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Thanks for the thoughts everyone - some updates from the weekend:

Wife changed her mind on the seperation, nesting, etc. options and agreed to stay together in the house for the time being.

We actually had a good weekend together. On Saturday we went to the pool together as a family. She had some friends there who she hung out with, I spent time with my daugther and wife and I chatted alone a little too. We went home and I barbequed for the family and we watched TV together after daughter went to bed.

On Sunday my wife had plans to take our daugther to lunch and a movie. As they were about to leave she invited me to come along. I was really suprised but I didn't have any other plans so I went along. It was pleasant, we made dinner together after the movie and again watched TV after daughter went to bed. So nothing remarkable really but we spent some time together as a family which was nice, really for our daughter I think. Defininitely no R talks by either of us but some bit of semi-normalcy after BD a month ago.

I did my 3rd coaching session with my DB coach on Monday. She recommeded I write an apology letter which I've been working on. Also saw an IC for help with more of the emotional side - he thinks my wife and I both have some issues from pervious relationships and/or childhood that have led to our problems. I'm sure we'll get much deeper in to that next time.

Question mainly for Steve85 but if others are familiar - anyone used Mort Fertels Marriage fitness material? I started working on some of it and it's pretty similar to DB techniques with a few key differences. I ask Steve85 specifically becuase he recommended "talk charges" and "touch charges" and I think that's where he got it from.

The main difference I see is when you get to the pursuit part. Mort recommends tableing problems, rebuilding connection and then tackling past problems - something easier to do if you are both open to it. Mort doesn't recommend giving a ton of space when you have an "obstinate spouse" (WAS) because he believes you are giving them what they want and clearing their concience to proceed with the divorce. He says the WAS will do everything in their power to get you to go along with their agenda, and by not backing down in pursuit (with some caveats) and instituting change with actions not words you will keep them conflicted in their decisions. Basically similar to BAMOAFWL but still initiating contact with the WAS.

Curious on others thoughts or experiences with these types of ideas that are similar but slighty different than strict DB.

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Yes, I bought Mort's program not long after my BD. And there is a lot of wisdom and logic in it. However, I think Mort's program is better suited to the situation where one spouse feels the other puling away. Once you get to BD it is too late for many of Mort's techniques. For example, date night. Most obstinate spouses are not interested in dating the spouse they just BD'd.

I also think that you have to be careful with some of the techniques. Pursuit and pressure DO NOT work in in 99.99999% of post-BD sitches. But some of his wisdom on the thoughts and feelings of the walkaway (obstinate) spouse are spot on and insightful.

I got value from his program listening to the material, doing the exercises. The Q&A was outstanding.I started doing the talk charges right away. I worked touch charges in, subtly. Date night was saved until after our MC got us to a point and suggested it. I do like how he kept hammering home that that there were no guarantees. That you couldn't control the obstinate spouse and that you had to focus one what you can control, yourself. But you have to be careful because some of the tactics are pursuit and pressure.

I used some of his tactics but really skewed more towards DBing. Where they agreed I absolutely did them Where they deviated I trended more towards DBing.


M(53), W(54),D(19)
M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017
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I am very interested to hear more about this Mort course. I get very mixed messages from my wife on needing space. She wants me to continue to be her partner, i.e. cook dinner and do the dished WITH her, other chores TOGETHER, and put the kids to bed. When she says that she wants space, she seems to suggest no romantic pursuit or manufacturing family events like outings and vacations.

She says that she is not mad at me and isn't resentful. She just doesn't have romantic feelings. Man I don't want to lose her!


M: 22, T: 27
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Originally Posted by Destroyd
I am very interested to hear more about this Mort course. I get very mixed messages from my wife on needing space. She wants me to continue to be her partner, i.e. cook dinner and do the dished WITH her, other chores TOGETHER, and put the kids to bed. When she says that she wants space, she seems to suggest no romantic pursuit or manufacturing family events like outings and vacations.

She says that she is not mad at me and isn't resentful. She just doesn't have romantic feelings. Man I don't want to lose her!


