Sotto - Maybe you are right. I don't know anymore.
Going to SPIN class tonight after work - that should tucker me out.
Tomorrow is back to school for kids, I'm thinking of going just to wish them a happy first day back. It would be for a quick photo and off they go.
First Day of School for Kids
It was W week with kids but I showed up at 8AM at school to see them of on their big day. Kids were surprised to see me but in a good way. We all walked in together. W and I made small talk about schedules, drop offs, just kid related stuff.
When kids were walking into their classrooms, I said goodbye, I love you, kissed them and said bye to wife and then just walked away. I did not look back.
Another bitterswet moment that seems to be my life these days. Had coffee with a friend last night, another ME friend which is good. Tonight is my CODA meeting and I definately going. I am lucky that they have one at my place of employment. How lucy is that?
It still feels very raw for me and at the first day of school, it was just a strange sensation. At least it was for me. Does it EVER get any easier? I pray for that day to come when I am completely detached.
W is all smiles and happy, happy and happy. Me? Not so much, but said hello to everyone I knew, met some new people and introduced myself as solo me and here is my S10 and D6. I forced myself to smile at everyone too, fake as it felt, I did it. As I was not around W, I didn't have to introduce her.
Accepting reality is hard, but I can't deny it anymore. Sadly I am tied to W for the rest of my life because of kids. How I wish that was not so.
How I wish I could just leave this city, and get away from all of this mess. For obvious reasons, I won't be able to do that so here I will remain.
Heavy,
I can only imagine the roiling emotions you must have felt during the first day of the school run. Yeah, it does get easier with the passage of time. It took me a long, long time to be really detached from Ms. Wonka and not feel pangs of pain.
It is great to see that you're connecting with your own friends and making plans for yourself. That is the only way you can move forward.
Yeah, I can relate with the feeling of just dropping everything and get away from it all. We all have those moments from time to time. Even now, I tell myself this occasionally when I am overloaded with tons of responsibilities.
It shall pass soon. Again and again.
L contacts me - getting stipulations aligned. Should be ready for review next week.
I did the best I could folks.
So sorry, Heavy, tough day for you. It's a dreary day here and it's hours till my divorce care support group, so I'm feeling pretty down myself. Lonely. Just very lonely. Wishing I could drop everything and go somewhere else, too. Want to trade places for a while?
Hang in there...
Hugs,
Dif
yes, I do want to change places. if I could I would
I am sorry Heavy, bad day for me too. Group hug!
I really thought that this divorce was not gonna happen. How could something like this happen?
But it is.
I have to accept my reality, I have to get to a place of peace about this. I have no choice but to surrender.
Funny - just as I was talking about surrender, my books "The 7 Spiritual Laws of Success" arrived in the mail today. Thanks V for the suggestion, I will start to read it tonight.
W texts me and asks if I wanted to talk to kids on the phone as it was their first day back. I did and they sounded great.
I find it strange that her bouts of "niceness" mixed in with the Divorce proeedings. It just feels like Yin and Yang to me. The good news is that I got to see and talk to my kiddos today!
Sounds very similar to my sitch Heavy. I feel your pain. I am in mediation limbo currently as W is out of country with kids. I have ok days and not so ok days. Today was a bad day as well. I had the realization that when she returns we are headed to mediation. I am thinking that I am going dark but she is probably enjoying not having to deal with me and she has the kids to herself for a month. I so much want my life back.
Duke
Sorry to learn we have similar situations. One day at a time is my new motto. I don't borrow trouble from the future because we don't really know what will happen you know? It's a process - a painful one but hopefully we will emerge as better people, stronger people. That's the goal.
Hang tough friend!
HeavyD
Bottom line my w had a choice me or AP. She chose AP and that hurts like heck but that is her free will and she has that right. I have no control over her or her actions or behaviors.
She must be doing this because she feels this is the right thing for her now. I have let her go.
I have a lot of living to do and I want to live it for Me and for my Kids.
We will see what happens next.
I don't know how I can realistically do this. W was everything to me - so obviously co dependant is an issue I am dealing with.
Why on earth would she choose this? Have I gone crazy trying to make sense of this?
Do I contiue to try to reason with her - I suspect not. For the past few months it has only been the bare minimum of communicating.
I feel like just giving her what she wants - acceptance will release the pain and confusion?
This situation has been on her timetable not mine. The endless and total desire to divorce has been unyielding.
Insights I have learned have been very valuable. Those insights I would have only gained through this process. I am stronger yet feel so cheated.
Caliguy or Wonka or Asitis?
Anything else I can/should do at this point? Should I suggest co parenting counseling? Just accept this and carry on?
One last comment before I head off to work.
It still feels like she is bluffing me. Is that my mind playing tricks on me? Is that what codependancy is? The urge to call her and say come on - let's talk this through is SO STRONG.
I have not done that for months now hoping it would show her strength and resolve on my part and not be the doormat that I have been over the past few years.
I am so freaked right now guys, not kidding. This is the real deal and I am facing it, staring it down in the face.
I shut up and certainly lose or I say something and lose my self respect. Is my self respect worth losing my family over? Parts of me think "NO" that I would do anything to keep my family together. The realistic and detached part of me looks at the big picture and says "Being in a relationship that shows me disdain and no respect in not real" and will only lead to more pain.
I am not trying to wallow in this, but Jeez, the closer it gets, the HARDER it gets.
Trying to gain clarity and make the "right" decision. Is there even a "right" decision. Is that an illusion? Is the D just a piece of paper and it won't change anything? What on earth would be good about this D? I honestly don't see how anything will be changed by it, except the freedom from my tormet to just let it happen. Again, it circles back to acceptance even though I don't want this.
Acceptance and forgiveness - is that the key?
Hang in there. I think you are doing the right thing. She will have to go through the A & then see how things fall out. She has to let her anger settle much more. She will most likely blast you for trying even if she has been starting to have doubts. It will be too threatening.
If she's starting to have doubts, you'll have time. I think as long as OW is in the picture, you need to let things be for her to take the initiative.
You seem to be teetering between moving on and terrified of doing so and wanting to take action. My general rule is that if I'm feeling a really strong urge to do something, the best thing I can do is not. Everytime I have, not only has it been the wrong thing for helping the sitch, but I stumbled over every part of the action. It is hard to say things the way you want, think clearly, or act skillfully while under the urge. That's been my experience, but others have reported the same.
Good luck. Unless you know something you haven't shared, I don't see that you are running into a point of no return other than possibly be going through a struggle that is you working through things as you approach some kind of decision about sticking it out or really moving on. That's just a little hunch, and I don't have a crystal ball.
Heavy,
Don't try to analyze your sitch and your W for it will drive you nuts! Get your mind off from W and put the focus squarely back on YOU.
You are actually doing really well. Stay on the path you've been on because you're doing the right things. W is one confused hot mess and it's best to stay out of her circus.
I am curious about your L's stipulations. Can you please elaborate more on that? I thought W said she didn't want a D. I am trying understand why you are doing the paperwork and inserting stipulations...for what?
I agree w/ Wonka that you are doing really well & on the right course.
And, I wouldn't mind you two fine ladies from hopping over to give me a woman's eye on the what I relate from yesterday's events w/ my W to see if my appraisal is realistic or overly optimistic (and too pessimistic is OK too, but I don't see that as a danger).
Wonka
We have been informally takeoff care of kids and insurance for them etc.... The stipulations will formalize those arrangements
1 50 50 on kids legal and physical
2. Who claims which child of taxes
3. Who claims which child on insurance
4. One can't take the children out of the city without written permission
And a few other similar items. You may remember that W threatened constantly and filed to have kids 100% of time both legally and physically.
Once stipulated these items are nailed down and she can't change her mind when we get down to the really hard decisions. L said many people do that - reneg on items already agreed on if they get angry or upset on another issue.
I hope that makes sense.
