Wow so much here that relates to where I am at
From the detachment thread
Steps in Developing Detachment
Step 1: It is important to first identify those people, places and things in your life from which you would be best to develop emotional detachment in order to retain your personal, physical, emotional and spiritual health. To do this you need to review the following types of toxic relationships and identify in your journal if any of the people, places or things in your life fit any of the following 20 categories.
Types of toxic relationships
The there is emotionally unavailable to you
You are overly dependant on the other
Relationship in which you are a chronic fixer, rescuer or enabler.
Relationship in which your obligation and loyalty won't allow you to let go.
When guilt is a major motivating factor preventing your letting go and detaching.
Relationship in which you have a fantasy or dream that the other will come around and change to be what you want.
Relationship in which there is no forgiveness or forgetting and all past hurts are still brought up to hurt one another.
Relationship in which your needs and wants are ignored.
So much is me me me or us us us
Where the flipping heck do I begin
I thought I was starting to detach but I can see I am nowhere near
Ghost, buddy,
stay strong. I know from what place you are talking, we have all been there. It does get better with time, it really does, but it does take months for it to be starting to turn.
In this situation our spouses turn into someone else, someone we've never met before.
I am not saying this to hurt your feelings or to project anything upon you, but you do have do protect yourself against the actions of your wife. Protect your heart and protect your financials, because your W just became an alien. Surely you have started wondering who is this person... She might come around, but it will take months if not years.
Hang in there buddy, we are all rooting for you...
Vapo thank you I know this is not going to be a quick fix and tbh I have seen some signs of her changing in the way she is to me things she says to me
That is excellent Ghost that you are working on yourself, identifying your issues and resolving them in a positive way. We all have baggage and sadly most choose to ignore it and just push along. But when we are confronted with a difficult life situation such as yours (and mine and everybody else's on these boards) we start to look within and hopefully we gather enough strength to start resolving our issues.
We are working on us, we are growing, we are clearing toxicity from our lives.
If you work on yourself and leave your W to the higher powers to handle (because in all honesty, you cannot do anything for her, she has to figure herself out), you will in time reach calmness (it will take time and in my experience you can count on at least a year). Do not waste your time to try to figure her out and on the futile attempts on fixing her (YOU CANNOT!!!) and you cannot nice her back into the relationship. I know you know your W better than all the world combined, but she is another person now. I am not saying to be a dick to her, be friendly, but you must detach for your own sanity.
In my own experience you will see flashes of your old W from time to time, but mostly you will not recognize her and her behavior will produce a lot of WTF moments.
She will try to guilt you in a lot of things, she will try to make this about you and she will try to control you and keep you in your place. Those are my opinions and before 25 rushes in with a 2x4, I stand by my words. I do hope (and I pray) that I am wrong in my assessment of the situation and you will get back together in the very nearest of futures.
Ghost, friend, I am not trying to be funny and I do want to offer my full support to you. You will find yourself confused a lot of the times, you will struggle with your feelings a lot of the time,but it does get better in time, it really does. Read others' threads, do offer your support to them and do give back some support you receive from the wonderful people on these boards. Commenting on other people's situations will give you a greater insight into your own. Go out in nature, go mingle with friends, (jump)start your life for you and your children...
Although I do not know you, we are brothers in this situation.
Hang in there buddy, you are not alone...
So read the detachment thread and then re read it then read some more but I still do not quite understand how the heck when when you have been in a R for many many years having been totally attached doing things for each other and with each other
How does one detache from the one you love
Developing and maintaining of a safe, emotional distance from someone whom you have previously given a lot of power to affect your emotional outlook on life.
Ability to let people you love and care for accept personal responsibility for their own actions and to practice tough love and not give in when they come to you to bail them out when their actions lead to failure or trouble for them.
