I'm moving over here from the newbies board. I'll just pick up where I left off ...
My W filed for D the first week of July. Our initial court date is set for tomorrow. It looks like we'll be exchanging all the necessary forms. Unless anything is contested, or there is some gigantic change of heart on Her part, it will all be official on Oct 9th or 10th. We've agreed on all the financial/stuff details. She's doing everything she can to get out as quick as possible. That part just frustrates me.
I've pretty much resigned myself to the fact that I can't stop the actual D. Any attempt on my part to do so is only going to come across as pursuit, or at the very least an attempt to hang on to the rope, so dropped it is. I think the part that frustrates me the most, is that there is/has been about zero communication from her about anything. How freaking hard is it to let me know what is going on? I've gone back and forth on being just absolutely livid about the whole thing to being almost hopeful. Stupid emotions.
I'm mostly mad that the little interaction I do have with her comes across like she decided to move on months ago then realized that she hadn't told me. So now I'm more of an afterthought while she lives the life she always wanted. I'm stuck trying to sort out something that happened months ago, for her anyway. Does that make sense to anyone?
I'm trying to sort out how I want to approach the whole paperwork thing tomorrow. Part of me is fighting to see why I should even care. She's already made up her mind that it is me that she doesn't want. I don't see any change in that. The other part of me thinks/hopes that there is some conflict buried beneath her "I've moved on" exterior. Maybe the short version is that she just gets to walk away clean. How do you do that? How do you just cut someone out of your life like that?
I'm all over the place today. I know this is disjointed but it needs to come out. Tomorrow will be here soon and I'd rather not have this rolling around in my head. Jump on in ... the water is warm.
Recipe for MLC
1c- seemingly normal person
1c- bad childhood
1/2c- unresolved issues
1c- seemingly innocent friend of the opposite sex
1/2c- anger and resentment
3/4c- confusion
1/2T- blank stare
1c- complete nuts
2c- depression
3c- Lying
Combine ingredients and let stew for several years...
Add depression and let (half) bake for several months...
Turn up heat and let expand until nuts are fully exposed on outer layer.
Apply a sprinkling of reality occasionally to keep from overexposure to heat.
Let ingredients rest as much as possible to keep from getting burned.
Should be done in around 3-7 years.
Let cool for several of those before attempting to handle.
There are several of these recipes out there, that will work.
Variations can always be done, and ( gasp ) this recipe can be re-written into a recipe that DOESN'T work....
Anyone else want to add anything ?
I would like to add ...
6 c - secrecy
and the blank stares need to be added to taste
Can I assume that the filing/pursuit of the divorce is not really moving on?
What do I do tomorrow? I'm thinking of acting like it doesn't bother me. That I have other more interesting things to do. No chit chat. Just fill out the forms and go about my day. Does that sound too aloof?
What do I do tomorrow? I'm thinking of acting like it doesn't bother me. That I have other more interesting things to do. No chit chat. Just fill out the forms and go about my day. Does that sound too aloof?
I think you need to keep a few things in mind.....
Dignity
Honor
Grace
And think about what it is that you want to project to her...
This is an oppurtunity for you to shine through this...
Not so sure that you can shine and project darkness at the same time....
You have done the work on yourself ( I assume )
Maybe it's time to NOT plan your actions beforehand and just let MW come out for a while...
Trust yourself that YOU are real, and that your work payed off for you....
And if that isn't enough ?
You can only be who you really are E....nobody else...
Trust YOU through this....
If it feels like an act, then that's all it will ever be....
I give you prayers my friend....
I would say luck, but you don't need that...
I say just be yourself tomorrow.
Mach, T2SP
I appreciate the responses. I met with Db Coach Jody yesterday. It seems to have thrown me off my game. I think I'm doing x, when it comes across as y. It could just be a case of too much thinking. I know why I moved. I know why I'm doing all this work. It's all for me to find me again. Not that I ever went completely missing, but this whole MLC/WAW stuff had me running around trying to figure out who I am with respect to Her. That's no way to live, especially with someone who doesn't want to be attached to me in any form.
Dignity. Honor. Grace. Good words.
Hi mt, I think it takes strong people to stay the course during someone's MLC so we don't take off into our own! Yes, we spin and get sucked in to their games and wonder who we are. Stay strong, stay steady.
Tomorrow? be your best self. Look good, smell good, walk with confidence. Be the prize she is losing.
I'll be thinking of you...fellow Coloradan!! Be strong and be the man she would never think of losing...
I'll be thinking of you...fellow Coloradan!! Be strong and be the man she would never think of losing...
Hey MW, nope, its no way to live, trying to figure out who you are in relation to her. But, you know that, right?
I will be thinking of you tomorrow. I know it will be a difficult day.
Stand strong and believe in you.
Mountain
Yes keeping the focus on ourselves and finding us ourselves again
It is a difficult road with the pain comes many unexpected blessings
and everything that was missing is found
as for the MLCer
I loved the recipe
so true
and it was not our fault-their escape
it may never really make sense ans they lose everything and get worse as time goes on
it was something they had to go thru maybe to find themselves too
I dont know
I just went thru the D thing
It was hard
but just another step
It means nothing if you decide to continue your stand
it means closure if thats what you need
it is scary
wishing you strength for tomorrow
peace
Chin up Punk !!!!
YOU are gonna be fine regardless.....
Thanks for the words of encouragement. I'm leaving shortly for my appointed time in court. I'm feeling good. No expectations.
AND.....how did it go? I'm probably next in line....Hang in there.
The update: She was waiting when I got there. I'm my usual dapper self. Told her she looked nice ... no response. There was this poster in the waiting room that she went on and on about. We talked about work a bit. We do the paper exchange with the court lady. We agree on everything, submit the appropriate forms, bing bang boom, on Oct 8th this will all be official. It was all very emotionless. It took all of 20 minutes.
We walk out together and nobody is saying anything. She just stops in the middle of the sidewalk and tells me she is going to this store across the street. Ok. The play by play is short ...
M: I'm sorry it has come to this. It seems like such a waste.
W: I'm sorry too.
<long pause>
M: I'm not mad that you want out. Well I am mad that you want out but I can deal with that. I just don't understand how we've gotten to this point.
W: We've been talking about this all along.
M: No we haven't. The last time we talked, you said you wanted things to work out with us. Now, all of a sudden it's just over. There is no discussion; no nothing. It's like you decided months ago and just got around to telling me.
W: We've talked this into the ground.
M: I just wanted to walk away knowing we tried everything possible.
W: You don't think that?
M: No, i do not.
W: Well, I do.
<long pause>
M: Well, I guess this is goodbye then. Take care of yourself.
She then hugs me and we part ways.
The only emotion I saw from her was when she hugged me. I could tell that she was about to lose it. Other than that it was like I was talking to a stranger. Now earlier, when we left the court lady, W asked her about the poster. W is all animated and into the discussion with this total stranger. like they are long lost sisters or something. She is about to leave me forever, and I get absolutely no response from her.
I decided to roll with me today. I can't decide if I totally blew all the Db principles with our little convo in the street, but I couldn't just walk away in good conscience without saying SOMETHING about how I think this is a waste of unbelievable potential. I'm bouncing back and forth between being ridiculously sad and absolutely furious.
I'm not mad that she wants to leave. Well I am, but that is not my main issue right now. I know that I'll be fine without her. I can exist just fine without her. I value myself enough to know that I deserve to be treated better than I have been. I'm mad at the way she left. I don't understand how someone can just walk away after 7 years together with just a "take care," like I'm an afterthought. How do you DO that? I don't understand how you don't even TRY to make it work. And that is the bottom line, for me, I think. Through all of this I have been offering to do absolutely anything to make it work. I volunteered to move anywhere in the world, quit my job, whatever it took. Since this all started, she hasn't even had tried to call me - for anything. Talk all you want, but how do you not TRY yourself? I know in her head she thinks she tried ... but really? How do you convince yourself you did? This didn't happen TO us.
Beats the heck out of me, except mine has been a 20 year marriage. How do you just leave those memories and that life behind?
So now what? Right now, part of me wants to believe that there is some internal struggle for her. That maybe she'll regret it - someday. The other part looks at this and thinks, "dude, wake up. She's gone and is showing no signs of looking back. This isn't a shot in the dark for her. She has already made plans that do not include you."
I know that me trying to make sense of this is like trying to catch the wind. I won't ever know why, really, unless she decides to tell me. I will make every effort to stop trying to figure it out and continue to work on me. I'm a great guy. I know my street value.
I deserve better than this.
But tonight. Tonight. It feels like I just got run over by a bus. And one that I saw coming. My emotions are all over the place. I know I did everything possible to make this work, but tonight ... I feel cheated. And my heart just hurts. I know it will get better. But not tonight.
Mountain
It is hard
and you went thru a lot today
tomorrow will be better
I believe the way our MLCers leave with NO feeling attached to it
is they shutdown
maybe thats part of the crises
they shut everything down
then the OP
they are confused and the love for us is buries deep within
I speak with many people
I have net people whose spouse has left
some had affairs
many returned others, wanted to return-sometimes it was too late
I beleive many wiull feel some regret
later
after bottom
after affair wears off
there is NO way to reach them
so we have no choice in this to let go
you will be OK
peace
peace-
Thanks for the kind words. I feel better today. Just about every time I see her she has sunglasses permanently attached to her face. Yesterday during the court deal she couldn't wear them, but she wouldn't blink either. The second we're outside the sunglasses return. I remember looking at her and thinking, "I know she is in there somewhere." It's like she is a zombie or something. Crisis mode ... I get that.
