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Posted By: SunnyB Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/24/14 04:20 PM
Last thread: http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2507746&page=1

Wow, 10. I never really expected that when I first posted here. I don't really know what I thought. Yes, I do. I thought if I could just hang in there until H's A imploded then I could go back to normal. That's what I thought. I don't know whether to laugh or cry at that.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/24/14 11:11 PM
Newsflash: my H just said "you're welcome" for the first time since BD.

I have more to tell about today but I'm exhausted. I'll post later.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 01:06 AM
So I ended up spending the afternoon in the ER. Turns out everything is ok and I came home but I'm exhausted. So glad my S19 was home to pick up D12 from school. H knew I was there but didn't offer any help. However when I talked to him later he was offering to cook Thanksgiving dinner. And then he sent me a gift certificate for a facial because I had a tough day. That's when I told him thank you and he came back with the elusive you're welcome. I have to say H has been nicer to me in the past few days than he has been in months, maybe years. I have no idea why.

Today I am grateful for all my kids. The one who can drive, the one who knows how to grocery shop, the one who can cook. They are jewels.
Posted By: raliced Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 01:33 AM
Glad to hear everything is ok rpp, and I'm not surprised your kids all came through. You raised them after all.

As for him being nice, I would guess that is both guilt and trying to put a sheen of friendliness/civility over the whole thing.

Stay Well
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 12:59 PM
Good morning. I'm having trouble unpacking all the emotions attached to my little ER trip yesterday. Most of it centers around my H offering to help with Thanksgiving cooking and sending a gift certificate, but not providing any real-time assistance picking up his own children from school or providing them dinner, or offering to get things I needed from the pharmacy. Am I wrong to think that would have been in line, even though we are S? I didn't specifically ask him to do any of those things, although we did talk about all of them on the phone after I left the ER. In the end, it all worked out without his help. Fact is that it's been working out without his help for years on end.

I cried all afternoon yesterday, much of the evening, and I feel another jag coming on now, even though I'm trying not to because I'm at work. I don't really know what all those tears are about.

Any words of wisdom out there?
Posted By: Wonka Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 01:44 PM
RPP,

Yeah, it blows that H was not really available to help you pre-and post-surgery. Still very much into himself and does the bare minimum to help out with the kids.

Are you missing the feeling of having a partner by your side to support you? Or is it that H isn't around as a family with the Thanksgiving holiday looming just around the corner?

It's okay to have a good cry. Get all the emotions out.
Posted By: Jefe Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 01:51 PM
I'm sorry, Rpp. ((()))
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 01:58 PM
Originally Posted By: Wonka


Are you missing the feeling of having a partner by your side to support you? Or is it that H isn't around as a family with the Thanksgiving holiday looming just around the corner?




It's the partner thing. I really want someone who will stand by me. But the thing I'm struggling with is that I don't know that H was that person anyway. I'm not sure if the sense of loss is about H himself, or the fact that now that I know how to ask for what I need (a recently learned skill), there's no one to ask. In any case, I'm getting no support from him, or any other man, and that blows, because I want it so much.

Last night would have been a good night if I didn't feel so crappy. S19 stepped up by picking up his sister from school and doing some grocery shopping. All three of them, plus D16's bf, pitched in to make dinner. My kids are gold. But they aren't my partner.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 02:31 PM
Please, accept that there will be crappy days. You've had a big loss in your life. Don't castigate yourself for having feelings.

Better days will come. smile

Why didn't you ask H to pick up the kids from school? That would seem appropriate even if you had been Dd for years.

Hope the sun is shining where you are like it is here.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 03:36 PM
Originally Posted By: labug

Why didn't you ask H to pick up the kids from school? That would seem appropriate even if you had been Dd for years.

Hope the sun is shining where you are like it is here.


I didn't ask H because when I was in the ER and we were texting, he was clear that he "had meetings" all afternoon. I also knew that I could probably get S19 to pick up D12, or one of my friends would do it. D16 already had a way home from school, her bf was going to pick her up. (They go to different school, not remotely in the same neighborhood).

My main issue with H on this is not that he didn't pick them up, I didn't ask him to, but that he didn't think ahead that his children would need a way home from school if their regular ride was in the ER. And so I can't fault him for not doing it, I didn't ask him to. But I don't think it's unreasonable for these things to occur to their father. Maybe I'm way off base on that one. Maybe I spent too many years doing it all myself for these things to even occur to him and now I am faulting the beast I've created.

It's the sense of being taken care of that I'm looking for, not the actual act of picking them up. I had the logistics taken care of, I always do. I just wanted someone to say "I have your back".

And it is in fact a beautiful sunny day in South Florida. smile
Posted By: Maybell Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 03:38 PM
Totally feel ya, RPP.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 03:40 PM
See how you read his mind and figured everything out so no one else had to expend any extra energy?

That's what your H is used to, where the family is concerned he's an accessory. Please know that I'm not saying that's all your fault but sometimes we have to leave room for others to be their best. He may not have it in him but you may NEED him in the future.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 04:06 PM
Originally Posted By: labug
sometimes we have to leave room for others to be their best. He may not have it in him but you may NEED him in the future.


H had asked me if he could pick up anything from the grocery store for Thanksgiving. I just sent him a list. RPP lets go, H steps up. It's a beginning.
Posted By: Underdog Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 04:42 PM
Hiya rpp,

I sure hope you're feeling better today. Sounds like a stressful way to start TG week.

Quote:
Maybe I spent too many years doing it all myself for these things to even occur to him and now I am faulting the beast I've created.


I think this is exactly the case. I like Bug's comment about being an accessory. This was true for me as well. You're probably going to have to teach him how to pick up the reins by letting him know what he can expect from you now that you are separated. Be objective and fair and be specific. He may not do it your way, but you're going to have to let him do things his way.

Quote:
It's the sense of being taken care of that I'm looking for, not the actual act of picking them up. I had the logistics taken care of, I always do. I just wanted someone to say "I have your back".


Well, I'm afraid that the barn door is open and the animals have fled. Expecting him to act as a husband should under the present circumstances is like expecting a cat to bark. It's not gonna happen, rpp. At least now. And you're going to have to expect him to behave as a divorced man would. I know you're not divorced, but act as if this man has no emotional ties to you and curtail those expectations.

So I'd ask to set up a family meeting to address the issues that you need HIM to fill now that you shouldn't be expected to have his back. He's going to be inconvenienced, and tough titties. You don't have to be unkind about it, but a dose of reality will go a long way toward getting him to start thinking in terms of being a present dad with his kids and not expecting you to be mom AND dad.

You may have to tweak things and renegotiate if he's not able to fulfill what the courts will expect him to do if he's divorced. That would be comp time or additional child support. So set this up so everyone wins.

The expectations need to go, rpp. If they are not agreed upon verbally (or in writing), they don't exist. Got it?

Hugs-
Betsey
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 04:46 PM
Originally Posted By: Underdog



The expectations need to go, rpp. If they are not agreed upon verbally (or in writing), they don't exist. Got it?



Betsey, great to have you back. I've been thinking of you and your family.

I know the expectations need to go. But that doesn't take away the desire. I don't expect H to have my back. But I really want someone to.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 04:49 PM
Its tough not having someone to lean on.
Its tough not having someone to lean on you.


I think you are starting to figure out where you stand with him right now. remember no expectations?

It is pretty hard to "circle the wagons" when one of the wagons is over yonder frolicking in the foothills without a care in the world.
I know I am beating a dead horse here, but I still see his " you're welcomes" making you happy and his "lack of forethought" causing you sadness.

