link to previous thread:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2460855#Post2460855Looks like we are on the same page Thorn. Also not sure if I told you but apparently earlier this week she came and picked up a few clothing items while I was at work. It kind of discouraged me a bit but then I let it go. I just tell myself that she is getting some nice clothes for our date lol.
No worries, she's just tired of wearing the same thing over and over. She didn't get ALL her clothes right?
No it looks like she tried to make it look she wasnt there, but she picked up maybe 4 shirts. The good thing though is that the house was clean. That was always something I didnt do well. The funny part about that is that I cleaned it the week she left and it has remained clean with minor tidying up the whole time. Im not trying to say that she was the dirty one...but she was the dirty one.
LOL! I keep my house fairly clean. I sweep the kitchen once every 2-3 weeks. But I'm hardly ever in the kitchen. She was in the kitchen daily because she loves to cook. So she swept it every 2-3 days. She's commented the she appreciates that I keep the house clean.
Maybe she wasn't necessarily the dirt one - just that she spent more time there and hence dragged more dirt in. It's just a usage thing I think.
Yeah, don't sweat it about the stealthy clothes pick-up. Probably just getting a change. Women need to keep it fresh. It's a good sign that she's taking care of herself. Want to look good for your date. You should go out and buy yourself a new shirt - something in the color she likes. And don't mention it during the date. She may notice "oh you got a new shirt?" But don't dwell on it.
Yeah I think youre right Pete. I am kinda weighing it out whether I should do the new shirt or not. On one hand it might make a good impression. On the other hand it would show that Im "trying" to hard I think. I would tend to lean towards getting the new shirt but Im not sure about it yet.
About the clothes pickup, I wasnt too worried about it. I would have been if she had picked up a bunch of clothes though. Like I said it seemed to only be about 4 shirts. My brother keeps telling me that he thinks that she might come back this weekend after our date based on the way things are going. I cant even describe how happy that would make me right now. I dont expect it, but right now to me its like that daydream that you have about winning the lottery. I know thats kinda cheesy, but thats how it is for me lol.
Hey, man. Be careful. If she comes back don't be too eager. You still have to play it cool. I know you'll be jumping out of your skin with joy. But too much enthusiasm can backfire. My W came back one night and we ML and I was in heaven. But I think I was too enthusiastic. She hasn't come back since. Maybe I scared her off a bit. Every Sitch is different though.
Get the shirt. You're not trying too hard - it's just a friggin shirt. Don't read too much into it - she won't. It's in Sandi's rules:
13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive at all times! In other words, be the best I can be and look the best I can look at all times. Even when wearing jeans and T-shirt, wear good cologne, because it does cause her to take notice.
And keep your cool.
Thornton,
So we went on the date on Saturday. I had to call her at like 5:30 to confirm that we were going, but she seemed like she hadnt forgotten about it or anything. We met at the restaraunt at 8:30. Actually I was there around 8:20 and she was already there in the parking lot. This is not common with her. She is usually late anywhere she goes, with everything. I was kind of surprised. My brother seems to think it means something good as far as it being important to her or a big deal. Like I said it was not like her at all. She also looked amazing. I told him that I would be able to tell how much it mattered to her based on how much of an effort she put into getting ready. We sat in the restaraunt for about an hour. She talked to me about everything that had happened with her last week. I paid attention this time instead of staring off at the TV like I usually do. She can talk for hours without any input lol. She told me that her old boss offered her a job at another location for her company in Juno Beach, FL. She asked me if we were to work it out what would I think about moving to FL. I told her that I figured she wouldnt do that because of her attachment to her family. She surprised me then and told me that she thought that was part of her problem. That she needed to stop being afraid of doing stuff. So I said ok, just letting her talk. I told her that I would probably be up for it and that I could learn how to surf which I have always wanted to do. Anyway, she talked for about 30 more minutes or so and we had some laughs and both agreed that our server was terrible. Oh yeah, as soon as I saw her I told her that she looked good. I didnt want to sound fake and say something that I would normally never say. She didnt really acknowledge that except to say that she has been swimming alot lately, referring to her tan. I then told her that her tan had a good contrast with her blonde hair and that it looked good. Then she told me thanks. I know she isnt used to getting compliments from me, so im trying not to come off as fake. Its not that I dont think she is beautiful because I do. Its that for some reason it feels weird to me to say it and thats something Im trying to get over. So I think it will be weird to her for a while too.
So then we went to the movies to saw 22 JS. We both got a lot of laughs out of that movie. At one point though I did test the waters and put my hand on her leg. She didnt move it or anything but also didnt put her hand on mine like she normally would have. It felt a little awkward to me so I moved it back after aout 20 seconds. My brothers wife seems to think that she was happy about it but scared to react because then I would think that she was back in already. Im not sure, but thats coming from a woman. It felt weird for about 10 minutes after that, but maybe that was just me. Then we got back to laughing and talking.
When the movie was over she drove me back to my truck and told me thanks for the movie and dinner. I said yeah it was fun. Then she said she was going to go ahead and go. I said ok. She hugged me and kissed me on the cheek. That is the first time since she left that she has kissed me at all. It felt like a friend zone thing, but again my brothers wife told me that it wasnt. Told me that she wouldnt do that if she didnt want to and that it was probably a making up for the hand holding thing since she didnt react to it then. I would love to believe that and it makes me feel alot better to think of that. I dont think Ive been friend zoned though because the W knows that I am in no way interested in being her friend.
She hasnt called me since then, but she did ask me to text her when I got home. I said ok and drove to my brothers house. I just texted her "did you make it home ok".