Today is a different day. This day is not about her or us. I do keep praying for her (and me). Ultimately I can't control anything about what she does or doesn't do. I can only control me.
On a side note ... despite being hijacked by my emotions yesterday, that didn't happen until the long ride home. All things considered, I was pleased with the way I handled myself DURING the encounter. I was confident and sure of myself like I normally am. Even our brief interaction wasn't begging or pleading, didn't try to talk her out of anything ... just me, MW, being me.
Grace. Dignity. Honor. Kept rolling around in my head.
Onward.
Enjoy the beautiful Colorado day!
mw, sorry for your hurt and glad you're feeling better today. It is amazing how the sun still shines after such dark.
Chin up!
Sweetie, I think you handled yourself beautifully yesterday with grace, dignity and honor and you can never go wrong being you.
My h walked away from a 31 year relationship without looking back. No one knows what is going on in their heads. Trying to figure it out will make you crazy.
So, you have to walk through and feel the emotions and then pick yourself up and continue on your journey.
I am thinking about you and wishing you peace.
These are just random thoughts I need to get out of my head. I've been trying to pinpoint what has been bothering me lately. I was watching TV the other day and there was this line I heard that sums up my frustration with my STBXW. "I mean so little to her that I don't even get the courtesy of a conversation." That about sums it up. I know she has feeling. I know she can't face them. This has to be her way right now. But it still doesn't make it hurt any less. I'm tired of thinking about it. At least I can put a name to it now.
DB C suggested I write this letter to her, basically letting her know that I understand why she chose to leave. I think I'm stuck on the way she proposed it to me ... "I was emotionally unavailable, so you became physically unavailable." I get that she may have FELT that I was unavailable, but that was not the case. I get that I contributed to the situation, but it's not so simple that she left in response to something I was incapable of doing. I need to let this go. I think I may change my point to "I understand how you felt I was emotionally unavailable." I don't know why it bugs me so much, but it just does.
I'm not so sure about the letter idea. When we parted ways last week, her last comment was "we've talked about us to death." I don't want to make this come across as me trying to get her to listen. DB C tells me that the point is to let her know that "I get it." I don't get it. I can understand her feelings. I can understand why she might think those things. I can't understand why the only solution is D, or sleeping with someone else, or any of the other weirdo things she has done.
I'm still processing. Just getting it out on paper. Or ... in print.
Mountain
it doesnt makes sense and I think I went threu a similar stage of grief
like
Why couldnt xh just leave..think things thru...be alone for a while..grieve like the way I choise to deal with it
I believe part of it is really the crises
they were gone long before the bomb
they were defying life and laws of nature way before
I see it as total rebellion
now it is clear 2.5 years later b/c my xh is at rock bottom
he is stuck
he is remarried
in debt
on prescription drugs
unavailable to his kids, himself or anyone else
they defy nature for a time and GET away with it
the secrets, the lies, the affair, the hurt, the walking away with no conversations...
but it catches up
for the few fortunate MLCers, will find help and find their way back to themselves
the one they wanted to becomne before crises
for the others...I dont know
time will onlky tell with each situation
continue your grieving
your searching seeking praying believing
continue moving forward whatever that means to you for today
hold on to hope
believe for the best,be your best
write the letter
send it or not
chances are it will NOT matter anyway
maybe the dbc- just wanted you to take responsibility for the failure (your part) of the M
and let W know you understand now what you did wrong
I did that at one point
It did catch my xh ear when I said it
but unfortunately in my situation, it didnt make a difference anyway
peace
time --the crises will take time and you will see more later
peace
Hey M, this is such hard stuff and its so hard to get your head around it. You are trying to understand something that she doesnt even understand. It doesnt make sense because it is crazy stuff.
I think if you are unsure about the letter, I would hold off on it. I dont know your whole sitch and I dont know what you and the DB C discussed, but, I am not sure what that letter would do at this point. Your w is not ready to hear any of that, in my opinion.
Sometimes it is best to be still, ya know? I spun around for many months trying to understand how h can do this, how he could walk away without a backward glance. You know what I figured out- nothing? You cant make sense out of the illogical. So, if you can, stop trying to make sense out of it. You will drive yourself crazy.
She is in crisis. She is lost, broken. It really doesnt matter why they do this, does it? It is what it is.
So, what are you going to do to move forward. Because if you keep trying to get this, you stay stuck. You chase your tail and never catch it.
It is important to be very objective in your part in the demise of your marriage. Not for her, for you. That is where you begin to take control of your life. That is where you begin the changes you want to make.
Hang in there. This journey can be so rewarding. It can make us become the person we were meant to be.
So, get back on it.
Just to catch everyone up ..
I've been looking back over my posts and it must seem like I am a mess. I'm not. Honest. Here is about the only place I have to vent and sort some things out. I appreciate all the folks checking in on me. I really do! I've been trying to identify what has been bothering me. I figure if I can name it, it will be easier to deal with.
Anyway ... last weekend I bought a motorcycle. I had to sell my last one to finance my move out here some 10 years ago. For the longest time I have been debating this purchase. Last weekend I went for a test drive. It's a used cruiser, fully loaded. Ok, so it is an impulse buy. It isn't practical. It isn't a necessity. I want it. I can afford it. It makes me happy. So there. I've had this internal dialogue since I've bought it. It dredges up some old, old issues with me, which I think is a good thing.
This week at work has been horrible, but at least it has allowed me to focus on something other than my M. I'm still standing for the M. I do want it to work out between us. But I'm not standing still. I haven't heard from Her since the court date. I still have some processing I want to do.
MW, good for you! Just dont go having a MLC on us now, ok?
And not standing still is also a good thing.
No worries on coming here to vent. Thats what this place is for.
Listen, this is all a process. It all happens when its supposed to happen. You will get where to where you want to be in your own time. Let is all unfold, allow yourself some time to process it all.
An MLC of my own? Now THAT would be funny. Many years ago I bought a bike and took it on a tour of the NE. I was a teacher, so I had 2 months off. Being on it is a) relaxing b) forces you to take the back roads and c) provides amazing singularity of focus. During this tour I was out looking for some direction and finally found it. It was a good experience. I'm not trying to recreate my past or anything, just doing those things that I know work for me. I may be slow, but my work is poor. Haha.
Interesting...my h is somewhere on his BMW motorcycle as I write this. He took the trip to get focused and try and figure out what the heck he wants. He'll be gone for a week and I hope he comes back maybe with a more clear direction, however I also know time moves so slowly for a MLCer that I don't know if it will be 'helmet time' for him. Maybe, just maybe enough to keep moving through the MLC tunnels...Hope you enjoy that bike!
Hey Golfgirl ~
Have you ever read my thread on the Newcomers forum? It is titled " Who Is This Stranger Living In My House?"
I recently talked about my H and the Harley.
We have a beautiful Ultra Classic Touring Bike that we both made the decision to buy.
I loved riding with him on that bike.
One of the first things that made me wonder if he was going through MLC was that he said he wanted to ride by himself a lot more. So he could think. The open road and time to think!! Uh Huh! The skank rides with him now.
When you have some time, go to my thread and find out what I recently realized. I can't believe I never thought of it before!
It's the footrest realization!
Within the last month, I even came face to face with them on the bike. Coming back from a trip I was hoping he was on alone.
I hate that bike now. It's all I can do to keep from pushing that bike over whenever I pull into the garage.
I don't though.
It's not the right thing to do.
I will be the better person.
I will continue to treat him with unconditional love, be his friend, and be the better option that I know I am.
I also need to remember that he is not himself right now.
Not the one I married.
I put my FAITH in the LORD everyday.
I focus on HIM and not the situation.
It will turn around.
In HIS timing.
Until then, I will continue to pray for him.
MJ
Mountain
Good for you
we need hobbies and sounds like the bike will supply some fun much needed right now
probably a good choice
MY xh had a bike too
hardly rode it
he had to recently sell it to pay his L
oh well- enjoy your new bike
you are doing great
peace
Thanks, peace.
I don't feel like I'm doing great with all of this.
I had this realization this realization last night, that all the things I do that make me happy, I do alone. I have friends here in my new city but most of the things I do for me, involve only me. I'm not sure why that is, exactly. I am introverted by nature, so I like and need the alone time, but all alone can't be good.
Friday my boss and I had a meeting with a vendor. Two women did this presentation for us and it was like something in me unleashed. The old MW came out ... all funny, chatty and just a little flirty. I was quite the hit. I'm working on getting out more. Out, in a social way. Just thinking.
Gotta learn to play golf!!! Great courses in this city...
I had this realization this realization last night, that all the things I do that make me happy, I do alone. I have friends here in my new city but most of the things I do for me, involve only me. I'm not sure why that is, exactly. I am introverted by nature, so I like and need the alone time, but all alone can't be good.
