Hi all. Thanks for checking in. Back from hols and kids and I had a great time. Myself and youngest three went and we did everything possible and loved the place. First time there and it was like we had landed on the moon. The whole place is volcanic rock and not s blade of grass to be seen. Weather was fantastic and enjoyed by us all Hire car took some getting used to because they put the steering wheel on the wrong side and not only that but they drive on the wrong side as well !!! Foreigners !!! Up early every morning and in to the pool Great start to the day hotel was all inclusive so S16 thought he had gone to heaven !! Three or four plate fiulls at every meal !!! Strolling along the beach at 12 at night in a t shirt and shorts !!!!!
Very tearful send off from EXW and it was awkward as she seemed to expect a hug but i jumped into drivers seat and accepted her farewells from a distance. She called 3' times before I got to the airport , all about nothing.
D11 text EXW everyday but the other two didn't. On the third day I got a text saying she hoped we where having a great time but she was disappointed not to get texts. I sent her 6/7 pictures of the kids getting on submarine and looking over the edge of a volcano , etc and she thanked me. Got one telephone call about kids and 1'other text to wish us a safe journey home
We got home with takeaway and EXW was home making dinner. Maybe stayed about two hours and left. She had cleaned the whole house which was nice. Before she left
She asked my opinion on her car insurance which had gone up. Her car is insured with the company that my company spends about 20k a year with so I called my contact and got her premium reduced by 20%. Looking back I maybe shouldn't have got involved but I would do the same for a customer or friend ( and have done )
EXW also asked me about a gas bill which she's not sure how it was calculated. I did offer to look at tit I will remind you all that EXW does not take any cash from me when I have offered so I'm not sure why she would ask about a gas bill. Insuarncce yes , because i have contacts
She then went on for about 30mins about which new phone she should get as she has a free upgrade next week
All in all things much the same on EXW front and I feel she has accepted her lot. That's mind reading I know but it's how I feel. Things do change and I'm very lucky compared to so many on here.
Thanks to you all for checking in. Take care Rd
Link to links
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=userposts&view=started&id=36100
Sounds like a great holiday Rd. Also sounds like you're making the best out of your sitch by focusing so much on the kids. That's all you can do and is the healthiest option all around, so well done.
Also sounds like XW knows she's missing out but has a disconnect as to why. She sounds sad from what you've written, I know the whole sitch is sad for all involved.
Keep putting your best foot forward and taking care of your kids. They know you're there for them despite the awfulness that's also happening.
Cheers,
PP
Hi PP. very greatful for the support its hard to know if she's sad or if it's the depression. I know mind reading does no good and I'm the first to point it out to others I must follow my own advice Kids are very easy to focus on as they are fantastic. My girls can't walk past me without giving me a hug , they sneak into my bed EVERY night about 3/4 am and my boys are fantastic S16 gives me a hug every night before bed and S20 is my strongest supporter I can't stress how lucky I am to have my kids and my heart breaks when I hear of others tales of part time parenting. You all amaze me with your strength and I'm not sure I could do what some of you do.
I also have huge support from mine and EXW family and while I don't contact EXW family I do receive calls and texts every now and then checking in with me
Like most I dwell on how easy it would be to repair the M if only we had tried but it's taken me almost a year to realise it was too late for EXW by then and she was done. We have all ended Rs at some point in our lives and can remember times when someone you no longer wanted in your life would not let go gracefully Now we are the ones that have been let go I think we need to show that grace even if it feels like it's killing us.
I read the DR and DB books often and while I whole heartily agree with them maybe some of us need more time than others to accept reality. I certainly did and was afraid to do anything that might appear to EXW as anti her even if it wasn't
Since I accepted that she's done I have moved forward, new car , new wardrobe , activities with the kids , sun holiday etc. I still treat EXW with respect and kindness but I don't answer calls if I don't feel like it. I answer texts when I'm ready and with a polite response Business like on all matters even if I'm helping
I can still say I love EXW She was a great W and mother up until 2 years ago and I can't dismiss that She keeps her private life quiet and still denies OM ( I don't ask but SIL did recently )
I won't go into detail because I'm not sure I would be believed at this stage but I was offered unusual relations with a near stranger while away and I only thought
that sort of thing happened in a certain movie Maybe it's the deodorant I wear because while I'm no Quasimodo I'm no George Clioney either !!!!
Thanks again for the support Take care. Rd
Hi RD, I'm glad you started a new thread....and who knows, Pink may drop by and say Hello too. She'd better not be too long, because there's clearly a queue forming!
I'm glad you and the kids had such a good time. It sounded like a great trip. And of course, no holiday is complete without a proposition for 'unusual relations' from a stranger....
It sounds like you are doing well. As you say - new car, new wardrobe and so on. Whilst I'm sure you would love to see some movement, you are accepting things and finding joy in your life. I think that is what we all aim for.
As for your W....well, it's hard to say really. It sounds like a funny 'friendship' with OM. But who knows? She clearly isn't in a great place right now and it may take time, but something will shift at some point. But I think when you get to the point you have, it almost doesn't matter how much time it may take because you are living your life anyway.
Hope you have a great weekend my friend xx
RD, that must be some deoderant if a total stranger is offering unusual relations! LOL, you have me wondering about that one..... You sound like you are doing well. It is good to hear from someone who has made it through.
Hi photoka. Far from through it but it does get much better. I'm not sure if I was clear about unusual but I'm not talking about normal stuff here. I won't go into detail but this lady had read one to many recently popular books about a Mr grey.
I wouldn't have been surprised to get an offer , after all I am very charming !!!! But an offer like this , it rocked me and not in a good way
Thanks for posting. Rd
And what is wrong with a little kink?
Don't knock it till you have tried it......
At least 50 shades made me roar with laughter.......
On the local garden centre they had a sign 50 sheds of grey.
V
So new car, new wardrobe, new you thanks to DB'ing, a holiday with those you love the most and an indecent proposal, what other things do you have on your mightily impressive tick sheet!? :-). How is the tan now that UK weather has had its input for a few days?
You aren't going to mind read your W and that's exactly right, it doesn't stop the rest of us offering observations though, right?
Your wife is demonstrating classic symptoms of depression, maybe mild to moderate but depression all the same. Only she can find her way out of that and she has to want to before her healing will commence.
I am starting to see a common thread in a number of sitch's I am following and it's making me wonder that when these couples were first getting together, a long time or not so long ago, how intricate must the dance have been? But usually when something significant happened (a concert, a long day trip that took planning, a school/college trip or disco...) it led to a coming together or at the very least a major step forward in that relationship.
Things have moved on in their R's and stuff's been said and bellowed at times plus well meaning friends have used platitudes and well worn phrases so those who haven't turned to forums or books or coaches are all at sea. Maybe thinking what have they done, what can I do and they end up feeling hopeless. If they are with an OM or OW, they think they are happy and that there is no way back, but is the happiness real or forced?
What they may need is a spark in their life or a lighthouse. The trouble is that they are probably mind reading those of us who are lighthouses and are potentially thinking, he/she won't want me, he/she's moved on and I'm left behind, or are simply blinded by our lights...depressed people then allow such thoughts to go round and round on this and turn things into mental monsters.
Meanwhile we are taking good care of ourselves, watching someone who is rudderless and wondering if they'll ever get back on any kind of course.
All of this ends up creating a bit of a block on "stuff", each partner looking to the other for signs that the other partner doesn't know they need to exhibit.
We also can't be the rescue team for our S's.
Rd, you like many, including me, are detaching to take care of ourselves but are we spending so much time keeping ourselves under control, that maybe we make our sitch's in some ways immobile?
My perception is that the majority of the sitch's that are on the significant mend here are doing so as a result of something majorly unforeseen or significant, those that are making ever so slow progress have a theme of "same old, same old".
You know that I've been banging the no more mr nice guy drum, that stands for putting yourself first and getting your own needs dealt with first. A more recent book has suggested that a good row, clears the air as it gets stuff in the open.
What I'm saying is are we all scared of creating or aiding the growth of a potential seismic event (an argument, a conclusive and broadcasted contentious decision...) because we fear things will move the wrong way?
How many times in the past have you found that while it is stressful, a row or something significant in a relationship caused a shift?
I am not suggesting that we all go out and pick fights with our S's, at the same time I think we should use other popular psychology and think big in what we do.
A number publicly post their goals for themselves on here so we can see their progress, what is missing from each one is a date that they are aiming for to achieve a certain objective in their R. So while we are all congratulating one another on our progress, which is incredibly important, are we all helping one another ignore an elephant in the room a timing for getting things shifted in our R's?
This is rambling a bit (a lot) and it's your thread rd, so I'll stop now.
Why did I say all of this, you might be wondering? The way you've described things, you and your wife are in a dance and both are frightened to change too much in case it upsets the other. If she upsets you she may not see her kids, if you upset her she may take another step away from you. That's a stalemate, so set some lofty goals (published on here or otherwise) and go for them. Be brave, be empathic, be compassionate and be decisive.
Does any of it make any sense, or is mr fixit coming back to the fore with a new disguise?