She said "Im over at SILs house, but yes. Im assuming you made it home ok". I said "Im over at Bs house, but yes". Then she questioned me like I was lying or she was jealous. Asked me how I got there so quick cause normally it takes 45 minutes. I said I dunno, I wasnt speeding or anything. Then I sent her a picture of my brother who was sitting next to me to let her know she could trust me. That was the end of our night. No contact since then.
Great job Ben. Don't fret the hand on the knee thing. I would have done the same just to test the waters, but her not reciprocating in not really a negative. More neutral. Her behaviour seems to say she's thinking of coming back. Especially asking you to move to FL with her. That's huge. She's obviously planning for you to part of her future life and that's a good thing.
As for the condition that you two work it out, do you know what patterns of behaviour split you two up? If so do you have a plan to break free of those patterns and move into a new, stronger and more conscious relationship?
Thanks Pete,
Yeah Im not too worried about the hand on the knee thing anymore. It bothered me at first, but now Ive just let it go. I agree about her behavior. I think its just a matter of time before she comes back and I just need to be patient. Yeah the FL thing took me by surprise actually. I loved that whole part of the convo, but I dont want to get excited and read too much into it.
I know that us S has a lot too do with my anger and the way I treat her. Ive been working on my anger alot since shes been gone and she even commented about how nice I was being when I talked to her last week. I think she cant be sure that its a real change yet and I dont blame her, it hasnt been that long. I also had my eyes opened to what Ive been screwing up as far as her love language when I read 5LL. The whole thing is so simple. Also she has a trust issue with me which is well founded as I have lied many times. Im working on being honest no matter what and it seems to be working out much better for me. Not sure if that answers your questions or not.
Ben you did an excellent job on your date! I am happy for ya man. It really is a good thing that she asked you about FL because that means she IS thinking about you in her future.
Keep it up!
Ditto what pilot said. Keep the road home smooth and paved bro!
hopefully things are going good....
Nah I dont have anything new except that I decided to text the W today. I know they say not to do this, but I have good reason to do so.
I texted her "Good morning beautiful". I got a response of "morning" about 40 minutes later. I didnt worry too much about that. Normally that would hurt my feelings or anger me in some way that she just blew off what I was saying to her. Not this time.
So my reasoning for texting her is
1)She always said that it hurt her feelings that when she broke up with me before, I never pursued her or tried to get her back.
2)This is one of the things that I used to do when we first started dating that made her fall in love with me.
3) This is a 180 for me as far as giving compliments. It isnt the same as in person but its the best I can do under the circumstances.
I think this is just one of those instances that she went from warm on our date night to cooled off today. Im not too concerned with it.
Thanks Oad and Thorn(I will not call you Thor) for your concerns.
Thanks Pilot and Rayzzz,
There was one other part of that convo though that I guess I left out on accident.
She told me that she had been at the apartment last week and that it smelled like cigarette smoke very badly. We both smoke but do not smoke in the house at all and havent for 2 years. I even took up ecigs now. I told her that I have no idea why it smelled like that since I wasnt even smoking. She then told "if youre going to continue not smoking, you might want to get rid of that apartment."
There are 2 ways that I could take that.
1)She clearly stated it like it was just my apartment and that she would not be involved in future plans for it.
2)Like my brother and his wife seem to think, she is saying that she doesnt want to live in "that" apartment anymore.
I dunno, this is some serious mindreading here, but I cant help it. It just really stuck with me. It also felt like maybe she thought she extended herself a bit with the Florida thing and was making up for it by letting me know that it wasnt all good yet. Again mindreading like crazy.
ben maybe she just feels that she may have had such a good time that she needs to pull back in fear that you may take it as a green light to pursue....just stay the same way you where before the date and you will be fine. About the cig and apartment thing...who knows...we can mind read this 12 ways to sunday and probably be completely wrong..lol
oh and im happy for you that you got a date...man I wish I can have that chance...who knows...
I think there is a possibility that youre right. I think that might be the case with all of the hot/cold behavior that the WAW has anyway. Lol yeah like I said major mindreading but I think we all do it to some degree.
About the date,
I have no idea how that happened man. I talked to her the night before and really controlled my anger and the conversation and validated like a pro. She told me that it was upsetting her that I was being so nice. I dunno I guess she wanted to stay angry and I wasnt gonna bite. Then just out of nowhere the next night I get a text saying "I think we should try to go on a date Saturday"
I have no clue as to why that happened really. I guess maybe she wanted to see how I was going to be for a bit more time in person. Again mindreading lol. Who knows man. I wish I had the right answer for you.
Lots of mind reading brother.
You had a good date. Now sit back and let her think about it. I promise you she is.
Don't initiate anything for a little while.
^^^^^what he said.
Dang Thorn, you seem to beat me to all the posts!
yay for the date ben, and yes I with what the guys are saying, from a girls perspective, even if your w is a waw, she wouldn't have gone if she didn't think you guys had some kind of future, and to bring up moving to FL, that's huge, good luck, definitely following....
I think the coolness after the date is natural. She saw a different side of you on the date and opened up a bit. Now she's afraid the changes are just temporary and so she's pulling back to protect herself. You must just keep the detachment and being pleasant and fun to be around. Be Calm, Consistent and Constant. Over time she will get more comfortable with the new you. Just keep working on yourself. Keep looking at what drove a wedge between you and fix your part of it permanently. It may be hard to do but well worth it. If she doesn't come back, then there will be a better you for another lady to fall in love with.
So I havent posted in a bit. Its been a good week for me for the most part. I went to the lake this past Saturday with some friends and had a great time. It completely took my mind off of the sitch.