Heavy
I totally get where you are at, I've been there ... done that. I was in a bit panic mixed with a healthy shot of disbelief. I could not understand how 24 years was gone 'just like that'. Throughout this whole thing the more I worked on me and things I wanted to change the better off I was. Then last year it just seemed to click. I wanted her happy ... if that was with OM, alone, whatever I wanted that for her knowing it would not involve me any longer.
Earlier this year, I told the mediator and the lawyer I did not want divorce, however at that point I no longer wanted the M we had either. I understood the many mistakes I made, owned them. Call it what you want ... faith, insight, detachment .... deep down I felt at that time I would divorce and move on, that being said I also told them I felt W needed this to happen, I felt she was stuck and the paper was the only way she would finally be set free to start searching for what truly was making her so miserable .... and these things were not me, OM was not the answer, those answers only she could figure out.
Heavy this MLC thing is not for the faint of heart ... you do have to just go on about your business, live your life and do your thing. Hurts like heck .... she may never come out of it thats the bad part of all this. I was convinced my W wouldn't at one time. Heavy she needs this to continue on her way, love her enough to set her on this journey and continue to love from afar .... The way I looked at it, I spent 24 years with W, not all good, but not all bad. Being D was not going to change my day to day life ... if anything I had hoped W would find peace, seeing her in that state, was just as painful as the sitch itself.
No one knows where this will go, you can only control you, play this hand you have been dealt. Let her be for now, things are going to be moving a bit with the added pressure of the pending D, you need to become the stable force you always have been and weather yet another storm.
Thanks all for the weigh in.
I just have to let it go. I agree Cali, if this bring her happiness, then it's her choice.
I will leave her alone. I don't question her or quizz her, heck we barely even talk. When we exchange kids most of the time it's at school so we don't even see each other.
I did see her apartment last weekend and I must admit it looked good, clean and orgnaized. So, my theory of she is in free fall is clearly not the case. She just wants to be free from me and do her own thing.
As much as it hurts, nothing I can do about it. She is a prideful person and never admits she is/was wrong about things, where as I overcompensate and did everything I could to please her and keep her happy.
It hurts me to see her act this way and choose things that are counter to everything she was before.
I will bury myself in work for the rest of this week, take my mind off things, get the kids Friday and we will have fun.
Resigned.
Wonka
I am not doing the paperwork. W is - my L called yesterday and said he has been in contact with W'sL and the the stipulations will be ready for review next week. W has said all along she wants this D. she has told me many times "I am divorcing you, get that through your head". So, that's pretty clear. I get it.
So I have dont nothing to move this along. It has been her. L says most likely she has talked to her L to move it along in the process.
I am just responding to what my L says.
I hope that clarifies.
I'm not as close to D-day as you were Cali or perhaps you are Heavy, but I definitely have that the legal D is what the W feels she needs to be in control and allow her to heal herself. She has to cut all cords to me and the M.
It is very hard to balance acceptance, loss of control, and hope. I see you as at that point where hope is mostly loss. Cali was there and got surprised. Don't know about either of us. Makes one a bit crazy.
Hang in there. We'll keep supporting each other and talking each other down.
Thanks - that is much appreciated.
I will certainly help anyone who needs talking down from the ledge. It is very easy to get on that ledge. It is a balancing act, no doubt about it.
As for hope - yes, I do feel that my situation is beyond that. W is deadset and there is nothing I can do about it except to accept, surrender and negotiate the best terms I can with my L.
You may not remember but my W really didn't want me to get a L and wanted us to handle this privately with the help of a mediator. I tired that route and once I saw that things were not acceptable to me - I had to get a L. That helped me but made her angry.
So there you have it.
Yes, the go along with me no matter what approach, then temper tantrum when you say tried, but this isn't working and I need another approach.
I'm prepared that for all our good intentions to solve this amicably as we don't see any issues may evaporate when the reality of the nitty gritty strikes. There are any number of issues that one or both of us haven't considered that derail the best laid plans.
I think at a certain point we decide that there may be hope in the future some time (@10% of divorced couples re-marry each other for instance), but that it is so low that it isn't worth holding on to.
At that point we need to wrestle with the acceptance & giving up control. Not an easy or quick move.
I'm torn between DB Coach's suggestion and the need to work on unattaching. They are sometimes at odds. I go back and forth. It definitely isn't a linear process.
Hang in there.
Not linear at all. It will take a long time. I have accepted that. I am prepared for that.
I am working hard to accept this for what it is, not the end of the world, but not what I wanted. This is not what I thought we wanted. This is not what I worked for 20 years for. But here it is.
We deserve to be treated kindly and with love and without lies and decit and broken trust and all of that negativity. We are all human and make many many mistakes. That is all in the past.
The best we can do now is to try to enjoy the day, and create a beter future for ourselves and children. I will continue the path of living my integrity and will eliminate self sabotaging thoughts and behaviors. I will stop trying to control others in thought or deed.
No one ever said life would be easy.
I am with you Asitis. You have given so much great advice to so many on this board. Be kind to yourself and know this process with really mess with your mind if you let it. Know what you want, know what you can and can't accept from your W. Is she capable of giving you what you need? Are you capabale of giving her what she needs? Maybe just a lot of time is what will help, time and patience.
I'm not as close to D-day as you were Cali or perhaps you are Heavy, but I definitely have that the legal D is what the W feels she needs to be in control and allow her to heal herself. She has to cut all cords to me and the M.
It is very hard to balance acceptance, loss of control, and hope. I see you as at that point where hope is mostly loss. Cali was there and got surprised. Don't know about either of us. Makes one a bit crazy.
Hang in there. We'll keep supporting each other and talking each other down.
Honestly ... the last round of D.... I was more about me at that time, decided that W and the M no longer defined who I was anymore .. that was the old me. I wanted W to be happy and accepted D was most likely the only way I could remove myself as the source of all her unhappiness as that's where she directed it to I was as detached from W for a solid 3-4 months as I ever had been and I felt good about who I was and where I was going. It was during the mediation meetings I received a few TM telling me she was sorry for blaming me for everything, I chalked this up as her way of dealing with the guilt and nothing more, then later learned W was discovering the same issues we had were now in her A proving to her it was not just me but her issues and faults followed her. A month later W told me she no longer wanted a D, and wanted to work on the M, realized that many of our issues she had a hand in....to be honest .. took me a month or so to really think about it and even then I was not so sure I wanted back on that merry-go-round.
Was not the kind of 'surprise' you would think ... I realize most here would jump at that chance but I dropped the rope, was moving on and had my new life somewhat plotted out. As a few vets here predicted it was my choice if I wanted a new relationship at that time. I think this is where MLC and the WAW/WW differ somewhat, it takes so long to get to, by the time the MLCr does actually have a sense of reality and comes to the conclusion they truly want the M (if they ever do), the LBS is so far ahead of them, there actually does have to be some deep thought and new soul searching.
Heavy thing is .. .D or not ... you have kids, there will always be interactions ... and like I said, one can not just toss out 20 years, she is in crisis and my advice is to live your live, detach and love from afar, pray she figures out what put her into this crisis to begin with and sorts all that out, this will be done by her without you really knowing what is going on. I do not think your sitch is over, but like mine I think D is what she needs to redirect all that hurt and pain, hopefully she figures out like mine its nothing to do with you .... be the lighthouse.
Heavy,
I am bringing this post of yours from today in another thread:
So wife left me for the AP. She asked if she could have an open marriage in order to be with the AP. I said no, I am not comfortable with this, we have never discussed this before, so no, I am not comfortable.
She continued it to a PA. I then told her that one of us would have to leave our marital house, she chose to leave.
So, in my mind, that is her choice, she knew my boundry and did her thing knowing it would be the end of our marriage.
Awful situation but most of the advice on the board has been to wait it out until the A cools off. D papers have been filed, lawyer called and will have some stipulations for me to review next week.
I don't want this divorce, but see no other way out as this is her wish.
Your suggestion? Let her go? or Fight the D and stand for the marriage.
What do YOU want, Heavy?