Hey, dude! I finally found your thread.
Just like everything else in all of this (even in life!), it's that all-important BALANCE.
Yes, you are right- all alone can't be good. But all "together" can't be good either, yes?
When I first began to get a grip on all of this, I spent a LOT of time with family and friends. I finally figured out that, while I did kind of feel better, there was something.....missing.
For me, that something missing was the "down time". It turns out that I was so busy with spending time with friends, that I was not giving myself the alone time I needed to process the grief I was feeling.
In effect, I was avoiding my issues by trying to cover up what was wrong with "good times"........
...just like my W.
I started to spend a lot more time alone...and I started to heal that "missing" part. I watched myself like a hawk, and eventually, the fear that I initially had about possibly slipping into a hermit-like depression slowly faded. Now, I feel I have a good balance between "face time" and "me time". But I had to learn to find that delicate equilibrium.
Don't overly concern yourself with "shoulds"- "I
should get out more", "I
should spend time with such-and-such", "I
should go out and do X". Take the
type of time that you need for your processing- whatever that may be. You'll know how much you need when you get there.
Two women did this presentation for us and it was like something in me unleashed. The old MW came out ... all funny, chatty and just a little flirty. I was quite the hit. I'm working on getting out more. Out, in a social way. Just thinking.
I like the sound of this. Unleash that stuff more often. By no means am I suggesting you go hop in the sack with someone. (which btw I know you wouldn't do) Having fun and being sociable are positive things that get lost in this mess all too often.
Unleash more.
Golfgirl-I golf, if you can call it that.
Trapt-I'm trying to unleash that part of me again. It was pretty hard to to with my W when all she was telling me was how unattracted to me she was.
Jimbo-Nice to hear from you! How are ya doin?
Ok ... today I get the only contact from my W I've had in weeks. It's an email about a random assortment of bills. For example, I paid off a joint card. She comes back and tells me there is $20 left on the acct and do I plan on paying it? I'm annoyed, especially after I've been unbelievably considerate paying off a bunch of bills. Really? We're going to quibble about $20 after I just paid thousands of dollars to pay off the acct in the first place? She still hasn't paid me fore the car insurance from May. I'm annoyed that it really has come down to this. All along I haven't said one word about the money, I've just paid the bills and kept quiet figuring that as long as we were still married I would do the stand up thing and honor my commitments.
Another example. The elec. bill was in her name. I paid it while I lived on my own and she moved out. It's in HER name, yet she's asking me to cancel the account. I'm not reading anything in to this. I'm not looking for a way to get back at her or anything, but it's her account. I don't live there anymore. Why can't she just cancel it? Is that petty to ask her to do it?
Something about this doesn't sit well with me, so I'm not going to respond right away. Anyone want to chime in here? Grrrr.
MW
I would try to seperate what is hers now
and what is yours
let her pay her own bills
get it all written up in the agreement exactly what your responsibility financially is toward her
if unsure check with your L
At this point while D is looming it is a business deal
not a M
If we allow them top emotionally hook us, we will want to give them more tham is fair
In my situation, MY xh was running the business in the ground spending it all
I had to take legal action to stop him
i have kids to tyhink of
I did stop him
I saved the business
it did bring conflict to us
but the conflict would have been anyway b/c he is an a$$
so think about YOU
what you need
what you want
financially what you can give or not
and set boundries
peace
just my thoughts
peace
My h called me when he moved out and wanted ALL of the bills for this house put into my name...my lawyer said NO way, so I didn't. He called the water company and got his name off of it and my girlfriend called them and made them put his name BACK on it. When I asked h about the water bill he said, "well, my name was never on that bill." WHAT??? That's why I'm going to court in a month or so...financial protection! And, you ARE doing the stand up thing and honoring your commitments. It's these MLCers who don't get "COMMITMENT." Hang in there..
I appreciate the concern for my well-being. I'm in a far better financial position than she is right now, which irritates her I am sure. There's no chance that she can hurt me in any way in our current situation. We have no lawyers. It's all about tying up loose ends. We're not even talking a lot of money here, maybe $50 total. That's the part that confuses me. When she left she couldn't get out fast enough. She took some clothes and the dogs and that was it. **Poof** Gone. She has a job. She can just as easily cancel the accounts that are in her name. Am I missing something?
Uhmm.....that she is F-ing Looney?
Nope, got that covered.....
Right....she's nuts. Gonna lose a great guy (and a golfer to boot) if she doesn't pull her head out of her a%$ really soon!
We're not even talking a lot of money here, maybe $50 total. That's the part that confuses me. When she left she couldn't get out fast enough. She took some clothes and the dogs and that was it. **Poof** Gone. She has a job. She can just as easily cancel the accounts that are in her name. Am I missing something?
Maybe
she is: Contact?
Sometimes it's not about what is said, as much as that there's
something being said between you.
Think of the 5 year old that sees mommy and daddy having a conversation, and they want to participate too, but don't know how- so they just spout off anything at any old time.
Yeah. It's a lot like that.
MW,
Thought I'd track you down. I'd read nothing into this interaction, if you can call it that, other than her tying up loose ends and get you to pay for stuff. You might still be "standing", but she's done. She simply doesn't care what you think (unlike you, who cares what she's thinking)...she just wants you to pay so she doesn't have to. Hopefully you are continuing to move forward with your own life and not worrying too much about what she's doing.
BTW, it was okay to do the stuff outside the courthouse...what's she gonna do, divorce you again. I think you got a truthful read, she is satisfied with being out.
maybe they want to keep us under their thumb?
just in case--maybe it pleases them to know how much we care still
I think My xh enjoyed the 2 years I stood
waiting for him to visit
spending my energy trying to show him I still cared, was cchanging and was willing to be there
It was part of my healing,,my amends to him for my part of the failure of our M
I have No regrets--I did change
I became the one I always wanted to be
Do what you think is best about the money and accounts
peace
OK, after a very poor decision this morning on my part, followed by a beating by Jim and Mach with some rather hefty 2 x 4 s, I decided to head to the mountains on my bike to clear my head. Note to self: riding a motorcycle in the freezing rain is less than fun. My one hour trip turned into 6. Fine. I went to my favorite spot hoping to be alone and process some stuff. Turns out there was some festival or other such nonsense. It was wall to wall people. I go to my favorite restaurant to wait out the rain - everyone around me wants to chat. What is up with that? Clearly, my "do not disturb" face is NOT working.
So, the thought occurred to me on this ride: what if this isn't an MLC? What if she just stopped loving me? She's moved on. End of story? If there is no MLC, she's not going to wake up. There is no chance at reconciliation. She's just done. Fini.
I'm not sure what to do with that thought.
mw,
Whether it's mlc or just waw symptoms, you still need to separate your finances/assets to protect yourself and your family. You must live your life to the fullest and let her go for a while. You can still move on and leave the door ajar, but do not wait in one spot for a very long time. We do not want to see you get stuck.
It's time now to look at your situation (monetary) as a business deal gone south and prepare the necessary paperwork to protect yourself. Right now, it doesn't matter whether she's in mlc or not...she's gone and has given the impression she's done.
Take it one second at at time and look to the day for new experiences and try to find one thing to smile about.
We are all here for you.
MW, if there is one thing I learned in here is this.......listen to Snodderly, God has given her an understanding of this MLC stuff.Doesn't preach to anyone. just tells us so much truth about what our husbands and wives are going thru...she has helped me understand what they are going thru..doesn't promise me my husband will come home, doesn't tell anyone what they want to hear....doesn't sugar coat anything.....she has been a blessing to me and so many others here.....Thanks you Snodderly for all you have done .......
Irma
Snodderly-
All our stuff has been divided. Financially we are completely independent. The paperwork has all been filed, financial agreements signed and submitted. I'm safe. I'm in a better place now that when we had joint accounts.
My issue with the bills wasn't a protection thing. She has been all gung ho about getting split up. I was surprised she called me to ask if i was going to pay this stupid $20 bill and to close the accounts that were in her name to begin with (elec, phone). I moved out a month and a half ago. She can easily take care of these thing on her own. It just seemed like an odd request. It is almost as if she wants to be divorced, but doesn't want to take care of crossing the t's herself. Like i'm somehow supposed to participate in this process.
All the paperwork for the D has been filed. I'm set. The waiting period ends Oct 8. Barring a major departure from the current status quo, it will all be official when the judge signs off on it.
Your wife is still looking to you to take care of things. If she wants the bills taken care of and her name removed from the accounts that she's on...she can do this herself. You are not her "daddy".
It's not an odd request at all...they will try/test you to see if you will: 1) do it for them and 2)get a reaction out of you. You do neither. Your wife is a big girl and if she wants to end the marriage, then she will have to be the one to do her part. They never want to look like the bad guys in all of this. They want to point the finger and say "see, he/she rushed this and I'm still confused or don't know what I want". Don't react.
Hang in there.
I worried about your ride...saw the storms coming and thought, "hope he has his rain gear!"
My h told me he "emotionally" left the marriage over a year ago..uh huh that makes me feel better. Thanks for the communication, buddy!
Remember, they rewrite whatever they need to to justify their actions. Let your heart hurt when it needs to, ride that wave out, get a beer and move on. You'll be fine...besides you know your "street value"
Don't forget that...