Hi Avanti. Thanks for the post. I think you are completely right I have a friend that's been through a year long seperation 10'years ago. He went to great lengths to recover and spent a great deal of money. He basically let go He was kind , generous even but he most defiantly let go. He said to his partner that while he hoped she found happiness in the future he hoped it'd was with someone who loved her as much as him She returned 2 months later and my friend , while very pleased didn't mind which way it could have gone
With EXW and I , it is indeed a dance of sorts. I do not contact her in any way unless it's in response She has text me only two weeks ago over D14 being v upset that she's sorry for all the hurt she's caused and often wonders how the hell we got to this situation. I didnt respond. EXW has in the past few months told me she hates her self and loves us all more than anything I didn't respond.
She denies OM to all her friends and family and has told my Ds that he is not a friend and not a nice person. EXW.has come forward on lots of occasions but I don't feel it's for the right reasons. I feel it's guilt and shame She left the marriage after 25'years. She has left her kids and her old life behind and now is on anti Ds, which she told me that if she had been on them 2'years ago none of this would have happened
EXW has herself said that she hopes something big happens and it will resolve all this
I have accepted its over but deep down I do feel she will want to return to the family unit one day but that day is very far away
Thanks for posting Take care. Rd
Hi RD, I think that's the key - to get to that place where you accept and are truly okay with the fact it may go either way. I once read about someone saying they would gratefully accept either outcome, and that always stayed with me. They stated it in more religious terms, and I'm not a believer, but I appreciated the outlook on things.
I suspect that your W may well want to return to the family unit at some point. I certainly don't feel that bridges have been burned from your end and I feel that you have shown a great deal of understanding, whilst not getting drawn into her dysfunction. Whether she has burned bridges from your perspective is up to you. In my sitch I struggle with the thought of overcoming all that has passed. I imagine many feel the same. Equally, I would like to think I can be as forgiving as the next person....I guess time will tell on that one.
I agree that your W is in denial with close family and friends. It is strange to tell others that OM is not a nice person or a friend.....but he does (or has??) share her bed??! I keep coming back to that....what's that all about then?? I imagine your W (when she becomes more healthy) will tire of what OM offers (we're not really sure what that is - a project? Another person in a mess too?) At that point, I think much depends on your approach.
Equally, you are at a similar point to me (apart from H filed for D) and it seems reasonable that you live your own life to all intents and purposes. Whether that includes dating is up to you - but I think fairness to the datee is critical there....otherwise - live your life and have some fun. But maybe stay away from strangers offering unusual activities...
Anyway - hope you have a fabulous weekend with those kiddos RD xx
Hi Sotto. Will be staying away from offers like that for sure. I had been chatting for about 20 mins !!!!
Re the burning of bridges I do feel EXW has done just that , especially at the start of all this. While I like to think I'm a much calmer person now I don't think I'm mature enough to rebuild the trust I had in her. I know I'm getting ahead of myself but that doesn't stop me wondering. Maybe life would be easier if I created a new NC dynamic that it much more clear cut. I effect NC pretty well and stick to the neighbour mantra even when EXW looks for more in way of help or advice
One of my biggest struggles at the moment is the kids. S20 is chatty with EXW but he also only responds. S16 is very standoffish but only on a superficial level because he adores his mum and has taken her leaving very hard D14 is very upset and having to deal with being 14'on top of all this is hard on her and she's a princess ( not in a good way ) anyway D11 is plain lost , she adores us both and just wants everything back to normal We have all bonded as a new unit but it hard to deal with all the different personalities , each struggling in their own way
As I have said before I'm not always sure what I am doing is the right thing
Re the OM , I have accepted they are together because it's easier for me If I try to believe.what she's telling everyone it gets very confusing and doesn't really make any sense and then I just let my mind wonder to bad places like her family
know but won't tell me or L/C is wrong etc
I do have a question if you could mull it over. Christmas is coming and I really don't want to spend it with her What's my best route here ? I could tell her out straight and offer her Xmas day with the kids or Boxing Day with the kids. I could offer her both days and next year I could have them Or I could tell a lie and say I'm working. I could cover this as it's something that does arise in my line of work
We have S16s birthday before but that's relatively easy to get around
Thank for posting Sotto. Take care. Rd. xx
RD, what do your kids want to do about the holidays? I'm not saying put it up for a vote, you are the parent and you get to decide, but do you have a sense of what their expectations might be?
Hi Sunny. As far I know the three younger ones would want it be family as usual it S20 and I have discussed it and he will accept what I decide S20 is very adamnet that EXW has no place in his life other than a friend and certainly not a mother. This is sad as they had a very special bond and I used to love seeing them together
Thanks for posting. Take care. Rd xx
So....your kids want a family gathering. But you can't just suck it up for a few hours? RD, that doesn't sound like you. What's really going on?
You are wise beyond your years Sunny. I'm actually lying on the couch in my office since 11am. I have blocked EXWs number on my phone and have ignored all calls from home. She's there this afternoon with kids. The kids have mobiles if they need me.
I'm in a slump after hols. I am going to whinge now so please feel free to ignore the next few paragraphs. I'm struggling with all this since yesterday I'm not a bad guy. I know I'll be happy again and there will be a time when all this is behind me It just feels like why do my kids and I have I have our lives so upset by someone who used to see us as her world. I know the answers and I know her telling me she's depressed and unhappy and lost , etx needs to be taken with a grain of salt but it effects me. Little things like when she left she put all our ornaments from our bedroom into a drawer and over the last 6 months they have been appearing back in the room. Even two days ago after the hols she had put out a ying and yang ornament from years back. I know it means nothing I really do but it just gets to me
I'm sure I can find a decent partner to spend time with but I really don't want my kids to have to get to know someone new I grew up in a single parent family and I always wanted better for my kids and now they are facing the same if not worse
Rant over. Thanks for caring Sunny. It means a lot Take care. Rd xx
RD, I wouldn't be so sure the redecorating means nothing. Maybe it's her way of trying to feel more connected. Or maybe it truly means nothing.
Have you ever asked her what it would take for her to come home? At this point I don't really see that it would do any harm, especially not if you made it clear that you had a list of non-negotiables as well. It might be that she expresses she'd love to come back and was just waiting for you to ask. It might be that she's not willing to do what it takes according to your boundaries. It might be that you aren't willing because the hurts too deep. But it would be an interesting conversation, don't you think?
Obviously, you are not in the right place to make holiday decisions yet. Sleep on that. For a couple weeks.
Sorry you're in a slump RD. Are you sure it's not regret about not taking up that invite??
It's true that you will be happy again. It's also true that 'through' it is the only way and of course we have our ups and downs as things progress. It is hard to accept that someone who once thought the sun shone out of us now.....doesn't. I think having kids must make it so much harder. For me, I regret the impact on SS - but I"m not his Mum and I just see myself responsible for my R with him now. I don't have that awful feeling of anger/regret for my kids having to go through this.
I will post some more about other queries you raised....need to dash out now - but wanted to stop by for a big hug (((((((((((((((((((RD))))))))))))))))))) I would also make an unusual invitation....but I'm not sure quite what that would comprise!!
Take care, and thanks for your post on my thread xxx
That's odd. It's as if, by stealth, she's moving back in to your life. OK, I think I would ask her the question. Something like 'I noticed you've been placing the ornaments out in our bedroom. Do you want to talk?'. I'll probably get slapped down by the fellow members here, but I think you've been the lighthouse so long, it might be time for the lifeboat to just stick a hand over the side and see if anybody reaches up.
Hi RD, that's interesting about the ornament and the cleaning too. I do get a sense that she still wants to be lady of the house at some level. And at another level, there is the whole OM/dysfuntion thing going on...
It might be an option to mention the yin/yang thing and say. I noticed that ornament came out...haven't seen that one for a while. Then float a little silence and see what bubbles up perhaps. Perhaps nothing will. I wouldn't go as far as asking her directly though. I think if she wants to reach out she will if you are generally kind and supportive and there is still some smooth paving on that road.
But from your perspective, I imagine OM would need to be very much out of the picture and your W very willing to do the necessary hard work to rebuild your R. She isn't there yet....but who knows, she may be slowly working her way in that direction. But I guess my point is - there isn't much point wondering and worrying about it - better to live your life as if you won't be together again. And if she does want something different - well, you can consider that if/when it happens.
Hope you have perked up a little xx
Sotto, at this point why not just ask directly? I don't think he has much to lose, and directness may get him an answer he could otherwise wait forever on. But you are a wise women and I'd love to hear your reasoning.
Hi Sunny, I guess I was just sticking with the 'don't initiate R talks' advice really. There may be some signs that she misses home and wants to be lady of the house again. But, as RD would say - are these just stars when really a planet is needed?
But I can see where you are coming from with this and if RD is able to ask and truly have no expectations - maybe that's okay? I guess in my own sitch, I am keen not to undo months of being seen to move solidly forward without H. And if RD says - what would it take for you to come home again? - might it undo some of the 'moving forward/on, you may be losing me' impression? It may just be that I'm overthinking that one.
I also think in RD's sitch, his W expresses regret quite often and says her life is miserable. But, she doesn't actually do anything significant to start repairing things with RD. And, given all that has passed, I think something significant from her would be needed. Although she has 'been there' more for the children, which is good.
Those are just my thoughts....but RD - you know your sitch and your W best. I'm sure you'll do what feels right in all the circumstances. It's good that you have a few viewpoints to ponder over...
