1st thread:
Speeding Cars2nd thread:
My Glass is Almost Empty3rd thread:
Weight of the World..and here we are.
(and I found the smileys!)
Thread title is a Jars of Clay song:
Fare thee well
Trading all our words for tea and sympathy
Wonder why we tried for things that could never be
Play our hearts lament, like an unrehearsed symphony
Not intend
To leave this castle full of empty rooms
Our love the captive in the tower never rescued
And all the victory songs
Seem to be playing out of tune
'Cause it's not the way that it has to be
Don't trade our love for tea and sympathy, no
And it's not the way that it has to be
You begin
And all your words fall to the floor and break like china cups
And the waitress grabs a broom and tries to sweep them up
I reach for my tea and slowly drink in
'Cause it's not the way that it has to be
Don't trade our love for tea and sympathy, no
And it's not the way that it has to be
Don't trade our love for tea and sympathy (don't trade)
Fare thee well
Words the bag of leaves that fill my head
I could taste the bitterness and call the waitress instead
'Cause she holds the answer,
Smiles and asks one teaspoon or two
Don't trade us for tea and Sympathy
We can work it out Will be back later, but was shocked to be locked (rhyme!)
Just curious, how in the world do you know the words to so many songs?
Hey BI,
How are you today?
Hope all is well.
Theoden
Just curious, how in the world do you know the words to so many songs?
I'm going to guess a lyrics website
working nights this week; will post when I am home and rested, i promise.
theoden, we have much to discuss my friend. i have not forgotten that
mamabear:
http://www.lyrics007.comi have not forgotten ya'll. lots going on internally, and lots to process. again. it never ends.
BI,
Yes, I'd like to get perspective, too. I'm working this out for myself by sharing my own DB experiences.
I haven't posted my long situation yet but will muster up the courage to do so pretty soon.
I come here to encourage others. But it breaks my heart to read people's stories. It really does. I know the pain of freaking out and feeling like your whole world is upside down. I know the weirdness of talking to a Christian spouse and suddenly realizing that nothing Jesus said about divorce seems to matter to someone who has professed him as Lord and Savior. I know the pain of temptation, when, month after month, you just want your spouse to touch you with some measure of passion and interest without having to intiate it or ask them to.
Yeah..and DB is the hardest thing I've ever done.
--Theoden
Ya'll, I have to sleep -again- as I have to work tonight. But I did get to the gym today, yay me! I miss being able to go more than twice a week (stupid night shift)
I'm working on finishing a post for the blog, and will have it up within the hour (I hope). Have several days off after tonight, finally! and should be able to post more here over the weekend. stay tuned.
Anyway, found this story last night, and it just tickled me. It's clever, but I also want this kind of attitude
An old man lived alone in Minnesota.He wanted to spade his potato garden, but it was very hard work. His only son, who would have helped him, was in prison.The old man wrote a letter to his son and mentioned his situation:
==========
Dear Son,
I am feeling pretty bad because it looks like I won,t be able to plant my potato garden this year. I hate to misdoing the garden, because your mother always loved planting time. I'm just getting too old to be digging up a garden plot. If you were here, all my troubles would be over.
I know you would dig the plot for me if you weren't in the prison.
Love,
Dad
=============
Shortly, the old man received this telegram:
============
"For Heaven's sake, Dad, don't dig up the garden!! That's where I buried the GUNS!!"
============
At 4 am the next morning, a dozen FBI agents and local police officers showed up and dug up the entire garden without finding any guns.
Confused,the old man wrote another note to his son telling him what happened and asked him what to do next.
His son's reply was:
=============
"Go ahead and plant your potatoes, Dad. It's the best I could do for you from here."
=============
NO MATTER WHERE YOU ARE IN THE WORLD, IF YOU HAVE DECIDED TO DO SOMETHING DEEP FROM YOUR HEART, YOU CAN DO IT. IT IS THE THOUGHT THAT MATTERS NOT WHERE YOU ARE.
Attitude is Everything...
Posted on the blog and wanted to share it here. Will also share more directly HERE now that I have some time off to do so (WOO!); need to get to sleep so I'm more on a normal sleep/wake cycle for my time off. Something really crappy happened to H tonight and I want to talk about it with my friends here, so I'll save that for a time OTHER than almost 1am
Sat in Any Chairs Lately?
When I started this blog last year, I had the intent of telling 1) The Story of Me and 2) why I started this introspection: the bomb blast of the adultery. My husband was amazing, I think: in the middle of his own pain and mistrust, he agreed to start sharing his part of our story here - since our perspectives are so different on separate sides of the blast.
We both had gaping wounds, each inflicted by the other. Both. Of. Us. I cannot emphasize this enough. Gaping, bloody ones with jagged edges. The kind of wounds that have to heal from the inside out, and will not knit together in a pretty thin line.
We were trying to process our new-to-us lives the best we knew how, while walking around like those zombies from Michael Jackson's "Thriller" video. We were in counseling together. We talked more, instead of just the necessary running-the-household-and-raising-kids conversations. There was guarded effort toward a better marriage on both our parts. We were not moving very fast, but there was wee snail movement toward a different and better relationship.
We each bemoaned the fact that I'm doing the best I can ... I'm doing all I can do ... Our counselor called bullsh!t on that right quick-like. We were each doing what we were willing to do at that point in time, but we were not doing everything we could have done for each other. Doing so would have involved a leap of faith that would cause extreme discomfort for each of us, considering our FOO and individual baggage.
Relational intimacy was hard for us in the best of times, much less in an aftermath of emotional gore like we were experiencing. Therefore, we wanted better, but could not/would not make the leap to getting it.
It's akin to an analogy I heard about faith in God; I think this was a Frank Peretti anecdote. He spoke about believing in God in the same way you believe in that chair across the room. Yes, that's a chair, it has four legs and a seat. Looks sturdy.
Yes, but will you go SIT in it?
You can lip-service all day, and intellectually drone on about the engineering of the chair and how it is structured to hold you up. But when the rubber hits the road, will you go over there and trust it to hold your weight?
There's the test, I think. And while I failed it for most of my life, I'm seeing how not sitting in the chair, from a place of relative "safety" across the room, is ultimately not in my best interest. Comfortable is not working.
I need to leap. I need to sit in the chair and trust it to hold me up. God is big enough to hold me and my baggage. He won't drop me. I know that intellectually. I do believe it. But I haven't walked over to sit in the chair. I haven't leapt in my faith. Shame on me.
I didn't leap in my marriage relationship, pre- or post-bomb. I waited to see if it was safe. I'll step here, if you'll go first. If you will, I will. Oddly enough, our relationship together started as a testimony to leaps of faith, of love. Probably the first and only time either of us stretched like that, before or since. And doing so rewarded both of us. It's astounding, in retrospect, how love moved us big time. Mightily.
Then it got less and less comfortable to make big steps. Always glancing out of our peripheral vision at each other: what's he/she doing? because if he/she's not making an effort to [whatever], i'm not stepping out by myself. Ugh. It's exhausting to look to someone else to guide your steps (or your non-steps).
Eventually we quit sharing our hearts at all. Married to a relative stranger. Familiar only in the routine of life, but not where it counts. Ya'll know.
Do I need to be looking to another person to guide my steps? No. I need to look away from the other side of the bed and look up. That's where my hope is. I'm just now figuring that out in a real way, not just a yeah, i know that kind of way.
When my husband was actively posting here, and we were routinely discussing our relationship together IRL, it was okay to blog the adultery and stories about him - or at least fairer. And while I hope it isn't always the case, he no longer posts his story/firsthand wisdom here, and we don't discuss Big Picture Issues daily. Because of that, it seems less 'okay' to blog about those things currently. I could be wrong, but we'll go with it for now.
I do want to tell you more about my husband as a person, what made me love him from the get-go. What contributes to why I still can. Just so you don't know him only as 'the adulterer'. Because that's not fair, and not who he is. I've posted a lot about my pain, because, hello, it is very real (see above reference to jagged wounds). But so is his.
I don't intend to go down the rabbit holes of my marriage and adultery specifically as the Main Plot Point to my blog. That's not to say I won't talk about either, or both, in relation to my story, or throw some lyrics into the mix that mean something to me personally. But I have a plethora of my own issues to work through, back stories of crazy-making and poor judgments that contributed to my unique chaos, and eventually helped lead to problems in my marriage. That's what I intended to do initially, and I hope to get back on track. Stay tuned.
BI,
What's your blog? Can we access it?
Hi Theo! I should have it in my sig, but those 2 bible verses are too important to me to leave out, and I'm at the max characters.
Anyway:
http://instepford.blogspot.comMUCH to tell you; later tonight. D7 has a friend over and waiting for her to be picked up. Will update tonight!
I don't want to be credited.
I was only joking.
Please edit.
Amy,
"Please edit" as in remove your words from the blog? Just need clarification; let me know!! [yes, in some areas, i need you to hold my hand and use small words. forgive me]
this is from Theoden on my last thread. Will address it after my update to follow.
God loves the raise the dead. He loves impossible situations. It's only when you are hopeless (in your own abilities) that you can really start to have hope (in Him). So start hoping again, because it looks like God is at work in your situation. I feel it.
First of all, I diagree with your counselor. If you've forgiven your husband for the A, then what grounds do you have to leave him? I'm speaking biblically. You can do what you want, but I'm asking you to think.
Second of all, I don't think your husband is leaving you anytime soon. He wants to work this out, he just hates himself right now. And yes, it sucks not having affection back. I know what that feels like. But thank God, you have time.
Thirdly. I think if you really GAL and start to to be fulfilled indepdendently of him, you will begin to attract him. People aren't attracted to drowning, upset, needy people. And also GAL can be spiritual growth. Maybe allowing Christ to be your righteousness, joy, peace and worth will begin to let you loosen the pressure on your husband. If you cup is full with Christ, then your husband won't feel that he needs to conform to your expectations in order for you to be happy. And that's sexy. You can be joyful in Christ even if hubby doesn't hug you tonight.
You know what helped me? Excercize and painting religious icons and...Writing down every night before I sleep at least 5 things I am thankful for that day. It can be small stuff: the salad I had for lunch, the smile I shared with my wife, etc. After 2-3 weeks I went from being morbid to being joyful and buoyant. But write it down. I also see a great Christian counselor who recommended a book: Authentic Happiness. He helped me climb out of a depression. He also recommended vitamins/supplements that could help my dark moods.
So..what are some GAL ideas for you? They don't need to be expensive.
Also, did you try Michelle's idea of writing down what you want from your husband in small, bit-sized, goals? And then asking him when you are both in an OK mood?
Keep at it hun. You are amazing for trying this.
Okee dokee. Had lots more to say, but there's a new development that could push this off the fence. Dang, it's been some horror show every 3 months.
SO. My faithful followers (bless you! ::waving::) know that H lost his job b/c of the A, and that I turned him in. Horrible stuff. Big debris and disaster.