If the answer is standing for the M, then I'd put the D paperwork on hold.
When I read your comment "let her go"...I sense you want someone to give you permission to set her free. Well, you've already set her free when you've said no to open M and she's moved out of the house. That's her choice.
Letting go doesn't necessarily mean that you've given up at all.
Letting go and moving on are two very separate things.
One can let go and continue standing for the M.
Moving on means just that...you've elected to cease standing for the M and completely accept that D is the next step. You are not quite there emotionally and mentally. I would aid spiritually as well.
See what I am saying here, Heavy.
Wonka
How can I put the D paperwork on hold? How is that possible? She filed for the D and I don't believe I can stop it?
She filed back in January 2015. Lawyer told me yesterday it is moving forward with stipulations.
Does that make sense now? I can't stop it even if I wanted to.
Okay. This response is 8 months after W filing for D. Why so long? Just trying to understand this part.
Were you able to work in staying at the marital house until the youngest is 18? And W paying for half of the mortgage costs? Then after the youngest turns 18, then the house can be put on the market with proceeds to be split between the two of you.
We tried mediation first, that did not work out. I withdrew from mediation and hired a lawyer. That stumped her for a while, then she hired a lawyer.
Stipulations are what we do agree on from Mediation - 50 50 custody, can't take kids out of state without written permission, etc....
Haven't worked any of that part out yet.
The stipulations are mainly child related. 50-50 custody, health insurnace coverage etc...
Believe me, if I could stop this I would. Maybe the best I can do is slow it down.
Heavy,
What you can do here is instruct your L to slow this train down as long as possible. If and when your W asks her L on the status and "pushes" for D again, then you can tell your L to go ahead and finalize it.
I (or rather my L) delayed things for as long as almost 4 years. That is until Ms. Wonka pushed for it to be done then I finally said to myself, "okay...let's get it done with here."
Heavy,
Bringing this over from the other thread:
Thanks Wonka
Now soccer season is starting up. I enrolled both kids as I thought it would be healthy and also give us some bonding time. Do you feel it's ok to ask W to join along- of course I want it to just be a family activity, but I can't very well say don't bring anyone. Right?
First practice is Saturday and the next Saturday as well.
Suggested text
W - S10 and D6 and I are going to attend the first scrimmage for soccer on Saturday. We'll be there at 10 at the XX park if you want to join us.
Take care - Heavy
I think the text is good. It is short and to the point while leaving it open for W to join if she chooses to do so.
And the reply was "Urgh for this weekend. I'm slammed".
That means outof town with AP. what else does I'm slammed over the weekend mean?
I don't think I will reply. Right?
Peering into your eyes
What do we say about mind-reading around here?
Zero expectations. No, it doesn't require a response.
Jeez Wonka
Of course that is why she won't attend. Soccer practice with kids or getting it on with AP. Easy choice. So want to respond with something negative. But I wont!
But, nothing I can do about it.
The show goes on!
Oh that's right...you have a video camera at W's AND OW's place.
It isn't helping at all. Just so you know, it isn't always about the OW/OM. It could be her work schedule is having an impact on her or trying to juggle her own GAL activities.
When W has the kids, you have your own life with your own GAL activities such as MeetUps, etc.
Jeez -
I know it is not helping, almost comical in a way?
I get it philosophically, I really really do. Emotionally, it is the black hole.
But what's the point of what if's? Off to spin class tonight girl. First time and I am stoked about it.
Spin Class was fun last night - first time. Trying to keep my GAL going. I must admit it is a little hard.
Today I have lunch lined up with a friend and a diner lined up with another friend.
Tomorrow is pick up kids day so that craziness (fun way) will start.
Life continues onward
Talked to L today.
W lawyer is pushing to have stipulations on what we agree to memorialized. L will have to me by end of week.
It's moving forward - no choice but to.
Communication with W is non existant at this point except kid stuff.
I just have the cold feeling in the pit of my stomach. Kind of like the feeling you might have when you discover someone wants to off the face of the planet. Oh well, I am not going anywhere.
Lemonaid anyone?
Hang in there Heavy .... its brutal.
Thing is you have done all you can do, and I have a feeling you will continue once the new sting of all this levels off. As I have said before .. your W may very well need these papers in hand in order to get to where she needs to be. Currently her happiness has some roadblocks and in her mind she has to get past them ... once there she may soon discover she is on the wrong road to happiness, no one can do this for her, no one can point it out ... this has to be her own private discovery. All that being said ... do not let this define you, You are the prize regardless of what she does ... know that, own that, be the best Heavy the world could ever know and the rest will fall into place for you.
A new wrinkle
So my W and I work together. We don't see each other becuase it is a large place and different buildings. She met her AP through a software trainer that came to our company.
Now it appears that my office may be using this software for part of what we do.
My W wanted me to come sit in on a meeting this morning that discusses and reviews this software. I declined and now I am glad I did. All the dots are now connected.
This just gets better and better folks!
Thanks Cali - I will remember that I AM THE PRIZE no matter what.
What this means is that I may have to be "trained" on the software by the AP. That is too much for me to stomach.
I am trying to move forward, claw myself to a better place emotionally and I feel like I keep getting dragged back into something I want NO PART OF.
I might just have to skip the training or delegate to another person.
Heavy
Ugh ... yeah that is a serious gut-punch. I could not imagine ... even now OM being within close range ... let alone in a work environment. Though I often fantasized about it
I have little to offer in forms of advice, just vent talk here I am sure things will work themselves out.
You know what?
I'm not fighting anymore. I won't drag this out, I will go into the night willingly.
I know there is a better future for me and my kids out there. I will be patient and continue to work on acceptance, and forgiveness of all involved.
I made plenty of mistakes, all of which contributed to the demise of my marriage but hopefully, I can learn from this experience and grow stronger as a woman and human.
I will not fear this any longer. I take 100% control of me.
Let's see what I can make the next chapter of my life become. I see the future now and I can feel the sun on my skin. I am ready.
You know what?
I'm not fighting anymore. I won't drag this out, I will go into the night willingly.
There's a difference between "not fighting" and giving up. You can step aside and release her to her mission", but still Not burn bridges.
Valeska and Inshock are both are both women DBers who were in your shoes, one with a child and one without.
You may be able to find their threads and I know Valeska is still around. They were/are wise women.
I'm straight, so maybe my read on this is off. Though I have a gay daughter in a long term R, that hardly makes me an expert.
My gut says there's a bit of a difference with gay women couples, and straight. Seems to me there's a lot more emotional attraction factors, and fewer purely physical.
So maybe the stereotypical straying h, who "wants more sexual variety(!)" is not applicable. (Not saying all WAH's are only searching for that, but some are).
OTOH, your choices are similar to other LBS's. You can beg & Plead, or you can step aside, or you can "fight" it, which I do not think works OR is in alignment with DB principles.
Cadet posted a long reply by MWD on this topic, but people confuse the "tough love" approach preached by Dobson, with a much softer yet firm approach herein.
(Dobson may be right, but this is a Div Busting site, not his).
I know there is a better future for me and my kids out there. I will be patient and continue to work on acceptance, and forgiveness of all involved.
THIS^^ is Crucial to any & all long term, happy marriages.
I made plenty of mistakes, all of which contributed to the demise of my marriage but hopefully, I can learn from this experience and grow stronger as a woman and human.
I will not fear this any longer. I take 100% control of me.
Let's see what I can make the next chapter of my life become. I see the future now and I can feel the sun on my skin. I am ready.
Well done!
Heavy,
25 has said it all beautifully for many of us in the peanut gallery.
You have conducted yourself with integrity in the face of some really tough, nasty, and painful stuff. There is nothing to hang your head about at all throughout your DB journey.
Cali has a very good point about letting W go and allow her to learn her own lessons. We all learn that happiness comes from within...not something to be achieved by external means. We are several steps ahead of the WAS in this regard.
No shame at all.
