http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...132#Post2515132Didn't realize my last thread locked. Above is a link to the previous thread.
The first post in this thread is the perfect time to say that I got what I think is the final draft of our dissolution yesterday. We had agreed to almost everything in our S but WAW changed her tune when she had the papers drawn up. I have spent the last 6 weeks fighting 3 big issues. 1) I wanted 90 days from the dissolution to pay her for her equity. I needed this time to sell investment properties. She nixed that and I have to pay her the day the judge bangs the gavel.
2) She agreed to live in the school district until the boys graduated. She balked on this one and we finally ended up settling on a clause that said the boys were to finish school in the district they are in. Negotiating this issue is when she threatened to just file for divorce, numerous times. If she were to move away there would be no way to co-parent. I would give every last cent to my name to keep the right to have my boys half the time.
3) Last and least important we initially agreed that cs would not be handled through the child support enforcment agency and that I would pay her half of the boys ins. cost, half of their school lunches and half of their clothing. She balked at this one too and demanded it go through CSEA. I relented easily on this one and its going to cost me a $24 a month processing fee. However, CS is now locked at a set amount, and the court is giving up jurisdiction so its locked at that amount for the next 8 years for s10. When insurance costs go up and inflation starts adding up I will not be on the hook.
I could not care less about the money or the CS but the clause in the papers stating the boys had to finish school in this district was a huge issue for me. It is now in writing that she can't pack up and move away and end our 50-50 time split with the boys.
What will you do about # 3? You said above you'd spend you're last cent to have them 50% of the time. These 2 statements seem to be contra.
I'm confused.
What happened around the accident?
3 and 2 are not related at all really.
Simply put, we agreed that I would just write her a check on the first of the month and call it CS. It would be an amount equal to half their ins, half their school lunch and half their clothing for the month. Halfway through she changed her mind and wants to run it through CSEA. Same amount. The only difference is the $ 24 a month processing fee. Wasteful I think, but overall, unimportant compared to shared custody.
Nothing has come about from the accident. No police report filed. I have taken a few precautions to protect myself in the event of further incidents. My law enforcement family member told me this morning that after 48 hours he wouldn't even take a report if he got the call. If it wasn't important enough to report right away, its not important.
OM sent another text trying to bait me into threatening him. Right now I am still on phone plan with WAW and she will not give me access to the account. I asked her to block his # on my phone but I doubt she bothers to take the time to do it.
If I had access to the account I would simply block his # and solve the issue.
As I read it, correct me if I'm wrong, you said inflation or increases in fees wouldn't affect the amt you pay.
That's the part that's confusing.
" However, CS is now locked at a set amount, and the court is giving up jurisdiction so its locked at that amount for the next 8 years for s10. When insurance costs go up and inflation starts adding up I will not be on the hook."
Hi bdub,
I just wanted to jump in about the phone situation. Are you both on the bill? If so, you can call customer service directly and get them to do what you need in terms of blocking OM.
My question would be why are you still on a phone plan with her? Given what you have written about OM texting your sons, I would get your own account stat and put your boys phones on it as well. Offer to pay for it if you think it might be an issue with your wife. That way you can ensure he's blocked from their phones.
Raliced, the big issue right now is that for some reason AT&T wont let us seperate the account unless we pay them $ 559. early this spring she signed up for the "no contract" deal. Turns out their is no contract but you get hosed because apparently you are paying for your phone as you go. I don't understand it at all because all I want to do is split the account in half. I would take my phone and my mom's phone, she would take hers and S13s. AT&T flat refuses to work with us.
We have talked about splitting the cost of buying the phone out but nothing was decided. I will probably choke down the $ 559 and buy it out on my own. If I do that I will move S13's phone to my account. It's only an extra $ 9.99 a month. I will pay that to be able to monitor.
Bdub,
FWIW, I used to be a manager in a customer call center for a wireless company. I would make one last attempt to call the customer care dept and calmly and politely ask to speak to a manager. The situation that you are describing is a case of front line employees following the rules a little too closely. They should want to keep your business (its expensive to have to replace customers). A manager would probably be more willing to work with you and have the authority to make that decision. If you get a manager or supervisor, keep emphasizing that you would like to keep your account with them, but that they need to help you out with this situation. They are not losing any money by splitting your account. Good Luck.
labug,
Our original agreement was to just pay it outside the court system and adjust the amount owed according to actual cost.
She balked at that a while ago and wants it to go through CSEA.
The amount when we agreed was $ 200 a month. 50 for ins, 50 for school lunch, and 100 for clothing.
Since she is going to run it through CSEA it just becomes $ 200 per month, period. So if anything goes up, CS stays at $200. She kind of shafted herself on that one.
Background: She makes more than I do and we share time almost exactly 50-50 so there really should be no support. Her ins is better and cheaper than mine so we chose that route. With the lunches the school does an auto deduct so we took last years total amount deducted and my half came to $ 50 a month. With the clothing, she has typically done most of the clothes shopping so we decided she would just keep doing it and I would kick in $ 50 per boy per month. The other option is both of us shop and we reimburse based on receipts. Thats too hard to track.
