I apologize if this is the wrong board. I'm really looking for insight, or maybe just looking to get all my thoughts out to help me process my thoughts and begin to take action one way or another. I understand from reading the boards on and off for the past year and a half that most here are not the initiators of divorce and that I may get some negative feedback. I'm okay with that. I really just need help getting unstuck.
I have been married over 20 years. We have three children between the ages of 7 and 12. Two years ago I told my husband I wanted a divorce. He asked me to give us a chance to see if we could make it better. I told him I was done trying, felt as though I had tried enough and had nothing left to give. He said he understood and was willing to be the one to put in the effort to see if it would change my mind. In the few years leading up to this point, at different times, I told him how I felt, asked for counseling, etc. He belittled me, took me for granted, let me do the majority of work at home (cleaning, bills (including the $ for it), kids schedules/needs, shot down any attempt I had to improve our home. He didn't participate in any decision making other than to tell me what I was doing wrong.
So, since I told him I was done, he is constantly under foot. Doesn't ever say no to anything I want to do (as I pay for the majority of things anyway). And basically can't seem to do enough to please me (or what he thinks will please me). He can't make a decision without asking me. I told him to get a friend, a hobby, anything to give me space (GAL anyone?), and he hasn't. We tried marriage counseling and have both seen individual counselors. I still don't want to be married to him, but I can't seem to do anything about it. I'm afraid my love has died, and it isn't coming back. I tried sitting back and seeing how I felt with his changes. I tried faking it until I could make. Now, I just don't want to be around him, but it all seems so selfish.
I don't want to hurt him. I don't want to hurt my children. I don't know what the heck to do. I feel as though I'm frozen in a place no one would chose to be. If I could just choose one way or the other, everyone would be better off. I feel, for me, the answer is divorce. What stops me is how it might affect him and our children. Maybe everyone would be better off. Why can't I just make a decision and take action?
I'm sorry to ramble. How do I know what I should do? I'm just so tired of trying to figure it out and still not knowing.
I don't understand why he would want to be married to me when I have cleary stated that the only reason I have hesitated is because I'm concerned how divorce would affect our kids.
His changes have been consistant, but I keep coming back to the fact that the only time he listened to me was at the point that it would affect his life. Before I told him I was done, my needs didn't matter, my requests were not important. I feel that the only reason he is making any effort is because it's easier for him, not out of any consideration for me. When he does something, he always seems to be looking for thanks in some manner.
His presence is smothering me. I feel physically anxious when he is near me. He follows me around like a puppy. I give him no positive feedback to any flirtacious comments. I have asked for space, he doesn't seem to get it. How many times should I have to ask, when I know it's hurtful for him to hear - I don't want to hurt him. Is it less painful just to end it?
Don't we deserve better than this? Is this really what I want my kids to learn about adult relationships? Sure, there is no fighting, but there is definately a lack of connection, a lack of balance in this relationship, a lack of respect I guess.
Welcome to the board
First of all love is a choice.
SO I ask you when you said those marriage vows what did they mean?
Have you read DB or DR?
You realize this is a marriage saving site so I am assuming that you dont want to hurt your children permanently?
Divorce IMHO will do that, I guarantee that.
Your husband seems like he is in the begging and pleading stage, he sounds like he is willing to make changes to win you back?
My suggestion is to start learning what YOU need to change,
without getting divorced?
While still living within your marriage,
you can do it I am sure.
Keep posting and learning.
You are on moderation right now so stick to this thread until you get off of it.
Knowledge is Power.
You are in the right place. And yes you are the minority here as far as which spouse seeks help on the forums. I would suggest you get both DB/DR books. Read them cover to cover before making any decisions. No one can change your feelings for your H but you. If you have already read the books what about the Five Love Languages?
I would guess that you havent read them based on what you are saying. Divorce is a last resort when you have tried everything already. I wouldnt say that you have tried everything. Those feelings can and will return.
"What stops me is how it might affect him and our children. Maybe everyone would be better off"
That is absolutely not true and Im sure you dont realy believe that. It would most likely devastate the whole family. In time you would probably regret doing it too. People can and do change, this site is full of great examples of it. There are women on this site that Im sure have been in your shoes and have come out of it. Im sure that a couple of them will chime in soon enough to give you some advice.
Thank you Cadet and Ben2010 for responding. I posted a second message before your posts, but it hasn't shown up yet, so it might be confusing.
I have heard that love is a choice, but I guess I don't know how. Right now, all I know is that anytime I'm around him I physically respond in a negative way. I guess like a stress reaction? It feels almost suffocating, like his every move is based on me... I'm not sure really how to describe it. And I know I've built up walls to protect myself from what I believe is him time and again over the years showing me by his actions that I didn't matter...not sure I can or want to open myself up to him again.
Yes, I do realise this is a marriage saving site :-) Logically, it makes perfect sense to me that everyone would be better off with an intact family. Financially, logistically... But are there no exeptions to this? What if I'm not able to get to a place of at least comfort in my own home when H is around?
I have not read DB/DR books, I thought they were more for the LBS. I have often wished, based on what I've seen here, that H would do alot of the things people talk about (at least GAL, some interest other than me). It's very tiring to have someone so dependent on me constantly.
I have hoped that time would turn things around, that his changes would help me feel good about us staying together and not being a poor model of adult relationships for our children. I am not finding that so far.
Apathy (perfect name),
I just joined also, and I am the one considering divorce; my husband does not know that I am at this point. We had considered divorce about 14 years ago... the reasons I chose not to pursue it was because, I do love my husband, and our kids were still young. Now they are grown, and I'm back at square one with the whole thing. I don't want to end my marriage, but I don't want to be in this situation anymore, which is why I came here. To help me figure things out. I hope that we both are able to find the answers we need. I have not purchased the 5 Love Languages yet, but it has been recommended to me by several people, so it is next on my list. I wish you luck.
I apologize if this is the wrong board. I'm really looking for insight, or maybe just looking to get all my thoughts out to help me process my thoughts and begin to take action one way or another. I understand from reading the boards on and off for the past year and a half that most here are not the initiators of divorce and that I may get some negative feedback. I'm okay with that. I really just need help getting unstuck.
I have been married over 20 years. We have three children between the ages of 7 and 12. Two years ago I told my husband I wanted a divorce. He asked me to give us a chance to see if we could make it better. I told him I was done trying, felt as though I had tried enough and had nothing left to give. He said he understood and was willing to be the one to put in the effort to see if it would change my mind. In the few years leading up to this point, at different times, I told him how I felt, asked for counseling, etc. He belittled me, took me for granted, let me do the majority of work at home (cleaning, bills (including the $ for it), kids schedules/needs, shot down any attempt I had to improve our home. He didn't participate in any decision making other than to tell me what I was doing wrong.
