I had the vets thread removed because I felt there was too much revealing information on there, and I was going public with some of you folks on the alt.
I admire the fact that so many folks here have fought so hard for their marriages. It restores my faith in the depth of human bonds.
Sometimes those efforts are successful in restoring a marriage, sometimes what looks successful at first doesn't stick, and sometimes the marriage isn't restored.
I think, however, that the fight is a good one so long as it isn't about outright denial about what is happening. I have learned a lot on this forum (and I have a lot left to learn no doubt).
My marriage, however, has moved from limboland onto the fast track to dissolution, and I think I just have to accept that. That doesn't mean I won't wonder about how it all happened sometimes, and that doesn't mean I won't have sad moments (especially around key events like the upcoming "getting served" and the eventual dissolution).
Sometimes things just don't turn out the way we might have wanted them to turn out. I know that it's not over until it's over, and I know that even then it's not over for some folks (especially those with kids). For me, on the other hand, I have to start living my life like it is over.
I will probably continue to post here even though some of this stuff is hard to read in the context of my personal situation, but I think it's OK for ME to let go.
Be thankful no kids were involved. I think that is what really makes people dig in and claw and fight for their marriages. After all you have a good advantage of having a nice CLEAN BREAK from your WAW.
Consider yourself very lucky timeheals. Very Lucky.
Consider yourself very lucky timeheals. Very Lucky.
I don't know if I consider getting divorced "lucky". Lucky would be overcoming difficulties in my marriage and having a stronger, better, deeper marriage in the end. That was my hope when I came here, and I did hold onto that hope for the last 8 months or so, so I put up a fight.
But that doesn't mean I can't still have great and rewarding life ahead, and I know that. I can feel it in my bones, and I know I need to start embracing life more now.
Be thankful no kids were involved. I think that is what really makes people dig in and claw and fight for their marriages. After all you have a good advantage of having a nice CLEAN BREAK from your WAW.
Consider yourself very lucky timeheals. Very Lucky.
Agreed! And you can take this experience of being married to know what you need for your next marriage...I am doing the same.
Also, we have to realize that we are here because our spouses wanted to divorce us. The odds are against us but some make it. There is that CHANCE. That's why we have to try, you know!
Journaling:
Slacking a bit this morning (and reading all of your posts).
Oldest dog threw up on the first landing of the stairs at 6:30AM this morning, so I woke up to having to clean that up. Decided to spend the next 30 minutes spot cleaning walls (a constant thing that must be done when you share a house with two Shar-peis).
I have mostly used this long weekend to get things done around here. I am cleaning and getting things back into shape after they have long been neglected through the long limboland phase of my R with STBX (we both let things go back then because we were both stuck).
I really need to focus on making this place MY home again. Yesterday, a trip to the grocery store turned into an example of how this is slowly unfolding: I bought TimeHeals stuff, and when I got home started cleaning out the refrigerator of W-oriented stuff.
I get to reorganize this place the way I want! Yay! I get to plan my own projects!
I say I am slacking a bit this morning because one new morning ritual (when weather permits) is getting up early and walking the dogs before it gets hot (and before work starts). It's a holiday.
Need to put some clothes in the dryer, finish this cup of coffee and then get busy!
Have a great day everyone (unless you are one of those people that is a very rude driver). There is light at the end of the tunnel!
Journaling:
There is something strangely calming about reading and revising the paperwork with your attorney.
W's L committed a procedural error and filed D on 6/27/10 before having the dissolution agreement signed. Moment of panic there.
Nothing crazy in the agreement her L came up with (left a couple of things out, mis-spellings, and incomplete sentence fragments that make you wonder how somebody who practices FL for decades could do such things, but nothing crazy).
D should be final in late July/early August.
Journaling:
Decided to spend the next 30 minutes spot cleaning walls (a constant thing that must be done when you share a house with two Shar-peis).
Sounds like the time I spend Windexing Shi-Tzu spit/slober off all the windows.
Be thankful no kids were involved. I think that is what really makes people dig in and claw and fight for their marriages. After all you have a good advantage of having a nice CLEAN BREAK from your WAW.
Consider yourself very lucky timeheals. Very Lucky.
While I don't agree that a divorce is "lucky" by any means, I do understand what you mean.
Had I not had children, I would have done things very differently. That I am sure of!
Error--D filed 5/27/2010. And I was busting on her L
Sounds like the time I spend Windexing Shi-Tzu spit/slober off all the windows.
Lord, you should see the windows after a couple of days of not cleaning them.
All that extra skin on Shar-peis is cute as heck, but on their faces it's a haven for slobber and food fragments.
But I love my dogs more than you can imagine.
Lord, you should see the windows after a couple of days of not cleaning them.
Pretty brave behind the window hey? Ours too. Not so much when they're nose to nose though!
But I love my dogs more than you can imagine.
That's awesome...glad you've got them. They're great listeners aren't they? I'm not really familiar with Shar-peis - are they a large dog? Or toy?
That's awesome...glad you've got them. They're great listeners aren't they? I'm not really familiar with Shar-peis - are they a large dog? Or toy?
Mine are both medium-sized, 43 lbs or so, one is chocolate, and the other is lilac.
Not lap dogs. Pics on alt page.
Oh that's bigger than I realized! They sound beautiful. Is 'lilac' that lovely silver-taupe colour?
Ours of course are a 1/4 that size. But I'm sure they think they're bigger. They of course, run the house; I'm just the food lady.
Pictures!? Oh I'd love to see their pics! What's this alt page about? I've heard other people refer to it and I don't know what/where it is?
alt is FB--the thing that ended my M
alt is FB--the thing that ended my M
Oh of course. I had been a fan of the DB FB page, but then I un-fanned (?) it because I was scared my H would see it and somehow find my posts here. I'm SO paranoid. But let me go look - I'd love to see the pooches.
I am not a fan of DB on there, but I am a friend of many who are. Initials GB.
Ok I'm a FB moron. I don't know how to find the pics.
How do I find people on there. I don't know how?!? I have the same name as on here on fb
I will have to have this post deleted.
link removed
Journaling:
Reincarnation in one's own lifetime feels like it is happening again.
Looking back, I'd be lying if I said that I didn't have hopes that things would turn out differently than they have, and that I didn't know I had my own changes to make and was willing to make them.
But I didn't wind up where I am now because it was everything I wanted or because I was the only one who needed to change.
I can seriously, however, say that I am happier with who I've become and who I am becoming having gone through this.
Journaling:
Time to get to work soon. Finished the morning dog walk around 7:30am. The dogs are liking the new routine, but the oldest dog is still missing W, I can tell. He was bonded very deeply it seems, but he gets me up early and is excited now in the mornings because he knows it's time to walk, so he's going to be OK.
Sounds like he's getting used to the new routine. My animals were my sanity during my S and D.
Take care,
WT
Journaling:
L called, and the revised dissolution agreement arrived, so I will sign that tomorrow.
Journaling: I guess I need to do some maintenance on the alt and defriend some folks just for healthy reasons.
I saw this AM that W's cousin had posted the following:
"I believe everything happens for a reasons.... Sometimes things fall apart so that better things can fall together".
W commented on that status with "AMEN cuz", and the irony is that is a paraphrase of a Marilyn Monroe quote (and we all know what an expert MM was in Rs and taking personal responsibility in them--wink, wink).
It didn't really bother me to see that, but it sort of did reaffirm what I already suspected about her unwillingness to see her own role in things and accept personal responsibility for her own actions.
It also drove home just how desperate and successfull waywards are in finding people to validate and support the complete abdication of personal responsibility.
Nothing much more to say.
Time to walk the dogs.
Journaling:
Dissolution Agreement signed, notarized, "Houston, we have a contract".
D should be final by late July/early August.
Journaling:
I feel like my story has become kind of boring by the forum standards. There's no more soap opera, no more self-pity.
What I do have is a boat load of to-dos that I need to attack:
1. Exteriot paint for the house (need to find painters).
2. Either refinish or replace front door.
3. Basically, home maintenance is what is nagging at me right now, so I have to deal with that.
The rest is just ordinary daily stuff that keeps me busy: work, house cleaning & such, giving the dogs baths (walking them, time for heart worm medication), and so on.
Thinking of taking a crack and quitting smoking again now that thing have settled down, and the "emotional roller coaster" is more of a kiddie ride whenever I find myself on it (which is more and more rarely).
Journaling:
Reading your posts in between work meetings.
Reading about folks getting served and still holding out hope. Must be really tough when you have kids.
I know that just watching my oldest dog when he still (almost a month later) waits for W at night makes me sad for him sometimes.
For me, I have just had to accept what is happening. Believe me, I had all of those discussions: end EA or move out; I want to work on this M, but I will not do it alone; etc.
All for naught. My W was in a hurry to file once she moved out, and fighting what she presented (she wants nothing) could only wind up costing us both lots of money.
So my L says late July/early August D will be final, but I can't remarry by TN law until September
Journaling:
I feel really, really good right now. I have been getting up very early (well, the dogs wake me early every day), drinking a cup of coffee, feeding the dogs, and then taking them for a two mile walk every morning.