Hang in there and enjoy this gorgeous day....
Hey MW, great talking with you yesterday.
Listen, a couple of things. You feel what you feel. This is a difficult time in your life and your emotions are going to be all over the place and that's ok. Feel them and then move forward.
But, it doesnt matter what you think about your w - if she is MLC, WAW, or has fallen out of love. You still have to do to do the same things.
You have to do the work on you. You have to think long and hard about what you contributed to the problems in your marriage, what things about you that you want to change and how to be the best MW you can be.
You have to try to let your w go for now. Let her walk her journey and you walk yours.
None of us know what the future holds. None of us.
So, get to gettin'. Do whatever you have to do to move forward. Day by day, step by step.
You can do this. I know you can.
Thanks all. Apparently my question came across more frustrated than I had anticipated. The bike trip was good, even without the rain gear.
It is the question in my head. But at the same time, putting a label on it or not doesn't change what I do. BM, I hear ya! I just need stop looking for trouble.
You know it is an odd day when, as I'm out running errands, I actually reach down to do an emergency check to verify I'm wearing pants.
MW, this is hard stuff you are dealing with, really hard.
You are going to have some good days and some bad days for a long time to come.
I always say I wish I could help speed this up for everyone. But the truth of it is, its important that you go through all of it. If you skip any part of the journey, you dont reap all of the rewards.
I can tell you honestly that I would not have wanted to miss out on this opportunity of self growth. Wish I could have learned it all in an easier way, but, it wouldnt have been nearly as effective.
Oh yeah, and the pants thing - well, nuff said - LOL!
Hey M, how are you doing? Just thought I'd pop in and say hi!
Hi! I'm doing well. Leaving for vacation tomorrow. Ready to turn off my brain for a few days.
I've been talking to a bunch of women who all seem to be in the same boat. The logic is driving me nuts, so if anyone can explain this it would go a long way to making my brain hurt less. It is the same scenario, different women. It's not really about my W, but could very well be.
Been married for years.
Some need is missing or not getting met.
They're miserable and feeling bad about themselves.
They're stuck and start looking to get the need met elsewhere.
I've seen this over and over again on the boards here, too.
To a person, I hear, I can't tell my husband how I feel.
They want this need met, just not by their spouse.
That last part is the one I really don't get. My first response is ... say something to your husband. He probably wants to meet this need you have and has no idea you are missing something. I know that many women HAVE tried to say something and been ignored or dismissed. That's not what I'm talking about here. If you know you need something, why don't you say something? This could easily be applied to men, but it seems to be the same story I hear with every married woman I know. Anyone?
They have unresolved issues from the past. They are in a sense broken. They never matured into healthy, whole adults. I don't think they know exactly why they feel this way, but it's much easier to place blame than to look in the mirror.
The journey they are on will take them down many deadend roads. For some the search will be a never ending one.
This impossible search for the destination called "happiness" will continue until they finally stop running from themselves, and face their issues.
You want the sad truth as I see it?
They have. Hell my wife did too. Said the same things over and over again. Our arguments became standard, rote. My complaints were repeated over and over again as well. Why change for her when she won't change for me? Complacent stupid logic. We take our spouses for granted, both the good and the bad.
When I say I am GLAD this happened, when I say I am grateful, I am not lying, I am not smelling roses in a cess pool, because I have a polly anna outlook.
I am glad this happened, because I have taken complancentcy and destroyed it. I strive every day. I listen to my wife when she talks and realize that it could be someone else listening to her talk...endlessly : ) ...about her day.
These women HAVE complained to their husbands. Dollars to Donuts.
And you know what?
Sadly it takes something like this to wake them up, sadder when those husbands...those spouses FAIL to look in the mirror and see their own contributuions to a failing marriage. Those are the people who get stuck, those are the people who will walk the same path in future relationships, be it with their spouse, or someone else. History repets itself if patterns are not changed.
Don't get me wrong...
MLC will happen if one has the childhood crafted toward it. But no one is clean here. There is not one LBS who couldn't have been better.
Life is unfair...boo-hoo... yes, yes it is. Sink or swim.
MLC will happen if one has the childhood crafted toward it. But no one is clean here. There is not one LBS who couldn't have been better.
What he said....
I think my brain is going here ... the folks I'm talking to seem clear that they haven't wanted to speak to their husbands about what is wrong. If it's me, and I'm not getting something I need, I'm gonna speak up. Now, maybe that thought is shaded by my post-bomb awareness and hyper-sensitivity to the subject. It just seems like there is something in their mind that says, "I shouldn't have to tell them." My W freely admits that she never mentioned that anything was missing, until after she had found someone else.
or ... it could be that I'm trying to make sense out of something that for many of these folks is just justification for actions they know are wrong ... addicted to the feeling.
Do you guys really want to know what goes on in a woman's mind?
This could be a little long, but yes like Jack said, they have, we have complained. Maybe not in the right way but most do speak up.
Women start out young, attractive, pretty to themselves. And obviously to the man who is interested in them. They get married and life happens. Women have children, which changes us chemically, physically, and emotionally. Suddenly, you are responsible for another human life. Yes, so is the H, but he can walk at anytime. For most women, they know this in the back of there mind. Not a ton of men take their kids when they leave. So responsibility sets in. In a major way.
Their body now has stretch marks, hemmorroids, extra weight that just won't come off. They are not all that pretty in many ways. They are busy constantly taking care of someone. Dinner needs to be made, laundry needs to be washed, the toilets need to be scrubbed. Most H's want Martha Stewart in the house, the porn queen in the bedroom. The kids want mommy, which doesn't fit into either of those scenarios. We, most of us, also work outside of the home. So there is that responsibility too.
So as the years go by, you begin to wonder, do I wipe the nose, put on the lace (and why do I need to, I didn't when we were younger and do I really have the energy to do that anyway when the kitchen floor needs to be washed?) or the apron to make dinner? How many hands do I need to have, or maybe I should just be cloned.
All most of us want to do, is sit down, and talk to someone, anyone, for a half hour or so a day about what is going on. We do have brains but they only really get to relax when we are going to sleep.
Feeling like a human being is often what ends up missing. A human being that is liked for who they are, not what they do for others. Who doesn't feel like in some area of her life, she is letting someone down. And asking for help is most often interperated as nagging or controlling. Saying you are tired is interperated as not having interest in your partner. Not being willing to give to the sexually out of sheer exhaustion is failure.
So suddenly, one day, you wake up and you wonder who you are. Why no one hears you. Why does my husband want to watch the sexy 20 somethings on the tv before he touches me? Does he need that to be attracted to me now? Then you look in the mirror and oh my God, you see your mother, or your grandmother. And you are only around 35 or 40. When did you get so old? Then you start listening to yourself and you sound like your mother. How did I become this person?
F- Martha Stewart. Gimme the porn queen.
I'll do all the cooking cleaning and the kids can call me mommy too.
And my pet hate "you are a great mother". People mean it well, but its not a compliment about a woman as a person. That would be "you have great patience with your kids" or "I love your ability to explain complex things simply"
Just like saying "you look pretty" is not at all like saying "I love it when you wear your hair like that" or "that outfit realy suits you"
Not being a mum until mid 30s, I have found the way people talk to you changes overnight. All anyone seems to want to talk about is your kids! Yes, it is up to us as well, of course. But it is a two way process.
Hey Jack,
you want to cook and clean, you are welcome here anytime.
F- Martha Stewart. Gimme the porn queen.
Laugh as you will, but he is correct.....
Women FEEL all of those things, sometimes within a two minute period of their day.....
Men are different....We have 3-4 basic needs in life....
Seldom do they vary.
As long as you perform your duties as you laid out.
ok now i'm cracking up. But I would have no problem with it if I could get some rest once in a while.
Mach is right though. And I wasn't trying to be blaming or anything. It really is what goes through our heads.
Maybe if a man would say, hey gimme me stouffers and make yourself pretty for what I really want, it would seem so much easier. And remind us daily that we don't look like our mothers (even if we do, LOL)
hey gimme me stouffers and make yourself pretty for what I really want !!!!!!
Work yet ?
working for me.
Man I'm too easy..............
Man I'm too easy..............
There is no such thing.
MW,
I disagree.
For example:
Cat laid out how she/women felt.
I pointed out what I would want and what I would do for that.
She accepted that propsal with a provisio that I found logical.
Now should cat and I find ourself in a realationship...easy-peasy.
We'd both be wearing smiles you couldn't wipe off with a Next of Kin notification.
MW,
You do get to a point where you don't want to talk anymore. I did anyway. But by then H was in his own MLC world anyway. Something I've learned through this though, as my H is still here and I have done some boundary setting, is that I was not as clear, as specific, as "hearable" as I could have been.
And yes, sometimes you really can't even define it until you meet someone else who makes you FEEL differently than you do. So take what I said, throw in a childhood that can bring on MLC, and you have the makings of a mess.
It is all in the approach. Jack, yes I think it would work out beautifully. Too bad we can't all be so clear.
It is all in the approach.
T-shirt.
