While Your Spouse Decides - DivorceBusting.com

Mods, I hope there is not a problem posting this here, if so, I apologize.

Here is an article by Michelle I just came across. I know there is some controversy here regarding the "friend zone." Just thought I would see what peoples thoughts are on this.

Quote:

Perhaps you are someone whose spouse is in the midst of an affair and it is making you crazy. You feel like giving up on your marriage. Worse yet, you feel like being hurtful. Don't do anything you will regret in the long run. You came to this website because you want to save your marriage. Remember that. You need to stay focused on your goal, even if it's hard. On rough days, refer to what David, a Divorce Busting� family member, taught us about how he won back his wife. He now lives ecstatically ever after.

Michele-

I decided, early in my separation, that my wife was my best friend....ever. I resolved to NEVER allow the separation to hinder my friendship with her. I acted, from the very beginning, as a friend. I helped her move out by moving all of her stuff downstairs to help her to save money with the moving people. I loaned her money to help her get her new place. More than anything, I stuck by her when her parents were in the hospital (during March, as you remembered) and supported her space, as a single woman (her stupid boyfriend actually got jealous about her spending so much time with her sick parents). I tried very hard to not allow my pain, over her choice to leave me, to be reflected in my face, mannerisms or with respect to how I treated her. I gave her space and respected her choice to enter into a relationship with someone else. I never said anything bad about her boyfriend and was always there when he couldn�t or wouldn�t be there. We did have one big argument, but even the bad feelings associated with that argument went away. I attribute this to our friendship. Whenever anyone asks me how to act after they have been left by their partner, I have one answer...act like a friend. Perhaps all that will survive is friendship, but by preserving a friendship, you always leave the door open to something more. My wife's boyfriend began getting jealous towards the end of their relationship. He forbid her to see me (which, of course, didn't go over well at all with her). This guy was the one carrying on a romance with my wife, but he was jealous of our friendship. True, unconditional friendship is very powerful. I believe, if more people just concentrated on saving the friendship, in the true manner of a friend (along with making changes in themselves), most would have their lovers back in their arms so soon it would make them dizzy.

I still wonder about this...but I think my wife and I sort of made excuses to see each other under the guise of "family and business" matters. I think my wife really just wanted to have me near her as someone who wouldn�t pressure her into a "date" or sex or anything of that nature. Just someone to be nice to her, accept her and talk to her with no pressure. The way I figured, is that we had experienced the dating, sex and marriage relationship things. I sort of developed an attitude of "been there, done that". I challenged myself to be her truest and most devoted friend. The more I challenged myself and lived up to the challenge, the more inner power I gained.

Friendship........empathy, being there without criticism, being non-judgmental.....this is unconditional friendship.

Believe me, the decision to be a friend, against all odds, proved to be a major challenge. There were times when I truly thought of giving up, especially when the boyfriend arrived. Usually, I would come to this site and vent and request support and information. Michele, and the "family" here, never let me down.

I dont know country. This worked for him but how many people does this not work for. It seems to go against parts of DBing.

Doesnt this also validate her decision. I get my boyfriend and also get to have my happy family whenever I want it. My W already told me that she wanted us to do things together with the kids and not just for the kids but because she needed that as well.

But then she has everything. She sleeps with OM and gets to be with me and kids. Cake eating. Besides, Im not sure I can do this.

Its sooooo complicated really.

9

The idea is to see if something 'works' has good results. If it does? Continue it. If it doesn't pull your head out of the fire and try something else.

That worked for him and his wife, but it wasn't easy. That didn't stop him though, he didn't say screw it its too hard and move onto something that didn't work so well but easier.

Originally Posted By: Jack_Three_Beans

The idea is to see if something 'works' has good results. If it does? Continue it. If it doesn't pull your head out of the fire and try something else.

That worked for him and his wife, but it wasn't easy. That didn't stop him though, he didn't say screw it its too hard and move onto something that didn't work so well but easier.

There is still one tough part of this though. Figuring out if what you are doing is working.

