans for me and my little girl we area going to the play center and I will be taking her to Father Christmas I will ask my W is she wants to come along this is up to her.
I think back over the marriage and there have been many times where we have argued over a relatively small things these are things that she is now making into a bigger issues and for her they are bigger issues. To you they were small maybe not to her. Additionally many frequent busts over small things hide a big issue. Maybe she saw and you did not. Maybe she is also rewriting for her benefit. You do not know the truth unless you honestly analyze and find out
The things that we argued over were
Me not doing enough with the kids I was always at work
Me spending too much time on my iPad and my computer
Me not spending the evenings with my W
Me not doing enough cooking
Me not doing my share of the housework
I read on someone else's post and I will add to it here I do not see how divorce selling the house choosing to see th children 1/2 the time ....becoming single parents to 4 children swapping the kids over twice a week or three times a week for the next 16 years with me staying in contact with my wife and her staying in contact with me through our children. Can possibly be better than staying in trying to work things out Bla bla bla again more of the same G If she does not want you or stay with anything will be better than what she has, can you not grasp this? if you were in prison with all luxuries would you want to stay or would you prefer to be free and face a lot of work?
She knows that we both love our children unless she has an alternative master plan then there is going to be a lots of swapping over of children Maybe that is her masterplan and there may be lots of swapping if it comes down to that be prepared.
I sometimes say to her I just want to make things better and she immediately says will better for you is asked getting back together and having sex no it's not but I don't know how I can let her know that's not what I mean getting back together could be any number of things it could be spending one night with each other going to the cinema once every couple weeks enjoying each other's company it might be going to the theatre it might be going out for a drink going for a meal once every week or every couple of weeks and just try andget along and see if our friendship grows.....but I can say this to her without it seeming pursuing It is persuing and what do you have to offer different than what she was getting and didnt want. How close are you to offering what she might want? Do you really want to become a housemate for the rest of your life with her? Are you really ready for a life of celibacy if that is what it will come down to?
So I need to back off and give her space YES!!!!! oh and STFU
We have been separated for about six months She has not you though. but we're married 17 years together 25 years and although we have been separated for the past six months we have probably spent as much time together if not more doing things for the children and doing things together And ? ...
Ok so something that she felt very strong about was that she felt I was being controlling and that she would not go out with her friends or even add males on Facebook through fear of it upsetting me do you think I should just turn round to her and say look I do not mind if you add people on Facebook I to you like I do not mind if you go out for a meal or a drink with someone else the bottom line is she is not with me and even if she was with me and if we ever did get back together this is something that would very much after change to allow her to do these things and to live her life the way she wants to live it. I can imagine what it was like to live with you. You are a control freak but I think more out of insecurity and low self esteem than anything else. Unless you address that problem forget any chance of getting back or even piecing. max you state that I am a control freak you do not know me yes I have insecurities i am working on regarding my weight ....sure I do not like the idea of her adding males to her friends it is almost impossible that males and females are just friends if there is an attraction then affairs can and often will develope I realise I have no say in this and she could if she wanted to fill her pages this is not something that she has started to do.
So I realise that I have to work on my insecurity if she wants to go out and if she wants something to happen then it will I have no control so might as well let this go
The marriage we had we could never ever go back toWould you want to? NO I WOULD NOT. Why? Would she want to? Why? SHE WOULD NOT WANT TO I just do not see why with all my changes that I'm doing G, WTF, the only real changes I have seen you make is change your member name and add new posts. What serious and deep changes have you really made G and of those, which ones really would want to make your W come back? why we cannot get to the stage where we have a very different marriage but she is not right now prepared to give it a chance
So all I can do is keep working on me andbecoming a better person and who knows what that might bring For a start it will make you a better person and if it is too late for your w will help with any future R with someone else and until then help you cope with being alone.
Seriously G,
I really wish you would stop smothering her, start working on yourself, stop contradicting yourself, stop lying to yourself and above all else stop asking questions you know the answer to.
NB: Stop mentioning about you initiating a D etc. You know full well you are only trying to get a reaction from her. The problem with using ultimatums as a bluff is if you get called out on them.
G I think you are a smart and intelligent person but with a lot of insecurity issues looking for an easy way out. If you truly think your R and W and kids are worth fighting for then stop whining and start growing a pair and follow the advice here. Not mine but someone's. It has been proven that your way isnt working.
Max
Morning AT , I've been thinking a lot of why you get so many people posting even though you ignore all the advice. Don't get me wrong , your always grateful and very thankful BUT you do ignore us.
I think we all see ourselves in you and we are desperate for you to put the brakes on your actions because they are making your sitch worse In 6 months you will grasp why we are all on to you so much You will look back and say , if only or why didn't I listen.
So my suggestion is this , take a leap of faith and put your trust in all the posters who really want AT to come through this
As a previous poster said you are intelligent and you can grasp what we say but you just can't get past your emotions and you let them take over
Sandis line after her posts says it all , do what works , etc
we all struggle and we all make mistakes so no one is judging you but we are steering you away from the mistakes.
Oh yea , one last thing I thought of late last night and it's a new method for you to try , STFU !!!!!!!!!
Let's keep count of how many days you can STFU for , you said yesterday was 1 so let's chalk up no 2 this evening
Take care buddy. Rd
RD
I am up to over 900 posts and yet I still feel that I do not know what I shold be doing this sounds so pathetic
Ok so let me ask something if I may The thing that is going through my head at the moment is not just that my W has asked to separate it is what is going to happen with regard the children.
Just today I was going to be taking me little boy to his weekend activity and at the last moment he said he wanted mummy to take him and he starts getting upset so I said how about mummy and daddy both take you so we can both go and watch you ....he said yes but my wife clearly did not really want us both to go..
So this got me thinking about when we divorce and are living apart how I know we really do not want to get child care matters decided by the courts...we have to sort this together....What if the children are ment to be coming to mine and they start crying say no I do not want to go ....do I just each and every time back down and just drive off in my own back to my house without my children
Being the mummy she has been arround so much more than I have because of my work she is arround after school and at weekends and the children are closer to her because of this.
So I have right now the gift of time but this is running out day by day and this is going to go on for ever with the children my youngest is two and the one that got upset is eleven.
I am at the point where I want to try and reason with my W negotiate some sort of deal ...how crazy does that sound ?
I stand that chance of loosing everything I realise just what is at stake
You have had 8 months to build a new bond with your kids and have them want to be with you but you continued to try and spend time with W. When it's your time with the kids after D it's your time. There might be some compromises and they swap days/times around but you won't just drive home everytime they don't want to see you.
Start thinking about your kids and not how it applies to W or with W.
Hi AP.
What are we going to do with you ????
The exchange this morning is classic GUILT for your W and trust me , that's exactly how she saw it.
I presume you had girlfriends In the past Now imagine one of them is going to be sleeping around next Thursday How do you feel about that ?? Seriously , how do you feel. I would imagine you couldn't care less Now if that woman had a serious illness and you heard that , you may be a little sad but it doesn't really change your life.
Now imagine that's how your W feels right now. You could leave and meet someone and she would t really be bothered. Because that's where she is right now. Please listen this time. Anything you say is seen by W in her light and not how you might intend it to be seen
Have you read Sandis thread on WW and WAW , there is terrific insight
Your mindset has to be one of mindfulness of how W perceives you. Now if you are doing X because X is what you want to do then fine but if X can be taken by W as influence then do X in a different way
I hope I'm being clear.