Take care xx
Hey RD just checking in on you I am not the person for advice at least not yet but if I was to say something it would be ...the point you made about Christmas and saying you have work is this really what you want to do ...I think probably not
You decide on what is right for RD
Take care my friend
Ghost
Thanks Huddy , Sunny and Sotto
Huddy and Sunny. I'm not sure asking her directly would be something Im comfortable with and she has told D14 on more than one occasion she wants to come home but can't at the moment. I do have nothing to lose and I don't think I'm afraid of the answer because I feel I know the answer would be not at the moment Which is no in any other language
EXW has been trying to be more involved in the house and told me a few weeks back that she still considers me her business I just smile at these sorts of things because they are just words. When previous ornaments came out I did ask and she just said it made the room nicer
Sotto. I would agree that she would have to make the move but I am aware that I have shut her down quite often. I posted a few weeks ( more ) back that she called and started feeling me she felt burnt out as a mother and she also could never see me in the rage I was in when I found out about OM. I answered that she would never be Iin a position to see me like that again and no one else would because I would never be hurt like that again. She defended herself with the usual he is just a friend but I cut her off She said she was feeling better after taking the anti ds and much more like her old self and wished she had taken them 2 years ago and none of this might have happen ( she added honey ) after the sentence and again I just said it is what it is I've always taken each conversation about an R as EXW just talking but I could have taken it way more positively Even chatting when we got back Thursday she called me honey a few times
Re OM , I have let it go by just accepting what is. She is denying to all. She has various issues re her body that may have an influence here but maybe not I don't talk about OM and she's knows not to mention it to me or the kids She has told the kids he's not even a real friend and just someone to chat with and she told L/C the same and L/C believes her completely. I don't dwell to much because it not worth it
ultimately I can only react from my gut and it's telling me to leave her to it She has come forward but it may be temp checking. We can't D for another 4 years and anything I do now will only affect kids. I avoided 6 calls today and feel better for it
Thank you all for your advice. It means a lot to know people actually have an interest and care
Take care. Rd
Thanks for posting Ghost. I will take Sunnys advice and sleep on it
Take care. Rd
RD
Bruv, what about those wonderful film evenings and cuddle hugs with your Ds?
Is that still happening?
Which film is next, are there pizzas?
How is SIL, the bike and.... Car?
V
I must have missed the OM part of the sitch. Yes, I see where you're coming from. Maybe she's afraid of saying she was wrong. Not making excuses for her.
Hi Huddy and Vanillia.
Huddy. Yes IOM is a serious issue. D11 spends Friday night with EXW and this Friday EXW told her that D11 could ask her anything g about her life because EXW has nothing to hide. OM is a bi polar alcoholic with serious mental issue and not someone you would want to be around. EXW tells all that he's not even a friend but just someone to spend time with but I think she's convinced herself at this stage. She is going through menopause and has being diagnosed with depression she's being on Prozac for 2 months now and the kids have seen a huge difference. She has told me lots that she's made a mistake and is ruining her life but that's where it stops She spent the first 10 months out of the house just crying when ever I saw her and I had lots of very very sad texts. I have friends who are friends of her on FB and she was posting real sad things about losing everything. She told me 10'weeks ago that she had called the Samaritans 3 times and her sister confirmed this to me
Vanillia. We watched little Nicky before we went away and have dodgeball to watch later this week. Bike hasn't been used for a while but have appointment with consultant on weds so it will get a blast then. Car is a dream and loving it I had a lot of car over the years and this is by far the nicest to drive SIL is quite enough. A few texts and one call to say EXW had called to tell her that OM had been really nasty and SIL asked again if she was WITH him. EXW again denied and SIL believe her
Thank you both for posting. Take care. Rd
rd, do you know what stalemate is? That's what I see in your sitch when reading this thread.
You are waiting for her to say and do something, what is it? Is it clear in your mind or does it keep changing? Will that be enough? Are you over thinking things? Are you scared that you might get hurt, so are keeping yourself in your comfort zone?
She is in a mess and is expressing regret to everyone not just you. She's tried a few things to build a bridge toward you (the strength and durability are questionable but it is a bridge nonetheless) and gets cut off or blocked by you, eventually she may give up. Maybe your blocking indicates that's what you want anyway?
That's a form of stalemate. Neither of you can or will move.
Have you considered that actually you relationship is now the flip of what it was? She is now the needy, chasing one and you are "the can't cope with that" one.
Not suggesting you welcome her back with open arms but asking a what-if question is a proven way of probing without indicating commitment. Something like, "I know this is completely mad and it's not going to happen, but if you wanted to come back what would need to happen?".
That's a question enabling her to open up. If she says "I don't know" keep quiet, keep quiet anyway, don't break the silence, let her do that.
If she says "are you still there", say "yes, I wanted to give you time to think" then be silent again. When she starts speaking, really listen, beyond the words as well as what is being said. The next time you speak to say anything of substance is to give a summary of what she has just said. If she keeps on ducking or going off at a tangent, "that's not what I asked" is a reasonable response.
If it's all going nowhere, bring the conversation to an end with polite "sorry got to go, blah, blah needs attention..." excuse and leave it all hanging with her. You'll have left her with a lot to think about and you may get a "this is what I want" call or text back. If not, what have you lost?
Be bold and be measured. It might be something your W admired about you when you were originally getting together and she sees it as having gone away...
Thanks, Sotto, for explaining. My thought about the "no R talk" was at this point, does that really matter anymore? I was probably putting a personal slant on it, I don't consider myself DB-ing my STBX anymore, although I have put some things in place permanently, PMA, validation, etc. And I don't talk about our past R. But I am far more bold in expressing myself and in asking for what I need, even if that's an uncomfortable conversation. That's kind of where I was pushing RD, being bold, getting clarification instead of continuing in an unsure situation.
But...
RD - you know your sitch and your W best. I'm sure you'll do what feels right in all the circumstances. It's good that you have a few viewpoints to ponder over...
Yep
Evening RD
Glad you had a good holiday and the car is working out well. I have momentary car envy then remember the fuel bills (although I have a VW so thats a sore point anyway)
I've said it before but I don't how you do it. I dont get any offers (unusual or otherwise) and there's you having to fend women off left, right and centre. You obviously have a special magnetism
I feel there is a good discussion here and a lot for you to think about because in the end its your life.
I read your post on Sotto's thread and if you dont mind i would like to offer the same view to you if you dont mind:
-EXW says she wants to be married to you just not intimate. Not something your happy with
- EXW leaves in deep depression and finds a kindred spirit in OM (with whom i personally dont believe there is any emotional affection there and given the issues you've describe that led to the first point i doubt there is a physical relationship either)
- EXW remains depressed but sees you get on with life
- EXW's depression worsens but then she eventually seeks help
- EXW has seen you flourish, knows she has issues (including probably some of the original ones) and probably doesnt feel like she could make you happy.
- RD remains firm in his resolve and continues to protect his emotions from further hurt.
Something like that anyway
I do think i've said it before but it feels to me like an olive branch may be required at the right time. Avanti said 'stalemate' and i cant say I disagree with that assessment. Something i think needs to shift and I think there comes a time when then something is you.
I think there is a caring way to approach these things and I would personally advocate having a good chat with L/C about it. Of course we would love to help but L/C knows you and your situation better.
Im sure you have before but can i also suggest watching the Brene Brown TED talk on the power of vulnerability. Sometimes we have to be a little bit more vulnerable to open up the doorway to something good.
Take Care RD and again i'm pleased you had a great holiday
Hi Avanti and Sunny.
Avanti. Your post actually reflected a conversation I had with one of my oldest mates ( spitting image of Steve McQueen ) last night. He introduced me to EXW 26 years ago. His girlfriend went to college with EXW. He lost his second wife 18 months ago and he was asking me to stand by EXW and ask her what it would take for her to work through this He has a very different view due to losing his W and he has known EXW for longer with me Your post reflected so much of what he said.
I have had EXW blocked on my phone for the last few days and i unblocked her today because she collects kids from school. I unblocked at 2pm and she called at 2.10pm. She asked how I was but sounded really down. I answered and asked how she was a she burst out crying She said everything was wrong in her life and she was really down. I asked when she didn't call someone and she said she did , me. I asked what was wrong specifically and she said her life. That she knew she had caused all this and she had to suffer the consequences. I asked was it money and she said again it was her fault and she didn't want any money for me She then said her car needed work and I offered to help but she again refused and carried on crying I told her an incident this morning which was quite funny and she cheered up. I was very busy so told her I had to go and she thanked me for listening. There was more chat but along the same lines
I think I'm going to stick to DB and carry on for me I will try to open up a bit as she seems to be very down but im not going to push because I think you have to let them do them until they decide what they really want and then if they want to reconcile you can decide how you feel at that point
Hi Sunny. I always appreciate your input. I'm comfortable enough with how things are and think this is how it's going to be. I'll be ok and happy again one day. I'm counting my blessing s today. I mentioned a funny incident this morning and I'm going to share because I think you will enjoy it
I will set the scene , I had dropped off kids to various schools and joined the motorway heading for work. The motorway was solid with traffic not moving. I was making various calls to tell drivers what to do and explaining to a couple of customers that I had meetings with that I would be late. As the traffic crawled along we passed an on ramp and a very pretty blonde lady was driving a Land Rover Freelander. Now these are an entry level ( cheap ) Land Rover. As she joined the motorway she looked at me and smiled Now I'm in my Black ('freshly cleaned )Range Rover , dressed in a black sweat shirt and jeans with shades and my immaculate pepper pot hair !!!!!! I made a gesture for the women to lower her window and I lowered mine I casually removed my sunglasses and gave her my cutest smile and said ". Why don't you save up and but the real thing " She burst up laughing and so did I. She then told me " to shut up " and I out up the window and drove on It was very funny and I think the lady enjoyed it too.