Energy levels are up. House is getting cleaner and more orderly. I need to hire some painters, and now I have the money to do things that I wouldn't have had if weren't technically single
I was taking stock of my life today:
1. I will be 45, single.
2. Getting back into shape after a couple of years where I let that slide.
3. I am not poor, and I enjoy all kinds of things and activities.
Things to work on: networking related stuff. I need to establish a peer group here locally, and then the rest is cake.
I don't mind the solitude one little bit though. It has actually been nice, and this board and phone calls to distant friends has been a good substitute for a social life while I was getting to this emotional state.
Man, I am 45, single, no kids, not poor, don't drink, etc.
If I just get the networking thing down in time, this is going to be great.
Journaling:
Was out doing yardwork, and I had to clear some brush. So far I have discovered two deer ticks on my body. I hate, hate, hate ticks! Need to douse myself with DEET before I do that again.
I wonder if they make a sunscreen with DEET? I have a wicked sunburn, I think
Journaling:
The morning ritual of walking the dogs a mile or two continues, and it makes the dogs happy and compliant early in the day.
The youngest dog is starting to mellow out a bit.
What is it with people trying to "set you up" when they find out you are going through a divorce?
I have no interest in dating at the moment. Zero, zip, nada. For one thing, my D won't be final until late July/early August, and for another... I have things I want to do for myself right now (changes I want to make) that are just far easier to do if I don't have to worry about dating and crap like that
I feel like I am in a crysalis state: change is happening, and I don't want to interupt it now.
Journaling:
Yesterday, a registration renewal form from the County Clerk's office arrived for my STBXW's SUV.
I sent an email letting her know that the mail forwarding period had apparently expired, and her registration renewal came here.
This morning I see she sent a reply yesterday to my email asking where and when I'd like to bring this to her.
Rolling my eyes so people in the back row of the theater can see me do it.
I think she needs a serious reality check. As if I have nothing better to do than to meet her someplace to give her stuff like we are doing some kind of drug deal or something.
I responded that I am too busy (which is basically true, and I am on call this week to boot). Women.
Journaling:
Youngest dog has me worried. For the last two days she wants to lay outside by herself in the blazing heat. Sudden behavior change. Don't understand.
Youngest dog has me worried. For the last two days she wants to lay outside by herself in the blazing heat. Sudden behavior change. Don't understand.
Hey Time, have you seen any physical changes? Like is she still eating, urinating, regular BMs?
If you're concerned, why don't you take her to the vet, just to be sure? If there's nothing physically wrong, there's still lots of things that can be done to help a dog deal with stress. For example, our vet gave our one pup a natural herb to help with her stress over car travel. She'd really flip out - shaking, hyper-salivating, wild eyes, the works. And the herb really did help.
Hey Time, have you seen any physical changes? Like is she still eating, urinating, regular BMs?
No noticable physical changes. She eats, but she used to eat as much as you would give her, and now she mostly seems suddenly uninterested in food.
Urination seems fine. Frequent BMs (2-3 times a day), not solid.
I can understand your concern - maybe still a bit of adjusting?
I usually try Bach's Rescue Remedy when I see a change in behavior...
http://www.bachflower.com/Pets.htmHope she's OK.
WT
She eats, but she used to eat as much as you would give her, and now she mostly seems suddenly uninterested in food.
I think that's a really good thing about the BMs and urination. I think I'd still take her in for a quick check though, given the change in her interest in food.
Oh, but are 'not solid' BMs normal for her? Do you think she might be having trouble digesting her normal food? That might explain her listlessness too - just low on energy or a stomach ache? Sometimes all it might take is introducing a milder, almost bland food that takes less work to digest. Waltham's (?) has an excellent soft chicken & rice formula. Our little guy got Parvo just after we adopted him, and that's what we used to coax his appetite back afterwards.
Hey Time,
I am glad to see you are doing better and moving forward.
Morning, Time - just wanted to say hello and see how your pup was feeling today?
Journaling:
STBXW is back to sending "Woe is me" emails.
She sent one last night out of the blue saying, "You said once that you didn't think I was broken, but I feel broken".
Made the mistake of responding like this:
"That doesn't sound good. Hope you feel better today".
This unleashed some lengthy emails about her and OM and how she inadvertently pushed HIM away.
Made the second mistake of responding to those with:
"I will not discuss the problems of your affair. I am all about doing the right thing as if God himself were here watching me".
Another page long "woe is me email" followed.
Note: It's easy to think as you move forward that your spouse must be moving forward too. Apparently, this is not even close to being the case.
Just begining to wonder what I ever saw in my STBXW....
Journaling:
Tired. Was up past 2AM because an automatic software update from work trashed my work VPN, and it took forever to figure out how to fix that (with no help from help desk).
Dogs got me up at 6AM.
Thoughts: to the tune of "These Boots" by Patsy Kline,
"These dogs were made for walking,
And that's just what they do
These dogs are going to wake you up
To go on a walk with you".
Tired makes me feel a little sad and nostalgic.
Note to self: get better sleep tonight.
OK, I am completely ready for things to change. Something new would be nice.
Don't know what, but something different.
TH,
OK, I am completely ready for things to change. Something new would be nice.
Don't know what, but something different.
I'm with ya. We're due. It's coming. I feel like I'm on the cusp. Something - s
omething - right around the next bend.
Journaling:
Grilled two Ribeye steaks: one for me, and one for the dogs.
The dogs finished before I got started on mine and congregated at my feet while I was eating.
Youngest dog (very food possesive) attacked older dog, so he now has a cut above his right eye and a nasty nick behine the left ear. Was sitting on sofa and eating, so my hands were full, and I couldn't put down the plate fast enough to prevent that.
Nothing new with STBXW really. I told her I wasn't bringing her mail and stuff to a place she designated. If she really wants that stuff, she can come and get it. I don't work for her.
Haven't heard from her since that call. She was crying. The crying doesn't work on me anymore. I just remember this is somebody who could care less about me, and even though I don't want anything bad for her, I can't help her. Sooner or later she might or might not get tired of doing things to make her life a mess. It's not my problem.
TH you really have detached. I know you say I dont listen, but I have been at this like 3 months.
I guess i need to really observe the true detachers on this site. I often wonder how I can Love someone who is so cruel to me. I guess i need to focus on the pain, rudeness, evil within and not on the good times.
Thank you for your advice, and maybe one day my WAW will cry and it will not affect me in the slightest.
Well, I feel pretty detached, so we shall see. STBXW is dropping by to pick up some things.
I don't expect much in the way of conversation. The writing is pretty much on the wall with this M.
Well, that wasn't horrible. She came and got her stuff, then came in and played with the dogs, cried a little bit, and then left.
No crazy stuff anyway.
Journaling:
Tuesday night STBXW came by to pick up her stuff. She called twice to tell me she would be 15 minutes late,
Things were generally calm.
She sent a letter later that night thanking me for being "nice to her" and commenting on how good we get along.
She is going home (another state) for birthday/vacation for a week.
I responded next day "Have a great vacation/birthday".
TH,
JShe sent a letter later that night thanking me for being "nice to her" and commenting on how good we get along.
Well, isn't that special? (Perhaps) not trying to be sarcastic, here.
Well, isn't that special? (Perhaps) not trying to be sarcastic, here.
I don't read anything into it. I don't know what she is going through, so I can't tell you why she felt that way or sent that email.
It is what it is.
Journaling:
I just cooked 3, 16+ oz, boneless, thick-cut ribeye steaks out on the grill, and me and my two dogs each ate one.
Stuffed.
why didn't you send out an invite?!
I just cooked 3, 16+ oz, boneless, thick-cut ribeye steaks out on the grill, and me and my two dogs each ate one.
LOL!! Love it!
My H has our dog....I miss her...she has nervous stomach issues so it's hard on her going back and forth, so I think it's better if he keeps her.
I am now rethinking that.
Good for you for not dating!!! I don't know what it is with people either. I guess they all think we can't be happy without someone else. Which...is a bunch of crap.
How can you jump right back into a relationship? Those that do learn the hard way about rebound relationships.
Hope you had a great weekend.
Good for you for not dating!!!
Well, I don't think dating would kill me or anything.
I am just not interested in a serious relationship, and I am not even interested in anything remotely romantic before the divorce is final, and I don't want to lead anybody on.
I enjoy female company. Might be nice to spend some time with female friends.
I am just not into 'romance' at the moment.
I just cooked 3, 16+ oz, boneless, thick-cut ribeye steaks out on the grill, and me and my two dogs each ate one.
Stuffed.
Wonderful to hear your pup has her appetite back! I can imagine the look on our Shih Tzus faces if we presented each one with such monster-sized ribeyes! Glad to hear they were enjoyed by all.
Journaling:
The dogs and I are doing well. I have spent a lot of time reading stories on this board, and it's hard sometimes not to tell the LBS's that they might just be better off telling the WAS to kiss their @ss and hit the bricks.
Seriously, I am probably needing a break for these boards and relationship problems in general because I just feel TIRED of reading, watching (TV), and hearing about all of the awful crap that people do to each other.