H was a mgr. over 3 other people he loved dearly. He's been in and out of touch with them over the last year, due to most people dropping him like a hot potato of leprosy. I have been disgusted at the way folks have run screaming away from him, as if it would rub off. Anyway, I digress.
He has been slooooooowly rebuilding some of these relationships. not all, but some. and it's been with much hesitation. he was SO hurt by their abandonment in the most dark times, that he's like a skittish animal with them (and me). His whole world fell apart, he's unemployed, we live in a small town, loss of dignity/integrity, etc. There is much more to this, layer-wise, but just go with me for now as I'm trying to be brief-ish.
He had gone to lunch with a female co-worker, AND HER FIANCE, all perfectly okay. And had been emailing her about her son's basketball schedule, and a bit of his struggle, she with hers. No, I'm not entirely comfortable with it; it's not inappropriate at all, the content, just that I feel (and thought he did too) that if it's much deeper than the weather, you need not be sharing that stuff outside of your M. It's what happened with his A, and he later realized he didn't have clear boundaries. I thought he would have better ones by now, since he's previously spoke of it, but perhaps not? AND the fact that he wasn't communicating with ME recently, this stuff, so it actually was deficient over here in the M, yet he's sharing with another female. ::ding, ding:::some red flags and bells.
So he was going to meet them for lunch again this week, and gets an email from her last night that says she was 'informed' that corresponding with him is not such a good idea. Frankly, it's a bit of a blessing from God for the reasons mentioned above, BUT b/c of his particular skittish/humiliated nature, he is CRUSHED. and Furious at the same time. As if he's a child molester, etc. Will never rise above it, things will never change. people will never see anything but what he DID, not who he was and is. you get the picture.
so the upshot tonight is, H says 'i don't think i can live here anymore' (this city) - which has been SO difficult for him. he sees someone from work every single day, passes the road to work every day. a burden emotionally, and has been, but each time he thinks he can rise above a little bit, something like this just wipes him out.
BI 'i want you to stay, but understand if you need to leave'
H 'we'd all have to go'
BI 'you don't want me to go. i'm part of your torture and you don't even look at me in the eyes anymore'
H (not looking me in the eyes) 'i don't want to break up this family'
BI 'i don't either, but what kind of M is this? we're not moving forward at all. the kids deserve a happy family, this isn't God's best for us'
H 'it's not about us. it's about the kids'
BI 'i know it is, but you may need to be away from me for a while'
H 'but i don't want to break up this family. it could be worse. i do care about you and respect you'
this is just paraphrasing, but the defeated tone he had, and let me just tell you. he was very much communicating that he would not be around me if he could, but is conflicted about the children. i am not projecting, b/c i was so shocked (yet verrrry calm), didn't expect him to be so de-fcuking-tached about us. I didn't argue with him about how he feels, it was just HARD to hear and see, when I thought we were in a different place than we apparently are.
Hello, Denial? Party of one, your table is now available.
I hugged him, and he kept his arms at his sides. Like a corpse. Nothing. NOTHING. Hands at his fcuking sides, people. WTF. uck.
I tried to go to him last night, when he came upstairs to tell me about the email, and was so distraught. he stiff armed me before I had a chance to get near him. "no. i don't want anything. i don't need anybody. i am done"
I cannot adequately convey what this was like. it sounds on paper kind of temporary, and just a phase, but i'm telling you i thought he was potentially somewhere other than where he IS. damn it. i am so unimportant in his Big Picture. DAMN IT.
Oh great God
Be small enough
To hear me now
There were times when I was crying
From the dark of Daniel's den
I had asked you once or twice
If you would part the sea again
Tonight I do not need a
Fiery pillar in the sky
Just want to know you're gonna
Hold me if I start to cry
Oh great God
Be small enough to hear me now
There have been moments when I could not face
Goliath on my own
And how could I forget we marched
Around our share of Jerichos
But I will not be setting out
A fleece for you tonight
Just wanna know if everything will be alright
Oh great God
be close enough to feel me now
All praise and all the honor be
To the god of ancient mysteries
Whose every sign and wonder
Turn the pages of our history
But tonight my heart is heavy
And I cannot keep from whispering this prayer:
Are you there?
And I know you could leave writing
On the wall that's just for me
Or send wisdom while I'm sleeping
Like in Solomon's sweet dreams
I don't need the strength of Sampson
Or a chariot in the end
Just wanna know that you still know how many
Hairs are on my head
Oh great God (Are you small enough)
Be small enough
to hear me now
-Nichole Nordeman, Small Enough
I foung this written on Marriage and it made me smile, comforting, and melancholic. I don't know why:
Its chosing your own family. It's almost like having your own personal historian running after you with a notebook. Just someone that witnesses your life and lives it with you.
Sorry believing. I know how the rejection from somebody you love can feel. The compassion you show in the face of that rejection is what makes you special.
Oh hon. I'm crying for you and hope you and your H will overcome. Prayers as always.
BI,
Great blog. Love the Kiergkegard quote.
Awiating the much you have to tell me.
Your right...your husband is a good writer.
I wish I could tell you both something... because I'm not sure I'm too convinced of it myseld...but somwhere inside me I belive it's true...sometimes our personal sin and failures and mess ups are the defining moments in out lives when God really shapes us into the kind of people we need to be. Is it perhaps possible, BI, that you both will become luminous and powerful and gracious and merciful beyonf your wildest hopes because of this crisis? If we are united with Christ, we are united with his sufferings, too, in order that we may experience resurrection. Death leads to life.
Ok..I'm gonna start crying now.
See ya,
Theoden
BI,
Sometimes leaving the town you are in is the only way to start fresh somewhere new. He's not crazy.
And look...he should be thankful that someone doesn't want to cross that line with him. I know it hurts. My wife is re-thinking our marriage and having an EA with my best friend. I started sharing this with an old college friend of mine, who is a woman, and who lives out of state. She's a Christian. She prayed for us, started sending me marriage-saving books, etc. Then she stopped returning my emails and calls. I got one last email from her saying she developed feelings for me and that she would break off all contact. I didn't share those feelings, but it was clear that she did the right thing. I emailed her back thanking her for her wisdom and told her I wouldn't call her or email her back. Ouch. A 23 year friendship down the drain. And I'm the one who is trying to save my marriage. Look...shit happens. Your husband shouldn't be surprised.
On the other hand, these people in your town (and his friends) need to know something about grace. He's repented of his adultery, he's put the other woman off. He's chosen to be with you. People should be running towards him and cheering him on!!! The father loves the prodigal when he returns. He throws a party. Maybe you can talk to his old friends and say that he needs encouragement and grace, not judgment.
Theoden
Thanks guys. No time right now, just reading and catching up -will be back late tonight, but HAD to paste a quote from rainbowlove that spoke to me:
Just remember, healing doesn't happen in a straight line!
Perfect.
BI, I'm so sorry to read about the latest developments in your sitch. It really does seem that your H's own self-loathing is holding him back from even being able to think about working on your M.
He needs to do something to change that, and if getting away on his own for a while is the only way he can do that, then he might just have to.
Maybe it doesn't even have to be an actual move, where he settles down somewhere else though. Maybe he just needs to go on a solo road trip for a while to get away from the glaring eyes of everyone in your hometown so he can start feeling good about himself again and hopefully realise that he's worthy of forgiveness, firstly from himself, and then also from you.
When my H first moved out, he mentioned that he was considering just "going bush" for a few days and not even taking his phone, so he could escape everything and everyone and get his head straight. As far as I know, he never did end up taking that trip, so hasn't really had any time to himself to reflect on who he really wants to be and what he really wants to do, and as a result is a total mess but is in total denial about it.
I really wish he had have taken some time for himself. I think that he, (and us) would have benefited greatly if he'd taken that timeout, and something similar may very well benefit your H (and your M) as well. Obviously, the way things have been, hasn't been working, so you'll both need to try a different approach.
I'll make sure and mention you in my prayers tonight!
Thank you so much, friends, for chiming in (and astimegoeson, for stopping by!)
Theoden, I had intended to point-by-point reply to your first post on my last thread. But dude, I am so tired. I keep reading that post over and over, and basically just nodding my head the whole time. Which is why I copied it to this current thread.
I agree with the whole bloody thing. The detach/fulfillment making one more attractive; absolutely. The making a Gratitude List at the end of each day. I did that for a while, pre-bomb, and forgot about it. Great idea, and I do it mentally but need to WRITE IT DOWN. you're right.
I have NOT written down small goals and I should. I've kind of avoided that b/c all my goals have not come to fruition, but I should break it down smaller. Bricks in the wall, instead of trying to have a building appear.
And funny you should say it, but every time I feel defeated and hopeless, I am always thinking: THIS IS THE GOD WHO RAISED THE DEAD, FOR PETE'S SAKE. MY MARRIAGE IS A CAKEWALK TO HIM. Thanks for affirming that.
How are you doing today BI? I was just stopping but to let you know that I was thinking about you. Hope all is well.
Ben, you sweet potato!
Eh. Stop by the blog for the latest-
http://instepford.blogspot.comI hope I don't piss off H with today's post. It just spilled out from an ever-growing place of compassion for such a complicated sitch. H described it like when you vacuum, and go to clean out the cannister - all the dirt and strings and lint are all jumbled together in a mess than can't be untangled. That's how he sees me, as part of the tangle.
He said last night:
I wish it were cut and dried. That I did what I did, and you weren't part of the people who hurt me. But I am. And I don't know if he can 'untangle' me. Neither does he.
I told him:
I have my hand extended. Only you can decide whether to take it.So, how am I?
Growing.
BI,
Was that your post on the blog? If so, it's a real compassionate understanding of your husband.
It's almost like I wish I could talk to him, or email him and talk to him about grace. I'm good at helping people see it. I'm almost unable to recieve it myself these days. Funny how we can use a gift for others, but can't use it for ourselves.
Anyhow, throw a prayer up for me. I need to feel God's love and grace so that I can be full in Christ and therefore be less judgmental. I want to invite my wife into a full life with me, not indict her for her shortcomings.
It's clear that when I'm doing OK, I'm more buoyant and able to listen to her. When I'm positive and joyful, she's less prone to "run screaming" from me. I'm just trying to open my heart and attract her.
Please, please, please pray for me.
--Theoden
You got it, friend. I am so sorry. Love is loooooooooooong suffering, isn't it?
This new chapter of our lives is so fraught with ups and downs, it makes me seasick.
Yes, I wrote that post about my H on the blog. No, he's not read any of my 'good' posts. He's not read the blog in almost 2 weeks, since the 'bad' ones. Of course. And I've been tempted to send him links to the blog twice this week (see! see! I'm writing nice stuff about you!), but that seems like forcing the hand, so I wait and hope he'll revisit on his own?
Hang on my friend. It is so hard some days. And Vday is going to suck. I scheduled myself to work that night, so I would not be around moping. No expectations of that day (I'm just postponing my expectations really; holding out hope for April - birthday/anniversary - and when that rolls by w/out The Love, I'll reset my date. That's how I roll, yo.)