HeavyD, you say maybe I'll grow, but you already have grown. You are already stronger & capable of being a partner to anyone. Raise your kids w/ your W, but seek your own path. If W deals w/ her issues & returns, you'll deal with it with the same solid, loving nature we've all seen demonstrated in your posts. right now, you (and I) won't get the loving presence we want and deserve in our Ws. We can support them so that they can be good mothers and co-parents to our kids, but the day is done when we can support them as spouse. Someday, we hope they can become friend, lover, and spouse again, but that is beyond our control.
I think that you are really getting to a healthy place, and I'm very, very happy for you.
Continuing down the path folks
A bit of weirdness, she texted Saturday and asked our S to tell her what her car license tag number was/is. The only reason I could think would prompt her for that was for a hotel. I knew she was away for the weekend. I ignored the text.
Friday night was rough - long day for the kids and around 8:30 my S10 starts to cry saying he misses W. I sat down with him, held him and said "yes, I miss her too, and I know this is hard." I said "We want Mom to be happy right?" "She is doing what makes her happy and her apartment is really cool right?" He said "Yes, but her being happy makes me suffer." I just held him and said "You know what, we will get through this, and we are going to be OK". You know that right? He then calls W and leaves a tearful message on her phone.
Of course, his trears trigger D6 to start crying and I had the same convo with her and then we started to read some books to distract her. She finally fell asleep with me rubbing her back. So, hard Friday night.
After that false start, we had a good weekend with a lot of GAL, cookout with two families in our backyard, I grilled hamburgers and hotdogs. Movie with a friend her her son. I arranged for a sleep over with my son with his friend which he loved. My D6 and I had special time and we watched a movie, and read books and giggled a lot. She really loved the one on one attention. And we had first day of soccer practice for both S10 and D6. That was fun but hot. Church and Sunday school was good too.
Monday, back to school and work for me. I took the kids to Doctor's appointment which was hard for S6 who cried hard at the thought of a shot/finger stick. So for now, I see the routine of 1). Work, no kid week, and 2). Work with kid week.
This kid free weekend, I have an adult birthday party lined up with a new friend. I have a dinner lined up midweek with another friend. I have replaced 5 screens at the house and have painted the front stoop and a few areas that needed it. I have worked in the garden, shoveled dirt, raked dead grass, everything I could think of to stay busy.
What I need more of is adult interaction/conversation. I am working on it, again, smiling a lot, talking to strangers, going outside of my comfort zone, like the SPIN class at the Y. I have joined a couple of online dating sites, but still the prospects of dating seem well, forced. More than anything I would like a friend. I am so very lonely.
Am I feeling any better about all of this crap ola? Mornings are still very hard. As soon as I wake up, it hits me, ahhh yes, I am still here and this is still reality. So, I get up as soon as I can and start doing something, anything to stay busy.
Thanks for letting me journal.
Hi Heavy, good to hear from you. I almost posted a 'how're ya doing' message last night as I noticed you hadn't been around for a few days.
That's hard with the kids being so upset. But it was good that they could be honest and let their grief out with you. All you can do is be there for them, and let them see that you are moving forward through the pain to a happier place.
As for the GAL - from what I read, you seem to do quite a few things - but if you feel lonely, there is always room to build in some further stuff. I would treat the dating sites with caution though - although if you have a 'just looking for friends' approach and are clear about that, I think that's okay. But moving into dating because you feel lonely isn't a good plan IMHO. For now it may be best to focus on building new friendships, social plans and connecting with others in a non-romantic way.
What I did like is that your post was almost all about you and your life, which is a good thing.
Take care Heavy xx
Thanks Sotto
Yes, I took a break from the board for a while to just clear my head. I am sick of thinking about all of this, you know?
I am still just doing my thing, trying to be the best I can be and be the best Mom I can be and the best employee I can be and the best friend I can be, etc...
It is still hard and again having to relearn so much of what I took for granted, cooking blanaced meals, picking out clothes from the store, knowing kids sizes, homework, and everything that goes with raising two wonderful kids who deserve so much more and do not deserve to have to go through this emotional pain.
I have good days and some bad days but at least I am having some good days. I struggle with feeling hopeless and have lost the joy in my life. I recognize this as depression and get help for it but I KNOW that God has a plan that I just can't see yet. I KNOW there is a good life for me and the kids but I just can't fully grasp it yet.
We are living our lives fully, and I am not waiting until I find the joy to "live". We are living regardless. I hope that makes sense. I am trying hard to shake the feeling of hopelessness and living without joy.
One day at a time is all I can do.
Thanks for leting me vent.
I did have a talk with one of my other D friends who went through a similar experience. Her W had an affair, lied about it, was confronted and was very devious.
My friend immediately filed for D hoping that would shock her out of her A but it just got her divorced. They have been divorced for about 5 years now, the exW now lives with the AP but has confessed to my friend she is not happy. She has asked to come back several times but my friend says no to reconcilliation.
Her advice to me - stop wallowing, and get the hell out of there (marriage wise). She said give up honey, everyone thinks their W will come back. She said she wished she had done that a lot sooner and it would have saved her some pain. She too thought that her W would wake up and recommit to the marriage. They had a young D at the time. Sadly it did not happen that way.
So, I did not share I was part of this board, but did say I was in pain and in the middle of an unwanted D. I do not agree with her assessment of how she handled her situation but that is none of my business.
The conversation left me feeling deflated but her situation is not my situation and I just don't know how things will turn out.
Heavy
I recieved the same advice .. multiple times. I think for many betrayed spouses the hind sight is "Should have cut my losses and moved on from day one" .... can not fault them for that .. their feelings are their feelings, I think looking back I wasted a solid year of energy spent on W, her A, and OM and would very well indeed have been better off without that.... but I think if we LBS's were able to do that so easy we might just be the WAS in reality.
There is nothing wrong nor weak about someone who stands and tries to fight for their marriage ... and if you can do that WHILE discovering yourself, growing, coming to grips with some hard truths ... the journey will be worth it regardless.
I agree it would be easier to toss in the towel and let the M go, note I said easier .. I do not believe its the right thing to do, nor could I after 25 years look at myself the way I wanted to without at the least trying.
Hang in there Heavy.
Hi Caliguy
Always good to hear from you. How many people must say that on these boards. You support so many with your patience and wise words.
I know, as my friend was telling me about her story, I just listened. If I did not have the board and the wise members here, I would have totally agreed with her. But I just let her talk and said how hard that must have been. She still misses her wife and her entact family even though they both have new partners now. I could hear it in her voice and she cried about it.
Well said about coming to truth about hard realities. Yes, that is exactly what this experience is all about. I know in my heart what we had, the love we shared, the family we created was real. I know that she knows that as well, regardless of what she says and how she acts.
I am just again, doing my thing and "trying" to stay ahead of it all. Our communication is minimal and cold and the whole text about "ask our S10 what my licesne plate number is" was just plain screwed up.
I love my kids and am keeping it together for them. I work my projects, step out of my comfort zone as much as I can and work the plan. Have I seen any success? With me, yes, with her no, with our relationship no.
I ran across a photo album last night from a few years ago, I peeked in and my W was so youthful and slim and beautiful in those photos. She has aged so much in such a short time. Maybe I have too, but my God, it was shocking to see the transformation in just a few short years. It is like the picture of Dorian Gray, like a metaphor of all the crap that she is involved in now. I can literally "see" what is happening with her and am powerless to stop any of it.
Yes, the path of least resistance is always the easy one but not necessarily the right one.
I am keeping on.
Hi Heavy,
I'm sorry your struggling with the path ahead. You obviously know it isn't just about your M but setting the stage for a good co-parenting R for your kids and the two of you who will either make getting along in that R easy or hell. And, you do never know. And, you've heard the advice that as long as she is in the A, not much is going to shock her into changing course. That is going to take her going down that path and seeing where it leads her.