So, since I told him I was done, he is constantly under foot. Doesn't ever say no to anything I want to do (as I pay for the majority of things anyway). And basically can't seem to do enough to please me (or what he thinks will please me). He can't make a decision without asking me. I told him to get a friend, a hobby, anything to give me space (GAL anyone?), and he hasn't. We tried marriage counseling and have both seen individual counselors. I still don't want to be married to him, but I can't seem to do anything about it. I'm afraid my love has died, and it isn't coming back. I tried sitting back and seeing how I felt with his changes. I tried faking it until I could make. Now, I just don't want to be around him, but it all seems so selfish.
I don't want to hurt him. I don't want to hurt my children. I don't know what the heck to do. I feel as though I'm frozen in a place no one would chose to be. If I could just choose one way or the other, everyone would be better off. I feel, for me, the answer is divorce. What stops me is how it might affect him and our children. Maybe everyone would be better off. Why can't I just make a decision and take action?
I'm sorry to ramble. How do I know what I should do? I'm just so tired of trying to figure it out and still not knowing.
Very interesting post and I can tell your dilemma is weighing on you.
Have you and your H ever been S(eparated)?
Has your H really changed? And if so, is it the change you hoped for? Do the 2 of you talk about these issues?
You pay for most things (you mentioned money a couple of times), what does that mean? Does he work? Seems there's some resentment about something there.
THere is an "I'm thinking about leaving thread" but it gets almost no traffic. You'll get more response here but remember, most people here are here because someone got off that fence you're still sitting on.
Yours is a good perspective to have here.
Apathy,
First of all, sorry to find you here. Secondly, perhaps you might want to change your screen name to a more positive one.
I remember we had a WAW to be here many years ago and she worked hard to change her perceptions. One of the several ways she did quite successfully was listening to the Keeping Love Alive (KLA) tapes offered through this site. You might want to look into those tapes for yourself.
Good luck with your journey!
Booklvr, thanks for the response. Sorry you're here, but it's a comfort to have someone is a similar situation - I wish you good luck in your journey as well. I will look up your posts.
labug, I almost burst into tears with just reading the first line of your response. Yes, it's been weighing on me for what feels like an eternity. I so just want to do the right thing for everyone. It feels though that there is a right for me, and a right for everyone else sometimes. And then that the right for everyone else can't be right either because of blah, blah, blah...I just talk myself in circles. We have never been seperated - we decided it was best to wait until we were sure about divorce to even bring it up to the children in order to not undermine their sense of security. I do second guess that decision sometimes. H has certainly changed in some ways but I guess it seems to me that it isn't geniune, that he expects something in return. It seems I have to tell him every step to take. I'm tired of being the director... I do have money issue resentments. He does work, just doesn't contribute equally - he doesn't make as much as I do, but also has no motivation to change that. He has had opportunities, just never took advantage of them. We see things differently, value different things I guess.
Wonka, I tried to think of a different name - all that came to me was "agony". No positives there.
Thank you for pointing me toward KLA tapes - I will take a look now.
So grateful for insights. Thank you.
hmm.. I wrote two other posts prior to my response to booklvr, labug and wonka. But they haven't shown up. Do they come up out of order sometimes while on moderation? Or maybe they've been lost?
We see things differently, value different things I guess.
Why did you marry him?
Why did you have children with him?
What has changed?
Why will things be better when you are divorced?
Why did you marry him?
I was young. I'm not sure it was anything more than it was the next logical step.
Why did you have children with him?
Because I wanted children. I don't mean to be flippant; I don't know that I put much thought into his role.
What has changed?
Pre-kids I did my thing, he did his, and when together we did ours. Due to work and school schedules, we had alot of apart time. Once kids came, I think the clash of our different priorities became apparent.
Why will things be better when you are divorced?
Because I will feel comfortable in my own home. Because I will be free to do what I want without H telling me why I can't, shouldn't, or what I don't know.
Thank you for these points.
Ap (I really can't bring myself to type out the real word),
I also think you have a valuable perspective to offer here and to get some feedback from the other side of the fence. I, too, was in your shoes and then my H up and walked out on me instead. For the longest time, I was really pissed off that he pulled the trigger first. Either way, once the barn door is open and the animals flee, there's no going back.
First of all, have you actually read Divorce Remedy? I love the 5LL, but I think you need some very targeted conversation on the topic of divorce. You sound like you're in such pain that you're willing to go to the lengths without truly knowing the consequences.
My now XH will be the first person to say (if he were here on this BB) that if he had known what the ramifications were, he'd have tried. He's not one to offer those kind of words, so know he meant them. And I'm a great XW. Any other person would have made him pay for his choices.
That being said...
I'm not sure you even know what you need to do to make yourself happy. I'd suggest holding off on fleeing the barn until you do. I think the folks here would say the same thing. Your H doesn't have the power to make you happy or unhappy: that's an inside job. From what I read, you sure do a lot of finger pointing. I'm going to go out on a limb and say I think there is some projection here.
As Bug mentioned, your money comments sound like a score card to me too. Can you elaborate on what your issues are? Try to focus on visualizing what things would look like IF YOU WERE HAPPY. What would you be doing/saying/thinking? I don't want to see one comment about what your H would be doing - this is all about you.
I'm also curious to hear more about what you discuss with your IC - not the nitty gritty, but the overall reason you've gone. Is it to justify yourself or to really and truly do the work?
Good luck!
Betsey
Why did you have children with him?
Because I wanted children. I don't mean to be flippant; I don't know that I put much thought into his role.
And what will be each of your roles after divorce?
Is this really going to be good for your children?
What has changed?
Pre-kids I did my thing, he did his, and when together we did ours. Due to work and school schedules, we had alot of apart time. Once kids came, I think the clash of our different priorities became apparent.
Why will things be better when you are divorced?
Because I will feel comfortable in my own home. Because I will be free to do what I want without H telling me why I can't, shouldn't, or what I don't know.
Love is a choice.
How is he stopping you from being comfortable?
Why will someone else make you more comfortable?
I agree with Underdog that you are responsible for your own happiness.
The relationship is not responsible for this.
Getting divorced is not going to make you HAPPY.
I also agree that you should work on those issues first before you get divorced.
Hope you keep posting and stop running away.
Underdog, I've been thinking alot about your post to me.
"Can you elaborate on what your issues are?" I think my issues are the little things that over time made me feel as if I didn't matter to H. My opinion didn't count. It used to be that at least when things got to the point where I was angry, at least then he would listen, but then even that stopped mattering to him. He stopped even marginally working as a team with me. "Try to focus on visualizing what things would look like IF YOU WERE HAPPY. What would you be doing/saying/thinking? I don't want to see one comment about what your H would be doing - this is all about you." I don't know that I'd be doing anything much differently. I'm happy with the majority of my life. I have a job I enjoy, hobbies, exercise...there is a marked difference in how I feel when he's there and how I feel when he's not.