The exchange this morning may have been genuine on your part BUT W could easy take it as guilt. This morning you could have easily said to S , come on buddy , we will play a game in the car and make it really fun This leaves W out of it completely
I know this is hard but you did not make 2 days with STFU. Improve you for you and if W is drawn closer then great but if she isn't then the new you will be able to cope and live his life fully
Please mate , no talking about the kids or anything for a week. Can you set yourself that goal ?
I have to bite my tongue regularly with my W. She leaves the openings there all the time and I can assure you that she is stunned by my ability to STFU I sometimes feel she says things to test the STFU attitude I know have Slowly , oh so slowly I have developed this ability and trust me , I fake it a lot of the time because the old RD knew everything and was happy to voice it to W
I'm at this longer than you and I'm gifted that I have my kids with me 24/7 but it's a struggle daily. I chose to move forward because I realised ( with loads of help from on here ) I had no real choice Neither do you.
Last lesson and please take it , Your W does not want an R with you right now and nothing you do short term or especially say short term will change that
Come on buddy , one foot in front of the other and W is now an alien that you cannot communicate with because there is a language barrier so the only way of communicating is by actions. Show W you are becoming a man only a fool would leave.
Take care. Rd
Max
Things that I love about my wife
I love her smile
I love her charisma
I love kee caring nature and her love for our children
I love her strength and her beauty
I love the person that she was and the person that she became over our marriage
I love how warmth
We were partners and had each other's backs in times of difficulties she was my friend and my lover
I loved her touch
I would have liked to have seen more personal touches of particular moments . These seem so general but OK I'll take these as good enough reasons.
Max it was suggested to me that perhaps a name change might make me feel different no longer feel like a shadow of myself Ok no problem I was just making a comment not questioning it.
I love my wife and I love my children if her master plan is plenty of swapping then this is fine if this is what it has to be ...I see family life as a unit of togetherness and I get it that this is not what we have right now So does this mean that you will no longer post anymore about how about if you separate your children will bla bla bla?
I have limited time before she tells me that the house goes on the market and she starts pushing forward with her plans The more you do thigs your way the shorter the time. If she does decide to push then let her do the work. Also make sure you are well assesed by a lawyer.
You talk to me as tho I am doing nothing to change myself to become a better person YUP got that right.
The only thing that I can see you saying over and over is that I need to grow a pair and I need to start doing thighs for me I get this . Then when are you going to throw some old spice between your legs and become a man?
The changes that I am making to myself What changes? we nt going to mak [censored] difference to my W NO so why persist in keeping an eye on her reactions? I am making these changes to be a better person You keep saying this but dont seem to have made any. Then you say things like why do changes if your W does not take notice. Which is it? to do my share of the housework means nothing to be a better father means the world to me I really dont think the issue was lack of housework and being a better father is great but change is much more than this.
Ok so I am seeing things a little calmer I am not spinning so much and I can even see how over the past six months I have been running scared I have been frantic G, You are still spinning, you are doing donuts on your future. You ARE running scared of being alone and losing the comfy life you had. You still havent told me 5 things you love about your W. If you cant come up with them why stay married? For convenience? I posted the answer to this above OK Noted
Ok so persuing is not good and I have been doing this through my fear of being alone and I see all I am doing is pushing her further away so this has now stopped. It hasnt, it will continue as all the other times you said the same story.
It may already be too late I do not know all I know is I have to start changing my thinking process if I am to either make a difference to my M or Make a Difference to myself. Your M is dead and no defibrilator will jump start it. Think about making a difference to G in order to start this possible new M. It does not have to be either one or the other. What does make a difference to ghost mean do things for me I realise my marriage is dead right now my W is co living with me does this not time me valuable time to wpend with her and the kids if this is something she wants If you truly believe your M is dead then why do you keep trying to repair it instead of working on yourself to offer a new R to your W?
Beginners mindset .....humm...put myself in her mindset NO there you go again ... thinking you know what she is thinking. You always make this mistake.
Actions rather than words THIS ....might be a good starting place I think you said this many many times already.
My wife does not believe my words she has heard them all before and she does not believe that I can change No because in all honesty I cannot see any change in you and furthermore she needs time. You expect her to flip in a few months and then get frustated when she doesnt react. Remember she has been brewing for years and you want reactions in months?
Since bomb date
I have continued to work hard At What?
I have changed my working hours so I get to spend time with my children before work every day OK
I have booked Sunday's off work so I do not work Sunday's OK
I have taken my little girl to the play center to the park out for a break to my sisters for 4 Days Good keep it up
I have been doing much more arround th hous with regard to house chores and cooking and cleaning washing ironing as it has been said before I could be Mary flippin popping and it would not have any effect on her wanting to work on the marriage. OK but you also know being a Mary Poppins as you say is part of the change not the main focal point ... right?
I have made many changes that she will be seeing in a day to day basis
I am working out and loosing weight.
I do not want to appear self centred by taking myself off and doing things for me and not putting my children first my wi used to always says that I did not do enough with the children,so I wold see what I am doing as a 180 but do not worry today I have got plans for me and my little girl we area going to the play center and I will be taking her to Father Christmas I will ask my W is she wants to come along this is up to her.
I think back over the marriage and there have been many times where we have argued over a relatively small things these are things that she is now making into a bigger issues and for her they are bigger issues. To you they were small maybe not to her. Additionally many frequent busts over small things hide a big issue. Maybe she saw and you did not. Maybe she is also rewriting for her benefit. You do not know the truth unless you honestly analyze and find out
The things that we argued over were
Me not doing enough with the kids I was always at work
Me spending too much time on my iPad and my computer
Me not spending the evenings with my W
Me not doing enough cooking
Me not doing my share of the housework
In short YOU taking her for granted. That is a BIG issue and one where W DO search for that interest elsewhere ... see how you got it wrong? When things were tough she stood by yourside ... did you stand by hers?
I read on someone else's post and I will add to it here I do not see how divorce selling the house choosing to see th children 1/2 the time ....becoming single parents to 4 children swapping the kids over twice a week or three times a week for the next 16 years with me staying in contact with my wife and her staying in contact with me through our children. Can possibly be better than staying in trying to work things out Bla bla bla again more of the same G If she does not want you or stay with anything will be better than what she has, can you not grasp this? if you were in prison with all luxuries would you want to stay or would you prefer to be free and face a lot of work?
She knows that we both love our children unless she has an alternative master plan then there is going to be a lots of swapping over of children Maybe that is her masterplan and there may be lots of swapping if it comes down to that be prepared.
I sometimes say to her I just want to make things better and she immediately says will better for you is asked getting back together and having sex no it's not but I don't know how I can let her know that's not what I mean getting back together could be any number of things it could be spending one night with each other going to the cinema once every couple weeks enjoying each other's company it might be going to the theatre it might be going out for a drink going for a meal once every week or every couple of weeks and just try andget along and see if our friendship grows.....but I can say this to her without it seeming pursuing It is persuing and what do you have to offer different than what she was getting and didnt want. How close are you to offering what she might want? Do you really want to become a housemate for the rest of your life with her? Are you really ready for a life of celibacy if that is what it will come down to?
So I need to back off and give her space YES!!!!! oh and STFU
We have been separated for about six months She has, not you though. but we're married 17 years together 25 years and although we have been separated for the past six months we have probably spent as much time together if not more doing things for the children and doing things together And ? ...
