I'm not one to air my laundry to ones I dont know, but I'm looking for suggestions from others who have gone thru this. Married to my wife going on 20 years this October. 4 years ago I did the unthinkable and ruined my marriage by texting another woman. I was texting a woman for about 2 months. I dont know what the hell I was thinking but I made the biggest mistake in my life and with a person I never physically met. After my wife found out about the texting I compounded the problem by denying it. After I finally owned up to my deception, my wife decided we would repair this and try to move on. Fast forward to one year ago. My wife tells me she cant get over the affair from 3 years earlier and wants to divorce. My wife doesnt work due to her bi-polar and I'm the lone income. We decided I would stay in the house with her until we were financially able to move on. We have one child living at home. I struggled emotionally for 6 months last year on the damage that I caused her. Took me a long time to come to terms with what I did. But I spent 6 months trying to repair the damage done last year. November, I finally realized that I had to let go of my wife. Only she could change her mind, I couldnt. Mid November I have enough savings to move, as I plan this my wife got closer and out of blue changed her mind. She now wanted to work on this. I was in heaven. Finally had my wife back and was working towards forgiveness. We used the savings to catch things up here. Fast forward to this February, she said it again, she cant get over what I did and wants a divorce. Once again wants me to stay until she finds a job. Again, I am heartbroken. I know I caused all this from my actions years ago. Now, my wife is bi polar. She doesnt leave house much. There is no outside interference here, no man that she is talking to. I just dont know what to do now. I dont know how else to profess my apologies to her. I realize that most on this board come from the other end of the spectrum, they were the ones cheated on so I am prepared to catch hell here for this, but understand I made a bad choice, a bad mistake. I would do anything to take back that damage I caused her. I guess I'm just looking for some advice or support. I have read the books here and admit that I still try to talk about the Relationship and saving us because ultimately I am the one who betrayed her and caused this.
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
I'm sorry you are here. I don't know if this helps but 7 years ago my H had multiple affairs. I decided to forgive him. It took a looooong time. Too long. One reason I'm here now is because he couldn't take my unforgiveness anymore. Right about the time I got help (therapy for the a's among other things), he was done. M was too hard for him. You can not make your W get help, but you can get help for yourself. You need support. Find it.
Listen to the people here. Surround yourself with people who accept and love you and don't focus on your w or where she is emotionally. It will make you miserable. One day at a time is the actual key to peace.
What you did was wrong. You know that now. Learn from it. Don't do it again. work hard to find out WHY you did it, to avoid putting yourself at risk. As you grow and focus on being the best you, you will come to a place where you can make good choices going forward.
Stand strong in the truth. She is going to throw all kinds of things at you. You can and should accept your part, but you can't accept ALL of the blame for your MR.
ME47 XH44, S28 S24 S19
8/17-BD IHS: 1/17-2/19 D FILED (ME): 7/19 D FINAL: 10/20 M23 T25 OW CONFIRMED: 01/21
Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.
Cadet, no, her diagnosis was not until after my EA. So years later into our marriage. She is on her meds, strong ones at that. It's almost as If they zap her emotions. She has built up a huge wall. The thing is, if I dont mention our future together, things are almost fine. Of course we are in separate beds, but everything else seems almost normal. She even lays her head on my lap at night on couch. When I bring up and question our future, that's when a switch occurs and all hell breaks loose and she says I need to move on... maybe I shouldn't ever bring it up and just forget about it..
I have another question. We currently share a home. At this time I am sole provider. Her plan is for me to move out when she can support herself, she is even thinking of having her mom move in with her to help with Bill's. What if I dont want to move out? I dont know why its automatically assumed that I should be the one to move, i guess if i say i will go then I'm not being selfish and thinking it will help me but if I refuse to leave it shows me as a selfish one and will all but kill any chance of saving M.. What is the general opinion on the matter of moving? I cant afford two places now so its understood that I am staying for now, but she says as soon as she is working I am to move. Now remember, I want to save this M that I destroyed, she is the one that wants out of it.