Be back later today to check on you. C appt. today - woo! - haven't met with her since the comment about giving up she gave me, so we'll hopefully clarify.
Hi BI,
What happened with H over the weekend?
Something really crappy happened to H tonight and I want to talk about it with my friends here, so I'll save that for a time OTHER than almost 1am
I hope it turned out well.
BI,
Thanks for praying.
Pray that I can put together something for Valentine's day.
We've got a school activity we have to go to on that evening. :-(
I suggested another night and she said she'll think about it.
--Alan
Mama, what I was alluding to was already posted: #926810 - 02/10/07 12:41 AM
Theo, I scheduled myself long ago to work this Wednesday night. Seemed like way too many expectations if I was off work. So, I will buy him a card and leave it for him before I go. Expect nothing, or some bogus non-romantic gesture, from H. Last year's card from him was truly bad, so hopefully it won't be that bad (or worse- ack). But at least it was a card. No card will be worse.
He's looking for jobs out of state this week. Haven't figured out how I feel about that. He suffers much here daily (hourly, even) but I don't know how "healed" he'll be by moving either. Plus, I have zero intention of going without a recovery plan in place for the M. With goals, actions, and some fcuking commitment to making the M/R a priority.
But. With that said, I do plan to pray about it, and asked H to pray together again (he abandoned that, hasn't been consistent ever with it. Driving me crazy with his inconsistent nature about the R) about the job stuff, stay vs. go stuff, and to make sure that as a unit we do what God would want.
Sigh. I'm tired. And flirting with pissed-off-ness. I've done a really good job of stuffing that for now. Of no use, and no good comes of me whining about what I'm not getting, blah blah.
That's about it.
Theo, don't push the V-day stuff. It's just a day, man. I do plan to write on the card some version of "I love you" b/c it is V-day, so think I get a pass for that. But it's not been spoken between us for months and months. bleh.
Hey Theo,
I took parts of your wise words and put it as a comment on the blog. I hope that is okay with you (all anonymous, no reference to here).
It was so wise and encouraging toward my H that I hope he will see it and find comfort in your kind words.
BI,
Thanks for the words on Valentine's say. We agreed to a "make-up
date" the following Saturday.
We had a nice date last night. Saw a play and went our for drinks.
You're welcome to put it on the blog.
Hey...you're doing great. There's hope for your marriage. Your husband just feels like his whole life is shit. A good job close to you might really be the trick. Cut the travel crap. Hey he's a man and needs to feel like one, again, that's all. He needs to GAL.
--Theoden
BI
I wanted to ask you, how do you stop yourself snooping. I know its not good, infact when ever I do do it and find something out I feel horrid after, but the reason I do it is because I do not want to be left in the dark, I would rather be hurt now and face the truth then to bury my head in the sand.
H assures me that the OW does not contact him, but I know she does, the message left on his phone today was first a joke, and then telling him how she liked his text. I deleted the voicemail as I don't want him talking to her, but it just makes me aware that they are still in contact & he is lying once again to me. One thing for you is that your H did break it off, I know a couple of months after you found out, but he broke it off - not you telling him to.
Well, honey, you just stop. And I can't claim sainthood here, b/c I've still peeked in his email account on occasion. You KNOW it does no good, and there is no reward from it. But if you're like me, you are scared out of your mind subconsciously that you are going to get "blindsided" again.
And I feel like Scarlett O'Hara on the hill with that turnip saying "As God is my witness, I will never go hungry again!" Except I'm holding an email password saying "I will never be blindsided again!"
But it's just a fantasy. I could still be blindsided at any time, tomorrow, next week, even 40 minutes from now ... and it's SO difficult to think that way about the one person on earth I just never ever EVER doubted in that way, prior to now.
It's like a vase that's broken. You can glue it up again, but it will always "have been broken" - no more do we have the luxury of an R that is untainted, unbroken. Sure it can be repaired, but not to the point of Never Broken. You know?
I think this is just us working out the kinks in our thinking, this snooping thing.
Now then. I realize I am blessed beyond measure that the OW is out of the picture. Completely. Not just Sort Of. I would get my fcuking redneck ON, if she were still contacting him, & he was denying it. If I had to deal with that, I may be institutionalized from insanity (or jailed for murder) by now.
You know, soreheart, I was 'poor me'-ing myself with the other posters whose S's are still saying ILY and still ML and all the trappings I so desire. But you have reminded me of the blessing I do have that H stopped the A abruptly and on his own (not that I wasn't being a bi-otch about it on occasion because, again, no one will be nominating me for sainthood in this lifetime). He gives most of the credit to God for doing the right thing, b/c 'he never could have done it in his own strength' (which is a double-edged sword to hear, as you might imagine).
My now-suspicious-of-him heart wonders if he misses her deep down (when he has said over and over that he doesn't and knowing her ruined his life, etc), and since he has no passion for me, where did he put it? Is it buried for someone else? kind of thinking. NONproductive thinking.
I'm off on a tangent here, sorry. I have no idea if you've gleaned jack from my rambling. On one hand, just STOP the snooping, you can't control his behavior, only yours, blah blah. On the other hand, if it were me, I know I couldn't bite my tongue about that sh!t and would probably make a mess of things by confronting him. I hope other wise people give you better advice, b/c it's only by God's grace alone that my emotional outbursts haven't completely wrecked this M. They almost have, actually. The outcome remains to be seen, here, but we would be further along, I believe, if I hadn't been such a psycho on one occasion too many.
If I can just butt in here and add my two cents - I think there are two good reasons for not snooping:
1. Snooping causes you to expend energy that would be best used GingAL - and you inevitably hurt yourself with what you find
2. You are often looking for information to make judgments about where your spouse is. You will never be able to come about this knowledge this way because you never know the level of honesty w/the OP, or with themself. It's disrespectful and will lead you in the wrong direction to judge intentions from observations, etc., and snooping is a more disrespectful way of doing this. It's an invasion of privacy in order to obtain information that is then used in a way that doesn't get you any closer to your goal.
That being said, the only real legitimate reasons to snoop are to make sure there's NO contact - what that contact is over is not the issue (you can't get in their heads and fix their thinking) - or making sure that marital assets are not being used to further the affair.
You may ALWAYS butt in Muddle
I used the quote in your signature on my blog post last night, by the way. I've been saving it. Think I even sent it to H one time last year.
I agree that snooping is not right, however as far as the invasion of privacy is concerned I would have to comment on that.
What is the "invasion" affects someone else - i.e. ME!!! A perfect example was H the other day. We got into a huge discussion (heated of course) over his visa bill. We have always paid both his and mine off each month, now I see his has been at 7-10,000 for the past few months (that I know of). I never checked before but registered our joint account online because of direct deposits I was getting from a new employer. There, in full view, was the balance on his account. I can't access the details of where the money went, but I had a fit (inside that is). When I calmed down I confronted him. Why? because even though it is his credit card, it comes out of a joint account - his and MINE!! So half that visa bill is my money - plain and simple. Therefore I have a right to know. We ended up with him saying he would walk away from the R if I pressed him any further on it but I thought "hmmm, if that's all our R is worth to you right now, I'm gonna fight back" so I called him on it and he admitted it was spent on the OW. However, yesterday I brought it up at the C office again. He said "it was the principal of the matter". H wasn't too pleased but I was thrilled because the C agreed with me basically and told H that when he is confronted with something that makes him vulnerable, he evades it and uses confrontation, anger etc to deal with it, it had nothing to do with principal and everything to do with him not feeling in control.
Then, after we left the office, H got violently ill (food poisoning from something he ate earlier) - hmmm, wonder if someone is trying to tell him something. As a matter of fact, he was rather nice to me today, even brought me a tea at work
H and D7 came back from the grocery store this afternoon, and D7 rushed in with a bunch of tulips: "mommy, i got you flowers for Valentine's Day. Tulips are your favorite!" which is true. I made a big deal of it to her, hugged her and asked if they were from her and she said yes.
H came in after her and I said "D brought me tulips!" and he looked at me like I was stupid and said "I know, I was with her"
well, duh.
I put them in a vase on the table and thanked D again. Have no idea whether that's "it" for vday; guess I'll know tomorrow.
Have ya'll realized how HARD it is to find a v-day card for your H/W? OMGosh, I must have spent the better part of an hour trying to find one that wasn't grossly inappropriate ("our love is better than ever" kind of sap) or stupid ("for a special friend"). I almost gave up and bought him a non-V card with a smiley face on it, then got him a humorous one instead. Two lions with a sheep in between them holding an "I love ewe" sign. Inside says "Read between the lions". har har. Ya'll seriously. That was the best I could find that wasn't formal script and gold foil about My Husband, The Love Of My Life. Damn. That sucked. I hadn't had to 'filter' like that before, and it was depressing as hell.
Ugh.
On a brighter (maybe?) note, H read the blog today -thank you again Theo for the 2nd comment you posted, it was great
but H hasn't mentioned anything. Maybe later he will? I will NOT prompt him to talk about it, but wish he would get closer to my page in the book about us. sigh.
I know !!! I had the same problem trying to find a card - you would think Hallmark would make cards for people like us. After all, there seems to be a lot of us
The one I got says something about not being in a normal relationship - I couldn't get to the checkout fast enough - lol
I'm with you on the card thing...had a tough time here too. All I could think about was the super-intimate valentine card from OW to H I stumbled on a couple of years ago...
I just got a card for our Son, That was good enough for me. I think I'll write Hallmark with a card idea.
I love you, but I'm not in love with you....
I want to be with you, but I am having an affair....
I fell out of love with you, and into love with someone else...
(enough excuses, I got more)
So here it is HAPPY VALENTINES DAY, because i have to
or
(not sure what would fit better)
BI,
My pleasure. Honestly, I wish I could talk to him and offer him hope. I wish someone could talk to my wife and offer her hope. I think that's the reason DB and other "systems" tell you not to talk to too many other people. Most people, rather than remaining a friend to the wayward spouse, listening and encouraging them to hope, instead tend to jump down their throats, judge, and tell them to "stick it out" because it's the right thing to do. Yeah, if we're Christians, we all know it's the right thing to do, but if they are at the point of having an affair, or considering leaving the marriage, traditional religous and ethical systems no longer hold their allegiance. Also, rather than offering them grace, love and a vision for an intimate, passionate marriage, they are simply telling them to "just say no" to divorce and adultery. Just say no? If it were that easy, then we wouldn't need a Savior who said "no" to sin for us and who said "yes" to God for us. Hellooooo!!!!
Anyhow, I'm preaching to the choir.
MuddleThrough, I really apprecicate your non-judgemental perspective. I need more of that. I think to discuss that with you. I don't have my own thread yet, so I'll ping you a private message, or perhaps, start a thread on the topic of being non-judgmental and respectful when you feel your spouse is morally wrong. It almost sounds zen-like in it's perpective of trying not to contol outcomes. In addition, I like your understanding of stating who you are clearly and asking for needs to be met without contolling or being controlled by other people. Yet...I find a paradox, because who I am is a person with crystal-clear moral/ethical stands, and yet, my judgments are crushing my wife. I'm working on bweing my authentic self withour worrying what my wife thinks, yet I'm working on humility and trying not to be judmental.