"I'm also curious to hear more about what you discuss with your IC - not the nitty gritty, but the overall reason you've gone. Is it to justify yourself or to really and truly do the work?"
It's accurate to say it was to justify myself. I went to try to figure out what I truly wanted. I came to the decision that a divorce was best for everyone, he told me he was shocked, didn't see this coming, never stopped loving me. I didn't understand how we could have such different perspectives - I second guessed my take on things and have remained in turmoil since.
Cadet, our roles after divorce will be that of parents.
"Is this really going to be good for your children?" At least they will experience both a mother and father who can both make decisions and steer the courses of their lives.
"How is he stopping you from being comfortable?" I described it a little in previous posts. I physically react to his presence. He is (or my perception of him is)very expectant, I can't make a move without him commenting on it, asking if he can help, etc. I don't know if I can describe it any better that. When he does help, there is always a proclamation of what he has done, as though now I may thank him or take note of his acts.
"Why will someone else make you more comfortable?" I'm not asking anyone to make me more comfortable - if we do divorce, I can't see myself ever marrying again.
"Hope you keep posting and stop running away." What is it that you think I'm running away from?
Just journalling...
Over the weekend I had more hope than I have in a long time that we could stay together and be a happy family. On the surface I'm sure that's true. But by the end of the weekend, I was back to doubting that. How can we really be happy when I don't trust him with my vulnerabilities, I don't want/feel comfortable to share my emotions with him? I would still be alone, only with him. I can't continue to feel discounted.
More thoughts/journaling...
I think I'm resenting that it seems that I'm the one giving up when I feel that he disengaged a long time ago and only decided he wanted to put effort into this marriage when I let go of the rope, when I decided I couldn't keep banging my head against the wall. Could the projection be that he is now where I was before? Wanting something from someone who doesn't have it to give?
As I stand on this brink, the majority of the time I know I want a divorce, but why can't I just do it already?!
I feel so sure that it's best for everyone, then I get scared. What if it's not?
I don't enjoy H's company. We both deserve more than what we have. I don't want him to hurt. I wish he would have realized he cared while I still did.
I can't imagine the time away from my children while they are with him. And what does it do to them to have to shuffle from home to home? Is it better quality time with both of us separately? Could that be an improvement for them? I am much better with them alone...more relaxed, joyful...
My guess would be because you have to do more work on you.
And please don't get me wrong, that doesn't mean I think you should stay married. Everyone may in fact be better off if you're Dd. There are very good reasons not to stay married, abuse of any kind being one.
think I'm resenting that it seems that I'm the one giving up when I feel that he disengaged a long time ago and only decided he wanted to put effort into this marriage when I let go of the rope, when I decided I couldn't keep banging my head against the wall. Could the projection be that he is now where I was before? Wanting something from someone who doesn't have it to give?
Not many of us change until we have a powerful reason to change so I wouldn't hold that against him. We eat too much, we smoke, we drink, we drug, we sex until the something bad happens. We see the light.
You don't have to D him today. Sit tight, see what happens.
Sit tight, see what happens.
Feels like I've been sitting tight an awfully long time...
Thank you :-)
You may have more to learn.
Feels like I've been sitting tight an awfully long time...
But its only the last 2 weeks you have come here to work on you (and your M).
I would like to address a few other things too:
First, you mentioned not reading them yet. But run to B&N (or download) DB & DR. The very first chapter of DB will talk about how divorce is not the answer, it makes a rather compelling case (However, as mentioned above: Except for in cases if there is any type of abuse) of the complexities it will add to your relationship (and there would be MANY). Divorce is not a solution' it is a shortcut to avoid problems (and notice I said avoid, not solve). ***I even seem to recall you can read the first chapter here (or somewhere) for free.***
Second, you mentioned:
I feel so sure that it's best for everyone
I can tell you with 100% certainty, for "everyone" (the players involved: you, him, your kids, extended families, friends, neighbors, the cat & dog, ministers, daycare, nannies, employers, accountants) it is NOT the best. Well except for attorneys... its actually really good for them
Third, you mentioned having attended counseling. Do you feel that was more of therapy? How did you feel about going? How do you think he felt about going? Did you feel like you got anything out of it? If so, why did you stop going? What keeps you from going back?
I'm sure you're right; I have more to learn. It just seems that all my thoughts go in circles. Hopefully I can learn to get unstuck soon :-) - I may go crazy otherwise.
I did read what I think is the first chapter of DR today. I thought DB wouldn't be helpful for me?
I guess I don't know the difference between counseling and therapy... I went to an individual counselor (as did H) and we both went to MC. As for MC, I didn't want to go, he did. I don't feel that I got anything out of it. It felt very negative to me and just served to remind me how things went wrong and why I feel they way I do.
Thank you :-)
I thought DB wouldn't be helpful for me?
It can't hurt... DR "spoke" to me more then DB, but I am still glad I read both.
I guess I don't know the difference between counseling and therapy... I went to an individual counselor (as did H) and we both went to MC. As for MC, I didn't want to go, he did. I don't feel that I got anything out of it. It felt very negative to me and just served to remind me how things went wrong and why I feel they way I do.
Both DR & DB address the styles of MC. One keyword to hammer home is Solutions Based Therapy (or somethimes referred to as Solution Focused Brief Therapy), it is NOT long term psychoanalysis (you know, blaming everything on how your were raised, what you experienced in life).
I had very good experiences with SBT, and was very comfortable with where I was after a a couple of visits.
I'll start with DR. Now, if only H would start with DB...
I like the sounds of SBT - I'll check that out.
Thanks!
I'll start with DR. Now, if only H would start with DB...
I kind of felt that this was tongue in cheek... but if it wasn't:
Do not give/show/leave out DR or DB for your H. Right now this is a tool for only YOU to help get your M back on track.
I like the sounds of SBT - I'll check that out.
Excellent!
It was tongue in cheek. :-) I'm having it shipped to my work address.
It was tongue in cheek. :-) I'm having it shipped to my work address.
Good
BTW, I want to commend you.... you seem to be the one recognizing there is repair and healing that needs to be done. You seemed ready to cut the ties and take the D route out (what we would refer to as a "walk away spouse"). In my short experience here, it seems the opposite of the typical DB'er. Please keep an open mind during this process, and keep your heart open to what the future may (or may not) bring.
At worst, you will make yourself into a better stronger person. At best you will find renewed love and save your marriage.
I want to commend you.... you seem to be the one recognizing there is repair and healing that needs to be done.