Labug and rpp, no more talk of sunshine. It dropped from 60 degrees to 20 degrees in 6 hours here yesterday. And rained all day!
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 05:32 PM
Originally Posted By: bdub
It is pretty hard to "circle the wagons" when one of the wagons is over yonder frolicking in the foothills without a care in the world.


This is funny. smile

Originally Posted By: bdub
I still see his " you're welcomes" making you happy and his "lack of forethought" causing you sadness.!


I'm possibly not explaining myself again well. I don't see appreciating a "you're welcome" as a bad thing. I'd appreciate it from the grocery store clerk, but that doesn't mean I'm attached to her. She's just not somebody I talk about here.

I'm not upset with H's lack of forethought, per se, I am upset that I am not in R with someone who would actually think of me. I am longing for something I don't have. It's not that I'm expecting things of H and then I'm sad because I don't get them, I am just expressing how nice it would be to have someone in my life that I could get those things from. Clearly, that's not H and I get that. But I can still want it.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 05:32 PM
Originally Posted By: bdub



It dropped from 60 degrees to 20 degrees in 6 hours here yesterday. And rained all day!


And YUCK, by the way!
Posted By: raliced Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 05:45 PM
Originally Posted By: rppfl

I cried all afternoon yesterday, much of the evening, and I feel another jag coming on now, even though I'm trying not to because I'm at work. I don't really know what all those tears are about.


Originally Posted By: rppfl
I'm not upset with H's lack of forethought, per se, I am upset that I am not in R with someone who would actually think of me. I am longing for something I don't have. It's not that I'm expecting things of H and then I'm sad because I don't get them, I am just expressing how nice it would be to have someone in my life that I could get those things from. Clearly, that's not H and I get that. But I can still want it.


Rpp- By any chance, have you been suppressing that desire to have a husband who "thinks of you" for years? If so, than allowing yourself to want this very natural and normal thing (after years of bottling it up)would certainly lead to crying jags.

I hope you are feeling much better today and that your kids are doing well.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 05:54 PM
Originally Posted By: raliced


Rpp- By any chance, have you been suppressing that desire to have a husband who "thinks of you" for years? If so, than allowing yourself to want this very natural and normal thing (after years of bottling it up)would certainly lead to crying jags.



Oh, yes, honey, without a second thought. I have not felt loved and valued in years. What went down yesterday with the ER and the picking up kids and the scrambling for dinner could have played out exactly the same way five years ago except substitute "H worked late" for "H left me". (And S19 couldn't drive then. smile )

In our 24 years of M, I asked H to come home "early" exactly twice. Once was the first day that D16 was home from the hospital and I was nervous about being home alone with a newborn and a 2-year-old all day when I was sleep deprived and in pain myself. The other time was when the older two were small about 1 and 3, and I had the flu, flat on my back on the couch all day. On each occasion, he came home at 8:00pm. I never asked again.

The thought that I'm letting out years worth of tears makes sense, 'cause I can't seem to stop them today.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 05:54 PM
hmmmmm, good observation.
Posted By: Underdog Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 06:03 PM
I want what you want too, rpp. The only difference is now I'm much pickier about who I want to be that man. The only man who's gonna scratch that itch for me is one who wants the job, hands down. Nobody need apply that isn't sure... smile

Quote:
The other time was when the older two were small about 1 and 3, and I had the flu, flat on my back on the couch all day. On each occasion, he came home at 8:00pm. I never asked again.


Wow, rpp. From where I sit, this clearly illustrates the man he is. Not the man you think he could be, but the zebra whose stripes are clearly visible. And these examples are awful. Awfully unkind. Awfully insensitive. Awfully uncaring.

You DO deserve better, my friend. Hold out hope that you will get what you want AND need. Shed tears of joy that you will get the kind of love you desire.

Thank you for thinking of me. It's been a really tough year. I'm definitely ready for the calendar to move to 2015. I'm predicting smoother sailing then. wink

More hugs coming your way-
Betsey
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 08:24 PM
I took all these thoughts into IC today. We talked more about how I trained H not to take care of me. And what an eager and willing student he was.

I see all this and can talk rationally about it. I just don't know what to do about it.
Posted By: Underdog Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 10:27 PM


Quote:
I see all this and can talk rationally about it. I just don't know what to do about it.


Did your C have any suggestions? I've got one for you. smile

Debbie Ford has a book called The Best Year of Your Life, which I highly recommend. You can begin any day you want--not just the first of the year. Why wait for the New Year to get started? Actually, I recommend a slew of her books. Spiritual Divorce rocked my world. So did the Secret of the Light Chaser. I've read almost all her stuff, and it's very worthwhile. I also highly recommend Cheryl Richardson and Marianne Williamson for the type of changes you want to make for yourself. They are both uplifting and wonderful.

Cheryl's big message is about self care and Marianne is the spiritual guru who puts it all in a thoughtful message.

What helped me is to define the me I wanted to become. I figured I would attract the right kind of people into my life when I got to the point where I felt good all on my own. But that's my way of doing things. It might not work for you.

I think I'm going to pull out this book tonight and start thinking about what I want for 2015 myself. So thanks for the reminder that I can start doing my homework now. wink
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/25/14 11:22 PM
Originally Posted By: Underdog


Did your C have any suggestions? I've got one for you. smile

Debbie Ford has a book called The Best Year of Your Life, which I highly recommend. You can begin any day you want--not just the first of the year. Why wait for the New Year to get started? Actually, I recommend a slew of her books. Spiritual Divorce rocked my world. So did the Secret of the Light Chaser. I've read almost all her stuff, and it's very worthwhile. I also highly recommend Cheryl Richardson and Marianne Williamson for the type of changes you want to make for yourself. They are both uplifting and wonderful..


IC would like me to open myself to new people and new experiences. She asked me to make a list of 10 things that I would like to do just for myself. My focus has been pretty narrow the past few years. Kids 75% H 25% RPP 0%. She is trying to shift those percentages. Just like you and labug smile

I believe I own a Cheryl Richardson book I bought a few years ago, but never got very far with. The timing was not right then for me to hear that message but I will give it a try now. I will also look for the Ford book.
Posted By: Maybell Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 01:17 AM
Thanks, Betsey for your awesomeness. smile
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 01:37 PM
Journaling: last night was a nothing kind of night, I spent most of it with my leg propped up. I watched some of the Heat game, and read some of my new Ford book. S19 went to dinner and spend the night with H. D16 and her bf went to dinner with friends, but picked up food for me and D12 first so I didn't have to cook. Have I mentioned I have great kids? smile

This morning's mood puts me back in the position of "I don't want to be M to this man, but I'm willing to be his friend." We exchanged a couple of texts about the logistics of Thanksgiving yesterday and it was all pleasant. I didn't respond to his text last night that was just a chatty narrative about what he and S19 had done all evening. But in my mind I was thinking why shouldn't I reply to him in the same way I'd reply to any friend? If I was willing to overlook his A to be his W, I can overlook it to be his friend. I know others have different opinions, but that's where I stand today. Ask me this afternoon, I may have a different opinion.

IC threw out some phrases and ideas yesterday that I had not previously been willing to entertain. That I will date again. That I might marry again. That I would be a good stepmother -- that one has never occurred to me at all. That I would be a good daughter in law to a different family. She's not pushing me by any means but I like how she tries to get me to think outside the box. The box I live in in pretty small these days. At the very least, I could move to a bigger box.
Posted By: Jefe Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 03:23 PM
Maybe because you are will to overlook the A to be his wife but to just be his friend means you have to overlook the A and the Marriage. That is my emotion about it anyway.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 03:36 PM
Rpp you are going to love what is waiting outside that box for you!
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 03:45 PM
Originally Posted By: Jefe
Maybe because you are will to overlook the A to be his wife but to just be his friend means you have to overlook the A and the Marriage. That is my emotion about it anyway.


