80% come back?

[pandora]

as i've been browsing the threads, i keep stumbling upon some statistic that says that 80% of MLCers come back. and of the 20% who don't, part of that is that the LBS didn't want them back.

is there validity to this "statistic?"

[job]

Pandora,

Please keep to one thread. When you have numerous threads, it is difficult for us to keep up with you. Also, you cannot follow your progress as well. Okay?

To answer your question..the 80% number has been floating around for the last 10 years. . You cannot base that percentage on those who post here....because we are only a small percentage of the population. However, I do think that there is a high number of mlcers that think about returning, but cannot because the spouse either has moved on w/another partner, or the betrayal was too much and then again, there is the pride factor and the work involved...some mlcers just can't do it.

Just remember, percentages are just numbers and those numbers can change hourly.....

[pandora]

thanks for the advice! i only included this separately since i was asking independent of my sitch. was just wondering about this..

[pandora]

btw, i don't know how to delete threads but you can delete this one if it's going to clutter stuff.

[job]

Leave it be....just, in the future, you need to stick to one thread. You can actually change your subject line each and every time you post on your main thread.

[braveheart]

Pandora, there is NO WAY 80% of MLCer's come back. As Snodderly pointed out, this board does represent a small sampling of all total MLCer's, but with that being said, I do believe that enough people post on here to have some pretty reliable data and stats. Based on what I have seen on here over the last 4 years, I would say about 5% return or restore the marriage. I feel that number is very generous.

[forward]

I think it depends on how you define "come back." It seems that most of them have their regrets and float the idea of returning by the LBS but are not willing to let go of OP...and the LBS moves on.

Also, time is interesting to consider--I have noticed that sometimes it is much much later, but it does seem to happen that they will make a rather limp effort to reconsider. Many on the board have had multiple returns.

[libbyasking]

I think it is difficult to substantiate any percentages accurately.

The people accessing this forum are very small. The number of men acknowledging MLC is also potentially very small.

I know 5 couples where the men recently went into MLC. Three couples are now back together and trying to make their new relationship work, my H is still out to supper and one H won't get home because his LBS has now moved on.

[peacetoday]

I have known 4-5 couples personally who went thru MLC ( or something resembling it) all reconsiled

none of the Male spouses moved out, but had affairs and much talk was said about moving but they didnt

all couples are currentlky still M but one is seperated- I think -we lost touch
I also believe many of the MLC cers MAY consider returning but there has been too much damage
I knew of one couple who after 8 years H showed regret and made HINTS of return, but XW flat out said NO Way
seems like in the begining, we LBS think we will never let go and always want H back, but in time many here do move on and sometimes, it may be years nad years before the MLCER may wake and so it mnay be too late
either way,, take care of you and use this time for your individual healing and growth
even if we can restore a friendship and lighten the load for our kids that is a sucess I believe for Us and rewards will be great for our individual growth as well as any future R
Peace

[forward]

Peace,
Friend of mine says that her X was hinting after 10 years.

It wasn't just NO WAY. It was NO BLEEPING WAY.

[1000ships]

Pandora,

i keep stumbling upon some statistic that says that 80% of MLCers come back. and of the 20% who don't, part of that is that the LBS didn't want them back.

If the 80% is true, then what? What does that mean to you; what will you do?
If instead, what Braveheart says about 5% return or restore the marriage, then what? What does that mean to you; what will you do?

Forget about statistics—I know, easier said than done. But what do you want? Are you going to make your decision based on the statistics? Do you base your desires on statistics.
I wanted my husband and marriage and determined that if the odds were 1/1000, I’d be the one.
If statistics are low, have you considered why?
Maybe others hear they are low and give up.
Maybe they are higher for DBers…or LBSs who learn Standing behaviors. Maybe not. Who cares! Choose what you are going to be based on your Self and what you want rather than basing it on what others have had.

[Jack_Three_Beans]

If you are expecting the numbers to work in your favor then the numbers are going to fail you.

You do the work, and work toward the set of numbers YOU want to be in in...be it the 80% or 1% that come back.

I wanted my husband and marriage and determined that if the odds were 1/1000, I’d be the one.