MW,
I could have been one of those women a few years ago. That is why it was so easy for me to say what I said. Because I was living here, just going through the motions because I had spent years talking. Of course, I don't know if I would have done anything about it. Maybe if H's stuff hadn't been triggered, maybe I would be in a totally different place now, not as healed, not as self aware, I don't know. I just know H started acting differently way before the bomb. I knew that I had to just keep going. I knew that I just was living this life that maybe could someday be different. Different how? I had no clue. So when the second bomb came, for me, it triggered first a whole bunch of anger, but then a sense of relief that it was all finally over, for a while. Then I started to really do the work on me. I had no choice cuz I was my own sort of mess. Now I see it all so differently.
Now should cat and I find ourself in a realationship...easy-peasy.
Until it isn't anymore. For the sake of argument ... we have the relationship skills that get us up to a certain level. We start out on the same page. We're communicating in a real way. It's easy. However, we both grow. We both change. It is just life. We, however, reach the limits of our relational skills and our original relationship arrangement. We recognize the things that our current arrangement lacks. The Stouffers has grown old. And now we're back where we started.
You don't know you need to change your communication approach until it doesn't work.
I am willing to debate this. Argue...that is just raising voices and not listening, but thinking that if I increase my volume just a little bit more you'll hear me, this time.
What you described, is why you find yourself here. It is why I found myself here.
It is also the reason I will never be here again, unless I become an idiot.
I'm not arguing with you. Just trying to dissect my own stupidity.
Don't kick yourself too hard in the nuts.
IF she is MLC then really unless you had a time machince you couldn't have stopped it. And really...a time machine? There would be so many other cool things to use it for.
Use this time to your advantage, you and your wife might go seperate ways, she might come back, you might even take her back. That is a lot of work by the way...more than you might think it is.
Either way, you'll be in a new relationship, and that is good, because the old you...the crappy one, he should be gone.
My questions here, aren't necessarily just about my W. I have had this same conversation with a ton a married women recently. In my case, I can see where I wasn't what she needed. I can also see that she ran into something that she couldn't see coming and sent her spiraling out of control. If it wasn't this particular trigger, it would have been another.
Do you all think the MLC can happen even when communication is good? I ask b/c of the prior comment, paraphrased, sometimes you don't know what is missing until you see how it can be.
Jack, you got here before me.
Yes MW, we all play our part. We can all learn how to do it better. That is the bottom line. And that is stuff you can fix.
Is that the whole reason I find myself here? Unfortunately, as I am on this board versus another, I doubt it. I didn't ignore my H when he was a child. I didn't expect him to be a grown up when he was 6. I didn't not provide a positive male role model for him. I didn't drink myself into oblivian and expect him to take care of the house when he could barely walk. I didn't do all of those things and many many others.
So am I the reason I find myself here. No. Am I the reason I shut down in my own M, sure. Can I use this to improve me, you bet. Can I see where I went wrong enough to know I won't do it again. Definately. That is my role in this. And I have to say, if this hadn't happened, I might not have that insight.
MY opinion:
MLC WILL happen, if the seeds have been planted. The severity of it...that is the question. Can we affect the severity? I think so.
ok jack, sticking out my tongue at your new signature. LOL
You are right, this was going to happen regardless. I know that. So it is what it is.
MY opinion:
MLC WILL happen, if the seeds have been planted. The severity of it...that is the question. Can we affect the severity? I think so.
Jack- When you say that you think we can affect the severity, did you mean with respect to making it better or worse?
Jim - yup.
In a perfect world, I even believe that the perfect spouse might even mitigate the MLC to less than what we see here. And despite many people saying they were/are the perfect spouse...there isn't any such thing.
Just checking in with everyone. I went back east to visit family for a few days. I warned folks that I didn't want to talk about Her or the D. Everyone respected that. It was good to get loved on by all the little ones. Lots of good food, drink, love - family drama not-withstanding. It was just a nice break from life for awhile.
Before I left, the inlaws were in town to visit with Her. We got to meet up for a little while. They know far less about what has been going on than I do. Apparently, She won't talk to them about anything of significance. I'm not surprised. The secrecy thing I just don't get. If you are so gung ho to get divorced and have chosen a new path for your life, at least embrace it. Whatever. I like them. They've always treated me really, really well. We talked for a while. I got to tell them that I appreciated them.
I've been in a good place lately. I'm not sure what has changed, but something has opened up, or unlocked ... something. Maybe it is the time off. I don't know. Trying to embrace the moment. Trying to be selfish, not in the "at the expense of others" kinda way. More just trying to love on myself a little bit. Addressing what has been neglected.
D day is fast approaching - 10/8. Not a thing I can do about it.
Good for you MW.
Ever think that 'good place' is because you purposefully didn't dwell on her and lived life in the moment?
Being selfish : ) REALLY good for you. Feels nice doesn't it?
10/8 is several tomorrows away, live for today.
When people do not wish to be judged they try to be secretive, and usually they do not wish to be judged because they know they are lacking.
Good for you MW.
Ever think that 'good place' is because you purposefully didn't dwell on her and lived life in the moment?
Being selfish : ) REALLY good for you. Feels nice doesn't it?
Amen to that brother!
Hey M, glad to hear you had a nice trip. I was starting to get a little worried about you.
Yay for you for getting to that good place. Just live life.
Embrace it all.
Does anyone else have a hard time being "selfish?" It's not about Her. I'm not worried about what she'll think about what I'm doing or anything. I was like this before Her. It's like there is something inside my head that says anything "just for me" is wrong somehow.
Yep, hard time for me, too. One of the many things I have been working on. That's why dbing is a good thing. Makes you think about stuff. But it also helps you focus on you. What you want, what makes you happy, what changes you want to make.
And there is nothing wrong with us thinking about ourselves. Nothing at all.
If you don't take care of yourself, how the hell are you going to be able to take care of other people?
You ever have an epiphany?
It is a beautiful word, and the meaning I am using here is this one:
: a usually sudden manifestation or perception of the essential nature or meaning of something (2) : an intuitive grasp of reality through something (as an event) usually simple and striking (3) : an illuminating discovery, realization, or disclosure b : a revealing scene or moment
I was listening to Social Distortion's "I Was Wrong" and the lyrics that jumped out and seized me:
"But, how can you love when you don't love yourself?"
How can you? Without that fundamental ability to love yourself or treat others without being able to treat yourself...it is hollow no matter how good, it is lacking.
I was listening to Social Distortion's "I Was Wrong" and the lyrics that jumped out and seized me:
"But, how can you love when you don't love yourself?"
How can you? Without that fundamental ability to love yourself or treat others without being able to treat yourself...it is hollow no matter how good, it is lacking.
Right. You can't give what you don't have.
I think you believe that not giving ALL you have is selfish. It isn't.
Let me give a real example. I've been looking for pants. I go to mall. I try them on. I like them. I can afford them. Then, something in my head goes, "but you don't really need them. You're just being ..." well, selfish isn't the right word, but it is close. I don't think it is about self-love. I love myself. Often. Hahaha. Ahem, I digress.
I like me. Really. I can do things for me. I just don't ... and I don't know why. This last trip was the first vacation I've had in years. I'm just trying to figure out my own head is all. It's not a crisis or anything. Just something that hit me. Mach (may he be returned to us shortly) and I were talking about this very thing earlier today. I don't know why I have done this in the past. I know I'm gonna try to stop. More time-off is in order, of that I am sure. Just thinking out loud.
Mach made the good point that this process of self-discovery is very similar to the MLC spouses we have, minus the self-deceit, lies, cheating and all the other crap they goes along with them. Doing for me ... purely for me b/c I like it ... opens up some long dormant parts. I can feel it. I think it is tied with that feeling I mentioned earlier about something shifting within me. A few days of just doing things for me was good ... opens the door for more of that. Good stuff!
MW, I know exactly what you mean. I do the same kinds of things. And you're right, selfish isnt exactly the right word,but, I dont know what word describes it.
I always say, I am learning so much on this journey. Just wish I could have learned it a different way.
Realizing our self worth and our purpose in this world, finding out what makes us happy, and making the changes necessary to become the best person we can be, all part of the journey, my friend.
By the way, Mach is around if you look around.
Oh yeah, and the loving yourself, often thing. Too much information. Just sayin'. LOL
hahahaha
just trying to bring a little levity
Oh yeah, and the loving yourself, often thing. Too much information. Just sayin'. LOL
Uhmmm....Yes it is....
But it would change the pants shopping thing from a selfish want to a neccessity....
lmao!!!
"Bring back the Mach attack"
I still think the "La La La!!" was more fitting.
wow everyone is up early today.
I had this ringing in my ear...then I realized it was my alarm..
Dam thing does it every morning !
I wake up at 5:30 no matter what now.
Thanks kids!
Boat, you are supposed to throw it at the wall when it does that.
I have the dogs and their wet tongues to thank for my early mornings.
I would, but I use my phone as an alarm.....
Can't get too far away from that....
Oh wait, I can since I'M not the one in MLC....
Wait a minute...There is nothing wrong with bringing your phone with you in the shower .
Wait a minute...There is nothing wrong with bringing your phone with you in the shower .
Since yours reads Fisher-Price....
It would be safe for you....
Exactly!!!