I suspect that your insight into the change between the photo and now may be one of the contributing factors to the M problems and the A. If she has been feeling like she is losing her youth & looks, and that you haven't been giving her the things she wanted, having OM come along and making her feel attractive and desirable, and the giddy feelings that she remembers feeling at the beginnings of the Rs of her youth, are a powerful drug.
As with any drug, only the addict can choose to kick the habit. You've fired your shot across her bow. You've taken away some of the excitement of the A being a hidden conspiracy. Do you want to push the D forward fast, or do you want to let it drag so that she can see where the A is going and maybe start seeing things in a different way? Do you think you never can trust her again, and are you sure of that? It seems like you haven't entirely made up your mind even though at times you have sounded pretty firm.
Hang in there. You've been doing a lot right, and you are being great w/ your kids through this. I know it is hard to watch them struggle, but you are really standing up and showing them what it means to be a dad. And while I'm sure you feel at times like you are flailing and struggling, I hope that I can handle things as well as you are if I ever get into the position you are in.
Asitis
Thanks for the weigh in.
I always told my W how much I loved her and we did weight watchers together and just got back from a lovely trip to Hawaii. At least I was very happy and told her that often. I always told her how proud I was of her job wise and that she was the prettiest girl in the room. I have no idea how she felt that I did not love her or notice her or appreciate her.
I have no idea why she would choose someone who is so unsuitable and unavailable for her AP. It just does not make any sense to me. Maybe that is why I am so hung up on it. All of a sudden she wants to be with someone who who is my polar opposite, and has not left her family.
It's like she just snapped and said I don't want this anymore. Who cares about the consequences, it's over and I am in love with AP. You can either submit to this open marriage or if not I choose her and here's how it's going to be. Of course I balked and out the door she went. She claims she will never be happy again and this is not what she wanted.
Thanks for your kind words about how I am handling this terrible situation stalemate. I have no clue what else to do other than just wait it out and continue to do my thing.
In my mind, there is only 1 inevitable conclusion to her AP relationship but that still might not wake her up. She may just be tired of playing house. Who knows.
All I can do is choose my battles and to walk my path. Let's see what I will learn from this experience. Bottom line, she has zero respect for me.
Wonka
My friend are you still giving advice?
Still here on the Boards, I don't see you as much.
Heavy
The unsuitable & unavailable may actually be part of the draw. And, I'm not saying you weren't demonstrative and that she went to OM because of that. She knew you found her attractive, but that was because you loved her. OM found her attractive wo/ already having that bond. That was the new affirmation. The conquest of still being able to reel someone in that isn't already attached. It also had that he has a thing for me despite it being inappropriate. If he isn't really available for a long term thing right now, that can get read as I'm such a desirable woman that he can't help himself despite the inappropriateness and availability. See the draw there? There is nothing you could have done to avoid that. Nothing. This is about her needs and desires, about her unresolved issues and insecurities.
Sure, the M had problems (which you know) and you still may have ended up in the S & facing a D. But the A part is all her.
Hang in there.
I have no idea why she would choose someone who is so unsuitable and unavailable for her AP. It just does not make any sense to me. Maybe that is why I am so hung up on it. All of a sudden she wants to be with someone who who is my polar opposite, and has not left her family.
No, none of us can really get down to the "why him/why her" issue. Typically they "Affair Down" ... by that is they choose someone who is much different than us, not on the same level as we are ... is this to feel better about themselves, because the OP really knows they have someone out of their leauge so they go into full 'worship' mode?, maybe its just so they can control the situation and feel some sense of power where they have little to none inside the hurricane they are in .. I am not sure.
My W chose ... an OM her Father would absolutely flip if he ever knew. He is a physical trainer, all about himself his looks and how he appears to others ... lives with his parents ... yes because evidently OMW tossed him out because the 6-7th OW finally was the last straw.
Its easy to get hung up there, I read over some of my old posts and I wanted to 2x4 the teeth out of myself.
Truth is ... they selcect someone lesser than us, not that it made me feel any better at the time, I realize there are areas OM 'won' ... but he is not close to the man I am and that's just fine by me.
It's like she just snapped and said I don't want this anymore. Who cares about the consequences, it's over and I am in love with AP. You can either submit to this open marriage or if not I choose her and here's how it's going to be. Of course I balked and out the door she went. She claims she will never be happy again and this is not what she wanted.
Thats MLC crazy talkin right there, she has to bottom out Heavy, you have to allow her to do so as you have been doing .. in the mean time do your thing, become the better you ... stay on your path and keep out of her way ... she is in crisis and out of control and ya just do not want to get any of that on ya
The truth of it Caliguy, she is together, and moving forward with her plans and life. It's just her life without me.
I just have to accept it, and intellectually I do that she is fine without me, can function, has a great career, jets off with her AP, and laughs and is doing fine.
Me? I'm the LBS with the IC, the shrink, the support group, the GAL activities that I force myself to do, theone who struggles to fill up my days, the one who struggles daily. Not her.
So, I don't agree with the "She's in crisis mode". I'm the one in crisis mode and that is what really scares me. it's not her, but me. That is the really scary part. I always joked that W picked up misfits and weirdo's to rescue and then it occured to me, that's how she saw me.
Now which category do I fit into?
On my thread I was just talking about how my WW chose a scuzbag loser. I was totally confused by this and irritated. Vanilla then reminded me that it is better that she choose this OM because it is less likely to work out.
There she goes instilling that PMA in me. Looking for the good side of the crap pile.
The truth of it Caliguy, she is together, and moving forward with her plans and life. It's just her life without me.
I just have to accept it, and intellectually I do that she is fine without me, can function, has a great career, jets off with her AP, and laughs and is doing fine.
Me? I'm the LBS with the IC, the shrink, the support group, the GAL activities that I force myself to do, theone who struggles to fill up my days, the one who struggles daily. Not her.
So, I don't agree with the "She's in crisis mode". I'm the one in crisis mode and that is what really scares me. it's not her, but me. That is the really scary part. I always joked that W picked up misfits and weirdo's to rescue and then it occured to me, that's how she saw me.
Now which category do I fit into?
That there .. ^^^ ... is called Stinkin Thinkin.. cut yourself some slack.
You said yourself she Looks a mess ... the crisis is affecting her physically, and who knows deep down what she is going through.
Yes you have support groups and IC, why? Because you are doing the right thing and working on
yourself while she is running away from the issues that put her into this mess to begin with.
Heavy you struggle to fill your days because like so many of us you gave them unselfishly to your W and family .. no crime in that, now you feel like a baby giraffe on those long new legs that were just handed to you... give yourself a break here, you were in a LONG relationship and have forgotten what its like to be solo ... your W, well .. she took all those emotional feelings, the good ones, and simply transferred them to someone else and she is trying to make OW wear those just as you did ... problem is they will never fit .. over time OW will feel uncomfortable in them, realize she can not fill YOUR shoes and at some point that A will implode. My W's A took 2 years from start to end to implode ... but as much as she swore they were soul mates and made for each other ... poof .. gone .. 24 months from "I'm leaving my wife.... how's your marriage" to "Never contact me again" for soul mates they didn't last long.
Wonka
My friend are you still giving advice?
Still here on the Boards, I don't see you as much.
Heavy
Aye, still in the classroom.
Past few days been crazy busy as I have been dealing with a bomb that a subordinate dropped in my lap that has consequences for my team. Not a fun experience at all.
Plus juggling my schedule to care for my 87-year old grandmother and stepmother.
You are in great hands with Cali.
Note to Asitis....Heavy is a gay woman whose wife is involved with OW, not OM.
Well hello Wonka
Sorry to hear about the lap bomb - no thats never fun.
And the care you are providing for your grandmother and step mother. You do sound like a busy lady.
Life sounds full for you now and that is always a good thing.
Take care - Heavy
Thank W. So busy, I just plum forgot. Sorry H, it's been a long week.
