What next.

[Rooney]

Are you currently 50/50 parenting? If not, how often are you currently parenting?

Also, this apartment isnt big enough to be anything other than temporary. I need another bedroom for anything more permanent.

[Ready2Change]

You will be walking at least two different paths at the same time.

1) Divorced. Plan on this one. Accept it.

2) Reconcile. Make all the positive changes you can as quickly as you can. Every interaction with W is an oppertunity to show the "new you".


It is important for you to come up with a plan. Lay out the plan here. Let us give you input. Revise your plan. Repeat this process a few times until you have it solid.


I am a firm believer that children need both of their parents frequently involved in their lives. This is 50/50 parenting. You parenting rights are yours to loose during this. Standing up for this is on you. I did not leave the marital home until I had a 50/50 parenting plan in writing. This went against my lawyers advise. His staff understood why I was not moving out. I did not want the house, she did.


I saw the temptation to drink, but I refrained. I did not want to give any ammo to the opposition.

You can handle this

[SoTorn]

You will be walking at least two different paths at the same time.

1) Divorced. Plan on this one. Accept it.

2) Reconcile. Make all the positive changes you can as quickly as you can. Every interaction with W is an oppertunity to show the "new you".


It is important for you to come up with a plan. Lay out the plan here. Let us give you input. Revise your plan. Repeat this process a few times until you have it solid.


I am a firm believer that children need both of their parents frequently involved in their lives. This is 50/50 parenting. You parenting rights are yours to loose during this. Standing up for this is on you. I did not leave the marital home until I had a 50/50 parenting plan in writing. This went against my lawyers advise. His staff understood why I was not moving out. I did not want the house, she did.


I saw the temptation to drink, but I refrained. I did not want to give any ammo to the opposition.

You can handle this

Same here. No way I was leaving without a legal custody agreement.

[Rooney]

You will be walking at least two different paths at the same time.

1) Divorced. Plan on this one. Accept it.

2) Reconcile. Make all the positive changes you can as quickly as you can. Every interaction with W is an oppertunity to show the "new you".


It is important for you to come up with a plan. Lay out the plan here. Let us give you input. Revise your plan. Repeat this process a few times until you have it solid.


I am a firm believer that children need both of their parents frequently involved in their lives. This is 50/50 parenting. You parenting rights are yours to loose during this. Standing up for this is on you. I did not leave the marital home until I had a 50/50 parenting plan in writing. This went against my lawyers advise. His staff understood why I was not moving out. I did not want the house, she did.


I saw the temptation to drink, but I refrained. I did not want to give any ammo to the opposition.

You can handle this

Thank for this R2C

1) is something I hadn’t really gone near until last couple of days. I have only ever seen path 2) as an option. Probably because D was way too scary to look for. Now the idea has come and found me I am trying to stare at i, sit next to it and see a world that is a distinct reality post D. It’s tough to stare it down but I know I cannot be afraid of it. The comfortable with it I am, the more likely 2) may happen. This has been my focus over the last 24/48 hours, Lots of breath8ng sand trying to be still and in the moment, Reading is helping if nothing more than helping me to sleep.

Emailed W today about having D9 stay with me more often now she is more comfortable, She is happy about it. D9 enjoys spending time with me here but I think is understandably resistant because she wants her parents together. Any contested custody would likely be based on current arrangements. Looking. To get 3 overnights at the moment if my work allows it. I see her coming out of her shell when she has spent time with me - both lifts and breaks my heart.

I feel the same about children needing both parents. It seems to me that the a lot of people whose parents divorced end up following the same path. They use the ‘they’ll get over it’ and ‘didn’t do me any harm’ lines without any irony. The regret of leaving D9 hurts. Especially as W appears to be growing colder not just with me, Reasons for condemning of heart are probably many but I can’t see in there so there’s little point I trying,

If she is mlc, and is following the script, I guess it’s possible there is an EA. Proof may be hard to come by though. If I had any that would result in an instant return to the MB.

As for a plan. Prepare for 1) (new to me) and hope (and prepare for) 2), is it at the moment. I still feel I need more time or more info to cut short this temporary separation I (now think mistakenly) agreed to.