Ability to exercise emotional self-protection and prevention so as not to experience greater emotional devastation from having hung on beyond a reasonable and rational point
Going to read some more
Thank you vapo will be looking at some more threds from other people later
I guess at the moment I am trying to nice her back in and we are getting along but I know her feelings have not changed and,I know I cannot change her thoughts she has to be the one to do this
25yrs has been very supportive as have many of the other people and without the help and support from here I do not know quite where I would be
Ghost, that is a tough question.
Go out, get a life, immerse yourself in activities, do stuff for you, hiking helps, exercise helps, get yourself in shape, do dress nice, smell nice, look your best, start feeling good about yourself, start liking yourself, and detachment will come, a little at a time. There will still be triggers, but they will sting less and less as time progresses.
Do read Sandi's 37 rules, they're pure gold. And ask questions, drop by the forum to rant, ask questions, come here when you are feeling in the dumps. It does get better, it really does...
Ghost
You are not unattaching from the one you love and have loved for that time. That isn't detaching, you can still stand.
Detaching is very different, it is letting go of the outcome. It is attaching to yourself.
It is doing that which works for you. It is doing that which you need to do for you irrespective of the effect it has.
It is following the process that works for you.
It really is not to be in a safe emotional place, you can still be detached and it works for you but be hurt.
For example Vapo has an anniversary, chooses to go out for a meal with some friends instead of moping. It is done because that works. The S may either a. Be angry b. Be disappointed c. Not care d. Rant e. Pick nose f. Eat cheese
It doesn't matter, Vapo still goes out. It is sad not the best night but it works for Vapo.
So how did I detach? Initially I used a technique called third position or fly on the wall. I looked at my WH and I and the sitch and said what would the fly on the wall see? As if I were the fly on the wall.
Another techniques is "best adviser technique" ie what would the very best adviser I have tell me to do? How will they mentor me? What would Wonka or Cadet say? You can have a team of advisers for different things, I have Nelson Mandela on my team, I also have Sherlock Holmes and Lord Dennison.
Yet another technique is older self, pretend you are 5 years older looking back what would you tell yourself?
It is about stopping W,your thoughts about your sitch from driving your physiology, feelings hence emotions and behaviour. It is giving you back the power to drive all of these for yourself from your own core with that which works for you. Irrespective of the effect of the outcome.
Given two equal choices though, you will always do the one which benefits all.
Oh yes, children always come first.
V
Ghost - when I think of the word DETACHMENT I initially pictures it as the spaceship from Apollo 13 detaching from the other ship. The physical letting go and letting the other ship orbit freely.
Unfortunately, it's really not like that. It isn't about the PHYSICAL act of release. It's more about the emotions. The physical stuff is easy. No contact, light breezy conversation, no touching, etc.
But picture your emotional relationship as a ball of two color spaghetti - it's not so easy to separate that bowl into two piles of the separate colors, right?
Job thank you so much for posting on my thread it means a lot
Yes, it's an acceptance that you will come out of the other side OK. R etc. is something you can work on later, now it's about you.
Ghost,
Detachment doesn't come easily and it won't happen w/a snap of the fingers. It's something that you have to work on and then one day...it's natural and you come to realize that you are not reacting to what is being said or done by your spouse as much as you did at first.
Don't beat yourself up if you have slip ups. It happens. Just get up, dust yourself off and continue working on you and moving forward. We all have been where you are and it takes time to learn how to do the things that we advise you to do.
Of course her friends will be biased....They're her friends.....i had exactly the same...
So this morning I have a feeling of there is noting I can do to change my current situation
When I say this i know I can better myself and start to try to move forward but I do not want to move forward but I have to [censored] [censored] [censored]
But my W just seems to be distancing herself from me further and further I want to be able to slow this down or stop it but I cannot I am feeling so [censored] lost
You are doing something about your situation. We all feel we are not doing enough but essentially that boils down to us facing something we cannot control.
Listen to the advice. Do the work and time will tell. Best of luck.
Hang in there buddy.
Everything you are feeling is so very normal. There is nothing wrong with you.