I'd add to Cali's point: W doesn't need shrink, IC, support group, etc., as she is filling the void w/ the A addiction. When an addict is getting their fix regularly, they can seem to be fine on the surface. It takes its toll in time. It is just postponing the crisis, but I think Cali is right on this. Some addicts can hold up for a long time, though. Keith Richards is still managing to not totally self-destruct somehow. And, they have to recognize and admit they are in crisis and seek help. Not all do.
The analogy has limits, as some people can string together failed R after failed R without ever catching on that the problem isn't the R.
So, don't see this as you are the mess and she is not just because you are seeking all the help to address your recognized problems. You are going through was is very normal, and you are standing up and handling it like a healthy adult. You are struggling, sure. But that you are taking responsibility for your struggling is what a very healthy person does when they recognize that they have issues and that life has thrown them one h*ll of a curve ball.
Omg that's so how I feel, HeavyD. H is not alone and longing to connect with me. He is happy and moving on. I'm the lonely abandoned one going to counseling, using every bit of will power not to call him on the phone, crying myself to sleep, losing a marriage I don't want to lose. This is my crisis and I am HURTING and it [censored] …
The mystery of life and the complexities of it are amazing.
I can recognize the depression and despair but it's like looking at another person. I'm talking about me. The disassociation ... feelings of being adrift, I'm letting them wash over me. I do not want to stay in this pit, I don't want to remain the victim of circumstance.
I went to a work retirement party yesterday, I felt a chill when people looked at me. As we both work at the same company, everyone knows and I have no idea the narrative what she told everyone. I guess it does not matter, I held my head high and circulated. No one brought it up and of course they wouldn't but I could see it in their eyes. The folks that didn't knpw all said "Hi, how are you and W and kids?" I just smiled and said "everyone is doing great, thanks for asking."
So many decisions to make or respond to problems are just not my priority right now. Just getting through the day are. Handing over kids today so I must get my GAL going.
W keeps asking about items (photo books, sports equipment) from "hone". I said I don't know where they are, and if I find them I will certainly give them to you. I honestly don't want her family photo albums, I can't bear to look at them even if I found them. Her replay was "Just tell me where they are, I just would like to know". I so wanted to say "Yes, there are lots of things I would like to know too" but I didn't.
I must find a way to move past all of this. Putting it in the past is my escape hatch. As long as I deal through the lense of "you hurt me" all communication is damaged. So, I have to let that go. I know that and think about the best way to accomplish that a lot.
Thanks everyone. Always appreciated to just let me journal a bit and I guess vent.
Always, Heavy D
Forgot my recent gratefuls:
I am grateful for my Mother who is endless with her patience and listening skills.
I am grateful for the sunshine today
I am grateful for the friends I have made post Bomb Drop
I am grateful for a wonderful career
I am grateful for the love of kids
I am grateful for my old friends I have reconnected with
So many things to be grateful for but it's easy to overlook them when other things get in the way.
HeavyD,
I love this list of gratefuls. It reminds me of all the people I have in my life supporting me. It helps me to not focus on WW and the people supporting her.
Thank you
I read a great article about victim mentality and how many people, myself included, play this role.
The poor pitiful me syndrome, look what my X has done, and while it hurts like he##, it is imperative to get up and move past it. If you don't, you run the risk of the downward spiral into depression and prolonged misery. I know because I have experienced it.
The real question is how long do you want to be defined as a victim? How long are YOU willing to play that role. As long as you play that role, you cannot move past this traumatic event and start living your new life.
There is no real definate answer to this, some people take a few months and some take years. The point is to process the information, recognize if you are stuck in the victim status mentality and practize ways to get out of it.
GAL is one way, PMA is another, practicing gratitutde is another, acknowledgement and recognition that you are playing that role, and start taking YOUR power back.
Google "Are you a victim of victom syndrome?" a really good insight into this reality to a lot of LBS.
Just thought I would share this info.
Heavy, I am glad you posted that. I know family and friends who have played the victim or martyr roll their entire life...and they will ultimate be unable to function as a result.
We choose to take the steps toward a new beginning, a new life, a new us! We have to realize it for ourselves first. Like you said, only then can you move on.
I hope you have a great weekend!!!
I know I have played that card too long now. It does nothing but prolong the misery and sadness. it feels good momentarily to tell your friends how you were wronged, get their sympathy but it does nothing for your self esteem and just bogs you down instead of healing, you are wallowing.
I choose not to be a victim and I encourage all DB'ers to challenge their thinking. Are you playing the victim mentality card too?
Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes. Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes. Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes.
We get the point! I love your analysis Heavy. I really, really do!!!!! Am excited For your reflection!!!!
So w sent email asking my permission to take kids on weekend to Las Vegas to a lantern festival during her weekend time. I replied where are you staying, are you traveling with folks, are you meeting up with folks, and a few other logistical details.
She then tells me that she wants to take AP with them and stay overnight in a hotel with them. I said its in the best interests of the kids to not introduce romantic partners until we have been divorced a year. She balked at that and said the kids already know about her. I said yes, but an overnight trip is different.
I asked her to reconsider taking them and I said I would do the same (not introduce kids to anyone I am dating for a year after divorce). I said the kids have been traumatized enough give them some time. She said she would consider it.
$:;/&-@/$!! I am so upset but have to remain calm and detached. There is nothing I can do but say no you can't take them on this trip. But then thats borrowing trouble right??
She tells me that she is disappointed that I have amputated her from my life and that it hurts her to see "the trapped animal wanting to get away from her" look I have in my eyes when we do meet. She is hoping that this divorce will calm things down between us. No remorse or regret.
Again - must detach. There is nothing I can do but accept the situation.
She tells me that she is disappointed that I have amputated her from my life and that it hurts her to see "the trapped animal wanting to get away from her" look I have in my eyes when we do meet. She is hoping that this divorce will calm things down between us. No remorse or regret.
Again - must detach. There is nothing I can do but accept the situation.
Ummm I'm sorry but she's upset that you amputated her from your life? WTF does she think she is doing? I'm sorry Heavy but that makes me angry for you. Why do they feel that we should be sitting in the wings waiting for them?
I also loved your post about the victim thinking. I have been working really hard at not having 'stinkin' thinkin' as my IC calls it. We are thrivers and survivors. We will come out of this better.
Do you have to take a parenting class in your state? If not, it would be still worth making part of the negotiating process. There are certain ground rules when it comes to children that really important to understand. It is something W probably needs to hear from someone other than you though. Then maybe incorporate some of those into the official agreement after you have both been through it.
Sorry you had to listen to the WTF logic they sometimes hit us with. She sounds like she is trying to rationalize her choice to assuage her own pain and guilt. A very normal thing to do, so even though it is hard to do, the more you can let it roll off like water off a ducks back the better for your sanity.
Still, I know how statements like that stick in my craw for days. Sending an electronic hug (we really need a hug emoticon).
No we don't have to take a parenting class but it might be a good idea.
She wants me to meet with AP and have the kids meet the AP. I said I am not interested in meeting with AP now or ever. She got upset with that and said I was being unreasonable. I said I am sorry you feel that way.
She is accusing me of dragging out the divorce and that my lawyer does not respond to her lawyer. I said I don't have control over the legal system. She said that the deadline is Monday and if her lawyer does not get the paperwork then it's going to court. I said OK, let the lawyers handle it.
I asked her to leave our kids out of this, and she said she is not putting her life on hold any more, we have been separated for almost a year and that is all she is going to wait. My request for her to wait until 1 year after divorce was not fair to her. I said you can do whatever you want and have been and that is your right, just don't do it in front of the kids, let them process the separation and divorce.
I said how can you possibly model a healthy relationship pattern with our kids with you introducing and sleeping with your AP. She replied our kids will learn that is how families deal with problems, they work through them. I said "you have have got to be kidding me".
More drama and then we just decided to end the call as it was only getting more heated and did not go anywhere.
I have no idea who this woman is and am baffled by her decisions and behaviors regarding our kids.
Detach and Detach and Deatch again.
Here's the thing - why are stbx so mean and cruel?