On my way home from the lake I get a random text from the wife, who hadnt texted or talked to me all week except a response text which I will get to in a bit. She sent me a picture of a yahoo answers type thing that says that a normal person passes gas 14 times a day. I responded back with "so youre saying that Im the unhealthy one?" She said "no just letting you know that Im healthy...fyi" This was brought up because I jokingly asked her "whats wrong with you" everytime she does that. That was the end of that convo.
The next morning I sent a picture to her of my chest and how badly it was burnt from the lake. It had a caption on it that said "Im also very healthy...fyi" She responded back with "Looks like a healthy glow." I laughed and let it go.
I went to my brothers house to hang out that night and we watched tv and ate some chinese food. Around 11 I decided to go home. As soon as I left she started texting me asking what I was doing and what I did that day. First time she has even asked anything like that since she left. We are on week 6 now. We started joking back and forth with each other and ended up texting for the next 2 hours like that. Was a great convo and felt like almost back to normal, maybe even better. I did end up letting her go saying "Alright well, Im gonna head off to bed have a good night." She responded with "Me too. Night. Love you." I said "Love you too."
Then the next day which was yesterday, I came to work to find her sending me emails immediately. She was sending me stuff like she used to. Was a picture of a lizard that her dad had vacuumed up and was still in the bag. We emailed for a bit the rest of the night with me telling her that it had probably crawled in her mouth while she was asleep and pooped in there. This was also the first time she has emailed me at work in the past month.
Previously in the week I had been texting her everyday "Good morning beautiful." She would always respond with "morning." Well on about the 4th day of that she didnt text me in the morning and I figured she was over it. Well she text me that night saying goodnight. I responded like she does and said "night." Then the next thing I know she is asking me why I keep texting her beautiful. I told her because thats what she is. She said I knew you were gonna say that. That I dont think that she is beautiful and that I never use that word. I told her that I have always thought that but made the mistake of not saying it. Then she responded with "well you have never said that to me except on our wedding day." I told her that was not true that I used to do that when we first started dating. She said that I didnt. I said "Ok, well I dont agree with that. However, that was just mistake on my part if I didnt." She said "Well thanks. Even though when you sent that I had makeup smeared all over my face." I just let it go at that. So everyday for about the past week or so I have been texting her this at the same time every morning. Same response almost always.
Not sure why she all of a sudden started texting me in general when I left my brother's house. It was kind of weird. Im not upset with it by any means and I tried to play it cool the whole time. Nothing has really changed other than me texting her that every morning. My brother's wife says that I broke down her wall and now she wants to talk. Im not sure Im ready to jump to that conclusion yet, but it did feel good. Anyone have any other ideas on this?
Things are looking positive for you!
I think I would back off on the text initiating just a little bit, that might be your sweet spot.
She's definately thinking on things, don't spook her with too many "morning beautiful" texts. Let her miss you a little bit.
I'm really new here, but I'd suggest keeping up with the playing it cool. It sounds like it's working for you, so keep on with it, and avoid jumping in too quickly with too much contact.
I agree they are looking up a bit. Im trying not to see it as to much right now. I dont want to be let down again. I dont know if its spooking her or not to be honest man. Im trying to be consistent and like you said, your W wanted to you chase her. Im not all out chasing her, just trying to let her know that shes important to me.
What do you mean about being the sweet spot?
Sweet spot means the middle ground between texting too much and not enough.
Maybe text every other day. That way she gets the chance to miss you but also know you still care. Experiment and monitor your results. You might be able to identify a pattern when she seems more responsive.
I got ya. I think I can do that and see what happens. Maybe I was just happy that I was able to get some results at all here by doing it. Funny though I have not gotten a text or email from her all day today. I love the hot/cold cycle. It really will drive you insane if you let it. I did expect it this time though. So it isnt a big surprise. But thanks for the input Thorn. Your opinion is always appreciated.
It's definitely a roller coaster. I'm still feeling my way with W and monitoring things.
If she doesn't text, it just means she needs some room to breathe. Give it to her. It shows you are confident and can stand on your own. And it shows you respect her and her space.
Update:
So last night after not having heard from the W in a couple days, she called me. Seems that I have found a pattern to her trying to "feel" me out. She text me "goodnight" which she doesnt really do. I text back "night" again like last time. She text "Love you" and I text "Love you too". 5 minutes later I get a phone call from her. We end up talking for 2.5 hours.
It was a really upbeat conversation the whole time. Not much if any R talk at all. She did throw some "we", "us" and "our" talk in there. I also got her to sincerely laugh at some of my jokes like she used to. She told me that all that time she was spending with her sister was starting to get old. LOL how nice. She also said she could tell that her sister was getting tired of her being around so much. I told her that I thought that it was rude when she needed someone to talk to lol. She agreed. Told me her sister has been quite a bitch lately. I just laughed and said "sounds about right". She got a laugh out of that too. I said that she was probably stressed about finding a job and all that right now.
She told me that she was planning on texting me last night to ask if I wanted to go out on another date. Then told me that she couldnt do that anymore because her sister is going camping and asked her to housesit and watch her niece while she was gone. I said "all good, Im sure we can figure it out eventually". She went over this about 3 more times that she was planning on doing this. I just said it wasnt a big deal. She said something about us going next weekend if we cant this weekend. Also got a different reply from her this morning other than "morning", this time it was "Good morning" for the first time ever. Doesnt seem like a big deal but it kind of is to me based on the previous 8 or so days.