For example in my situation. For a solid month and a half, I basically did the same thing. Friendly and dim I guess would be the best description. During this time I saw my W be friendly in return and did not bring up D. So does that mean what I did was working? What should the expectations be for something �working?�

Then this last week I started the week by being more dark than normal, but then also tried something else new and through out a comment about our �old plans.� Then Friday she brings up selling the house. What caused this? Was it the period of me ignoring her? Or was it the comment I made about our plans? Or did it have nothing to do with what I did?

I think the big thing here are the different expectations people should have based on their situation. I am really thinking the most I can expect right now while my W is still having an affair is that she is not actively working on D. If that is the right expectation to have, I think going back to a �friend zone� might be the best thing I can do. But if I should have a different expectation, if her simply standing still is not �working� I need to think about doing something different.

Head = Spinning

Quote:

There is still one tough part of this though. Figuring out if what you are doing is working.

Agreed Country, one of if not the hardest part.

As JTB said we need to figure out what works. What works for one may not work for another. Each sitch is unique to some extent and it is incredibly difficult to figure out what is working if there is no contact. This is the issue many of us have with going dark. It is the reason I try and take a temp every few weeks and have established a FB.

My original goals have been achieved. They weren�t real ambitious but I am in a better place after three months. Now I need to change up my strategy go dim and look for feedback. Like CS my biggest obstacle is determining if what I am doing is working. So I will look for little things. For example it would be nice if W asked about how I or the dog is doing even to one of the SILs. Or anything else to indicate she is not so me focused. Just one little baby step.

In the mean time life goes on so more GAL. If anything this experience has taught me the value of a life outside of the relationship W that dominated the life W and I shared.

Originally Posted By: Country

Then this last week I started the week by being more dark than normal, but then also tried something else new and through out a comment about our �old plans.�

How is it working for YOU to be trying all the time to get in her head?

Be consistent Country. Not You, not I nor anyone else here knows what your W is thinking or deciding.

You know what you did in the M right? You are changing that right?

Be consistent with your actions. Or she will think you are some guy who is ruled by some whim of her emotion.

The best way I can tell you to know what is working is how much pain it is causing you.

Friend zone?

Does it hurt you to be her friend? Can you be Country while be her friend?

Can you handle being her friend?

If not then you need not to be.

Until you get control over yourself your tactics, and they are tactics if you expect outcomes, are just that.

And she will see right through you to see the man she left.

The sooner you get control of you and what you want the sooner she will see a different Country.

And maybe. maybe.

Want to hang out with that cool new dude.

Don't fear the man you want to be. She will see him or she won't.

You will not do your M a disservice by being that man.

TG, I really like this. Truth be told I am most comfortable when I am being friendly with her. I am most content that way. When I try to ignore her too much I feel like I am just trying to get a reaction, not doing what I want to be doing. So maybe that is why I was able to be pretty consistent for a while when I was doing this.

I do think this shows off the best side of me. Someone who is able to stay positive in the face of this situation. I cannot say I was a positive person in our M.

Do for YOU Country...

The rest will follow if she is open to it.

Country,

If we all did what we wanted to be doing with our WAS, I don't think we would be db. It is not suppowed to make us feel good or content. But you have to figure out wha works. It may be what makes you feel that way IS working, but it may not be the case.

Every time I go really dark with my W, I get a very angry reaction, talk about D, orwhy won't you talk to me, or just overall evil looks. To me, I think these are positive signs. She is showing some emotion, which means she cares what I think and what I am doing. If she did not have a reaction, she truly would not care. Just think about that.

Maybe your W bringin up D when you went dark was a way to try to hurt you bc she was hurting. Idk. It is just something to think about.

I know this kind of turned into another discussion of my sitch, but I would like to discuss this topic generally here. It does seem to be one where there are opinions on each side. I am sure situations where this may be a good direction, others where it is not. Just curious to hear opinions.

Some things to consider:

Does being friends really always make it easier on the WAS?
Or can this actually make the WAS consider the person they are leaving?
Do the problems that caused the M to collapse have something to do with whether or not being friends may work or not work?

I have personally never seen this work. Ever.

One thing you need to consider, if you're thinking of trying this approach: do you really think that your new spouse or GF someday will be cool that you're "best friends" with your ex-wife?

Be civil, be courteous, be friend-LY. If this doesn't work out, you'll need to co-parent, and those will all serve you well. But if your wayward spouse is under the illusion that you're going to still be BFF with them if they continue to cheat and run away from your marriage, I think you'd be wise to set them straight, in a calm, firm, loving manner.

