Previous thread:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2794168&page=11Think I'll rename my thread next time. Keeping it as "Affair discovered" feels like living in the past.
At present: W's family helping her move out in a couple days, she's been packing all week. My last post in previous thread focuses on that. W and I both want what's good for our son.
STH,
I know its hard but let go of the anger, if you truly love your W allow her to chose her own path, that is what love is all about ain't it. Allowing a person to be themselves and be free to choose!!!!
You dont have to agree with her choice, but you have to allow her to make that decision. It's like a person that like dogs and you like cats and you hate that person for liking dogs. I know it's not that simple, but look at it like that. Validate your wife for liking dogs even thou you don't. You dont ever have to like dogs, but validate your W by saying, i understand how You can feel that way about dogs(not wanting to be in this marriage). And leave it at that. You dont need to try to change her mind or explain to her why cats are so much better, that's your opinion.
Also, if you CHOOSE to never be the person your W is now, you will never be that.
You interaction today was a good time to show your W a confident and happy STH.
Find a way to feed the good wolf and let go of that anger towards your W. I watched alot of youtube videos on how to live an optimistic life and dwell in positivity no matter how my life and day is going, it helped a lot.
You want her to choose you, well you start choosing you.
Stop worrying about her mindset, her moving out, how her decsions well affect this and that. Start worrying about how your decisions will show your son a strong and confident man. Show family and strong and confident man she will be leaving.
You cant control her nor do You want too.
Onward and forward.
Find a way to feed the good wolf and let go of that anger towards your W. I watched alot of youtube videos on how to live an optimistic life and dwell in positivity no matter how my life and day is going, it helped a lot.
Any link you could share for that? Sounds good to me.
I think I made an oopsie. Our car insurance needs to be renewed this month, and since we just sold a car, I had to change that on the policy. Since W also has her own car now (her parents just gave her theirs), and is moving out tomorrow, I wanted to look into options for car insurance. I logged into my policy and removed W and the car we sold from the policy to see what the renewal cost would be. I thought I was just going to get a quote, but the final screen said the changes would be made within an hour.
whoops!
I'll talk to W about it today at lunch time. I read online that courts typically order no changes be made to ins "before or during D". But we sold a car, the policy is due for renewal, we're low on cash, W is moving out and won't be driving my car anymore. So changes do need to be made. I guess the question is whether W stays on the policy and we add the car her parents gave her. I don't know if they even made that official with a title transfer though. Legally, our marital assets would be tapped if she gets in an accident and any damages need to be paid. So it is in my interest for her to be insured. I wish she would take responsibility for paying for it herself though.
oh, just got an email saying my request couldn't be processed online, I'd have to make a phone call. That's a relief I suppose, but I think I should still talk to W about it.
I would mention to her that you are calling in to remove the one car, and ask her if she has insurance on the car her parents gave her because if so you'll go ahead and remove her from your policy. That's perfectly reasonable, but she'll probably get angry so be ready for that and remind her that she is the one that wants this and you're just trying to facilitate her.
Talked to W about it, no hiccups at all. I think I could have been more assertive but I asked if she was getting insurance for her car, and she said yeah. Eh, it wasn't all that clear really what she was planning to do or how it would be paid for. But she was fine with me taking her off our policy.
When I came home my son was excited and said "is it the weekend!?" So W told him he'll be staying with me on the weekends. I'm happy he's excited about it at least. Also not happy about the whole situation of course..
Looking at wife's smiling and laughing face while she plays with son is painful. Now she's reading son a bedtime story in the next room over and it feels like listening to a tv show playing, not any reality I'm a part of. I feel sadness, anger, and nothing.
STH, that's so so sad. It's probably better to leave the house but it's the same for me. My husband is here this weekend visiting and I have stuff to get done so I'm here when he's here and it's a painful reminder of the happy days when we were a family. I feel envious of our daughter that he hugs and kisses her and gives her attention! Yet even she only receives that sporadically. I wish families could just stay together - how can anyone cheat or leave when they have little kids? And what lowlife man would be doing this with your wife knowing she has a little kid and a husband at home? Unbelievable.
Originally Posted By: joejoe1
Find a way to feed the good wolf and let go of that anger towards your W. I watched alot of youtube videos on how to live an optimistic life and dwell in positivity no matter how my life and day is going, it helped a lot.
Any link you could share for that? Sounds good to me.
Just type in how to feed the good wolf.
And what lowlife man would be doing this with your wife knowing she has a little kid and a husband at home? Unbelievable.
I'd say the kind of man who feels sorry for her and believes I am as bad as W tells him I am. Better for me not to think about that though.
Sandi, thanks for the search tip, I'll check it out.
Today is W's moving day. Her family just got here to help. Time to make myself scarce I think.
Or not. Son want son to stay home and make slime. Okay, sounds fun!
STH - stay positive- this too will pass. Good Luck!
And she's outta here! That didn't take long. now I feel like I can finally get this house in shape. Will need to sell it soon anyway. I have a job interview next week in our home state.
When her family came her dad had my mom on his phone for me to talk to. Her parents and mine think this must be so hard on me. They don't know i am pretty much happy to have the space myself at this point. I did all my crying about her leaving me months ago. Tried to be a better husband, fumbled the reconnection, and then W started an affair. I need a break from her as much as she does from me.
Feeding the GOOD WOLF is a concept that helped save me and my M. I started feeding myself with only positive things. If I turned on the news and it was negative I turned the channel. If I was listening to the radio and a negative song came on I found a uplifting and positive song. I listened to a lot of gospel.
I start going to church. I found a church that made me feel good to attend the people were very inviting and offered me a lot of opportunities to do things in the church I took them up on their offer. (While was at the church my W thought I was with someone else. On 3 nights out the week.) I would get dressed up nice and put on some smell good, say bye and say I will see you later ( I also asked if she had anything going on, I didnt want to be a A hole). I never told her where I was going, but I was always was pleasant with my interactions with her. Always feeding the positive, optimistic side of of life.
I have thrived and lived off of pessimism, so training myself to have an optimistic outlook during such a low point in my life was hard as hell. But I had to do it for myslef and boys. I was tired of living in the the misery.
I started and ended everyday reflecting on the good things about that day.
At the start it felt kind of fake, but after a while it became my mantra. I was living with a positive attitude. I would smile at every person I could, even my WW (its hards not to smile at someone that's smiling at you). When I went to public places and was in the check out lines, I would read the name tags of every person I interacted with, and when they finished I thanked them for their service.
I told everyone bye, hi, good morning, afternoon, evening and day, even my WW. I refused to leave my M and my W having the last memories of being an angry and a negative person.
I still never talk about the M, R, or said ILY. I stuck to Sandi Rules, and I detached with love the way AS preaches.
I start going about my life doing things I always wanted to do. I start meeting new people, they were uplifting. Like, one day I did a meetup.com hike. And while on the hike, I started talking to the guy who made the meet up. Come to find out he was a pastor at one of the biggest churches in my city. We ended up talking for a while at the end of the hike and he gave me comfort and great advice.
I started to open myself to the world and I stop looking at all the wrongs with my life and startes thanking GOD for all the good.(what a transformation for a man like me.)
I listened to videos on YouTube about optimistic and positive outlooks.
All these changes, a compilation of changes, I also 180ed a lot of my old bad habits, made my W curious and she wanted to see if they were for real, and they were, I stop making changes for her and did them for myself.
It took time and patients.
I tried to added the parable to you thread but No bueno. If you search it on Google it will pop up.
Thanks joejoe1, I found a short version of the parable. Something I think I do is to feed neither the good wolf nor the bad, just waiting for something to happen in my life instead. GAL activities are good for feeding the good wolf for sure.
When W left on Saturday, the only thing that really surprised me and hurt a little was finding that she left behind her house keys. She still has a garage door opener, but we had never talked about whether she would come back or not.
Today W came to the house to pick up son for the week. She wanted to talk, and asked if we could talk outside so our son wouldn't interrupt. That shows her respecting my boundary of not talking about us in front of son, which I appreciated. She wanted to tell me that if I removed her from our car insurance and closed our joint accounts, it would "reflect poorly on me in court". She could be right, but it felt like scare tactics to me. Bothers me because both things were things that she had agreed to herself in the past. I asked if she would sign something to show she agreed to be removed from the policy, but she refused, saying she was still an owner of the car. I didn't think that mattered since she wasn't going to be driving it anymore (also her choice). I also asked her when she was going to start paying for her student loans. She started to choke up a little then and began telling me how I was leaving her with nothing and she didn't have a job and couldn't afford rent. She did acknowledge that she spent money to make herself feel better, and she acknowledged some of her own behavior problems like explosive anger and negative thought patterns. She says she only learned this month that she had depression. None of this was news to me, I'd known it for years. I would have thought she did too. I don't think I heard an apology towards me for anything though.
She thought me being fine with her leaving was a sign I didn't care about her, and wanted to know why I didn't tell my mom she was leaving. I just told W she left me months ago, and I felt insulted that nobody thought I could take care of myself, that her dad thought I needed him to call my mommy for me. I know her parents were just showing concern for me, and I do appreciate that, but I'm a big boy. W just thought I was being an "island" isolating myself and keeping my feelings bottled up. Oh well, I get to feel how I feel and tell those feelings to who I want to tell.
We talked for at least an hour. Too long I know. But I'm in the "I've got nothing to lose" mentality now, and I saw it as an opportunity to check in with W and where she's at with her own processing of our relationship. I'd say it's improved marginally, but she's still set on divorce. She said she wants to start over with our relationship, as acquaintances, so that we can be friends and be good parents for our son. My first thought was "not so fast, you're not getting off the hook that easy!". I asked her what being friends meant to her. I don't remember what she said, but she asked me and I started to get emotional, saying she hasn't been treating me like a friend. I said a friend is someone you can talk to, who you can trust to be there for you to help when you need it. She said she always felt I treated my friends better than her. Thinking on that I believe that could be because my friends treated me better than she did too. Meh. I know W and I both treated each other poorly. I'm happy to try to do better, but I'd like to see some effort from her at building a relationship now.
