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DnJ Offline
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Good Morning Andrew

Having lived through three boys telling me they are moving out, I will give my view.

I used the words “telling me” and not asking or discussing, because that is what they do. All my boys went through a stage where they messed up the nest, a precursor to actually leaving. Making things a bit worst, so leaving is a bit easier. And by a bit - yeah that is a relative term. At the time it was, what the ___ is going on? On the other side, it doesn’t look so bad - relativity, not just a space time thing. smile

Also they are growing up and realizing and accepting all that responsibility. Stepping out of the shadow of a parent is difficult. They push away. Don’y worry, they turn back around reasonably soon. They become adults and our relationship becomes more adult to adult than child to parent. That is probably harder on us than them.

I suspect S24’s rant is due to a variety of factors. Growing up, pushing away, his ‘Mom, his Dad, B, work, car payments, and so on - you know life and the pressures of it. He is grappling to find his way, and his place.

I wouldn’t get to hung up on why, focus more on how - like how can I help him through this. Realizing you can not control him; just inspire and gently steer.

Take him driving. The car is an awesome place for discussions. Let him control the car and the conversation, he will open up and let you know - when he is ready - just be sincere and listen. And you got that down pat, so no worries.

Besides, he will tell you the why eventually.

Well that’s my take on things. I am very glad to see that he “told you off”; he vented to who he sees as the safe and stable person in his life. Well done Andrew, even though it probably doesn’t feel like it right now - it gets better, honest.

Be prepared to listen and accept whatever he is feeling, the next time you won’t be caught off guard as much and it will be more productive.

I think kids rebel the most against the authority figure they respect the most.

Hoping you have a wonderful Father’s Day.

DnJ


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I agree, perhaps 20 something was the last bit of pressure that blew the lid and he vented at his safe place, you.

I do really feel B perhaps should lay off. S24 knows she is willing to help which is great, so now he can go to her when he feels comfortable.

Does he have a hobby he enjoys? Maybe he can turn that into a career. Trades are often undervalued, college isn’t always the answer, but learning a trade at perhaps a trade school could give him purpose and a goal to work towards.

Does he date? Honestly, a woman he might be interested in might drive him one day to be independent . I think he knows women like men who can be independent. He may yearn for a lady one day and that will be his driving factor.

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Thanks DnJ and Ginger

Originally Posted by Ginger1
Does he have a hobby he enjoys? Maybe he can turn that into a career. Trades are often undervalued, college isn’t always the answer, but learning a trade at perhaps a trade school could give him purpose and a goal to work towards.

Does he date? Honestly, a woman he might be interested in might drive him one day to be independent . I think he knows women like men who can be independent. He may yearn for a lady one day and that will be his driving factor.
Well - I'm pretty sure he's straight and likes girls. He hasn't dated since he was 16 and really hasn't shown any interest that I can detect. I think he's actually fairly happy with the monastic life. He certainly had a good example from me I like to think that a man can be on his own and manage perfectly fine. The bulk of the girls his age are now married / in relationships / having babies too which reduces the available pool. He perhaps also knows that not making yourself vulnerable means that he won't get hurt. I do remember a very nice girl I dated back in University who was very firm on staying single her entire life as she didn't want to go through what her parents did in their divorce.

S24 and I were actually chatting as he was driving me home from the nice Father's Day brunch he took me out for and agreed with my comment that I was doing rather well on my own and that it is very very different with B around now.

As far as work goes S24 is actually a reasonably good chemist. He was attending University in a program oriented at medical lab work. He's not handy and has never shown any interest in the work shop or puttering around mechanically. He likes to cook and at one time considered that as a career when he was a lot younger. Despite not finishing his degree he is quite smart. He failed out more due to a lack of applying himself than inability to do the work. Even though he's an introvert he's quite personable and can be very charming. I actually think he would do well in sales. The original plan had been for him to do lab work for a few years and then start selling the lab equipment - cuz that's where the "real" money is. As a side note, after he failed out his mother chastised him for picking a career where good eyesight is an asset when he has poor vision even with his glasses. I wasn't happy about that.

We have talked multiple times about him going back to school. His opinion, which I support, is that without a specific goal in mind he would be, like a number of his friends, using up years of his life and money for no good purpose. This is an area where I could "really" use some constructive assistance from his mother as TBH I've really been stuck for the last 4 years on this. I "is" S24's thing to sort out I know but there are certainly times when I feel like I'm letting him and my "family" down by not providing stronger leadership on this.

Being more mobile will be good for him. He needs to set goals and work towards them.

Well - time to get the blankets out on the line and go for a walk around the village. I did my ironing yesterday after dinner which made for a very late night. One nice thing about B not being around these past two weekends is that it does allow me to fall back in to my old comfortable patterns for a while. I expect her home mid/late afternoon. She has to play taxi taking the various grandkids home from the cottage before she can come home herself.

