Havn't been here for awhile, update.

Hi everyone;
I have not posted in months, I have been reluctent to post for fear of "jinxing" it, or not wanting to get my hopes up, or just not wanting to be too comfortable with my new situation.

For those who don't know me, I got the bomb in Nov. '06 when W told me about OM. W moved out March '07 and we have been separated since that time. She has filed and we have had one court date to set spousal support. In the time since my last post, W has romanced OM with long visits including trip to Europe and several 2 week visits from him here where we live. As of July, my W informed me that her relationship w/ OM was over, and that she would like to see what it would be like to move forward together. Tonight she told me for the first time without being solicited that she loved me. At first she said I must not of heard her because I didn't say anything, I heard her just couldn't believe what I had heard, so I said "say it again" and she did.

We are a long way from healed, but at least we are both pulling in the same direction, and that is all I have ever asked for. I am not afraid of the hard work that lays ahead, I actually look forward to it. That said, the OM issue is still a huge stumbling block for me. Resentment, and lack of trust abound, but I continue to want to be happy, not right.

After we started to reconnect, I took all her pictures back out and put them back up in my bedroom. I have since took all the wedding pictures back down. I have come to the conclusion that I am not married to her, but I am dating her and I need to remember that.

We both agree that we need help learning how to communicate, and at her request, we have made an appointment with a marriage councilor for next week.

Last week we celebrated our 19th anniversary. It was not all I had hoped it would be, but we celebrated it together and were able to talk about what disappointed us about it. She continues to keep her distance and states that she is not sure it will work, I continue to "smile and wave." At our anniversary dinner, she said she still wasn't sure there was any passion for me, I simply said that "that may just be how it is, and that if she had no passion, it ultimately would not work and that was OK, I was just glad to be working together." The DBing continues. It is difficult because every fiber in my body wants to grab ahold of her and never let her go, but at the same time I know she needs to want it to work, and she needs to have time and space to find that on her own.

What I have learned through all of this is that I matter, I deserve to be happy and I want to share that with my wife. I have also learned that even though we have been together for 27 years, I don't know jack sh!t about what my wife is thinking or experiencing. I was soo cocky, so complacent about our relationship. I was such a good husband, yet I never bothered to ask her if she was happy, obviously she was not.

I think we both realize that our old marriage is dead, we have both said that we "don't want it back, as it didn't work", so it is onward. It is frightening and ulcer inducing stuff, but I wouldn't trade it for the world.

A big thank you to all of you who kept me focused on what it was I really wanted, I think my wife thanks you as well.

So, Ben, Whatis, Theo, Ford, Amy, Hey, and everyone else, THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm glad to hear you are at this turning point. Just remember to be patient and loving with her. The trust and feelings about the A will take time to subside, but they will diminish as time passes and she proves worthy of your trust again.

You need to allow yourself time to grieve the "Old M" though, even though you say you don't want it back. Also, you will grieve the fact that your W is now seemingly a different person in your eyes after what she has put your family through in the whole sitch.

With all of that being said though, it is all doable. The resentment and all of the negativity will fade in time -- it is something you need to work on daily. Just go w/ the flow, go w/ the positives and just be patient.

I have to say one more thing:

REJOICE in your second chance w/ your W and your family. NEVER FORGET the lessons you've learned during this period of time in your life.

I am still learning and reminding myself to NEVER TAKE ANYTHING FOR GRANTED. Remind yourself every day that we are so very blessed w/ our children and our spouse and our life and that's not to be taken lightly. $\:\)$

Wow!!! What wonderful news to see on here. I know it'll take some time, and won't be all fun and games, but like cadesmom said this is a time to rejoice and use patience to get through the hard times!!

Hi Cadesmom and LWB;

Thank you for your words of encouragement. I feel very strongly that I will never go back to taking it for granted. Yes, I miss my old wife, yes I continue to be angry about what she has put us all through, but at the same time I am excited about what can be in the future. We have talked at length about what we have been through and I think we both see it as what "needed" to happen for both of us to get to a place where we really wanted to find a different relationship together.

Patience; I struggle with it every day, and yet as I reflect on the last 8 months, just about every time I was convinced of something, I found out I was wrong. When all of this began, I thought all this "do it for yourself" stuff was BS, I wanted a system, a plan. The reality is that we simply can't know what another is thinking and feeling unless they decide to share it with us. Everything else is at best a guess. The card my wife gave me for our anniversary talked about where we came from and where we are going. She wrote that "if you had asked me 2,3,4,5,or 6 months ago if we would be here together tonight, I would have said no way, and yet here we are."

We have a tradition of putting one of those glow in the dark stars on our bedroom ceiling every year on our anniversary, I put the 19th one up months ago, at the same time my wife would have told anyone that we were done, over, through, and yet we found our way to the same place at the same time.