-- Theoden
Theoden,
I think it would be a great discussion to have on the forum. I look forward to it.
I think it's important to adhere to your standards while accepting that others do the same. "Working on being" is really about awareness, in my opinion. Being aware that you have the choice to be humble in the moment allows you to do so, being aware of having the opportunity to be judgmental and also of an alternative path allows you to make the choice not to do so.
Thanks for stopping in everyone! I feel I should have had chips & salsa out for you - it's a party!
Unfortunately, after a few days off (aaahhhh!) I return to night shift tonight, and must start getting ready
BUT. Had to share this first so I don't forget it.
As ya'll know, I love me some Isaiah - and really only found out how fab it is since the bomb:
God, your Redeemer,
who shaped your life in your mother's womb, says:
'I am God. I made all that is.
With no help from you I spread out the skies
and laid out the earth.'
Isaiah 44:24 (The Msg translation)Note the bold, which is what YELLED at me today. Hello?! I have GOT to lay down my earthly eyeballs - I can't fix this, I can't MAKE H love me again, I can't DO DO DO, when I keep praying WHAT SHOULD I DO?
GOD can do it, WITH NO HELP FROM ME, thanks. He's most capable, he
made the earth and
raised the dead, for Pete's sake. What am I doing running around like a headless chicken, worried that
every little thing I say/don't say or do/don't do will critically affect my situation? I am NOT that powerful, but God IS.
Hi Mama!
Thought I would stop by on your new thread.
You're doing so well. This is hard for you and H, but consider this. If this was *easy* for him to get through, it would mean that it's part of his character, part of who he is and does not mean much to have had an A.
Just my oversimplified way of looking at things now, since I am tired of complicated analysis (geesh).
So, since I'm not much help, I thought I would stop by your curb, get some chips and salsa, and give you a thumbs up.
One bit of advice: at some point, you and H will slowly have to stop picking at the scab, stop looking at the scar while it slooooowwwwlllllyyyy heals. Stop looking at the wound, wondering, thinking, picking.
It's not easy, and it's not sudden and it's not without LOTS of counseling and healing, but little by little, mama.
Love you!
Happy day!
BI, I think you're hitting on something really profound here. Letting go of the illusion of control. If you focus on the impact your actions have on another person you're not really living. You're not doing justice to yourself. God gave you the gift of your body and mind and heart and soul - are you respecting and appreciating this gift by torturing yourself? Let go of control and allow yourself to focus on caring for you. Allow yourself to channel God's love and will rather than trying to substitute your own.
BI,
God, your Redeemer,
who shaped your life in your mother's womb, says:
'I am God. I made all that is.
With no help from you I spread out the skies
and laid out the earth.'
Isaiah 44:24 (The Msg translation)
You are absolutly right with this. It is a simple to say that we need to let go and let God take care of our problems for us but he still needs us to walk his path and believe. Without the belief that he will provide for us then we are lost and will continue down our cheesless tunnel. I hope you are doing alright. I have not been able to keep up with everyone due to my own sitch as of late. Needed to take a little break from chatting and get my head straight.
I hope you have a wonderful day and that everything is going great for you.
Later,
Ben
Hi,
I've just been reading your post and I just want to say that your "small enough" prayer made me shed tears. It touched that place that is so hurt and torn. The place that knows that only God can make it better. I wish that I could feel a hug from Jesus in these dark moments of life. I have a very similar story as you and I truly feel the dissappointment that comes from finding out that your H isn't really any closer to feeling better about being together.
I just filed for my divorce since my H who had professed his desire to stay to keep the family together, was actually behind my back still communicating with OW. I guessed he hoped to stay until the kids were a little older and then he could leave and go to his"soulmate" BTW mine has been going on for over 2 yrs.
You know what tipped me off was spending 6+months seeing that he had trouble being really close and affectionate other than just having sex.
Oh well, what I pray for you is that your H really work at being obedient to God and let God fill him with the many blessings he has for those that do the right thing and trust in him.
May God fill you with peace and patience!
Hopeful2
hey there, dont' work too hard girly, take care)))))))))))
Always, Muddle, Ben, Hopeful, Cat
My thanks thanks thanks for dropping by this thread today. I sure needed the company!
Every time I think I see hope, or have a decent-ish day, I am treated to another (UNprovoked) discussion with H. Latest one just ended about 10 minutes ago, he went downstairs to pay bills: no kiss goodnight, and I cried alone and came here.
sigh.
He went to work out tonight, as usual, and I had a pamper-me evening. Soaked my feet and did a total pedicure on my tired tootsies. Felt great, then I curled up reading "Love & Respect". I started reading it waaaay pre-A, and stopped about 1/2way thru never to pick it up again. Picked it up a few weeks ago, and it's amazing the different perspective I have now, a year and a half later. It made sense before, but I am reading it now with completely new eyes, you know?
And while I thought it was perhaps a bit foolish to be reading this particular book, in light of having almost zero R with my H except that he's in the house, I have some innate (stupid?) hope/optimism at my core, in the face of all that is Not. I still hope for what Might Be. Anyway, I figured any insight into a good R will benefit me later/in another life/at some point, if not now.
So I was reading wonderful ideas, having some crazy hope, and feeling peaceful that God is in charge and surely he would be charging in on His white horse sooner than later, so that I could put into practice fully all the stuff I was reading about.
And then H came home.
He is SO nowhere near capable of anything with me beyond what we are living. He's just DROWNING in his hurt, and again, I am a part and parcel of that hurt.
He used to acknowledge his 'sin' against me, with no caveats, but now they are always in place. He said you know, when I had the A I hurt you deeply, your womanhood in a way I couldn't even understand. And before I could even have a little comfort from that, he continued, but when you turned me in, you hurt me deeply as a man. My life is over, I have to rebuild. I have no identity as a man b/c of the loss of job, dignity etc. We ripped each other apart. That he's so hurt that he can't move past it (implied: do anything about this R/M).
I validated, when I wanted to fcuking scream at him. I understood how he feels, apologized again ad nauseum for my part in his pain, etc. And I said that nothing I said or did could change what happened, or how he felt about it. That I would change things if I could but I cannot. And that either God can raise the dead, or He can't. That His promises are true, or they aren't. You know? I am trying like crazy to be/show/act respectful, or else why am I reading this book? My voice is not tense and b!tchy (i.e. Old Me) and actually soft enough that he asked me several times to repeat what I had said (which probably just irritated him)
I want to scream from a mountain: I am a completely New wife, but you're too wrapped up in yourself, your pain, your hurt, you you you to See Me. And that's just me being selfish as well, perhaps. Me me me.
Sh!t, people. My bad action is equal to his, in his mind, and he's quit working to rebuild, repair, or make any effort outside of pleasantries and co-parenting. And he's looking to find a job away from here (if it's God's will) to escape from the daily torture of seeing people, and he wants me to come along for more of the same? Fcuk that, screams my inside self.
But I'm being quiet outwardly. Inside, I'm screaming at God to Help Me, and work it all out as He sees fit, as I know that Now is not the time for ultimatums or whatnot about the R. Maybe it never will be, but I do know that I will not be going across the fcuking street with this man unless God makes it very clear with a roadmap and some movement toward me from H. Well, maybe not a roadmap, but some clear direction, you know?
I did say, somewhere in this unprovoked discussion, that if it weren't for the children, I know you would not still be here. And he didn't say a word. ::screaming silently:::
I had a pamper-me evening. Soaked my feet and did a total pedicure on my tired tootsies. Felt great
Good for you. Taking time to care for yourself is great, and necessary. Glad you enjoyed it.
He is SO nowhere near capable of anything with me beyond what we are living. He's just DROWNING in his hurt, and again, I am a part and parcel of that hurt.
BI, you did what you did, way back when. You did what you thought was your best option back then. You hurt him then. Today he hurts himself with this knowledge. He makes himself miserable with the facts of the past. You are not hurting him still, he is using your past actions to hurt himself in the present. Just as you have done with the fact that he had the affair. It is a painful memory, but it can only hurt when the "victim" chooses to dwell on it.
And before I could even have a little comfort from that. . .
Perhaps you could forgive him to the point where you see him as an equal and not as someone who owes you a debt. Why do you find comfort in his acknowledging that he hurt you? Wouldn't you rather see the human awareness of the suffering he caused and the guilt and shame in his memory of it? Wouldn't you prefer he let go of this?
We ripped each other apart.
He really believes this - and it seems that it's not just something that happened in the past. You are continuing to resent and blame - it sounds like it's happening on both sides. There is enormous love in forgiveness - and forgiving is something that needs to happen on a regular basis. You have to forgive yourself as well as forgive him and vice versa. You can't do one without the other.
That he's so hurt that he can't move past it (implied: do anything about this R/M).
He's still in the past, the relationship is still there. The painful events play themselves over and over in his mind. I wonder if you could ask him what the biggest triggers are for him to keep it there. Maybe you could make a change that would allow the past to fall away. Perhaps you're living in the past too much yourself.
I validated, when I wanted to fcuking scream at him. I understood how he feels, apologized again ad nauseum for my part in his pain
I think this should be the last time you apologize. You conveyed your sincere remorse already. Things like this should not be held over another's head. Either he gets over it or he doesn't - it's his problem to deal with, and if he wants to make you a part of the solution, he can ask, but you can not solve this problem for him.
I want to scream from a mountain: I am a completely New wife, but you're too wrapped up in yourself, your pain, your hurt, you you you to See Me. And that's just me being selfish as well, perhaps. Me me me.
BI, you're doing great. You've come a long way, and you should be proud of all of it. It was an enormous struggle, and you are a better person for it. He IS too wrapped up in himself to see right now. He needs to rebuild himself and his life. Right now he seems trapped in a place where something is preventing him from doing so. So he looks to blame someone or something for his lack of progress. Give him time and space and don't take his problems personally.
Glad to see you had a pamper-me evening. I am also sorry for the bad day that you had. Today is a new day so make the best of it. You are in my prayers and God will always be there for you...
Muddle, thank you.
I agree with everything you said, and I have wondered about apologizing so much as he has stopped apologizing so much, and what good is all this repetitive behavior? He just keeps running around his personal Mt. Sinai, and I don't know that I can do 40 more years here in the wilderness.
I struggle daily with feeling like I am inauthentic, b/c I want to sit him down and tell him all the things he is NOT doing, can't he see it? blah blah. I don't, I won't, but I fight it daily. I swallow this bitter pill all the time.
He says he's forgiven me but can't forget it. I disagree. I do think I've forgiven (finally) the A. What hurts and what I have not forgiven, is the ongoing lack of effort in this R. It makes me bitter and pissed. He focuses on what he WANTS to, expends effort on what he WANTS to. That is not ME in any way.