Wanna know what's even better?? No matter what time it is, there is always someone on the other end of that sucker too and they listen to EVERYTHING!!
No matter how bad the day has been, I always hear "you're the best!" Even when I curse at them, I'm still the best.
Do you hear these voices often?
The all new Fisher-Price phone for MLC....
All lies, all the time.....
And here I thought you only used your Cinderella mirror for that....
I thought the only mirror that talked was the Snow White one.
What did MLC folks do before cell phones?
Leave my magic mirror out of this! <stomp, hair flip>
maybe that is how morse code came about. I guess MLC isn't all bad.
See..that's how to put a positive spin on things.
Ooooops....
Between Cinderella, Snow White, and Trapt, I have a problem keeping my Princesses straight....
Thanks Cat !
Not the dreaded hair flip!
All real princesses flip the hair (so I've heard).
Yep.
We got the Hair Flip dude...
NOTHING beats a Hair Flip....
All real princesses flip the hair (so I've heard).
Cept for you forgot the Eye roll.......
Stomp, Hair Flip, Eye roll, and a loud Hmmph.....
Do you hear these voices often?
Uh.....yeah, we all do right??
The all new Fisher-Price phone for MLC....
All lies, all the time.....
And here I thought you only used your Cinderella mirror for that....
The deluxe model comes complete with daily reminders.
"Tanning appt. at 2 o'clock!"
"Don't forget to whiten your teeth today!"
"Screw the electric company! Buy the blouse!"
"What have you done for YOU lately!?"
The one here has hourly reminders for shaving!
Clearly my problem is that I don't have this phone.
I think I need to leave work now and go get it. Sounds like my life will be infinately better. I'm sure I wouldn't have forgotten the eye roll and hmmph if I had one to remind me just how to be a ....
Do you hear these voices often?
Uh.....yeah, we all do right??
The all new Fisher-Price phone for MLC....
All lies, all the time.....
And here I thought you only used your Cinderella mirror for that....
The deluxe model comes complete with daily reminders.
"Tanning appt. at 2 o'clock!"
"Don't forget to whiten your teeth today!"
"Screw the electric company! Buy the blouse!"
"What have you done for YOU lately!?"
Man, I needed that laugh Trapt......
Too true man.....
Oh look.....Boxes again !!!!
the phone here comes with a permanent hand attachment and a proximity alarm
Warning! You are too close. Please step away from the phone.
MW,
You must have the MLC Barbie one.....
Comes with all of Ken's stuff too....
Saw her out with GI Joe last week..
Boat-
Mine comes with a special sunglasses attachment. I think it cuts down on the phone glare, especially at night.
LMAO!! I love the phone, all lies all the time.... hehehe. Yeah, I get calls and texts from one of those like, every freaking day.
So ... I went to a concert tonight with a friend. A pretty friend, but a friend nevertheless. I just didn't want to go alone and figured it would be fun. Lo and behold, friend has the same attachment to her phone. It was a great show, she's busy texting, checking email ... whatever. Seriously, how hard is to to ingore the stupid thing for 2 hours? You can't miss THAT much. I think the phone thing bugs me more than it should.
Hey MW,
You don't have kids I see. The phone, my real teenager, it is glued to his hand. He doesn't even make phone calls. ALL text, ALL the time. Last month over 10,000. No that is not a TYPO. It is rude, disrespectful, and if the kid tells me one more time he is paying attention to me and plugging away at that thing I might kill him. LOL.
It is their way, and our dislike, mine anyway, comes in part from my age, I didn't even want of feel like I needed a cell for years. The rest, I think it is about feeling disrespected. But they really think they are paying attention to what is going on around them because it is so much a natural part of their existence.
Can't wrap my head around that. I text or watch TV. Find it hard to do both. But the kids can. So give it the thought it deserves and let it go. It is a new and crazy but probably pretty permanent part of our lives.
Especially if Trapt's implants take hold. Maybe he can figure a way to utelize the body to power them instead of batteries.
Cat-
I think you are right me feeling it is a disrespect thing. I've even been guilty of the phone obsession on occasion. It's just funny b/c we were in the middle of a darkened theater and her stupid iPhone would light up the entire row. People around us were not happy. This is a grown woman.
I think it just hit a nerve. My STBX does the same thing. She'd answer the phone when were in the middle of a conversation or jump at the sound of the incoming text. Just flashbacks, I guess. And a reminder of the disrespect I feel/felt from my W ... and how that is just not acceptable to me anymore ... from anyone.
No big deal, just felt the need to share. And now ... off to look at the fall colors, if I can find them.
I think it's really rude and disrespectful, my h would do the same thing. I ASKED if he would please put the phone down while we were having a conversation, or whatever. NOPE, he couldn't do it....I think it's some sick need to be wanted or in control or feel important because someone is contacting them. I don't know....good for you for setting those boundaries.
Glad you enjoyed the concert with your friend. I was wondering if you were heading up on such a gorgeous day...
But I heard the weather is turning colder tomorrow.
To many peolpe are glued to that damn thing and actully see the texts etc as real connection. I don't like it and the only reason I even look at my phone when I'm out is to see if it's from D's. Even then, if I don't get another text/call right on top of the first one, I figure it's not urgent (and I have a good friend that is also a neighbor and the kids have her and an uncle that lives close in a real emergency).
Honestly if my D's weren't minors and didn't live with me 24/7 I'd probably hardly ever use the thing.
I really don't understand why people can't enjoy what they're doing in the moment and not worry about what they might be missing.
I hope you find some nice colors today.
The mountains were awesome today. I got some really nice pictures of the golds and greens. I was trying to make it to Buena Vista, but that big storm was just on the horizon and closing fast. I could see the snow/rain and figured it was time to come back and watch some football. Excellent day. I didn't check my phone once. Of course, I don't have the disease. Haha.
You should mat and frame some of the photos.
Forced yourself to watch football huh?
So far, I'm negative for cpd (cell phone disease/disorder), but I hope it isn't catching.
So far, I'm negative for cpd (cell phone disease/disorder), but I hope it isn't catching.
The vaccine is in Stage 1 clinical trials.
Strange to see all these rats running around with little cell phones.....
Really, really strange.....
Well at least there are plenty of rats to test the vaccine on.
It's almost amusing (if it wasn't so sad) that so many people don't know how to just
be. And they laugh at me b/c I'll do things alone rather than not do.
Geez, at least I can sit in silence without getting anxious.
I'd like to think it's a temperment more than an age thing....
Well at least there are plenty of rats to test the vaccine on.
It's almost amusing (if it wasn't so sad) that so many people don't know how to just
be. And they laugh at me b/c I'll do things alone rather than not do.
Geez, at least I can sit in silence without getting anxious.
I'd like to think it's a temperment more than an age thing....
Must have something to do with the hair flip....
I LOVE silence.....It's the quietest thing I have....
Maybe we could get a standard issue Phone/Sunglass combo ?
Oh crap, don't steal my idea Trapt.....
Anyone have a number for a patten ?
Nope but I know how to get one.
Must have something to do with the hair flip....
Smooches!
I LOVE silence.....It's the quietest thing I have....
Too funny. I get sensory overload sometimes and then everything is off and the kids need to have earphones or be in their rooms (that's fairly easy with teenage D's).
Better hurry on your idea, could be a real money maker. Even if it's a pet rock thing, look at the $$$ he made.
Awwww.....Thanks Gracie !
Can't access the alt from here, but I knew you would enjoy that video...ahhh, yes I forgot about Scarlett J...
What's not to like? tee hee
I have been just stupidly tired. I'm not sure if it is my life catching up with me, depression, the flu or what, but man it is wiping me out. I can fall asleep, I just get up every hour so it doesn't feel like I get any rest. Ah, rest. Oh how I miss you.
I have this feeling ... like I want to relax, but am afraid to for some reason. Afraid isn't a good word for it. I don't know what it would take to get me to that point where I feel like I can let go. Exercise doesn't really help either. I'm not sure if it is tied to the whole D ordeal. Maybe my body is just telling me it is time to not be so wound up all the time. Ha ha. It is still morning and I'm already dreaming of sleep.
Mach-
Yours, from another thread ...
Do I still love her ?
Can I forgive her ?
Do I believe in the condition called MLC, and is she going through one ?
#3 ... does it change things if she is not?
MW,
I don't believe so....
I think it is about Faith, and Hope....
Standing doesn't mean standing still.
I think the answers lie within the questions....
Every crisis is different, much as every stand is different.
Your decisions are all that matter now for you...
Answer me this MW.....
Do you believe that MLC exists ?
Do you think that she is going through this ?
This is my big dilemma. I've spoken with Jim about this too. I'm just curious as to your take on it. I believe in that the MLC is a real thing. It would be hard NOT to. I have two thoughts about my W in relation to all of this.
1) Maybe she's not going through an MLC. Maybe she has another issue that she's not telling me. Even if that is true, it doesn't change how I respond to her. We've talked about that before.
B) I keep hoping that eventually she'll come out of the MLC fog or whatever. There's no guarantee that she'll talk to me about any of it even if she does. I think maybe this is my worry here. She may hit bottom, deal and move on. I could never know. If she's not in an MLC, this part never happens. If she is, it still might not happen.