It is a great place to be!

Mazel Tov!! Your star tradition is beautiful! I would steal it but I would have to do it for goals or something else! It is an awesome idea! SHE is the lucky one.

81388,

Congratualtions! You have been rewarded for your patience and generosity of spirit. I too am in a resurrected marriage (for want of a better word). The path back to togetherness is rocky in its own right.

My husband and I found our way after going to a Retrouvaille weekend. I recommend it to you as a way to learn constructive communication with your wife, and to heal the marriage. For us it was truly a lifeline. They have a website http://www.retrouvaille.org. The weekend was the place where my Husband and I found our passion for each other again. (And we were not the only ones.) We will be celebrating our 28th anniversary in October.

Best of luck.

I agree with your words, and it's exactly how I feel in my sitch, that if the whole sitch had NOT happened, we would not be where we are today which is a much better place. Just go w/ the flow, enjoy each day and just love your W and everything will fall into place. I truly didn't know what I was missing until I was "forced" to see what had gone wrong in my M.

Heyya 81

I'm very happy for you.

take care

Hey Ford, long time;

Not sure I would be here w/out you. I seriously think part of what started to turn the tide was some attitude. She was free to choose her own course, but I was free to ignore her BS and call it what it was.

Right before she changed direction, I had written her a letter stating that I had tried everything I could think of to let her know that I still cared and wanted to work on a relationship together, but that at every step along the way she refused to work at it. I told her that I would not continue to hand her my heart only to have her break it. I said that after getting hit in the face so many times I was learning how to duck, and that I would miss her and her friendship, but that I could no longer pay the emotional price of in any way supporting what it was she was doing. I made it clear that I still didn't agree with divorce as the only solution, but that I was done.

I really think her change of heart had less to do with the letter, and more to do with the natural progression of the relationship with OM. Hate to support timetables, but 8-9 months, and it ran out of gas.

Thanks again man, I hope all is well with you and your's.

8,

OMG...it's great to see your posts again.

I really missed you.

I'm glad things seem to moving along in a hopeful direction.

May God bless you.

Email me if you want. Maybe we can chat on the phone. I'm in need of strong men right now to stand with me. It's gotten very dark in my side of the forest.

theoden.king@hotmail.com

--Theoden

Theo;
Thanks, as I told ford, I really don't think I would be here if not for your help.

Where is here? Joint counciling session today, yet still separated, divorce proceeding postponed until oct., wife very nervous about session today. We were able to visit some this morning and she seemed upset so I just asked. She had a laundry list of things that she needed to get done, AND then there is this session today. I told her that I thought that was a positive thing. She said she never said it wasn't positive and wasn't I nervous about it? I told her that we didn't have anything to loose, and I was ready to talk about everything and anything. I told her that I didn't mean it in an uncaring way, because I know she never did anything to intentionally cause me pain, but that I could not be hurt anymore. Nothing that either one of us had to say could be any worse then what we have already been through.

Carpe Diem, we have nothing left to loose, only to gain!

Thank you my friend for getting that through to me.

Now you, what has been going on. I will check email if you don't respond here. Stay strong man, God has and will continue to bless you.

8,

Do email me. And honestly I need to talk to people.

I think I'm almost beyond DB. I'm almost ready to blow everything up.

My wife's affair ended in March, then I think re-started recently.

I'm exhausted.

I'm contemplating telling OM's wife and several other people in his life.

--Theoden

--Theoden

Theo,

I am certainly no expert here,but I remember reading another website how bringing it out in the open to everyone sometimes helps the reality settle in faster. I am sure at first she will be furious at you and you might feel like you are moving backward,but dont let that stop you. Let her get mad and tehn she will have to get over it.

IMO the OM's wife needs to know. Then and only then will the REAL pressure start.

theo,

I have just emailed you.

Saffie

Saffie,

I'll check it tonight. Thanks.

Theo,

Ok - I am praying for you.

Don't do anything too rash. Read my email. You sound fit to bust. Just hang in there.

Saffie

Theo

I have never written to you before, but would like to caution you to make sure that the A has started again before you say anything to the OM's W.

Just my opinion.

Faith

Yeah I would need to confirm it.

She doesn't know anything has happened.

Glad to hear it.

Faith

Theo;
Check your Email.

Let me know what you think!

Peace brother,

8

Update;

JC session went reasonably well. Had a funny moment when C was asking about our early relationship, and W and I just looked at each other a said "I don't remember, it was so long ago." C seems good, very focused on communication and behaviors and where they come from and how they are recieved. Perhaps a little too much "what happened in the past" for me, but I am sure that is part of the problem as well.