He stays awake at night until 2-4 am, his own avoidance behavior that has continued since pre-A, during A, and post-A. He now doesn't face/touch me in bed, we just change who's-sleeping shifts for child-watching. No time spent together. I asked him a few nights ago to hang out, and we watched the 2nd half of a basketball game together, and he immediately left to work on his resume after it was over. No interaction, outside of discussing the game. No PLEASANT,fun, lighthearted interaction. I am TIRED of this.
My S6 is home sick today, and H's a$$ is in the bed which is why I'm not at the gym.
I work tonight, so I'll have to sleep this afternoon. He is fine with leaving the kids basically unsupervised while he sleeps. I am not. I'm tired
too. I
TOO am depressed to the point of sleeping in every spare moment. Damn, but my resentment is large and stuffed down. And yes, we are both on meds to try to help this emotional crap. Imagine how bad it could be without it
Nothing changes, so nothing WILL change. I could just hit him for his INaction. This passivity about the R is ultimately destructive, I think. Hope I'm wrong.
I've now been working full time for a year as of 2/13; had to get a job b/c of his A, and subsequent firing. I had hoped it would not be permanent, but it appears to be, and perhaps this is part of my sadness/anger this week. Esp. if we don't stay M, my stay-at-home-with-children days are over, and I mourn that too.
Right now he seems trapped in a place where something is preventing him from doing so.
Amen, my friend. and I just want to POINT THAT OUT, YELL IT FROM ON HIGH TO HIM. But I cannot, and I am more frustrated than I could have ever imagined myself. I feel he is deflecting, and placing blame for his hurt on everything else.
Yes I did what I did, BUT is his motto. It used to be my motto, so I see it SO clearly.
He is fine with leaving the kids basically unsupervised while he sleeps. I am not.
BI, I feel you here my STBX is the same way but my kids seem a little smaller than yours. Not sure how many you have but my STBX would sleep on the couch downstairs while my D1 would just run around and get into everything...Crazy the way they think isn't it?
I know your feeling. What do you think you should do about it? What do you think you can do to ease the bitterness that you currently have towards your H? I know you are trying to save your M and if you want that to happen you are going to have to find some way to deal with the anger and resentmet that you are feeling towards him.
Esp. if we don't stay M, my stay-at-home-with-children days are over, and I mourn that too.
This is so true. Unfortunately you need to look at this as a positive. You need to look at it as you are preparing your life for the future. If you do seperate in anyway you will have already started preparing for life after seperation and it will make it easier on you in the long run. I am actually happy for you for picking up a full time job. It shows how dedicated of a parent you are. That is something you had to do for you and your kids and you took the proper steps to do it. Kudos.
Yes I did what I did, BUT is his motto. It used to be my motto, so I see it SO clearly.
I agree with Muddle when he says it looks like you husband is trapped and will not let himself free right now. In time he will have to accept his part in the mess and forgive you for yours. Until then you will have to just stay patient and not let those crazy emotions get the better of you...
Stay strong BI.
BI,
Some observations:
1. Sound like your hubby is depressed, perhaps clinically. He should get help, simply for his own sake.
2. It's OK to state your desires/needs is small bite-sized, positive actions steps. Instead of giving him a huge "stop doing this" task like, "Stop being emotionally distant from me."
How about, "Hun, would you be willing to say, 'Good night'
to me and give me a kiss on the cheek before we go to bed?" Or instead of "You don't reach our to me at all" try, "Can we in the next week or so, plan a date night that we both might have fun in and agree not to discuss our relationship during this time?"
Maybe something basic, like sitting him down, when you are both awake and relatively decent moods and share with him what you want and need. It's Michelle's idea of asking for what you want.
It's the thing I have the most trouble doing . It's seems silly. But maybe it works.
In our case my wife addresses me with large "stop doing this" imperatives: I am emotionally distant, I don't "see" her true self, I don't respect her. Whan I've asked her what a positive expression of repsect would look like that I could try in the next 2 weeks, she refuses to answer.
Interesting...eh?
--Theoden
Instead of giving him a huge "stop doing this" task like, "Stop being emotionally distant from me."
How about, "Hun, would you be willing to say, 'Good night'
to me and give me a kiss on the cheek before we go to bed?" Or instead of "You don't reach our to me at all" try, "Can we in the next week or so, plan a date night that we both might have fun in and agree not to discuss our relationship during this time?"
This is excellent advice. Tell him what you want. Tell him how you'd like him to behave. This is ALWAYS easier to take than being told your behavior is wrong, bad, annoying, etc.
People always respond better by being asked than being told what to do.
BI,
Yes..you have repented of causing him to lose his job.
But...for a man, his identity is his job, his vocation. SO physchologically, you've emasculated him. He feels like your bitch right now. And until he gets his footing back in the work force, he'll always feel like he's half a man. How can he forget you cost him his job when he's unemployed?
Add that to guilt, public shaming and depression.
He must be a joy to live with.
Perhaps he needs encouragement. Not nagging. Tell him you are encouraged by his job seeking efforts and that it means a lot to you. Maybe let him know you care about him a lot (avoid the word love) and that you think he could really benefit seeing someone (a therapist) for himself to help him through this slump. Encourage him to do something for himself, to care for himself, because he's really worth it.
You know, it feels like he's only one good belly laugh away from starting to see hope in this situation.
I think he's lost hope and he's just going through the motions right now.
--Theoden
BI,
You posted this thing about trusting God through this and not obsessing over every thing you say/do.
Good move.
Let me share with you my wrestlign with God on this.
Here's what I found. It seems God likes DB principles, too. I still pray for him to change my wife, end her relationship with OM, etc. But, what I'm finding is that it's the prayers for me to change are being answered. For example, I've been praying that I can learn to patiently grieve with my wife and sit with her in her pain. Well, he's provided opportunities for me to do that. One evening on a date night, she was cold, angry, depressed and miserable. I wanted to say, "Let's go home, since you don't seem to want to be here." Instead, I drew her out. Asking questions, validating felings, listening, not judging, sharing my stuggles with similar issues. By the end we were laughing. The next day she called me and thanked me for really listening. The next night she initiated love-making. Sha-zaam. I must point out, I drew her our because I genuinely cared and loved her, not because I was doing a technique. I also had been GAL, so I was buoyant and happy, I was a dynamo of peace, fun and hope. Her sadness was not going to crush me. In addition, while I was drawing her our, I threw up a prayer, "Holy Spirit come and be here." I invoked the presence of the Almighty.
Another time, I was praying that God would humble me. Then I read this book called Come Back Barbara. It's about how a pastor learned to love his daughter unconditionally after she punted her faith, got divorced, and started dating drug-dealers. It didnt exactly apply to a marriage, but I began to see how I loved the self-pity, holding the moral high ground and the self-righteousness I had in our marriage crisis. It really struck me and I confessed it to God. One evening I was talking to my wife and I told her that throughout this process I was being very self-righteous and would she forgive me for that? She started to cry. She also commeted on how she noticed I was changing for myself and not for her and that she appreciated it. No we didn't have sex after that, but she's seeing that my heart is able to change.
So..God answers prayer. It seems he delights in answering the prayers of people who are seeking to humble themselves and become more Christlike.
When I pray the "miracle" prayers, I find, sometimes, that I'm just asking him to fix my wife, end the pain and turn the clock back. Most of all, end the pain.
But...the pain is what's changing me into a more wonderdful man, isn't it?
--Theoden
So true, Theo! God (as you believe him to be) is giving you the opportunity to do something different, and you did. I too have had to look at myself and see all the marvelous changes I have made to myself and acknowledge that without this pain they never would have happened. Blessings come in many different guises, maybe the best is still to come!
Maybe the best is still to come.
OMGosh, ya'll ROCK. Thank you so much for being here today. I can't wait to more thoroughly absorb your thoughful posts, but alas - I work tonight (ugh). I've got a post for the blog knocking around in my head to get out, and if I can get started on that, I'm going to SLEEP.
Will check in later tonight from work if (please, God) it's a slow night. Oddly enough, I can come to this site, and read blogs all night long, but heaven forbid I try to check email or look on ebay! ha.
Thanks again for your uplifting, insightful selves. I SO appreciate each of you more than you know. If we were all single, I'd fall madly in love with each of you
Wow, so you're not all that into monogamy, are you?!?!
hahaha
I struggle daily with feeling like I am inauthentic, b/c I want to sit him down and tell him all the things he is NOT doing, can't he see it? blah blah. I don't, I won't, but I fight it daily. I swallow this bitter pill all the time.
Don't we all wish we could sit them down and make them see the things they don't? I've read so much on these forums over the last month in particular that I reckon I probably know H's mind better than he knows it himself right now. I desperately wish there were some way to make him face the reality of how destructive he's being to himself, (nevermind to me, or to our M).
Then I read this part in one of theoden's posts, (love the username BTW, I'm gonna go right ahead and assume you're a
Lord of the Rings fan?)....
I began to see how I loved the self-pity, holding the moral high ground and the self-righteousness I had in our marriage crisis. It really struck me and I confessed it to God. One evening I was talking to my wife and I told her that throughout this process I was being very self-righteous and would she forgive me for that? She started to cry.
....and it hit me like a bolt outta the blue that I too have been self-righteous throughout this ordeal. Even now I'm still doing it, with the wanting to find a way to explain to him how much better I understand him now. Part of my wanting to tell him that is so that I can feel like I'm the one in control because I know so much about him. And as right as I may be about how his mind is working right now, I can't tell him that because it's not my place to tell him how to feel. He's gotta work it out for himself. The frustration I have, (and maybe this is the same for you BI, seeing as you mentioned his passivity pissing you off), is that he
won't realise it himself, so that scares me, and it just fuels my wanting to "fix" him (and in turn, fix
us) even more, which in turn just makes me more self-righteous.
BI, we've gotta accept that
we can't fix them! As terrifying as it is to leave them to their own devices to figure themselves out, somehow we've gotta find a way to do just that. We've gotta give up whatever control it is we think we have over them, because it's all just in our heads anyway, and we just end up making
ourselves crazier when we spend so much time and effort worrying about
them, and if
we're more crazy, then the situation won't
ever improve.
The situation won't change until someone
in the situation changes, and as much as it sucks, and as impossible as it feels to do it,
we have to be the ones to let them go and trust them to be able to manage their own issues, the prospect of which is scary as all hell!
Dammit, why is it that there's gotta be so much, "easier said than done" stuff when it comes to good DBing.
Hang in there BI.
In an effort to focus more on my stuff, I've worked hard on yesterday's blog post. H still doesn't read it, so it's not for his 'approval':
http://instepford.blogspot.comAND.