Thank you, but H has done alot of work on himself in the past two years while I've pretty much been sitting in judgement.
Please keep an open mind during this process, and keep your heart open to what the future may (or may not) bring.
I'm trying :-)
At worst, you will make yourself into a better stronger person. At best you will find renewed love and save your marriage.
Either of which (or both) would be an improvement from where I am now. Something's gotta change!
DR should be here in a few days and I'm planning on researching SBT today.
Thank you for taking the time to help!
Woundedfool, pardon the hijack apathy, are you describing your experience with different kinds of therapy?
Woundedfool, pardon the hijack apathy, are you describing your experience with different kinds of therapy?
Sort of... I only had direct experience with SBT.
A close family member had an experience with a traditional psychoanalyst (how did you mother treat you, did you feel loved, etc.), a 4 year journey that he felt was a colossal waste of time and money (and after learning about SBT, I tend to agree).
Sorry to see you on here apathy, but you will get good advice from DBers.
I'm also sorry to say that yes, some of us idiots only really wake up to reality at the 11th hour or when it's too late. I can hear my wife saying some of the things you recount.
I went to transactional analysis counselling around 20 years ago now. I was depressed and thought it would speed up the process. I learnt a few things about myself, but after a while I felt it was just some big talking shop.
My wife and I also went to marriage counselling briefly, but again it was just more talking. I didn't get how any of this was going to change anything.
I have learnt so much more in the past month since Bday by reading BD, (half of) DR, psycology today website and my new counsellor who is SFBT/SBT.
And now I want to change and I believe I can do it and I want it, I need it for myself. I hope my wife will see it and reconsider, but in the words of the vets here, I have no expectations.
Sorry, that was a bit more tha I planned to say. Let me just say, read the books and forums because in the long run, you'll learn from it I'm sure.
I'm also sorry to say that yes, some of us idiots only really wake up to reality at the 11th hour or when it's too late. I can hear my wife saying some of the things you recount.
Thanks odsnt. I guess I just don't understand how someone can love someone and
not hear them for so long? I was so sure when I told my H that I wanted a divorce that he would be relieved, because I was convinced he just didn't care anymore. I'm having a hard time believing that it's love and not just convenience of some sort.
I agree with the sentiments on traditional counseling - how the heck is dredging up all the bad stuff over and over going to help? There are alot of SFBT counselors near me, now to figure out how to choose a good one. :-)
Thanks for your thoughts!
There are alot of SFBT counselors near me, now to figure out how to choose a good one. :-)
Thanks for your thoughts!
Word of mouth us best. And you can always switch if you're not comfortable.
[quote=apathy] There are alot of SFBT counselors near me, now to figure out how to choose a good one. :-)
Also, I hear good things about the DB coaches here.
(I did not use one, and it is the only real regret I have in my journey).
Woundedfool, pardon the hijack apathy, are you describing your experience with different kinds of therapy?
Sort of... I only had direct experience with SBT.
A close family member had an experience with a traditional psychoanalyst (how did you mother treat you, did you feel loved, etc.), a 4 year journey that he felt was a colossal waste of time and money (and after learning about SBT, I tend to agree).
There are different therapies for different people/issues and some times a combination of therapies.
I think it's a jump to brand a whole model based on the unfortunate experience of a relative. And as in all areas of healthcare, there are skilled and not-so-skilled providers of every ilk.
I didn't want to dredge up the past for most of my life and I only got more and more unhappy. Sometimes we have to face our demons. There are SBT practices that have helped me. I've also had great success with yoga and meditation and exercise is also an adjunct.
I don't think there's an argument that whether we were loved or how we were treated as young children doesn't affect us. But, it does affect each of us in a different way and to a different extent.
I'm happy the therapy you were able to choose for you worked well. That's always a good circumstance.
(of course, insurance companies would love it if everything could be solved with SBT)
Thanks or the space, Apathy.
Thanks or the space, Apathy.
Anytime, it was helpful for me as well. :-)
I guess I just don't understand how someone can love someone and not hear them for so long?
This is sadly very, very common. Typically we don't hear because we are using different languages. If you have read either "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus", or "The Five Love Languages", you'll get this immediately.
My W has told me how she tried to tell me she was unhappy, and looking back now, and having read the books, and knowing now that she was trying to get my attention, I see it. At the time though, I had no idea, because what she said was not what I heard. And so the resentment built and built.
In fact, that is probably common with all LBS here, especially the men - we wish you had just shouted plain English words in our faces, instead of trying subtle hints. Men really are simple.
And though I hope never to make the same mistake again, my W is probably thinking like you - How could he not have known? and it may be too late for her to ever let it go.
If you have read either "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus", or "The Five Love Languages", you'll get this immediately.
H and I both read Men are from Mars (I identified more with the male oddly enough)... and H read 5LL. According to what we discussed from his understanding of 5LL, I spoke his LL due to him discussing with me (years ago) my lack thereof and he chose not to put effort into speaking mine, even though it had been discussed (requested, yelled, etc.) a number of times. He blames his upbringing and my independance.
... - we wish you had just shouted plain English words in our faces, instead of trying subtle hints. Men really are simple.
Unfortunately I did, I'm a pretty straight shooter. A few years prior I had told him we were heading for divorce. It was the one and only time I had said those words prior, so I don't think he saw it as an empty threat. Which I think is what makes it so hard for me to believe that he even cared. I think I don't trust that it's genuine. The whole, "fool me once shame on you, fool me twice..." thing, you know?
and it may be too late for her to ever let it go.
Same here, but I hope not for you. :-) thank you for taking the time to reach out, it's helpful to understand that others go through similar times and see the opposite perspective on things.
Just re-read my last post...Maybe I do have an issue with finger pointing. Oiy.
Just re-read my last post...Maybe I do have an issue with finger pointing. Oiy.
Happens to us all. Sometimes it only takes a minute. Sometimes when you read last week's post, you can't believe you wrote it.
he chose not to put effort into speaking mine, even though it had been discussed (requested, yelled, etc.) a number of times.
So you read Venus/Mars... and do you remember what it said about repeatedly discussing/requesting/yelling ...nag, nag, nag, complete shutdown...
Apathy, (and you must change your name), this is
all good. You
will learn here, if you stick to it. And we can probably help you understand what your H may be thinking. And that knowledge will help you decide how you want to deal with your situation, hopefully to improve the chances of getting the outcome you want.
Thanks Zew :-)
Of course I don't see it as nagging, but I imagine the nagger never does...
If I change my name how will people know who I am?
I do want to learn. So I guess my lesson right now is this is about me? And not what I perceive H has done? I need to set that all aside and figure out me? I really just want peace...
Thanks!