Is it a defense mechanism? Is it a way to cut the rope of attachment in any form? Is it because they hate the reminder of what they have done? All of the above? None of the above?
Hate is such a hard ugly thing. It is a mangy dog tied to a chain lunging at you trying to bite you with rabid saliva drooling. It is cold. It is scary. It is unreal.
I pray that in time hate will pass and fade away like a stormy cloud. It is only an emotion. Can hate ever be transformed into something softer, dislike and of course indifference hopefully.
I don't like to ruminate on this but wow - it sure packs a punch. It is hard to endure, maybe I will sidestep it.
It feels like if I don't give her what she wants, then hate follows. That sounds like fear on my part. Give her what she wants to avoid the hate. Must sidestep that too.
Just sending you hugs Heavy. I'm not sure why stbx's do anything. Human beings are funny though, when we hurt, we either take it or lash out. Sounds like she's lashing out.
She probably had a very well designed fantasy going and anything that goes against her scares her to her core. Remember what she's bet. She's bet her entire family on the new relationship. That's a big bet. If things don't work out just as she thought, she's got to live with that loss for the rest of her life. That's what she's put down on the table but also has the addiction of the new relationship pulling her towards her decisions.
On one hand she simply can't avoid the lure of the new R. On the other, some part of her knows that she's flushed her family. That's a lot to walk around with.
I hope you find some peace this weekend, more hugs your way.
PP
Made it out to the adult party last night . It was
from 6-8 and I managed to stay until 9;15 - yay! Today is church, clothes shopping now that I am a size 4 and a pesicure.
A friend wants to stop by this afternoon and just hang out which will be nice. I have a contractor stopping by to give me a bit on some painting I need.
So keeping busy which is what I need today. Keep moving.
No word from l and deadline that w insists is tomorrow. If I had to choose between who is telling me the truth - her or my Lawyer - it would be the lawyer hands down.
Happy Sunday all!
Made it out to the adult party last night . It was
from 6-8 and I managed to stay until 9;15 - yay! Today is church, clothes shopping now that I am a size 4 and a pesicure.
A friend wants to stop by this afternoon and just hang out which will be nice. I have a contractor stopping by to give me a bit on some painting I need.
So keeping busy which is what I need today. Keep moving.
No word from l and deadline that w insists is tomorrow. If I had to choose between who is telling me the truth - her or my Lawyer - it would be the lawyer hands down.
Happy Sunday all!
Sounds like a great time & more good stuff. Congrats on the size 4. One good in the bad of R implosions is that many of us shed some of those stubborn pounds we've been trying to get rid of for oh so long. Not always done in the healthiest of ways, but hey, it works.
And how are you doing with your sitch asitis??
Who knows. There are some positive signs (W mentioning things that are topics of common interest that allow for openings, no flare ups of anything, calmness), but I'm just trying to stay focused on me & meet the openings with friendly interest in a busy schedule.
The usual ups and downs of mood (e.g., really wanted to invite W over to spend the night last night, which surprised me at its intensity), but these the downs don't last long & are easily navigated.
I don't expect any real changes in the foreseeable future, so it isn't really I just engage where it makes sense and keep the pressure off by having no expectations and worrying about everything on my plate instead of watching her for signs and signals. The shift is likely leading to some of this opening up on her part. I can't imagine she if second thoughts pop into her mind even briefly at this stage of things, so it makes it easy to not allow the little shifts and changes to raise any hopes in me. A very healthy place to be.
W called this morning very upset that S10 had not compelted his homework 100% and that he is doodling in class and not really paying attention. He will read in class when he's not supposed to and just not fully engaged.
I replied I hear you, but I think this is just him adjusting to the new normal and we are all having difficulties with this adjustment and we just have to be patient.
She replies, that it is basically my fault that homework is not getting done correctly and that during her week it is. I said OK I hear you but we do homework every night. I am doing the best that I can. She did say that I have improved a lot in my pareting skills and I said, great, thanks for saying that.
I could tell she was very upset and she started crying that she "didn't want this" and I just said neither did I. I told her that I have put the kids 100% first in my life. I told her I have been given a child psychologist refcommendation to help with divorce transition and she seemed agreeable to that.
She said if I could not get it together, the kids will live with her during the week and I could have them on the weekend. I said "no, that's not going to happen." She said that I was letting my "ego" get in the way of raising our children. I said no, it was your ego and that you put yourself in front of the kids best interests. You chose to do this, break apart our family, have them live in two houses and these are the repercussions of your decisions. That was probably the wrong thing to say, but there it was. Needless to say, that only added gasoline to the fire.
I will talk to my S10 tonight about things at dinner tonight to see what can be done to help him with school and to settle down.
Jeez.
Just found out there is a homework club afterschool so that should help S10 with getting his homework completed on time and with more accuracy.
I have enrolled him in that. I will ignore the comments about me not bein a good homework Mom. I know that is not true, so out it goes.
W keeps repeating that D does not have to be this way and that I am making it harder for all of us. Maybe there is some kernal of truth in that statement. Maybe I will just have to let it go and try to get along with her better. I honestly see this as letting the natural outcomes occur but not at the expense of my kids and their school work.
For some reason that is stuck in my craw, I keep wanting her to acknowledge that she thrust us all into this chaos and uncertainty but I know that is not going to happen. She just doees not see it that way. So, I guess my only option is to let it go. Have no expectation of that ever occuring and learn to be OK with that. That is one of the areas that keeps me stuck and getting the glue off my feet is hard work but necessary.
Went to an Al Anon Meeting at my church last night with a friend. No, I don't have an alcohol problem, I don't drink at all actually. But I had heard that 12 step programs are helpful in divorce situations. Anyway, went to the womens group and it was really really good.
A lot of it involved people who are struggling, just like I am, but in mnay different areas of life, jobs, relationships, substance abuse, shame, drama, etc... It bascially was realizing that we don't have power of anyone except ourselves and how we just have to let go over what we can't control. It is more eloquent than that and there are 11 other steps, but the meat of it was to just let it go, and be compassionate about it and get in touch with you and God. It was really beautiful. It touched something inside me and really made me think how much of my power I gave away and how much control I thought I had over situations that I don't. it's enough to drive one batty. I will go back next week.
I swear, my next realtionship, I will be so ready to have a healthy one with the new and improved me. I have learned so much during this last year, so much and I am so grateful.
I contacts a recommend child psychologist to get my kids in for counseling. She is a specialist that deals with kids of divorce. My kids are showing signs of the strain and I want to make this a easy as possible or them.
My W wants to take them with the AP to Las Vegas for 2 days in October. I suggested waiting until our D is finalized a year before introducing the kids to her. She balked but then said she would consider it.
I will bring it up with the psychologist in a non threatning and/or controlling way. My W can do whatever she wants with whoever she wants when she is not with the kid, but not drag them into her mess.
I am hoping an external third party professional will back me up on this issue. We'll see and I have my fingers crossed. My kids have had enough trauma for the year.
Am I wrong for wnating her to wait a year? I have no idea if this scuzzy AP will be on the scene for a another year. I just want my kids to have the most stability possible.
I forgot to mention a funny on Saturday convo.
Another readson my W left is:
1. I talk to much on the phone with my Mom
2. We weren't out enough when we started dating 20 years ago.
My my my - the list keep growing and shifting and morphing.
Tonight - meeting up with a friend at 6 and then head home. Tomorrow - coooking dinner for a friend. Today got invited to a baseball game at the stadium - which will be fun!
I am getting better at this GAL thing.
OK
She also left because
1. You eat toast
2. You once had streaks in your hair
3. You have a t shirt with a stain
4. You like Frank Sinatra singing White Christmas
5. You hate Frank Sinatra singing white Christmas
6. You don't know who sings White Christmas
7. You don't care who sings white Christmas
8. You answered the phone in a bath towel once
9. You sing white Christmas in the shower
10. You once left the toothpaste cap off
And so on........