Jefe, are you saying that I have to pretend the M didn't exist for us to be friends going forward? Can you expand on this a bit, I want to understand.

Originally Posted By: bdub
Rpp you are going to love what is waiting outside that box for you!


bdub, I keep hearing that! smile And I'm almost ready to go see what's out there. Almost. It's a little scary still. But I'm working on that.
Posted By: Jefe Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 04:04 PM
IDK, for me to overlook the affair for the marriage is easy, because it should mean the affair (the pain) is over. To be friends means the affair is not over and neither is the pain.
It's just my perspective. But I am not as detached as you are which is a huge part of my problem.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 04:06 PM
You don't have to jump out of the box like a jack-in-the-box. Take a peak out now and then. Stick a hand out, then an arm.

I used to shudder every time I was put in a situation that put me outside my comfort zone. Now, after a few good expereinces, I look forward to being "challenged" on a daily basis.
Baby steps!
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 05:23 PM
Originally Posted By: Jefe
To be friends means the affair is not over and neither is the pain.


But the pain is over. Because if I'm not M to him (and don't want to be M to him) then I don't care who he's sleeping with. None of my business.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 05:24 PM
Originally Posted By: bdub
You don't have to jump out of the box like a jack-in-the-box. Take a peak out now and then. Stick a hand out, then an arm.



Love this image. Here I am waving my hand out!!!
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 05:44 PM
Originally Posted By: rppfl
Originally Posted By: Jefe
To be friends means the affair is not over and neither is the pain.


But the pain is over. Because if I'm not M to him (and don't want to be M to him) then I don't care who he's sleeping with. None of my business.


Mind you, I'm not saying I'm totally there yet. I'm just entertaining it as a possibility down the road.
Posted By: raliced Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 05:49 PM
Rpp - Its interesting to read your perspective on this, as I've been thinking about it a lot. I can see being friends with STBX years down the line - but at the moment I feel like he would have to really recognize and acknowledge the pain this has caused me. Maybe that need will fade over time. And, I'm petty, but I think I would have a hard time accepting current OW. Future ones, yes, but not this one.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 06:03 PM
Originally Posted By: raliced
Rpp - Its interesting to read your perspective on this, as I've been thinking about it a lot. I can see being friends with STBX years down the line - but at the moment I feel like he would have to really recognize and acknowledge the pain this has caused me. Maybe that need will fade over time. And, I'm petty, but I think I would have a hard time accepting current OW. Future ones, yes, but not this one.


Raliced, I totally hear you on the current OW, and I said the same thing to IC yesterday. That I could accept his future girlfriend, wife, whatever, the point is someone he met after we D. But not the duck that whispered in his ear to cheat on his wife and walk out on his kids. Not absolving him of his responsibility, but not letting her off the hook, either. She's not someone I want my kids around, ever. Nor would I want to have to be civil towards her myself. Then again, she deserves a man who cheats on his wife and walks out on his kids, and maybe the fact that she's getting one is enough.

Maybe H and I are being too civil to one another, maybe I know too little about the duck, maybe he's being too generous in the money department for me to feel any real ill will towards him. I look back at my M and don't want that again, but I look at him and think he wouldn't be a bad friend.

As I say, that's what I think today. Tomorrow the wind may shift.
Posted By: Jefe Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 10:12 PM
Originally Posted By: rppfl
Originally Posted By: raliced
Rpp - Its interesting to read your perspective on this, as I've been thinking about it a lot. I can see being friends with STBX years down the line - but at the moment I feel like he would have to really recognize and acknowledge the pain this has caused me. Maybe that need will fade over time. And, I'm petty, but I think I would have a hard time accepting current OW. Future ones, yes, but not this one.


Raliced, I totally hear you on the current OW, and I said the same thing to IC yesterday. That I could accept his future girlfriend, wife, whatever, the point is someone he met after we D. But not the duck that whispered in his ear to cheat on his wife and walk out on his kids. Not absolving him of his responsibility, but not letting her off the hook, either. She's not someone I want my kids around, ever. Nor would I want to have to be civil towards her myself. Then again, she deserves a man who cheats on his wife and walks out on his kids, and maybe the fact that she's getting one is enough.

Maybe H and I are being too civil to one another, maybe I know too little about the duck, maybe he's being too generous in the money department for me to feel any real ill will towards him. I look back at my M and don't want that again, but I look at him and think he wouldn't be a bad friend.

As I say, that's what I think today. Tomorrow the wind may shift.



And here is where my feelings lie.

I don't want my marriage that I had back either. That one suc*ed. I do, however want a new marriage with my wife if at all possible.

You're doing great Rpp.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 10:41 PM
Originally Posted By: Jefe


And here is where my feelings lie.

I don't want my marriage that I had back either. That one suc*ed. I do, however want a new marriage with my wife if at all possible.


Jefe I thought the same thing for a long time. But I have come to see, in my case anyway, that a new M isn't possible because he's the same guy. He doesn't see the need to be any different. I have made changes, yes, but that's the reason I'm seriously considering moving on. In no way will my changes alone create a new M. He has to change, too, and right now he doesn't even think he needs to. Expecting a new M with the exact same H is not realistic.
Posted By: Jefe Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/26/14 11:06 PM
Originally Posted By: rppfl
Originally Posted By: Jefe


And here is where my feelings lie.

I don't want my marriage that I had back either. That one suc*ed. I do, however want a new marriage with my wife if at all possible.


Jefe I thought the same thing for a long time. But I have come to see, in my case anyway, that a new M isn't possible because he's the same guy. He doesn't see the need to be any different. I have made changes, yes, but that's the reason I'm seriously considering moving on. In no way will my changes alone create a new M. He has to change, too, and right now he doesn't even think he needs to. Expecting a new M with the exact same H is not realistic.


Very true.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/27/14 02:32 PM
All good posts and lots of great thinking.

I think keeping "friendship" in perspective is a key here. Being friendly to someone is very different from being friends. We do those kinds of things for our kids all the time. There are some parents of kids' friends that I could be friendly to but would never be friends with.

The future will take care of itself. You can set the intention to be friendly and genuine and what happens from there happens.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/28/14 03:18 AM
Happy Thanksgiving to all! H came over this morning and made the dishes he always traditionally makes for Thanskgiving. The girls and I had made most of it yesterday, but there are his specialty dishes that he spent all day making. We had a pleasant dinner, ate some pie, watched some family tv. By the end of the evening I have to say I was ready for him to go. It was a nice day but I was ok when it ended.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/28/14 01:38 PM
Happy thanksgiving rpp.
Posted By: Jefe Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/28/14 06:37 PM
Happy Thanksgiving, RPP. Glad you had an enjoyable time.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/28/14 07:10 PM
Thanks bdub and Jefe.

Yesterday I looked nice and spent a lot of time around H but wasn't particularly engaging. Part of it is that I still don't feel well. Part of it is that I am not feeling like I want to win him back. There was never a point where we were alone without the kids so there was that aspect too. But looking back I dont know how much he'd want me back with yesterday's performance.


The past few days H texts me more than I text him. I feel like I'm ignoring him. But it's not like I'm having to stop myself, I just don't feel like being chatty. If it was a question, I'd reply.

All in all, I'm not sure I'm doing anything to attract him back. And that's ok with me right now, but what if I change my mind later and then I've been dull and uninteresting for too long?

Rambling now...
Posted By: Jefe Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/28/14 07:26 PM
I wouldn't worry about any of that. When it's time, it will be time. You're doing great. Besides, I have a hard time believing that ANYONE would think you are dull and uninterested.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/28/14 10:20 PM
Originally Posted By: Jefe
I wouldn't worry about any of that. When it's time, it will be time. You're doing great. Besides, I have a hard time believing that ANYONE would think you are dull and uninterested.