It seems to me that preparing for 1) or 2) are very similar in DB. Detach, GAL, 180 and patience.

[Rooney]

Same here. No way I was leaving without a legal custody agreement.

I wish I had had that level of consciousness and mindfulness at the time. I just wanted to ‘fix it’ as I have done all my life.

Any new or rekindled relationships won’t see as much of that guy. I’ll leave my white coat at work.

[Rooney]

Saw W yesterday to talk about D9 and we agreed to up the overnights to two over the weekend with possibly another midweek soon. I need to be with D9 as much possible - I don’t feel like W is interacting with her much at the moment. Her levels of selfishness seems to be growing.

My interaction with W was too open from me - I know I need to be more guarded and need to work on it. I was calm and cordial but too friendly. I should got through the business of D9 and left. Still way too attached and affectionate.

I believe I caught her lying yesterday too. She said she would be a bit late as a meeting was dragging on at work. When she came back she had clearly had a drink. I confronted her she said no, I said she had, then she said it was at lunchtime. I know none of that means she was with OM, but it is looking like a possibility that I need to come to terms with and figure out the best course of action to take to both prove it and deal with it internally and in reality. At least, it is disrespectful.

I’d like proof so the thought of a PI on a few evenings when I have D9 should confirm one way or another. Is this worthwhile? I see a few saying ‘does it matter?’ on other threads, but I want to honour the request for time and space that I was asked for so need to be sure if I were to go back to the MRB early.

Last couple of days have been tough looking down the barrel at D, but I think my fear is subsiding and there will hopefully come more detachment as a result.


At the moment, the plan is to:-

1) Have D9 stay as much as possible and spend the best time I can with her. Support S18 as much as I can.

2) DB more - the detachment is increasing but obviously way too strong still. Get back to GAL. Expand personal goals. Go darker.

3) Read - No More Mr Nice Guy is ordered today, so is DR. Any other book recommendations welcome.

4) Improve budgeting. After a couple of months of spending as I would’ve done previously, I need to reign in my spending.

3) Try to prove A. If A exists, then terms of temp S have been breached. Straight back to MBR, full LRT and leave her to deal with the consequences of her actions from the sofa. PI’s / discreet q to friends/IL. Any advice on pros and cons of these approaches are welcome.

4) Have patience over the next two months by committing to my growth in 2) and, if still no talk of R from W, then back to the MBR before lease ends as S was temp not perpetual. The default position was never for me to stay here indefinitely. May have been different in her head if she has just been manipulating me and ‘letting me down gently’.

5) Plan for D emotionally and legally. See different L for advice. Get papers in order. Possible counter file for D due to (if proven) A.

[Rooney]

Another interaction with W yesterday when picking up D9.

The DBing is in my head when alone but not made it to my heart - I am not controlling my emotions. A kiss when arriving and with a hug when leaving...so far from detached and it comes across as desperate and needy pursuit. The most I should do is a peck on the cheek and even that may be too much at this stage.

I am also asking too many questions about her and how and what she is doing. A lot of this comes from trying to catch her lies about where and what she is doing. I don’t know how to detach when I am trying to figure out the extent of her lying. Maybe detachment is to go past caring what the hell she doing and how she can justify it to herself - trying to figure it out will test my sanity and so it is best if I don’t bother. I need to admit to myself that the woman I knew as my wife has gone and may never return and it is her decision to decide which path to take. Letting go is really really hard.

She still seems interested in telling me a bit about any progress (or lack of) there has been around changes she wants to make in herself. She told me she is putting on weight and she is the heaviest she has ever been, I said it didn’t matter, then I get ‘you’ve been telling me I’m fat for 10 years stop saying it doesn’t matter’. WTF? That is a huge rewrite of history - I have only ever tried to support her In her efforts to lose weight when she wanted to. I cannot believe she truly believes this is an accurate representation of history. Her newer group of friends must think I’m a monster.
I tried to validate as much as possible - ‘I’m sorry you feel that way’, ‘I understand that you feel this way’, ‘I cannot change the past’. It helped us move away from the subject quickly.