V
Heavy,
Yeah, leave the crazy monkey show where it firmly belongs: W's circus ring. You just cannot worry about W's opinion of you or your parenting style. She's just looking for buttons to press and waiting to see if you light up like an Otis elevator.
I think you did a really good job throwing out a truth bazooka W's way about her not really putting the kids' best interests at the top of her list. Well done. Sometimes we have really let it blow and not always drink the STFU smoothie allllll the time.
So glad to read that you're engaging a child psychologist to aid your children's transition. A very, very smart move on your part. Wise choice.
Yeah, about your W taking the kids out with the AP on an extended vacation. Don't you have the right of refusal as outlined in the separation agreement. Is that enforceable?
I don't know what's enforcable or not.
I will certainly bring it up in the Child Psychologists Meeting tomorrow.
Went to friends house last night and we talked about our divorces and how similar they were/are - infidelity and the inevitable bad feelings it triggers. She is 5 years out post bomb drop and is still angry at her ex. Wow. She said she has gotten better too!
I guess like anything else, it is a process and processes don't have any time tables, you just go through them at whatever speed works for you. There is no one size fits all.
My friend suggested what everyone on this board has suggested, put the focus on ME and what is best for ME and my kids. Period. Ignore STBX antics and try to parent to the best of your ability with her even if you don't like her, understand her or even recognize her at this point. It is not about HER but ME.
The worst part about all of this mess is that W works at the same company, she is involved in school and we are both from the same town. So much overlap. It is hard to get away from her which is what I want to do right now. I just don't think that is possible.
Gotta keep reminding myself of that.
Dinner with friend tonight. Going to try and grill some steaks on the new grill.
Question on communication
Question on communication
So after all of this I find that I am not able to even look at W, be in the same room with her, or even even talk to her. 90% of communication is about kids and is by email and even that is hard.
I am just so profoundly shocked and shaken and dissapointed to my core that I don't think I will be ever able to speak to her or have a conversation with her again. That is challenging becuase we have kids. So our spreadsheet serves in that capacity. When we did have to meet to pick up kids, we don't acknowledge one another, just text "here" and she brings the kids out and vice versa.
WTF is wrong with me? Last Saturday when we did talk - about her proposed trip with her AP and our kids, she asked me how I could amputate her out of my life after 19 years? I had no answer for her and still don't.
Does anyone have the same situation? Is this post traumatic shock disorder or just plain stubborness on my part. Today she sent about 6 differnt emails about kids, schedules, coordination, updates, drop off's etc.... that it just overloaded my brain and I could not deal. I feel I have been made mute by this experience when I have to deal with her in any capacity. I feel my face is numb and emotionless.
I don't want to be this way, I have accepted everything, but is this just a part of the grieving process? I do't want it to be viewed as a passive agressive action on my part but I am honestly unable to be anywhere near her.
I am so far from "meh".
I hear you HeavyD. I think it's part of the process and I imagine that, like any grieving, it gets easier with time.
I've tried to put some boundaries on communication-- we only talk about logistics about our D, but there are a lot of logistics to sort out, and I find it difficult.
And then I am interpreted as not communicating enough. But I've found it helpful to put a little bit of space and sometimes I respond, "let me think about that and get back to you."
It's tough-- so tough that they choose this over working on creating a happy life together, especially since there is so much regarding the kids that will be there for years to come.
But we can control them. And I think it will get easier. Hang in there.
^^^**CAN'T** control them!^^^
Autocorrect fail!
I figured that is what you meant.
No, we have no control over others. I have learned that. The whole free will thing is hard but it's just that free will. We all have our choices in life, many of them actually. But with the choices we all get to make, we have to live with the consequnces of them. Some are good and some are bad but it's like the law of nature. Just like we can't stop Fall from happening or a river flowing. The only thing we can do is observe and try to enjoy the moment.
I seriously have to work on forgiveness. I know that is God's plan, and as a follower of Christ, I have to forgive just as I have been forgiven of my many mistakes in this life.
I am wrestling with it, doing breathing execises, read "When Things Fall Apart" by Pema Chodrun and it's all there. The key to happiness and moving forward is forgiveness. Forgivenes is God's command, I know that.
Now I don't plan on being all chatty about it, but just like loving someone from afar, maybe I can forgive from afar too. I don't have to make any grand pronouncements, just if it happens, I thnk attitutdes and actions will fall in line accordingly.
Just thinking out loud here folks.
And the child psychologist meeting was a waste of time.
W wants kids to meet her AP as she will be in her life "forever".
There is nothing left to do but just remove myself from this situation and let it go. How many times have I said that I don't know. I guess I will have to say it a million more times. Who knows maybe the kids will really really like her and it will work out great. You just never know.
My #1 goal now is to find a way to release the anger that is inside of me. I must let it out and replace it with only positive emotions. I must do it for me and must do it for my kids and must do it for x. It is the only way out of this now, forgiveness.
I hope God can forgive me.
Hi Heavy D. I'm new here. But have been reading posts for months. I have also read the book you mentioned and am trying to be positive stay positive not judge, trying to understand how this can be Gods plan, what am I suppose to be learning??????
Hi JPEG
If I knew the answer to that I would not be here LOL!!
Seriously though I believe the message is to accept and just let go. Once you stop the fight or struggle everything works out like it is supposed to. Put the focus on what makes YOU happy. Forget about your spouse for a while. They have to learn their own lessons on their own time table.
What are your goals???
HD - I love the sentiment in your signature.
But it wasnt the DBers that made you a better person. It was YOU. It's easy to give advice. It's hard to go out and do it. Don't short change the work you've done and continue to do!
Awwww. thanks!!
Yes all of this blows but you know it is so important to not be a door mat. Integrity and morals matter in this world . I am not judging anyone or myself just saying that in the end - you have to be able to respect yourself or no one else will.
Hi HeavyD - that is what has been so challenging for me. My husband is what made me happy - I don't even know what my goals are - I have just been living day by day trying to hold things together - maintaining our home and cottage and being available for our 5 kids ( and the dog)
It is a great book.
Forgiveness is in part for you as well. If you can't forgive, then you learn what obstacles are still in your heart getting in the way of being able to love (and that includes being able to love yourself).
A worthy struggle, that continues to challenge me with some people.
Cheers.
I know - believe me I know. I have been trying to GAL, stay busy, PMA all of that jazz but in my heart of hearts I keep thinking "How could this have happened".
I don't have any answers. Love is a losing game as Amy Winehouse famously sang about.
Maybe after the passage of time we will have a better perspective.
Love yourself, you are worth it and you are more than
Your relationship with your husband. You are YOU, perfect in every way. Keep repeating that every day!!
Wife emailed that her L will work on stiplations and send to my L. So we are moving forward. I expect we will go back and forth fine tuning the destruction of our family.
After the stipulations are agreed to, then the remaining aspects will be tackled.
Seeing her yesterday was like another person. Her makeup was heavy, too much for her face and too dark for her complexion. I don't recognize her anymore. She said to the thearpist - just look at her, she always has a sour face and sits hostily with her legs crossed and arms crossed. She won't even eat if we go to dinner. Wow. I was just sitting in the chair listening to her. My very existence is an affront to her. It is true the last time we met as a family, I just drank a coke. I didn't know that was a cardinal crime.
At the teacher conference, I was there, but just looked through her and listened and talked to the teaher. Once it was over, I thanked her, and left.
Nothing else to do but just accept more, agree to her wishes and be done. At this point the best I can do is to listen. I do not want to argue in any way shape or form with her. I will say "No' to things I don't agree with which ticks her off but it is my right. I will exercise my legal rights to the maximum as I try to protect myself and my kids.
Her plan is to continue with her once per month visit with her "forever person" who lives with her wife and kids in another city. She keeps wanting me to me meet her but I am not interested. I will keep a close eye on my kids and they will tell me what is going in.
My plan is to give my kids my 100% attention and time and of course work on me and my issues. I will attend the 12 step program this week and move forward.
I tell myself that D is not the end of the world as I once thought it was.
Please start a new thread