Clear as mud now?
Thats right raliced. In fact, they will be making more money. Currently we have a primary phone at $ 60 a month and 3 secondaries at $ 10 a month. If we split the accounts we would have 2 primaries at $60 and 2 secondaries at $10. I can't make them understand that. Baffling. I have called 3 times and WAW has called and been to a store.
I am not leaving ATT. However, I might now since they wont help out on this one.
Yeah- that's a pain. You can try asking to speak to the "retention" dept when you call. Most carriers have one. THeir job is to keep customers.
labug,
Our original agreement was to just pay it outside the court system and adjust the amount owed according to actual cost.
She balked at that a while ago and wants it to go through CSEA.
The amount when we agreed was $ 200 a month. 50 for ins, 50 for school lunch, and 100 for clothing.
Since she is going to run it through CSEA it just becomes $ 200 per month, period. So if anything goes up, CS stays at $200. She kind of shafted herself on that one.
Background: She makes more than I do and we share time almost exactly 50-50 so there really should be no support. Her ins is better and cheaper than mine so we chose that route. With the lunches the school does an auto deduct so we took last years total amount deducted and my half came to $ 50 a month. With the clothing, she has typically done most of the clothes shopping so we decided she would just keep doing it and I would kick in $ 50 per boy per month. The other option is both of us shop and we reimburse based on receipts. Thats too hard to track.
Clear as mud now?
I was thrown by your comment that she shafted herself when in reality it's your kids who are in need of lunch, insurance and clothing. Kids grow fast and need lots of stuff. I think she was right to do it the way she did, but it will be hassle to go back to court and get increases.
The hassle is what I was referring too. In a perfect world we could have handled it like adults. When ins. costs go up, I up my check by half that amount. I get that she was protecting herself by going through CSEA but I also know that I will never miss a payment and always put the boys first. Now I have to pay the county $ 288 a year that could have gone to the boys and she will have to pay an attorney every year to get the adjustments done.
bdub, how's it going today?
Doing well today rpp, thank you. Not much to report. WAW did have a pretty decent talk about how to set up CS and how to adjust it. The conversation ended with her saying she could see the benefit of doing CS outside of CSEA and she has to weigh the flexibility of my idea with the security of her idea. I left it up to her.
Once she decides on that, our papers are ready to sign. I am not pushing to settle, but I need some relief from the stress of not knowing how this is going to turn out. As of today I am very satisfied with the agreement we have. If we end up with a D through the courts I will likely lose parenting time, have to sell investment properties, and have to shell out lots of $ for an attorney to fight it out.
bdub, why would you lose parenting time? Just curious. I thought most courts these days leaned towards 50/50. Are you sharing 50/50 now? (We are not. I have been thinking about offering H one more day, though.)
Do you have a L for yourself?
The standard visitation schedule in our state and county is every other weekend. I will comment more later on this.
Why isn't 50/50 in the agreement?
50-50 is in the agreement but nothing is signed. I was saying that IF she files for D instead of signing dissolution the standard is every other weekend and every other Wednesday. I have been told the court leans towards 50-50 but I don't want to take the chance and I dont want to fight it out in court.
We are sharing 50-50 now and the dissolution spells it out almost to the hour.
The last issue we have to hash out is how to adjust CS. Without going into a tremendous amount of detail: we based support off of the cost of the boys ins., school lunches, and clothing costs. I think we all know whats going on with the cost of insurance so we cant just include a clause that says CS goes up 3% every year.
Working through this I thought it would be easier to just keep CS out of the CSEA all together. We could then sit down on September 1 with the new insurance cost for the year, and the new lunch cost for the year, and adjust CS.
If she choses to go through CSEA she will have to hire an attorney and petition the court every year. Seems wasteful to me.
bdub, I'm sure all this paperwork and negotiating is a pain, but you seem to be handling it well. Right now, H is still paying all my bills. I don't just mean providing the $, I mean physically opening the bills and writing checks or making online payments. I am not ready to start dividing assets and taking over financial responsibilities. I can do it, of course, I just don't want to right now!
bdub, how was your weekend?
Rpp,
My weekend was good. It was an off weekend for me but I got to see s13 win a basketball game and s10 play in 2. I got the rest of my christmas shopping done and finished the weekend off with a couple cold ones and some quiet time :-)
I have always been the one to set up the budget and pay the bills. The first thing I did was seperate finances in order to protect my assets. The one positive thing I have heard from WAW is that she now appreciates the way I handled our finances.
bdub, what's going on this week? Busy with kid stuff?
rpp,
This weekend : I have the boys this weekend. Today is basketball practice for 13 early and then a game for s10 today and tomorrow. Yesterday was my birthday so last night dinner was my choice so we got my favorite pizza. A friend of mine stopped over with his 2 boys and we ended up in the barn playing basketball. Of course it was way too competetive so I am pretty sore this morning. It won't be long and s13 will be beating me on a regular basis. No plans for tonight but I am sure we will come up with something fun. Thankfully christmas shopping is done so I will be avoiding the stores from now on at all cost.