That was honestly the best conversation I have had with her in months really. It felt good to connect with her again like that. I think that I played it cool enough to where it didnt seem like I was anxious at all. I also have no expectations at all about us going out on a date. I think she could tell that and thats why she mentioned it more than once. Semi-mindreading. I wont go all out and say that my sitch has taken a turnaround or anything, but I think that its starting to look up a bit.
Also went to see my IC today. Had a pretty good session with him. He seems very pleased with the progress that I am making with everything. It is days like today that give you enough motivation to make it through another week or more. I dont think they have any idea how much the small things mean to us at this point. All in all Im doing great today!
Ben you are a rock star! Keep it up. I am happy for you. You have played the DB 'game' well. I hope things continue to remain positive. Be cautious at the same time. As sandi said, this is a delicate time for you and her.
Keep us posted!
Thanks Pilot,
Im trying to take from Thorn's sitch and go super slow. I dont want to seem eager or anxious at all. Just gonna let her move at her pace and see how it goes. Thanks for the kind words.
Nice! Good job man! Just keep doing what you're doing, nice and easy. You're on the right track.
Thanks Thorn,
Not quite there yet, but Im moving in the right direction at least. Looks like we might not get to do our sleepover after all...
Ben2010, after reading your sitch it seems like you have a pretty good understanding of DBing and are in control of your emotions. Imo you have done work not just talk about doing the work. Just wanted to give you an Atta Boy! I hope I can get there :-)
Well thanks CSan. I am still new at this too. My emotions get the best of me plenty of times just like they do everyone else on here though. I am no stronger than you. I have also made plenty of mistakes in doing this and am still learning alot. Since Thorn listed what worked for him I will mention a few things too I guess. I dont have as much as he did.
1)Pray everyday sincerely. If you dont have a faith of some kind, I would suggest finding one. It helps tremendously. It will comfort you when nothing else will. Lets face it, most of this is out of your hands. I pray for my Ws healing more than anything still. I created her pain and I need God's help to get her through this.
2)Never initiate any calls/texts/emails. As much as I wanted to the whole time, I didnt because I knew that it would set me back. This of course changes for those of you that have kids.
3)Always be upbeat during any interaction. Never let them see how much it is bothering you. Dont hold on to the conversation unnaturally. When its time to say bye, say bye. Always first.
4)GAL is super important. Find something to do that takes your mind off of your situation. You have to take breaks from dealing with this or you will lose your sanity.
5)NO SNOOPING LOL. This is sooo hard to do, but dont do it. I backslid a lot because of this. No matter how clever you think you are, it isnt worth it. You will either get caught doing it or make things much worse in your own head.
6)Do not bring up the R unless they do first. So many of us know how this one goes. It's an explosion waiting to happen and you dont want to be on the other end.
7)This one is HUGE to me. I am an angry person normally. Control your anger. Do not bite when they are fishing for a fight. They use this to justify what they are doing and you validate all of that by arguing or getting angry. If you can master this, it makes all the difference in the world. It opens so many doors that would otherwise remain closed. Along with this comes validation. Put those 2 together and you have a great chance to deescalate your spouse and start understanding what the real issues are. You may think you know, but you might be surprised if you LISTEN at this point.
8)Read the books. Read 5LL. See a C. All of these sources have strategies to making this work. Not everything in any one of them is a perfect plan for every person out there. You will have to find what works for you. There are many other books out there, but these are the ones that resonated with me.
9)Come here for support. Everyone on here can be helpful. I would never have even made it through a week without some of the insight that has been offered to me on here.
I hope this will help someone out there. Again Im still working at this right now and far from finished. These are just a few of the things for me that have produced positive results in one way or another.
Ben,
This got my attention alright!
I am an angry person normally.
Really, Ben? Why is that so? What does that look like to you? How did you reach that point?
Wonka,
So this is in referrence to most of my attitude before this happened. I have generally had a negative outlook on most things. I lose my patience and temper with ease. Alot of people would probably consider me to be a mean person too. I didnt mean to be that way and honestly never paid it much attention. After talking to my C, he seems to think that its due to my mother being my primary influence when I was younger.
I do realize that it is a problem and an very unhappy about it. I saw that it was an issue when I took a good look at what kind of person I am versus what kind of person I WANT to be. I am currently going through anger management with my C and it seems to be helping tremendously. Its taking a bit of time to understand some of the concepts involved, but it is working. I can honestly say that I feel 10x better about life in general on a daily basis since working on it.
I hope this answers your questions here. Let me know.
I can honestly say that I feel 10x better about life in general on a daily basis since working on it.
This is really awesome! I hope it makes a big difference in everything else in your life, too, including your DBing.
I can honestly say that I feel 10x better about life in general on a daily basis since working on it.
Would you be at this point right here, right now if W hadn't done what she did? It is the most painful, best gift you've gotten.
Got another call from the W last night. This one was even friendlier than the last one. She was in the car with her 12 year old niece and they were going to get something to eat. She talked to me about how her sister was really starting to irritate her because she has stopped being friendly to her when she comes over. I didnt think she would do that in front of her niece as it is her mom, but the niece agrees with her so I guess its ok to her.
She ended up letting me go so that they could jam out to some music on the way home, but then called me back about 30 minutes later. We talked for about an hour and a half more. She asked me if I wanted to go to the movies tonight, but I told her that I couldnt because I have to work until midnight. Also told her that I had gotten a deal through work for a restaraunt that she likes alot. $3 for a $25 gift certificate but you had to spend $50 to use it. Told her that she could use that with her family or when they order it for lunch at work because you have to spend that much to use it. She told me no that if I got it for her, she would be going with me. I said that we dont spend anywhere near $50 when we go there. She said "well I guess we will have a lot of spaghetti then" and laughed.