So when she asked if we could start over and be friends, and not rehash the past anymore, I thought for a while. I don't think the past has been adequately or accurately resolved between us, and I don't feel comfortable sweeping it under the rug and just moving along like it never happened. That's exactly the kind of thing that led me to emotionally abuse my wife. And the biggest obstacle for me is W's affair. So I told her, "If you want to be friends we have to address the fact that I worked hard to try to repair our relationship, and you chose to have an affair instead. We need to talk about that." She looked down, and the first thing she said was "our relationship has been broken since the beginning". No admission, no denial, similar to before. Then she started to instead tell me how I had not included her in the relationship repair work or my own self-growth or something. This time I knew it wouldn't do any good to argue, but I know that is not true. Even if I did fail in some critical ways during that recovery, it was only because I had not yet progressed far enough in my own journey, just as she had not progressed far enough in her own to join me. I don't understand how she can now claim I didn't involve her enough in something she clearly wanted no part of at the time.
Because she is lying to you and herself to appease her guilt.
I just told another poster this same thing: these talks are counter-productive. You shouldn't let her suck you into them. You have NO chance of getting the truth out of her. You have NO chance of getting admissions of guilt from her. You can't believe anything she says. So what value do these conversations have? None. They are valueless. Cheeseless tunnels.
Oh sure, your attachment gets appeased for a while as you get "her attention". But that just proves that you have a lot of work to do to truly detach.
Next time she asks to talk you should say "unless it is about S4 then I am not interested in discussing anything with you". She knows you don't want D, so telling her that has no value. She knows you know the history of R, as does she, so discussing that has no value. When and if she wants to R she will not wait to tell you, she will just come out and say "I am sorry, I made a mistake, and I want to R!"
and I saw it as an opportunity to check in with W and where she's at with her own processing of our relationship. I'd say it's improved marginally, but she's still set on divorce.
No there is no improvement. What you say was a WAW, that has moved out, trying to get out of you what she wants? What does she want you ask? You gave yourself the answer:
he wanted to tell me that if I removed her from our car insurance and closed our joint accounts, it would "reflect poorly on me in court".
She wants insurance and she wants access to your money. Period. This is why WAWs stay in limbo for as long as possible without filing for D. As long as they have access to the benefits of the MR, why would they change anything.
So let's take score:
- She is living on her own and now can do anything she wants to do. (Remember, Ws don't need to move out for any other reasons than to sleep with someone else or someones else.)
- She has car insurance until you remove her.
- She has access to your money until you remove her from the joint account.
- She apparently can come and go as she chooses (and you are ok with that as shown by being hurt by her leaving her keys). Take her garage door opener away. She needs to see what it means to "move out".
- She has you on the hook to discuss anything she wants with you anytime she wants.
She is eating so much cake it isn't funny.
Time to remove her cake.
Ok I'm back! I had a job interview yesterday that went really well I think. I would take the job if I get an offer. It's back in my home state (where W is now) and would be a two-hour commute by train each way until I move.
Steve, I find myself disagreeing with about half of what you wrote, but I think I disagree more with your judgments about my situation than the recommended actions I should take, so I don't have much to argue with.
The only thing that made me say I saw a small improvement is that W said she may have loved me once, but can't anymore. I thought that was an improvement from what she has told me before, that she never really loved me, that she only married me because I was an engineer and she thought her family would respect her more if she married me. I know it doesn't change anything for our relationship status at the moment and I'm not getting my hopes up over it.
Looking into it more it seems I can't remove W from the car insurance policy unless she signs something herself. Maybe I could just cancel the policy myself and get a new one somewhere else. I'm not sure if this issue is more about the cost of the policy, or about me standing up to W demanding she support herself.
I closed one joint checking account today that only had $60 in it. I will tell her tomorrow and give her half the cash when we meet to hand off son. I'm also going to talk to her about our remaining joint accounts, reasserting that I wish to close them. I will give her two options: she can have half the balance in the accounts and I give her no continuing support, or I move all the money in the accounts to my new private checking account and have her give me a monthly amount she thinks she needs to live on, which I will consider and accept. And I will move direct deposits to my private checking account (one is done already but I have another that I haven't moved).
She said herself that her spending was a form of financial abuse against me. Why would I want to continue sharing accounts with her when she even admitted that herself? Even if she wasn't cheating on me and wanting a divorce, it would be reasonable for me to establish financial boundaries to protect myself from a possible reoccurrence of that abuse.
- She is living on her own and now can do anything she wants to do. (Remember, Ws don't need to move out for any other reasons than to sleep with someone else or someones else.)
That is probably a factor here, but I don't think it is fair to say that is the only reason she is moving out. Another factor is her not wanting to live with me, someone she believes and/or feels controlled and abused by.
You're going to give her cash? That's not traceable. Any money issues like allowances should be discussed with lawyers. Don't shoot yourself in the foot.
Don't let her take advantage of you in any way. Get your money right. Her reason to move out is most likely to sleep around.
What did you do that was so horrible?
So you believe all this is your fault? COMMON misconception by LBSs. Especially LBHs. Because if we can blame our behavior then we can fix it! Sorry STH but it isn't that easy.
Do what you want but paying her to live separate is NGS to the max. And won't bring her back to you.
I acknowledge the fault I had and am committed to making changes around that. Because of our relationship status at the moment though, I am trying to prioritize myself and my son over the relationship. That has been difficult for me because putting the relationship first is something I thought I needed to do as a change to save our relationship. I am having to set that aside now.
I know cash is somewhat risky. In this case because the amount is so small and we still trust each other enough, I'm not so worried about it. I don't have checks yet for my new account, I need to get on that too. Maybe I need to think this through some more, but I've done that for a while already and just need to make a decision and move on. I think I'm leaning towards moving all direct deposits to my checking account, taking half the money out of the joint accounts and leaving the rest for W to budget herself. It should last her long enough to get a job, and I wouldn't be setting up a precedent of support by giving her an allowance. I also just don't want to put myself in the position of giving her an allowance as if I'm her parent. She's a grown woman.
STH, good new perspectives here. One thing when it comes to money decisions, you may want to consult a lawyer. Generally the legal rule is that unless there is a court order to do so, you are under no obligation to provide her with any new funds. The existing funds is where the issue lay, and a lawyer can make sure you are doing the right thing in your jurisdiction.
Sigh. Today was a tough day for me. I regret not going to sleep earlier last night. Too little sleep always makes me more defensive and irritable, and weak when interacting with W. I met her today to transfer son to my care (i hate talking about my son like that as if he's some piece of property, but I don't know what else to say). She was a half hour late because of traffic. I used the time to clean out my car a bit (spent a lot of time already this past week cleaning out the mess she left behind in it). On my way to the meeting I called MIL to clear the air about the move-out day and how I felt I was not given the autonomy to make my own decisions about seeking support for myself that day. I also talked to FIL last night about same. So that's all fine now. I told them I appreciated their concern and want to maintain a good relationship with them, and that in the future I would prefer direct communication with me and for them to ask me if I need anything and let me decide for myself.
So when W showed up, son was sleeping in the car and when he woke up he was acting angry. He asked if they had to live at grandma's house again next week, sounding like he really didn't want to. W said something like she was sorry there was nothing that could be changed about that right now. I hope I didn't actually roll my eyes at that. Son didn't want to give her a hug goodbye or let her touch him, backing away into me instead. That was strange to me. He didn't really want to talk to me either though. It was really sad for me to see him angry like this. W has been telling me he's been angry a lot more lately.
I told W I closed the one account with $60 in it and asked if she wanted half the cash. She declined it. I asked her if she wanted the $10 I owed her still from the car sale and she did accept that. She asked who was paying the credit cards and I said I would pay them one last time. She said "then we're just not going to pay them anymore!?" I said I wasn't going to be putting any more expenses on the joint card, so it would be up to her to pay it. She sighed and said "ok I guess."
W asked me if I would watch son next week during a couple of doctor appointments she has near our house. I had been doing this a lot before she moved out, and I thought I should take any time offered with son, so I agreed. I wish I had told her I would have to get back to her on it after checking my schedule.
Then I put son in his car seat to leave. I saw W immediately call somebody on her phone. That phone call made me wonder a lot. Who she was talking to, was she reporting what I had just told her, or making plans with OM? And I don't like that I am worrying about one little phone call so much like that. We started driving away and then son wanted to say goodbye to mom. So I pulled over and flagged down W to stop so he could say goodbye. Then we left.
Later I realized I might be a reserve juror next week. I had received a summons about a month ago that summoned me for this week, but I asked for and was granted a postponement because this week was the week my thesis was due for the summer term. I didn't meet that deadline like I wanted to (I've been distracted, can you guess by what!?). I thought I postponed it for only one week, but I can't find any documentation that confirms a new date. Just an email that said I would receive a new summons. Well I don't recall receiving a new summons, but if it is next week that could conflict with the times I just said I could watch our son for W's appointments. So I caved and called W to ask if she had seen any new summons come in the mail. She'd been bringing in the mail the last week or two before she moved out, and we hadn't been speaking much at all during that time.
She answered the phone on the first ring, and sounded cheerful. She said she hadn't seen it but I should check all the mail piles. Then she said she was "kind of working right now and have to take care of some people." okayyy...bye. Then I was feeling angry thinking she got a job without telling me and probably never planned to but still was going to let me continue paying for her life. I've had my interviews on the calendar and she hasn't asked me about them once. I snapped at my son shortly after about something I don't think I would have if I hadn't called W (and stayed up too late last night). Son didn't want to talk to me for a while after that either. It took some time but I made sure to repair with him.
I took son to a church festival in the evening and we had a lot of fun. I spent a lot of cash I normally wouldn't in the past. Old me would have taken son into the church to drink from the water fountain instead of paying $1.50 for a water bottle. Today I bought the water bottle. It was refreshing. Another fun couple of days with son ahead, but I'm still worried about the jury duty thing. I haven't been able to figure out when my new summons date is or if I was even given one, and I am upset that it is going to take more time out of my weekend with son to figure out, if I even can figure it out.
Overall, today feels like I made a lot of mistakes and I'm feeling down about it. I think I need to focus on some positives. Best thing today was having fun with my son at the festival. I'm thankful for that.
STH- We all make mistakes- it is when we continue doing them over that becomes a problem. Focus on you and your S and the good times do not dwell in negativity. Blessings!