I'm not looking for a guarantee ... just processing.
IF.....a frog had wings, he wouldn't bump his a$$ when he hopped either....
A lot of if's bro.
Just remember that whether or not she is MLC, it still cannot stop YOU from living.
These things happen on God's time, not ours....
And this is HER crisis...
Do you believe that every person in their lifetime goes through major life evaluations ?
Transitional periods ?
One cannot run forever from their issues....
And if they do ? I wouldn't want to be around them anyway....
One step forward my friend....another tomorrow.
I think I just need sleep.
Hey Mach, what up?
MW, I, too, have had the same questions. Most times I think that my h is not in a MLC.
And Mach is going easier on you when you ask that question than he did on me. Just preparing you - LOL!
In the end I realized MLC or not, I will stand until I cant anymore. I will stand because I love him, because I made a promise before God, because I know no other way right now.
Do I believe there is such a thing as MLC? Absolutely. Does it matter if my h is in one? Not anymore.
My decision is the same.
About the sleeping thing. Dont let that go too long. I know firsthand the havoc it could wreak. Could be depression, anxiety.
When we are going through all of this, we are so tightly wound and waiting for the other shoe to drop and we are trying so hard to process and keep it together that it affects us physically, too.
So, let your doctor know you arent sleeping. Find ways to relax 30 minutes before bedtime. Try to release everything from you mind before you get into bed. Make sure there isnt a tv on and that the room is dark.
Hang in there, Sweetie. This is all part of the journey. You are doing really well.
I think I just need sleep.
Hey B, Doin okay...for now...
MW.....NYQUILL !!!!
Does tequila count as a NYQUILL substitute?
BM ... falling asleep is rarely a problem. I just can't STAY asleep.
And both he and Jim have beat me given me the appropriate beatings over this before.
Yeah, I hear ya on the staying asleep. That is anxiety, my friend.
As far as you trying to figure out if this is MLC or not. Let me save you some time.
It doesnt matter. Really and truly. It doesnt matter. If you are hoping it is MLC because then there is a chance she will come out of this, you are standing in the way of your own journey because then you are looking to someone or something else to move this along.
And it cant be moved along by anyone or anything but you.
When you think this way, you are looking for her to change, decide, get through the MLC.
And sorry, but, thats not how this works. So, it doesnt matter if she is MLC, ADD, or XYZ. You still have to walk this - for you.
So, stop thinking about what she is and get back to thinking about you. Who cares what the hell her problem is?
Talk to a doctor about your sleep problem, move forward in the journey and let her blow in the wind, ya know?
I could go all whack and explain the inner workings of the brain and how your inner thoughts come to the top of thinking when you're brain is relaxed....
But,
I've talked to you, and your brain can't be too much more relaxed bro....
Sooooo....Yes, Tequila.
Yes, the sleeping is anxiety. I have spent many nights falling asleep then waking up in a sweat suddenly. I also went through a really bad patch where I couldn't eat anything but crackers without throwing it back up. All anxiety. If it persists seek some help for it. Especially not sleeping will beat you down. Been there, done that. Feel for you.
... how your inner thoughts come to the top of thinking when you're brain is relaxed ...
I have inner thoughts? That can't be good.
I have inner thoughts? That can't be good.
You scare me....
Another shot ?
Tequila!
I suspect most, if not all of us have been there. It sux. You will find a way that works for you.
Do talk to a dr. about it though. Can't do without sleep..(damn right I'm good in bed...I can sleep for days!)
HUGS
Clonazepam...goes by Klonopin
Will work, and keep you asleep....I promise
inner thoughts ... are there any other kind?
Mach,
Are you eyerolling my sleeping ability? I have a knack
(actually it's from years of shift work).
inner thoughts ... are there any other kind?
There are for women (at least this one), some of us are very good at opening our mouths a letting things fall out. In all fairness to myself, I have gotten really good at not doing this.
Ooooh ... I hear a song in the making.
MW, I like the way you think - LOL!
I get an email yesterday ... please take care of these bills, blah, blah. Whatever. Then this whole rant on how she doesn't know where I live so she can send the bills and forms. What forms? Who knows. And she doesn't know my address? What?? Um ... I emailed her my address. She acknowledged getting it and thanked me for it. It's on all of the D paperwork. I'm not hiding or anything. It's so stinking weird.
So, I should probably respond to the email ... but I don't want to. I want to send her the email trail of the address thing. Or just blow it off. Apparently SHE adamantly believes I'm in hiding. Why argue with a crazy person? I grow weary of crazy.
So, what did you decide to do?
I hope you got a good night's sleep.
MW,
Do what is right.....
The other crap is projection on you....
A MLCer can only let you get so far away.....
Good Morning B !!!!
MW,
I am curious as well...
You emailed her your address, if she actually has forms to send, then you will get them.
I want to apologize because I almost laughed at your post for a second. It made me realize that it is the little things that get to me as well...
Have a good day. Finally the coffee is ready...
Why argue with a crazy person? I grow weary of crazy.
HUGS
I sent her an email explaining our agreement, that I paid the bills, and a copy of the email thread where I gave her my address and she acknowledged it. I got an immediate response from her. She's all sorts of angry. Whatever.
So ... D day arrives this coming Friday, barring an act of God. A judge will just sign the forms and we'll both be notified by mail. Part of me wants to break the silence and send her an email letting her know I'm thinking of her and wish her well. Part of me wants to disappear for awhile. Part of me wants to call and scream at her. Part of me doesn't care. Part of me just wants it over. Part of me is actually excited to start something new. Apparently, I am a man of many parts. Emotionally swirly day. Kinda caught me off guard
A person with that many facets
must be a diamond.
Hang in there sweetie.
HUGS
So ... D day arrives this coming Friday, barring an act of God. A judge will just sign the forms and we'll both be notified by mail. Part of me wants to break the silence and send her an email letting her know I'm thinking of her and wish her well. Part of me wants to disappear for awhile. Part of me wants to call and scream at her. Part of me doesn't care. Part of me just wants it over. Part of me is actually excited to start something new. Apparently, I am a man of many parts. Emotionally swirly day. Kinda caught me off guard
Yup...I know how THAT feels.
I'm around if you want to talk.....
Hey, of course you are feeling all kinds of emotions. Nothing wrong with that.
I truly believe that everything happens for a reason. That's not lip service or platitudes, it is something I feel deep in my soul.
So, while I know that this is not something you want, I know that it is what is supposed to be right now.
MW, I promise you that this journey will be worth it. I promise you that one day you will feel good again.
I will be thinking of you.
Hey, MW, thinking of you. Hang in there, my friend.
Thanks. Yesterday was just like Monday, emotions all over the place and without warning. It was very odd since I'm not usually that emotional. I woke up this morning with an unusual sense of clarity and calm. We'll see how long that lasts. I have some thoughts I'll put down later. Back to work ...
Thanks. Yesterday was just like Monday, emotions all over the place and without warning. It was very odd since I'm not usually that emotional. I woke up this morning with an unusual sense of clarity and calm.
What you have described is you working through this process. I can really relate to the way you have described it. The severity and frequency will become less and less over time.
Allow yourself to feel all of this, and then let it go. Try your best not to get caught up in analyzing the "why" of it all.
Embrace the clarity you have today and the next time you feel down and emotional just know that your clarity will soon return, and when it does, it will be more powerful than before.
Mw,
This happened to me at certain times throughout all of this.
After a while you'll be able to recognize it for what it is, and anticipate that clarity coming back to you even stronger.
Look at it as having a growth spurt so to speak.
Look at it as having a growth spurt so to speak.
And one you will never regret having.......
Chin up Punk(s).....
You can do this with Dignity , Honor, and Grace....
Trapt,
Very beautifully said. Took me half a novel to say the same damn thing. LOL
It comes with time and the less we fight it, the easier it is.
Thanks Cat.
Took me half a novel to say the same damn thing. LOL
I am from Mars.
But do you have the cool space hat with the brush on top?
Good luck with that, we can't even send PM's here.
Or rolling eye emoticons...
Yea,
Cause the one you actually CAN have on FB is so nice ....
But do you have the cool space hat with the brush on top?
I need to get one of those, or maybe something more scary.
I have had way too many crazy close encounters lately.
How about a blaster or light saber you you can be defender of the realm?
I find weapons not only much cooler, but scarier than hats
YES!
Good idea!!
I'll take the blaster please.
I find weapons not only much cooler, but scarier than hats
I don't know about that, Grace.....I can look pretty scary in my tinfoil hat......
You might not to wear that hat out Jim.
The chicks who wouldn't be worried about it...prob have more issues going on in their heads than a simple MLC.
Yes I said simple MLC.
True story: I was dating this amazing fun and pretty woman, soccer player athletic smart...right up until I found out she had been and still was being abducted by aliens.
Now...I'm all for intelligent life being out there, but I think the surest sign of it is that they haven't contact us.
So tomorrow is the big day. A judge will sign the forms and ... my marriage will officially be over. I was OK during most of the day. But right now ... now ... just sucks and there is absolutely nothing I can do about it. I hope she is happy. I am not. There's nothing to say, really. She's gone. And I didn't even get a goodbye.