One of the best christmas light displays in ohio is less than 30 miles from here. I am not sure I can convince the boys to go but that is what I would like to do.
Wednesday I withstood a barrage of "nasty grams" from WAW. She was baiting me into a fight and I responded a few times and then let it go. Her last few texts were threatening and belittling.
She sent receipts with s13 and wanted me to pay half of some clothes she bought for the boys. I took pictures of enough receipts to match what she sent and told her we were even. I spent more but I am not the least bit interested in asking her to share.
One of the things our MC/DC told us in our last session was that " keeping score" and "nit picking" are major reasons people fail at doing what we are trying to do.
Maybe it needs to be more clearly spelled out in your agreement.
Bdub- Take this with a grain of salt - just totally my opinion. Do you really want to be dealing with receipts with her for the next 8 years? Is there a way you guys can come up with an annual number that she can operate with (can always be adjusted for cost of living increases)?
In my situation we are splitting the cost of extracurricular activities and any medical bills that my insurance wouldn't cover and that's it. I'd pull my hair out having to bother with receipts with STBX all the time, but thats just me.
It is spelled out perfectly in our agreement. The problem is that the agreement is not signed.
We agreed that clothing cost would be part of the support and that support would start when she signed the house over to me so I could refinance in my own name and lower the payment. I agreed to pay her the lump sum we agreed on at that time. However, she decided not to sign anything over until we sign the dissolution papers.
Now we are stuck. Right now we are both buying stuff for the boys here and there just to get through. However s13 needed dress clothes for the basketball team and then s10 out grew his basketball shoes. I bought the shoes she bought the rest. It was within 50 cents of being exactly equal.
Question now : She has asked me to pay back support for the past few months. I have no problem supporting my kids. However, I am not including the amount added in for clothing since I have spent the same amount on them she has.
Is that reasonable?
That's sorta where I was going, you each spend up to a certain amt and anything over that is the responsibility of the purchaser.
But you had some sort of agreement, there's more to this story.
raliced,
We talked about doing the receipts once a month and both decided it would be a horrible way to go.
Since we make roughly the same amount of money and have the kids 50-50 we decided support would be half the cost of ins, half the school lunches and 100 a month for clothing. The ins and lunches are a firm number backed by history. The clothing allowance thing we just pulled out of thin air. Is $ 2,400 a year a reasonable figure for s10 and s13?
Bear in mind her family and my family both are big christmas spenders and we have always had big christmases so that accounts for a chunk of their clothing needs.
Help me clarify labug. What are you digging for? I would be glad to go into more detail, just not sure what you are after.
I'm not really digging for anything other than what you explained above. I remembered that we had talked about an agreement for kid spending. The more to the story would have been an explanation of why she sent the receipts.
Was the expense for something extra like new winter coats, or one/both grew out of shoes really fast (as boys do at that age). Just wondered why she sent the receipts.
It is spelled out perfectly in our agreement. The problem is that the agreement is not signed.
We agreed that clothing cost would be part of the support and that support would start when she signed the house over to me so I could refinance in my own name and lower the payment. I agreed to pay her the lump sum we agreed on at that time. However, she decided not to sign anything over until we sign the dissolution papers.
Now we are stuck. Right now we are both buying stuff for the boys here and there just to get through. However s13 needed dress clothes for the basketball team and then s10 out grew his basketball shoes. I bought the shoes she bought the rest. It was within 50 cents of being exactly equal.
Question now : She has asked me to pay back support for the past few months. I have no problem supporting my kids. However, I am not including the amount added in for clothing since I have spent the same amount on them she has.
Is that reasonable?
You and I cross-posted. I didn't see this which explains a lot.
Sounds reasonable. Just keep good records.
What's the holdup on the dissolution papers?
The receipts were sent because it was more than just a t shirt or whatever. It was a dress shirt, tie, pants and shoes. I agreed to pay for my half when she bought them. However, he lost a tie and tie tack that I replaced.
Then I discovered s10 had outgrown his basketball shoes, to the point it was hurting his feet. By the time I bought that stuff and a pair of jeans for s13 because he couldnt get into a pair he already had, the amounts spent were so close to equal.
I should have paid the receipt (she took 3 weeks to get it to me) and then had her pay me for what I spent.
Lesson learned I guess.
At some point, B, you have got to put in a boundary else stay in this mode for a very long time. Reading your posts, she is taking advantage of you at every turn possible. That's important in the sense that you're trying to deal fairly (I respect and applaud the idea) with her, while she and OM are trying to take advantage of your generosity and kindness.
That's important in the sense that you're trying to treat her like a business partner, when she is not being partner material.
You're grasping for the idea if something is reasonable or not.
Seems reasonable to me that she had an affair, left, wanted out, and now wants her cake too. I see that stuff all the time.
Seems reasonable to me that you wouldn't give it to her on her terms. Not caustic, but just that you will figure out your absolutes and defend them to the end of time.
I could not care less about the money or the CS but the clause in the papers stating the boys had to finish school in this district was a huge issue for me. It is now in writing that she can't pack up and move away and end our 50-50 time split with the boys.