My wife had a chance to vent about a lot of things, and for the most part that was good, I continued to validate and be supportive, but at the same time was unsettled that she was still so focused on things that happened more then 20 years ago. At times is felt like she was still saying that she has known all along that it would never work. The other problem was that when the C asked what it was we were looking to accomplish, she sounded as though she was looking for someone else to tell her wether or not we had a chance. She did back track and say she was also hopeful that we could find a way forward together.

It seems like it is so fragile, and I have to continue to work at not walking on eggshells. I only called her on a few statements, along the lines of "I wouldn't agree with that, or I don't think I never,or always etc." For the most part I continued to smile and wave.

I am having trouble with OM issues, and don't lnow how hard to push. She has no contact other than work, had said she would discontinue that part of her job that brings her in contact with him, but has reversed course and decided she doesn't want to give up that part of what she does. There is still stuff at her place from him, and although it is boxed and out of the way it is still obvious and it is really hard to be there and not think about it. I would really love to just say get it out of here, but I am not sure that is the right move at this point. As for work, she has worked really hard to get where she is and I don't want to be the reason she can't do that, but at the same time it brings her in contact with OM and that just drives me crazy. Guess I sit on it awhile longer and see what develops.

Let me all know what you think.

Update cont.
After JC session wife pretty much distanced self, I just kept quiet and dark, tonight girls went to wife's house after cheerleading and I picked them up there. Kept it light and fun and wife asked me out on a date tommorrow night. She wanted to know if I would like to meet her in town to see a band. I told her it sounded like fun and was planning on going anyway, so give me a shout when you get done with work and I will meet you there.

The baby steps continue.

81388

It appears that things are least going in the right direction. As for the OP, until they are completely out of your S's lives, you can not trust that something will not happen.

My H and I were back together working on things, having a good time, enjoying each others company, but he had not given up the OW completely. He still went to the same gym that she goes to and was not in a place yet to share his e-mail account with me, but he was home and with me almost all of the time so I thought we were doing ok. Well, he was doing ok because he had me and her. He has since moved out (at my request) and I have begun detaching. He now seems more interested in me then ever. We still do things together and I make sure we have a good time, but I don't do them as much as I use to. My DB coach told me that I was too available and that I needed to have more quality time and less quantity time. It seems to be working. Don't know if this helps you or not. Just seems like the 180 really gets their attention.

Take care and hang in there.

Faith

Faith;
Thanks, it does help. The OM is way out of town, so no direct contact, phone possibly, but I doubt it. The job thing would be direct contact over several days at least twice a year.

We are still separated and she has not made any move towards coming home.

I think the thing that upsets me the most is that there is no consideration for me and how much she knows it hurts to have to think about her spending anytime at all around OM. Even a discussion about how she knows it is going to be hard, but it is important to her and what do I think? But she just went and did it then told me about it. Same thing with OM stuff around her house. I have made it clear that it makes me uncomfortable, but I guess maybe I am too available, maybe I need to just say I can't spend time there if she won't get rid of the stuff.

81388

I think not spending time there is good. I assume that you have the kids and so you don't need to go there for them. If you do need to go there for them, then just pick them up quickly and take them home with you or where ever you are going.

Do the unexpected. Throw her off. Don't be so predictable. It seems to be working for me. At least for now.

Faith

Faith;
Thanks for the imput. I am not sure what the unexpected is right now, but I get the idea. Of course me being upset by OM issues is totally predictable.

She is trying, I just don't know how hard to push, if at all.

Let me know what you think.

8

81388

I haven't found pushing to work. You just have to back off and give her space.

So far the only thing that has had the reation that I have wanted from my H is that he thinks another man is interested in me. I make sure to be busy. I don't accept all of his invitations to do things. When he asks me questions about some event, I just say it was nice.

I do not have another man and have only mentioned golfing with one once. All the other times I have been out or not accepted his invitations, he assumes I'm with someone else. I do not correct him, but I don't lie either. But since your W's OM appears to be out of the picture (unlike my sit) and she appears to want to work on the R, then you probably just need to give her space and try not to be so predictable.

Have you asked her what she wants from you?

Faith

Hi Faith;
Yes, I have asked her.

A couple of nights ago, I had taken the bus to the airport to meet her plane (she had driven herself when she left).we had a really good time on the way home, although she was really tired. The kids were all at "my" house. When I got her home we were very close, just hugging and holding each other. She said it was too bad that the kids were not here, then I would be able to stay.

Last night, we had a date. We went into town and listened to a band. No dancing $\:\($ but had a good time, talked a lot. She had worked late, so we met there. I had run around like a crazy person getting the kids together, books, homework, pizza, had them all at "her" house before I left. When we got home, she was pissed off because all the kids were there and I hadn't told her anything about it. She said she would want them anytime, but would like to be told in advance.