Thanks for posting. Take care. Rd
You flirt!! I'd never do something like that! Except maybe at the weekend, but that was an odd exception. Oh and the week before but I swear it hasn't been happening a lot recently. ;-)
Rd, where does the DR book say, leave your S to wander and see if she comes to her senses? If you point me to the page I will shut up.
If you can't find the page, here's a question for you, are you being a chicken, or perhaps a bit silly? :-)
I am not a religious type but this piece sums up what I see with you and your sitch at the moment:
God Will Save Me
A terrible storm came into a town and local officials sent out an emergency warning that the riverbanks would soon overflow and flood the nearby homes. They ordered everyone in the town to evacuate immediately.
A faithful Christian man heard the warning and decided to stay, saying to himself, “I will trust God and if I am in danger, then God will send a divine miracle to save me.”
The neighbors came by his house and said to him, “We’re leaving and there is room for you in our car, please come with us!” But the man declined. “I have faith that God will save me.”
As the man stood on his porch watching the water rise up the steps, a man in a canoe paddled by and called to him, “Hurry and come into my canoe, the waters are rising quickly!” But the man again said, “No thanks, God will save me.”
The floodwaters rose higher pouring water into his living room and the man had to retreat to the second floor. A police motorboat came by and saw him at the window. “We will come up and rescue you!” they shouted. But the man refused, waving them off saying, “Use your time to save someone else! I have faith that God will save me!”
The flood waters rose higher and higher and the man had to climb up to his rooftop.
A helicopter spotted him and dropped a rope ladder. A rescue officer came down the ladder and pleaded with the man, "Grab my hand and I will pull you up!" But the man STILL refused, folding his arms tightly to his body. “No thank you! God will save me!”
Shortly after, the house broke up and the floodwaters swept the man away and he drowned.
When in Heaven, the man stood before God and asked, “I put all of my faith in You. Why didn’t You come and save me?”
And God said, “Son, I sent you a warning. I sent you a car. I sent you a canoe. I sent you a motorboat. I sent you a helicopter. What more were you looking for?”
-------
If you take the question at the end and apply it to your sitch, what would you answer be? Leaving it to DB'ing is not really an answer, you are better than that.
I am not suggesting that you become your wife's rescue team, I am suggesting that you need to release a log jam and how you do that is something you should seriously consider.
Final question, in your M were you the one to resolve situations where the two of you had argued and then didn't speak, or was it your W? If it was your W, she's not of the right mind set to do it and it would be a 180 for you to do it, is that not DB'ing? (Sorry, sneaked a last question in there, did you spot it? :-) )
RD, you are funny! I would never dream of doing something like that....but you get away with it every time. I'm not sure I could carry it off in a Toyota Aygo anyway....even a top of the range sporty black one
I was thinking about your sitch the other day and asking myself. Did I just advise RD because that would be what I would do in my own sitch right now? Others are suggesting you may want to lower the barriers a little perhaps. I see no harm in trying on a purely friendly basis. You can always withdraw again.
Another thought I had is, when your W is bemoaning the state of her life, but not actually doing anything useful about it - could you drop in a gentle question or two - how do you think you could improve things? What do you want for yourself...but don't take it too far - just listen for the answer.
I see no harm in mixing things up a little and trying the odd experiment here and there. I think in general if you are solidly moving forward in your own life, it's okay to do things like this.
Just my thoughts for today anyway lovely RD xx
Geez, I'm going to follow rd's thread just to learn how to be when I'm officially single again! You're like James Bond!
Geez, I'm going to follow rd's thread just to learn how to be when I'm officially single again! You're like James Bond!
Smart move, PP. RD has it goin' on! Loved the story, RD, thanks!
Hi all. Thanks for posting.
Avanti. You are completely right. I suppose the way I see EXW and her attempts to talk are just temp testing She is hurting and maybe she is second guessing her choices but I think she living by them and it's not my place to interfere
I am here for her but that's where it stops. As time passes I accept more and more that she did what she did for her and realistically I played a minor role ( 30 -'40% )
Today EXW called and started crying and asked could I lend her 150 euro I agreed and she said that she had direct debits going out and I could deduct the 150'from the 200 I give her every month to cover a few bills still in her name She said she was ashamed to ask me as she left and had to crawl back asking for a loan , she added that she had no one else to turn to. I said it was only a loan of 150 euro and to calm down She cried for a while longer but I cracked a few jokes and she calmed down
She then told me that she was not getting a MOT ( car test ) for her car as she could not afford it at the moment. She quickly added that she was not looking for the money and she would be able to afford it in a couple of weeks. We then discussed my hospital appointment and she asked me to call her with the results. I didn't and she called me back and seemed pleased.
I lent her the money and I can honestly say it was something I would do for a neighbour or friend. It's funny how I have no expectations any more. I do things that I want or not when it comes to EXW and I try and e the best RD I can be
On the note of hospital visit , all good. So kidney is working perfectly Really pleased
Hi Sotto. You are correct I have accepted EXW is not coming home so anything I do is because I want to and I feel it's right. No other reason
I will address the flirting part below
Sunny D. I hoped you would enjoy the story I was rocking with laughter as I put the window up and the lady was obviously still wanting to chat That only made me laugh all the more because she might have had a witty comeback but had no chance to deliver !!!
PP. James Bond.!!! More like Mr Bean !! I've always been very chatty with people and would be the guy to break the ice in an awkward sitch or the like. I enjoy people and just like shallow Hal , it's doesn't hurt when their pretty !!!
When I was younger I would always go for the most beautiful girl in the club and you would be amazed how often it worked (. I was and so where my mates )
I've always found people respond to me coming forward and when I'm with my kids , they are always amazed how I chat to strangers and get a conversation going. My girls love it especially D14 I think my attitude comes from have no expectations and so if people didn't respond I really don't mind and I just move on
Thank you all for posting I'm in great form today as results from hospital were great
Roller coaster is on an up swing.
Take care all Rd
Glad you're having a great day and way to go with the kidney function....so pleased for you - high five!
It surprises me with your W that she has left with so little. Presumably if she wanted, she might apply for more financial support? But she doesn't choose to do this?
xxx
Hi Sotto. Not sure what she could apply for. She was a director of my company up unt a year ago and over here you get reduced help from govt because of this
Re her getting more support from me , I think we would have to be legally separated or D for that to happen and even then I'm not sure that's she ddue anything as I have the kids.
Thanks for the high five. It's a great relief when you hear the results !!!
Take care. Rd. xx
Great news on the results
I've said it before and I'll say it many more times - I just don't understand your EXW. Pretty much all the other WAS on here I can at least sort of understand the rationale,but yours......
Best I can get to is that she thinks that the she is doing the right thing for you and the kids by leaving. That she feels too broken to stay.
Not that is particularly helpful to you right now but it may be somewhere down the line.
I think I need to replicate some if that RD charm in my daily routine though.
Have a good day
I am thrilled about the kidney.
Just shows how lifestyle changes improve health.
Just love my internet bruv RD.
V
I must have missed the kidney problem post. Hope you're feeling a whole lot better!
So, I was walking down the street today and I see a sleek black rangerover with cream seats parked. Then a guy emerges from a store - salt & pepper hair, wearing jeans and a black top. He smiles at me, puts on his shades, gets into the rangerover and drives off.....I was thinking RD??! I kid you not - it really happened
Hope you've had a good day my charming friend xx
Hi Huddy. On my second transplant ( this one 2 years 6 months ) so getting the all clear is a big deal. Dyalisis [censored]. !!!!
Sotto. Did you hear the Twilight Zone theme music. If it had been me we would now be giggling like fools in a karaoke bar after spending the afternoon discussing ( character assassination ) our respective partners over a shandy or two !!!!!
Do you know the words to ," Give it up " By casey and the sunshine band ?
Watch out for those smooth grey hair lads in black range rovers they charming bast@rds !!!!
You have to pass a charm test before you are allowed to buy one ( only the black ones though !!! )
Jim. Thanks for the input mate. At this stage I think it's time to carry on with life and let her become the past. It's tough because some days you feel she wants to come home and then nothing happens
Thanks all Take care. Rd
Hi RD, just checking in to see how your weekend is going? Have you been cruising around in that smart new rangerover with your shades on?? I hope so....
Just wanted to say Hi anyway xx
Hi all. Just journalising. Good weekend and got the grass cut , after 3 weeks, I was expecting g to meet a lost tribe in some parts , the grass was so long !!!!!
D14 and I went shopping and on the way back we went to a local parkland and D14 took control and we cruised around for 20 mins. She was in heaven !
Did last months sales figures and we were up on previous month by 25% so we can all eat for another month. Which is nice !