The ground beef for the meatloaf is thawed and that's a fairly easy dinner for me to make. I'll maybe do some fresh biscuits, steamed vegetables and mashed potatoes to go with it.


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Hi A., Happy belated Father's day. Glad you and s got to spend some alone time.

So - boys. I heard this once and it resonates ... with girls, you know about the guy they like six months before their first date. With boys, you're lucky if you learn about the female six months after they break up. Even more so with those introspective boys.

My son should have taken a gap year. Exh and I encouraged him but he insisted on going off to school ... and here we are. He paid his rent and phone bill Saturday, on our agreed upon date. I think, Andrew, that you are absolutely not letting anyone down here. As we all know, everyone is on their own path. We can only guide. We can't do it for them. You've given him a wonderful example of how to be steady in the face of adversity, how to re-build your life and do all the right things to get and stay on track after your village got nuked by the one person who should have been working with you to guard the perimeter.

He will find his way. Hold steady, which you do very well my friend.

xoxoxo


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I have made no secret of the fact that I'm a huge advocate of lighting a fire under S24 and getting him out and on his own and independent, but I do NOT think that you are in any way letting him or your family down in any way. If he wants to go back to school, that is great, but that is a decision he has to make when he is ready for it and you can't make that decision for him. You are an awesome dad. You are trying to guide him as best you can when you know he has other influences that may or may not be complementary with yours. You know your son and we don't so it is easy for me to sit here and say, get him out when I don't really know all the ins and outs of the situation. I think what you are doing for your son is showing him how to be a man and handle his business. Whether he is around all the time or not, he sees you taking care of the house and your financial responsibilities and that is, undoubtedly, a lesson that will serve him well in his future. While I find it unusual that a young man is 24 and doesn't yet have a driver's license and now he's put himself in debt to get a car that he can't drive, at least he's showing ambition to gain his independence. You should be proud of that instead of thinking that you are somehow not holding up your end of the bargain. Even more to the point, though he still leaned on a parent for help, he went to his mother and asked for her help on his own and even that seems to be a step in the right direction.

As for his outburst toward you, there are any number of reasons that he might've come at you as he did. Several other posters before me have given some great ideas about that. One that came to my mind that I haven't noticed anyone else say is maybe he's a bit jealous of your finding B. I get that he's a grown man, but it has just been the 2 of you for awhile and now all of sudden, B is in the mix and in his personal space. Maybe he's pushing back a little against that whole situation, not necessarily because he doesn't like B or doesn't want you to be happy, but because it has disrupted his "normal". I don't know if that makes sense or not, but it is just a thought. Only he REALLY knows why he lashed out.


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well, to go a bit further with Dawn's post - if someone had moved into my family home and was there for a very short time and started telling me what to do, I'd lay into my dad also - and my dad was - make no mistake about this - my favorite parent. love my mom to bits, but I was and always will be daddy's little girl ... so maybe son is irked about that.

xoxoxo

hope this helps.


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D26 is now D27 - it was her birthday yesterday. I sent her flowers and a card. She missed the florist by about 10 minutes yesterday and so they were delivered today.

The peonies in the front flower bed were opening this morning. They looked lovely. Favourite flowers of both D27 and her mother. This bed was rescued from a neighbour who was renovating about 20 years ago. Perhaps more. My ex used to say that they always opened specially for her for her birthday which is Saturday. She'll be 54.

It was on her 50th birthday "girls weekend" with her sister when I personally think she was pushed along the first steps on the path towards infidelity.

Sometimes it all seems like just yesterday and others it seems like forever ago.

I did look at the peonies this morning though and wondered if she does perhaps have honest regrets. Not that would change the past nor even the future. She only lives 5 minutes away and so would pass by the house that was her home for about 1/2 her life from time to time. She really did love those flowers even more so than the ones from her grandmother's farm that will be blooming soon in the back garden. She loved that house as well despite it's crooked walls and floors. She even loved me.

I'll undoubtedly never know the truth. It does make me sad about the loss of what could have been for her, for me and for our family.

My own future is looking bright. I am with a woman who I love and who loves me with an intensity that I've never experienced before. My children have grown in to fine adults, albeit flawed but who isn't. My career for the present appears to be stable. My health is good. I have many good friends and still do, each and every day find some Joy to appreciate, no matter how small.

I am very blessed.


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Here's an idea, perhaps for your son to give his mom - take cuttings from the peonies and plant them in a pot for her.

Quote
My own future is looking bright. I am with a woman who I love and who loves me with an intensity that I've never experienced before.


For those of us that were the pursuers and nurturers, it's refreshing to be in a relationship where that is returned in equal measure, isn't it?