Thanks. And truth is, I shouldn't have to put on a performance for a guy anyway.

I learned a lesson today. I need to be clearer about drop off and pick up times for D12. I am annoyed that H kept D12 all day even though we had talked about an early afternoon drop off. But I didn't specify an exact time. So that's a lesson learned.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 02:07 PM
Lesson learned!
Last week I pulled into WAW's place to drop off boys and OM car was still there. EVERYONE was upset about that one.

Specific time with a 15 minute window on either side. As time goes by hopefully you will settle into a routine.

According to DB you should be detaching and GAL right now. Maybe even going dark. If you don't step away from the relationship he is never going to miss you and you are never going to become interesting and mysterious. This is pretty hard to do with children, and every situation is different but I think the vets on here will agree... he's going to have to miss you and you need some time to make changes.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 02:56 PM
I'm curious, why were you annoyed?
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 02:58 PM
Hi bdub! Sorry about the OM car in your face. Right now, H always drops off and picks up from my house. I drive by H's building but it's garage parking and I have no idea about the duck's car anyway. So that's good.


H has been gone less than two weeks. I only contact him about the kids schedules. I have not responded to his texts about other things. The glaring exception of course was spending the entire day Thanksgiving together. That's where I started to feel like I wasn't good enough for him. But that's dangerous territory for me, I spent a lot of years in that mindset. I cannot let myself go there again.

We have no reason to communicate today.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 03:08 PM
Labug,
I was annoyed at our lack of communication.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 03:12 PM
Originally Posted By: labug
I'm curious, why were you annoyed?


When I originally emailed about the weeks schedule I said that D12 and D16 had plans in the afternoon. It wasn't a time specific thing it was a lets go get ice cream together thing. So I never said , she needs to be home by 2:00pm for instance

Yesterday H kept telling me, she's sleeping late, we stopped by a store, the line at the store is long, we are getting lunch, the service is slow, blah blah blah. It just seemed like a million excuses.

But in the end I was not clear about what I wanted, so I didn't say anything. And next time I'll be clear.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 03:15 PM
OK, are you still annoyed?
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 03:19 PM
Originally Posted By: labug
OK, are you still annoyed?


No. I just learned I need to be clearer.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 03:20 PM
I have heard the holidays are hard on divorced/split families. Never really understood that until Thursday.

The OM car experience was all on me because of my expectations.

Big plans for your Saturday rpp? I am going out with 2 couples this evening. Old friends. Out of my comfort zone being a 5th wheel for the evening and a GAL. AFTER the OSU vs UM game of course.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 03:25 PM
O-H-
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 03:30 PM
I-O
Posted By: Wet Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 03:30 PM
Hey you know there are other Big 10 games going on today? Go Minnesota Golden Gophers against Wisconsin. Let's win Paul Bunyan's Axe!
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 03:33 PM
No, there is only one game today. Sorry!

THE game.

I have heard that OSU's big 10 championship game opponent is to be decided today but I figured it would just be whoever drew the short straw ;-)
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 03:37 PM
Originally Posted By: bdub


Big plans for your Saturday rpp?


No actually I don't. All three kiddos are with me so whatever happens will be kid related. I'm still handicapped by my leg issue too. I'm ready for that to resolve for sure.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 03:57 PM
Originally Posted By: rppfl
Originally Posted By: labug
OK, are you still annoyed?


No. I just learned I need to be clearer.


That may seem like badgering but figuring out what we're feeling and why can save us from unnecessary rollercoaster riding.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 04:07 PM
Originally Posted By: labug


That may seem like badgering but figuring out what we're feeling and why can save us from unnecessary rollercoaster riding.



I didn't take it as badgering. I know you always have reasons for your questions. And that I'm better off when I answer them. smile
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 04:10 PM
Having the kids is the best! Taking the boys to the zoo next weekend to see the christmas lights. The new Hunger games movie is good. Took S10 and S13 there last weekend.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/29/14 10:47 PM
Had a nice day with all my kiddos at home, plus S19's gf. Now teens are going out and D12 and I are going to a movie.

The zoo is a good idea, our zoo does the lights too.

A friend told me she saw H out shopping today. The amount of $ he's spending furnishing his new place is crazy. Sigh...
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 11/30/14 06:53 PM
Church was ok this morning. After church H snapped pictures of the kiddos for the Christmas card and then we all went to breakfast, including D16's bf. I briefly considered not going but I didn't want to miss out on the time with S19 who is going back to college today. Overall, H has his independent bachelor/duck life and his family life too. Best of both worlds. I know I shouldn't participate in that but I dont know that I'm the critical player here. The kids were going with H anyway, I don't know that my staying away would have changed his perception of warm happy family. Anyway, it was a pleasant breakfast.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 01:50 PM
Journaling: Not much to tell about the rest of Sunday. S19 left to go back to school, I did a little Christmas decorating, and that's about it. H and I exchanged a couple of texts about kid calendar for the upcoming week, and he sent me the pictures that he took for the Christmas card.

He asked if we wanted to go get our Christmas tree next Sunday afternoon. I am torn. We have always made the tree a family outing, and the main reason I'd want to do it that way again would be for D12. I am certainly capable of getting a tree on my own, but I don't want to take away her family outing. The reason I wouldn't is because it's feeding his double life of bachelor/duck and happy family, to be toggled at his convenience.

But truthfully, I'm struggling with even that. I know I shouldn't allow his double life but what if I don't care? What if I don't actually want him back and so it's OK with me that we play happy family occasionally for the sake of the kids? If I do decide later that I really want him back, have I done too much damage? I know everyone says don't worry about being friends right now, but this is an ongoing issue for me. It's really easy to be his friend.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 02:49 PM
I think you're beating yourself up unnecessarily.

Do what you want to do as long as it's without guile, from an authentic place.

It's the holidays, I would guess you don't have as many family customs in Jan . smile

Things will change as they change.

You've listed what you think is good about his life now.

What's good about yours?

What new things are you going to do for you in the New Year?
Posted By: wmwb123 Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 02:57 PM
I'm with labug. You're not really feeding a double life. The kids know he's gone, and they know why he's gone. If he's delusional, maybe he thinks he's pulling it off, but in reality there's no secrets. I think you're doing well considering the circumstances.
Posted By: Underdog Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 03:30 PM
rpp, I have to agree with Bug as well. It doesn't appear that you're in a good place to start all over with different traditions. You can reevaluate during the year next year and see where everyone is. It's probably easier for your kids to get through what will undoubtedly be a weird holiday with as much familiarity as you can both offer.

Besides, picking out a tree, mounting it on the car and then hauling it in and putting it in a stand is a lot of work for you alone. Let him contribute to that.

In the same theme as Bug stated, have you had any ideas from reading The Best Year of Your Life? I did pull it out again and it's on my nightstand - I re-read the introduction and then the holiday hit. I'm going to pick it back up tonight in earnest. There is so much positive there.

Focus on what you can do to take care of yourself and your kids. I'd really focus on YOU this holiday. Your kids have been your priority for awhile, and the time has come for some extreme self-care. Coffee with friends, mani/pedis, new costume jewelry, a new, fun workout (pole dancing? LOL hot yoga?) - anything to give to yourself will go a long way toward making you feel better about YOU.

Wear a rubber band around your wrist and snap it when you start imagining what his life is life. You won't get the truth from what you tell yourself anyway. It's a lost cause, is not helpful and will do nothing to make you become happy. Right?