EXW called me on Friday to thank me for lending her the money. She then asked if I had been to she L/C recently I asked her why and she said she might like to go and see her as EXW has been really down. She said she had called the Samaritians twice because she's waking up at 4am every morning and can't sleep with all the stress she's under and trying to figure out how she ended up in this sitch I validated as best I could but it wasn't easy. She then asked if she would see me later that night or sat. I told her I was working late and working sat. She signed
On sat after work S16 had been shopping with EXW and he told me EXW had upgraded her phone and left both phones for him to transfer data. On Sunday morning EXW called in about 8am on her way to work. My Ds were in my bed and EXW came Iin And hugged them. , she then tickled my foot and asked me how I was. I just laughed
That evening I was wearing a new jumper and new jeans. EXW came to visit kids and told me I looked really nice. I was washing car so just said thanks and carried on
Today EXW called me and said she wasn't sleeping and didn't go out anymore as she didn't feel like she wanted to and went to bed early most nights. She then said she was convinced she was having a stroke toady and always the mortgage would be paid off. I said don't be silly you would be missed and she answered not by RD I changed the subject.
Carrying on with my new life but it is sad to see her like this.
Thanks for reading. Take care all. Rd
Hi RD, from what you post, your W seems to be doing quite a lot of reaching out. I know we had this debate on your thread recently about what you might do, and you were in favour of carrying on as you are. I know these are stars rather than a planet, but I wonder if some of the time it might be worth carrying on as you are and now and again mixing it up a little with no expectations.
From what you post below - I'm working late, but call in for coffee Sat pm if you like?
You look really nice - Thanks. Pause, and extend the convo a little instead of carrying on with what you are doing.
She does sound sad and also too broken to do anything useful in terms of repairing things. I can appreciate you don't want to put yourself 'out there' too much - but why not try a little 'mixing it up.' Offering some more warmth on occasion, with no expectations and just see how that goes?
Just a thought RD xx
Sotto, while rd isn't here, so won't know we are talking about him, I think rd is a little scared of making himself vulnerable, which Is understandable given the pain he's been through. If enough people say stuff like you have above, he might change slightly one day. Quick! He's coming back, talk about something else, "nice day today isn't it Sotto?"
RD, if you shut me down as often as you do W, I'd probably give up. She must really want to have a connection with you to keep it up. I'm wearing my "I Agree with Sotto" t-shirt, throw the woman a bone and see what happens.
Hmm mm
RD, stop!
You need your privacy, I know you need a full on R, and if you believe WW hasn't got this on offer then move on.
Let's be frank, if WW isn't the one let her go. Bruv!
If she is, it's time. Heck, a hug is a half way house, your bigger sis and honorary house guest is more than willing g to bang your heads together.
So that you at least have a peck on the cheek.
V
Hand out bud. I don't think it would be any harm to ask her the question. Good luck!
Thank you all for the input. Think it's time to move on I don't get as upset as I did about what's happened and at the end of the day she made choices for herself and I have to respect them.
She might one day change her mind and then I can see how I feel. It's tough for the kids and I wonder if that's why I still help EXW and care because when you look at the sitch why would I still want to be with her She's not who she was and that's the hard part to accept Why they change and how they change doesn't really matter because they have changed and that's it
All good at home and just collected kids from school Pizza night tonight and a film I see glimpses of how life will be very good again one day and it's nice to have that feeling It doesn't always stay for long but I keep clearing me mind of the unpleasant thoughts and it's gets easier
Thanks again , it's great to have this support. Take care. Rd
Hi RD, before you decide on anything major like that - where's the harm in trying a couple of science experiments with no expectations?
I have quite a bit of time for your W. Mainly because she genuinely seems to be in crisis. She isn't out there living it up in hae mini skirt and stilettoes. She has left her whole family behind (including lovely RD) and is clearly struggling.
You say she's made choices and you need to respect them. But truly - is she fit to be in charge right now? It's up to you if you are ready to move on (which I would question whether you are BTW) but if you are ready...why not try a couple of things first. Just to see how they go?
Rd, you have every right to make your decision and I completely respect it and have immense respect for you for making it.
One last angle though, if I may as it hasn't come up. When the BD came and your world all started to fall apart, did you at any time think, how is this going to affect the kids? Silly question I know.
So far, everyone has, quite rightly told you to focus on you and your kids and recently the focus has been on your Interactions with your W or is your STBXW?
Have you taken any time to think about how your kids will feel? In years to come will your conscience be clear and you can say to yourself that you did everything you could? How do you think they would view you if you could say to them that you tried everything you could to have a second M with their mum but it didn't work out, rather than, where you seem to be heading at the moment, ending the R because the first M didn't work out?
I have said my piece now and will not raise this again, you are a strong and very capable man that it is a privilege to share electrons with and having your respect, by knowing when to stop, is far more important than trying to persuade you that I am right. Which I may or may not be...
I want RD to be happy, in a loving gentle R, with a sexy Pinkish style lady. Riding his bike and laughing with his honey.
WW has freedom of your home. How will you have your privacy to move on?
There are some things to resolve RD. I for one think you will know what you want.
You are grounded.
What is the film tonight.
Tons of hugs to all
V
Hi All. Thanks for the posts and I think Avanti has hit the nap on the head. I would rather let EXW go than risk anymore hurt I've thought about the posts all week and even though EXW has called and text more than normal and has reached out in a couple of ( potentially ) positive ways I still think it's time to move on.
I was with I/C on Thursday and she was very impressed by how I was. She felt I was ready to let the sitch go and move forward. She still thinks an R is very possible and has advised me against starting a fresh R with anyone She feels EXW is stuck in a stagnant pool for now and EXW has to choose to climb out. L/C did offer to see EXW for free but I haven't told EXW as it hasn't come up
I felt really good seeing L/C and came away very positive and I'm staying on the positivity train going forward.
Work has been good this week. Had a meeting with a major client and we are keeping the business for another year. On the way back from the meeting I took a call from a potential customer and they are 99% certain they are coming to us for storage which means the warehouse is almost at capacity. Happy days !!!
Kids all ok but a few little things have become larger issues and I defused them but they are still there. In laws coming fr a visit next week and while they are supportive of me , EXW is their flesh and blood so I spoke with FIL and explained I would not be around as I felt it would cause unnecessary awkwardness for us all. He tried to persuade me to meet but I declined. EXW s brother walked out on his family and the inlaws treated SIL without much thought and now they no longer communicate. I think inlaws have learnt from this experience.
Kids don't really want to see inlaws but I'm sure once they meet them the nervousness will disappear. Kids always got on with inlaws before EXW left but have t seen them in over a year and won't take their calls
I am just waiting to be served at a very nice restaurant in Dublin were I am waiting for D14 to finish seeing 1 direction. I got her three tickets last year as she was D13 then and not allowed into the concert without an adult. I was going with D13 and her bestie. However D14 informed me two days ago that now she was D14 she no longer need my company and she was taking 2nd bestie instead. As you can imagine I was heart broken but since Zane left it hasn't fellt the same for me anyway
I left about 3 ish and EXW was there to say goodbye. She asked was I going for a meal and where. I told her and she asked who I was taking. I answered I hadn't decided with a laugh. She replied , enjoy your hot date. She then asked me if S16 icould go with me !!! I told her no as the car was already full of three teenage girls going to a concert and no place for S16. ( or me ). She since called me and asked if I was go to drive home because the concert was on for 4 hours , again I replied no. I will add I look absolutely stunning tonight so no wonder she was curious !!!!!!!
That's the update and I will enjoy my dinner and then collect three hyper teenagers for an hours (!) drive home The joys of being a dad
Thanks for reading and take care all. Rd
Oh, you lost your place at the concert.....that's too bad!!! I have no idea who Zane is I'm afraid, though I did once know someone who was married to a Zane. Sounds like your W is a little rattled about your plans tonight. Mysterious is the way to go for sure....along with looking stunning of course!!
Now then, back to the whole 'moving on' theme. I get where you are coming from. I'm not sure if I would feel able to open up to h again. It feels easier just to move on in so many ways and open up with someone else in time. However, I haven't entirely given up hope. I just don't plan my life around any potential reconcilitation. If I ever come to that bridge, I will cross it at the time.
What I want to ask is - what does 'moving on' actually mean for you though? Is it purely an internal shift, or will anything become different as a result? It doesn't sound as though you want to date just yet. You can't D yet. I guess you could formally S if you wanted? In a way, I think it's no bad thing for us all to accept the R as over and act as if. However, we can still DB and do that. I think the boundaries for me are I didn't want to file for D and I don't want to date while I'm still M and would still consider a possible R with H. That just doesn't seem fair to some other guy.
Enjoy your meal and try not to feel too sad about missing the concert xxx
...I would rather let EXW go than risk anymore hurt...
Hurt is not your W's exclusive domain, others can do that to you too, the difference is that she's a known(ish) quantity...
... I've thought about the posts all week and even though EXW has called and text more than normal and has reached out in a couple of ( potentially ) positive ways I still think it's time to move on.
That must have been painful but brave. Go with your heart and mind.
...I/C did offer to see EXW for free but I haven't told EXW as it hasn't come up..
When it does, don't forget the offer. She's your kids mother and they deserve someone who they can enjoy life with and and I/C will help her to recover herself and be there for them.