When W picked up son today I told her I didn't know if I would be able to watch son anymore because of possibly having to go in for jury duty. W said she would figure something out. I did have to go in today, but I am done now and was told I don't have to come in at all tomorrow. So do I keep the original agreement I made to watch son and call W to say I can watch him, or say nothing and not tell her about not having jury duty? The first one feels like the "right" thing to do. I'd also get to spend a bit more time with my son, even though I should be working at school.
I called her to let her know I didn't have jury duty tomorrow. She has childcare covered, I didn't ask how. I came home and found she has been packing up important documents and pictures I don't want leaving the house. It's not snooping when she's packing up things I have equal claim to. She's also taking things I know she has no use for other than to sell, which I would never see the money from. And she took a $60 Visa gift card we received as a Christmas gift. She was going to take son's baptismal stole and papers. She embroidered the stole, but she has rejected the church so I don't know why she would want it. She found the bank folder I was looking for that has our house purchase documents in it. No deed in there that I can see, maybe that's not something that was ever in there? I am not letting her take all these things.
There also was the receipt for her engagement ring. I'm not letting her profit from the sale of that either. It wasn't an expensive ring, but all this stuff she's taking to sell can really add up.
Tonight I was supposed to have a relaxing night cooking myself dinner. Scrap that. Now I feel like I have to go around the house hiding anything else I don't want her to take.
STH,
A few remarks:
1) I think you can feel free asking any questions that pertain to your son, such as his childcare (as long as it is truly about your son, and not some thinly covered attempt to snoop on her). Even if you split, you will still be involved in and responsible for his upbringing.
2) I would advise you not to worry about petty stuff like things she took to sell. If you have expensive things like a Rolex watch or valuable things like your grandparents wedding rings, you should put them away (safe deposit box maybe). But a sixty dollar gift card is not worth the trouble, in my opinion. Do you think you will remember about this gift card 5 years from now? Even 5 months from now? I do not think so.
3) I missed your posts over the last few weeks. It looks like she has moved out. Why does she still come and go as if your house is a hotel? If she wants to come, she needs a reason from now on. This is your home now, not hers.I would consider changing the locks. You do not need to confront her about it, you can just do it and tell her you have done it.This is what I think at least.
On #3, or just do it and let her find out the hard way.
I think I don't even have to go so far as changing locks right now. I will ask a lawyer first, but since my wife voluntarily left her house keys behind and her only means of entry is with the garage door opener, I think I can just erase the remotes from the opener and that would keep her out. If I talked to her about it she may even agree to hand over her remote. She did not object to me wanting the baptism things, we're splitting the school pictures, and she said she didn't remember seeing the bank folder (i suspect that is a lie, I found it in one of the boxes she packed.)
I expect she will say she should have access to the house because of our son's things being there. I think my answer to that is that this is son's home, he did not choose to move out, and if she wants anything of his (or her own for that matter), she can ask for it and we can arrange a time for her to pick it up. I don't plan on being available much more than the times we transfer son between us.
I have expected her to put up more of a fight about a lot of things, like me taking the bed back, me closing accounts and switching direct deposit to my own new checking account. She really hasn't fought any of those things though. Maybe me taking the bed back made her finally decide to move out, but she'd wanted to do that since January. I think my actions reinforce her resentment more than her growing any respect for me. Can't worry too much about that right now though, gotta keep standing up for myself.
I wouldn't trust the key thing. Keys are easily and cheaply copied. I'd rekey the locks.
Make it a clean break with the locks/her access. It should be clear and easy for her to understand.
Don't get too nitpicky.
So the response I got from a lawyer was that W can file for divorce in the state she moved to in as little as three weeks, and the lawyer is urging me to file soon in my state if I want jurisdiction here. I don't see how it matters much where it is filed, other than if W requests a temporary order for custody that I would contest. And I would probably have to find a new lawyer, but that's not a huge concern for me right now.
Feel like I'm heading into battle today. No running away.
So the response I got from a lawyer was that W can file for divorce in the state she moved to in as little as three weeks, and the lawyer is urging me to file soon in my state if I want jurisdiction here. I don't see how it matters much where it is filed, other than if W requests a temporary order for custody that I would contest. And I would probably have to find a new lawyer, but that's not a huge concern for me right now.
Feel like I'm heading into battle today. No running away.
My suggestion is that if you are against D, and especially if you are morally opposed to D, then do not be the one to file. Ls always want you to file first. They have their reason, and I am sure there are good reasons to do so as well. However, what makes sense legally doesn't necessarily make sense morally. If you knew for sure your W was in an EA or PA, then I would say go for it without hesitation. For me cheating is the only thing that justifies filing. But then you aren't me so do whatever you feel is best.
Definitely EA and PA, extent of PA unknown but the worst is likely from what I've read.
We made a non exhaustive list for property division we both signed. I made a toothless request for her to give me her keys. She says I can't legally keep her out. I knew that. I guess she agreed to let me know when she would be coming to the house. This is depressing.
Definitely EA and PA, extent of PA unknown but the worst is likely from what I've read.
We made a non exhaustive list for property division we both signed. I made a toothless request for her to give me her keys. She says I can't legally keep her out. I knew that. I guess she agreed to let me know when she would be coming to the house. This is depressing.
I'd talk to a lawyer about that. I think in most cases if they move out they give up rights to unfettered access to the marital home. But there are different rules on that in different jurisdictions.
So the response I got from a lawyer was that W can file for divorce in the state she moved to in as little as three weeks, and the lawyer is urging me to file soon in my state if I want jurisdiction here. I don't see how it matters much where it is filed, other than if W requests a temporary order for custody that I would contest. And I would probably have to find a new lawyer, but that's not a huge concern for me right now.
Feel like I'm heading into battle today. No running away.
That is a tough choice. On one hand, I agree with Steve that you probably do not want to file for D yourself. On the other, it may be much worse if she files in a different state. For one thing, you will need a L that is registered in that state, you need to attend meetings in that state... it complicates things big time. If I were in your shoes and I was positive she would file, I would consider preemptively file myself. Very tough dilema, though...
Just remember, you can file, and if things change, always request a withdrawal of proceedings.
Just found out I didn't get the job I interviewed for last week. I had put a lot of hope in that. This week has been hard, I think I am experiencing depression. Not as bad as my wife did for months or years at a time probably, but I've noticed a change in my own attitudes. Feeling a lot more hopeless in general about the future. All my GAL activities feel empty now, like they aren't enough to make me happy. Being with my son is positive, but also saddens me because I keep worrying about not having a job, daycare, or housing plan for him/us. And my car needs an emissions check by the end of the month but needs repairs before it will pass. I ordered parts today and I hope that fixes the problem but I feel I am taking a risk with doing it myself to try to save some money on it.
Just sent son off with W for this week. I did a lot of fun stuff with son this weekend. Went to another festival that had free carnival rides and had ice cream there. We re-painted one of his dinosaur toys and a happy meal toy because he's been watching a lot of youtube videos of toy customization like that. I had a friend, his wife, and their infant over for dinner one night.
Despite all that my son has started telling me "I don't like you, I hate you, I don't like living with you" when I say "I love you" to him. I've read that can be a common thing for kids his age to do, especially when they are upset about not getting their way with something. That was definitely the case the first time, he was upset I wanted him to sleep in his bed instead of on the couch. It caught me off guard and I tried asking him why he said that, it's not a nice thing to say. And after some reading I learned the best response is not to do that, but to assure him that I still love him no matter what. I did that the next day when he said the same things and I think it turned out better.
It seems to be the same sort of detached response necessary for dealing with a spouse who says they are not in love with you: "Ok, you don't love me, but that is not a reflection of my true intrinsic value, and I will still love you no matter what." Except saying "I love you" to a spouse who wants out doesn't really work. And that's an even harder attitude to maintain when spouse is having an affair. I wonder if I still love her or I just haven't let her go. I think I know how to get my love for her back if I needed to (that is if she shows any interest in R).
I am sad that my son is saying these things to me because I think he would not be saying them to me if W had not moved out. He was very excited to see W today when she came to pick him up. I feel like not only have I lost my W, now I need to save my relationship with my son too.
I had a text exchange with W tonight to set up exchange for our son tomorrow. I requested an earlier time than we've done before (about 30 min earlier). She asked where, and I said either our house or the "halfway" point we have been using. She asked me how long it took me to get to the halfway point. I knew where this was going but told her 45-60min. She said it was taking her 1.5 hours and asked if I would drive further. I wanted to hold my ground, so I said I couldn't tomorrow. She asked what was going on tomorrow. I didn't want to start an argument about whose time was more important, so I ignored that question and just said we should meet at the usual halfway point and that I was reading son a bedtime story at the moment. She agreed and that put the issue to rest for now. I don't think I could have had that interaction face to face with her without it turning sour (I would have been pretty stony, as I have been more often with W since she moved out). I expect her to keep asking me to drive further in the future. She's been doing more of the driving than I have, but I don't think it is my responsibility to make the driving time equal. She is not my priority any more.
I don't want this conflict to turn son into a gamepiece. It already feels like that with handing him over to each other for exchanges: here you go, your turn! I don't want that to be his experience growing up, switching between two lives, one with a mom and one with a dad. That's why I want to start calling him while he is with W during the week.
When I drop off son tomorrow I plan on telling W that I want to call son this week, so she knows I will be calling and we can agree on a time for that. I'm sure she won't object to me talking to son, but I have a fear that she will suspect I am really calling to check up on her (I'm not, and I would just call son directly if he wasn't only 4). I haven't called son while he's been with W since she moved out, and she hasn't called him while he's been with me either.
First, I commend you on being a good father! So many have no problem turning their kids into game pieces. So well done.
On the halfway point thing, I think sometimes we LBSs put the emphasis on the wrong thing. if driving an extra 1/2 hour even things out, then do it. There is nothing wrong with being reasonable and accommodating. In fact, that kind of thing can go a long way in making your sitch a little easier to deal with. Look at it i reverse, what if you were driving 1.5 hours and she was driving 45 minutes? That would likely stick in your crawl. So try to be even with things. Accommodate where it makes sense. Error on the side of trying to show a conciliatory attitude. This doesn't mean you become a doormat, but reasonable accommodation doesn't turn you into that.