On the phone last night while I was at work, I touched on the whole him-perhaps-leaving-town-for-a-job thing (I asked him to pray about it with me, he agreed, he hasn't. Very old pattern with him. Agree to, but no follow-thru):
I mentioned that I was praying about moving as a unit and whether or not we were supposed to, etc. Just a vague statement from me in a friendly tone, and said to him,
I'm sure you've been praying about it too. What do you think/feel?He said:
I don't know ANYTHING. I really don't. I know we need to sit down and talk about how we feel about everything. And I said,
Why don't we do that in front of C? and he AGREED immediately. I was very uplifted by that. I see C on Monday a.m., and will try to schedule a 2nd meeting with her for the 2 of us maybe Wednesday, but hopefully ASAP. I hung up very hopeful. No matter WHAT happens, the chance to ADDRESS things again makes me feel so much better. Thank you God.
Off to work again, hopefully with a chance to read the boards (although I'm always sad by the 'weekend slowdown' here. Quit GAL-ing and post so I'm not lonely! ha!)
Since I'm spending my FABULOUS (eye-roll) Saturday evening surfing the boards, I thought I'd pop in and say 'hi'...don't want you to feel too lonely!
I'm glad your H agreed to the counseling session. I hope it goes well.
Today's irritation (my problem, not his)
School's on a 2hr delay from snow. I have C appt at 10:30. H was supposed to do a presentation in S6's class today, but b/c of the tight school day, will now be on Friday. Ah! H will now be free at 10:30.
I asked him in bed if he wanted to come to C with me today since he won't be busy then, and (appealing to his $ concerns)said it would be more cost-effective to meet once this week instead of twice. He groaned, said no. I didn't expect him to rise to the occasion, and I get p*ssed when he does just that.
Plus, he smelled of beer and apparently feels he must hide it somewhere now. He doesn't put it in the fridge, and must hide the empties. WTF? We'll be chatting about this later for sure, b/c I am NO prude about alcohol. Hell, I'd drink with him if he'd invite me, y'know?
BUT. The beer disappeared from the fridge months ago when I mentioned some that (a) alcoholism runs in his family and he'd been drinking regularly since the A, as in nightly, and (b) he's on psych meds trying to find the best one for him, and combining it with alcohol didn't seem like a good idea while doing that. I don't THINK I was being his mother, just bringing up points, but now he's 'sneaking' - and NO, this is not every night, but maybe once every week or two that I can tell. A concern.
I'll bring it up, but will talk to C today about how to do that, so I don't come off as the Party Pooper Police.
Thus ends today's vent. Carry on.
Why's he got to invite you? Why don't you bring home a bottle, maybe grab a nice Belgian (beer that is!) and share a nice moment. Yeah, you are being motherly - but it's because you care. He's hiding it for two reasons - he knows you're right and he doesn't want you to worry either. It's a sign that he cares.
Have fun, be a bit rebellious. He sounds like he's not having much fun with you these days. What did you guys used to do for fun back when you were in love? What can you do now to get his heart thumping? Excitement increases feelings of love and togetherness. I've even heard that it's good for couples to have near-death-experiences every few years! I'm not advocating this, just saying that something to up the excitement level would be a good thing.
Muddle, I am so trailer-park about beer! Miller Lite is fine with me. H will drink Samuel Adams, etc and I just gag at the dark strong stuff! ha.
I completely agree about the fun stuff. Excitement has been non-existant for years and now in the face of children underfoot and no $$, I am paralyzed by HOW to have any. Which is depressing in itself.
I'd fall out of an airplane with him if it would help.
Hell, shout obscenities at people in the mall! That's free! Drink a couple beers before church! Embarass him in a way that you can laugh about. Act like a teenager at times. Let your inner child out. Stop taking everything so seriously. Poke and prod your husband, don't treat him like he's fragile and you don't want to break him. Kick his butt somtimes! Get your hands on him.
Look back at what worked in the past. What did work? How did you have fun together?
Well, Muddle, your recommended excitement came today.
On the way to taking the kids to school, we slid off the side of the mountain (snow/ice in a curve) and flipped the car. The scariest thing EVER. OMG, I have never been in an accident with the kids in the car, and this was the worst. A true "Jesus, Take the Wheel" moment.
A pathfinder rolling down a mountain is VERY LOUD. It felt like the end of the world. I was so scared to turn around to the backseat to look at the kids when we finally stopped moving. Tree stopped us from going further, and it braced the car enough to be stable. The hardest part was getting their seatbelts unbuckled. Landed on the driver's side, and I climbed up out of the passenger window & got the kids out that way.
They were
unharmed, praise God. S6 had NO injuries and D7 an abrasion on her neck from seat belt. I was the worst, and just head cuts/lumps, lots of glass in my head, and hand cuts that bled worse than they were. NOTHING like it could have been, you can't even see the car from the road. Had we been really injured, where we could not have walked, nobody would have found us.
We climbed up to the road and walked in the snow until we could flag down a car. Those nice folks drove us back home and H took us to the ER. Xrayed my head to make sure no skull fractures, and checked the kids thoroughly. Oh, dear God, for some health insurance. And of course, the car was 12 years old, paid for, and not insured for collision.
After we left there, went to see the car. (on the road, S6 kept saying "Daddy you're going too fast!" and when we pulled off the road at the site, D7 screamed thinking we were going to fall again)
H got out and went down to it and looked it over. When he came back up, he said "It's a MIRACLE no one was really hurt" and it is. The car is crunched.
H went out to meet the park rangers and figure out how to get it towed. He hugged me before he left and said "I'm glad you're okay". I thanked him for taking care of us and being our hero today. He said 'you're the hero for pulling the kids out of the car and getting them to safety'
I feel awful about the whole thing. We SO didn't need to have another financial blow, hospital bills and one less car, but I am so grateful that everyone is okay. God's hand was all over that.
Obviously i missed my C appt (ha) and rescheduled for next week (with H to attend), and won't be working tonight.
COUNT YOUR BLESSINGS. It can all change in a minute.
OMG, I'm so glad you are all ok.
Maybe this will be your H's wake up call, to realize what he almost just lost.
Forget about all of the things you do not have right now, focus on all that you are grateful for and more good things will happen to you!
Thank goodness you're okay BI! Wow, you ask for a little excitement...
BI-
Glad you are ok......any advice on how to properly roll my truck??? If it worked for you as an awakening.......:)
Thank God you and the kids are OK, BI! Sounds terrifying!
I know the financial blow is something you really didn't need right now, but try to focus on the fact that you all still have your lives, and those are priceless!
BI,
SO you got your excitment. Holy Moses!!!! I'm so glad you are OK.
Here's my prayer.
Dear Lord, what the hell are you doing? You are sovereign, and even this accident is for your glory and BI's good. So..we're going to trust you are at work. We're going to trust that you are saying, in your own peculiar, inscrutible way, "Watch me do someyhing wonderful in this mess." Though Christ our Lord, Amen.
Wow!
Muddle has a real good point. Have a little fun, aww heck, have a lot a fun. Maybe he needs to see your fun, thrilling, sexy crazy-ass side, rather than your desperate, psychotic, coddle-the-adulterer, crazy-ass side.
Instead of treating him with kid gloves, try putting a whoopie cushion under his seat.
Opheila, yes I love Lord of the Rings.
--Thedoen
So glad you are okay - isn't it amazing how these things seem to come along at certain times in our life to make others in our life realize what they have? Hmmmm, wonder what your H will be thinking about tonight?
Theo,
I'm curious, do you have your own thread?
I admire your outlook and really like the advice that you give to BI.
Mamabear
Thank God he was looking out for your family. Sorry for the terribly tragic event you and your kids went through. I am glad that you and the little ones are all alright.
Again sorry for the tragedy but thank God that he was watching over you.
BI, I'm glad you're all safe. I trust you'll all draw upon each other for support through this building your bond. Something tells me there's far more good to this than meets the eye.
Mamabear,
Thanks for the encouragement.
I've got to bite the bullet and post my own thread. I'll try and do it this week. I can certainly use some advice on things.
--Theoden
BI;
I am so glad you and your kids were unhurt. No doubt, "Jesus take the wheel".
Just you watch our amazing God do His thing, in His time, according to His plan.
May God continue to bless each and everyone of you.
Just thinking about you today...I hope all is well.
Bi, I have never encountered your sitch before but I am no stranger to bizarreness or drama. You handled yourself so well that you should be proud of yourself and feed off that immense amount of confidence and ability that you showed for the weeks coming up. Your husband and children are very lucky to have you!
just a dribble from me...peace
oh honey, how scary! I know how awful that is! I've lost 2 cars already in accidents and it is a trauma, I'm so so glad you and the kids are alright))))))))))))))))
I'm sorry to hear about the car though, but a thing like this sure puts a new spin on things, hugs hon)))))))
BI - so glad you're all ok!! I loved the hero line, used by both of you
B-I
Thoughts and prayers are with you. Glad to hear you and the kids are ok.
Rob
Thanks so much, sweet friends. So tired & SORE! Will update when I don't have 1 hand slathered in neosporin! hard 2 type.
Some photos of the car posted 2nite on blog:
http://instepford.blogspot.comyou'll see the blood from my hand in one pic -ewww!
More tomorrow when I have my hand back.
Hope everything is going alright for you.
Sweet friends,
I am so blessed to have you. Wish I could give you all a group hug. I wish my H had you guys, or something other than his island. We LBS are so fortunate to have each other, the support, and different perspectives, advice and comfort. Ya'll know that, but I am sooooooooo thankful for you guys. Haven't said it in a while, but think it every day I come here.
So.
H was very very kind on the day of the accident. He has always been awesome in crises, never blaming, always comforting, etc. When the kids and I flagged down a ride and got to the house, he pulled each child out of the backseat of their sports car with a hug and a once-over to make sure they were fine.
I was the last out, with my bloody hand and encrusted hair (glass all in it, and what I thought was dried blood in my hair was coffee! ha!), and I
believe he let slip with a "babe" as he got hold of me. Not much for the rest of you, but BIG here. I'm the one saying honey, etc. and I am not addressed by ANY terms of endearment, hardly my own name actually. This was so amazing, I still wonder if it happened.
After we got the kids in bed and I took a (painful!) shower, H stood me on a towel and combed my hair with a just-bought fine-toothed comb - to get all the glass out. Sadly, that was the longest close contact we've had in AGES. ha. But it was sweet.
After I was in bed, and he was downstairs, I sent him an email:
And got this reply:
HA indeed! We are so blessed to have all of you tucked into your beds and relatively unscathed tonight. God was in the house today as he protected the three most important people in my life from what could have been a tragedy. I am SO thankful. I stood there and just stared at that Pathfinder on its side today and was in awe that you all walked away from that accident. Talk about perspective. Praise God! He has sheltered us yet again. I can do nothing but be thankful.
I was in awe, and so happy to hear that from him. I just let it be and went to bed all comforted.
Then the next day happened. Bleh.
H is back to his post-A negative, I-am-a-Loser self. He's beat himself up that we didn't have collision (as if that's HIS fault? Hell, I didn't think we needed it either, anymore, both cars are old as the hills and paid for), that his whole world is crumbling around him, everything he touches goes bad, people abandoned us after the A (which is true), he'll never rise above his sin, nobody will see him as anything but his sin, blah blah. He's lost EVERYTHING, I just don't understand what that's like for a man...