It's obvious you don't care about he money. It's obvious you want her to be able to have part time with the kids. She obviously wants to take advantage of that.
What kind of person takes advantage of you for that?
What kind of person has an affair with a married woman and then threatens or tries to goad the H into an confrontation?
Having lived some of what you describe, it seems to me that you're just not sure yet a) what you'll absolutely not give up i.e. not everything is clear in that realm b)what is the "decent" thing to do that you can live with and c) you seem to think she'll "co-parent" with you as long as you bend over backward to give her what she wants.
Pay back support? Pay "princess" things that she feels entitled to in order to keep the peace?
You have no peace, bdub. I get what you're doing and why. Your kids are very important to you.
So the question to figure out is if you can get your kids with what you're doing.
Can you? Or is that not going to be possible if you play this out?
I've been there bdub. I have. I've done much of what you describe (shorter timeline) until it dawned on me that I didn't need to suffer for her actions any longer. Until I realized that there would be a time to deal with OM, but it wasn't now. Until I realized I mattered in the conversation and there was a better way to deal with things, even if I had to go to court or lose everything.
Where are you in that journey?
AJ
P.S. The OM, while a POS, is not the issue. No need to deal with that for now. Trust me when I tell you, he'll get what he deserves at a later date and if you totally ignore him, it'll happen faster.
raliced,
. Is $ 2,400 a year a reasonable figure for s10 and s13?
Depends on how fashionable they want to be.
S13 is getting in that zone. Sounds like things will get smoother after she signs off. From my memory of your threads it just semed like there were a lot of receipts going back and forth.
In my situation, I want as little of this type of activity as possible and even considered just eating the cost of extracurriculars just to avoid - but decided that could end up being too much. You two will get it all settled - I'd just be on the lookout for any situation that could lead to years of aggravation.
The hold up is trying to figure out the best way to adjust support from year to year. I suggested leaving it out of the cours and sitting down with ins cost and school lunch cost in sept. She is waivering about wanting the security of having it go through csea. If it goes through csea she would have to get an attorney and petition the courts to get the adjustment every year. If we leave it out of the court we can easily adjust it early in the fall when her ins renews. She is weighing the benefits of the easy adjustment vs the benefits of security with the csea. it's obvious where I stand, but I am the one writing the check, not receiving it.
AJ,
Thanks for chiming in. We have been thisclose to signing 3 times now. I am getting a a decent deal financially and we are splitting time with the boys 50-50. As this drags out I am caving more and more to stand up for the financial deal and the split time with the boys. The cost of D is pretty big (10 k) and the combative nature I want to avoid.
I can give a little to avoid that. However, now we have settled everything except how to adjust support annually. Now, she comes at me with a tm message barrage saying she wants to up support by 100 a month for no good reason. She is pushing to see what I will tolerate.
I am going to get clobbered for this but oh well: I went back through all my tm from her. There have been 4 major blow ups since she left. each and every single one started exactly 28 days after the last. Now, I KNOW I should not blame hormones or cycles but really? 28 days on the nose, 4 times in a row?
Background: she was on some sort of birth control that lasted 5 or 7 years. That ended right before she left.
I could never and would never bring this up to her, but to me, its pretty obvious whats going on.
Thanks for chiming in AJ
Re OM I intervened to the extreme to protect the boys. WAW was cramming him down their throat and they wanted nothing to do with it and would not stand up to her.
Afer they stood up to her and she agreed to not bring OM around them... to me he no longer exists. He is twice divorced and ran off with his second D attorney. He will not be around long.
Dopamine, addiction, fairy tail, knight in shining armor etc. etc.
according to my L if we go through a full D I will get 50-50 custody, will probably have to sell investment properties, and support is a big unknown. If I can lay low and get the dissolution signed, it is worth it, for now.
From my memory of your threads it just semed like there were a lot of receipts going back and forth.
This is the first and last exchange of receipts. I will take care of whatever clothing needs they have until we sign. With christmas coming they wont need anything for a while.
We will get it worked out. There are times we can have productive talks and work through issues. Then she decides to make changes and threatens me with D. This time I went radio silent. I will see how that works out when we make contact again.
Re: fashion. The boys are not at all into name brands. We live at Old Navy and some at Kohls. They are a little picky about shoes, but I taught them that.
Clearance racks, 30% off sales, and coupons ;-)
I am going to get clobbered for this but oh well: I went back through all my tm from her. There have been 4 major blow ups since she left. each and every single one started exactly 28 days after the last. Now, I KNOW I should not blame hormones or cycles but really? 28 days on the nose, 4 times in a row?
Nah, no clobbering here. Story checks out. I don't suffer from this myself, but it is well documented that some women suffer from it to an extreme. Hormones are no joke. At least its predictable and you can be prepared.
Raliced, I went through my calendar and cirled the days when I discovered this.
I really wish someone could bring it up to her because I am pretty sure its a managable thing. I am NOT an expert !
My plan of action is no contact on circled days. Self preservation?
I would certainly experiment with no contact on those days and see if your life gets a little easier.
Maybe even experiment with no contact on other days? At least don't negotiate on the days you have circled
and the combative nature I want to avoid.