I detect one of the 180s you could do is like the above. You said: "I don't think I could have had that interaction face to face with her without it turning sour (I would have been pretty stony, as I have been more often with W since she moved out)." So 180 on that. Remain upbeat, friendly, accommodating even in person. Don't let it turn sour and don't return in kind. If she does start getting disrespectful calmly state: "I refuse to have this conversation with you if you can't remain respectful. When you can be respectful then we can continue this discussion." And then walk away.
Remember 180s are about stopping doing that which doesn't work, and starting to that which does.
Just found out I didn't get the job I interviewed for last week. I had put a lot of hope in that. This week has been hard, I think I am experiencing depression.
So sorry you didn't get the job you wanted. I'm sure you are experiencing natural disappointment. One thing that always helped with not getting the job I wanted, or other things, is that I know my God has a plan for my life. He wants the best for me, and sometimes, He has to shut a door...
.in order to open another one. In other words, if I interview for a job that "I" think would be good, but God (knowing the future), knows it would be bad, so He closes that door. But if I will
trust Him, He will open the way for me for to get the "right" job.
Don't take this as a personal rejection. Don't start beating yourself up, thinking you aren't good enough. You have been, and still are, going through a storm. It gets tiring. You have to find the fuel that feeds your soul. I compare it to the love tank (most everyone knows a little about that), and we can run just so long on the fuel we had stored in our tank. However, if we don't take time to pull over and fuel up......we will run completely out, and then what?
You have had to deal with a lot of negative stuff in your life. That takes a toll on your spirit. You've got to have something positive that inspires you. Something that gets you pumped! It may be inspirational music, motivational talks, dancing, whatever. But you have to go find it. It won't come to you. Know what I mean?
FWIW, my H & I have faced many times we didn't know how we were going to keep the utilities on, make the next car payment, buy groceries, etc. He would go for periods of time without a job (and that is such a stressful time on the MR). I mean, it was so bad we thought living from paycheck to paycheck would be a slice of heaven! By the grace of God, we would come through it. It may not have been the way "I" would have preferred, but we made it. So, my heart goes out to you during this time. Edification has never been my "gift", but I do want to encourage you not to give up hope for your life getting better. This period
will pass. (((hugs)))
STH17, that's really hard when you divide custody. That's great to call your son when he's not with you. I hope your wife will cooperate. My husband calls my daughter every day now and I help facilitate the call, encouraging her to answer his questions and then I talk to him a little sometimes as well. I hope you can find an arrangement that works. I feel so, so sad for these children. I can't understand how anyone can walk away from their marriage with innocent little kids. Once we have kids they become the most important thing. Raising them is a huge responsibility and privilege. I hope this is a temporary time in your child's life and you and your wife can either reconcile someday or find a better arrangement that prevents him from being a game piece.
So sorry you didn't get the job you wanted. I'm sure you are experiencing natural disappointment. One thing that always helped with not getting the job I wanted, or other things, is that I know my God has a plan for my life. He wants the best for me, and sometimes, He has to shut a door...
.in order to open another one. In other words, if I interview for a job that "I" think would be good, but God (knowing the future), knows it would be bad, so He closes that door. But if I will trust Him, He will open the way for me for to get the "right" job.
Such a good point! There have been times when I wanted a job so bad.....didn't get it. And NOT getting it ended up being the best thing for me!
1) Right out of college I lost out to the other finalist for the job. Turns out I would have been stuck in that position or moving to sales (and I am not a sales person!), instead I got a lower paying job that had lots of advancement opportunities. In short, I would not be where I am in my career today if I had landed that job.
2) Wanted a job with my W's company really badly. Even though I was finishing some schooling for a degree (that would have went on hold). Didn't get it, and then 3 months after not getting it they let all of the new people they had hired go in a layoff. I would have been jobless, and had less opportunities since my schooling wasn't finished.
3) Applied for a job with my sister's company. She is in accounting, I am in IT. She didn't know much about their IT business. I didn't get the job. Work with someone now that worked for that company and said it was the worst IT company he's ever worked for! Another bullet dodged!
STH everything happens for a reason.
Thanks Steve, Sandi, and Nicole.
This week was a pretty good week for me. I didn't apply to any more jobs, but it was a restful week I was able to turn my attention more towards setting better habits for myself and taking a look at what's working and what's not in my life. Calling my son on Wednesday was great. We did FaceTime and he was in a good mood. He told me W bought brownies, cookies, and cupcakes, which is exciting for him, but a dead giveaway to me that W is feeling depressed herself. I only talked to W about scheduling the next exchange of our son, and she was getting frustrated with son who was climbing all over her. She told him she wanted him to leave her alone for a few minutes while she talked to me. I don't know if there was anything else she wanted to talk about. She seemed distracted by son, so I just said I could go so she could give him her attention. I'm glad I talked to my son, and want to keep doing that at least once a week while W has him.
Today when I picked up son, he soon told me again he didn't want to live with me, that he wanted to live with mom at grandma's house. I asked what he liked about grandma's house. This time he said he wanted to live there with mom and me, together. And he asked why mom's house couldn't be across the street. That was heartbreaking to hear from him. I get the sense that his emotions about this are hard for him to talk about and understand too. I told him that I would like to live together with him and mom too. I didn't know what else to say. I told him I loved him, and mom loved him too.
This week I met up with a running group for a 3-mile run and post-run meal at nearby restaurant. I think that was the best thing I did this week (calling son was a close second). I met some new people, and I think running is more uplifting for me than rock climbing which I've been doing a lot of but is starting to feel like a chore of a workout.
W changed the password for our (her) Netflix account yesterday, locking me out. Party's over :P. Oh well, she's probably doing me a favor in reality. I just need to replace the time I spent watching TV with something better. I've been wanting to start habits of reading and journaling, but Netflix and Youtube often distract me. I want to be more conscious of my choice to watch Youtube videos, and make a choice to do something else positive.
I haven't been coming to this forum as much this week either. I spend a lot of time here when I'm anxious about my sitch. I've been journaling in a notebook each night this week, and that's been pretty good. It's different than writing here.
Still a long road ahead I know. This week was kind of a breather/recovery week. Next week is my 8th anniversary on Tuesday. It will be just another Tuesday this year. I'll be staying busy that day.
STH, it's good to hear positive updates. It sounds like you've done so much this week. Calling your son, running, journaling, and meeting new people are all healthy and rewarding activities. Everything with your wife still happened recently so you probably really needed a week like this to help unwind. I'll be keeping your son in my thoughts as he struggles to understand what's happening. I'd give anything to prevent any kid from going through this. I'm sure your call helped your son a lot to know you still care even when you're not there.
I took my son to another fair this past weekend, the biggest one we've been to all summer. Spent 8 hours there. Gave son back to W last night because I had a meeting to go to. She was going to bring him to me today because she had an IC appointment. Instead right when she should have been leaving she texted me that she was leaving son with her parents. I was disappointed and angry. I was looking forward to having some time with my son today. It would have been a couple two hour car rides for him to spend two hours with me. I don't know why W changed the plans. I only responded "OK". I would like to ask her why she changed the plans with such short notice, and tell her that I was looking forward to spending time with son and am disappointed I didn't get that time with him today. I even tried calling W's parents to Skype with son, but MIL only had Skype on their basement computer, and son didn't want to go down there to talk to me. I think he just didn't want to talk to me. He seems to take every transition hard, not wanting to hug either me or W goodbye.
I'm going running tonight with the same group as last week but a new (for me) location.
Tomorrow is anniversary number eight. I will not be contacting W tomorrow.
Stay strong STH. Keep your detaching and GAL. How was the running?
Running was great, the meetup was at a brewery and I stayed there til 9 hanging out with the other runners. I felt immediately accepted into the group, but I want to stretch myself by opening up and talking more to make some friends. I texted W while I was there asking to FaceTime my son, but she told me he was busy playing with his cousins. I said fine, I'll try another day. She said today would work, so I said ok I'll call tonight at 7. So I will be contacting her on our anniversary after all, but I'm not going to mention it, just going to talk to son. I'll be thinking about W a lot today though. It's a sad, sobering day.
Anyone have tips for a first anniversary alone? Feel the feels and mourn, or distract myself? It doesn't feel like a depression sadness right now, just sad and wistful disappointment.
There, I think naming the feeling helps. I think I'll try getting some work done now and come back to my feelings later in the day. I want to do some journaling or letter writing today to myself or to my wife, to really be completely honest with myself and with her. No plans to give it to her, I just need to write out all my feelings in a way I haven't done in a long time.
This last time picking up my son, W was 45 minutes late because she said son didn't want to go. When I got to our meeting spot I texted her I was there, and she asked if I wanted to meet closer to her. I've been trying to stand my ground on this issue, so I said I would wait for her. If she wants to meet closer I want her to actually talk to me about it ahead of time, not just change plans at the last minute. She didn't say a word to me at the dropoff, and drove off while I was getting son in his carseat. The hardest thing about driving him home with me this time was that his clothes and backpack smelled like my in-laws' house, which brings memories to me of first dating W and spending a lot of time there with her. I had to open a window after a while to deal with it.
W has refused to close joint accounts, so I've just been spending them dry on things like mortgage payments and other bills. It's reached a low level now where there's not enough money there to pay off the credit card I wanted W to close. I've got enough money in my new checking account, but I have no idea how much money has hidden in her own account or what she is earning now. I am going to tell her tomorrow I am not paying her student loan anymore. I've switched all the autopays I could from our joint accounts to my new one.
It was a while ago since we talked about medical bills and health insurance premiums, but I think there is an understanding now that I will continue paying those costs. I want to change that. I would like to just tell W I am not paying anything for her anymore, and leave it up to her to figure things out herself or negotiate with me.
W changed her address with post office this week (didn't tell me, but notice came in the mail and there was a fee on our credit card). So that is one more step towards her filing for D. I keep thinking about things like that as signs of increasing distancing in our relationship. I've read relationships are always moving closer together or further apart. I have to stop hanging on to things like that though, and all the financial support I'm giving W as if holding onto it is preventing further distancing. Paying somebody's student loans and medical bills isn't a sign of closeness in a relationship when the person benefitting wants nothing to do with the person paying. It's just taking advantage.