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Originally Posted by kml
Here's an idea, perhaps for your son to give his mom - take cuttings from the peonies and plant them in a pot for her.
LOL - Given that ants usually accompany peonies this might not be a popular move. But on the other hand ....... HMMMMM

While I can't know for sure, I'm pretty certain that his mother hasn't taken S24 out for driving practice as of yet. I do know that early on she texted both kids at least twice a day but have no idea what sort of contact nor at what frequency it may be. Literally none of my business though beyond the now complicated parking situation which is more or less sorted out.

I did send a message to S24 yesterday morning that we could go in "to town" at lunch time together but since he didn't emerge from his den until well after lunch that didn't work out.

------

On a good news side, my solo trip for a week in Madrid has been booked for mid-September. Tickets for the Prado museum are going to be pre-ordered as well. I'm nervous but also excited. It's a mostly guided trip but with a couple of open days and I'm sure evenings etc. B I think is nervous about me going but she's broke and any conversations we have about taking trips etc have the base implication that we each pay our own way on such things.

I am thinking of doing another weekend getaway sometime reasonably soon. Niagara Falls is nice and not too far away and certainly romantic. One challenge is that the hotel that I would most likely pick is the same as the one where my ex and I spent our 25th wedding anniversary. Despite being modestly priced, it has nice views of the Falls (if you are lucky) and big two person tubs.

I've worked hard on not repeating things I did with my ex with B even down to pet names. B actually asked me the other day what pet name that my ex had for me and was rather surprised that it was Bunny (I can hear you giggling from here). There are no worries that she'll call me that. I've almost slipped a couple of times and called B the pet name I had for my ex which is based on her name. The places where my honeymoon was spent don't exist except for on hotel which isn't romantic at all so no worries there.

---------------------

I'm really struggling on being motivated at work -hence posting mid-afternoon on a Thursday. Rumours of my boss retiring continue to swirl. One of the company presidents (we have one for each division) told me that he had been given a date of September 10th. When I sent in my official vacation request my boss mentioned that he is planning on being in Italy around that time. When he leaves, there will be some shake-up around here. Hopefully for the good. What my own role will be remains uncertain.

I can't wait for the weekend - although what's happening is kinda up in the air. B's son has asked if we'll take two grandkids for the weekend. I've remained neutral on the subject but it would make the third weekend in a row that B has been occupied / away. And she was complaining to "me" that I'm too busy on weekends.

On the relationship front, things are going reasonably smoothly. It's still odd to have B around at times. Her son I think is struggling with having his two little ones (GS2, GS4) underfoot on his own and B has gone in fairly often to rescue. I stay out of it although he did ask if we would take the kids this weekend which I'm not really keen on as I've not gotten much "B time" for me and she looked after them all last weekend - along with 3 others. I may hint that she perhaps needs a break.

One unexpected thing that I have a bit of a struggle with is the fact that B is indeed still married. We can ignore the fact that she still does a certain amount of adulting for her STBX (when? We don't know but probably not for a year) Every now and then she refers to me jokingly as "Mr Magoo" as a pet name. The automatic but supressed response would be to refer to her as "Mrs" or even "Ms" whatever. But I don't. I sort of "feel" like a husband and presumably she feels rather wifely but there's that darned legal fact that she is indeed married to another man and that I am playing the part of Lothario in this drama.

Speaking of things matrimonial, I have done some reading and it turns out that in Ontario, Canada that a person can indeed have a legal married spouse and a common law one. Common law status begins after 3 years however for Canada Revenue, they consider Common Law to be one year. We do need to get our legal ducks in a row - ideally before I go away on my trip (you never know what may happen).

I honestly don't know what B's feelings are as far as re-marrying in the future. She's made the comment that she has no interest in it but I'm not certain how solid that feeling is in reality.


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Andrew,

What I do when cutting peonies for my house is that I cut them the night before and place them in a vase outside. The next morning...the ants are gone. This has worked for me every time. Actually, you need the root/bulb in order to repot/transplant them. You can do this in the fall or early spring. You will need to select one of your peonies and then dig it up and separate the "roots" and them replant/repot the roots into a pot for his mom. I have done this with the plants at my parents' home and I have some beautiful peonies that are quite old and yet still going strong.

Why do you think that B is nervous about your trip to Spain? It's not like you are planning to hook up w/someone else. Do you think it's because she will be on her own in your home?

If I am out of line, please let me know, but doesn't B's son have siblings that could help out w/taking care of his children? Does he work on the weekends or is this his party time? Do you know if he shares custody w/the mother of his children? If so, they need to work out the care of the children. Unless you speak up, I see the little ones being at your home every weekend. As for you being busy every weekend...what about B? BTW, how can you be too busy on the weekends when you have little ones under foot unless she is hoping that you'll help take care of them.

She may make comments that she has no interest in remarrying, but I would put money on the bet that if she were legally free and you asked her....she would jump at that opportunity to say "yes". Why? Because you are a good man and no you do not look anything like Mr. Magoo.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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