Ok so something that she felt very strong about was that she felt I was being controlling and that she would not go out with her friends or even add males on Facebook through fear of it upsetting me do you think I should just turn round to her and say look I do not mind if you add people on Facebook I to you like I do not mind if you go out for a meal or a drink with someone else the bottom line is she is not with me and even if she was with me and if we ever did get back together this is something that would very much after change to allow her to do these things and to live her life the way she wants to live it. I can imagine what it was like to live with you. You are a control freak but I think more out of insecurity and low self esteem than anything else. Unless you address that problem forget any chance of getting back or even piecing.
max you state that I am a control freak YUP you do not know me I never met Jack the ripper but think we can agree he did have to work on his social skills. yes I have insecurities i am working on regarding my weight see what I mean ....sure I do not like the idea of her adding males to her friends controlling attitude through insecurity with added jealousy it is almost impossible that males and females are just friends if there is an attraction then affairs can and often will develope Affairs develop if there is something missing at home and someone else is at the right moment at the right place and it doesnt have to be with a brad pitt look alike. Do you really want to go through life thinking your partner will have an affair so easily. Do you really think so low of yourself? Dont you think it is time to earn some self respect and show your W and rest of the world who you are and you have something to offer? I realise I have no say in this and she could if she wanted to fill her pages this is not something that she has started to do. Does not mean anything.
So I realise that I have to work on my insecurity if she wants to go out and if she wants something to happen then it will I have no control so might as well let this go YES you have to work on your insecurities and a LOT and be prepared for her to maybe have an EAPA. The problem will then be how you react if she does. If you're lost now then if that happens you wont even find your way with a GPS stuck up where the sun dont shine. Additionally, women dont like insecure men. Believe me on that one.
The marriage we had we could never ever go back toWould you want to? NO I WOULD NOT. Why? Would she want to? Why? SHE WOULD NOT WANT TO I just do not see why with all my changes that I'm doing G, WTF, the only real changes I have seen you make is change your member name and add new posts. What serious and deep changes have you really made G and of those, which ones really would want to make your W come back? why we cannot get to the stage where we have a very different marriage but she is not right now prepared to give it a chance Exactly. She may be prepared to give it a chance if there was something to attract her. You are just offering the same misery. She may think she deserves better than what you have given her lately and she wants it. Keep up your methods and she will definitely never want to give it a chance. How can you offer a different marriage if you are stil the same person.
So all I can do is keep working on me andbecoming a better person and who knows what that might bring For a start it will make you a better person and if it is too late for your w will help with any future R with someone else and until then help you cope with being alone.
Seriously G,
I really wish you would stop smothering her, start working on yourself, stop contradicting yourself, stop lying to yourself and above all else stop asking questions you know the answer to.
NB: Stop mentioning about you initiating a D etc. You know full well you are only trying to get a reaction from her. The problem with using ultimatums as a bluff is if you get called out on them.
G I think you are a smart and intelligent person but with a lot of insecurity issues looking for an easy way out. If you truly think your R and W and kids are worth fighting for then stop whining and start growing a pair and follow the advice here. Not mine but someone's. It has been proven that your way isnt working.
Max
RD
I am up to over 900 posts and yet I still feel that I do not know what I shold be doing this sounds so pathetic
Ok so let me ask something if I may The thing that is going through my head at the moment is not just that my W has asked to separate it is what is going to happen with regard the children.
Just today I was going to be taking me little boy to his weekend activity and at the last moment he said he wanted mummy to take him and he starts getting upset so I said how about mummy and daddy both take you so we can both go and watch you ....he said yes but my wife clearly did not really want us both to go..
So this got me thinking about when we divorce and are living apart how I know we really do not want to get child care matters decided by the courts...we have to sort this together....What if the children are ment to be coming to mine and they start crying say no I do not want to go ....do I just each and every time back down and just drive off in my own back to my house without my children
Being the mummy she has been arround so much more than I have because of my work she is arround after school and at weekends and the children are closer to her because of this.
So I have right now the gift of time but this is running out day by day and this is going to go on for ever with the children my youngest is two and the one that got upset is eleven.
I am at the point where I want to try and reason with my W negotiate some sort of deal ...how crazy does that sound ?
I stand that chance of loosing everything I realise just what is at stake
Guilt trip and still trying to use the Kids card on W to force to rethink leaving as it will affect kids otherwise why bring it up now when you still have to sell the house.
See what I mean about looking for every excuse under the sun to stop W from leaving through need or discomfort rather than personal desire to stay through love.
What will be the next post? How will she cope in a new house? What car will she need ? Unti you realize a house is not a home you will fail.
Really sad G.
Max
Max I cannot see how i can show my W love right now I am being told left right and center that I have to back off from her she is not interested in spending time with me
I am not sure how I can show her my changes ...your words....she may be prepared to give it a chance if there was something to attract her you are offering her the same misery with nothing to attract he
I cannot push for anything period
I have not spoken to her about me filing for a divorce this is something that she wants to do and as such I am not going to be the on to bring up,
I am actually enjoying doing the housework it takes my mind,off things here
Max I cannot see how i can show my W love right now I am being told left right and center that I have to back off from her she is not interested in spending time with me
Ghost, you do it by backing off. Completely. Pretend she is your neighbor.
I am not sure how I can show her my changes ...your words....she may be prepared to give it a chance if there was something to attract her you are offering her the same misery with nothing to attract he
I cannot push for anything period
You are right, stop pushing.
I have not spoken to her about me filing for a divorce this is something that she wants to do and as such I am not going to be the on to bring up,
Exactly, don't bring it up. If she does, respect her wishes, just go along with it. Don't facilitate the process, but don't try to stop her either.
I am actually enjoying doing the housework it takes my mind,off things here
Pho thank you for explaining things to me sometimes, no often I need things spelling out to me.
I have read sometimes doing nothing is better than doing something it just seems counter intuitive doing nothing and waiting for something to happen.
I hope you have been keeping well sometimes the days go just so fast
Huggs
Max I cannot see how i can show my W love right now I am being told left right and center that I have to back off from her she is not interested in spending time with me
As Pho said, by backing off, STFU and concentrating on working on yourself so she does not feel smothered. It is hard to bear a smothering H, much less a smothering LBH.Read the great article on Love v Smothering
I am not sure how I can show her my changes ...your words....she may be prepared to give it a chance if there was something to attract her you are offering her the same misery with nothing to attract he
We are told here to work on ourselves, be the best we can be, only a fool would leave, you get the drift. Do this, work on yourself and show her a new G 2.0. Otherwise what incentive does she have? I am not saying that working on yourself will get her back, only that if she is to consider anything with you she needs to be sure your changes are real and also what she wants. If she wants a secure and self respecting G, doing the housework is fine but will not get her back. I seriously think (and it is my opinion) that your smothring, controlling of her and your relationship as well as taking her for granted was what really pushed her away. I dont think it was just the housework.
I cannot push for anything period Exactly.
I have not spoken to her about me filing for a divorce this is something that she wants to do and as such I am not going to be the on to bring up, Exactly.
I am actually enjoying doing the housework it takes my mind,off things here Great but dont make it your flagship change
I want to comment on the topic of making changes. If I have read his posts correctly, AtPeace has mostly seen making changes as to what leg action he does. He has tried to put action to the things his W complained about........more housework, more time with kids, less time on IPad, etc. These are actions I call leg actions, because it doesn't require growth or inner development. It doesn't require a lot of good character traits. A man can do these things without changing his attitude or mindset.
AtPeace, I believe what may be missing are those areas where you change the inner man. In other words, you "become" a better man. It isn't about what leg action you can do or not do. Those areas are pretty simple and relatively easy in comparison to changing how you think. Have you changed the inside of you? Dealt with your fears, compulsion thinking, codepency, etc.? We have tried to tell what to do or stop doing, in an attempt to help you "become" that better man, however, when you talk about your changes........you pull out this leg action list of your W's. Remember when you were doing all the housework, while she did none of it? Didn't make her any happier, did it? That's b/c it wasn't the real problem.