1000, That alone makes you awesome. : )

Be the 1 in whatever number. : )

[braveheart]

Jack, that is a great attitude in dealing with life, I agree about being #1. Unfortunately, in this situation, you have virtually no control on the outcome. There is one statistic involved that you can't ignore, and that is its really up to the WAS to come back. I have read some posters posts about those wanting to come back after the LBS has moved on. I think those people stand a greater chance, I mean how would want someone who hasn't moved forward and is sitting around waiting for them to come back?

[1000ships]

Braveheart,

Unfortunately, in this situation, you have virtually no control on the outcome.

Virtually no control?
That is not true. You have control over your portion of it.
It is true that you cannot make your spouse come home—back or forward. It is true that you cannot make your spouse want to be home or make them choose to be home.
But you control your responses. If you are reacting, you are not controlling your Self. Choose an outcome of joy regardless of what your spouse chooses or does.
Not all midlife crises will play out the same; no midlife crisis will play out like another. But I have learned that in many situations the LBS has the most choice. What I mean is that in the end there are many MLCers who want to return or wish they could and the LBS gets to choose to say yes or no

[braveheart]

1000 ships, where do you get this information that most MLCer's want to or wish to return? I have been on this board 4 years and I have only seen that very rarely, I know 1 person who went through an MLC and posted on here regularly and tried every way possible to make the marriage work, but in the end it didn't. I have seen a couple of marriages restored, but very few. I also have my doubts on a few of them working out. What you have to understand about an MLC is they leave because they feel their spouse is their problem. They blame everything on you, take zero responsibility or accountability in their lives. They are mean, spiteful, cruel, and downright mean spirited. At the end of the day, most probably do see that it didn't work out the way they wanted, but you have to understand that in order for them to return, they have to admit they were wrong. Most people aren't willing to do that, I mean you spend years telling everyone what a monster you are as the LBS, and how you were the cause of all their problems, its really tough to come back. Its been my experience that most people won't admit they have done wrong, its just a pride thing. I also believe that many in an MLC never come out of it.

[Jack_Three_Beans]

She said Many...not most.

Look with this...tempers are going to flair.

Anytime a number comes up.

Anytime someone says, most, many, some, few always never...

As far as numbers go...screw it. If a person WANTS their marriage to work, then they should be spitting eye of conventional wisdom. Anyone who looks at the numbers is hard pressed not to feel intimidated anyway.

But Screw the numbers...the only number that should matter is the number you determine yourself to be. What percentage are you?
Many, or Most, or few to none?

Determine your own course...and do not let some number, some percentage, or some grouping tell you what that is.

Data is corruptable...it is far from clean.

[forward]

BH, I think you are right that many MLCers never come out of it. They whirl and twirl and are basically lost the rest of their lives, if they ever grow up.

However, I have noticed that most MLCers DO have moments where they try to approach the LBS--sometimes directly, sometimes not. I would say that that is the norm, not the exception. It is really mostly a matter of timing.

The thing is, the LBS has often moved on by then--has gained self-esteem, perhaps has a new love, and sometimes has new standards that they insist. Although I am not currently involved with anyone, I am certainly leaning that way and it would take a great, great deal for X to win me back at this point. In fact, I doubt it could happen.

X hasn't expressed an interest but if he were to do so, I don't think I would take him up on it.

[Truegritter]

I enter this with humble humility...as an anecdote and nothing more.

I am here because I am an LBS in my 2nd M. But before the second I was an LBS in my 1st M- 10 years ago (I know there is something wrong with me that's why I'm here, I am a slow learner!)

Well xW finds out that there is trouble in my M and calls me a couple of months ago to tell me that what she did in our M was the biggest mistake she ever made in her life. She offers to call my W and tell her that.

I thought her very gracious to care about my new W so much.

We have been divorced 10 years now and she never remarried or had children.

So the there ya go Jack a sample size of 1!

[SoCo]

Also key is did the MLCer do any work and heal themselves before they want to come back. The LBS has usually worked, improved themselves, and become a better person (we hope). If the MLCer is the same or more messed up (for lack of a better word) as they were at the beginning, coming back is fruitless.

[gatsby11]

Ha ha ha, Truegritter. I will keep that story in mind. . .

I actually like this thread because it's just musings on chances, and who doesn't wonder from time to time?