...As you can imagine I was heart broken but since Zane left it hasn't felt the same for me anyway
...
I feel for you. Zane was the magic in that band. Who is Zane?
I told her no as the car was already full of three teenage girls going to a concert and no place for S16...
Correct me if I am wrong, you drive an RR, right? 3 teenagers on the back seat would each ride in sumptuous comfort. Was it more that you wanted to eat on your own?
Immense, aren't they.
Hi Sotto and Avanti. Thanks for posting. Dinner finish Considerably poorer but food was good.
Avanti. I get what your saying re hurt and it's possible that I might get hurt again. I don't think I will ever be that hurt by someone as once bitten and all that.
I would hope to have an R again one day but. Honestly don't feel I would ever trust to that level again so any hurt caused further down the line would not be as bad as EXW
I would always help EXW with her demons because she is kids mother but as time progresses I don't feel the contact will be the same.
Yes indeed an RR but 3 14 year old girls in the back , no way , I put D14 in the front , stuck beasties in the back with earphones on and dvd on the screens. D14 and I rocked to Style Councl the whole way
S16 s head would have exploded had he had to endure the journey
Sotto. Moving on in more a mental thing I have harboured hopes that EXW would try a return for an R but as time progresses the logistics of time apart make reconciliation very difficult. I believe I will always love the person I thought EXW was And even typing this I'm filled with great memories It's always hard to let go and maybe this is nt the time but it feels like it is. I won't behave any different other than to reduce my time around EXW. This really seems to help
Again thank you for your input. Another two hours to go and then the debrief. Can't wait.
Take care. Rd
Well, the movie is finished and I'm no poorer, but the film was good.
So, what are you up to now RD.....dessert??
I understand what you are saying about never being that hurt again. I feel that too. I'm not sure if I would marry again - be so 'all in.' But who knows for us both in time. There are scars for sure, but it would also be a shame not to love again wholeheartedly in case of hurt.
I think reducing your time is a good plan for now anyway. Enjoy the rest of your evening my friend xx
Great updates Rd, you've got a strength and fortitude to move forward that I aspire too. It's hard for all of us to imagine being all in again with our current wounds still unhealed, and even then the scar tissue will be there to remind us of this round.
That being said, we get to make all new decisions at that time. Not now. Now we just have to take care of ourselves, continue being a rockstar dad, and do our own work.
Your EXW sounds like she is certainly struggling and I'm sure you have compassion for her path, but also need to keep yourself and your family off of it. Completely understandable. I hope she finds the solace she is looking for in a healthy way.
Congrats on the business success, you truly are an example of a man that it is handling things with grace and strength on all fronts.
Cheers,
PP
Hello Sweet RD,
Glad to see that you been all the same just like myself. The craziness continue and our sitches are with insane people.
I will try to update my stuff, but for now, I just want to say hello and say that "Time is the best healer".
Just a note that stands out for me: Maybe your wife is falling in love for a different guy now. You are changing no? Why not to look at this different woman and ask yourself that if this is a kind of woman you want to fall in love?
It's part of our human journey to change, we all change and no doubt... have a butterfly affect.
Love your adventures... later loved one!!!
Give my kisses and hugs to your kiddos!!! Some for you too !!!
Pink
PINK !!!!!! Fantastic to hear from you !! I really hope your doing well. Can't wait for an update on you and the boys. Lots of people been looking for you and hoping you would post.
Really pleased to hear from you and thanks for the input
Take care. Rd xx
I am picking up my little one from a football game. He plays on JV and is back up for Varsiry. So, busy, busy.
Have been missing you a lot. It's amazing how much you still help me even without communication.
Hey, and what is this with so much flirting RD? Are you going into some mid life crises now?
My kids are doing good. Lots of wounds. My "X" is still very crazy and just leave wounds behind.
My boys do not want him back. They say that he is a Jerk, irresponsable, I'm moral and a little more. It's sad to see what is happening, but it's out of my control. I do what I can.
I will try my best to keep writing often. Time 8s limited, but I just miss you so much. I miss Soto, V, Jim and so. You are all the best.
Love to you sweetie.
Pink
Pink!!! So pleased to see a post from you!! I've missed you - and RD sorry for the hijack....but, well you know....
Sorry to hear things are still crazy with your XH. Mine filed for D, as has Jim's W and we are at a similar stage, he and I. Hope you'll find time to catch up with our sitches and post some more about your own.
Lovely to see you back here my friend xxxx
(Oh, and good morning to you too lovely RDXX)
Crazy WH? WW?
Golly they aRe all over the place.
V
Hi all. Just a bit of journaling.
EXW called me on Monday and started talking generally After a few minutes she said she couldn't understand how she ended up in this mess. She asked me how I was coping and if I was happy how things were
I told her I wasn't ecstatic but doing ok. EXW said she was lost and started to get upset She was talking about her brother and how he has pneumonia but not as bad as I once had it and how the doctors told her I might not recover. I joked that if I hadn't it would have saved her a lot of trouble. EXW answered quite angrily that she was happy to have looked after me and she didn't regret one moment of our life together and wouldn't go back and change it even if she could. She got very upset and asked if I would change things in the past.
I answered that most of it was good She then said she was very sorry for how she acted last year and this year and can't believe some of the things she said to me and didn't mean any of them. She then asked if I thought she needed help.
I would normally ask how she felt but I decide this time to speak my mind. I told her I thought she was depressed and that she was in a deep hole and couldn't get out without help. I told her that I wanted her to be happy and I felt that she wouldn't be if she carried on as she was. I them told her I appreciate I was sounding like I was telling her what to do and EXW cut me off and said she wanted me to tell her what to do as she had no idea why she left her family and sits in her flat wondering if she will ever be happy again She then agreed she was in a hole and couldn't get out but she had stopped digging. I didn't ask what this meant as I felt I had said enough i told EXW I had to go back to work and we left it at that
EXW called yesterday and asked me to make a call re her insurance which I did and now she has called me 5 times to thank me
I think because I accept the M is over and there is no way back , it's ok to try and help her I'm not acting out of self interest and have zero expectations
That's my thoughts for this evening. Thanks for reading
Take care. Rd
RD
WW does know how she got herself in this mess, 100% she does. That is the issue, she would rather not know. She would rather be down, confused and unhappy than resolve her issues. That is the way it is.
She is testing you and temp checking. Scattering crumbs. Will you take care of her?
However, she likely is depressed and she is the mother of your children.
However RD, she needs professional help and it's her choice to get it. Not yours to give it.
V
Hi Vanillia. Thanks for posting I agree with all you've said and any help I give her is because I feel it's right to do so.
I've stopped acting as if and now it's for real. I still love her but life is now not together but. apart
Thanks vanilla Take care. Rd. xx
RD & V.....get yourselves off to bed - it's past your bedtimes!!
RD, that's an interesting talk with your W. For sure, she's thinking and she has regrets. It is interesting that she still doesn't really see how she got herself into this position, and I feel she has yet to accept her part in an adult way. There seems to be a lot of 'lost little girl' in her interactions with you and I think she has a ways to go.
I think your approach now is about right, and I don't think the sitch is by any means hopeless. But I still believe she is pretty lost (tho perhaps a touch less than before) and is presumably continuing with whatever dysfunctional R exists with OM. For those reasons, I would stay your course, carry on with your own life but keep the door open a crack going forwards if you want to.
At some point, if she wants the life she has lost, she will need to embrace the learning needed and get into an adult state, ditch OM and accept her part in this if she wants to have a chance of a future life with RD.
You are doing well RD and I think it's okay to have these little convos with your W as long as you can do that and then leave her to her path, continuing along your own path for now.
Take care and have a lovely Friday xxx
I'm glad you kinda threw your hand over the side of the boat RD. I don't think you guys are done. I think your W needs help. Could you live with yourself if she asked for help, you refused?
I think she's getting to a stage where she realises what she's done. I don't think she's far away. What would be your answer if she said she wanted you to help her and wanted to mend the M? Please think long and hard about it RD.
Sending you hope!
Hi Sotto. Thanks for the input. I too feel it's ok to have these talks as now the R is over from my end it does help to know that she has regrets because while I have accepted my failings in the M it's nice to know I wasn't all bad
Also I do feel for EXW. She has lost everything and is living a tough life economically Losing her kids must be incredibly hard and while I appreciate its her choice , I do wonder of her straight thinking ability sometimes
Huddy. Thanks for posting and can I just remark how impressed I am by your control and the huge change your brought about in your own thinking. I get that you still look for signs re your W and I understand 100% but the way you can stand back and see what's really happening I do help EXW but I'm careful not to over step any lines Sotto remarked on the little girl thing and I have always treated EXW like that and smothered her in what I thought was protecting or helping but no can see it as taking over and not letting EXW take her choice , right or wrong.
Regarding any future R , I won't say never but it's certainly how I feel at the moment. EXW is coming forward but maybe it's just trying to shed some guilt
As I am the first to point out if a WAS what's to R then they will Must make it very clear
Thanks again. Take care. Rd
Hey RD
Appreciate how you feel right now. You're doing your bit by being an upstanding father to your kids. I get the little girl thing. Glad you're at peace right now.