And I am starting to question the emphasis on 180s (unless you are an @ss to begin with). Is it good to work on improving yourself? Sure, but you should do that anyway. All of these gymnastics of trying to twist yourself up like some pretzel just to please somebody who doesn't care about your and who is out looking for an OP or OP2 seems to border on the ridiculous sometimes.
Man, I am grumpy today.
Hey Time, sorry you've got the grumps today. Those kind of days suck.
I also just wanted to say thanks for the great advice this morning. Made a big difference to my day and outlook for my weekend with all the crazy gear-heads. I'm going to take your wise insight, let go and see where it takes me.
Thanks again for sticking around. I hope you and the pups have a good weekend. Me and mine will toast you and yours from the beach. Cheers. PG.
I agree with you Timeheals, why change for the one person in the world that doesn't give a damn about you. It is good to work on yourself and get your mind off you current problem. But the idea of changing yourself to be better to the one that already dislikes you rubs me the wrong way. If I was the problem then i would need to change. When the WA is the screwed up one that you just have to find someone better. Heck, I can't do any worse than what i already had. I am still hurt and confused but I will be better in the long run. I still have the thoughts of the good memories and i just don't think of the bad stuff. I wonder why? It is stupid mind games that just make me feel bad.
Hey TH,
Just wanted to drop by to say hi and thank you for all of your posts on my thread. I'm doing the best I can to follow everyone's advice, but it can really be tough at times. My W filed about a month ago, which was when I really first started DBing. At least that is when I found the website and started trying to detach. I have been doing 180's since January 3rd, but it hasn't made any difference. She was already gone by then.
You wouldn't take your W back at this point if she wanted to work on things? I haven't gotten to that point yet.
Anyway, it is good to see you hanging in there and you are right, once your D is final and you start to network, I think you will have a LOT of fun. On of my D'd friends recommends that E-H website for meeting people. I may have to try that eventually. He says it helps keep out the rifraff.
My Hearing for a Temporary Order is coming-up on Tuesday. Tells us how everything will be handled between now and when the D is final. I wish my W didn't want anything, but we are likely going to end-up fighting over the placement of the kids. Child support and Alimony payments are starting to look daunting. Not looking forward to this at all. All of our standards of living will be going down soon, and I fear dramatically. I still can't believe this is what she really wants and I think she will eventually regret it, but who knows.......
Hang in there buddy, better times appear to be just around the corner for you.
Hang in there buddy, better times appear to be just around the corner for you.
I know this, but today I am feeling... well... just tired of BS in general.
I guess I could lie and say everything was always aweful, but things weren't always aweful. It wasn't pure bliss, and the last 8 months of our M were a living Hell. That's about the truth of it.
And I could lie and say I am completely over it (sometimes I am sure I am), but sometimes... sometimes... I am a little bit angry when I let myself think about all the hearts that broke: our families', my dogs', and mine.
I suppose I should be grateful that I am only the single-father of two dogs and don't have kids that have been abandoned as well. Yippe!
Time for some B-vitamins and a light workout. That should break this funk.
You doin' good TH. Keep moving forward.
Journaling:
Low, gray cloud covered sky. Very high humidity today. Feels like being inside of a terrarium.
Debating the morning dog walk because of possible rain, but that hopeful, deep stare of the oldest dog is making me think the daily walk has to happen. Maybe I will just try not to get too far from the house in case it starts to pour.
Heck, it might be a little fun to get caught in a down pour with two avoid-water-like-it-is-kryptonite dogs
A walk in the rain does sound nice.
TH,
i was just writing about how sick I am of all the BS too. You get to a point where you're just tired and frustrated and want it to be over..want to think some happy thoughts..want to be happy again.
And the moods that the LBS go thru..today I'm a little mad, and very frustrated and feel like crying my heart out. But I'm a girl so you probably have more restraint when it comes to that.
I have 3 dogs and know how easy it is to love them and treat them like your children. They are the best when it comes to unconditional love, aren't they? You're lucky to have them at this time in your life. I had my baby grandson to help me focus on other stuff too.
Hang in there and know that we are thinking about you and saying some prayers for a happy ending for you.
I need to stop reading all these stories cuz the people I pray for each night is getting really long!!!
Hang in there and know that we are thinking about you and saying some prayers for a happy ending for you.
I appreciate the prayers, and my prayer list has grown fairly long too. I spend a lot of time praying for a lot of folks on this board who I have never even met
I can honestly say, having gone through this ordeal, that I don't ever want to be in a M again with somebody who doesn't have it in them to fight for the M at least as much as I was willing to fight for my M. I will never second guess myself on this because I don't think ANYBODY deserves less.
I am at the point where I KNOW that I am better off alone than chasing somebody who won't fight for me, our M, and our families.
I am at the point where I KNOW that I am better off alone than chasing somebody who won't fight for me, our M, and our families.
Pretty hard for someone to fight for you if they haven't lost you or at least wonder if they have. Fighting for something usually means that the something they are fighting for is possibly out of reach and may be lost or not in their total power to have at will.
Pretty hard for someone to fight for you if they haven't lost you or at least wonder if they have. Fighting for something usually means that the something they are fighting for is possibly out of reach and may be lost or not in their total power to have at will.
Pretty hard to see what you meant to accomplish with this comment.
In my case, the divorce is final in weeks, and at any rate any number of horrible circumstances could befall any one of us at any minute, and it takes strength to weather some of these storms. Nothing is in our total power to have at will.
Journaling:
STBXW and I spoke 2 times on phone since Monday.
She is having second thoughts about the divorce. We're 2 weeks from her divorce being final.
Not sure what to think about this.
Going to a cousin's wedding in Louisville this weekend with my Mom and my two dogs in tow.
Told her we could talk when I return. We spoke a long time last night (too long--5 hours).
Hello TimeHeals. I don't have any advice for you and I'm in no position to give advice.
However, maybe I'm being optimistic, but at least she has second thoughts! Maybe, keep doing whatever you are doing to get these "thoughts" Idk. (sell me some magic too plz :D) But man I'm going to include you in my prayer and if you don't want a prayer, then I'll just think hope for you.
What's your gut telling you?
This weekend away will help. Go, have fun and see how you feel when you get back.
Wow TH. I guess this is how it goes. When you are finally ready to move on, they change their minds. I guess that is really the key. Letting go of the rope. I am still a newbie here, but search your feelings. What do you REALLY want? If you want a chance at reconciliation, maybe this is it. A lot of the vets have actually gotten divorced and then still got back together. The ball is in your court. However, even if you do want it, don't be quick to jump at it. Make her pursue you for a while. At least that is what I learned here. Don't go too fast or she will get cold feet.
I'm not telling you anything you don't already know, but sometimes we need a reminder.
Hang tough. Enjoy your weekend and think hard about what you really want. If you have really let go, maybe that is best, but only you can say.
Good luck and my thoughts are with you...
TimeHeals,
I've been reading up on your situation. That's some major news regarding your wife's second thoughts. Please keep us updated. Sending positive thoughts your way. Keep praying for your heart to be open to God's will in your life.
Take care, ap10
Yeah, I think that's a foregone conclusion: I have to protect me, my home, and so on from this person until I know otherwise.
Journaling: Met STBXW for ice cream last night. Less than one week to approaching D-day.
She wants to see about delaying D if it costs no money to do so. Either way she wants to see if we can start over slow and start dating.
Again, not sure what future brings, not sure if I can trust this, not sure where I am headed in all of this.
Either way she wants to see if we can start over slow and start dating.
Hey Time,
Did she give you an explanation for what why she's had a change of heart? If so, what did you think of it - was it sincere and showing that she'd done some soul-searching?
Regarding trust, if indeed you think you could trust her again, what do you need from her - behaviours, communication etc - in order to feel that trust? No need to answer if you don't want; just thought I'd pose the questions for your consideration. Take care.
Journaling:
Several emails from STBXW. She wants to see if things might work out for "us", she is unsure if I can really ever "forgive" her.
The thing that comes through, however, the most IMO is that she is sorry (she says so), but it's mostly that she's feeling sorry for herself for having got herself into the mess she got herself into.
I will state clearly that prior to the EA, I was not blameless for the state of our M, but I have owned my actions and choices.
How likely is it that she will ever fully own her part? I guess that's what I want to see first to know that change is really possible for her.
Oh well... thinking that reconciling may be a hopeless fiasco. That's what I am feeling right now anyway.
I really, really, really want to do the right thing, but STBXW is still very confused IMO.
She actually asked why I could so easily write off a friend (who I was not close too) for the EA but not write her off. Keep in mind that I have not been sure whether or not to write off this M, and I sure as heck will rather than deal with somebody who cannot see why I would not permanently discard a friend who did not respect me or my M and yet try to be open to the possibility that there may be something to save in terms of our M.
The bottom line is if she cannot put that EA behind her, then I can't either.
Journaling: Going on a "date" with STBXW Saturday afternoon.
Cheap lunch and then going to see "Inception".
Yea though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I shall fear no evil
Journaling: got a late start this AM (up at 7), and didn't walk dogs until after 8.
Gotta take off to wash car & get gas soon, come home, shower (it's already HOT and HUMID here), and then get ready for the "date". I said I would call STBXW around 11 AM.