And while you're at it, maybe you can start a new tradition this year just because it's something you want to do? Sometimes it means eliminating expectations that don't bring you joy. For me, that was dropping the Christmas card thing. I have a huge network of family and friends that I adore, and I love hearing from them. But having that albatross chore smack in the month of December made me depressed. I hated feeling obligated to do it. So a couple of times, I sent out cards and letters in February. It made everyone laugh. I might do that again in February just because. I do remember that first year going out with my Denver adopted parents and kids and looking at Christmas lights. It was really fun and it got me in the mood to be joyful.

I tell you this because I struggled with Christmas "joy" for years. There is a lot of baggage there, and I finally addressed it. So I truly *had* to do things that made me feel joy, because it's the reason for the season and my girls deserved it. I didn't want my legacy to them to include holiday depression because I wasn't ready or willing to clear that up.

Anyhoo, I hope you can find some new reasons to seek out JOY - starting today! Let it be a practice you carry forward over the new year and beyond.

Hugs-Betsey
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 03:39 PM
I disagree with Labug and wmwb. I think you are allowing him to cake eat. He chose to run, let him go. Let him deal with not having a family anymore. I know it stinks and it means that you don't either, but its kinda true.

Getting your own tree would be a great GAL activity. It would show your kids you are capable of standing on your own. Start a new tradition. Who knows, it might be better than the old.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 03:53 PM
Originally Posted By: labug
I think you're beating yourself up unnecessarily.

Do what you want to do as long as it's without guile, from an authentic place.

It's the holidays, I would guess you don't have as many family customs in Jan . smile


OK, I can do that. And getting a tree together is fine by me. Because I think it will make D12 happy.

Both my birthday and H's birthday are in January. So that's the next hurdle. But I'll worry about that later.

Originally Posted By: labug
Things will change as they change.

You've listed what you think is good about his life now.

What's good about yours?

What new things are you going to do for you in the New Year?



My life is pretty similar to what it was before H moved out. And it's really easy to keep it that way. My days are already full with work, kids, house. And my kids are the best thing about my life right now, hands down.

I know I need to make a little more effort to get out of my comfort zone. I have some things planned for next weekend, several things, actually. That's easy during the holidays, there are more things available than I can cram in.

In the New Year, I don't know. I have a big giant list of things I could possibly do. I just need to pick some of them.

I need more friends. I need different friends. All my friends are M. And I have lunches with them like I always have, but it's hard to be the third wheel on a weekend. I've said this before, but D is just not done in my social circle. I need a bigger social circle. I was pretty jealous of Maybell's flirting stories over the weekend, because among my friends flirting with a guy would mean one of my friend's H. Not cool.

Originally Posted By: wmwb123
I'm with labug. You're not really feeding a double life. The kids know he's gone, and they know why he's gone. If he's delusional, maybe he thinks he's pulling it off, but in reality there's no secrets. I think you're doing well considering the circumstances.


I really meant from his perspective. Not that he's fooling any of us, but that he can go back and forth between lives at his whim. Have a family when he wants it, whoop it up in his own apartment with the duck when he feels like it without the inconvenience of a family. If he can live the free life most of the time and get his family fix when he wants it, why should he ever come back? Aren't I supposed to be acting in a way that makes him miss us? He can't miss us if we are doing the same things we always do together.

I suppose I'll just try my best to live with grace and dignity through the holidays and go from where I am in the New Year.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 04:28 PM
Originally Posted By: Underdog

rpp, I have to agree with Bug as well. It doesn't appear that you're in a good place to start all over with different traditions. You can reevaluate during the year next year and see where everyone is. It's probably easier for your kids to get through what will undoubtedly be a weird holiday with as much familiarity as you can both offer.

Hi Betsey! You are right, I am not interested in forging new traditions this year. Not for me, not for my kids. I kind of feel like it's best for them to keep things the same as possible. Fact is, H and I are NOT divorced, I don't have to push acting like it.

Originally Posted By: Underdog

In the same theme as Bug stated, have you had any ideas from reading The Best Year of Your Life?


Not yet. I have read the first few chapters and made some notes. Last night I wrote out what kind of life I wanted a year from now and what kind of person I would need to be to get it. And I can tell you in generalities what I want. Specifics are harder.

Originally Posted By: Underdog


Focus on what you can do to take care of yourself and your kids. I'd really focus on YOU this holiday. Your kids have been your priority for awhile, and the time has come for some extreme self-care. Coffee with friends, mani/pedis, new costume jewelry, a new, fun workout (pole dancing? LOL hot yoga?) - anything to give to yourself will go a long way toward making you feel better about YOU.


I am so not good at this. I appreciate the reminder.





Originally Posted By: bdub
I disagree with Labug and wmwb. I think you are allowing him to cake eat. He chose to run, let him go. Let him deal with not having a family anymore.



bdub, I know exactly where you are coming from on this. And that's why I'm spending so much time tossing this tiny thing back and forth as if it were life-changing. But after I've thought about it more, I am going to let go of what I "should" do (get my own tree) and do what I "want" to do (go together as a family). That's what feels right to me this year. Maybe after the holidays I'll have a clearer picture of how to proceed. I always appreciate your viewpoint, bdub, you make me think. smile
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 04:40 PM
Agreed. The holidays are tough and sometimes its more about survival than anything else.
Posted By: wmwb123 Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 05:12 PM
Eventually you'll need to make your own traditions, but what I'm saying is that it doesn't matter what he thinks. If you think it's best for your children to keep the old tradition this year, then do it. Don't even think about what WH is thinking. It's not about him.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 07:09 PM
Let go of all the shoulds. I get the feeling you have a lot of those (my life was ruled by shoulds), it'sll take time and effort to let go.

I'm with Bets, about only keeping traditions that bring joy. Otherwise what is their meaning.

I dropped Christmas cards, unless I feel like it.

I dropped excessive baking, unless I feel like it.

I dropped shopping, unless I feel like it. I shop but I do a lot on line for Christmas. My list is very short these days. I do like to go to the mall on Christmas Eve and people watch.

You do what works for you.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 07:48 PM
Originally Posted By: wmwb123
Eventually you'll need to make your own traditions, but what I'm saying is that it doesn't matter what he thinks. If you think it's best for your children to keep the old tradition this year, then do it. Don't even think about what WH is thinking. It's not about him.


Got it. And that's very freeing. We'll get the tree together because that will make D12 happy. And that's good enough for me.



Originally Posted By: labug
Let go of all the shoulds. I get the feeling you have a lot of those (my life was ruled by shoulds), it'sll take time and effort to let go.



Of course I have/had a lot of should. How can you get to perfect if you don't do all the shoulds??? smile

Actually baking is something I enjoy, but I had cut way back on in the past few years. H didn't like to have the kitchen messed up. Even though I cleaned it right after. So I've told D12 that she can invite some friends over to bake and decorate cookies this year. And we'll get frosting all over the place.
Posted By: Underdog Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/01/14 10:41 PM
Quote:
How can you get to perfect if you don't do all the shoulds??? smile


LOL! Isn't it wonderful that we don't ever get to perfect?

Quote:
H didn't like to have the kitchen messed up. Even though I cleaned it right after.


WTF? Is he the grinch or something?

Baking is the kind of thing that is a memory builder. It's not for people who want a kitchen for show. Good grief, rpp. I hope this year you bake to your heart's content.

Back to our program, already in progress... guess what the topic of discussion was at my dentist's office an hour ago? Self care. Apparently, my hygienist and the office manager are having difficulty with this too. We discussed baking and traditions as well. My hygienist is married with 2 very small kids and apparently she grew up in the world of "should" with the rest of us. We discussed balance and what that entails. Well, as much as I could while getting my gums blasted by the ultrasonic. At any rate, she said her mom started her own traditions when she got a D. She was between middle and high schools and told me that she and her brothers were totally on board for something new and fun.