I have another question. We currently share a home. At this time I am sole provider. Her plan is for me to move out when she can support herself, she is even thinking of having her mom move in with her to help with Bill's. What if I dont want to move out? I dont know why its automatically assumed that I should be the one to move, i guess if i say i will go then I'm not being selfish and thinking it will help me but if I refuse to leave it shows me as a selfish one and will all but kill any chance of saving M.. What is the general opinion on the matter of moving? I cant afford two places now so its understood that I am staying for now, but she says as soon as she is working I am to move. Now remember, I want to save this M that I destroyed, she is the one that wants out of it.
The general opinion is to do what you want, what is best for you given the situation. If you guys divorced, would you move elsewhere or want to keep the house? If you'd want to stay there, you say it once b/c it's the truth. After that, you don't need to proclaim it anymore.
Her sticking around b/c of your income isn't good either. She shouldn't be doing that and it isn't justified by your affair.
Originally Posted by Sad_lost
The thing is, if I dont mention our future together, things are almost fine.
Like Cadet said, do what works. If you don't know what works, don't do what you know doesn't work.
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
I'm not really sure how to take this one. Wife and I still together under same roof. Of course no sex not sleeping in same bed but everything else is normal. Only time anything is brought up is when I bring it up and she tells me again that we are legally married but that's all, we are not a couple or together. She lays with me on couch, I rub her head and she is on with this. Actions on her part dont add up. It's her words.. of course she will never allow sexual contact. But this is where I'm confused and not sure what to do, I guess I screwed up tonight by bringing up boundaries. I feel strongly about this. I told her we need clear boundaries while we still living together and she tells me that we do not need boundaries. We are not together. She tells me if I want to talk to another woman or have sexual contact with another woman it's ok as long as I don't bring her home. When I tell her that I have no interest in that she says that's my choice. I asked about her, and she says if she goes with another man its morally ok. Because she is not with me anymore. Now I really dont think she has been doing this or has plans to do this. She says she wants to work on herself and her condition 1st but If something ever did happen it's not my business nor is it wrong. When I tell her its disrespectful she points out my EA from 4 years ago and tells me I didn't respect her then. I dont know how to take this. I know her actions sometimes dont match her words, but if she was confused about our M or really still cared, would she really tell me that I'm ok to meet someone or that she would not have any problems sleeping with another man? I still consider this cheating, apparently she does not. I guess I'm sooo afraid to move out and move on If there really is a small chance. This happened last year and she changed her mind. I am confused.
I honestly dont think she is having an affair. Unless she is really good at doing it while I'm at work and she is at home. She doesnt go out anywhere. She suffers major panic attacks so she is always home. I guess its possible that maybe someone comes over during the day, but I work locally and come home from time to time and I just dont think she would do that. Once again, I could be wrong, but I really dont think she is having affair. As far as moving out, I guess it was always assumed since she told me she wanted divorce that I would move since I'm the one working and she doesnt drive. I guess I always agreed maybe thinking I would be the nice one, I dont want to be selfish, and I do feel responsible for this mess from my EA years back. I caused this, so I should be the one who pays for my choices and mistakes.
Is that the general opinion though? That she is having affair of her own? I must also say, not downplaying my EA. This was done via text to someone I never met, and I was never emotionally involved. Hate to admit, it was mostly sexting someone I never saw or met. I know it doesn't paint a good picture of me. I never ever would have acted out on any of that. Stupid fantasy I had going on in my head.
Is that the general opinion though? That she is having affair of her own? I must also say, not downplaying my EA. This was done via text to someone I never met, and I was never emotionally involved. Hate to admit, it was mostly sexting someone I never saw or met. I know it doesn't paint a good picture of me. I never ever would have acted out on any of that. Stupid fantasy I had going on in my head.