I agreed to drop off son at W's work tomorrow, which could eat up 3 hours of my day travelling. Guess I can at least ask her to return the favor in the future. I don't feel as bad cutting off support now that she's working, but I also think whether she's working or not shouldn't really matter.
Dropped off son today. It took 3 and a half hours out of my day because of the extra distance. I don't want to agree to doing that again, unless W makes similar effort for me. Even then, I think I'd rather just stick with meeting halfway. Another twenty minutes I probably could have dropped him off right at in-laws' house.
I was anxious all day yesterday and today about telling W I had changed all the autopays from our joint accounts to my new checking account, and she will have to pay for her student loan from now on. Also reminding her she is responsible for making payments on our joint credit card. Like so many other things like this, I got no reaction from her at all. Just an "ok, fine!" It still feels like a game of chicken, seeing who will flinch first. I expect D papers coming soon. Next step for me would be to ask her to pay half the mortgage and home and health insurance bills. That seems pointless though. Not enforceable in any way. I may go back on my commitment to paying her medical bills. I don't even know if she's seeing her IC anymore, she hasn't put any more appointments on our shared calendar. Now that my money is going into my own checking account, I can keep it there and not pay anything of hers.
I'm at the level of "done-ness" that would have been helpful a year ago, but I wouldn't have understood half what I do now. I'm sick of worrying about my finances and the effect divorce will have on them. Or the effect staying married will have on them, for that matter.
More important personal goal now is to get a job and decide whether I'm moving or not.
Today W changed the password on the budgeting app we'd been using. She stopped using it when I started staying with friends last Nov., and I've stopped using it since she moved out a few weeks ago. I had been thinking of asking her if she even wanted the account and if I could change the password and email to my own (it was set up by her). She decided herself without talking to me about it though.
FaceTimed son tonight, always a pleasure. After hanging up (son hung up by accident, but we were done anyway), W texted me to say there's a birthday party in a couple weeks I could take son to if I wanted, she can't go because she'll be working. It's a weekend, so I would have son with me. The party has been on the calendar for a while, and I knew we'd have to talk about it soon. I just replied after a few minutes that I would think about it. The party is for the 3yo son of W's cousin who is recently divorced. Her husband cheated on her a year ago and continued to live with AP after confrontation, and she was very public about the whole thing on FB, including her dating which to me seemed to be just to spite her husband. Seemed very immature on both sides. She is the cousin I have snoozed on FB.
If I am only thinking about my own wants, I would absolutely not go to that party. It's not a relationship I need or want in my life. But if I am thinking about my son, I can see how it would be fun for him, and would be something he would normally have gotten to go to if it wasn't for W not wanting to be a family anymore. So I can give my son a couple hours of fun with his cousins, and practice being detached among W's family (if any are even there). I'll ask W if she has a gift for the kid, and if not I'll give son $5 to pick something out at Target.
This week I asked to meet W to pick up son earlier than 11am, and she said son "had a thing that morning at 8:30" and she couldn't be there earlier than 11. ??? What "thing" could my son have on a Friday morning??
Hi STH, it seems like it would be nice for your son to go to the party. It seems a bit awkward though to sit there alone, without your wife, socializing with everyone. Hopefully there will be some people there who are friendly and have no idea what's happening so you can just talk about normal stuff and enjoy your time!
I'd say "hell naw" to going to that party with the skeezy you-know-what there. You can take your son out to the arcade, go shooting, hiking, fishing, go to the playground, get McDonalds, call one of his other friends. So many awesome father son activities that there's no way I'd go to that toxic environment when I could enjoy my day.
W texted asking me to bring her W2 and a copy of our tax return when I pick up son tomorrow. Also wants me to bring the last of her mail and asked me to return her library books. She is living about 2 hrs away now. A few weeks ago I did tell her I didn't want her dropping by and taking things from the house. She hasn't come around since then.
The 8:30 thing for son tomorrow is a school evaluation near W's parents. I felt blindsided by that and we ended up in a typical argument for us. My mind races with scared and weak and angry thoughts, things I think I can't or shouldn't say, and W gets impatient with my silence, so I start talking but my tone is angry because I always feel like she is criticizing me for my silence. And I don't think I can just hang up because I feel like I have to respond but don't know what to say.
She asked if I wanted to come with to the evaluation. Son started crying real loud because he wanted to make cupcakes. He sounded really distressed. I told W to take care of him and call me back. I tried to cool off during that time. When she called back she asked if my main concern was having equal time with my son. During the first call I said she was making a decision without me about son that would reduce the time I could spend with him. So I confirmed that was my main concern. She said she didn't even know what a schedule would be for school. I asked if she wanted to put son in school just so someone would be watching him or because she wanted him in school. She said he should be in school because he needs the stimulation. I reminded her that this wasn't even a consideration for her a few months ago when she wanted to move out. (She had said he didn't have to be in school since he was only 4). I think she was just quiet after I said that.
We didn't talk about the library books. I'm not taking them even though I was planning on going to the library with son this weekend. She wanted the W2 and tax return for enrolling son in the school. Is that really something that's needed? She's looking at a public school, we had son in a private school last year. I thought she might want them to work on divorce papers. Or gov benefits?
STH, I didn't think W2's and tax returns are necessary for a school enrollment but maybe to establish residency in a particular district? Why does she lives so far away from you know by the way? That sounds really inconvenient a lot of time for your son to be sitting in the car going back-and-forth.
I have the same problem as you not knowing how to respond and thinking all those thoughts and not being able to respond in a happy and carefree way. Sometimes we just have to do our best but this is the hardest thing ever. It's so hard to avoid shouting "maybe if you just came home and we could be a normal family again we wouldn't have to have all these conversations!"
I hope your son gets through all this ok. I'm so sorry for you and your son. I hope this situation gets better whether your wife comes back or not.
The only reason I can think of is for income verification. The documents show her old address, not where she's trying to enroll son. I gave W her mail and W2, and told her I don't have a physical copy of the tax return since I e-filed and she can get one herself from IRS online because I didn't want to email sensitive info to her. No arguing today. No mention of her library books last night or today. I won't bring it up, and if she asks again I still plan on telling her I'm not doing things like that for her anymore.
ugh. A week ago I told W she would have to take care of her student loan payment from now on. I've been watching the joint checking account it usually gets paid from, and noticed that over the weekend she transferred the last of our savings account into the checking account, but was still about $10 short for the student loan payment. Today the student loan payment was taken out of the joint checking account, and overdrafted the account. What really surprised me though was that an overdraft protection was automatically applied that came out of MY credit card. I have my own card with that bank, and we have a joint card that W is the owner of which I have asked her to remove me from. I'll have to talk to W about it.
Hmm I just took another look, and see that just a day ago my cousin cashed a check I wrote him for his wedding two months ago. The overdraft still would have occurred regardless of this check being cashed, but now the amount of the overdraft that is "my responsibility" is a little muddied. The fact remains that W did not put enough money in the account to cover her student loan payment. Now that the accounts are empty, if W continues to overdraft them, I will close them.
I need to be careful with this situation because a typical behavior from me is to have expectations about how I want W to do something, not communicate that fully to her, then get upset when she does something different than I would have or the way I wanted her to do it. So I need to not tell her "why didn't you do this or that", but just address the facts that I told her she was responsible for her student loan payment, and now the checking account is overdrawn because she did not make arrangements for that. How is she going to keep that from happening again? And if she is not going to keep it from happening again, I will, by closing the accounts.
Good 180 here STH. Keep it up, eventually she will realize that not having you there is going to hurt.
Hi STH. How are you doing?
Hm, a month since I updated here.
Shortly after last post, W finished closing the bank accounts. So our financial separation (nothing legal or official) is pretty much complete aside from my name still being on the jointly held credit card she is primary owner of, and me paying our monthly health insurance premium. We've settled into a routine for exchanging son each weekend, without really talking a lot about it or the future.
W has son enrolled in a 4K public school near her parents' house, and I was going to object to that because it would prevent me from having son overnight Sunday nights, but last week W told me he was placed in the afternoon class so the only change to the schedule we've fallen into is that I would get son later on Fridays. That is not so bad because it allows me to work more hours on Fridays on my master's project. I suppose the alternative still could be for me to arrange child care for son on my own, but the arrangement my W has made isn't looking so bad anymore.
I have been texting W every evening I am without son to ask to talk to son. We don't talk to each other unless it's about scheduling pickups and dropoffs. We're pretty much done having any kind of relationship.
I've continued meeting with the running group, and am starting to go to public outdoor workouts that meet a couple days a week before work. Exercise has been great for me, and meeting new people in the groups has been good too. with.
I met a guy a week ago who is in the running group, and went to his house for dinner. He asked if I had a wife and kids, and I told him I had a son and I had a wife who moved out. His reply was "oh yeah, that happened to me too with my second wife, she said 'I've got a place and I'm moving out in a week', so I said 'Ok, I'll go downstairs and tell the kids.'"
Then the guy asked if I had a girlfriend yet. Interesting to me that he followed up with that question so quickly. I just said no, we're still married. He brought it up again the next time I saw him though, like he wants to get me dating someone. I still don't think it's right for me to do that while still being married.
Hi STH, it's good to hear your updates. It would always be nice if there was better news but it's good to know some of the logistics are working out and you're making new friends. I agree it's questionable as to whether dating while still married is the right thing to do. I personally think making friendship connections with people of the opposite gender that could lead to future dating possibilities is fine. I haven't found anyone like that for myself but perhaps you will. When do you think you or your wife will take the next step towards divorce?
For a while about a month ago I kept expecting divorce papers in the mailbox every time I checked the mail. I used to dread it, now I almost get excited hoping to find them there. Don't know if that even comes in the mail or what, but that's what pops into my head every time. I don't know if W is/has worked on moving that forward at all since she moved out. Might be up to me in the end, or she'll blindside me again as continues to happen every so often, most recently with son's school. I dropped son off at her parent's house last weekend, and noticed that all her boxes are covering the frontroom. It looked to me like the stuff had been there since she moved in with her parents, but I don't know that for sure.
