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Hey Tad!!!!! smile smile smile
So nice to have you here! smile
I agree! They should not have to stress over this. It is only a couple of years away and is definitely the best way to go.
I' ll stay put a bit longer!
Thank you!!! smile

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Why can' t i get raid of this anger??

Ex-h has been making D16 feel bad everyday for a week now.
For her birthday ( which he missed by 3 days ), he got her a winter jacket on-line.
He took her out for supper and gave it to her. It was too small.
All week, he wanted to bring her the exchanged jacket but D16 was working 3 evening shift and the 2 evening she was off were not good for him. Frustrated from this, he started telling her he should not keep her phone going since she never text him. An hour ago, he shows up with OW to pick up D16 for the evening and D16 did not want to go. She made him wait outside for 10 min. She told me at least 3 times: " i don' t even want to go! And his jacket? Winter is over!! ".

I could feel my anger raging inside. Why do they put up with this?
Why don' t they tell him? Are they still unable to say no to him? Why are they the one feeling like crap because of his narcissism and hurtful comments?

Will the day ever comes when they will say ENOUGH!!
My day came! I did it! They saw me do it! They did not want him to come back and live with us but they accept this treatment?

I get soooooooo angry! The wheel: D16 felt bad. She felt like she should go with him eventho she did not want to. He will spend heavy cash on her. She will feel like she must be good and text him more often until he starts ignoring her texts. She will pull away and he will make her feel bad all over. If he feels she is angry, he will use emotional blackmail to get her sympathie. I can not see how healthy having a relationship with their father is.

Not in a million year would i have thought this would be my life.
No matter how hard i try to cut myself from him, he is contantly thrown in my face

Ex-h calls this love. I call it obsession/ addiction. Love is time, love his kind, love is respect, love is devotion, love is bringing the best out of others, love his emotional support, love is honesty, love his priority.

Ex-h' s relationship with us reminds me of an addict parent who will claim loving their child but won' t get the help they need to be a parent and will often use their children as the reason they are the way they are.. just like I AM THE REASON EX-H IS WHO HE IS!! Powerful me!! Arrrgggg...

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Exquisitetobe - I wish that I had a "make it all better wand" to loan you.

Your anger is honest, legitimate and justified.

I think that in some ways as a former spouse that it is easier for us to cast them loose than it is for our children. Dad (Or Mom in my case) is a selfish entitled jerk. But we also taught them that Family is important.

I have no specific advice. Just a big hug. ((((Exquisitetobe))))


On BD
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T27, M26
S21, D23
BD-9-Mar-16
D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18
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I understand your anger. It's not easy to sit back and watch your children being hurt over and over again by a spouse/former spouse. Your h is a very selfish man who wants the world to think he's the greatest thing since swiss cheese, but the bottom line is that he doesn't care about anyone but himself and his image.

He used the jacket as an excuse to get his daughter to go out w/him and the ow. Shame on him. If he truly cared about her, he would have made every effort to get her a gift and delivered it to her on her birthday, not several days late and then it was too small. Since he really didn't know his daughter's size, he should have asked her or you...or better yet, given her the money and allowed her to purchase what she wanted.

Your daughter is still young, but she will get fed up at some point and tell him what she thinks of him and his behavior. He's burning that bridge between him and your daughter very quickly...but right now, he is manipulating her by threatening to cut off her phone. Maybe it's time to think about getting her a phone of her own and not on her dad's plan. That would cut out the manipulation and threats of cutting her phone off.

Your h is playing the dance of distant and pursuit w/your daughter. Until she stops taking his bait, she will be in this game for a long time.

I wish that I had more to offer, but she will have to decide when she's had enough and I think that will happen in the next year or so.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Good Morning E

As job has said the manipulation by her Dad is obvious. job’s suggestion of getting her cell phone off his plan is a good one and removes one of those buttons he can push.

My own four kids all experienced their Mom’s threats and manipulations, and I the fear and anger that went along with that. The manner in which she blew up her’s, mine, and our kids’ lives was a tad extreme, however it left very little for her to use against us.