Yeah, maybe you can. It's hard to see that, but it sounds like you have a plan.
I think you'll be glad you did. I did similar and I am very glad I did.
Best of luck!
AJ
Best of luck, Bdub. Hopefully it won't be long.
Raliced, I went through my calendar and cirled the days when I discovered this.
I really wish someone could bring it up to her because I am pretty sure its a managable thing. I am NOT an expert !
My plan of action is no contact on circled days. Self preservation?
How do you manage your hormonal days? You do have them, you know. We all do.
Bringing it up to her wouldn't work well and I think you know that. There really isn't good "management" for it unless she wants to work on yoga and meditation.
I think you realize it's best to let this ^^^ go. The holidays are difficult for everyone, maybe after the 1st, she'll be ready to make it final.
I wanted to say that I think your doing great thru and compared to some others, you're miles ahead.
That doesn't mean it's not painful, you've just managed to stay above the fray.
Keep your eyes on the prize.
Hi Bdub, how are you doing? Labug is right (isnt' she always?), you are doing great. This is the week to breathe deeply, stick to a plan, breathe deeply, take care of yourself and your boys. And hopefully after the first of the year things will clear up for you. Hang in there.
She is always on the money! Had a good weekend even though the basketball games did not turn out too well.
I did have a brief back and forth when WAW came to get the boys but I kept my cool and held my own at the same time.
WAW and I have always struggled communicating. Her first reaction to conflict is to raise her voice. My reaction to her raised voice is to shut down and close her out. When I don't shut down she tends to switch topics or bring up past issues. Then, when I try to re-center the conversation she gets frustrated because she feels like I am controlling.
Anyone else ever have to deal with this? To me, when she starts switching topics and bringing up the past its like being on the computer and having more and more windows pop up. I keep trying to close one window at a time but more and more pop up. Very overwhelming and nothing ever gets accomplished.
After a while I start interrupting and cutting her off. Then I start reacting to her emotion and it just becomes a viscious circle.
Her first reaction to conflict is to raise her voice. My reaction to her raised voice is to shut down and close her out.
To me, when she starts switching topics and bringing up the past its like being on the computer and having more and more windows pop up. I keep trying to close one window at a time but more and more pop up. Very overwhelming and nothing ever gets accomplished.
My H is the one who flashes anger and raises his voice. I am the one who shuts down. It's a struggle, but I admire you for recognizing the dynamic. It's up to you to keep yourself open and not shut down, even when it's uncomfortable. It's OK to ask for a short break and then pick up the conversation later. Even 10 minutes could help you gain control and open up.
My suggestion on the pop-up windows is, at a time that all is calm, explain to her that you are not a multi-tasker and that you like to discuss one thing at a time. You know she is good at keeping track of many things simultaneously, but you get overwhelmed, could she please help with that? If she reacts favorably, maybe you could come up with a phrase that you could say that she'd recognize in the heat of the battle, a code word or phrase, if you will, to indicate that you are feeling overwhelmed so she can adjust.
All this assumes she's willing to work with you, of course. Do you think she is?
If she's not, then maybe just try to keep gently guiding the conversation back to the main topic. Don't interrupt, don't cut her off, but you don't have to defend yourself on every pop-up, either. Stick to the original subject if you can, and ignore the rest. Maybe say, politely, I'd love to talk about that later, but for now can we make a decision on X?
After BD and before she moved out I had gotten pretty good at guiding the conversation back to the topic, and picking out only certain things from what she said. My IC helped me work on this skill because he was our MC/DC counselor too and even he struggled with it.
She was never willing to work on it while we were M, no way she will work on it now.
I tried sticking to mainly tm for a while but 2 things : 1) tm are hard to read "tone" and 2) found out it was OM texting back and forth with me on 2 occasions.
At least with TM I could go back and read, and re-read her msgs.
I like the idea of saying we can talk about it later. In fact, I have thought about having a pen and paper so I could write down the topics we were going to discuss.
Honestly though, I really don't want to talk about any of our past issues any more because she has re-written our marital history so bad that I actually laughed at her last week.
Excited to get the boys today. Only have to work until noon so I get some extra time. The bad news for me is that they go back to WAW after christmas at my mom and dads tonight. I wont get to see them again until early afternoon tomorrow. GAL activities are extremely limited christmas eve and christmas morning. I see some lonely and sad coming on. I have never spent christmas eve alone.
I have never spent christmas eve alone.
Oh, bdub, I'm sorry. We are all going to church together tonight (H is playing) and then to dinner, but he won't be coming home with us, of course. I guess I'll get to stuff the stockings all by myself. I hope you find something to occupy yourself tonight.
D12 asked if H could spend the night in the guest room since he's coming back in the morning. Nope, not gonna happen. He doesn't live here, his choice. He can sleep in that big new giant sleigh bed he just bought.
Sorry bdub, but I'm glad you get to spend the evening with them and your parents. Tomorrow will be here soon and you'll have them back. Merry Christmas!
Thanks ladies.