Today W texted me some info about son's school, which he is starting on Monday. She said she'd "like it if I dropped him off Monday and picked him up Friday" from school. And she has a new job starting tomorrow "for the morning shifts". Said she can give me more information about that. Which would be the first time in months she's given me any information about what she's doing, besides when I asked her if she had a job a week after she moved out and I was starting to cut off support. Enough about her. If I am to do the drop-offs, that will take more than 6 hours out of my week, just spent driving. I want to reply "I'd like you to drive S up to my house and take the rest of your stuff back with you" since she has left a room full of her stuff at our house still too, and hasn't said a word about it since I told her I didn't want her dropping by and taking a few things at a time.
She left me, and now we don't talk. And I'm two steps behind on everything pertaining to son, divorce, job, life...
Going to school tonight to work on my master's project. It's been neglected for a long time as I've been doing a lot more GAL stuff. For the dating decision, I still am thinking heavily about what W would think about it, and whether I'd be violating my own marriage commitment. Filing for D still seems like breaking my marriage commitment. I know W already did break it, so maybe I'm just stubbornly holding on to something that isn't there. That's the dilemma all LBS are faced with though isn't it? WAS says it's over, but the LBS doesn't believe it. Until the LBS just gets tired of waiting? Which is what led the WAS to say it's over in the first place, they were tired of waiting for change. I'm just starting to wonder what's the point of resisting divorce if there's nothing I can do to stop it. If it's inevitable, the sooner the better right? I guess that's what I'm feeling now, but still would rather W do the filing herself. I told her she would have to file by herself months ago, and that's about when we stopped any communication about anything. Well, that's when she had a breakdown, got meds and intensive therapy, then moved out.
Last week butted heads with W over who would be taking on the burden of driving son back and forth interstate now that son has started 4K. I dropped off son on his first day (Oct. 1) and W came along in my car to show me where to go for the dropoff. I have told her I can drop off son on Mondays at school if she drops him off at my house Friday afternoon/evening. She pushed back on that, saying she isn't going to drive through rush hour traffic anymore to get son to me. She told me I could drive all the way to pick up son.
Since I thought it clear W was not going to give me what I wanted, I asked my mom for help with the driving. I can't take 6 to 8 hours out of my week every week to do all that driving myself. My mom agreed to drive son to me twice a month on Fridays. I think I can do the Friday drive once a month and spend a weekend at my parents' with son. I have two priorities, first is spending as much time with son as I can, which to me means not giving up Friday nights or Monday mornings, and second is getting time to work on my master's project.
My IC advised me to tell W that having time with son is important to me, and focus on that in negotiating rather than me rigidly setting down times I expect to have son delivered to me. I was all ready to discuss with W last Friday immediately after my IC appt, but W texted saying she didn't feel comfortable negotiating with me on the phone, and she would send me a proposal in a few days. That was 5 days ago and no mention of it since. We both are typically bad at following through on those kinds of commitments, and I doubt W even saw it as a real commitment to send me anything. So I think it falls upon me to make the next move still. I committed to my men's group to send W an email tonight to get the ball rolling, but now I'm writing this post instead after not knowing what to say in my email to W.
Recommendations welcome. I have an idea of what I think I'd settle for, which is for W to drive son to me one Friday a month, with me taking him to school every Monday and splitting up the other Friday pickups between my mom and myself. I don't want to lead negotiations with that and have to settle for less, which is why I was waiting for W's proposal, but I could be waiting for something that never comes. We haven't talked about this weekend yet, but I made plans to babysit for my sister so I'd likely drive down to get son this week.
Got a call while at work but couldn't answer because I was in a meeting. No voicemail, but I looked up the number and saw it was from an employee assistance program near W. Don't know anything about it or why I would be getting a call from them. W must have given them my number. Lots of stories in my head about why. Last week as I was setting up a payment for my credit card, I noticed W started using our joint card again, for what looks like clothes, jewelry, skincare, hobbies, all typical stuff for her but which she hasn't put on that card for the last few months. I also saw that she made a payment to a collections agency. I think that's for a medical bill, as I had to pay to the same people a month ago for an overdue medical bill of my own (just a couple copays I thought I had paid but apparently not). I don't know if W has a huge bill she's slowly paying off (from the hospitalization) or if that one payment settled it for her. She didn't ask me about it.
I still haven't written to W about scheduling pickup/dropoff. I think I'll just ask her when I can expect a proposal from her, and state that I have plans this weekend that allow me to pick up son near her. I worry that asking when I can expect a proposal will be received by her as me being pushy, judgmental, and angry. I think I am those things, because I am frustrated that I have not yet received what she said she would send me, and I want to plan my weeks ahead.
Haven't read all your sitch, but when I found out about EA/PA I dumped all joint accounts. I said I am not financing any of your new lifestyle. If that is possible get out of all of those arrangements
Yeah our accounts are separate now except for the joint card which W is primary owner of. I asked her to close it or remove me from it, but she wouldn't. I just don't use that card anymore, and told W she was responsible for making payments on it.
Sent an email to W asking what she was thinking about the schedule, and I said I love our son and having him on Friday nights is important to me. She replied a few hours later. She says son seems exhausted by the long trade offs (I guess she means the travel time). An ideal arrangement according to her would be to trade every other week. I don't know what that means exactly, and doesn't answer anything for the present reality. I think she means we would each take care of son for a full week at a time. That's not an option while we're living so far apart and son is enrolled in the school she chose. W wants to keep son over weekend every 4th week. I don't like that idea and don't see any reason to agree to that. Maybe I could agree to every 6th or 8th weekend. W says she's unable to drive as far anymore (but my mom and I have no problem picking up all the driving?). She closed by agreeing with my proposal of me picking up son tomorrow at 6, but didn't say where he would be... ugh.
I guess my response should only be to request clarification first to make sure we understand each other, since it is easy for me to react with judgments at what I see as W's selfish reasoning.
I haven't replied to W yet. I had given myself a deadline of today. I tried writing something back to her yesterday, and some more today, but both times I still just find myself feeling angry about what I see as W's nonchalant matter-of-fact attitude towards the situation and her unwillingness to share the burden of driving and expecting me and my mom to do it all. I am angry that W seems to believe son has a new home and his old one with me is not as important. I'm just angry and I feel powerless. Especially now that we're communicating by email about this, I feel like I have to be even more careful with my choice of words. I'd rather we just scream at each other at this point. Like who gives a [pre-emptively censored] anymore? She can't even talk to me on the phone about OUR SON!? I want to tell her how angry I feel about this. Voicing my anger instead of being passive-aggressive would be a 180, but I think I will be just as hog-tied whether or not I tell her what I'm really thinking.
Maybe I just need to spend more time writing every nasty thing I am thinking and want to say to wife, then burn it or something. Writing just this much here shows me how much anger I'm still holding and I have been noticing it growing about older stuff in our relationship too, stuff that's in the past and should have no bearing on my present and future. Is it possible to just let it go? I have been sad this week thinking again about how none of this had to turn out this way, that there was work we both could have done to grow closer, not further apart. I'm just pissed off today.
Thanks for listening.
Hm. Just received a text from W (a very rare occurrence). She "needs" money for school photos and says we can split them.
Excuse me? When did I agree to split the cost of school photos? I'd be happy with just a 5x7 and a couple wallets. What would I be getting for the money she's asking for?
I think I should reply saying she can send me a copy of the order form and I'll decide what I want to order.
Tell her that you will order photos that you want and she can do the same.
Don't tell her this, but she chose a separate life so now she gets to deal with the consequences of her decision. Buzz off crazy lady!
STH, what is your current arrangement? I read your description but it's a little confusing, does W have your son M-F and you have him weekends?
She replied a few hours later. She says son seems exhausted by the long trade offs (I guess she means the travel time). An ideal arrangement according to her would be to trade every other week. I don't know what that means exactly, and doesn't answer anything for the present reality. I think she means we would each take care of son for a full week at a time.
So if I understood correctly, she has him M-F and you get him Friday and then take him back Sunday? And she's suggesting you switch off weekly instead. Well I don't think her request is unreasonable, it's not really fair to her that she never has him on weekends. Also if she has to shuttle him to school (even if it's close) all the time then that's a burden on her that's not really fair either. A 50-50 split with a weekly handoff would seem much more fair, but it sounds like he's going to school close to your W which would mean you have to drive him over there and pick him up each day which is a burden on you. Is there a compromise where he can be in daycare that is closer to the middle rather than close to her and far from you? Also think about what will happen when he starts school too. Who is going to be primary residence (divorce court will require this)? Where is the school he will be attending? How are things going to work then? It may seem way in the future right now, but it's not!
That's not an option while we're living so far apart and son is enrolled in the school she chose. W wants to keep son over weekend every 4th week. I don't like that idea and don't see any reason to agree to that.
Why don't you like it? It sounds reasonable. Maybe tell her that if she gets him every 4th weekend then you get to optionally come pick him up one evening each week (or every other week or whatever) to take him to the park or dinner or something. My ex and I wrote that into our D decree so that neither of us would have to go a full week without seeing the kids.
We're living 1.5-2 hours apart depending on traffic and 100 miles. So for me to do all the driving is 6 to 8 hours and 400 miles of driving a week so I can spend less than 72 hours with my son (F night thru M morning). I can't just drive down on a weeknight to take son out to dinner in the middle of the week. The school is less than two miles and 4 minutes from W's parents' house. I don't see a comparable burden there.
I would be okay with letting W have a few hours on a weekend to do something with son, but not an entire weekend since that is the only time I can see son in person now. A daycare closer to both of us would have been my preferred choice too, but since son has already started this school I don't want to take him out and put him somewhere else that might be just as short-lived.
Under guidance of my IC, I emailed W last night asking to meet in person to discuss this further, also saying I'm open to having a third party there to help us talk it through. W replied this morning saying she can't do that, as it would be bad for her mental health to negotiate in person. Sigh. Just emails or lawyers at this point I guess. Makes me wonder if she'd even be willing to meet with a divorce mediator anymore.
The way I see it now, W is offering me nothing, but asking me for more time with son for herself. So if I want something from her (for her to drive more), I can agree to let her have a few hours with son occasionally on weekends.