Thanks Zew :-)
Of course I don't see it as nagging, but I imagine the nagger never does...
If I change my name how will people know who I am?
I do want to learn. So I guess my lesson right now is this is about me? And not what I perceive H has done? I need to set that all aside and figure out me? I really just want peace...
Thanks!
If you change your name people can still figure it out as you keep all the same threads.
Go up to my stuff - edit profile, I changed my name once, if you go back far enough you can figure it out.
In my case it was a mistake, I should not have changed my name. But that is a whole other story.
To answer all your other questions
YES, YES, and YES!
:-). Ok. I have changed my name, pending admin. Approval, to Shanti.
I searched synonyms for peace, as that is what I'm seeking, and found "Shanti, Santhi or Shanthi (from Sanskrit शान्तिः śāntiḥ; √ शम śam: ‘be calm’) means peace, rest, calmness, tranquility, or bliss." I was thinking Lily, but that came up as the flower of death! Shanti seems to be more positive. :-)
Now, here's to finding it!
Thank you!
I guess I just don't understand how someone can love someone and not hear them for so long?
This is sadly very, very common. Typically we don't hear because we are using different languages. If you have read either "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus", or "The Five Love Languages", you'll get this immediately.
My W has told me how she tried to tell me she was unhappy, and looking back now, and having read the books, and knowing now that she was trying to get my attention, I see it. At the time though, I had no idea, because what she said was not what I heard. And so the resentment built and built.
In fact, that is probably common with all LBS here, especially the men - we wish you had just shouted plain English words in our faces, instead of trying subtle hints. Men really are simple.
And though I hope never to make the same mistake again, my W is probably thinking like you - How could he not have known? and it may be too late for her to ever let it go.
Great insight, zew. We
expect everyone to think and communicate just like we do. When we can let go of that expectation and give some space, both people benefit.
Thanks, la. I don't think I'm getting any stupider over time. Unfortunately, my W and her posse keep building bigger conspiracy theories by the day, to the point where I am losing both hope and interest.
I haven't read your thread, but sometimes it is too late. Be thatt as it may, the things you've learned about yourself can't be taken away in a D settlement.
You can give them away.
I hope you won't.
Never underestimate the human capacity for change. Look at you.
My W warned me 'one day this won't be enough'. I went to IC, we went to MC but it was all just talk to me. I knew I had issues but just talking about them didn't solve anything, I still hadn't a clue how to do anything about them.
Now, after finding out about SBT and DB I know. And now is the time when she presented me with a tangible list and has said it's too late.
We'll have to see about that last bit though because I'm not giving up easily. But it just shows how differently we think.
odsnt,
My W warned me 'one day this won't be enough'. I went to IC, we went to MC but it was all just talk to me. I knew I had issues but just talking about them didn't solve anything, I still hadn't a clue how to do anything about them.
At least you made an effort; you heard that something needed to be changed, and you attempted that. That has to count for something...
I received my DR book yesterday and have started reading it. Just getting started though, so we'll see how that goes. I'm waiting on SBT until I can get through DR a bit to see if I can have a goal in mind, I'm tired of wasting time spinning my wheels.
We had another pretty good weekend. Maybe the name change has helped already.
after finding out about SBT and DB I know
...
I'm not giving up easily
I have to imagine there is a reason she gave you a tangible list at this point, right? I'm thinking there is still something there, otherwise what's the point? I wish you success in turning your situation around.
Zew, concentrate on growing and making yourself the person only a crazy person would divorce. Remember: Don't believe anything she says (and the posse) and only half of what you see.
Shanti,
To get the most out of the DBing process, I'd highly recommend that you visit other threads and post there. I learn a lot by visiting various threads and gain a whole lot of perspectives here.
Perhaps I am wrong...but I don't see you posting in other people's threads. Just staying in your own thread isn't doing you a great service at all. I'd urge you to branch out a bit and take a look around.
Pick several that resonates with you and post there. You'd be amazed at the type of exchanges here when you do that.
Glad to see that you're trying really hard to see your M in a different light.
Did you know that there's a former WAW who is active here. Her name is Sandi and if my memory serves me right...she had OM for 2 years before she dumped him and went back to her H. Sandi is providing great advice around here.
Thanks Wonka,
I have read a lot of other posts, but haven't felt comfortable contributing much since my perspective has been a bit different than most here. But I'll try to be braver.
I'll look Sandi up, too.
Just getting caught up with your posts. Thank you for sharing and really giving us LBS some valuable cracks across the heads with a 2x4...i for one really need to hear your voice here.
So sorry your M has made you come to this point.
Shanti you are my WAW's doppleganger. The money issue was more sore though cause I just was inconsistent over the years providing for her, she ended up in a MLC and we separated 17 days ago (yep..i love her and am keeping track) you can find my story thread here:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...111#Post2453111As for why he didnt hear, THIS video will explain everything the WAW syndrome video from the divorcebuster herself Michelle
http://youtu.be/eyty0xb7IMMWomen communicate with WORDS
Men with ACTION
soon as you speak our language "I am divorcing, leaving you" we finally listen. Does it seem fake to you ? sure it does.
We have been feeding our hurting WAW ground beef for decades and when we bring out a grade A top sirloin you wouldn't know what to do with it! WE don't even know if we have bbqed it properly. My wife has said the exact same things:
"When you touch me you just make my skin crawl"
"I hate coming home to you" she was deppressed this whole year and through IC realized it was "because" of me
"When do I get to do something right for me (divorce)? Why do I have to suffer in this marriage so everyone else can be happy"
"I am so done...this is too little too late"That frantic needy H of yours is at a crisis point where if he plays his cards right YOU will have the husband you have always dreamed of, longed for...but he needs to snap out of his suffocating behaviours that are pushing you off the cliff, where he is expecting you to change direction in freefall!
So far we have only heard your side of the story...and not alot of things about what you need to change to fix this sinking boat. SO what are your shortcomings that have hurt him and made your H not feel like he was valued...cause maybe this may have encouraged him to listen more
If you read my story the non confrontating, no fighting communication thing played heavy into our "years of her telling me she was unhappy". Turns out she is a lousy communicator and I am a lousy listener...thank you broken family systems.
She also says she doesn't trust me anymore with all my flowery words and promises so now....there has not been any words except what I believe God has been saying to me "win her back quietly"
Proving to myself I can change and then letting that benefit my world: work, church, family, kids and my W too...she will not be able to deny this. I win even if she doesnt come back and I LIKE the new me!
Will this win her back? I am building a castle with my bare hands for her to live in so that is the intention. If not? I have already had another interested beauty remark on my newfound confidence and changes...and my W would be a fool not to keep these hard earned changes.
It does sound like you do have a happy weekend with your H but you need him to do the
"right things, not just the nice things".