Moving forward is so very different from moving on. Moving on would mean that you have given up hope and decided to forgo your marriage and seek comfort elsewhere. Bad move. Moving forward means that you have come to the realization that you can not do anything about your relationship with your W right now and that it is time to walk forward and grow for yourself. As long as there is love in your heart, there is hope.
Try not to look at your W's actions, it is her business and not yours. There is nothing you can do for her but respect her right to chose her path, her way. Again, read Sandi's 37 rules and reread them daily if not more often until they sink in. Pure gold, I tell you, each and every rule. Do not snoop after her (hard as hell, I know), do not interrogate her her, make her think you had an awakening. And a very important point. Have NO expectations. Do not expect a reaction from your W for anything "nice" you try to do for her.
Why would you not want to move forward? I would imagine because you are a creature of habit and moving out of your comfort zone makes you nervous. Don't be. You will soon find out that there is a wonderful wide world of possibilities out there that you never knew existed. Embrace it, go out of your comfort zone, the benefits are multiple.
You have to start to love yourself. If you do not love yourself, how can anyone else love you?
And to return to your first point. Yes, there is not a damn thing you can do about your situation, but there is a whole lot you can do for yourself and that is the right way, the only way. Go out, go to your happy place, go hiking, go to your friends.
GO! DO! BE!
It's OK to feel like this. Hey, I'm five months in and still get days when I just wish my W would pull back, but she seems further away. It's all about preparing yourself and being ready, either way.
You can't control your W. You have to let her go off, do what she's doing and not get over anxious about it. My biggest mistake was seeing anger in my W, whilst following the rules, and interpreting that as failiure. What a dummy! When they start getting angry, they are actually starting to get mixed up because they aren't controlling the situation any more. Keep going.
Thank you ....i cannot remember ever not having control and feeling absolutely hopeless that I cannot change her feeling
Time will help
Ghost -
Any time I start feeling like that, it's because I'm being IMPATIENT Rrelax; take some cleansing breaths. Don't worry about the future - just worry about TODAY.
Patience, Ghost.
I so want to send this me to my wife ....... W please give D a huge cuddle and kiss and tell her I love her very much she is beautiful I know we cannot change the past nothing can make that any better ....I deeply regret how I made you feel so lonely.... please tell the older ones too that they are great kids and that daddy loves them very much I will be there for all of you and I will make you all feel so special please give me that chance xx
I did not send this I just had to out it somewhere
Write it, post it....whatever.
Just don't send it.
Read your post from yesterday. Sounded like you had a lot of PMA and good feelings. Just relax and get through this patch of despair.
Yesterday really was not a good day and today has not been much better it is the whole thoughts of W being in the house and not being with her and the thoughts of W moving out at some point and selling the house is a worse..... not seeing her when she decides it is time to sell is going to kill me
He the feck do I stay strong for my children my babie is only 2 ....my W must rally have been unhappy to want to be a single mum to the baby with 3 older kids as well
I do not know what I can do so much for moving on this thread is me being depressed can I rename it
ghost,
Im feeling the same as you today. Yesterday was not too bad but today has been hell. I cant stop thinking about my W. I love her passionately and would give anything to have her back. I have been working the DR and the rules but it has been the hardest thing I have ever done.
I don't know if I have it in me to keep it up. Also, ive been crying again. I thought that I had moved past that stage and here it is again.
I know it don't help, but I know exactly how you feel.
Thank you for posting I do not think that anything is going to help me at the moment and I am sure you are feeling much the same ....I lost my father last year and the grief I felt from that loss was not a touch on this
Somehow I have to find a way through this but I do not know how
Me too. I wish there were some button I could push so that I wouldn't care anymore. I don't want this for my family. My kids are worried. My parents are worried. BTW my father has pancreatic cancer and is not doing to well.
It has helped me a little to have found this site.
The kids start school tomorrow and we will have to work together tonight in getting them ready for it.
Hang in there and keep posting.