Christmas eve at mom and dad's is usually the highlight of the holidays for us. Good family, good food, good gifts. The kids are all about the same age and are more friends than cousins.
I can't decide if I want to open gifts at home tonight before we go or tomorrow when they get back. I know what they will want ;-)
It will be lots of fun followed by lots of quiet, followed by lots of fun again.
Merry christmas, happy holidays to all.
Thanks to everyone that posts here or tolerates me posting on their threads.
Your support and advice has been the greatest gift a person could hope for.
Bdub, I hope your Christmas was merry and bright!
Christmas was good. There were some awkward moments and some sad times but I think I had done a good job preparing for it.
Being alone on christmas eve stunk, I can't lie about that. I held it together until I got home and then I let it out and "sat with it" for a while. It was a brief but intense moment of sadness. I quickly realized I was feeling sorry for myself. I focused on how blessed I am and how lucky I am in life. I found lots of things to do and even slept in a little on christmas morning. The boys were very happy to be back in the afternoon and we even managed to smuggle a cousin away from my brother and kept him overnight. I am getting too old to play basketball for 2 hours against 2 10 year olds and a 13 year old that is taller and tougher than me.
Today is back to the grind. Work for me and basketball practice for both boys. I have a few days off next week. One for me with no boys and one with boys. I have no idea what I am doing on my day off alone and I am completely ok with that.
Bdub is your new year getting off to
a good start?
rpp,
2015 is more of the same. The lows of the emotional new years eve and the highs of the HUGE buckeye win last night.
New years eve was really not that bad. We attended a small gathering of friends. Before midnight all the kids came downstairs to be with the adults except mine. Went and found them and they were alone watching the clock wind down. I sat with them as the new years came in. It was obvious they were thinking back over the past year. They were pretty tired from cutting and stacking wood all day in the cold (18 degrees and windy) so we were home by 12:30.
It was quite a game!
On to the Ducks! (different duck, rpp
)
s13 called me Monday after basketball practice and asked if they could come home since I was off work. I told them no, it was their time to be with their mom and he then informed me she was not around. Turns out she left immediately after picking them up from me on Saturday. She drove 900 miles to New Orleans to tailgate the Sugar bowl and left the boys with her mom. I called her to see about getting them and she of course said no. S13 said he would try and she denied him too. We both tried again on Tuesday and she finally agreed so I got an extra day with them.
I can't wrap my head around the idea that she could leave the boys for 3 days during her time to have them, to drive 900 miles to sit in a bar and watch the game on a tv screen. S13 is big time mad at her and s10 is sad about it.
On to the Ducks! (different duck, rpp
)
May the team with the best uniforms win. (That would not be those hideous green things.)
Wow bdub, I can't imagine doing that or having it done to me. (The one night H couldn't take D12, he asked if I wanted her. Or he was going to arrange a sleepover with a friend, my choice. Of course I took her. )Sorry! But you are a good dad to stick up for them.
I don't know that I'm surprised by the behavior, given all the awful stories one reads on these boards. That's rotten for your boys Bdub. I thought right after you separated you had an agreement that if one couldn't watch the boys, the other would automatically get them?
I am pretty excited about the championship game. Oregon is my second (very distant second) favorite team.
I had to be VERY careful in how I answered their questions. They asked me a lot of things about what happened. I deferred most of them to her, but I gently explained to them that I was sure she wanted to take them but could not.
They were shocked that I had no idea she was gone and they were very dissapointed when she refused to let me keep them.
Raliced,
We , in fact, did. I am struggling with that and with all the other changes she has made to the dissolution we had already agred too.
Raliced,
We , in fact, did. I am struggling with that and with all the other changes she has made to the dissolution we had already agred too.
bdub, I'm sorry she's not sticking to the agreement. I know that's a really tricky situation, not because I've experienced but I do have friends that have. One friend in particular, her XH has never stuck to any agreement or court order they've ever had. There's drama on a weekly basis. Her new H must be a saint to put up with it. I hope your W comes to her senses about raising the kids, that she'll see they are the thing to focus on now. In the meantime, it sounds like you are doing a great job. Continue to stick up for yourself and for your boys.
We have had the drama on a weekly basis too and I am done with it. It was a week ago today we had a huge argument on the phone about her leaving the boys with her mom and not letting me keep them. There has been zero contact since. She showed up an hour late (again ) to pick up the boys Sunday. I cracked the door open and told her they would be read in 5 and shut the door again. The boys and I calmly gathered their things and double checked to make sure they had everything. They said goodbye to me and their dog and off they went. There was no hurrying, yelling or drama.
On a side note: Expectations always leads to dissapointment. I expected she would be excited to see the boys after not seeing them for an entire week.
bdub, are you having a drama-free day?
100% drama free. I expect more of the same in the near future.
The more I detach and GAL the more I learn how to handle the spew. The better I handle the spew the easier it is to detach.
100% drama free. I expect more of the same in the near future.
The more I detach and GAL the more I learn how to handle the spew. The better I handle the spew the easier it is to detach.
Go visit HP, would you?
It's funny that we are talking about NC and drama stuff right now because in the last 45 minutes WAW and I have exchanged 19 tm. So much for NC lol.