Be patient, he will get the picture that his begging, pleading, placating you isn't working and hopefully start changing tactics.
The gift of DR/DB and this community is that I have learned these two great truths:
Divorce doesn't make you happy
Marriage doesn't make you happy
YOU make you happy.I hope you found my 2cents helpful and your H has an amazing woman in you...hope he can realize that so you get the love you deserve from him and the marriage you have always dreamed of.
Shanti it is great to have perspective here, it doesn't matter if you are the WAW or the LBS. we are all here to help eachother, knowledge is key and we can help eachother see things from the other point of view.
dam rayzzzzzzzzzz are we married to the same wife..lol you forgot to add "everything you are doing now is an act to get me back". and "why did you have to wait until now to become super husband".
oad, I am sure our W are partying together...but yes Shanti you do us a huge service by showing just how much crap our own W may be going through and maybe this will help us all move towards saving our M
Thanks Rayzzz and oad. It is scary how similar WAW/LBS situations seem to be.
I can see every comment you both made from your wives' perspectives being said (or thought) by me.
So far we have only heard your side of the story...and not alot of things about what you need to change to fix this sinking boat. SO what are your shortcomings that have hurt him and made your H not feel like he was valued...cause maybe this may have encouraged him to listen more
I think before I try to figure out my shortcomings that may have hurt him and made him feel not valued I need to figure out my shortcomings that held me back from being happy without figuring him into the equation. I don't know that I have the energy (or motivation) to work on R right now. I need to figure out me first, without walking away or doing anything destructive to our R. And see how that fits. I think I have let his needs/wants be foremost for so long that I need to work on getting my needs/wants in a kind way, if that makes sense? And not trying to anticipate his feelings if I do this or that. Just do what I want.
Oddly enough he says he felt insecure because of my independence, but I think I lost alot of my independence over the years in trying to please him (or at least have as peaceful a home as I could manage). I'm tired of putting my wants to the side out of deference to him. It felt as if I gave, gave, gave, but never was given any, you know? If we can survive in an environment where I matter too, maybe we can do this. That's how I feel today anyway.
I need to figure out me first, without walking away or doing anything destructive to our R. And see how that fits. I think I have let his needs/wants be foremost for so long that I need to work on getting my needs/wants in a kind way, if that makes sense? And not trying to anticipate his feelings if I do this or that. Just do what I want.
Yes Shanti makes perfect sense. My WAW always said "why do i have to be the martyr? When do I get to be happy and do something for myself?" ugh. IMHO if I had known she was always taking the bullet and sacrificing herself I would've made sure I changed everything cause of course she doesn't have to be a doormat. Learning this after the fact kills me I love her so....wish I had elephant ears to have heard this!
The fact you are working on this without walking away....you are yards ahead of me and my stonewalled WAW in our separation.
I'm tired of putting my wants to the side out of deference to him. It felt as if I gave, gave, gave, but never was given any, you know? If we can survive in an environment where I matter too, maybe we can do this. That's how I feel today anyway.
Yes your husband was certainly selfish and has taken advantage of you for years ....but if he's like the rest of us blockhead LBS..he wants to 180 that away...but IDK him... Again a huge huge regret for me after the fact. It has to be a partnership where you and H feel valued of course. In the end just like DB..it is saving ourselves which will ultimately give us any chance to save our M.
One bit of advice you may find helpful is what has been a plumbline that my therapist told me:
> You are each on your own journey, and your relationship is , in a
> sense, on its own journey as well. It will only be healthy if the both
> of you maximize your personal wellness health, that is the foundation.
> From there, you both make decisions about what the future will be.
> Without that health, there is no decision to make.
Keep working on being healthy,finding the real you..I will do the same and we'll see where the M goes =D From my LBS perspective you are approaching this from a good place...excited to see what kind of fruit you bear in your transformation. hang in there
My WAW always said "why do i have to be the martyr? When do I get to be happy and do something for myself?" ugh. IMHO if I had known she was always taking the bullet and sacrificing herself I would've made sure I changed everything cause of course she doesn't have to be a doormat. Learning this after the fact kills me I love her so....wish I had elephant ears to have heard this!
rayzzz, Your W and I could be twins. I'm sure she wasn't "always taking the bullet", but it sure does feel like it sometimes...
The fact you are working on this without walking away....you are yards ahead of me and my stonewalled WAW in our separation.
I don't know about that, feels like I'm frozen in place.
....but if he's like the rest of us blockhead LBS..he wants to 180 that away...but IDK him...
He does. I just don't know that I have it in me to do this again. I don't even want to share trivial things with him, let alone things of more importance. I just don't trust him with my feelings. In the abstract it's all good, but in reality it just isn't working (yet? IDK...).
One bit of advice you may find helpful is what has been a plumbline that my therapist told me:
> You are each on your own journey, and your relationship is , in a
> sense, on its own journey as well. It will only be healthy if the both
> of you maximize your personal wellness health, that is the foundation.
> From there, you both make decisions about what the future will be.
> Without that health, there is no decision to make.
Keep working on being healthy,finding the real you..I will do the same and we'll see where the M goes =D From my LBS perspective you are approaching this from a good place...excited to see what kind of fruit you bear in your transformation. hang in there
That is very helpful, thank you. Feeling a little frustrated today and that was good for me to read. I read your thread and am sorry you're having a difficult time with separation from your children (and they with you). That is the part that always gets me. I wish we could make their lives perfect and painfree...
Since getting DR I have been super busy and am just now starting chapter two. Anxious to get into the meat of it. :-)
It's been a bit since I've written. In that time we've had a vacation and too much time together. I was having glimmers of hope but it's more apparent that I really don't want to be married to him. But I really fear for my children's well being if we divorce, and dealing with their absence during shared custody freaks me out. I just don't trust him with my vulnerabilities. How do I do this and make everyone ok?
Ugh. Feeling very negative right now...
Haven't made much progress in reading DR. Should probably get back to that. Is there a chapter on stopping the mind from circling? ;-)
Just journaling,
Came back to see where I'd been last time I was here. I'm disappointed to be in the same damn spot.
I have no reason to want to leave. No dire circumstances making me want to leave. No OM, or other situation calling my name.
Still struggle with what is better for my children: this is not the marriage I would want for them. I don't want to be anywhere near him. I don't want him home when he's there, I don't want him going anywhere with me...But, what does divorce show them about commitment, about 'family above all else', unconditional love, conflict resolution, all kinds of things, ugh.
I don't want anyone hurt. I think we all are, at least on some level. But who's to say a change would make anything better; maybe it'll make things worse for them. IC said he thinks I'd be ok with aliens taking H, I think so too...how horrible.