Here's a detachment test: seeing a profile pic of the person you know as your shy introverted anxious depressed wife dressed as sexy catwoman (TBH I only can see her face in the pic and I am imagining the rest). In a facebook memory marking the day we met 14 years ago. Having spent our whole marriage with sexual insecurities, shame, and dissatisfaction on both our sides, it is frustrating that now that I believe we are both working to be more comfortable in our sexuality, that doesn't include each other. Too late I guess.
I'm running a 5K race this weekend with a team of three other people I assembled. Asking others to be on a team with me was a good stretch for me, trying to connect with others and not worrying too much about possible rejection. I'm looking forward to it.
Thatīs good STH. Getting some GAL. Stay away from SM. Moving forward man.
W texted asking me to pick up her antidepressant prescription and bring it to her when I drop off son on Monday. I believe we call that a temp check around here. Or is it just naive entitlement, cake-eating? I replied saying she'd have to make other arrangements.
I have been worried about her more lately though. Maybe starting with her telling me her mental health would suffer if she negotiated with me in person. Then son saying "I just want mom to be happy" before going back with her this week. He was excited to share his Halloween candy with her. W was in IC, but I think she stopped going. Still taking meds for depression. Had an uncle (one of 16 siblings) who killed himself. Divorce makes suicide risk higher. A guy in my running group told me yesterday he had a girlfriend who killed herself two years after they broke up, she had a son (not his, and I didn't inquire anything about the relationship or its ending).
In 2016 W told me she tried to kill herself by banging her head on the couch while home alone with son. I was scared to leave her alone then. That was probably around when I first heard ILYBINILWY, and "I don't think I want to be married anymore." When we went on Retrouvaille March 2017 I shared how scared I felt then, and W's heart softened. We hugged, I cried, she promised I would never have to worry about her like that again. That R only lasted about a month. After W started an affair, she fell into suicidal depression and was hospitalized for it. So I guess she's technically "in treatment" since she's on meds and scheduled for a follow-up for that, but I don't know if she's in counseling anymore.
When I think W's actions are a result of her depression, I feel sad and compassionate. When I think her actions are just done out of her anger and resentment towards me, I feel less worried about her hurting herself. Like the fire of her anger towards me is keeping her alive.
There's my thoughts and swirling fears for the day.
STH, prayers my friend. That is all tough. But you handled the script request perfectly.
It's that time of year again, health insurance renewal! :P I still haven't finished my master's project, and progress on that has slowed since I started working more hours at my regular job back in August. We're on a marketplace plan and I'll have to update the application for that. I'm going to try talking to W about it tonight. It's been a complicated enough process even when we were living together. If W has to pick a different plan now that she's moved to a new state, maybe now I could also shift the payment responsibility to her for that.
I plan to just be honest with W which is that I don't know what the best course of action is here, and since we're still legally married our health insurance and tax options are still tied together too.
This is a mess. W said she applied for medicaid for herself and son in state she's living in now, and that she's been filling out forms saying we're separated. There hasn't been any legal separation though. She's taken my son out of state, enrolled him in school there, I only see him on weekends. She pretends we're legally separated.
There's a family event at son's school next weekend. W is open to us all going together, but she said she might work that weekend. She might have even used the words "family time" when we were talking about it?
I think I'm going to get screwed.
I guess this is what happens when everything is quiet for a long time. Eventually you find out all the stuff you didn't really want to know. I thought I was being patient. I don't think there's anything worth waiting for anymore. 2019 is the year I get divorced, finish my master's degree, get a new job, new house, and start dating.
I'm sad, scared, and angry.
Hi STH17,
I am almost in the same sitch you are, my W moved out of state across the country, I am not sure there is OP but feeling sad, scared and angry is the worst, I am feeling all of this as I speak.
Hang in there, we will make it!!!
Hi STH, it's good to see your update despite it not being better news. My separation isn't formal either. Has your wife asked for a legal separation or divorce? I bet your son would love having you attend his school function. That's so sad you can only see him on weekends. Everything else about your 2019 sounds great but getting divorced is just such a sad outcome after your patience and willingness to compromise. You never know for sure what'll happen though. Your wife could always realize what she's about to lose, but it sounds like divorce would at least help to clarify some of these legal, financial, and custody issues that have been lingering.
I will be going to the school event with son this Saturday. It means an absurd amount of driving for me, but should be good for son. Tomorrow I will try to contact a CPA to see if I can get some better and reliable info about my options for health insurance subsidies and tax filing status. I don't even know if a CPA is what I need.
Thanks krull and Nicole for checking in. krull, your sitch sounds like it was a very abrupt departure of your wife, and I'm sorry you've been left in the dark. You hang in there too!
My W asked me to work on filing for divorce with her back in the spring of this year, but I told her then I didn't want a divorce and she would have to prepare and file it herself. She hasn't done that yet to my knowledge and hasn't spoken to me about it since. Hardly spoken to me about anything since, really.
Every day I can't see my son in person, I've been texting W to ask to talk to my son. To me it is a way to try to maintain connection with my son while we are separated. Son is not always interested in talking. Sometimes it is a 30 second conversation. That was hard for me earlier in the separation, but I have gotten more used to it now and just let it go and continue on with my day when I don't get to speak with him.
A few months ago W told me she was upset that I just started asking to talk to him every day. I was asking to talk every day at 7pm. I thought consistency would be good and better than randomly interrupting at a different time every day. I think she asked me then to set up a time with son so that he would be more willing to talk to me. So that's what I did, even though I knew that to make plans with a 4yo for the next three days of phone contact was not really practical. He doesn't understand time that well. Yes I can make a plan and fulfill a commitment to contact him at an agreed upon time, but I don't know that he understands what we are agreeing to. Now W says I'm being disrespectful making plans with son when it is her phone he is talking to me on.
I felt angry when she told me this (by text). I have not responded but plan to during my lunch break. I will text since W has anxiety talking to me on the phone.
Am I really being disrespectful? Does that matter? Am I just supposed to validate her feeling disrespected regardless?
I could respond "I hear you are feeling disrespected. Can we talk about this to reach a better arrangement? I am not asking you to force son to talk to me. I am asking you to facilitate a relationship between our son and his father."
She may also be feeling disrespected by a couple days ago when I did not make plans with her for dropping off son with her until the day of (she texted me twice an hour apart because I didn't see the first one, away from my phone). But that's speculation on my part.
My basic want is to have daily contact with my son. I understand son may turn down that contact some days, but I do not believe that should stop me from reaching out to him every day.
A FB FRIEND REQUEST!!?? I received one from W tonight. Maybe just because I sent her an email tonight asking to be added as a parent to son's FB kids' messenger account. Is it a requirement of the kids account that any parents on it are also FB friends? Can't imagine W wanting a genuine friendship, and if so this isn't the way I'd want to start one. I don't want to be her FB friend anymore.
More details if interested:
I've been slow to respond to W about this conflict around talking to my son on days I don't have him with me, but the night of my last post I did ask her if she was open to talking about it. No response from her that night. Met with my IC the next day who advised me to email a proposed schedule and have a shared calendar for when I plan to talk to son during the week. I dropped the ball on that but did make a calendar before next dropping off son with W. At Monday morning dropoff, W looked to have just woken up. I asked her to talk about scheduling times to talk with son, and she asked to talk about it later. I said ok, and that in case we didn't talk about it, I had planned with son already to call him the next day after I got off work. No initiation of contact from her until then, so I texted the next day asking to talk to son as usual. She replied after 10 minutes that he didn't want to talk to me. Later that night she sent me a FB message which was a request to add me as a contact to son's kids messenger account. We had never mentioned the option of a messenger account for him to each other, though it was something I was considering myself. I thought it would be a less reliable means of contacting him, and I had other concerns about it too, age appropriateness, privacy (my own from W). Tonight I emailed her saying I'm open to trying it out, but that I want to talk to son about it first in person, and be added as a parent to his account. I wish W would actually use words to communicate with me about this. She's just dropping things in my lap with no explanation or discussion.
I just accepted W's FB friend request. She said I needed to do that so she could add me as a parent to son's messenger account. I took the opportunity to browse her posts and see if anything had changed. NOPE. Everything I see there still shows me an angry woman who believes she is a victim of abuse, made a mistake marrying me, and can't handle being a parent. Funny that lately I'd been feeling more warmly about the memories FB shows me. Hard to see those and remember our relationship wasn't all bad, then see the past year of garbage W has posted.
I don't think I can stay married to a person like that. I have a feeling at this moment like I need to start running for the exit door myself. What I see on her FB is not a person I would want to reconnect with anymore. I don't understand her, and I think I'd be lost in a dark place if I did.
Anyway, I unfollowed her, put her on my restricted list, and I don't plan on checking her page anymore. Maybe after filing for D, which I think I should target for May, same as graduating and getting a job and finding a school for son for next year. All things I'm still afraid of doing, but not afraid of happening. And that's why I'm still in counseling!
I know I shouldn't delay action any more on the chance or hope that she'll snap out of it. Wish I could see some kind of accountability from her though.
Did I mention she's started using our joint credit card quite a bit more again? And carrying a balance with it. I didn't want to divorce just because of financial reasons, but I am looking forward to not being liable for her financial choices anymore. Hoping that selling our house will settle all debts and we can just move on separately. Oh wait we have a kid together... Sorry son.
Hi STH, I'm sorry to read that your wife hasn't improved or realized the mistake she's making. It's good that you're able to conclude that you can't stay married to her. It will help you to stay more rational during the divorce process. It sounds like in your case the divorce needs to be filed sooner than later. It is still sad for you son though. I hope you're able to find a favorable custody arrangement that will help ease this transition for him.
W has appointment near our house today and just texted me she wants to pick up some of her things from the house. NGS would say "sure, help yourself". But I don't want her going into my (legally our) house unsupervised. Tuesdays are busy for me, and I wasn't planning on being home today until late in the evening. I shouldn't have to change my plans for her convenience to pick up a few movies and other things she left behind. We don't have that relationship anymore. I think I will tell her I am busy and won't be home to let her in today. She has a key but the front door has a latch that can only be undone from the inside.
Sigh.. I do want her to get her stuff out of the house though. I also fear consequences for locking her out of the house which she is legally allowed to enter. I read her full message and she did at least ask me if I wanted to be there while she was, so she is somewhat trying to respect that boundary. I just still wrinkle at her choosing the time that is convenient for her then asking me at the last minute. Maybe I'll ask her to schedule a pickup and give me more advance notice.