I know that most W's will give an entire laundry list of things the H needs to do or stop doing (all leg actions). However, it really boils down to what kind of man you are with her, and her children. A woman doesn't fall in love with a man based on his housekeeping skills. When she complains about you working too late or being on your IPad too much........that really isn't what she means. This probably blows your mind, so I won't continue on with this subject, but Max touched on it. It's all about how you make her feel. It is about the relationship. It is about "becoming" a new and better man by how you think and feel.
RD
Can you explain this a little further
You said in a previous post
Stop trying to justify her working on the M because its the what's best for the kids. It seems you haven't changed from the old M anyway because you still cling to her and for all the wrong reasons. It's not even that you love her as much as it's just your fear of being alone and how hard life will be starting over. What she said was true, her coming back is what's best for you right now and the things you tell her (even if they are true) only reassure her she was right.
Here's something I want you to think about for a while. You said 3 years ago she was nearly out the door and you changed some so she would stay (I think, forgive me if I'm confusing stories). You said those changes didn't last and it was becaue they were for the M and not you. You have even said if the changes stuck then and you did more work you might have saved it then. How is now different from then if she comes back to you tomorrow? Nothing would have changed and you would be back here in 3 years again. You changing for you is only part of the equation, the rest is her and out of your control.
When we nearly split up it was because she had been feeling very unloved I had been taking her for granted and I had not been spending quality time with my children.
I was not pulling my weight arround the house and I was still expecting everything from my W
All the time she was feeling extremely unhappy she was still doing every thing for me and for the house and for the children she must have been exhausted
I would put pressure on her at bedtime I was selfish I put my needs above hers and I did not stop to consider her feelings.
She tried to tell me how unhappy was and I did not listen she would cry I would comfort her but for her the words went in one ear and out the other. Sure i tried to comfort her but. I did not see and did not realise just how unhappy she was.
My actions we're abusive and over the years this is how she has felt ...abused
my W had felt unloved she felt that I did not listen to her and did not want to show her my love and now I realise just how she has been feeling
So how have I changed
I accept that we are finished as a Maried couple I have to listen to what she has been saying she said during our marriage that I did not listen ....well I am listening .
She does not have to be here in the house with me right now but she is choosing to stay
I am being a lot calmer arround the children and arround my W
I do not have any expectations
I no longer treat Her with disrespect
I show her I care
I show love to all our children
I spend time with all of them
I care about the house and I do my share of the housework I do this because it is the right things to do
I love the fact that we are both arround every day to spend quality time with our children
I get to see them every day
I am arround when my children are sad
I am able to co parent in the same house two parents are better than one we have each other for backup
So to confirm,
1) STFU
2) do not push for anything
3) spend time every day with each of my children show them love
4) create peace at home
5) continue to become a better man
6) have no expectations
Sandi2
I do understand what you are saying and I know and can see what you mean about the fact that on the surface changes are not what makes the difference
Max also hit it as well and the last two posts I will read a few times and will add theese to my saved posts
I am starting to understand
Thank you both and RD your posts and Fogg Pho Azzork to name just a few you are starting to get through to me
Sandi2 you are not blowing my mind I understand exactly what you are saying about how she wants to feel how she wants to be treated ....I suppose the big question is is it too late for her to believe in me and my changes ...I do remember when we first got together she did feel special she had a glow she radiated love towards me and over time this was erroaded away by my actions.
People talk a lot about the 189s
I was controlling I gues to some degree we all can be butt this is not about her it is about me and my changes.
I did not see my actions as smothering but on reading the post on loving over smothering I can see how I was
My W deserves to feel loved with no expectations from me the most important things in Her life are her children ...our children.
Question
how do I get the balance between showing my W caring loving actions without persueing her or making her feel that I expect anything ....if she feels smothered to give her the space she needs ....to listen to what she is saying.
I have been getting this so wrong I have been trying to make things better with my W when I need to be strengthening the love between me and my children
I have three children that love me and I have one that does not want my love I have one child that feels let down by her daddy I need to find her love language and try and rebuild a relationship with my eldest daughter
V thank you so much for the post on love and smothering
Ghost
Seems like a selfless, loving thing to do would be to let her go.
I have read sometimes doing nothing is better than doing something it just seems counter intuitive doing nothing and waiting for something to happen.
Here's an example that might help you.
Let's say you're making a spaghetti dinner for your family. The first thing you do is put the water on to boil. Once you start it, there's really nothing more you can do. Every time you check it, the temp goes down and makes it take longer. So, you "do nothing".
While that's happening, are you going to sit around and wait? NO! You get out the ingredients, prepare the sauce, set the table, etc.
So, let the water boil, AP. Start making DINNER. Not pasta.
Azzork thank you
Claire I am not string enough to do that
Everything is falling apart my daughter 17 year old kicked off yesterday saying to me in front of my W I cannot wait till we live in separate houses
I am trying to make the bond between my daughter and myself stronger but this is also broken I believe behind repair right now
I cannot divorce bust her I just have to give her space I would like to see her in counselling with me and my W but then that is controlling my wife says my daughter will not go so the only option I have is to back off from her give her space and stop talking to her as well
This would be so much easier if my W would just want to work on things whilst she does not I have nothing that I can do or say to make things better with my daughter
I feel like a broken record
Divorce is not the best option for my children for the future but if my W will not talk or work on making things better then we are going nowhere
I feel my daughter will live with my W so my W gets my daughter all the time
My hugest boy is going to be so so confused scared and unsure
My eldest boy will make his decision
My youngest daughter will share the access with me
Been to Dr asked for more counselling sessions I really do not see anyway forward from this
Sorry
Spinning
Hi mate. Could you ask the Dr for some medication to help you calm down
I'm afraid to ask but how did you fall out with D. My D14 goes to an I/C and I wouldnt dream of asking my W to go
Most divorces are not good for the kids but they happen and life goes on
IF and it's a HUGE IF, your W decides to work on your R it will be a long time before that starts I've read the average is 1 month for every year together so you have years to go. Accept that,
This is your life and you can let this sad event define you forever. In 20 years time you can be on here saying how W made a terrible mistake but it still happened
My dad is now 80 and he regrets with all his heart leaving my mom 38 years ago.
Those regrets won't help you. They don't help me now
I can tell by your posts you are saying / doing more than your telling us and if your not telling us it's not good stuff your keeping back
Time to man up , accept what is and show your kids you will be the best dad ever
Please get back to Dr , get some help and start to accept what is
Take care Rd
It sounds like your older daughter might be feeling left out of the situation, meaning that she might not be feeling loved as you and your W focus on each other
Am I right in remembering that you were reading about love languages? If so, you might want to think about how you express your love to your children. I think the principles can be used very effectively in every relationship - whether its parent-child, work-related, with friends, or with a spouse.
Just my 2 cents, and good luck with everything. It's not going to be easy, but nothing worthwhile ever is.
I never really post and I am sorry if I am over stepping
LET GO.... love her by letting her go
Love her by being the best dad you can be
Love her by being strong and independent
Love her by taking care of you
Azzork thank you
Claire I am not string enough to do that You need to work on that whether you like it or not. This is not optional otherwise might as well kiss her goodbye.
Everything is falling apart my daughter 17 year old kicked off yesterday saying to me in front of my W I cannot wait till we live in separate houses She has issues you need to work on with her. Why did you fall out with her and be truthful, objective.
I am trying to make the bond between my daughter and myself stronger but this is also broken I believe behind repair right now As a father you should NEVER give up till your dying breath on your children. You have this habit of whinning and giving up easy but then complaining nothing gets done.