She and her hubs go up to Estes Park the day after TG for the weekend (with the kids), buy a new Christmas ornament, stay the night and do fun things (like sledding and cross country skiing) to start off their holiday season. I really like that idea. She said it helps keep her balanced for a few weeks and serves as a reminder to work on the joyful part of the season.

And I'm guessing since this has come up in two places today it's a reminder to stick with the theme. Along with actually using my Sonicare... so my public service announcement is to brush and floss and use a Sonicare daily for gingivitis. frown

Quote:
We'll get the tree together because that will make D12 happy. And that's good enough for me.


This is a fabulous mantra, rpp. For me, doing things that made my girls' lives happier became my line in the sand. If it didn't do that, I gave myself permission to cease and desist.

All my earlier threads are thankfully gone. But had you read them 10 years ago, you would have seen my dilemma that undoubtedly led to people thinking I was allowing cake eating. My issue? Mr. Wonderful really wanted to come over and eat dinner with us several times a week. I did it for a long time because it made my girls happy. And I also had my wonderful DB coach, Laurie, coach me into keeping him plugged into the family where he was allowed to be. There did come a day when it confused me. So I told him that having him there confused me and also gave me hope that he was coming home. I remember the deer in the headlights look. He agreed that if it gave me false hope and made things worse for me that he would end that routine. And then he brought the girls home with him for his time. It worked until it didn't work anymore. And for some reason, I knew when it was time to do something different. Learn how to trust that instinct.

I *will* say to you that when I had this conversation with him, I had learned how to communicate more directly - by using "I feel" statements instead of "you make me feel" statements. I had some good practice under my belt before I was ready to have this talk. And it worked out well.

Now, here we are almost 12 years later (my bomb drop anniversary is later this month) and I ask him to spend TG dinner with us. It's crazy but it really works for us. But it took time to figure out how we felt and what we could or would do for the sake of our children and not do further damage. Trust the process. It's not cake eating if it serves a good purpose. There *is* something to be said about missing you. But trust me, he knows when he goes home to his meager apartment. Whether or not this is something to tip the scales is not something you can control. So do what you can and leave it at that. You'll know.

Oddly enough, my XH is all about Christmas. He LOVES everything about it. It hasn't always been a happy holiday for me, though. I'd go through with the efforts because it made HIM happy. When he left, I revolted by decorating sparsely and one year I didn't even get a tree. It certainly mirrored my feelings, but my D20 was absolutely miserable. Turns out, I gave birth to another Christmas lover... the person who absolutely LOVES having a decked out house with all the pomp and circumstance. So I incorporated things that made her happy along the way and worked on my issues.

Her first year of college I had my house up for sale (which I wound up pulling off the market later on). I asked her dad to give her one last decked out exterior for her present. He did it happily. I had to admit that it looked nice. But what really made my year in 2012 was the pure joy she felt when we turned the corner after I picked her up from the airport. I could have put crap in her stocking, but she would have told people she had the.best.Christmas.ever. I realized how powerful experiencing the joy of others truly was.

I'd be paying someone to do it for me this year, but my roof is being replaced in a few weeks and the roofer asked me not to put up lights until it's done. So I'm working on the interior now. smile It's funny what we'll do for love. And although I still complain about the materialistic side to the holiday, I have to admit I do love my house decorated too. It all worked out because of what I had to do to get there.

And I promise you all will too. Even if you reconcile, maybe starting new traditions will help remind you that you will never go back to that life. laugh But I won't lie... the first couple of years were difficult. I just had to keep the mantra of finding balance and joy to propel me through to better times.

Some wise person here long ago used to tell us that the only way out is through. It's stuck with me through the years, because it's oh-so-true.

Hugs to all-
Betsey
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/02/14 03:48 PM
Good morning! Journaling: Nothing. The End. Seriously, another quiet evening at home with my girls. The only contact with H yesterday was a work-related e-mail (I handle the space scheduling for my church, he wanted a practice time/space for his band); and one about a Spanish tutor for D16. I have a few things I want to go over with him, but I'm simply making notes and saving them up for an email later in the week, none of it is an emergency.


Originally Posted By: Underdog
Quote:
H didn't like to have the kitchen messed up. Even though I cleaned it right after.


WTF? Is he the grinch or something?

Baking is the kind of thing that is a memory builder. It's not for people who want a kitchen for show. Good grief, rpp. I hope this year you bake to your heart's content.


Honestly, I have no idea what his problem with the baking was. I have no idea what his problem with my cross-stitch project "taking up space" inside a cabinet was. It's not like we lived in a two-room cabin.

And he did in fact want a kitchen for show. About a year ago, he had an electrician split the overhead kitchen lights onto two switches, one for the outside perimeter, one for over the island. H thought it would look pretty to have only the center island lights on at night. I hate it. You can turn on the perimeter from either side of the kitchen, but you can only turn on the center section from the breakfast room. The way I use the kitchen, I never enter from the breakfast room, I enter from the family room. That means I can't turn on all the lights when I enter, and to turn them all off, I have to turn them off and then walk through a dark kitchen. Did I mention I hate it?


Originally Posted By: Underdog

All my earlier threads are thankfully gone. But had you read them 10 years ago, you would have seen my dilemma that undoubtedly led to people thinking I was allowing cake eating. My issue? Mr. Wonderful really wanted to come over and eat dinner with us several times a week. I did it for a long time because it made my girls happy... It worked until it didn't work anymore. And for some reason, I knew when it was time to do something different. Learn how to trust that instinct.

I like your story. And I'm going to ask him about Christmas plans later this week. Originally, he had proposed spending both Thanksgiving and Christmas Day together. I agreed to Thanksgiving, but balked at Christmas. But I thought TG went well, and I think my kids would enjoy having as normal a Christmas as possible. So I'm going to take him up on the offer if it still stands.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/02/14 04:13 PM
About a year ago, he had an electrician split the overhead kitchen lights onto two switches, one for the outside perimeter, one for over the island. H thought it would look pretty to have only the center island lights on at night. I hate it. You can turn on the perimeter from either side of the kitchen, but you can only turn on the center section from the breakfast room. The way I use the kitchen, I never enter from the breakfast room, I enter from the family room. That means I can't turn on all the lights when I enter, and to turn them all off, I have to turn them off and then walk through a dark kitchen. Did I mention I hate it?



Hire an electrician to put it back the way you want it smile
Every time you have to walk those extra steps : 1) you will think of him 2) resentment will build.

It's amazing how long I parked on my side of the garage and slept on my half of the bed. Now, my truck sits in the center and my body sleeps at an angle across the bed, corner to corner.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/02/14 04:18 PM
Originally Posted By: bdub


It's amazing how long I parked on my side of the garage and slept on my half of the bed. Now, my truck sits in the center and my body sleeps at an angle across the bed, corner to corner.


Ha! bdub, I'm already a pro at taking up the entire bed. He travelled waaaayy too much on business for me not to learn that one. smile
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/02/14 04:34 PM
Begin Vent: When will my H learn to look at the shared family calendar that the rest of us have been using for years on end? What about "D16 mid-terms" indicates that would be a good time to book a Dr. appointment? And what about the meeting I have booked indicates that I can take her? I thought I was doing a good job letting him make the appointment. I should have done it myself. End vent.