[braveheart]

Jack, as I said earlier, everyone should do what they feel is best. I am not being critical of anyone's decisions. I am just merely sharing my own experiences, they are not what most want to hear, but they are what they are. I hope people don't gem mad, I won't, its not personal. I am a data guy, although I do agree that things happen against the odds and numbers. I have acknowledged this. Truegritter, you are one of the very few people on here that I have seen this happen to. Yes, it does happen, I have also recognized and acknowledged this, it is however rare when it occurs.

[iluvme55]

Hey H......I would love to prove you wrong......if I could prove you wrong, would you try not to be so hard on new people at least till their skin gets a little thicker.......ttyl

[braveheart]

IRMA, I am neither wrong nor right. I have acknowledged things happen, just rarely. I'm not trying to be hard on anyone, the original thread was does 80% come back? Its very obvious that number is unrealistic, I was merely pointing that out. I do not believe in lying to people, especially about this. If one wishes to stand for the rest of their life, its their choice, I wish them well in their quest.

[1000ships]

Braveheart,

1000 ships, where do you get this information that most MLCer's want to or wish to return

As Jack pointed out, I said many not most.
I no longer offer percentages. Regarding the 80% rule, back in the day I read it, spread it and now regret it. I neither believe or disbelieve it because I don’t feel that relying on the data in a situation like this is beneficial. Data can be changed and thus it’s accuracy is corruptible

I have been on this board 4 years and I have only seen that very rarely

Yes, I remember your arrival and you’ve pointed out how rarely you’ve seen returns several times it seems. You even made a list of a few and left out some regular posters who you corresponded with and knew. But you’re not going to catch all of them and I think most who are rebuilding leave the boards to work on their marriage. That’s not why I was gone and I’ve returned occasionally. Sure I’ve been working on my marriage, but there were other reasons for my leaving.

I have seen a couple of marriages restored, but very few. I also have my doubts on a few of them working out.

I also have my doubts. That is because LBSs claim restoration when their spouse comes back—often early in the crisis (before two years post Bomb)—rather than returning forward.

What you have to understand about an MLC is they leave because they feel their spouse is their problem. They blame everything on you, take zero responsibility or accountability in their lives. They are mean, spiteful, cruel, and downright mean spirited. At the end of the day, most probably do see that it didn't work out the way they wanted, but you have to understand that in order for them to return, they have to admit they were wrong.

You are telling me what I must understand?
A new identity does not mean I don’t understand. I’ve written about Monster based on observations in my own life as well as other LBSs.

its really tough to come back

ARRGH!
Coming back is easy. It’s difficult to return forward.

most people won't admit they have done wrong

That depends on what you mean and require in an admission.
Many will not verbalize an I’m sorry but will show it. And the verbalization is meaningless without the action—I received a lot of words before there were actions to back them up.

Some LBSs want their MLCer groveling.
Begging and pleading is yuck from either the MLC and LBS.
Apologies are wonderful. Actions are wonderful. But I wanted a strong spouse. MLCers return broken—or rather they attempt to return by coming back. Sometimes the returns are genuine attempts and sometimes they have no intention of putting effort into ending the affair to work on the marriage. Mine thought he could work on the marriage during the affair; I think he really believed that. So I kicked him out when I saw evidence.

I also believe that many in an MLC never come out of it.

Some don’t. Some become even worse and get stuck in Limbo.

Look with this...tempers are going to flair.

Not from me. I have received emails from posters who are upset with Braveheart. As for me, Braveheart has always been my discussion hero because though he supports, he brings up the things people don’t want to face, asking the tough questions. But he is polite and respectful in his style. Many don’t get that and only see him brewing up another batch of MLC Another Perspective.

[braveheart]

1000 ships, thank you for your kind words. Its true that we as people do disagree, that is what makes us different. I certainly have my perspective on things, I'm sorry if it offends some people on here, I don't make this personal, just my opinions on things. I try not to make anyone mad, but I suppose some are pretty passionate about their beliefs, I just wish they could be passionate without being angry. I guess its kinda like dealing with other things, you can't make people feel or do anything, so I suppose we will have to agree to disagree. I'm good with that, I can still be your friend and not agree. I will give a stat that might make some people happy. If your spouse is with another person, there is a 97% chance it will fail. If you are divorced and your XW or XH has remarried, there is a 65% chance they will divorce..... I also agree with those stats, I try to be fair!