I cannot divorce bust her I just have to give her space I would like to see her in counselling with me and my W but then that is controlling my wife says my daughter will not go so the only option I have is to back off from her give her space and stop talking to her as well So you have a daughter that doesnt like you to put it mildly so your answer is to stop talking to her? Talk to her about everyday things normally, keep on acting as a father, see what p1ssed her off and fix it. Dont smother her or act like with your wife ... stfu as well till she comes round. IMHO anyway.
This would be so much easier if my W would just want to work on things whilst she does not I have nothing that I can do or say to make things better with my daughter You do, its just that YOU have to do your homework, dont try and squirm out of this as well as. See how you keep on relying on your W? You are not showing your W any inner strength at all just a deep level of dependency on her, ie more pressure.
I feel like a broken record
Divorce is not the best option for my children for the future but if my W will not talk or work on making things better then we are going nowhere
I feel my daughter will live with my W so my W gets my daughter all the time
My hugest boy is going to be so so confused scared and unsure
My eldest boy will make his decision
My youngest daughter will share the access with me
That's because you are a broken record. None of us are here because things turned out as we had planned. My life is not turning out how I pictured it. I've been betrayed and abandoned and it SUXX. I want to scream at my stbx and scream at the heavens at how unfair this is... and I've done that. And it didn't change a thing. I'm still here. But now what? Do I curl up and die because of this? ?? Is my whole life OVER because of this? Um, I don't think so. I have a life to lead, I have a daughter who needs me. I have friends and family and a world full of people who do and can appreciate me. Some of them I haven't even met yet!
Will this sukk for my daughter? Sure, it's not what I would choose for her. But I will be the best darn mom I can be in this situation. I will love her unconditionally. Even when she says she hates me. Even when she seems to not want to be with me.
Ghost /At Peace : have the courage to work on yourself. Have the courage to get the help you need. Have the courage to love your kids unconditionally (without expectations ). You can be a part of their lives even if they don't live with you. Your daughter will remember how you worked hard to be a good dad and man even when it was hard. Live the kind of life where you can rest your head each night thinking, "I did my best to be the best person I can be."
There is so much out of your control and that's really tough. WE GET IT. You can only control you. SO DO THAT. Because you can control you.
I feel like a broken record Self Pity STOP IT!!
Divorce is not the best option for my children for the future but if my W will not talk or work on making things better then we are going nowhere bla bla bla more of the same STOP IT!!! Try new lyrics, we have heard this song already.
I feel my daughter will live with my W so my W gets my daughter all the time NOT if you work on your R with her. She is a big girl and if you win her over you and your W will share her.
My hugest boy is going to be so so confused scared and unsure You need to be rock for him and help him overcome it though at this stage seems like he will be the rock for you.
My eldest boy will make his decision
My youngest daughter will share the access with me
Three years ago when my W and I nearly split up I said to my daughter that mummy is unhappy and we all have to work hard to make her happy my daughter now says I said it is your fault that mummy wants to leave and is unhappy I did not say anything like that ...so this and the fact that I spent more time with my son and so my W spent more ti me with my daughter doing her hobbie when she was growing up has led her to have resentment towards Me as I gave more of my time to my son, the balance should have been more even I have regret over this but I cannot change.
AP. I'm running out of ways to explain this buddy !!!! Tomorrow is a new day a some people will not get to see the end of it. It's really sad but it's the way it is This time tomorrow you won't have moved 0.0001 % forward because you won't start.
Your damaging relationships with your kids. Do you speak to your S about this ?? If you do , stop other than to hear their concerns and be there for them.
I've been on and on at you to STFU and now you need to STFU to yourself Stop saying there is nothing you can do because that's cr@p.
Stop the pity party and move forward. We all have it tough and we all struggle with our own particular sitchs
Only one person can make your sitch better and it's you.
I truly feel your pain and want you to get through this but unless you do something about it you will be stuck forever.
Take care. Rd
Wow, great advice RD, very proud of you.
Hugs,
Pink
Well I not the gym today walked in found one of th personal trainers and told them that today is the day my life changes
I have booked myself in for an assessment on Friday morning 7am she is going to write me a program I am hoping that I can throw myself into this
I am looking to train four times a week at least
Let's add this to a baby step
Control the things I can control
Good work ATP. Let's maintain a shift of focus here. You are the bit you get to control and I would love to see you move forward with your own stuff now.
Remember, it is a loving thing to do, to let go and respect your W's wishes - even though they may not be what you want.
Tick for fitness! Now then, how about getting your needs for good conversation met. What's the plan there my friend?? X
OK. My thoughts on this in blue. I know it's a week old, but I asked you to do the exercise, so I will give feedback. Your letter in bvlack. Your comments in bold. My comments in blue.
Ghost this would have been a very bad decision
You have to see this from your wife's point of view last night you tried talking to her and it left her in tears
Good Morning I need to say this I understand that us talking about things does not help ..let me repeat this for My Benefit it Does Not Help. Then if you know this then good don't talk to her about this
Right! You just said talking about this does not help. So why would you continue on with a letter....talking about it?
I mentioned yesterday about me feeling helpless and not having any control over things please try to understand because of this I look for tiny glimmers of hope and all I want is for us to try and make things better whatever this might be. Ghost we all look for glimmers of hope do the work first[ you can only control you you need to understand this it hurts sure it does but you cannot change her mind you might , just might have the chance to influence it but only if you do the right things now
This is good. But what's more is, why are you telling her that you are looking for "glimmers of hope". If your boss fired you, would you be telling him you are looking for glimmers of ghope that he might change his mind and rehire you? Heck no - youd be out getting certified, taking classes, fixing your resume, etc.
Also, how does THIS paragraph compare with your FRIST paragraph? You know. Where you said you dont want to "talk about it"...
I respect you and your decision not to want to talk about this and It hurts me to see you get upset as I still care about you. So you respect her decision ...then why are you trying to talk again
Exactly. How does this letter "respect her decision"?
I will do my best not to bring up things ever again ghost will do my best this leaves you open to failing
Right. What does this even mean? Are you saying that you cant control the words that come out of your mouth? Its 100% within your control to never bring it up again. So just dont do it. Why tell her that you arent going to?
G
I'd give you a pretty good score on reading into your own thoughts with your DB hat on. I think you really DDO understand what were saying, youre just scared to implement it. Hopefully, the new things you are doing will help you alleviate some of that fear.
You know WHAT to do. Just DO it....
Did you setup more sessions with an IC? Have you thought about joining a mens group also? I found both to be very useful over the last year.
Hi I have set up more sessions with IC
I want back to the gym last night did I hr in the treadmill
I woke up this morning and I felt so much better for the exercise
Little bit sad this morning not wanting to turn this back in to a thread about my W however I saw a post on her facebook
Put a frog into a vessel fill with water and start heating the water.
As the temperature of the water begins to rise, the frog adjust its body temperature accordingly.
The frog keeps adjusting its body temperature with the increasing temperature of the water. Just when the water is about to reach boiling point, the frog cannot adjust anymore. At this point the frog decides to jump out.
The frog tries to jump but it is unable to do so because it has lost all its strength in adjusting with the rising water temperature.
Very soon the frog dies.
What killed the frog?
Think about it!
I know many of us will say the boiling water. But the truth about what killed the frog was its own inability to decide when to jump out.
We all need to adjust with people & situations, but we need to be sure when we need to adjust & when we need to move on. There are times when we need to face the situation and take appropriate actions.
If we allow people to exploit us
physically, emotionally, financially, spiritually or mentally they will continue to do so.
Let us decide when to jump!
Let's jump while we still have the strength.
She started posting things on her facebook shortly before she gave me the first bomb I think another rhombus is coming and she is planning in telling me that she wants to sell the house
What do you think I should do or say
Do I say anything to her about seeing the post ?