He can make the call to re-schedule it. And he can make if for a time that it's convenient for him to take her.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/02/14 05:13 PM
You are/were doing a good job letting him make the appointment.
He'll learn. Just takes a while !
Posted By: Ahoy Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/02/14 07:16 PM
Ha -- It's things like this (which I also deal with constantly with my STBX) that make me happy thinking I will no longer be legally tethered to his stupidity. It's too bad it affects the kids, but they will all just have to learn through the experience.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/02/14 07:45 PM
Originally Posted By: Ahoy
Ha -- It's things like this (which I also deal with constantly with my STBX) that make me happy thinking I will no longer be legally tethered to his stupidity. It's too bad it affects the kids, but they will all just have to learn through the experience.


My H can very expertly juggle his own business schedule. He just won't look at what his kids are doing. Because if it's convenient for him...... All that's coming to an end. I'm looking for ways to give him more responsibility for the kids, and this is a start. I should have done it years ago, I thought I was being a good wife by handling routine things freeing him up to make a living for us. Apparently, he had a little too much time on his hands......
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/02/14 07:53 PM
STBXW couldn't manage to find the school where S13 was playing basketball last night....then asked me to bring him to her place ASAP because of homework....then spewed all over me for not feeding him on the way home.

I will bet others on here could share some whoppers on this topic!
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/03/14 01:22 PM
Journaling: I'm going to name my next thread Blindsided and Boring. No contact with H after the texts about the dr apt yesterday, and I don't even know how that resolved. Today I'll email him about D12's calendar for the upcoming weekend.

Last night after dinner I took D12 shopping for a particular style of shoes she needs for an upcoming chorus performance, and for a new outfit for her first middle-school dance on Friday. It was a good evening, but I was wiped by the end, all that walking and standing took its toll on my leg.


Wishing everyone a strong day!
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/03/14 03:39 PM
Just emailed H about D12's calendar for his upcoming weekend. Nothing of note, except that I asked that the trip to get the Christmas tree be just for our house and if he wanted one for his apartment to please get it when I'm not there. If he does, then I'm prepared to leave the tree lot and get my own tree another time. I don't think it will come to that.

I forgot to address Christmas plans, though. Seems like a big thing to overlook, but I did. D12 had a lot going on this weekend and I was very focused on that.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/03/14 05:15 PM
So we got Christmas plans hashed out, by email. It was what he originally proposed, I just wasn't ready to sign off on it until I saw how Thanksgiving went. We will all go to church at the service H plays on Christmas Eve, we will go to dinner afterwards. Christmas morning, he'll come over early and open presents, have Christmas dinner later. It's a Thursday, so D12 will spend the night at his place. There shouldn't be any drama around any of that.

And to those of you who say it's cake eating.....maybe it is. But I just went through this whole discussion about getting the Christmas tree. If spending Christmas Day together makes my kids happy, then so be it, I'll do it.
Posted By: raliced Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/03/14 05:24 PM
I don't think there is any cake eating in this - and I've read lots of stories about families who celebrate the holidays together post D.

If it makes you kids happy and your ok with it - enjoy!
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/03/14 05:36 PM
Originally Posted By: raliced
I don't think there is any cake eating in this - and I've read lots of stories about families who celebrate the holidays together post D.

If it makes you kids happy and your ok with it - enjoy!


Thanks, raliced. It's become so obvious to me throughout this whole process that for me, it's all about my kids. I saw that through my posts here, and IC commented on it last time. There's a high probability that if we didn't have kids I'd have filed by now. But we do, and I don't see anything wrong with trying to make their lives a little more normal, a little happier. I think it will be a nice day. smile
Posted By: Underdog Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/03/14 06:43 PM
There is no hard and set rule about what to do. Ever. The DB premise is based on "do more of what works and less of what doesn't". No matter what the end game is, you all benefit by interacting as a family. Right? And if your H is one of those people who needs to see if you will walk the talk, then just maybe this is a test. For example, my XH is definitely in that camp. Most of the time, I didn't know he was putting me to the test. He wanted to see if having a R with me was even possible, and his litmus strip was how well or poorly I treated him in any given situation.

I know it's kind of galling when you think it's THEM that did the leaving and disrupting. But the flip side is that because they are the ones that leave, they are the ones who need to believe that things could be different if they were to return. So go into it with the sense that he will come home and want to work with you, and what you do now must be done anyway, so why not practice humility and kindness toward the father of your children now?

Of course, there are no guarantees that if you pass the test that they will come home. They tend to move the bar anyway. But know it's not in vain, because your children will see the efforts and they *will* make a difference to them. It's all good.

So remember everyone: do more of what works and less of what doesn't. That's why everyone's situations are all so unique.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/04/14 01:30 PM
Journaling: Yesterday I ran some errands after I picked up the girls, D12 helped me make dinner (a new recipe), and we all enjoyed it. All very routine, all very nice.

H and I texted on some calendar items yesterday, and then I thanked him for ordering a photo print of the Christmas card picture. (I have a collection of frames for each year since S19 was born.) His reply was to comment on how "chunky" D12 was and then he called D16 "fat". Both my girls are beautiful and of normal weight, but neither is skinny. This smacks way too close to the years he criticized me for being normal sized but not skinny. I didn't make any reply to him at all, and I'm not sure where I want to go with it. I certainly don't want him to start in on their appearance not being up to his standards. And it's certainly a turn-off to ever wanting him back.


Originally Posted By: Underdog
No matter what the end game is, you all benefit by interacting as a family. Right?


Yes! And even though I don't know what the goal is at the moment, this feels right to me. I guess the goal at the moment is to make life as normal as possible for my kids, and getting along with their dad is what I can do to make that happen.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/04/14 04:37 PM
I sukk at going dark. This morning I had to ask him for the safety deposit box key. And then he texted about an item on the "house list" that he asked me to make. I put it on a shared ap so that I wouldn't have to talk to him about it, but he saw it and asked a question that I had to answer.

What I don't like about all this is that is seems like business as usual. Taking care of the kids and the house, but not making any real connections, that's what our M was all about before. And it didn't work. We are great business partners, lousy H and W. Maybe that's a sign.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 01:59 PM
Journaling: Last night I ended up being by myself at home, D12 was with H and D16 had a babysitting job. I made a few batches of cookie dough, I have a killer sugar cookie recipe and the dough has to be chilled. D16 and I are going to bake Saturday morning for an event she has Saturday afternoon. Yes, I cleaned up the kitchen nicely afterwards.

I also made some progress on The Best Year of Your Life. I listed my go-to excuses, mostly time and kids, plus a few feelings that fall in the not-good-enough department. Those are hard to give up, because if I'm not the busy mom, then who am I? My identity is tied up in my excuses.

Today I'll see H at D12's basketball game. I'm sure we'll sit together and chat like we would have a year ago. And then we'll go our separate ways. I don't really miss him all that much I have to say. Maybe we have too much contact, but I don't see that going away anytime soon, I make a real effort to keep it to kid and house now, and save up anything that's not an emergency. I think that's just my life at the moment.

Oh....and I watched a Seinfeld episode about a hairbrush. It was crazy hilarious. There was this girl named Wonka......
Posted By: raliced Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 02:13 PM
Rppfl,

I just want to say I'm glad that you are findnig some peace and balance during your separation. Who knows what will happen with your H? The separation is pretty fresh, and will be for awhile I think (your H sounds like he is really enjoying is furniture buying spree).