One Direction, by the way! I bet you're glad you didn't get in that concert. A drink of the black stuff on the Quays sounds a lot better.
Hi Sweetie,
First, ONE DIRECTION is awesome, fantastic!!! I love those kids, and if I was years younger I would be dying for Hair Styles. He is so handsome and I love his voice. Next time, maybe I can go with the girls.
Second, RD you know how I am a bit romantic. The thing here for me is that your W is reaching out in her own way. There is shame, regret, guilty and on and on mixed up in her mind and soul. She is still very depressed and it is a vicious cycle she may be dealing with right now.
As I look back in my life I can remember how many times I would wish to have my XH away and for a long time. Rising three kids and being a homemaker made me depressed too. My XH had it all figured out for himself, job, career, self steam, and blah, blah, blah.
I was there counting the days when I could have a chance to do something more with my life, trying to look at the positive, struggling with my own self, my appearance, even subjects to talk about that did not involved kids.
I guess what I am trying to say is that your W sounds like at some point she just gave up on herself, life and then everything else was in the tornado blow.
I am not excusing her, but I know how hard it is to feel all alone even when you have a Hubby and kids. She probably did everything to everyone and forgot herself. Maybe she became the last one on the line.
It's not you fault, nor the kids as well, it's her own fault, but does it matter who's fault it is right now?
I know you are all stubborn, saying that you can't do this or that. But she always sees that there is something there, some hanging unresolved R and some hope that it can better.
You compare to the little girl... yes, I feel that way too sometimes. Some women are super high maintenance in that area and we need lots of attention. We do not need money, food, new clothes... we are thirsty for attention.
Just an idea... would you go for a dinner, just the two of you. No talks about specifics, no doctor talk, no OM, no wounds subject, nothing that reminds both of you of the bad issues.
But instead, the two of you that started sometime in the past. You changed, she changed, and maybe there is still time to rebuild a family. See what happens. You won't be doing this just for her, but mainly for yourself, to find out what do you feel, how do you feel and if that is what you still wants.
And again, I know you will say that I am too romantic. But I guess life is just to cruel and harsh on the everyday deal, we may need a bit of romanticism to make things prettier and see the magic happen.
Well like everyone says, this is my two cents. Now, I would like you to think and say honestly that she knows exactly what "You" want from her. Does she?
It seems to me that you want her, love her but you don't want her, is feeling good in your new life, moving on, and doesn't love her the same way anymore. Yeap! I feel she is very confused and does not know what direction to take.
You are afraid to get hurt and now she is afraid to get rejected (maybe in her mind...again).
Maybe other girls in this board will agree with me. "We girls are complicated" but maybe because of that we are also the most gorgeous things in this world.
Just something to think about coming from a girl perspective. This would not be pursuing, this would be talking to a good friend with a lot of respect.
Think about. Lots of hugs and kisses to you and the kiddos.
Love,
Pink
Hi Pink Just seeing you post cheers me up !!!
I get what your saying and maybe your right. At the moment I feel I wouldn't want an R even if it was offered I've grown in lots of ways and I wouldn't have if this hadn't happened.
I would like another R one day and you know who with !!!!!!
EXW maybe coming forward but who knows ? She doesn't appear to be happy but again who knows
Thanks for posting lovely Pink. I hope to read about your sitch very soon and look forward to hearing from you soon
Take care. Rd xxxx
Rd, did you make your wife aware of the free counselling sessions your IC offered? It was something you said you were going to do but didn't mention it, in the small hours of today.
Being awake at such an late time, midweek,indicates, to me anyway, that you've got stuff ticking in your head that you probably need to ruminate over for a while longer before it starts to make sense to you...
Hi RD,
I too was missing your posts and to tell the truth I am always looking forward to talk to you.
I don't know about another R in my life. I am very scared of getting myself into another mess and hurt the way it did and is doing.
Wounds like this are not only directly relate to loosing your H but there are so much more feelings involved in it and there are the kids too, what hurts us further.
I feel old RD, I don't know if I still got it. I play around saying things that may sound as I am a very secured person, but my gaps are big craters. I don't feel attractive enough, I don't feel confident in my attitude towards love anymore.
Maybe time will make me feel better, but for now I prefer to stay inside the shell and hide there. That's funny, I have been changing and became a turtle.
I just know one thing, that the tough of you is good and always makes me smile. I guess you are the big crash without pressure, face, name, no fear involved. Sometimes, I feel I am going crazy.
Life is complicated and we both have our still young kids to take care after. You are indeed an intriguing question in my mind, a big fear in my thoughts, a big smile in my dreams, a question mark in my day. What is it RD? Are we so vulnerable we get so connected to one that gives us attention? Is this life laying it's hidden secrets before our eyes?
Somehow there is (or are) something there, and I am a very curious person...
Thinking about you all day today, maybe I am totally insane now.
Love,
Pink
Hi Pink. You are such an honest person and trust me you will love again Someone with your passion and love of life needs to share it Your able to chat with me because you feel safe because there is distance between us and the anonymity of the net. I truly think we would have been great friends In the real world because we share a similar thinking on a lot of things.
It's nice to be able to feel that someone cares for us and while we have the barrier of the Internet to protect us , we can still share our feelings and appreciate others strengths and weaknesses.
You are a very special lady Any self doubt you have is due to the sitch your find yourself in. We have all been rejected and made to feel we aren't good
enough and while we all have a certain amount of responability in the breakdown of our Ms, we are the one posting on a forum about saving that M
You've gone through an incredibly tough time and it's bound to knock your self confidence Please don't let it , I have fallen for you and not what you look like If you are a tenth as attractive on the outside and you are on the inside then you must be stunning and if your not you will still be stunning Maybe the Internet is a blessing because we can focus on how people really are and not some image they are putting out to the world
For me , it's not about kind words or people telling us we aren't all bad but it's people we feel we can connect with. On this site I have found some really good people. I'm so lucky to have found Lady V who has helped me face up to some harsh realities while comforting me at the same time Sotto who is always o e of the first o post and always with compassion and wisdom Jim who asks the hard questions while supporting me Sunny D who always is there with kind words and a funny twist on things Avanti a new and regular poster on my sitch and fellow car man ( even if he's still playing with the cheaper end of the market !!!!)
And my lovely Pink who I would love meet in the real world but would be afraid because it's would be so great and at the same frightening in case I wasn't what you expected Have no doubt that you are a worth so much more than H has given you. You would be ( and will be , if you choose ) a fantastic partner for some very lucky man
I'm sitting with D14 and S16 watching a movie. I've had a few glasses of red and I'm meeting a friend tomorrow who has been waiting for a kidney transplant for 12 years and he called me yesterday and sounded so down and asked me to meet him tomorrow
Whle we have all been through and are gong through a very tough time , I think we need to step back and thank the higher power ( copyright Vanillia ) for what we do have.
Pink. Thank you for being my friend While you were gone I started a thread looking for you because I wanted you to know that you are cared for and loved by your friends on here. I posted and was quickly joined by the crew.
I hope it shows that we can see your worth even accross the net and you needed to feel that worth when your down. Please know that even if you discard all others suitors a cockney sounding Irish man is always here for you
Take care Cira Hugs and kisses. Rd
RD
This funny online world, we have found friendship, support and dare I say connection to our higher power.
Sadly we are not encouraged to meet in the real world, I am in Listowel at the end of the month for a friend's birthday party and I travel by ferry to Ireland. I hope I can find the cash, I love Southern Ireland at this time of year.
Maybe we can toast each other with a glass of the black stuff across the miles.
That would be amazing to be on the same soil as my online bruv.
I sense Pink would not be disappointed in you.
V
Hi Vanillia. While we are not allowed to meet please please do not hesitate to contact should you need any help while here. I would be upset and disappointed if ( and I sincerely hope you don't !! ) you needed help and didn't let me know
Take care. Rd xx
OK RD.
Looking forward to my visit to the Fair Isle.
V
Hi Vanillia. While we are not allowed to meet please please do not hesitate to contact should you need any help while here. I would be upset and disappointed if ( and I sincerely hope you don't !! ) you needed help and didn't let me know
Take care. Rd xx
Hi RD, just thinking about you and hoping you are having a good day.
Pink
Hi Huddy. I think it's more for male / female type sitch as we are all venerable and meeting someone might not be best for the obvious reasons
Pink. !!!!!!! Thanks for checking in. I'm still looking for your post about yourself and the boys. Not doing too good today. Before I start my tale of woe can I tell you a secret. Every morning when I wake up I check my iPhone for the weather On the app I have where I live , where I work , London , lanzarote and New York Also I have Colorado and have had for over 8 months. So I think how your doing everyday 😄
I blocked EXW from my phone on Friday afternoon On sat I went out to visit and friend who is still on Dyalisis after 12 years of waiting for a transplant He's really down and it does focus your mind on things in a real world way. On Sunday I went out shopping when EXW was due to call in after work and on Monday ( a bank holiday ) I went out for the day and ended up at work. EXWs parents arrived from the UK yesterday so I unblocked EXW incase she needed help with them. They are not in great health and have not supported EXW in leaving.
EXW called in last night about 8pm and was on the verge of tears. She said she had been to see inlaws and was heading home. I asked how they were and then carried on watching TV EXW left 2 mins later and again seemed in the verge of tears.