I’ve had many conversations with my kids ensuring them it is alright to feel all of what they feel, even the numbness of indifference. I know how hard it is to walk with four others emotion journeys when your own is all mixed up.

A few thing the five of us have found:

She is still your Mom. It is ok to love her.
She threw us away.
She is behaving irrationally and making poor desparate choices.
She is a terrible role model.
She offers no help.
She has caused a lot of pain and grief.
It is ok to not love her.
It is ok to hate her, to be angry, to be sad.
It is ok to feel sorry for her.
It is ok to be kind and compassionate.
It is ok to forgive her.
She is still your Mom. It is ok to realize you actually do love her. And it is ok to not like her or her choices.
It is ok to let go and live peacefully.
She is still your Mom.
It is ok.

- - - -

I know you have been at this much longer than I. At BD your children were younger than mine, and that makes this a lot harder in my opinion. The feelings of anger, hurt, rage, and such, are completely justified and real.

Focusing on just the question and plead of why can’t I get rid of this anger. The advice I would offer, is that which has been so very benifical to me. Feelings are fleeting. Let them flit.

Feelings and emotions are born within our irrational side. We control ourselves, our actions and responses. Emotions and feelings do not fall under this “control”. We control logic and reason. The intellectual side. The actions and responses.

Feelings will happen, will be triggered, or born for a variety of causes. The love, happiness, anger, lust, despair, joy, sad, etc... all irrational. How we respond or act on these feelings is what we control.

The triggering of an angry response to one’s spouse’s actions can be looked at and reasoned out. This detaches the spouse’s action from your feeling. At first it just allows one to quell those angry feelings and thoughts. Continued efforts and time will disassociate the two. It is then, that one can find the intellectual understanding and emotional acceptance of why one is angry. When one has both of these, anger is abated.

We control our intellect.
We accept our emotions.

Control of Intellect provides reason and logic. Reason and logic provide understanding.
Accepting of emotions leads to kindness and compassion. Kindness and compassion leads to empathy.

With understanding and empathy one can find forgiveness and peace.

E, I wonder what does your destination look like? What are you heading for? Forgiveness?

I am sure you do not want this reaction to exH and the winter coat to be how it is, how things are to be. Just as much as I am sure I am over simplifying this for illustration. When behaviours are not getting the desired results - try something else. Make a change with what is within your control.

You know what you can control regarding your anger. You also know you cannot control D16; I can’t control mine either. smile She controls herself.

You could have conversations with her, and yourself (not as crazy as that sounds btw), about moving forward towards achieving your destination and goals. Something that is well within both of your controls.

Peace and forgiveness is very much worth the effort and struggle to learn; and is not contingent on the actions of someone else. That is a lesson I am very proud and happy to have learned.

DnJ


Feelings are fleeting.
Be better, not bitter.
Love the person, forgive the sin.
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D16 was dropped off at her bf's within 2 hours of being picked up. The jacket fit but is exactly like the one D18 has.

You can' t make this stuff up. Anyway, Ex-h now feels like he is the father of the year and will leave her alone for awhile.

As for me, venting here is my medecine. I let it all out, i get alot of help and great support.

Andrew, i did raise my children with a " family first " rule. I role modeled that rule. At bomb, i blew up! Lol My rule became : Kids first. I am all they have and i must make sure we stay a tight family unit. Ex-h was no longer part of my unit but was part of theirs ( on his own timing ).

Maybe, they know how he works. They know to expect sh!tty treatment from time to time. If it ever goes too far, will they distance themselves like i did?

Job: Ex-h has excuses for everything. He is a master in manipulating and intimidating others. That is why he make a great cop.( very dirty at times ). I often wonder if the older kids realise how he manipulated them in the past? Better yet, do they know they were and still are?

They witnessed a few arguements. They have made the connection of ex-h calling me after talking with them. They became aware of his questioning tactic. As for the recording device on the phone line, the tracking device on my car, my journal and my lawyer and subject of my counscelling sessions were kept from them. I encouraged them to look at him with compassion. Even through the mess, it felt like the right thing to do. Today, humm?? I am not so sure. Maybe because ex-h is stuck? He still beleive is family is now OW, our kids and me as the nanny for the kids. ( that is how i am treated ).