I just told her that I had hoped that like the other night, having them here would alow us to spend more time together. I apologized for not understanding what she meant the other night (I still don't). I was not trying to do anything other than afford us an opportunity to be close.

It was unexpected and not something I would have done 8 months ago, and was obviously not the right thing, right now. At the end of the conversation, I just asked her what it was that she wanted? I told her that I really needed her to tell me because I was having a hard time figuring out what it was that she needed to feel loved.

No response other then "it is just a bad night." I think she had had a bad day at work, was late getting out, and generally stressed. That said, it still goes back to the general lack of any concern for me. I had obviously tried really hard to do something for us and she couldn't even muster a "that was really sweet, but tonight is not a good night for me."

I get the giving them space, but if the underlying problem is a lack of communication, how much do you try to spur discussion?

8

Just a thought.

I have said earlier that when I am convinced of something to do with my wife and OM, I am more often then not wrong.

W's job, and contact with OM has been really bothering me. Focusing on it, loss of detachment, etc. So the other night I just said I really wanted to be able to talk to her about everything, incl. OM. I told her that her choice to reapply for work that would keep her in contact with OM was difficult for me to understand, but that I would like to try.

The response was that because of a change in employment, the OM would not be involved in that aspect of the job.

I want so badly to be able to trust her again, and everytime I don't, it turns out I should have. I wish there was a way to rebuild the trust that didn't involve being proven wrong. I made a point to say that I was glad to know that OM would not be involved, and to tell her that without her telling me, there was no way for me to have known that.

Heyya 81

rebuilding trust is probably harder than separating two coats of paint.

but if you choose to continue seeing her, you have to wipe the slate clean, easier said than done, but you have to.

it really doesn't matter if she works with the OM, if she is worthy of being your wife, she'll have the resolve to conduct herself in a professional manner and keep temptaion at bay. if she can't, well then, match.com here we come!.

bottom line is, you can't control her, if she is going to slip up, she will and you'll find out. just trust her, wipe the slate clean and when you get that funny feeling, talk yourself out of it, don't spend energy on it.

take care

Hey Ford;
Thanks, it's really good to hear from you. Two coats of paint is about right. $\:\)$ We had D15 MIA for awhile tonight and she was checking her phone, I was sitting right next to her, I saw recent call to/from OM. Thankfully, before I said anything, I thought about my previous post and realized it was just as possible that she had called OM to tell him to come get his sh!t out of her place as anything else.

The problem is that I did not feel like I should comment on it. Maybe that is a good thing though, in keeping with what you wrote, that is her problem. If she wants to move forward with me, then she will choose to do so, if she does not then so be it.

I don't know about match.com, but I do know that when I look at what she is doing, I am strengthened. Lots of contact, willing to go to MC, limited (if any) contact with OM, positive responses to offers of time together, etc. In other words, she is willing to date me and that is a good start.

Just dropping by to say I hope everyone had a restful long weekend. I am glad the kids are back to school. $\:\)$

8, it all sounds great (especially the kids going back to school!) but, a word of caution, don't be too eager here. Let her earn you back too. Don't always be available when she wants time, show her that you have a life and she isn't the only thing in it! Play a little hard to get, don't be rejecting but let her know that you'll be OK with her or without her.
I'm so happy things seem a bit more positive for you!
BTW didn't the Browns kick the crap out of the Bears the other night? OK, so maybe your world isn't that great right now!

Whatis;
Greatt to hear from you. You are right, I am way too available. I have not figured out how to strike that balance yet, but I better pretty soon because I am starting to get resentful, yes I know, normal at this stage, but it seems like I am doing all the work.

As I write that, I realize that she is working at it as well, only she has farther to come, as in coming back to me. I never really left. I was and continue to be a detachment failure

and that makes this even more difficult then it needs to be. I continue to do things for me, but find myself slipping back into those old patterns of me doing everything for her, of looking for ways to show her that I am still in love with her. I need to let her show me.

Positives:
1)W has agreed to, and gone to MC.
2)W has said she loves me $\:D$ but only one time

(I have by the way reverted to the no ILY rule until we are further along)
3)W looks for things for us to do together, both as a couple, and as a family.
4)W is spending a lot of time with the kids.
5)W introduces me as her H.
When we first started to reconnect, she would say things like "Oh hi, and this is 8....." then it became "this is 8,.....my husband", now it is "this is my husband,8"
6)W will pull me to her and kiss me.

I need to stay focused on the positives without losing track of what brought us here.

Oh yeah;
About dem Browns

Bear down, Chicago Bears....