All in all a great convo. She told me some embarassing stories about herself too that I had never heard before! Some of which were ridiculous and made me laugh extremely hard. No R talk at all, which is how I would like it to stay for right now. Eventually Im sure we will end up talking about it, but not now.
The only thing that concerns me about this is that she is not really talking to her sister right now. Im hoping that she isnt just turning to me temporarily because her normal outlet is not available. Either way if it is, I have still made some strides with her and a positive impact on her with the "newer" me. I dont want to say "new" because Im not finished.
Nettles,
Long time since Ive heard from you lol. Great to see you again.
I absolutely would not be where I am now without her doing this. I think about that all the time. It really is a gift. You are forced to take a long look at yourself and really take notice to what you dont like about yourself. And hell yes its been the most painful gift Ive ever gotten. I cant even think of anything in my life that compares to the pain of this situation and my heart goes out to all of those out there that have it worse than I do.
Thanks for stopping in Nettles. Always a pleasure to get comments from you.
Wife just emailed me and asked if I want to go to IHOP tonight when I get off of work. So I guess Im going to IHOP. Then she starts sending me pictures of waffles LOL. This whole thing is a bit strange how quickly they can turn around. I have to be careful because Im sure that she can shut back down just as fast.
So last night went well. She picked me up with her niece and we drove out to eat. Had a great joking conversation in the car and I tried to mainly talk to her niece. Ive known her since she was about a year old and we have always gotten along very well. In fact I would say that Im her favorite besides my W.
We got to the restaraunt and continued on with the good atmosphere. We were taking some quiz online about how "southern" we were. Niece-72%, W-68%, me-28%...lol.
We ate and had a good meal. We tried to run away and leave her niece behind, didnt work lol. She drove me back to my place and I could tell that she wanted a real kiss but wasnt gonna do it, so I did it and it worked out well. Told her goodnight and started making my way up the stairs. She yelled out the window that I could go to the amusement park with them today, but I let her know that I had to work unfortunately. I could have easily called in to work today, but I dont want to seem too available.
Got a call from her when she got to her sisters house to housesit and had about a 20 minute long pleasant convo. All in all, a great night for me. Things are really looking good for us right now. Im still trying to be careful about it and not rush it at all. Letting her take the lead on the whole thing. Should be going over to my brother's house today after work to have a cookout.
It's awesome to see great people enjoy success. Can't wait to read more!
Thanks Mat I appreciate your support.
Since you wanted to hear more...here goes.
So I didnt "speak" with her on Saturday night, but she was texting me while I as over at my brothers house. Asking what I was doing and such. Told her that I would be leaving soon since his W's gay friend had just arrived. I am not homophobic or anything like that before anyone gets upset about that. He is just a very obnoxious person in general and makes it to where we cant even watch TV over ther because he is constantly talking.
She texted me back jokingly asking if he and I were going to go out and if thats why I was leaving. I of course couldnt be outdone and text her back yes and would she please stop texting me because I didnt want him to suspect anything. Next thing I know she is texting me every 10 seconds with a bunch of nonsense LOL.
I headed home and she asked me if I wanted to go out after church on Sunday or if I was busy. I said "well obviously Im free now..." She must have really gotten some laughs out of that based on her reply. She told me that it was my turn to pick since she picked last time. I suggested dinner and a walk downtown. She agreed and said it sounded like fun. Said goodnight and that was it for Saturday.
Sunday came around and I got a text asking if I was going to church. Told her yes. She said that she would pick me up and we could go together. I said alright.
She picked me up pretty much right on time. Of course I had been ready for about an hour because I wanted to look my best. I had already gotten a haircut earlier. Put on an oxford and some cologne and looked great. Church went well, she sat right up next to me and talked to me alot(yeah I know its church and you arent supposed to talk). She was whispering very close in my ear and I think she was doing it on purpose. It was really getting to me. So as soon as church was over she pretty much ran out to the car and waited for me to get done talking with her family. They actually talked to me this time and knew we were going out on a date unlike last time.
So date time! I suggested a restaraunt that we had never been to before and thats where we went. The food was a bit expensive but well worth it. Was a place with no TVs and we just sat there and talked. The food took forever even though they werent busy. I wasnt upset though because I got a lot of time to talk with her. She looked amazing btw. We decided that we would go get ice cream afterwards. We did however spend about 30 minutes driving around downtown so we could find another restaraunt that she wanted me to go to with her.
Went and got ice cream and walked a bit. Was a good time. Not much into ice cream anymore like I guess I was when I was a kid though. We both agreed on that LOL. Went back to "our" place and talked for about 2 hours. I thought she was just going to leave, but she was showing me all kinds of animals and stuff that she had been looking at with her niece. She sat right up next to me on the couch, she had never done this even during our good times. We had our own spots.
She did tell me during our conversation that the only reason that we werent having sex that night is because she was on her period. We havent had sex in 2 months or so now. Anyway sorry this is so long, dont want to leave too much out. She ended up leaving but we had a really good but short makeout session. My favorite part of the night!!!
Talked to me on the way home and we had decided to go zip lining for the next date or maybe the one after. Im pretty excited about that. We dont normally do things like that. She was also upset when she realized that I have to work until 12 all this week. She said that she wanted to come over during the week to "watch a movie".
Sorry again trying to finish this but more keeps coming. We talked about getting a new apartment too and some new furniture. It was as if there was no question to her that we were working it out.
A great night overall and things seem to be going very well right now. Im sure I will have forgotten something here and post the rest of it.
No worries there's no redundant info there. I have severe bouts of keyboard diarrhea myself, so not one to judge!