Ghost, Tkdmme,
I feel for you guys and I know what you are saying. I've been there. It is OK to cry, nothing to be ashamed of. You guys have been in this 2-3 months only, it will take a couple of months before it starts to get better. But trust me, it will get better. If you are feeling in the dumps, do not hesitate to seek medical help, the meds can take the edge of the whole situation.
The trick is to take it one day at a time. It is without a doubt one of the hardest things one can go trough. You have to find your inner peace and it does take time. Don't be hard on yourself.
Exercise helps and when you start to get in shape it also helps the self image.
If you are religious it helps to turn to the higher powers.
You can always come here and rant & vent. No one will judge you here and we understand...
Yeah guys, I totally feel it too. All the time. Vapo is really right about working out. I started consistently lifting weights about a month ago and it's been a huge help. The weights are honest. You can trust them. You get stronger. You look better. It's really good for your brain chemistry, and in the long run you be proud of how you look. Highly recommend it.
And also, for the first time in my life, I'm thinking about meds to take the edge off. I don't see any shame in it. Sometimes things are just too much to handle.
My heart goes out to you.
One of the biggest things I've learned here is to stop worrying so much about the big picture. yes - I need to be prepared to survive if I leave my house or something. But I shouldn't worry about what I would feel IF she left, of IF we divorce or whatever. I barely know how I'll feel tomorrow, let alone in a few months!
So I worry about TODAY. What am I going to do for myself TODAY. How will I make today OK? Sometimes I may fail and have a down day...but then I worry about TOMORROW.
Do things for you to keep your PMA up. You'll cross those bridges later - and you'll be more prepared for them.
Maybe it has already been suggested, IDK. In your attempts to emotional/mentally detach from the idea of her being your W, have you thought about pretending she's a boarder staying in your home?
Seriously, how would you treat a little old lady who was renting a room in your house? Think about how differently you would treat that elderly lady from how you treat your W.
Thinking this and doing this are two completely different things
How do I loose the attraction
Our baby is only 22 months old it seems just so unfair on her as well that she will have two parents seporated and will be living in different houses eventually unable to cover each others backs
Team work is and has to be better
I am feeling better in myself have to keep it in the day to day moment and not think too far ahead
You haven't lost the attraction, your W has. How do you show her that she should be with you? Think about it a bit differently. Turn it upside down.
Thinking this and doing this are two completely different things
How do I loose the attraction
Our baby is only 22 months old it seems just so unfair on her as well that she will have two parents seporated and will be living in different houses eventually unable to cover each others backs
Team work is and has to be better
I am feeling better in myself have to keep it in the day to day moment and not think too far ahead
Of COURSE it's unfair to the kids. Of COURSE it's not better.
But, in your wife's mind she is unhappy and you are the cause of it. Therefore, she believes that she needs to get away from you.
As we've said, chasing her will only push her away faster. Instead, you need to try to REATTRACT her.
Azzork,
I see your advice about reattracting the W. How do u do this when u r going through a divorce when financials and custody create such an adversarial environment? Sorry to hijack.
You haven't lost the attraction, your W has. How do you show her that she should be with you? Think about it a bit differently. Turn it upside down.
Ermmmm not sure be the best daddy for the kids do more arround the house show her I care for her show her she still means the world to me ??
Thinking this and doing this are two completely different things
How do I loose the attraction
Our baby is only 22 months old it seems just so unfair on her as well that she will have two parents seporated and will be living in different houses eventually unable to cover each others backs
Team work is and has to be better
I am feeling better in myself have to keep it in the day to day moment and not think too far ahead
Of COURSE it's unfair to the kids. Of COURSE it's not better.
But, in your wife's mind she is unhappy and you are the cause of it. Therefore, she believes that she needs to get away from you.
As we've said, chasing her will only push her away faster. Instead, you need to try to REATTRACT her.
And how do you re attract whilst distancing yourself
Ghost - I think you should go back and reread your threads. I feel like you're asking a lot of questions that have already been answered.