D9 seemed distant and sad when I picked her up. We had a lovely afternoon and evening with family. I want to make sure the time she spends with me is the thing she looks forward to the most albeit in circumstances that are making her sad.

Anyway, I know the interaction with W has not helped. How much more damage it has caused, I don’t know. Maybe I am past caring...I guess if I was truly past caring, then I wouldn’t be making these mistakes.

[Rooney]

Drove past MH today. Curtains drawn, W car not there.

Do I confront her about it? Do I ask her where she is staying tonight?
Pretty sure the answer is no.

Sent a couple of pics of D9s activities today. One word replies.

This stuff is hard.

[Rooney]

Good weekend with D9 - we had lots of fun. She did knew things that will help build her confidence...

W takes D and S to see relatives tomorrow for a few days (was planned before BD and I was originally meant to be going).

Dropped off D, W asleep on couch when we got in. Very cold and stand offish when she woke as she has been for the past couple of weeks.

No kisses/hugs offered to me as I was leaving, so I offered none back. Felt very strange not to offer anything but, after all, she has fired me and I am not going on holiday with my family (which hurts like hell).

The NGS needs to disappear. NMMNG book should arrive tomorrow. Can’t come soon enough.

[AnotherStander]

She said she would be a bit late as a meeting was dragging on at work. When she came back she had clearly had a drink. I confronted her she said no, I said she had, then she said it was at lunchtime. I know none of that means she was with OM, but it is looking like a possibility that I need to come to terms with and figure out the best course of action to take to both prove it and deal with it internally and in reality. At least, it is disrespectful.

Rooney, here is the problem- you are behaving like the two of you are still married, she is behaving like you are already divorced. She is closer to right than you are. Most WAS's consider the marriage done at BD. Most LBS's are already divorced at that point (at least spiritually), but continue to live in denial for months or even years. You can't control whether she has a drink at lunch and as far as she is concerned it's none of your business. Unless she is coming home sloppy drunk and it's affecting her motherly duties then it shouldn't be on your radar.

I’d like proof so the thought of a PI on a few evenings when I have D9 should confirm one way or another. Is this worthwhile?

Only you can answer that. If you know she's having an A then are you done with the M? Ready to file D immediately? Or would you keep on DB'ing? If you would keep DB'ing then assume the worst and continue on. If you would file for D then go ahead and hire a PI and find out for sure.

Read - No More Mr Nice Guy is ordered today, so is DR. Any other book recommendations welcome.

Married Man Sex Life Primer. Available electronically. Good info on apha versus beta behavior although somewhat of a crude read for the more sensitive out there!

A kiss when arriving and with a hug when leaving...so far from detached and it comes across as desperate and needy pursuit. The most I should do is a peck on the cheek and even that may be too much at this stage.

Correct and yes, even a peck is too much. Think of someone you can't stand to the point of being repulsed by the sight of them. Would you like that person coming in for a kiss and hug every time you saw them? That's how your W feels right now.

I am also asking too many questions about her and how and what she is doing. A lot of this comes from trying to catch her lies about where and what she is doing.

That needs to stop. She can tell she's being cross-examined, and that's not helping.

I don’t know how to detach when I am trying to figure out the extent of her lying.

Detachment is understanding your M is done for now and that her lying simply doesn't matter. You live your life and you let her live hers, even if she's living a pack of lies. It needs to cease to be your concern.

Maybe detachment is to go past caring what the hell she doing and how she can justify it to herself

Yes, that is in part exactly what it is.

She told me she is putting on weight and she is the heaviest she has ever been, I said it didn’t matter, then I get ‘you’ve been telling me I’m fat for 10 years stop saying it doesn’t matter’.

Listen and validate. It matters to her, if it didn't she wouldn't have mentioned it. "You've gained some weight, how does that make you feel?" When you say "it doesn't matter" you are invalidating her feelings.

I tried to validate as much as possible - ‘I’m sorry you feel that way’, ‘I understand that you feel this way’, ‘I cannot change the past’.

Those are wimpy rubber-stamp validation statements, and that last one is not validation at all.