I also seem to think the worst of M in the Spring, weird. I wonder about that.
Anyway, feeling more apathetic than Shanti-like lately.
Peace.
I had a dream last night that my husband died. It was horrible. What is wrong with me? Why can't I just love him and get on with it?! There's a song about someone not being able to make someone love them if they don't... Why not, if love is choice, am I choosing not to love him? I would rather love him and remain a family. Why can't I stand to be around him?
~Shanti
Hi Shanti,
Instead of working on yourself, to see how you can enjoy life with what you have, you want to run.
Dispose and start fresh. This is all external oriented. The consequences of a throw away society. Get rid of the situation is far easier than looking inward to see what hidden issues may lie dormant.
DB essentially is about working on yourself (GAL). Letting go of the external things you cannot control (DETACH), and realizing that you are responsible for your happiness, not the situation (STOP FOCUSSING ON THE EXTERNAL).
My advice to you is to Detach and GAL. Start looking inward to see what is the cause of your dissatisfaction.
What do you want? What activities do you want to make time for? Job? Career? Start the bucket list and start here. Let him do the housework while you go out and do your GAL. You don't need his support or permission.
Here's a possible conclusion. If you have worked on your life and feeling great, the confusion of what you need to do next will be far clearer.
Shanti,
I read this awhile back and so far it has helped me, I saw a lot of myself in this article and also in your thread. I don’t know if I’ve fully forgiven my S yet but I am trying and believe I can. Has your H changed? Are they the changes you wanted? What have you done to make yourself happy? As I’m sure your aware that’s not H job.
http://www.divorcebusting.com/a_forgiveness_gift_yourself.htmMake no mistakes, D is not the best option for your kids.
[
...and realizing that you are responsible for your happiness, not the situation (STOP FOCUSSING ON THE EXTERNAL).
My advice to you is to Detach and GAL. Start looking inward to see what is the cause of your dissatisfaction.
What do you want? What activities do you want to make time for? Job? Career? Start the bucket list and start here. Let him do the housework while you go out and do your GAL. You don't need his support or permission.
Thank you for taking the time to read and respond.
Believe me, I'd like to detach and GAL. I do have activities that I enjoy, but H seems to assume he can jump in and join, or hover while I do them. This just takes the pleasure from them. I don't want to keep hurting him by telling him I don't want his presence. I have told him he needed to get his own interests, but he seems to have forgotten this (which is history repeating itself).
How many times does a subject need to be raised before it's fair to say...what, I don't even know. History of H doing what he thinks best, even when I tell him what I need. Then I get blamed for not telling him there was a problem! Oh boy, sorry.
Obviously I need to tell him to give me time/space to do my own thing (once again). I am feeling very smothered.
Plain conversation, bucket list, get to work. Thanks!
~Shanti
don't you think having a common hobby/pursuit would lead to some type of bonding? maybe something that neither one of you knows anything about and learn together and make it fun. i guess the question is do you really want to have a good marriage with your H? MWD says that sometimes feelings follow actions. act as if you love him/want to be around him. just an idea. good luck
I think that your words are just words. You need to start turning them into action.
The longer you prevent yourself from GAL, the worse you feel about your H, and the farther you get.
Unless he is physically restraining you? Does he suspect an A?
Shanti
Just read your sitch ... a short one but one that covers some time as far as the calendar.
I have learned so much here, alot of us have.... but those lessons were not ones we wanted to learn, was more like we were forced to out of survival. Looks like you are and have been stuck, fearful to move in either direction, why>? ... in a word FEAR. Your mind cycles, you are fixated on your unhappiness, that resentment is building and in your case directed at your H. Thats what I get from your sitch.
You can try to GAL, but H tags along, involves himself ... does not seem like anything he is doing is setting you off, just his mere breathing, his existence in your life ... why?> Because the little things have added up and you have started to resent him.
This is where you are now, this is not where you need to live, this is not how you need to be, this is not who you want to be is it? One of the lessons DB/DR teaches ... you control you, you can not stop your H from breathing, nor anything he does .. you CAN change how it effects you. There is a secret .... no one can make YOU happy but YOU.
Start thinking positive, do small things that make you feel good about you. Take charge of your life and your thoughts, own it. focus on that. I think you see D as the out .... sure .. it may be easier just to sign docs and part ... that still will not make YOU happy, you might feel less pressure for a bit .. then the new neighbors will irritate you, your H having the kids enjoying things will bother you. The D is a fantasy you have allowed to think about because its an escape ... requires no work to daydream about that life.
Work on YOU, I think your unhappiness is more to do with YOU than it has to do with your M, and I think once you start making these changes, putting in the work you would be surprised at how much happier you can be regardless of your H.
Has your H changed? Are they the changes you wanted? What have you done to make yourself happy? As I’m sure your aware that’s not H job.
Thanks JayTx, I have printed the article and will try to forgive. I certainly can/do hold a grudge (or several)! H has changed, in some ways what I wanted, in others not. He definitely pitches in more, but has not GAL, I'm a strong introvert and really need some space. I feel like the activities director, you know? Nothing gets done w/o my stamp of approval. I want a partner, not another child. As for making me happy, I try to do what I want, when I want. For a long time I tried to do what he seemed to want (or tried to not anger him, is more accurate, I guess).
Bravo61, thanks for responding. I do think that eventually that should happen. Right now, I need some breathing room. I did try to live "as if" and the feelings never followed, I got tired of the falseness and frankly didn't have the heart to continue it.
TenBook, your post made me angry, which must mean it strikes close to home. :-) I do tend to think, think, think about all the things I'd like to do. I need an action plan. And I think some more clearly defined boundaries. It seems hurtful to me to keep saying "stay away", but I guess D w/o trying it (one more time - which is what gets me - how many 'one more times' do I have to give it?!) is certainly more hurtful than that. No, he isn't physically restraining me, and as far as I know doesn't suspect A.
CaliGuy, yep, right on target; your whole post, his existence in my life, mere breathing...
"This is where you are now, this is not where you need to live, this is not how you need to be, this is not who you want to be is it?" No, I so want to be believe it's possible to get out of this spot! Right now I can't imagine wanting H around, I want to, I just can't see it.
Thanks all for responding - I really appreciate your thoughts!
~Shanti
I'm glad about the angry.
Thinking can perpetuate itself into more thinking. It can escalate. Transform your thoughts into ACTION.
Share with us a timetable on what you intend to do for GAL. It can be just one thing. We want to support you and you will find it here.
Putting my money where my mouth is. It's been awhile, but it's what I need. Ok. So I figure the first step is setting clear boundaries, right?
Formal conversation hasn't worked in the past, so I guess just stating I'm going to...and if he acts as though he's joining in, tell him no. And when he gets all mopey about that, ignore that.