Do I give her more space offer to move to parents as I feel this is going to give us the space we both need.
Cut back all communication only talk with her if she talks to me first so no persuading at all
I do not want to risk loosing my share of the house
Any advice would be great
Ghost
Why are you even looking at her FB page?
Jeeesh ghost... I'll let the vets give you the advice. But man, do yourself a favor.. Unfollow her on fb. Trust me, I know from experience. As soon as BD happened, I unfollowed my wife and eventually blocked her. I wouldn't ask her anything about the post. It might have nothing to do with you and it would show her she still has you under her finger.
How do you go from a fb post to worrying about losing your share of the house??
Hi I have set up more sessions with IC
I want back to the gym last night did I hr in the treadmill
I woke up this morning and I felt so much better for the exercise
It will only be useful if you are constant.
Little bit sad this morning not wanting to turn this back in to a thread about my W however I saw a post on her facebook You just have, you also just went back to NO GAL or detaching, you also are persuing and snooping. Worst is you KNOW this is wrong but you dont seem to care.
Put a frog into a vessel fill with water and start heating the water.
As the temperature of the water begins to rise, the frog adjust its body temperature accordingly.
The frog keeps adjusting its body temperature with the increasing temperature of the water. Just when the water is about to reach boiling point, the frog cannot adjust anymore. At this point the frog decides to jump out.
The frog tries to jump but it is unable to do so because it has lost all its strength in adjusting with the rising water temperature.
Very soon the frog dies.
What killed the frog?
Think about it!
I know many of us will say the boiling water. But the truth about what killed the frog was its own inability to decide when to jump out.
We all need to adjust with people & situations, but we need to be sure when we need to adjust & when we need to move on. There are times when we need to face the situation and take appropriate actions.
If we allow people to exploit us
physically, emotionally, financially, spiritually or mentally they will continue to do so.
Let us decide when to jump!
Let's jump while we still have the strength.
She started posting things on her facebook shortly before she gave me the first bomb I think another rhombus is coming and she is planning in telling me that she wants to sell the house People post things and change profiles on whatsapp because they are calling out, wanting attention. She has many reasons for doing this, but you should not care. Why you still think about it after what we told you and your pompous posts and fancy phrases full of philosophy still reflects weakness from you and worst still you are happy to acknowledge it and continue hoping something will change for the better.
What do you think I should do or say FFS G ... Read 3 pages back ... she wants to be left alone. She does not want to discuss anything with you. We told you ... you said you had to drop it ... you wrote about moving forward the new you ... bla bla bla. I see its still cr@p.
Do I say anything to her about seeing the post ? Sure, tell her youre snooping her FB page. I think that should get her closer to you and demonstrate you are past your controlling issues.
Do I give her more space offer to move to parents as I feel this is going to give us the space we both need. What do you mean give her more space. BTW Nice line "I feel this is going to give us the space we both need". She wants space from you and you want her space. You are still kidding yourself.
Cut back all communication only talk with her if she talks to me first so no persuading at all Why do you keep writing these lines down only to talk about the complete opposite or do the complete opposite on your next post? Who are these messages for?
I do not want to risk loosing my share of the house Have you seen a lawyer about this, are you following his advice?
Any advice would be great LOL Nice one!!! you have received what? 900 posts of advice to whch you have followed none. What do you want advice for if you NEVER follow it?
Ghost
Max
Thank you for for your really helpful post
I was asking for advice I am trying not to keep getting it wrong
My W is about to walk out the door and I have not helped with the conversations I have had with her
All the advice you ever need was already given to you in previous threads. The point max is making is people can't continue to hold your hand through this and tell you what to do when you don't listen to it. At some point you have to figure it out yourself. It's really only going to happen 3 ways. You wise up and do a radical change to your actions. You push her out the door more and more until shes forced to spell it out for you though her actions. Suffering is involved in all the paths. Or what happened to me where you keep so enmeshed in what she's doing what you eventually break your own heart watching her fall in love with another man.
She's not going to just wake up and decide to keep the family. She is going to want to sell the house and the only reason she's in it right now is to save money and prepare for her new life. You think her staying is good and cohabiting is working but she's only doing it now becaue it let's her prepare for her new life. She wants to escape you and you continue to raise the temperature in that pot. Sorry but this is the truth.
I know how your thinking becaue I did it for months also. Snooping into many things to gauge how she's reacting and convincing yourself things are getting better. She's thinking about how happy her new life is going to be without you and we can't even discuss why that's wrong because you don't accept it thr way it needs to be accepted.
You're stuck. Until something changes you will continue being stuck. Suffering will do it, her pushing forward will do it, but you could do it also.
Hi AP. I honestly starting to wonder about this thread Some of the questions you ask don't really seem right to me Why do you think you would lose your part of the house ? You continuously ask the same questions and not even in different ways Your thank people on here who ( rightly in my opinion ) are telling you your not listening or not even attempting to change
I'm going to hold back posting for a while because something just doesn't seem right
Ghost,
I wish you peace. We cannot talk you out of your crisis. I believe strongly that you need serious IC and probably meds to help control your obsessive ruminating and stop your brain from circling around and around.
I'm going to follow my own DB principles and let you solve this on your own time. You can do this ghost. We believe in you.
Hang in there.
Ghost - You are the frog.
I was asking for advice I am trying not to keep getting it wrong
You don't need advice at this point. You know what to do. You're just not doing it.
I am the frog I thought she was the frog feeling trapped
So you cannot talk me out of my crisis
Am I correct in thinking that my only course of action here is to let her go and tell her that we should instruct soliciters and put the house onthe market she says that when the house sells she will divorce me
That perhaps I should move to my mums and that I am sorry that I have been trying to save the marriage and build something new
Rd the reason I said that I might loose my part of the house is in the UK if you move out of the home then it is possible for her to claim it if I have deserted the home
My head is spinning and I am confused over what I should be doing
I am not trying to be difficult I just am seriously struggling
1) The best thing to do is to let her go
2) I should tell her that we should instruct soliciters to put the house on the market
3) I should move to my mums
4) I should tell her that I am sorry that I have been trying to save the marriage and build something new
NOBODY ELSE ANSWER THESE.
YOU GIVE IT A SHOT, GHOST.
WHAT DO YOU THINK WE WILL SAY TO THESE?
I have let her go I do not have any control over whatever she is going to do
Moving to my mums will give her space but this will not help to make things better as I doubt anythng will make things better now
I should instruct a solicitor and tell her I am going to to move things forwards to where it is going to go to
No point in telling her I am sorry for trying to save the marriage ...just laying guilt on her
Azzork
I get what you say that I am the frog
I see this just don't what to believe it
Thank you
I have let her go I do not have any control over whatever she is going to do
So why are you asking us? Of COURSE the best thing is to let her go. So just do it.
Moving to my mums will give her space but this will not help to make things better as I doubt anythng will make things better now
It isnt about "making things better". Try again. Should I move out to your mom's place?
I should instruct a solicitor and tell her I am going to to move things forwards to where it is going to go to
Are you [censored] kidding me? Why would you do that? HAS ANYBODY RECOMMENDED YOU TO DO THAT? ANY. SINGLE. PERSON?From everything I can tell, you are not interested in a divorce at this time. So why the hell would you do the work for it?
Try again. Should I instruct a solicitor to move forward with a divorce?
No point in telling her I am sorry for trying to save the marriage ...just laying guilt on her
Yep. Got it.
Yes I did
I will read it again tonight
Please is there any specific sections that I should pay particular attention to ?
Or just read the whole book again
Ok I will not get a solicitor to do this I do not want this I do not want to divorce
No harm in re-reading the book.