Well there's 3 types of affairs- PA (physical), EA (emotional) and IA (imaginary). WAS's are always engaging in one of those. If she is staying married to you but doesn't consider you together then she's just biding her time until "someone better comes along". But she's not motivated to divorce, or separate, or actually look for that "better" person so she's content to just sit it out at home. Sometimes these type of "lazy WAS's" will continue having sex and sometimes they won't. But it can be enormously frustrating for the LBS because these "lazy" ones will stay at home forever and never make a move to change anything. Often it's the LBS that finally gets tired of the limbo and leaves. You might pick up Michele's book "The Sex-Staved Marriage", I've never read it myself but I understand it's helpful for people in situations like yours.
Just to clarify a little about what we mean by IA, the WAS imagines a knight in shining armor is going to arrive and sweep her off her feet and have toe-curling sex with her. Sometimes this knight is someone they know that doesn't actually return the interest (could be a coworker or even a celebrity or sports figure) and sometimes it's just a figure they've dreamt up. But you can imagine how hard it is for a LBS to compete with an imaginary OM because the WAS can imagine him to be as perfect as she wants. Sometimes they quit having sex with their H because they picture themselves as saving themselves for that imaginary OM.
Just to clarify a little about what we mean by IA, the WAS imagines a knight in shining armor is going to arrive and sweep her off her feet and have toe-curling sex with her. Sometimes this knight is someone they know that doesn't actually return the interest (could be a coworker or even a celebrity or sports figure) and sometimes it's just a figure they've dreamt up. But you can imagine how hard it is for a LBS to compete with an imaginary OM because the WAS can imagine him to be as perfect as she wants. Sometimes they quit having sex with their H because they picture themselves as saving themselves for that imaginary OM.
Or they read romance novels and fall in love with the hero of the novel.
For some reason, she still seems to hold onto my EA that I had. Is 4 years still normal to hold onto this? She is very admiring that she wants a divorce because of what happened years ago. I still feel awful with what I did to her. I just dont know how much more I can show her how sorry I am. I dont know what else I can do. But she loves to make me feel bad still over what I did. She always brings it up and throws it in my face. But I did do it and she has every right to make me eat it and live with it.
For some reason, she still seems to hold onto my EA that I had. Is 4 years still normal to hold onto this? She is very admiring that she wants a divorce because of what happened years ago. I still feel awful with what I did to her. I just dont know how much more I can show her how sorry I am. I dont know what else I can do. But she loves to make me feel bad still over what I did. She always brings it up and throws it in my face. But I did do it and she has every right to make me eat it and live with it.
Sad_lost,
Some advice from my struggles apologizing to my wife - not for an EA, but for some emotionally abusive things that I did. I apologize =) in advance if any of this sounds harsh, it is not meant that way. I made mistakes when I first tried to apologize. Read up on ways to apologize online. In my case I also read books about emotional abuse.
1. You have to let go of outcomes. True apologies do not insist on forgiveness, or expect anyone to eventually get over it. Accept the consequences.
2. Do you believe you have addressed the underlying issues that drove you to have the EA?
3. Have you forgiven yourself? I believe you cannot expect forgiveness from another person if you haven't forgiven yourself.
4. There is a huge difference between remorse and feeling awful/ashamed/bad. Feeling awful or ashamed is hiding from what you did, and it is making the apology about YOU instead of the offended person. True remorse means accepting that you are not a bad person, but you made bad decisions. You own the responsibility for what you did. You express regret. You address why you made those decisions, and take actions so that the offended person understands you won't ever do that to them again. You put yourself in your W's shoes, ask how she felt, really try to understand the complexity of her emotions and why she feels that way. Empathize. Validate. If she hasn't told you, imagine how she must feel. Explain that you understand there are consequences for what you did, and you accept them no questions asked... And at the end of the day, your apology may fall on deaf ears.
I'm in a similar position. I've written apology letters and e-mails (she refuses to talk outside of MC about these things), and asked her to share her feelings so I could empathize more. And... I'm shut out, and she's preparing a BD.