I'm glad your focusing your time and energy on you! And you know, in 5 or 6 years, D12 will be off to college too, so its a bonus that you are developing other parts of yourself right now besides Super Mom.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 02:30 PM
I am reading this and it seems to me like the only thing that has changed is that H can now have his OW in his life and everything else stayed the same. Why would he ever want to change from the situation he now has? He gets his family when he wants, and only when he wants, and he gets OW too. He gets all the benefits you provide and doesnt have to give anything back. I think you are selling yourself short here rpp.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 03:11 PM
Originally Posted By: bdub
I am reading this and it seems to me like the only thing that has changed is that H can now have his OW in his life and everything else stayed the same. Why would he ever want to change from the situation he now has? He gets his family when he wants, and only when he wants, and he gets OW too. He gets all the benefits you provide and doesnt have to give anything back. I think you are selling yourself short here rpp.


bdub, I totally hear you and I don't disagree with that. He does get the duck in his nicely-furnished apartment, and he gets to play happy family when he feels like it. And the thing that keeps me playing along is the kids. It makes D12 happy for us to do things together, and I'm willing to do it to for now, and especially through the holidays. I don't know that I always will, though. I just need to live through these early days, and re-evaluate after the New Year.

And, I keep circling back around to this, but......if I actually want him back, that would be the incentive to cut him off, in hopes that it would drive him back to me. But I don't know that I do, so what's the point in creating tension and making my kids unhappy? That's something I need to consider in the New Year also.

I am not discounting your opinion at all, I think it's completely valid. I'm just setting is aside for a few weeks and then I'll decide how I want to play it.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 03:31 PM
Just voicing my opinion and trying to make you think a little. I totally get the holidays. And I totally get living through the eearly days. Keep up the good work and I will keep nagging you ;-)
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 03:35 PM
Originally Posted By: bdub
Keep up the good work and I will keep nagging you ;-)


Deal! That's why I keep coming here. It's better than IC.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 03:40 PM
Speaking of holidays: I did all of my christmas shopping on cyber Monday. I will let everyone else have black friday and store shopping in December.

Do you like having a live christmas tree? Through the years my pets have all but destroyed my tree and I was thinking of going to live trees next year.
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 03:45 PM
Originally Posted By: bdub
Do you like having a live christmas tree? Through the years my pets have all but destroyed my tree and I was thinking of going to live trees next year.


Yes, I do like a live tree, I've never had anything else. Growing up, my dad and I went out in the woods and chopped down our own tree. When I moved to South Florida and had to go buy one, I was appalled at the price. But I wouldn't do it any other way. To me, an artificial tree just wouldn't be the same.

I got two kittens a couple months ago, though, and they are very playful. We will see how my tree fares this year with them in the house. A long time ago when I had both cats and toddlers, I had to anchor the Christmas tree to the wall.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 05:39 PM
Originally Posted By: bdub
Just voicing my opinion and trying to make you think a little. I totally get the holidays. And I totally get living through the eearly days. Keep up the good work and I will keep nagging you ;-)


What would you have her do, bdub?

What is her H getting that you think he should be denied? He deserves access to his family so I'm having trouble picking up what you're laying down.

Life will give him whatever consequences he needs. It may not be now and it may not be visible but that's really not our business.

Help me understand your viewpoint.

rpp,I think you're doing a great job and I think this is giving you an opportunity to really think about what kind of life you want for you. Bravo!

I also read your response to K girl about finding another man "at your age." Interesting things happen in this process and you may find that you are very happy just as you are right now. There is no rule that we can only be happy attached to a man. Before my H and I decided to date again, I as perfectly happy in my life. I did miss having someone to do things with (dinner, movies, trips) but not enough to seek someone out. I figured when the right person came along, the right person would come along. I could do these things alone or with friends. I really had to think hard about upsetting my new, free, single life. I got married at 22, so I hadn't had much of that.

Stretch your wings a little and fly a bit.
Posted By: bdub Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 06:35 PM
Labug,
In my opinion he is getting exactly what he wants. He wants family time so he gets it. If he wants OW time he gets it. I am not saying to punish him or cut him off completely. I think he will never want to change his current arrangment because he has the best of it all right now.

I disagree that H desreves access to his family. I think he deserves access to his CHILDREN. He left his wife.

I guess it all boils down to the fact that I think H is cake eating.
However, I am not there so I dont know the entire situation. If this is working for everyone then I say keep it up. However, reading through the boards I have found no one that has "niced" their WAS back.

I worry that rpp is in denial and is trying to hold the family together instead of allowing H to S. I have heard her say many times on here she doesn't want her old M. However, it seems like nothing is changing. It seems like she is just sticking her head in the sand and pretending everything is ok. I know, thats over simplified but thats my view point.

Does that make it easier to smoke what I'm rollin ?
Posted By: Underdog Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 07:22 PM
bdub,

Quote:
Does that make it easier to smoke what I'm rollin ?


LOL, nope. And I live in a state where it's legal. wink

You're distinguishing wife and family. To their children, their is no delineation. rpp IS family. No matter if she stays married to her H or they divorce, they still have a family.

I realize I'm speaking for those of us who eventually divorced. Yet, I stayed this course for 2 years for 2 reasons: 1) for better or for worse meant something to me; and 2) our children. Although I'm divorced, I have no regrets about doing what I felt was "the right thing" for our family.

Simple kindness is something that nobody can ever take away from you. I can look myself in the mirror and feel proud of the road I've taken. My kids are much better off because of it. I've been divorced for almost 10 years, but my XH and I still share holidays together, still go to kid's events together, and while I realize that this is horribly unconventional and out of the norm, we still travel together. Hell, yesterday we officially updated our wills and kept each other as the executor and medical and legal POAs. I know that's not typical. But since I travel in a group of college volleyball parents who are divorced who do the same damn thing, I know we're not *that* weird.

We don't have ex sex or have a relationship that is abstract or laden with innuendoes either. We're friends who co-parent amiably.

Very often, parents that cut off the other parent are "rewarded" by the walk away parent walking away altogether. This isn't to say it wouldn't happen anyway. But why be the instigator in a situation that might not go that route if you can avoid it? If rpp can make it comfortable enough for him to co-parent much more actively and cooperatively, why wouldn't she do that if he's willing to *be* that parent?

Things *are* changing. He may never come home to accept his role as a husband, but he will always be the father of her children. And personally, I think he deserves a fair shot at stepping up to function that way. Sometimes the only gift we have to offer others--especially those who hurt us--is to give them the benefit of the doubt. Even when they are not returning the favor.

rpp is a spiritual and religious person, and I'm sure she fully embraces the concept of whatever you do for others, you do for me. It's not a position of denial, bdub. She's allowing her children's needs and wants to have a say in how she executes. If it harms HER in any way, I'm pretty sure that she has people here who have her back--including you--to help her see that.

But right now, I think the gift she can give all of them is to let this holiday season be as typical for everyone as she can. They've never been apart as a family before, and it's going to take the next 11 months for her to figure out a long term solution for all of them. Mine left January 3. We had all year to figure stuff out, and we still wound up not happy with the first pass.

FYI, when my XH, D17 and I traveled to NY to watch our D20 play in a college volleyball tournament, we all walked to a restaurant together (along with other people). My D20 said, "We look like a real family!" And her dad replied, "Your mom and I may be divorced from each other, but we are still family." He had quite a few people clap for him for that. Because it's true.

Anyway, that's my take... FWIW.

Betsey

p.s. The only reason my XH and I can do those things together is because I allowed them to happen. It all started with a simple gesture of kindness on my part. My girls truly appreciate having access to both of us without worrying about hurting the other's feelings. I'm beyond thrilled that we could do that for them.
Posted By: labug Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 07:27 PM
OK, I understand but I disagree.

I think he's seeing his family and by family I meant kids. rpp can decide to see him or not.
It's the holidays, not an easy time to make big sweeping family changes.

After the initial anger, I was nice to my H. I had some boundaries but I treated him like a friendly neighbor and the father of my sons.

He came back.

Every situation is different.

Sorry to be talking like you're not in the room, rpp. ((( )))
Posted By: SunnyB Re: Blindsided and on my own (10) - 12/05/14 07:46 PM
Actually sometimes being a fly on the wall
is very educational
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