However, I have learned that dissolution is almost done and if what she says is true, its signable. The boys are going to the house to get their winter clothes so they can be outside on this snow day. WAW is going to loan me our carpet cleaner AND the shampoo for it so I can clean the bedroom carpet AND shes going to deliver it when she gets the boys snow clothes.
Happy new years to me?
Contact, but no drama. Vanilla would give me points for that, right?
Contact, but no drama. Vanilla would give me points for that, right?
Vanilla is pretty generous with her points, I'm sure you get something for that.
And how are you doing today?
Doing well today rpp. The boys only had 1 day of school this week thanks to arctic temperatures, 6 inches of snow, and 25 mph winds. I was off work Thursday so we got to spend the entire day together. I played chef and stepped way out of my comfort zone and prepared 2 actual meals. Not just PB&J or chicken nuggets.
bdub, I think we must be in the same state, given your support of Buckeyes and also the number of snow days endured this past week. I too am on the path to dissolution (meeting to hash out proposal with L this Tuesday) and am eager to move it forward quickly (but also nervous about the process). I hope yours goes smoothly -- stay warm!
I played chef and stepped way out of my comfort zone and prepared 2 actual meals. Not just PB&J or chicken nuggets.
Did you see our discussion of men in the kitchen from Maybell's thread the other day? You are on the right track here.
Are you staying warm?
Those ice storms are the worst.
We have not lost power yet and I think the worst of it is over regarding the ice. Luckily no wind this time. 7 years ago we went 6 days with no power. It felt like little house on the prarie. I carried water out of the creek to water my cattle in the barn 3 times a day.
Labug I am plenty warm today, its all the way up to 34 now. Heat wave!
Ahoy,
Our sitchs are VERY similar except my WAW stayed at home until October. I got another revision of my dissolution Friday. I have been over it and I only have an issue with one clause. WAW text me this morning and I told her about it. She is ok with the change I want to make. We are at warp speed to get the attorney to make the change today so we can sign and she can file today. She also benefits from snow days ;-)
I hate the thought of this being final, but I am getting very anxious to get the agreement signed and finalized. She started changing things and it looked for a while like we were going to go through a full D. In fact, I had an attorney draw up the papers so they could be filed immediately if I felt she was going to back out of the dissolution all together.
Did you see our discussion of men in the kitchen from Maybell's thread the other day? You are on the right track here.
No but i will go find it. I did have a good laugh at the thread about the laundry though. I think that was raliced , maybe?
Men in the kitchen?
laundry?
...shifty eyes look from side to side....
annnndd what about us
...just don't mention ironing, don't do ironing unless absolutely necessary!
Ironing at my house = damp cloth in the dryer with wrinkled clothes for 10 minutes. Problem solved.
Contact, but no drama. Vanilla would give me points for that, right?
Vanilla is pretty generous with her points, I'm sure you get something for that.
Oh, at least 1 pt per day, no more, can not have a drama free life. WAS have not given their permission! Detach....
V
Laughing at V!!
I get bonus points. TM with WAW about dissolution and she asked a complex question that needed answered ASAP. So I called her.
She unloaded on me. Spew flying everywhere. I deflected, validated, STFU, did 180s, GAL, and every other DB technique in the book. She screamed at me for not trusting her and not taking her word for what the clause meant. In the end she gave her attorney permission to talk to me. He called and the clause I was questioning was in fact going to effect my visitation time.
Turns out she was wrong, and the clause got changed.
We now have a dissolution we both agree too and she MAY be coming to my office to sign the papers. It's been a long twisting tangled road and I am ready to close the book on this chapter of our lives. After we sign there will be no more negotiating. Negotiations have been well over half of our contact the past few months.
Other than her cramming OM down the boys throats, it has been the biggest source of tension and anxiety in my life.
bdub, (responding to your previous post), the dissolution process makes me nervous, since I too want to move it forward as quickly as possible. I'm also worried about having to convert to a divorce if we can't get on the same page. And a divorce would drag the process out longer, and cost more, and potentially interfere with my plans to move back to my home state. My H is really cheap so I think he will want to avoid the divorce option, but I'm still worried. I have a meeting scheduled for tomorrow with my L to work out a proposal. At this point my feeling is that whatever it costs to extract myself from this crazy man will be worth it...
Bdub, good luck with the dissolution. And hope that calmer heads prevail. You are doing the right thing by just negotiating out side of court. It may feel like crazy stress, but compared to the normal process you are getting a reprieve.
Hang in there, you're doing great.
This too, shall pass.
(and we are the Champions!)
Ahoy,
The combative nature of divorce drives me crazy. Negotiating was very difficult. There was no good faith or trust. Once I found out about OM and all the lies it became very hard to believe anything she said. She changed the agreement 4 times. In the end, I listed out my priorities and stood firm on my top few and let a few of the others slide.
Looking back at the last few months she has lied about everything from OM to income to stuff about boys to dissolution stuff. She has lied to me, the boys, my parents, her parents, her friends, my friends and even her attorney.