Destroyd - if you google his name you can find his site, don't want to post a link to a competing program here. I'm only in the beginning of his course but I think there is some helpful stuff. A lot similar to DB but some is different. I think you have to critically think and apply what would work best for your sitch.

Speaking of your sitch, I've been following your thread and I really feel for you - I haven't commented because I have no good advice. I'm out here flailing just like you, looking for something to turn my marriage around. I know there is no magic action to make it happen. I'm just trying to use all available resources to put my best effort forward for one last chance.

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Well Dadhurt, we will flail together. I am sitting in my work office crying right now with my window shades pulled down. I never thought life would hurt this bad. But, I am feeling better than I did 1 month ago, so I am feeling progress.


M: 22, T: 27
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Originally Posted by Destroyd
I am very interested to hear more about this Mort course. I get very mixed messages from my wife on needing space. She wants me to continue to be her partner, i.e. cook dinner and do the dished WITH her, other chores TOGETHER, and put the kids to bed. When she says that she wants space, she seems to suggest no romantic pursuit or manufacturing family events like outings and vacations.

She says that she is not mad at me and isn't resentful. She just doesn't have romantic feelings. Man I don't want to lose her!

Hell no!

That's the friendzone. Just go do your thing and give her space. Nothing wrong with maintaining the home but don't plan out doing chores together.

Destroyd, you have to get up and jump around, make yourself happy!!!!!! Do not sulk!


H 34
W 29
BD 3/12/18
Divorce Busted Spring 19

It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
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Well, update to my sitch. Last night I really screwed up.

W, D6 and I went to pool together, had a good day. Had some drinks at pool and back home, BBQ, etc. good family day. Ended up talking to an old friend on the phone who went through a divorce several years ago. He basically said “hate to tell you but if she is having an EA then she is done with you, you need to lawyer up, protect yourself and file and move on.”

I’ve been holding so much anger in due to the (texting) EA, I confronted my wife last night and let it all out. I really let her have it verbally. At first she denied it, then when I told her I had gone through her work phone she admitted it apologized. I yelled at her about the disrespect and betrayal. I told her we need to tell our daughter, she needs to move out and I’m going to file.

After sobering up this morning I realize how much I screwed up and let my anger take over after drinking. We talked more about the EA and she confirmed that she was just looking for attention, apologized and told me she would stop texting him. She now is considering moving from the state when previously she was going to stay for a year.

I feel terrible. Part of me is glad I confronted her on the EA but I did it in such an angry way, any small goodwill I built over the last couple of weeks is undone and then some.

I so regret this- please help!

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You can’t undo what is already done but you can resolve to do better moving forward. A well-worded apology for yelling at her and drinking too much wouldn’t hurt either. Then pick yourself up and make today a really good Father’s Day with your daughter. And maybe stay away from drinking too much until you are feeling more grounded and less emotional. Nothing good comes from drinking too much when you are going through something like this. It just lowers your inhibitions and you really need those right now. (((HUGS)))

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Originally Posted by DejaVu6
You can’t undo what is already done but you can resolve to do better moving forward. A well-worded apology for yelling at her and drinking too much wouldn’t hurt either. Then pick yourself up and make today a really good Father’s Day with your daughter. And maybe stay away from drinking too much until you are feeling more grounded and less emotional. Nothing good comes from drinking too much when you are going through something like this. It just lowers your inhibitions and you really need those right now. (((HUGS)))


You are absolutely right - no more drinking like that. I’m actually not much of a drinker anymore but I’m just trying to numb the pain and be able to act “natural” and friendly with the wife. Totally backfired. I did apologize this morning and renig on her moving out and me filing- not good DB but that’s not what I want.

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I am so sorry you are going through this Dadhurt. It is hard not to lose your temper when your spouse betrays your trust. Don't beat yourself up too much. While you might not have helped your sitch, you were justified in losing your temper.


M: 22, T: 27
Three Children
BD: 12/15/18
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