But you already know what to do. STFU, detach, and get a life that doesn't revolve around her, your feelings for her, your expectations about her and your M, and your fear.
ATP
Get legal advice. I moved out of the family house primarily because I couldn't afford it on my own.
I took advice and there was no detriment to moving out.
Best thing I ever did was letting her go. You can move on with your life and believe me it gets easier.
Im now in Divorce proceedings and looking forward to the day when my stbx is no longer in my life apart from our daughter.
She made her choice and I made mine......no more dancing to her tune..
So up early and down to the gym for my consultation
Feeling very motivated to loose the weight and get fitt
Booked in ten sessions with the personal trainer
My daughter is just two for the next how ever many years we will be passing her back and forward this seems so wronging my son is 12 this cannot be the best for him
No family holidays it is so much easier for everyone living together
I just want her to work on things
ATP, in terms of your focus, Keep this >>>> So up early and down to the gym for my consultation
Feeling very motivated to loose the weight and get fitt
Booked in ten sessions with the personal trainer
Lose this>>>>>>My daughter is just two for the next how ever many years we will be passing her back and forward this seems so wronging my son is 12 this cannot be the best for him
No family holidays it is so much easier for everyone living together
I just want her to work on things
Read what you post again - this seems so wronging, it is so much easier for everyone, I just want her to.....Let this stuff go, it is not yours to control. Release it ATP and every time your mind goes down this track, switch it back on to you, the gym, what you can do for yourself, okay??
What Sotto said, let it go. Those things are outside of your control so why even think about them? It's you you're worried about, not them. The kids will actually manage better than we like to realize. It may not be the best situation they could be in but they will adapt and overcome all of this.
Now, how about you?
No more talk about the kids and what's best for them unless your trying to decide if it would be better to take them to a museum or the park on Saturday.
Went out for a drive tonight given the option of staying in watching TV with the W playing happy family's I had to get out
Went to my mums but I really do not have anything to do here
So I have been given a heck of a lot of advice and I try to remember all the good advice that has been given to me
I know what I have to do but I cannot do this I do not feel that it should be me to make this decision. I do not need any advice I just need to vent
Vent Ghost, vent all you want. This is the hardest thing in life I have experienced so far Ghost, just vent, its ok.
I am sorry. I am glad you have your mom, I am sure she is glad that she can be there for you.
Went to my mums but I really do not have anything to do here
Why dont you plan some kind of GAL activity instead next time?
I know what I have to do but I cannot do this I do not feel that it should be me to make this decision.
What decision are you talking about?
I know what I have to do but I cannot do this I do not feel that it should be me to make this decision.
No, no, no. I can only assume "be me to make this decision" is to sell the house or to file for D and if that's what you "know what I have to do" then you still don't know.
Why do you keep assuming, after it being pointed out multiple times, that accepting that she is done with the M right now means you have to do one of those things?
What you do have to do is let go of the fear of being alone and let whatever happens happens.
We told you to let her go, that doesn't mean D her, it means stop pursuing her while she deals with her life and you deal with yours. If she wants to sell the house or D that's on her and you don't need to fight her on it.
This doesn't make sense to you because your fear is clouding your thoughts. You jump from wanting to do everything to fix the M to doing everything to end it. There is a middle ground, just listen and read your threads to figure it out.
Azz
Fog hit the nail on the head when he said I was thinking that I see no way out of this and that if I gave her what she wants
ii have to sleep I am exhausted
I have booked a DB session tomorrow with a coach
Thanks
Ok so I am in a clearer state of mind and I am trying to see things clearer
It is my wife who wants out of the marriage
I feel that the longer we are apart them more she will move away from me emotionally I understand that if this is something she wants to happen then it will happen.
I have fear that she has her needs both emotionally and physically that she needs met and she will find these somewhere else. Neither of us have strayed during the marriage and during our marriage we both felt that this would be pretty much the worst thing we could ever do.
Now we are only married on paper there is little to stop her finding happiness elsewhere.
How long do people stay in limbo for ?
We get along ok ...I do not know how much of it is show and how much is the real emotions I have been doing things wrong over the months I have been trying hard to keep a connection try and build conversation look for ways to build up intamacy. We spend time together watching TV we have been out as a family just the other day my W and I went out for a pizza meal ..just the two of us. I felt dreadful afterwards It gives me false hope
A few days ago I posted about something I had seen on her facebook page about a frog in boiling water and Azz mentioned that I was the frog... I did not see this at the time, it talked about getting out while you still can. She was posting this about her getting out of our situation, yet it can work both ways.
Fear I have fear [censored] loads of it
I am fearful if we divorce move to separate houses what effect this will have on our children being pulled from house to house child swap what if a child gets hurt when in my care. My W is very skilled with childcare this is her job our two year old is developing very quickly my W has 7 days to give her love and support to our daughter if we share custody then this will reduce to 3/4 days ...she is hoping that I will give her as much as she gives on the days that I have the children.
If she feels I have been abusive why would she let me have the children for 3/4 days and her not be with them it makes no sence
If things go wrong then resentment will build rapidly as might her hate or anger ...I know a am looking at the worst case.
My W feels that she has been living in an abusive marriage I do not know how I can fix this. She believes that the reason the abuse has stopped is because she took action and ended the marriage ...noting to do with the fact that I have made reall efforts to be a better man.
How long do people stay in limbo at what point do they decide to move forwards without wanting to fight any longer for the marriage
This keeps coming back to my W wanting to divorce and wanting to be in two separate houses if this is what she wants and if this is the only option then I should surly give her what she wants .
she has told me she feels she has been in an abusive relationship how am I going to feel or react if I see her in the arms of another man ..with anger ?? I do this then she will say that I am still abusive ...how would you feel or react seeing your loved one in the arms of another person.
I want to continue the fight for my marriage I am not ready to give up. The pain of not having my W hurts.
I would welcome any thoughts
Thank you
Atp
I want my W to be happy and feel,loved
I want my children to feel happy and loved
I want to feel happy and loved
Ok so I am in a clearer state of mind and I am trying to see things clearer
I have fear that she has her needs both emotionally and physically that she needs met and she will find these somewhere else. Neither of us have strayed during the marriage and during our marriage we both felt that this would be pretty much the worst thing we could ever do.
FEAR?!!
Now we are only married on paper there is little to stop her finding happiness elsewhere.
How long do people stay in limbo for ?
AS LONG AS IT TAKES TO HEAL. AND NO, YOU ARE NOT EVEN NEARLY THERE.
We get along ok ...I do not know how much of it is show and how much is the real emotions I have been doing things wrong over the months I have been trying hard to keep a connection try and build conversation look for ways to build up intamacy. We spend time together watching TV we have been out as a family just the other day my W and I went out for a pizza meal ..just the two of us. I felt dreadful afterwards It gives me false hope
A few days ago I posted about something I had seen on her facebook page about a frog in boiling water and Azz mentioned that I was the frog... I did not see this at the time, it talked about getting out while you still can. She was posting this about her getting out of our situation, yet it can work both ways.
STOP WITH THE FACEBOOK...
Fear I have fear [censored] loads of it
SEE ABOVE...
I am fearful if we divorce move to separate houses what effect this will have on our children being pulled from house to house child swap what if a child gets hurt when in my care. My W is very skilled with childcare this is her job our two year old is developing very quickly my W has 7 days to give her love and support to our daughter if we share custody then this will reduce to 3/4 days ...she is hoping that I will give her as much as she gives on the days that I have the children.
FEAR?!?!
If she feels I have been abusive why would she let me have the children for 3/4 days and her not be with them it makes no sence
AGAIN STOP WITH THE MIND READING. DO YOU SEE NOW, WHAT YOUR SNOOPING LEAD YOU TO?!?