Dogs are collapsed. One is cooling on the kitchen tile floor, and the other is sprawled out on the wood floor in the living room.
Well, get I had better start getting motivated. Promised myself I would take care of the car at 9 AM.
Enjoy your day TH, take it slow and I heard the movie was awesome. I to got a late start need to get a lot done today, I guess we have something in common, W and I are actually doing something together today which ahsnt happened in a while(its church) which I will not complain not really a date but time together to be myself with her and the kids.
Peace
Hey TH,
Thinks for responding on my Posts...I took a some time out today to re-read yours. I noticed we have several things in common. No kids, 2 dogs, not drinking, etc.
Hope your "date" together goes well.
I'm feeling pretty angry now...not guilty anymore because I can't do anything to ever fix the past. I've accepted the fact that I can't control anything except me moving forward. However, I'm mad, very bad thoughts about how W handled our sitch, not like violence mad, but just bad thoughts mad. Did you ever feel this way?
If you did, can you tell me if I'm close to "detaching", I'm by no means happy...and I still have a lot to do for myself, but am I close? Or is it just another up and down kind of thing? I'm so irritable today and just want to get on phone and tell her off regardless of outcome.
Faith,
Detaching isn't about not having a wide range of feelings, it's about letting those feelings control you. If you find yourself losing control, remove yourself from the room, take a walk, take a shower, go to the store/library, anywhere but where you are feeling these emotions.
I too am struggling with anger towards my W. Anger is normal, and perfectly justified. I'm angry my wife is giving up, that she's willing to sacrifice our family's wellbeing for a fantasy life. When I feel this way, I carefully drive on some errand, and then park the car and just scream. It doesn't always help, but I figure it's better than letting my anger fester and grow.
I love my wife, and I wish things were different. Eventually you'll get to the point where you accept what's really happening, and the anger will get worse. Then it will mellow to something else.
The important thing is to remember that you can control your actions, but not your emotions. The best thing about my sitch is realizing this.
Thanks Pin,
I know I have not detached. MY DB Coach helped me a lot last night, but then I received that text I was talking about in my post. It's almost to the point where I see reality and I'm trying to embrace it, I finally had the courage to sign the papers, I let her know this...and then she asks me if I'm going to sign? WTF!
It was instant anger and I'm still mad...I even beat the crap out of my pillow, hoping to relieve it...I've prayed about it...I'm just tired of feeling this way. Literally, tired! I just want to snap my fingers and not give a damn anymore. It hurts me more to feel this anger, than the pain of missing my wife.
I did a no-no and snapped back at her text. Haven't heard a word and really don't care if I hurt her, or if she was drunk and trying to show her friends or OM how I would react, or whatever the hell the purpose was. Now, I'm mad that I even responded. ARGGGGGGGGGGGGH
Then I just get this sinking feeling that maybe she's just lost her mind...when she interacts it seems like she just doesn't know WTF she's doing or saying. From one extreme to the other.
Just venting.
You're right, she doesn't know what she's doing. All she knows is what she's feeling. That's what drives most WASs. I agree that it often seems like they're insane; throwing away a long relationship, trashing finances, and hurting children. But all they can see is some NeverNeverLand that will fix the hole in their heart.
I hate feeling the way I do, this ever-present weight upon my chest, this sense that my heart is just beating millimeters from the skin of my chest. The mood swings, the anger, the grief, the sadness, the guilt. It all just sucks.
Letting go, really letting go will take time and strength. Time for your heart to mend, strength to accept the reality that she's leaving. If you really want to get over her, think of all the bad times. It's natural to remember all the good times you've had, but do a 180 and think of every time she put you down, or denied sex, or any of a million things she did that drove you crazy. No relationship is all wine and roses.
My brother in law lost his daughter to murder in 2005, the same year I found out I had cancer. He still hasn't recovered, and has lost much of his sense of humor. I don't want the death of my marriage to do the same to me. I want to live and love with an open heart; and to have someone love me, warts and all. I've accepted that my wife doesn't. She may later at some time, but I can't wait. We're only given so many ticks on the clock, and waiting for someone to come out of their fog is costing me my life.
Yeah, I was angry and a mixture of angry/sad for a while. All of that is gone now.
I don't know, however, if there is a way forward for both of us, or if we go our seperate ways, and that's that.
I have no map for my future, and that past is just the past now.
I read this once- Don't make your divorce the highlight of your life. It is pretty wise. Only you can make it a horror in your life. You control your emotions and your life. It is easier said than done but just don't make this that big of a deal. It hurts, but you will survive. It is almost like a death, I know that, I have been there. I am sorry you feel bad.
TH,
Your future will be what you make of it. Think about the opportunities you have for a new wonderful life. It will be hard at first, but it will be okay.
Well, spoke to STBXW this evening, and I am convinced we have entirely different concepts of the commitment it takes to make any long-term R work.
We discussed the "date" on Saturday, and she said she just wasn't "feeling" what she needed to feel, so I basically agreed that if all it takes is a buger and a movie date for her to make up her mind, then that doesn't work for me either.
TH, I haven't had time to go through you sitch again in detail, but I wanted to let you know you are often in my thoughts and I'm sorry for your pain. You are an insighful, wonderful person and your posts to others are full of wisdom. I always read what you have to say on the forums and your advice helps me a lot.
TH, I haven't had time to go through you sitch again in detail, but I wanted to let you know you are often in my thoughts and I'm sorry for your pain.
Meh, not "pain" so much as weary of investing any more time with somebody who is so tied up in their preconceived notions about what others think and feel and what they think and feel that they have no apparent interest in find out what you think or how you feel. I feel disconnected entirely from STBXW.
I always read what you have to say on the forums and your advice helps me a lot.
Why, thank you.
Yep, see what you mean about disconnection. I guess I meant your earlier pain
Your sitch may not be as 'dramatic' as others right now, but there IS stuff happening here... I think you are doing great.
Well, I engaged in a round of emails and a phone call, and delaying the divorce is off.
I don't think I'm cut out for the drama. Tired of it. Que sara, sara.
I can't get through a conversation without being told how I feel. If I say anything about it, she denies it.
One of the last things she said to me on the phone was "I just don't think we really like each other".
I guess I could have asked "is that the royal WE?". I could have used the handy, "I'm sorry you feel that way", but instead I fell for it like Charlie Brown trying to kick that football that Lucy is holding for him.
What did I say? "I don't like some things you have done, but there's a difference between not liking something somebody has done and disliking them as a person".
Somebody... need a 2x4. What is it about her that I let myself be stupid sometimes?
Hey Time, for what it's worth, I think you did a great job at thwarting her attempts at mindreading. Plus avoided the 'you feel this way - no I don't' circular, endless argument. Sorry to hear you're having a rough day. PG.
Hey Time, for what it's worth, I think you did a great job at thwarting her attempts at mindreading. Plus avoided the 'you feel this way - no I don't' circular, endless argument. Sorry to hear you're having a rough day. PG.
Hey, I could just move on and not look back. If it's rough, I let it be rough at this point.
But thanks. Maybe someday I can meet somebody who actually likes me who values commitment, and I can put everything I have learned to good use. Otherwise, I sure am not as judgemental as I used to be.
But thanks. Maybe someday I can meet somebody who actually likes me who values commitment
I have a feeling that day will come sooner than you think.
You're an intelligent, articulate man with a lot of depth and capacity for expressing your thoughts and feelings.
Maybe someday I can meet somebody who actually likes me who values commitment, and I can put everything I have learned to good use.
Is it just me, I think there is something missing here.
I thought the ultimate reason we are DBing is to learn about having better R and communication in order to be successful in our future R--- whether it is our spouse or not.
Well, I think you're presented with the best chance to learn here with 'all this drama'?
To test and learn what and how she responds to what you do or say. What contributed to the down fall. Aren't some of the answers contained in that drama?
Without finding out if you just go onto the next, you might have a new set of dramas down the line... isn't that why we are here?
Hang in there and know that we are thinking about you and saying some prayers for a happy ending for you.
I appreciate the prayers, and my prayer list has grown fairly long too. I spend a lot of time praying for a lot of folks on this board who I have never even met
I can honestly say, having gone through this ordeal, that
I don't ever want to be in a M again with somebody who doesn't have it in them to fight for the M at least as much as I was willing to fight for my M. I will never second guess myself on this because I don't think ANYBODY deserves less.
I am at the point where I KNOW that I am better off alone than chasing somebody who won't fight for me, our M, and our families.
Hi Time, I think you have been on my thread, but I was reading thru yours and this statement sums up my feelings exactly. I have been having a hard time trying to figure out why I have been so angry, and this is why. Thank you for giving me this statement!
Journaling: Day 63 of walking the dogs 2 miles. Hot and humid. Need a shower. Started working light weigh circuits and floor excercises into routine 3 days ago, and I am in PAIN. Very sore.
On another note: I say, "The glass is half-full, Doggonit!".
GoG8trz,
I agree with you. I feel the same way that you and TH do.
It is to bad the WAS gives up on the marriage. I have fought so hard for mine. I have never given up, but I still I to face reality. It does make me angry.