Does she have every right to make you eat it? I'm not sure about that. I don't think anyone should accept being miserable the rest of their life. It just sounds like something has to change in your R. Either your W has to reach some point where she forgives you (which you can't control), or you may have to move on for your own well-being and happiness.
Sorry that you are here, but this is a wonderful community that can help you get through this and come out the other side stronger. People might say things that you don't want to hear, but listen as closely as you can. There is a wealth of experience that people here can draw on.
I can't comment about how long it takes to move past an EA. I have no idea, and imagine that it would vary greatly according to the situation and people involved. What I do know is that you have to let her go on her own path. Nothing you say or do right now is going to change her heart. Only she can do that. You have to focus on a) giving her the time and space that she needs and b) working on yourself to become the best person that you can be.
W 34 Me 42 Married 7 years together 8 0 kids 1 beloved dog BD 4/6/2018 I moved out 4/7/2018 I moved back in alone 8/05/2018 I file 3/06/2019 D official 5/7/2019
I thank everyone for their kind words. As far as forgiving myself for what I have done, I dont know if I ever can. I have moved past it, I have accepted what I have done, I have come to terms with what I have done, but I'm not sure if I can forgive myself for it. I took the easy way out 4 years ago and did not think of the consequences. I was selfish. I was wrong. It was a hard lesson to learn. I made a bad choice, but I have to move on from that and learn from it. I hope it made me a better person. As far as me trying to move on past my wife, it's hard. Its hard when she tells me she hates what I did to her, she tells me she cant wait for me to move, then next day she is laying on couch with me rubbing my knee and hand while watching a movie. Or when she makes plans for future dates and includes me in those plans. It's just confusing to me. If she moved on from me, if she doesnt love me, how does she still do these things?
The mixed messages from your wife are confusing. I have no idea what to say. I'm about 2 months into realizing how bad things are in my sitch, and I've been up and down on that roller coaster trying to interpret my W's actions and words.
What helps me sometimes is to consider all possibilities, and realize how it's impossible to narrow it down to the right choice. For instance, last night she was friendly, and brought me a snack. This could mean:
A. She wants to reconcile! B. She's only being friendly so I don't act crazy when she BDs me! C. She would do the same to a friend, I am in the FriendZone. D. She wants to maintain a friendship post-D as we have to co-parent. .... on and on
Even more, understand she is human, and probably experiencing her own wild emotional swings - hence the saying believe only half of what they do (which half? I don't know..) So on any given day her actions may change, just on a whim.
For the self-forgiveness part, again I can share my personal experience to date. Two months ago I realized my M was on the rocks, and I pulled the car over histrionically demanding my W talk to me (she was giving the silent treatment). She was frightened for her safety. This was emotionally abusive and wrong, I accept that.
I am learning and recognizing now the underlying attitudes and thoughts that drove me to pull over. First, I should have not acted on these thoughts. Impulse control. Second, the thoughts and attitudes themselves are extremely unhealthy. My fear of abandonment and losing the M is what, ironically, may have destroyed my M. I recognize the underlying anger and self-pity and passive-aggressiveness in the way I was thinking. Am I cured? Absolutely not. Do I hope that this understanding will lead me to make healthier choices going forward? Yes. At some point, I hope I can look back and both accept what I did was wrong (the easy part) and also forgive myself because I know to my very core that I would not make that same choice again (the hard part).
I also know my W may never forgive me. I haven't specifically asked for forgiveness yet, I feel like I need to forgive myself first.
That's a long-winded way of saying -- I think self-forgiveness may happen when you reach a point where you know in your heart that you would not make that same choice again. Not because you now know the consequences, but because you have fundamentally changed. You wouldn't do it even if nobody every found out.