But, to answer, you ARENT distancing yourself. You aren't trying to add distance, you're just not pursuing....right? You can't control if SHE continues to add distance for now.
And I think I may have not spoken clearly. You aren't trying to attract HER exactly. You're trying to be ATTRACTIVE. Dress nicely, act confident, be a good father, and so on. You aren't trying to woo HER, you are trying to be the best YOU, which is attractive.
Ditto. You don't need to treat her with kid gloves, but just show her the attractive, confident guy she first met. It's not going to happen overnight, but just keep plugging on.
Being a good dad etc. is a really good start.
Exactly what AZ said. And do not look behind the shoulder if she is looking, she will be, but in any case you are doing it for yourself.
YOU CANNOT NICE YOUR W BACK. No amount of nice actions, chocolate, flowers and jewelry will bring her back. She has turned off the emotions towards you. I am guessing that if you touch her, she pulls away. She has checked out of the marriage at least a year before she bombed you, and possibly more. In hindsight you will probably be able to tell when things started to look fishy.
I am not saying that you are without blame for the destruction of the marriage, own your $hit and work on it. Now you have time to fix you for (gues who) YOU!
A confident man is sexy as hell (so I'm told) and it helps confidence to be smartly dressed, wear the good cologne, be groomed and show her that you can take care of yourself. Fix your place up, learn to cook some (if you haven't already), do stuff that will make her wonder, but as I said, do not look over your shoulder if she is looking. Believe me, she will be. And no, you will not see short term results from her side, but you will be starting feeling better about yourself and that is what it is all about.
You have to detach from her to the point that you aren't triggered by her actions, it is hard as hell, but you can get there. And do not try to rush into a new relationship of any kind, totally not god for you. You have to come to the place of knowing that you will be OK, even if you do not get back with your W.
Give yourself time, you have to grieve the relationship that is gone and buried, but perhaps you can build a new relationship with your W.
Again, get your a$$ in gear and start growing, a little bit at the time, just start and then keep up the pace. Wonderful things start happening and you will start feeling better and you will get that feeling of being alive back.
Fist bump buddy! Let's GO!
Huddy when I said how do you loose the attraction what I meant was how do I stop my feelings towards her how do I switch things off 25 years together and 17 years M .....she has lost her feelings towards me but this took her a few years of feeling resentment towards me apparently
If I did not find her attractive If I did not love my W then this would be easy
Back to reading the detach thread
Hi Ghost, I think detachment is a journey and not a destination. The journey is about recognising that 'life' is not all about your wife. It is about building up interests separate from your M, which help you focus on things other than your sitch. It won't help your sitch if you think of it all your waking hours.
It's not about not loving your W - more about not linking your own happiness to her just now. It takes time, patience and GAL though. Are you making GAL plans??
Sotto xx
do more arround the house show her I care for her show her she still means the world to me ??
This will do the opposite of getting her attracted to you. She doesn't want to be M to you! And you are going to knock yourself out proving she still means the world to you?
Nobody said this would be easy. As long as you dwell on how attracted you are to her, it just makes it more difficult. You can pretend, can't you?
We understand what you're saying about the unfairness, but it doesn't cause her feelings to change just b/c it's not fair to the baby.
You have to change gears. Think and act differently. Change the dynamics of how things stand at the moment.
Fake it until you make it
Thank you all so much for your help it has been a very difficult couple of days I am seeing my dr tomorrow and will be looking at contacting relate to see if they can help me as well
I will keep working on detaching I really do not have any choice anyway
Once again thank you
Without the support from you guys and girls I do not know where I would be
It's a long road and it's hard as hell ....
Azzork,
I see your advice about reattracting the W. How do u do this when u r going through a divorce when financials and custody create such an adversarial environment? Sorry to hijack.
You laminate Sandi guidelines and follow them. On my sitch I marked myself out of 10 on each one and tracked it monthly.
V
I like that. Gonna get a copy laminated.