Oh Sweetie, I am so sorry. She is lost, broken, confused, in crisis, but, happy, I dont think so.
But, I dont really care about her. I care about you. I can only imagine how much this must hurt. I know right now it seems like almost more than you can take. But, you will be happy again. You will.
MW, let this be the beginning of a new part of the journey for you. Walk through this part, let it wash over you, and then slowly, you will begin to heal. Take it a day at a time.
We are here for you, my friend.
So tomorrow is the big day. A judge will sign the forms and ... my marriage will officially be over. I was OK during most of the day. But right now ... now ... just sucks and there is absolutely nothing I can do about it. I hope she is happy. I am not. There's nothing to say, really. She's gone. And I didn't even get a goodbye.
Hey man.... I can't begin to tell you how badly I feel for you that you have to go through this. This REALLY sucks...big time.
Like me, your emotions will be (and are) all over the map, both before and after. But because of that, it's even more important to maintain your perspective. Let yourself process the emotions. All of them. But don't let your perspective on this be swayed by them.
Beginners is right. She will try to convince herself that she is happy, but just like with all the lies she tells everyone else, (Did you think you were the only one she lied to?).....she forgets one very important truth.
She is lying to herself.
She is so confused and desperate right now, that she will do ANYTHING to get away from herself. Unfortunately for the both of us, that is the path that both our spouses needed to take. In all of this, remember that she
IS in crisis. She's fumbling around for the solution to what's wrong, because she never learned to cope with her problems way back when. Now she has to "relearn" what she never learned to do in the first place!
And she WILL make mistakes.
BIG ones.
She thinks this D will make her happy, and solve all her problems. It won't.
They have their work to do of trying to figure out their lives. So do we. I know just how much you hurt right now, MW. I know the frustration and helplessness you're feeling right now. But please believe me when I tell you that things
will get better. Remember that this is just another signpost on the path, my friend. Remember that this is a PROCESS. For both of you.
Healing comes. Slowly. Go easy on yourself. Process your feelings. Take time for you.
Give me a call if you feel like talking....
Chin up Bro.....
You know where I am if you need.....
I appreciate all the thoughts and prayers. I'm ok. I really am. I'm sad. I have a lot to process. I'm just not in a talking mood right now ...
and Grace ... I hear ya!
"A pearl is a beautiful thing that is produced by an injured life. It is the tear [that results] from the injury of the oyster. The treasure of our being in this world is also produced by an injured life. If we had not been wounded, if we had not been injured, then we will not produce the pearl."
Hang in there....
Well ... it is official. I'm divorced. Got the paperwork in the mail today. Booooo that.
I am so sorry, my friend. I could tell you that it is only a piece of paper, but, that would invalidate your feelings.
So, I will tell you that when you have had time to heal, you will begin to see the possibilities in life. You will begin to see which way you are to go.
For now, I am sending you hugs and prayers and a wish that you find peace.
MW,
I too am sorry.
Be patient with yourself and allow the healing to begin. There is a whole wonderful world out there just waiting for you.
Blessings.
((((MW))))
I don't have any words. Just big bear hugs.
So ... I've been quiet lately. I don't have anything to say to myself either. I'm trying to process all that has happened. It is pretty surreal. I feel kinda lost. It is hard to explain. I think I'm just lost in the processing. I have this pile of bills on my desk that I thought "you know, I'll deal with those later." I looked at the pile yesterday and thought "wow, it's been a month an a half, I JUST put those down. Where have I been?"
Getting the papers in the mail wasn't fun. But at least the waiting for it to happen is over. I'm actually sleeping again, which hasn't happened in ... well, I can't remember. There are no more milestones with her on the horizon. I guess it makes the letting go a little easier that way.
I'm sad that it came to this. It is such a waste of relationship potential. I'm dealing with the fact of her leaving much better than I am than the HOW of it. If she doesn't want me, I don't want her to stay. I'm confident that I'll be able to move on. I am confident that I'll be happy again. The biggest frustration is her absolute disappearance. I don't know what I expected, but this isn't it. Haha. I deserve so much more than I got from her. It's that part that I don't understand. I think I'm frustrated that she chose to leave the way she did. Like, I'm somehow offended that I wasn't allowed the opportunity to let her go. The whole thing was just forced on me. I have so many questions ... that I know I'm just not going to get an answer to. And I should. Even that isn't up to me.
I appreciate all the encouragement and support. I really do. You all rock.
I hear ya on the disappearance. I was with h 30 years and now, not a word. It's like it all didnt happen.
But, you're right about the not getting answers and this being forced on us. And you know what? There's not a freakin' thing we can do about it.
But, sitting around trying to figure it all out is cutting into our new lives.
He took so much from me, I am not giving him that, too. Uh uh, not gonna do it.
So, you are going to feel lost for awhile, and sad and angry and some other stuff, too. But there are no shortcuts here, I'm afraid. You have to go through all the steps in the grieving process to get out the other side.
So, go easy on yourself for awhile. Give your mind a rest when you can. Try to keep busy and get through the day.
I've been slowly trying to regroup. Work has been crazy, so it helps to be distracted a little. XW and I have some unfinished business we need to take care of by the 1st as was ordered by the divorce papers. No big deal. I sent an email with the last of the details, In a nutshell ... hey we need to get these things taken care of. Just checking on the details to make sure we've done what we were supposed to. Hope you and the dogs are well.
About 3 minutes later I get a response detailing some extra bills she thinks we have agreed to, though not in the D agreement. The short version is that the original lease was in her name. When she moved out, she left under the pretense that it was temporary. So when she filed, I took that as my cue to move out. She wants the deposit back, which was hers anyway. When I left, she wanted to deal with the landlord directly and hasn't. So now she has decided that she's going to deduct whatever shortfall from the deposit from the money she owes me.
It's not about the money, its about control. I've been debating not saying anything and just letting her have it, if only to keep the drama to a minimum. But something in me just doesn't want to. Her usual MO is to tell me that we've agreed to something when in fact there was no agreement. Funny how she's always the one who gets what she wants from these mental creations.
I noticed that my first response was to just do it so I don't make her mad. Then i realized I don't really care if she gets mad. What is she gonna do, divorce me again? Stop talking to me? I'm treating her like the person she used to be ... and why? She's a liar and has been since the beginning. She just makes crap up and I'm supposed to go along with it. I got more emails from her today, than I have since April combined. All business. All manipulative. It's funny. I do care about how she is, so I asked. Haven't done that in about 6 months. All she'll respond to is the bills. So, fine. No more asking.
I'm just venting. It seems like an odd reaction from her for something that should just open and shut. Odd.
Hey MW. Yeah, I've had those same thoughts. Why do I try to avoid making ex mad now? We are already divorced.. lol. BUT, then I end up still trying to be peaceful b/c we NEED to get along for the kids sake. Sigh. I sure would love to just let him have it though... : ) He knows what the no holds barred me is like, and I think he's glad he doesn't have to deal with that.... : )
Stay strong. Your feelings are obviously normal since I have them too : ) Just keep being the good person you are.
SoCo- Yes, my XW is afraid of that no hold barred thing too. It rarely comes out. My X isn't nearly as crazy as yours, but they all have a way of finding just the right button to push. I think they're all crazy in their own unique ways.
I'm actually better than ok. I know what I want to do. She's not gonna like it. Too bad. She's only had 2 years since she moved out to take care of this stuff and now we're at crunch time. It would have been easier if we just talked about things like normal people, but she didn't want to do that. Part of me thinks this is petty on my part ... in the past I wouldn't have fought her about anything if she felt entitled to whatever even if I disagreed, but I've had enough of her taking things without talking to me. She can feel entitled all she wants. My feelings get to count now. I guess that's not THAT petty.
I'm off to enjoy this glorious fall day. Woo and hoo!
Your feeling do count. If she can't talk and negotiate like a sane person ...oh well.
I find it fascinating that we are concerned about making them mad. I fall into that category too, ut what really intrigues me is that my H said he didn't want to make me mad. Of course, I had to ask, what he thought I was going to do....leave him? He just said he needed to figure out why it bothered him.
Whatever you decide to do, I know you'll handle it well.
Enjoy the day.
OK ... looking for some logistical advice here. I took care of the financial piece this morning. It was the last account we had to split up. She'll be mad, too bad. She's still expecting me to reimburse her for whatever deposit shortfall may happen from our old apartment. (She gets the deposit back, but wants to "charge" me for whatever is deducted by the landlord) That's not gonna happen. We both signed a financial agreement that said nothing about that. The only thing left is for her to sign the title of the car over to me. I sent it registered mail a week and a half ago. I included a self addressed, stamped envelope to make things easier. She signed for it 9 days ago. I know she has it. She knows I know. She has to sign it by the end of the month according to our signed D agreement. So ... do I ask her for it? Do I wait for her to mail it? Do I talk to a lawyer just in case? It's the last thing we have connecting us. I know she didn't forget about it or anything. I'm assuming this is a control thing ... everything is. Thoughts?
mw, I would not fret over the car title. The deadline isn't here yet, and is it causing undue hardship for you at this time?
As for the deposit, if it wasn't in writing or your agreement then she's just SOL. Like you already said, what's she going to do if she doesn't like what you do?