Thanks Unchien, if that is what you believe self forgiveness is, then yes, I forgive myself. I know I made a horrible choice. And I know 100% under any circumstances that I would never do that again. This is regardless if it's my wife or another relationship in future. The hardest part is knowing when to move on. Obviously i cant move on while we are both living together. I care for her way to much to let her go and I fear that, if I let her go, then I missed a chance. What if she only needs more time? What if 4 years isn't enough time yet for her? But then the other side of me knows that I'm 41. I'm not getting younger and how much can I hold on for. The living situation also really confuses me. She knows I cant afford to move out. She knows she has no income. Yet she jabs at me over what I have done all the time. Especially when I bring it up, but she still jabs every couple days. It's like this is her way of making me pay and suffer for what I did to her. She knows I cant escape it, and she especially knows that I hurt whenever she reminds me of what I did to her. Its bad enough that every time I look in her eyes that I'm reminded of the pain and sorrow I caused her. I would give anything to remove all that pain from her. I just dont know how. I also know that yes, my actions have caused this and some would say I deserve to take her jabs, I owe it to her, but 4 years of it? I'm ready to move past it. But she is not, and it's not fair for her if I move past it, I caused this for her.
Sorry if this was already covered: Have you asked her for forgiveness?
Originally Posted by Sad_lost
it's not fair for her if I move past it, I caused this for her.
I politely disagree, and I understand you are in a tough and very sensitive situation with the constant reminding. She may never forgive you, but that doesn't prevent you from forgiving yourself. Also, forgiving yourself is not the same as moving past it, it's more being able to accept and coexist with what you have done.
I hear a lot of me in your writing, you are kind of beating yourself up. When I do that, and I just start feeling really bad about things, it doesn't do any good. I find I can empathize better with my W when I also show myself some compassion first, and stop wallowing in my self-pity. I struggle with it a lot though.
Hey guys, im sorry its been so long since i have posted. Life has been very busy. Im having an awful last couple days. I want to sit and cry. As you read, my wife and I still living together. She wants a divorce stemming from an EA 4 years ago. Our weeks have been very up and down. Most nights when i dont bring anything up things seem ok. She lays on couch with me, we do family things. When i mention us being together is when all hell breaks loose. She reminds me that she no longer has feelings for me and she is just trying to live in peace. And then continues to Yell at me for texting OW that i did years ago. This week has been hard. Usually her actions dont match her words, until this week that is. There is a party next week that we were both supposed to go to. Today she tells me to stay home as she doesnt want me there. Come to find out, her ex boyfriend from 23 years ago will be there. She also removed my lastname from her name on FB and deleted her relationship status. Also when i asked her, she tells me she is free to date or see who she wants, but points out she has no plans on doing this. Of course, all i think of now is that she is going to party to try to either pay me back or rekindle an old relationship. I am having a really tough time. Im refusing to let go of our marriage. 90% of the time things seem like they are good or getting better and I get sucked in. In 3 weeks we are going on a small family vacation.. i also know she has not been with another because her bipolor condition has her always being home, until next weekend that is. I can really use some advice. I know I caused all this pain and heartache for her 4 years ago. I wish I can change the things that I did. It was selfish of me.
When i mention us being together is when all hell breaks loose
It appears that isn't working. Go ahead and forget about bringing that up for a couple years.
I advise you to stay off social media and focus your energy elsewhere. All the WASs do what she did. Don't let it bother you.
As for the party I'd find plans for that day and beat her out of the house and then be out still when she got home. Show her that you can get along just fine. Shes pulling the punches on you with this I can date whoever BS, let her wonder what you're up to and don't argue about anything. You need to read and post here more too if you want to improve.
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
Thanks for all the heads up and advice. I think i really messed things up lastnight. I have had a feeling that she has been using a burner phone to talk to someone else. Just by some things that i have noticed in the past couple weeks. Last night i accused her of this. Any progress that we might have made just went down the drain. Its very hard living here with her, and watching her slip further and further away from me, and now for me to accuse her of talking to another man, while i was the one doing the EA 4 years ago is just wrong. Im so afraid she is going to pay me back for the crime i commited, that it has consumed me. I need to get over that fear.