This is all amazing stuff. But at this point, what's your strategy for assessing whether to make the big move? What signal are you waiting for, and how do you plan to make sure you don't slip back into old habits?
I'm not saying this to be negative, in fact, this is quite a positive; you may be coming out of LRT, and getting ready to build a brand new healthy relationship!
Lol yeah I think we all do that sometimes.
Thanks! Right now Im not planning anything out for the big move. Im just trying to take it one day at a time and let her gradually feel it out. I think she is pretty close to being ready to get back together but doesnt want any part of the apartment that we live in currently. I wont be pushing anything with her. Its going well right now and still moving forward.
As far as slipping back into old habits...This one will be tough, but I know I can make sure it doesnt happen. Im not at all considering myself done with working on myself. Not even close. I think that I have to keep in my mind that she is really the one that I want to spend the rest of my life with and that I cant take her for granted anymore. I also cant stop working on the relationship either. The thing is, she likes the new me alot, I can tell. Shes excited to be around me, maybe more so than when we first met. I want to keep that going because when I am happy its contagious and she is also happy.
I look at it like that too. I think this is really a gift from God. We have been given the chance to start again with the knowledge of the mistakes that were made in the previous relationship and work on not going down that same road.
Good job man! You're definately on the right track, just keep it cool and don't spook the squirrel!
It sounds like you have a great plan to work with, and are super-aware of what went wrong before and what needs to happen now. This is great to read!
Hey Ben, just wanted to pop in here and say I'm really happy your story is going well and keep up the good work! Best of luck!
Hugs,
Lisa
Thanks Lisa,
I appreciate everyone's support on here. Im far from in the clear though. Have a long way to go. Happy that I can bring some hope to some of the people on here.
Wow that road home sure is nicely marked, paved, shiny with bright lights to guide your way and even a free liquor store or is that a lingerie store? Lol
So pleased with how you are gettin on and proud of the work you are doing.....as Donny Osmond used to sing in a cheesy way be a "soldier of love"
Keep militant in your changes and reap the rewards!
Ben, you are giving us all hope! Keep up the good work.
Yeah thats what Im going for rayzzz. Trying to make it nice and easy for her to come back when she is ready. On another note she said that she is going to come over one day this week even if I get off late to cook me dinner and watch a movie. Im pretty excited because she is making me something I love too.
That is the idea too. Want to make sure these changes stick and be the person that I want to be for life.
Hi Ben,
I'm finally caughte up with your story. Wow, that was a lot of reading but towards the end there it felt like I was watching a love story with a happy ending.
I'm proud to call you a fellow DBer and it gives me hope with my sitch. You've really come a long way especially with the porn issue...that's a toughie. I might be exposing a very delicate secrete here but women have porn issues too.
Not sure if there is a whole lot of info on it but it's out there. It's just flat out poison to your M.
Sex may not be a priority for a majority of women compared to men but we too experience sexual tension and need release. I made the mistake of just peeking and then I got sucked in. Mind you it was a "once in a while thing" when we just couldn't get together. I mean he had porn in his dvd player when I first moved in. I stumbled upon it wanting to watch a movie in the bedroom but there was already a disc in. So i hit play and...hello. Daily single guy routine? It didn't bother me because I knew it was common. He just needed a visual aid. I think this is where i rationalized it in my head. I figure if he's okay with it then why shouldn't I be? So, it wasn't until he gifted me with a 2x4 that I realized that taking care of myself was relieving him of his God-given ability. I was sucking the life out of our sex life by taking things into my own hands...literally.
It was a very embarrassing and humiliating discovery but since that discovery I've abstained completely. I've been better because of it.
I've experienced the same issues that you have from drastic change in behavior, changing for them, reaching out to their family, religious guilt trip, difficulty with detaching and GAL, mind reading...etc. I too found it difficult to treat my spouse like a friend. In my mind I was thinking "WTH, that's why we got married in the first place!" But as the days passed I learned more about myself from reading, listening and paying attention, and more importantly prayer than I have in my entire 33 years on this earth. I learned the negative patterns that kept resurfacing and began to understand and identify my negative behaviors of communicating and interacting. God also revealed to me that my rationalization with porn was due to deeper trust issues with men in my early childhood. I will skip the details but this is when I decided that change was for me and not for my H. Since you are a proclaimed christian, I recommend the book that Rayzzz suggested by John Eldredge called "Wild at Heart: Discovering the Secrets of a Man's Soul." Like Rayzzz says it talks about walking with integrity, delving into your deepest fears, why emasculation is so widespread, what it means to be truly masculine in God's eyes. You can love your W beyond what your human heart can fathom but only through the love of the Lord. It will also teach you how to pursue your W in the correct way because all women want to be pursued or rescued but it's in the act that makes a difference.
Anyway, so glad that things are looking up for you and your W. I hope that paved road is smooth all the way through. I appreciate your feedback on my sitch too. Keep us posted!
Ben,
Wanted to drop by and say "hi!" It seems that you're DBing really well with your W. Like Thor, you are a quick study too.
Keep it up, buddy.
Thanks for stopping by CMF. I appreciate your insight here. I honestly did not think that porn was ever an issue for women as it is generalized thought that women are more emotional/touch while men are more visual. I too did not see the harm or problems that can be caused by porn. Thought it was just an ordinary thing for guys. I had always had that feeling of shame around it, but never really understood why. After talking to my C about this whole thing, he explained it to me. He also explained how it made my W feel too as well as several other women on here that have had to deal with it. It seems that it would be less painful to her if I were to drive a knife into her side than to be involved with porn.