This morning EXW called at work and asked me was everything ok as I hadn't answered her texts. I said everything was fine and i hadn't seen her texts. She said she was very sick on Monday and text me to say she wouldn't be calling to see kids. EXW then went on to say inlaws were hoping to say hello if I was home early one day. I answered I would prefer not to see them as I felt it would be awkward for us all and didn't see the point. EXW said they didn't support her leaving and I answered that I fully appreciated that but I'm from your old life and not in your new life and felt it would be easier for all if we didn't meet. EXW said ok and said she had to go.
I dropped S20' to the bus today at lunch time so he could go home to see inlaws. His bike is off the road again and I haven't had time to sort it
I feel I made the right choice not seeing inlaws but I hope they understand why
Other than that all good. Work is busy and I'm generally ok. I have my moments but then I think of lovely Pink and the great time we will have once we meet !!!!!!!!!
Please post soon and myself and lots of others would love to know how you and your boys are
Take care and thanks for caring. Rd. xxxxx
Ah, right. Yes, understand the male/female vulnerability thing.
I think you were right not to see the inlaws. Personally I feel it inappropriate and I hated it when mine arrived for the day in August.
Your W sounds bad. Is there anybody who can just push her that last bit?
Sounds like a strong move with the in-laws Rd, nothing good would have come from that meeting. Your boundaries are going to take energy to hold but you're holding them and that will keep some peace around you.
Agree with Huddy that it sounds like your EXW is really struggling. I feel for all of you.
Stay on the path Rd, you're doing it.
PP
Hi RD, I think it's fair enough re. the inlaws. It is a tricky situation and things do change significantly - there's no getting around that. For sure, your W can't expect you to be accommodating them, given she chose to leave your M.
On a lighter note, I heard a little news item about Dublin being voted as one of the best cities to visit - I can't remember exactly how it was described, but it was something like 'vibrant, exciting and pulsing'....that's just like RD I thought
Hope your week improves my friend xx
Board rules that we all agreed to when signing up to join:
You agree to not post any messages that are defamatory, harassing, abusive, hateful, threatening, or otherwise offensive. Your posts must be polite and considerate. Do not post names, addresses, phone numbers, email addresses, or any confidential or private contact information. You agree not to post any copyrighted material, photos, videos, book references, or links to other sites. To be absolutely clear I do not intend to break the board policy. My membership is important to me.
V
Hi Vanillia. I apologise if my posts made it seem in anyway that your membership might be threatened , that was not my intention.
Take care. Rd
Hi Vanillia. I apologise if my posts made it seem in anyway that your membership might be threatened , that was not my intention.
Take care. Rd
I absolutely know this RD, others may not understand. This is a complex online world, but it's ours......
Dearest bruv!
I have a slightly different twist on your in laws, they are your children's grand parents, they are clearly unwell and you are very dear to them. You might want a quick brief contact even if only by phone, wishing them well, or send a small note via the kids, just saying that you want the best for them. It would be a small kindness for your kids.
Just my 2c
V
I don't think that means you can't meet at all, it just means you can't post private information for obvious privacy reasons. I imagine too, they don't want people soliciting others here, for example to find people and take them off the boards for private, for profit coaching. Couldn't a person say "we are having a meetup at McDonald's cafe on Tuesday at 6pm?" That is not private, it is a public meeting and would seem to be in the spirit of these boards. A shame they block private messages. One of the only forums I've seen that does this. But I can see the rationale for doing so.
Well those terms and conditions are different to the ones posted in the sticky now. Virginia added a clarification:
"It was never our intention to provide a means of privately connecting with others via the internet. There are many other sites where that is encouraged. This is not one of them."
One might argue the intent or legal definition of "privately". Are there DB support groups? That might be a great resource.
I agreed to the purple wording on the previous page. That was the choice I made. That was my choice to agree.
A clarification is lovely to have, but it is just that a clarification. If the wording in the clarification should replace the wording I agreed to then replace the purple wording. Then ask me to agree to that new wording.
I hold to my agreement.
V
I have a slightly different twist on your in laws, they are your children's grand parents, they are clearly unwell and you are very dear to them. You might want a quick brief contact even if only by phone, wishing them well, or send a small note via the kids, just saying that you want the best for them. It would be a small kindness for your kids.
Agree with V here, I don't see the big deal about being nice to the inlaws if you had a good relationships before. I'm quite cozy with my inlaws, I like them, they like me, and I think it's important for my kids to see that their grandparents are worth spending time with, even though their dad left me. He's the odd man out, not me.
Thanks for the posts Sunny and Vanillia. My take on the inlaws is they have to support their Daughter. When she introduces her next R person then it gets awkward for the inlaws to have a relationship with me. They live in the UK and as such I don't have any dealings with them save a couple of times a year over the phone
As the M is dead and buried why keep contact with inlaws ( other than polite when needed ) Maybe it's the. Child in me but when EXW finished the M then all ties related to that M should also be finished otherwise you are leaving the door open to more hurt.
The last thing I would want is to hear how great W was in a new R and keeping contact with inlaws only opens the door to hearing stuff that would not be appreciated at the moment at least.
I did speak to FIL a few months back and explained that he has access to the kids at all times and the kids needed him and MIL in their lives I also explained that I would feel awkward in a face to face now that EXW and I are no longer together FIL said he was very sorry how things had turned out and would like to remain in contact and I answered if it's re the kids then absolutely
Also SIL has attempted contact but I answered her text but ignored her request for a chat to catch up. Again my take is M is over so why keep contact with people relating to that M who in time will be involved in EXWs new R
I have no intention of ever not answering inlaws should they need info on kids , etc but moving on means that
We can't change what has happened but we can grow from it. I don't feel growth is helped by maintaining contact that could provide fresh pain
Thanks again for posting. Rd
Hi RD,
Hope you are just busy as I am. How are things going? Hope the kids are well...
((((((RD)))))))
Pink
Surprise RD! Just checking in on you.
Hey RD - just popping in to wish you good morning my friend. How are you doing these days?? xx
Hi RD,
Hope everything is OK.
Pink
While we are not allowed to meet please please do not hesitate to contact should you need any help while here. I would be upset and disappointed if ( and I sincerely hope you don't !! ) you needed help and didn't let me know
I don't think the Board Administrators control what we do off line. The Board policies are about what is not allowed on the DB Board.
Sandi is correct. What you do on your own time off the forum is your business. The Board Administrators only control what goes on here, the DB Board. However, with that in mind, please remember that we can't post our contact info here or it will be censored and repeat offenders are then placed on moderation for a period of time.
BTW, it's time to start a new thread.
Edit - Agreed - Cadet
Hi all. Thanks for checking in. I'm doing ok and moving on with life. I have a date for Saturday night with a doctor Long story but let's see what happens. She's very attractive and that's inside and out and I feel I've got to give dating a fair chance as before I was hoping W would reconsider and my heart wasn't in it. This time the lady seems very suited to me and I'm looking forward to getting to know her
W doing more of the same I will post more but nothing dramatic. Lots of sadness and strange behaviour
Kids doing ok and business good. Figures for October where up on last year so that's good. Lots of storage coming in which is always good
Not sleeping too well and not sure why. Had a few good days recently so strange that sleep would be suffering
Pink , please lpost. !! ! Your important to me and I would love to know what's happening with you and your boys
Thanks for checking on me I will post tomorrow with more details
Take care. Rd
Good for you Rd. Nothing wrong with spending time with someone new. As you told me, no expectations and you don't have to take it any further than you're comfortable. As long as you're upfront and honest you'll be good to go.
Glad to hear that your numbers are good, I know it helps to have one area of your survival needs on the positive side. If you're going to have a confused and strangely behaved W, you might as well be making some money at the same tim.
Sleep is often disturbed if there is something unsettled, do you ever journal before bed?
Be well my friend, I appreciate your insight today on my sitch. Was helpful and read a few times over to make sure it stuck.
PP
RD, she's a lucky lady & I hope you have a lovely evening xx
Hi Rd,
Don't want to lock your thread but just want to wish you good luck with your date. I am very happy for you. Seems like life is taking another direction, so go slow and avoid hurting your heart again.
Hugs to you and your kiddos.
Pink
RD, I don't want to lock your thread either!! But I wanted to tell you that I was thinking of you last night and hoping you had a nice time....xx
Hi Sotto. It was a good evening. Lady is an ER doctor from Greece. We seemed to get on well and she's asked to se me again. We had a nice steak dinner over looking Dublin bay and the food was great
Not sure how I feel , lady was very attractive ( if you like that blond haired , blue eyed , pretty , fit type ) funny and good conversationalist She laughed at my jokes ( always a bonus ) and she was a really positive , can do type of person
Maybe I'm just not ready or maybe I'm more attached than i realise. im certainly not as keen as the Dr is
Other news EXW called on Friday and she had run over a dog at the animal shelter where she works. She was very upset and I did go over the friend limit a wee bit. I offered to meet her but she said it was ok.
She called later that evening to thank me for talking to her and caring. I validated
Nothing much else to report. Feeling like I'm on an even keel most of the time and that's welcome. Kids all doing well D116s birthday at the end of the month and he's already looking at cars ! !!!
Small bit of bad news , I didn't win the euro millions , so that's not good. !!
Take care Rd.