He didn't even want to let our pastor know b/c he thinks everyone will be all
well, if he hadn't had that A...
I didn't handle it well, IMO, b/c HELLO? God just saved me and my kids from certain horrors and you're WHINING? WTF? I didn't bitch at him, I just kept polly-anna-ing it, with It Could Be Worse, We're So Blessed, The car Is No Big Deal. You know? It just pissed him off that I didn't UNDERSTAND what he's going thru, etc.
After the convo, I apologized and asked his forgiveness for trying to solve/not just listening to him. I just can't crawl in that hole with him, you know? I am GRATEFUL. Screw that we lost an asset, screw that we are 'one paycheck away from losing everything' as he said, screw that we are a month behind on our mortgage. God knows all this stuff. I am just NOT that fcuking worried about it. Sorry man.
Anyway, back to 'normal' here, which bums me out. Thought it would be a wake-up to him, but not so much. I guess if God wanted to wake HIM up, he would've flipped HIS car. This message was perhaps just for ME.
OMGosh, ya'll, limbs and stumps could have come in the breaking windows as we flipped and impaled, decapitated, or otherwise SERIOUSLY INJURED each one of us. My sweet S6 still had his little glasses on when we stopped rolling, they weren't even crooked, for God's sake. How amazing is all that? It makes me cry to think about it.
So last night, here are our emails -
he sends me a link to a horrible story about a mother who accidentally ran over her 3-year old with
Yes, yes, and yes, things could be MUCH worse. What a horrible story. This mother may never be able to get over this. I cannot even begin to imagine her grief. So sad.
And I haven't spewed forth in an email to him in a LONG time, but I just started typing:
Yes, yes, and yes, things could be MUCH worse.
That was in Dania Beach, did you notice? I am just numb with horror. I keep imagining stumps or limbs that could have come right thru the windows and impaled the kids as we rolled down.
H, I never intended to beat you over the head with 'it could be worse' during this last year. Sh!t, It WAS worse. It has been fcuking AWFUL for so long, but I have much GRATITUDE lately (even before yesterday) from all I'm personally going thru/learning (which was a mutual goal for me), and I'm SO sorry if that has come across as insensitive to the complexities you are grieving.
I actually DO see all that you see, I just SO want it to be better for you (and want it for you yesterday) - my desire to ease your pain stomps all over my ability to just BE in your pain with you while you express it. That's my fault and I'm wrong to assume any ability to lessen it with mere words, or my lame point of view.
I can only imagine the torture you endure daily, the enormous loss you feel- which seems to never lessen or improve. I know the truth that we have mostly been LEFT ALONE as the rest of the world zooms along on the Hurry Up Interstate. It sucks and makes no sense to me, either.
My prayer is that you find comfort in Who made you, even while He has you be annoyingly still, with no other identity, next career project, or 'clear' purpose that satisfies & comforts you.
I don't want you to feel emasculated, that you are stuck here as an indentured servant b/c I'm working, or some other mutation of reality. Wherever you're supposed to go, if you are, I want that for you.
God does NOT desire for you to be defeated, THAT I know as the truth. He wants you victorious, and able to point to Him as the reason for it. I see so much in you that I think you've quit seeing. You are still amazing.
**Please know that I do not live in the past mentally and hold it over you, in my heart**
I hope that is not a reason you can't be around me. It simply is no longer true.
It's the present and the future that has my attention now. But I will gladly sit in the hurt and hold your hand during this awful time if you would only let me join you. I am on your team and will always support you no matter the outcome.
PS-
thanks for all your help post-accident with ideas to make my pain less, etc. Thank you for slowly combing my hair, getting pain medicine, and applying heat packs. You have been so kind and I do appreciate you for it.
His reply?
Did you make an appt. with C for next week for us?
I almost laughed. I spewed my guts up and he asks when we're going to C. Better than what he
could have said, right?
Boy, I cannot WAIT til next Wednesday (our C session) to see what we're doing here.
Tonight I go back to work for the 1st time since the accident (just called the hospital and asked them to
please assign me easy patients!). I'm sore and smell like BenGay (ha) but will try to check in on ya'lls threads later tonight if it's not too busy!
{{{{my DB friends}}}}
Wow, this post is about as long as one of PL's
(she used to be here in Infidelity, but is now in MLC)
BI,
Hugs to you babe. You spilled your guts. H has definitely heard you, he just cannot answer you right now. He still loves you, he just doesn't quite love himself yet. I see this in the hair combing and the care taking. I think your e-mail was really sincere, probably more so than ever. H heard this loud and clear which is why he probably feels it necessary, more than ever, to talk to you via a counselor. He has so much to process and now that he knows that you understand his torture, he might be able to relax a little and let his guard down.
Again, be grateful for all of the little things coming your way. Push any negative thoughts out of your mind. Let go of the past, it is over and done with. There is NOTHING that you can do to change it. Make room in your heart for all of the goodness that your God has in store for you. Take Care, Mama
Bravo Mammabear...
BI,
Just checking to see how you are doing. MammaBears post (IMHO) is right on the mark. Just continue to be patient and let him take care pf his issues...He does love you...
Later,
Ben
BI,
Praise God about your deliverance from death.
Hang on....
Back to your marriage...
Let's look at at the problems you DON'T have.
Your main problem....
IS NOT that your husband is having an affair. That's repented of.
IS NOT that your husband is leaving you. He's at home. He ain't going nowhere.
IS NOT that your husband is punting his faith in Christ. He's a man of faith.
IS NOT that your husband is a moral relativist. He loves truth.
IS NOT that your husband is having a MLC. Doesn't look like mid-life issues.
Right now, it seems your main problem is your huband's deep depression. He doesn't see hope or grace for his own life.
Praise God! Jesus LOVES to wake up depressed people wih a blast of his love.
Maybe pray for those things. He needs encouragement, grace and hope. Believe me, it seems like your husband's heart is in the right place, but he's clinically, and perhaps, structually depressed.
--Thedoen
Theo, you are so great. Thank you! It IS a horrible depression, and apparently Celexa is not for him, or not strong enough or something. He's been on it for several years but perhaps circumstances are too big for the drug. NOT too big for God, amen.
We argued this a.m. a bit, he accused me of 'blowing sunshine up' his hind end, with my thankful/grateful/it-could-be-worse attitude about stuff. Meh. Not really an argument, as in not taken personally and whatnot, just both of us frustrated and mad in general.
Anyway, I have to get ready for work BUT to make matters only MORE interesting:
Someone stole a stray checkbook (from the accident scene, we think) and wrote 2 checks for over $600 on the day of the wreck, completely ruining our finances. More fun news. Wheeee! BUT. Someone FOUND the checkbook in the Walmart parking lot, and mailed it back to us (bless them!) - it was a DUPLICATE checkbook, the crooks checks are right there for us to see and he wrote a driver's license number on the check that we HOPE is his real one (dumb crook news?). Because of where the accident/crime occurred, it is a Federal Offense, and H is out and about opening up a new checking acct, and filing police reports, etc.
Needless to say, he's all end-of-the-world, what-else about it, and I am all wow-how-great-is-that-somebody-sent-us-the-checks-and-we-might-ID-the-criminal/s! We are not on the same page of the Gratitude Journal anymore, eh?
BI,
Try this.
"Hun, I just happen to feel optimistic and grateful because God saved our lives. I am fully aware that our financial situation is pretty tight, but I think that a positive and creative mental attitude might be more helpful to us right now. At least that were I want to live. I'm in this with you."
"Hunnnnnn. I know you are soooooo stressssed by finances. You seem soooo tense. Mmmmmmmmmm.....Maybe I can help you relieve a little of that pent up stress baby. Can I help you release some of your anxiety? Mmmmmmmm." Then play that 70's porn movie music: boom, chaka, boom, boom.
heheheheh.
Theo,
I'm blushing
Sorry I've not been around much, my friends. Having some nerve damage to the right arm/hand, and typing much has been a stress. Although I have lurked a tad.
Just now went to peek at my blog visitors, and 2 days ago, my H went to the site and left this comment on the car accident entry:
I have looked at these photos again and again, and I continue to be amazed that the three most important people in my life walked away relatively unhurt from this. Praise God. My Wife was the hero as she kept a clear head in the midst of chaos.And never mentioned it. What a sweet surprise to my heart. They are few and faaaaaaaaaaaaar between, but when they happen I have a physical reaction to them. My heart just relaxes for a bit. So nice. Had to share with you.
H is having lunch with our pastor today, and going to C with me tomorrow. Should be an interesting week. I'll keep you posted
How nice, BI! My thoughts are with you and your family--I hope the week brings good developments for you.
Good heavens. It's been too difficult for me to post on my own thread this week. Don't know why. Having a tough time mentally. H came to bed after 4am for the 2nd night in a row today and we ended up arguing (and me beating him with a pillow in frustration. good times.) ugh. I feel neglected, he feels attacked. blah blah. same sh!t, different day.
Going to C in about 10 minutes. All day yesterday, I kept thinking,
Just hold it in until you get to C and process it there. Um...not such a successful plan. Ack. So discouraged. I am coming undone in the M area. I'll climb back up shortly I'm sure. I am Pendulum Girl, watch me swing. ugh.
Anyway, just posted this on another thread and realized the hijack-ness of it. Should be over here instead.
In all my single years, I NEVER considered an affair with a married woman. I was propositioned by a few unhappy ones back then, but never let myself be seduced by one. I can't imagine the lack of integrity, morals, and self-respect it would take to resort to that. Would you personally consider a relationship with a married W?
Well, I failed that test many years ago pre-M. Just started posting that story on my
blog, oddly enough, and here you guys are talking about it. I was young and stupid, but still. Just trying to purge my past sins and figure out my common denominator.
If we were picking who would win the Integrity Battle in my M, it would have been H by a mile. I have a sorely checkered past. Actually, now that I remember it, I confessed it to my H not too long after we were M and he was
horrified at me (in a
Who Are You? I Don't Even Know You kind of way). Plus he knew the couple involved. Oh, the irony.
Geez, sorry for the hijack
Will stick this on my own neglected thread!
BI-
No prob on the alleged HJ. I like getting varied opinions/stories. It helps me see that I am not alone.
BI,
Just thinking of you. Sorry you had a bad night. I am waiting for your upward swing. You are a very strong person and a lot of people look upto you around here. Keep your chin up.
Ben
BI,
I spent some time reading your blog. Here's the message I got.
I think it's time you give back your H's passwords, and let him know you trust him completely again. You'll always have some fears, but it's completely up to you to make the decision to trust. Sounds like your H has never been told he's a man, and a damn fine man at that. I sense he has'nt heard those words in a VERY long time if ever from you.
You want him to love you, to desire you, to relish you. I know the feeling, but it's just not happening right now. So we CAN go out and find that immediate gratification in the arms of someone else, but what will we have accomplished? And what weakness is it in US that would even contemplate such a step? I don't believe in allowing ourselves to be doormats, but we are called to the most difficult of tasks, to deeply love someone who can't love us in return. It's vomit inducing, but it's our calling right now. Let's hang in there and see it through to the glory.