I don' t think they will cut him off. I wish they would but they won' t. Ex-h might, eventually. He is words on a phone with a visit once a month or so.

On a better note, i was able to get him off my hydro and satellite. What a releif and a lesson for me. Everytime i think i am free of him, i get a surprise. I have received mail for ex-h twice last week. Correspondence from his Union adressed to him. He got one of them when he came to pick up D16. I got the other one a couple of days later and forgot to give it to D16 yesterday. I have made the decision of no longer caring for his mail. After 10 years, don' t you think he should have changed his address? He got the first letter, it is up to him to contact them and make the change. How can we tell who was the responsable one. ( rolling my eyes... but feeling good about myself smile )

Dnj, i get your words. I have tried. I care and i don' t. When someone you love is mistreated, it is instinct to try and protect them. If it was up to me TODAY, i would cut ex-h off of everyone. It is so hard to stay out of it and do nothing but listen. I repeat to myself constantly that i did not break their relationship and it is not my place to fix it. It is between them and their father. Another thing i need to remind myself is : " not all of ex-h' s visits are negatives". I hear of the negative ones because they need to vent and let it out; just like me.

I look back at bomb. I recall my words: - " ex-h is having a mid-life crisis. He is stressed out, over-worked and over-whelmed. Nothing is enough and everything is too much." " He wants to go but won' t let me go." " does this make sense to you?" " If you talk to him, he will have a totally different story. I do not know what is happening nor why. "
( those were my words to a cop friend of ours who was asking about our separation. He is also the one who watched over us in the storm without ex-h' s knowledge.)

Forgivenes is a tuff one for me in this situation. I link forgiveness with a changed attitude which will produce empathy. For example: an alcoholic who QUIT drinking. An addict who gets treatment. A goal of positive outcomes.

I can' t feel sorry for ex-h anymore. Over 10 years of this. I am done crying. I am done trying to fix everything. I am done. Unless i see consistancy in him, words and actions, i am off radar. I no longer see this day to ever come.

Outside of this drama, life is good. Life is fun. Life is getting better as the weather warms up! smile
Moods are up and smiles are back in town!
Canada, do not forget to move your clocks ahead 1 hour tonight. I' m doing it right now! smile
Good night everybody!

Last edited by job; 03/10/19 02:06 PM. Reason: edited a word and inserted spacing between paragraphs
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Quote
I have received mail for ex-h twice last week


Haha - after ten years apart and living in a house that I bought two years after the divorce, I still get occasional junk mail for my ex, who never lived in this house. This week I got junk mail for his NEW WIFE lol!

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Hello E

I absolutely understand the need to vent, and that your post was mostly venting and not reflective of the state of affairs of the vast majority of your life. Yes, outside this drama, life is good.

I do have a thought regarding your reply.

Originally Posted by exquisitetobe
It is so hard to stay out of it and do nothing but listen. I repeat to myself constantly that i did not break their relationship and it is not my place to fix it. It is between them and their father.

I agree you did not break their relationship and it is not you place to fix it.

Why do you believe you must stay out of it and do nothing but listen?

I know your children will vent to you (like mine), which is great. I do not believe we should just doing nothing, during venting or otherwise.

Using myself and my D16 for example. I do not attempt (anymore smile ) to repair the burnt bridge between W and her daughter. I do help D16 deal with her feelings and teach her tools to use in these difficult situations. If D16 decides to use them with Mom that is her choice, if she slams the door on her Mom, still her choice - she controls her actions.

If D16 was having trouble with a friend, or teacher, or bus driver, or a server at McDonalds today - one time thing - just listen to the venting and validate. A continual problem with same person, situation, or same problem or concern over many different persons or situations - her and I dig deeper and see what solution(s) she is willing to try. She can only control and change herself.

Now dealing with her Mom, yes that is a problem. Mom’s current stirrings before scurrying back into her tunnel was regarding delivery of payment of income tax holdback for inheritance of the estate of W’s Grandpa, kids GreatGrandpa.