Well anger is the flip side of love so it makes sense you would be angry. I am trying to hold onto the fact that even if we end up divorced, I will be able to look at my DD and look in the mirror and know I did everything I could to save my M.
It is to bad the WAS gives up on the marriage.
Look at it this way: if you are happy, their loss
Journaling: You ever wake up in a very good mood for no particular reason (OK, well... there are lots of reasons, but... no one thing you can put a finger on)?
Divorce Schmivorce. Full speed ahead!
Journaling:
Still feeling super. Dogs interupted floor excercises while I was doing crunches this morning. I feel like a wet book of over-licked postage stamps.
Mental note to self: wait until dogs are either outside or close door to keep them out while lying on the floor unless I want a "bath".
LOL. Good one, Time!
Mel really is certifiable by the sounds of it!
TH,
I am glad you are doing okay. I hope everyday is good for you.
I wish you the best. It is good to journal sometimes to get it out. I am doing journaling and it helps me alot to write about what is happening in my sitch.
Keep the PMA going.
Journaling: Do you think happiness can actually make you stupid?
I ask because... I have been danged happy lately. Today was my Dad's birthday, and I was driving out to their house (about 32 miles from here), and there's this one section of the Highway that is an infamous speed trap where the speed limit goes from 65 to 55 and then to 45 MPH all in the space of about 200 ft while you are going down a hill.
So there I was driving down the road singing the theme song to "Sesame Street" without a care in the world and not noticing the cars behind and beside me were slowing down.
To make a long story even longer, I got the first speeding ticket I have got in 15 years for doing 65MPH in a 45 zone.
I handed the officer my license as he walked up, and he asked if I knew how fast I was going, and I said, "I'm sorry. I didn't even notice the signs, but I realized what was going on as soon as I saw you pulling out".
He asked, "Is there an emergency or anything where you need to get someplace in a hurry?"
I said, "No, I was just happy, singing the "Sesame Street" theme song, and I didn't notice I was already to the speed trap"
He thanked me for being so cooperative. Whatcha gonna do?
Happiness can make you stupid.
Journaling: Still feel great. Got a new front entry door. Life is good.
Time to fly to buy stuff for home-related projects.
Did I say life is good?
Nice to hear you're having a great weekend Time! Enjoy your projects!
Journaling: Feel kind of bad because I spoke in anger to a neighbor today.
I was walking my dogs through the neighborhood, and some woman was walking her dogs (both very large, one some kind of wolf hound mix), and her dogs were not on leashes and not staying close to her.
Her dogs came over to sniff my dogs. My oldest dog provokes fights by "staring" to assert his dominance, and my youngest dog is perfectly fine around other dogs unless they act aggressive toward her, and then she promptly red lines.
So there I was hoping the leashes or collars did not break as my dogs lost control and her dogs were a foot away or less, I am yelling "No", she is yelling at her dogs from across the street, and in the middle of the fear that I was about to have a mess on my hands, I yelled at her, "You know there's a leash law, right?".
She said, "I'm sorry I'm not from here".
I could have let it go at this point because her dogs moved on, but the adrenelin was still pumping, and I said, "Well, you need to put your dogs on leashes so I don't call the cops next time".
I feel pretty bad about that last comment.
Now, there are other folks who have those electronic collars instead of leashs around the neighborhood, and some that allow their dogs into their front yards without a leash. This is the first incident, and to be fair, I was more worried about my dogs provoking a fight, and then they were on leashes, so me controlling them if a fight started would be potentially harmful to them.
But I should not have spoken so much because I was angry and scared there for a minute. That sucks.
Don't worry about it. You were right. So don't feel bad. My daughter refused to walk her dog on a leash, and plenty of her neighbors yelled at her, even though her dog was just friendly and not at all aggressive. Less than a month after moving into the neighborhood with her dog, her dog was killed by a car. It's been a year, and she's still not over it. Walking a dog on a leash is good for everyone. You were doing that woman a favor, whether she knows it or not.
TH,
I agree. Let it go.
You were right.
Three times you mentioned how bad you feel about it. That says more about who you are than your (justified) actions and words at that moment do.
Angry and scared can be an overwhelming combination.
Peace,
Journaling; It really comes as no suprise at this point, but I think my M is a lost cause (it should have been over already, but that was delayed).
I was sitting here thinking about how many of my friends or members of my family try to tell me what I am thinking or feeling or what I should be thinking or feeling in any conversation where I didn't ask them for such input, and I couldn't come up with any.
It's unique to my STBXW. It's seeming that's just the way she is in long-term relationships: mind reading and invalidation ... to the point it causes serious problems.
Not much left for me there, I guess.
That is neither a happy nor sad realization. It's just an observation.
The key to moving forward (thought for the day):
1. Focus on the good things in your life and what you are doing to really 'live'.
2. Focus on the thing that you are doing to make your future better.
3. Focus on the good things in your past.
4. Spend less time focusing on negative things in the past.
5. Spend less time accepting that you cannot change the present or future.
Journaling:
STBXW asked her attorney yesterday to set the hearing date ASAP. It's a simple, uncontested D, so in a week she should become XW.
I am not suprised. When she first talked about reconciling, she refused MC and wanted to see "how she felt", and at first (because reuniting seemed exciting most likley), she said she was hopeful.
I am bad about following my own advice in that I know I should have backed off with no firm commitment and signs of problems. I accepted weekly dates that went from "fun and slightly romantic" to strained and almost forced in a very short time. In my bachelor life, I would have walked away early from somebody I was dating if every date seemed to be a step backward, but I didn't do that, and maybe it's for the best?
Last week things got really out of hand. She was back to "seeing signs" and attributing all sorts of meanings to synchronicities (re: confirmation bias in overdrive), and it was approaching the levels it did when she was having her failed, largely in her own head, online EA. I read this as, "if it's fate, then I am truly not responsible for my choices or actions".
My "reaction" to this escalation of "magical thinking" was not to back off (as I would tell anybody else). Tuesday I argued with her about it, and she predictably became more insistant to the point of offering dream-based revelations about how I would meet a woman with long-blond hair and a young daughter, and that we "would be very happy together".
Sigh.
So... Moving on without Mrs TimeHeals is my apparent future.
I accepted weekly dates that went from "fun and slightly romantic" to strained and almost forced in a very short time. In my bachelor life, I would have walked away early from somebody I was dating if every date seemed to be a step backward, but I didn't do that
What do you think was going on there, Time? What made them strained and feeling forced?
What do you think was going on there, Time? What made them strained and feeling forced?
On the first date (post going dark 6 weeks), she was excited, she smiled, she was positive. We shared a small kiss (the kind you might have on a 2nd or 3rd date with somebody new), and she was calling all of the time.
On the 2nd date, she invited me over to swim, she was then distant, I tried to kiss her before I left, and her body language was "full retreat".
On the third date, we watched a movie together, and parted without saying much. I called afterward to make sure she got home OK because she is afraid of being out late at night by herself.
Then things spiraled completely out of control: she sent dozens of emails, I sent about half as many replies, and every one of them was a step toward more and more distance and craziness.
The only thing left to do in the end was to agree that her decission to proceed with the divorce was probably for the best because, in her own words, she "didn't love" me, and I "wanted somebody who did" love me.
Sigh. So... Moving on without Mrs TimeHeals is my apparent future.
Sorry to hear it Time, and to hear the sad resignation in your voice. She obviously has great difficulty even knowing (let alone expressing) what's truly going on in her head and heart. Just protect yourself if you can. I'm sorry to hear of you getting yanked around like this.
You know what sucks?
Sometimes feeling that "something is broken and needs to be fixed now" and then realizing there's nothing to fix.
Sometimes feeling that "something is broken and needs to be fixed now" and then realizing there's nothing to fix.
Ouch. Yah. I really feel for you. That's got to be frustrating as h*ll. I hope you're still going to head out to see the crazy statue guy this weekend? Sounds like you could use a distraction; someplace to put that energy.
Ouch. Yah. I really feel for you. That's got to be frustrating as h*ll. I hope you're still going to head out to see the crazy statue guy this weekend? Sounds like you could use a distraction; someplace to put that energy.
It's a weird feeling. It's like the feeling you get in those dreams most of us have had at one point in our lives where something irreparable has happened, and you know it, but in your dream you go through awkard motions that you know are pointless, all things considered. It's that feeling: Nothing you can do will ever change what is broken.
Don't care for it much. Guess ... it's just a feeling, so it isn't going to kill me or anything.
It's the Fix It bug. Impossible to eradicate entirely, but tamed with a huge amount of self-control and self-love.
/quote]
It's a weird feeling. It's like the feeling you get in those dreams most of us have had at one point in our lives where something irreparable has happened, and you know it, but in your dream you go through awkard motions that you know are pointless, all things considered. It's that feeling: Nothing you can do will ever change what is broken.
I know that you know it isn't going to kill you, and I'm guessing you're not a big huggy type of person but ... ((((Time)))). If I could bake you a lasagna I would. I'm really sorry you're having a bad time.