I guess what I am trying to say ahoy is that I too want to get this done as soon as possible.
Ahoy, one thing that I did learn was to negotiate is short infrequent sessions. WAW is pretty quick to anger and then her anger throws me off track. The successful sessions ended before I lit her fuse.
Thank you for the great advice, bdub! I am avoiding meeting with my H in person, and trying to conduct most communication with him through email. However, last night I could tell he was getting defensive/afraid about my move and the idea of D14 coming with me for school. When he is defensive he lashes out and is angry and nasty, so I wanted to calm him down and realize that I am not trying to threaten him, I am just trying to figure out what's in D14's best interest. My H also lies about so much these days, it's difficult to trust. Luckily, at this point I really don't care how much it costs, I just want out. And quickly. If he starts dragging his feet with the dissolution, I'll just convert it to divorce to get the ball rolling. I've been super patient and compassionate these past seven months, but now I have to move on.
Please keep me posted on how you're doing with the dissolution process. By "sessions" do you mean mediation negotiations with the lawyers or just conversations between the two of you?
By sessions I mean conversations between the 2 of us. While she was still at home we spent half an hour every other night figuring it out. We wrote it all down and had EVERYTHING in place. Since she moved out she has changed or tried to change several things. Most have been trivial so I give in. A few have been worth fighting for and I have.
If we sign what she has in her hand now I will still get the financial settlement I want, 50-50 time with the boys, very little CS (she makes more than I do), and the boys will finish school in this school district. The last one is SUPER important because the boys have all their friends here, it protects my 50-50 split, and this immediate area is all they have ever known.
That sounds like a great settlement, bdub. I hope my H will recognize that my proposal is generous and that, although I need to move back to my home state for my job and family support, that I want him to have as much time with our daughter as possible, and keep that connection strong. But I'm fearful that I might have to convert to divorce, since he seems to be resisting the move.
I definitely don't want to waste time with one-one-one sessions with my H. I'd rather just work through the lawyers because he messes with my brain too much. I think it will help us stay amicable in the long run if we don't try to hash it out unsupervised by legal guidance.
If he messes with your head and you can't think clearly around him, use the attorneys.
It must be tough to have to pack up and move away. I am blessed that I do not have that issue in my sitch.
Just sat down with WAW and signed the dissolution papers. She also signed the deed transferring the farm into a trust for the boys. I am not allowing this to effect me right now as I am at work for a few more minutes. But when I leave I am sure I will feel the relief and the grief. I have a basketball game and then I will have 4 11 year old boys for the night so I will not really be able to sit with it and work through it for a while. I hope I get a chance to work through it before the boys leave on Sunday so that emotion does not get thrown on top the pile.
It has been a long twisting road.
Hey, it has to hurt but you've been quite steady throughout this process.
Grief is grief.
((( )))
Bbdub I know this a relief and sadness all at the same time. Thinking of you today.
It has been a while since I have checked in and that is a good thing. I took the boys to the Florida Georgia Line concert and S11 was totally amazed and took it all in. S13 was unimpressed and bored halfway through the show. The next night S11 had 3 friends over to celebrate his birthday and They had a blast. It cost me 3 pounds of bacon, a dozen eggs, an entire bag of hashbrowns, 2 pizzas, a bag of pretzel M&Ms, a small bag of jolly ranchers and a bag of Doritos but it was a night they will all remember. Those memories mean 1000 times more than any gift I could have bought him.
Gosh Bdub- Now I'm hungry.
It sounds like they had a blast!
bdub, I see you posting around a bit, but how's your own sich? All quiet?
Hi rpp, sorry for the delayed response. My thread has become pretty boring so I don't check it often.
Here's a quick update:
Next Monday is our court date and I have been giving it a little more thought each day. It does not consume me, but occasionally I catch myself thinking back on the good times. I honestly think it is more of closure than anything. I get more centered every day and the bad times are not as bad and not as frequent.
I still let WAW push my buttons sometimes but at least I recognize that I LET her. Example: S11 had to be at his game at 12:15 Sunday. WAW normally picks them up at 12. I assumed she would get them at 11:45 so I made plans to meet a friend for lunch before the game. Game time was 1pm so I was great. WAW sent a TM at 9:45 stating she would be there at 10 to get them. We were still in our PJ's, expecting a noon pickup. I told her the boys were not ready, but they would be ready by 11:30. She told me I would have to take S11 to his game then as she had a confirmation for a family member at chuch from 11-12. I told her I could not as I had made plans for lunch. Her reaction was " Well then they will have to walk because I have xxxx's confirmation." Naturally, I caved and cancelled my lunch and took the boys to S11's game early. Of course I resented this but it has become the norm. I will never understand the selfish attitude of a WAS. The game and it's start time has been on the schedule since November. If I would have known she had a confirmation I would have never made plans and would have gladly taken the boys to the game.
Actually, that is not 100% accurate. I did not get the TM at 9:45 regarding the 10:00 pickup. S13 did. S13's mood went south immediately as he felt it was somehow his fault. I explained to him that all he did was get the text. It was my fault and his moms fault for not addressing the schedule earlier.