D16 knows her Mom, well this “new” Mom. W behaves like an adolescent, usually 18 years old, reverting to 14 when she get agitated. Well W had these checks and I guess things didn’t go as she expected regarding all her kids to drop everything and show up for a visit. Manipulation and extortion - that just doesn’t fly around here. D16 can see through that BS, and she is busy. So three days later a frustrated W shows up a school during the day and finds D16 to give her the cheque and stomps off in a huff.

Oh well. Can only control you. D16 sees her Mom’s struggles and how gone and different she is. They all do, and they all know the slim odds of her “returning” to herself.

Just to further my example a bit using this same problem of inheritance. Currently W is the trustee of all four kids’ inheritance of $34000 each. As stated in the wishes for Grandpa, it can be released early for education purposes or really anything else the trustee agrees to. Last year S19 asked for some of his money to attend university. She said no. Purely a power struggle and she is attempting to extort visiting. W’s angry reason, well this way they will have to atleast visit me until they are 23. Of course no they don’t have to visit her at all, and they still would get their money when 23.

Anyhow, talking with the kids we looked at what we and they can do. Take her to court, ignore it, ask again and again and again, and so on. My advice for S19 was to not ask her anymore, it is just pressure and she has enough problems already. Besides do we really expect a different result if you run at that wall again.

So he controls his actions, still visits her once in a while and lets sleeping dogs lay. The bank of Dad covers the children with loans and the promised repayment from future funds. This does lead to a risk of her dipping into said funds, which is pretty low on our collective radar. And this first income tax remittance from the trust accounts is completely W’s responsibility and no one “here” is getting involved with that. Perhaps four trust accounts and the government (karmic) slap for not producing paperwork and income tax submission will prompt her to change something that is within her control. We’ll see, not expecting much.

Everyone can use some guidance when dealing with problems, especially an MLC problem. The very irrational nature of everything within its sphere needs to be looked at in a different manner. That is where I get involved and the side I now keep myself.

I think you are doing wonderfully E. Maybe this helps, maybe not. It is just conversation between friends.

DnJ


Feelings are fleeting.
Be better, not bitter.
Love the person, forgive the sin.
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Every word helps!

Today, while going to gaz up, i saw a big wave hi. I waved back and realised it was ex-h. My anxiety rised.

D16 was working and did not know ex-h was coming to town nor did he visit her at work.

Vanilla, this question is for you.
Just those insignificant encounters get my anxirty to the roof. Knots in the middle of my chest. Why? Can cognitive behavior therapy stop this?
Will it keep coming back everytime ex-h make a unexpected appearance?

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Good morning exquisitetobe - I don't think that Vanilla comes by here too often these days and I don't know anything about cognitive behaviour therapy.

What I do know is that over time, as I've gotten distance from my own ex, that the stress knots that I get are lessoned. You and I went through very different experiences though with your's being much more traumatic.

For me, I think it's part of the letting go that we need to do to become healthier. It's undoubtedly harder for you because he keeps inserting himself in your life either directly or through the kids.

From the outside, you seem to do better when you are angry at him, or when you are finding Joy elsewhere. A friend of mine is divorced about 10 years also from an abusive husband. One of her boys is getting married soon and she like you is a normally strong and outgoing woman. One who has built a new successful life. But when we were talking she was really bothered by even the thought of having to interact with her ex. I know that you've managed that with the help of friends and family.

For me, I'm dreading the inevitable few encounters I'll have with my ex but have managed to avoid thus far for years now. Seeing her across the street on the rare times she sees S24 still gives me a twinge. A mix of anger, sadness and jealousy.

I wish that there were easy answers. Lean on your friends and family. We'll help hold you up. Hopefully someone who knows more about trauma and recovering from it can have something more concrete. (((exquisitetobe)))


On BD
H52, W50
T27, M26
S21, D23
BD-9-Mar-16
D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18
I am a storyteller. The story may do you no good.
But a story is never for the listener. It is always for the one who tells
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