If things go wrong then resentment will build rapidly as might her hate or anger ...I know a am looking at the worst case.
My W feels that she has been living in an abusive marriage I do not know how I can fix this. She believes that the reason the abuse has stopped is because she took action and ended the marriage ...noting to do with the fact that I have made reall efforts to be a better man.
MINDREADING
How long do people stay in limbo at what point do they decide to move forwards without wanting to fight any longer for the marriage
SEE ABOVE...
This keeps coming back to my W wanting to divorce and wanting to be in two separate houses if this is what she wants and if this is the only option then I should surly give her what she wants .
she has told me she feels she has been in an abusive relationship how am I going to feel or react if I see her in the arms of another man ..with anger ?? I do this then she will say that I am still abusive ...how would you feel or react seeing your loved one in the arms of another person.
DETACH...
I want to continue the fight for my marriage I am not ready to give up. The pain of not having my W hurts.
DETACH... AND GIVE UP THE FIGHT. YOUR M IS OVER, DONE, BURIED, GET WITH THE PROGRAM...
I would welcome any thoughts
Thank you
Atp
Hi G
You should get a prize for the member asking the same question in different and original ways.
You should also get another one for ignoring the most advice given here.
Finally you should get another one as the member who most tries to kick start a zombie marriage.
When will you realize your R cannot be saved with your current actions even if you hired a Jedi.
You are intelligent but weak and until you realise that real change starts with actions and only with you ..... You will never live happily with or without her.
Max
The point of the frog story was not "get out while you can".
The point was that to save yourself, you need to understand and adapt to your surroundings.
In calling you the frog, I was pointing out that you can see your surroundings changing, but you are not adapting to them. And as such, you are going to be in big trouble.
Learn and adapt.
I can't believe we're doing this same cycle with you again. I feel like that's the 50th time I've read that same post and I can almost see what you will write next. I said no more talking about how much this will effect the kids and you listed off you same old fears. I'm sorry ATP but I think I have to back out of your thread also until you take some of the advice you have been given over and over. Good luck, I understand how difficult this is for you and I truely feel for you but at some point you have to follow your own path.
Thank you for trying to get through to me
I am in no hurry
I have changed in many ways and these changes are for me I like the new ghost my children like the new ghost and perhaps in time my W might like the new ghost.
I tried to understand that I have to let things go and for me I will try to work on my fear
Max sometimes well actually mostly I seem to miss what your trying to say.
I will keep working in making ghost a better person I do not divorce bust very well I am going to re read some of my earlier threads
My sitch changed from me thinking that my W was upset because I did not do enough with the kids and the house work but it comes down to she felt neglected and abused
I have no control of what she does I can and will be the man that I want to be
Thanks
Ghost
The point of the frog story was not "get out while you can".
The point was that to save yourself, you need to understand and adapt to your surroundings.
In calling you the frog, I was pointing out that you can see your surroundings changing, but you are not adapting to them. And as such, you are going to be in big trouble.
Azz I am trying to adapt trying to let go detach I will keep reading other people posts and see if I can pick up on what I need to be doing
Thank you
Learn and adapt.
ATP, it seems a little strange to me that as people are opting out of this thread I am choosing to post, but I feel ya.
I see you as wide eyed with panic. You probably look almost the same to everyone in your daily life, but fear and sadness of what is in reality happening and of the scenarios your overactive brain is constantly creating is paralyzing your ability to focus on what is being said to you. And its hard to breathe with that boa constrictor around your chest.
You are trying to manipulate advice given to you in such a way that it seems people are telling you to walk away and lose everything and be depressed for ever and ever (victimhood) or to be able to say "yeah I've been doing that for a long time and nothing is working!Its all hopeless! Help me!" (Put up wall, shut down, back to victimhood).
Slow...Down. THIS IS GOING TO TAKE A LONG TIME. You, and I I now realize, have not been in this sitch very long. REALLY. We are short timers. Changing little things about us over a few months is not sending a message to our spouses that we have made permanent changes. That is because we are...wait for this...STILL ONLY DOING IT FOR THEM. To be permanent, IT HAS TO BE FOR US, because it feel like we are better off REGARDLESS OF OUR MARRIAGE OR KIDS.
I believe you need to realize how much you are trying to control. The mere fact that you are in a panic about not being able to do anything right now and not knowing what to do shows how much you NEED to be in control. YOU ARE NOT. But, you can CONTROL YOURSELF.
Go to work. Smile. Engage. Be awesome at your job. Go for walks on your lunch hour. Ask people to walk with you. Ask them about their lives. Don't complain about yours.
Come home.Play with your kiddos. Talk to them about friends and school. Don't judge, just laugh with them empathize. Go for walks. Go do something fun. LET THEM PICK THE TOPIC OR ACTIVITY. IF they are so used to you doing it that they can't, GIVE THEM THREE CHOICES AND ASK THEM TO PICK ONE. If they say no drop it and save it for another time and don't be hurt by it. Shake it off.Tickle them. Give them noogies.
Greet your wife with a smile if and when you see her. Then go do something, fix something. Go for a walk. If she makes you dinner, tell her it is good and thank her. Clean up. If you cook, offer her some. If she says no. smile and say ok, then drop the subject.DO NOT TELL HER TO DO ANYTHING. DO NOT FOLLOW HER AROUND> GIVE HER SPACE. if you are lonely, go online or to a bookstore, or online to a bookstore. Research everything you can on validation, control issues, emotional response, emotional regulation, emotional reactivity, communication and detachment. LEAVE HER ALONE PLEASANTLY. DO NOT ASK HER HOW SHE IS OR HOW HER DAY WENT. DONT ASK HER ANYTHING.
Find other people to hang with...meetup.com, library, bowling league, church, naked camel racing...whatever interests you.
DONT THINK OF THE FUTURE. ITS NOT HERE YET. DONT THINK OF LEAVING. OR SELLING THE HOUSE. YOU AREN'T THERE YET.
SLOW...DOWN...NO EXPECTATIONS MEANS DON'T EXPECT ANYTHING.
DON'T LET YOUR FEARS AND WORRIES RULE YOUR MIND.
ok. I'm done now.
Ciluzen
big thumbs up... Awesome advice...
Ciluzen you make a lot of sence ...a heck of a lot of sence
I thank you for your valuable post
Many people have stuck with me for ages and I have been scared and my fear is what has stopped me from moving forward
Thank you
Ghost
First off please take this however you want or throw it away as maybe I am just in a mood. I also know I am by no means good at this but I have to say these things.
You changed your name, not sure why. You are worse than before in here. I understand we come here to vent but you are asking questions and getting answers then asking the same questions. You are not at peace
Here is the part that I am going to say that you won't like and I know it is hard for me to grasp also.
Your wife does not want you. She still lives with you out of convenience. There is nothing you can do to change her mind you can change 100% and it will not matter. She has to wake up one day and decide she does want you. You could rob a bank or save a dying child and it will make no difference. You could give her dying mothers kidney or pull the plug. It will not matter.
So what do you do? Of course you still pray for what you want and take advantage of instances to get it but you live your life like it will never happen. Don't do something that goes against what you want but stop trying to make it happen. She is not a new girl you are trying to get attention of. You already did that the game has changed. Now you have to let her sit.
Please stop
Posting about fear. We all fear. If she leaves are you going to crumble up and shrivel away? I hope not. Life is what you make of it. Do not come back and say I just want my life to be my family. We get it. May not be in the cards right now. But maybe down the road. But maybe not if you don't live life!
By the way. I need to live my life about what I just wrote as well! Lol