Ive also done a tremendous amount of learning in the past few months based on reading and alot of self discovery. I have grown closer to God, to myself and my family. The funny thing about it is that I avoided doing this stuff before because I wanted to have fun and enjoy myself. I feel so much better about who I am now and the future that Im working towards that I cant even think about going back to who I used to be. Im sure that is the same for a lot of people on here.
I will have to check that book out. I have seen it talked about in a few posts on here. Will order that and Love Must be Tough today.
Thanks Wonka,
Im trying here lol. Still not out of the woods at all here, but Im starting to see the faintest of light through the trees.
Ok so update time:
The last contact that I have posted about with the W was that she might come over this week to watch a movie and make dinner. As it turns out she came over that night, Tuesday. I didnt expect her to be there, but when I got home she was already in the kitchen cooking dinner. She made some amazing poppy seed chicken and we sat and talked after instead of the movie because it was kind of late. She told me that her feet were killing her and I offered to rub them for her. She gave me a look and laughed. I guess this is because I rarely do that unless she asks and stil rarely then. I did a much better job this time than normal and it didnt feel like I was forcing myself to do it because I wanted her to notice. I just kept going and I guess it ended up being about 40 minutes or so. She loved it.
We talked about getting the new apartment which is right across the street lol, but way nicer and bigger. Decided that we would go look at a model over there this coming week.
Then yesterday when I was at work as I am now, she sends me an email asking if I wanted to watch the movie last night. I told her that I had plans to go base jumping, but that I guess I will settle for watching a movie with her instead. Of course I had no plans to go base jumping nor would I. Those are just the kind of jokes we use. Anyway, so she was there when I got off work again and had already bought stuff to make dinner before asking me if I was hungry...I had eaten at Burger King earlier...I wish I had known. Oh well that just means the food is still there and maybe she will come over and cook it tonight
.
We watched a movie and she surprised me by laying on the couch with me. Not the traditional way like spooning, but on the other side so that we were overlapping legs. This is something that we never did, always had non-touching separate areas. I liked it and we couldnt have spooned on the couch anyway, it isnt deep enough on the cushions. We arent fat it is just a small couch lol. All in all a great week so far and we have scheduled a date after church and a possible movie date on Saturday as well. She invited me on Saturday. I invited her to a sushi place on Sunday, we both love sushi. Still no LM or anything, but we end up having very passionate kissing at the end of the night to say goodbye, last night I went for an ass grab too lol. That is something that I used to do and I know that she gets a laugh out of it. She laughed last night too.
Things are going well, Ben! I'm happy for you!
Just make sure you don't spend too much time with each other right off the bat or you can quickly fall back into old routines.
Slow and steady wins the race!
Ben,
As a fellow sushi lover, may I suggest the Playboy roll!
Slow and steady Ben but great stuff!!!
Thanks Thorn,
Just trying to let her see me as much as she wants to right now. I had asked her about Sunday prior to her asking me about Saturday, so it was kind of unexpected.
Wonka,
Not sure what the playboy roll is. The only thing that Ive run into so far that I was not a fan of is eel.
Bashy,
Im trying man, not pushing this at all right now. She is making all of these plans. I did think about declining a date sometime soon for this reason though.
Also a quick bit I left out,
When I walked in the door last night from work, she was on the couch reading "Hope for the Separated". The first book that I read when this happened. Never in a million years thought I would walk in and see that.
Good stuff Ben.
I just re-read your first post here, and I'd advise you to be very patient here and wait for a giant neon sign from W that it should happen.
I was also wondering if W is in nursing school right now? Are there classes in the summer? If not, will that change soon?
Nettles,
Thanks for commenting. Yeah I would agree with the neon sign thing. I dont want to make her uncomfortable or blow the whole thing by misreading it. I certainly dont want to push it for my own selfish needs either.
She is not in nursing school anymore. She didnt do so well with it last semester and I dont think she knows exactly what she wants to do with her career right now. I dont know if that will change at all. She is very scared of taking risks on things. In order for her to get through nursing school, she would need to quit her current job and that is a huge risk. I try to be as supportive as possible when the opportunity arises. Doesnt seem to make much of a difference.
She is not in nursing school anymore. She didnt do so well with it last semester and I dont think she knows exactly what she wants to do with her career right now.
I can see that. She had a few other things going on.
She is very scared of taking risks on things.
Hmmm. I've read a lot about a huge risk she took.
I try to be as supportive as possible when the opportunity arises. Doesnt seem to make much of a difference.
What is that last sentence? Explain.
LOL im assuming the risk you are talking about is marrying me?
The last sentence there is talking about me encouraging her to just try to do something that she enjoys. Even last night for example, we talked about her doing photography, which she loves. Ive told her many times that I would find a way to make it work financially while she gets acclimated to it. She doesnt feel comfortable trying out something like that. It isnt even the money part of it that she worries about. I think she is just afraid of failing or having to try to figure the whole "business" aspect of it out. She has been in love with photography since Ive known her. It would be a great job for her IMO. She hates the place she works at now.
LOL im assuming the risk you are talking about is marrying me?
Not at all. The risk was to leave to make things better.
The last sentence there is talking about me encouraging her to just try to do something that she enjoys.
Just because she doesn't act on an opportunity doesn't mean it doesn't matter to her that you are supportive. It's her choice. She just tried nursing and that didn't work out. Her ego is bruised. Keep supporting her even if she stays where she for a long time.
LOL ok, wasnt sure there.
Yeah youre right man. I still get the credit for being in her corner I suppose. I agree with you on the bruised ego part of it, but she has been that way for as long as Ive known her. Way before the nursing thing. It was a surprise to me that she even went for the nursing thing to begin with. I will just keep supporting her though. One day when she takes a leap she will need it.