Do what works for you. If it doesn't inconvenience you to let her come by today then let her. But if she can't get in because the door is latched from the inside then just explain that to her and ask her to give you some more advanced notice so you can leave it unlatched.
Or just don't respond, then tonight respond that you just got her message and she is welcome to come by.
Steve, I don't feel like playing games like that anymore. I think she could tell if I'd read the message anyway. I just gave her a short response and a 30 minute window for her to get her stuff while I'm there.
AS, your option sounds good. I thought briefly of that and thought I would have ended up being too wordy. I was afraid I would get the wording wrong or just cause more problems. Soooo NGS anyway I guess. I also reset the garage door opener codes a while ago so hers doesn't work anymore. It really is inconvenient for me today. So I'm just going to focus on the positive of having more of her stuff gone. She'll have her dad's pickup so hopefully she gets a significant amount out. Whatever remains I hope I can stuff in a closet or two then finally start using that room for myself.
And I can talk to IC about this on Friday for a debriefing.
STH, I don't see it as a game as much as it is a LBS not being at the WAS' beckon call.
W emailed me tonight telling me she is flying out of state in a couple weeks and won't be back to take son to school on Tuesday. I normally drop him off with W before school on Mondays. W asked if my mom could do the Tuesday school drop-off son since hers couldn't, saying scheduling was hard for her on Tuesdays.
I'm thinking NOT MY PROBLEM but also think I should wait to respond so I don't sound like an a-hole. Or maybe I need to stop caring about sounding like an a-hole. Sigh. It's hard not to just be angry about this. I have a lot of judgments about this trip of W's as well as assumptions that may be incorrect. I think I am in the habit of expecting the worst from her now.
I knew W had bought some plane tickets because she used our joint card. I need to talk to W about closing that card again because I don't want my name on it anymore, and she has started using it more often and is only making minimum payments on it now.
I am angry that W can throw wrenches in my life like this and they affect me so much. For now I am writing this post and will not think about it more until tomorrow. Truth is I need to think about it, but I hate my anxious obsessing over things like this and I hate how worried I am about how to respond. Sorry W, now's not a good time.
Btw, it's nice having W's stuff out of that room. I used the space in there today to reglaze a window pane in my front storm door. Son even came in to ask if I needed his help, which was heartwarming. I showed him what I was doing with the glazing putty and I had him hold the putty in place while I pressed it in with the putty knife. He did that for about 30 seconds then he had enough. Was nice to have him there though
If it's a one time thing (or infrequent), I'd do it. It's nice to give each other a little flexibility. There may come a time when you'll need her to return the favor.
W emailed me tonight telling me she is flying out of state in a couple weeks and won't be back to take son to school on Tuesday. I normally drop him off with W before school on Mondays. W asked if my mom could do the Tuesday school drop-off son since hers couldn't, saying scheduling was hard for her on Tuesdays.
I'm thinking NOT MY PROBLEM but also think I should wait to respond so I don't sound like an a-hole. Or maybe I need to stop caring about sounding like an a-hole. Sigh. It's hard not to just be angry about this. I have a lot of judgments about this trip of W's as well as assumptions that may be incorrect. I think I am in the habit of expecting the worst from her now.
Well on the one hand you don't want her just taking advantage of you, but on the other hand as Harvey said you never know when you might need the favor returned. My ex did the same thing early on asking me to drop off or pick up the kids and as long as it wasn't a big inconvenience for me I did it. As it turns out I was the one that ended up having a lot of last minute work trips and had to ask HER to help out, and she always did and still does. All these years later we're still asking each other for help with S16 now and then.
I knew W had bought some plane tickets because she used our joint card. I need to talk to W about closing that card again because I don't want my name on it anymore, and she has started using it more often and is only making minimum payments on it now.
If you're carrying a balance on the card then you can't close it out until it's paid down to zero because the bank wants the option to go after either of you if needed. You also do not have the option of removing just one party, you have to close the account and open new ones. Credit cards are always messy business in S and D.
I am angry that W can throw wrenches in my life like this and they affect me so much.
Yeah, no one gets married thinking they need to protect themselves from stuff like this! It's unfortunate that we have to go through the financial headaches on top of the emotional ones, I think that's part of what makes it so gut-wrenching. It's like we're getting slammed from every angle. It gets better so hang in there! Sorry you're going through this!
When I dropped off son with W this morning she asked me if I got her email. I just said I did and that she'll have to ask my mom about it. W then started telling me about the logistical difficulties for that day, then kinda trailed off with "I guess we'll have to figure that out ourselves though.." (we meaning her and her parents I think). So I think she understands that I'm not her fixer for these kinds of problems. I'm not interested in exchanging favors with her right now. All that matters is that my son is taken care of. I'll do whatever I have to do for son if W fails to make arrangements for his care. I'll just leave it alone for a few days and then ask if she's got son's care figured out.
I was locked out of my house a couple weeks ago and I asked W to give my mom a key (after trying everything I could think of short of breaking a window). W gave my mom a key, I didn't give it back, and W didn't ask for it back. If she hadn't agreed to give me a key, I would have figured something else out, like calling a locksmith. I am not obligated to help her with her vacation planning oopsie.
If you're carrying a balance on the card then you can't close it out until it's paid down to zero because the bank wants the option to go after either of you if needed. You also do not have the option of removing just one party, you have to close the account and open new ones. Credit cards are always messy business in S and D.
I am painfully aware of these obstacles, found them out last summer when I called the bank to ask to be removed from the account. What
I would like is for W to transfer the balance to a card of her own and close the joint card. All I can do is ask though, or maybe negotiate with something in return.
I took W off car insurance a couple weeks ago hoping to save some money, but because of the increased mileage I reported from all the interstate travel for son and the marital status change to separated, I owe $20 more instead of $100 less like I thought I would. That was a rude awakening.
Time for some updates. Turned out W did think I was going to talk to my mom to ask if she could take son to school on a Tuesday. She was angry, saying it was a request for our son, and it's my mom so I should talk to her. The bridge was burned between W and my mom for a year now. I think the request was for herself, and should have taken responsibility. In the end I did end up making the arrangements because W didn't. It was stressful for me being the middleman coordinating care for my son between my mom and W's mom. In the end yes I did it for my son, but the reason I had to do that for my son was because his mother neglected to take responsibility herself.
Another thing that I have been sitting on: The trip was to CO and when she returned home she bought something from a smoke shop, I know because she paid with the joint credit card. I haven't confronted her about the purchase or her use of the card, though I've talked to a few people about it and decided to tell her I don't want any drug paraphernalia around my son, acknowledging that I have no real evidence that she is exposing son to that, but have seen enough to be concerning and warrant me speaking up about it. In typical fashion I have "made a decision" yet taken no action.
We are going to a school open house this Friday. Last week we had a respectful phone conversation about school plans for son. I felt very deflated and sad after having such a respectful conversation in which we both expressed our concerns and desires for son's wellbeing. I was thinking "why can't our relationship be like this all the time?"
Conflict continues around me wanting to communicate daily with my son, and W saying son doesn't want to talk to me and is annoyed by me calling. W says I am disrespecting her by making plans with son and not her, that I am not respecting W's wish that I call only once per week. I think she is alienating me from my son and I don't think she should be controlling how I communicate with my son.
My bday is this thursday. Since I am driving down for the open house friday morning, I wanted to come Thursday night and have dinner with son. I asked W to bring son halfway, and I offered to keep son overnight. She initially agreed last night, then sent me a long text this morning changing her mind, talking about how disrespectful I am, my family treats her like trash while hers respects me, she's helped me in the past (she brought up the lockout), I haven't helped her (the meds, the vacation). She says she changed her mind because I talked to son about it before her. I had told him it was my birthday this week and I was excited, and I'd like to have dinner with him on my birthday.
W also emphatically stated that I abused her to the point of her wanting to die.
So W feels disrespected. I think I should validate that (help with wording would be appreciated). I don't want to be alienated from my son, and I don't want W holding the keys to my relationship with him.
You can't buy MJ with a credit/debit card in CO. Cash only business at dispensaries. Just an FYI. I frequent CO often.
The trip was to CO and when she returned home she bought something from a smoke shop, I know because she paid with the joint credit card.
How do you know she brought "it" back, or that it was paraphernalia? I mean it could have been a t-shirt or something, who knows. Or even if it was paraphernalia it may have been a gift for someone else.
I haven't confronted her about the purchase or her use of the card, though I've talked to a few people about it and decided to tell her I don't want any drug paraphernalia around my son, acknowledging that I have no real evidence that she is exposing son to that, but have seen enough to be concerning and warrant me speaking up about it. In typical fashion I have "made a decision" yet taken no action.
I wouldn't take action until you know for sure there's something actionable. I mean if you know she's doing illegal drugs around S then by all means do something about it, but if you're just guessing then I would take a wait-and-see approach.
We are going to a school open house this Friday. Last week we had a respectful phone conversation about school plans for son. I felt very deflated and sad after having such a respectful conversation in which we both expressed our concerns and desires for son's wellbeing. I was thinking "why can't our relationship be like this all the time?"
Don't be sad when things go well. Michele says to celebrate the 1%. If your WAS is mean and nasty 99% of the time and wonderful 1%, then celebrate the 1% and it will encourage them to make it 2%, then 4% etc.
She initially agreed last night, then sent me a long text this morning changing her mind, talking about how disrespectful I am, my family treats her like trash while hers respects me, she's helped me in the past (she brought up the lockout), I haven't helped her (the meds, the vacation). She says she changed her mind because I talked to son about it before her. I had told him it was my birthday this week and I was excited, and I'd like to have dinner with him on my birthday.
W also emphatically stated that I abused her to the point of her wanting to die.
So W feels disrespected. I think I should validate that (help with wording would be appreciated). I don't want to be alienated from my son, and I don't want W holding the keys to my relationship with him.
Well if you're looking for advice on validating, then say something like "It sounds like you felt disrepected and abused, I am sorry you have felt that way in the past. I would appreciate it if you allowed me to see S since it is my birthday, and I would be happy to allow you the same on your birthday. I will be disappointed if you don't allow this but it is your decision since it's your time to have him and I will respect your wishes."