I know that you know it isn't going to kill you, and I'm guessing you're not a big huggy type of person but ... ((((Time)))). If I could bake you a lasagna I would. I'm really sorry you're having a bad time.
Ehh, I appreciate your concern, and my appetite (if not my wasteline) appreciates the virtual lasagna, but I am already feeling better. The divorce stuff... well, I let my guard down, and I took it on the chin a few times. What can you say? All's fair in love and war, they say.
I'm feeling pretty good, so I got up before the referee could count to 2 this time
I have the Fix It bug, too. And it's hard having the feeling you need to fix something but it's not there to be fixed.
On another thread, folks were discussing where to go with their life, and how to think of it as a new chapter, and my response is today's journal entry:
I had those same thoughts, those same feelings, and I was telling myself the same thing until only a couple of days ago.
As I sat on my patio, I watched my two dogs "playing". They are shar-peis so "playing" resembles a dog fight minus the blood and chunks of fur flying.
And then it hit me. Ummm... I am just living my life. What I do in the next minute, hour, day or week isn't really of any monumental, life-changing consequence. I doubt anybody will want to write books about it.
Sure it's good to set goals, keep fit, stay rested, and make plans and enjoy life. Isn't that what everybody who isn't helplessly dysfunctional is doing anyway?
There is nothing that makes this moment in my life "more special" or signifant than any other time in my life. Imagining life having a ticking clock counting down the seconds of my life and driving a sense of urgency wasn't a good way to live my own life.
So I am getting divorced. So what? A woman I thought I loved and who I thought loved me didn't love me anymore. Big deal.
And then I continued to sit there watching the dogs while I finished my morning coffee.
Hey TimeHeals,
Thanks for your advice; all of this stuff is tough. I know your advice is probbly right. No R talk & stick to our S.
We were going to meet Mon. After I get out of work, But not sure as I have a 5pg. term paper due Tues & need to focus. I think I will push it to Fri. I'm going to post a new thread "Need Advice for Monday" I just want to get more thoughts and advice.
Ehh, I appreciate your concern, and my appetite (if not my wasteline) appreciates the virtual lasagna, but I am already feeling better. ... I got up before the referee could count to 2 this time
Not surprised to hear it actually. You sound like the resilient sort. Just take care not to let your experiences make you too tough, hey Time? The right one will come along one of these days. Try to keep your heart open...I'd hate for you to miss out.
I had those same thoughts, those same feelings, and I was telling myself the same thing until only a couple of days ago.
As I sat on my patio, I watched my two dogs "playing". They are shar-peis so "playing" resembles a dog fight minus the blood and chunks of fur flying.
And then it hit me. Ummm... I am just living my life. What I do in the next minute, hour, day or week isn't really of any monumental, life-changing consequence. I doubt anybody will want to write books about it.
Sure it's good to set goals, keep fit, stay rested, and make plans and enjoy life. Isn't that what everybody who isn't helplessly dysfunctional is doing anyway?
There is nothing that makes this moment in my life "more special" or signifant than any other time in my life. Imagining life having a ticking clock counting down the seconds of my life and driving a sense of urgency wasn't a good way to live my own life.
So I am getting divorced. So what? A woman I thought I loved and who I thought loved me didn't love me anymore. Big deal.
And then I continued to sit there watching the dogs while I finished my morning coffee.
This is brilliant and true TH, thank you for that.
Try to keep your heart open...I'd hate for you to miss out.
I believe my heart is open. I just took a few steps backward this week only to rediscover that they only way to let go is to... let go
I believe my heart is open.
Glad to hear it. I think I'd just gotten a little concerned when I read this...
So I am getting divorced. So what? A woman I thought I loved and who I thought loved me didn't love me anymore. Big deal.
So often I hear of people trying to suppress their hurt feelings by denying that the cause of them meant anything to them in the first play - that 'Yah you hurt me but I don't care about you anyways' response, you know? Was just worried that this may be where you'd been heading. But it's so hard to tell from someone's writings sometimes - it only gives part of the whole story right? Anyways hope your weekend is going well, hope you got out to see the crazy statue guy.
Take care. PG.
TH,
Remember when you let go, have someplace soft to land. Recoil is a bitch...
Remember when you let go, have someplace soft to land. Recoil is a bitch...
I have a cool crib, two dogs with a ton of character who love me to death, my parents and a future of whatever opportunities I choose to expose myself to, so I think I'll be OK.
Journaling:
Thought for the day: "Change vs Progress"
People often mistake change for progress. Without an eye toward likely future consequences, it's very possible to make change that is going backward.
We see this often with WAS that go on a self-destructive bent when they leave their marriages: they may be changing, but sometimes they are definitely not making progress.
On the other hand, we see LBSs who refuse to embrace change who just get stuck, and this can turn into a fruitless excercise with mounting legal fees, cancelled non-refundable "romatic" vacations that are ill-conceived attempts at rekindling the flame of romance when there is nothing left there, and so on.
In the latter case, embracing change--within reason and with an eye always toward efforts likely to yeild positive results--is the best path to progress.
In my personal case, I think I fall into the latter category. There is nothing left to be gained from not embracing the change, and there is much to be lost (time, money, peace of mind) by resisting change.
In the latter case, embracing change--within reason and with an eye always toward efforts likely to yeild positive results--is the best path to progress.
In my personal case, I think I fall into the latter category. There is nothing left to be gained from not embracing the change, and there is much to be lost (time, money, peace of mind) by resisting change.
I like this. Unfortunately, some people just have a really hard time with change. My H for one gets completely stressed out. The bigger the change the bigger the stress.
We can't control everything. We can make goals and make efforts to reach them, but if the universe throws a wrench in your plans maybe there's a reason.
Enjoy the journey, not the destination.
Morning Time, sorry to interrupt. Any chance you might have a moment to stop by my thread? If not no worries. Take care. PG.
Thank you for listening, and for your help today Time, I really appreciated it.
Time, that makes sense. Appreciate your thoughtful posts.
Gatsby11 is trying to drop the rope in Newcomers... I wonder if you could look at the last couple of pages of her sitch and offer up comment. I meant to put you in that list of vets
In the latter case, embracing change--within reason and with an eye always toward efforts likely to yeild positive results--is the best path to progress.
In my personal case, I think I fall into the latter category. There is nothing left to be gained from not embracing the change, and there is much to be lost (time, money, peace of mind) by resisting change.
I like this. Unfortunately, some people just have a really hard time with change. My H for one gets completely stressed out. The bigger the change the bigger the stress.
We can't control everything. We can make goals and make efforts to reach them, but if the universe throws a wrench in your plans maybe there's a reason.
Enjoy the journey, not the destination.
Very true, both posts. I'm one who resists change and need to embrace the fact I can't control everything. Getting there I hope, slowly but surely.
I had the vets thread removed because I felt there was too much revealing information on there, and I was going public with some of you folks on the alt.
I admire the fact that so many folks here have fought so hard for their marriages. It restores my faith in the depth of human bonds.
Sometimes those efforts are successful in restoring a marriage, sometimes what looks successful at first doesn't stick, and sometimes the marriage isn't restored.
I think, however, that the fight is a good one so long as it isn't about outright denial about what is happening. I have learned a lot on this forum (and I have a lot left to learn no doubt).
My marriage, however, has moved from limboland onto the fast track to dissolution, and I think I just have to accept that. That doesn't mean I won't wonder about how it all happened sometimes, and that doesn't mean I won't have sad moments (especially around key events like the upcoming "getting served" and the eventual dissolution).
Sometimes things just don't turn out the way we might have wanted them to turn out. I know that it's not over until it's over, and I know that even then it's not over for some folks (especially those with kids). For me, on the other hand, I have to start living my life like it is over.
I will probably continue to post here even though some of this stuff is hard to read in the context of my personal situation, but I think it's OK for ME to let go.
Just read your initial start to this thread after seeing you post on mza8 thread.
Have you friended me on the alt?
greatday tobe alive
Journaling:
Monday STBXW called and wanted to "go do something". I asked her if she was up for a field trip. We went to Tennessee Safari Park.
I was licked by a girraffe and was uncomfortably close to a very hungry osterich while there. STBXW wanted to adopt an affectionate camel
So... long story made short: today she is putting big-D back on hold for now. We are going to Hot Springs, AR the weekend of the 24th to see the balloon festival and a free Clint Black concert. Got a nice suite on the other side of the lake there. Never been to Hot Springs before.
Looks like you are making serious progress.
Keep it up!
TH, that is awesome. Hot Springs sounds fun
We are going to Hot Springs, AR the weekend of the 24th
Go to the Brau House and see if a band called "The Itinerant Locals" are playing.
www.polkayoureyeoutYou won't be disappointed.
Awesome TH!!!! Thank you for all your constructive criticism with my sitch. Been there on a harley ride a few years back, I think I remember the place Coach is talking about.
How come folks here don't argue with you much when you start trying to get them to refocus their perspective?
I try to make it all about them. Why it's good for them, how it will help and put it in context. Facts and figures are great for debates not for relationships.
After leaving the Air Force (non-emotional career) and getting into the Fin Advisor (money very emotional) business taught me to make my appointments with clients all about them and what they want to talk about. They listen to me when after I listen and understand them.