Starsky

CS- this was one of the first posts I saw when I came to the site! I remember thinking, well, that's someone with a ton of strength, courage, and forgiveness. Amazing discipline. Though I don't know if I'd choose that strategy myself, I really admire that kind of internal strength in a person.

How do we know if it's working? I don't think we ever know 100%. To me it is the UNCERTAINTY that is so painful. Heck, I don't even know 100% if my W is having an EA with her boss. I want to KNOW. And that sometimes leads me to do dumb things, like inititate OR talks, looking for reassurance - which, as you know, always ends badly for me. I'll even do things that would push her towards this other guy, because sometimes it feels like KNOWING she was in an EA would be easier than NOT KNOWING. Uncertainty causes anxiety, causes me to go looking for certainty and control over the situation. I wish I had the discipline to sit down with the pain of uncertainty and endure it, when that would be my choice. I'm learning, and it's a struggle. I think we need to find the thing that gives us internal strength.

That would help me do what works in my M.

Originally Posted By: Country_Song

Does being friends really always make it easier on the WAS?
Or can this actually make the WAS consider the person they are leaving?
Do the problems that caused the M to collapse have something to do with whether or not being friends may work or not work?

Unfortunately there is no one-size fits all model. What might be right for you, may not be right for some. (Okay I stole that from the Diff'rent Strokes Theme, but it applies.) I think some Ws respond differently.

For me, friendship was critical. Our relationship started out of a friendship. My W also and still does considers me her best friend. My W had to get the friendship feelings back before she could even consider working on the M. Without that, I would've been sunk.
So at least for the for the first month after the bomb, I tried to be her friend as I always was. but I didn't try to be her best friend, if that make sense. She appreciated that effort. We we had one of our first MC sessions, she brought that up.
But being friends is not the same as a co-dependency.

I think for some women, it might make it easier to move on, especially if they are in some kind of fog. But I think for the majority, it makes them see what they are missing. It doesn't necessarily make them come back thought.

I think many married people say that their spouse is there best friend. There is a reason for that and a meaning to that.

IMO we need to evaluate the state of the relationship we currently have with our spouses to determine how any of the things we are putting into practice applies. The R is never truly gone. My SIL and her XH still interact after 21 yrs.

As recently as last summer W and I were laughing and friendly with each other. I remember her remarking our friendship is one of the reasons we have lasted. Looking back and analyzing from the perspective of now there were cracks in the R then and being a better friend would probably helped alleviate where W and I now find ourselves. She may have been trying to tell me that.

It is a two-way street as the R cracked W could have spoke up at any time. In early winter as things began to spiral I pushed for MC. I didn�t realize she made her decision to abandon the R until the bomb.

Now I think I need to be friendly, but not her friend if that makes any sense. Not as a tactic, but as a matter of personal integrity. I struggled with that recently.

Originally Posted By: JustStunned

Now I think I need to be friendly, but not her friend if that makes any sense. Not as a tactic, but as a matter of personal integrity. I struggled with that recently.

This is my thought exactly.

This is something I have been thinking about. When I am dark, my texts to her (when she texts me) are very short. I think she takes this as I am mad or don't care about her. But when I am friendly, I get a much better vibe from her. I know my divorce is going to go through, I have to decide how I can be that friend to her. She said she wants to be close and be friends, but I have to wait till she's ready to do that.

I struggle with this alot lately. In past phone calls, W has gradually gotten angrier, bitter and raised her voice, even as i had not even said anything except hello. it got to the point where she would just hang up on me. Then call back 20 minutes later after she had calmed down. This causes me great anxiety and i have to take a pill. So i have decided to not accept any phone calls, if she leaves a message i respond via text. I had to get reassurance from my pastor that this was ok. He said as long as its for a health issue, which i have to be healthy, mentally, physically, and emotionally for time with my 2YO son, its ok. When it becomes a way to control the conversation or situation then its not ok. Like this morning she called and i started becoming anxious just seeing it was her calling. She left a message to call her, that we need to talk about a few things. I got very anxious. Anyhow dont want to highjack this thread.....