God Bless,
COG
PS My experience with 3 years of C was mixed. I found that the longer I went, the more frustrated the C became, and the more drastic their recommendations. I/we went to two different ones, and I went to 3 or 4. When it reached a point that I would enter a session feeling good, and leave feeling bad then I quit going altogether. They can really stir up the S??t sometimes.
BI;
Just checking in, how you doing? Havn't reviewed, but you had mentioned something about MRIs. I can imagine neck pain after what you have been through.
Just wanted to let you know I was thinking about you.
BI, I to, think you should let your H know that you want to trust him again. Tell him to change his passwords and release that part of your relationship. I had the same problem, - which was snooping. Every time H left his phone where I could see it I would look at it and all the past calls and tm he sent and received. As soon as I made the sound effort to stop doing this, it released me from that bitterness, and made ME feel better. In doing that I treated him better. I am not saying its easy, in fact there are times when I think to myself – oh let me just look he won’t know – but I WILL know and the Lord will know that I looked, as when I made that decision I decided to give that demon to the Lord, and He is blessing me everyday. I know its hard to trust again, but we can do anything through the Lord. Another thing I wanted to ask, with your H out of work, it must be a huge blow to his manhood. Is there no way that he can just do anything for a while just to get out the house?
BI,
How are you doing....By the way (I know you already know this) snooping does you no good. I agree, have him change his passwords, and let him know that you are trying your hardest to trust him again.
Anyway I was just stopping by to see how you were feeling today...
Take care,
Ben
mco, COG, 8, soreheart, ben,
Thanks so much for coming to sit on my curb for a while. Ya'll know how nice it is to be thought of here and I appreciate each of you.
COG, thanks for taking the time to 'blog up' on me and give me feedback about it - was well-needed, and I think you are right. (alert the media, I am conceeding a point. may not happen again in this lifetime!)
soreheart, you are spot-on about the unemployed/manhood issue. HUGE. BIG. can't see a way around it. He does go to the gym almost every day, which is a big help in the not-losing-his-mind department. But circumstances need to move there for him to climb back mentally. Sadly enough, here is all this FREE TIME in his world to WORK ON HIS MARRIAGE but he can't. I worry that when he is once again in a job that he will throw everything into the j-o-b, just like always, and find his validation there, spend all his free time there, and have the perfect excuse again not to work on the M b/c he's BUSY.
Fears, fears, everywhere. That one is my biggie. Well, you know, other than never having sex again. Also a possibility.
Must sleep. (yawn!)
Smooches to all my manly friends for sitting on the curb here and holding my hand. So thankful.
(((hugs))) for you BI, my smart, sassy, compassionate friend.
I wish I could wave a wand and make all the fear disappear for you. But I CAN tell you that you are a force of nature. You are a strong woman, more powerful than any fear that stands in your path. I hope you can see that someday. It's hard to find, but so worth the search.
BI,
Well, as an unemployed man, he's a depressed mess. Hopefully he can find a job that doesn't require him to travel so much. I think a job will be a big improvement, hopefully, this time he won't make it an idol.
If he finds his validation in his relationship with you, you'll both suffocate.
Unless he finds his validation in Christ, he'll be miserable.
I'm really talking to myself here.
--Theoden
believing--
how are you doing???
jacqm
Thanks for digging my thread up from the archives, jacqm! So glad to hear from you. Haven't had much gumption to post my own story for a while, but lurking and reading about everyone else.
H is back in MC with me for now. We're trying to mutually hit a "reset" button on the R. Harder than it sounds, but we had a little mini "date night" last night (just played 2 rounds of Scrabble after the kids went to bed. He smoked me, like usual. I start off strong, but he almost always wins). Then I went to bed with a raging head cold, and he went to his downstairs office to work. Small progress. We're both so flippin' uncomfortable with each other, it's difficult to see how we'll get out.
But that's where God comes in, right? Anyway, our anniversary is next week (and ironically, one year since OW contacted H for the last time) and he has been proactive in making sure I give him the babysitter's phone number, so he can call her about it. That is also nice (usually I have to line up all the childcare ducks in a row).
And he's been leaving me Good Morning notes like he used to (nothing mushy, just a smiley face note), and that is also something that makes me feel nice.
Well, I was interrupted by a man at the door from the electric company asking for past due amount of $219 - ugh. Thank God today is payday and I wrote a check. Nightmare to be chased down on so many fronts. Financially, spiritually, emotionally. YUCK.
My D7 had resistant strep this month, and her 2nd Rx cost us $192 - OMGosh it's so awful not to be able to afford health insurance!! I miss having a $20 copay for everything. (ending rant)
Anyway, that's the small scoop from here. No fat drama -this week, anyway. Read the blog if you need any more drama.
Glad to see that you are doing so well BI. Have not seen you around in a while.
Take care,
Thank you, dear Ben. I think of you often
No thank you...That means a lot BI.
Now gotta get back to getting yelled at for something....
BI--glad to see some positives! Keep it up girl.
Hey girl....keeping tabs on you, too.
Thanks for stopping by my thread...and bringing your light.
I am proud of you.....it's not an easy path you're taking and you are doing so well with all the struggles - though it may not feel that way all the time.
Loves to you!
Hi all, thanks for stopping in.
Warning, whining ahead:
I am weary weary weary.
Financially, our ship is sinking. Has been for a while, but I kept thinking things would get better soon. And then time would pass, and I would think Things will get better soon. And more time would pass and .... you get the idea.
There's no Silver Lining here.
Now I'm just defeated. I see no light at the end of our tunnel. H has been out of work for over a year now. His 'marketability' in a high white-collar position is waning with so long out of work. It appears that I will be the one doing all the work for a while, and while I was deluding myself that this was Just For A Season, it looks like there's no end to it.
And it's not like I'm making enough $ to sustain us. We've gone through H's entire cashed-out 401K, and his unemployment checks end in a few weeks. Then he'll try to find some menial job, which will A) make him feel like sh!t, and B) bring on a whole set of childcare issues, since he's been able to be home with them fulltime.
We're behind on our mortgage - we've had to renegotiate with the mtg co. to not go into Breach of Contract. Basically agreeing to pay big fat monthly payments thru June. I will have to pick up extra shifts to try to get this $ somehow.
Night shift is killing me
My anniversary is tomorrow and we don't have $ to do anything.
My 40th birthday is at the end of the month, and will likely not be much of an 'event' past a cake that I will likely make. On a positive note, everyone I work with is always shocked at my age, saying I look 25. Woo! A positive thing. Take note, there's not many here.
A college friend of mine turns 40 a week before me, and I got an invitation to a big bash for her. I can't attend (it's too far away), but I got all down -feeling like my life is at a dead end. Not even a party. Nothing worth celebrating. Yeah, I'm whining. But dammit, people, I've been looking for the silver lining for so long, and it's just not happening. After a while, that wears you down. And here I am.
If it were just the marriage, or just the finances, or just the job thing, but it's everything. Everything. I thank God for our health every day, though.
All I want to do is sleep. And never wake up. Even H has said he just wishes he were dead. Yes, it's that bad.
Now. I've vented here, and will go on about my day. Sorry for the downer.
(((((((((((((((BI)))))))))))))))
I know exactly how you're feeling.
BI-
As far as the $ problems go, I am so sorry that you are where you are. Keep your head up!
For your B-Day-There are plenty of free or cheap things to do if you think about it and they can be fun. Go to the mall and window shop. Go to a park and enjoy the beautiful spring weather. (It's pouring rain where I am), go for a drive, gas is high, but splurge. Take the kids to a zoo, rent your favorite movie and veg in front of the TV.
Take control of the situation and have fun. Money isn't the secret to fun.
Thanks, ya'll. I hope we can do some stuff like that. Maybe a picnic. I'll bounce back a little bit I'm sure. Just at the bottom of the valley right now.
Just got off the phone with our MC; had to cancel appt yesterday (and can't reschedule in the foreseeable future) and had to explain that all to her. She was supportive and sympathetic, which is nice. This is just difficult. But what else is new? My energy to 'mobilize' for the fight is low right now, but I will hopefully be renewed and transformed - just in time for Easter
BI,
I feel for ya! It's very depressing to add up the cost of a M breakup. It's staggering. And I know how you feel about
If it were just the marriage, or just the finances, or just the job thing, but it's everything. Everything.
You've got a huge weight on your shoulders.
Just thinking outloud here but I'm a faithful guy and I've got to believe there's a reason and a purpose why you've been given this load. Is this financial struggle actually, maybe keeping the two of you together? Are you learning anything from it? Do you think your H is learning? Are you afraid? How is the fear affecting your judgement, outlook and attitude? Could things be worse?
I know you're venting, and that's a good thing. I also know you'll bounce back, and be joyful for the blessings you have. I'm praying right now that your H be given a career opportunity that matches his interests.
Hang in there girl!
Love,
COG
BI,
Please, please don't give up.
I'm getting choked up.
May God hold you up this time.
--Theoden
BI - so sorry, mamma.
I know how beat you must feel.
But, keep this to what it is...the finances.
This might be a good opportunity to become close through this, working through this?
This is a little different...you MUST get back up...you must do this for your kids and your family.
Plenty of hugs to you, and happy birthday!
:::Mwah!:::
Big fat kisses to all my DB friends. I am so thankful for you.
H had a crappy day, he's been unable to sleep lately (or get into the deep REM sleep) and we don't have the $$ for a Rx. SO. I come home from work this morning to him snapping at D7, which he NEVER does. I'm the snappy parent! He apologized to her, and then drove himself half crazy thinking he had ruined her for life. etc.
Woo! Happy Anniversary to me!
He had a vase of tulips and a sweet card waiting for me. Yay!
Then he left to take the kids to school, I put out his card to find, and went to sleep.
We watched a DVD tonight together with popcorn; it was nice.
He's obviously not in bed with me now; a disappointment, but not unexpected. God's got to work all this out.
Thought I'd share with you what was happening
11 years ago. Sent an email to H with a link and the subject line "Happy Anniversary".
Better than last year, maybe, seeing as OW emailed H that night a year ago trying to re-establish contact. That was the last time. So that's better. A whole year without her.
The fact that I'm still upstairs/he's still downstairs at night checking emails, not so much better. Slow walk in, slow walk out.
BI,
How are you doing? I am just checking in on you...
sounds like you had a pretty good anniversary.
Now to fix the upstairs/downstairs thing - I recommend duct tape...
Now to fix the upstairs/downstairs thing
Put a live gorilla downstairs.
Hey I am a red neck at heart as well. You only need three tools to fix any problem: Duct Tape, Vice Grips, and a gun....
Happy Day-After-Your-Anniversary hon!
I'm glad there was some nice time shared together. I wish I could reach out and take some of your load off your shoulders, but I know you will come out of this furnace a bright, sparkling gem.
Love and best wishes to you!