TH,
Glad to hear that your sitch is progressing positively.
Outstanding TH! So awesome that she approached you, wanting to "Do Something"
The safari sounds like a fun time, even if those pesky critters don't respect personal boundaries! Enjoy Hot Springs...
Journaling:
Today, I have a date. STBXW and I will work out together, go to brunch, and then attend a local festival that includes "the running of the weenies" (dachsund's racing to raise money for charity), crafts, and so on.
The sun is shining, the sky is clear, there's a cool breeze, and "The Future's So Bright, I Gotta Wear Shades".
Y'all have a good one.
Good luck TH, have fun on your date
Good luck TH, have fun on your date
Thanks, Darlin'
I most certainly will... just for you
Time, how did it go? Sounds like you two feel comfortable together, even having a bit of fun?
Yeah, it was a good day.
We went to the weight room at W's apartment complex and used the Body Solid equipment, back to her apartment for showers, then a little romance, then went to brunch, then watched weiner dogs (dachsunds) race for charities, then she came to my house and watched the dogs, then we went out for fast food.
It was a very fun and romantic day, and it worse us both out (physically).
Hey Time,
I'm very glad to hear that your sitch is improving so dramatically. Just when you seemed to have given-up all hope and accepted that you needed to move on, things changed again.
What happened between 8/24 & 9/8 that made your W reconsider? Were you just dark?
I have been separated for 2 weeks now and there has been very little contact between W and I. Only about the kids. I am struggling very much with this situation at the moment and try to take heart from the developments in your sitch, but I just don't see it happening with mine.
I have been GAL pretty much and I have a great house to live in, but this was my first week-end alone and I took it hard at times. I guess I just need to find more things to do.
Sorry to ramble on about my sitch here, just looking for some advice from someone who seems to be handling this better than I am.
Again, congratulations on your progress.
err.. "wore" us both out physically
Coffee working now
What happened between 8/24 & 9/8 that made your W reconsider? Were you just dark?
Her perspective changed.
I am sure it had nothing whatsoever to do with anything I did.
I had said "We're not going to be buddies" to her "let's be friends" speech. I went out and had a good time, decided no matter what I was having a good life.
Day after my birthday, she brought me a sandwich for my B-day.
I have just been happy, so it was no big deal to be charming in some of our interactions (not hard to do when you aren't having to deal with being attacked).
Honestly, I have changed, and she is changing. That's what I think it is anyway.
TH,
Congratulations on the progress. It appears as you really let go that your sitch began to improve. Keep progressing.
Congrats, TH -- well-deserved!!!
Puppy
Be prepared for some spew. Had a good day now you will be tested. It's just part of the process.
Cheers
Dan, I should add that my W and I seperated on 5/25, and we didn't speak after 5/27 until mid July, so there was a period of about 6 weeks of darkness where I just worked on getting my own danged mojo back, started a new fitness routine, started making near-term plans for my own future, talked to a therapist and so on.
It's been a long road, and I was certain my marriage was over more than once, and even now I don't know even though we are getting along better than we ever have.
The divorce has been placed on-hold twice now (first time extended from August to September, and now it has been delayed indefintely--our dissolution agreement expires after 6 months).
Thanks TH. I appreciate your experience and insight.
Dan, I should add that my W and I seperated on 5/25, and we didn't speak after 5/27 until mid July, so there was a period of about 6 weeks of darkness where I just worked on getting my own danged mojo back, started a new fitness routine, started making near-term plans for my own future, talked to a therapist and so on.
It's been a long road, and I was certain my marriage was over more than once, and even now I don't know even though we are getting along better than we ever have.
The divorce has been placed on-hold twice now (first time extended from August to September, and now it has been delayed indefintely--our dissolution agreement expires after 6 months).
It is quite amazing how this stuff works. Although I am not physically separated and never was, I spent my time reading DR, hanging around here and enjoying my moments at home alone while W was running around town with her drinking buddies.
We did not really speak for months. Before I ended up in here I did not know how to properly detach but my brain told me to leave her alone and just watch from the distance.
So now after I announced that I may be moving out of town alltogether things have changed.
We're getting along well, the family is back in the picture. Last night W dropped in my lap again for a neck massage.
It is a strange journey and I would go crazy if I would try read into every little sign, but I won't.
Focusing on the process not the outcome. Tryng to keep that catnip on me at all times.
TH,
The absolutely no communication between you and your W? Did it drive you crazy or did you totally focus on GAL and detaching? I am on my 10th week of NC from my W and slowly getting better.
Last night W dropped in my lap again for a neck massage.
And you did this for free?
Last night W dropped in my lap again for a neck massage.
And you did this for free?
Of course not. Had steamers, lobster and steak, creme brulee with some Louis XIII for dessert. All on her.
Last night W dropped in my lap again for a neck massage.
And you did this for free?
It has to be done for free or it doesn't count. Were you expecting a BJ in return maybe? That, apparently, was my problem with my W!!! Or rather ONE of her problems with me.
I focused on... living and rediscovering my own happiness and so on. As I said, I thought my marriage was over, and I was 99.99% certain it was.
It turns out, I can be happy no matter what. Who knew?
pookie,
You are one of a kind...takes some tips from TH. If I remembered your W did a little shimmy the other day that had you befuddled.
It turns out, I can be happy no matter what. Who knew?
You focused on what and what happened? GTFOH!!!
pookie,
You are one of a kind...takes some tips from TH. If I remembered your W did a little shimmy the other day that had you befuddled.
That was then.
I was resolute. No creme brulee and Louis XIII - no rub.
It turns out, I can be happy no matter what. Who knew?
You focused on what and what happened? GTFOH!!!
I am calling the Department of the Obvious.
It turns out, I can be happy no matter what. Who knew?
You focused on what and what happened? GTFOH!!!
Well, watching old Cary Grant movies, the new fitness routine, the Zimbardo book, and making all those "gratitude lists" helped a lot
TH,
So during this 6 week NC you only focued on GAL and detaching and did not work a communication counter insurgency (a little spy joke). So how different are you know than you were when your sitch began?
So during this 6 week NC you only focued on GAL and detaching and did not work a communication counter insurgency (a little spy joke). So how different are you now than you were when your sitch began?
When the situation began (October 2009), I was angry, I insisted that "we work on things", I begged, I reasoned, then I was just angry and sad. For a while (oct-dec) I drank too much.
Philip Zimbardo helped me learn how to focus my perspective, and Cary Grant is still teaching me how to be more playful and provocative (re flirt) while still having some "class".
Here's a secret: my FSTBXW (formerly STBXW) is a magical person in so many ways, and I learned how to say it and be playful and charming about it.
He learned how to read his woman.
Philip Zimbardo helped me learn how to focus my perspective
ever watched his Ted Talks?
www.ted.com
ever watched his Ted Talks?
Yep, it was you posting links to those that inspired me to talk about buying "The Time Paradox", and through a fortunate turn of events (I had a birthday and had posted those on FB), I was gifted that book and several others
Countdown to Hot Springs micro vacation begins. T minus 3.5 days and counting.
W came over and spent the night Friday and Saturday. We went sight-seeing locally, went to a flea market, went and saw a movie, had Indian food for lunch, had a simple dinner here and watched a DVD, went on a long walk, and so on.
Nice weekend all-in-all. W is wearing her wedding rings again.
Great TH, I'm very glad to hear that things are looking up. It's good to be on that path, even if it's not perfect, you know that you're going there and the journey is what counts.
Sounds like you had a very fun weekend, TH
Enjoy your vacation.
Nice weekend all-in-all. W is wearing her wedding rings again.
Wow. Wow. That's just great Time. Glad to hear it. Hope you enjoy your mini-vacay coming up. You deserve it. Cheers and thanks as always, for all your help. FMV.
Every time I read something like this, it gives me just a little sliver of hope. Good for you!
I know you have put in your hard work and it hasn't been easy. Maybe my hard work is just beginning. Sometimes I can't see the forest for the trees.
Keep doing the right thing. You have my prayers.
Thanks for the well wishes. Going slow and easing back into this right now. "Letting the rose bloom in its own time" if you will.
I suppose we could have had one huge talk up front, but so far things are getting checked off the list of things that need to be done before reconcilling.
The one I am unsure of exactly what I am going to do is the whole therapy angle. At some point, there's gotta be something, and I don't want anything where we sit around and talk about our problems and keep opening old wounds. I want something more geared toward building a better relationship, and that's about it. Now, if she wants to do IC, then that's fine with me. Couldn't hurt. Barring that, this is just going to take a while, I expect.
The rose is just beginning to bud.
The rose is just beginning to bud.
Don't let your dogs pee on it.
Maybe my hard work is just beginning
You never know. You have to be prepared to go on alone, I think, and be happy anyway.
It has certainly been an eventful year.
The one I am unsure of exactly what I am going to do is the whole therapy angle. At some point, there's gotta be something, and I don't want anything where we sit around and talk about our problems and keep opening old wounds.