So Saturday I will do one activity of my choosing, by myself, and feel no guilt. Yes?
Thanks for the push!
~Shanti
Shanti, as supportive and as tender as I can sound over an Internet posting...
What is the activity you are choosing.
When are you going to inform him.
What "script" do you have in mind when you inform him of your going out.
How are you going to reinforce your positive mental state going through this one outting?
TenBook - I didn't mean to imply I need tender, I don't, I need the push.
I hadn't planned a specific outing. I figured I would just maybe take a bike ride, or walk, take a drive... just take a couple hours for mental space; even these small things I can't seem to do without H assuming I want him along. So, I figured a small activity, state I want to go alone and stay positive by knowing I set the boundary and can do it.
Not specific enough?
~Shanti
I wish he would have realized he cared while I still did.
Hi Shanti, I've been following your thread and this post has really bothered me. Would you mind discussing it?
This sentence infers that you loved your husband very much at one time.
And, during this period of time...when you loved your husband...did you feel rejected?
Did I interpret this sentence correctly?
If so, was this an extremely vulnerable time for you?
And was it during this time that you made a decision to shut off your feelings for your husband?
Or...am I reading too much into this sentence?
Hi Hope414,
It's interesting - I never thought I decided to shut off my feelings for my husband, it seemed to happen little by little, as he belittled me, or chose others over me, disregarded my feelings, you know? It's hard not to get the message that I didn't matter... So eventually I guess I did decide that I didn't need/want him. And yes, I guess I was extremely vulnerable. I think my biggest stumbling block is that I know to have a connection I need to be vulnerable and I just can't with him. I don't know if I'll ever be able to let him see my vulnerabilities.
Thanks for reaching out.
~Shanti
Shanti
“I need to be vulnerable and I just can't with him. I don't know if I'll ever be able to let him see my vulnerabilities.”
I am going to go out on a limb here, I would guess after 20+ years being married to you, and if I am doing the math right, 3 years post BD your H has a pretty good idea of your vulnerabilities( what can physically or emotionally hurt you) if that's what you meant. I get it, you've put up a wall, drawn a line in the sand so H can’t hurt you, so unless you let H past you will never know if he has learned/changed, done work on himself, too not repeat the past….
That is totally up to you, if you don’t D is most likely in the future. If you do, and H truly has changed you just might get an amazing M.
“I would rather love him and remain a family.”
Love is a choice.. You would need to choose to Love him again.
"Why can't I stand to be around him?”
IMHO, because of past hurts, grudges, resentment, looking back instead of forward.
Hi Hope414,
It's interesting - I never thought I decided to shut off my feelings for my husband, it seemed to happen little by little, as he belittled me, or chose others over me, disregarded my feelings, you know? It's hard not to get the message that I didn't matter... So eventually I guess I did decide that I didn't need/want him. And yes, I guess I was extremely vulnerable. I think my biggest stumbling block is that I know to have a connection I need to be vulnerable and I just can't with him. I don't know if I'll ever be able to let him see my vulnerabilities.
You're still here and you're still in your marriage. You've given your spouse the gift of time.
And you've given yourself the gift of time.
I'm sorry you felt belittled and disregarded by your spouse. It is difficult when people we love forget our hearts are fragile.
We can't speak to your husband's feelings (mind-reading) but you have indicated he is still living with you. And you have indicated he loves you and wants a relationship with you.
This is good.
So can we begin with a goal for you?
Could your goal be: When time has passed you want your marriage to be strong and your family intact?
If you like this goal...How can we help you do this?
If this goal is too large for you...what would be a more manageable goal right now?
Hang in there! Don't walk out!!
"I need to be vulnerable and I just can't with him. I don't know if I'll ever be able to let him see my vulnerabilities. frown"
Actually you can. You just choose not to show him your vulnerabilities. He is afraid of you walking out on him the same way the rest of the LBS's on here are. We all make mistakes. The LBS and WAS alike. While you say he treated you negatively in the past, i can probably assume that you weren't 100% perfect yourself.
He's afraid to lose you which is why he's "hovering". All LBS's are guilty of that. And like all WAS's, this turns you off. So the two of you need to come to some kind of compromise if you want to stay M'd. Do a search for project happily ever after. The author was also a WAS who actually imagined her H dead. But then managed to turn things around.
Thanks everyone.
Hope414, While I think that's a good goal overall, I think it's too much for right now. I can't see how to bridge what seems like an impossible distance between where I am now to having a strong marriage. I'm not sure it's realistic for me right now. I don't know if I want to spend the rest of my life with H. And that feels awful to say...I think I need something smaller. :-)
I checked out the happily ever after project. We are off for a family vacation soon, so maybe when we get back I can get that and glean some wisdom from there as well. Is this something I can read in the open? Or do you suggest not (like db)?
I appreciate your thoughts! I need to get unstuck...
Shanti,
I applaud your honesty.
You should be setting goals that you see as obtainable. If you set goals that you don't honestly believe in...well...they aren't really goals are they?
I definitely recommend you read the DB & DR books. I also recommend you speak to a DB counselor. You don't have to commit to sessions but it might help you in move toward a course of action.
The family vacation sounds nice. Can you set one goal for the vacation?
I have read DB and DR. I'm not sure I have the money for a session with a coach...
And I'm having trouble thinking of a goal for vacation...my plan was simply to relax. And I need to be able to let myself do that, I have a hard time with doing what I want without worrying about other people. I don't mean that I want to do something major, I don't even know how to explain it. I think I'm just full of resentments that I need to let go, roll with the punches more. I don't know.
Thanks for the suggestions!
~Shanti
So... What did you do on your GAL committment this weekend?
Unfortunately, I ran out of time. I was forgetting about Easter, so I had lots to do for that and preparing for vacation...I was going to play it by ear and when the opportunity arose, to take a couple of hours to myself. There was no time. Fail.
~Shanti
Just an update.
Vacation was nice. A lot of together time, which usually doesn't end well, but this time was okay. I was able to relax and that was my goal.
I think the difference is that I am beginning to be able to assert myself and do things I want without feeling bad about it. H still has the tendency to hover and not want me out of his sight for too long, which drives me crazy, but I'm trying to not stress about it and realize it's his issue (it annoys me though, just trying not to let it stress me).
Life is busy right now, but will try to figure a GAL goal for this weekend.
~Shanti
I belong to one, and use it regularly while kids are doing their activities...
I'm fairly busy, so I think I need some quiet time to myself where I can go slow and breathe, and be with just me. The problem is I like my home, my yard, but can't seem to be alone there. Need to find something similar somewhere else, I guess.
Thank you for continuing to listen.
~Shanti
Tell your husband to leave the house and don't come back for 5 hours.