I still get the credit for being in her corner I suppose.
What? There isn't a scoreboard for keeping track of things. You support her because you love her and that's what people do in M.
Maybe she never "takes a leap". Is that going to be an issue?
Credit in the Love Bank my friend. Thats what Im talking about. And no it will not be an issue if she never takes a leap. I wish she would though. She has never been happy at her current job and has never really had another one. Been there since she was 18. Doesnt know that there are places out there that she can work and not be miserable.
Credit in the Love Bank my friend.
I don't like that. Easily turns in to "I've built up X in the bank, so I can do Y."
Is "Love Bank" in DR or DB?
No but it is in 5LL. Or Love tank as it is in 5LL. And it isnt about I built up X and now I can do Y. Its about filling hers up so that she feels loved.
Update time!!
Last night...W came over to watch a movie. We watched Noah and ate Taco Bell which I picked up on the way home. Had a good time pointing out all of the inaccuracies in the movie compared to the Bible.
Then she informed me that she would be staying the night! This was a first and I didnt ask her to or even bring it up in any way. I said "oh yeah?" She said "yeah, but Im wearing my chastity belt to bed" and laughed. I laughed too and said "ok". We went to bed and I woke up a bit early today. I remember waking up in the middle of the night and finding myself holding her hand. Never done that before. When I woke up I started scratching her stomach and arms for her. At one point I stopped and pulled her shirt back down as I didnt want her to think that I was pressuring her into sex. Then returned to her arm instead. The next thing I know she was lifting her shirt back up to indicate that she wanted me to keep going on her stomach, so I went back to that...Then it happened. She lifted up her panties for me to put my hand in there!!! I didnt hesitate at all and kind of laughed. So we ended up having sex and it was amazing.
She has a baby shower to go to today and I am at work. We ended up taking a shower together also which hasnt happened in forever either. Did some more talking about apartments and a vacation for our anniversary too. Im not pushing anything at all and am not expecting that this means that we are "piecing" or that she is moving back in. Just saying it was sex that we both wanted and that is a step in the right direction maybe. She said that she wanted to do something after I get off work today too. I said ok and will make it another light casual night. But I am excited about sushi time tomorrow.
I just want to make a quick note to all of you that are still fighting the fight here. It can change and turn around so quickly to a positive. Dont give up and dont ASSUME anything about it. Im not saying that Im the perfect model or anything close, but that should give you all hope as I have made so many mistakes and it is still going in the right direction. Still a lot of work to do for me, but its starting to pay off.
Seems this supposed risk-averse girl doesn't mind driving the ship. Looks like the best play for now is to say "aye aye, Captain!"
Yeah I think youre right Nettles. Also the beauty of it is that I know that when we do things, that she WANTS to do them, not because she feels any pressure or anything from me. Feels so much better that way. Not that Im used to pressuring her into things, but you know what I mean.
Oh wow Ben the last part almost made me cry! I'm so happy the way this is going for you and I hope the rest of us get to experience a turn around like this too!
Good luck and keep up the great work!
Hugs, Lisa
Thanks Lisa,
I just want to make sure that people know that there is hope out there no matter what. It isnt the same for every situation, but I have dealt with her going from what seemed like hating me to pursuing me all over again just by following basic steps here and in the books. Ive grown during this process as a person and Im excited to see more changes in myself for the future.
On a side note though, I think Im addicted to this site now...As I dont have that much to do at work, I get to read a ton of these stories on here and try to help others which I like and is kind of a new thing for me.
Ben, I am So Happy for your Sitch!!! Keep it going stay positive and I wish you both forever Happiness.
I am so happy for you! Keep up the good changes and remember to listen, listen, listen!
Thanks cq and ss!
Ok, so she spent the entire weekend back at home with me. Was a great time! We ended up talking about us and our future and eventually house shopping. Didnt get a lot of time together since I had to work on Saturday and she had the baby shower to go to.
Went to church last night and then to a sushi place. Ended up having a great meal, sorry Wonka no Playboy roll on the menu...Went home and went for a walk at the local park and then drove around looking at houses a bit. Also on a side note, had lots of sex this weekend lol.
The way it is going now its as if nothing happened between us at all. She mentioned something about us being "worked out" and I told her that I still wanted to pursue MC or at least some sort of marriage building activity/retreat. I know that communication issues will end up resurfacing between us and I dont want to fall back into the same old routine and be back in the same sitch in 6 months. I know that she is thrilled with who I am becoming right now, but that isnt the only issue that we have. I can honestly say that she doesnt need to change as much as I do. We both need help in learning to communicate effectively, but she doesnt have the kind of personal issues that I do.
Talked to my brother about all of this and realized that it was just 3 weeks ago that I was feeling as if my world had crumbled down around me and here we are now. It really can change in no time at all. Hang in there DBers and keep fighting.
Good call Ben on asking for MC and really incredible to see how far you have come so quickly!
Have you looked into Retrouvaille or something similar?
Wow, Ben. Just caught up on your story. Looks like you've navigated these waters very well indeed. What a turn around!
Ben,
Remember easy as it does...slow and steady.
Congrats Ben! So happy for you... Remember your changes - don't revert back to old habits!
Congrats Ben 2010. I see some similarities in our situations. I just started posting, would love some insight if you have time to take a look. Thanks.
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...592#Post2474592
Wow ben2010! I just read your entire sitch! I must say you did very well with everything. I am currently in a dillemma myself. Stories like yours give me great hope and the strength to get throug another day!
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2488936#Post2488936