There must be some therapists in your area that use MWD's 'solution oriented (or focussed?) brief' therapy... isn't that what she calls it? As far as I understand, it's about the 'here and now' problems. They don't even get into the stuff that's done and gone. Besides, if it's going well right now, just the two of you, you don't have to make a decision on it yet.
It has certainly been an eventful year.
And that, ladies and gentlemen, is the understatement of the year!!
I have a few minutes between meetings, so journaling:
T-minus 2.5 days and counting to the Hot Springs micro-vacation.
W is sending lots of emails lately. Got a few Tiggers in my email. Tigger makes me smile. I have a "gigantical" smile right now
Day is good. Life is good. Pretty calm day, and nothing untoward to report.
TH,
I am envious! Have a great time and thank you for your support!
Got a few Tiggers in my email. Tigger makes me smile.
Tigger?! You mean the
'The wonderful thing about Tiggers Is Tiggers are wonderful things; Their tops are made out of rubber; Their bottoms are made out of springs' kind of Tigger? If so, well then no wonder you're smilin! Tigger's groovy.
More importantly, Tigger is Ginormously Fantabulous
More importantly, Tigger is Ginormously Fantabulous
LOL! Glad you're having a good day Time.
LOL! Glad you're having a good day Time
Thanks,
I am, and as you can see, I have Completified a Grrreat course on Tigger and now speak it fluently
Well, TTFN!
LOL! Glad you're having a good day Time
Thanks,
I am, and as you can see, I have Completified a Grrreat course on Tigger and now speak it fluently
Well, TTFN!
This is ridicarus!!!
Why yes it is! This is what tiggers do best! What a minute... "ridicarus" means "good", right?
Whoo-hoo-hoo-hoo-hoo!
Journaling: This is the spell-checked version of something that found its way into a response early this morning, and its topic was the same as the name of this thread, so I am including it as today's entry.
At some point, you will begin to understand that the root of all of the negative emotions (e.g. anger) is "fear". Fear can be a healthy response when you are threatened by real physical violence, robbery, and so on. That is a very temporary thing however.
What is the process of "Letting go"?
The fear, anger, regret, resentment, and so on ... that you feel are not who YOU are. It's OK to feel them. In fact, the only way to move beyond them is to feel them and understand that they are part of your unconscious mind at work. You should always be aware of what you are feeling, and then understand that these emotions would like to take over, but they cannot do that unless you begin to identify with them. They are like demons that want to take over. So feel them, understand them, and know that when you are able to watch them when you feel them, they lose their power to take over. They cannot withstand the light, so to speak. So long as you are aware, and you watch them, they lose their power to control you.
Likewise, your ego is not really who YOU are either, but it wants you to think it is YOU. Your ego is a tool, but it is insecure because it fears its own annihilation constantly. You ego cannot exist in the present, the NOW. It cannot exist without TIME. The ego is rooted in the past and visions of the future.
You need your ego to set goals, make reasonable plans, to learn from your past. It is who you are when you are "thinking", when your mind is busy, but it is not who you are when you are in the moment. It is a tool, but it is a tool that ceases to be when you are not thinking about the past or the future, so it would like you to believe it is who YOU are so it can stick around.
So you have the unconscious emotional patterns that want to take you over so they can continue to exist, and your ego would like to keep you constantly in the past or the future so that it can always exist, but then... there is who YOU are when you are just living in the moment.
So... getting back to letting go.
You have to be able to live in the only real time that there ever is: NOW. The past and the future do not ever actually exist. The past is filtered memories, the future is hopeful or fearful fantasy, but the only time you can DO anything is NOW, and the trick to letting go is that you have to be aware of who you are when your ego is silent, when the demons of your unconscious mind have been put to rest, and when you are just living in the NOW, when you are just "being".
I don't usually waste much time trying to explain all of where I am coming from to people here. I usually ask folks to try to make gratitude lists (list 10 things for which you are grateful. do this every day for a month).
The point of the gratitude lists is to shift your "mind" (ego) to start noticing the good things in life. But to really, really experience joy, you have to be in the present moment, your ego has to be silent, and you have to overcome identifying with your negative emotional patterns. You have to just be. The gratitude lists are a nice stepping stone to the NOW and letting go.
It's a nice day, isn't it?
Yes, it is a nice day! Do you talk to your wife about these types of things? If so, is that a new thing for your relationship?
TH,
ATF needs to read that.
Just read it. Is it bad to be envious of his state of mind and bettering sitch?
ATF
Just read it. Is it bad to be envious of his state of mind and bettering sitch?
ATF
No. Take an example and lead.
It is bad to tell yourself "I can't do it. I just can't."
You can.
Look ATF. Most of us here arrived hysterical, depressed, angry and confused. You can only control yourself. It will get better. Trust me.
“Envy consists in seeing things never in themselves, but only in their relations. If you desire glory, you may envy Napoleon, but Napoleon envied Caesar, Caesar envied Alexander, and Alexander, I daresay, envied Hercules, who never existed.”Bertrand Russell
Is it bad to be envious of his state of mind and bettering sitch?
Bad? Your ego is telling you, "I will be happy if only...". It isn't making you happy
Your ego is useful. It helps you make plans, helps you learn from the past, but it's lying to you about being really happy. You can be happy right now just by not identifying with your ego and your fear.
Where your ego can help you: your marriage will not improve if a few things don't happen.
1. Your wife needs to let go of her affair: no contact, no totems or trophies.
2. You don't respect yourself enough to set clear boundaries and enforce them (e.g. No Contact, no sweatshirt). You are to the enforcing them point, so you need to make decissions about how you are going to enforce your boundaries. Initiating divorce, initiating short-selling your house and asking her to find her own living arrangements while you do the same? These are things to discuss in MC).
3. If you aren't happy, it won't improve either.
So... getting back to letting go.
You have to be able to live in the only real time that there ever is: NOW. The past and the future do not ever actually exist. The past is filtered memories, the future is hopeful or fearful fantasy, but the only time you can DO anything is NOW, and the trick to letting go is that you have to be aware of who you are when your ego is silent, when the demons of your unconscious mind have been put to rest, and when you are just living in the NOW, when you are just "being".
Over this past year as I've finally started really letting go, I have felt this very thing happening, more and more. I'm happy just hanging by myself sometimes, I don't fear the future, and I don't beat the dead horse of the past any more. It's a good thing.
ATF,
Anger, envy, happiness - they are all emotions.
When dealing with emotions, don’t ignore it, avoid it, dismiss it, and especially don't suppress the emotions. Instead, we acknowledge it’s existence, and take note of what it is trying to tell you and move along by responding to the message in an objective manner.
Anger, envy, happiness - they are all emotions.
Yes they are. But the negative emotions are all rooted in fear.
When dealing with emotions, don’t ignore it, avoid it, dismiss it, and especially don't suppress the emotions. Instead, we acknowledge it’s existence, and take note of what it is trying to tell you and move along by responding to the message in an objective manner.
I use the comparrison of a demon for the negative emotional patterns for a reason: if you fight a demon, you make it stronger. The way to overcome the demon is just to recognize it for what it is and not identify with it. I feel angry. I am not Anger.
Feeling the anger is like "watching" it
It is not who I am.
So basically, yes. No stuffing feelings, no ignoring them, etc.
I feel angry. I am not Anger.
Feeling the anger is like "watching" it
It is not who I am.
Yes, it's like becoming a 3rd person observing yourself.
What the heck is going on here?
What happened?
How is this person feeling?
Why is he feeling that way?
What does he believe to feel that way?
What would he rather want?
What would make him feel better?
What would I do?Snap right out of it - works for me.
Now you see why I sometimes jump in the middle of the chaos filled with angst and despair and crack a off the wall joke.
It breaks the pattern and won't stress myself for feeling the pain of others on these threads.
At times it may seem inappropriate but if it breaks the cycle and puts a smile on someone's face, it's all good.
In any case it makes ME feel good.
Journaling:
Dogs got me up EARLY this AM. Just as well because we have to get their walk done before the painter gets here to look at the house so that he can get back to me with an estimate for painting the exterior trim and shutters.
Getting ready for Hot Springs trip today. I went to pick out some new clothes last night at the mall. Met W there, and we walked over and ate at the food court together.
Lots to do today with work, domestic stuff, trip prep, and so on. I'll try to keep up
Ooh you're gonna have fun on your trip! New clothes are always exciting (especially for women) Haha.
TH, can you post in my thread please? Thanks.
Dogs walked, check.
Things packed, check.
I'm headed out today. Stay well folks!
Have an excellent trip TH!
Still in Hot Springs. The Free Clint Black concert was pretty good Friday night.
Having a good time. Will try to check in more with db folks on Monday.
Awesome Bud. Keep enjoying it.
Journaling: W gets off work soon. Sent her an email at work that said, "Green Bamboo [included link to the Vietnamese restaurant]. I'll meet you at your place after work, and we'll go there together? Me love you long time.".
Going out in a bit.
Glad to hear things are going well for you TH. you deserve it. Sorry I haven't kept-up with your sitch, but things have been crazy for me lately.
Anyway, keep enjoying your life!
but things have been crazy for me lately.
"When the going gets weird, the weird go pro.", Hunter S. Thompson.